March 28, 2025 • 56 mins
What does it truly mean to be an interpreter in the deepest sense? Is it merely transferring words between languages, or something far more profound?
Ryohei Onishi, returning guest and two-time TEDx speaker from Japan, takes us on a transformative journey through the evolution of his understanding of interpretation. Five years after his first talk on "de-verbalization," Ryohei's perspective has deepened into something more spiritual – what it means to truly become "the voice of others."
The catalyst for this shift came from three simple words spoken by a client: "Be my voice." This command fundamentally changed how Ryohei approached his craft, moving beyond technical skill to a deeper embodiment of the speaker's intentions, emotions, and essence. He shares the mysterious "sync" moments that occur between interpreters and speakers, when the boundaries between them seem to dissolve.
The conversation explores the profound silence required for genuine listening, with Ryohei noting poetically that "listen" contains the same letters as "silent." This active silence allows interpreters to fully receive another's message by quieting their own internal dialogue. We hear about the emotional weight of interpreting difficult content, like discussions of war, and the intentional "unplugging" required afterward.
Perhaps most fascinating is Ryohei's perspective on interpreting in the AI age. He observes that we've moved from a world with two options (interpretation available or not) to one where some form of translation is always available – the question now is whether to choose machine or human interpretation. Rather than competing with AI on speed, Ryohei chooses to emphasize his humanity: "I'm the pilot, not the passenger."
For anyone curious about what lies beyond words, beyond terminology, and beyond the technical aspects of communication, this episode offers a rare glimpse into the soul of interpretation. Join us to discover why, in Ryohei's words, "interpreting is not just the art of language, it's also the art of life."
Connect with Ryohei Onishi:
Deverbalization - 1st TEDx talk
Share your thoughts about this episode!
Thanks for tuning in, till next time! 👋
Connect with Mireya Pérez, Host
www.brandtheinterpreter.com
Facebook
LinkedIn
Instagram
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome back to another episode of the Brand the
Interpreter podcast.
This is Mireya, your host.
To all returning listeners,thank you for joining me again
and if this is your first timetuning in, welcome.
I am so glad you're here.
So I want to begin today'sepisode by asking you some
questions to think about as youare listening to today's episode
(00:29):
.
I want you to think about whatit really means for you to be an
interpreter.
Is it simply transferring wordsfrom one language to another,
or is it something more,something deeper, more human, or
perhaps something that doesn'tjust connect us to others but
(00:51):
quietly reshapes us too?
In today's episode of Brand theInterpreter, we welcome back a
returning guest, ryohei Onishi,interpreter, educator and TEDx
speaker from Japan, whoseevolving journey invites us to
rethink the soul of thisprofession.
Five years after his first TEDxtalk on de-verbalization, ryohei
(01:15):
returned to the TEDx Kobe stagein 2024 with a new message
being the voice of others.
But what does that really mean?
What does it take to fully stepinto someone else's thoughts,
emotions and intentions,especially when the message is
raw?
Interpreting war, themysterious sync moments between
(01:38):
interpreter and speaker, and whysilencing your inner voice
might just be the most powerfullistening tool we have.
We also explore what it meansto be a human interpreter in a
(02:01):
world now saturated with AI, andhow our value isn't found in
speed but in presence.
Throughout our conversation,you'll hear that Ryoji offers
more than insight.
He offers perspective rooted inempathy, intentionality and
(02:21):
love for the art ofcommunication.
So if you've ever wondered whatlies beyond the words, beyond
the terminology, the moments wedon't often speak about, the
things maybe we just think aboutor things that go unheard of,
this episode is for you.
We're not just talking aboutthe profession, we're sharing
(02:44):
our stories.
So if this is the type of stuffthat you'd like to hear about
with regards to our profession,then you have found your home.
This is the Brand theInterpreter podcast, where I
share your stories about ourprofession.
Let's dive in Rioje.
(03:12):
Welcome to the show.
I'm so glad to have you back.
Welcome back.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Yeah, thank you very much for your invitation.
Muchas gracias por invitarme,pero no sé nada más en español.
Does that make?
Speaker 1 (03:28):
sense.
It makes perfect sense actually.
So thank you so much Thank youso much.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
It's always a pleasure to be able to have past
guests come back and share withus where they've been and what
different things have happenedin between, and the amazing
thing about it, at least for me,it's that it's been a whole
three years since you were lasthere, so that's amazing.
And for those of you that arelistening and did listen to
(03:59):
Ryohei's past episode, he joinsus all the way from Japan.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Yep, do you know Japan?
Speaker 1 (04:07):
I wish I knew Japan.
I wish Actually my son.
I have a younger son that isalways saying that when he gets
older he's going to move toJapan.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
We're always welcome yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
So, yeah, maybe fast future, a few years, once he
gets older, he'll invite me tocome over.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
if that's in fact what happens, I'll let you know
yeah, sure, and I will start tospeak and try to study more
spanish language as well well,talk to us real here about
what's been going on.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
I know that the last time you were here, you did
share that you had been on TEDx,and so we talked and did a deep
dive on that particularexperience for you and, of
course, your experience as alanguage professional all the
way from the other side of theworld.
But talk to us what has beenhappening since then and then
(05:00):
share with us the fact that youactually were invited to come
back to TEDx and you gaveanother conversation about
interpreting.
So catch us up.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Yeah, sure, thank you so much for the introduction.
I came back to TEDx Kobe 2024.
Last time it was 2019.
So I came back after five years, but it happened after a long
process of the audition and therehearsals and the selection and
all that.
So it was not like a straightprocess, but then I was really
(05:32):
able to come back with differentideas about what interpreting
is.
I think last time, back in 2019, I talked about
de-verbalization.
That was a very fresh idea forme, but this time I had to talk
about something else, about whatinterpreting does to people,
and this time we really focusedon being the voice of others.
(05:53):
That's the kind of phrase whichcame out after a long process
of consideration and aconversation with other people.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Yeah, For the audience that hasn't had the
opportunity to listen to yourepisode which, by the way, after
today's episode, I hope you goback and find Rio Hay's episode.
I'm going to link in theepisode notes but just briefly
explain what de-verbalizationconcept is about, and then we'll
get into the other, tedxepisode.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
Yep, sure, like de-verbalization is in a way a
paradoxical concept forinterpreting, because
interpreters are basicallyverbalizing.
So we think that we're alwaysverbalizing what other people
are saying.
But actually we first try tode-verbalize what people are
saying and get out of the worldof language and get into the
(06:43):
world of meaning and then wereally get and understand what
the people are saying and comeback to the world of language
and say what the speaker wassaying in a different language.
So that's the process that weare going through, especially in
simultaneous interpreting.
I believe that was the conceptwhich I tried to introduce in
(07:04):
the TEDxCOVID-19, 2019 talk.
I hope it makes sense byexplaining this way.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Yeah, and, like I said, I'm definitely going to
include that episode in theepisode notes, that link, but of
course also the informationthat you can go back to his TEDx
talk then where he explainsthat so that you could sort of
get a good grasp of it.
And I think what I really likeabout what happened, ryohei, is
(07:32):
that you first introduced thistopic to that particular
audience in a very, shall we say, scientific way so that they
meaning the audience, thegeneral audience can understand
sort of that, that scientificprocess of the brain of the
interpreter and what isoccurring sort of in the
(07:53):
background.
So I often say it's not aninput output process, there's
actually something going onright in the brain with an
interpreter.
But what I also like is thatnow you've come back to humanize
the profession, meaning you'vecreated something, a
conversation with a generalaudience about the human aspect
(08:15):
of interpreting.
So let's talk about that alittle bit more and share with
this audience what it is thatyou brought to the conversation.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Yeah, thank you so much for that question.
For this 2024 TEDx talk, I hadto face one difference from the
last time, which is that,although in 2019, we did have
simultaneous interpretation ofmy talk into Japanese language,
but this time we didn't.
So I had to really make surethat by speaking in English,
(08:47):
then the participants couldunderstand without the
simultaneous interpretationdevice.
So it seems like the conferencehall for that TEDxCOBE
conference in 2024 didn't allowthe technical equipment for
simultaneous interpreting.
That was the kind ofenvironmental condition that I
had to kind of meet.
(09:07):
So then I thought about thislike, hey, okay, if I'm an
interpreter, but if we cannotuse the interpreting function,
then what can I do?
Maybe I had to change the way Italk about the idea.
So when I say the voice ofothers, it's really about
becoming the voice of thespeaker.
For example, if you'reinterpreting for a president,
you have to feel like thepresident, you have to speak
(09:30):
like the president, and this issomething that I call
personalization, or somethingthat I used to call
personalization.
But then, when I was workingwith the TEDxCOBE speaker team,
I called this team Team Ryohei,by the way, and the team members
said like this team, TeamRyohei, by the way, and the team
members said like, okay, whatis personalization?
I couldn't really understandthat word.
(09:51):
So I had to really go deeperand made it really really simple
by saying, oh, notpersonalization, but
internalization, does that makesense?
And then the team member saidno.
Then I had to come back againand I said voice of others and
they said like, okay, that makessense.
Yeah, so I had to really makeit easy.
(10:12):
But then, by making it reallyeasy, the word of interpreting
really went into the minds ofthose participants.
So I think that's anotherversion of my TEDx talk
experience, like interpreterstalking about interpreting
without simultaneousinterpretation.
That's kind of paradoxical, butin this way I was able to make
(10:33):
it really successful this time.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Yeah, and it almost feels like you actually became
the speaker, which you wereright, the speaker, which you
were right, but in this caseit's like you were the
individual that was trying toget across your thoughts, your
original thoughts and feelingsabout your subject to an
audience that spoke a differentlanguage.
(10:57):
And so now, right, you're sortof de-verbalizing your own
information in order for it toconnect to your audience.
I like this notion of when youare someone's voice, you feel
(11:17):
what they feel and you speak theway they speak.
What do you say is the actualprocess to that for an
interpreter if there is aprocess, Because I almost feel
like it isn't just about showingup as a trained interpreter and
by magic it happens what do youthink is the actual process in
(11:41):
order for that synchronization,if you will, to occur?
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Right?
That's a great question, and Ithink if we try to make a
comparison between just merelyspeaking a foreign language to
interpreting, I think thecontrast is much clearer.
