September 10, 2021 • 31 mins
TN Voices COO Will Voss talks with Jasmine Taylor-McHaney about how lived experience prepares many of those who work in the mental health field to help their clients and their families. They explore the contributions that fresh, new perspectives offer in the scope of everything TN Voices does.
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Rikki Harris (00:05):
and it is a podcast of Tennessee voices
about mental health, featuringstories of people who have
overcome mental healthchallenges, as well as those who
have helped people overcomemental health challenges. This
podcast is about authenticity.
And it's intended to give avoice to those who are
passionate about mental wellbeing. We hope that by sharing
(00:25):
stories, listeners understandmental health and just how
important it is in our day today lives, and they will help us
reduce stigma. We want you toknow that so many who have
struggled with mental health canand did overcome their
challenges. And if you arestruggling, you can too. I'm
your host, Ricky Harris, CEO,Tennessee voices. And with me as
(00:49):
my favorite co host, WilburRoss, CEO of Tennessee voices.
Welcome to our podcast. Let'sget candid.
Unknown (01:04):
It is. So thank you.
Thank you so much for joining metoday. For our can did podcast
segment. Jasmine is currently atherapist here in our outpatient
therapy program, providingsupport to all ages, individuals
who are seeking therapy there inthe moment. So Jasmine, tell me
a little bit about yourbackground, kind of what brought
(01:26):
you into the field?
Yeah, so I started with myundergraduate in 2015, at MTSU,
in social work, and then Istarted my internship in 2018 at
Tennessee voices. So that was myfirst time being in the field.
(01:48):
I've always wanted to helppeople. So that's always my
passion. And I started out withprogram development, not working
one on one. So it's a big changefor me to be here now, as a
therapist, graduated with mymaster's in 2020. So last year,
fresh out and working withindividuals has been great. It's
(02:11):
been very exciting and somethingnew every day. So I've loved
that. And just getting to helppeople. One thing we always talk
about is what your why's andhelping people figure out what
there was so fun to me. It makesme feel like I have purpose. So
that's kind of why I'm here.
Awesome. It is great to hear.
Yes, you started with us back in2018. Time is flying. So talk to
(02:32):
me a little bit about what itwas like coming in as an intern
in 2018. To becoming staff andleaving returning now you're
back with us what has it beenlike working for Tennessee
voices or being connected withNZ voices over the past three
years?
(02:54):
It's been so exciting. I thinkthe first time I came here, like
my first week here, I was sonervous, like what to expect
program professional developmentversus personal development, can
I be myself in the workplacethose things. And it was a
journey, let's just say that,um, to get in to be comfortable.
(03:15):
And knowing that I'm in a placewhere I'm accepted is huge for
me. And I've always felt thatTennessee voices. The youth
voice is something that we'vealways pushed and just like
being able to be heard no matterwhat your ages or what your
category you fall into is. Andso inclusion has been huge for
me here, just feeling like I'm apart of a whole or a system
(03:38):
that's doing something positivehas been great. And then like
the transition from being anintern to being an employee,
even better, right like gettingto know that I have a voice and
kind of kind of developed medeveloping my own personality
and in this has been great. AndI definitely for four months.
(03:59):
And it was one of thoseexperiences like you have to go
out there. Sometimes they kindof see what what you need or
what you don't have or what youalready have. And I learned very
quickly, I had all the things Ineeded all the tools I needed
and that I was where I wassupposed to be. And sometimes
money is not is not the reasonto like go out there and try to
better yourself. So I came backand I plan to stay. And it's
(04:23):
just been one of those thingswhere like I said, my voice
being heard is one thing buttaking a step further and asked
him well what can we do with thethings that you need? Once you
tell someone what you need, youhave to be positive in that and
confident in that. And that'sone thing that you have taught
me like confidence is key whenyou ask for something know what
you're asking for. And what doesthat look like for you? So I
(04:45):
think that I thinkprofessionally, my voice has
been developed here in the mostpositive way that it could be.
You mentioned voice a lot inwhat you just said. So how as an
agency, I guess how has thatbeen? And the opportunity been
awarded to you. Sohere we have our tagline
firsthand experiences, right.
(05:08):
And I think that, at firstcoming in, it was very
uncomfortable for me to talkabout my own experiences. Like,
that's separate, you know, I'm aprofessional here. And I quickly
learned that those things emergeso fast, and that to kind of get
to get across to your clients orto reach them, sometimes you
have to take off that therapistshat and say, Hey, I'm a human.
(05:30):
And this experience that we'rehaving here is a human
experience. And yes, I am herein a position of power to help
you but that power really meansnothing because you're in
charge, and we have to meet youwhere you're at. And so using my
voice to empower others throughknowing that I've had
experiences similar to them. Andknowing that just because I'm a
(05:51):
therapist, doesn't mean I'm thatmuch removed from what mental
health looks like, and how itcan affect you as a person. So
just kind of, I think Ricky sentout a motivation to this morning
talking about humility. And Ithink about that a lot in my own
life, like, the word grace isbig for me, like, what do you
extend to others when you need,you know, when they need it
most? And then vice versa? Whereare you giving out, you know,
(06:14):
for those people who needthings. So just being me through
and through something that Ihave done with my voice, and I
think that's been accepted hereand also appreciated?
That is good to hear. alwaysrewarding. And, you know, we
talk a lot as an agency, we areTennessee voices, right? People
think we're out in thecommunity. I know, in the past,
(06:35):
they thought we were a singinggroup. No, we use our voices in
different ways we advocate howis it that? Or I guess, to
reframe the question, how wouldyou encourage someone to be able
to use their voice? I mean, youtalked a lot about, you know, we
mentioned youth voice and comingin as an intern. And three years
(06:56):
later, you're still using yourvoice in a therapeutic setting?
How would you encourage someoneelse to use their voice?
So I think something that Davidand I talk about a lot, which is
my clinical supervisor, to seevoices clinical supervisor, he
often pairs voice with choice.
