Bonus Episode: The Return of the King Wrap Party!

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
cast where two friends pick a book at least one
of them has not read and worktheir way through it a few
chapters at a time.
I'm your host, critter, and I'myour host, jess, and we
finished the trilogy.
We did it.
Yeah, we finished the trilogyand the hobbit.
We started with the hobbit.
We finished the trilogy.
Um, hi, everybody in the chat,what's up?

(00:20):
Good to see you.
It happened, we're really done,it's a real thing.
It's a real thing, it's a realthing.
So most recently, obviously, wefinished the Return of the King
.
Jessica, my esteemed co-host,had never read Tolkien, so I
think we start with how does itfeel to no longer be a Tolkien

(00:45):
first timer?

Speaker 2 (00:49):
I feel like it was totally worth it.
I'm very excited to have kindof checked that off the bucket
list I had made it into like abig, scary monster, Because at a
certain point you're just like,why are you a fantasy fraud,
right?
Like why would you have notread it before now?
So I feel like I earned mystripes.

(01:11):
I'm very excited about it andit was an incredible story.
I was just telling Mr Jessicathat this is a story that for a
story, I thought I knew so well,I learned so much.

Speaker 1 (01:25):
That's a great way to put it Honestly same, because
it had been so long since I hadread them.
I was so entrenched in themovies, which are still my
favorite movies of all time Iwill fight verbally anyone who
disagrees that they areincredible.
But having read the books againfor the first time and what

(01:46):
I've calculated is probablyabout 20 years I had forgotten
how rich and deep and so much,yeah, just like more in depth
they are than the movies.
It's, it's just, it was.
it was really satisfying to readthem all again, finally, after
all this time it was so good andit was nice to have you along,

(02:07):
because there were some thingsthat you just didn't know
happened, most recently thescourging of the shire, right,
so let's jump to the very, veryend.
That was, would you say thatwas the biggest deviation, or
obviously I'm putting you on thespot here, but what would you
say were some of the biggestdeviations for you that you just
weren't expecting, having onlywatched the movies?

Speaker 2 (02:26):
no, I feel like that's the biggest one you know.
So I knew that tom bombadilexisted, um, I don't feel like
he was hugely pivotal to thestory.
Um, I didn't know about themouth of sauron, which
apparently I should have fromthe extended editions and the
forest folk right.

(02:46):
So the, the Mumakil, or the,the men who said they had been
hunted, and I'm sorry to chatfor not remembering the name of
the men who you know, aragorn,honored the promise to leave
them in peace following the war.
So those are the big things thatwere different, I feel like.

(03:08):
So I do feel like the Scourgeof the Shire is the biggest
thing, that is different, andyou didn't know that at all.
I had no idea, no idea and noidea leading up to it because,
as I've tattled on myself manytimes that I don't look ahead at
even chapter titles- so, when Iopened that chapter and saw

(03:32):
that title, I went wait, what'sthis?
What?

Speaker 1 (03:35):
what are we talking about here?

Speaker 2 (03:40):
So, um, yeah, and I love that.
I love that there weresurprises.
I obviously talked up a lot allof the little things that were
surprises to me but were valueadds along the way, and the big
things were cool too, yeah, okay, how about you?

(04:01):
I'd love to know if you had toname one or two or a couple of
your favorite moments.
Going back to this as an adult,you know for this read Things
you found that maybe you missedwhen you were a kid, or just
maybe you didn't notice them orthey hit different.

(04:21):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (04:25):
It's my turn to put critter in the house.
I know, I think I think as akid, when I was reading them, I
was in it for I don't say theplot, but I was in it for what
happens next, what's gonnahappen?
Because I hadn't seen themovies and so I was just
engrossed in.
How is this ring gonna make itto mortar?
How are Mordor?
How are they going to do this?

(04:45):
How are they going to overcomethese armies that are giant and
have been waiting in Mordor tocome out and kill them all?
I was just inhaling it becauseI wanted to see what happened
next.
Right, and so probably myfavorite thing about reading
them again as an adult, otherthan really fully appreciating
the prose, um, I think, wasunderstanding and feeling what

(05:09):
the characters were feeling.
More so, if I thought I lovedsamwise gamgee the first time
around, I had no idea how, justhow amazing if I I I think I
said I didn't even fullyremember like what I thought
about faramir the first timearound, and this time immediate
faramir stan like, oh my god,one of the best characters in

(05:32):
the books, like there were somany examples of that where it
was just this.
My heart exploded for some ofthese characters, whereas a kid
I I don't know that I would havenoticed how beautiful the
friendship between frodo and samreally was right, because I was
so focused on oh my gosh, isfrodo gonna get out of the tower
?
Is what?

(05:53):
Is frodo gonna die, whatever?
Um, this time I could reallysoak it in because I kind of
knew it was gonna happen alreadyand I could just appreciate it.
So awesome, yeah, yeah.
So we got, uh, aldora in thechat.
I also had no idea about thescourge.
I've been highly suspicious ofwhat saruman was up to, since he

(06:13):
didn't die when I was expectinghim to.
I did guess shire at one point.
Okay, okay, I was gonna say,jess, I remember whenever they
decided not to kill sarah mondor whatever, and they just kind
of left him in the tower, um,you were like a little sus on it
.
But you know, I think I askedyou like what do you think he
could do, or something, and itwas very much like I don't know.

Speaker 2 (06:35):
So who knows what he could get up to now we didn't
like tip you off that he hadmore to come no, no, but as we
talked about like, there werevery clear clues in the chapter
leading up to it, that just wentwhoosh like a 747 right over
the old head.

(06:56):
So no, I don't think you ruinedanything okay, that's good.

Speaker 1 (07:00):
I felt I was like, whatever it's, it's always one
of those like, if I have.
So I have several friends whoare currently reading the Wheel
of Time Right, because I am aproselytizer, if anyone is when
it comes to fantasy books, wheelof Time especially and every
time they come up to me and askme something, I'm always like,
you know, I can't really tellthem and I just try and school

(07:21):
my face to be like, wouldn'tthat be weird?
I don't know, you know, like ifthey come with the theory, um,
so I really am nervous alwaysthat I'm gonna give something
away, but I'm glad that I didn'texactly.
No, you were great, that's good.
Yeah, and I think, honestly,doing the podcast in this format
helped.
Kind of aldora kind ofsuggested that like it helped
slow me down and not inhale itas much, because, yeah, that's

(07:44):
just my tendency is to to justyou know, so that and also
talking it through right.

Speaker 2 (07:50):
So I I am also somebody who inhales content.
Yeah, it's nothing for me tosit there and try to, or back in
the day.
I don't think today I reallyhave that kind of time, but I
remember reading like an 800page book in a day, like I just
did it.
I don't think I would do thatanymore, but I still.

(08:13):
I do like to read voraciouslyand once I get into a book I'll
just keep going until it's allgone.
And so having to wait, havingto talk it through, think about
what I think, to answer yourquestions but also bounce off of
you.
You know we are similar in alot of ways, but it was always
fun when we weren't you know thethings that we weren't on the

(08:35):
same page, or you read it oneway and I read it another.
It was kind of fun when thosemoments happened.
And none of that would haveoccurred if we didn't take the
break.
Yeah, moments happen and noneof that would have occurred if
we didn't take the break.
Yeah, so doing a buddy read.
I tried to do it once before.
It failed after the first week.
Um, so this was, this was agreat way to um savor it yeah, I

(09:03):
agree.

Speaker 1 (09:04):
Um, it's been lovely.
And it's been extra lovelybecause we've had, like, people
in the discord talking to us,people coming into youtube,
leaving comments and stuff.
So that has been great to havenot just you, but you would have
been enough, definitely youwould have been enough, or
whatever the lord of the ringsversion of that is.
But at the same time, havingother people to talk to about it

(09:27):
has been great.
And so, basically, I haveplanned this.
I've ordered a few Butter, theirDragon stickers, so I'm going
to try to do an actual chatgiveaway, but because I have two
YouTubes connected to myStreamlabs, it might not be
automatic.
Either way, it'll be finebecause I'm going to do that.
I have two YouTubes connectedto my stream labs.
It might not be automatic,either way, it'll be fine Cause
I'm going to do that.
So I this is my like just towarn you all that that's going

(09:50):
to happen and I'm probably goingto initiate the first one I'll
probably give away two stickersand I'll initiate the first one
in like five minutes, justbecause I know that some people
are up very late to watch thisjust in case they want to go to
sleep.

