August 31, 2022 • 52 mins
Brian and Stacey try to figure out what is going on with their Venezuelan audience... Questions range from first loves, what their next tattoos might be.
Analyzing dreams has Stacey being Aqua Woman and Brian in an alternate universe....
Other questions : Do we feel emotionally close ?
Broken Tile Reviews :
"Blackbird" on Apple TV
"Nine Perfect Strangers" on Hulu
Spotify Musical Guest : Nation Of Language
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Brian Upton (00:05):
red lights on label.
Stacey Upton (00:08):
Welcome to What?
To the broken tiles podcast withbrains
Brian Upton (00:31):
now you're gone for a second month there.
Stacey Upton (00:34):
That's usually how we start. It's very true. How
are you? Tired still, but I'mgood.
Brian Upton (00:44):
I've gotten into a habit of doing furious typing
right up to the time we start
Stacey Upton (00:53):
furious typing on your computer. Yes, because
there's lots of work to dolately.
Brian Upton (00:58):
If you're not typing, you're eating popcorn.
Stacey Upton (01:02):
like a crazy person.
Brian Upton (01:03):
If not eating popcorn, you're scratching your
skull.
Stacey Upton (01:11):
So we have to describe that. Is that something
you really wanted to share with?
Brian Upton (01:15):
Maybe you haven't heard this show is about brutal
honesty. That is I found out wehave a problem in Venezuela. Oh,
tell? We you know, we've gone wego anywhere from between number
14 and number 75. On Applepodcasts. I've done some
analytics. Okay. When I make funof you. Yeah, we're near the
(01:38):
top. What appears when I let youkind of roll free. We dropped to
near 75.
Stacey Upton (01:47):
I think you're full of it. I really have some
doubts about your analyticevaluation
Brian Upton (01:58):
over team. Oh, really? Yeah. Researchers. Yeah.
And that includes who? Baileycolumn, he'll take the bullet
for me.
Stacey Upton (02:09):
Well, does that mean he'll be truthful or your
your thinking that he'll justsay what you might like for him
to say is that what take thebullet for me means
Brian Upton (02:19):
he'll take the bullet for me.
Stacey Upton (02:23):
All right. The bottom
Brian Upton (02:25):
line is this is that I come with you with
science and with numbers andwith facts. And you come back
with me with emotion. I'm comingwith cold hard facts about what
is making our podcast go. It's acoincidence that it's me making
fun of you.
Stacey Upton (02:44):
What I have learned about research is it can
be swayed hypotheses, andfindings can be construed to
point in the direction you mightlike for them to point.
Unfortunately, not always
Brian Upton (03:05):
condescending.
Well, that's not the point. Iwant it.
Stacey Upton (03:11):
What was that?
Brian Upton (03:12):
I don't know. Let's do this one.
I even know what level this is.
Close it is. That's right. nineepisodes in nine episodes in
learning the game. We're playing
Stacey Upton (03:31):
the game called Let's get closer.
Brian Upton (03:36):
I think I've changed my mind. I want to start
winning. What do you mean thegame?
Stacey Upton (03:42):
There's a way to win. Okay,
Brian Upton (03:45):
is there I just feel like nine episodes in I can
start dominating now on myanswers.
Stacey Upton (03:52):
I think playing the game is a way to win.
Brian Upton (03:56):
So I won.
Stacey Upton (03:58):
Well, maybe I needed to reset. Okay. Question
number one. The Green Levelclose. What? Sorry? When was the
first time you fell in love?
Brian Upton (04:21):
Oh, we did first I was about to go down the path
that we were we did. Have youever had your heart broken? I
think or do have you ever brokensomebody's heart? That's right.
The first question I fell inlove. So I feel like this goes
all the way back to I think it'sgonna be towards sixth grade or
(04:48):
seventh grade. And I feel likethere's a journey song involved
in a downstairs dance atsomebody's house.
Stacey Upton (04:54):
Oh my goodness.
Like these questions they
Brian Upton (04:57):
come on and it's like a flush of accessing The
part of my brain that thequestion brings on. And it's
kind of coming back to me who itwould have been. I know that
feeling would have been lovebased on what I knew from books
and movies and things like thatit would have been six to
(05:18):
seventh grade. And are we tryingto access the person? Even if
it's like a first name kind ofthing, right?
Stacey Upton (05:25):
You can if you would like, I think it's helpful
just to remind yourself of whatthat felt like and the
experience.
Brian Upton (05:34):
Yeah. And I think the first girl that I was in
love with was in that rain,sixth or seventh grade ish in I
think it was Joanna Martin. Andshe would have been at Holy
Cross with me, I have memorieslike now I'm piecing it together
of memories of straw hat pizza,like after an event or something
like that, and having her friendtalk to my friend, talk to her
(05:57):
friend, talk to my friend. Andyou kind of had that. That final
moment. I don't even know if wekissed her anything. It might
have just been, I was in loveand Joanna and her could have
been, I feel like there was onegirl I dated. And it's funny
(06:19):
what you call love at that age.
I might have been in love withsomebody. This is a true story.
I've told you this one before.
But I threw a note. I wasconnected to a girl, Chris, and
through a friend. We starteddating, like in one of the first
two periods of class. And it wasofficial, that she'll go out
(06:39):
with you. And we're official.
And then she broke up with me atlunch
Stacey Upton (06:42):
at lunch the same day. Yeah. But I
Brian Upton (06:45):
will tell you this, that in the micro of that little
moment from 930 to 1227. I wasin love.
Stacey Upton (06:55):
Well, what did you experience? Like? How did you
What were you feeling that madeyou think it was love?
Brian Upton (07:01):
That's thinking about our future? Thinking about
what we name our kids future
Stacey Upton (07:07):
beyond lunch
Brian Upton (07:09):
that I laid right out in front of me? I think it's
a great question. I think it'swell, I think, for me, where I
lead with it the beginning,scratching part of my brain
making my brain think back. Ican do some of the math here is
probably 44 years ago now. 46years ago. Yes. In that
(07:34):
somewhere in that range to thinkthat's probably a healthy habit.
Stacey Upton (07:41):
To back that far.
Is that what you mean?
Brian Upton (07:43):
I don't know the science of but I think so. To
kind of like, you know, possiblyaccess a memory. I don't even
know if there would be a thoughtto this. But I feel like there
has to be something positiveabout that. About you.
Stacey Upton (08:00):
Yeah, for me. When I when I thought I was really in
love, because of course prior tothis, there were crushes here
and there. But it was not thesame is seventh grade. Brad.
Brian Upton (08:15):
I know all these names I know.
Stacey Upton (08:17):
And I'm not going to say his last name, because
it's a very distinctive lastname. And I just don't think
that would be fair. No, well, Idon't think anybody is going to
know. That was a more commonlast name that you stated.
Joking. But anyhow, I was inseventh grade. And he was a
(08:38):
friend of a boy that went to mychurch. And he brought him to a
youth group event. Oh, it was alock in. We had an overnight
sleepover at the church just forthe teens. Oh, yeah. I mean,
there wasn't anything nefariousthat happened. But
Brian Upton (09:00):
why can't you look me in the eyes while you're
telling that story.
Stacey Upton (09:03):
I was in love with him. He was he played the viola
and I played the clarinet. So wewere both band geeks. And really
liked being band geeks. And youknow, for that age, we felt like
we had a lot in common. But Ijust remember like, that's all I
(09:27):
could think about was him. Yeah.
And we wrote notes to eachother. And we didn't get to see
each other very often. But itwas, you know, that first
feeling of like, I think beingin love that new kind of love is
very akin to obsessivecompulsive disorder. So you
think about,
Brian Upton (09:48):
oh, I was about to ask you to explain that. But
yeah,
Stacey Upton (09:50):
it's all you think about every thought. Every
action is sort of revolvingaround this person that you
can't get out of Your system.
Brian Upton (10:01):
Yeah. And mine was two hours and 32 minutes. But
whole life right ahead of me andthe other part of my story and I
want to get back so I have aquestion or two. Is that it? She
broke up with me. across theplayground somebody else telling
me so Oh, yes, we didn't holdhands. We really had no
interaction. We were just goingout for two or three periods.
(10:24):
Did
Stacey Upton (10:24):
it start with a note? Like somebody champ this
box? If you liked me?
Brian Upton (10:27):
Yeah. Basically, I don't think it said that. I
think it was really like, youknow, I couldn't negotiate more
of like a nucular summit oflike, I'm a dude. And I like
that girl. And it worked out.
But we still hadn't quiteconnected at lunchtime, there
was no holding hands. It was nokiss exchanged. And I think it
was over before. We actuallywere seen as a couple out there.
So what's a big lingeringquestion for me after your story
(10:52):
of first love is what's a viola?
Stacey Upton (10:57):
It's similar to a violin. It's in the violin
family.
Brian Upton (11:02):
Oh, that makes it that makes it better? I'm glad
you clarified. That wasconfusing. broaden it, though.
Let's do our little game we'vebeen within the game, which is
broadening the question a tinybit to the scope of great
answer. Why is this possiblymatter? And I do have a thought
(11:22):
on it that you can maybe expoundon. We almost by accident. And I
always say that, possibly not byaccident. But I know it wasn't
super intentional. So somewherein between, we're very open
talking about every singlerelationship we've ever had
leading up to ours at the verybeginning, we didn't circle back
around, right, it was part of acontinuing sort of narrative. I
(11:45):
think out of just being youngand super curious about where
you just came from before astigma fit in. About, like,
let's say you meet somebody at30, you might have some
permanent thoughts of it, youmight be not going to dig up old
shit. But when you meet as youngas we did, I think we rolled in
like who just date? Where do youjust come from? Like, literally,
(12:06):
where'd you just come from? AndI think it became a pattern of
behavior, not only where we justcame from, but then expanding
who was before that?
Stacey Upton (12:15):
Well, yeah, because I think what we were
trying to discover is who areyou? And if you had a
relationship that didn't workout why
Brian Upton (12:23):
that's it. And that's the point I was going to
make as I think as far as intothe universe of relationships.
Without knowing that was oursort of path and intention. I
think what we might have done isbeen giving each other a
playbook of what didn't work forme, and what did
Stacey Upton (12:42):
exactly, and I think it's important to
recognize that we all you know,before entering a lasting
relationship, very likely havehad more than one time where
we've been in love withsomebody, and those are
opportunities to learn whatworks, what doesn't, you know,
for you personally, and ofcourse, you want to take what
(13:04):
you learned into that nextrelationship and see, you know,
how can you make it better? Howcan how might things be
different because of what Ilearned from that last
experience and the experiencebefore that? And before that,
that's it? Yeah.