I think, for example, when weare learning a foreign language
like English, then we try tospeak English better.
So you want to talk aboutyourself, right?
So you focus on.
So you want to talk aboutyourself, right, so you focus on
(12:07):
yourself.
I want to talk about this, talkabout this, so you focus on
yourself.
But then when you start doinginterpretation, actually for me
I had a very hard timeunderstanding others, because in
the world of interpreting, younever talk about yourself.
You have to talk about others.
You have to stop talking aboutyourself and you have to really
(12:28):
listen and it's really a greatthing for me to learn that the
word listen is spelleddifferently and you get silent,
right, listen and silence.
So that really totally makessense for the interpreters.
In order to do a betterinterpretation, you have to
really be silent and listen, andthat's for me, the way to be
(12:51):
the voice of others.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Yeah, I like that Listen silently, right, it's
something of the sort.
So it's like you have to turnoff that internal dialogue.
I suppose that would be one ofthe processes to really be able
to take in the delivery of theperson that you're interpreting.
(13:15):
For I often feel like, wheneverthat does occur particularly, I
think it happens more for methe experience I'm referring to
when I'm doing a simultaneousinterpretation more so than a
consecutive, in a dialoguesetting I feel that when I'm
(13:36):
experiencing that it occursduring a simultaneous
interpretation and it doesn'toccur with every speaker, and
I've never really stopped orhave paused to think about why I
sync with particularindividuals and why I don't with
others.
But I can tell you that from myexperience I definitely feel
(13:58):
that the message is conveyed asclose to its original when I do
have that sync moment I call itsync moment because I've
actually expressed that toothers where I feel like I
synced with the speaker, I knowwhere they're going, I
understand the essence of themessage and so I'm able to
(14:20):
interpret it in that way, but itdoesn't happen with every
speaker.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Oh yeah, it's a very difficult question Because I do
feel that I'm synchronizing inyour definition and for me it's
being the voice of others andit's hard to be the voice of
everyone because sometimes it'sdifficult to really download the
people's voice, sometimesbecause of the difference in the
way they think.
(14:45):
For example, I didinterpretation for the United
Nations University director orParis Saint-Germain you know,
soccer ball players and I didn'tplay soccer ball, so I had to
start like, hey, what is soccerball, how do they work?
And then it had to come with avery good amount of downloading
(15:06):
about what soccer players do.
And I also did the pressconference interpretation of an
NBA basketball coach.
I didn't play basketball at all, so I had to start really like,
hey, how does basketball work?
And and so this kind ofdownloading.
But then, regardless of theoccupation or the work that they
do, as long as I am able todownload the voice of others, I
(15:29):
was able to be them, be likethem.
It was really strange butreally and mysterious experience
, in my opinion, to be reallyable to feel like what they're
saying.
And I felt really heavy when Iwas interpreting about Ukrainian
war and that was the kind ofseminar about the Japan's
(15:52):
self-defense force.
I had a one-day seminar withthem and then they were talking
about the death toll or thesoldiers dying on the
battlefield in Russia or Ukraine, and interpreting about this
seminar really made me heavy,and then that was really
difficult for me to get out ofthat voice of others.
So sometimes I can download,and if you over-download it's
(16:16):
hard to get away from it.
So I had to kind of go away,shut down my PC and then take a
walk for just 15 minutes for meto kind of decentralize the
voice of others and stuff likethat.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (16:31):
Oh, totally.
I think that that's somethingthat we've spoken about, at
least in the show on previousepisodes with other individuals
that have talked aboutinterpreting for situations that
you know have have this impactat the moment, and just the
trying to disconnect after hasto be very intentional.
(16:52):
It's not something thatautomatically happens.
You know, to sort of follow theword choice here, we have to
unplug from that download inorder to be able to make that
disconnect.
But it has to happen sointentionally because it doesn't
automatically happen.
So this is where we've talkedabout also in the past year
(17:15):
about that self-care as aninterpreter, because we have to
sort of make it that habit.
Yes, when we do our work.
I want to, I want to continuetalking about this be my voice
topic because I feel likethere's so many different angles
that we can go right and deepdive on it.
(17:36):
I often find that especially, Ithink, for the newer
interpreter that hasn't yet hitthat piece or that moment in
which they really make aconnection with this description
for seasoned interpreters aboutbecoming someone's voice, in
(17:57):
the beginning it feels likebeing someone's voice is
speaking for them.
So how would we differentiatebeing someone's voice from
speaking on their behalf?
Speaker 2 (18:14):
someone's voice from speaking on their behalf.
Right, it's also a verydifficult or and a great
question as well.
But when I think aboutinterpreters, there are at least
two different types ofinterpreters.
One is the interpreter thattranslates the words or
(18:38):
languages, and another one isthe interpreter that translates
the meaning of the speakers.
So, and I try to be the thelatter one, um, I want to be the
person who can talk, who cantranslate the meaning of what
they're saying.
And then when I teach umstudents about samaritani
interpreting especially, theyfirst try to go after every
single word that the Japanesepeople say, and then they run
(18:59):
out of time and they speak toomuch and they don't know how to
omit the words and they forgetto listen.
Once again, the silent andlisten, they forget to listen.
They just are too muchpreoccupied with just speaking
or just consuming whatever soundthey're hearing.
And I say no, that's not whatinterpreting is.
(19:19):
Interpreting is not justspitting out every single word
that the speaker is saying.
It's about really understandingthe meaning.
And interpreting reallyenriches your life.
That's what I'm telling thestudents.
And then they begin tounderstand, like, okay,
interpreting.
They thought interpreting isjust like the extension of
learning of foreign languages.
(19:40):
But that's not exactly true.
Learning interpreting is livinga life itself.
For me, interpreting is a wayof life, so that's why I want
them to also understand thatinterpreting is not just the art
of language, it's also the artof life as well, if I can put it
(20:00):
this way.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
That's beautiful actually, and I think that,
again, when somebody is goingthrough training or through
studies of this profession,ultimately, whether that be
during the program or after, inpractice, perhaps that
connection, hopefully thatconnection is actually made,
because you know, one thing isin theory and another thing is
(20:24):
in practice.
Right, how do we make thatconnection of it's not just
about the words, it's about themeaning, once we begin actually
interpreting for individuals,particularly individuals, I feel
that speak freely.
It's about the meaning Once webegin actually interpreting for
individuals, particularlyindividuals, I feel that speak
freely.
So it's like thisbi-directional communication.
It's like we have to learn tolisten silently, like you've
(20:45):
mentioned, to be able to makethat connection.
But I also feel like there'sthis sort of gap, sometimes not
just with students, butgenerally speaking.
So what I loved about your talkis that you were speaking to a
general audience.
You brought the message to anaudience that doesn't have that
(21:09):
background in interpreting, thatdoesn't have that background in
interpreting.
So talk to us more about howyou introduced the profession in
a way that humanizes theprofession, that was understood
by a general audience, becausewhen I see the camera pan out, I
see a lot of nods, so there's alot of individuals that are
(21:29):
making a connection with yourmessage.
Share with this audience whatthat was about.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
Yeah, the interaction with the audience where the
participants in TEDx terms wasquite amazing for me, I thought.
First of all, I thought thatwhen I speak in English although
I spoke very slow, but then theparticipants may not understand
everything that I say, but theydid understand it and that was
a positive surprise.
And then I wanted to make thismessage broader, as broad as
(22:00):
possible, so that they are ableto cancel their misunderstanding
about this occupation calledinterpreting.
So when they hear the wordinterpreting or interpreters,
they think like, oh, you are thelanguage master, you know
everything about English orSpanish, whatever.
But then that's not the case.
We're always on the developmentphase, like we're always
(22:22):
learning about new things, aboutforeign languages.
And some people think like we'rejust magicians, but then we're
not like that, we're just humans.
We're also trying to be thevoice of others.
We're learning, we're alwaysstudying stuff like that.
So I just wanted to changetheir misconception about who
interpreters are by making itextremely simple, like be the
(22:46):
voice of others.
And then this act ofinterpreting itself can also be
applied to their lives as well,whether they are playing guitars
, for example, if you're playingthe Beatles, you also feel like
the Beatles, like let it be,let it be.
You know you feel that, right,it's not like you just play the
song, but you also feel like howthey felt.
(23:07):
It's also the same as likepainting a picture.
If you're painting a picture ofthe scenery you're looking at,
you also feel like, hey, thatguy seemed like really sad,
what's going on with him?
Or you are also like being thevoice of the person being
painted.
Um, so my point of making thattalk extremely, as broad as
(23:27):
possible is that I wanted, uh,people or the participants, to
link interpreting to their livesas well.
So there is always somethingthat's really in common with the
interpreting world and theirworld as well.
Yeah, does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Yes, completely.
I often feel like there's somany different ways that we can
explain the profession and everytime someone from the industry
takes the opportunity to talkabout the profession to a
general audience, it's alwaysexciting, just because it's
explained in different ways sothat it hopefully catches the
(24:08):
attention of that particularaudience and their understanding
right of what the interpretingprofession actually is.
I definitely noticed that andhopefully those individuals took
with them that it is definitelymore than an extension of
learning a foreign language.
It goes so much deeper thanthat.
(24:30):
You shared a story in your talk, rioje, about when the
individual said be my voice.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Share that story with this audience, if you will,
please 10 years ago, back in2014, when I was working for an
Australian manager called WayneMiller he is my best friend
right now and then I was hisinterpreter back then and he, I
(25:03):
think, he knew how to useinterpreters.
So the first day I met him, hesaid like I'm your boss and
you're my voice, so you have tobe my voice, ryohei.
And that really changed my life.
Like, okay, I was just alanguage user I had a good
command of language at the timeas well and I was just be my
(25:25):
voice.
But he said be my voice.
Like I had to be his voice,right, I had to stop talking
about myself and I had to startto listen.
I had to be the voice, right, Ihad to stop talking about
myself and I had to start tolisten.
I had to be the voice of WayneMiller.
So that short three words likebe my voice totally changed my
life, and that has changed mylife to this day as well.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
It's like it turned on a switch right All of a
sudden.