So what does that look like? Youknow, giving someone the power
to use our voice is one thing,but I think that, like real
(07:19):
advocacy is telling them theways to use it. Right? So you
already had the tool to beginwith, you've always had your
voice, but often presented asfrom zero to 18, we're told what
we can do basically, right,like, we have these rules that
we have to follow, we have finelines, some of those are in our
control, and some of themaren't. Right. So what can we do
(07:40):
with that after that 18 age, westart getting a little bit more
choice. But you know, from thattime that zero to 18, it's very,
this or that, right? So kind oflearning what it looks like when
you don't have it this or thatoption, when you have to create
your own this or that. Andrealizing what power that like
that gives you a gives a personit's empowering. And it's also
(08:02):
kind of scary, right? Whenyou're the person in power. It's
like, oh, no, what's happened?
What can I do with that? So, youknow, just giving them tools to
say, Hey, you are capable. Youmight have had your voice, you
know, muted before, but it'sokay. Like, we can work past
that. And just giving peopleconfidence. Again, I think I
(08:23):
struggle with that sometimesjust fear is a big emotion. For
me, it drives me often I haveanxiety, I talk about it all the
time. And so, you know, givingthat power in my life, what does
that look like? Do I want it tobe louder than my own voice? No,
of course not. So just you know,reminding people that there are
things that are going to kind ofbe obstacles, but you still can
(08:44):
use your voice and how does thatlook for you?
That's good. And you talk a lotabout you go from your
professional standpoint toletting people know, yeah,
you're still human, you're atherapist, and you're still
human. These are things that Istruggle with, which is awesome
thing that continues to showyour humility. You mentioned
just a minute ago, that fear issomething you know, sometimes it
(09:07):
creeps up on you, and youcontinue to still move forward
and push forward. There are alot of people that we're hoping
to reach in these podcasts andare going to be experiencing a
lot of not only what Rick and Iare talking about, but what
every guest that comes on thisshow and mentions as well. So
there's someone out there that'slistening right now and that
fear is something that they canrelate to. How would you
(09:30):
encourage you know whatsomething that you yourself used
to continue to push forward attimes? What would you tell
someone else's list Ialways tell my clients fear is a
chameleon emotion. So we look atchameleons and they they respond
to the stimulus is in theirenvironment. So if they're
scared, which typically whathappens whenever they change
(09:52):
emotion, they match theirenvironment so you can't see
them anymore, right? So I'lltalk about that a lot like how
Fear driving you and your life?
And how does that look like?
When do you change colors? Whendo you act like something you're
not right. And so with that, Ialways let them know the only
time that we should talk aboutwhat ifs is, if we're going to
(10:13):
be a scientist. Sometimes theylike that sometimes they don't.
But 5050 is something that candrive your life, right? Like,
well, it could go this way, orit could go that way. So always
say, you know, put, put yourhope in the good things, and do
work around that. Put your hopein the good things that can
happen and hope that that doescome through and come to
(10:34):
fruition. I'll give you thetools, I'll give you the
support, I'll be someone you cancount on our model that for you.
And we'll work through thattogether. So I always tell
people, you're not alone. Fearis something that is going to
always be present. And we haveto figure out what what ways can
we come? What can we comeovercome those fears that we do
(10:55):
have? Soit's good, and it's good. You
probably just helped a lot ofpeople moving forward. Yeah, I'm
being serious about beingserious. Even here three years,
and you have seen a lot ofchange, change and staff, change
in leadership in differentlevels. And you also were here
(11:19):
during pandemic, while we weretrying to figure out what does
this look like? How do we stillprovide services. And you also
were here, as we talked aboutracial inequality, things going
on in the world, you decided tojoin the cultural diversity,
(11:40):
diversity and inclusioncommittee. You brought a very,
very, very great perspective.
You also were part of thatplanning committee to really get
there, where we we sat and weopenly talked about how we were
feeling about what was going on.
After the aftermath of GeorgeFloyd's killing. You wrote code.
(12:03):
You wrote letters, things thathelped you cope. And then you
also take the time to talk withother staff members and being
able to educate them. Talk to meabout how that experience was
for you. Because you weren'tdoing therapy at that?
(12:26):
Was my idea is always my own.
Maybe? What? No, that time washard for everyone, which was
beautiful that we were able tobe together on, I think, I think
our agency did something that alot of people were scared to do,
which was talking about it thefirst step, right. And that was
it. That was huge for me,because coming from the place
(12:49):
that we come from. And yeah, sobeing the one that's not the one
in the room, basically, whatthat means to me is being
different. Being an outlier,being someone who you can
visibly say, Hey, you look likeeveryone else, or you're not,
(13:10):
you're not coming with the samethings that other people are
coming with, right? So we lookat marginalized people. And I
feel like a lot of times in mylife, I've fallen in that
category, for different reasons,being a woman, being a person of
color, different things likethat. And so for me, I was like,
wow, look at look at thisopportunity for us to kind of
(13:31):
come together as a whole, andpeople to hear us, right, like,
really hear how we feel. And soI loved I love the opportunity,
I think the biggest thing I gotfrom that whole experience. And
I think that our agency reallydid some good healing in that
time, was that the first step isbeing courageous enough just to
(13:53):
say, Hey, this is what's goingon. And like we have got to talk
about it right. Having thosehard conversations is something
that's so important. And maybewe don't see change for five
years after the combo, right?
Maybe it's 10 years later, Idon't know. But I know that it
feels good in that moment toknow that other people care. And
to kind of just come together onthat. And so the CDF CDI has
(14:17):
been amazing. I think thateveryone in it and involved
around it have been open andhonest. And I think that's
another beautiful concept thatwe haven't always gotten. And
then the conversations outside,you know, I've taken it to other
meetings like, Hey, I didn't seeyou there. And I just want you
(14:38):
to know, this is what we'redoing. Right? And that even
having that received well hasbeen a great a great feeling.
You know, I'm sitting here rightnow with Black Lives Matter
earrings. I mean, it's like noone cares about that. You know,
like it's important that we cansay and express ourselves the
way that we feel and be acceptedand then in return You know, be
(15:00):
positively reinforced by that wetalk about that a lot. And so I
think that, you know, it wasgood, it was good for everyone.