Brian Upton (13:19):
And funny, again, a very innocuous question, that I
think I'm almost getting moreaddicted to in this podcast,
this part than the actual answerbecause you're, you're in your
own mind, you're giving ananswer. And it's honest, but
(13:42):
it's got an entertainment valueof you and the dog curled up on
the ground right there to acertain extent, to a certain
extent, because it just doesn'tresonate, but so I like getting
to this after you know, beforewe go there I know there's
something that's been hauntingyou
Stacey Upton (13:59):
haunting me?
Brian Upton (14:01):
What what a ninja sex party might sound like?
Stacey Upton (14:07):
I've never heard of such a thing
Brian Upton (14:08):
but it's been haunting you.
Stacey Upton (14:09):
How can it be haunting me?
Brian Upton (14:12):
Because this is what it sounds like. Even Trade
very now what I thought the sexparty would sound like
confusing. Wait, what is that?
What is this?
Stacey Upton (14:28):
Oh my goodness.
Brian Upton (14:29):
This is a cover of Take on me by ninja sex party.
Wow. I like it was a bait andswitch right there.
Stacey Upton (14:39):
It totally what
Brian Upton (14:40):
I thought we were going to do our first rated
episode. It's a little band thatdoes all covers called ninja sex
party. Huge promotion for them.
There. They have a chance toprobably skyrocket in Venezuela
after this Have you ever getold?
Stacey Upton (15:06):
No, I, it's so fun.
Brian Upton (15:07):
There's so many people that call me. Like,
that's the that's a good littlehook. And it's one of four
buttons that I have. How luckyare we?
Stacey Upton (15:15):
I don't have a huge soundboard. No, no, it's
very first
Brian Upton (15:18):
question people have when they listen to podcast
is, who's your producer? What'sthe studio? Like?
Stacey Upton (15:25):
If they could only see,
Brian Upton (15:27):
I can't believe you think we have people that ask?
It's ever as
Stacey Upton (15:33):
my gosh, I really need to consider the source.
Always
Brian Upton (15:38):
move a little closer. Well done. Thanks. I
know the game.
Stacey Upton (15:43):
Okay. What was our biggest challenge? And how did
we overcome it?
Brian Upton (15:53):
We're still in the middle of it. And I know we've
accessed this information. MaybeMaybe you have a different one.
I think the the obvious one is alittle it's more on the nose of
I'm gonna give a second answer.
But the first one is, I think weovercame in the first half may
be and I do. We've we've alludedto it in some of the podcasts. I
(16:14):
think we overcame my youth, my,my brain developing through that
period. And I think it's asubstantial, we survived me more
than we did you. As far asthat's the way I see it. That's
not my answer. The answer tothat specific question is we
survived our 20s and early 30s,financial sort of frivolity. And
(16:39):
the story we have with thatthat's interesting, going
backwards is almost too much tooearly. In a way, it was like too
much too early as far as. AndI'm not saying that is an excuse
at all, I'm looking back on theblueprint of our life. And why
we struggled financially, it's,it's there was a couple arcs
(17:01):
where I think we learned somebad habits early because of a
dearth of money, and then inexcess of money for the age we
had with what was in ourchecking account. And we didn't
have any kind of a, I'll usethat word again, like a playbook
for what to do with it. Andthose struggles had
(17:22):
reverberations for a long time.
And so if I remember what thequestion is already, which is
kind of lame, it wasspecifically,
Stacey Upton (17:33):
what was our biggest challenge? And how did
we overcome it?
Brian Upton (17:37):
Yeah, that was it.
It was kind of going to thebottom of that. And then quite
honestly, a 15 year, a lot ofour life is broken up into
halves right now, I kind of feellike there's parts of it that
are, you know, at 32 years,there's 14 of this 16, or
something like that, where itfeels like we've been on a path
of recovery from that for wellover 10 years. Now. If you know,
(18:00):
to move towards 15, we've grownup together we have so that
would be my answers. Is that tothat question is is we did
survive that together.
Stacey Upton (18:12):
Yeah. And mine is somewhat similar. I thought
about the the big financialevent fall, if you will, when we
were living in New York. And itwas it was a challenge, because
of course, you know, when you'reat a point where you lose
everything, that at least itfelt like we were losing
(18:33):
everything. It it made usreprioritize everything. Yeah.
And first of all, you alluded tothe fact that we sort of
overcame you was what you saidand and I I don't know that I
fully agree with that, becausewe were both youthful and
(18:56):
operating, unskilled fully. Andwhen this financial fall
happened, you had not beenforthcoming about what was going
on until it was too late oressentially, over. It was over.
When you shared with me what wasgoing on, and you allowed
(19:21):
yourself to be vulnerable, andreally share everything,
including how you felt and whatyour emotions were. That's when
I think we started theovercoming part of it. We were
on a new level between us. Therewas openness and honesty that I
(19:44):
don't know that I realizedwasn't there before. But it
wasn't but it wasn't. And so itwas kind of it was all shocking.
But then it was like we leveledup in a sense with our
relationship.
Brian Upton (19:58):
I feel like it was the shackles of The patriarchy
in a little more in hindsight,that in the moment and the
moment it was chaos, inhindsight, I think what I was
struggling with was the, theburden of a patriarchal concept
of I got it, I got it, I got it,I got it. My Respect is earned
(20:18):
from me getting it. I've got itcovered in man, that the minute
that I said, let's share it, itdidn't make me less of a person.
I didn't change muchfundamentally, as far as my
daily sort of Outlook regime, Ijust had some balance and some
help in and you know, the beatthe word down a little bit, some
(20:41):
equity in even those those partsof it. And that helped.
Stacey Upton (20:46):
And I was happy to live in the patriarchy at that
time. I put my blinders on. Istayed home. I was raising the
kids, I was sort of doing my ownthing. But when we went into
that next level, and the equitybegan to happen between us.
(21:09):
While it was hard, it was alsoit felt good.
Brian Upton (21:13):
Yeah. Oh, there's no doubt about it. I'm a little
shocked thinking back on it thatI didn't have a breakout
earlier. We were non traditionalat the beginning. I was going to
school. I raised Taylor, for thefirst couple years. You were
working full time. But it didn'tstick or something. I wasn't
reaching out. But we weren't. Iwasn't overthinking it. I wasn't
(21:34):
depressed at home. I wasn'tYeah, I loved watching Taylor
full time. I loved my life doingthat. And then I just happened
to go to work full time youstayed home. But I did. Once I
went back, I did fall back intothat sort of muscle memory
behavior of the patriarchy of,of for some reason, making you
think I always had you guyscovered.
Stacey Upton (21:55):
Yes, that was an you really use those words of
I've got it. I've got it. Yeah.
It was almost like a mantra.
Brian Upton (22:04):
Right. And to this day, we still have remnants of
it. And what's the big thing thelast couple of years you and I
have been talking about? Wereone of the biggest remnants of
the life decades of thispatriarchy, decades of this.
When you say can we spend itright? And it just, I'm just
like, let's let's and we like mesaying it's one of those things,
(22:27):
or it's one of those ones? Yes.
I think that's part we're tryingto break because I've gotten to
the point now I'm like, I don'tknow, can we you know, we know.
But we both know, the broadeningthis one out a tiny bit. We
don't have to spend a ton oftime on it. But I did have a
thought as we go to thebroadening of this is the
question itself might be afundamental one to kind of
(22:48):
receptacle to in a relationship.
So you know that you can achievethings and you recognize it so
that you can rely on it whenshit hits the fan. So if you ask
this question yourself, and insmaller increments, you might
realize that within therelationship already, you have
the fundamentals to solve shit.
Stacey Upton (23:07):
Absolutely. It's it's the same tactic that we use
in behavior change in some ofthe behavior change classes that
I teach. It's creating a placefor small for success, small
success, and then going back andlooking at what have I
(23:30):
accomplished? What have Iactually done? Well, so you can
build up that sense of selfefficacy, that that feeling of
agency that I can do this,right? It's important. It lets
you know that I am capable,
Brian Upton (23:46):
because what happens is, I think people lose
connection with their ability tofind their way out. Yeah, and
all of a sudden, you're wakingup saying I can't find my way
out or I can't see a way outwith that person. And I
literally want out now,
Stacey Upton (24:05):
yeah, you get it's easy to get stuck in a role that
for whatever reason worked,because it was efficient for
some reason. And then we forgetthat we can do things a
different way. Right. And youyou experience that learned
helplessness, that inability todo something different. Yeah.
(24:26):
And we all have the ability todo something different. It's
just a matter of getting outsideof your comfort zone, which is
always a challenge right. Now isSookie is playing with a ball.
Brian Upton (24:40):
Can I just take the ball away from her? Oh, no. She
said, Okay. Nope, not yet. Oh,little pause here we're going to
do we're going to do tworeviews. And it's a new angle.
It's going to be quick. We'restill doing the, you know the
one to 10 broken tiles eight,nine and 10 is a master Pease
(25:03):
567 is a mosaic okay anythingbelow that you get into
basically the kind of trashyrange so we're going to do two
reviews now these are ones thatare kind of a little bit more
along the lines of some of thereviews you would see on maybe a
rotten tomatoes where they wereliterally doing a limited
episode review one might be fullbut I think the other ones just
(25:26):
one or two episodes we watchedsee if this rings a bell
don't look you're cheating.
Stacey Upton (25:37):
You're can't read it.
Brian Upton (25:38):
Because it's pretty far away. You wouldn't know it's
not on there. No
Stacey Upton (25:46):
one's familiar but I can't place it
Brian Upton (25:48):
nine perfect strangers.
Stacey Upton (25:50):
Oh gosh.
Brian Upton (25:52):
The broken tiles review.
Stacey Upton (25:55):
Yeah, I can come up with this real quick. It's on
Hulu. It's on Hulu. It starsNicole Kidman right. I'm going I
say this lives in the velvetpainting range.
Brian Upton (26:08):
Whoa, I don't even think we have that as a
category. It's a new categoryand you just made it up. Yep.
What number
Stacey Upton (26:15):
it is this range from one to three.
Brian Upton (26:18):
And I'm waiting
Stacey Upton (26:22):
Well, I had heard from more than one person that
it was really worth watching andfun. And
Brian Upton (26:30):
should we give a full credit here we'll give it a
little tiny preview like we doso people know what we're
talking about. I'm perfectstrangers and American drama
streaming television mini seriesbased on the 2018 novel The same
name by Leon Moriarty created byDavid Kelly also develop the
series that did not give me thedescription of what I was
looking forward you know I thinkthe
Stacey Upton (26:51):
nine strangers come to a Wellness Spa that's it
and so it's a stories of each ofthese nine people that come
together
Brian Upton (26:59):
yeah promise total transformation nine very
different people arrive attranquil them houses secluded
retreat run by the mysteriouswellness guru, Marsha. Okay, get
my review right now go for itzero.
