Episode Transcript
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David Yas (00:00):
Welcome to Bring Out
the
Talent, a podcast featuring learning and development experts discussing innovative approaches and industry insights. Tune in to hear our talent help develop yours. Now here are your hosts, TTA's CEO and President Maria Melfa and Talent Manager Jocelyn Allen..
Jocelyn Allen (00:25):
Well, hello,
Maria.
John Laverdure (00:28):
Hi there.
How are you?
Jocelyn Allen (00:32):
You must be under
the weather.
John Laverdure (00:33):
Yeah, haven't
been feeling very well lately. Thanks for noticing, Jocelyn.
Jocelyn Allen (00:39):
Well, just
kidding.
Hi, John.
Everybody, it's John Laverdureback with us today.
You know him well.
He visits us on occasion and isgoing to help us.
Oh, David, come on.
Don't egg them on.
Just kidding.
John, it has the technicalprowess that we learn from here
every day on TTA.
And considering that we havethis more involved, strategic
(01:05):
type of conversation today, Ireally wanted you to be able to
join us to lend a hand to theconvo.
So thank you.
John Laverdure (01:12):
Yeah, no, that's
very nice of you.
I figured you were trying tokeep me away, but I'm glad to
join.
Jocelyn Allen (01:18):
Well, beggars
can't be choosers, John, as they
say.
But anyway, on with the show,because we are really excited
for today's episode on expertsleading experts, building a
culture of teaching andlearning.
So I'm going to tell you alittle bit about the episode and
our guest.
In today's episode of Bring Outthe Talent, we're thrilled to
be joined by Joel Podolny, CEOand co-founder of Honor
(01:42):
Education and the founding deanof Apple University.
Joel's career is nothing shortof extraordinary.
As we know, he shapedtransformative learning
experience at some of the mosticonic organizations in the
world, from Apple to Yale,Harvard, and Stanford.
You know, just a couple, fourlittle guys on the planet.
(02:03):
We'll dive into the idea ofexperts leading experts and how
organizations can create aculture where sharing knowledge
isn't just encouraged, it's asecret for driving innovation
and excellence.
Joel will also discuss thechallenges leaders are facing in
building these cultures, whyhumility and mutual respect are
complete game changers, and howto empower your top talent to
(02:26):
teach and learn from oneanother.
Get ready for anotherinsightful conversation that's
all about transforming the wayorganizations think about
learning and leadership.
Welcome to the show, Joel.
Joel Podolny (02:37):
Thank you.
It's a real, real pleasure tobe here.
Jocelyn Allen (02:41):
We're excited to
talk to you about your expertise
as well.
I mean, transformative learningculture, the way that we teach,
the way that we learn, that is100% of what TTA does.
So we're really excited to hearmore from you and your
expertise.
And so we'd love to hear moreabout honor education and your
history with Apple University.
(03:03):
Can you tell us a little bitmore about how your journey has
shaped your understanding ofthis key phrase that we're
bringing to the table of expertsleading experts and industry
agnostic even.
Joel Podolny (03:16):
Yeah, I'd be
delighted to start with that.
I began my career as a businessschool professor.
And one of the things about abusiness school degree is it's a
generalist degree, right?
You're giving the same degreeto those who are going to start
entrepreneurial careers, thosewho are going to work in large
corporations, those who aregoing to go into services,
(03:39):
consulting, finance, whatever itis.
And so for me, it was like anunbelievable learning when I got
to Apple that how somebodyleads in hardware is different
than how somebody leads insoftware and how somebody leads
in software is different thanhow somebody leads in marketing.
Sure, there's some basicfoundations, but you realize how
(04:02):
much somebody's expertise canbe critical to their ability to
lead, to manage, to move anorganization forward through
uncertainty because thatexpertise becomes the basis for
sort of the intuition thatallows you to, especially when
(04:25):
it's about innovation andchange, to start to have an
insight around, I don't yet knowhow we're going to solve this
problem, but I know this is thedirection to move forward.
And that was a realawesomeness.
for me, again, just given whereI had started, where it's like,
(04:45):
oh, we're going to teach thesame cases, we're going to give
the same books, regardless ofthe career.
And so, yeah, I really, it wasa big part of my evolution was
realizing if you're really goingto elevate the learning in a
company, you need to figure outhow you leverage that expertise
(05:07):
as part of it.
