March 14, 2023 • 55 mins
We're back for our 50th episode! The big 5-0. This week is our monthly tech news show and we give a shoutout to the Cisco Champions community, Alex using Cisco Continuing Education Credits and renew his CCIE and also some ChatGPT/Google Bard news. Tune in!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Pat (00:01):
Hey everybody.
Welcome back to this week'sedition of Breaking Down the
Bites.
Thanks for joining us this week.
As usual, I'm your host, pat.
You can find me on Twitter at@layer8packet.
That's the number eight.
You can find Kyle on Twitter,@Danath256, and you can find the
show on Twitter at@breakinbytespod.
(00:21):
We're pretty active on Twitter,so come say hello.
If you like the show, don'tforget to subscribe on your
streaming platform of Choicethree Amigos are back again.
This week we're all here.
Yes, it feels like a good time.
We're all here.
We can all get together, singKumbaya, do all those sorts of
things.
So, no guests this week, youjust got us three chatting away,
(00:43):
and we're gonna do the the techour monthly tech news this week
as well.
So, some two, two personal sortof endeavors.
And then a little ai, a littlechat G P T and Google Bard News.
So that's gonna be always alwaysfun as well.
So, Kyle, what's up man?
How you doing?
Kyle (00:59):
live in the dream.
How about yourself?
Pat (01:02):
That's it.
This is the dream.
I'd hate to see the nightmare,I'll tell you that much right
now.
So, yeah.
Nah, man.
We did not get the weather thatwe expected.
It was kind of mild, I gottaadmit.
But you know, it is what it is.
And we there's a chance for agood snow yet here in, in the
east, on the east coast yet.
We we've seen snow up until,early May, or I should say yeah,
early May, early early April.
(01:24):
So, we got about another monthto go.
So we'll see what happens.
I know you're the weather guy,Kyle, so
Kyle (01:30):
let's roll the dice here and,
Pat (01:32):
throw that out there.
Kyle (01:32):
right, right.
Pat (01:33):
I'm knocking on wood cuz I'm not the big snow guy cuz I'm
the one shoveling it.
So I w I would not prefer tohave that happen.
So, I will tell you, I willintroduce you to a man who does
not have snow right now, wherehe is at on the left coast.
Mr.
Alex is back with us.
Hey man, what's going on?
Alex (01:49):
Busy studying trying to renew my CCIE, but we'll talk
about that more a little laterin the podcast.
And
Pat (01:58):
if I ever heard one
Alex (02:00):
right and trying to psych myself up for next week.
So starting tomorrow cuz that'sgonna be the official return to
the office four days a week.
Pat (02:09):
Oh, that's
Kyle (02:10):
Oh man.
Pat (02:11):
That's right.
Alex (02:13):
we'll see.
And the big guy,
Pat (02:16):
far, how far the drive is it for you into the office?
Alex (02:20):
it's 49 miles.
Which I, I did bef I did foryears.
It evolved by pos almost exactlywhat my commute was, but
Pat (02:26):
Yep.
Alex (02:27):
it, it wasn't an la queue commute, so
Pat (02:29):
Right.
Alex (02:31):
it takes me an hour and a half at least to do it.
So, it never bothered me toomuch cuz I was only going to the
office once and then recently,twice a week.
So we'll see how this
Pat (02:42):
How, how it
Alex (02:43):
out.
Pat (02:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
you sound really, really stoked,I must say
Alex (02:49):
I got all kinds of audible books queued up, so that's what
I've been
Pat (02:53):
it just gives you more, it just gives you more power to
listen to podcasts, so it's allgood.
Alex (02:57):
Yeah.
I gotta start subscribing tosome podcasts.
Pat (03:00):
There you go.
So if anyone has any suggestionsfor Alex to get on the train
with podcasts, let us know.
Cuz he's gonna need a wholeboatload for that hour and a
half drive to la So that's oneway.
So technically he's, he's a,he's a three hour guy now.
He's a three hour guy
Alex (03:18):
And that's if I'm lucky, I've had a
Pat (03:20):
on a good day.
Alex (03:22):
pushing two hours on the way
Pat (03:23):
Yeah.
Oh, geez.
Yeah.
So that's, that's interesting.
Alex (03:28):
yeah.
For.
Pat (03:30):
That is interesting.
I'm, I'm curious to see how thatplays out.
So,
Alex (03:34):
I'm interested to see who shows up.
I wanna see how many peopleactually commit to that.
Pat (03:39):
Yeah.
Kyle, what's your drive?
I know you're sort of in theopposite direction of where
you're working now at Cus town.
Kyle (03:45):
Yeah.
It's 27 miles and it takes meabout a half an hour to get in.
like 40 to 45 to get home, 30ish on a good day.
But normally it's, airport roadand like Cedar Crest, they're
always
Pat (04:02):
Ugh.
Terrible.
Kyle (04:04):
not great
Pat (04:05):
Nope, not great.
No traffic here in the LehighValley really, really stinks.
Like we have highways that werebuilt for like the mid fifties
and now we're like trying tolike jam a million cars on these
things.
It's like, good Lord.
Anyway.
Alright, cool.
So, oh, shout out to Louis alsoknown as Netec Weezy on Twitter
(04:27):
for last week's episode.
That was really,
Kyle (04:29):
Yeah, it was awesome.
Pat (04:30):
really cool dude.
We, we appreciate him coming onand sharing his story and giving
us a little a little schoolingon some next Gen firewall stuff.
So, that's gonna be really cool.
So appreciate him coming out.
So, we'll definitely have himback on again.
But this week sort ofhighlighting the community as
some of you may or may not know,the show was nominated last year
(04:51):
for Cisco IT Blog Awards.
We were a finalist last year, soI don't know how that happened.
I don't know who nominated us,but we're glad that they did
obviously.
But yes, totally, totally cool.
And that has opened some doorsfor.
For us as far as a platform to,to reach people me specifically
I think Dean as well who's inthe same community, but we were
(05:13):
roped into, or we were acceptedinto the Cisco Champions
community.
And that's basically it's aprivate community that Cisco has
that you sort of have toregister for, sign up for sort
of be nominated, blah, blah,blah.
And I obviously use the podcastas leverage to get into that
community.
So, kind of rolling off of thatI was fortunate enough to be
(05:35):
invited to do a Cisco ChampionsRadio podcast this week.
And basically the gist of it isif you, if you haven't heard of
it, go check it out.
They have some really, reallycool topics on there.
And it's it, it's, it's a mix ofCisco champions.
So you basically get pickedthere's like two or three per
episode, two or three championsper episode that, that get to go
on.
And there's a set topic.
(05:55):
And then Cisco also invitesBasically Cisco employees
whatever that topic is, theyinvite the SMEs, the subject
matter experts for thatparticular topic or product, and
then have them come on thepodcast with us.
And then basically just, have achat back and forth.
And sometimes it's show, showshowcasing a product.
Sometimes it's, I listened tothe one the other week, it was
on how to basically do, likestudy habits, things of that
(06:16):
nature.
And there's a whole plethora oftopics that are that are out
there.
So, I did one just recently lastweek and it was on the new Cisco
Catalyst 9,500 X series switchthat they have coming out, layer
three switch.
So, we had some product folkover at Cisco come on and talk
about what that is and kind ofwhat's where it came from.
(06:37):
And how that all kind of came tolife and, and, use cases and
guts and, things of that nature.
And it was a really, really gooddiscussion.
Once I have a definite date,I'll, I'll mention it again on
the podcast here just so youguys can tune in.
But yeah, had, had a blast.
It was really, it was a reallygood time and they just keep
coming out with some really goodproducts and, and the 9,500 x
is, is is, nothing short ofthat.
So, totally enjoyed that andlooking forward to being on on
(06:59):
another one the next uh, nextcouple of months depending on
when they pick me.
So I thought that was a coolthing to start the show off with
and, and kind of go from there.
So, yeah, really loved it andwish I could do more of it.
Alex (07:10):
Yeah, and I don't want to ruin it for anyone who plans on
listening to that podcast, butcan you give us kind of the
cliff notes?
So what's the big thing with the9,500 x.
Pat (07:22):
Yeah, so I g you know, so what they did a couple years ago
is they kind of repackaged thecatalyst line under the 9,000
naming moniker, I guess youwanna call it.
So, the, the the three, theCatalyst 3000 became the 93
hundreds, the catalyst, wellnine, the, the, the 2000 line
became the 92 hundreds, 93hundreds, so forth and so forth.
(07:46):
That sort of thing.
So, the catalyst 5k became the95 k, things of that nature.
So, so it's, it was an all allinclusive umbrella, if you will.
I'm trying to bring that morekind of more standardization and
kind of under the same umbrella.
But now it's just a, they're upin the 9,000, so they kind of
try to streamline a lot of that.
So, And I, the 9,500 x is it's,it's meant for a campus, campus
(08:08):
switch, right?
So not technically data centersomewhere in a, in a branch or,
enterprise, type, type buildingheadquarters things of that
nature.
So, but it's got it's got somereally good juice going there.
So, it brings all the standardstuff that Cisco's known for at
that enterprise level, right?
Stateful, switchovers, andthings of that nature.
I think they did bump the gutsup from the, the Mac table.
(08:30):
It's like 128,000 to like 2 56,so they doubled it.
Things of that nature.
What else is here?
It does all the routing, right?
BGP and mpls layer three VPNs.
Yeah.
Ethernet over mpls.
What else?
Spine leaf, you can do that,that kind of thing.
So it is quite, it's quite it's,it's got it's, it's definitely
got the juice and 400 gig is,it's got a couple ports of 400
(08:52):
gig throughput on there.
So, I think it's, it's 40 gig, ahundred gig, 400 gig is kind of
what their ports are, lookinglike.
And then with the, they call'embreakout cables, right?
So, your fiber and whatnot.
So you got, you got 10 gig, 25gig, 50 gig, and then a hundred
gig with the with the specified,breakout cables for, fiber and
things of that nature.
So there's quite a few modelshere and whatnot, but it seems
(09:16):
to, they're creeping into that400 gig territory, which I,
which I find really, reallyinteresting.
Alex (09:22):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's cool.
And I think also the 9,500 lineand maybe some others, I didn't
look into it too much.
I know they're starting to dosome things with containers,
which is a good call.
Back to previous episode we justhad, so now Cisco hardware is
being containerized, and whatthat is allowing people to do is
(09:44):
you can actually run a Dockercontainer on a Cisco device now,
which I'm interested to see howpeople use that as a as
something really helpful.
I mean, from what I'veunderstood, there's nothing
really even stopping you.
You could, you could run a, afull on Linux desktop on a, I
mean, I don't see any reason whyyou don't wanna do that.
(10:05):
But I'm interested to see whatpeople end up using that for.
I know one of the real quickexamples that I saw someone use
it is just to install a reallylightweight version of I purf.
So for anyone who hasn't used Ipurf before, that's the simplest
way you can do to really liketest the circuits bandwidth
capabilities.
It just allows you to, it's atraffic generator.
So people now can install, Iperf in a container right off a
(10:28):
networking device.
And now you can use yournetworking device and really
slam a circuit if you want to,if you wanna do some testing.
But yeah, there's also somethings like some telemetry data
that people can pull.
And now you're used to having topull telemetry data or send
telemetry data somewhere else,but now you're, you're, it's
right there on the same box.
(10:48):
You're trying to get thesereally interesting stats and
maybe some pretty gooeys.
And you can run it right on abox now, which is all pretty
neat.
Pat (10:57):
Yeah.
The other thing I would say toois this falls in line with
Cisco's DNA Center.
So that's their overarching kindof gooey controlled sd software
defined networking platform.
Right.
Which I'm a little shocked thatthey don't have a virtual
version of that.
It's, it's still a physical box,but apparently it's, it's a
pretty beefy box that they havetrouble converting it.
To virtual, but yeah, I digress.
(11:19):
May maybe one day there'll be avirtual version of, of DNA
Center, but yeah.
DNA Center, so this iscompletely compatible with that,
right?
With the automation that seemsto be here and, and sort of ever
booming, netcom s com yangmodels, all that kind of stuff,
that's all supported on the9,500 x zero touch provisioning
is also supported.
So, we all know that theshipping and.
(11:41):
Whatnot has really been adetriment to a lot of tech these
days.
So you're waiting, what seems tobe a long time for, for gear.
Instead of shipping it to aheadquarters and having somebody
configure it and then reshippingit to wherever it needs to go,
you can drop ship it right tothe, the place it needs to go
and it'll, it'll, plug in andcall home and no, no need to
technically touch it, that kindof thing.
(12:02):
So, telemetry is another goodone.
Right, though you kind oftouched on that, Alex, so it
supports all that.
So, yeah.
I was really excited to be apart of it and it seems to be
they've really put some, somereal.
Brains and beef into the 9,500 xstuff.
So, it's, it's, it's reallyinteresting to see kind of where
that's gonna go in the nextcouple of years and, and see if
that really takes off.
But from, from what I've seen orfrom, the discussion that we had
(12:24):
with some of the product folkson that, on that podcast, it was
really cool.
So, shout out to my to my buddyTim Burino as well.
He's he is a host over there atthe Art of Network Engineering
podcast.
He was on with me as well.
He was a champion that was onwith me as well.
So it's always good to see Timre really good guy.
So, yeah, shout out to them.
So, yeah, it was just a cool, itwas a cool time.
Cool, cool podcast and hope tobe part of more so just wanted
(12:45):
to kind of throw that out there.
Alex (12:49):
Awesome.
