May 15, 2025 • 17 mins
Is training 5 or 6 minute rounds killing your jiu jitsu progress? Using a round timer is common-place in jiu jitsu gyms around the world. But what if this practice is holding your jiu jitsu back? 10,15 or 20 minute rounds sound very daunting, but you might be surprised about how you approach these rounds and how they could skyrocket your BJJ progress.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
A good martial artist does not become tense, but
ready.
Essentially, at this point thefight is over, so you pretty
much flow with the goal.
Who is worthy to be trustedwith the secret to limitless
power?
I'm ready.
(00:27):
Training with a timer islimiting your jiu-jitsu.
It's holding you back, folks.
It is a staple of the jiu-jitsuacademy.
You've got the timer on thewall.
Beep, beep, set the round timer, round goes.
Okay, guys, new trainingpartner.
Actually, having the timer isnot helping your Jiu-Jitsu, if
(00:51):
anything, it's limiting it.
And I want to talk about itbecause no one's talking about
it.
So this was actually raised morerecently and has been talked
about before by John Danaher.
Now there's plenty of stuffthat Danaher says I don't agree
with.
He's a very smart guy andactually Craig Jones had talked
about how John Danaher willdetermine when the round ends.
(01:13):
There's no timer and he'll justgo.
Okay, guys, stop Like okay, endof round.
But you're just Really, yeah,you're just working, you're just
working and obviously he workswith some very advanced athletes
.
I did hear him talk about thatactually, and this may not
necessarily be practical.
If you run a gym, you're acoach, you're running a gym,
you've only got a certain amountof time where you've got to fit
(01:35):
in your class structure.
So I understand why the roundtimer is used from a practical
perspective, is used from apractical perspective.
But more recently, what wasbrought up by John Dana, who was
talking about the most recentmatch between Nicky Rod and
Kynan Duarte and also LukeGriffiths beating Victor Hugo
(01:57):
and this was only as a resultWas that on the same card?
Yeah, fuck, he beat Victor Hugo, shit how.
But earlier in the match he hadhis back.
I don't remember if he finishedit, mate, he had the Fuck,
there's some wild swings goingon at the moment, isn't there,
dude?
Yeah, because Victor Hugo cameoff the back of Of beating Nicky
(02:17):
Rod, that's right.
Yeah, fuck Right.
And Olivares beat Luke Griffithin that ADCC.
Yeah, sorry, go on, yeah.
So here is the interestingthing about this Earlier, in
those matches, both the athletesthat won were losing,
technically, right, like Kynanwas up and also Victor Hugo was
(02:41):
up.
But as the match wore on, thekind of the jiu-jitsu prevailed
and the tide turned.
So those guys who maybe they'rebetter at doing shorter matches
like 10 minutes, 15 minutes,like John's post directly said
that 15 to 20 minute matches arebetter in terms of showing who
has the better technique.
(03:02):
That's his take.
Now, obviously it was hisstudent and previous student who
prevailed, so kind of it's aconfirmation bias.
But there is something to thiswhen you think, oh, I'm good for
five minutes.
But how often do you have itwhere you're rolling and you
catch your partner like doingthe cheeky little clock check,
(03:22):
they sweep you and then theyjust do a little where are we?
Oh, there's only a minute to go, I'll just hold this guy down.
And you only know they're doingthat because that's what you do
.
You also do it.
You're like I just passed, justhold him down.
And it does change the way inwhich you are engaging.
If that's how you've beenconditioned to roll, it very
(03:45):
much enters your psyche that, oh, this is a five minute round,
I'm used to this, I'll go a bitharder.
Or oh, it's a 10 minute round,I'll I'll pace myself.
What if there was no clock?
It's different jujitsu, youknow.
I remember um shout out to myold training buddy, bean oh, yes
, the second strongest man injujitsu.
And he, and he said to me, tome he was like bro, have you
ever done like 20 minute rounds?
(04:06):
And I said, and I was like no,I haven't what.
And he's like, fuck, they'rereally good.
Like I did some the other dayat some gym, or he's like we
should do it sometime.
And I just remember being likesuper intimidated by that.