John Laverdure (05:08):
That's awesome.
So I...
It's amazing that you werehandpicked by Steve Jobs over
for Apple University.
Jocelyn Allen (05:17):
I was just going
to say that and be like, is this
real or are you lying?
That's the coolest thing I'veever heard, that Steve Jobs is
like, you know what, Joel?
You.
It's you.
That's so cool.
Joel Podolny (05:29):
Yeah, one of the
things I've always tried to do
in my career, this was true forthe deanship at Yale, it was
true for Apple, is you alwayswant to show up near the end of
a search.
You never want to show up nearthe beginning.
Because in the beginning,they're really picky.
But near the end, I mean, it'slike, he's a warm body.
(05:49):
Let's just put him into thejob.
Who's left?
Joel?
Right, right, exactly.
I was the last one standing.
John Laverdure (05:56):
Employment by
apathy.
Perfect.
Awesome.
Right.
So when you're building thesecultures of teaching amongst
experts, I mean, there's got tobe some challenges in creating
that type of culture.
What are they and how canleaders address those?
Joel Podolny (06:14):
So one is just
practical, right?
Which is I think for anybodywho has spent any time teaching
and in all the sort of rolesI've had, even including this
one, I certainly try to weaveteaching into what I do because
for me, it is my passion.
Like, you know, what I'mteaching, that's what I'm in my
passion.
I'm in my happy place.
(06:36):
But the practical issue is forthose who haven't taught, they
think teaching and presentingare the same thing.
And one of the practical pointsthat I like to make when I've
got an expert who we're tryingto leverage their expertise for
(06:56):
the purpose of teaching isteaching is only maybe 20% what
can you put into somebody?
Cause like when you'representing, it's kind of like a
hundred percent, like kind ofwhat can I, what can I put into
them?
What can I give them?
It is in me that I want, but,but when you're teaching,
there's a bit of that, but it's,but, but, but 80% is what can I
(07:20):
pull out of them?
Right.
And, and you're going to use inthis example, of an expert who
hasn't done a lot of teaching.
You're gonna use yourexperience, you're gonna use
your expertise as the basis onwhich to create curiosity, to
(07:41):
create interest, to createquestions.
But you then have to lean intothat.
How does what you're sharingbring up something for them that
they want to share back foryou?
And that to me is like kind ofthe first, you know, sort of the
first, just very practicalchallenge you have to overcome.
(08:03):
Because when we get, because itrequires a certain amount of
vulnerability, right?
For somebody to be open to thefact that for this to be great,
this session, it has to be aboutmore than what I've got in my
head and I'm going to try to putinto theirs.
It's got to be like, how do Idraw and pull from them?
And that requires somebody tolet go a bit in that moment and
(08:31):
to be open and kind of humbleand curious and all the rest.
Jocelyn Allen (08:37):
the very valid
point that I think a lot of
people struggle with is theyknow what to do with the kind of
the initial impact of it all.
But like you said, once they'recurious and start asking
questions, you've got them onthe hook.
So where do you go with that?
And how do you get the buy-inof the expertise as well?
Because I think like, have youever had, if you're trying to
(09:01):
break, my brain's going in athousand different directions
right now, can you tell?
But have you ever had I guesswhen you're trying to get these
experts involved and bringingthem into this, you are who you
are and there's so much morethat can be achieved.
Yeah, no, I...
Joel Podolny (09:46):
I mean, it's a
great question.
And I think you're one.
It is probably true that noteverybody is necessarily primed
for that.
They may be insecure, as smartas they may be.
I mean, one of the things thatamazed me at I've had the good
(10:07):
fortune to be around really,really smart and accomplished
people, but it can also beamazing how really, really smart
and accomplished people canthemselves be insecure about
their own expertise and beingseen not as being expert.
And I think if I think ifthat's really fundamental and
core to somebody, they're goingto have a hard time being a
(10:28):
teacher.
I mean, just to kind of becompletely frank about it.
But I also think you can primesomebody with things like,
you're going to, and I'll saythis, I mean, look, you're going
to come up with whatever it isthat you want to teach over the
hour or whatever you have.
But like, once you come up withthat, ask yourself, what would
(10:50):
you love to learn about them?
And how are you going to getthat out of it?