Pat (12:50):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's really interestingstuff.
So, what else can I say aboutthe champions?
I don't know.
It's, I, I, I enjoy it, man.
It's, it's a cool platform forpeople to get together.
It's a like-minded sort ofcommunity and there, there's a
bunch of things that you get asa champion to kind of get the
inside peek behind the covers,sort of thing.
So, yeah, so, and, and I thinkactually was it registration
(13:12):
just ended not too long ago for,for this year's inductees, if
you will.
So, yeah, so it's a, it's, it'sa pretty cool platform.
And actually my my new boss saidI get to meet tomorrow.
First time meeting him.
Well, I shouldn't say first timemeeting him.
He's actually a champion aswell, so we're part of the same
kind of, kind of community.
So that's kind of cool.
So actually I knew him from aprevious life, so when I worked
(13:32):
at the data center, he, he wasworking for somewhere that had
data center space, so I knew ofhis name and would see him every
now and then.
And now we're kind of crossingpath again.
So he's my new boss.
So I'll, I'll meet, I'll get tosee him tomorrow.
So shout out to him, So it'salways interesting how those
things play out, right?
Small world
Alex (13:52):
So do you, you mentioned that registrations or
nominations, whatever it may be,just closed up.
Does that mean you have to benominated again or are you a
member for life now until theykick you out?
Pat (14:06):
Now.
So technically you have toreapply, quote unquote, every
year.
But as long as you're stilldoing something, like a blog or
like a podcast or some sort ofwhat kind of got you in the
program to begin with, then youknow, there's very little chance
that you'll be, kicked out sortof thing.
But you do have to reapply everyyear.
I don't have to reapply cause Ijust got in last year, but as
(14:27):
this time comes around next yearI'll have to, reapply sort of
thing.
So yeah, it is a, I'm, I'mguessing they do that just so
they don't have people basicallyjust becoming stale, in there,
that kind of thing.
So like if we decide to not, dothis podcast tomorrow, we would
still kind of benefit from thatfor the end of time if they
didn't kind of gate check somepeople.
So I'm guessing that's whatthat's about.
Alex (14:48):
Okay.
And outside of this podcast youjust did recently, do you think
you've been kind of takingadvantage of the platform at
all?
I mean, maybe not as much as youcould be.
Pat (14:58):
yeah, so I, you always probably could be doing a little
more.
But you know, there's some, so,so as, as a champion, you get
access to a exclusive like WebExand there's a bunch of channels
in here.
Stick of it as like a slack kindof thing.
And, and people, people chatfrom, I mean, they're from all
over the world.
So, yeah, basically you're justchatting in all these different
different spaces and, and and asfar as the show, man, we could
(15:22):
literally have guests from heretill forever.
People would come on, you knowwhat I mean?
Just pluck, pluck guests from,from this platform and people
would would totally, you.
Be in on that.
So I could see that we get to,and I get to promote it.
I get to promote it everyepisode within this.
And obviously that's more peoplelistening and eyeballs and,
things of that nature.
And then, as far as from a guestpipeline, it's like an unlimited
(15:45):
amount of guests here cuzthere's a bunch of really,
really smart people in here.
So, we'll probably startplucking some folks here shortly
and just having'em come on andit's it's just a cool thing to
just keep going and see how farit takes us.
Kyle (15:57):
Be
Alex (15:58):
All right, and my last question, maybe the most
important question, did you getany swag,
Pat (16:05):
I did I didn't get any swag.
I know.
I gotta ask about that.
It just depends on,
Alex (16:10):
a sticker or something
Pat (16:12):
I know something.
I know.
That'd be nice.
Yeah, no, I, I hear you.
Alex (16:16):
Don't.
Not expecting like anembroidered jacket or anything,
but
Pat (16:21):
You know what?
I did ask our Cisco count repthat I've been working with
Cisco for 20 years and have nota stitch of Cisco swag any
places I've ever worked.
So I'm like, come on Tim, let'slet's get on that.
And he's like, all right, what'syour size?
So I gave him my size andwhatnot.
He's like, I'll see what I cando.
So, man, I gotta, I actually,I'm gonna see Tim this week, so
I'm gonna, I'm gonna check onthat, see if I get some Cisco
swag.
Alex (16:42):
Yeah, I got some Meraki stuff heading my way.
I just had lunch with Cisco anda couple of the Meraki guys were
in town, so they came on boardand they just said, do you, do
you want any Meraki stuff?
I said, sure.
I mean, I don't use it, butI'll, I'll take some swag.
Pat (16:58):
Heck yeah.
Heck yeah.
That bumps your street cred.
Alex (17:03):
Yeah.
I've been wanting a polo like eever since I got in the Cisco
game like 15 years ago, I stillhave not gotten someone to gimme
a Cisco Polo
Pat (17:11):
Come on.
Somebody at Cisco send this mana polo.
Alex (17:14):
Yes,
Pat (17:15):
He's an ie.
For goodness sake, send him apolo.
The least you could do is sendhim a polo Now the other cool
thing about the Cisco championsthings too, is like you chat
with these people prettyregularly, and then I would say
a good portion of them actuallyhead to Cisco live.
So then it's nice to meet upwith them in person at, at Cisco
live.
So that's the other thing too,I'm kind of looking forward to.
(17:36):
And I've, I have never been toCisco live.
I'm trying to go this year.
So we'll see what see whathappens.
But I would I, I would love togo this year, and I think it's
in Vegas again this year, if I'mnot mistaken.
I would love to go and, and meetsome of these folks and just,
it's kind of just a coolcommunity to hang out with and,
you chat with all these peoplevirtually and then you get to
meet'em in person.
You're like, ah, this is cool.
It kind of brings your fullcircle.
So looking forward to that's,see what happens.
(18:00):
It is in Vegas this year, right?
I think.
Alex (18:02):
I didn't look at it.
I'm surprised that I haven'tthought about it yet cuz it's
coming up before we know itthree months away.
Pat (18:07):
Sis.
Alex (18:08):
I know with layoffs and stuff, companies aren't that
quick to pay for something likethat, but I guess I should ask.
Pat (18:15):
Yep.
There it is.
Las Vegas, June 4th through theeighth.
Kyle (18:19):
No, man,
Alex (18:19):
Yeah.
That's just a, that's a roadtrip for me.
Pat (18:23):
hot hop skipping a jump.
Alex (18:26):
Yeah.
Hour flight, four hour drive.
Yeah.
Kyle (18:30):
not bad.
Pat (18:32):
It's the fir yeah, the first full week in June.
Right on.
So yeah, let's see if I canscore some tickets from that
and, and see what see what comesof it.
So that's gonna be cool.
So yeah, I thought we'd lead offwith that and see just kind of,
talk about that.
And Kyle, you, you applied forit this year cuz you're part of
the show now.
Kyle (18:49):
Yeah.
You gave me the, the link assigned up
Pat (18:51):
Good deal.
Alex, you did too?
Or did you get to that or not?
I wasn't sure if you came alittle later.
Alex (18:56):
yeah.
I applied too.
So we'll see if what happens.
Any idea when they pick those?
Pat (19:01):
It should be soon, from my understanding, I, I can't
remember the exact time lastyear, but I think it should be
soon.
I, I, it was relatively quicklyafter the closing of the, of the
registration period.
So, yeah, I, I'm curious to seeif you guys if you guys get in,
so we'll see what happens, butyeah, that's cool.
So, yeah, so I thought I wouldlead the show with that and just
kind of say, that was reallycool and really look forward to
(19:23):
to that episode coming out in,in May.
I think I think it's in May.
So just be on the lookout forthat and once I get more
details, I'll, I'll send italong obviously.
But that was a really cool coolthing to do.
So.
Kind of pivoting, still talking.
Cisco kind of pivoting though.
Mr.
Alex, you're up on this one.
You mentioned that you're tryingto redo your C C I E or at least
(19:44):
re re-up it, and this is yourfirst time doing it via the
credits, right?
Alex (19:50):
Yeah, that's right.
I've kind of done it the typicalway for the last.
Oh, eight years, I guess, whichis you just have to take the
written again and that renewsyour IE and everything
underneath it.
And I was planning on doing theexact same thing again this
year.
And I just had a guy thatreports to me pretty much told
(20:12):
me I was nuts.
If I want to try brute force inthe written exam again, because
that's what I've been doing.
I mean, I don't, I shouldprobably put a little bit more
effort into it, but I thinkevery time that I've gone to
renew my C C I E, so this wouldbe the, the fourth time I've
done it.
So the three times previous,I've failed it at least once and
wonk
Pat (20:32):
Ah,
Alex (20:33):
And this is, so if you're not getting reimbursed for this,
which I don't think I would, Imean that's$500 a pop.
So
Pat (20:39):
Sure.
Alex (20:40):
you don't want to keep brute forcing it.
But yeah.
A guy that reported me suggestedthat I look into the continued
education.
I, I guess I just thought that,it would be a lot of
administrative overhead, like,take the course and then trying
to figure out how I can provethat I took it and then making
sure that it did count and I seeit.
(21:04):
And I, I did one course recentlyon the digital learning library,
I think is what it's called.
But they have lots of courses onthere.
There's some that are free.
Other ones you pay per course,other ones you, they have other
options like just a full on passthat unlocks everything.
But there are some free ones.
But the one I took was a onpaper, 40 hour course broken out
pretty well.
(21:25):
Has labs, has little quizzes atthe end.
And then at the very end there'sjust a the equivalent of, of an
exam really.
Pat (21:33):
Hmm.
Alex (21:33):
or you have to work through, I don't know how many
different questions.
And if you get a passing grade,then it counts as you've
completed the course and you getthe continued education score
credit for it.
And depending on what level ofcertification you're trying to
renew.
So if it's an associate level,and again, this is all Cisco
stuff and associate level one,that's so the CCNA for example,
(21:56):
that's 40 credits professionallevel, like the ccnp, it's 80
expert level at the C C I E,it's 120 and these 40 hour
courses, and there's severalthey're all 40 credits.
So at least the majority of'emare so, well, one I completed I
think probably took me aboutprobably closer to 20 hours.
Closer to 20 than 40.
And yeah, when I was done thisis the part that was the big
(22:19):
question mark for me.
Again, administratively what,what, how do you actually get
credit for what you've justdone?
But they really do make itstraightforward.
If you go to like ce.cisco comwhich is the continued education
site you log in with your normalCisco credits or your Cisco
credentials, and it'll show youthe certs that you have when
(22:40):
they expire.
And there's an option there to Iguess I forget how they word it,
but get credit for any coursesthat you've done.
So in my case, when I completedthe that course, that 40 hour
horse they gave you a, like a 10digit number to kind of signify
the, the, you completed it.
(23:01):
And when I went to the cecisco.com site I just put in
that 10 digit.
Number when I completed theexam, and it was like an hour
later, it said confirmed, andthree days later it showed that
my CCNA had been extendedanother three years.
I, I saw the extension date.
(23:22):
So it's really asstraightforward as you complete
these courses.
They give you a, a unique valuecode that somehow references the
completed course and you can usethat to yep, renew your
certifications.
So in this case, I, I'm alreadystarting my second one about
halfway through that now, butsounds like this is gonna be the
way to go going forward.
So I'm pretty excited aboutthat.
(23:43):
So, I mean, having said allthat, have you tried any of it
yet, or are you still just doingit the classic way where you're
just let them expire, or take anexam at some point and that's
how you renew your other ones?
Pat (23:58):
Yeah, I got, I gotta be honest, I, all of mine have
actually expired.
They've ex, they were expiredlike right around the beginning
of the pandemic, and I justdidn't, it's just, it was too
crazy.
Stuff was going on, and I let itexpire and I probably shouldn't
have, but I did let it expire.
And so I don't really have anyskin in the Cisco game anymore.
Not that I wouldn't want to, Iprobably, I probably should at
(24:19):
least look at something again,since, where I'm at is 90% Cisco
shop.
But, there's just other thingsthat I'm dealing with now that,
that, that, that are a littlemore beneficial.
Right.
So, like I said, some of theaddress stuff that we that we
talked about, I've been, doing alot of that and things of that
nature.
So it's No, I, I, I don't haveany sort of CE credits or, or
(24:39):
any sort of need for them at themoment, but I totally should.
Just because it's, probablyshould get back on that horse at
least.
At some point I'm interested tosee if I could actually pass the
new ccna, cuz when I passed it,it was it's a decade ago, 2013.
So, that was the older one, or,a couple old versions by now.
But I'm curious to see if Icould pass the new one and then,
kind of go from there.
But the cc m p was really, wasreally cool.
(25:01):
That was a special one.
I just you never thought youcould get there and then all of
a sudden you do and you're like,ah, cool.
I can, kind of hang in with thebig boys.
This is nice, and I was an idiotfor letting them expire.
So, I, like I said, I, Iprobably shouldn't have, but it
just it just is what it is.
So, Kyle, do you have any Ciscosor anymore, did you ever attempt
them or did you have, did theyexpire on you?
Kyle (25:21):
no, no, I actually, I never got any as, as much as
Kevin, Kevin, beat it into ourhead.
Pat (25:27):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We should have.
Yeah, I, well, I took, it tookme three times to pass mine, my,
my ccna.
So I, I have nothing to I havenothing to, to to, to write home
about on that one.
But yeah, it was,
Alex (25:39):
Hey, that search there, Joe
Pat (25:42):
Yeah.
The entry level, I'm, well, thecoming from, coming from
somebody that is just, hasschool like you and I work Kyle,
and not actually like in it dayto day, the NA is a tall order
because it just, it, it's morereal world than just.
