February 13, 2025 • 25 mins
In this episode of Build Momentum, we are joined by Dr. Dan Cox, the Superintendent of Schools in Rochester Community Unit School District 3A in Rochester, Illinois. In his 16-year education career in the state, he led the Staunton Community Unit School District and the Jasper County Community Unit 1 School District. He also served as an Assistant Principal and Principal at East Richland Elementary School in Olney. He is active on many boards at the local, regional, and state levels, including the State Assessment Review Committee for the Illinois State Board of Education.
Some Questions We Ask:
- Can you tell us more about your career as a superintendent? (01:25)
- What aspect of your career is most rewarding? (02:18)
- What are your thoughts about the RAND research and how important wellness is to you in coping with stress? (04:04)
- How do you feel scrutiny of the superintendency has changed over the years? (05:45)
- What are key factors in unifying the community to support your vision? (09:34)
- How much do you think your experiences align with those of superintendents in your state or across the country? (07:11)
- How are you able to share and communicate your stories with the community? (12:39)
- What advice can you give to other school leaders who are struggling in building a community? (15:21)
- Why is it important for people to see superintendents as human beings? (18:23)
- How can the community support superintendents? (20:20)
In This Episode, You Will Learn:
- Dr. Cox’s career in education (01:36)
- Rewarding aspects of his career (02:29)
- The importance of wellness in coping with stress (04:15)
- Scrutiny of the superintendency (05:53)
- Developing a single vision for the community (09:56)
- Thoughts on communication and storytelling (12:54)
- Advice on community-building for fellow school leaders (15:43)
- Humanizing the role of superintendents (18:35)
- Advocating for superintendents (20:26)
Quotes:
“We had a pandemic, and it was our responsibility as superintendents to bring a sense of hope, but also a sense of peace and calm and renewal—and then bring in joy and love: the joy of education and the love for what we do and who we serve, which is our kids and our communities.”
“If I was to break it down and just really be authentic and vulnerable about it, [my advice for wellness] is to know who you are at your core and don't identify yourself with your profession.”
Stay in touch with Dr. Dan Cox:
Stay in touch with Sarah Williamson:
SWPR GROUP Website
LinkedIn
Stay in touch with Chad Bolser:
LinkedIn
About "The Secret to Transformational Leadership," which Sarah co-authored with Dr. Quintin Shepherd:
Transformational Leadership Secret website
Purchase the print or ebook
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Sarah Williamson (00:05):
Hello and welcome to Build Momentum for
Education. A podcast where weexplore thought leadership and
education. I'm Sarah Williamson,the founder of SWPR Group, an
agency that supports publicrelations, communication
strategies and thoughtleadership support for school
districts, education companiesand nonprofit organizations.
Chad Bolser (00:23):
I'm Chad Bolser, Chancellor at Ivy Tech Community
College in Indiana. This season,we explore a particularly unique
perspective in K 12 thoughtleadership, humanizing the role
of the superintendent.
Sarah Williamson (00:36):
Throughout the many conversations we continue
to have with superintendents, aclear theme has emerged about
the need to bring more humanityinto the role of the
superintendency. In this specialseries, we interview current and
former superintendents andresearchers to pursue the core
question, how can we better seesuperintendents as real people
navigating complex challenges toprovide the best possible
(00:56):
education for K 12 students?
Chad Bolser (00:58):
We dig deeper into how this important work can help
build community, invitecollaboration and increase
widespread engagement.
Sarah Williamson (01:08):
We can't wait to get started. So let's dive
in. We're so excited to havesuperintendent Dan Cox with us
for this episode. He is fromRochester Community Union School
District 3A in Rochester,Illinois. Welcome Dan.
Dan Cox (01:23):
Hi. Thanks for having me.
Sarah Williamson (01:25):
Yes. Will you tell us about your career as a
superintendent and the variousdistricts you serve in and your
current role right now?
Dan Cox (01:32):
Sure. Well, you know where I always like to start is,
while I'm a superintendent ofschools, I'm a husband, I'm a
father, I'm a son, I'm abrother, I'm a friend, obstacle
course racer, ultra marathonrunner. I'm a proud
superintendent of schools. It'swhat I do, but it's not who I
am. You know, over the course ofmy career, I've been blessed to
work in a lot of wonderfulcommunities, and as a
superintendent, I am in my 16thyear as a school superintendent.
(01:54):
I feel like I'm becoming ananomaly in that. And have been
blessed to serve in threecommunities of Jasper County and
rural southeastern Illinois, andthen Staunton in southwestern
Illinois, just outside of theMetro East of St Louis. And now
I'm in Rochester, where we are abedroom community of our capital
city of Springfield. We're atpre K 12 unit district of 2100
(02:15):
students. And I always say it'sa great day to be a rocket.
Chad Bolser (02:18):
That's great. So as we talk about this role, and
kind of try to humanize it alittle bit throughout your
career, what aspects of thesuperintendency have brought you
the most joy?
Dan Cox (02:29):
Oh man, you know the superintendency. I was once told
by a mentor of mine, when I wastaking my classes to become a
superintendent, get myspecialist degree, that the
superintendency was going to beone of the most challenging
professions you could ever do,but it's also going to be one of
the most rewarding, and that hasstuck with me through the good
times and the bad. And I thinkwhat I try to remember is
(02:50):
separating the job and the work.
There are pieces to the job,quite frankly, that just aren't
very much fun, that we have todo or that we have to deal with,
but that leads to the work, andthat work is doing the good work
to serve others. I love helpingothers, bringing out the best in
them. And we do this, I think,as superintendents, by
instilling hope within ourschools and our communities and
bringing a sense of peace withinstorms. You know, I think back
(03:13):
to 16 years ago. It was thefinancial crisis, and we were
having to eliminate positionsand programs, and it was
incredibly difficult to, youknow, just a few years ago in
the pandemic, you know, justwhen I thought it couldn't get
any worse than a financialcrisis, right? We had a
pandemic, and it was ourresponsibility as
superintendents to bring up asense of hope, but also a sense
of peace and calm and renewal,and then bringing in that joy
(03:36):
and love, the joy of educationand the love for what we do and
who we serve, which is our kidsand our communities.
