February 10, 2025 • 44 mins
The episode explores the significant role of impact consultants in driving social change within corporations, sharing inspiring stories and insights from a successful entrepreneur in the field. It highlights impactful projects, mentorship, and the importance of collaboration across sectors to create equitable outcomes while emphasizing that profit and purpose can coexist.
Unlock the keys to driving systemic change with insights from our special guest, Tynesia Boyea-Robinson, CEO & President of CapEQ. Experience Ty’s transformative journey, beginning with their landmark work with Walmart that reshaped minimum wage policies and led to broader social impact across various industries. Ty reveals their strategies for embedding equitable practices into businesses, sharing the creation of the Investor Blueprint for Racial and Economic Equity. Discover how Ty manages a dynamic lifestyle, balancing travel and virtual meetings to collaborate with clients ranging from Fortune 500 companies to influential foundations.
• Introduction to the journey of an impact consultant
• Changing corporate practices for social good
• Powerful stories of transformative projects
• Navigating barriers to equitable practices
• The importance of partnerships between businesses and philanthropies
• Highlighting the Investor Blueprint for Racial and Economic Equity
• Mentorship as a crucial component of professional growth
• The entrepreneurial spirit in impact consulting
• Encouragement to take bold steps toward personal and professional dreams
Disclaimer:
The thoughts, views, and opinions expressed on Career Cheat Code are those of the individual guests and do not necessarily reflect those of the host, affiliated organizations & employers. This podcast is intended for informational and inspirational purposes, highlighting the guests and their unique career journeys. We hope these stories inspire you to chase your purpose, define success on your own terms & take the next step in your career.
If you enjoyed this episode, please like, rate, and subscribe to this podcast on whatever platform you’re using, and share this podcast with your friends and your networks. For more #CareerCheatCode, visit linktr.ee/careercheatcode. Let's make an impact, one episode at a time!
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Our very first client was Walmart, which is an odd
client to have to start,especially when you think about
oftentimes people when theythink of Walmart they think
about them in a way that'sextractive.
But my very first job with them, project with them actually led
to them changing minimum wagefor the entire company, which
results in millions of dollarsin the hands of pockets across
(00:21):
the country.
And that was just my very firstproject.
That's just one example, and soas we kind of add up the types
of things we've been able toachieve it, I just get really
excited about it because I canpoint to the outcomes and the
impact that we're having.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Welcome to Career Cheat Code.
In this podcast, you'll hearhow everyday people impact the
world through their careers.
Learn about their journey,career hacks and obstacles along
the way.
Whether you're already havingthe impact you want or are
searching for it, this is thepodcast for you.
All right, ty, welcome to theshow.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
So let's dive right in there.
Let's tell the world what it isyou do for a living.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Well, I am an impact consultant is the shorthand for
what I do.
So basically work withbusinesses and investors to help
them embed equitable impactinto their practice.
And then, when they run intobarriers, I partner with
foundations and associations tobuild tools and resources to
remove those barriers.
But the shorthand for it is I'ma consultant that drives social
(01:19):
change.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
That's great.
What is the name of yourorganization where you do this
at?
Speaker 1 (01:23):
I am the CEO of Cappy Q, and I founded the
organization about 13 years agonow, so I've been doing it for a
while.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
That's great, so tell me more what that means.
So, as a founder of thisorganization, what is your
day-to-day week look like?
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Well, one of the great things about running your
own thing is that if yourday-to-day isn't working for you
, that's your fault.
So my day-to-day is prettyflexible, honestly.
So I have two kids and mostdays I am either dropping off or
picking up in the morning.
I do most of my work from home,and I've been working from home
even before COVID.
So everyone else, welcome tothe virtual technology space.
(02:01):
I've been doing that for awhile and I spend most of my
time on meetings, whether it'smeetings directly with clients,
whether it's conversations likethis one, but that's generally
my day, and then, I would say,about twice a month, I'm usually
on the road for something.
So either flying to a clientspeaking at a conference,
organizing an event, but that'sgenerally what my typical day
(02:23):
looks like, all while foldinglaundry.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
That's great.
What are your type of clientsand what are the type of events
that you're going to Like?
Are these conferences allregional, in the same area or
just spread out throughout thecountry?
Speaker 1 (02:38):
It's spread throughout the country.
And the cool thing about myclients is when you think about
embedding equitable impact onthe it's.
We have such a range oforganizations, but it tends to
be either large for-profitbusinesses or investors, so
everybody from Walmart toMassMutual to the Carlyle Group.
Or on the building, the toolsand resources side, it tends to
(02:58):
be large philanthropies, so FordFoundation, kellogg Foundation,
cerdna Foundation, and thatseems like an odd mix of people.
But the thing is, when you'reworking on making sure people's
business models are actuallydriving outcomes that are
helpful for the community, lotsof times the business side and
the investor side is not goingto resource the types of things
(03:20):
that are gaps in their practices.
So they'll pay you to help themfigure out things like oh, we
need to figure out our supplierdiversity and have that do
something differently.
Or, oh, we want to build animpact fund.