It was good for the agency, andwe have to keep doing that work.
We have to never give up on it.
Because I think it's soimportant.
Which led me into my nextquestion, you kind of just
(15:21):
answered a little bit. Why didyou join the committee? They you
said it was something that a lotof other agencies didn't do
something that we had not donehere, as an agency, what made
you join it?
I think it's one of those thingsthat like, sometimes you know,
what you have to offer like,before you come to a table or a
(15:43):
position, and then sometimes youhave no idea like, maybe I'm
just there just to say I'm thereto be a part of the collective?
I don't know. I think I feltlike I had no choice. Right.
Like, it's one of those thingsthat I did without thinking kind
of like breathing like, Oh, I'mgonna do that for sure. Because
it's a part of my passion. Andit's something that isn't
(16:03):
personal, that doesn't justpersonally affect me, but
professionally, you know, it'ssomething that has followed me
for my life and will continue tofollow me. And I think that this
was not only like healing, likeI said, but also good practice,
because there's gonna be anothersituation where we have to speak
up and have that difficult,difficult conversation. I think
(16:24):
one time in a meeting, you toldme it was like, not what you
say. It's not what you say, it'show you say it. And ever since
then I'm like, Okay, I haveimportant things to say. And I'm
always gonna say them. That'sone thing about me, no matter
what it is, so just finding theway to say, Hey, I got this
going on, or hey, like, I wantedto talk to you about this, like,
those things are so important.
And I think the CDI, si si Cid,is that right? Yep. Yeah. CDL
(16:49):
use me abbreviations. Um, yeah,I think that that's another
thing that gives us the abilityto do like, you know, teaching
us that there are hard topics,were even going to have those
conversations with our clients.
So if you can't do that withyourself and your own time and
your own comfort zone, youcannot do that with another
person. So yeah, I think it doesa lot for everyone. And it also
(17:13):
just gives a safe space to kindof say, hey, this happened, and
I need someone to hear me.
I'll tell you a difficultconversation. You talked about
vulnerability, having those hardconversations. I remember you as
a new therapist, you came intomy office one day, and you say,
Well, I got a question for you.
And before I can send you away,I said, what? You asked me, what
(17:36):
should you do to a certainsituation? Do you recall where
I'm heading with this? Ofcourse, referral that was a
outpatient therapy referral.
They requested an AfricanAmerican female therapist. And
(17:59):
you like, I mean, what if? Whatif you have a different
background story? That reallyhit home to me? Because we're
both black? We're both AfricanAmericans, from my viewpoint,
from walking in my shoes. Yeah,your background is different
from mine. And there aredifferent struggles that you
(18:22):
face being a black female that Idon't face as a black male. And
then you come from aninterracial background
Erika Lathon (18:33):
Jimena scenario.
Unknown (18:35):
Looking back on where you were in that moment. How do
you encourage other individualswho have backgrounds that is
similar to yours? How do theycope with what's going on? What
do they? How do they deal withit? Yeah,
so I think something we oftentalk about is skin color. I've
(18:57):
often made comments like, youknow, what, my skin is not
outwardly black. So that does tome a different category, I am
mixed, which is a fact of life,biracial, whatever you want to
call it. And, you know, I've hadthis conversation 1000 times my
grandma. And she'd always say,Well, what do you identify?
That's all that matters. And,you know, that looks different
(19:19):
for everyone. And everyone getsthe right identify with what
they want to and I think that'ssomething I personally believe.
And so I guess that's where Ioriginally was coming from with
the question I say, in thatscenario, if anyone else is
faced with that, but you got ahunch that self doubt, because
at the bottom of that selfdoubt, was a person once again,
(19:41):
back to humility. And, you know,you reminded me like your
therapist, just do your job.
Right. So I think that in thisworld, we have all these hats,
what I call them, they're alsoidentities, whatever you want to
call it boxes to check offwhatever. And you know, I think
that they weigh on us sometimes.
You know, I've Like I said, I'ma woman, I'm a woman of color. I
(20:02):
am a biracial woman. So yeah, Ihave been right in the middle of
all of that my whole life. Andnavigating that has never been
just a simple black and whiteanswer, which is now no pun
intended there. So, when lookingat that, you know, I think self
doubt is easy to feel it's, youactually gave me a book recently
(20:23):
Brene Brown book, talking aboutyour your best thing, and I have
literally not put it down sinceyou gave it to me
to return, but you know what?
I'm working on it. So it willreturn quickly. Um, and one of
the things that they talk aboutis black guilt. And what does
that look like? Right? Like,everyone's is different. And it
(20:44):
comes in all shapes and sizes,and it's very careful, right,
you carry it anywhere you go.
And so, you know, there's essaysin there that talk about that.
And each version of like, guiltis different. So different, but
it's, it's definitely somethingthat he can relate to on each
scenario. So, you know, thatadvice that I have for that is
(21:08):
just hush yourself down andremember who you are. Remember
your ancestors, remember whatyou came from what you what was
built around you, which wasliterally this country. So I
think you know, those things,empower me and remind me that I
am where I'm supposed to be. Ialways tell myself, I have this
quote in my mirror in mybathroom, don't question the
(21:29):
table, you set out. Someone setyou there, right? And a lot of
times, you know, maybe it's youreally brought me in here into
this agency gave me a choice thefirst time or maybe, you know, I
worked for I don't know whichone it is, but either one. I've
been here and I've been awardedthe spot. So I can't question
that. So that's my advice.
(21:51):
You know, I'm gonna challengethat. He said, I gave you a
spot. How hard did you work asan intern, or you worked hard
for it, and you earn it spot,you're in this spot. You know,
there are a lot of interns thatcome through, and they work
hard. And unfortunately, we'renot able to find a placement at
(22:12):
that time. Then there aremoments where things align
together, and they work out theway as they should. You worked
hard for it as an intern, youyou understand the importance of
networking, and showing peoplewho you truly are, and really
learning to understand your why.