Sarah Williamson (03:44):
Yeah, I love that answer. Dan, I think it's
so important that you rememberwhat you love about it when
there are so many challengingopportunities as superintendent.
So I'm curious. We've talkedabout this with all of the other
leaders we've had on this show,but the 2023 RAND study found
that superintendents have one ofthe most stressful jobs in
America. I'm sure you're verywell aware of that study. How
(04:05):
are you able to navigate thatstress? I know you've really
shifted your life to have a bigfocus on wellness. Will you tell
us about what wellness means toyou and why this has become so
important to you?
Dan Cox (04:15):
Yeah, man, I could probably spend an hour just on
this question, right? But Iwon't. But there's a lot of
layers to that. If I was tobreak it down and just really be
authentic and vulnerable aboutit, it is to know who you are at
your core and don't identifyyourself with your profession. I
was 32 years old, starting thesuperintendency, and for so
long, identified myself as that,as a superintendent of schools.
(04:37):
And to be successful in this, Ineeded to realize that is what I
do, but it's not who I am, andmake sure I don't lose those
pieces of me that make me uniquein that. I think I really had to
have a transition point. Youknow, it was 2020, in the
pandemic, and I was not handlingit well. I wasn't handling the
stress of the pandemic well. Iwas really working obscene
amount of hours for many years,and you know, so you still work
(05:00):
hard and long hours no matterwhat and how you do your fitness
as a superintendent. But I hadto rediscover my physical and
mental fitness, both in thattime. And, you know, I did that
by just continuous improvement,through physical activity,
through better diet andnutrition, getting outside and
moving and really looking atthat core pillars of a holistic
wellness to stay grounded. And Ithink the other piece was
(05:24):
leading by example forcontinuous and growth, trying to
talk to people about thechallenges that we face and how
we can deal with them, just bytaking small little steps and
changing our relationships withthings, changing my
relationships with my workrelationship, changing my
relationships with food,changing my relationships with
the profession, as you will,just to be a little more
(05:44):
balanced.
Chad Bolser (05:45):
So tell us, how do you feel scrutiny of the role as
superintendent has changed overthe past few years?
Dan Cox (05:53):
Oh gosh, you know, let me begin with this. And so going
back to that last question, itwas about four years ago. I was
100 pounds heavier than I amtoday, and I couldn't run two
minutes on a treadmill. Mydoctor was telling me the
various types of medications Iwas going to need to get on and
all of these different things. Isaid, you know, I want to do
something different, and I needto do something different. Fast
(06:15):
forward to the day, 100 poundslighter. I'm running ultra
marathons, I'm eating wholefoods, and just doing things a
lot differently, bothphysically, but also I'm in my
mental approach to things, whichhas also led to, knock on wood,
not have to be on thosemedications yet anyway, as I get
older. And I had to do that inpart, because of the pressures
we face in the job, and when Isaid changing my relationships
(06:37):
with things. It's how you handlethat pressure, how you handle
that scrutiny. And certainly thescrutiny on superintendents have
increased dramatically. One ofthe things I noticed during the
pandemic, it was hard, but wewere all fearful, and it's
become true, that post pandemicwas going to be even more
difficult, and it is. I thinkthere's a lot of angst in
society, in the world, and youhave people who are angry, but
(06:59):
they just don't quite know whatthey're angry about, but they
just know they're mad and theydon't like what they have, so
they want something different.
There are opportunities for usthere. And the reason I started
with that scrutiny piece andthat last question is I
intentionally put myself in hardsituations. Somebody's like, why
would you put yourself in aposition to run 50, 60, 80, 100
miles? Right? And I'm not sayingthat's for everybody, but for
(07:22):
me, if I intentionally putmyself in difficult and adverse
situations, I can handle theadversity that comes with a job
and look for the opportunitiesthat lie within it, because they
are really, really hard. So Ithink what I've seen you know
that has gotten hard with thatis that we went from being able
to I just heard this from DavidHorsager, which I'll talk about,
you know, in a few minutes. Welive in a more critical world
(07:45):
today without the ability tocritically think than we've ever
lived before. And so now it'spersonal attacks I've seen that
evolve over the career, wheresuperintendents are met with
personal attacks about decisionsthey make on the job. People
forget that we're human too, orthat we're even parents. Many of
us are parents with children inthe same schools that we serve,
and our families are subjectedto their criticism and the
(08:08):
scrutiny that comes with theprofession. This is not just a
person who sits in the chair inthe superintendent office, their
partner, their children, theirfamilies, are all subject to it
as well.
Sarah Williamson (08:20):
Yeah. So you think it's pretty consistently,
consistent across the board, inyour state peers, you know, is
there just increased scrutinynationally with superintendents.
Dan Cox (08:32):
100% and you know, we're not unique. The
superintendent profession is notunique. I have a more kindred
bond ship with anybody thatworks with the public today than
I ever have in my career. Youknow, you go talk to the retail
clerk, go talk to the server atyour restaurant that work with
the public. I think everybody isneeding more scrutiny, more
criticism, and just really thata bit of erosion of humanity and
(08:55):
just treating each other peoplewith kindness, and I go back to
the beginning, is why it's ourresponsibility to bring some joy
to what we do and recognize andsee others. And certainly, I
think we are as superintendents,locally, regionally, in our
state, our nation, we'recertainly seeing an increase of
that, of the scrutiny and thepersonal attacks. I think a lot
of it, you know, it'sattributing to turnover in the
(09:16):
profession, which does concernme, and we have to balance the
demands of that scrutiny withthe well being of our districts
and ourselves, that's somethingwe're certainly facing in a
conversation that we need tohave is, how do we do that?
Because we need to build thenext generation of leaders, or
we're going to be in realtrouble. And that's something
that concerns me greatly.
Chad Bolser (09:34):
We know that your story and your superintendency
is, you know, we've focused alittle bit here about the
difficulties of it, but youbring vision to your community
and to your school corporation.
