July 29, 2025 • 46 mins
In this bold and soul-baring episode, Elaine is joined by powerhouse coach and speaker Jacquie Grillon for a truth-packed deep dive into people pleasing, perfectionism, and what it really takes to unlearn the conditioning that keeps women stuck, silent, and drained.
From Catholic school trauma to addiction, codependency, and overgiving in work and relationships — Jacquie shares her personal story of growing up in dysfunction and how she began the lifelong process of reclaiming her voice.
Key Takeaways
- People pleasing is not kindness — it’s self-abandonment in disguise.
- We often give not from generosity, but from a deep need to be chosen, included, and liked.
- Recovery doesn’t end with putting down the drink, food, or men — there are deeper emotional patterns to heal.
- When you stop people pleasing, many relationships will fall away — and that grief is real.
- You’ll either work your trauma out with one person over 30 years, or with 20 different ones — the lesson will keep coming until you heal it.
- Boundaries may feel awkward at first — but laughter and grace can help you hold the line.
- Healing makes you more effective, not less — Jacquie shares a story of a client who reclaimed her life, her joy, and even lost 100 pounds by finally prioritizing herself.
“If you’ve ever said yes when you meant no — this episode is for you.”
In this truth-packed convo, I sit down with the fierce and fabulous Jacquie Grillon, who pulls no punches on people pleasing, growing up in chaos, perfectionism, and why boundaries are the new black.
Jacquie Grillon: JacquieGrillon@gmail.com
🎧 Available now on Captivate the Mic
Tag your fellow recovering “good girls” — this one’s a must-listen. 💥💛
Connect with your Host, Elaine Williams:
Check out Captivate the Mic Podcast on Elaine's YouTube Channel
Check out the Captivate the Crowd Website
Follow Elaine on Social- LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok
Want to schedule a free chat with Elaine? Click here to book a zoom date!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
Hello and welcome to Captivatethe Mic with Elaine Williams
where we talk about confidence,storytelling, speaking, how to
be more effective, morepowerful.
I have amazing guests on, and Igive.
Tips and tricks and tools frombeing in the performance arena
for 50 plus years.
(00:26):
And I wanna tell you today, I amso excited.
I have a very special treat foryou.
This woman, her name is JackieGian, and she a client, a
friend, a colleague.
We had been working together fora while on her visibility.
And she's already an amazingdynamic speaker and we're doing
some work on video and in thisinterview she goes so deep into
(00:52):
people pleasing.
Why we do it.
If you grew up in dysfunction,how it's a survival skill and
how it can really be suckingyour soul and taking your power
away, and she gives some amazinginsights.
Every time I talk to her, I'mlike, woo.
So sit back, listen, take notes.
(01:13):
Please share this with somebodywho needs to hear it.
I know a lot of females, wewere.
Cultured and educated andgroomed to be people pleasers.
And there's some really powerfulinsights in this amazing and
dynamic interview.
So enjoy.
Thanks so much for being here.
I am so excited everybody.
(01:34):
I am here with the fabulous andamazing Jackie Grill on, is it
Grill on Grillin?
Yes.
I mean in French, to betechnical it's grill, but grill,
in America, I've been butchered.
It's grill on, it's grilling,it's turned the grill on,
whatever it was.
It's Jackie G.
(01:54):
There you go.
So everybody welcome.
This is Captivate the Mic, and Iam so delighted to share this
brilliant woman with mylisteners and viewers because
Jackie, you have done it all.
You have transformed yourselfagain and again.
(02:16):
We've both done a ton of workand I have never had anybody.
Break it down.
The people pleasing thing, likethere's some things that you
have spoken about,perfectionism, the people
pleasing, and how when you are agiver you attract the takers,
like you just have just laid itdown.
(02:37):
So eloquently and powerfully anda little bit like Woo.
But isn't that what we want Abitch slack of truth versus
something that's oh, that's anice thought to think about.
No, like I want to betransformed, so I call me on my
stuff.
Listen, that's the jersey.
(02:57):
I can't hold back from that.
I love it.
So tell us a little bit about.
Whatever you wanna say aboutyour evolution, if you will.
My evolution with peoplepleasing or evolution in
general.
Yeah.
Why don't you start at the,let's start at the very
(03:17):
beginning.
Okay.
No musical theater, Elaine.
Just tell us a little bit about,I know you grew up in
dysfunctional family, of course.
Does anything, whatever youwanna say about whatever you
wanna say about what led you tothis path.
Okay.
So when you grow up in a family,our parents did the best they
(03:38):
could with what they had.
My mom was probably notdiagnosed with a lot of
different things, just like I'veonly been diagnosed with some
certain things, right?
Our parents, were young.
My, my mom was 19 when she gotmarried, and my dad was 24.
They didn't have a clue what wasgoing on anyway.
So growing up, what I thoughtwas normal was anything but
(03:58):
normal.
There was a lot of yelling andscreaming in my house.
There was a lot of, my dad wasone to for punishing because he
didn't know how to handlechildren and neither did my mom.
And my mom would leave the roomand my dad would line us up to
span us.
So that was like, not a funtime.
So it was just like weird stufflike, but that was all normal.
(04:19):
I went to Catholic school,that's when, back in a time when
our parents basically paid tohave us abused physically,
mentally, and emotionally allday long.
It's not like my parents knewany better.
They think they're doing rightby their children paying to go
to, a private school, likethey're doing the right thing.
They have no idea the positionsthat they're putting us in.
The conditions and thecontainers that, I.
(04:41):
I was born into, were not,ideal.
They were ideal for, abuse andaddictions and avoidance and
dissociation and things likethat.
So of course I became a peoplepleaser.
Of course, let me do whatever Ican do to get you to pick me,
love me, and include me.
Just please don't abandon me,and Right.
Because you were being, that'show you survive Catholic school,
(05:04):
right?
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
So whatever I needed to do, andthen I basically begged my
parents to let me go to publicschool in seventh grade.
Because please give me Yes.
Gimme away from the nuns, right?
Yes.
It was terrible.
And out of the 30 that were inour class, only two of us got to
(05:25):
go to public school and wethought, wow, we have a ride.
Woo.
So now we have no idea what thisis gonna be like, right?
Because we've never done the goto a different class every
period thing.
We've never done the have 500people in your class.
We've had 30 people in our classfor whatever.
So that was a rude awakeningwhen I got into my first class,
homeroom of my first class,which was also like social
(05:47):
studies or something, history,whatever.
And they started saying, okay,so you know, here's the outline
of what we're gonna do thisyear.
Like we never had any of that.
And then it would be like, blah,blah, blah, blah, blah.
And you probably already learnedthis in third grade.
And I'm like, oh my God.
Oh my God.
Oh my God.
Oh my god.
And that's when I realized Idon't know anything.
What they teach you in Catholicschool is pretty much, they
(06:09):
shove religion down your throat.
They shame you and bait beat youand tell you to sit there and.
With a sin in your soul and allthe things.
And and then, now I get to thisbig school and I don't know
anything and plus I have allthese other things.
So who am I gonna talk to aboutall of that?
Yes, it was my childhood, so nowonder it led me into checking
out and addictions and peoplepleasing and all the things.
(06:33):
Yes.
And I think.
Addiction.
That's a whole, one woman showfor both of us.
Absolutely.
And I think so many people doget into recovery, which is
beautiful.
And then there's still so manyother things.
The codependency, the peoplepleasing, the, yeah.
(06:53):
Self-doubt.
We put down the drink, the drugthe men, the food.
Shopping, the, all that.
But then there's so many otherlayers and I think you and I
have talked about this before,like we do things to survive our
families.
'cause we can't move out'causewe're 10, right?
Whatever.
And so we discount the pain.
(07:14):
It's not that bad.
We keep going.
We pour our hearts into theschool or to musicals or
performing or whatever,cheerleading, sports, and then.
But you've gotten used todiscounting and then what
happens with so many women thatI've worked with, and same for
you.
You have these adult women whoare doing amazing things and
(07:37):
they're like it's not that, theystill are discounting things.
So it's like, what served yougrowing up is not serving you
now.
So I feel like so much of.
The work that you and I both dois helping people unlearn the
things that served you untilthey didn't, right?
So stop discounting yourbadassness and the fact that you
(08:00):
have 53 degrees, or that youconquered a mountain or that
you've bounced back from.
Whatever.
Dating not great men, right?
So let's get into, I think I'vedone all of those things you
just mentioned.
For those of you listening Ijust lost my father a couple of
(08:21):
weeks ago.
And I've, I've been givingmyself grace and crying, but
boy, I am like, Elaine, you needto break up with sugar.
It is time.
It's just, there's a way tocomfort yourself and then you're
like, okay, this is actuallyhurting me.
It's not serving me.
Never a dull moment.
But I Absolutely.
Somebody said sometimes you'lldo the old behaviors, but not as
(08:45):
long or as much.
Or not to the Detri, of course.
Of course.
Because once you can't pretendyou don't know anymore, right?
Whether, let's just say forinstance, a guy, a guy who's
abused you or whatever.
It doesn't mean that you're notgonna pick another one.
If you haven't healed any of thethings that attracted them to
begin with, you're going to pickanother one.
(09:05):
It's just how it is.
You're gonna work it out withone person for 30 years or 20
people.
20 different people, but it'sthe same lesson.
You're gonna work it out.
The difference is that you'llsee it coming.
Yes.
And then the more you feel thatparticular trigger issue,
whatever it is it will become,like I said, you see it a lot
(09:25):
quicker, so you're not gonnastay in it as long.
So whether it's.
Picking a bad relationship or abad job or sitting in self pity,
you're just not going to wantthat as long.
The more you heal, the moreself-esteem and self-worth and
just your inherent ness of beingworthy to be an existent human
(09:47):
on the planet goes up when that,goes up, you won't tolerate that
kind of stuff anymore.
Oh, I love that.
Thank you.
I'll have some of that please.
Thank you, Jackie.
I love it.
That's so beautifully said.
And some of the things that youhave said about really all of
the things you've said aboutpeople pleasing, just pierced my
(10:10):
soul and my heart, can you speakto, can you share one of the
stories of the people you'vehelped or tell us a little bit
about the people pleasing,because I think so many women
struggle with that and men are.
Yeah, people pleasing is a bigone.
Whether it's in your personallife, whether it's at work, and
(10:31):
if you even have it to a littlebit of a degree, whether you
grew up with it or you just doit in work because you don't
wanna make waves at work, right?