Yeah, you became synced withthat individual, and again I use
that word sync only because Ican't think of anything else
that necessarily for me,mentally, visually, makes that
connection and we sort of haveto become one with the speaker.
(26:09):
So that's why I keep using thatword sync.
But I feel that if individuals,a general audience that works
with interpreters, understoodthe actual work, perhaps that
would also be the messaging andthe understanding of people when
they work with interpreter.
(26:30):
Yes, it would be hey, thisperson needs to be my voice, and
so, if they're going to be myvoice, they need to understand,
maybe, the context, and so wemore easily receive information
prior to an assignment, asopposed to the questioning
behind why does the interpreterneed material?
(26:50):
What have you found throughoutthese last few years, ryohei?
That, whether it be throughyour students or through the
work that you do with regards toour profession, and
particularly with technologynowadays, what have you come
across?
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Yeah, thank you for that question.
It's a great question.
I started teaching universitystudents three years ago and
then this has been a greatopportunity for me to really
look back on what I'm doing, howI can really contribute to the
future generation of Japanthrough interpreting.
And then I also started todefine my class as user
(27:28):
education time, because they'regoing to be graduating from the
university and they are able touse English very well, so they
will be most likely be workingin global companies, and global
companies meaning they will beusing interpreters.
So they will come back to me andsay like, hey, rohei, are you
available this day, with thatday?
And then that for me, it's atime I will say like, yes, i'm'm
(27:52):
available, but you remember myclass, you know how to use
interpreters.
Now, right, don't use me, don't, don't abuse me.
You, you just have to use me,right?
That's what I would say if theyask me that question.
But so for me, really teachingthem how to interpret is also
about teaching them how to useinterpreters.
So user education is soimportant because they are going
(28:14):
to be the main generation inthe future and if they know how
to use interpreters, they canalso make international business
, global business moresuccessful, right?
So from that viewpoint as well,like teaching and going to the
class every Monday morning isjust way more than just teaching
90 minutes.
It's more about nurturing thefuture generation of Japan.
(28:37):
That's how I define my job onevery Monday morning.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
I love that.
That's lovely, I think I oftenthink about when we are training
others on how to work withinterpreters, whether that's the
interpreters themselves,potential interpreters or other
individuals.
I often think of them as brandambassadors.
So you've got people that areout there promoting the brand
(29:10):
right.
When you talk about it in thatcontext, I think of them as that
brand ambassadors, because theyknow how to work with an
interpreter, they understand theintricacies of interpreting
because you're teaching them now, and so they're able to help
promote the profession in a waythat's different from somebody
(29:33):
that doesn't understand what itactually is.
So, yeah, in my mind I usuallycall them well, these are the
brand ambassadors.
You are an extension of theprofession now, because now that
you know better, hopefully youdo better.
Yeah, I really like the word,yeah, a brand ambassador.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
So they're all ambassadors.
So I need to really tell theright message and they also need
to get the right understandingof what interpreters are doing
and how hard interpreting couldbe.
So that's why I don't reallytry to evaluate whether their
interpreting is really accurateor not, like hey, that was a
great interpreting or that wasnot a great interpreting.
I try not to jazz that way,because in this way you are just
(30:20):
expecting the unexpected.
So you can't expect them, likestudents who are just still
studying English, to interpretjust like professionals do.
And yeah, so, and not so manypeople are going to be a
professional interpreter, indeed, after they graduate.
So what I can really contributeto in the future for them is
for them to really understandthe occupation, the art of
(30:45):
interpreting, so that when theyknow how hard it is, they also
would be able to be kind to thefuture interpreters, and that
also makes a really betterecosystem for the interpreting
world as well, right?
So that's why I don't say, likeit took one minute for you to
interpret this one single line.
How come?
(31:05):
No, no, I wouldn't really saythat.
I would just say like, okay,it's okay, that's interpreting.
You learned how hardinterpreting is.
That's the lesson for you today.
You did a great job.
That's what I would say.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
Oh, I like that.
That's so great.
I think that you're absolutelyright.
Not everyone necessarily thatgoes through that training.
That might be their intentionin the beginning, but maybe they
realize, like many otherprofessions, not just with
interpreting that this is notactually what they want to do.
But now they have a deeperunderstanding about the
profession and they can go outthere and help advocate for the
(31:42):
right setting for an interpreter.
For example I know that we inthis show we've talked about it
a couple of times where there'sa researcher, an interpreter
researcher by the name of DrSofia Garcia-Bayer, and she
coined this term communicativeautonomy, right, and it's like
(32:06):
this mouthful for what basicallyshe describes as the essence of
an interpreter, in which theinterpreter allows for the right
environment for individuals tobe responsible for and in
control of their owncommunication.
(32:27):
And I know that when I firstheard that, I suddenly realized
what interpreting was all about.
In the beginning it was just,you know, a plug and play.
Basically, I learned mystrategies, my techniques, I
would show up to my assignment,I would interpret and you know,
(32:48):
every assignment was that way.
But when I came across thisterm, I realized there is so
much more, it's so much deeperthan what we're actually, even
as an interpreter, sometimesthat we're actually making a
connection with.
How do you see that, incombination with being my voice
(33:08):
as far as an interpreter,internalizing what their true
essence is?
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Right, if I understand this correctly,
having the right environment tobe able to do the job or to be
able to take the responsibilityas an interpreter is so crucial.
It's so crucial All the morebecause we're now interpreting
more often online than before.
Then having the rightenvironment is something that we
(33:35):
have to really advocate to theusers or customers, because they
cannot see us so easily becauseof the online communication.
That's one thing, and thenanother thing is that we
interpreters have to know whatthe right environment is for us
Like.
If we are missing thiscondition, that condition, that
condition, then we wouldn't beable to really take
(33:57):
responsibility as an interpreter.
So we have to really sacrificeand compromise the quality of
interpreting and then I'll bereally honest with that to the
customer, sometimes anyinformation or agenda or any
keywords shared with us rightbefore the meeting, until right
before the meeting, then I I'mnot a god, I'm not a magician,
(34:22):
right, so I would say I wouldn'tbe able to take responsibility.
I would just say whatever theyhear.
So I'll be the type oneinterpreter, the interpreter
that just translates thelanguage.
Um, I'm not really satisfiedwith that, but then that also in
a sense exemplifies the factthat if the right environment is
not there or is missing, thenthe whole thing about
(34:46):
interpreting or the wholeconversation uh, bilingually is
going to collapse.
So that's what I, in a sense,indirectly want to tell the, the
customers or the clients, sothat they also think like oh, I
made a mistake because I madethe wrong choice about creating
the conditions for interpreters.
That's why that meetingcollapsed or failed.
(35:06):
Next time I have to do itdifferently.
That's kind of user educationthat I want to do through my job
.
Yeah, does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Completely and, speaking of first type, which we
mentioned, was the interpreterthat is, focusing more on the
words as opposed to the meaning.
Yes, we often think aboutexperiences, as a language
professional, that help shapeour understanding of our own
(35:38):
profession or that help shapeourselves as the professional.
You talked about the story ofthe individual that said be my
voice, which sort of turned onthe switch for you.
You know, there's thoseexperiences in which, as
interpreters, we suddenly feellike, wow, maybe I'm not as good
as I thought or maybe I need toquestion this a little bit more
(36:02):
.
Was there ever a moment for youlike that while interpreting,
whether it be a speaker or asubject, in which you felt all
the training that you have andexperiences wasn't enough?
Speaker 2 (36:15):
all the training that you have and experiences wasn't
enough.
Yeah, I do come across thiskind of experiences and that is
quite evident when it comes tothe in-house interpreting or
business setting interpretation,and they're dealing with terms
that only they use inside of oneparticular company and that's
not, of course, on the internet,so you can't really check it.
(36:36):
And even though it's on theinternet, they don't tell us
about that right before themeeting.
So those are the cases thatinterpreting seems to become
more challenging because of thereally closed range or scope of
the words being used in thatkind of setting.
But when it comes to forums orsymposiums or different types of
(36:59):
webinars or seminars, they aretalking about something that is
partially searchable on theinternet, so we can get those
pieces of information and thismeans that interpreters can also
learn by preparing forinterpreting and they can do a
better interpretation.
So confidentiality could be onecondition that will really
(37:21):
change the fate or the successor failure of interpreting.
I would say yeah, and I dounderstand that they can't
disclose all the informationbecause that's confidential, but
then at the same time this alsoaffects in a sense, the quality
of interpreting as well.
So I'm still thinking orsearching for a better way to
(37:42):
satisfy myself and satisfyingclients with the in-house or the
in-company interpretingenvironments.
I know that confidentiality isquite a high barrier, but I'm
just hoping that someday, youknow, we can try to get away
from this kind of difficulty.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
One of the things that I really appreciate about
being able to have conversationswith language professionals
from around the world is sort ofseeing the changes in the
industry and similarities aswell between you know other
parts of the world and here inthe States, and of course, here
we've been having a lot ofconversation with regards to AI
(38:26):
and what that's doing in theindustry.
What is Japan seeing in thelanguage industry profession
with AI?
If anything, what are thoseinsights that you've come across
that you could share with thisaudience?
That's pretty US-based.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Yeah, thank you.
Yeah, maybe most of the thingshappening in Japan are the same
as what's happening in the US aswell, but I would say that the
situation has changed, totallychanged, with the advent of AI.
Nowadays I think prior to AItimes, we were living in a world
where there were only twosituations Situation one where
(39:07):
there is no interpretationprovided, and there is a
situation where interpreting isprovided.
So it's like zero or a hundred,right, zero or a hundred.
But then right now we're livingin a world where interpreting
or translation of some form isprovided a hundred percent, like
it's not a human interpreter,but machine translation is
(39:31):
available.
So the automatic subtitlingwill be available on the screen,
even though you're joiningMicrosoft Teams or Zoom or
whatever it is, so you are ableto see the translation or at
least see the subtitles of whatthe people speaking in English
are talking about, so they'reable to see that or they're able
(39:51):
to kind of understand what'sgoing on.
But then in this second world,then the choice would be do you
want to go to machinetranslation or human
interpretation?
So it's 100% and 100%.
There is no choice for nointerpretation, no translation
provided.
There is something alreadyprovided, right, then people are
(40:14):
left with two choices machinetranslation or AI translation,
or human translation.