How do you think you do that?
What is the key to bringingpeople together to support your
vision and have communitysupport?
Dan Cox (09:56):
Wow, the superintendency. When I got into
it, I really. I thought I was ontop of the world, right? And I
quickly learned that I was notas good as I thought I was, but
I also learned that I was betterthan what I'd given myself
credit for, too. And indulge me,I'll tell you a story I went to
my first superintendency was inthe school district in the town
and the high school I grew upin, and I was feeling pretty big
(10:18):
time, right? And I was taking awalk on one of my first days on
the job. It was in thesummertime. It was in July, and
I was walking through the highschool, and I walked down the
chemistry wing, the science wingof the school, and I saw this
little plaque on the wall, andthat wing was named after a
former superintendent from the50s. And I stood there for a
minute. I have a picture of iton my phone still and I took
that picture, and I stood therefor a minute. I said, Man, that
(10:39):
must have been a heck of aneducator and a heck of a leader
and superintendent. I aspire tobe that someday, you know, when
I'm done with this career. Andthen I stood there, in about 30
more seconds, I said, I neverknew who that guy was. I never
heard the name. I had never seenthat plaque before, and I went
to high school. That tells youhow much I paid attention in
science classes, right? I hadnever seen that before. I said,
I don't know who that is, andnot in the mean way. I don't
(11:01):
care. And then it hit me,nobody's gonna remember or know
or care who I am, either I'mjust nothing more than a
temporary guardian of thiscommunity schools and its most
precious resources, which areits children. And that changed
my mindset for the rest of mycareer, is that this is not my
school, it's not my district,it's not my community. I'm just
blessed to be able to be agatekeeper and a guardian of its
resources, and I want to servethat community the best I can
(11:24):
and those kids while I'm here.
So I think as we lean into that,you never figure it out, just
when you think you figure itout, you'll get snake bit on
that. You know, when things seemlike they're going easy or
they're going well, you aregoing to trip, you are going to
hit adversity. You are going tohave difficult things happen in
your career or within yourcommunities, and at that point,
you have to understand theperspective of other people and
(11:44):
understand it's not you. Wetalked about scrutiny in the
previous conversation. It's notyou that they're scrutinizing,
even though it feels like it,it's the situation. And people
want to feel heard, they want tofeel valued, they want to feel
connected with purpose, and thatway, they're more likely to
support a shared vision andbringing people together and
bringing those diverseperspectives together. And I
(12:06):
think the last piece is findthat common goal, and we know
where we disagree. I don't knowwhen today's society will ever
agree in the areas we disagreeon right where we're polarized,
but we can find that commonground. And in the school
community, it's always the kids.
Nobody wants their children todo bad parents, teachers,
community. Everybody wants thebest for the kids, and that's
(12:27):
where we have to focus our work.
Sarah Williamson (12:28):
Yeah, and I know one of your pillars, Dan,
especially your focus over thelast couple years has been
communications, so and that'sobviously very important to us,
and that's one of the reasons wehost this podcast. And I love
what you just said about reallybringing people together around
feeling heard, and that commonvoice and that common goal, tell
(12:50):
us about how you're doing thatwith communications and
storytelling?
Dan Cox (12:55):
Yeah, you know, we've had the opportunity to have some
conversations on the side aboutthis right communication is
something I really enjoy, butI've also seen it grow and
become a monster in of itself,especially in recent years. I
was once told in my previousdistrict, I was told by a parent
and a good I would consider afriend to and that parent said,
(13:16):
you know, I can tell how thingsare going in the district by how
and how often you communicate?
What do you mean? Well, thingsare going well in the district.
You're communicating all thetime, but when I know things are
difficult or you're reallyslammed, we may not hear from
you for six weeks. And that hitme, the importance of the
consistency and communicationand you fast forward to today,
the appetite for communicationgrows at a rate faster than what
(13:39):
we can keep up. We arecommunicating as a school
district more in in moredifferent ways than we've ever
communicated before, and westill hear great cries for more
communication, more diversecommunication, and more
transparency in communication,which has led me to believe in
our next step in this growth, inthis journey, is we've gotten
(14:02):
very good at print. We've gottenvery good at video. We've gotten
great at social media, thesetypes of communications. But
where we're missing and where weneed to go next is the deep,
meaningful connections and twoway connections. I've been able
to build good connections withpeople over using video I
recently. It was a year or twoago, I met some parents for the
(14:23):
first time, and it was anadverse meeting, not with me,
but the situation. They wereupset about something going on
with one of their children inone of our schools, and they
wanted to speak with me and sowe did meet. And whenever I met
the parents, I said, Man, it'sreally pleasure meeting you. I'm
sorry we're meeting under thesecircumstances, and I'll never
forget the mom. She was so nice.
(14:45):
And she said, No, it's okay. Ialready feel like I know you
from your videos. And she jokedthat, hey, you're much taller in
person. I'm six, six, right? Andshe's like, you're much taller
in person. She goes, but youknow, I don't see those anymore.
I miss seeing you. And she wasright. I probably hadn't sent
videos. Was out for two months,so that was a key point of, I
need to do that consistently.
But today, we're doing thosethings, but we're hearing and
(15:07):
seeing a need for the two waycommunication, the face to face
communication, and that's wherewe're growing next in that
piece, you know, not just beingconsistent, but also trying to
make meaningful connections andlistening, I think, is what
we're missing.
Chad Bolser (15:21):
And you kind of touched on this next question a
little bit, but you know, asleaders and superintendents,
listen to this and listen to youtalk about who are struggling to
build that community, whatadvice do you give those
superintendents, those schoolleaders that maybe don't have or
aren't at the place that you arein your organization?
Dan Cox (15:43):
Well, I mean, it doesn't matter. You can be at a
good place a bad place. It's notif it's when crisis hits your
school district, your community,when you're in very difficult
times or adverse situations thatyou have to navigate as a school
leader, as a superintendent,especially, you're kind of like
that lone tree in the fieldcatching the lightning, right?