Stacey Upton (27:12):
And why?
Brian Upton (27:14):
Trash in this is probably a circumstance where I
will look at some point after tosee how far off base I am. That
this is horrible. It wasterrible, amazing actors, great
actors, unbelievable actors inthat
Stacey Upton (27:31):
blown away. I felt like the dialogue was stale. And
the characters were verystereotypical. And it it didn't
grab my attention
Brian Upton (27:43):
tomorrow waving Bobby Cannavale Grace Pat and
Melissa McCarthy's in it LukeEvans, Manny Jacinto, which is
we love these actors like theactors just kept coming into the
first couple minutes I'm likehell yes.
Stacey Upton (27:56):
We didn't finish the first episode we couldn't
get through it zero Yeah, I wasbeing too kind we'll force
Brian Upton (28:02):
our way through me because I think like the Rotten
Tomatoes ones we can always recircle around and up this rating
at some point if we want to givea quick update and I'll fly
through since we trashed it I'llwe'll watch a few more episodes
and see if it can recover but Ididn't get your number
Stacey Upton (28:19):
I said to
Brian Upton (28:22):
what did you find redeeming?
Stacey Upton (28:26):
I like the actors
Brian Upton (28:30):
are gone second review. I give me more time tell
me says do anything do don'tlook
Stacey Upton (28:35):
up it's got to be Blackbird. It's
Brian Upton (28:44):
Blackbird.
Stacey Upton (28:45):
I don't wreck Oh, now I recommend recognize the
music. Okay, this is Masterpiecequality. It never failed. The
acting was remarkable. The whatwas the creepy characters named
Larry the person who playedLarry who's a pedophile? I've
(29:10):
never seen anything so creepyand disturbing and well done. It
was phenomenal. I wouldrecommend this to anybody if if
you if you are not put off bythe subject matter
Brian Upton (29:27):
it's it's unbelievable in will give the
same treatment inspired byactual events when high school
football hero and decorate apoliceman sons Jimmy Keane is
sentenced to 10 years in prison.
In a minimum security prison.
He's given a choice of lifetimeinterim maximum security prison
for the criminally insane andbefriend suspected serial killer
Larry Hall. And it withoutgiving. There's no spoilers that
(29:47):
basically is what the beginningof the series happens. And I
think it's a limited series onApple TV. I'm going I'm trying
to find any fault in that thing.
But I do want to give myselfsome kind of wiggle room for
some that we come. I'm going 9.7You know, masterpiece with all
the wings.
Stacey Upton (30:10):
I have to agree i There wasn't one thing I didn't
like about it right? It'sdisturbing. Yeah. But very well
done
Brian Upton (30:26):
it's not even your turn. Oh, okay. I didn't expect
better. I'm trying to be alittle more spontaneous with
this because I realized the funpart of our game is that I don't
know. So I'm trying to justrifle through and go to a page
and see if it's good.
Stacey Upton (30:39):
A page of what explain. It's called if a book
called
Brian Upton (30:44):
F, Evelyn MacFarlane and James say, well,
Stacey Upton (30:48):
Sookie found another ball.
Brian Upton (30:50):
It's outrageous.
But she so here's a fun one.
Okay, if you had to go tonightto be tattooed. Where on your
body? Would you have it done?
And what would it be?
Stacey Upton (30:59):
My I can answer that. The wearer of my body I'm
not quite clear on but I wasactually thinking recently about
the top of my foot because Iwant to see it. And what I want
is a golden heart. Do you knowwhy I want a golden heart? Yeah,
for your boy. Yeah. When Baileyour son was? Well, you know, I
(31:24):
was about to say when he waslittle, he was sweet. But he
still is. But when he was young,you know, as a toddler. We were
just everybody would be amazedby how sweet and kindly always
was. And so we call them the boywith a golden heart. That was
his nickname. And I was given Ithink it must have been for
(31:45):
Mother's Day. purchased by you,but as a gift from all the kids,
those willow tree statues. Andit's it looks like a boy holding
a heart that's painted gold.
Yeah. And so I have asked ourtattoo artist if he can do a
gold heart and there's not goldink, but he says he can make it
(32:07):
look like gold and I can'tremember how he said he was
going to do it. But that's whatI would do.
Brian Upton (32:14):
Brayton for a long heavy water tattoo free plug
26th Avenue. He's excellent andbest of everything right best of
Santa Cruz for like yeah, fiveof the last six hard
Stacey Upton (32:22):
to get into see him you got a book out months in
advance. He's seven months
Brian Upton (32:26):
out right now. I saw him the other day and I
think he's six to seven monthsout. So he runs good business.
This is usually really obviousto me. You know, do you have a
few I mean, do you have
Stacey Upton (32:40):
one too? Six. Wow.
Maybe five.
Brian Upton (32:49):
Probably go out tonight and get one. It might
actually be in the world of thelittle game. I want to start
playing if I was gonna go runout and get one tonight. I think
you know what I want to do withmy next few. I've got quite a
few on both of my arms is starthiding some Easter eggs from my
own entertainment. I think Imight go out and get thug life.
(33:14):
That would that one I wantdirectly on my back. But what's
the hook? Micro tattoo? A tinyone tiny tattoo of like, I want
to get tiny tattoo all over mywhole both of my arms here and
there with all of the mostregrettable tattoos. Like I want
every regret that someone's eversaid like, I want one that says
(33:35):
no regrets. I want thug life. Iwant your name with a heart and
an arrow through it. But in amicro tiny tattoo so that it's
almost imperceptible, you knowthe ones are doing like the ones
on the fingers and the rings. Iwant a micro tattoo. And I think
there's probably seven to 10 Ican do within the pattern I've
got on both my arms where I canhide it. And when somebody
(33:57):
brings up a conversation orconversation comes up with
regrettable tattoos, I'll eitherhave it or I'll go get it after
I hear about it.
Stacey Upton (34:05):
Like no regrets. I just said that.
Brian Upton (34:08):
I'm gonna do I
Stacey Upton (34:10):
actually want us to think thug life would be
super regrettable until I readthe book. The hate you give. If
anybody is interested in readingit is actually I listened to it
on the audiobook app which isescaping me audible. Wow. Oh,
(34:34):
the most well done audiobookI've ever listened to really. So
well produced the the narrator'swere fantastic. And it was a
story that I didn't think Iwould connect to and it was
amazing. I just, I reallyenjoyed it.
Brian Upton (34:54):
You ruined my tattoo. Sorry.
I'm going again. You are soright below it that I want to
ask you if you could realize adream that you had while asleep,
which dream would you pick? Oh,pretty good,
Stacey Upton (35:15):
right? Yeah I'm I don't remember dreams
often. But the first thing thatpopped into my head was I
remember having it was actuallya scary dream, where I was
swimming underwater, andsomebody was shooting at me.
That's not the part I'd like torelive. But what was happening
(35:38):
is I realized I could breatheunderwater. Oh, and so they
didn't know I could breatheunderwater. And so I could just
stay underwater and alsorealizing the bullets. Couldn't
get me because I could swimaway. And I don't know it was it
was kind of a cool dream in thatway. Wow.
Brian Upton (36:04):
We think I've very vivid dreams, yes, you do in a
lot of them manifest themselvesinto things that actually occur.
I know the one I know as I'mthinking about this, the one or
a series of ones when I wasplaying around writing the the
fantasy novel about the kids andthings like that, there'll be
(36:26):
times where I was writing a lot.
And it I would dream, acontinuous sequence of what I
had just finished. And sometimesit would become the next chapter
was so vivid, I get up, scribbleit down, write it down, like
energetically. And those dreamswere in color of the animation
of the art that Nizar did forthe book. And it was an absolute
continuation with all of the allof the movement, all of the
(36:50):
lights, all of the magic, all ofthe things that were happening,
that I would wake up kind ofstartled and bummed. But if I
could manifest that airwingworld into being true, I think I
would, I think I would reallyenjoy that.
Stacey Upton (37:05):
Yeah, you would. I would, too, if I could be there.
Yeah. Was fun one.
Brian Upton (37:11):
Now we're onto a baby. The Redwings scares the
shit out of me.
Stacey Upton (37:16):
This question may be easier than you might expect.
But I think it can lead to areally good conversation. Do you
feel emotionally close to me?
Brian Upton (37:30):
This is way better than Are you listening to me
from the last episode? Wayhigher on the chart? Yes. Way
higher on the chart here? Theanswer is? The answer is yes.
But the caveat is that weprobably let life get in the
(37:54):
middle of that way more than weshould as far as like that. When
you say emotionally connected,I'm talking like all the way
like, like, there's periodstimes like I think of sitting
there watching that sunset, Ithink we talked about going to
pass a pizza pass a grill beach.
As a quick reference tosomeplace we've been, it could
be anywhere you have thosemoments where you're deeply no
(38:17):
distractions emotionallyconnected. Yeah, that's the bar
I'm setting for it. So theanswer is, yes, I do as far as
32 years, overwhelminglyemotionally connected. I think
we, we try to keep momentumgoing towards that as much as
possible. But like a lot of theother things we've talked about,
there'll be days times wherementally you not necessarily on
(38:41):
that. watching the sunset.
emotional level, you're millionsof miles apart emotionally.
Absolutely. And it can go on forhours or days or something like
that. So it's complicatedquestion. I think as far as the
(39:02):
overall barometer, for sure,yeah. We because we really, do
we have a good groove going mostof the time. But when put on the
spot and answering it. It feelslike I wouldn't have thought
about this till just now. Itfeels like oh, there's a lot of
work to do.
Stacey Upton (39:19):
At times. Yeah, I think we've mentioned before
that, you know, we can havephases of how things can feel
really good between us. And thenat times we get distracted by
life, like you were just saying,Yeah, and I agree I, I, I would
say yes, we are emotionallyclose. And I also agree that
(39:43):
there are times you know, thingsget away from us. We get
preoccupied with something. Butthe question I have for you is
and that's not on this card, I'mjust coming up with this thing.
I'm riffing. It's not somethingI do very after the question I
have for you would be, how couldwe be emotionally close more
(40:07):
often? Like what would have tohappen for that to be the case?
Brian Upton (40:15):
What do you want my immediate answer? Sure. Lovesac
couch.