I was like, bro, I fuckingbarely survived five minutes
with you, like I don't want to.
I fucking barely survived fiveminutes with you, like I don't
want to fucking do 20.
But he's like no, bro, it'stotally different.
Like you slow it down and youknow cause you're more, you're
(04:28):
preserving energy.
And I was like, oh wow, andthen I think we did it or
whatever.
But it's a fundamentallydifferent way to do jujitsu.
Right, because you can't, youcan't go balls to the wall for
two minutes and then fuckingride out the next three minutes,
until the end of the round,possibly.
But when there's 20 minutes onthat clock, you have to change
(04:49):
how you approach it.
And there's an interestingthing here, because I know
there'll be plenty of people whopush back on this, and that's
fair enough, but we've got toconsider doing things
differently.
Will there be?
Who's going to push back?
No, plenty of people, I'm sure,because there is value in Like
even you know, like time in andof itself is a variable, it's a
(05:10):
constraint, right, it'sdifferent jujitsu.
Holy, are you saying what Ithink you're saying?
I was just.
I was just misappropriating aquote.
We've been doing ecologicalthis whole time.
I think that's great, justreaching.
But yeah, shout out, greg and Ijust become best friends.
I think you did You're bros now.
No, it's.
(05:32):
It's interesting because, likeeven within um weight, uh,
weight training, if you reducerest time, it becomes a
different workout.
Yeah, if you give more resttime, it's, yeah, it's a
different experience.
You're training kind ofdifferent qualities by doing
that, and I think there isdefinitely something to also how
long you rest between rounds interms of the quality of the
round.
But if we took time out of itentirely, your jiu-jitsu does
(05:54):
change.
You do need far more efficientjiu-jitsu.
Now plenty of people could say,oh, boring, like there have been
some tragically long matches injiu-jitsu and the quality
doesn't go up.
There is a.
There is a point where itshould just be tapped out for
both.
It gets sloppy.
Yeah, I remember not that thismatch was particularly sloppy.
(06:16):
It was keenan cornelius I can'tremember the year versus gordon
ryan.
This is before gordon becameultimate champion, ascending and
gordon finishes keenan with aninside heel hook.
It was at a grappling industriesand actually ben hodgkinson was
reffing the match.
Oh, wow, I asked him about it.
He was like it was so tiringman to be the ref.
Wow, how long was it?
47 minutes, 48 minutes.
(06:38):
He's like bro, I was like.
He was just like I was likefalling asleep.
He's like it's hard.
Guys so technical, back andforth, escaping back and forth,
and it is hard to stay in it asa spectator but I believe as a
grappler it brings somethingdifferent out of you.
(07:00):
And you mentioned the Isaac.
There was Isaac Michelle onthat.
What was that show?
It was like a reality show.
Yeah, they were doing like a.
It was like who's number one,but like who's next?
Yeah, they were doing like awho's number one, but like who's
next, who's next?
That's what it was.
Yeah, yeah, and it was coolbecause I think the Tacketts
were on that, yeah.
So Isaac Michelle had some epicmatch With Kyle Chambers, kyle
Chambers, and it went over twohours, fucking hell.
(07:22):
And they had to move them fromthe main stage While they
brought on.
I think it was Tackett and DanManasoi or some shit.
Oh my God, I mean two hours.
That's just Some of the mostgrueling jiu-jitsu ever.
Yeah, I mean, that's justfucked.
Yeah, dude, I saw Joel Costelloone of the first subversions
here in Sydney at Sammy's gymOkay, at the back, they did one
(07:43):
of the first subversions thereand Joel deadline fight I can't
remember who he was goingagainst and uh, they did 20
minutes or whatever and therewas no points and so they're
like 10 minute overtime.
And then they got through thatand they're like take a rest.
And they're like 10 minuteovertime.
And he was like I thought therewas only one overtime round.
They're like no, we justdecided we'll just keep doing
(08:04):
overtime rounds.
And at some point his, hiscompetitive diet of fucking
bongs and energy drinks, somepoint his, his competitive diet
of fucking bongs and energydrinks was not serving him in
the best way possible and but itcame down to I can't even
remember what it came down to,but it was just it wasn't good
for anyone.