(16:03):
You're the polarizing objectwhere everything is and you
navigate those things. Werecently, just a few weeks ago,
we had our state school board,school superintendent and school
business official conferencehere in Illinois, the triple I
conference is what it's called,and it's a phenomenal
conference, and it has over13,000 attendees at it. So you
think about the majority ofschool board members, business
officials, superintendents, allin one conference. It can be,
(16:26):
you know, pretty engaging event.
And we had a keynote speaker,David Horsager, who wrote the
trust edge and trust matters.
And so I wanted to give himcredit for this, because one of
the things he talked about, whenthings get difficult and when
things become adverse, we and inthis context, we as
superintendents, we need to staycommitted. We need to stay
committed to our kids. We needto stay committed to the
mission, and we do need to rideout that storm. And I think how
(16:50):
you do that is building thattrust. And to do that, you have
to focus on listening first andcreating opportunities for
people to be heard, even whentheir opinions differ again, we
can disagree, and we do have toget back to that place of being
able to be critical, but alsobeing able to critically think
and have civil discourse aroundthe table and remember
(17:10):
everybody's humanity that startswith us. And so that means when
you do face that scrutiny, whenyou do get that personal attack,
because you will is to keep thatother person's perspective in
mind, in as difficult as it mayseem, understand that it's not
personal, and build yourrelationships by finding common
ground where you can agree andlooking at those shared goals
(17:32):
that we have for our kids andour students. And you do that
by, you know, being transparent,being authentic about what's
happening. I'm having a meetinglater this evening to rekindle
some family engagement andparent engagement, and I'm going
to be very authentic about whyit fell off of the table. And
there's things we own. There'sthings our families have to own
as well, of why that fell off ofthe table, and owning mistakes
(17:54):
is important too. I can pointthe finger all day long about
people needing to humanize us assuperintendents, but when I do
that. You know this, there'sthree fingers pointing back at
me while I do that. And so Ithink it's okay to own mistakes
and show that vulnerability asleaders as well.
Sarah Williamson (18:09):
That's why we're here, Dan, we're here to
point the finger at people, tohumanize the role of the
superintendent. We can do it.
Dan Cox (18:14):
Yeah, right, right.
Sarah Williamson (18:16):
So actually, that's perfect, because I wanted
to ask you, I really want to getto the heart of this question.
That's why we're running thisseries. You really want to
understand. Do you think it'simportant to humanize the role
of the superintendent? Do youthink it's important people see
superintendents as real peoplewho are navigating complex
challenges, and does that helpyou serve the communities more
effectively?
Dan Cox (18:35):
It 100% does. You know I have to remember as a leader,
that when somebody makes a poorchoice, a mistake, somebody's
upset and they're yelling at us,or whatever. Nobody wakes up in
the morning says, I'm going togo and do a bad job. No kid gets
up in the morning says I'm goingto be late for school, right?
They might realize they're goingto be late for school, but
that's not their goal. Almostevery kid you ask, says I want
(18:57):
to do well in school. I mean,99% of kids will say, I want to
do well in school. When you askthem, Do your parents want you
to do well in school? Yes, theydo. When you ask parents, do you
want your children to do well inschool? Yes, teachers want the
best for their kids. Schoolleaders want the best.
Communities want the best fortheir kids. But things get in
the way, and life gets in theway where it may not always
(19:18):
reflect that, and I think wehave to remember that and give
each other grace and extend thatgrace. Extend grace to yourself.
You know, we talked about how wecan keep going in this
profession as superintendents,that starts with giving grace to
yourself, that you may not haveeverything done just perfectly
okay. You may not be able towork 16 hours a day, and you
(19:39):
shouldn't, you know, do that,but you have to stay consistent,
and you have to stay patient andunderstand that building trust
takes time with people, andlikewise, I think, for others to
help us see us as a real person,it gives us a lot of confidence
to you know, we have to firstextend grace as leaders, but
getting that grace in returncertainly means the world. You
(20:00):
know, we recently navigated avery complex issue within our
community, and it was tough,really tough. I was not feeling
great, and a few messages camein from families that were
extending grace, and man, thatwas something I could hold on to
and really help me navigatethat. That was good to hear from
those people.
Chad Bolser (20:20):
That kind of leads us to the next question is,
we're advocates. We'resupporters of K 12 education,
and we want to know how to ascommunity members, parents
better support our nation'sdistrict leaders?
Dan Cox (20:37):
Right. Because, what I just said, extend grace and
empathy, and that's a two waystreet. We have to do that as
leaders and model that. Butalso, I would ask that people
look at everybody that workswithin a school system, or
anybody that you encounter on adaily basis, quite frankly, who
are trying to serve and help youand help serve you and your
families. Recognize that, youknow, we do face immense
(20:59):
pressure, and we face very, verycomplex challenges. There are no
right or wrongs in many of theissues we face and many of the
decisions we make. And we'rerepresenting a very broad group
as school superintendents. Sorecognizing us as people, and in
doing so, recognizing ourhumanity really goes a long way.
I think the next thing thatpeople can do is get involved
(21:21):
constructively. I said I wasgoing to be, you know, just lay
things on the table and beauthentic. Social media is
killing school communities.
People that go on and complainand voice their issues but don't
want to be a part of thesolution that's not
accomplishing anything. And Isee social media tearing down
teachers, tearing down schools,tearing down communities and
leaders, and it makes people notwant to do that. So I think
(21:44):
getting involved in a productivedialogue, attending school
events, joining committees andbeing a part of the solution
strengthens trust and buildsrelationships. Two ways. We, in
turn, have to provide thoseopportunities as well. You know,
within our schools, and the lastis advocate for education,
support policies andinitiatives, ask good questions
(22:06):
and keep an open mind. I thinkyou know those three things are
where people can really help usas school leaders and our school
systems as a whole.
Sarah Williamson (22:15):
Thank you, Dan, where can our listeners
connect with you and learn moreabout you?