(26:03):
Book Text Smart kind of thing.
That, and that's why I, like Isaid, I, I bombed it twice
before passing it a third time,but it's for those that are
trying to break in and do thenetwork thing without any real
world experience, and I don'teven know if they have it
anymore, but the, the C C E N Twas probably the better track to
go to the two, the two testroute rather than the one c n a
(26:24):
route.
But I don't even know if theyhave that anymore because of the
way they restructured theirexams.
So, but yeah, it, it, it's nojoke.
And pe it really, it keepspeople up at night and I could,
I could definitely see why even10 years ago I could see why
Alex (26:37):
So the moral of the story is don't let it.
Pat (26:40):
Yeah.
Don't be an idiot like me andlet it expire.
Alex (26:44):
and you have continued education credits as a valid
option.
And, and like I said, it, youonly need 40 credits to renew an
associate level exam.
And there are some free ones outthere.
If you go to the digitallearning library on several
different top, and it can becompletely different topics too.
So maybe that's not clear toeveryone.
It's like if you have a CCNA inthe classic route and switch
(27:07):
you, you can do a a five hourcourse on SD WAN Meraki's and
which maybe that's not a goodexample cause that's, I think
that's part of the CCNA now, butyou could do a yeah.
On any topic and that'll countas continued education.
Going to Cisco Live also givesyou credits too.
So if you go to Cisco Live, justattending the conference and
(27:29):
then.
if you go to certain breakoutsand can ch you get proof that
you attended them, the, in theirentirety, you get credits for
those too.
So, yeah, you, you, you can, youcan go without ex expiring certs
if you really want to withouthaving to dive back into the
books.
Hardcore again.
Pat (27:47):
Yep.
That's interesting.
I, I, I probably should take itagain just to prove to myself
that I could pass a CCNA again.
I'd be interested to see howthat, how that, how that plays
out in my head.
So for those of you that don'tknow, Alex, I don't know why,
why don't you, you for, foryour, you've been a C C I E for
what?
Six, seven years now?
Something like that.
Alex (28:06):
Yeah.
2015.
Mm-hmm.
Pat (28:08):
Okay.
Wow.
Time flies.
For those of you that don't knowthe rigorous I don't wanna say
nonsense, but in the sense it isnonsense.
That is a C C I E prep to, totry and pass it.
I, I do You wanna give it alittle 50,000 foot view of what
you kind of went through to, toget yours?
Alex
Alex (28:23):
Oh wow.
Sure.
Yeah, we could talk about
Pat (28:26):
Spotlight
Alex (28:28):
one.
I was in a position that at workwhere they gave me a lot of time
to do it.
I, I don't, I, I just, maybemore pe people are just more
into it than I am, but I, Ijust, I would have a tough time
doing the C C I E if I just hadto do this on my own and I
couldn't use some work time todo it.
(28:49):
So in this case, evolve IP thatwas at I was the most logical
choice to, to get it on theteam, but they needed a C C I on
C C I E on staff in order tohave some type of membership
level that they needed withCisco.
So that was why they had skin inthe.
and they gave me I pretty muchthree months of my time there at
(29:13):
evolve ip, I was pretty much oncall.
If anything real world came upreal work came up.
But otherwise I was, it was allmy time to study for the C C I
E, so to say it was six hours aday, five days a week was
probably accurate.
So that in itself was just somuch time.
And I did have a, a blog postthat I put on the Cisco Learning
(29:36):
Network that kind of highlightedmy tips and tricks.
But the big thing that helpedwith me is a shout out to I and
E.
They had the C C I E workbooks,which I think were probably the
best training material that Ihad, but it was all stuff that I
could.
All lab related work.
So I could go through thesebooks and I could I had a
(30:00):
virtual lab.
It's kind of like the equivalentof what Eve is today.
But that's not what it wascalled back then.
But it was something better thanGNS three to emulate network
environments.
And I used that and I wentthrough every single page, every
single lab of that workbook,which I think there's 2000 labs.
It was something crazy.
So I went through every one ofthose labs and then they had a,
(30:23):
they had a video course that wascalled Advanced Technologies
that was really good.
I think that was like 130 hours.
And then there was everyone hadlike a list of five books you
have to read, T C P IP, volumeone and two, like boil M P L S
Design Technology.
I P V six and there was somesomething else that I did.
(30:44):
So I pretty much read fivebooks, did two workbooks.
I had I think about 2000 labsand 130 hours of video training.
And then the final thing I didwas it was called Cisco 360
then, but that was Cisco's ielab training, but they had mock
labs you could do full on likeeight hour long mock labs.
(31:06):
And I think there were six of'em.
I did six of those.
So in my eyes, I had taken thelab seven times, the six, the,
the six times that I triedthrough Cisco and then the
actual lab.
So then when I went and actuallytook the exam, I actually
thought the exam was easier thanthe, the Cisco Labs I was doing.
(31:29):
Yeah, they, they, I thought theywere harder and Yeah, I, I left
the, the lab pretty, prettyconfident they had passed and I
was ex excited waiting for thatemail.
Cuz one of the things that Imentioned in my blog post when I
talked about it, which I don'tthink most people realize.
I think people, there's a stigmaabout the C C I E lab and maybe
(31:50):
it's different now, but evenback then, there was a stigma
that they tried to trick you andthing wording could be
misinterpreted.
But I thought that was all justridiculous.
I thought the lie was reallystraightforward, as in you
really had to know your stuff.
But the question would be like,set up NPLS VPNs.
(32:12):
I mean, it, it'd be very clearcut what they wanted you to do.
And one of the other things thatthe C C I E lab did was maybe.
I can't remember if it was everyquestion that you were asked to
do, but certainly the majorityof'em they would say, they would
give you some way to validatethat you're correct.
So it would say like, onceyou're done you should have this
(32:34):
output.
This show command should havethis output or you should be
able to have reachability fromthis device to this device.
So you can find out as you'regoing along like how well you're
doing.
Cuz you know the show outputlooks what it's supposed to or
things can ping that you'reexpected to be able to ping.
So yeah, either I could probablygo into another hour of exactly
(32:57):
what I went through, but that'skind of the gist of it.
Pat (33:01):
Yeah.
And I remember, I remember youpassing and you like calling me
at some ungodly hour.
Cause you got the email at someungodly hour.
I don't know what, I don't knowwhat it was.
The text was in Texas.
Okay.
Like
Alex (33:11):
texted four people at three 30 in the morning.
Pat (33:14):
I, that's it, that's what it was.
I remember being in bed and allof a sudden the phone's going,
boop.
And I'm like, who in the f istexting me right now?
And like, I, I just see hertext.
She's like, I passed, I passed.
I'm like, oh my God.
Like I couldn't wait.
I couldn't wait to get to workthe next morning to talk about
it, man.
It was so, man, it was soexcited.
That's, that's really cool.
Alex (33:35):
Yeah, my wife was happy.
Cause you know, that was takingup so much of my life.
And prior to the C C I U, Imean, I was doing, just seemed
like I always had some cert thatI was after.
I was just, if it wasn't the na,it was the C M P.
And then I went into securityand data center tracks and yeah,
just finally it felt like theculmination, like I, I didn't
(33:57):
get another Cisco cert for awhile after that.
But yeah, that it was kind of arelief because then I kind of
felt like I can kind of take abreak from studying all the time
and maybe focus on my job a bitmore.
So
Pat (34:10):
Nice.
Yeah.
Good deal.
Yeah, I figured we'd throw thatin there.
Cause I, I don't know how manypeople really understand what
kind of a game it is to, to dothe C C I E and it really does
take a village.
Right.
So, yeah, I know, I know yourwife went down with, you drove
down to, to to Raleigh things ofthat nature.
So, and obviously you have, youhad young kids at the time.
(34:30):
They're not so young anymore cuzwe're old, but
Alex (34:33):
teenagers?
Yeah.
Pat (34:34):
Teenage.
Yeah.
So it's like, ah, man, like,having young kids and trying to
be that dedicated.
But I think I think that was bigfor Evolv to give you the, the
time and, and and whatnot to, tofocus.
And I, I totally think that'sthat really puts you over the
edge.
So just wanted to highlight yourstory a little bit and it's,
it's not an easy feat and itreally takes a village and, your
(34:55):
family has to be just asunderstanding of your, of the
time commitment as, as you dowhen you take, the C C I E.
So it's, it's definitely a bigthing.
I, I think, I don't, I don'tthink a lot of people realize
that.
I think a lot of people justrealize it's another cert and
Yeah, I'll study when I get toit, and blah, blah, blah.
And, and it's like, no, yougotta keep on track and, and you
gotta, know, you gotta meetdate, dates and deadlines.
Once it's scheduled, you reallygotta get there or else you're,
(35:17):
you're in trouble,
Alex (35:19):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it's not like I came fromZero too.
I mean, I was I was a seniornetwork engineer at that point
too, like the guy and still tooka lot and yeah.
Which is why, again, I can't letit expire.
I can't imagine how pissed mywife would be if I told her I
let that expire.
Pat (35:40):
So the question is, are you going for another one at any
point?
Alex (35:44):
I told myself a while back once the DevNet stuff came up
that I really should, and ifthere's any track that would
make me do it, it's the DevNettrack, but at this point I
haven't even tackled the na, soI won't talk about that until I
get that part.
Pat (35:58):
there you go.
Good deal.
Good enough.
So, Or I should say,transitioning to some of the
tech news that's out there or Ishould say, making some
headlines in the last couple ofweeks.
We, a few weeks ago we talkedabout chat G P T and sort of the
waves that was Macon in the AIspace and the kind of craze
(36:19):
that's going on with it now.
And then of course couple weekslater Google comes out and says,
we will not be outdone.
So, Google Bard is the latest AIchatbot.
Sort of, I guess it's a service.
It's very similar to chatgpt.
It's, it's gonna be a competitorobviously, to that.
So figured AI is hot right now,and, and Google just announced
(36:41):
their competition to it.
So, take a few minutes and, andchat about that.
So, I don't know, Alex, youwanna kind of give an idea of
what like we talked aboutchatgpt and sort of what it's
used for and, that kind of thingand and whatnot.
I don't know.
Do you have any kind of startingpoint from a Google Bard
perspective?
Alex (36:59):
Well, when we talked about chatgpt, I think we talked of
some of the advanced things thatyou could do with it and how
it's kinda limitless in itspotential.
But I think what we should makeclear to some people is it's
what Microsoft is using forright now, which is the beta
that people are using.
It's really supposed to be likethe evolution of.
(37:21):
The search engine that was kindof like the most straightforward
way people are gonna see thistoday.
I mean, outside of being in techand being a developer and people
that can really utilize chatgptand Google Bar to their full
potential, think of it as anevolution to a search engine.
So that's it's been prettyshocking the Microsoft Beta for
(37:43):
Bing.
How interested people havegotten into just Bing because
they've introduced chatgpt aslike a add-on to Bing.
So, people are used to, theyhave a question, but they
generally use search engines,not really to put in the
questions, especially if it'spretty abstract, but they use it
to put in a topic and then findthe answer that they want based
(38:04):
on the stuff that comes up.
Now they're changing a searchengine to, yeah, go ahead and
ask me the question and.
It could be very abstract, like,rather if you're, well going
back to tech, if you're saying,I need to write code that does
X, Y, z, you probably wouldn'texpect a year ago to be able to
(38:25):
type in how can I write a scriptthat does this for me on this
device?
And if you did type it, you'dkind of expect, maybe you'd
piece things together on threeor four different websites and
get to what you want.
But now what Chat g p t is doingand what Google Bard's doing is
it's actually knowing that'swhat your intent is.
Going in doing all these fromall these different, sites all
(38:49):
over the world, and thenactually coming back with a
human readable answer that isexactly what you want.
Like, the, the examples thatI've seen just in the beta have
been extraordinary and scarytoo.
Cuz like I said, some of theexamples are write a script that
does this for me, using on thislanguage that will work on this
(39:12):
platform and it'll come back andsay, all right, let me get this
straight.
This is chatgpt or Bing comingback.
And it'll say, let me get thisstraight.
I think this is what you'retrying to do.
I said, based on that, I thinkthis code will do it.
And then write, it'll write outthe entire code.
And then based on the output ofthe code, you can actually have
it tweak things.
You can say, oh yeah, that,that's close, but I don't want
(39:33):
this done.
I would rather it to be closerto this and it'll rework it.
And yeah, having said all thatthe reason why that's important,
why Google, I kind of think feltthe need to say something in a
hurry was it got people excitedabout.
Which, there's kind of like anongoing jokes where, who's ever
said, let me go bing that, but
Pat (39:55):
That's right.
Yeah.
I'm, I'm interested to see whereit goes, to be honest with you,
because I don't, like I said, I,I don't use chatgpt a whole lot.
Just cause I don't think aboutit, whatever.
But.
the Google Bard thing.
I, from my understanding, GoogleBard wasn't really ready to, for
the prime time, or they weren'treally ready to announce it, but
(40:16):
they sort of had to, cuz chatgptwas so hot, like they had to
announce it a little earlier andI think they've had some fumbles
through that.
So I think that is kind of, Iwould say weighing them down.
But it definitely is a littlebit of a black eye on Google's
watch.
Alex (40:31):
Yeah.
I mean, this is not somethingthat you turn up in a week.
So this has been in productionfor.
Years.
Yeah, given the success of ChatGBTs and Bing's beta people kind
of felt like Google hurry up andrushed an announcement before
Microsoft could get any morenews press on it.