Yes, like you said, thespectators weren't having fun.
(08:24):
The jiu-jitsu that was ondisplay was abysmal.
Yes, it's just two tired guys,you know, flopping on each other
, yeah, and so you're like allright.
They're like, wow, somethingdifferent does happen when you
draw it out.
If you draw it out to theabsolute end.
In a competition sense, it'snot necessarily great.
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(08:48):
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But I was going to say here issomething that I have found
(09:12):
interesting.
I believe it maybe it wasdominance in melbourne.
Uh, the dominance hq gym did asubmission only tournament and
it was probably similar to agrappling industries where they
were like, uh, like a novicecategory and an advanced
category and like it wasn'tbased on belts.
It was kind of like how longhave you trained?
Do you think you can do leglocks?
Maybe not submission,submission only.
The matches actually finishedthemselves up.
(09:32):
They only had a couple ofmatches that went quite long,
like, in the name of people,just getting after it and going
for the submission.
The match was done inside offive, 10 minutes.
Right, If that makes sense.
So I do believe that when younot only remove time but you
remove the idea of points thatif it's just going for the
(09:56):
submission it doesn't mean thematch goes forever.
No, that's true.
Sub only kind of does implywell, sub only is like go hard
to get the finish and you'll berewarded.
Yeah, yeah, like, whereas in apoint scenario maybe we lean
into oh well, I don't want tomake a mistake so I'll just play
it safe not to give up thepoints, yeah, and then that ends
(10:18):
up in a stalemate kind of match.
Yeah, and, and look, you knowmany people have critiqued the
ebi overtime and like startingin certain positions.
But I think the advantage atleast, or the good the upside on
an EBI overtime is there's adecisive outcome in terms of
once the match has gone to acertain point, either someone's
(10:38):
going to get submitted orsomeone's going to get out, and
this is going to determine thewinner.
Yeah, and so from anentertainment perspective,
there's that.
But if we're talking aboutimproving your jujitsu and
you've only ever done fiveminute rounds, 10 minutes is
going to feel like a world ofhurt.
Yeah, like it's verychallenging and you probably
look at that.
You probably look at likeadvanced class or whatever,
doing 10 minutes, and you'relike, oh my God, I could never
(10:59):
do that.
Right, you totally can, by theway you can.
And then because you develop adifferent cadence, you approach
your jiu-jitsu differently, andthen also because I had this
experience before where Ithought the timer was still
going.
It was kind of it was theoption of like the class had
finished, but you can keeprolling if you want, and the
last bell I heard was, I thought, the start of the next round.
(11:21):
Right, it wasn't, it was theend.
And so me and a good friend Iwon't mention his name, but he's
a weapon, he's a judobackground guy, but just a tough
, tough gay motherfucker, and heand I have a bit of a history
of going hard.
It's probably similar to youand Bean.
We've always rolled each otherhard and dude.
(11:43):
We were rolling and we wererolling really hard, and then
neither of us wanted to give up.
But I think we both got a pointin the roll where we're like,
fuck the round, the round's gotto end soon, but we just kept
rolling and rolling and we'd getmore exhausted, but like
neither of us wanted to give upon, like you know, they say ego
is bad.
But we're like, no, I don'twant to give this person the
satisfaction of giving up.
(12:04):
And then we both got to a pointwhere we scrambled, he came up,
he half took me down, I come upon his leg and we're both just
like.
We both looked at the clock andthe clock was just blank.
Okay, we're like there's no,there's no timer, and like
there's like hardly anyone lefton the mat and we're just like
how long have we been rolling?
We didn't even know like it.
Just it just became endless.
(12:24):
And maybe we didn't actuallyeven roll that long.
It felt like an hour.
It's probably more like 15minutes.
But what was so interesting was, because we thought there was a
timer, we went probably harderthan we could sustain.
Right, if we'd both agreedthere's no timer and we'll
finish this when there's asubmission or we'll finish when
we're finished, it would havebeen different.