Dan Cox (22:19):
I knew this question was coming, so I guess, you
know, first I'll start with,it's the month of December,
right? I'm taking it asseparation season, and so you
know that joy and that peace,and in that time for reflection,
I decided to take a break fromsocial media. So right now,
you're not going to find meuntil 2025 But all joking aside,
you know, I think that issomething people can do that's
(22:41):
healthy is take some time foryourself to reflect and grow and
write and read in differentways. But I will be coming back
next year, and you can, ofcourse, find me on LinkedIn and
Twitter and Instagram all at DanCox. I think LinkedIn is Dan W
Cox, and Twitter and Instagramare at Dan underscore Cox. And I
don't know if I'll come back toall those things or not, but for
sure, I'll be on LinkedIn, and afew surprises coming in 2025 as
(23:04):
well.
Sarah Williamson (23:04):
Oh, we can't wait. Well. Thank you so much.
This has been a fantasticconversation. We appreciate it.
Dan Cox (23:09):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Chad Bolser (23:11):
Thanks.
Thanks for tuning into the BuildMomentum for Education podcast.
If you enjoyed listening today,we would love to hear your
feedback, and we'd be gratefulif you could leave us a review.
Sarah Williamson (23:23):
This helps us to share these powerful stories
with even more people. If youliked what you heard, we'd be
honored if you could share thisepisode with someone in your
network. We look forward toseeing you next time on Build
Momentum for Education.
Hello and welcome to Build Momentum for
Education. A podcast where weexplore thought leadership and
education. I'm Sarah Williamson,the founder of SWPR Group, an
agency that supports publicrelations, communication
strategies and thoughtleadership support for school
districts, education companiesand nonprofit organizations.
Chad Bolser (00:23):
I'm Chad Bolser, Chancellor at Ivy Tech Community
College in Indiana. This season,we explore a particularly unique
perspective in K 12 thoughtleadership, humanizing the role
of the superintendent.
Sarah Williamson (00:36):
Throughout the many conversations we continue
to have with superintendents, aclear theme has emerged about
the need to bring more humanityinto the role of the
superintendency. In this specialseries, we interview current and
former superintendents andresearchers to pursue the core
question, how can we better seesuperintendents as real people
navigating complex challenges toprovide the best possible
(00:56):
education for K 12 students?
Chad Bolser (00:58):
We dig deeper into how this important work can help
build community, invitecollaboration and increase
widespread engagement.
Sarah Williamson (01:08):
We can't wait to get started. So let's dive
in. We're so excited to havesuperintendent Dan Cox with us
for this episode. He is fromRochester Community Union School
District 3A in Rochester,Illinois. Welcome Dan.
Dan Cox (01:23):
Hi. Thanks for having me.
Sarah Williamson (01:25):
Yes. Will you tell us about your career as a
superintendent and the variousdistricts you serve in and your
current role right now?
Dan Cox (01:32):
Sure. Well, you know where I always like to start is,
while I'm a superintendent ofschools, I'm a husband, I'm a
father, I'm a son, I'm abrother, I'm a friend, obstacle
course racer, ultra marathonrunner. I'm a proud
superintendent of schools. It'swhat I do, but it's not who I
am. You know, over the course ofmy career, I've been blessed to
work in a lot of wonderfulcommunities, and as a
superintendent, I am in my 16thyear as a school superintendent.
(01:54):
I feel like I'm becoming ananomaly in that. And have been
blessed to serve in threecommunities of Jasper County and
rural southeastern Illinois, andthen Staunton in southwestern
Illinois, just outside of theMetro East of St Louis. And now
I'm in Rochester, where we are abedroom community of our capital
city of Springfield. We're atpre K 12 unit district of 2100
(02:15):
students. And I always say it'sa great day to be a rocket.
Chad Bolser (02:18):
That's great. So as we talk about this role, and
kind of try to humanize it alittle bit throughout your
career, what aspects of thesuperintendency have brought you
the most joy?
Dan Cox (02:29):
Oh man, you know the superintendency. I was once told
by a mentor of mine, when I wastaking my classes to become a
superintendent, get myspecialist degree, that the
superintendency was going to beone of the most challenging
professions you could ever do,but it's also going to be one of
the most rewarding, and that hasstuck with me through the good
times and the bad. And I thinkwhat I try to remember is
(02:50):
separating the job and the work.
There are pieces to the job,quite frankly, that just aren't
very much fun, that we have todo or that we have to deal with,
but that leads to the work, andthat work is doing the good work
to serve others. I love helpingothers, bringing out the best in
them. And we do this, I think,as superintendents, by
instilling hope within ourschools and our communities and
bringing a sense of peace withinstorms. You know, I think back
(03:13):
to 16 years ago. It was thefinancial crisis, and we were
having to eliminate positionsand programs, and it was
incredibly difficult to, youknow, just a few years ago in
the pandemic, you know, justwhen I thought it couldn't get
any worse than a financialcrisis, right? We had a
pandemic, and it was ourresponsibility as
superintendents to bring up asense of hope, but also a sense
of peace and calm and renewal,and then bringing in that joy
(03:36):
and love, the joy of educationand the love for what we do and
who we serve, which is our kidsand our communities.
Sarah Williamson (03:44):
Yeah, I love that answer. Dan, I think it's
so important that you rememberwhat you love about it when
there are so many challengingopportunities as superintendent.
So I'm curious. We've talkedabout this with all of the other
leaders we've had on this show,but the 2023 RAND study found
that superintendents have one ofthe most stressful jobs in
America. I'm sure you're verywell aware of that study. How
(04:05):
are you able to navigate thatstress? I know you've really
shifted your life to have a bigfocus on wellness. Will you tell
us about what wellness means toyou and why this has become so
important to you?
Dan Cox (04:15):
Yeah, man, I could probably spend an hour just on
this question, right? But Iwon't. But there's a lot of
layers to that. If I was tobreak it down and just really be
authentic and vulnerable aboutit, it is to know who you are at
your core and don't identifyyourself with your profession. I
was 32 years old, starting thesuperintendency, and for so
long, identified myself as that,as a superintendent of schools.