And because of that, it seemedlike a lackluster announcement
(40:53):
where even if you're not in techtoday, you take a just, just a
vote of how many people haveheard of Google Barr.
And it, it's probably not nearlyas many as you think should
given the, its importance.
Cuz of right now if Google Bardisn't successful, they're gonna
lose a huge market share toMicrosoft.
(41:14):
And just the idea that Microsoftcould potentially, because this
is such a evolution in the.
This game that the idea thatMicrosoft could be the de facto
search engine seems just wild tothink of like a year ago.
But this legitimately could turninto, people will say, let me
(41:36):
bing that
Pat (41:37):
Kyle,, are you using chatgpt or goo Google Bar for
anything nowadays?
Kyle (41:42):
I haven't used Bard yet, just cuz I cannot, I I just
haven't really, I, I've beenusing just chatgpt for
everything.
Pat (41:50):
Yep.
Kyle (41:51):
I refuse to do it through Bing though.
I go still through the website.
Pat (41:54):
That's funny.
Kyle (41:55):
yeah, I was, I was looking at the difference between him
two.
I guess Bard uses a differentkind of artificial intelligence
than chatgpt does, which Ithought was kind of cool.
Or Bard is based off the Lambda,I think is what it is, the
language model for dialogueapplications,
Pat (42:15):
yep.
Kyle (42:16):
which is cool as as opposed to, I forget what the g
t stands for now.
Alex (42:21):
Yeah, I do too.
I mean, eventually it won't, it,it won't be called Google Bard
and chatgpt it'll just beprobably, yeah,
Pat (42:30):
and chat
Alex (42:32):
it'll just the newest version of Google or you, that's
what big Google search Engine orthe Bing Will Just things will
use chatgpt and Google Bard butyou, they just, it won't be
called that, like Yeah, they'lljust, they'll utilize it to make
other things much better.
Pat (42:50):
Yep.
G P T stands for generativepre-trained transformer.
Kyle (42:54):
There we go.
Pat (42:55):
So for all you folks keeping score at home, that's
what it
Kyle (42:59):
Did, did you find that on Bing
Pat (43:01):
for No I wish.
No, that was like the old jokeyears ago where nobody used
Internet Explorer.
The only time you use InternetExplorer is to download Chrome.
So it's like, it's the same it'sthe same
Alex (43:13):
The crew installer.
Pat (43:16):
that's it.
You might as well call it aChrome installer.
It's basically it.
No, it's the same thing here,but no, I, I think if, if
Microsoft can get this right andGoogle sort of fumbles with it
still, it just seems that therecould be a shift in the tide,
which is kind of weird cuz we'veall literally been Googling for
decades now.
It seems like its like now it'sweird.
(43:38):
Googling is literally a verb,you know what I mean?
Alex (43:42):
Yeah.
Who doesn't?
I'll Google that.
Yeah.
I was
Pat (43:45):
That's right.
Alex (43:46):
some TV show the other day, just like some detective
show, and they said the term,Google it twice.
And and I was just, yeah, and Imean Google lens, which is also
kind of, I was just somewhat inthe same vein as AI with the
idea of being able to scan apicture and then that can
actually go out and then findwhat that actually is an image
(44:10):
of and bring back resources.
So I was using that the otherday and then I just couldn't
just how that's another AIthing, just like how impressive
this technology has become.
Cuz we were at a car show and wehad two different instances.
One was a very unique car and atGoogle ends it and it came up
with the exact model.
Like, oh yeah, this is a model,whatever car.
(44:31):
And then my wife, we were on awalk and she noticed some
pretty.
and she wanted to know what typeof tree it was.
She took a picture of it, andthen, yeah, Google lens could
then, based on that, themetadata that's in these little
parts of the tree or the pictureof the tree could come up and
say, oh yeah, this is this kindof tree.
And that's, that's pretty wildtoo.
And the, I think they're, Idon't know if Samsung's
(44:54):
implementing that yet, but thatmight be on phones coming up
soon.
So say you have a thousandpictures on your phone and
you're trying to find a pictureof a dog at the beach and you're
circling through, you canactually type in dog in the
beach and it will actually,based on that, could come up
with images that it thinks is adog and a beach.
Pat (45:12):
On a beach.
Look at that.
Look at that.
Alex (45:16):
So yeah.
Technology's wild.
Pat (45:18):
it is crazy.
I just I hope I'm dead beforethe Sky Net 2.0 comes around
again,
Alex (45:24):
Well, that's another, that's, you bring that up.
That's another thing that wastech news here, because I.
That former Google engineer wasmaking a highlight or headline
news cuz he kept saying thatGoogle's bard was sentient, like
Pat (45:41):
Yeah.
Alex (45:42):
He's, he's claiming that they've made true self-aware
artificial intelligence,
Pat (45:48):
It's crazy.
This is crazy.
Alex (45:50):
So, I mean, Google's trying to write it off like he's
nuts.
But he did make some headlineslike,
Pat (45:59):
Yeah.
That's interesting.
I, I'm, I'm interested to seewhere this goes.
The other thing, and, and I'll,I'll say this in full
disclosure, but I am an Androidguy all the way through.
I've never been a Mac or aniPhone or an Apple guy, is just
kind of where I've fallen alongthe battle lines.
But it, it, it's just the onefrustration I do have with
Google is it drop.
(46:19):
Projects so quickly.
It just seems that's likefrustrating to the end user of
like, look like you had so manycool ideas and so many things,
and then all of a sudden it justliterally cuz goes off the face
of the earth and you're like,man, really should have stuck
with that.
I like that.
That kind of thing.
So like, like for example, thiswas forever ago.
I wanna say at least a good 10years maybe, maybe almost 15.
(46:42):
But they had Google Wave, whichwas basically slack before Slack
was a thing, right?
They had, it was called GoogleWave.
And then, we were, I was usingit, I thought it was cool, blah,
blah, blah, and then all of asudden it was gone.
And I was like, where did yougo?
That was freaking awesome.
And they just never had any sortof, kind of steam behind that.
But the, the, the messages isanother thing.
(47:04):
Text messages, right?
So I think Kyle, you and Italked about this a few weeks
ago.
Like, they had hangouts for awhile and then it was messages
and then it was
Kyle (47:12):
They had
Pat (47:13):
Aloe, and there was like a whole bunch of'em, like, like
literally, that's the thing Igive credit to Apple for like,
they've literally hadstandardization and development
over their stuff over the lasthowever many, years that they've
had a thing and it's like they,you know what it is, but like
Google, it feels like sh changeslike almost every day.
And it's just like, I hope thisGoogle Bard thing doesn't sort
(47:35):
of go the same way of the lostbin of projects that Google just
never seems to, sort of putbehind.
Alex (47:43):
I think that was one of Steve Jobs quotes which probably
should Google or bing the quote
Pat (47:48):
Let me bang that.
Hold on.
I'll be right back.
Alex (47:51):
he had, so, Steve Jobs said something about focus and
saying that focus isn't sayingyes to the things that you need
to do, but I guess in a largecompany, like an Apple or
Google, it's saying no to athousand really good ideas, so
you can focus on two or threeand see them to completion
Pat (48:09):
Yep.
Yeah, I would agree.
I
Alex (48:12):
still doing the thousand ideas and then eventually just,
oh, we can't do it anymore.
Pat (48:16):
so frustrating.
It's just like, oh man.
Like, it's some really goodstuff and then all of a sudden
it just is not there anymore.
And you're like, man, this it'shard to get any traction.
It's like, man, but then it'slike, goo Google.
Yeah.
Google's like my dealer, like, Ijust can't quit it.
Like, you wanna walk away sobad.
I'm just like, I can't quit.
You And you're just so wrappedup in ecosystem that you just
(48:39):
have no, like, I, I can't startover.
This is insane.
And they, and the problem isthey know that.
So it's like, like, it's just,there's no incentive.
I, I don't know.
It's just annoying.
Anyway, thanks for coming to myTed Talk.
I'll get off my soapbox now.
now.
But I'm, I'm really interestedto see what The, the Google Bard
stuff does.
(48:59):
And like I said, I think theywent off to a little rocky
start.
I think they were a little theykind of jumped the gun a little
bit.
They had to sort of putsomething out in, in competition
with chat G P T and it justwasn't quite ready yet.
It just they had some, they hadsome issues with I guess they
(49:19):
had some knowledge that waswrong in the demo.
Like, I think somebody asked ita question about the James Webb
telescope and, and it got like awrong answer or whatever.
So I think there's some, somedon't wanna say lackluster, but
there's not a whole lot ofconfidence, in that.
So they've had a rocky start,but you know, it's Google.
They're, they're gonna getthere.
There's, it's just a matter oftime it's just what they do.
(49:40):
So I'm really interested to seewhere that, where that sort of
goes.
Alex (49:45):
Yep.
Yeah, I'm interesting.
Yeah, I think that was actuallythe one of the things that
Google says it's trying to dobetter than chatgpt, is when
things are objective andopinionated, I guess chatgpt,
for whatever reason, whateverits algorithm is using, it tends
to.
One opinion and then state it asfact, which is, could be.
(50:08):
And the example that Google gavewas if you asked chat g p t,
what's easier to learn, thepiano or the guitar?
Like it, it would pick one andthen justify it as opposed to
Google, which will say that itawarded in a way to make you
say, well, some people thinkthat the guitar is easier
(50:28):
because of this reasons, andpeople think piano is better for
this reason.
And because of that they thinkit's less likely to miss not
misinformed people.
Where right now that's chatGPTs, what they claim is
they're, one of their biggestflaws is just the idea of
stating things as fact.
Based on whatever algorithm itused when it's maybe not quite
(50:50):
fact,
Pat (50:51):
Yeah, I'm interested to see what that looks like too, right?
Because it's, in this world ofjust information that just swims
out there it'll be interestingto see what sort of what sort of
way things lean.
Cuz we all know the tech, thetech industry has over the last
couple of years sort of swayedvarious opinions and, been
(51:13):
caught doing some, some weirdstuff.
But I'm interested to see whatthat.
Where, where that sort of lies.
But you know, whether it is anopinion and they're just
justifying that, or if it's, ifthere's other pieces to that.
If they take five opinions andkind of shove'em together and
kind of give you all a, a pieceof all of them, or, I don't know
(51:34):
that, that, that'll be aninteresting piece to see where
that goes in the next couple ofyears.
So,
Alex (51:41):
Yeah, definitely a topic we'll revisit in six months, a
year from now.
Pat (51:48):
That's it.
Kyle.
Anything else?
You got any skin in the gamehere?
Kyle (51:52):
No.
Now I'm just reading about theBarden stuff.
Deep dive.
Pat (51:57):
That's it.
Mind blown.
Oh my God.
Kyle (52:01):
Yeah.
Once they
Pat (52:02):
script.
Kyle (52:03):
yeah, once, once they get everybody going in the same
direction, I think this isreally gonna be probably pretty
awesome.
Alex (52:10):
Oh yeah, it'll transform things.
Yeah, just like Google did.
I mean, just the idea of howyou're so much more confident
that you can do your job cuz youknow, you, you got Google as a,
an option to help you figure itout.
This is just gonna be the nextstep where, people can do, do so
much more.
Pat (52:30):
that's it.
And I feel like I feel like itguys are just better at Googling
things than other people.
Maybe that's where we're at inour careers.
There's just,
Alex (52:38):
And then you just, yeah, we, where people joked about how
I'm really good at Googling onresumes now people are gonna
joke about, I can chatgpt t,like a beast.
I mean,
Pat (52:47):
That's it.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's right.
I'm gonna work on that.
That's it.
I think that's it.
Phils, anything else?
Any other points you wanna throwout here?
We're right around the hour markand trying to get outta people's
hair, but anything else youwanted to touch upon in the the
tech news that we got going on?
Alex (53:03):
No, we're good.
An hour's.
Good time.
Kyle (53:06):
Yeah.
Pat (53:06):
good to me.
Kyle, you good?
Kyle (53:07):
Yeah.
I'm good.
Pat (53:09):
Good to go.
All right, buddy.
Well, we appreciate youobviously joining us here this
week on the podcast, breakingDown a Bites.
Make sure you visit our website,breaking Bites pod.io, where you
can subscribe to the show onApple Podcast or Spotify or
Stitcher or Google Podcastwherever.
Or if you need just an RSS feed.
(53:31):
We have one there as well, soyou never miss the show.
Throw us some rating on ApplePodcasts.
That would be awesome.
That fools with the algorithmsand I don't know, maybe they use
AI too.
I don't know what goes on overthere, give us a rating that
plays with the algorithms andthe whole deal and get some more
people more eyes on the show andin people's ears.
So that's always the, the goalhere.
(53:52):
And simply tell a friend aboutus as well, that works just as
well.
Be sure to follow us on socials,right, Twitter, LinkedIn
Facebook it's a Discord serverout there for us.
So, invites in the show notesand all the links for the for
our socials are in the shownotes as well.
So we sell the survey out there.
The uh, Feedback survey, or Ishould say the listener survey
(54:12):
just like nine or 10 questions.
It's completely anonymous.
We don't know who you are justaggregates answers for us and
just tells us where we need toimprove the show and what you're
looking for versus what we'regiving you.
So, the more people will fillout that survey, the better the
show gets, and topics and, kindof what you wanna see.
So, that, that's super, superimportant.
So again, all that stuff is inthe show notes, links for all
that stuff.
(54:32):
So feel free to head over thereand do your part.