(12:44):
But we absolutely fuckingcooked each other, thinking that
the bell would save us.
It's coming, yeah, and the bellcannot fucking save you.
And I think this is actually animportant lesson to take from
that whole danaher post is youroll differently when you're
thinking of the clock comparedto when you know it's not there.
Yeah, you're not reliant on itat all, no, and and having that
(13:06):
as a not having it as a factor,I believe, adds a different
dimension to your jujitsu.
I'm not saying it's better, I'msaying it is worth exploring to
, to to have it.
It wouldn't even have to beonce a week, like maybe you just
factor it in once a fort, oncea fortnight, once a once a month
where you do I'm going to do acouple of rounds without a clock
(13:28):
and maybe we just do it forsubmission or we just roll to a
fucking cooked.
Yeah, I was just thinking aboutit.
I'd love to offer it in some ofmy classes and I was thinking
like the tough part as a coachis you've got a class, you've
got a bunch of people paired upand there's often not the
pairings aren't excellent, rightso there's always going to be
someone that's paired with, likethe new guy or whatever, and so
(13:50):
having the shorter rounds whereyou're doing more of them
allows everyone to kind of getwhat they need More exposure.
But it would make sense thatyou could go like hey, after
today's class, I'm going to putthe clock on for 20 minutes and
if you want, once class finished, you can just choose a partner
that you want to roll with anddo a 20 minute round.
You know that'd be sickactually.
Yeah, yeah, and I think thereis a liberation in that as much
(14:11):
as having a time limit can forceyou to push the action, and
there's value in that removingit also could make you a bit
freer maybe and less urgent inyour jiu-jitsu.
And yeah, I think we always talkabout skill exposure, whether
it's lifting or jujitsu rollinglonger it does kind of put a
(14:36):
focus on how efficient are you.
Are you wasting energy doingcertain things Because you might
be able to keep it up for fiveminutes but you can't do it for
20.
Yeah, that sort of pacing orenergy management thing is.
You're probably not reallygetting much exposure to that as
a training mode in a fiveminute role, no, whereas when
you go, yeah, 10, 15, 20, thatbecomes like a really pivotal
(14:58):
piece of the puzzle.
You're like, oh shit, I'm goinga bit too hard.
I need to back it off so thatyou know that's a.
That's a valuable thing foranyone to experience.
I think about.
Here in the gym we do it right.
We do some conditioningworkouts that are short and
(15:20):
sharp, where it's like sprintand then you do some that are
like 20, 25, 30 minutes.
It's a very different approach,yeah, and I think that there is
different qualities, trainedphysically as well as mentally.
So as much as a submission onlyshort round kind of, is really
compelling you to do the thing,get it done.
That longer round is both youand your partner know that if
you come out too hard too soon,you probably gas yourself and
(15:43):
then you're getting done.
And my only slightly differenttake to Danaher is Danaher
believes it's better jujitsu inlonger rounds.
He believes the person with thebetter technique prevails.
Only slightly different take toDanaher's Danaher believes it's
better jujitsu in longer rounds.
He believes the person with thebetter technique prevails.
I just think it's differentjujitsu.
That's my take.
(16:06):
I don't think it's better, Ithink you just roll differently.
But if more people were to dothat earlier in their jujitsu
life at white and blue belt, Ithink it would actually make
them a better grappler.
I think that when you're awhite belt obviously you don't
have a lot of specific fitness,so a five minute round already
feels fucking long.
You're like fuck, how do I rollfor 10 or more minutes.
But it takes the over grippingand the spazziness and all of
(16:29):
that away from you becauseyou're like, oh, I can't do this
, I am going to have to pacemyself.
And maybe that brings in adegree of maturity is the wrong
word, I don't know.
It brings in a level ofexperience that usually only
higher level grapplers areexposed to and that if you got
exposed to it when you're awhite belt, then maybe that
would improve your jujitsu moreor diversify it.
(16:52):
That's what I'm thinking.
There it is, folks.
The time limit is limiting you,so if you want to get better at
jiu-jitsu, it could be worthtaking that timer off Now.
We appreciate you being here,thank you for staying all the
way to the end and if you gotthis far, we give you the love.