Stacey Upton (40:21):
Well, is that I'm not
Brian Upton (40:23):
kidding. Okay,
Stacey Upton (40:24):
that's lame to everyone.
Brian Upton (40:26):
It's a small thing.
But we live in this littleplace. And we have this
wonderful couch. And it's it's adefinite upgrade from where we
were before. The attraction tothe couch is the fact that each
end of it has a recliner. Yes.
And this customer thought decentsized couch is probably a 10
foot couch. So we sit in ourcouch in our two foot recliners,
(40:51):
as we're watching these horribleshows like nine perfect
strangers, and good ones. Butwe've got you know, 10 minus
four is six feet between us. Andthat's been different. Because
we did in our old circumstance,we would be a little bit closer,
some cuddling would go on. Wewere in Denver this last week,
and we stopped in Cherry Creekmall and sat on a love set
(41:13):
couch, which is way more than wewant to spend on a couch by
think we immediately the firstthing we said to each other was
this, this would be so muchbetter for us as far as our
evenings and being closer. Yeah,that's the joke answer. The
second one would be more timeaway from the screens more time
with the phones down a rulepossibly. I don't know why we
(41:34):
drift away from a vote when wedecide we're going to play a
game of Scrabble or something.
It's amazing.
Stacey Upton (41:39):
We enjoy it. Yeah, I think I think what happens is
your job is very physical. Andyou do need to rest when you get
home. And it's so easy to justturn on the TV. And that becomes
our evening. I think if we wereto maybe say one or two nights a
week, to start, we don't turn onthe TV. Maybe we go do something
(42:04):
go on a hike or a walk or playsome games. Yeah, something
different. Right. Not watchingTV. No, I mean, it's a may not
do as many reviews. If we'rewatching less TV.
Brian Upton (42:17):
That's a good point. But we could do food
reviews or book reviews or gamereviews. Yeah, who gives a shit
all kinds of things I doappreciate you said My job is
very physical because it is not.
Well, it used to be used to beit's it's more, it's more
logistical. And in a lot ofways, emotional from customer
service, sort of aspect,draining that way. But it's I
(42:37):
get the point, I get the pointwhere I am out and out and out.
And then I come back. And thatis my unwind period.
Stacey Upton (42:46):
And you're out and out and out and not on a
computer where I am on acomputer all day. And so it
would be really great for me tonot look at a screen.
Brian Upton (42:56):
That's why I'm finding so much like balance
going out to that hot tub evenfor 25 minutes every day. It's
been every day, like for a whilenow. It doesn't have to be a
long time. But there's no screenout there. It's just it's just
me and a little bit of music.
And that's been that's beenreally good.
Stacey Upton (43:13):
Yeah, I think that would be a good habit for me to
do too. But you're usually doingthat while I'm finishing work.
Brian Upton (43:19):
That's very true.
Yeah.
Stacey Upton (43:21):
I wanted to bring something up. Wow. Are we with
time?
Brian Upton (43:25):
We are. Let's see.
We're doing great. What? Goahead.
Stacey Upton (43:30):
Okay. So this do you feel emotionally close to me
question? For some reasonreminded me of this concept of
the four horsemen inrelationships. Do you remember,
I do a little talked about thisa little bit. So this comes from
research by John Gottman and Ihe does research with his wife,
(43:56):
which I think her name is Judy.
And you can look this up if youwant to learn a little bit more
about it. But you know, ifyou're not if you have if you
are in a relationship withsomebody, and you're not
emotionally close, you know,that could really signify things
are not quite right. Would youagree? Yes. Yeah. So it just
made me think of, they call itthe Four Horsemen of the
(44:20):
Apocalypse, which is a metaphor,depicting the end of time, so
very familiar with that. Yeah.
So this is in the context of arelationship. Okay. So the first
is criticism. So criticizingyour partner is a little
different than offering acritique or, you know, making a
complaint or something, right.
So it's really an attack on onyour partner at the core of
(44:43):
their character.
Brian Upton (44:46):
Yeah, it's, that's horsemen one. Yeah.
Stacey Upton (44:49):
horseman, two is contempt. So when we're
communicating in a state ofcontempt, we're we're mocking
we're disrespectful. Maybe usingbody language like eye rolling,
it's really meant to show thatyou think the other person is
worthless. The next one isdefensiveness. And this can
(45:16):
actually happen if somebody iscommunicating in that contempt.
way,
Brian Upton (45:22):
I might be riding that horse.
Stacey Upton (45:26):
But defensiveness is really you're not taking
responsibility for anything.
You're coming up with excuses.
Brian Upton (45:32):
I only get on that defense horse when you come
flying in on your contempt horsethough.
Stacey Upton (45:38):
And then the last one is stonewalling. What
stonewalling. You've been onthat horse too. You have when we
had our episode that you named?
I'm a slow, you're slowprocessor. I'm just pissed. You
were essentially saying when wefight it when we used to fight
in the past, you wouldStonewall? Yeah. You did not
want to interact
Brian Upton (46:03):
was on that fucking horse? You were right. And it's
hard.
Stacey Upton (46:07):
So you know, what's interesting is these
researchers have, through yearsand years of research and
studying couples and doingcouples therapy, they actually
got to this place where theycould predict with, I don't
remember the percentage ofcertainty, very high percentage
of certainty whether a couplewould split or not. And it was
(46:30):
by identifying these fourhorsemen.
Brian Upton (46:33):
That's a big bomb to drop at the very end of a
podcast, because it's so good.
It's one point it's like it'salmost has it needs its own air.
To go over that. I think each ofthose that might be a very fun
podcast to do is diving deepinto those four categories
contempt, divestment, and youknow all of the nature of those
(46:54):
with some of our own personalexperiences to kind of like root
it out. Sure, but I think thatis a classic, put a pin in it.
Stacey Upton (47:02):
Yeah,
Brian Upton (47:03):
we follow up with zero of what we say we're going
to follow up.
Stacey Upton (47:07):
I know I've noticed that that's an issue
Brian Upton (47:09):
super confident pushing this down the road
though a little. This might bethis might be one. It's a great
name for the four horsemen.
Yeah, it's a great name for apodcast with something funny on
the other side of it, but it's agood name for it. That was
actually really good. And weshould come back to that. Okay.
America, you don't know it yet.
(47:30):
But you're going to Europe thissummer on your yard because we
cut our fares. They're lowerthan last year. There's no
excuse not to excuse ourparents. You're going to Europe.
I got some news on Panem. Oh,tell me legit really? Gonna talk
(47:50):
about the next podcast.
Stacey Upton (47:51):
Oh my gosh,
Brian Upton (47:52):
there's a Pan Am Museum. What? Yep. And Garden
City, New York. Open 10 to five,seven days a week real museum.
Huge teaser. We'll move on downthe road. But that exist.
Stacey Upton (48:06):
I think we need to do a traveling podcast got
Brian Upton (48:09):
you stunned right now do the so I can regroup for
the close out here. Let's do ourintelligent change.
Stacey Upton (48:15):
You read my mind?
I did. You did?
Brian Upton (48:19):
Yeah. So stonewalling
Stacey Upton (48:21):
our, our sponsor, intelligent change is where this
game that we're using to sparkour conversations comes from.
I've also shared on thispodcast, The Five Minute
Journal, which I absolutely lovethe first product I ever I ever
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(48:45):
tools that you can use toenhance your life and, and your
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So I encourage you to check themout and chill intelligent
change.com. And, please, how doyou how do you describe this?
(49:06):
Brian, if someone wants toreceive a free product, I'm
doing a different this way.
That's what I Okay, go ahead andexplain.
Brian Upton (49:14):
I'm not even playing the game this week. What
do you mean by that? Well, let'smove on to Episode 10 broken
tiles podcast@gmail.com All theyhave to do is basically follow
the show on Spotify or Apple anddownload it. You're in the mix
there and then just email itbroken tiles podcast@gmail.com
That you did it with youraddress and you're in the
(49:35):
running to get a game. I'mgiving the game to our last
review on Apple because I canreach out. Here's the review.
Just heard the first episodeLove the authenticity, your
stories in the transition musicSpotify blend sharing music with
different generations. Lovelyfamily, that person's getting a
(49:56):
game I'm finding that personbecause that's a very sweet
review to give and they'reactually getting the game. But
for everybody else playing, justemail us just just find any
platform. We're on 12 differentplatforms. Now you can even say
I don't want to do it right now.
And I will I turned it down. Youcan even say, hey, Alexa, play
the broken tiles podcast andit'll play. Which is awesome.
(50:16):
That's pretty cool. Yeah. And itwas pull it right up. If you've
never listened to start rightwith Episode One. Oh, dang it.
Alexa, stop. So my real
Stacey Upton (50:28):
question though, I thought at our on our last
podcast, it was people weresupposed to do something over
social media.
Brian Upton (50:38):
I think all it did was created a we do have the
broken tiles podcast onInstagram, right. And I want to
make that easier. You can likethat. And we also have the
broken tiles, podcast playliston Spotify. That's right. And
we'll make that easier andeasier. For this one we'll get
through keep just do read,download, download anywhere,
reach out to that email, andyou're in the mix to get the
(50:59):
game. Excellent. So you're readyto get out of here and play our
Stacey Upton (51:03):
game. If you're interested in any of the
intelligent change products, usethe promo code
Brian Upton (51:09):
broken tiles 10 Thank you. Which I think if we
keep going this way, it's goingto be broken tiles 20 Pretty
soon, maybe through but rightnow it's 10% off. Okay. We go.
Give me a number. This onedoesn't count. By now.
Stacey Upton (51:23):
Let me think number between one and what
Brian Upton (51:25):
we literally have like a minute to get out of
here. Get going.
Stacey Upton (51:29):
The numbers 81234.
Brian Upton (51:36):
I went again, we're going to this concert. Recognize
Stacey Upton (51:39):
it so fast.
Brian Upton (51:42):
I cannot recommend this band any more than Oh,
Stacey Upton (51:45):
nation of language. This is Brian. Yes.
And you know, it's interestingthinking about that comment that
you just read the review thatyou just read. You would think
maybe this would be from ayounger generation. But this is
a new band that you found notour kids,
Brian Upton (52:03):
I think different Brooklyn, New York. Their second
album just came out. They'regoing on tour to support it.
They are heavily influenced byOMD Depeche Mode a bunch of 80s
bands, and they're phenomenal.
Stacey Upton (52:15):
And that's why we love it. Yeah. They are really
good. And the more we listenedto it the more I like it. We're
not
Brian Upton (52:21):
gonna be on time. I can't turn the song off.