And just talk about it. Butunderstand your why. So you're
(22:33):
in your seat at the table.
You're great at it.
Thank you. Thankyou. Yes, yes. So we talk a lot
about self care. We've talkedabout you know why you got into
the field and youth boys findingyour voice having your own lived
experience, cultural competencebeing black in America? What are
(22:57):
some self care tips that you cangive listeners out there that
you have found helpful indealing with any of those
categories?
Yeah, so self care is somethingyou taught me. So kudos. Before
that I did not know what selfcare was just flat out to be
(23:18):
honest. And I think that selfcare is once again a journey,
one of those lifelong journeysthat we should never quit, and
always seek. And for me, adviceon self care is, whatever you
can do to de glamorize it dothat. Self care needs to be
accessible. I mean, literally,at the snap of a finger, it
(23:40):
needs to be something thatalways makes you feel good, not
a 50% time and then the othertime it doesn't, right. It needs
to be something that you can doat any moment, anyplace and
anytime. You know, I often tellmy people that you've got to
find free self care first, andthen build on that build on the
things that you can't afford todo and the things that look good
(24:02):
to you, but self care at thebasis. Literally what makes you
feel good. If that's walkingoutside for five minutes in
between your break, you do thatright? And then making a plan
for is the other thing I neverthought about, like why would I
plan on self care, right? Thatwas another thing you taught me,
I'm like, why don't need towrite this down. But we all know
that if we see things, we'remore apt to do them. So writing
(24:24):
it down is really important. Andit's kind of like setting a goal
for yourself. If you don't havethe intention to accomplish that
go, you won't do it. So I thinkit's really huge. Everyone
should have a self care plan. Itshould be reevaluated every 30
days type thing. And it shouldit should be specific to things
that work for you and thingsthat don't. You should have
(24:45):
options, plenty of options.
Learned that along the way aswell. Options are good. Options
are good. You heard me tell thestory. I got that guitar during
the pandemic. And that was goingto be a part of my self care
plan. But I can't read music. Soit became more of a stressor. So
I had to change that up. Listento people playing guitars.
(25:08):
That's my ministry right there.
Yes. Listening to music playing.
It's good. Good. So as we as wewrap up being a thermistor
headed on the licensor licensuretrack. Very exciting, very
exciting. What is your hope forthose who are scared to enter
(25:35):
into their into enter intotherapy of their own? What's
your hope for those who may noteven see the importance of
going?
Well, I always want to validatethat there's a lot of reasons to
fear therapist to fear systemhelp, basically, bottom line,
(25:57):
there is generational trauma,then there is just real life
fears, you know, like, what ifthey don't help me? Or what if
they're not what I need in thismoment? I went to some
conference, I believe it wassocat. And I cannot remember the
speaker's name for the life ofme, so forgive me. But they said
something that's always stuckwith me. And they said that
therapy is like dating. And atfirst I was like, What? No way.
(26:22):
But then I thought about it. AndI was like, yes, absolutely.
Like you have to date around,you have to be open to dating,
right? First, that's the firststep. And then you have to be
open for it to be bad. Okay, andthat you can find someone good.
Okay. So I think that'simportant to know that your
first experience may not gowell. And your first therapist
may be terrible. And that'sokay, too. So keeping that in
(26:47):
your mind, I mean, open to it.
And then the other part is, I dowhat's called parallels for my
people, because sometimes withmental health being a new thing,
right, because something that'strending right now, it's hard to
understand, we talked aboutfear, we fear things we don't
understand. So I do parallelsall the time, physical health,
you got to your physical healthdoctor, right, you have to
(27:08):
maintain your physical body, youhave a whole body here. Well,
your mind is inside of yourbody. And it's very important
that we maintain our mentalhealth, which is our brain. And
so you know, just letting themknow that just like you have a
body to maintain you have amind, that does not mean that
you have a mental healthdisorder that's gonna label you
(27:28):
for life. It just means that youhave some things to take care
of, you got a little tune up youneed here and there, you know,
you got to relax, everyone. Sohow do you start recharge those
things? And just normalizing asmuch as we can. People always
are worried, oh, if we talkabout mental health, everyone's
gonna know if we don't talkabout it. No one's going to get
help. And that's the biggestthing for me talk, talk, talk,
(27:51):
talk, talk, even when you'reuncomfortable talk a little bit
more. Until someone says, oh, Inever thought about it like
that, or oh, that's the firsttime I'm hearing and then you
know, you've done you've done agood job. So I think Monique
says this a lot. One of ourstaff she wants her job is to
work herself out of a job. AndI'm adopting that mindset, I
(28:11):
would love to wake up one dayand no one need me, I think that
it would be a little frighteningas a helper to feel that I will
might be a little panicked. Butat the same time, I feel like it
would feel like I'veaccomplished a lot and that I
would feel good to know that myclients are empowered and doing
things on their own. So go outthere, try things out and get
some help. It's okay.
(28:37):
I love you, I hope youunderstand the impact that you
are making. This podcast ismeant for people to realize that
you know what? You can do it andlook back and say, Yeah, I did
it. I did it. So I appreciateyou for being a part of another
(28:57):
great impact that we're tryingto make as people as an agency.
And thank you for everythingthat you're doing. So we really
appreciate it. Reallyappreciate. Final words you want
to leave for anybody listening,ready to wrap up at the next
session? I am.
Erika Lathon (29:18):
Thank you, Dan voices is now hiring qualified
applicants to build positionsall across the state. You can be
part of a growing team that putsthe mental health of Tennesseans
first and thrive in acompassionate work environment
to apply to join our team log onto tn voices.org/employment.
(29:50):
September is Suicide PreventionMonth, and there are things each
of us can do to help preventsuicide every year at this time
lifeline and other mental healthorganizations and individuals
across the US and around theworld, raise awareness of
suicide prevention. If you arehaving suicidal thoughts, call
(30:11):
1-800-273-8255 and head to teaand voices.org for mental health
resources, including our newlyrenovated online library. You
can be the one to preventsuicide this month and all your
law by gaining the tools andknowledge you need to foster
(30:33):
better mental health foryourself and those around you.