Which one would you want tochoose, and would you want to
pay for human interpretation ornot?
So it was not the matter ofnecessity.
It is now the matter of choice.
That's the world we're livingin, at least in Japan.
(40:35):
I'm not sure about how thethings are working in the US,
but yeah, that's how I take it.
Speaker 1 (40:40):
I think in a sense it's basically the same right,
and perhaps even worldwide itwould be.
And the concern is always thatthat other choice has variable
factors, meaning the use oftechnology.
Number one right theunderstanding of the technology
itself.
Usually, I imagine, there'sthis lag time between the
(41:05):
general audience and theunderstanding of the technology.
Well, first, I think, theacceptance of the technology,
because not, let's face it, noteveryone, not everyone trusts
technology.
So just having that acceptanceperhaps first, and then being
able to learn how to use it.
But I think the conversationsthat we've been seeing thus far
(41:29):
as well around this topic is thecost, which is, I mean, that's
not anything new.
We could all agree that cost isalways a driver for
decision-making in many of theorganizations that we interpret
for.
But obviously the cost of thetechnology in this case would
(41:52):
definitely be something that isa decision-making factor because
it's more affordable.
I suppose you can say so, whileI love this notion that you
just talked about, it went fromeither zero right, no service,
to full service, 100%.
(42:13):
There is no zero capability nowbecause of the technology, and
that piece is great.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
Yeah, it's a great thing.
Yeah, it's a universalizationof interpreting service?
Yeah, then we are now facedwith a different question.
As an interpreter, what is theadded value can you provide?
Right?
I think that's the new questionthat the interpreters of the
2025 are faced with.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Yeah, oh, I like that .
So what is your added value asan interpreter in this era of AI
?
A dramatic pause forinterpreters to ponder.
I mean, it's not that it'snecessarily been something
different, right, in terms of,hey, we have to learn to
differentiate ourselves asinterpreters in the language
(43:06):
industry by, I don't know, maybespecializing in something or
having a niche, or something ofthe sort.
So I think that concept, youknow we've had around in a while
, but now there's a new, youknow a new player right in the
game, and this one is a littlebit different.
So I think that theconversations are always
centered around AI nowadays, itfeels like.
(43:28):
So I wanted to get a feel, foryou know, what's happening out
in the world, out in Japan.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
What's happening out in the world, out in Japan.
For when I teach Englishreading classes, then even
though they're given Englishreading assignment, they first
go to DPL or Google MachineTranslation and they get the
Japanese translation first.
They read it first and then, ifthey don't understand what's
(44:10):
written, even with that Japanesetranslation, they first, then
they go to English.
So it's totally the other wayaround compared to 30 years ago
when I was studying English.
Right, yeah, that's one thing,but then another thing is when I
see other interpreters in Japanworking, they are also working
in different styles.
Some of them do use machinetranslation of the presentations
(44:35):
or presentation slides intoJapanese.
So they read out the machinetranslation Japanese version for
interpretation, likesimultaneously.
And then when I saw that, whatI felt is like, okay, they are
working with the AI, that's good, that's good, yeah.
But then I wanted to avoid beingthat kind of interpreting.
(44:59):
On the other hand, I wanted tobe myself.
I wanted to do interpreting inmy own way.
They can help us.
I mean, ai can help us do it,but AI is not going to do it for
me, I just want to do it myself.
Ai can maybe help us with thecertain translation of a
(45:19):
technical term that I don't know, but then they're not going to
dictate my job.
That was my kind of the thinkingback then when I saw other
interpreters doing the job.
So I don't know if it makessense in the context of the US,
but I just want it to be humanand when a lot of interpreters
are looking like AI translators,I want to be a human
(45:44):
interpreter by not looking at AI.
So it's like when you watch TV,you behave like a TV celebrity,
right, but then when you don'twatch TV, you don't know what
the celebrities are doing.
Just like that.
If you're watching AI, then youtranslate just like AI, but I
don't watch, I don't see AI, soI don't know how AI behaves.
(46:08):
Maybe that could be thedifferentiator for my
interpretation.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Yeah, yes, I like that.
So it's the natural versus the.
I don't know the machine, right, and I do know what you're
talking about, because I thinkat one point somebody had
mentioned the integration of AIas it's captioning the speech
(46:36):
and the interpreter is somehow.
You know, that was acomplicated part for me is that
the interpreter is also basingtheir interpretation on that
particular dictation.
But I'm thinking, are we nowthe voice of the machine or are
we the voice of the speaker?
(46:58):
Yeah, because it's the words,but I just and I don't know if
they are using the machine inthe other language or if they're
using it in the source language.
But anyway, my thought was justlike that.
(47:37):
That is some heavy splitattention skills first of all,
reading the content andlistening to the speaker.
And how do we ensure that thewords that are written by
machine is accurate to what thespeaker is saying?
I and I say that because Iremember one time I turned them
on to sort of get a feel and Irealized you know the the.
The text on the screen saidsomething about um evil, or it
was like.
It was just a word that soundedlike whatever the speaker said,
but it was so out of contextand it just threw my brain for a
loop so I was like, nope, thisis not for me, not yet at least
(48:00):
yeah, yeah, yeah, I 100% get it.
Speaker 2 (48:02):
Yeah, uh, in the case of japanese language, if I may
comment on that, um, it doeshave a problem like uh.
In japanese language, we dohave a lot of words that sound
the same but they mean totallydifferently, for example, one
example is ame, that means rainand candy.
(48:23):
So rain and candy.
If you mistake it, then youhave to say it's raining but the
candy is falling down, or youcan make totally silly sentences
, right, depending on how youunderstand the context to be.
Human, interpreters don'tmistake it, but machine
translators may mistake it, andthen they do mistake it.
(48:46):
So that's one thing.
Like the words pronounce thesame but they mean differently
and when written, they aredifferent, right, so that's one
thing, but, on the other hand,sound recognition by AI is
improving day by day, so I haveto also admit that I use a lot
of sound recognition or voicemessage function for any texting
(49:08):
applications.
In Japan, we have a messagingapplication called Line and more
than 80% of the Japanesepopulation use it.
But then I stopped typing everytime because it's taking too
much time, and I started to usethe voice message function, and
it does not do the perfect job,especially those words that
(49:31):
sound the same, with differentmeanings.
But I can just edit and changethose words only, and then I can
also say period or comma, andthey give us common or period
and they can make the sentencesum.
So that's a great thing.
So I'm also in a sense livingwith the technology, but I'm not
dictated by the technology.
(49:52):
So it's like, uh, you're,you're coexisting with the
technology, but I'm, I have, Ihave, I have the handle.
You know, I'm the pilot.
Uh, I'm not the passenger.
That's how I feel about thistechnology.
Speaker 1 (50:03):
Yeah, oh, I like that .
Yeah, I'm definitely coexistingwith it too, you know, but not
not being dictated by it.
But, um, I do for a fact lovein my just general life not
necessarily with interpretinghow much more efficient I feel
that I could give it a specificresponsibility and I don't have
(50:26):
to spend hours on end onsomething that it just helps me
a shortcut right, it'll help meget to it, and I know a lot of
interpreters use it forcontext-based.
So when we were talking aboutearlier about context, being
able to sort of derive contextabout a particular topic, as
opposed to searching for it andcompiling it ourselves, ai can
(50:49):
do that for us in split seconds,in terminology as well.
So now our glossaries are nolonger something that we
necessarily have to be consumedby.
Ai can create that for us in amatter of seconds as well.
So, absolutely, definitely withyou on that.
Being able to have it as partof my work, but not it dictating
(51:13):
my work, I think, is definitelythe best view of it when it
comes to technology, at least upuntil this point.
We're getting down to basicallythe end of our conversation,
but I want to make sure that Igive you the opportunity to
share any new insights or anynew words of inspiration for our
(51:35):
listeners, whether that besomeone that is just starting
out in the field or someone thatis considering entering the
field.
What words of advice orrecommendation do you have for
the generation of new languageprofessionals?
Speaker 2 (51:51):
Yeah, that's the best question, or a great question.
I think the message for youngergenerations who aspire to
become an interpreter or alanguage professional is this
Learning a language or learninghow to interpret it itself is
meaningful.
And when you look at AI, theycan do the job.
I know it.
(52:11):
But then you love the action,you love the act itself of
interpreting or learning aforeign language.
That's actually like a drug forme and it feels really like
addictive.
Sometimes I want to do it inEnglish, I want to speak in
English, I want to interpret it.
So even if the people don't payme for it, I will still be
(52:34):
interpreting for the fun of it.
So that's why, like, if youreally can enjoy this not for
money but for yourself, theninterpreting is for you.
But if you think you areinterpreting just for something
else, like for the monetarypurpose, then maybe you should
think twice about this.
So, do you love it?
If you don't love it, maybeit's not your job.
(52:56):
But if you love it, welcome tothe world of interpreting.
I think that's the message forany younger generation who
aspire to become an interpreter.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (53:04):
Excellent words of advice, particularly if you're
wanting to do it for the money.
That's not necessarily.
This's not necessarily thatthis is not necessarily the
profession for it, but theconnection there with regards to
what you're doing and how youdo it, there is definitely a
(53:24):
sense of pride in in the work.
So thank you for thatrecommendation.
And and then lastly, Rohe,where can our listeners find out
more about you and the workthat you do?
Speaker 2 (53:41):
yeah, thank you for that.
Um, I am on youtube, I am onfacebook, um, so if you can
search, uh, real, hey, onishi,um, you can find me.
I'm talking about interpretingand learning English and stuff
like that.
I'm also on LinkedIn.
I also am on Instagram.
I do not have a lot of shortvideos, but mainly I'm on
(54:03):
YouTube and, sorry, I'm mostlyspeaking in Japanese, but
sometimes I do upload Englishrelated articles and videos when
I find some English speakerslike you.
So in those times, please dosee me there.
Yep, maybe you can findsomething really interesting
about interpreting.
I'm talking really a lot aboutinterpreting in a way that's not
(54:27):
really publicized yet.
So, like when you see YouTubevideos about interpreting, you
will hear something like hey,interpreters can earn X million
yen or Y billion yen I don'tknow if it's a billion yen, but
you know this kind of monetarythings but I'm not talking about
that.