Speaker 2 (10:02):
And we feel the love you guys, we do Thank you.
You know, even if you couldn'tbe with us, live during
different things, those who arecoming in and dropping comments
in YouTube or on social or inthe Discord, like I don't know
if you know, but it reallyjazzed us every week.
I know that Critter and I havetalked about it a couple times

(10:22):
how it's insane to do it likethis and that you guys really
kept the energy alive for us.
So waiting to see what you guysthought when a new episode
dropped.
Just, you know, hearts.
You guys Like it really meant alot.

Speaker 1 (10:37):
The kids do it.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
I don't know how the kids do it.
I'm legitimately too old.

Speaker 1 (10:43):
Yeah, some of them do this, others do.
I think it's this, which Ithink is a little better.
Whatever, I'm a millennial.
So, yeah, thank you all forsticking with us.
Um, okay, so yeah, return ofthe king.
This is like.
This is a return of the kingrecap, but it's also because
we're done, done the seriesrecap.

Speaker 2 (11:00):
Yeah, recap.

Speaker 1 (11:01):
So I know, and this, it gets harder and harder
because we're further andfurther removed from the other
books, right?
But and I didn't tell you, Iwas gonna ask you this in
advance, I hope you thoughtabout it a little bit do you
have an order of fate, like, howwould you rank them, books wise
, including the hobbit, fromfavorite to least favorite?

(11:24):
And and why don't we do likewe'll both say our least
favorite and then kind of godown?
And let me just say that in mygoodreads I have been trying to
use my goodreads more often inmy goodreads they are all five
stars, so it's not like I'mgiving five stars, then four
stars, then three stars.
No, I love them all, but I'mgonna do my level best to rate

(11:50):
them so I think, for thepurposes of least favorite, it's
so.

Speaker 2 (12:01):
I feel like it's so common, like it's such a basic
answer, but it probably is TwoTowers.
But to your point, it was stillan excellent read.
I think my ranking would be TwoTowers at the bottom.
Two Towers is my bottom.

Speaker 1 (12:30):
I think I agree with you.
I think Two Towers is also mybottom, which is interesting
because it's also my leastfavorite of the movies, even
though, again it's incredibleand I love them all.

Speaker 2 (12:44):
It's got some really great stuff that happens in
there.
It's got some great quotes thatare in there.
There is a lot of really goodstuff in Two Towers.
I think I might have mentionedthis at one point, maybe when we
did the Two Towers wrap that Iwas worried that Two Towers
would suffer from the middlechild syndrome that I think a
lot of middle books have, and soit kind of hurts a little to

(13:05):
read it at the bottom.
I know, I know Because I thinkthat it does so much better than
I thought it would after havingread it, especially knowing
going into it that you knowTolkien intended this to just be
one giant volume.
Yeah, so that was bottom thenext honestly.
Yeah, so that was uh, bottomthe the next honestly.

(13:26):
Next would next would be returnI'm right there with you.

Speaker 1 (13:36):
Look at us.
Why are we the same okay?

Speaker 2 (13:38):
I don't know, that's wild I think, we've been
spending too much time, I thinkyou're.

Speaker 1 (13:42):
You're right, we're fully synced up.
I'll jump in here.
Return of the King.
To me, that one is actually myfavorite movie, even though I
will say that Fellowship is theperfect movie.
But the Return of the Kingmovie makes me cry a lot and I
love how it makes me feel,basically, and so that's what

(14:04):
brings it over the top.
Um, but as far as books go,while it did make me cry, I just
it just, and it's so good still, but I just think Fellowship
and Hobbit are more entertaining.
That makes sense.
Um, I don't know what about you?
What do?
What do you think?

Speaker 2 (14:24):
I mean same right.
So fellowship, fellowship andHobbit are kind of neck and neck
and I think the only thing thatedges out you know, fellowship
over fellowship and Hobbit, bothover return of the King, is the
the beginning of the journeykind of vibe.

(14:48):
Yeah, it's a good vibe, it is.
And so there's so much inFellowship.
That was just such excitement,because at the beginning and I'm
a completionist so there's alot about Return of the King
that I love because, as wetalked about, I think that
Tolkien does a good job closingthe story and tying up those

(15:08):
loose ends.
So it's a really hard choice,but I think that that's
ultimately why Fellowship andHobbit edge above it.
Okay, yeah, I'm with you.

(15:31):
So now I'm curious.
I think we may differ here justbased on past ratings, but
what's your number two?

Speaker 1 (15:34):
No, why don't you say your?
number two, just like now, Ifeel like I'm gonna be talking
about the hobbit because, like,why does it beat it?
But like, fellowship surpassesthe other two because, as you
said, it's just the, the promiseof a journey to come right.
There's so much world buildingthat happens at the beginning

(15:57):
which is just kind of perfectlyexecuted, so it doesn't feel
like it's too heavy.
Um, it's light-hearted in someways because it's the Hobbit
heavy at the beginning and Ilove the Hobbits, I just love
the Hobbits.
It's got the like, I don't know, it's just got so much fun
stuff.
After Bilbo leaves and Frodo'sdealing with all of his like
bequeathments and stuff.

(16:19):
Tom Bombadil's hilarious theCouncil of Elrond is just a huge
lore drop.
That was, you know, great.
And then they get sent off inthe fellowship and then you have
boromir and all of his issuesand I don't.
It's just it's a great story initself and then it sets off

(16:39):
this amazing journey and it'sjust so satisfying.
So I'm holding off on talkingabout the Hobbit, cause that
one's my favorite, but you goahead.
What's your number two?

Speaker 2 (16:49):
So my number two is the Hobbit.
Okay, I knew, I think.

Speaker 1 (16:52):
I remember that we were different in that way.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
Okay, yeah, okay and so it did hold up and I,
honestly, I wasn't a hundredpercent sure until I just heard
you talk again Okay, becauseit's a self-contained story, and

(17:15):
so I I don't know how to I thisis hard talking about it
without talking about why theother one is number one.
I didn't know I was settingmyself up for disaster here.
While they're both excellentreads, while they're both

(17:38):
excellent reads, um, I feel liketolkien's craft had advanced
okay, and so the hobbit was, youknow, a sound like a drawing
board that he came back to andhe improved.
And I also can't compare,knowing now that there are
different versions right,there's different versions of
the story out there um, I thinkthat fellowship beats out the
hobbit, because the hobbit iswhere he learned so much okay,

(18:03):
that's fair, all right.

Speaker 1 (18:05):
So I think the hobbit beats out the fellowship and
again, slim margins all around.
The hobbit beats out thefellowship for me because it is
a contained story and I think itis a banger from start to
finish.
It is such an easy read.
It's something I couldrecommend to my friend's 10 year

(18:26):
old daughter, which I literallydid.
I loaned her my copy and my youknow bestie lawyer friend from
work right, I get anybody like I.
I would recommend it to anybodybecause not only is it
beautifully written, it's superfun, it's funny, there are some
serious themes in there as welland it's just really.

(18:46):
It's just so much fun to read.
I don't know I it's.
It's kind of in the way that Ifeel about the fellowship of the
ring movie, where I just feellike it's perfectly like,
balanced, as all things shouldbe.
I think the hobbit is that wayfor me because it's just there.
There are no missed chapters,every like it, just it, just it
had.
The pacing is perfect, thecharacters are fun I don't know

(19:09):
that's and I turns out bilbo andI are like this.
I loved Bilbo in that book, soyeah, that's where I landed like

(19:32):
I feel as though we'resplitting hairs here a little
bit.

Speaker 2 (19:33):
I think that Fellowship sold me amazingly on
the world building.
So again, the world buildingwith a really big dose of strong
character origins.
So I don't think that I could,I don't think that this whole
experience would have been thesame without a very strong

(19:57):
reaction to the fellowship read.
So it really kind of it set theanchor, it set the post for
this is, you know, be all in,and I absolutely am.
So that's why fellowship getsmy top spot.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
It hooked you.