We appreciate the love to bereturned.
Give us a like.
Give us a like, give us asubscribe.
(17:12):
It means a lot to us and itgoes a long way to get more good
stuff like this to more goodpeople like you.
A good martial artist does not become tense, but
ready.
Essentially, at this point thefight is over, so you pretty
much flow with the goal.
Who is worthy to be trustedwith the secret to limitless
power?
I'm ready.
(00:27):
Training with a timer islimiting your jiu-jitsu.
It's holding you back, folks.
It is a staple of the jiu-jitsuacademy.
You've got the timer on thewall.
Beep, beep, set the round timer, round goes.
Okay, guys, new trainingpartner.
Actually, having the timer isnot helping your Jiu-Jitsu, if
(00:51):
anything, it's limiting it.
And I want to talk about itbecause no one's talking about
it.
So this was actually raised morerecently and has been talked
about before by John Danaher.
Now there's plenty of stuffthat Danaher says I don't agree
with.
He's a very smart guy andactually Craig Jones had talked
about how John Danaher willdetermine when the round ends.
(01:13):
There's no timer and he'll justgo.
Okay, guys, stop Like okay, endof round.
But you're just Really, yeah,you're just working, you're just
working and obviously he workswith some very advanced athletes
.
I did hear him talk about thatactually, and this may not
necessarily be practical.
If you run a gym, you're acoach, you're running a gym,
you've only got a certain amountof time where you've got to fit
(01:35):
in your class structure.
So I understand why the roundtimer is used from a practical
perspective, is used from apractical perspective.
But more recently, what wasbrought up by John Dana, who was
talking about the most recentmatch between Nicky Rod and
Kynan Duarte and also LukeGriffiths beating Victor Hugo
(01:57):
and this was only as a resultWas that on the same card?
Yeah, fuck, he beat Victor Hugo, shit how.
But earlier in the match he hadhis back.
I don't remember if he finishedit, mate, he had the Fuck,
there's some wild swings goingon at the moment, isn't there,
dude?
Yeah, because Victor Hugo cameoff the back of Of beating Nicky
(02:17):
Rod, that's right.
Yeah, fuck Right.
And Olivares beat Luke Griffithin that ADCC.
Yeah, sorry, go on, yeah.
So here is the interestingthing about this Earlier, in
those matches, both the athletesthat won were losing,
technically, right, like Kynanwas up and also Victor Hugo was
(02:41):
up.
But as the match wore on, thekind of the jiu-jitsu prevailed
and the tide turned.
So those guys who maybe they'rebetter at doing shorter matches
like 10 minutes, 15 minutes,like John's post directly said
that 15 to 20 minute matches arebetter in terms of showing who
has the better technique.
(03:02):
That's his take.
Now, obviously it was hisstudent and previous student who
prevailed, so kind of it's aconfirmation bias.
But there is something to thiswhen you think, oh, I'm good for
five minutes.
But how often do you have itwhere you're rolling and you
catch your partner like doingthe cheeky little clock check,
(03:22):
they sweep you and then theyjust do a little where are we?
Oh, there's only a minute to go, I'll just hold this guy down.
And you only know they're doingthat because that's what you do
.
You also do it.
You're like I just passed, justhold him down.
And it does change the way inwhich you are engaging.
If that's how you've beenconditioned to roll, it very
(03:45):
much enters your psyche that, oh, this is a five minute round,
I'm used to this, I'll go a bitharder.
Or oh, it's a 10 minute round,I'll I'll pace myself.
What if there was no clock?
It's different jujitsu, youknow.
I remember um shout out to myold training buddy, bean oh, yes
, the second strongest man injujitsu.
And he, and he said to me, tome he was like bro, have you
ever done like 20 minute rounds?
(04:06):
And I said, and I was like no,I haven't what.
And he's like, fuck, they'rereally good.
Like I did some the other dayat some gym, or he's like we
should do it sometime.
And I just remember being likesuper intimidated by that.
I was like, bro, I fuckingbarely survived five minutes
with you, like I don't want to.