So if you're looking forsomething different from those
(54:48):
kind of mainstream interpretingvideos, then welcome to my
channel.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (54:53):
I'll make sure to include those links in the
episode notes.
Rioje, it was a pleasuretalking to you once again,
having you come back to the show.
I hope that in the near futurewe get to do this again, just to
see where you're at and wherewe're at at that time.
Speaker 2 (55:09):
Sure, let me once again try this.
Muchas gracias por invitarme,pero no sé nada más en español.
Welcome back to another episode of the Brand the
Interpreter podcast.
This is Mireya, your host.
To all returning listeners,thank you for joining me again
and if this is your first timetuning in, welcome.
I am so glad you're here.
So I want to begin today'sepisode by asking you some
questions to think about as youare listening to today's episode
(00:29):
.
I want you to think about whatit really means for you to be an
interpreter.
Is it simply transferring wordsfrom one language to another,
or is it something more,something deeper, more human, or
perhaps something that doesn'tjust connect us to others but
(00:51):
quietly reshapes us too?
In today's episode of Brand theInterpreter, we welcome back a
returning guest, ryohei Onishi,interpreter, educator and TEDx
speaker from Japan, whoseevolving journey invites us to
rethink the soul of thisprofession.
Five years after his first TEDxtalk on de-verbalization, ryohei
(01:15):
returned to the TEDx Kobe stagein 2024 with a new message
being the voice of others.
But what does that really mean?
What does it take to fully stepinto someone else's thoughts,
emotions and intentions,especially when the message is
raw?
Interpreting war, themysterious sync moments between
(01:38):
interpreter and speaker, and whysilencing your inner voice
might just be the most powerfullistening tool we have.
We also explore what it meansto be a human interpreter in a
(02:01):
world now saturated with AI, andhow our value isn't found in
speed but in presence.
Throughout our conversation,you'll hear that Ryoji offers
more than insight.
He offers perspective rooted inempathy, intentionality and
(02:21):
love for the art ofcommunication.
So if you've ever wondered whatlies beyond the words, beyond
the terminology, the moments wedon't often speak about, the
things maybe we just think aboutor things that go unheard of,
this episode is for you.
We're not just talking aboutthe profession, we're sharing
(02:44):
our stories.
So if this is the type of stuffthat you'd like to hear about
with regards to our profession,then you have found your home.
This is the Brand theInterpreter podcast, where I
share your stories about ourprofession.
Let's dive in Rioje.
(03:12):
Welcome to the show.
I'm so glad to have you back.
Welcome back.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Yeah, thank you very much for your invitation.
Muchas gracias por invitarme,pero no sé nada más en español.
Does that make?
Speaker 1 (03:28):
sense.
It makes perfect sense actually.
So thank you so much Thank youso much.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
It's always a pleasure to be able to have past
guests come back and share withus where they've been and what
different things have happenedin between, and the amazing
thing about it, at least for me,it's that it's been a whole
three years since you were lasthere, so that's amazing.
And for those of you that arelistening and did listen to
(03:59):
Ryohei's past episode, he joinsus all the way from Japan.
Speaker 2 (04:05):
Yep, do you know Japan?
Speaker 1 (04:07):
I wish I knew Japan.
I wish Actually my son.
I have a younger son that isalways saying that when he gets
older he's going to move toJapan.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
We're always welcome yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:22):
So, yeah, maybe fast future, a few years, once he
gets older, he'll invite me tocome over.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
if that's in fact what happens, I'll let you know
yeah, sure, and I will start tospeak and try to study more
spanish language as well well,talk to us real here about
what's been going on.
Speaker 1 (04:39):
I know that the last time you were here, you did
share that you had been on TEDx,and so we talked and did a deep
dive on that particularexperience for you and, of
course, your experience as alanguage professional all the
way from the other side of theworld.
But talk to us what has beenhappening since then and then
(05:00):
share with us the fact that youactually were invited to come
back to TEDx and you gaveanother conversation about
interpreting.
So catch us up.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
Yeah, sure, thank you so much for the introduction.
I came back to TEDx Kobe 2024.
Last time it was 2019.
So I came back after five years, but it happened after a long
process of the audition and therehearsals and the selection and
all that.
So it was not like a straightprocess, but then I was really
(05:32):
able to come back with differentideas about what interpreting
is.
I think last time, back in 2019, I talked about
de-verbalization.
That was a very fresh idea forme, but this time I had to talk
about something else, about whatinterpreting does to people,
and this time we really focusedon being the voice of others.
(05:53):
That's the kind of phrase whichcame out after a long process
of consideration and aconversation with other people.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Yeah, For the audience that hasn't had the
opportunity to listen to yourepisode which, by the way, after
today's episode, I hope you goback and find Rio Hay's episode.
I'm going to link in theepisode notes but just briefly
explain what de-verbalizationconcept is about, and then we'll
get into the other, tedxepisode.
Speaker 2 (06:21):
Yep, sure, like de-verbalization is in a way a
paradoxical concept forinterpreting, because
interpreters are basicallyverbalizing.
So we think that we're alwaysverbalizing what other people
are saying.
But actually we first try tode-verbalize what people are
saying and get out of the worldof language and get into the
(06:43):
world of meaning and then wereally get and understand what
the people are saying and comeback to the world of language
and say what the speaker wassaying in a different language.
So that's the process that weare going through, especially in
simultaneous interpreting.
I believe that was the conceptwhich I tried to introduce in
(07:04):
the TEDxCOVID-19, 2019 talk.
I hope it makes sense byexplaining this way.
Speaker 1 (07:11):
Yeah, and, like I said, I'm definitely going to
include that episode in theepisode notes, that link, but of
course also the informationthat you can go back to his TEDx
talk then where he explainsthat so that you could sort of
get a good grasp of it.
And I think what I really likeabout what happened, ryohei, is
(07:32):
that you first introduced thistopic to that particular
audience in a very, shall we say, scientific way so that they
meaning the audience, thegeneral audience can understand
sort of that, that scientificprocess of the brain of the
interpreter and what isoccurring sort of in the
(07:53):
background.
So I often say it's not aninput output process, there's
actually something going onright in the brain with an
interpreter.
But what I also like is thatnow you've come back to humanize
the profession, meaning you'vecreated something, a
conversation with a generalaudience about the human aspect
(08:15):
of interpreting.
So let's talk about that alittle bit more and share with
this audience what it is thatyou brought to the conversation.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
Yeah, thank you so much for that question.
For this 2024 TEDx talk, I hadto face one difference from the
last time, which is that,although in 2019, we did have
simultaneous interpretation ofmy talk into Japanese language,
but this time we didn't.
So I had to really make surethat by speaking in English,
(08:47):
then the participants couldunderstand without the
simultaneous interpretationdevice.
So it seems like the conferencehall for that TEDxCOBE
conference in 2024 didn't allowthe technical equipment for
simultaneous interpreting.
That was the kind ofenvironmental condition that I
had to kind of meet.
(09:07):
So then I thought about thislike, hey, okay, if I'm an
interpreter, but if we cannotuse the interpreting function,
then what can I do?
Maybe I had to change the way Italk about the idea.
So when I say the voice ofothers, it's really about
becoming the voice of thespeaker.
For example, if you'reinterpreting for a president,
you have to feel like thepresident, you have to speak
(09:30):
like the president, and this issomething that I call
personalization, or somethingthat I used to call
personalization.
But then, when I was workingwith the TEDxCOBE speaker team,
I called this team Team Ryohei,by the way, and the team members
said like this team, TeamRyohei, by the way, and the team
members said like, okay, whatis personalization?
I couldn't really understandthat word.
(09:51):
So I had to really go deeperand made it really really simple
by saying, oh, notpersonalization, but
internalization, does that makesense?
And then the team member saidno.
Then I had to come back againand I said voice of others and
they said like, okay, that makessense.
Yeah, so I had to really makeit easy.
(10:12):
But then, by making it reallyeasy, the word of interpreting
really went into the minds ofthose participants.
So I think that's anotherversion of my TEDx talk
experience, like interpreterstalking about interpreting
without simultaneousinterpretation.
That's kind of paradoxical, butin this way I was able to make
(10:33):
it really successful this time.
Speaker 1 (10:35):
Yeah, and it almost feels like you actually became
the speaker, which you wereright, the speaker, which you
were right, but in this caseit's like you were the
individual that was trying toget across your thoughts, your
original thoughts and feelingsabout your subject to an
audience that spoke a differentlanguage.
(10:57):
And so now, right, you're sortof de-verbalizing your own
information in order for it toconnect to your audience.
I like this notion of when youare someone's voice, you feel
(11:17):
what they feel and you speak theway they speak.
What do you say is the actualprocess to that for an
interpreter if there is aprocess, Because I almost feel
like it isn't just about showingup as a trained interpreter and
by magic it happens what do youthink is the actual process in
(11:41):
order for that synchronization,if you will, to occur?
Speaker 2 (11:46):
Right?
That's a great question, and Ithink if we try to make a
comparison between just merelyspeaking a foreign language to
interpreting, I think thecontrast is much clearer.
I think, for example, when weare learning a foreign language
like English, then we try tospeak English better.
So you want to talk aboutyourself, right?
So you focus on.
So you want to talk aboutyourself, right, so you focus on
(12:07):
yourself.
I want to talk about this, talkabout this, so you focus on
yourself.
But then when you start doinginterpretation, actually for me
I had a very hard timeunderstanding others, because in
the world of interpreting, younever talk about yourself.
You have to talk about others.
You have to stop talking aboutyourself and you have to really
(12:28):
listen and it's really a greatthing for me to learn that the
word listen is spelleddifferently and you get silent,
right, listen and silence.
So that really totally makessense for the interpreters.
In order to do a betterinterpretation, you have to
really be silent and listen, andthat's for me, the way to be
(12:51):
the voice of others.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Yeah, I like that Listen silently, right, it's
something of the sort.
So it's like you have to turnoff that internal dialogue.
I suppose that would be one ofthe processes to really be able
to take in the delivery of theperson that you're interpreting.