Or you're looking to get ahead.
We tend to, say yes when we meanno or say no when we mean yes.
And it gets a little muddled andconfusing for people who aren't
even full-blown people pleasers.
But when you come from abackground of codependency and
(10:54):
addiction and secrets and thingslike that, it's definitely more
prevalent because everybody'snever being their true selves.
And if you're not being yourtrue self, you're people
pleasing somebody.
And now a quick word.
You know the best way to growyour business and your brand is
to be out there speaking,whether it's on stage, in
(11:15):
meetings, on camera, but maybeyour talk isn't really landing.
Are people running?
To the back of the room to comesign up for your thing.
When you go on podcasts as aguest, are you growing your list
every time you're on a newpodcast, because people hear you
and they hear a compelling storythat moves them to take action
(11:38):
and grab the freebie that you'reoffering, so that you're going
your email list.
If you've answered no then weshould have a talk.
What I have found from workingwith amazing, brilliant feminine
leaders for many years now issometimes.
Leaders can get a little tooserious or too intense or too
(12:00):
attached to all their content,but it's in the book.
But this, they love this part,we don't want too much.
You can have the best content inthe world, but if you're fire
hosing them.
It doesn't matter.
And sometimes you're too closeto the material to have any
objectivity.
One of my superpowers is to pullapart keynotes that aren't
(12:21):
working, pull apart stories thathave gotten stale, pull apart
videos series that aren'tlanding so that we can see how
can we infuse some humor, howcan we infuse emotion?
Which causes people to takeaction.
And maybe we need to take outsome of the data or content if
(12:42):
it's too much, or maybe it canbe said in a more compelling,
concise, pithy way.
So if this is resonating withyou, I encourage you to find my
scheduler.
It's in the show notes.
I would love to have a quickzoom call with you.
No pressure, and we can justfind out.
Where you are, what's going on,and if maybe it's time for a
(13:05):
little revision or a littlebreath of fresh air, a little
humor infusion.
So now let's go back to the showSo in the land of people
pleasing.
It's tough because you've set itup that way, whether it's
(13:27):
conscious or unconscious.
For me, personally, myunderlying thing, when I was
people pleasing, I would doanything for anybody that I
cared about and I still will.
The difference was, is back thenthe unconscious part was I was
doing it to my detriment.
I would give.
I wasn't taking care of myself.
(13:47):
I would give to avoid looking atmyself, and I would give because
I needed you to like me, and Ineeded you to pick me, include
me, whatever it was.
I needed something from you.
I didn't realize that at thetime.
I thought I was just thiswonderful person because it was
my only sense of self-esteem.
(14:08):
Me doing for you.
Made me feel good about me.
That's still a benefit.
So I don't even know.
I'm using you for self-esteem.
So it's still me looking to theoutside to make myself feel
better, and it's a brilliantdistraction from looking at my
own stuff.
But it's the only way I know tohave self-esteem at that time,
(14:30):
which I just think ding ding.
Everybody like, it's sobrilliant how you said it.
It's it's great to be acts ofservice and to be generous of,
but if you're doing itunconsciously Yeah, as a way to
make yourself feel good.
And that's the only way you cando that.
(14:51):
That's a.
Dangerous formula.
Ask me how I know I have thebumper sticker and the T-shirt.
That's the problem.
You don't know.
You don't know that when you'redoing it.
It's not until you haveproblems.
Everybody talks about you're notgonna look at anything unless
you have a problem with it.
And even then some people arelike no.
La.
It's not really happening.
But it's not until.
(15:12):
You're doing all these thingsfor people and they're not
appreciating it, they are stillleaving.
They're not doing anything backfor you.
There's nothing reciprocal, andyou realize that pretty much
every relationship you're in isone sided, then you have a
problem.
Because now you're gettingdrained and now you're the you
(15:34):
who's the wonderful givingperson that you are, even though
you haven't looked at yourmotives yet is getting drained,
and now you're resentful,bitter, and angry at the same
people that you're doing allthis for because they're not
even appreciating you, let alonegiving you a thank you, which.
Was my setup to begin withbecause I expected at least a
thank you or appreciate.
(15:55):
Oh, yes, boy, bye.
I, Debbie Ford used to talkabout do you give to get Right.
And I am.
I've been in recovery a longtime.
Not as long as you, when peoplesay, check your motives.
That didn't resonate with me.
I didn't.
It just, sometimes there'scertain phrases that you're
like, yeah.
I'm a good person, blah, blah,blah.
(16:16):
Yeah.
And I still struggle with this,when I give somebody a tip, like
at the coffee place, I'm like.
I want everybody to see that I'mgiving a tip, like I've done
that.
Or you wait to hand it to themso they see how wonderful you
walk.
I'm really, but I want, I don'twant just the coffee person to
see me.
(16:36):
I want every oh, that'shilarious.
It's so pathetic.
I'm just being vulnerable.
Here.
There is a part of me that's.
Still like when I worked at theSteakhouse for 15 years, I loved
being loved.
I walked in and it was like,Elaine's here, now we can work.
There's a part of me that'sstill a recovering drama queen
(16:57):
and a recovering people pleaser,and I guess.
The great news and part of thiswas out of conversations with
you, Jackie.
Oh.
And I'm catching myself more andI'm, I am really, truly trying
to give.
Just to give.
And if forget a thank you,awesome.
(17:19):
But for many years I wouldoverestimate friendships.
Like I'll never forget.
I let this woman who I hardlyknow come stay at.
I had just bought my house, justbought my house.
It was my brand new three familyhouse.
I saved living in a one roomstudio for three years, and I go
(17:41):
away on a trip.
And I let her stay at my house.
Like looking back, I'm like,what an idiot.
And then I thought we were goodfriends.
And then when she got married, Iwasn't invited and I was so
offended and, multiply thattimes a hundred.
And that's been a process for meand I'm sharing this with people
(18:02):
because I do see this.
With women in business inparticular absolutely.
Especially women in business,right?
Because men don't have to.
People please.
They have their boys club thinggoing on, so it's a little
different.
Women have it.
Much tougher in business.
So you're gonna see a lot morewomen, people pleasing and not
(18:22):
sticking up for themselvesbecause they're, if they voice
their truths, the way that mendo whatever it is, whether it's,
something that adds or.
Something that could potentiallyhurt the business.
They're going to be viewed a lotdifferent.
They're going to be labeled, sothey put on their best.
And I'm not saying it's fullblown people pleasing, but it
(18:45):
is, and you are.
Every single time you do that,you're abandoning yourself.
You don't think.
Are, but you are, you'resacrificing something.
You're selling your soul evenjust a little bit.
But it's for work.
Oh, I just don't wanna makewaves.
Oh, it's this.
Oh, it's that.
But each one of those littlethings will niggle at you or not
you just a little bit at somepoint.
(19:07):
It's like an un undermining ofself.
Yes.
And you make it okay until youdon't make it.
Okay.
So somebody like me who is afull blown.
Whatever you need.
Please just love me.
As needy as they come, doormatto be the person who's standing
in front of you, who is clearlynot like I overshare, I over
(19:29):
stick up for myself and advocatefor others to the point where I
know people are looking at mesideways and I can get in
trouble for that, but it's likethere's that, rebellious part of
me that's I'm not gonna besilenced ever again.
And here's where I love usinghumor, right?
So I first started becomingaware of this when I was working
(19:49):
at this steakhouse.
And, I had some super closefriends and some sort of
friends, and then some peoplethat were just like, you stay
over there, and I remember.
Trying to set a boundary aboutsomething and it was so awkward.
I was so like, ugh and thenluckily the next day I could go
to that friend and say, you knowwhat?
(20:11):
I'm sorry.
I'm so awkward.
I'm really working onboundaries.
And I just am like, Ugh.
And we laughed about it.
Now, obviously you cannot dothat with certain people,
especially if they're aauthority figure, but yeah,
being able to laugh when you'rein what I, like the transf, the
goo of the butterfly, right?
(20:32):
Yeah.
All those times when you feellike I'm growing and it's like
I'm growing out of my skin and Ifeel weird, if you can use some
humor with yourself, absolutely.
And with the people that, that'ssuch a gift.
Now, Jackie, that's tough,right?
Because when you're in themiddle of changing anything,
people pleasing any issue thatyou're working on, right?
(20:53):
It's I'm changing and I forgotto tell people, and it's not
like I need to tell people, butpeople are like who the heck are
you?
One minute you're doing this andnow you're not doing that.
You always say yes.
And now you're telling me no.
Yes.
And then that's the thing.
So when a people pleaser stops,people pleasing, if you're in
one side of relationships,they're all gonna go because
those takers need to go takefrom somebody else.
They're not in a re, they neversigned up for a reciprocal
(21:15):
relationship.
They gotta go.
So that's when you really findout.
What's really going on.
But it's also heartbreaking,right?
Because that immediately throwsyou into deep grief into what my
whole life was a lie.
And then you have to look at thefact that you've set it up that
way.
That yeah, your life was liebecause you weren't even being
yourself.
You were people pleasing them.
You weren't even being you atthe time.
(21:38):
So it does start a wholeprocess, but it's also the
beginning of.
It was very painful when Ithought that I was beloved and
all these things.
Yeah.
And I do have some people thatI've stayed in touch with, but
of course it was a big realityshift Yeah.
Of the story that I thought, wetell ourselves these things and
(22:01):
then the truth comes out andit's whoa, jackie, you have
shared with me so many clientsuccess stories.
We could go on and on.
I would love to hear about thewoman who you helped her with
one thing and as a side effect,she lost a hundred pounds.
But I just love this story andwe don't have to say her name,
(22:22):
but can you just tell us thisfabulous story.
Yeah, so she came to me becauseshe had a lot going on with work
and home and family and tryingto juggle it all, as women do
you know?
And trying to be the super momand the super wife and the, the
super, why can't I think ofperfect woman?
(22:43):
Yeah.
She's not a worker, but like inher job, her, her I don't know
why I'm losing my words, hertitle.
That what I'm saying.
Yes.
Yeah.
She's, an executive, right?
So she has to, it's, there's alot of.
What it looks like in thisworld, right?
It's all about smoke andmirrors.
Just look at social media.
Unfortunately, it's all smokeand mirrors, and we
unfortunately compare ouroutsides to the insides, and
(23:04):
that's where we get in trouble,right?
We all wanna be what it lookslike, and none of it is for
real, right?
There is no super mom, there isno whatever.