Speaker 2 (20:15):
It did.

Speaker 1 (20:16):
From the beginning.
I can see it.
I can totally see it.
Okay.
So I'm going to try to initiatethis giveaway and if it doesn't
work automatically, I'm justgoing to ask you all to type
something in the chat and thenI'll write it down and do a
drawing, because we're gonnamake this work.
And if you want to know what itlooks like, the stickers that I

(20:36):
have look like our little logo.
So if you want a but are theredragons sticker that looks like
that, I'm gonna everybody crossyour fingers that this works.
I clicked okay, come on.
It says giveaway started.
You can do this.
Oh man, I thought it was goingto work.

(20:56):
See, I was worried that it wouldbe hooked up to my other
YouTube channel because, youknow me, I can only have many
YouTube channels.
What's up?
Random Noman think it's goingto show up on there.
So what I'm going to do is askanybody who wants to be entered
to win a sticker, and we'regoing to do two, and this is
just going to be the first one.

(21:17):
The next one will be later onin the stream.
Um, type your favorite book.
Which one was your favoritebook of the four that we did
hobbit, fellowship, fellowship,two Towers Return and if you've
already done it, I'll count it,because I know Aldora already
did it.
I will write your username downand then you have to be willing

(21:40):
to be available on Discord orreach out to me in DM somewhere
else and give me your addressand I will send you a sticker if
you win.
So I'll do a random numbergenerator to pick.
So we've got Aldora already,we've got Dana, lou and holler,
if I miss anybody.

Speaker 2 (22:00):
But I will.

Speaker 1 (22:02):
Okay.
So Narita says my eternal copout, it's one book, all four of
them.
Okay, fellowship, there we go.
Narita decided the sticker wasworth it.
Uh, not all who wander, saysfellowship yeah, it's hard to
pick.
It is hard to I mean fellowshipis so, so strong um but you

(22:28):
know my feelings aren't hurt atall that you're all siding with
Jessica.
I'm not allowed.
Oh, since you're missing,you're not allowed, okay.

Speaker 2 (22:37):
I never said that.

Speaker 1 (22:39):
It's a random number generator and there's multiple
stickers to give away, sowhoever wins the first one,
don't enter to win the next one,obviously.

Speaker 2 (22:49):
Okay, and normally I would be in chat hyping you all
up, but do give us, you know, alike and a follow if you're
interested.
I know we are going to be on alittle bit of a hiatus while
Critter, you know, changes herentire life, but we will be back
.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And just if Jessica decides andit's going to be wholly up to
her to do other books thataren't Tolkien related while I'm
away, I want you all to knowthat there will be no hard
feelings on my end.
We already talked about it thatI'm totally cool with that.

Speaker 2 (23:22):
If folks have suggestions on things they might
be interested to see us do,whether it's me while Critter's
on hiatus, or both of us whenshe returns, we're always open
to feedback too.
It can be a little difficultfor us to find property that one
of us hasn't read and the otherone has.

Speaker 1 (23:41):
It would be but I don't know, we'll see, and not
all who wonder.
I know, lord of the Rings isone book, but the Hobbit is a
part of our mix, right?
So that's what.
That's why we have to split itall up, um, so, all right, okay,
well, I'm gonna.

(24:02):
I'm gonna wait like two moreminutes at my time.
8, 26, we'll call it.
We currently have aldora, dana,lou, nerita not all who wander
and random gnome and entered inthe in the giveaway.

Speaker 2 (24:12):
That's everybody I saw in the chat perfect, okay.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
So I don't know what else do you want to talk about?
I know we have our mvps, wehave our um, we have our uh sign
offs, but I feel like the signoffs we do last, obviously, yeah
, um I don't know if anybodywho's in the chat wants to take
a guess at who they think ourtop mvp is for return of the

(24:38):
king.

Speaker 2 (24:39):
If anybody wants to drop their guess in chat,
they're welcome to okay okay, wedo have, uh, we do actually,
you know what I have.

Speaker 1 (24:51):
This is perfect.
Jessica put something togetherand I think now is a perfect
time to play it, because becausethen we can have the end of
that be the end of the giveawayentries.
So Jessica went and pulled someof the clips that we've been
posting on, like TikTok andwhatnot, from streams past, and

(25:12):
they're all in this cute littlecompilation video that we have
now.

Speaker 2 (25:15):
So I'm going to the production value is really low,
you guys.
So manage your expectations,but I did my best with my
limited skills.

Speaker 1 (25:25):
I think it's great and it's a podcast, so you know
what?
What matters is the audio morethan anything else, and I think
it's lovely, okay, so I'm goingto, uh, let's see, let's see,
let's see.
All right, that should work.
Wait, can I full full screen it?
I thought I did that before,but no, okay, that's fine.

(25:47):
That's fine, that's fine.
Sorry, guys, all right, I justwant to make sure it's good for
you.

Speaker 2 (25:53):
Um show on stream there it is yes, there it is,
and then I'm gonna play it theblack writer in the book has a
much more advanced vocabularythan how they are portrayed in
the movie sniffing, screaming,screaming, sniffing, screaming.

(26:16):
Shire and Baggins over and overagain.
Oh right, yeah, I love thatyou've cut those in, because
that's exactly what I wasthinking of.
They knocked on the door andsaid open in the name of.

Speaker 1 (26:30):
Mordor and I was like , ah, who's going to open that?
Only dark friends.

Speaker 2 (26:35):
Mordor PD open up.

Speaker 1 (26:37):
I don't know Mary, who we haven't met yet in the
book but we keep hearing littlesnippets of in the prologue, is
both the expert on pipe weed andalso quite sure and proud that
hobbits were the first folk todecide to smoke it.
Other people were familiar, butthey were the ones that were
like we're gonna light this onfire and inhale it.
Right, the movies are just pure.
Farmer maggot slander right,because he, like in this chapter

(27:01):
, kind of saved the day.
So, don, is there anythingGandalf can't do?
Fly.

Speaker 2 (27:10):
Oh, okay, fair, I was gonna say answer a direct
question.

Speaker 1 (27:15):
Oh, legolas nerding out about the trees rolling
right into gimli, talking abouthow incredible the caverns of
helms deep are, and them makinga pact to vacation together to
visit their favorite places whenpeacetime and then they did it

(27:36):
and it made me so happy andjetson so the first time I ever
heard those words uh, this isnot in my outline, but I just
thought of it was I believe thatwas ursula's um to be fair, it
taught me a lot of new words toolittle burbade.
Yeah, totally Burbade.
Yep, totally.
I thought they were just names.
I didn't know they meantanything.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
Oh, yeah, and so then I, oh, and that the tower is 50
fathoms tall.

Speaker 1 (28:01):
Math, fantasy, math.

Speaker 2 (28:04):
Sorry, 300 feet there we go, that makes more sense
300 feet, so that's like 30stories.
That's really really effing.
Tall, tall, that's a footballfield, right?
Yes, that's 100 yards, okay,okay it's like yeah, yeah, yeah
pretty tall.
Believe it or not, I had towait for my brain to go from

(28:26):
vertical to horizontal, to belike yes, that tracks yes, I
believe that's true I amsomebody who has to jump in the
map like joey and friends.

Speaker 1 (28:36):
I am that person but I'm uh, I'm a lawful good.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
So, yeah, I think my alignment is like no, that still
bothers me and also the factthat I love it I love it in your
pocket.

Speaker 1 (28:49):
After the fact, very low.
Like I, I was really annoyed bythat.

Speaker 2 (28:55):
Did that bother you at all?
I think that this is a greatquestion, because as soon as you
mentioned it, I was like well,here's where our lawful good
versus lawful neutral really,really shows.

Speaker 1 (29:07):
Just cut in because I also had that written down.
But the particular line thatthat was in, I thought was a
perfect little piece of literaryumami, as we call it yeah.
So the raven recommends peacewith the men of dale.
You know, old bird wise.
Uh, though he notes it wouldlikely cost thorin in gold.
Thorin responds angrily that noone will get his gold.