Thank you for joining us. If youenjoy today's program, like
subscribe and review thispodcast if you or someone you
(30:56):
know is in need of mental healthsupport services, log on to tn
voices.org or call one 806 70988to join us next time as we get
candid
and it is a podcast of Tennessee voices
about mental health, featuringstories of people who have
overcome mental healthchallenges, as well as those who
have helped people overcomemental health challenges. This
podcast is about authenticity.
And it's intended to give avoice to those who are
passionate about mental wellbeing. We hope that by sharing
(00:25):
stories, listeners understandmental health and just how
important it is in our day today lives, and they will help us
reduce stigma. We want you toknow that so many who have
struggled with mental health canand did overcome their
challenges. And if you arestruggling, you can too. I'm
your host, Ricky Harris, CEO,Tennessee voices. And with me as
(00:49):
my favorite co host, WilburRoss, CEO of Tennessee voices.
Welcome to our podcast. Let'sget candid.
Unknown (01:04):
It is. So thank you.
Thank you so much for joining metoday. For our can did podcast
segment. Jasmine is currently atherapist here in our outpatient
therapy program, providingsupport to all ages, individuals
who are seeking therapy there inthe moment. So Jasmine, tell me
a little bit about yourbackground, kind of what brought
(01:26):
you into the field?
Yeah, so I started with myundergraduate in 2015, at MTSU,
in social work, and then Istarted my internship in 2018 at
Tennessee voices. So that was myfirst time being in the field.
(01:48):
I've always wanted to helppeople. So that's always my
passion. And I started out withprogram development, not working
one on one. So it's a big changefor me to be here now, as a
therapist, graduated with mymaster's in 2020. So last year,
fresh out and working withindividuals has been great. It's
(02:11):
been very exciting and somethingnew every day. So I've loved
that. And just getting to helppeople. One thing we always talk
about is what your why's andhelping people figure out what
there was so fun to me. It makesme feel like I have purpose. So
that's kind of why I'm here.
Awesome. It is great to hear.
Yes, you started with us back in2018. Time is flying. So talk to
(02:32):
me a little bit about what itwas like coming in as an intern
in 2018. To becoming staff andleaving returning now you're
back with us what has it beenlike working for Tennessee
voices or being connected withNZ voices over the past three
years?
(02:54):
It's been so exciting. I thinkthe first time I came here, like
my first week here, I was sonervous, like what to expect
program professional developmentversus personal development, can
I be myself in the workplacethose things. And it was a
journey, let's just say that,um, to get in to be comfortable.
(03:15):
And knowing that I'm in a placewhere I'm accepted is huge for
me. And I've always felt thatTennessee voices. The youth
voice is something that we'vealways pushed and just like
being able to be heard no matterwhat your ages or what your
category you fall into is. Andso inclusion has been huge for
me here, just feeling like I'm apart of a whole or a system
(03:38):
that's doing something positivehas been great. And then like
the transition from being anintern to being an employee,
even better, right like gettingto know that I have a voice and
kind of kind of developed medeveloping my own personality
and in this has been great. AndI definitely for four months.
(03:59):
And it was one of thoseexperiences like you have to go
out there. Sometimes they kindof see what what you need or
what you don't have or what youalready have. And I learned very
quickly, I had all the things Ineeded all the tools I needed
and that I was where I wassupposed to be. And sometimes
money is not is not the reasonto like go out there and try to
better yourself. So I came backand I plan to stay. And it's
(04:23):
just been one of those thingswhere like I said, my voice
being heard is one thing buttaking a step further and asked
him well what can we do with thethings that you need? Once you
tell someone what you need, youhave to be positive in that and
confident in that. And that'sone thing that you have taught
me like confidence is key whenyou ask for something know what
you're asking for. And what doesthat look like for you? So I
(04:45):
think that I thinkprofessionally, my voice has
been developed here in the mostpositive way that it could be.
You mentioned voice a lot inwhat you just said. So how as an
agency, I guess how has thatbeen? And the opportunity been
awarded to you. Sohere we have our tagline
firsthand experiences, right.
(05:08):
And I think that, at firstcoming in, it was very
uncomfortable for me to talkabout my own experiences. Like,
that's separate, you know, I'm aprofessional here. And I quickly
learned that those things emergeso fast, and that to kind of get
to get across to your clients orto reach them, sometimes you
have to take off that therapistshat and say, Hey, I'm a human.
(05:30):
And this experience that we'rehaving here is a human
experience. And yes, I am herein a position of power to help
you but that power really meansnothing because you're in
charge, and we have to meet youwhere you're at. And so using my
voice to empower others throughknowing that I've had
experiences similar to them. Andknowing that just because I'm a
(05:51):
therapist, doesn't mean I'm thatmuch removed from what mental
health looks like, and how itcan affect you as a person. So
just kind of, I think Ricky sentout a motivation to this morning
talking about humility. And Ithink about that a lot in my own
life, like, the word grace isbig for me, like, what do you
extend to others when you need,you know, when they need it
most? And then vice versa? Whereare you giving out, you know,
(06:14):
for those people who needthings. So just being me through
and through something that Ihave done with my voice, and I
think that's been accepted hereand also appreciated?
That is good to hear. alwaysrewarding. And, you know, we
talk a lot as an agency, we areTennessee voices, right? People
think we're out in thecommunity. I know, in the past,
(06:35):
they thought we were a singinggroup. No, we use our voices in
different ways we advocate howis it that? Or I guess, to
reframe the question, how wouldyou encourage someone to be able
to use their voice? I mean, youtalked a lot about, you know, we
mentioned youth voice and comingin as an intern. And three years
(06:56):
later, you're still using yourvoice in a therapeutic setting?
How would you encourage someoneelse to use their voice?
So I think something that Davidand I talk about a lot, which is
my clinical supervisor, to seevoices clinical supervisor, he
often pairs voice with choice.