And I think that's it.
Okay guys appreciate you joiningand we'll see you everybody next
week.
Kyle (54:41):
So long.
Hey everybody.
Welcome back to this week'sedition of Breaking Down the
Bites.
Thanks for joining us this week.
As usual, I'm your host, pat.
You can find me on Twitter at@layer8packet.
That's the number eight.
You can find Kyle on Twitter,@Danath256, and you can find the
show on Twitter at@breakinbytespod.
(00:21):
We're pretty active on Twitter,so come say hello.
If you like the show, don'tforget to subscribe on your
streaming platform of Choicethree Amigos are back again.
This week we're all here.
Yes, it feels like a good time.
We're all here.
We can all get together, singKumbaya, do all those sorts of
things.
So, no guests this week, youjust got us three chatting away,
(00:43):
and we're gonna do the the techour monthly tech news this week
as well.
So, some two, two personal sortof endeavors.
And then a little ai, a littlechat G P T and Google Bard News.
So that's gonna be always alwaysfun as well.
So, Kyle, what's up man?
How you doing?
Kyle (00:59):
live in the dream.
How about yourself?
Pat (01:02):
That's it.
This is the dream.
I'd hate to see the nightmare,I'll tell you that much right
now.
So, yeah.
Nah, man.
We did not get the weather thatwe expected.
It was kind of mild, I gottaadmit.
But you know, it is what it is.
And we there's a chance for agood snow yet here in, in the
east, on the east coast yet.
We we've seen snow up until,early May, or I should say yeah,
early May, early early April.
(01:24):
So, we got about another monthto go.
So we'll see what happens.
I know you're the weather guy,Kyle, so
Kyle (01:30):
let's roll the dice here and,
Pat (01:32):
throw that out there.
Kyle (01:32):
right, right.
Pat (01:33):
I'm knocking on wood cuz I'm not the big snow guy cuz I'm
the one shoveling it.
So I w I would not prefer tohave that happen.
So, I will tell you, I willintroduce you to a man who does
not have snow right now, wherehe is at on the left coast.
Mr.
Alex is back with us.
Hey man, what's going on?
Alex (01:49):
Busy studying trying to renew my CCIE, but we'll talk
about that more a little laterin the podcast.
And
Pat (01:58):
if I ever heard one
Alex (02:00):
right and trying to psych myself up for next week.
So starting tomorrow cuz that'sgonna be the official return to
the office four days a week.
Pat (02:09):
Oh, that's
Kyle (02:10):
Oh man.
Pat (02:11):
That's right.
Alex (02:13):
we'll see.
And the big guy,
Pat (02:16):
far, how far the drive is it for you into the office?
Alex (02:20):
it's 49 miles.
Which I, I did bef I did foryears.
It evolved by pos almost exactlywhat my commute was, but
Pat (02:26):
Yep.
Alex (02:27):
it, it wasn't an la queue commute, so
Pat (02:29):
Right.
Alex (02:31):
it takes me an hour and a half at least to do it.
So, it never bothered me toomuch cuz I was only going to the
office once and then recently,twice a week.
So we'll see how this
Pat (02:42):
How, how it
Alex (02:43):
out.
Pat (02:43):
Yeah.
Yeah.
you sound really, really stoked,I must say
Alex (02:49):
I got all kinds of audible books queued up, so that's what
I've been
Pat (02:53):
it just gives you more, it just gives you more power to
listen to podcasts, so it's allgood.
Alex (02:57):
Yeah.
I gotta start subscribing tosome podcasts.
Pat (03:00):
There you go.
So if anyone has any suggestionsfor Alex to get on the train
with podcasts, let us know.
Cuz he's gonna need a wholeboatload for that hour and a
half drive to la So that's oneway.
So technically he's, he's a,he's a three hour guy now.
He's a three hour guy
Alex (03:18):
And that's if I'm lucky, I've had a
Pat (03:20):
on a good day.
Alex (03:22):
pushing two hours on the way
Pat (03:23):
Yeah.
Oh, geez.
Yeah.
So that's, that's interesting.
Alex (03:28):
yeah.
For.
Pat (03:30):
That is interesting.
I'm, I'm curious to see how thatplays out.
So,
Alex (03:34):
I'm interested to see who shows up.
I wanna see how many peopleactually commit to that.
Pat (03:39):
Yeah.
Kyle, what's your drive?
I know you're sort of in theopposite direction of where
you're working now at Cus town.
Kyle (03:45):
Yeah.
It's 27 miles and it takes meabout a half an hour to get in.
like 40 to 45 to get home, 30ish on a good day.
But normally it's, airport roadand like Cedar Crest, they're
always
Pat (04:02):
Ugh.
Terrible.
Kyle (04:04):
not great
Pat (04:05):
Nope, not great.
No traffic here in the LehighValley really, really stinks.
Like we have highways that werebuilt for like the mid fifties
and now we're like trying tolike jam a million cars on these
things.
It's like, good Lord.
Anyway.
Alright, cool.
So, oh, shout out to Louis alsoknown as Netec Weezy on Twitter
(04:27):
for last week's episode.
That was really,
Kyle (04:29):
Yeah, it was awesome.
Pat (04:30):
really cool dude.
We, we appreciate him coming onand sharing his story and giving
us a little a little schoolingon some next Gen firewall stuff.
So, that's gonna be really cool.
So appreciate him coming out.
So, we'll definitely have himback on again.
But this week sort ofhighlighting the community as
some of you may or may not know,the show was nominated last year
(04:51):
for Cisco IT Blog Awards.
We were a finalist last year, soI don't know how that happened.
I don't know who nominated us,but we're glad that they did
obviously.
But yes, totally, totally cool.
And that has opened some doorsfor.
For us as far as a platform to,to reach people me specifically
I think Dean as well who's inthe same community, but we were
(05:13):
roped into, or we were acceptedinto the Cisco Champions
community.
And that's basically it's aprivate community that Cisco has
that you sort of have toregister for, sign up for sort
of be nominated, blah, blah,blah.
And I obviously use the podcastas leverage to get into that
community.
So, kind of rolling off of thatI was fortunate enough to be
(05:35):
invited to do a Cisco ChampionsRadio podcast this week.
And basically the gist of it isif you, if you haven't heard of
it, go check it out.
They have some really, reallycool topics on there.
And it's it, it's, it's a mix ofCisco champions.
So you basically get pickedthere's like two or three per
episode, two or three championsper episode that, that get to go
on.
And there's a set topic.
(05:55):
And then Cisco also invitesBasically Cisco employees
whatever that topic is, theyinvite the SMEs, the subject
matter experts for thatparticular topic or product, and
then have them come on thepodcast with us.
And then basically just, have achat back and forth.
And sometimes it's show, showshowcasing a product.
Sometimes it's, I listened tothe one the other week, it was
on how to basically do, likestudy habits, things of that
(06:16):
nature.
And there's a whole plethora oftopics that are that are out
there.
So, I did one just recently lastweek and it was on the new Cisco
Catalyst 9,500 X series switchthat they have coming out, layer
three switch.
So, we had some product folkover at Cisco come on and talk
about what that is and kind ofwhat's where it came from.
(06:37):
And how that all kind of came tolife and, and, use cases and
guts and, things of that nature.
And it was a really, really gooddiscussion.
Once I have a definite date,I'll, I'll mention it again on
the podcast here just so youguys can tune in.
But yeah, had, had a blast.
It was really, it was a reallygood time and they just keep
coming out with some really goodproducts and, and the 9,500 x
is, is is, nothing short ofthat.
So, totally enjoyed that andlooking forward to being on on
(06:59):
another one the next uh, nextcouple of months depending on
when they pick me.
So I thought that was a coolthing to start the show off with
and, and kind of go from there.
So, yeah, really loved it andwish I could do more of it.
Alex (07:10):
Yeah, and I don't want to ruin it for anyone who plans on
listening to that podcast, butcan you give us kind of the
cliff notes?
So what's the big thing with the9,500 x.
Pat (07:22):
Yeah, so I g you know, so what they did a couple years ago
is they kind of repackaged thecatalyst line under the 9,000
naming moniker, I guess youwanna call it.
So, the, the the three, theCatalyst 3000 became the 93
hundreds, the catalyst, wellnine, the, the, the 2000 line
became the 92 hundreds, 93hundreds, so forth and so forth.
(07:46):
That sort of thing.
So, the catalyst 5k became the95 k, things of that nature.
So, so it's, it was an all allinclusive umbrella, if you will.
I'm trying to bring that morekind of more standardization and
kind of under the same umbrella.
But now it's just a, they're upin the 9,000, so they kind of
try to streamline a lot of that.
So, And I, the 9,500 x is it's,it's meant for a campus, campus
(08:08):
switch, right?
So not technically data centersomewhere in a, in a branch or,
enterprise, type, type buildingheadquarters things of that
nature.
So, but it's got it's got somereally good juice going there.
So, it brings all the standardstuff that Cisco's known for at
that enterprise level, right?
Stateful, switchovers, andthings of that nature.
I think they did bump the gutsup from the, the Mac table.
(08:30):
It's like 128,000 to like 2 56,so they doubled it.
Things of that nature.
What else is here?
It does all the routing, right?
BGP and mpls layer three VPNs.
Yeah.
Ethernet over mpls.
What else?
Spine leaf, you can do that,that kind of thing.
So it is quite, it's quite it's,it's got it's, it's definitely
got the juice and 400 gig is,it's got a couple ports of 400
(08:52):
gig throughput on there.
So, I think it's, it's 40 gig, ahundred gig, 400 gig is kind of
what their ports are, lookinglike.
And then with the, they call'embreakout cables, right?
So, your fiber and whatnot.
So you got, you got 10 gig, 25gig, 50 gig, and then a hundred
gig with the with the specified,breakout cables for, fiber and
things of that nature.
So there's quite a few modelshere and whatnot, but it seems
(09:16):
to, they're creeping into that400 gig territory, which I,
which I find really, reallyinteresting.
Alex (09:22):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's cool.
And I think also the 9,500 lineand maybe some others, I didn't
look into it too much.
I know they're starting to dosome things with containers,
which is a good call.
Back to previous episode we justhad, so now Cisco hardware is
being containerized, and whatthat is allowing people to do is
(09:44):
you can actually run a Dockercontainer on a Cisco device now,
which I'm interested to see howpeople use that as a as
something really helpful.
I mean, from what I'veunderstood, there's nothing
really even stopping you.
You could, you could run a, afull on Linux desktop on a, I
mean, I don't see any reason whyyou don't wanna do that.
(10:05):
But I'm interested to see whatpeople end up using that for.
I know one of the real quickexamples that I saw someone use
it is just to install a reallylightweight version of I purf.
So for anyone who hasn't used Ipurf before, that's the simplest
way you can do to really liketest the circuits bandwidth
capabilities.
It just allows you to, it's atraffic generator.
So people now can install, Iperf in a container right off a
(10:28):
networking device.
And now you can use yournetworking device and really
slam a circuit if you want to,if you wanna do some testing.
But yeah, there's also somethings like some telemetry data
that people can pull.
And now you're used to having topull telemetry data or send
telemetry data somewhere else,but now you're, you're, it's
right there on the same box.
(10:48):
You're trying to get thesereally interesting stats and
maybe some pretty gooeys.
And you can run it right on abox now, which is all pretty
neat.
Pat (10:57):
Yeah.
The other thing I would say toois this falls in line with
Cisco's DNA Center.
So that's their overarching kindof gooey controlled sd software
defined networking platform.
Right.
Which I'm a little shocked thatthey don't have a virtual
version of that.
It's, it's still a physical box,but apparently it's, it's a
pretty beefy box that they havetrouble converting it.
To virtual, but yeah, I digress.
(11:19):
May maybe one day there'll be avirtual version of, of DNA
Center, but yeah.
DNA Center, so this iscompletely compatible with that,
right?
With the automation that seemsto be here and, and sort of ever
booming, netcom s com yangmodels, all that kind of stuff,
that's all supported on the9,500 x zero touch provisioning
is also supported.
So, we all know that theshipping and.
(11:41):
Whatnot has really been adetriment to a lot of tech these
days.
So you're waiting, what seems tobe a long time for, for gear.
Instead of shipping it to aheadquarters and having somebody
configure it and then reshippingit to wherever it needs to go,
you can drop ship it right tothe, the place it needs to go
and it'll, it'll, plug in andcall home and no, no need to
technically touch it, that kindof thing.
(12:02):
So, telemetry is another goodone.
Right, though you kind oftouched on that, Alex, so it
supports all that.
So, yeah.
I was really excited to be apart of it and it seems to be
they've really put some, somereal.
Brains and beef into the 9,500 xstuff.
So, it's, it's, it's reallyinteresting to see kind of where
that's gonna go in the nextcouple of years and, and see if
that really takes off.
But from, from what I've seen orfrom, the discussion that we had
(12:24):
with some of the product folkson that, on that podcast, it was
really cool.
So, shout out to my to my buddyTim Burino as well.
He's he is a host over there atthe Art of Network Engineering
podcast.
He was on with me as well.
He was a champion that was onwith me as well.
So it's always good to see Timre really good guy.
So, yeah, shout out to them.
So, yeah, it was just a cool, itwas a cool time.
Cool, cool podcast and hope tobe part of more so just wanted
(12:45):
to kind of throw that out there.
Alex (12:49):
Awesome.
Pat (12:50):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it's really interestingstuff.
So, what else can I say aboutthe champions?
I don't know.
It's, I, I, I enjoy it, man.