You do the best you can and youjuggle as much as you can, but
when somebody comes to you andthey're like, what's wrong with
me?
That I don't have it alltogether.
And I'm like, yeah, welcome tothe rest of us.
(23:24):
Yeah.
No, nobody has it together.
Nobody gave me the answers.
Nobody gave my parents theanswers.
I have fumbled through it all.
Any successes I've had in mylife is because I had to go
through all the pain and themuck like you were talking about
earlier, and the heartbreak andthe, the trial and error, I
haven't learned, I've onlylearned things from things.
That I've messed up or I've donewrong.
(23:45):
I don't learn when life is justhanded to me.
I, there's no lessons there.
Everything was hard fought andand definitely earned.
So when she comes to me and shetells me she's burnt out and she
has all these things done right,first, we have to.
Regulate, right?
So the first thing you gotta dois get them back regulated into
their nervous system, into theirbody.
Help them remember like why theygot their job, why they became a
(24:08):
mother, why they became a wife,why, just remember little things
here and there just to get youback into yourself because
they're so out there about whatthey should be doing, and they
have all these balls in the airand you're out outwardly
focused, which is how women aresocialized, especially exactly.
Everybody wants to keep allthese balls in the air and we're
terrified to just let the ballsfall down because if we let the
(24:31):
balls fall down, we are soterrified that who will do that
job?
If I'm an executive, I'mdefinitely thinking they're just
gonna replace me with somebodyelse.
And, it's not, it'll probably bea guy or whatever.
I'm gonna be, replace in twoseconds.
And then if, if I don't takecare of my husband, you know
he's gonna divorce me and mykids will always love me,
(24:51):
whatever.
So the only person that I know,who still wants something for me
is my dogs.
That's how she felt, right?
She had these pugs at home likethat.
As much as she knew everybodyelse, loved her, cared about
her, and all that things, sheknew the only unconditional love
she was getting really was fromher pugs.
And she still had to feed them,so she still had to do things,
so I feel like, so theredefinitely was no time for her.
(25:14):
So anyway, long story short, westarted just slowly.
Not so slowly.
'cause this really only took sixmonths and then at the end of a
year, she didn't even reallyneed to work with me after six
months.
But she was feeling so good.
And as a byproduct of her comingback into herself, remembering
who she is, what she reallyliked in her life, remembering
what her joy and what her soulwanted for her, remembering all
(25:38):
of that.
She started making differentlifestyle choices, because she
was working so much andeverything else, she was like
eating on the go, so she wasn'teating right and all the other
things.
She wound up losing a hundredpounds just because she just
started paying attention toherself for the first time in a
long time.
She wasn't even like looking forthat.
That just was a byproduct.
She was working out.
She started, the endorphins areflowing.
(25:59):
Everything is, she's feelinggood about herself, the home
life.
All of a sudden, all this timethat we say we don't have, she
has extra time for herself forworking out.
Her job is still getting done.
Only she's now a more productiveperson at work.
More energized and focused.
Yeah, so she's actually bringingin more money at work.
(26:19):
She was so de terrified ofletting the balls fall that she
was gonna lose her job, letalone get a ccc, a CA C-suite
position.
Like you don't think, you thinkall of our fears about what
we're gonna lose all ourself-centered fears, right?
Either somebody's gonna takesomething we have or we're not
gonna get something we want, orwhatever else.
(26:40):
And that's our self-centeredfear dinging.
Brilliant.
Yes, of course.
If you let the balls fall, it'soh my God, what's gonna happen?
We always make it worse in ourhead, or at least I do.
So when we just.
Let one ball fall, in a safeplace like at home and realize
your husband's not gonna leave.
The kids are fine, the dogs arefed and blah, blah, blah.
And and you could still work outa little or you could still
(27:01):
whatever.
Then you can start implementing'em in places that you're really
terrified at.
And for her, it was work.
Like she thought like she wouldlose her job or lose her
position or lose her whatever.
And she didn't.
She wound up, being promotedand.
Being in charge of a whole teamthat she didn't even have
before, that she didn't eventhink she could, and she was
hesitant to take that partbecause she didn't, she was.
(27:25):
So used to now taking care ofherself and letting the family
work on its own and letting thejob work on its own, like
working smarter, not harder.
Wow.
She wasn't sure if she took on ateam, if that was going to take
away her me time because now sheworried.
Valuing herself now.
She was valuing her me time andshe didn't know if taking on a
(27:48):
team versus just doing herduties as an executive was going
to interfere with that, but itactually didn't, so she started
out slowly.
It's not like they give you ateam of 20 to start with, so she
wound up with a small team, andthen as it grew.
She learned to trust thembecause she trained them.
So she learned to rely on othersto do their jobs, to know that
(28:12):
they're just as competent as sheis, and to know that everything
else will work out and that sheis there as backup for all these
things, but that she gets totake, her, she gets to make
herself just as valuable as allthe other things that she was
valuing more in the beginningwhen she first came to me.
So you helped her own her valueand her worth and delegate.
(28:35):
Wow.
That's profound, Jackie.
In six months.
That's, it just makes me feel sogood because, you work with
people, I work with people foryears and it's you can't really
take credit for it.
They're doing everything.
All you're doing.
They're doing the work, helpingthem remember all of that.
But it does make me feel good,right?
Oh my totally.
It totally makes you feel goodwhen you see them making these
(28:56):
things, you're like, oh my God,that's awesome.
And you're like cheering for'emon the sidelines.
You're like, that's so awesome.
I have goosebumps.
That's why I love this work.
I love watching people achieve.
You like the, that new level orreclaim their voice or, I got to
speak last week, Jackie, and itwas messy.
(29:16):
I was like, my dad just died.
I'm gonna get emotional.
I went off script, but I was soauthentic.
I had 65 women on the edge oftheir seats.
I was like doing comedy, thenmorphing into stories and it was
very unconventional, but it wasone of the best talks I've ever
given because there's something.
I always say like when I've hadsome of the best performances
(29:39):
when I'm sick or crying there,because there's something about
like vulnerable, the mask hasbeen taken off and it's this is
me real and raw.
You don't have to pretend,right?
Yeah.
And I'm always like, if you wantthe most perfect, poised,
polished speaker, coach, that'snot me.
But if you want authentic,funny, quirky human.
(30:01):
Sign me up.
But anyway, back to you, becauseI just think this work is so
important.
I know you shared another storyabout this woman,'cause I
remember the horses.
I remember what the horsehorses, because I think, again,
this is just a beautiful story.
So please tell us about thisperson.
(30:21):
Okay.
So I worked with this girlagain.
She wasn't she used to be in thecorporate world, but she decided
to become a stay-at-home mom,right?
So this is the complete oppositethan the executive, but they
were both moms.
So she was a stay at home mom,so she was feeling a little
resentful that, the, that thehusband got to go outta the
house and she had to do all thethings or whatever else.
(30:44):
And she was saying, stay athome.
Mom is so hard.
You're never done.
Yes.
You never are done.
Absolutely.
And she loved that.
She wanted to do that becauseshe wanted to spend time with
her children.
That was her dream.
And the fact that they could dothat, they, they had to buckle
up a little, but that they coulddo that.
She wanted that, but we all geta little resentful or jealous
when you're looking at thehusband gets to go out every
(31:05):
day.
They're covered in, whatever,like green peas and Yes,
whatever.
Exactly.
So at some point everybody getsa little resentful or jealous.
We're all human, right?
We all have emotions.
And so by the time she got tome, she was like, listen, I
chose this.
I wanted this, this is not, I'mnot like, I feel a little lost
and I'm getting and she wasgetting a little rageful about
(31:28):
it, right?
So she, she was having troublelike with her emotions as well,
right?
Sometimes we don't know what todo with it or what have you.
So we started there.
We started at okay, what'sreally going on?
And and people tend to eitherput our.
What we can't feel, there arebig stuff that we can't feel.
We use a placeholder, right?
So in her case, she was usingher husband as a placeholder for
(31:50):
her pain.
And so we needed to take thatback because it's not his fault
that he had a job and he wasbeing a good provider, right?
He just was doing what he'ssupposed to be doing, but she's
blaming him for all of itbecause it makes her feel good.
But now it's got a little riftin their relationship.
So that's not good, even thoughshe's the one who wants to be at
home.
But there's the other part ofher, like her soul or her joy
(32:10):
was like, I want, stuff too.
So she had all these innerturmoil about all of this.
She put it all on her husbandand first I had to, make her
recognize that it wasn't herhusband's fault, and that yes,
these were her choices and thefamily's choices, that they both
decided to do this and this iswhat they wanted and this is
what they're doing.
And she didn't really wannachange any of that.
(32:31):
But she also knew that shecouldn't keep going on the way
she was, she couldn't keep goingon blaming him and fighting with
him, especially in front of thekids.
It's not the life she wanted.
And again, it's just a matterof, getting to what's really
going on.
And then for me.
It's always coming back to whoyou really are.
And a lot of us, we just forget,we get busy, we have kids, we go
(32:52):
to work, we have a job wedevelop all these different
identities and we lose theoriginal identity that sometimes
gets lost at a very young age,especially if you come from a
lot of trauma.
The, that little girl or thatlittle boy that's inside that
used to like to go out and, playwith frogs or horses or
whatever.
And for her.
It was horses.
And for her, she was anequestrian jumper.
(33:15):
And I was like, are you kiddingme?
Or whatever you call it.
I don't remember exactly what itwas, but you know what I'm
saying?
She was an equestrian that didthe jumping things, right?
Yeah.
Hunting jump.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then she was like, no joke.
Yeah.
So I was like what did you usedto love as a kid?
And what was your joys?
And so she's like pulling outall the ribbons and the things,
and I was like, oh my God, thisis crazy.
So when was the last time youwere in front of a horse?
(33:36):
She's oh, I can't even tell you.
And I was like.
Why aren't you with a horse?
Oh, I don't have time for that.
I have, I don't have, we allnever have time.
We have no time.
But the whole point of us beingon the planet, I think, is to
come back.
It's a to love yourself andremember who you are, and to
give yourself all the love youwanna give to others.
You better be given to yourselffirst because.
(33:57):
That's your legacy right there.
Whether you have children or youdon't have children, that's your
legacy.
That's how you can be a walking,breathing example on the planet
is to love yourself.
That is the shining example.
So to do for everybody else, andyou're depleted.
That's not a legacy.