(29:29):
Yeah, yeah, so he had me goingthere.
When he, like he gave bilbo theme thrill, reassured him about
his share, I was like okaythorin's.

Speaker 2 (29:39):
Really, again we're getting, we're getting wisps and
references to that verymagnanimous thorin that I think
I made up.
I think I made him up.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
Fake news, Not real Thorin.
This is Thorin.
This is Thorin.
Who's like nobody gets my gold.
This is my gold.

Speaker 2 (29:59):
The way that he doubles down on the whole ain't
nobody touching my stuff reallydoes not pass the vibe check at
all.

Speaker 1 (30:11):
Major ick.
That is like like nothing else.
Even the guy who plays thorinin the movies at this point is
an ick.

Speaker 2 (30:19):
Um eagles are the fifth army correct uh, no it I
still think this is the wildwolves, the goblins that I had
to put it in, so they werecalling the goblins and the
wargs as two separate armies,even though they were literally
okay.

Speaker 1 (30:36):
So I'm gonna push back on that.
I know I believe you, but likethe goblins are riding the wargs
and we get a whole separatefleet of eagles, so why would
the eagles not be the fifth army?

Speaker 2 (30:48):
it's the kind of day I was having when I read this
why indeed, but for you to havehad a letter for three months.
Three months, oh it hurts.

Speaker 1 (30:57):
It hurts, it stings, it burns yeah, like definitely
leave by the end of july is whatthis letter says.

Speaker 2 (31:04):
This is september, by the way, in case anybody forgot
.
Like late, late, almostseptember last week in september
.

Speaker 1 (31:12):
And you know what's so funny to me is that the
reason that mary knows about thering it goes back to the
sackville baggins.
They ruin everything we cametoo far not an extreme planner.
So, absolutely, we havequestions for you, so I hope
that's okay, ring it Okay.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
Nice, I love it.
I love it.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
All right, we're going to hide that again and
we're back, hilarious, I still.
That doesn't make sense to me,that the Eagles aren't the fifth
army.
I think they are.

Speaker 2 (31:47):
I will die on that hill, or that Irie, as some
might say.
I think when you get to theafterlife, I'm just gonna want
to be a fly on the wall when youconfront tolkien about it fair
enough, I will.

Speaker 1 (31:57):
I will be like okay, let's talk about it.
I know if anybody would, it'syou okay?
So, um, I said at the end ofthe thing we were going to do
the drawing.
We've got five people entered.
So far as you can see, they areall in a list and we're going
to consider them all in order.
Okay, I've got a random numbergenerator right here.
It's one through five.

(32:17):
Eight is the current selection,because it started at ten, so
I'm going to press it Doop Five.
So we've got random Noman E1,congratulations.
There will be another giveaway.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
We'll say in ten minutes, Okay so random Noman
one one.
There will be another giveaway.
We'll say in 10 minutes, um,okay, so random moment one one.
Very excited dora thinks weshould have timed the read to
correspond with their trek fromthe shire.
Brilliant idea, had it evenoccurred to us, I don't know if
that would have been like toofast.

Speaker 1 (32:46):
No, because it was.
It was like a year it was ayear, so and that was it was.

Speaker 2 (32:53):
We wound up in under a year even with the hobbit
right.

Speaker 1 (32:59):
So yeah, I guess if we wanted to be like you know,
we could have done.
We could have maybe done it.
Baby critter would haveinterfered, he would, he would
have.
Yeah, probably okay.
So, um, do we want to do themvp?
Sure about the mvp?

Speaker 2 (33:17):
I saw some good guesses in chat.
Um, I will say that we have one, two, three, four, five, six,
seven, eight people who made itinto the MVP and there is
essentially three ties.

Speaker 1 (33:38):
True, true, yep.
So we've got some guesses,we've got Sam wise.

Speaker 2 (33:43):
We've got.

Speaker 1 (33:43):
I know I saw another one.
I know I saw another one.

Speaker 2 (33:47):
Yeah, I can't.
I'm not logged in as a host.
I can't help with this.
I'm sorry.

Speaker 1 (33:52):
Oh, here we go.
We've got another aragorn orsam perhaps.
Um, I don't.
Uh, that's all I got.
Okay, so that's what we got.
Yeah, hey, brian lehman, what'sup?
Um, I'm aboard okay, so we'reabout to do our mvp for the
return of the king, and thenwhat's going to be fun is I've

(34:13):
got all of our past Lord of theRings numbers so we can tally
who's the ultimate MVP, which Ithink is interesting.

Speaker 2 (34:25):
Dana Liu just weighed in.

Speaker 1 (34:28):
Samwise and Gandalf are possibilities.
Okay, all right, should I showit, or should we?

Speaker 2 (34:37):
I don't mind doing tie for third.
You want to do tie for second,and then do it that way.

Speaker 1 (34:42):
Yeah, I think that's a good goal.

Speaker 2 (34:44):
Okay, so our third tie is a four-way tie and it is
between Theoden, eowyn, merryand Frodo, which makes me so sad
, but we're going to talk aboutit.
We're going to talk about someMVP fallout.

(35:05):
So that was our four-way tieFor third yeah, and they each
had one vote.

Speaker 1 (35:14):
Yeah, which is wild to me the fact that Eowyn only
had one vote.
The fact that Frodo only gotone vote in the entire season.
True, true.

Speaker 2 (35:25):
I checked that math a few times.

Speaker 1 (35:31):
Yeah, but he didn't throw the ring into the fire.
Sorry, sorry, narita, sorry,okay, okay.
So how do we feel about these?
I mean, they had a pretty epicmoment.
That makes sense.
Mary did really well once theygot back to the Shire.
Frodo was the ring bearer andthen Eowyn no, I'm kidding, I

(35:52):
know it feels so dismissive nowand then Eowyn had the epic
moment too.
So, like, yeah, they deservedsome recognition for sure.

Speaker 2 (36:05):
And these are just the straight counts.
This doesn't include anyhonorable mentions, which we
were much more liberal with thisseason.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, frododid make it on the list.
He was he.
He did get one vote.
I gave voted for him on thelast episode.
I did at least somebody did hehad a really strong last episode

(36:26):
and I'm glad that I gave to himI don't know that I realized we
didn't vote for him at all thisbook no, it's crazy to me, as
we were critter and I were backand forth today setting up
documents and stuff and justseeing frodo has a marked lack
of votes in general for forbeing the bearer uh, yeah, yep,

(36:52):
he did his best did anyways,what about, what about?
tied for second.
Tied for second.
We have each having two votesuh, gandalf and arwen.
So gandalf, both times Gandalfgot nominated was from you,

(37:14):
critter.

Speaker 1 (37:15):
Oh, really no.

Speaker 2 (37:16):
Gandalf votes from you?
No, none.
This read which is wild.
And Arwen was episode seven,where we both felt that Arwen
deserved a nomination.

Speaker 1 (37:30):
It was one of those, like it's that gandalf and arwen
are tied right because of thescale of their participation in
the books very different justbased on how we split the reads
up.
Right, yeah, you can be.
You have a major advantage ifyou've got kind of a low-key set
of chapters.
And that's exactly whathappened with arwen, like the
competition was not steep and uhand hurt she.

(37:53):
She had a great contribution,but the fact that she's tied
with gandalf feels mildly wrongdisproportionate, if nothing
else a little bit, yeah uh, sothat's an interesting outcome,
but it is what it is, yeah andso that leaves us with two names
who are tied for first, eachwith four votes.

(38:16):
It is indeed aragorn andsamwise gamgee yeah, yeah, yeah,
let me pull it up so you canall now see share there.
It is okay.
There they are.
Um.
This checks out for me, rightum?

(38:39):
This was definitely aragorn'sbook titular character, right um
?

Speaker 2 (38:46):
yep, they each had one honorable mention too.
I was gonna say we could usehonorable mention to tie break.
No, we can't.
No, we can't, apparently not.
Yeah, yeah, you're right,aldora, a hundred percent right,
like of course it was gonna be.
Them had to be.