(13:15):
For I often feel like, wheneverthat does occur particularly, I
think it happens more for methe experience I'm referring to
when I'm doing a simultaneousinterpretation more so than a
consecutive, in a dialoguesetting I feel that when I'm
(13:36):
experiencing that it occursduring a simultaneous
interpretation and it doesn'toccur with every speaker, and
I've never really stopped orhave paused to think about why I
sync with particularindividuals and why I don't with
others.
But I can tell you that from myexperience I definitely feel
(13:58):
that the message is conveyed asclose to its original when I do
have that sync moment I call itsync moment because I've
actually expressed that toothers where I feel like I
synced with the speaker, I knowwhere they're going, I
understand the essence of themessage and so I'm able to
(14:20):
interpret it in that way, but itdoesn't happen with every
speaker.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Oh yeah, it's a very difficult question Because I do
feel that I'm synchronizing inyour definition and for me it's
being the voice of others andit's hard to be the voice of
everyone because sometimes it'sdifficult to really download the
people's voice, sometimesbecause of the difference in the
way they think.
(14:45):
For example, I didinterpretation for the United
Nations University director orParis Saint-Germain you know,
soccer ball players and I didn'tplay soccer ball, so I had to
start like, hey, what is soccerball, how do they work?
And then it had to come with avery good amount of downloading
(15:06):
about what soccer players do.
And I also did the pressconference interpretation of an
NBA basketball coach.
I didn't play basketball at all, so I had to start really like,
hey, how does basketball work?
And and so this kind ofdownloading.
But then, regardless of theoccupation or the work that they
do, as long as I am able todownload the voice of others, I
(15:29):
was able to be them, be likethem.
It was really strange butreally and mysterious experience
, in my opinion, to be reallyable to feel like what they're
saying.
And I felt really heavy when Iwas interpreting about Ukrainian
war and that was the kind ofseminar about the Japan's
(15:52):
self-defense force.
I had a one-day seminar withthem and then they were talking
about the death toll or thesoldiers dying on the
battlefield in Russia or Ukraine, and interpreting about this
seminar really made me heavy,and then that was really
difficult for me to get out ofthat voice of others.
So sometimes I can download,and if you over-download it's
(16:16):
hard to get away from it.
So I had to kind of go away,shut down my PC and then take a
walk for just 15 minutes for meto kind of decentralize the
voice of others and stuff likethat.
Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (16:31):
Oh, totally.
I think that that's somethingthat we've spoken about, at
least in the show on previousepisodes with other individuals
that have talked aboutinterpreting for situations that
you know have have this impactat the moment, and just the
trying to disconnect after hasto be very intentional.
(16:52):
It's not something thatautomatically happens.
You know, to sort of follow theword choice here, we have to
unplug from that download inorder to be able to make that
disconnect.
But it has to happen sointentionally because it doesn't
automatically happen.
So this is where we've talkedabout also in the past year
(17:15):
about that self-care as aninterpreter, because we have to
sort of make it that habit.
Yes, when we do our work.
I want to, I want to continuetalking about this be my voice
topic because I feel likethere's so many different angles
that we can go right and deepdive on it.
(17:36):
I often find that especially, Ithink, for the newer
interpreter that hasn't yet hitthat piece or that moment in
which they really make aconnection with this description
for seasoned interpreters aboutbecoming someone's voice, in
(17:57):
the beginning it feels likebeing someone's voice is
speaking for them.
So how would we differentiatebeing someone's voice from
speaking on their behalf?
Speaker 2 (18:14):
someone's voice from speaking on their behalf.
Right, it's also a verydifficult or and a great
question as well.
But when I think aboutinterpreters, there are at least
two different types ofinterpreters.
One is the interpreter thattranslates the words or
(18:38):
languages, and another one isthe interpreter that translates
the meaning of the speakers.
So, and I try to be the thelatter one, um, I want to be the
person who can talk, who cantranslate the meaning of what
they're saying.
And then when I teach umstudents about samaritani
interpreting especially, theyfirst try to go after every
single word that the Japanesepeople say, and then they run
(18:59):
out of time and they speak toomuch and they don't know how to
omit the words and they forgetto listen.
Once again, the silent andlisten, they forget to listen.
They just are too muchpreoccupied with just speaking
or just consuming whatever soundthey're hearing.
And I say no, that's not whatinterpreting is.
(19:19):
Interpreting is not justspitting out every single word
that the speaker is saying.
It's about really understandingthe meaning.
And interpreting reallyenriches your life.
That's what I'm telling thestudents.
And then they begin tounderstand, like, okay,
interpreting.
They thought interpreting isjust like the extension of
learning of foreign languages.
(19:40):
But that's not exactly true.
Learning interpreting is livinga life itself.
For me, interpreting is a wayof life, so that's why I want
them to also understand thatinterpreting is not just the art
of language, it's also the artof life as well, if I can put it
(20:00):
this way.
Speaker 1 (20:02):
That's beautiful actually, and I think that,
again, when somebody is goingthrough training or through
studies of this profession,ultimately, whether that be
during the program or after, inpractice, perhaps that
connection, hopefully thatconnection is actually made,
because you know, one thing isin theory and another thing is
(20:24):
in practice.
Right, how do we make thatconnection of it's not just
about the words, it's about themeaning, once we begin actually
interpreting for individuals,particularly individuals, I feel
that speak freely.
It's about the meaning Once webegin actually interpreting for
individuals, particularlyindividuals, I feel that speak
freely.
So it's like thisbi-directional communication.
It's like we have to learn tolisten silently, like you've
(20:45):
mentioned, to be able to makethat connection.
But I also feel like there'sthis sort of gap, sometimes not
just with students, butgenerally speaking.
So what I loved about your talkis that you were speaking to a
general audience.
You brought the message to anaudience that doesn't have that
(21:09):
background in interpreting, thatdoesn't have that background in
interpreting.
So talk to us more about howyou introduced the profession in
a way that humanizes theprofession, that was understood
by a general audience, becausewhen I see the camera pan out, I
see a lot of nods, so there's alot of individuals that are
(21:29):
making a connection with yourmessage.
Share with this audience whatthat was about.
Speaker 2 (21:37):
Yeah, the interaction with the audience where the
participants in TEDx terms wasquite amazing for me, I thought.
First of all, I thought thatwhen I speak in English although
I spoke very slow, but then theparticipants may not understand
everything that I say, but theydid understand it and that was
a positive surprise.
And then I wanted to make thismessage broader, as broad as
(22:00):
possible, so that they are ableto cancel their misunderstanding
about this occupation calledinterpreting.
So when they hear the wordinterpreting or interpreters,
they think like, oh, you are thelanguage master, you know
everything about English orSpanish, whatever.
But then that's not the case.
We're always on the developmentphase, like we're always
(22:22):
learning about new things, aboutforeign languages.
And some people think like we'rejust magicians, but then we're
not like that, we're just humans.
We're also trying to be thevoice of others.
We're learning, we're alwaysstudying stuff like that.
So I just wanted to changetheir misconception about who
interpreters are by making itextremely simple, like be the
(22:46):
voice of others.
And then this act ofinterpreting itself can also be
applied to their lives as well,whether they are playing guitars
, for example, if you're playingthe Beatles, you also feel like
the Beatles, like let it be,let it be.
You know you feel that, right,it's not like you just play the
song, but you also feel like howthey felt.
(23:07):
It's also the same as likepainting a picture.
If you're painting a picture ofthe scenery you're looking at,
you also feel like, hey, thatguy seemed like really sad,
what's going on with him?
Or you are also like being thevoice of the person being
painted.
Um, so my point of making thattalk extremely, as broad as
(23:27):
possible is that I wanted, uh,people or the participants, to
link interpreting to their livesas well.
So there is always somethingthat's really in common with the
interpreting world and theirworld as well.
Yeah, does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (23:45):
Yes, completely.
I often feel like there's somany different ways that we can
explain the profession and everytime someone from the industry
takes the opportunity to talkabout the profession to a
general audience, it's alwaysexciting, just because it's
explained in different ways sothat it hopefully catches the
(24:08):
attention of that particularaudience and their understanding
right of what the interpretingprofession actually is.
I definitely noticed that andhopefully those individuals took
with them that it is definitelymore than an extension of
learning a foreign language.
It goes so much deeper thanthat.
(24:30):
You shared a story in your talk, rioje, about when the
individual said be my voice.
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Share that story with this audience, if you will,
please 10 years ago, back in2014, when I was working for an
Australian manager called WayneMiller he is my best friend
right now and then I was hisinterpreter back then and he, I
(25:03):
think, he knew how to useinterpreters.
So the first day I met him, hesaid like I'm your boss and
you're my voice, so you have tobe my voice, ryohei.
And that really changed my life.
Like, okay, I was just alanguage user I had a good
command of language at the timeas well and I was just be my
(25:25):
voice.
But he said be my voice.
Like I had to be his voice,right, I had to stop talking
about myself and I had to startto listen.
I had to be the voice, right, Ihad to stop talking about
myself and I had to start tolisten.
I had to be the voice of WayneMiller.
So that short three words likebe my voice totally changed my
life, and that has changed mylife to this day as well.
Speaker 1 (25:47):
It's like it turned on a switch right All of a
sudden.
Yeah, you became synced withthat individual, and again I use
that word sync only because Ican't think of anything else
that necessarily for me,mentally, visually, makes that
connection and we sort of haveto become one with the speaker.
(26:09):
So that's why I keep using thatword sync.
But I feel that if individuals,a general audience that works
with interpreters, understoodthe actual work, perhaps that
would also be the messaging andthe understanding of people when
they work with interpreter.
(26:30):
Yes, it would be hey, thisperson needs to be my voice, and
so, if they're going to be myvoice, they need to understand,
maybe, the context, and so wemore easily receive information
prior to an assignment, asopposed to the questioning
behind why does the interpreterneed material?
(26:50):
What have you found throughoutthese last few years, ryohei?
That, whether it be throughyour students or through the
work that you do with regards toour profession, and
particularly with technologynowadays, what have you come
across?
Speaker 2 (27:07):
Yeah, thank you for that question.
It's a great question.
I started teaching universitystudents three years ago and
then this has been a greatopportunity for me to really
look back on what I'm doing, howI can really contribute to the
future generation of Japanthrough interpreting.