Stacey Upton (52:26):
To just fade it out. We can listen to
Brian Upton (52:28):
it and just turn it up. It's so good though. It is
alright. Nation of language.
red lights on label.
Stacey Upton (00:08):
Welcome to What?
To the broken tiles podcast withbrains
Brian Upton (00:31):
now you're gone for a second month there.
Stacey Upton (00:34):
That's usually how we start. It's very true. How
are you? Tired still, but I'mgood.
Brian Upton (00:44):
I've gotten into a habit of doing furious typing
right up to the time we start
Stacey Upton (00:53):
furious typing on your computer. Yes, because
there's lots of work to dolately.
Brian Upton (00:58):
If you're not typing, you're eating popcorn.
Stacey Upton (01:02):
like a crazy person.
Brian Upton (01:03):
If not eating popcorn, you're scratching your
skull.
Stacey Upton (01:11):
So we have to describe that. Is that something
you really wanted to share with?
Brian Upton (01:15):
Maybe you haven't heard this show is about brutal
honesty. That is I found out wehave a problem in Venezuela. Oh,
tell? We you know, we've gone wego anywhere from between number
14 and number 75. On Applepodcasts. I've done some
analytics. Okay. When I make funof you. Yeah, we're near the
(01:38):
top. What appears when I let youkind of roll free. We dropped to
near 75.
Stacey Upton (01:47):
I think you're full of it. I really have some
doubts about your analyticevaluation
Brian Upton (01:58):
over team. Oh, really? Yeah. Researchers. Yeah.
And that includes who? Baileycolumn, he'll take the bullet
for me.
Stacey Upton (02:09):
Well, does that mean he'll be truthful or your
your thinking that he'll justsay what you might like for him
to say is that what take thebullet for me means
Brian Upton (02:19):
he'll take the bullet for me.
Stacey Upton (02:23):
All right. The bottom
Brian Upton (02:25):
line is this is that I come with you with
science and with numbers andwith facts. And you come back
with me with emotion. I'm comingwith cold hard facts about what
is making our podcast go. It's acoincidence that it's me making
fun of you.
Stacey Upton (02:44):
What I have learned about research is it can
be swayed hypotheses, andfindings can be construed to
point in the direction you mightlike for them to point.
Unfortunately, not always
Brian Upton (03:05):
condescending.
Well, that's not the point. Iwant it.
Stacey Upton (03:11):
What was that?
Brian Upton (03:12):
I don't know. Let's do this one.
I even know what level this is.
Close it is. That's right. nineepisodes in nine episodes in
learning the game. We're playing
Stacey Upton (03:31):
the game called Let's get closer.
Brian Upton (03:36):
I think I've changed my mind. I want to start
winning. What do you mean thegame?
Stacey Upton (03:42):
There's a way to win. Okay,
Brian Upton (03:45):
is there I just feel like nine episodes in I can
start dominating now on myanswers.
Stacey Upton (03:52):
I think playing the game is a way to win.
Brian Upton (03:56):
So I won.
Stacey Upton (03:58):
Well, maybe I needed to reset. Okay. Question
number one. The Green Levelclose. What? Sorry? When was the
first time you fell in love?
Brian Upton (04:21):
Oh, we did first I was about to go down the path
that we were we did. Have youever had your heart broken? I
think or do have you ever brokensomebody's heart? That's right.
The first question I fell inlove. So I feel like this goes
all the way back to I think it'sgonna be towards sixth grade or
(04:48):
seventh grade. And I feel likethere's a journey song involved
in a downstairs dance atsomebody's house.
Stacey Upton (04:54):
Oh my goodness.
Like these questions they
Brian Upton (04:57):
come on and it's like a flush of accessing The
part of my brain that thequestion brings on. And it's
kind of coming back to me who itwould have been. I know that
feeling would have been lovebased on what I knew from books
and movies and things like thatit would have been six to
(05:18):
seventh grade. And are we tryingto access the person? Even if
it's like a first name kind ofthing, right?
Stacey Upton (05:25):
You can if you would like, I think it's helpful
just to remind yourself of whatthat felt like and the
experience.
Brian Upton (05:34):
Yeah. And I think the first girl that I was in
love with was in that rain,sixth or seventh grade ish in I
think it was Joanna Martin. Andshe would have been at Holy
Cross with me, I have memorieslike now I'm piecing it together
of memories of straw hat pizza,like after an event or something
like that, and having her friendtalk to my friend, talk to her
(05:57):
friend, talk to my friend. Andyou kind of had that. That final
moment. I don't even know if wekissed her anything. It might
have just been, I was in loveand Joanna and her could have
been, I feel like there was onegirl I dated. And it's funny
(06:19):
what you call love at that age.
I might have been in love withsomebody. This is a true story.
I've told you this one before.
But I threw a note. I wasconnected to a girl, Chris, and
through a friend. We starteddating, like in one of the first
two periods of class. And it wasofficial, that she'll go out
(06:39):
with you. And we're official.
And then she broke up with me atlunch
Stacey Upton (06:42):
at lunch the same day. Yeah. But I
Brian Upton (06:45):
will tell you this, that in the micro of that little
moment from 930 to 1227. I wasin love.
Stacey Upton (06:55):
Well, what did you experience? Like? How did you
What were you feeling that madeyou think it was love?
Brian Upton (07:01):
That's thinking about our future? Thinking about
what we name our kids future
Stacey Upton (07:07):
beyond lunch
Brian Upton (07:09):
that I laid right out in front of me? I think it's
a great question. I think it'swell, I think, for me, where I
lead with it the beginning,scratching part of my brain
making my brain think back. Ican do some of the math here is
probably 44 years ago now. 46years ago. Yes. In that
(07:34):
somewhere in that range to thinkthat's probably a healthy habit.
Stacey Upton (07:41):
To back that far.
Is that what you mean?
Brian Upton (07:43):
I don't know the science of but I think so. To
kind of like, you know, possiblyaccess a memory. I don't even
know if there would be a thoughtto this. But I feel like there
has to be something positiveabout that. About you.
Stacey Upton (08:00):
Yeah, for me. When I when I thought I was really in
love, because of course prior tothis, there were crushes here
and there. But it was not thesame is seventh grade. Brad.
Brian Upton (08:15):
I know all these names I know.
Stacey Upton (08:17):
And I'm not going to say his last name, because
it's a very distinctive lastname. And I just don't think
that would be fair. No, well, Idon't think anybody is going to
know. That was a more commonlast name that you stated.
Joking. But anyhow, I was inseventh grade. And he was a
(08:38):
friend of a boy that went to mychurch. And he brought him to a
youth group event. Oh, it was alock in. We had an overnight
sleepover at the church just forthe teens. Oh, yeah. I mean,
there wasn't anything nefariousthat happened. But
Brian Upton (09:00):
why can't you look me in the eyes while you're
telling that story.
Stacey Upton (09:03):
I was in love with him. He was he played the viola
and I played the clarinet. So wewere both band geeks. And really
liked being band geeks. And youknow, for that age, we felt like
we had a lot in common. But Ijust remember like, that's all I
(09:27):
could think about was him. Yeah.
And we wrote notes to eachother. And we didn't get to see
each other very often. But itwas, you know, that first
feeling of like, I think beingin love that new kind of love is
very akin to obsessivecompulsive disorder. So you
think about,
Brian Upton (09:48):
oh, I was about to ask you to explain that. But
yeah,
Stacey Upton (09:50):
it's all you think about every thought. Every
action is sort of revolvingaround this person that you
can't get out of Your system.
Brian Upton (10:01):
Yeah. And mine was two hours and 32 minutes. But
whole life right ahead of me andthe other part of my story and I
want to get back so I have aquestion or two. Is that it? She
broke up with me. across theplayground somebody else telling
me so Oh, yes, we didn't holdhands. We really had no
interaction. We were just goingout for two or three periods.
(10:24):
Did
Stacey Upton (10:24):
it start with a note? Like somebody champ this
box? If you liked me?
Brian Upton (10:27):
Yeah. Basically, I don't think it said that. I
think it was really like, youknow, I couldn't negotiate more
of like a nucular summit oflike, I'm a dude. And I like
that girl. And it worked out.
But we still hadn't quiteconnected at lunchtime, there
was no holding hands. It was nokiss exchanged. And I think it
was over before. We actuallywere seen as a couple out there.
So what's a big lingeringquestion for me after your story
(10:52):
of first love is what's a viola?
Stacey Upton (10:57):
It's similar to a violin. It's in the violin
family.
Brian Upton (11:02):
Oh, that makes it that makes it better? I'm glad
you clarified. That wasconfusing. broaden it, though.
Let's do our little game we'vebeen within the game, which is
broadening the question a tinybit to the scope of great
answer. Why is this possiblymatter? And I do have a thought
(11:22):
on it that you can maybe expoundon. We almost by accident. And I
always say that, possibly not byaccident. But I know it wasn't
super intentional. So somewherein between, we're very open
talking about every singlerelationship we've ever had
leading up to ours at the verybeginning, we didn't circle back
around, right, it was part of acontinuing sort of narrative. I
(11:45):
think out of just being youngand super curious about where
you just came from before astigma fit in. About, like,
let's say you meet somebody at30, you might have some
permanent thoughts of it, youmight be not going to dig up old
shit. But when you meet as youngas we did, I think we rolled in
like who just date? Where do youjust come from? Like, literally,
(12:06):
where'd you just come from? AndI think it became a pattern of
behavior, not only where we justcame from, but then expanding
who was before that?
Stacey Upton (12:15):
Well, yeah, because I think what we were
trying to discover is who areyou? And if you had a
relationship that didn't workout why
Brian Upton (12:23):
that's it. And that's the point I was going to
make as I think as far as intothe universe of relationships.
Without knowing that was oursort of path and intention. I
think what we might have done isbeen giving each other a
playbook of what didn't work forme, and what did
Stacey Upton (12:42):
exactly, and I think it's important to
recognize that we all you know,before entering a lasting
relationship, very likely havehad more than one time where
we've been in love withsomebody, and those are
opportunities to learn whatworks, what doesn't, you know,
for you personally, and ofcourse, you want to take what
(13:04):
you learned into that nextrelationship and see, you know,
how can you make it better? Howcan how might things be
different because of what Ilearned from that last
experience and the experiencebefore that? And before that,
that's it? Yeah.