Like for this to be really,great for you, what would you
like to know?
And either in terms of theirreaction to what you're putting
forward, in terms of how theirexperience relates to what your
experience has been, in terms ofhow for somebody who's maybe
(11:14):
15, 20 years earlier in theircareer than how you are now, how
it's different.
And if you can have that inyour mind.
I want to walk out with thosethings.
It almost naturally puts youinto this different place of
asking questions, pulling thingsout.
At Honor, we've built atechnology platform to make that
(11:38):
a little bit easier for peopleto do in the moment, because
especially when it's virtual,not all the platforms lend
themselves really well to peoplesharing back most of their you
know, kind of built to be pipes,just kind of pushing content in
one direction and not in theother and not in the other.
But it ultimately begins withthe mindset of the of the
(12:01):
instructor, the teacher, theexpert.
John Laverdure (12:03):
So what you're
sharing, it reminds me of kind
of early in my learning relatedcareer, kind of that that
distinction between instructingversus facilitating.
Is that pretty analogous towhat you're referring to?
Joel Podolny (12:19):
Yeah, I mean, I
think that's fair.
The only way in which I'dprobably do a little bit of a
tweak on it is, to me, we thinkfacilitation is a skill that
doesn't necessarily require thefacilitator in the front of the
(12:39):
room to be an expert, to be moreknowledgeable or at least as
knowledgeable as the people whoare in the room.
I think you want to bring thosefacilitation skills to the
expert, but it is also the casethat what you want experts,
(13:02):
leading experts or experts,teaching experts, you want the
person in the front of the roomto have a point of view.
And then having a point ofview, and in fact, be a powerful
way to then pull things out ofother people, right?
It's like, it's about advocacyand inquiry, right?
To go back to the sort of ChrisArgyris sort of language,
(13:25):
right?
I'm going to put out my view.
You may disagree.
If you disagree, I want tohear.
I want to hear why.
right?
Let's have a conversation aboutthat.
When somebody's a facilitatorand their whole role is to
facilitate, they oftentimes findthemselves, I think, in the
(13:45):
position of putting out aquestion, sort of hearing a lot
of answers to the questions.
Maybe they whiteboard it, puton a flip chart, whatever it is.
But it's harder for them tokind of drive debates that
ultimately lead to in my view,greater insights or epiphany
because unlike the expert, it'sharder for them to come in with
(14:08):
a clear point of view.
Does that...
No,
John Laverdure (14:12):
that helps a
ton.
I'm glad we teased out thatdistinction because earlier on
when you were explaining it, Iwas just like, that sounds like
the facilitation versusinstructing.
But really, it's kind ofbringing it all to the table.
It's having that deepexpertise, having your own
perspectives on this, and alsohaving those facilitation skills
to elicit that engagement anddrive some further learning.
(14:36):
So no, that helps a ton.
Joel Podolny (14:38):
Yeah, and what you
just said, well said, much more
pithily said than I did.
I often say the talent of anacademic, which I was for many,
many years, was the ability tosay in two hours what a normal
person can say in two minutes.
That's a talent in and ofitself, by the way.
(14:59):
So thank you for saying it in amuch more pithy fashion.
Jocelyn Allen (15:05):
So what...
What are the practical type ofsteps that organizations should
be thinking about or taking tocreate this environment where
experts are feeling empowered toteach and learn not only from
one another, but to the massesand kind of like adjust their
role, create that professionaldevelopment within their
(15:25):
atmosphere?
What should organizations bethinking about and or doing to
get that started?
Joel Podolny (15:31):
It's a great
question.
I think one is to not makedecisions a teaching and
learning experience set up soprecious that you feel like it
can only happen at a particularlocation in the corporate
(15:53):
offices, campus, whatever it is.
I mean, we think about theseiconic corporate university
campuses like Crotonville orwhatnot.
And They had, on the one hand,like amazing, right?
Like, I mean, they're sosymbolic in terms of driving a
learning culture, but they havethe drawback of, well, when
(16:15):
we're at a place likeClaretonville, we're learning,
but then we go back to work andwe do teaching when we're there.
We do like work with feedbackwhen we're here.
And I think a big part of whatyou want to do.
And I think a big part of theway this is evolving and why you
don't have a lot of companiestoday anymore thinking about
(16:37):
these corporations is we'relooking for ways to weave the
teaching into work.