You're basically teachingeverybody in your life that
(34:17):
you're exhausted and andprobably gonna be, need to be on
meds someplace, it locked up ina psych ward that, that's not,
or burnt out or dying work.
Yeah.
That's not somebody's legacy.
That's not a legacy, I don'tthink.
Whatever you believe in that'sbigger than us is anybody's will
for anybody.
If our, if I feel like theuniverse's will for everybody is
(34:39):
to live in joy and peace and theremembrance of who we are, who
we really are, at a soul level,remember who you are and if
that's the case, we have to comeback to that.
We have to.
Come back to that and rememberwhat your joy was and what your
joy was when you were a littlekid is a great place to start.
It may not be where you end, butit's a great place to start.
(35:02):
Because that's gonna get youremembering.
Oh, I used to love that.
Like I was into photography.
I always thought I was gonna bea, still a a still photographer
on a movie set.
That was my thing.
I still love photography.
I am a photographer in my soul,will I ever get paid to be a
photographer or whatever?
I don't know.
Moving forward, who knows, butI've never, done the necessary
(35:25):
steps to take that anythingforward than what I have.
So for right now, it's a hobby,but that's in my soul, so you
move on to other things andother things become important.
Anyway, for her it was horses.
I said why don't you just go tothe stables and just scope it
out, like you don't have to doanything.
Oh no.
I can't do that.
And I go why?
Nobody's telling you gotta golike jump horses or anything,
but you can just go see a horse.
(35:46):
Nobody's telling you to sign upfor a show.
You have to go immediately tothe Olympics.
Yeah, no, yeah.
But in her head it went to, if Ican't be the number one rider
and have first place, then don'tdo anything.
It was all or nothing.
So then we had to deal withthat.
We had to break down the all ornothing thinking, and we had to
deal with all of that.
And we had to remember that itreally was about joy.
(36:06):
It wasn't about winningsomething, it was just about
remembering.
What she loved and what her soulloved and everything else.
And don't, she not only wentback to the horses and whatever,
she got back up.
She was in her little outfit,and she was jumping with the
horses and now she's got herdaughter involved.
Her kids are involved too, buther daughter is actually in the
(36:27):
shows and doing all the thingsthat she did when she was a kid.
But it's just so funny when yourmom.
Goes and finds her joy, whetherher daughter is ever gonna
continue in that she showed herby example to have joy in her
life again, and that sparked joyin her daughter.
And whatever it does for hersons, it doesn't matter whether
(36:47):
it's horses or not, you're justshowing them by example.
Joy, that's the point.
Show them what you love.
You're gonna be better ineverything, whether it's your
job, your home life, yourregular relationships, humans at
the food store.
But if you don't, we're allgonna be overwhelmed and
exhausted and in doom scroll,like too many things are, I love
(37:10):
that Jackie.
So I love that so much.
And it, having just lost aparent and.
My favorite parent, it's it justmakes you think about life is
precious and it is short.
Even though I have had periodswhere it seemed really long and
I was like, are we done?
I think, everybody if you'reawake and or we are unconscious,
(37:31):
we have those moments.
But I love that.
I do believe, I obviously, Ibelieve in a god, a higher
power, universal source, mothernature, whatever you want to
call.
And I believe that we are herelearning our lessons, and part
of the lesson is, can you findjoy amidst all the chaos and
(37:52):
craziness, right?
'cause when you can still giveyourself permission, right?
Then it gives other peoplepermission.
Because if we waited to haveeverything perfect.
You wouldn't get on stage, youwouldn't like, it's, there's
always gonna be humanity andchaos as long, I love that so
much.
Yeah.
That's here's tips and tricks 10 1, life is a big fat
(38:15):
distraction.
And if you get sucked in anddrink the Kool-Aid of the
distraction.
And if that's not clear enoughof what's going on in the
universe right now.
Life is trying to pull you awayfrom yourself.
To frighten you, to instill fearin you to instill chaos.
Chaos is great, right?
(38:36):
Chaos is great because it's adisruptor and it's a great
catalyst for change, but you getto decide what that change is
gonna be.
Are you gonna come from thefear-based and drink the
Kool-Aid and go into, anxietymode and things like that?
Or are you gonna come back towho you really are, which is
love and stillness and joy andcompassion?
(38:58):
And if you're not in thoseplaces, that's not who you are.
That's what life is trying toget you to be afraid.
So you make.
Decisions based from fearinstead of based, in your
stillness, oh, I love that.
Yeah.
No good decision is gonna bemade from fear.
I love that in the stillness.
(39:19):
I've done.
Like you, lots of energy workand I'm always like, the inner
critic, I have a couple ofvoices, my stepmother is still
there, lot of course.
And what I've learned for me iswhen I can get still, which is
hard for me when I have thissort of inner small voice, it
(39:42):
bubbles up.
And I have to be still andquiet.
That's my work.
Many times that is my higherself or what I would consider
God or my guardian angels.
And it's quiet.
It whispers.
And sometimes I'm like, couldyou make it louder, please?
(40:02):
But.
My, because I'm not my per, I'venever had a problem like sitting
on the couch and not, andprocrastinating.
I'm like a doer.
And my work, at least thislifetime, is to sit and be still
and to trust that and be withthe silence, and allow life to
have its day with you.
(40:23):
Not force and make up for longtime.
Wow.
That's the, I love it Jackie.
I is the doing the yin is theallowing right there has to be
allowing or there's no magic ifyou're constantly doing and
making it all happen.
Where's there room for the magicof God or whatever it is that
you believe in, or life toactually help you, to move you,
(40:45):
to integrate all of that.
If there's no allowing, ifyou're constantly doing, there
is no room for it.
Oh my gosh.
Okay.
Super quick story.
So I had my spleen taken out.
We found this huge cyst andblah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And then, this is years ago, andthe doctor, I was like it's not
cancer.
And he was like not yet.
And he was like, you're gonnaneed two weeks.
And I was like, two weeks.
(41:06):
And I had back to back shows andcollege conferences.
I was touring and you work sohard to get those gigs and if
you cancel, that's it.
That you are never, so I waslike, can I postpone it till
January?
And he was like.
I guess anyway, so I finallyhave to go.
I'll fall.
I have Christmas and then likeJanuary two I have my surgery
(41:27):
and it was, I have a scar, andall of a sudden I'm stuck at
home and I had all these peoplecoming over and bringing me food
and I was so touched andsurprised.
And I remember just thinking,wow, Elaine, you're always
searching for the love and ifyou can just sit, look what's
(41:50):
coming.
And it was so profound.
And of course I didn't, twoweeks and I was like, all right.
But it was such a cool,allowing, the universe was like,
you're gonna sit, anyway, I lovethis.
Okay, so Jackie, I know you workwith people one-on-one and you
also have these fabulous groups,a healing group and, or I'm
(42:13):
sorry, circles, empoweringcircles.
Can you tell us a little bitabout how those work?
Yeah, sure.
Obviously, I come from a bunchof different worlds, right?
So we have the regular street,smart world, and then we have
the woo world, right?
And sometimes they mix andsometimes they don't.
Right?
Sometimes woo people, I.
Non woowoo people don't likewoowoo people, so that's why I
(42:37):
have two, right?
Because I wanna be allinclusive, right?
So we have a healing circle thatmaybe we do some energy work and
some meditations and things likethat, and some processes to come
back to whatever, and then itbasically just opens up and then
it.
The group feeds off of eachother.
The power of groups is awesomebecause the energy of a group is
just amazing to me, and thetransformations that happen and
(42:58):
they're inexpensive, right?
And then the empowerment groupis for nonoo people where maybe
we'll do a guided meditation,but maybe not.
Maybe we just start off withHey, how's your week going?
And everybody shares aboutwhatever.
And again, it just gets intothat or what have you.
But there's not gonna be likeany energy work or anything like
that, so it doesn't turn offanybody.
So they're just too.
(43:19):
Two, pretty much opposite sidesof the same coin, so to speak.
They basically do the samething.
They help each other to you,help each other to relate and
hold each other accountable andall of that fun stuff.
And we get to see each other'sprogress and we get to see the
measurable results of thoseprogresses every week.
And that's pretty awesome.
(43:39):
And then there's other people,of course, that wanna work
one-on-one, and.
Some people wanna work for ashort time and other people are
like, no, I need you for a year.
And I'm the, teach man to fishperson.
I don't feel like people shouldneed you forever.
And even when they think theydo, you have to kinda, as the
good parent, kick'em out of thenest or what have you, but.
That's why I have differentthings, even for one-to-one,
(44:00):
whether it's three months, sixmonths, or a year.
But some people never need thatamount.
It's a personal thing.
I don't have cookie cut oranything.
Okay.
Love it.
And then there's other thingswhere we do events, where
they're lives and things likethat.
And.
Lately, for the past number ofyears I've been called to sacred
sites around the world andthings like that.
And every time I get back,whether it's friends or
(44:20):
colleagues or what have you, andthey're all like, that's so
interesting that you go to allthese things and nobody's paying
you and you just go to theseplaces and do this, fun rituals.
Stuff on the land, and then youcome back and bring all of that
back to us.
We wanna come, we wanna beinvolved.
So I have a feeling retreats aregoing to be Yes.
Into that.
And and then I, and I'm doing alot more podcasting and speaking
(44:41):
and things like that, so I'mputting myself out there, with
this whole camera thing, whichis my work.
I'm working through my camerafears and all of that fun stuff.
As I don't have a problemspeaking to anybody or even
speaking from a podium, but putme on that camera.
That's my work.
That's where we're all growingand learning and a lot of people
evolving.
Yeah.
Many people.
I have days where I'm like, ahso I'm gonna put how to get in
(45:05):
contact you in the show notesfor people.
Awesome.
Because I think you resonatewith a lot of high-powered women
who.
Maybe can't relate to the,everybody take a deep breath.
Those, I call oh, love and lightlooking bubble ladies.
And they're great.
They're great.
But I'm like, I'm more, you knowthis for, yeah, I'm a get it
done.
(45:25):
I'm a get it done kind of girltoo.
Like I said, I'm from Jersey,but I also, I'm a big believer
in work smarter, not harder, andsometimes we just need.
When you're in the middle ofsomething you can't see it.
You just need, outside reminder,I approach a different set of
eyes.
Exactly.
I just, I'm, I'm just amazedhow, one conversation could
completely woohoo.
Absolutely.
So Jackie, thank you so much forsharing your beautiful wisdom.
(45:49):
It's a pleasure.