It's, it's a cool platform forpeople to get together.
It's a like-minded sort ofcommunity and there, there's a
bunch of things that you get asa champion to kind of get the
inside peek behind the covers,sort of thing.
So, yeah, so, and, and I thinkactually was it registration
(13:12):
just ended not too long ago for,for this year's inductees, if
you will.
So, yeah, so it's a, it's, it'sa pretty cool platform.
And actually my my new boss saidI get to meet tomorrow.
First time meeting him.
Well, I shouldn't say first timemeeting him.
He's actually a champion aswell, so we're part of the same
kind of, kind of community.
So that's kind of cool.
So actually I knew him from aprevious life, so when I worked
(13:32):
at the data center, he, he wasworking for somewhere that had
data center space, so I knew ofhis name and would see him every
now and then.
And now we're kind of crossingpath again.
So he's my new boss.
So I'll, I'll meet, I'll get tosee him tomorrow.
So shout out to him, So it'salways interesting how those
things play out, right?
Small world
Alex (13:52):
So do you, you mentioned that registrations or
nominations, whatever it may be,just closed up.
Does that mean you have to benominated again or are you a
member for life now until theykick you out?
Pat (14:06):
Now.
So technically you have toreapply, quote unquote, every
year.
But as long as you're stilldoing something, like a blog or
like a podcast or some sort ofwhat kind of got you in the
program to begin with, then youknow, there's very little chance
that you'll be, kicked out sortof thing.
But you do have to reapply everyyear.
I don't have to reapply cause Ijust got in last year, but as
(14:27):
this time comes around next yearI'll have to, reapply sort of
thing.
So yeah, it is a, I'm, I'mguessing they do that just so
they don't have people basicallyjust becoming stale, in there,
that kind of thing.
So like if we decide to not, dothis podcast tomorrow, we would
still kind of benefit from thatfor the end of time if they
didn't kind of gate check somepeople.
So I'm guessing that's whatthat's about.
Alex (14:48):
Okay.
And outside of this podcast youjust did recently, do you think
you've been kind of takingadvantage of the platform at
all?
I mean, maybe not as much as youcould be.
Pat (14:58):
yeah, so I, you always probably could be doing a little
more.
But you know, there's some, so,so as, as a champion, you get
access to a exclusive like WebExand there's a bunch of channels
in here.
Stick of it as like a slack kindof thing.
And, and people, people chatfrom, I mean, they're from all
over the world.
So, yeah, basically you're justchatting in all these different
different spaces and, and and asfar as the show, man, we could
(15:22):
literally have guests from heretill forever.
People would come on, you knowwhat I mean?
Just pluck, pluck guests from,from this platform and people
would would totally, you.
Be in on that.
So I could see that we get to,and I get to promote it.
I get to promote it everyepisode within this.
And obviously that's more peoplelistening and eyeballs and,
things of that nature.
And then, as far as from a guestpipeline, it's like an unlimited
(15:45):
amount of guests here cuzthere's a bunch of really,
really smart people in here.
So, we'll probably startplucking some folks here shortly
and just having'em come on andit's it's just a cool thing to
just keep going and see how farit takes us.
Kyle (15:57):
Be
Alex (15:58):
All right, and my last question, maybe the most
important question, did you getany swag,
Pat (16:05):
I did I didn't get any swag.
I know.
I gotta ask about that.
It just depends on,
Alex (16:10):
a sticker or something
Pat (16:12):
I know something.
I know.
That'd be nice.
Yeah, no, I, I hear you.
Alex (16:16):
Don't.
Not expecting like anembroidered jacket or anything,
but
Pat (16:21):
You know what?
I did ask our Cisco count repthat I've been working with
Cisco for 20 years and have nota stitch of Cisco swag any
places I've ever worked.
So I'm like, come on Tim, let'slet's get on that.
And he's like, all right, what'syour size?
So I gave him my size andwhatnot.
He's like, I'll see what I cando.
So, man, I gotta, I actually,I'm gonna see Tim this week, so
I'm gonna, I'm gonna check onthat, see if I get some Cisco
swag.
Alex (16:42):
Yeah, I got some Meraki stuff heading my way.
I just had lunch with Cisco anda couple of the Meraki guys were
in town, so they came on boardand they just said, do you, do
you want any Meraki stuff?
I said, sure.
I mean, I don't use it, butI'll, I'll take some swag.
Pat (16:58):
Heck yeah.
Heck yeah.
That bumps your street cred.
Alex (17:03):
Yeah.
I've been wanting a polo like eever since I got in the Cisco
game like 15 years ago, I stillhave not gotten someone to gimme
a Cisco Polo
Pat (17:11):
Come on.
Somebody at Cisco send this mana polo.
Alex (17:14):
Yes,
Pat (17:15):
He's an ie.
For goodness sake, send him apolo.
The least you could do is sendhim a polo Now the other cool
thing about the Cisco championsthings too, is like you chat
with these people prettyregularly, and then I would say
a good portion of them actuallyhead to Cisco live.
So then it's nice to meet upwith them in person at, at Cisco
live.
So that's the other thing too,I'm kind of looking forward to.
(17:36):
And I've, I have never been toCisco live.
I'm trying to go this year.
So we'll see what see whathappens.
But I would I, I would love togo this year, and I think it's
in Vegas again this year, if I'mnot mistaken.
I would love to go and, and meetsome of these folks and just,
it's kind of just a coolcommunity to hang out with and,
you chat with all these peoplevirtually and then you get to
meet'em in person.
You're like, ah, this is cool.
It kind of brings your fullcircle.
So looking forward to that's,see what happens.
(18:00):
It is in Vegas this year, right?
I think.
Alex (18:02):
I didn't look at it.
I'm surprised that I haven'tthought about it yet cuz it's
coming up before we know itthree months away.
Pat (18:07):
Sis.
Alex (18:08):
I know with layoffs and stuff, companies aren't that
quick to pay for something likethat, but I guess I should ask.
Pat (18:15):
Yep.
There it is.
Las Vegas, June 4th through theeighth.
Kyle (18:19):
No, man,
Alex (18:19):
Yeah.
That's just a, that's a roadtrip for me.
Pat (18:23):
hot hop skipping a jump.
Alex (18:26):
Yeah.
Hour flight, four hour drive.
Yeah.
Kyle (18:30):
not bad.
Pat (18:32):
It's the fir yeah, the first full week in June.
Right on.
So yeah, let's see if I canscore some tickets from that
and, and see what see what comesof it.
So that's gonna be cool.
So yeah, I thought we'd lead offwith that and see just kind of,
talk about that.
And Kyle, you, you applied forit this year cuz you're part of
the show now.
Kyle (18:49):
Yeah.
You gave me the, the link assigned up
Pat (18:51):
Good deal.
Alex, you did too?
Or did you get to that or not?
I wasn't sure if you came alittle later.
Alex (18:56):
yeah.
I applied too.
So we'll see if what happens.
Any idea when they pick those?
Pat (19:01):
It should be soon, from my understanding, I, I can't
remember the exact time lastyear, but I think it should be
soon.
I, I, it was relatively quicklyafter the closing of the, of the
registration period.
So, yeah, I, I'm curious to seeif you guys if you guys get in,
so we'll see what happens, butyeah, that's cool.
So, yeah, so I thought I wouldlead the show with that and just
kind of say, that was reallycool and really look forward to
(19:23):
to that episode coming out in,in May.
I think I think it's in May.
So just be on the lookout forthat and once I get more
details, I'll, I'll send italong obviously.
But that was a really cool coolthing to do.
So.
Kind of pivoting, still talking.
Cisco kind of pivoting though.
Mr.
Alex, you're up on this one.
You mentioned that you're tryingto redo your C C I E or at least
(19:44):
re re-up it, and this is yourfirst time doing it via the
credits, right?
Alex (19:50):
Yeah, that's right.
I've kind of done it the typicalway for the last.
Oh, eight years, I guess, whichis you just have to take the
written again and that renewsyour IE and everything
underneath it.
And I was planning on doing theexact same thing again this
year.
And I just had a guy thatreports to me pretty much told
(20:12):
me I was nuts.
If I want to try brute force inthe written exam again, because
that's what I've been doing.
I mean, I don't, I shouldprobably put a little bit more
effort into it, but I thinkevery time that I've gone to
renew my C C I E, so this wouldbe the, the fourth time I've
done it.
So the three times previous,I've failed it at least once and
wonk
Pat (20:32):
Ah,
Alex (20:33):
And this is, so if you're not getting reimbursed for this,
which I don't think I would, Imean that's$500 a pop.
So
Pat (20:39):
Sure.
Alex (20:40):
you don't want to keep brute forcing it.
But yeah.
A guy that reported me suggestedthat I look into the continued
education.
I, I guess I just thought that,it would be a lot of
administrative overhead, like,take the course and then trying
to figure out how I can provethat I took it and then making
sure that it did count and I seeit.
(21:04):
And I, I did one course recentlyon the digital learning library,
I think is what it's called.
But they have lots of courses onthere.
There's some that are free.
Other ones you pay per course,other ones you, they have other
options like just a full on passthat unlocks everything.
But there are some free ones.
But the one I took was a onpaper, 40 hour course broken out
pretty well.
(21:25):
Has labs, has little quizzes atthe end.
And then at the very end there'sjust a the equivalent of, of an
exam really.
Pat (21:33):
Hmm.
Alex (21:33):
or you have to work through, I don't know how many
different questions.
And if you get a passing grade,then it counts as you've
completed the course and you getthe continued education score
credit for it.
And depending on what level ofcertification you're trying to
renew.
So if it's an associate level,and again, this is all Cisco
stuff and associate level one,that's so the CCNA for example,
(21:56):
that's 40 credits professionallevel, like the ccnp, it's 80
expert level at the C C I E,it's 120 and these 40 hour
courses, and there's severalthey're all 40 credits.
So at least the majority of'emare so, well, one I completed I
think probably took me aboutprobably closer to 20 hours.
Closer to 20 than 40.
And yeah, when I was done thisis the part that was the big
(22:19):
question mark for me.
Again, administratively what,what, how do you actually get
credit for what you've justdone?
But they really do make itstraightforward.
If you go to like ce.cisco comwhich is the continued education
site you log in with your normalCisco credits or your Cisco
credentials, and it'll show youthe certs that you have when
(22:40):
they expire.
And there's an option there to Iguess I forget how they word it,
but get credit for any coursesthat you've done.
So in my case, when I completedthe that course, that 40 hour
horse they gave you a, like a 10digit number to kind of signify
the, the, you completed it.
(23:01):
And when I went to the cecisco.com site I just put in
that 10 digit.
Number when I completed theexam, and it was like an hour
later, it said confirmed, andthree days later it showed that
my CCNA had been extendedanother three years.
I, I saw the extension date.
(23:22):
So it's really asstraightforward as you complete
these courses.
They give you a, a unique valuecode that somehow references the
completed course and you can usethat to yep, renew your
certifications.
So in this case, I, I'm alreadystarting my second one about
halfway through that now, butsounds like this is gonna be the
way to go going forward.
So I'm pretty excited aboutthat.
(23:43):
So, I mean, having said allthat, have you tried any of it
yet, or are you still just doingit the classic way where you're
just let them expire, or take anexam at some point and that's
how you renew your other ones?
Pat (23:58):
Yeah, I got, I gotta be honest, I, all of mine have
actually expired.
They've ex, they were expiredlike right around the beginning
of the pandemic, and I justdidn't, it's just, it was too
crazy.
Stuff was going on, and I let itexpire and I probably shouldn't
have, but I did let it expire.
And so I don't really have anyskin in the Cisco game anymore.
Not that I wouldn't want to, Iprobably, I probably should at
(24:19):
least look at something again,since, where I'm at is 90% Cisco
shop.
But, there's just other thingsthat I'm dealing with now that,
that, that, that are a littlemore beneficial.
Right.
So, like I said, some of theaddress stuff that we that we
talked about, I've been, doing alot of that and things of that
nature.
So it's No, I, I, I don't haveany sort of CE credits or, or
(24:39):
any sort of need for them at themoment, but I totally should.
Just because it's, probablyshould get back on that horse at
least.
At some point I'm interested tosee if I could actually pass the
new ccna, cuz when I passed it,it was it's a decade ago, 2013.
So, that was the older one, or,a couple old versions by now.
But I'm curious to see if Icould pass the new one and then,
kind of go from there.
But the cc m p was really, wasreally cool.
(25:01):
That was a special one.
I just you never thought youcould get there and then all of
a sudden you do and you're like,ah, cool.
I can, kind of hang in with thebig boys.
This is nice, and I was an idiotfor letting them expire.
So, I, like I said, I, Iprobably shouldn't have, but it
just it just is what it is.
So, Kyle, do you have any Ciscosor anymore, did you ever attempt
them or did you have, did theyexpire on you?
Kyle (25:21):
no, no, I actually, I never got any as, as much as
Kevin, Kevin, beat it into ourhead.
Pat (25:27):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We should have.
Yeah, I, well, I took, it tookme three times to pass mine, my,
my ccna.
So I, I have nothing to I havenothing to, to to, to write home
about on that one.
But yeah, it was,
Alex (25:39):
Hey, that search there, Joe
Pat (25:42):
Yeah.
The entry level, I'm, well, thecoming from, coming from
somebody that is just, hasschool like you and I work Kyle,
and not actually like in it dayto day, the NA is a tall order
because it just, it, it's morereal world than just.
(26:03):
Book Text Smart kind of thing.