Brian Upton (13:19):
And funny, again, a very innocuous question, that I
think I'm almost getting moreaddicted to in this podcast,
this part than the actual answerbecause you're, you're in your
own mind, you're giving ananswer. And it's honest, but
(13:42):
it's got an entertainment valueof you and the dog curled up on
the ground right there to acertain extent, to a certain
extent, because it just doesn'tresonate, but so I like getting
to this after you know, beforewe go there I know there's
something that's been hauntingyou
Stacey Upton (13:59):
haunting me?
Brian Upton (14:01):
What what a ninja sex party might sound like?
Stacey Upton (14:07):
I've never heard of such a thing
Brian Upton (14:08):
but it's been haunting you.
Stacey Upton (14:09):
How can it be haunting me?
Brian Upton (14:12):
Because this is what it sounds like. Even Trade
very now what I thought the sexparty would sound like
confusing. Wait, what is that?
What is this?
Stacey Upton (14:28):
Oh my goodness.
Brian Upton (14:29):
This is a cover of Take on me by ninja sex party.
Wow. I like it was a bait andswitch right there.
Stacey Upton (14:39):
It totally what
Brian Upton (14:40):
I thought we were going to do our first rated
episode. It's a little band thatdoes all covers called ninja sex
party. Huge promotion for them.
There. They have a chance toprobably skyrocket in Venezuela
after this Have you ever getold?
Stacey Upton (15:06):
No, I, it's so fun.
Brian Upton (15:07):
There's so many people that call me. Like,
that's the that's a good littlehook. And it's one of four
buttons that I have. How luckyare we?
Stacey Upton (15:15):
I don't have a huge soundboard. No, no, it's
very first
Brian Upton (15:18):
question people have when they listen to podcast
is, who's your producer? What'sthe studio? Like?
Stacey Upton (15:25):
If they could only see,
Brian Upton (15:27):
I can't believe you think we have people that ask?
It's ever as
Stacey Upton (15:33):
my gosh, I really need to consider the source.
Always
Brian Upton (15:38):
move a little closer. Well done. Thanks. I
know the game.
Stacey Upton (15:43):
Okay. What was our biggest challenge? And how did
we overcome it?
Brian Upton (15:53):
We're still in the middle of it. And I know we've
accessed this information. MaybeMaybe you have a different one.
I think the the obvious one is alittle it's more on the nose of
I'm gonna give a second answer.
But the first one is, I think weovercame in the first half may
be and I do. We've we've alludedto it in some of the podcasts. I
(16:14):
think we overcame my youth, my,my brain developing through that
period. And I think it's asubstantial, we survived me more
than we did you. As far asthat's the way I see it. That's
not my answer. The answer tothat specific question is we
survived our 20s and early 30s,financial sort of frivolity. And
(16:39):
the story we have with thatthat's interesting, going
backwards is almost too much tooearly. In a way, it was like too
much too early as far as. AndI'm not saying that is an excuse
at all, I'm looking back on theblueprint of our life. And why
we struggled financially, it's,it's there was a couple arcs
(17:01):
where I think we learned somebad habits early because of a
dearth of money, and then inexcess of money for the age we
had with what was in ourchecking account. And we didn't
have any kind of a, I'll usethat word again, like a playbook
for what to do with it. Andthose struggles had
(17:22):
reverberations for a long time.
And so if I remember what thequestion is already, which is
kind of lame, it wasspecifically,
Stacey Upton (17:33):
what was our biggest challenge? And how did
we overcome it?
Brian Upton (17:37):
Yeah, that was it.
It was kind of going to thebottom of that. And then quite
honestly, a 15 year, a lot ofour life is broken up into
halves right now, I kind of feellike there's parts of it that
are, you know, at 32 years,there's 14 of this 16, or
something like that, where itfeels like we've been on a path
of recovery from that for wellover 10 years. Now. If you know,
(18:00):
to move towards 15, we've grownup together we have so that
would be my answers. Is that tothat question is is we did
survive that together.
Stacey Upton (18:12):
Yeah. And mine is somewhat similar. I thought
about the the big financialevent fall, if you will, when we
were living in New York. And itwas it was a challenge, because
of course, you know, when you'reat a point where you lose
everything, that at least itfelt like we were losing
(18:33):
everything. It it made usreprioritize everything. Yeah.
And first of all, you alluded tothe fact that we sort of
overcame you was what you saidand and I I don't know that I
fully agree with that, becausewe were both youthful and
(18:56):
operating, unskilled fully. Andwhen this financial fall
happened, you had not beenforthcoming about what was going
on until it was too late oressentially, over. It was over.
When you shared with me what wasgoing on, and you allowed
(19:21):
yourself to be vulnerable, andreally share everything,
including how you felt and whatyour emotions were. That's when
I think we started theovercoming part of it. We were
on a new level between us. Therewas openness and honesty that I
(19:44):
don't know that I realizedwasn't there before. But it
wasn't but it wasn't. And so itwas kind of it was all shocking.
But then it was like we leveledup in a sense with our
relationship.
Brian Upton (19:58):
I feel like it was the shackles of The patriarchy
in a little more in hindsight,that in the moment and the
moment it was chaos, inhindsight, I think what I was
struggling with was the, theburden of a patriarchal concept
of I got it, I got it, I got it,I got it. My Respect is earned
(20:18):
from me getting it. I've got itcovered in man, that the minute
that I said, let's share it, itdidn't make me less of a person.
I didn't change muchfundamentally, as far as my
daily sort of Outlook regime, Ijust had some balance and some
help in and you know, the beatthe word down a little bit, some
(20:41):
equity in even those those partsof it. And that helped.
Stacey Upton (20:46):
And I was happy to live in the patriarchy at that
time. I put my blinders on. Istayed home. I was raising the
kids, I was sort of doing my ownthing. But when we went into
that next level, and the equitybegan to happen between us.
(21:09):
While it was hard, it was alsoit felt good.
Brian Upton (21:13):
Yeah. Oh, there's no doubt about it. I'm a little
shocked thinking back on it thatI didn't have a breakout
earlier. We were non traditionalat the beginning. I was going to
school. I raised Taylor, for thefirst couple years. You were
working full time. But it didn'tstick or something. I wasn't
reaching out. But we weren't. Iwasn't overthinking it. I wasn't
(21:34):
depressed at home. I wasn'tYeah, I loved watching Taylor
full time. I loved my life doingthat. And then I just happened
to go to work full time youstayed home. But I did. Once I
went back, I did fall back intothat sort of muscle memory
behavior of the patriarchy of,of for some reason, making you
think I always had you guyscovered.
Stacey Upton (21:55):
Yes, that was an you really use those words of
I've got it. I've got it. Yeah.
It was almost like a mantra.
Brian Upton (22:04):
Right. And to this day, we still have remnants of
it. And what's the big thing thelast couple of years you and I
have been talking about? Wereone of the biggest remnants of
the life decades of thispatriarchy, decades of this.
When you say can we spend itright? And it just, I'm just
like, let's let's and we like mesaying it's one of those things,
(22:27):
or it's one of those ones? Yes.
I think that's part we're tryingto break because I've gotten to
the point now I'm like, I don'tknow, can we you know, we know.
But we both know, the broadeningthis one out a tiny bit. We
don't have to spend a ton oftime on it. But I did have a
thought as we go to thebroadening of this is the
question itself might be afundamental one to kind of
(22:48):
receptacle to in a relationship.
So you know that you can achievethings and you recognize it so
that you can rely on it whenshit hits the fan. So if you ask
this question yourself, and insmaller increments, you might
realize that within therelationship already, you have
the fundamentals to solve shit.
Stacey Upton (23:07):
Absolutely. It's it's the same tactic that we use
in behavior change in some ofthe behavior change classes that
I teach. It's creating a placefor small for success, small
success, and then going back andlooking at what have I
(23:30):
accomplished? What have Iactually done? Well, so you can
build up that sense of selfefficacy, that that feeling of
agency that I can do this,right? It's important. It lets
you know that I am capable,
Brian Upton (23:46):
because what happens is, I think people lose
connection with their ability tofind their way out. Yeah, and
all of a sudden, you're wakingup saying I can't find my way
out or I can't see a way outwith that person. And I
literally want out now,
Stacey Upton (24:05):
yeah, you get it's easy to get stuck in a role that
for whatever reason worked,because it was efficient for
some reason. And then we forgetthat we can do things a
different way. Right. And youyou experience that learned
helplessness, that inability todo something different. Yeah.
(24:26):
And we all have the ability todo something different. It's
just a matter of getting outsideof your comfort zone, which is
always a challenge right. Now isSookie is playing with a ball.
Brian Upton (24:40):
Can I just take the ball away from her? Oh, no. She
said, Okay. Nope, not yet. Oh,little pause here we're going to
do we're going to do tworeviews. And it's a new angle.
It's going to be quick. We'restill doing the, you know the
one to 10 broken tiles eight,nine and 10 is a master Pease
(25:03):
567 is a mosaic okay anythingbelow that you get into
basically the kind of trashyrange so we're going to do two
reviews now these are ones thatare kind of a little bit more
along the lines of some of thereviews you would see on maybe a
rotten tomatoes where they wereliterally doing a limited
episode review one might be fullbut I think the other ones just
(25:26):
one or two episodes we watchedsee if this rings a bell
don't look you're cheating.
Stacey Upton (25:37):
You're can't read it.
Brian Upton (25:38):
Because it's pretty far away. You wouldn't know it's
not on there. No
Stacey Upton (25:46):
one's familiar but I can't place it
Brian Upton (25:48):
nine perfect strangers.
Stacey Upton (25:50):
Oh gosh.
Brian Upton (25:52):
The broken tiles review.
Stacey Upton (25:55):
Yeah, I can come up with this real quick. It's on
Hulu. It's on Hulu. It starsNicole Kidman right. I'm going I
say this lives in the velvetpainting range.
Brian Upton (26:08):
Whoa, I don't even think we have that as a
category. It's a new categoryand you just made it up. Yep.
What number
Stacey Upton (26:15):
it is this range from one to three.
Brian Upton (26:18):
And I'm waiting
Stacey Upton (26:22):
Well, I had heard from more than one person that
it was really worth watching andfun. And
Brian Upton (26:30):
should we give a full credit here we'll give it a
little tiny preview like we doso people know what we're
talking about. I'm perfectstrangers and American drama
streaming television mini seriesbased on the 2018 novel The same
name by Leon Moriarty created byDavid Kelly also develop the
series that did not give me thedescription of what I was
looking forward you know I thinkthe
Stacey Upton (26:51):
nine strangers come to a Wellness Spa that's it
and so it's a stories of each ofthese nine people that come
together
Brian Upton (26:59):
yeah promise total transformation nine very
different people arrive attranquil them houses secluded
retreat run by the mysteriouswellness guru, Marsha. Okay, get
my review right now go for itzero.