I fucking barely survived fiveminutes with you, like I don't
want to fucking do 20.
But he's like no, bro, it'stotally different.
Like you slow it down and youknow cause you're more, you're
(04:28):
preserving energy.
And I was like, oh wow, andthen I think we did it or
whatever.
But it's a fundamentallydifferent way to do jujitsu.
Right, because you can't, youcan't go balls to the wall for
two minutes and then fuckingride out the next three minutes,
until the end of the round,possibly.
But when there's 20 minutes onthat clock, you have to change
(04:49):
how you approach it.
And there's an interestingthing here, because I know
there'll be plenty of people whopush back on this, and that's
fair enough, but we've got toconsider doing things
differently.
Will there be?
Who's going to push back?
No, plenty of people, I'm sure,because there is value in Like
even you know, like time in andof itself is a variable, it's a
(05:10):
constraint, right, it'sdifferent jujitsu.
Holy, are you saying what Ithink you're saying?
I was just.
I was just misappropriating aquote.
We've been doing ecologicalthis whole time.
I think that's great, justreaching.
But yeah, shout out, greg and Ijust become best friends.
I think you did You're bros now.
No, it's.
(05:32):
It's interesting because, likeeven within um weight, uh,
weight training, if you reducerest time, it becomes a
different workout.
Yeah, if you give more resttime, it's, yeah, it's a
different experience.
You're training kind ofdifferent qualities by doing
that, and I think there isdefinitely something to also how
long you rest between rounds interms of the quality of the
round.
But if we took time out of itentirely, your jiu-jitsu does
(05:54):
change.
You do need far more efficientjiu-jitsu.
Now plenty of people could say,oh, boring, like there have been
some tragically long matches injiu-jitsu and the quality
doesn't go up.
There is a.
There is a point where itshould just be tapped out for
both.
It gets sloppy.
Yeah, I remember not that thismatch was particularly sloppy.
(06:16):
It was keenan cornelius I can'tremember the year versus gordon
ryan.
This is before gordon becameultimate champion, ascending and
gordon finishes keenan with aninside heel hook.
It was at a grappling industriesand actually ben hodgkinson was
reffing the match.
Oh, wow, I asked him about it.
He was like it was so tiringman to be the ref.
Wow, how long was it?
47 minutes, 48 minutes.
(06:38):
He's like bro, I was like.
He was just like I was likefalling asleep.
He's like it's hard.
Guys so technical, back andforth, escaping back and forth,
and it is hard to stay in it asa spectator but I believe as a
grappler it brings somethingdifferent out of you.
(07:00):
And you mentioned the Isaac.
There was Isaac Michelle onthat.
What was that show?
It was like a reality show.
Yeah, they were doing like a.
It was like who's number one,but like who's next?
Yeah, they were doing like awho's number one, but like who's
next, who's next?
That's what it was.
Yeah, yeah, and it was coolbecause I think the Tacketts
were on that, yeah.
So Isaac Michelle had some epicmatch With Kyle Chambers, kyle
Chambers, and it went over twohours, fucking hell.
(07:22):
And they had to move them fromthe main stage While they
brought on.
I think it was Tackett and DanManasoi or some shit.
Oh my God, I mean two hours.
That's just Some of the mostgrueling jiu-jitsu ever.
Yeah, I mean, that's justfucked.
Yeah, dude, I saw Joel Costelloone of the first subversions
here in Sydney at Sammy's gymOkay, at the back, they did one
(07:43):
of the first subversions thereand Joel deadline fight I can't
remember who he was goingagainst and uh, they did 20
minutes or whatever and therewas no points and so they're
like 10 minute overtime.
And then they got through thatand they're like take a rest.
And they're like 10 minuteovertime.
And he was like I thought therewas only one overtime round.
They're like no, we justdecided we'll just keep doing
(08:04):
overtime rounds.
And at some point his, hiscompetitive diet of fucking
bongs and energy drinks, somepoint his, his competitive diet
of fucking bongs and energydrinks was not serving him in
the best way possible and but itcame down to I can't even
remember what it came down to,but it was just it wasn't good
for anyone.