So what does that look like? Youknow, giving someone the power
to use our voice is one thing,but I think that, like real
(07:19):
advocacy is telling them theways to use it. Right? So you
already had the tool to beginwith, you've always had your
voice, but often presented asfrom zero to 18, we're told what
we can do basically, right,like, we have these rules that
we have to follow, we have finelines, some of those are in our
control, and some of themaren't. Right. So what can we do
(07:40):
with that after that 18 age, westart getting a little bit more
choice. But you know, from thattime that zero to 18, it's very,
this or that, right? So kind oflearning what it looks like when
you don't have it this or thatoption, when you have to create
your own this or that. Andrealizing what power that like
that gives you a gives a personit's empowering. And it's also
(08:02):
kind of scary, right? Whenyou're the person in power. It's
like, oh, no, what's happened?
What can I do with that? So, youknow, just giving them tools to
say, Hey, you are capable. Youmight have had your voice, you
know, muted before, but it'sokay. Like, we can work past
that. And just giving peopleconfidence. Again, I think I
(08:23):
struggle with that sometimesjust fear is a big emotion. For
me, it drives me often I haveanxiety, I talk about it all the
time. And so, you know, givingthat power in my life, what does
that look like? Do I want it tobe louder than my own voice? No,
of course not. So just you know,reminding people that there are
things that are going to kind ofbe obstacles, but you still can
(08:44):
use your voice and how does thatlook for you?
That's good. And you talk a lotabout you go from your
professional standpoint toletting people know, yeah,
you're still human, you're atherapist, and you're still
human. These are things that Istruggle with, which is awesome
thing that continues to showyour humility. You mentioned
just a minute ago, that fear issomething you know, sometimes it
(09:07):
creeps up on you, and youcontinue to still move forward
and push forward. There are alot of people that we're hoping
to reach in these podcasts andare going to be experiencing a
lot of not only what Rick and Iare talking about, but what
every guest that comes on thisshow and mentions as well. So
there's someone out there that'slistening right now and that
fear is something that they canrelate to. How would you
(09:30):
encourage you know whatsomething that you yourself used
to continue to push forward attimes? What would you tell
someone else's list Ialways tell my clients fear is a
chameleon emotion. So we look atchameleons and they they respond
to the stimulus is in theirenvironment. So if they're
scared, which typically whathappens whenever they change
(09:52):
emotion, they match theirenvironment so you can't see
them anymore, right? So I'lltalk about that a lot like how
Fear driving you and your life?
And how does that look like?
When do you change colors? Whendo you act like something you're
not right. And so with that, Ialways let them know the only
time that we should talk aboutwhat ifs is, if we're going to
(10:13):
be a scientist. Sometimes theylike that sometimes they don't.
But 5050 is something that candrive your life, right? Like,
well, it could go this way, orit could go that way. So always
say, you know, put, put yourhope in the good things, and do
work around that. Put your hopein the good things that can
happen and hope that that doescome through and come to
(10:34):
fruition. I'll give you thetools, I'll give you the
support, I'll be someone you cancount on our model that for you.
And we'll work through thattogether. So I always tell
people, you're not alone. Fearis something that is going to
always be present. And we haveto figure out what what ways can
we come? What can we comeovercome those fears that we do
(10:55):
have? Soit's good, and it's good. You
probably just helped a lot ofpeople moving forward. Yeah, I'm
being serious about beingserious. Even here three years,
and you have seen a lot ofchange, change and staff, change
in leadership in differentlevels. And you also were here
(11:19):
during pandemic, while we weretrying to figure out what does
this look like? How do we stillprovide services. And you also
were here, as we talked aboutracial inequality, things going
on in the world, you decided tojoin the cultural diversity,
(11:40):
diversity and inclusioncommittee. You brought a very,
very, very great perspective.
You also were part of thatplanning committee to really get
there, where we we sat and weopenly talked about how we were
feeling about what was going on.
After the aftermath of GeorgeFloyd's killing. You wrote code.
(12:03):
You wrote letters, things thathelped you cope. And then you
also take the time to talk withother staff members and being
able to educate them. Talk to meabout how that experience was
for you. Because you weren'tdoing therapy at that?
(12:26):
Was my idea is always my own.
Maybe? What? No, that time washard for everyone, which was
beautiful that we were able tobe together on, I think, I think
our agency did something that alot of people were scared to do,
which was talking about it thefirst step, right. And that was
it. That was huge for me,because coming from the place
(12:49):
that we come from. And yeah, sobeing the one that's not the one
in the room, basically, whatthat means to me is being
different. Being an outlier,being someone who you can
visibly say, Hey, you look likeeveryone else, or you're not,
(13:10):
you're not coming with the samethings that other people are
coming with, right? So we lookat marginalized people. And I
feel like a lot of times in mylife, I've fallen in that
category, for different reasons,being a woman, being a person of
color, different things likethat. And so for me, I was like,
wow, look at look at thisopportunity for us to kind of
(13:31):
come together as a whole, andpeople to hear us, right, like,
really hear how we feel. And soI loved I love the opportunity,
I think the biggest thing I gotfrom that whole experience. And
I think that our agency reallydid some good healing in that
time, was that the first step isbeing courageous enough just to
(13:53):
say, Hey, this is what's goingon. And like we have got to talk
about it right. Having thosehard conversations is something
that's so important. And maybewe don't see change for five
years after the combo, right?
Maybe it's 10 years later, Idon't know. But I know that it
feels good in that moment toknow that other people care. And
to kind of just come together onthat. And so the CDF CDI has
(14:17):
been amazing. I think thateveryone in it and involved
around it have been open andhonest. And I think that's
another beautiful concept thatwe haven't always gotten. And
then the conversations outside,you know, I've taken it to other
meetings like, Hey, I didn't seeyou there. And I just want you
(14:38):
to know, this is what we'redoing. Right? And that even
having that received well hasbeen a great a great feeling.
You know, I'm sitting here rightnow with Black Lives Matter
earrings. I mean, it's like noone cares about that. You know,
like it's important that we cansay and express ourselves the
way that we feel and be acceptedand then in return You know, be
(15:00):
positively reinforced by that wetalk about that a lot. And so I
think that, you know, it wasgood, it was good for everyone.