Speaker 1 (39:02):
Aragorn and sam had to be titular character and my
personal favorite, so why wouldit not be?

Speaker 2 (39:09):
I'm curious.

Speaker 1 (39:09):
I know you have a spreadsheet, but were our Sam
votes pretty well spread out,like was it two and two, or was
I way too Sam heavy?

Speaker 2 (39:18):
You and I each did Sam for episode five and episode
six.
So episode five, I think, isthe close of no.
Just kidding it was, it wasback to back.
So it was them going intomordor, him rescuing, and then
frodo, yeah, and then him savinggollum, who essentially saved

(39:44):
everyone the fires of mount doom.

Speaker 1 (39:47):
Yeah, yeah, that tracks yeah, so it was.

Speaker 2 (39:52):
It was really intense in that one section of the book
.
And then, just for fun, youknow, critter had done some work
going back and looking at somepast mvp stats and I went
through because of ourconversation.
I feel like the last of ourconversation, I feel like the

(40:16):
last rap stream and wanted tosee, now that I've read the
whole series, who would my mvppicks be per book?
So I don't know if you want toshare what you so pulled.
Thank you, my brain juststopped working it's okay.

Speaker 1 (40:32):
Um, I'm trying to find how to hide here.
We go hide that, okay, um, sothe thing that I was looking at
was, uh, my project was to findthe total big mvp, like the mvp,
mvp for the whole thing, basedon our votes.
So I feel like we should doyours first, your particular

(40:55):
MVPs.

Speaker 2 (40:57):
So what I did, just to share with everybody in chat.
I went through and I looked andI started by looking at per
book, meaning books one throughsix, six, and then based on who
I picked in the two books perbook, then going from there and

(41:19):
all of you obviously understandwhat I mean.
So, going all the way back tofellowship um, which has book
one and book two in it, um, Ihad picked for the book one the
first half of Fellowship.
I put Gandalf slash Aragorn.
I was kind of on the fence, butI feel like it's at the

(41:42):
beginning, it's really early forboth of them, but they're both
kind of instrumental in thestaging of the story.
So I was a little on the fenceat that point.
And then I looked at book twoand I was like I think Frodo has
to be my MVP for all of theaction that happens in the
second half of fellowshipbecause that's him volunteering

(42:06):
to take on the quest and go onthis journey.
So then, looking at thosetogether and the action of
everything that happened infellowship I I picked gandalf as
my mvp for all of fellowshipbecause he was so instrumental
in staging and setting thecourse yeah and it took somebody

(42:29):
as overpowered as Gandalf tobeat the Balrog.
The quest would have died ininfancy without him to take on
the Balrog.
So my choice for fellowship foroverall MVP based on the book
as opposed to our readincrements, is Gandalf.

Speaker 1 (42:47):
Okay, I think that's totally fair.

Speaker 2 (42:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (42:51):
What about book two?

Speaker 2 (42:52):
Book two for the first half.
Of the two towers, I definitelypicked Mary and Pippin.
I know we're not keeping score,we don't have to worry about
splitting votes.
So I'm saying Mary and Pippinbecause that that obviously the
first book of the two towers isalmost entirely about their
journey with tree beard andeverything that they're doing,

(43:15):
how they influence that, howthey influence the Entmoot and
the individual effects that theyhad on the story.
I feel like it's Mary andPippin for the whole of book
three, the first portion of TwoTowers.
Okay, for the whole of bookthree, the first portion of two
towers.
Okay, um, for book four of thetwo towers, I pick Smeagol.

Speaker 1 (43:43):
You would Okay, why I ?

Speaker 2 (43:44):
pick Smeagol because he's so pivotal to the action in
the second half of two towers.
So his pursuit, his choices andthe way that he led them into

(44:10):
Shelob's lair were crucial tothe story and ultimately found
them a different path thatotherwise they might not have
made it into the realm of Mordor.
Now, granted, his motors werenefarious, but a lot like I've
never.
I've never claimed that Smeagolwas a good creature.
Um, so that that was how I felt.

(44:31):
Um, so that that was how I felt.
And then, looking at the twotowers as a whole, um, I'm back
to sam wise.
Uh, again I go back to theimportance of the quest for the
ring.
Um, and sam's choices at theend of that book affected the

(44:56):
affected, whether or not thestory continued.
You know, if Sam had not Ithink that's the name of the
last chapter is the choices ofSamwise, gamgee and I perfectly
named.
I can't, I can't, escape that.
So Samwise was my pick foroverall for the two towers,
because of how crucial he was.

Speaker 1 (45:17):
Perfect.
You know, I'll always back youup on that one, I figured you'd
be okay with it.

Speaker 2 (45:22):
I had to throw a little Smeagol at you to set you
up?

Speaker 1 (45:25):
Yeah, just knock me off guard a little bit.

Speaker 2 (45:28):
And then for book three.
If I look at the first half ofReturn again, I wind up picking
Gandalf.
He is just so instrumental inkeeping everybody else afloat
long enough for the quest toreach its conclusion.

(45:49):
He's so instrumental to reachits conclusion.
He's so instrumental, you know,beacon of shining light on the
battlefield, saving Faramir,doing all of these different
things that that make, then makeit a world worth coming back to
.

Speaker 1 (46:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (46:06):
And then for book six I have Samwise, slash, frodo.
And this is where you're tryingto make up for the fact that you
didn't vote for Frodo at all,because I feel bad, because
Frodo really did make anincredible sacrifice and he did

(46:27):
make that journey just as muchas samwise made that journey.
He faltered at the end.
But does that undo everysacrifice, every step along the
way?
I don't think that it does.
I don't want to live in a worldwhere it does.
Um, but it was through thechoices of samwise gamgee that
the quest was ultimatelysuccessful.

(46:48):
Um, but if it weren't for Frodo, samwise wouldn't have been
there.
So they're a very tangled knot.
I think somebody in chat made acomment about how it's very
muddled because they're alwaystogether.
They are a package deal, um, andso for, ultimately, for book

(47:12):
three, I still go samwise, okay,because he does the whole
journey and he's the heraldthat's going to continue the
story, so that, um, the, thememory isn't lost and so that it
was all worthwhile, uh, goinginto the new age.
So those are my overall picks.

Speaker 1 (47:32):
Okay, well, that is interesting, especially given
what I just calculated, which isthe overall score winner, right
, because in our spreadsheets,as you've seen, it's like who I
voted for, who Jess voted for,if we had a like who I voted for
, who just voted for, if we hada guess who they voted for,
right.

(47:53):
So we have all those numbersfrom past seasons.
So if you have a guess, anybodywho won overall, you can put it
into the chat.
But I will do a little bit of acountdown.
Um, so you might be wonderingwho won.
It was the least successfulhobbit and I will tell you that.

(48:15):
In fact and we're not doing thehobbit, because this is just
the lord of the rings trilogy,right?
Um, interestingly enough, maryand bilbo tied for least voted
hobbit.
Mary got three and bilbo gotthree as well, and I, yeah, and
I think, was it?
So I think bilbo got his um, atleast one of his, during the

(48:37):
council of elrond, because hewas like, well, I guess I can
take the ring and we just reallyliked that and because he had
been through it like he knewwhat a perilous thing that was.

Speaker 2 (48:49):
Um you know, whereas in the in the moment, sam frodo,
mary and pippin do not know.

Speaker 1 (48:55):
Yeah, um, bilbo does yeah, and he's still volunteered
.
If you'll recall, the seasonmvp, based on votes from two
towers, which is so funny to me,was pippin.
But he did not.
He, he is, uh, he oh okay.

(49:17):
Well, actually he did beatfrodo, so frodo's next for the
hobbits.
Frodo got four votes throughoutthe entire trilogy, four votes
for the entire trilogy, which isjust really funny.
Um, I mean not funny, it's,it's interesting, it's
interesting stuff.

(49:37):
Um, but yeah, so frodo got four, pippin got five, and I think
you all know that sam's gonna beup at the near the top, at the
very least.
So I'm gonna leave him till theend.
Um, another very honorablemention goes to well, treebeard
and galadriel and faramir allgot two votes total.