And so to make it a assumedpart of a comm meeting right who
do we have on the team thatthey can share some particular
insight that's going to be avalue and we just take that as
(16:58):
given and and and to rotate thatand make it part of it that's
one two is a big part ofteaching is is in in my view is
as we said it's it's It's askingquestions as much as it is
providing answers.
The other part I always feel ofteaching is it's giving the
(17:23):
whys behind the what.
So often you end up in thesecorporate cultures of like
report outs.
This is what we did.
And then this is what we did.
And then this is what we did.
And it's like the sort of astereotypical way in which, you
know, Parents will talk abouttheir teens coming home and
telling the story.
And then he said, and then shesaid, and then he said, and then
(17:43):
she said, right?
But teaching is about likegiving the context, right?
Here's the options we wereconsidering, right?
At the time, it wasn't obvious.
We went this way.
Here's why we went this way, asopposed to going this other
direction.
It's great storytelling.
(18:05):
It's kind of bringing peoplein.
And all of that can just bepart of work.
But it requires people beingaware and conscious and being
open to ask.
So if they see somebody justpresenting the what, For
somebody in the back of theroom, could be a senior leader,
could be somebody else saying,I'd love it if you just kind of
(18:25):
take us into what was in yourhead in the moment and what were
all the other things that youwere thinking and how you ended
up going.
And all of a sudden, we shiftfrom I've got a presentation to,
oh, I'm actually teaching.
So I think that's a big part ofit is building those routines,
making it a norm, not have it bethis thing that gets done at
(18:47):
this particular point.
place.
There's a lot of components
Jocelyn Allen (18:50):
to it that have
to do with if we're talking
about a first step and part ofthis is meeting people where
they're at and identifying whothose influencers are within
your organization that canprovide that expertise.
There's 60 different directionsany one organization can take
to get started.
But the identity andunderstanding what it is that
(19:13):
your organization needs tofollow through with, I think it
is part of the foundation ofwhere we get started.
And, you know, that's a biglift.
So I appreciate your wellthought out answer.
And if there's anybody whodoesn't do conciseness, it's me.
So you're among your peoplehere, okay?
Speaker 02 (19:30):
That's good to hear.
Jocelyn Allen (19:32):
So in the past,
if we're going back to kind of
like the basics here from thatpast question, you've also said
that foundationally, two of themost important things to have
when it comes to teaching andlearning amongst your peers in
this way is humility and amutual respect.
It seems maybe a littleself-explanatory, but let's talk
(19:53):
a little bit more about why youfound that those are so
important in fostering thisculture of experts to lead
experts.
Joel Podolny (20:01):
So to me, yeah,
humility and respect are
foundational for curiosity.
And to just echo maybe a pointI was making before, I mean, I
think...
the most effective teachers arethe ones who are truly curious
(20:22):
in the moment of teaching,right?
Like if I ask a question, Ireally want to know like, like
what, people are going toanswer.
Not like I want to know theanswer.
I mean, presumably, as I waspreparing teaching, I have the
answer written down somewhere.
(20:42):
But I want to know what they'regoing to answer, and I want to
know why.
And I'm particularly intriguedwhen I'm surprised.
And I think that's what leadsto a great kind of teaching and
learning culture is one whereyou can just feel the curiosity
(21:07):
in how people interact with oneanother you can feel when people
make a statement and they'repausing not because they want to
move on but they really want toknow like okay how do you react
to what i just said like howdoes that hit you how does that
strike you what does that makeyou think of and If people don't
(21:34):
have humility around theirexpertise, if they don't have a
respect for others who don'thave their expertise, it's
almost impossible for them tohave that level of curiosity to
really elevate the learningexperience and then more broadly
the learning culture.
John Laverdure (21:55):
I'm very curious
your perspective, Joel, We've
had a lot of evolution oftechnology in the last several
years.
I mean, it never stops, but wecertainly hit certain
milestones, generative AI beingone of those.
And with all that, with allthose dynamics at play, how do
you see the roles of teachingand learning evolving in
(22:17):
organizations over the nextdecade?
So
Joel Podolny (22:22):
for me personally
and for Honor Education as a
company, One of the things thatwe regard as like foundational
and central is transformationallearning requires human
connection.