Yes, like you said, thespectators weren't having fun.
(08:24):
The jiu-jitsu that was ondisplay was abysmal.
Yes, it's just two tired guys,you know, flopping on each other
, yeah, and so you're like allright.
They're like, wow, somethingdifferent does happen when you
draw it out.
If you draw it out to theabsolute end.
In a competition sense, it'snot necessarily great.
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But I was going to say here issomething that I have found
(09:12):
interesting.
I believe it maybe it wasdominance in melbourne.
Uh, the dominance hq gym did asubmission only tournament and
it was probably similar to agrappling industries where they
were like, uh, like a novicecategory and an advanced
category and like it wasn'tbased on belts.
It was kind of like how longhave you trained?
Do you think you can do leglocks?
Maybe not submission,submission only.
The matches actually finishedthemselves up.
(09:32):
They only had a couple ofmatches that went quite long,
like, in the name of people,just getting after it and going
for the submission.
The match was done inside offive, 10 minutes.
Right, If that makes sense.
So I do believe that when younot only remove time but you
remove the idea of points thatif it's just going for the
(09:56):
submission it doesn't mean thematch goes forever.
No, that's true.
Sub only kind of does implywell, sub only is like go hard
to get the finish and you'll berewarded.
Yeah, yeah, like, whereas in apoint scenario maybe we lean
into oh well, I don't want tomake a mistake so I'll just play
it safe not to give up thepoints, yeah, and then that ends
(10:18):
up in a stalemate kind of match.
Yeah, and, and look, you knowmany people have critiqued the
ebi overtime and like startingin certain positions.
But I think the advantage atleast, or the good the upside on
an EBI overtime is there's adecisive outcome in terms of
once the match has gone to acertain point, either someone's
(10:38):
going to get submitted orsomeone's going to get out, and
this is going to determine thewinner.
Yeah, and so from anentertainment perspective,
there's that.
But if we're talking aboutimproving your jujitsu and
you've only ever done fiveminute rounds, 10 minutes is
going to feel like a world ofhurt.
Yeah, like it's verychallenging and you probably
look at that.
You probably look at likeadvanced class or whatever,
doing 10 minutes, and you'relike, oh my God, I could never
(10:59):
do that.
Right, you totally can, by theway you can.
And then because you develop adifferent cadence, you approach
your jiu-jitsu differently, andthen also because I had this
experience before where Ithought the timer was still
going.
It was kind of it was theoption of like the class had
finished, but you can keeprolling if you want, and the
last bell I heard was, I thought, the start of the next round.
(11:21):
Right, it wasn't, it was theend.
And so me and a good friend Iwon't mention his name, but he's
a weapon, he's a judobackground guy, but just a tough
, tough gay motherfucker, and heand I have a bit of a history
of going hard.
It's probably similar to youand Bean.
We've always rolled each otherhard and dude.
(11:43):
We were rolling and we wererolling really hard, and then
neither of us wanted to give up.
But I think we both got a pointin the roll where we're like,
fuck the round, the round's gotto end soon, but we just kept
rolling and rolling and we'd getmore exhausted, but like
neither of us wanted to give upon, like you know, they say ego
is bad.
But we're like, no, I don'twant to give this person the
satisfaction of giving up.
(12:04):
And then we both got to a pointwhere we scrambled, he came up,
he half took me down, I come upon his leg and we're both just
like.
We both looked at the clock andthe clock was just blank.
Okay, we're like there's no,there's no timer, and like
there's like hardly anyone lefton the mat and we're just like
how long have we been rolling?
We didn't even know like it.
Just it just became endless.
(12:24):
And maybe we didn't actuallyeven roll that long.
It felt like an hour.
It's probably more like 15minutes.
But what was so interesting was, because we thought there was a
timer, we went probably harderthan we could sustain.
Right, if we'd both agreedthere's no timer and we'll
finish this when there's asubmission or we'll finish when
we're finished, it would havebeen different.
(12:44):
But we absolutely fuckingcooked each other, thinking that
the bell would save us.
It's coming, yeah, and the bellcannot fucking save you.