(04:37):
And to be successful in this, Ineeded to realize that is what I
do, but it's not who I am, andmake sure I don't lose those
pieces of me that make me uniquein that. I think I really had to
have a transition point. Youknow, it was 2020, in the
pandemic, and I was not handlingit well. I wasn't handling the
stress of the pandemic well. Iwas really working obscene
amount of hours for many years,and you know, so you still work
(05:00):
hard and long hours no matterwhat and how you do your fitness
as a superintendent. But I hadto rediscover my physical and
mental fitness, both in thattime. And, you know, I did that
by just continuous improvement,through physical activity,
through better diet andnutrition, getting outside and
moving and really looking atthat core pillars of a holistic
wellness to stay grounded. And Ithink the other piece was
(05:24):
leading by example forcontinuous and growth, trying to
talk to people about thechallenges that we face and how
we can deal with them, just bytaking small little steps and
changing our relationships withthings, changing my
relationships with my workrelationship, changing my
relationships with food,changing my relationships with
the profession, as you will,just to be a little more
(05:44):
balanced.
Chad Bolser (05:45):
So tell us, how do you feel scrutiny of the role as
superintendent has changed overthe past few years?
Dan Cox (05:53):
Oh gosh, you know, let me begin with this. And so going
back to that last question, itwas about four years ago. I was
100 pounds heavier than I amtoday, and I couldn't run two
minutes on a treadmill. Mydoctor was telling me the
various types of medications Iwas going to need to get on and
all of these different things. Isaid, you know, I want to do
something different, and I needto do something different. Fast
(06:15):
forward to the day, 100 poundslighter. I'm running ultra
marathons, I'm eating wholefoods, and just doing things a
lot differently, bothphysically, but also I'm in my
mental approach to things, whichhas also led to, knock on wood,
not have to be on thosemedications yet anyway, as I get
older. And I had to do that inpart, because of the pressures
we face in the job, and when Isaid changing my relationships
(06:37):
with things. It's how you handlethat pressure, how you handle
that scrutiny. And certainly thescrutiny on superintendents have
increased dramatically. One ofthe things I noticed during the
pandemic, it was hard, but wewere all fearful, and it's
become true, that post pandemicwas going to be even more
difficult, and it is. I thinkthere's a lot of angst in
society, in the world, and youhave people who are angry, but
(06:59):
they just don't quite know whatthey're angry about, but they
just know they're mad and theydon't like what they have, so
they want something different.
There are opportunities for usthere. And the reason I started
with that scrutiny piece andthat last question is I
intentionally put myself in hardsituations. Somebody's like, why
would you put yourself in aposition to run 50, 60, 80, 100
miles? Right? And I'm not sayingthat's for everybody, but for
(07:22):
me, if I intentionally putmyself in difficult and adverse
situations, I can handle theadversity that comes with a job
and look for the opportunitiesthat lie within it, because they
are really, really hard. So Ithink what I've seen you know
that has gotten hard with thatis that we went from being able
to I just heard this from DavidHorsager, which I'll talk about,
you know, in a few minutes. Welive in a more critical world
(07:45):
today without the ability tocritically think than we've ever
lived before. And so now it'spersonal attacks I've seen that
evolve over the career, wheresuperintendents are met with
personal attacks about decisionsthey make on the job. People
forget that we're human too, orthat we're even parents. Many of
us are parents with children inthe same schools that we serve,
and our families are subjectedto their criticism and the
(08:08):
scrutiny that comes with theprofession. This is not just a
person who sits in the chair inthe superintendent office, their
partner, their children, theirfamilies, are all subject to it
as well.
Sarah Williamson (08:20):
Yeah. So you think it's pretty consistently,
consistent across the board, inyour state peers, you know, is
there just increased scrutinynationally with superintendents.
Dan Cox (08:32):
100% and you know, we're not unique. The
superintendent profession is notunique. I have a more kindred
bond ship with anybody thatworks with the public today than
I ever have in my career. Youknow, you go talk to the retail
clerk, go talk to the server atyour restaurant that work with
the public. I think everybody isneeding more scrutiny, more
criticism, and just really thata bit of erosion of humanity and
(08:55):
just treating each other peoplewith kindness, and I go back to
the beginning, is why it's ourresponsibility to bring some joy
to what we do and recognize andsee others. And certainly, I
think we are as superintendents,locally, regionally, in our
state, our nation, we'recertainly seeing an increase of
that, of the scrutiny and thepersonal attacks. I think a lot
of it, you know, it'sattributing to turnover in the
(09:16):
profession, which does concernme, and we have to balance the
demands of that scrutiny withthe well being of our districts
and ourselves, that's somethingwe're certainly facing in a
conversation that we need tohave is, how do we do that?
Because we need to build thenext generation of leaders, or
we're going to be in realtrouble. And that's something
that concerns me greatly.
Chad Bolser (09:34):
We know that your story and your superintendency
is, you know, we've focused alittle bit here about the
difficulties of it, but youbring vision to your community
and to your school corporation.
How do you think you do that?
What is the key to bringingpeople together to support your
vision and have communitysupport?
Dan Cox (09:56):
Wow, the superintendency. When I got into
it, I really. I thought I was ontop of the world, right? And I
quickly learned that I was notas good as I thought I was, but
I also learned that I was betterthan what I'd given myself
credit for, too. And indulge me,I'll tell you a story I went to
my first superintendency was inthe school district in the town
and the high school I grew upin, and I was feeling pretty big
(10:18):
time, right? And I was taking awalk on one of my first days on
the job. It was in thesummertime. It was in July, and
I was walking through the highschool, and I walked down the
chemistry wing, the science wingof the school, and I saw this
little plaque on the wall, andthat wing was named after a
former superintendent from the50s. And I stood there for a
minute. I have a picture of iton my phone still and I took
that picture, and I stood therefor a minute. I said, Man, that
(10:39):
must have been a heck of aneducator and a heck of a leader
and superintendent. I aspire tobe that someday, you know, when
I'm done with this career. Andthen I stood there, in about 30
more seconds, I said, I neverknew who that guy was. I never
heard the name. I had never seenthat plaque before, and I went
to high school. That tells youhow much I paid attention in
science classes, right? I hadnever seen that before. I said,
I don't know who that is, andnot in the mean way. I don't
(11:01):
care. And then it hit me,nobody's gonna remember or know
or care who I am, either I'mjust nothing more than a
temporary guardian of thiscommunity schools and its most
precious resources, which areits children. And that changed
my mindset for the rest of mycareer, is that this is not my
school, it's not my district,it's not my community. I'm just
blessed to be able to be agatekeeper and a guardian of its
resources, and I want to servethat community the best I can
(11:24):
and those kids while I'm here.