In part, we've been talkingabout that, right?
Like what makes somebody agreat teacher is we could have
said it a slightly different waythan we did, but it is about
(22:45):
that connection.
When I think about like thelearning experiences that have
been most transformative in mylife, So, yeah.
My worry, let me give my worryfirst, John.
(23:20):
My worry is that whattechnology has been doing for a
while is it's been driving usinto these almost
hyper-personalized silos, right?
Where on the one hand, it'sgreat.
You can get kind of anywhere,anytime access to content.
(23:40):
And now you can get anywhereaccess to content and you can...
have a conversation with yourown chat bot who's going to be
completely obsequious and tellyou how smart you are and kind
of all the rest in terms of howyou understand things.
But my worry is that, andagain, this is based on my own
experience, for me, like thegreatest learning experience
(24:05):
that I've had is when I bumpinto somebody who thinks
differently from me, whoperceives differently than me,
who understands somethingdifferently than me.
And I, you know, what we'recommitted to at Honor is weaving
that human connection intolearning.
(24:26):
And I think the need to focuson that now is even more more
important than, honestly, when Istarted the company a few years
ago because of what AI hasbecome.
And on the one hand, it isabsolutely one of the most
empowering technologies that Ihave experienced in my lifetime.
(24:48):
So I am hardly a critic.
And at the same time, I thinkwe need to be really mindful of
And I suspect most peopleresonate with that observation
that the most significantlearning in your life has had
connection to other individualsas part of it.
And so how do we build ourtechnological infrastructure in
(25:13):
a company to make sure that I'mstaying connected to other
learners as I'm on my ownlearning journey and that that
That to me is really critical,but it requires intentionality
for all of us who are in thelearning and development
profession, because the naturaltendency is going to be to move
in the other direction.
Like just here, you can havethe content when you want it,
(25:36):
where you want it.
Here's your chat bot to havethe conversation with it.
And then you're kind of in yourown, own echo chamber.
John Laverdure (25:42):
Yeah, there was,
there was a huge step towards
that.
Even, even as search enginesbecame very complex.
quick and easy to look thingsup on a moment's notice, and we
just turn the dial up to 10 withAI.
We know AI is all about theprompts, and we're offering the
prompts, right?
So it very much does become anecho chamber and rife with
(26:03):
biases just in that regard.
Joel Podolny (26:06):
Yeah, I mean,
without kind of going into too
many of the details of it, butto tie it back to where this
conversation started, I'mconvinced that the reason I got
the job at Apple University whenSteve was interviewing me was
we started having a conversationabout higher education.
And I told him one thing thatchanged the way he– I don't know
(26:31):
if it changed.
That's probably a little bittoo much.
I don't know if it changed theway he thought about it, but it
gave him something to thinkabout that he had not had the
opportunity to– have presentedto him in the particular way.
And because after that moment,it completely changed the
conversation.
It was like, you have thesemoments in an interview where
(26:51):
you're like, oh, I think I'vegot the job now.
Like, that was the moment whenit was like, oh, you've now
given me...
And he was such a voraciouslearner, like, as I would come
to know later.
Like, it even convinced memore, like...
he was looking for that.
Like, give me something that Idon't already think.
Give me something that I don'talready know.
(27:13):
Give me something that I can'tfind out on my own, right?
Because if I can find out,like, what do I need you for?
And that's a particularlyproactive version of it.
But I think that's true aboutall of us.
Like, I absolutely lean in whenI hear from somebody who, like,
(27:34):
wow, they are thinking aboutthis completely differently than
me.
I mean, they could be a hundredpercent wrong, but like, at
least in the beginning, I'mlike, okay, this is interesting
now.
I mean, if they're just kind ofparroting what I already
believe, like, again, it is alittle bit of a waste of time.
And, and, and I think whatwe've got, that's again, why at
Honor we're, we make thatcollective engagement so central
(27:58):
to the, to the, to the digitallearning experience.
Cause we, we, we just, We'rejust really concerned that the
way the world's evolving, that'sgoing to be forgotten.
And anyway, I think keep going.
John Laverdure (28:10):
Well, chances
are if you engage Steve Jobs,
you probably engaged a strongcross-section of Apple.
So probably a good move on hispart to bring you on board.
So awesome.