And then I also started todefine my class as user
(27:28):
education time, because they'regoing to be graduating from the
university and they are able touse English very well, so they
will be most likely be workingin global companies, and global
companies meaning they will beusing interpreters.
So they will come back to me andsay like, hey, rohei, are you
available this day, with thatday?
And then that for me, it's atime I will say like, yes, i'm'm
(27:52):
available, but you remember myclass, you know how to use
interpreters.
Now, right, don't use me, don't, don't abuse me.
You, you just have to use me,right?
That's what I would say if theyask me that question.
But so for me, really teachingthem how to interpret is also
about teaching them how to useinterpreters.
So user education is soimportant because they are going
(28:14):
to be the main generation inthe future and if they know how
to use interpreters, they canalso make international business
, global business moresuccessful, right?
So from that viewpoint as well,like teaching and going to the
class every Monday morning isjust way more than just teaching
90 minutes.
It's more about nurturing thefuture generation of Japan.
(28:37):
That's how I define my job onevery Monday morning.
Speaker 1 (28:41):
I love that.
That's lovely, I think I oftenthink about when we are training
others on how to work withinterpreters, whether that's the
interpreters themselves,potential interpreters or other
individuals.
I often think of them as brandambassadors.
So you've got people that areout there promoting the brand
(29:10):
right.
When you talk about it in thatcontext, I think of them as that
brand ambassadors, because theyknow how to work with an
interpreter, they understand theintricacies of interpreting
because you're teaching them now, and so they're able to help
promote the profession in a waythat's different from somebody
(29:33):
that doesn't understand what itactually is.
So, yeah, in my mind I usuallycall them well, these are the
brand ambassadors.
You are an extension of theprofession now, because now that
you know better, hopefully youdo better.
Yeah, I really like the word,yeah, a brand ambassador.
Speaker 2 (29:55):
So they're all ambassadors.
So I need to really tell theright message and they also need
to get the right understandingof what interpreters are doing
and how hard interpreting couldbe.
So that's why I don't reallytry to evaluate whether their
interpreting is really accurateor not, like hey, that was a
great interpreting or that wasnot a great interpreting.
I try not to jazz that way,because in this way you are just
(30:20):
expecting the unexpected.
So you can't expect them, likestudents who are just still
studying English, to interpretjust like professionals do.
And yeah, so, and not so manypeople are going to be a
professional interpreter, indeed, after they graduate.
So what I can really contributeto in the future for them is
for them to really understandthe occupation, the art of
(30:45):
interpreting, so that when theyknow how hard it is, they also
would be able to be kind to thefuture interpreters, and that
also makes a really betterecosystem for the interpreting
world as well, right?
So that's why I don't say, likeit took one minute for you to
interpret this one single line.
How come?
(31:05):
No, no, I wouldn't really saythat.
I would just say like, okay,it's okay, that's interpreting.
You learned how hardinterpreting is.
That's the lesson for you today.
You did a great job.
That's what I would say.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:17):
Oh, I like that.
That's so great.
I think that you're absolutelyright.
Not everyone necessarily thatgoes through that training.
That might be their intentionin the beginning, but maybe they
realize, like many otherprofessions, not just with
interpreting that this is notactually what they want to do.
But now they have a deeperunderstanding about the
profession and they can go outthere and help advocate for the
(31:42):
right setting for an interpreter.
For example I know that we inthis show we've talked about it
a couple of times where there'sa researcher, an interpreter
researcher by the name of DrSofia Garcia-Bayer, and she
coined this term communicativeautonomy, right, and it's like
(32:06):
this mouthful for what basicallyshe describes as the essence of
an interpreter, in which theinterpreter allows for the right
environment for individuals tobe responsible for and in
control of their owncommunication.
(32:27):
And I know that when I firstheard that, I suddenly realized
what interpreting was all about.
In the beginning it was just,you know, a plug and play.
Basically, I learned mystrategies, my techniques, I
would show up to my assignment,I would interpret and you know,
(32:48):
every assignment was that way.
But when I came across thisterm, I realized there is so
much more, it's so much deeperthan what we're actually, even
as an interpreter, sometimesthat we're actually making a
connection with.
How do you see that, incombination with being my voice
(33:08):
as far as an interpreter,internalizing what their true
essence is?
Speaker 2 (33:13):
Right, if I understand this correctly,
having the right environment tobe able to do the job or to be
able to take the responsibilityas an interpreter is so crucial.
It's so crucial All the morebecause we're now interpreting
more often online than before.
Then having the rightenvironment is something that we
(33:35):
have to really advocate to theusers or customers, because they
cannot see us so easily becauseof the online communication.
That's one thing, and thenanother thing is that we
interpreters have to know whatthe right environment is for us
Like.
If we are missing thiscondition, that condition, that
condition, then we wouldn't beable to really take
(33:57):
responsibility as an interpreter.
So we have to really sacrificeand compromise the quality of
interpreting and then I'll bereally honest with that to the
customer, sometimes anyinformation or agenda or any
keywords shared with us rightbefore the meeting, until right
before the meeting, then I I'mnot a god, I'm not a magician,
(34:22):
right, so I would say I wouldn'tbe able to take responsibility.
I would just say whatever theyhear.
So I'll be the type oneinterpreter, the interpreter
that just translates thelanguage.
Um, I'm not really satisfiedwith that, but then that also in
a sense exemplifies the factthat if the right environment is
not there or is missing, thenthe whole thing about
(34:46):
interpreting or the wholeconversation uh, bilingually is
going to collapse.
So that's what I, in a sense,indirectly want to tell the, the
customers or the clients, sothat they also think like oh, I
made a mistake because I madethe wrong choice about creating
the conditions for interpreters.
That's why that meetingcollapsed or failed.
(35:06):
Next time I have to do itdifferently.
That's kind of user educationthat I want to do through my job
.
Yeah, does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Completely and, speaking of first type, which we
mentioned, was the interpreterthat is, focusing more on the
words as opposed to the meaning.
Yes, we often think aboutexperiences, as a language
professional, that help shapeour understanding of our own
(35:38):
profession or that help shapeourselves as the professional.
You talked about the story ofthe individual that said be my
voice, which sort of turned onthe switch for you.
You know, there's thoseexperiences in which, as
interpreters, we suddenly feellike, wow, maybe I'm not as good
as I thought or maybe I need toquestion this a little bit more
(36:02):
.
Was there ever a moment for youlike that while interpreting,
whether it be a speaker or asubject, in which you felt all
the training that you have andexperiences wasn't enough?
Speaker 2 (36:15):
all the training that you have and experiences wasn't
enough.
Yeah, I do come across thiskind of experiences and that is
quite evident when it comes tothe in-house interpreting or
business setting interpretation,and they're dealing with terms
that only they use inside of oneparticular company and that's
not, of course, on the internet,so you can't really check it.
(36:36):
And even though it's on theinternet, they don't tell us
about that right before themeeting.
So those are the cases thatinterpreting seems to become
more challenging because of thereally closed range or scope of
the words being used in thatkind of setting.
But when it comes to forums orsymposiums or different types of
(36:59):
webinars or seminars, they aretalking about something that is
partially searchable on theinternet, so we can get those
pieces of information and thismeans that interpreters can also
learn by preparing forinterpreting and they can do a
better interpretation.
So confidentiality could be onecondition that will really
(37:21):
change the fate or the successor failure of interpreting.
I would say yeah, and I dounderstand that they can't
disclose all the informationbecause that's confidential, but
then at the same time this alsoaffects in a sense, the quality
of interpreting as well.
So I'm still thinking orsearching for a better way to
(37:42):
satisfy myself and satisfyingclients with the in-house or the
in-company interpretingenvironments.
I know that confidentiality isquite a high barrier, but I'm
just hoping that someday, youknow, we can try to get away
from this kind of difficulty.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
One of the things that I really appreciate about
being able to have conversationswith language professionals
from around the world is sort ofseeing the changes in the
industry and similarities aswell between you know other
parts of the world and here inthe States, and of course, here
we've been having a lot ofconversation with regards to AI
(38:26):
and what that's doing in theindustry.
What is Japan seeing in thelanguage industry profession
with AI?
If anything, what are thoseinsights that you've come across
that you could share with thisaudience?
That's pretty US-based.
Speaker 2 (38:45):
Yeah, thank you.
Yeah, maybe most of the thingshappening in Japan are the same
as what's happening in the US aswell, but I would say that the
situation has changed, totallychanged, with the advent of AI.
Nowadays I think prior to AItimes, we were living in a world
where there were only twosituations Situation one where
(39:07):
there is no interpretationprovided, and there is a
situation where interpreting isprovided.
So it's like zero or a hundred,right, zero or a hundred.
But then right now we're livingin a world where interpreting
or translation of some form isprovided a hundred percent, like
it's not a human interpreter,but machine translation is
(39:31):
available.
So the automatic subtitlingwill be available on the screen,
even though you're joiningMicrosoft Teams or Zoom or
whatever it is, so you are ableto see the translation or at
least see the subtitles of whatthe people speaking in English
are talking about, so they'reable to see that or they're able
(39:51):
to kind of understand what'sgoing on.
But then in this second world,then the choice would be do you
want to go to machinetranslation or human
interpretation?
So it's 100% and 100%.
There is no choice for nointerpretation, no translation
provided.
There is something alreadyprovided, right, then people are
(40:14):
left with two choices machinetranslation or AI translation,
or human translation.
Which one would you want tochoose, and would you want to
pay for human interpretation ornot?
So it was not the matter ofnecessity.
It is now the matter of choice.
That's the world we're livingin, at least in Japan.
(40:35):
I'm not sure about how thethings are working in the US,
but yeah, that's how I take it.
Speaker 1 (40:40):
I think in a sense it's basically the same right,
and perhaps even worldwide itwould be.
And the concern is always thatthat other choice has variable
factors, meaning the use oftechnology.
Number one right theunderstanding of the technology
itself.
Usually, I imagine, there'sthis lag time between the
(41:05):
general audience and theunderstanding of the technology.
Well, first, I think, theacceptance of the technology,
because not, let's face it, noteveryone, not everyone trusts
technology.
So just having that acceptanceperhaps first, and then being
able to learn how to use it.
But I think the conversationsthat we've been seeing thus far
(41:29):
as well around this topic is thecost, which is, I mean, that's
not anything new.