That, and that's why I, like Isaid, I, I bombed it twice
before passing it a third time,but it's for those that are
trying to break in and do thenetwork thing without any real
world experience, and I don'teven know if they have it
anymore, but the, the C C E N Twas probably the better track to
go to the two, the two testroute rather than the one c n a
(26:24):
route.
But I don't even know if theyhave that anymore because of the
way they restructured theirexams.
So, but yeah, it, it, it's nojoke.
And pe it really, it keepspeople up at night and I could,
I could definitely see why even10 years ago I could see why
Alex (26:37):
So the moral of the story is don't let it.
Pat (26:40):
Yeah.
Don't be an idiot like me andlet it expire.
Alex (26:44):
and you have continued education credits as a valid
option.
And, and like I said, it, youonly need 40 credits to renew an
associate level exam.
And there are some free ones outthere.
If you go to the digitallearning library on several
different top, and it can becompletely different topics too.
So maybe that's not clear toeveryone.
It's like if you have a CCNA inthe classic route and switch
(27:07):
you, you can do a a five hourcourse on SD WAN Meraki's and
which maybe that's not a goodexample cause that's, I think
that's part of the CCNA now, butyou could do a yeah.
On any topic and that'll countas continued education.
Going to Cisco Live also givesyou credits too.
So if you go to Cisco Live, justattending the conference and
(27:29):
then.
if you go to certain breakoutsand can ch you get proof that
you attended them, the, in theirentirety, you get credits for
those too.
So, yeah, you, you, you can, youcan go without ex expiring certs
if you really want to withouthaving to dive back into the
books.
Hardcore again.
Pat (27:47):
Yep.
That's interesting.
I, I, I probably should take itagain just to prove to myself
that I could pass a CCNA again.
I'd be interested to see howthat, how that, how that plays
out in my head.
So for those of you that don'tknow, Alex, I don't know why,
why don't you, you for, foryour, you've been a C C I E for
what?
Six, seven years now?
Something like that.
Alex (28:06):
Yeah.
2015.
Mm-hmm.
Pat (28:08):
Okay.
Wow.
Time flies.
For those of you that don't knowthe rigorous I don't wanna say
nonsense, but in the sense it isnonsense.
That is a C C I E prep to, totry and pass it.
I, I do You wanna give it alittle 50,000 foot view of what
you kind of went through to, toget yours?
Alex
Alex (28:23):
Oh wow.
Sure.
Yeah, we could talk about
Pat (28:26):
Spotlight
Alex (28:28):
one.
I was in a position that at workwhere they gave me a lot of time
to do it.
I, I don't, I, I just, maybemore pe people are just more
into it than I am, but I, Ijust, I would have a tough time
doing the C C I E if I just hadto do this on my own and I
couldn't use some work time todo it.
(28:49):
So in this case, evolve IP thatwas at I was the most logical
choice to, to get it on theteam, but they needed a C C I on
C C I E on staff in order tohave some type of membership
level that they needed withCisco.
So that was why they had skin inthe.
and they gave me I pretty muchthree months of my time there at
(29:13):
evolve ip, I was pretty much oncall.
If anything real world came upreal work came up.
But otherwise I was, it was allmy time to study for the C C I
E, so to say it was six hours aday, five days a week was
probably accurate.
So that in itself was just somuch time.
And I did have a, a blog postthat I put on the Cisco Learning
(29:36):
Network that kind of highlightedmy tips and tricks.
But the big thing that helpedwith me is a shout out to I and
E.
They had the C C I E workbooks,which I think were probably the
best training material that Ihad, but it was all stuff that I
could.
All lab related work.
So I could go through thesebooks and I could I had a
(30:00):
virtual lab.
It's kind of like the equivalentof what Eve is today.
But that's not what it wascalled back then.
But it was something better thanGNS three to emulate network
environments.
And I used that and I wentthrough every single page, every
single lab of that workbook,which I think there's 2000 labs.
It was something crazy.
So I went through every one ofthose labs and then they had a,
(30:23):
they had a video course that wascalled Advanced Technologies
that was really good.
I think that was like 130 hours.
And then there was everyone hadlike a list of five books you
have to read, T C P IP, volumeone and two, like boil M P L S
Design Technology.
I P V six and there was somesomething else that I did.
(30:44):
So I pretty much read fivebooks, did two workbooks.
I had I think about 2000 labsand 130 hours of video training.
And then the final thing I didwas it was called Cisco 360
then, but that was Cisco's ielab training, but they had mock
labs you could do full on likeeight hour long mock labs.
(31:06):
And I think there were six of'em.
I did six of those.
So in my eyes, I had taken thelab seven times, the six, the,
the six times that I triedthrough Cisco and then the
actual lab.
So then when I went and actuallytook the exam, I actually
thought the exam was easier thanthe, the Cisco Labs I was doing.
(31:29):
Yeah, they, they, I thought theywere harder and Yeah, I, I left
the, the lab pretty, prettyconfident they had passed and I
was ex excited waiting for thatemail.
Cuz one of the things that Imentioned in my blog post when I
talked about it, which I don'tthink most people realize.
I think people, there's a stigmaabout the C C I E lab and maybe
(31:50):
it's different now, but evenback then, there was a stigma
that they tried to trick you andthing wording could be
misinterpreted.
But I thought that was all justridiculous.
I thought the lie was reallystraightforward, as in you
really had to know your stuff.
But the question would be like,set up NPLS VPNs.
(32:12):
I mean, it, it'd be very clearcut what they wanted you to do.
And one of the other things thatthe C C I E lab did was maybe.
I can't remember if it was everyquestion that you were asked to
do, but certainly the majorityof'em they would say, they would
give you some way to validatethat you're correct.
So it would say like, onceyou're done you should have this
(32:34):
output.
This show command should havethis output or you should be
able to have reachability fromthis device to this device.
So you can find out as you'regoing along like how well you're
doing.
Cuz you know the show outputlooks what it's supposed to or
things can ping that you'reexpected to be able to ping.
So yeah, either I could probablygo into another hour of exactly
(32:57):
what I went through, but that'skind of the gist of it.
Pat (33:01):
Yeah.
And I remember, I remember youpassing and you like calling me
at some ungodly hour.
Cause you got the email at someungodly hour.
I don't know what, I don't knowwhat it was.
The text was in Texas.
Okay.
Like
Alex (33:11):
texted four people at three 30 in the morning.
Pat (33:14):
I, that's it, that's what it was.
I remember being in bed and allof a sudden the phone's going,
boop.
And I'm like, who in the f istexting me right now?
And like, I, I just see hertext.
She's like, I passed, I passed.
I'm like, oh my God.
Like I couldn't wait.
I couldn't wait to get to workthe next morning to talk about
it, man.
It was so, man, it was soexcited.
That's, that's really cool.
Alex (33:35):
Yeah, my wife was happy.
Cause you know, that was takingup so much of my life.
And prior to the C C I U, Imean, I was doing, just seemed
like I always had some cert thatI was after.
I was just, if it wasn't the na,it was the C M P.
And then I went into securityand data center tracks and yeah,
just finally it felt like theculmination, like I, I didn't
(33:57):
get another Cisco cert for awhile after that.
But yeah, that it was kind of arelief because then I kind of
felt like I can kind of take abreak from studying all the time
and maybe focus on my job a bitmore.
So
Pat (34:10):
Nice.
Yeah.
Good deal.
Yeah, I figured we'd throw thatin there.
Cause I, I don't know how manypeople really understand what
kind of a game it is to, to dothe C C I E and it really does
take a village.
Right.
So, yeah, I know, I know yourwife went down with, you drove
down to, to to Raleigh things ofthat nature.
So, and obviously you have, youhad young kids at the time.
(34:30):
They're not so young anymore cuzwe're old, but
Alex (34:33):
teenagers?
Yeah.
Pat (34:34):
Teenage.
Yeah.
So it's like, ah, man, like,having young kids and trying to
be that dedicated.
But I think I think that was bigfor Evolv to give you the, the
time and, and and whatnot to, tofocus.
And I, I totally think that'sthat really puts you over the
edge.
So just wanted to highlight yourstory a little bit and it's,
it's not an easy feat and itreally takes a village and, your
(34:55):
family has to be just asunderstanding of your, of the
time commitment as, as you dowhen you take, the C C I E.
So it's, it's definitely a bigthing.
I, I think, I don't, I don'tthink a lot of people realize
that.
I think a lot of people justrealize it's another cert and
Yeah, I'll study when I get toit, and blah, blah, blah.
And, and it's like, no, yougotta keep on track and, and you
gotta, know, you gotta meetdate, dates and deadlines.
Once it's scheduled, you reallygotta get there or else you're,
(35:17):
you're in trouble,
Alex (35:19):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And it's not like I came fromZero too.
I mean, I was I was a seniornetwork engineer at that point
too, like the guy and still tooka lot and yeah.
Which is why, again, I can't letit expire.
I can't imagine how pissed mywife would be if I told her I
let that expire.
Pat (35:40):
So the question is, are you going for another one at any
point?
Alex (35:44):
I told myself a while back once the DevNet stuff came up
that I really should, and ifthere's any track that would
make me do it, it's the DevNettrack, but at this point I
haven't even tackled the na, soI won't talk about that until I
get that part.
Pat (35:58):
there you go.
Good deal.
Good enough.
So, Or I should say,transitioning to some of the
tech news that's out there or Ishould say, making some
headlines in the last couple ofweeks.
We, a few weeks ago we talkedabout chat G P T and sort of the
waves that was Macon in the AIspace and the kind of craze
(36:19):
that's going on with it now.
And then of course couple weekslater Google comes out and says,
we will not be outdone.
So, Google Bard is the latest AIchatbot.
Sort of, I guess it's a service.
It's very similar to chatgpt.
It's, it's gonna be a competitorobviously, to that.
So figured AI is hot right now,and, and Google just announced
(36:41):
their competition to it.
So, take a few minutes and, andchat about that.
So, I don't know, Alex, youwanna kind of give an idea of
what like we talked aboutchatgpt and sort of what it's
used for and, that kind of thingand and whatnot.
I don't know.
Do you have any kind of startingpoint from a Google Bard
perspective?
Alex (36:59):
Well, when we talked about chatgpt, I think we talked of
some of the advanced things thatyou could do with it and how
it's kinda limitless in itspotential.
But I think what we should makeclear to some people is it's
what Microsoft is using forright now, which is the beta
that people are using.
It's really supposed to be likethe evolution of.
(37:21):
The search engine that was kindof like the most straightforward
way people are gonna see thistoday.
I mean, outside of being in techand being a developer and people
that can really utilize chatgptand Google Bar to their full
potential, think of it as anevolution to a search engine.
So that's it's been prettyshocking the Microsoft Beta for
(37:43):
Bing.
How interested people havegotten into just Bing because
they've introduced chatgpt aslike a add-on to Bing.
So, people are used to, theyhave a question, but they
generally use search engines,not really to put in the
questions, especially if it'spretty abstract, but they use it
to put in a topic and then findthe answer that they want based
(38:04):
on the stuff that comes up.
Now they're changing a searchengine to, yeah, go ahead and
ask me the question and.
It could be very abstract, like,rather if you're, well going
back to tech, if you're saying,I need to write code that does
X, Y, z, you probably wouldn'texpect a year ago to be able to
(38:25):
type in how can I write a scriptthat does this for me on this
device?
And if you did type it, you'dkind of expect, maybe you'd
piece things together on threeor four different websites and
get to what you want.
But now what Chat g p t is doingand what Google Bard's doing is
it's actually knowing that'swhat your intent is.
Going in doing all these fromall these different, sites all
(38:49):
over the world, and thenactually coming back with a
human readable answer that isexactly what you want.
Like, the, the examples thatI've seen just in the beta have
been extraordinary and scarytoo.
Cuz like I said, some of theexamples are write a script that
does this for me, using on thislanguage that will work on this
(39:12):
platform and it'll come back andsay, all right, let me get this
straight.
This is chatgpt or Bing comingback.
And it'll say, let me get thisstraight.
I think this is what you'retrying to do.
I said, based on that, I thinkthis code will do it.
And then write, it'll write outthe entire code.
And then based on the output ofthe code, you can actually have
it tweak things.
You can say, oh yeah, that,that's close, but I don't want
(39:33):
this done.
I would rather it to be closerto this and it'll rework it.
And yeah, having said all thatthe reason why that's important,
why Google, I kind of think feltthe need to say something in a
hurry was it got people excitedabout.
Which, there's kind of like anongoing jokes where, who's ever
said, let me go bing that, but
Pat (39:55):
That's right.
Yeah.
I'm, I'm interested to see whereit goes, to be honest with you,
because I don't, like I said, I,I don't use chatgpt a whole lot.
Just cause I don't think aboutit, whatever.
But.
the Google Bard thing.
I, from my understanding, GoogleBard wasn't really ready to, for
the prime time, or they weren'treally ready to announce it, but
(40:16):
they sort of had to, cuz chatgptwas so hot, like they had to
announce it a little earlier andI think they've had some fumbles
through that.
So I think that is kind of, Iwould say weighing them down.
But it definitely is a littlebit of a black eye on Google's
watch.
Alex (40:31):
Yeah.
I mean, this is not somethingthat you turn up in a week.
So this has been in productionfor.
Years.
Yeah, given the success of ChatGBTs and Bing's beta people kind
of felt like Google hurry up andrushed an announcement before
Microsoft could get any morenews press on it.