(50:00):
So good for them.
Um, you love to see it,especially because I you know me
I freaking love faramir now.
Um, again I was reminded howamazing he is.
Of course we have some like rhave some randos who got one
vote.
That include Théoden and Éowyn,which they didn't spend as much
time in the series, so ofcourse that's Arwen got two as

(50:21):
well.
Arwen did get two, which stillis kind of like she got no hate,
but she did get a really luckypoll.

Speaker 2 (50:29):
She did not have a lot of active participation in
the story.
You know, I was left wonderinguntil the last, like two
episodes, whether she wasconsenting.
So you know, yeah.

Speaker 1 (50:41):
So what's interesting is because, primarily because
he didn't get any votes in thetwo towers, aragorn took third,
like even though he took firstand returned to the king, tied
for first and return of the king, aragorn took third overall

(51:03):
with six points four in thereturn of the king and two in
fellowshiphip Gotcha.
So I think, as many of usprobably expected, the top two
were Sam and Gandalf and itended up being not that close,

(51:24):
and I think it's because Gandalfonly took two in Return of the
King, gandalf only took two inreturn of the king.
So gandalf got second placewith nine points, which is a
solid number.
But nothing to my boy, sam, whotook 11, 11 points.

(51:48):
Yeah, he always his worstseason.
He got 2 points, he got 4, 5,and 2.
And I guess it was all.
Yeah, that was Two towers also,which is so funny.
Actually, no wonder it's myleast favorite.
One or no Returns my leastfavorite?
No, two towers is my leastfavorite.
So, yeah, no wonder, becauseSam didn't do as much.

(52:09):
So anyways, overall.
But tower is my least favorite.
So, yeah, no wonder because samdidn't do as much.
Um, so anyways overall.
But are there dragons?
Mvp seems to align withjessica's conclusion that sam is
number one because he won twoof your two of your books,
correct?
Yes, yeah, he won two of yourbooks overall.
So, yeah, it makes sense.
Whether we look at it pointswise.

(52:29):
Whether we look at it pointswise, whether we look at it,
jessica, book by book wise,that's how it goes, yeah.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
I will say that that is probably the biggest
revelation about this read, nowthat I've come to the end of it,
is that it turns out that, forme, frodo is not the hero of the
story, is not the hero of thisstory.

(52:56):
Frodo is a hero because of whathe did, but he is not the hero
of lord of the rings, and thatis not a thing I was uh
expecting to learn on this readyeah, it's so funny too looking
at like.

Speaker 1 (53:05):
And no hate to elijah wood, he did an incredible job
when you look at the movieposters right like frodo, front
and center, sam kind of behindhim, whatever, which is kind of,
you know, that's how sam wouldhave wanted it.
But at the same time, when youthink about it, like sam has
always been my favoritecharacter and he, you know, I

(53:25):
feel really justified in thatopinion because he's so good he
is so many ways and just lovely,okay.
So I think it's time for mysecond and final sticker
giveaway.
Um, so what should we have themtype in the chat this time?
Should we do their mvp, theirpersonal mvps, or?

Speaker 2 (53:48):
for the whole, for the whole trilogy.

Speaker 1 (53:51):
Yes, okay, if you would like to be entered in a
drawing to win a, but are theredragons sticker?
That looks just like that and Iwill.

Speaker 2 (54:02):
I will mail it to europe, so whoever like, feel
free to enter I mean, I happento be going to europe so I could
drop a local post.

Speaker 1 (54:11):
Well, actually, because it's just paper, it
should only be like $1.50 toship, so it's totally worth it.
Let me know your fave and I'llwrite your.
We've got Danilu, we've got NotAll who Wander, I'll write you
down and we will do anotherrandom number generator.

Speaker 2 (54:27):
I do want to give acknowledgement to Aldora.
My biggest minor charactershout out was for Baragond,
absolutely.
Baragond got honorable mentionin episode 3 and that was
another character moment that Ididn't know I was missing until

(54:47):
I got it and I loved Baragond.
Aldor also picked Samwise, asdid Brother Zachariah.
Lots of Sam love in the chattonight.
I'm good with it.

Speaker 1 (54:58):
Totally good with it, All right.
So I've got Dana Lou Not Allwho Wonder Brother Zachariah and
Aldora, so far, yeah.

Speaker 2 (55:07):
Oh, that's true, Not All who Wonder is going to be in
prague.

Speaker 1 (55:12):
so oh, that's fun, yeah uh, perfect, um, narita,
okay, I'm gonna, I'm gonna sharethat on the screen.
I like that a lot.

Speaker 2 (55:26):
Okay, popping it up, narita in this essay I will says
I definitely agree.

Speaker 1 (55:32):
Frodo isn't the hero, but in my opinion he is the
character most tied to the themeof unglorious heroism and in
this essay I will okay, I'mgonna, I'm gonna count you as
having entered, uh, just basedon that little essay Narita, 10
of 10 would read.
Because I agree.

Speaker 2 (55:54):
There's a whole extra weight to the idea Of him being
the face of that quest and theweight that he had to carry,
represented as a physical weightOf carrying the ring itself
Right, absolutely.
And that's why I was saying Idon't think the fact that he
faltered at the end Negates thebravery or the sacrifice of

(56:14):
everything else he did leadingup to that.

Speaker 1 (56:17):
No, he did an incredible thing, without a
doubt.
Could he have done it withoutSam?
No, we proved that, but norcould Sam probably have done it
without him, and so they are so,intertwined, enmesed whatever
you want to call it, they'relinked.
That you have to give Frodo hisprops, and he was the one that

(56:39):
probably made me cry, along withSam, the most in the end, right
, and you saw how the journeyaffected him more deeply than
any of the others, as it wasobviously appropriate to do
because he was the one carryingthe ring most of the time.
So, anyways, yeah, love, loveme some frodo.

Speaker 2 (56:57):
Don't get me wrong, but I just, and I would say that
, having read it now, seeing howfar his progression was.
So, again, a nuance that wasn'tincluded in my or at least
least I didn't get from mywatching of the movies was there
was a scene in in fellowshipbefore when Bilbo left him the

(57:17):
ring, where he was saying he hadwished that Gollum had just
been killed, like somebody hadjust killed him.
And so for him to be comingfrom that place of no mercy no,
no empathy whatsoever to wherehe got to at the end is an
incredible arc yeah, agreed,agreed, oof.

Speaker 1 (57:40):
That's a literary degree dissertation topic right
there, I agree completelyactually I did a.
I took a media criticism classin college and, um, one of the
things I I decided to do or noone of our we the first movie
that the teacher showed us wasthe fellowship of the ring,

(58:00):
which was so interesting and welike wrote a whole essay like
critiquing the movie and ofcourse I was like no, no, it's
flawless not really, but stillit's interesting.
Like um, we also talked aboutin that class, like the hero's
journey and how the fellowshipand generally lord of the rings
is such a perfect execution ofit.

(58:20):
I guess um so, yeah, anyways,much love to these stories like
insane, insane love for sure.
Um, okay, so I am.
I think I have everybody thathas entered.
Yeah, dana loo, not all whowonder.
Brother zechariah, aldora andarena.
That's another five.
List of five.

(58:40):
Let me pull the rng here.
Okay, okay, so this is the list.
So you all see, boop ProofDon't copy my handwriting, so
we're going to generate thenumber.
Boop Two Not all who wander.
Okay, there we go.

(59:02):
Congratulations.
Not all who wander.

Speaker 2 (59:04):
Congratulations.

Speaker 1 (59:05):
But are there dragon sticker?
So I don't know that I'll beable to get it to jessica in
time for her to bring it to youto prague, so we may still have
to.
I may still have to ship it toyou, but we can work that out in
the dms.
Okay, I'm happy that you'rehere in the chat.
Um, oh yes, this is like, just,you know, plugging watcon, a

(59:31):
wheel of time convention madefor fans by fans.
You should go next year.
It's in July, okay.
So is there anything else, jess, that you want to cover before
we?
We talk about the finale?
You know the the sign offs,because that would be the end of
the stream.
I don't want to end itprematurely.