So as far as it would be coolto have a takeaway for some HR
and L&D leaders listening today,what would you say is one piece
of advice that you could giveto help them build a culture
(28:33):
where teaching and learning arereally at the core of their
organizations?
Joel Podolny (28:38):
So maybe to just
put what I just said in kind of
a simple statement, I mean, one,prioritize connection and
learning, right?
Like whether or not that'sconnection between the
instructor and the learners.
And what do I mean byconnection?
I mean, it's truly a dialogue,right?
Like I have the opportunity ifI've got questions to have those
(28:58):
questions answered if I'm alearner.
and meaningfully answered.
If I can be really excited,really curious, and then I've
got a whole bunch of questions,but you're basically told, oh,
sorry, we don't have time forthat, or we don't have the way
for you to access that, you cango do your own internet search.
(29:21):
To me, that would completelyundermine the learning culture,
and conversely, prioritizedconnection, and I think it
elevates it.
And so we tend to focus so muchon the content.
And I think what we misssometimes is the importance of
community around that content.
(29:42):
And so that would be numberone.
I think the second is, if youwant a great learning culture,
you do need a great teachingculture.
Because what ultimately makesan organization great, not just
good, but great, is that theyreally focus on what is distinct
(30:07):
and unique about them.
And if you're just pulling inlearning content from the
outside world that anybody elsecould have access to, as opposed
to building your own repositoryof expertise, experience,
wisdom, and insight, there'sonly so high you can go relative
(30:30):
to what's there.
What I loved about Apple andApple University was Apple
basically said to us, we wantand we need you to create
content that works for Apple.
Meaning, If you were in anothercompany, you'd be building
something else.
We want you building what'sunique to us.
(30:52):
And so that then requires, one,giving those who are involved
in learning exposure to thecompany and the decisions that
are made and the whys behind thewhats and all the rest.
It requires having a and atechnological infrastructure
that supports that teachingculture.
And then it does require theseaspects of culture, the humility
(31:15):
that we talked about.
But to really focus oncommunity, really focus on how
do we teach who we uniquely arewhen we're at our best, like
that's to me what makes forgreat learning.
Jocelyn Allen (31:34):
I love how much
regarding connection that you
put into your explanation there,because I believe in that.
We deal with that every day,that it's not just about content
on a page.
It's about the engagementfactor that comes from being
good at what you do, but alsobringing relevance to the table
(31:54):
as well.
So I love that you're leaningin on the connection there,
because I think that's a hugemissing piece of what makes
learning different organizationto organization.
Joel Podolny (32:04):
I'm glad that
resonates.
Jocelyn Allen (32:05):
Yeah, I do.
I'm all about the connectionshere.
You know what I'm also allabout is putting a little
playful spin on the end of theshow.
And I'm drawing it out, Joel,because I want to hype you up.
Joel Podolny (32:17):
I've heard.
I'm getting ready.
I
Jocelyn Allen (32:18):
know you're ready
for it, my dude.
So with that, David, I thinkyou have a theme song for the
TTA 10 that you're supposed toplay right about now.
David Yas (32:28):
It's the TTA 10.
10 final questions for ourguest.
Jocelyn Allen (32:34):
All right, Joel,
you know what this is all about.
We talked to the beginningabout how I'm going to ask you
10 playful questions.
Dave is going to put 90 secondson the clock.
You answer them as naturally,as quickly as possible.
And whether you win or lose, wedon't care.
We're going to celebrate you atthe end anyway.
So it's all in the name of goodfun.
(32:54):
So are you ready for thechallenge ahead?
Joel Podolny (32:58):
Hold on one sec.
Unknown (33:00):
Okay.
Joel Podolny (33:01):
All right, I'm
ready.
Jocelyn Allen (33:02):
Now you're ready.
David, 90 seconds on the clock,please.
David Yas (33:08):
Yes, Jocelyn, 90
seconds on the TTA 10 clock
beginning now.
Jocelyn Allen (33:14):
Okay, would you
rather give up coffee forever or
give up social media forever?
Joel Podolny (33:20):
Oh, social media,
no problem.
Jocelyn Allen (33:21):
I know, me too.
Would you rather wear shoesthat are one size too small or
one size too big all the time?
Joel Podolny (33:30):
One size too big.
Jocelyn Allen (33:31):
Yeah.
Okay.