Stacey Upton (27:12):
And why?
Brian Upton (27:14):
Trash in this is probably a circumstance where I
will look at some point after tosee how far off base I am. That
this is horrible. It wasterrible, amazing actors, great
actors, unbelievable actors inthat
Stacey Upton (27:31):
blown away. I felt like the dialogue was stale. And
the characters were verystereotypical. And it it didn't
grab my attention
Brian Upton (27:43):
tomorrow waving Bobby Cannavale Grace Pat and
Melissa McCarthy's in it LukeEvans, Manny Jacinto, which is
we love these actors like theactors just kept coming into the
first couple minutes I'm likehell yes.
Stacey Upton (27:56):
We didn't finish the first episode we couldn't
get through it zero Yeah, I wasbeing too kind we'll force
Brian Upton (28:02):
our way through me because I think like the Rotten
Tomatoes ones we can always recircle around and up this rating
at some point if we want to givea quick update and I'll fly
through since we trashed it I'llwe'll watch a few more episodes
and see if it can recover but Ididn't get your number
Stacey Upton (28:19):
I said to
Brian Upton (28:22):
what did you find redeeming?
Stacey Upton (28:26):
I like the actors
Brian Upton (28:30):
are gone second review. I give me more time tell
me says do anything do don'tlook
Stacey Upton (28:35):
up it's got to be Blackbird. It's
Brian Upton (28:44):
Blackbird.
Stacey Upton (28:45):
I don't wreck Oh, now I recommend recognize the
music. Okay, this is Masterpiecequality. It never failed. The
acting was remarkable. The whatwas the creepy characters named
Larry the person who playedLarry who's a pedophile? I've
(29:10):
never seen anything so creepyand disturbing and well done. It
was phenomenal. I wouldrecommend this to anybody if if
you if you are not put off bythe subject matter
Brian Upton (29:27):
it's it's unbelievable in will give the
same treatment inspired byactual events when high school
football hero and decorate apoliceman sons Jimmy Keane is
sentenced to 10 years in prison.
In a minimum security prison.
He's given a choice of lifetimeinterim maximum security prison
for the criminally insane andbefriend suspected serial killer
Larry Hall. And it withoutgiving. There's no spoilers that
(29:47):
basically is what the beginningof the series happens. And I
think it's a limited series onApple TV. I'm going I'm trying
to find any fault in that thing.
But I do want to give myselfsome kind of wiggle room for
some that we come. I'm going 9.7You know, masterpiece with all
the wings.
Stacey Upton (30:10):
I have to agree i There wasn't one thing I didn't
like about it right? It'sdisturbing. Yeah. But very well
done
Brian Upton (30:26):
it's not even your turn. Oh, okay. I didn't expect
better. I'm trying to be alittle more spontaneous with
this because I realized the funpart of our game is that I don't
know. So I'm trying to justrifle through and go to a page
and see if it's good.
Stacey Upton (30:39):
A page of what explain. It's called if a book
called
Brian Upton (30:44):
F, Evelyn MacFarlane and James say, well,
Stacey Upton (30:48):
Sookie found another ball.
Brian Upton (30:50):
It's outrageous.
But she so here's a fun one.
Okay, if you had to go tonightto be tattooed. Where on your
body? Would you have it done?
And what would it be?
Stacey Upton (30:59):
My I can answer that. The wearer of my body I'm
not quite clear on but I wasactually thinking recently about
the top of my foot because Iwant to see it. And what I want
is a golden heart. Do you knowwhy I want a golden heart? Yeah,
for your boy. Yeah. When Baileyour son was? Well, you know, I
(31:24):
was about to say when he waslittle, he was sweet. But he
still is. But when he was young,you know, as a toddler. We were
just everybody would be amazedby how sweet and kindly always
was. And so we call them the boywith a golden heart. That was
his nickname. And I was given Ithink it must have been for
(31:45):
Mother's Day. purchased by you,but as a gift from all the kids,
those willow tree statues. Andit's it looks like a boy holding
a heart that's painted gold.
Yeah. And so I have asked ourtattoo artist if he can do a
gold heart and there's not goldink, but he says he can make it
(32:07):
look like gold and I can'tremember how he said he was
going to do it. But that's whatI would do.
Brian Upton (32:14):
Brayton for a long heavy water tattoo free plug
26th Avenue. He's excellent andbest of everything right best of
Santa Cruz for like yeah, fiveof the last six hard
Stacey Upton (32:22):
to get into see him you got a book out months in
advance. He's seven months
Brian Upton (32:26):
out right now. I saw him the other day and I
think he's six to seven monthsout. So he runs good business.
This is usually really obviousto me. You know, do you have a
few I mean, do you have
Stacey Upton (32:40):
one too? Six. Wow.
Maybe five.
Brian Upton (32:49):
Probably go out tonight and get one. It might
actually be in the world of thelittle game. I want to start
playing if I was gonna go runout and get one tonight. I think
you know what I want to do withmy next few. I've got quite a
few on both of my arms is starthiding some Easter eggs from my
own entertainment. I think Imight go out and get thug life.
(33:14):
That would that one I wantdirectly on my back. But what's
the hook? Micro tattoo? A tinyone tiny tattoo of like, I want
to get tiny tattoo all over mywhole both of my arms here and
there with all of the mostregrettable tattoos. Like I want
every regret that someone's eversaid like, I want one that says
(33:35):
no regrets. I want thug life. Iwant your name with a heart and
an arrow through it. But in amicro tiny tattoo so that it's
almost imperceptible, you knowthe ones are doing like the ones
on the fingers and the rings. Iwant a micro tattoo. And I think
there's probably seven to 10 Ican do within the pattern I've
got on both my arms where I canhide it. And when somebody
(33:57):
brings up a conversation orconversation comes up with
regrettable tattoos, I'll eitherhave it or I'll go get it after
I hear about it.
Stacey Upton (34:05):
Like no regrets. I just said that.
Brian Upton (34:08):
I'm gonna do I
Stacey Upton (34:10):
actually want us to think thug life would be
super regrettable until I readthe book. The hate you give. If
anybody is interested in readingit is actually I listened to it
on the audiobook app which isescaping me audible. Wow. Oh,
(34:34):
the most well done audiobookI've ever listened to really. So
well produced the the narrator'swere fantastic. And it was a
story that I didn't think Iwould connect to and it was
amazing. I just, I reallyenjoyed it.
Brian Upton (34:54):
You ruined my tattoo. Sorry.
I'm going again. You are soright below it that I want to
ask you if you could realize adream that you had while asleep,
which dream would you pick? Oh,pretty good,
Stacey Upton (35:15):
right? Yeah I'm I don't remember dreams
often. But the first thing thatpopped into my head was I
remember having it was actuallya scary dream, where I was
swimming underwater, andsomebody was shooting at me.
That's not the part I'd like torelive. But what was happening
(35:38):
is I realized I could breatheunderwater. Oh, and so they
didn't know I could breatheunderwater. And so I could just
stay underwater and alsorealizing the bullets. Couldn't
get me because I could swimaway. And I don't know it was it
was kind of a cool dream in thatway. Wow.
Brian Upton (36:04):
We think I've very vivid dreams, yes, you do in a
lot of them manifest themselvesinto things that actually occur.
I know the one I know as I'mthinking about this, the one or
a series of ones when I wasplaying around writing the the
fantasy novel about the kids andthings like that, there'll be
(36:26):
times where I was writing a lot.
And it I would dream, acontinuous sequence of what I
had just finished. And sometimesit would become the next chapter
was so vivid, I get up, scribbleit down, write it down, like
energetically. And those dreamswere in color of the animation
of the art that Nizar did forthe book. And it was an absolute
continuation with all of the allof the movement, all of the
(36:50):
lights, all of the magic, all ofthe things that were happening,
that I would wake up kind ofstartled and bummed. But if I
could manifest that airwingworld into being true, I think I
would, I think I would reallyenjoy that.
Stacey Upton (37:05):
Yeah, you would. I would, too, if I could be there.
Yeah. Was fun one.
Brian Upton (37:11):
Now we're onto a baby. The Redwings scares the
shit out of me.
Stacey Upton (37:16):
This question may be easier than you might expect.
But I think it can lead to areally good conversation. Do you
feel emotionally close to me?
Brian Upton (37:30):
This is way better than Are you listening to me
from the last episode? Wayhigher on the chart? Yes. Way
higher on the chart here? Theanswer is? The answer is yes.
But the caveat is that weprobably let life get in the
(37:54):
middle of that way more than weshould as far as like that. When
you say emotionally connected,I'm talking like all the way
like, like, there's periodstimes like I think of sitting
there watching that sunset, Ithink we talked about going to
pass a pizza pass a grill beach.
As a quick reference tosomeplace we've been, it could
be anywhere you have thosemoments where you're deeply no
(38:17):
distractions emotionallyconnected. Yeah, that's the bar
I'm setting for it. So theanswer is, yes, I do as far as
32 years, overwhelminglyemotionally connected. I think
we, we try to keep momentumgoing towards that as much as
possible. But like a lot of theother things we've talked about,
there'll be days times wherementally you not necessarily on
(38:41):
that. watching the sunset.
emotional level, you're millionsof miles apart emotionally.
Absolutely. And it can go on forhours or days or something like
that. So it's complicatedquestion. I think as far as the
(39:02):
overall barometer, for sure,yeah. We because we really, do
we have a good groove going mostof the time. But when put on the
spot and answering it. It feelslike I wouldn't have thought
about this till just now. Itfeels like oh, there's a lot of
work to do.
Stacey Upton (39:19):
At times. Yeah, I think we've mentioned before
that, you know, we can havephases of how things can feel
really good between us. And thenat times we get distracted by
life, like you were just saying,Yeah, and I agree I, I, I would
say yes, we are emotionallyclose. And I also agree that
(39:43):
there are times you know, thingsget away from us. We get
preoccupied with something. Butthe question I have for you is
and that's not on this card, I'mjust coming up with this thing.
I'm riffing. It's not somethingI do very after the question I
have for you would be, how couldwe be emotionally close more
(40:07):
often? Like what would have tohappen for that to be the case?
Brian Upton (40:15):
What do you want my immediate answer? Sure. Lovesac
couch.
Stacey Upton (40:21):
Well, is that I'm not
Brian Upton (40:23):
kidding. Okay,
Stacey Upton (40:24):
that's lame to everyone.
Brian Upton (40:26):
It's a small thing.