And because of that, it seemedlike a lackluster announcement
(40:53):
where even if you're not in techtoday, you take a just, just a
vote of how many people haveheard of Google Barr.
And it, it's probably not nearlyas many as you think should
given the, its importance.
Cuz of right now if Google Bardisn't successful, they're gonna
lose a huge market share toMicrosoft.
(41:14):
And just the idea that Microsoftcould potentially, because this
is such a evolution in the.
This game that the idea thatMicrosoft could be the de facto
search engine seems just wild tothink of like a year ago.
But this legitimately could turninto, people will say, let me
(41:36):
bing that
Pat (41:37):
Kyle,, are you using chatgpt or goo Google Bar for
anything nowadays?
Kyle (41:42):
I haven't used Bard yet, just cuz I cannot, I I just
haven't really, I, I've beenusing just chatgpt for
everything.
Pat (41:50):
Yep.
Kyle (41:51):
I refuse to do it through Bing though.
I go still through the website.
Pat (41:54):
That's funny.
Kyle (41:55):
yeah, I was, I was looking at the difference between him
two.
I guess Bard uses a differentkind of artificial intelligence
than chatgpt does, which Ithought was kind of cool.
Or Bard is based off the Lambda,I think is what it is, the
language model for dialogueapplications,
Pat (42:15):
yep.
Kyle (42:16):
which is cool as as opposed to, I forget what the g
t stands for now.
Alex (42:21):
Yeah, I do too.
I mean, eventually it won't, it,it won't be called Google Bard
and chatgpt it'll just beprobably, yeah,
Pat (42:30):
and chat
Alex (42:32):
it'll just the newest version of Google or you, that's
what big Google search Engine orthe Bing Will Just things will
use chatgpt and Google Bard butyou, they just, it won't be
called that, like Yeah, they'lljust, they'll utilize it to make
other things much better.
Pat (42:50):
Yep.
G P T stands for generativepre-trained transformer.
Kyle (42:54):
There we go.
Pat (42:55):
So for all you folks keeping score at home, that's
what it
Kyle (42:59):
Did, did you find that on Bing
Pat (43:01):
for No I wish.
No, that was like the old jokeyears ago where nobody used
Internet Explorer.
The only time you use InternetExplorer is to download Chrome.
So it's like, it's the same it'sthe same
Alex (43:13):
The crew installer.
Pat (43:16):
that's it.
You might as well call it aChrome installer.
It's basically it.
No, it's the same thing here,but no, I, I think if, if
Microsoft can get this right andGoogle sort of fumbles with it
still, it just seems that therecould be a shift in the tide,
which is kind of weird cuz we'veall literally been Googling for
decades now.
It seems like its like now it'sweird.
(43:38):
Googling is literally a verb,you know what I mean?
Alex (43:42):
Yeah.
Who doesn't?
I'll Google that.
Yeah.
I was
Pat (43:45):
That's right.
Alex (43:46):
some TV show the other day, just like some detective
show, and they said the term,Google it twice.
And and I was just, yeah, and Imean Google lens, which is also
kind of, I was just somewhat inthe same vein as AI with the
idea of being able to scan apicture and then that can
actually go out and then findwhat that actually is an image
(44:10):
of and bring back resources.
So I was using that the otherday and then I just couldn't
just how that's another AIthing, just like how impressive
this technology has become.
Cuz we were at a car show and wehad two different instances.
One was a very unique car and atGoogle ends it and it came up
with the exact model.
Like, oh yeah, this is a model,whatever car.
(44:31):
And then my wife, we were on awalk and she noticed some
pretty.
and she wanted to know what typeof tree it was.
She took a picture of it, andthen, yeah, Google lens could
then, based on that, themetadata that's in these little
parts of the tree or the pictureof the tree could come up and
say, oh yeah, this is this kindof tree.
And that's, that's pretty wildtoo.
And the, I think they're, Idon't know if Samsung's
(44:54):
implementing that yet, but thatmight be on phones coming up
soon.
So say you have a thousandpictures on your phone and
you're trying to find a pictureof a dog at the beach and you're
circling through, you canactually type in dog in the
beach and it will actually,based on that, could come up
with images that it thinks is adog and a beach.
Pat (45:12):
On a beach.
Look at that.
Look at that.
Alex (45:16):
So yeah.
Technology's wild.
Pat (45:18):
it is crazy.
I just I hope I'm dead beforethe Sky Net 2.0 comes around
again,
Alex (45:24):
Well, that's another, that's, you bring that up.
That's another thing that wastech news here, because I.
That former Google engineer wasmaking a highlight or headline
news cuz he kept saying thatGoogle's bard was sentient, like
Pat (45:41):
Yeah.
Alex (45:42):
He's, he's claiming that they've made true self-aware
artificial intelligence,
Pat (45:48):
It's crazy.
This is crazy.
Alex (45:50):
So, I mean, Google's trying to write it off like he's
nuts.
But he did make some headlineslike,
Pat (45:59):
Yeah.
That's interesting.
I, I'm, I'm interested to seewhere this goes.
The other thing, and, and I'll,I'll say this in full
disclosure, but I am an Androidguy all the way through.
I've never been a Mac or aniPhone or an Apple guy, is just
kind of where I've fallen alongthe battle lines.
But it, it, it's just the onefrustration I do have with
Google is it drop.
(46:19):
Projects so quickly.
It just seems that's likefrustrating to the end user of
like, look like you had so manycool ideas and so many things,
and then all of a sudden it justliterally cuz goes off the face
of the earth and you're like,man, really should have stuck
with that.
I like that.
That kind of thing.
So like, like for example, thiswas forever ago.
I wanna say at least a good 10years maybe, maybe almost 15.
(46:42):
But they had Google Wave, whichwas basically slack before Slack
was a thing, right?
They had, it was called GoogleWave.
And then, we were, I was usingit, I thought it was cool, blah,
blah, blah, and then all of asudden it was gone.
And I was like, where did yougo?
That was freaking awesome.
And they just never had any sortof, kind of steam behind that.
But the, the, the messages isanother thing.
(47:04):
Text messages, right?
So I think Kyle, you and Italked about this a few weeks
ago.
Like, they had hangouts for awhile and then it was messages
and then it was
Kyle (47:12):
They had
Pat (47:13):
Aloe, and there was like a whole bunch of'em, like, like
literally, that's the thing Igive credit to Apple for like,
they've literally hadstandardization and development
over their stuff over the lasthowever many, years that they've
had a thing and it's like they,you know what it is, but like
Google, it feels like sh changeslike almost every day.
And it's just like, I hope thisGoogle Bard thing doesn't sort
(47:35):
of go the same way of the lostbin of projects that Google just
never seems to, sort of putbehind.
Alex (47:43):
I think that was one of Steve Jobs quotes which probably
should Google or bing the quote
Pat (47:48):
Let me bang that.
Hold on.
I'll be right back.
Alex (47:51):
he had, so, Steve Jobs said something about focus and
saying that focus isn't sayingyes to the things that you need
to do, but I guess in a largecompany, like an Apple or
Google, it's saying no to athousand really good ideas, so
you can focus on two or threeand see them to completion
Pat (48:09):
Yep.
Yeah, I would agree.
I
Alex (48:12):
still doing the thousand ideas and then eventually just,
oh, we can't do it anymore.
Pat (48:16):
so frustrating.
It's just like, oh man.
Like, it's some really goodstuff and then all of a sudden
it just is not there anymore.
And you're like, man, this it'shard to get any traction.
It's like, man, but then it'slike, goo Google.
Yeah.
Google's like my dealer, like, Ijust can't quit it.
Like, you wanna walk away sobad.
I'm just like, I can't quit.
You And you're just so wrappedup in ecosystem that you just
(48:39):
have no, like, I, I can't startover.
This is insane.
And they, and the problem isthey know that.
So it's like, like, it's just,there's no incentive.
I, I don't know.
It's just annoying.
Anyway, thanks for coming to myTed Talk.
I'll get off my soapbox now.
now.
But I'm, I'm really interestedto see what The, the Google Bard
stuff does.
(48:59):
And like I said, I think theywent off to a little rocky
start.
I think they were a little theykind of jumped the gun a little
bit.
They had to sort of putsomething out in, in competition
with chat G P T and it justwasn't quite ready yet.
It just they had some, they hadsome issues with I guess they
(49:19):
had some knowledge that waswrong in the demo.
Like, I think somebody asked ita question about the James Webb
telescope and, and it got like awrong answer or whatever.
So I think there's some, somedon't wanna say lackluster, but
there's not a whole lot ofconfidence, in that.
So they've had a rocky start,but you know, it's Google.
They're, they're gonna getthere.
There's, it's just a matter oftime it's just what they do.
(49:40):
So I'm really interested to seewhere that, where that sort of
goes.
Alex (49:45):
Yep.
Yeah, I'm interesting.
Yeah, I think that was actuallythe one of the things that
Google says it's trying to dobetter than chatgpt, is when
things are objective andopinionated, I guess chatgpt,
for whatever reason, whateverits algorithm is using, it tends
to.
One opinion and then state it asfact, which is, could be.
(50:08):
And the example that Google gavewas if you asked chat g p t,
what's easier to learn, thepiano or the guitar?
Like it, it would pick one andthen justify it as opposed to
Google, which will say that itawarded in a way to make you
say, well, some people thinkthat the guitar is easier
(50:28):
because of this reasons, andpeople think piano is better for
this reason.
And because of that they thinkit's less likely to miss not
misinformed people.
Where right now that's chatGPTs, what they claim is
they're, one of their biggestflaws is just the idea of
stating things as fact.
Based on whatever algorithm itused when it's maybe not quite
(50:50):
fact,
Pat (50:51):
Yeah, I'm interested to see what that looks like too, right?
Because it's, in this world ofjust information that just swims
out there it'll be interestingto see what sort of what sort of
way things lean.
Cuz we all know the tech, thetech industry has over the last
couple of years sort of swayedvarious opinions and, been
(51:13):
caught doing some, some weirdstuff.
But I'm interested to see whatthat.
Where, where that sort of lies.
But you know, whether it is anopinion and they're just
justifying that, or if it's, ifthere's other pieces to that.
If they take five opinions andkind of shove'em together and
kind of give you all a, a pieceof all of them, or, I don't know
(51:34):
that, that, that'll be aninteresting piece to see where
that goes in the next couple ofyears.
So,
Alex (51:41):
Yeah, definitely a topic we'll revisit in six months, a
year from now.
Pat (51:48):
That's it.
Kyle.
Anything else?
You got any skin in the gamehere?
Kyle (51:52):
No.
Now I'm just reading about theBarden stuff.
Deep dive.
Pat (51:57):
That's it.
Mind blown.
Oh my God.
Kyle (52:01):
Yeah.
Once they
Pat (52:02):
script.
Kyle (52:03):
yeah, once, once they get everybody going in the same
direction, I think this isreally gonna be probably pretty
awesome.
Alex (52:10):
Oh yeah, it'll transform things.
Yeah, just like Google did.
I mean, just the idea of howyou're so much more confident
that you can do your job cuz youknow, you, you got Google as a,
an option to help you figure itout.
This is just gonna be the nextstep where, people can do, do so
much more.
Pat (52:30):
that's it.
And I feel like I feel like itguys are just better at Googling
things than other people.
Maybe that's where we're at inour careers.
There's just,
Alex (52:38):
And then you just, yeah, we, where people joked about how
I'm really good at Googling onresumes now people are gonna
joke about, I can chatgpt t,like a beast.
I mean,
Pat (52:47):
That's it.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's right.
I'm gonna work on that.
That's it.
I think that's it.
Phils, anything else?
Any other points you wanna throwout here?
We're right around the hour markand trying to get outta people's
hair, but anything else youwanted to touch upon in the the
tech news that we got going on?
Alex (53:03):
No, we're good.
An hour's.
Good time.
Kyle (53:06):
Yeah.
Pat (53:06):
good to me.
Kyle, you good?
Kyle (53:07):
Yeah.
I'm good.
Pat (53:09):
Good to go.
All right, buddy.
Well, we appreciate youobviously joining us here this
week on the podcast, breakingDown a Bites.
Make sure you visit our website,breaking Bites pod.io, where you
can subscribe to the show onApple Podcast or Spotify or
Stitcher or Google Podcastwherever.
Or if you need just an RSS feed.
(53:31):
We have one there as well, soyou never miss the show.
Throw us some rating on ApplePodcasts.
That would be awesome.
That fools with the algorithmsand I don't know, maybe they use
AI too.
I don't know what goes on overthere, give us a rating that
plays with the algorithms andthe whole deal and get some more
people more eyes on the show andin people's ears.
So that's always the, the goalhere.
(53:52):
And simply tell a friend aboutus as well, that works just as
well.
Be sure to follow us on socials,right, Twitter, LinkedIn
Facebook it's a Discord serverout there for us.
So, invites in the show notesand all the links for the for
our socials are in the shownotes as well.
So we sell the survey out there.
The uh, Feedback survey, or Ishould say the listener survey
(54:12):
just like nine or 10 questions.
It's completely anonymous.
We don't know who you are justaggregates answers for us and
just tells us where we need toimprove the show and what you're
looking for versus what we'regiving you.
So, the more people will fillout that survey, the better the
show gets, and topics and, kindof what you wanna see.
So, that, that's super, superimportant.
So again, all that stuff is inthe show notes, links for all
that stuff.
(54:32):
So feel free to head over thereand do your part.
And I think that's it.
Okay guys appreciate you joiningand we'll see you everybody next
week.
Kyle (54:41):
So long.
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