Thanks for having me.
Client stories with people.
I just, I love your work.
I have a vision of us going to asacred place with other
fabulous.
Oh, I would love that.
And I really hope to see you atthe horse thing and anyway, to
be continued and everybody,thanks so much for listening and
(46:11):
please share this episode with awoman who needs to be inspired
or that this might resonate forher or a guy.
And please share, subscribe,rate, and review.
'cause that's how we get this.
Captivate the mic out to abigger.
Crowd and my vision likeJackie's is to help heal the
world.
(46:31):
One video, one story, oneperson, one client, one joke at
a time.
And so that's it.
Yeah.
Here we are.
Okay.
Bye everybody.
Thanks again.
Thanks Jackie.
Bye.
Remember who you are.
Hello and welcome to Captivatethe Mic with Elaine Williams
where we talk about confidence,storytelling, speaking, how to
be more effective, morepowerful.
I have amazing guests on, and Igive.
Tips and tricks and tools frombeing in the performance arena
for 50 plus years.
(00:26):
And I wanna tell you today, I amso excited.
I have a very special treat foryou.
This woman, her name is JackieGian, and she a client, a
friend, a colleague.
We had been working together fora while on her visibility.
And she's already an amazingdynamic speaker and we're doing
some work on video and in thisinterview she goes so deep into
(00:52):
people pleasing.
Why we do it.
If you grew up in dysfunction,how it's a survival skill and
how it can really be suckingyour soul and taking your power
away, and she gives some amazinginsights.
Every time I talk to her, I'mlike, woo.
So sit back, listen, take notes.
(01:13):
Please share this with somebodywho needs to hear it.
I know a lot of females, wewere.
Cultured and educated andgroomed to be people pleasers.
And there's some really powerfulinsights in this amazing and
dynamic interview.
So enjoy.
Thanks so much for being here.
I am so excited everybody.
(01:34):
I am here with the fabulous andamazing Jackie Grill on, is it
Grill on Grillin?
Yes.
I mean in French, to betechnical it's grill, but grill,
in America, I've been butchered.
It's grill on, it's grilling,it's turned the grill on,
whatever it was.
It's Jackie G.
(01:54):
There you go.
So everybody welcome.
This is Captivate the Mic, and Iam so delighted to share this
brilliant woman with mylisteners and viewers because
Jackie, you have done it all.
You have transformed yourselfagain and again.
(02:16):
We've both done a ton of workand I have never had anybody.
Break it down.
The people pleasing thing, likethere's some things that you
have spoken about,perfectionism, the people
pleasing, and how when you are agiver you attract the takers,
like you just have just laid itdown.
(02:37):
So eloquently and powerfully anda little bit like Woo.
But isn't that what we want Abitch slack of truth versus
something that's oh, that's anice thought to think about.
No, like I want to betransformed, so I call me on my
stuff.
Listen, that's the jersey.
(02:57):
I can't hold back from that.
I love it.
So tell us a little bit about.
Whatever you wanna say aboutyour evolution, if you will.
My evolution with peoplepleasing or evolution in
general.
Yeah.
Why don't you start at the,let's start at the very
(03:17):
beginning.
Okay.
No musical theater, Elaine.
Just tell us a little bit about,I know you grew up in
dysfunctional family, of course.
Does anything, whatever youwanna say about whatever you
wanna say about what led you tothis path.
Okay.
So when you grow up in a family,our parents did the best they
(03:38):
could with what they had.
My mom was probably notdiagnosed with a lot of
different things, just like I'veonly been diagnosed with some
certain things, right?
Our parents, were young.
My, my mom was 19 when she gotmarried, and my dad was 24.
They didn't have a clue what wasgoing on anyway.
So growing up, what I thoughtwas normal was anything but
(03:58):
normal.
There was a lot of yelling andscreaming in my house.
There was a lot of, my dad wasone to for punishing because he
didn't know how to handlechildren and neither did my mom.
And my mom would leave the roomand my dad would line us up to
span us.
So that was like, not a funtime.
So it was just like weird stufflike, but that was all normal.
(04:19):
I went to Catholic school,that's when, back in a time when
our parents basically paid tohave us abused physically,
mentally, and emotionally allday long.
It's not like my parents knewany better.
They think they're doing rightby their children paying to go
to, a private school, likethey're doing the right thing.
They have no idea the positionsthat they're putting us in.
The conditions and thecontainers that, I.
(04:41):
I was born into, were not,ideal.
They were ideal for, abuse andaddictions and avoidance and
dissociation and things likethat.
So of course I became a peoplepleaser.
Of course, let me do whatever Ican do to get you to pick me,
love me, and include me.
Just please don't abandon me,and Right.
Because you were being, that'show you survive Catholic school,
(05:04):
right?
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
So whatever I needed to do, andthen I basically begged my
parents to let me go to publicschool in seventh grade.
Because please give me Yes.
Gimme away from the nuns, right?
Yes.
It was terrible.
And out of the 30 that were inour class, only two of us got to
(05:25):
go to public school and wethought, wow, we have a ride.
Woo.
So now we have no idea what thisis gonna be like, right?
Because we've never done the goto a different class every
period thing.
We've never done the have 500people in your class.
We've had 30 people in our classfor whatever.
So that was a rude awakeningwhen I got into my first class,
homeroom of my first class,which was also like social
(05:47):
studies or something, history,whatever.
And they started saying, okay,so you know, here's the outline
of what we're gonna do thisyear.
Like we never had any of that.
And then it would be like, blah,blah, blah, blah, blah.
And you probably already learnedthis in third grade.
And I'm like, oh my God.
Oh my God.
Oh my God.
Oh my god.
And that's when I realized Idon't know anything.
What they teach you in Catholicschool is pretty much, they
(06:09):
shove religion down your throat.
They shame you and bait beat youand tell you to sit there and.
With a sin in your soul and allthe things.
And and then, now I get to thisbig school and I don't know
anything and plus I have allthese other things.
So who am I gonna talk to aboutall of that?
Yes, it was my childhood, so nowonder it led me into checking
out and addictions and peoplepleasing and all the things.
(06:33):
Yes.
And I think.
Addiction.
That's a whole, one woman showfor both of us.
Absolutely.
And I think so many people doget into recovery, which is
beautiful.
And then there's still so manyother things.
The codependency, the peoplepleasing, the, yeah.
(06:53):
Self-doubt.
We put down the drink, the drugthe men, the food.
Shopping, the, all that.
But then there's so many otherlayers and I think you and I
have talked about this before,like we do things to survive our
families.
'cause we can't move out'causewe're 10, right?
Whatever.
And so we discount the pain.
(07:14):
It's not that bad.
We keep going.
We pour our hearts into theschool or to musicals or
performing or whatever,cheerleading, sports, and then.
But you've gotten used todiscounting and then what
happens with so many women thatI've worked with, and same for
you.
You have these adult women whoare doing amazing things and
(07:37):
they're like it's not that, theystill are discounting things.
So it's like, what served yougrowing up is not serving you
now.
So I feel like so much of.
The work that you and I both dois helping people unlearn the
things that served you untilthey didn't, right?
So stop discounting yourbadassness and the fact that you
(08:00):
have 53 degrees, or that youconquered a mountain or that
you've bounced back from.
Whatever.
Dating not great men, right?
So let's get into, I think I'vedone all of those things you
just mentioned.
For those of you listening Ijust lost my father a couple of
(08:21):
weeks ago.
And I've, I've been givingmyself grace and crying, but
boy, I am like, Elaine, you needto break up with sugar.
It is time.
It's just, there's a way tocomfort yourself and then you're
like, okay, this is actuallyhurting me.
It's not serving me.
Never a dull moment.
But I Absolutely.
Somebody said sometimes you'lldo the old behaviors, but not as
(08:45):
long or as much.
Or not to the Detri, of course.
Of course.
Because once you can't pretendyou don't know anymore, right?
Whether, let's just say forinstance, a guy, a guy who's
abused you or whatever.
It doesn't mean that you're notgonna pick another one.
If you haven't healed any of thethings that attracted them to
begin with, you're going to pickanother one.
(09:05):
It's just how it is.
You're gonna work it out withone person for 30 years or 20
people.
20 different people, but it'sthe same lesson.
You're gonna work it out.
The difference is that you'llsee it coming.
Yes.
And then the more you feel thatparticular trigger issue,
whatever it is it will become,like I said, you see it a lot
(09:25):
quicker, so you're not gonnastay in it as long.
So whether it's.
Picking a bad relationship or abad job or sitting in self pity,
you're just not going to wantthat as long.
The more you heal, the moreself-esteem and self-worth and
just your inherent ness of beingworthy to be an existent human
(09:47):
on the planet goes up when that,goes up, you won't tolerate that
kind of stuff anymore.
Oh, I love that.
Thank you.
I'll have some of that please.
Thank you, Jackie.
I love it.
That's so beautifully said.
And some of the things that youhave said about really all of
the things you've said aboutpeople pleasing, just pierced my
(10:10):
soul and my heart, can you speakto, can you share one of the
stories of the people you'vehelped or tell us a little bit
about the people pleasing,because I think so many women
struggle with that and men are.
Yeah, people pleasing is a bigone.
Whether it's in your personallife, whether it's at work, and
(10:31):
if you even have it to a littlebit of a degree, whether you
grew up with it or you just doit in work because you don't
wanna make waves at work, right?
Or you're looking to get ahead.
We tend to, say yes when we meanno or say no when we mean yes.
And it gets a little muddled andconfusing for people who aren't
even full-blown people pleasers.
But when you come from abackground of codependency and
(10:54):
addiction and secrets and thingslike that, it's definitely more
prevalent because everybody'snever being their true selves.
And if you're not being yourtrue self, you're people
pleasing somebody.
And now a quick word.
You know the best way to growyour business and your brand is
to be out there speaking,whether it's on stage, in
(11:15):
meetings, on camera, but maybeyour talk isn't really landing.
Are people running?
To the back of the room to comesign up for your thing.
When you go on podcasts as aguest, are you growing your list
every time you're on a newpodcast, because people hear you
and they hear a compelling storythat moves them to take action
(11:38):
and grab the freebie that you'reoffering, so that you're going
your email list.
If you've answered no then weshould have a talk.
What I have found from workingwith amazing, brilliant feminine
leaders for many years now issometimes.
Leaders can get a little tooserious or too intense or too
(12:00):
attached to all their content,but it's in the book.