We could all agree that cost isalways a driver for
decision-making in many of theorganizations that we interpret
for.
But obviously the cost of thetechnology in this case would
(41:52):
definitely be something that isa decision-making factor because
it's more affordable.
I suppose you can say so, whileI love this notion that you
just talked about, it went fromeither zero right, no service,
to full service, 100%.
(42:13):
There is no zero capability nowbecause of the technology, and
that piece is great.
Speaker 2 (42:23):
Yeah, it's a great thing.
Yeah, it's a universalizationof interpreting service?
Yeah, then we are now facedwith a different question.
As an interpreter, what is theadded value can you provide?
Right?
I think that's the new questionthat the interpreters of the
2025 are faced with.
Speaker 1 (42:42):
Yeah, oh, I like that .
So what is your added value asan interpreter in this era of AI
?
A dramatic pause forinterpreters to ponder.
I mean, it's not that it'snecessarily been something
different, right, in terms of,hey, we have to learn to
differentiate ourselves asinterpreters in the language
(43:06):
industry by, I don't know, maybespecializing in something or
having a niche, or something ofthe sort.
So I think that concept, youknow we've had around in a while
, but now there's a new, youknow a new player right in the
game, and this one is a littlebit different.
So I think that theconversations are always
centered around AI nowadays, itfeels like.
(43:28):
So I wanted to get a feel, foryou know, what's happening out
in the world, out in Japan.
Speaker 2 (43:50):
What's happening out in the world, out in Japan.
For when I teach Englishreading classes, then even
though they're given Englishreading assignment, they first
go to DPL or Google MachineTranslation and they get the
Japanese translation first.
They read it first and then, ifthey don't understand what's
(44:10):
written, even with that Japanesetranslation, they first, then
they go to English.
So it's totally the other wayaround compared to 30 years ago
when I was studying English.
Right, yeah, that's one thing,but then another thing is when I
see other interpreters in Japanworking, they are also working
in different styles.
Some of them do use machinetranslation of the presentations
(44:35):
or presentation slides intoJapanese.
So they read out the machinetranslation Japanese version for
interpretation, likesimultaneously.
And then when I saw that, whatI felt is like, okay, they are
working with the AI, that's good, that's good, yeah.
But then I wanted to avoid beingthat kind of interpreting.
(44:59):
On the other hand, I wanted tobe myself.
I wanted to do interpreting inmy own way.
They can help us.
I mean, ai can help us do it,but AI is not going to do it for
me, I just want to do it myself.
Ai can maybe help us with thecertain translation of a
(45:19):
technical term that I don't know, but then they're not going to
dictate my job.
That was my kind of the thinkingback then when I saw other
interpreters doing the job.
So I don't know if it makessense in the context of the US,
but I just want it to be humanand when a lot of interpreters
are looking like AI translators,I want to be a human
(45:44):
interpreter by not looking at AI.
So it's like when you watch TV,you behave like a TV celebrity,
right, but then when you don'twatch TV, you don't know what
the celebrities are doing.
Just like that.
If you're watching AI, then youtranslate just like AI, but I
don't watch, I don't see AI, soI don't know how AI behaves.
(46:08):
Maybe that could be thedifferentiator for my
interpretation.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Yeah, yes, I like that.
So it's the natural versus the.
I don't know the machine, right, and I do know what you're
talking about, because I thinkat one point somebody had
mentioned the integration of AIas it's captioning the speech
(46:36):
and the interpreter is somehow.
You know, that was acomplicated part for me is that
the interpreter is also basingtheir interpretation on that
particular dictation.
But I'm thinking, are we nowthe voice of the machine or are
we the voice of the speaker?
(46:58):
Yeah, because it's the words,but I just and I don't know if
they are using the machine inthe other language or if they're
using it in the source language.
But anyway, my thought was justlike that.
(47:37):
That is some heavy splitattention skills first of all,
reading the content andlistening to the speaker.
And how do we ensure that thewords that are written by
machine is accurate to what thespeaker is saying?
I and I say that because Iremember one time I turned them
on to sort of get a feel and Irealized you know the the.
The text on the screen saidsomething about um evil, or it
was like.
It was just a word that soundedlike whatever the speaker said,
but it was so out of contextand it just threw my brain for a
loop so I was like, nope, thisis not for me, not yet at least
(48:00):
yeah, yeah, yeah, I 100% get it.
Speaker 2 (48:02):
Yeah, uh, in the case of japanese language, if I may
comment on that, um, it doeshave a problem like uh.
In japanese language, we dohave a lot of words that sound
the same but they mean totallydifferently, for example, one
example is ame, that means rainand candy.
(48:23):
So rain and candy.
If you mistake it, then youhave to say it's raining but the
candy is falling down, or youcan make totally silly sentences
, right, depending on how youunderstand the context to be.
Human, interpreters don'tmistake it, but machine
translators may mistake it, andthen they do mistake it.
(48:46):
So that's one thing.
Like the words pronounce thesame but they mean differently
and when written, they aredifferent, right, so that's one
thing, but, on the other hand,sound recognition by AI is
improving day by day, so I haveto also admit that I use a lot
of sound recognition or voicemessage function for any texting
(49:08):
applications.
In Japan, we have a messagingapplication called Line and more
than 80% of the Japanesepopulation use it.
But then I stopped typing everytime because it's taking too
much time, and I started to usethe voice message function, and
it does not do the perfect job,especially those words that
(49:31):
sound the same, with differentmeanings.
But I can just edit and changethose words only, and then I can
also say period or comma, andthey give us common or period
and they can make the sentencesum.
So that's a great thing.
So I'm also in a sense livingwith the technology, but I'm not
dictated by the technology.
(49:52):
So it's like, uh, you're,you're coexisting with the
technology, but I'm, I have, Ihave, I have the handle.
You know, I'm the pilot.
Uh, I'm not the passenger.
That's how I feel about thistechnology.
Speaker 1 (50:03):
Yeah, oh, I like that .
Yeah, I'm definitely coexistingwith it too, you know, but not
not being dictated by it.
But, um, I do for a fact lovein my just general life not
necessarily with interpretinghow much more efficient I feel
that I could give it a specificresponsibility and I don't have
(50:26):
to spend hours on end onsomething that it just helps me
a shortcut right, it'll help meget to it, and I know a lot of
interpreters use it forcontext-based.
So when we were talking aboutearlier about context, being
able to sort of derive contextabout a particular topic, as
opposed to searching for it andcompiling it ourselves, ai can
(50:49):
do that for us in split seconds,in terminology as well.
So now our glossaries are nolonger something that we
necessarily have to be consumedby.
Ai can create that for us in amatter of seconds as well.
So, absolutely, definitely withyou on that.
Being able to have it as partof my work, but not it dictating
(51:13):
my work, I think, is definitelythe best view of it when it
comes to technology, at least upuntil this point.
We're getting down to basicallythe end of our conversation,
but I want to make sure that Igive you the opportunity to
share any new insights or anynew words of inspiration for our
(51:35):
listeners, whether that besomeone that is just starting
out in the field or someone thatis considering entering the
field.
What words of advice orrecommendation do you have for
the generation of new languageprofessionals?
Speaker 2 (51:51):
Yeah, that's the best question, or a great question.
I think the message for youngergenerations who aspire to
become an interpreter or alanguage professional is this
Learning a language or learninghow to interpret it itself is
meaningful.
And when you look at AI, theycan do the job.
I know it.
(52:11):
But then you love the action,you love the act itself of
interpreting or learning aforeign language.
That's actually like a drug forme and it feels really like
addictive.
Sometimes I want to do it inEnglish, I want to speak in
English, I want to interpret it.
So even if the people don't payme for it, I will still be
(52:34):
interpreting for the fun of it.
So that's why, like, if youreally can enjoy this not for
money but for yourself, theninterpreting is for you.
But if you think you areinterpreting just for something
else, like for the monetarypurpose, then maybe you should
think twice about this.
So, do you love it?
If you don't love it, maybeit's not your job.
(52:56):
But if you love it, welcome tothe world of interpreting.
I think that's the message forany younger generation who
aspire to become an interpreter.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (53:04):
Excellent words of advice, particularly if you're
wanting to do it for the money.
That's not necessarily.
This's not necessarily thatthis is not necessarily the
profession for it, but theconnection there with regards to
what you're doing and how youdo it, there is definitely a
(53:24):
sense of pride in in the work.
So thank you for thatrecommendation.
And and then lastly, Rohe,where can our listeners find out
more about you and the workthat you do?
Speaker 2 (53:41):
yeah, thank you for that.
Um, I am on youtube, I am onfacebook, um, so if you can
search, uh, real, hey, onishi,um, you can find me.
I'm talking about interpretingand learning English and stuff
like that.
I'm also on LinkedIn.
I also am on Instagram.
I do not have a lot of shortvideos, but mainly I'm on
(54:03):
YouTube and, sorry, I'm mostlyspeaking in Japanese, but
sometimes I do upload Englishrelated articles and videos when
I find some English speakerslike you.
So in those times, please dosee me there.
Yep, maybe you can findsomething really interesting
about interpreting.
I'm talking really a lot aboutinterpreting in a way that's not
(54:27):
really publicized yet.
So, like when you see YouTubevideos about interpreting, you
will hear something like hey,interpreters can earn X million
yen or Y billion yen I don'tknow if it's a billion yen, but
you know this kind of monetarythings but I'm not talking about
that.
So if you're looking forsomething different from those
(54:48):
kind of mainstream interpretingvideos, then welcome to my
channel.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (54:53):
I'll make sure to include those links in the
episode notes.
Rioje, it was a pleasuretalking to you once again,
having you come back to the show.
I hope that in the near futurewe get to do this again, just to
see where you're at and wherewe're at at that time.
Speaker 2 (55:09):
Sure, let me once again try this.
Muchas gracias por invitarme,pero no sé nada más en español.
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Therapy Gecko
An unlicensed lizard psychologist travels the universe talking to strangers about absolutely nothing. TO CALL THE GECKO: follow me on https://www.twitch.tv/lyleforever to get a notification for when I am taking calls. I am usually live Mondays, Wednesdays, and Fridays but lately a lot of other times too. I am a gecko.