Speaker 2 (59:47):
I don't want to end it prematurely, no, I mean just
it was so much better than Ithought it could be.
It was a much richer experience.
It was just incredible, and itwas so much more than I even
thought it would be.
So that's all.

Speaker 1 (01:00:08):
Okay, so that's all.
Well, I'll just say that I'm sohappy on that fateful night at
Jordan Con or Wat Con, whereverwe were, jordan Con, where we
went to tapas and startedtalking about the fact that you
had never read them and I said,hey, if you read them, we'll do
a podcast.
And you said, bet, and that wasthe beginning of a beautiful

(01:00:31):
journey.
I'm so happy it happened thatway.
I think it's so funny.
That was the conception ofbutter their dragons and it's
been a fun ride and it feelslike it's like the end, but it
is a end and it's been great andI'm so happy.
I've reread them now andthey're right, right up there

(01:00:56):
with my favorite books.
They're just so close.
How would you say, like, whereare they for you?
Are they near the top?
Are they just great books thatyou wouldn't rank super?
You know, like, how do you feelabout?

Speaker 2 (01:01:07):
them.
I would say, I would say they.
I say, when you get into thetop five it gets really murky
for me and I'm certainly subjectto recency bias, like at all
times I feel yeah.

(01:01:27):
I definitely think they're oneof the top five series of my
life.
I can easily say that, yeah, Idefinitely think they're one of
the top five series of my life.
I can easily say that, yeah,and I think it was.
I think it was completely worthit.
I'm so glad that I did.
I don't know, I don't know ifit would Oust my number one of

(01:01:49):
all time.

Speaker 1 (01:01:51):
Yeah, it didn't.
Although I is asking wheel oftime or lord of the rings.
You can only read one everagain.
And that to me, honestly, iseasier than it should be,
because you're saying I canwatch lord of the rings, I'll
take, I'll read wheel of time,um, but no, uh, wheel of time's
got a super, super special placein my heart, so that one's my
number one, but I will say thatlord of the rings, for I can

(01:02:12):
confidently and safely say thatit is my number two and it is
not far behind Wheel of Time.

Speaker 2 (01:02:19):
Yeah, it's really close.
For me it's really close.

Speaker 1 (01:02:22):
Yeah, I think there's something to be said for me
about having relatable femalecharacters that are really,
really important.
You know, great, I'm notdiminishing galadriel or aowen
or arwen or any of them, butlike they weren't as
inextricably intertwined withthe plot or they weren't people

(01:02:43):
that you could necessarilyrelate to, like the women in the
wheel of time are, um, and Ialso just think that the wheel
of time has I'm trying toremember the quote on the back
that's like Jordan has masteredthe world that Tolkien began to
reveal, or something like that.
Basically, jordan's worldbuilding is just massive in

(01:03:05):
scale and it's just such apleasure to read it every single
.
I could re-ad those booksliterally every year, and I'm
sure I probably could alsoreread lord of the rings, but
there's just more that I relateto, I guess, in the little time
books that's.
That's the big difference yeah,I mean the.

Speaker 2 (01:03:22):
The stories themselves are a product of
their time, and so I think thoseare the only real limitations
to the story.
I think the idea of a mind likeTolkien existing with our
sensibilities today is a veryexciting one, because the story,
these stories are incredible,even given those limitations.

Speaker 1 (01:03:44):
Yeah, it's, he's who, he's a master, that's not an
exaggeration, yeah, anyway, soI'm I'm really glad that you did
this with me, by the way, it'sbeen a pleasure and and, yeah,
it's been amazing.
So the last thing that we do inevery episode, other than pick

(01:04:06):
an MVP, which we've already goneover Sam, sam for the win, sam
for the whim um, just, you know,statistically the best, uh, is
our sign off, and so I thinkwhat we do is we'll pick the
number one sign off for returnof the king and then I actually
don't know that.

(01:04:26):
I have the past winners with meright now.
So we can just pick the one forreturn of the King.
That'll be fine, and then maybedo a Twitter poll after the
fact.

Speaker 2 (01:04:37):
Sure, About when we can like check the best best one
.

Speaker 1 (01:04:41):
Yeah and so okay.
So let me see if I can showthis.
I want to like zoom in on itactually, so it's just focused.

Speaker 2 (01:04:49):
I kind of have it ready to go Share it, zoom in on
it actually, so it's justfocused.

Speaker 1 (01:04:51):
I kind of have it ready to go share it.
Can you share it, don't you I?

Speaker 2 (01:04:53):
understand everybody.
Bear with me window.

Speaker 1 (01:05:00):
I want to share this okay, I'm gonna show it boop.
There it is.
I'm going to show it Boop.

Speaker 2 (01:05:11):
There it is Okay.
Is that large enough for peopleto read?
I'm hoping so.

Speaker 1 (01:05:16):
If it's not, I can hide us completely, which should
make it a little larger.
I think I can hide uscompletely.

Speaker 2 (01:05:25):
Way to go, aldora, you're already on book 10.
Excellent Spread, the good word, and I hope you're enjoying it,
excellent Spread the good wordand I hope you're enjoying it.
Obviously, we joke about it sohard, but obviously the real
hope is that you enjoy it.
Oh good, you can read it Great.

Speaker 1 (01:05:45):
Perfect, okay, so we have eight.
Obviously, we had eightepisodes this season, which has
been pretty.
It's pretty average for us.
I think we've had like eight toten, depending on the book, and
I can't even remember which oneof us picked which one.
So this is good, it's going tobe fun.
It doesn't really matter, sowant to trade off reading them.

Speaker 2 (01:06:07):
Sure, I think I picked number one, so I'll read
number one.

Speaker 1 (01:06:10):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:06:12):
Okay, sure, I think I picked number one, so I'll read
number one okay, okay, so, andyou can just put in chat the
corresponding episode number,don't feel like you have to type
it out.
So for episode one, our signoff was farewell listeners.
Ride unto great renown for two.

Speaker 1 (01:06:29):
Once again, we thank you, listeners of the pod.
Good fortune go with you foryour support and friendship.

Speaker 2 (01:06:37):
Episode three.
You are weary, Rest a while andtake food and be ready when we
return.

Speaker 1 (01:06:45):
Episode four.
This is our tale and it hasended for now.
This is our tale and it hasended for now episode five.

Speaker 2 (01:06:53):
Well, here goes listeners.
We'll have to leave you for abit and trust to luck.
See you next week episode six.

Speaker 1 (01:07:02):
We're glad that you're here with us, dear
listeners, here at the end ofall things episode seven.

Speaker 2 (01:07:11):
Goodbye, dear friends .

Speaker 1 (01:07:13):
Not for the last time , not yet and episode eight and
the immortal words of gandalf goin peace.
I will not say do not weep, fornot all tears are an evil yeah,
same here.

Speaker 2 (01:07:28):
Aldora, like why?
Why do I want to cry?

Speaker 1 (01:07:31):
quit it I know the one for seven is so like
thematically appropriate becauseit was her second last episode.
Good, not for the last time,not yet yeah that was your pick.

Speaker 2 (01:07:43):
You picked seven.

Speaker 1 (01:07:44):
I stole it from the book.
I can't I can't pretend like Iwe stole them all from the book
true, true.
Thankfully, there werefarewells in almost every read,
which was perfect.

Speaker 2 (01:07:56):
Four sounds at the end of a.

Speaker 1 (01:07:57):
Shakespeare play.
What is it?
The Surtain has ended for now.
True, it kind of does.

Speaker 2 (01:08:05):
Narita voted for three Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:08:08):
Let me pull out the old notebook, the Watcon
notebook Number.
I'm going to just three, four,five, six, seven, eight.
All right, so we have three.

Speaker 2 (01:08:21):
Has one vote Dana Lou for eight Eight, brother
Zachariah for eight Eight.
Not all who wander is votingfor seven.
It's a good one.

Speaker 1 (01:08:35):
It's a good one it is , hmm, which one's my favorite?
Let me think.
Let me think.
I'm trying to think, like,because eventually we could pick
one of them as the actual signoff that we use on the podcast,
right, like permanently.
I don't know that that'll everhappen.
I kind of like picking adifferent one every time but.