So I think as we lean into that,you never figure it out, just
when you think you figure itout, you'll get snake bit on
that. You know, when things seemlike they're going easy or
they're going well, you aregoing to trip, you are going to
hit adversity. You are going tohave difficult things happen in
your career or within yourcommunities, and at that point,
you have to understand theperspective of other people and
(11:44):
understand it's not you. Wetalked about scrutiny in the
previous conversation. It's notyou that they're scrutinizing,
even though it feels like it,it's the situation. And people
want to feel heard, they want tofeel valued, they want to feel
connected with purpose, and thatway, they're more likely to
support a shared vision andbringing people together and
bringing those diverseperspectives together. And I
(12:06):
think the last piece is findthat common goal, and we know
where we disagree. I don't knowwhen today's society will ever
agree in the areas we disagreeon right where we're polarized,
but we can find that commonground. And in the school
community, it's always the kids.
Nobody wants their children todo bad parents, teachers,
community. Everybody wants thebest for the kids, and that's
(12:27):
where we have to focus our work.
Sarah Williamson (12:28):
Yeah, and I know one of your pillars, Dan,
especially your focus over thelast couple years has been
communications, so and that'sobviously very important to us,
and that's one of the reasons wehost this podcast. And I love
what you just said about reallybringing people together around
feeling heard, and that commonvoice and that common goal, tell
(12:50):
us about how you're doing thatwith communications and
storytelling?
Dan Cox (12:55):
Yeah, you know, we've had the opportunity to have some
conversations on the side aboutthis right communication is
something I really enjoy, butI've also seen it grow and
become a monster in of itself,especially in recent years. I
was once told in my previousdistrict, I was told by a parent
and a good I would consider afriend to and that parent said,
(13:16):
you know, I can tell how thingsare going in the district by how
and how often you communicate?
What do you mean? Well, thingsare going well in the district.
You're communicating all thetime, but when I know things are
difficult or you're reallyslammed, we may not hear from
you for six weeks. And that hitme, the importance of the
consistency and communicationand you fast forward to today,
the appetite for communicationgrows at a rate faster than what
(13:39):
we can keep up. We arecommunicating as a school
district more in in moredifferent ways than we've ever
communicated before, and westill hear great cries for more
communication, more diversecommunication, and more
transparency in communication,which has led me to believe in
our next step in this growth, inthis journey, is we've gotten
(14:02):
very good at print. We've gottenvery good at video. We've gotten
great at social media, thesetypes of communications. But
where we're missing and where weneed to go next is the deep,
meaningful connections and twoway connections. I've been able
to build good connections withpeople over using video I
recently. It was a year or twoago, I met some parents for the
(14:23):
first time, and it was anadverse meeting, not with me,
but the situation. They wereupset about something going on
with one of their children inone of our schools, and they
wanted to speak with me and sowe did meet. And whenever I met
the parents, I said, Man, it'sreally pleasure meeting you. I'm
sorry we're meeting under thesecircumstances, and I'll never
forget the mom. She was so nice.
(14:45):
And she said, No, it's okay. Ialready feel like I know you
from your videos. And she jokedthat, hey, you're much taller in
person. I'm six, six, right? Andshe's like, you're much taller
in person. She goes, but youknow, I don't see those anymore.
I miss seeing you. And she wasright. I probably hadn't sent
videos. Was out for two months,so that was a key point of, I
need to do that consistently.
But today, we're doing thosethings, but we're hearing and
(15:07):
seeing a need for the two waycommunication, the face to face
communication, and that's wherewe're growing next in that
piece, you know, not just beingconsistent, but also trying to
make meaningful connections andlistening, I think, is what
we're missing.
Chad Bolser (15:21):
And you kind of touched on this next question a
little bit, but you know, asleaders and superintendents,
listen to this and listen to youtalk about who are struggling to
build that community, whatadvice do you give those
superintendents, those schoolleaders that maybe don't have or
aren't at the place that you arein your organization?
Dan Cox (15:43):
Well, I mean, it doesn't matter. You can be at a
good place a bad place. It's notif it's when crisis hits your
school district, your community,when you're in very difficult
times or adverse situations thatyou have to navigate as a school
leader, as a superintendent,especially, you're kind of like
that lone tree in the fieldcatching the lightning, right?
(16:03):
You're the polarizing objectwhere everything is and you
navigate those things. Werecently, just a few weeks ago,
we had our state school board,school superintendent and school
business official conferencehere in Illinois, the triple I
conference is what it's called,and it's a phenomenal
conference, and it has over13,000 attendees at it. So you
think about the majority ofschool board members, business
officials, superintendents, allin one conference. It can be,
(16:26):
you know, pretty engaging event.
And we had a keynote speaker,David Horsager, who wrote the
trust edge and trust matters.
And so I wanted to give himcredit for this, because one of
the things he talked about, whenthings get difficult and when
things become adverse, we and inthis context, we as
superintendents, we need to staycommitted. We need to stay
committed to our kids. We needto stay committed to the
mission, and we do need to rideout that storm. And I think how
(16:50):
you do that is building thattrust. And to do that, you have
to focus on listening first andcreating opportunities for
people to be heard, even whentheir opinions differ again, we
can disagree, and we do have toget back to that place of being
able to be critical, but alsobeing able to critically think
and have civil discourse aroundthe table and remember
(17:10):
everybody's humanity that startswith us. And so that means when
you do face that scrutiny, whenyou do get that personal attack,
because you will is to keep thatother person's perspective in
mind, in as difficult as it mayseem, understand that it's not
personal, and build yourrelationships by finding common
ground where you can agree andlooking at those shared goals
(17:32):
that we have for our kids andour students. And you do that
by, you know, being transparent,being authentic about what's
happening. I'm having a meetinglater this evening to rekindle
some family engagement andparent engagement, and I'm going
to be very authentic about whyit fell off of the table. And
there's things we own. There'sthings our families have to own
as well, of why that fell off ofthe table, and owning mistakes
(17:54):
is important too. I can pointthe finger all day long about
people needing to humanize us assuperintendents, but when I do
that. You know this, there'sthree fingers pointing back at
me while I do that. And so Ithink it's okay to own mistakes
and show that vulnerability asleaders as well.