But this, they love this part,we don't want too much.
You can have the best content inthe world, but if you're fire
hosing them.
It doesn't matter.
And sometimes you're too closeto the material to have any
objectivity.
One of my superpowers is to pullapart keynotes that aren't
(12:21):
working, pull apart stories thathave gotten stale, pull apart
videos series that aren'tlanding so that we can see how
can we infuse some humor, howcan we infuse emotion?
Which causes people to takeaction.
And maybe we need to take outsome of the data or content if
(12:42):
it's too much, or maybe it canbe said in a more compelling,
concise, pithy way.
So if this is resonating withyou, I encourage you to find my
scheduler.
It's in the show notes.
I would love to have a quickzoom call with you.
No pressure, and we can justfind out.
Where you are, what's going on,and if maybe it's time for a
(13:05):
little revision or a littlebreath of fresh air, a little
humor infusion.
So now let's go back to the showSo in the land of people
pleasing.
It's tough because you've set itup that way, whether it's
(13:27):
conscious or unconscious.
For me, personally, myunderlying thing, when I was
people pleasing, I would doanything for anybody that I
cared about and I still will.
The difference was, is back thenthe unconscious part was I was
doing it to my detriment.
I would give.
I wasn't taking care of myself.
(13:47):
I would give to avoid looking atmyself, and I would give because
I needed you to like me, and Ineeded you to pick me, include
me, whatever it was.
I needed something from you.
I didn't realize that at thetime.
I thought I was just thiswonderful person because it was
my only sense of self-esteem.
(14:08):
Me doing for you.
Made me feel good about me.
That's still a benefit.
So I don't even know.
I'm using you for self-esteem.
So it's still me looking to theoutside to make myself feel
better, and it's a brilliantdistraction from looking at my
own stuff.
But it's the only way I know tohave self-esteem at that time,
(14:30):
which I just think ding ding.
Everybody like, it's sobrilliant how you said it.
It's it's great to be acts ofservice and to be generous of,
but if you're doing itunconsciously Yeah, as a way to
make yourself feel good.
And that's the only way you cando that.
(14:51):
That's a.
Dangerous formula.
Ask me how I know I have thebumper sticker and the T-shirt.
That's the problem.
You don't know.
You don't know that when you'redoing it.
It's not until you haveproblems.
Everybody talks about you're notgonna look at anything unless
you have a problem with it.
And even then some people arelike no.
La.
It's not really happening.
But it's not until.
(15:12):
You're doing all these thingsfor people and they're not
appreciating it, they are stillleaving.
They're not doing anything backfor you.
There's nothing reciprocal, andyou realize that pretty much
every relationship you're in isone sided, then you have a
problem.
Because now you're gettingdrained and now you're the you
(15:34):
who's the wonderful givingperson that you are, even though
you haven't looked at yourmotives yet is getting drained,
and now you're resentful,bitter, and angry at the same
people that you're doing allthis for because they're not
even appreciating you, let alonegiving you a thank you, which.
Was my setup to begin withbecause I expected at least a
thank you or appreciate.
(15:55):
Oh, yes, boy, bye.
I, Debbie Ford used to talkabout do you give to get Right.
And I am.
I've been in recovery a longtime.
Not as long as you, when peoplesay, check your motives.
That didn't resonate with me.
I didn't.
It just, sometimes there'scertain phrases that you're
like, yeah.
I'm a good person, blah, blah,blah.
(16:16):
Yeah.
And I still struggle with this,when I give somebody a tip, like
at the coffee place, I'm like.
I want everybody to see that I'mgiving a tip, like I've done
that.
Or you wait to hand it to themso they see how wonderful you
walk.
I'm really, but I want, I don'twant just the coffee person to
see me.
(16:36):
I want every oh, that'shilarious.
It's so pathetic.
I'm just being vulnerable.
Here.
There is a part of me that's.
Still like when I worked at theSteakhouse for 15 years, I loved
being loved.
I walked in and it was like,Elaine's here, now we can work.
There's a part of me that'sstill a recovering drama queen
(16:57):
and a recovering people pleaser,and I guess.
The great news and part of thiswas out of conversations with
you, Jackie.
Oh.
And I'm catching myself more andI'm, I am really, truly trying
to give.
Just to give.
And if forget a thank you,awesome.
(17:19):
But for many years I wouldoverestimate friendships.
Like I'll never forget.
I let this woman who I hardlyknow come stay at.
I had just bought my house, justbought my house.
It was my brand new three familyhouse.
I saved living in a one roomstudio for three years, and I go
(17:41):
away on a trip.
And I let her stay at my house.
Like looking back, I'm like,what an idiot.
And then I thought we were goodfriends.
And then when she got married, Iwasn't invited and I was so
offended and, multiply thattimes a hundred.
And that's been a process for meand I'm sharing this with people
(18:02):
because I do see this.
With women in business inparticular absolutely.
Especially women in business,right?
Because men don't have to.
People please.
They have their boys club thinggoing on, so it's a little
different.
Women have it.
Much tougher in business.
So you're gonna see a lot morewomen, people pleasing and not
(18:22):
sticking up for themselvesbecause they're, if they voice
their truths, the way that mendo whatever it is, whether it's,
something that adds or.
Something that could potentiallyhurt the business.
They're going to be viewed a lotdifferent.
They're going to be labeled, sothey put on their best.
And I'm not saying it's fullblown people pleasing, but it
(18:45):
is, and you are.
Every single time you do that,you're abandoning yourself.
You don't think.
Are, but you are, you'resacrificing something.
You're selling your soul evenjust a little bit.
But it's for work.
Oh, I just don't wanna makewaves.
Oh, it's this.
Oh, it's that.
But each one of those littlethings will niggle at you or not
you just a little bit at somepoint.
(19:07):
It's like an un undermining ofself.
Yes.
And you make it okay until youdon't make it.
Okay.
So somebody like me who is afull blown.
Whatever you need.
Please just love me.
As needy as they come, doormatto be the person who's standing
in front of you, who is clearlynot like I overshare, I over
(19:29):
stick up for myself and advocatefor others to the point where I
know people are looking at mesideways and I can get in
trouble for that, but it's likethere's that, rebellious part of
me that's I'm not gonna besilenced ever again.
And here's where I love usinghumor, right?
So I first started becomingaware of this when I was working
(19:49):
at this steakhouse.
And, I had some super closefriends and some sort of
friends, and then some peoplethat were just like, you stay
over there, and I remember.
Trying to set a boundary aboutsomething and it was so awkward.
I was so like, ugh and thenluckily the next day I could go
to that friend and say, you knowwhat?
(20:11):
I'm sorry.
I'm so awkward.
I'm really working onboundaries.
And I just am like, Ugh.
And we laughed about it.
Now, obviously you cannot dothat with certain people,
especially if they're aauthority figure, but yeah,
being able to laugh when you'rein what I, like the transf, the
goo of the butterfly, right?
(20:32):
Yeah.
All those times when you feellike I'm growing and it's like
I'm growing out of my skin and Ifeel weird, if you can use some
humor with yourself, absolutely.
And with the people that, that'ssuch a gift.
Now, Jackie, that's tough,right?
Because when you're in themiddle of changing anything,
people pleasing any issue thatyou're working on, right?
(20:53):
It's I'm changing and I forgotto tell people, and it's not
like I need to tell people, butpeople are like who the heck are
you?
One minute you're doing this andnow you're not doing that.
You always say yes.
And now you're telling me no.
Yes.
And then that's the thing.
So when a people pleaser stops,people pleasing, if you're in
one side of relationships,they're all gonna go because
those takers need to go takefrom somebody else.
They're not in a re, they neversigned up for a reciprocal
(21:15):
relationship.
They gotta go.
So that's when you really findout.
What's really going on.
But it's also heartbreaking,right?
Because that immediately throwsyou into deep grief into what my
whole life was a lie.
And then you have to look at thefact that you've set it up that
way.
That yeah, your life was liebecause you weren't even being
yourself.
You were people pleasing them.
You weren't even being you atthe time.
(21:38):
So it does start a wholeprocess, but it's also the
beginning of.
It was very painful when Ithought that I was beloved and
all these things.
Yeah.
And I do have some people thatI've stayed in touch with, but
of course it was a big realityshift Yeah.
Of the story that I thought, wetell ourselves these things and
(22:01):
then the truth comes out andit's whoa, jackie, you have
shared with me so many clientsuccess stories.
We could go on and on.
I would love to hear about thewoman who you helped her with
one thing and as a side effect,she lost a hundred pounds.
But I just love this story andwe don't have to say her name,
(22:22):
but can you just tell us thisfabulous story.
Yeah, so she came to me becauseshe had a lot going on with work
and home and family and tryingto juggle it all, as women do
you know?
And trying to be the super momand the super wife and the, the
super, why can't I think ofperfect woman?
(22:43):
Yeah.
She's not a worker, but like inher job, her, her I don't know
why I'm losing my words, hertitle.
That what I'm saying.
Yes.
Yeah.
She's, an executive, right?
So she has to, it's, there's alot of.
What it looks like in thisworld, right?
It's all about smoke andmirrors.
Just look at social media.
Unfortunately, it's all smokeand mirrors, and we
unfortunately compare ouroutsides to the insides, and
(23:04):
that's where we get in trouble,right?
We all wanna be what it lookslike, and none of it is for
real, right?
There is no super mom, there isno whatever.
You do the best you can and youjuggle as much as you can, but
when somebody comes to you andthey're like, what's wrong with
me?
That I don't have it alltogether.
And I'm like, yeah, welcome tothe rest of us.
(23:24):
Yeah.
No, nobody has it together.
Nobody gave me the answers.
Nobody gave my parents theanswers.
I have fumbled through it all.
Any successes I've had in mylife is because I had to go
through all the pain and themuck like you were talking about
earlier, and the heartbreak andthe, the trial and error, I
haven't learned, I've onlylearned things from things.
That I've messed up or I've donewrong.
(23:45):
I don't learn when life is justhanded to me.
I, there's no lessons there.
Everything was hard fought andand definitely earned.
So when she comes to me and shetells me she's burnt out and she
has all these things done right,first, we have to.
Regulate, right?
So the first thing you gotta dois get them back regulated into
their nervous system, into theirbody.
Help them remember like why theygot their job, why they became a
(24:08):
mother, why they became a wife,why, just remember little things
here and there just to get youback into yourself because
they're so out there about whatthey should be doing, and they
have all these balls in the airand you're out outwardly
focused, which is how women aresocialized, especially exactly.