But we live in this littleplace. And we have this
wonderful couch. And it's it's adefinite upgrade from where we
were before. The attraction tothe couch is the fact that each
end of it has a recliner. Yes.
And this customer thought decentsized couch is probably a 10
foot couch. So we sit in ourcouch in our two foot recliners,
(40:51):
as we're watching these horribleshows like nine perfect
strangers, and good ones. Butwe've got you know, 10 minus
four is six feet between us. Andthat's been different. Because
we did in our old circumstance,we would be a little bit closer,
some cuddling would go on. Wewere in Denver this last week,
and we stopped in Cherry Creekmall and sat on a love set
(41:13):
couch, which is way more than wewant to spend on a couch by
think we immediately the firstthing we said to each other was
this, this would be so muchbetter for us as far as our
evenings and being closer. Yeah,that's the joke answer. The
second one would be more timeaway from the screens more time
with the phones down a rulepossibly. I don't know why we
(41:34):
drift away from a vote when wedecide we're going to play a
game of Scrabble or something.
It's amazing.
Stacey Upton (41:39):
We enjoy it. Yeah, I think I think what happens is
your job is very physical. Andyou do need to rest when you get
home. And it's so easy to justturn on the TV. And that becomes
our evening. I think if we wereto maybe say one or two nights a
week, to start, we don't turn onthe TV. Maybe we go do something
(42:04):
go on a hike or a walk or playsome games. Yeah, something
different. Right. Not watchingTV. No, I mean, it's a may not
do as many reviews. If we'rewatching less TV.
Brian Upton (42:17):
That's a good point. But we could do food
reviews or book reviews or gamereviews. Yeah, who gives a shit
all kinds of things I doappreciate you said My job is
very physical because it is not.
Well, it used to be used to beit's it's more, it's more
logistical. And in a lot ofways, emotional from customer
service, sort of aspect,draining that way. But it's I
(42:37):
get the point, I get the pointwhere I am out and out and out.
And then I come back. And thatis my unwind period.
Stacey Upton (42:46):
And you're out and out and out and not on a
computer where I am on acomputer all day. And so it
would be really great for me tonot look at a screen.
Brian Upton (42:56):
That's why I'm finding so much like balance
going out to that hot tub evenfor 25 minutes every day. It's
been every day, like for a whilenow. It doesn't have to be a
long time. But there's no screenout there. It's just it's just
me and a little bit of music.
And that's been that's beenreally good.
Stacey Upton (43:13):
Yeah, I think that would be a good habit for me to
do too. But you're usually doingthat while I'm finishing work.
Brian Upton (43:19):
That's very true.
Yeah.
Stacey Upton (43:21):
I wanted to bring something up. Wow. Are we with
time?
Brian Upton (43:25):
We are. Let's see.
We're doing great. What? Goahead.
Stacey Upton (43:30):
Okay. So this do you feel emotionally close to me
question? For some reasonreminded me of this concept of
the four horsemen inrelationships. Do you remember,
I do a little talked about thisa little bit. So this comes from
research by John Gottman and Ihe does research with his wife,
(43:56):
which I think her name is Judy.
And you can look this up if youwant to learn a little bit more
about it. But you know, ifyou're not if you have if you
are in a relationship withsomebody, and you're not
emotionally close, you know,that could really signify things
are not quite right. Would youagree? Yes. Yeah. So it just
made me think of, they call itthe Four Horsemen of the
(44:20):
Apocalypse, which is a metaphor,depicting the end of time, so
very familiar with that. Yeah.
So this is in the context of arelationship. Okay. So the first
is criticism. So criticizingyour partner is a little
different than offering acritique or, you know, making a
complaint or something, right.
So it's really an attack on onyour partner at the core of
(44:43):
their character.
Brian Upton (44:46):
Yeah, it's, that's horsemen one. Yeah.
Stacey Upton (44:49):
horseman, two is contempt. So when we're
communicating in a state ofcontempt, we're we're mocking
we're disrespectful. Maybe usingbody language like eye rolling,
it's really meant to show thatyou think the other person is
worthless. The next one isdefensiveness. And this can
(45:16):
actually happen if somebody iscommunicating in that contempt.
way,
Brian Upton (45:22):
I might be riding that horse.
Stacey Upton (45:26):
But defensiveness is really you're not taking
responsibility for anything.
You're coming up with excuses.
Brian Upton (45:32):
I only get on that defense horse when you come
flying in on your contempt horsethough.
Stacey Upton (45:38):
And then the last one is stonewalling. What
stonewalling. You've been onthat horse too. You have when we
had our episode that you named?
I'm a slow, you're slowprocessor. I'm just pissed. You
were essentially saying when wefight it when we used to fight
in the past, you wouldStonewall? Yeah. You did not
want to interact
Brian Upton (46:03):
was on that fucking horse? You were right. And it's
hard.
Stacey Upton (46:07):
So you know, what's interesting is these
researchers have, through yearsand years of research and
studying couples and doingcouples therapy, they actually
got to this place where theycould predict with, I don't
remember the percentage ofcertainty, very high percentage
of certainty whether a couplewould split or not. And it was
(46:30):
by identifying these fourhorsemen.
Brian Upton (46:33):
That's a big bomb to drop at the very end of a
podcast, because it's so good.
It's one point it's like it'salmost has it needs its own air.
To go over that. I think each ofthose that might be a very fun
podcast to do is diving deepinto those four categories
contempt, divestment, and youknow all of the nature of those
(46:54):
with some of our own personalexperiences to kind of like root
it out. Sure, but I think thatis a classic, put a pin in it.
Stacey Upton (47:02):
Yeah,
Brian Upton (47:03):
we follow up with zero of what we say we're going
to follow up.
Stacey Upton (47:07):
I know I've noticed that that's an issue
Brian Upton (47:09):
super confident pushing this down the road
though a little. This might bethis might be one. It's a great
name for the four horsemen.
Yeah, it's a great name for apodcast with something funny on
the other side of it, but it's agood name for it. That was
actually really good. And weshould come back to that. Okay.
America, you don't know it yet.
(47:30):
But you're going to Europe thissummer on your yard because we
cut our fares. They're lowerthan last year. There's no
excuse not to excuse ourparents. You're going to Europe.
I got some news on Panem. Oh,tell me legit really? Gonna talk
(47:50):
about the next podcast.
Stacey Upton (47:51):
Oh my gosh,
Brian Upton (47:52):
there's a Pan Am Museum. What? Yep. And Garden
City, New York. Open 10 to five,seven days a week real museum.
Huge teaser. We'll move on downthe road. But that exist.
Stacey Upton (48:06):
I think we need to do a traveling podcast got
Brian Upton (48:09):
you stunned right now do the so I can regroup for
the close out here. Let's do ourintelligent change.
Stacey Upton (48:15):
You read my mind?
I did. You did?
Brian Upton (48:19):
Yeah. So stonewalling
Stacey Upton (48:21):
our, our sponsor, intelligent change is where this
game that we're using to sparkour conversations comes from.
I've also shared on thispodcast, The Five Minute
Journal, which I absolutely lovethe first product I ever I ever
purchased from this company. Andthey offer so many different
(48:45):
tools that you can use toenhance your life and, and your
level of gratefulness andauthenticity and productivity.
So I encourage you to check themout and chill intelligent
change.com. And, please, how doyou how do you describe this?
(49:06):
Brian, if someone wants toreceive a free product, I'm
doing a different this way.
That's what I Okay, go ahead andexplain.
Brian Upton (49:14):
I'm not even playing the game this week. What
do you mean by that? Well, let'smove on to Episode 10 broken
tiles podcast@gmail.com All theyhave to do is basically follow
the show on Spotify or Apple anddownload it. You're in the mix
there and then just email itbroken tiles podcast@gmail.com
That you did it with youraddress and you're in the
(49:35):
running to get a game. I'mgiving the game to our last
review on Apple because I canreach out. Here's the review.
Just heard the first episodeLove the authenticity, your
stories in the transition musicSpotify blend sharing music with
different generations. Lovelyfamily, that person's getting a
(49:56):
game I'm finding that personbecause that's a very sweet
review to give and they'reactually getting the game. But
for everybody else playing, justemail us just just find any
platform. We're on 12 differentplatforms. Now you can even say
I don't want to do it right now.
And I will I turned it down. Youcan even say, hey, Alexa, play
the broken tiles podcast andit'll play. Which is awesome.
(50:16):
That's pretty cool. Yeah. And itwas pull it right up. If you've
never listened to start rightwith Episode One. Oh, dang it.
Alexa, stop. So my real
Stacey Upton (50:28):
question though, I thought at our on our last
podcast, it was people weresupposed to do something over
social media.
Brian Upton (50:38):
I think all it did was created a we do have the
broken tiles podcast onInstagram, right. And I want to
make that easier. You can likethat. And we also have the
broken tiles, podcast playliston Spotify. That's right. And
we'll make that easier andeasier. For this one we'll get
through keep just do read,download, download anywhere,
reach out to that email, andyou're in the mix to get the
(50:59):
game. Excellent. So you're readyto get out of here and play our
Stacey Upton (51:03):
game. If you're interested in any of the
intelligent change products, usethe promo code
Brian Upton (51:09):
broken tiles 10 Thank you. Which I think if we
keep going this way, it's goingto be broken tiles 20 Pretty
soon, maybe through but rightnow it's 10% off. Okay. We go.
Give me a number. This onedoesn't count. By now.
Stacey Upton (51:23):
Let me think number between one and what
Brian Upton (51:25):
we literally have like a minute to get out of
here. Get going.
Stacey Upton (51:29):
The numbers 81234.
Brian Upton (51:36):
I went again, we're going to this concert. Recognize
Stacey Upton (51:39):
it so fast.
Brian Upton (51:42):
I cannot recommend this band any more than Oh,
Stacey Upton (51:45):
nation of language. This is Brian. Yes.
And you know, it's interestingthinking about that comment that
you just read the review thatyou just read. You would think
maybe this would be from ayounger generation. But this is
a new band that you found notour kids,
Brian Upton (52:03):
I think different Brooklyn, New York. Their second
album just came out. They'regoing on tour to support it.
They are heavily influenced byOMD Depeche Mode a bunch of 80s
bands, and they're phenomenal.
Stacey Upton (52:15):
And that's why we love it. Yeah. They are really
good. And the more we listenedto it the more I like it. We're
not
Brian Upton (52:21):
gonna be on time. I can't turn the song off.
Stacey Upton (52:26):
To just fade it out. We can listen to
Brian Upton (52:28):
it and just turn it up. It's so good though. It is
alright. Nation of language.
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