It was good for the agency, andwe have to keep doing that work.
We have to never give up on it.
Because I think it's soimportant.
Which led me into my nextquestion, you kind of just
(15:21):
answered a little bit. Why didyou join the committee? They you
said it was something that a lotof other agencies didn't do
something that we had not donehere, as an agency, what made
you join it?
I think it's one of those thingsthat like, sometimes you know,
what you have to offer like,before you come to a table or a
(15:43):
position, and then sometimes youhave no idea like, maybe I'm
just there just to say I'm thereto be a part of the collective?
I don't know. I think I feltlike I had no choice. Right.
Like, it's one of those thingsthat I did without thinking kind
of like breathing like, Oh, I'mgonna do that for sure. Because
it's a part of my passion. Andit's something that isn't
(16:03):
personal, that doesn't justpersonally affect me, but
professionally, you know, it'ssomething that has followed me
for my life and will continue tofollow me. And I think that this
was not only like healing, likeI said, but also good practice,
because there's gonna be anothersituation where we have to speak
up and have that difficult,difficult conversation. I think
(16:24):
one time in a meeting, you toldme it was like, not what you
say. It's not what you say, it'show you say it. And ever since
then I'm like, Okay, I haveimportant things to say. And I'm
always gonna say them. That'sone thing about me, no matter
what it is, so just finding theway to say, Hey, I got this
going on, or hey, like, I wantedto talk to you about this, like,
those things are so important.
And I think the CDI, si si Cid,is that right? Yep. Yeah. CDL
(16:49):
use me abbreviations. Um, yeah,I think that that's another
thing that gives us the abilityto do like, you know, teaching
us that there are hard topics,were even going to have those
conversations with our clients.
So if you can't do that withyourself and your own time and
your own comfort zone, youcannot do that with another
person. So yeah, I think it doesa lot for everyone. And it also
(17:13):
just gives a safe space to kindof say, hey, this happened, and
I need someone to hear me.
I'll tell you a difficultconversation. You talked about
vulnerability, having those hardconversations. I remember you as
a new therapist, you came intomy office one day, and you say,
Well, I got a question for you.
And before I can send you away,I said, what? You asked me, what
(17:36):
should you do to a certainsituation? Do you recall where
I'm heading with this? Ofcourse, referral that was a
outpatient therapy referral.
They requested an AfricanAmerican female therapist. And
(17:59):
you like, I mean, what if? Whatif you have a different
background story? That reallyhit home to me? Because we're
both black? We're both AfricanAmericans, from my viewpoint,
from walking in my shoes. Yeah,your background is different
from mine. And there aredifferent struggles that you
(18:22):
face being a black female that Idon't face as a black male. And
then you come from aninterracial background
Erika Lathon (18:33):
Jimena scenario.
Unknown (18:35):
Looking back on where you were in that moment. How do
you encourage other individualswho have backgrounds that is
similar to yours? How do theycope with what's going on? What
do they? How do they deal withit? Yeah,
so I think something we oftentalk about is skin color. I've
(18:57):
often made comments like, youknow, what, my skin is not
outwardly black. So that does tome a different category, I am
mixed, which is a fact of life,biracial, whatever you want to
call it. And, you know, I've hadthis conversation 1000 times my
grandma. And she'd always say,Well, what do you identify?
That's all that matters. And,you know, that looks different
(19:19):
for everyone. And everyone getsthe right identify with what
they want to and I think that'ssomething I personally believe.
And so I guess that's where Ioriginally was coming from with
the question I say, in thatscenario, if anyone else is
faced with that, but you got ahunch that self doubt, because
at the bottom of that selfdoubt, was a person once again,
(19:41):
back to humility. And, you know,you reminded me like your
therapist, just do your job.
Right. So I think that in thisworld, we have all these hats,
what I call them, they're alsoidentities, whatever you want to
call it boxes to check offwhatever. And you know, I think
that they weigh on us sometimes.
You know, I've Like I said, I'ma woman, I'm a woman of color. I
(20:02):
am a biracial woman. So yeah, Ihave been right in the middle of
all of that my whole life. Andnavigating that has never been
just a simple black and whiteanswer, which is now no pun
intended there. So, when lookingat that, you know, I think self
doubt is easy to feel it's, youactually gave me a book recently
(20:23):
Brene Brown book, talking aboutyour your best thing, and I have
literally not put it down sinceyou gave it to me
to return, but you know what?
I'm working on it. So it willreturn quickly. Um, and one of
the things that they talk aboutis black guilt. And what does
that look like? Right? Like,everyone's is different. And it
(20:44):
comes in all shapes and sizes,and it's very careful, right,
you carry it anywhere you go.
And so, you know, there's essaysin there that talk about that.
And each version of like, guiltis different. So different, but
it's, it's definitely somethingthat he can relate to on each
scenario. So, you know, thatadvice that I have for that is
(21:08):
just hush yourself down andremember who you are. Remember
your ancestors, remember whatyou came from what you what was
built around you, which wasliterally this country. So I
think you know, those things,empower me and remind me that I
am where I'm supposed to be. Ialways tell myself, I have this
quote in my mirror in mybathroom, don't question the
(21:29):
table, you set out. Someone setyou there, right? And a lot of
times, you know, maybe it's youreally brought me in here into
this agency gave me a choice thefirst time or maybe, you know, I
worked for I don't know whichone it is, but either one. I've
been here and I've been awardedthe spot. So I can't question
that. So that's my advice.
(21:51):
You know, I'm gonna challengethat. He said, I gave you a
spot. How hard did you work asan intern, or you worked hard
for it, and you earn it spot,you're in this spot. You know,
there are a lot of interns thatcome through, and they work
hard. And unfortunately, we'renot able to find a placement at
(22:12):
that time. Then there aremoments where things align
together, and they work out theway as they should. You worked
hard for it as an intern, youyou understand the importance of
networking, and showing peoplewho you truly are, and really
learning to understand your why.
And just talk about it. Butunderstand your why. So you're
(22:33):
in your seat at the table.