Speaker 2 (01:08:55):
But I don't want it to be sad, so like I know I will
not say do not weep.

Speaker 1 (01:09:03):
And imagine if we're reading like like I've never
read a hitchhiker's guide to thegalaxy.
So imagine we're reading thatand really really yeah, yeah, um
.
So imagine we're reading that,which I understand is a
relatively goofy book, and likeat the end of a goofy chapter
we're like in the immortal wordsof gantalf.
I will not say do not weep.

(01:09:25):
Why would they weep?
Because it's you know, um,anyways, uh, we are still
sharing.

Speaker 2 (01:09:33):
I hope you know this oh, I forgot okay um, all right,
all right, all right, um yeah Iwanted to go over and look at
the other quotes, for because Ionly have one other season of
quotes in this spreadsheet,because I did not get myself
sorted- Aldora pick number six.

Speaker 1 (01:09:55):
I need to pick.

Speaker 2 (01:09:56):
Here at the end of all things gets me, and that's
hard.
Yeah, it's the same proto yeahbecause it resonates, but it
also it's sad.

Speaker 1 (01:10:20):
Here at the end of goodbye to friends, not for the
last time, not yet that one's sogood, because it's like it
leaves something you know,basically like saying, you know
until next week, tune in nextweek for the next episode of.
But are there dragons?
I don't know.
Do you have a vote?

Speaker 2 (01:10:38):
I do like that one because it is a little bit more
upbeat.

Speaker 1 (01:10:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:10:42):
I also kind of like number five for that.
It also happens to be Wait.
Who is that quote from?
Is that hold on?
Oh, I can't, I'm sharing myscreen.
Leave you for a bit and trustto luck.
I think that that was somethingthat Sam said to Frodo as he
walked away.

Speaker 1 (01:11:04):
That's fair, yeah, huh.

Speaker 2 (01:11:17):
Okay, I think my vote is seven.
Okay, what's your vote?
I think I.
I think seven is a better signoff, like it's a stronger sign
off.

Speaker 1 (01:11:24):
I just like five and for me, I love eight, but yeah,
I think, as far asoffs go it'sgot to be seven.
But what's yours?

Speaker 2 (01:11:37):
Yeah, no, seven, it's got to be seven.
That's really good, and then Ido want to go back and compare
to the ones that we've used forpast seasons and see if anything
else is a contender, becauseI'd be fine with that becoming
our permanent sign off.

Speaker 1 (01:11:54):
Oh, okay.
Do you want me to stop sharing,or you want to just flip over
to it while on the on the screen?

Speaker 2 (01:11:59):
I don't mind.
I think everybody in the chatshad a chance to read it.
So, yeah, yeah, what did wehave?
So, and this is two towers, Idon't have anything on this
document from fellowship,unfortunately.
Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:12:18):
So I can make it a little bigger.

Speaker 2 (01:12:26):
Try to remember which one of these won.
Oh, I made you choose aSmeagolgel impersonation.
It was fantastic.
Yeah, that was one thing Iwanted to get into the video.
That I didn't quite get enoughin was impressions oh yeah, that
would be well.

Speaker 1 (01:12:45):
We'll have our tiktok account.
We can.

Speaker 2 (01:12:47):
We can get a compilation at some point um, I
think, go with the goodwill ofall good men and women.
I think that that was you andyou had modified it um from the
read.
So whatever we were reading, soit was, you know, next to the

(01:13:08):
last episode in Two Towers.
Okay, I do like this one, Ilike three.

Speaker 1 (01:13:20):
I was just about to say if you can foresee whether
their road will lead them untilthey come to its end.
And this is our end until nextweek.
I really like that one.
That one's a good one.

Speaker 2 (01:13:29):
Yep, that's a really good one too, does it beat?

Speaker 1 (01:13:34):
season four.
Does it beat Return of the King?
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:13:38):
That's a longer one.
Let's do a little.

Speaker 1 (01:13:46):
Not for the last time , not yet.
It's just.
It's short and sweet.

Speaker 2 (01:13:54):
Yes, and that is actually a good thing, with
sign-offs.

Speaker 1 (01:14:00):
Right, Right, right right.
What do you guys think?
Do you like the Two Towers oneor the Return one better?

Speaker 2 (01:14:07):
Yeah, dana Lou likes number seven.

Speaker 1 (01:14:09):
I remember last stream she liked shorter ones,
so that makes sense.

Speaker 2 (01:14:14):
Yep, this is.
This is very flowery and andfun, but it's a little, it's a
mouthful.

Speaker 1 (01:14:22):
Yeah, yeah.
I feel like the return to theKing ones are all like.
There's so many bangers on thislist it would be hard to beat
many of them.
There's so many bangers on thislist, it would be hard to beat
many of them.

Speaker 2 (01:14:31):
I'd have to go back and see if I made a document.
I don't know if I actually putthe quotes on a document I must
have, but anyways yeah, yeah,where that ended up.

Speaker 1 (01:14:46):
It's been a while, yes.

Speaker 2 (01:14:52):
It has been a while.
Yeah, zachariah votes fornumber seven as well.

Speaker 1 (01:14:55):
it's a really strong sign off, it is feeling, feeling
real good about that this timearound.
Wow, okay, okay, is that it Ithink that's it okay, well, I
don't have our normal sign offin front of me, do you?

Speaker 2 (01:15:09):
or we can just say use, use the, uh, the one that
won up to you um, I think,before we go into our sign off,
I would just like we usually doyou know, thank you guys so much
for your participation whetherit's at the same time, not at
the same time, in discord,through comments, live streams,

(01:15:31):
whether you're a first timer, amillion timer, it doesn't matter
.
The engagement is awesome.
We it literally made all thedifference to have all of you
along, and I will get just alittle mushy and say, you know,
thank you, critter, it was somuch fun to do this project with
you and I know it's just abreak, but thank you for being

(01:15:52):
an awesome pod partner back atyou.

Speaker 1 (01:15:56):
It's been.
It's as I said earlier, it has.
It has been a pleasure and Iappreciate your dedication to it
and, uh, and I love that we'rekind of on the same page when it
comes to like scheduling and Ilike to think we're both very
reliable, which is such a relief.
So it's it's been, it's beenreally fun and and, honestly, as

(01:16:17):
far as like content creationgoes, you know cause I do like
so much stuff, this is, this isone of the things that I think
of as like one of my cozyactivities, cause it's just so
much, yeah, so much.
Oh, I love that.
Yeah, it's like tolkien's gotsuch good vibes.
We have such good vibes.

Speaker 2 (01:16:34):
It's just like low key, low stress, been really
great and especially becausewe've got these people following
along with us that have becomeour lord of the rings friends
and I will tell you that we havetalked about it and if
silmarillion happens, it willonly happen with the two of us.
So, yeah, no, reliability ishot dana lou a hundred.
Yeah, we've talked about it.

(01:16:57):
We both really want to do thesilmarillion, so the hope is
that we are going to do that, um, but we're not.
We don't know what that lookslike yet, but we will keep you
all posted.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
So when we know, you will know yeah, yeah, be keeping
an eye on discord or socials orwhatever.
Just know that I I won't beback for several months, so
silver alien will not behappening for quite some time
several months yeah, so don'tbuy it or anything if you don't
own it yet, in the anticipationthat it's going to happen soon,
because I will be learning howto be a parent for the next

(01:17:30):
while, um, but we will takesuggestions.
You know, crit, a parent forthe next while, but we will take
suggestions.

Speaker 2 (01:17:33):
You know Critter's Discord is the easiest place to
drop it I think most of you thatare here do that but you can
also DM us, reach out to us onsocial media if you have an idea
.
If you have an idea for an IPthat you'd like to see me do
with somebody else while Critteris on hiatus, as long as it's
not the Silmarillion, I'll atleast consider it.
Okay.

(01:17:54):
Okay, all right, I made youstart, so I'll stop.
So just big thank you, big loveyou guys, and don't be
strangers on social media, ondiscord, you know.
Reach out, stay in touch, and Iwill just say goodbye, dear

(01:18:17):
friends, not for the last time,not yet.

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