What is six plus two?
Eight.
Oops.
Sorry.
My computer froze.
Okay.
If your life had a theme song,every time you entered a room,
what would the song be?
Joel Podolny (33:42):
We're going to get
way past the 90 seconds on this
one.
I can't, can't always get whatyou want rolling stones.
That's what's in my mind.
Jocelyn Allen (33:56):
If you were a
superhero, what would your
superpower be?
Joel Podolny (33:59):
My superpower
would be not being able to go on
relatively little sleep.
Yeah, that's my superpower.
Jocelyn Allen (34:06):
All right.
Would you rather go on avacation beachside or
mountainside?
Joel Podolny (34:12):
Mountainside.
Jocelyn Allen (34:13):
Okay.
If you could learn everylanguage on the planet or be
able to talk to animals, whichwould you choose?
Joel Podolny (34:20):
100% animals.
I really would love to knowwhat my cats are thinking all
the
Jocelyn Allen (34:24):
time.
Joel Podolny (34:25):
Yeah, that one's
easy.
Jocelyn Allen (34:27):
What is a talent
that nobody knows that you have?
Joel Podolny (34:30):
Nobody knows?
I'm a really good baker.
I mean, my wife knows, but Idon't think a lot
Jocelyn Allen (34:38):
of people know.
Okay.
What's a weird food that youlove but everybody else hates?
Joel Podolny (34:45):
Everybody hates
it.
Okra?
Jocelyn Allen (34:48):
Okay.
What's the last book that youread?
Joel Podolny (34:51):
The last book that
I read was Robert Cairo's The
Power Broker.
Jocelyn Allen (34:56):
Okay.
And then if you could switchlives with any celebrity, who
would you choose?
Joel Podolny (35:02):
What popped into
my head was George Clooney, but
I don't know why.
Jocelyn Allen (35:06):
Okay.
Hey, listen, that's okay.
You don't have to have a goodreason.
You just got to have an answer.
So with that, David, 10questions complete.
I mean, I've been looking atthe clock, so we know the
answer, but let's give this guya celebration, shall we?
David Yas (35:21):
Hold on.
Hold on.
The time came in that unclear,but we had to adjust it because
Jocelyn got confused as to whattwo plus six was.
And also he gets...
Bonus deduction because I wasgoing to say George Clooney,
too.
It popped into my head.
So that's where it's at.
So he came in.
You know what?
(35:41):
He won.
That's the
Speaker 02 (35:42):
answer.
Yay, Joel!
David Yas (35:49):
Yay! And because he's
a winner, of course he's a
winner.
He's Joel Podolny.
We're going to salute himappropriately.
And everybody enjoy thismusical tribute, an ode to Joel.
We'll be right back.
(36:27):
he built apple you like ahogwarts for brains with keynote
spells and leadership lanes hesaid let's not hoard all this
knowledge gold let's share itlike snacks before it gets old
he's the master of mutualrespect got mbas nodding correct
(36:51):
correct he'll empower yourtalent and sharpen your aim and
make your slack channel Bye.
Bye.
Bye.
the good stuff yeah joel paulme he'll school you with love
(37:44):
yeah joel paul me he'll schoolyou with love oh about that
Jocelyn Allen (37:53):
wow Joel, I
realize it was very unfair to
ask you about your theme songbefore that song played.
So now you obviously have abetter answer, but...
Joel Podolny (38:04):
Yeah.
Wow.
I, I, I, I've never had asurprise party thrown for me,
but like, I feel like I now knowthe
Jocelyn Allen (38:09):
feeling.
And now, you know, sixdifferent ways to produce, to
pronounce your last name.
We
David Yas (38:17):
did that on purpose
just to keep everybody guessing.
Jocelyn Allen (38:21):
Oh, goodness,
Joel, you are a delight.
So thank you for spending thetime with us and giving us all
this great information.
It was a pleasure and weappreciate you sharing it with
our audience.
So thank you.
Thanks again.
And we look forward to havingyou back sometime.
Joel Podolny (38:37):
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, thank you.
It was a real pleasure.
I look forward to the next timewe connect.
Thank you so much, Joel.
Take care.
Jocelyn Allen (38:47):
For more
information on building a
culture of teaching and learningin your organization, visit us
at thetrainingassociates.com.
We'll see you later.