You're great at it.
Thank you. Thankyou. Yes, yes. So we talk a lot
about self care. We've talkedabout you know why you got into
the field and youth boys findingyour voice having your own lived
experience, cultural competencebeing black in America? What are
(22:57):
some self care tips that you cangive listeners out there that
you have found helpful indealing with any of those
categories?
Yeah, so self care is somethingyou taught me. So kudos. Before
that I did not know what selfcare was just flat out to be
(23:18):
honest. And I think that selfcare is once again a journey,
one of those lifelong journeysthat we should never quit, and
always seek. And for me, adviceon self care is, whatever you
can do to de glamorize it dothat. Self care needs to be
accessible. I mean, literally,at the snap of a finger, it
(23:40):
needs to be something thatalways makes you feel good, not
a 50% time and then the othertime it doesn't, right. It needs
to be something that you can doat any moment, anyplace and
anytime. You know, I often tellmy people that you've got to
find free self care first, andthen build on that build on the
things that you can't afford todo and the things that look good
(24:02):
to you, but self care at thebasis. Literally what makes you
feel good. If that's walkingoutside for five minutes in
between your break, you do thatright? And then making a plan
for is the other thing I neverthought about, like why would I
plan on self care, right? Thatwas another thing you taught me,
I'm like, why don't need towrite this down. But we all know
that if we see things, we'remore apt to do them. So writing
(24:24):
it down is really important. Andit's kind of like setting a goal
for yourself. If you don't havethe intention to accomplish that
go, you won't do it. So I thinkit's really huge. Everyone
should have a self care plan. Itshould be reevaluated every 30
days type thing. And it shouldit should be specific to things
that work for you and thingsthat don't. You should have
(24:45):
options, plenty of options.
Learned that along the way aswell. Options are good. Options
are good. You heard me tell thestory. I got that guitar during
the pandemic. And that was goingto be a part of my self care
plan. But I can't read music. Soit became more of a stressor. So
I had to change that up. Listento people playing guitars.
(25:08):
That's my ministry right there.
Yes. Listening to music playing.
It's good. Good. So as we as wewrap up being a thermistor
headed on the licensor licensuretrack. Very exciting, very
exciting. What is your hope forthose who are scared to enter
(25:35):
into their into enter intotherapy of their own? What's
your hope for those who may noteven see the importance of
going?
Well, I always want to validatethat there's a lot of reasons to
fear therapist to fear systemhelp, basically, bottom line,
(25:57):
there is generational trauma,then there is just real life
fears, you know, like, what ifthey don't help me? Or what if
they're not what I need in thismoment? I went to some
conference, I believe it wassocat. And I cannot remember the
speaker's name for the life ofme, so forgive me. But they said
something that's always stuckwith me. And they said that
therapy is like dating. And atfirst I was like, What? No way.
(26:22):
But then I thought about it. AndI was like, yes, absolutely.
Like you have to date around,you have to be open to dating,
right? First, that's the firststep. And then you have to be
open for it to be bad. Okay, andthat you can find someone good.
Okay. So I think that'simportant to know that your
first experience may not gowell. And your first therapist
may be terrible. And that'sokay, too. So keeping that in
(26:47):
your mind, I mean, open to it.
And then the other part is, I dowhat's called parallels for my
people, because sometimes withmental health being a new thing,
right, because something that'strending right now, it's hard to
understand, we talked aboutfear, we fear things we don't
understand. So I do parallelsall the time, physical health,
you got to your physical healthdoctor, right, you have to
(27:08):
maintain your physical body, youhave a whole body here. Well,
your mind is inside of yourbody. And it's very important
that we maintain our mentalhealth, which is our brain. And
so you know, just letting themknow that just like you have a
body to maintain you have amind, that does not mean that
you have a mental healthdisorder that's gonna label you
(27:28):
for life. It just means that youhave some things to take care
of, you got a little tune up youneed here and there, you know,
you got to relax, everyone. Sohow do you start recharge those
things? And just normalizing asmuch as we can. People always
are worried, oh, if we talkabout mental health, everyone's
gonna know if we don't talkabout it. No one's going to get
help. And that's the biggestthing for me talk, talk, talk,
(27:51):
talk, talk, even when you'reuncomfortable talk a little bit
more. Until someone says, oh, Inever thought about it like
that, or oh, that's the firsttime I'm hearing and then you
know, you've done you've done agood job. So I think Monique
says this a lot. One of ourstaff she wants her job is to
work herself out of a job. AndI'm adopting that mindset, I
(28:11):
would love to wake up one dayand no one need me, I think that
it would be a little frighteningas a helper to feel that I will
might be a little panicked. Butat the same time, I feel like it
would feel like I'veaccomplished a lot and that I
would feel good to know that myclients are empowered and doing
things on their own. So go outthere, try things out and get
some help. It's okay.
(28:37):
I love you, I hope youunderstand the impact that you
are making. This podcast ismeant for people to realize that
you know what? You can do it andlook back and say, Yeah, I did
it. I did it. So I appreciateyou for being a part of another
(28:57):
great impact that we're tryingto make as people as an agency.
And thank you for everythingthat you're doing. So we really
appreciate it. Reallyappreciate. Final words you want
to leave for anybody listening,ready to wrap up at the next
session? I am.
Erika Lathon (29:18):
Thank you, Dan voices is now hiring qualified
applicants to build positionsall across the state. You can be
part of a growing team that putsthe mental health of Tennesseans
first and thrive in acompassionate work environment
to apply to join our team log onto tn voices.org/employment.
(29:50):
September is Suicide PreventionMonth, and there are things each
of us can do to help preventsuicide every year at this time
lifeline and other mental healthorganizations and individuals
across the US and around theworld, raise awareness of
suicide prevention. If you arehaving suicidal thoughts, call
(30:11):
1-800-273-8255 and head to teaand voices.org for mental health
resources, including our newlyrenovated online library. You
can be the one to preventsuicide this month and all your
law by gaining the tools andknowledge you need to foster
(30:33):
better mental health foryourself and those around you.
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