Everybody wants to keep allthese balls in the air and we're
terrified to just let the ballsfall down because if we let the
(24:31):
balls fall down, we are soterrified that who will do that
job?
If I'm an executive, I'mdefinitely thinking they're just
gonna replace me with somebodyelse.
And, it's not, it'll probably bea guy or whatever.
I'm gonna be, replace in twoseconds.
And then if, if I don't takecare of my husband, you know
he's gonna divorce me and mykids will always love me,
(24:51):
whatever.
So the only person that I know,who still wants something for me
is my dogs.
That's how she felt, right?
She had these pugs at home likethat.
As much as she knew everybodyelse, loved her, cared about
her, and all that things, sheknew the only unconditional love
she was getting really was fromher pugs.
And she still had to feed them,so she still had to do things,
so I feel like, so theredefinitely was no time for her.
(25:14):
So anyway, long story short, westarted just slowly.
Not so slowly.
'cause this really only took sixmonths and then at the end of a
year, she didn't even reallyneed to work with me after six
months.
But she was feeling so good.
And as a byproduct of her comingback into herself, remembering
who she is, what she reallyliked in her life, remembering
what her joy and what her soulwanted for her, remembering all
(25:38):
of that.
She started making differentlifestyle choices, because she
was working so much andeverything else, she was like
eating on the go, so she wasn'teating right and all the other
things.
She wound up losing a hundredpounds just because she just
started paying attention toherself for the first time in a
long time.
She wasn't even like looking forthat.
That just was a byproduct.
She was working out.
She started, the endorphins areflowing.
(25:59):
Everything is, she's feelinggood about herself, the home
life.
All of a sudden, all this timethat we say we don't have, she
has extra time for herself forworking out.
Her job is still getting done.
Only she's now a more productiveperson at work.
More energized and focused.
Yeah, so she's actually bringingin more money at work.
(26:19):
She was so de terrified ofletting the balls fall that she
was gonna lose her job, letalone get a ccc, a CA C-suite
position.
Like you don't think, you thinkall of our fears about what
we're gonna lose all ourself-centered fears, right?
Either somebody's gonna takesomething we have or we're not
gonna get something we want, orwhatever else.
(26:40):
And that's our self-centeredfear dinging.
Brilliant.
Yes, of course.
If you let the balls fall, it'soh my God, what's gonna happen?
We always make it worse in ourhead, or at least I do.
So when we just.
Let one ball fall, in a safeplace like at home and realize
your husband's not gonna leave.
The kids are fine, the dogs arefed and blah, blah, blah.
And and you could still work outa little or you could still
(27:01):
whatever.
Then you can start implementing'em in places that you're really
terrified at.
And for her, it was work.
Like she thought like she wouldlose her job or lose her
position or lose her whatever.
And she didn't.
She wound up, being promotedand.
Being in charge of a whole teamthat she didn't even have
before, that she didn't eventhink she could, and she was
hesitant to take that partbecause she didn't, she was.
(27:25):
So used to now taking care ofherself and letting the family
work on its own and letting thejob work on its own, like
working smarter, not harder.
Wow.
She wasn't sure if she took on ateam, if that was going to take
away her me time because now sheworried.
Valuing herself now.
She was valuing her me time andshe didn't know if taking on a
(27:48):
team versus just doing herduties as an executive was going
to interfere with that, but itactually didn't, so she started
out slowly.
It's not like they give you ateam of 20 to start with, so she
wound up with a small team, andthen as it grew.
She learned to trust thembecause she trained them.
So she learned to rely on othersto do their jobs, to know that
(28:12):
they're just as competent as sheis, and to know that everything
else will work out and that sheis there as backup for all these
things, but that she gets totake, her, she gets to make
herself just as valuable as allthe other things that she was
valuing more in the beginningwhen she first came to me.
So you helped her own her valueand her worth and delegate.
(28:35):
Wow.
That's profound, Jackie.
In six months.
That's, it just makes me feel sogood because, you work with
people, I work with people foryears and it's you can't really
take credit for it.
They're doing everything.
All you're doing.
They're doing the work, helpingthem remember all of that.
But it does make me feel good,right?
Oh my totally.
It totally makes you feel goodwhen you see them making these
(28:56):
things, you're like, oh my God,that's awesome.
And you're like cheering for'emon the sidelines.
You're like, that's so awesome.
I have goosebumps.
That's why I love this work.
I love watching people achieve.
You like the, that new level orreclaim their voice or, I got to
speak last week, Jackie, and itwas messy.
(29:16):
I was like, my dad just died.
I'm gonna get emotional.
I went off script, but I was soauthentic.
I had 65 women on the edge oftheir seats.
I was like doing comedy, thenmorphing into stories and it was
very unconventional, but it wasone of the best talks I've ever
given because there's something.
I always say like when I've hadsome of the best performances
(29:39):
when I'm sick or crying there,because there's something about
like vulnerable, the mask hasbeen taken off and it's this is
me real and raw.
You don't have to pretend,right?
Yeah.
And I'm always like, if you wantthe most perfect, poised,
polished speaker, coach, that'snot me.
But if you want authentic,funny, quirky human.
(30:01):
Sign me up.
But anyway, back to you, becauseI just think this work is so
important.
I know you shared another storyabout this woman,'cause I
remember the horses.
I remember what the horsehorses, because I think, again,
this is just a beautiful story.
So please tell us about thisperson.
(30:21):
Okay.
So I worked with this girlagain.
She wasn't she used to be in thecorporate world, but she decided
to become a stay-at-home mom,right?
So this is the complete oppositethan the executive, but they
were both moms.
So she was a stay at home mom,so she was feeling a little
resentful that, the, that thehusband got to go outta the
house and she had to do all thethings or whatever else.
(30:44):
And she was saying, stay athome.
Mom is so hard.
You're never done.
Yes.
You never are done.
Absolutely.
And she loved that.
She wanted to do that becauseshe wanted to spend time with
her children.
That was her dream.
And the fact that they could dothat, they, they had to buckle
up a little, but that they coulddo that.
She wanted that, but we all geta little resentful or jealous
when you're looking at thehusband gets to go out every
(31:05):
day.
They're covered in, whatever,like green peas and Yes,
whatever.
Exactly.
So at some point everybody getsa little resentful or jealous.
We're all human, right?
We all have emotions.
And so by the time she got tome, she was like, listen, I
chose this.
I wanted this, this is not, I'mnot like, I feel a little lost
and I'm getting and she wasgetting a little rageful about
(31:28):
it, right?
So she, she was having troublelike with her emotions as well,
right?
Sometimes we don't know what todo with it or what have you.
So we started there.
We started at okay, what'sreally going on?
And and people tend to eitherput our.
What we can't feel, there arebig stuff that we can't feel.
We use a placeholder, right?
So in her case, she was usingher husband as a placeholder for
(31:50):
her pain.
And so we needed to take thatback because it's not his fault
that he had a job and he wasbeing a good provider, right?
He just was doing what he'ssupposed to be doing, but she's
blaming him for all of itbecause it makes her feel good.
But now it's got a little riftin their relationship.
So that's not good, even thoughshe's the one who wants to be at
home.
But there's the other part ofher, like her soul or her joy
(32:10):
was like, I want, stuff too.
So she had all these innerturmoil about all of this.
She put it all on her husbandand first I had to, make her
recognize that it wasn't herhusband's fault, and that yes,
these were her choices and thefamily's choices, that they both
decided to do this and this iswhat they wanted and this is
what they're doing.
And she didn't really wannachange any of that.
(32:31):
But she also knew that shecouldn't keep going on the way
she was, she couldn't keep goingon blaming him and fighting with
him, especially in front of thekids.
It's not the life she wanted.
And again, it's just a matterof, getting to what's really
going on.
And then for me.
It's always coming back to whoyou really are.
And a lot of us, we just forget,we get busy, we have kids, we go
(32:52):
to work, we have a job wedevelop all these different
identities and we lose theoriginal identity that sometimes
gets lost at a very young age,especially if you come from a
lot of trauma.
The, that little girl or thatlittle boy that's inside that
used to like to go out and, playwith frogs or horses or
whatever.
And for her.
It was horses.
And for her, she was anequestrian jumper.
(33:15):
And I was like, are you kiddingme?
Or whatever you call it.
I don't remember exactly what itwas, but you know what I'm
saying?
She was an equestrian that didthe jumping things, right?
Yeah.
Hunting jump.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then she was like, no joke.
Yeah.
So I was like what did you usedto love as a kid?
And what was your joys?
And so she's like pulling outall the ribbons and the things,
and I was like, oh my God, thisis crazy.
So when was the last time youwere in front of a horse?
(33:36):
She's oh, I can't even tell you.
And I was like.
Why aren't you with a horse?
Oh, I don't have time for that.
I have, I don't have, we allnever have time.
We have no time.
But the whole point of us beingon the planet, I think, is to
come back.
It's a to love yourself andremember who you are, and to
give yourself all the love youwanna give to others.
You better be given to yourselffirst because.
(33:57):
That's your legacy right there.
Whether you have children or youdon't have children, that's your
legacy.
That's how you can be a walking,breathing example on the planet
is to love yourself.
That is the shining example.
So to do for everybody else, andyou're depleted.
That's not a legacy.
You're basically teachingeverybody in your life that
(34:17):
you're exhausted and andprobably gonna be, need to be on
meds someplace, it locked up ina psych ward that, that's not,
or burnt out or dying work.
Yeah.
That's not somebody's legacy.
That's not a legacy, I don'tthink.
Whatever you believe in that'sbigger than us is anybody's will
for anybody.
If our, if I feel like theuniverse's will for everybody is
(34:39):
to live in joy and peace and theremembrance of who we are, who
we really are, at a soul level,remember who you are and if
that's the case, we have to comeback to that.
We have to.
Come back to that and rememberwhat your joy was and what your
joy was when you were a littlekid is a great place to start.
It may not be where you end, butit's a great place to start.
(35:02):
Because that's gonna get youremembering.
Oh, I used to love that.
Like I was into photography.
I always thought I was gonna bea, still a a still photographer
on a movie set.
That was my thing.
I still love photography.
I am a photographer in my soul,will I ever get paid to be a
photographer or whatever?
I don't know.
Moving forward, who knows, butI've never, done the necessary
(35:25):
steps to take that anythingforward than what I have.