And I think this is actually animportant lesson to take from
that whole danaher post is youroll differently when you're
thinking of the clock comparedto when you know it's not there.
Yeah, you're not reliant on itat all, no, and and having that
(13:06):
as a not having it as a factor,I believe, adds a different
dimension to your jujitsu.
I'm not saying it's better, I'msaying it is worth exploring to
, to to have it.
It wouldn't even have to beonce a week, like maybe you just
factor it in once a fort, oncea fortnight, once a once a month
where you do I'm going to do acouple of rounds without a clock
(13:28):
and maybe we just do it forsubmission or we just roll to a
fucking cooked.
Yeah, I was just thinking aboutit.
I'd love to offer it in some ofmy classes and I was thinking
like the tough part as a coachis you've got a class, you've
got a bunch of people paired upand there's often not the
pairings aren't excellent, rightso there's always going to be
someone that's paired with, likethe new guy or whatever, and so
(13:50):
having the shorter rounds whereyou're doing more of them
allows everyone to kind of getwhat they need More exposure.
But it would make sense thatyou could go like hey, after
today's class, I'm going to putthe clock on for 20 minutes and
if you want, once class finished, you can just choose a partner
that you want to roll with anddo a 20 minute round.
You know that'd be sickactually.
Yeah, yeah, and I think thereis a liberation in that as much
(14:11):
as having a time limit can forceyou to push the action, and
there's value in that removingit also could make you a bit
freer maybe and less urgent inyour jiu-jitsu.
And yeah, I think we always talkabout skill exposure, whether
it's lifting or jujitsu rollinglonger it does kind of put a
(14:36):
focus on how efficient are you.
Are you wasting energy doingcertain things Because you might
be able to keep it up for fiveminutes but you can't do it for
20.
Yeah, that sort of pacing orenergy management thing is.
You're probably not reallygetting much exposure to that as
a training mode in a fiveminute role, no, whereas when
you go, yeah, 10, 15, 20, thatbecomes like a really pivotal
(14:58):
piece of the puzzle.
You're like, oh shit, I'm goinga bit too hard.
I need to back it off so thatyou know that's a.
That's a valuable thing foranyone to experience.
I think about.
Here in the gym we do it right.
We do some conditioningworkouts that are short and
(15:20):
sharp, where it's like sprintand then you do some that are
like 20, 25, 30 minutes.
It's a very different approach,yeah, and I think that there is
different qualities, trainedphysically as well as mentally.
So as much as a submission onlyshort round kind of, is really
compelling you to do the thing,get it done.
That longer round is both youand your partner know that if
you come out too hard too soon,you probably gas yourself and
(15:43):
then you're getting done.
And my only slightly differenttake to Danaher is Danaher
believes it's better jujitsu inlonger rounds.
He believes the person with thebetter technique prevails.
Only slightly different take toDanaher's Danaher believes it's
better jujitsu in longer rounds.
He believes the person with thebetter technique prevails.
I just think it's differentjujitsu.
That's my take.
(16:06):
I don't think it's better, Ithink you just roll differently.
But if more people were to dothat earlier in their jujitsu
life at white and blue belt, Ithink it would actually make
them a better grappler.
I think that when you're awhite belt obviously you don't
have a lot of specific fitness,so a five minute round already
feels fucking long.
You're like fuck, how do I rollfor 10 or more minutes.
But it takes the over grippingand the spazziness and all of
(16:29):
that away from you becauseyou're like, oh, I can't do this
, I am going to have to pacemyself.
And maybe that brings in adegree of maturity is the wrong
word, I don't know.
It brings in a level ofexperience that usually only
higher level grapplers areexposed to and that if you got
exposed to it when you're awhite belt, then maybe that
would improve your jujitsu moreor diversify it.
(16:52):
That's what I'm thinking.
There it is, folks.
The time limit is limiting you,so if you want to get better at
jiu-jitsu, it could be worthtaking that timer off Now.
We appreciate you being here,thank you for staying all the
way to the end and if you gotthis far, we give you the love.
We appreciate the love to bereturned.
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Give us a like, give us asubscribe.
(17:12):
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