Sarah Williamson (18:09):
That's why we're here, Dan, we're here to
point the finger at people, tohumanize the role of the
superintendent. We can do it.
Dan Cox (18:14):
Yeah, right, right.
Sarah Williamson (18:16):
So actually, that's perfect, because I wanted
to ask you, I really want to getto the heart of this question.
That's why we're running thisseries. You really want to
understand. Do you think it'simportant to humanize the role
of the superintendent? Do youthink it's important people see
superintendents as real peoplewho are navigating complex
challenges, and does that helpyou serve the communities more
effectively?
Dan Cox (18:35):
It 100% does. You know I have to remember as a leader,
that when somebody makes a poorchoice, a mistake, somebody's
upset and they're yelling at us,or whatever. Nobody wakes up in
the morning says, I'm going togo and do a bad job. No kid gets
up in the morning says I'm goingto be late for school, right?
They might realize they're goingto be late for school, but
that's not their goal. Almostevery kid you ask, says I want
(18:57):
to do well in school. I mean,99% of kids will say, I want to
do well in school. When you askthem, Do your parents want you
to do well in school? Yes, theydo. When you ask parents, do you
want your children to do well inschool? Yes, teachers want the
best for their kids. Schoolleaders want the best.
Communities want the best fortheir kids. But things get in
the way, and life gets in theway where it may not always
(19:18):
reflect that, and I think wehave to remember that and give
each other grace and extend thatgrace. Extend grace to yourself.
You know, we talked about how wecan keep going in this
profession as superintendents,that starts with giving grace to
yourself, that you may not haveeverything done just perfectly
okay. You may not be able towork 16 hours a day, and you
(19:39):
shouldn't, you know, do that,but you have to stay consistent,
and you have to stay patient andunderstand that building trust
takes time with people, andlikewise, I think, for others to
help us see us as a real person,it gives us a lot of confidence
to you know, we have to firstextend grace as leaders, but
getting that grace in returncertainly means the world. You
(20:00):
know, we recently navigated avery complex issue within our
community, and it was tough,really tough. I was not feeling
great, and a few messages camein from families that were
extending grace, and man, thatwas something I could hold on to
and really help me navigatethat. That was good to hear from
those people.
Chad Bolser (20:20):
That kind of leads us to the next question is,
we're advocates. We'resupporters of K 12 education,
and we want to know how to ascommunity members, parents
better support our nation'sdistrict leaders?
Dan Cox (20:37):
Right. Because, what I just said, extend grace and
empathy, and that's a two waystreet. We have to do that as
leaders and model that. Butalso, I would ask that people
look at everybody that workswithin a school system, or
anybody that you encounter on adaily basis, quite frankly, who
are trying to serve and help youand help serve you and your
families. Recognize that, youknow, we do face immense
(20:59):
pressure, and we face very, verycomplex challenges. There are no
right or wrongs in many of theissues we face and many of the
decisions we make. And we'rerepresenting a very broad group
as school superintendents. Sorecognizing us as people, and in
doing so, recognizing ourhumanity really goes a long way.
I think the next thing thatpeople can do is get involved
(21:21):
constructively. I said I wasgoing to be, you know, just lay
things on the table and beauthentic. Social media is
killing school communities.
People that go on and complainand voice their issues but don't
want to be a part of thesolution that's not
accomplishing anything. And Isee social media tearing down
teachers, tearing down schools,tearing down communities and
leaders, and it makes people notwant to do that. So I think
(21:44):
getting involved in a productivedialogue, attending school
events, joining committees andbeing a part of the solution
strengthens trust and buildsrelationships. Two ways. We, in
turn, have to provide thoseopportunities as well. You know,
within our schools, and the lastis advocate for education,
support policies andinitiatives, ask good questions
(22:06):
and keep an open mind. I thinkyou know those three things are
where people can really help usas school leaders and our school
systems as a whole.
Sarah Williamson (22:15):
Thank you, Dan, where can our listeners
connect with you and learn moreabout you?
Dan Cox (22:19):
I knew this question was coming, so I guess, you
know, first I'll start with,it's the month of December,
right? I'm taking it asseparation season, and so you
know that joy and that peace,and in that time for reflection,
I decided to take a break fromsocial media. So right now,
you're not going to find meuntil 2025 But all joking aside,
you know, I think that issomething people can do that's
(22:41):
healthy is take some time foryourself to reflect and grow and
write and read in differentways. But I will be coming back
next year, and you can, ofcourse, find me on LinkedIn and
Twitter and Instagram all at DanCox. I think LinkedIn is Dan W
Cox, and Twitter and Instagramare at Dan underscore Cox. And I
don't know if I'll come back toall those things or not, but for
sure, I'll be on LinkedIn, and afew surprises coming in 2025 as
(23:04):
well.
Sarah Williamson (23:04):
Oh, we can't wait. Well. Thank you so much.
This has been a fantasticconversation. We appreciate it.
Dan Cox (23:09):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Chad Bolser (23:11):
Thanks.
Thanks for tuning into the BuildMomentum for Education podcast.
If you enjoyed listening today,we would love to hear your
feedback, and we'd be gratefulif you could leave us a review.
Sarah Williamson (23:23):
This helps us to share these powerful stories
with even more people. If youliked what you heard, we'd be
honored if you could share thisepisode with someone in your
network. We look forward toseeing you next time on Build
Momentum for Education.
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