So for right now, it's a hobby,but that's in my soul, so you
move on to other things andother things become important.
Anyway, for her it was horses.
I said why don't you just go tothe stables and just scope it
out, like you don't have to doanything.
Oh no.
I can't do that.
And I go why?
Nobody's telling you gotta golike jump horses or anything,
but you can just go see a horse.
(35:46):
Nobody's telling you to sign upfor a show.
You have to go immediately tothe Olympics.
Yeah, no, yeah.
But in her head it went to, if Ican't be the number one rider
and have first place, then don'tdo anything.
It was all or nothing.
So then we had to deal withthat.
We had to break down the all ornothing thinking, and we had to
deal with all of that.
And we had to remember that itreally was about joy.
(36:06):
It wasn't about winningsomething, it was just about
remembering.
What she loved and what her soulloved and everything else.
And don't, she not only wentback to the horses and whatever,
she got back up.
She was in her little outfit,and she was jumping with the
horses and now she's got herdaughter involved.
Her kids are involved too, buther daughter is actually in the
(36:27):
shows and doing all the thingsthat she did when she was a kid.
But it's just so funny when yourmom.
Goes and finds her joy, whetherher daughter is ever gonna
continue in that she showed herby example to have joy in her
life again, and that sparked joyin her daughter.
And whatever it does for hersons, it doesn't matter whether
(36:47):
it's horses or not, you're justshowing them by example.
Joy, that's the point.
Show them what you love.
You're gonna be better ineverything, whether it's your
job, your home life, yourregular relationships, humans at
the food store.
But if you don't, we're allgonna be overwhelmed and
exhausted and in doom scroll,like too many things are, I love
(37:10):
that Jackie.
So I love that so much.
And it, having just lost aparent and.
My favorite parent, it's it justmakes you think about life is
precious and it is short.
Even though I have had periodswhere it seemed really long and
I was like, are we done?
I think, everybody if you'reawake and or we are unconscious,
(37:31):
we have those moments.
But I love that.
I do believe, I obviously, Ibelieve in a god, a higher
power, universal source, mothernature, whatever you want to
call.
And I believe that we are herelearning our lessons, and part
of the lesson is, can you findjoy amidst all the chaos and
(37:52):
craziness, right?
'cause when you can still giveyourself permission, right?
Then it gives other peoplepermission.
Because if we waited to haveeverything perfect.
You wouldn't get on stage, youwouldn't like, it's, there's
always gonna be humanity andchaos as long, I love that so
much.
Yeah.
That's here's tips and tricks 10 1, life is a big fat
(38:15):
distraction.
And if you get sucked in anddrink the Kool-Aid of the
distraction.
And if that's not clear enoughof what's going on in the
universe right now.
Life is trying to pull you awayfrom yourself.
To frighten you, to instill fearin you to instill chaos.
Chaos is great, right?
(38:36):
Chaos is great because it's adisruptor and it's a great
catalyst for change, but you getto decide what that change is
gonna be.
Are you gonna come from thefear-based and drink the
Kool-Aid and go into, anxietymode and things like that?
Or are you gonna come back towho you really are, which is
love and stillness and joy andcompassion?
(38:58):
And if you're not in thoseplaces, that's not who you are.
That's what life is trying toget you to be afraid.
So you make.
Decisions based from fearinstead of based, in your
stillness, oh, I love that.
Yeah.
No good decision is gonna bemade from fear.
I love that in the stillness.
(39:19):
I've done.
Like you, lots of energy workand I'm always like, the inner
critic, I have a couple ofvoices, my stepmother is still
there, lot of course.
And what I've learned for me iswhen I can get still, which is
hard for me when I have thissort of inner small voice, it
(39:42):
bubbles up.
And I have to be still andquiet.
That's my work.
Many times that is my higherself or what I would consider
God or my guardian angels.
And it's quiet.
It whispers.
And sometimes I'm like, couldyou make it louder, please?
(40:02):
But.
My, because I'm not my per, I'venever had a problem like sitting
on the couch and not, andprocrastinating.
I'm like a doer.
And my work, at least thislifetime, is to sit and be still
and to trust that and be withthe silence, and allow life to
have its day with you.
(40:23):
Not force and make up for longtime.
Wow.
That's the, I love it Jackie.
I is the doing the yin is theallowing right there has to be
allowing or there's no magic ifyou're constantly doing and
making it all happen.
Where's there room for the magicof God or whatever it is that
you believe in, or life toactually help you, to move you,
(40:45):
to integrate all of that.
If there's no allowing, ifyou're constantly doing, there
is no room for it.
Oh my gosh.
Okay.
Super quick story.
So I had my spleen taken out.
We found this huge cyst andblah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And then, this is years ago, andthe doctor, I was like it's not
cancer.
And he was like not yet.
And he was like, you're gonnaneed two weeks.
And I was like, two weeks.
(41:06):
And I had back to back shows andcollege conferences.
I was touring and you work sohard to get those gigs and if
you cancel, that's it.
That you are never, so I waslike, can I postpone it till
January?
And he was like.
I guess anyway, so I finallyhave to go.
I'll fall.
I have Christmas and then likeJanuary two I have my surgery
(41:27):
and it was, I have a scar, andall of a sudden I'm stuck at
home and I had all these peoplecoming over and bringing me food
and I was so touched andsurprised.
And I remember just thinking,wow, Elaine, you're always
searching for the love and ifyou can just sit, look what's
(41:50):
coming.
And it was so profound.
And of course I didn't, twoweeks and I was like, all right.
But it was such a cool,allowing, the universe was like,
you're gonna sit, anyway, I lovethis.
Okay, so Jackie, I know you workwith people one-on-one and you
also have these fabulous groups,a healing group and, or I'm
(42:13):
sorry, circles, empoweringcircles.
Can you tell us a little bitabout how those work?
Yeah, sure.
Obviously, I come from a bunchof different worlds, right?
So we have the regular street,smart world, and then we have
the woo world, right?
And sometimes they mix andsometimes they don't.
Right?
Sometimes woo people, I.
Non woowoo people don't likewoowoo people, so that's why I
(42:37):
have two, right?
Because I wanna be allinclusive, right?
So we have a healing circle thatmaybe we do some energy work and
some meditations and things likethat, and some processes to come
back to whatever, and then itbasically just opens up and then
it.
The group feeds off of eachother.
The power of groups is awesomebecause the energy of a group is
just amazing to me, and thetransformations that happen and
(42:58):
they're inexpensive, right?
And then the empowerment groupis for nonoo people where maybe
we'll do a guided meditation,but maybe not.
Maybe we just start off withHey, how's your week going?
And everybody shares aboutwhatever.
And again, it just gets intothat or what have you.
But there's not gonna be likeany energy work or anything like
that, so it doesn't turn offanybody.
So they're just too.
(43:19):
Two, pretty much opposite sidesof the same coin, so to speak.
They basically do the samething.
They help each other to you,help each other to relate and
hold each other accountable andall of that fun stuff.
And we get to see each other'sprogress and we get to see the
measurable results of thoseprogresses every week.
And that's pretty awesome.
(43:39):
And then there's other people,of course, that wanna work
one-on-one, and.
Some people wanna work for ashort time and other people are
like, no, I need you for a year.
And I'm the, teach man to fishperson.
I don't feel like people shouldneed you forever.
And even when they think theydo, you have to kinda, as the
good parent, kick'em out of thenest or what have you, but.
That's why I have differentthings, even for one-to-one,
(44:00):
whether it's three months, sixmonths, or a year.
But some people never need thatamount.
It's a personal thing.
I don't have cookie cut oranything.
Okay.
Love it.
And then there's other thingswhere we do events, where
they're lives and things likethat.
And.
Lately, for the past number ofyears I've been called to sacred
sites around the world andthings like that.
And every time I get back,whether it's friends or
(44:20):
colleagues or what have you, andthey're all like, that's so
interesting that you go to allthese things and nobody's paying
you and you just go to theseplaces and do this, fun rituals.
Stuff on the land, and then youcome back and bring all of that
back to us.
We wanna come, we wanna beinvolved.
So I have a feeling retreats aregoing to be Yes.
Into that.
And and then I, and I'm doing alot more podcasting and speaking
(44:41):
and things like that, so I'mputting myself out there, with
this whole camera thing, whichis my work.
I'm working through my camerafears and all of that fun stuff.
As I don't have a problemspeaking to anybody or even
speaking from a podium, but putme on that camera.
That's my work.
That's where we're all growingand learning and a lot of people
evolving.
Yeah.
Many people.
I have days where I'm like, ahso I'm gonna put how to get in
(45:05):
contact you in the show notesfor people.
Awesome.
Because I think you resonatewith a lot of high-powered women
who.
Maybe can't relate to the,everybody take a deep breath.
Those, I call oh, love and lightlooking bubble ladies.
And they're great.
They're great.
But I'm like, I'm more, you knowthis for, yeah, I'm a get it
done.
(45:25):
I'm a get it done kind of girltoo.
Like I said, I'm from Jersey,but I also, I'm a big believer
in work smarter, not harder, andsometimes we just need.
When you're in the middle ofsomething you can't see it.
You just need, outside reminder,I approach a different set of
eyes.
Exactly.
I just, I'm, I'm just amazedhow, one conversation could
completely woohoo.
Absolutely.
So Jackie, thank you so much forsharing your beautiful wisdom.
(45:49):
It's a pleasure.
Thanks for having me.
Client stories with people.
I just, I love your work.
I have a vision of us going to asacred place with other
fabulous.
Oh, I would love that.
And I really hope to see you atthe horse thing and anyway, to
be continued and everybody,thanks so much for listening and
(46:11):
please share this episode with awoman who needs to be inspired
or that this might resonate forher or a guy.
And please share, subscribe,rate, and review.
'cause that's how we get this.
Captivate the mic out to abigger.
Crowd and my vision likeJackie's is to help heal the
world.
(46:31):
One video, one story, oneperson, one client, one joke at
a time.
And so that's it.
Yeah.
Here we are.
Okay.
Bye everybody.
Thanks again.
Thanks Jackie.
Bye.
Remember who you are.
Popular Podcasts
NFL Daily with Gregg Rosenthal
Gregg Rosenthal and a rotating crew of elite NFL Media co-hosts, including Patrick Claybon, Colleen Wolfe, Steve Wyche, Nick Shook and Jourdan Rodrigue of The Athletic get you caught up daily on all the NFL news and analysis you need to be smarter and funnier than your friends.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com