But then when you're under thehood in their organization and
you run into issues like well,we say we want to invest in a
way that's equitable, but thereare all these processes that are
(03:40):
actually barriers to usachieving that goal, oh well, I
guess it doesn't work.
It's usually what happens on thebusiness investor side and
because we have a balcony viewand get to look across all of
these organizations, we canstart to see patterns and say,
hey, foundation, look, these arethe barriers people are
experiencing.
Would you be able to fund us tohelp build some tools and
(04:01):
resources to show them whatthose barriers are and provide
outcomes and next steps thatthey can then use?
And then we take those toolsand resources to show them what
those barriers are and provideoutcomes and next steps that
they can then use.
And then we take those toolsand resources back to the
businesses and investors andstart to move the needle.
So it's a virtuous cycle whenit works.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
That's great.
Can you give me an example of aproject that you were involved
with or led you're really proudof?
You don't have to give thespecifics of who the
organization was, but just someof the things that you were able
to support them with.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Sure.
So one of the ones that wehelped build several years ago
that has been something thatI've been able to use quite
frequently is the investorblueprint for racial and
economic equity.
So when you think aboutinvesting and all these people
said they wanted to start seeingmore capital landing in the
hands of black and brownfounders, fund managers and
(04:46):
others, and what we started tosee is, like I mentioned before,
there were just so manybarriers to that for folks.
So the investor blueprint,which we built in partnership
with PolicyLink, actually laysout this is exactly what it
looks like to invest in a waythat's equitable.
It's not just about the capitalgoing outside the door.
It's about what's your duediligence process.
My shorthand for it is whoselects your investments, how do
(05:07):
you select your investments andwhat's your return on your
investment, and so giving veryclear steps on.
These are the five steps ineach of these Global Impact
(05:29):
Investing Network or largeinvestor organizations to
actually put those tools inpractice.
And it's great because beforethe investor blueprint that's a
great example of I had theseclients saying they wanted to do
investor work in ways that wasdriving equity, but they would
get stuck, and so now, when theygot stuck.
It was like hey, this is thestep you're on, you need to move
(05:50):
to this, this and this, and itreally helped accelerate the
process and accelerate theoutcomes for folks.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Oh, that's awesome.
What was the catalyst for youcoming up with this or
supporting with this blueprint?
How did that all come?
Speaker 1 (06:03):
you know Michael McAfee and PolicyLink have been
leading equity work for decadesand I actually know Michael from
you know before when I used tobe the chief impact officer at
Living Cities and you know theystarted taking on equity and
business practices a littlewhile ago and that's something
he and I had kicked around for awhile.
So I mean I think PolicyLink isjust a great partner.
(06:24):
And the woman I worked withthere is Mahalik Ghatacho, and
you know I remember callingMichael when he was just named
the CEO and saying, ok, michael,I'm seeing all these barriers,
we've got to fix it, let's workon it together.
And he's like I probably needto hire someone first.
Ok, so I kind of was likewaiting, waiting for Mahalette
to get hired, to start to workon that with her, because I knew
(06:47):
that if you wanted to centerequity, even if it was something
that was a new field for policy, I couldn't think of a better
partner to do that with otherthan them.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
So that's part of why that's awesome.
You seem very excited when youtalk about the work.
What's your favorite part ofyour role?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
You know, I think one of the things that I just feel
really fortunate about is for anorganization that I founded 13
years ago.
The number and types of thingswe've been able to do is
something, one of those thingswhere I can say when I die, I
can say I did my part on mywatch.
You know, our very first clientwas Walmart, which is an odd
(07:23):
client to have to start,especially when you think about.
Oftentimes people when theythink of Walmart they think
about them in a way that'sextractive.
But my very first job with themproject with them actually led
to them changing minimum wagefor the entire company, which
results in millions of dollarsin the hands of pockets across
the country.
And like that was just my veryfirst project.
(07:43):
That's just one example, and soas we kind of add up the types
of things we've been able toachieve it, I just get really
excited about it because youknow I can point to the outcomes
and the impact that we'rehaving, and our company's vision
is to change how the world doesbusiness and so that that
umbrella is broad enough thatwherever I see barriers to
(08:03):
business actually being a force,that's not just about making
money.
But you know how you do well bydoing good.
There's always a new problem ora new challenge to solve for,
and I love solving problems.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
That's great, and, you know, I love that example
too, because these are verytangible things that you can
point to to say you know, wereally supported that effort and
we really changed something,that is, you know, helping
families throughout the country,right?
So that's amazing.
I'm glad you were able to sharethat.
So then, on the contrast,what's the most challenging part
(08:35):
of your role?
Speaker 1 (08:36):
I would say right now is a challenging time with a
lot of the work that you know.
If you think about when I firststarted my company and I said I
believe companies have a role toplay and that can drive social
impact, like, everybody waslooking at me like I was crazy.
I had several patronizingmoments where people were like
(08:57):
that's not how the world works,honey, and I'm like OK, and then
you fast forward a couple ofyears and B Corp start to get
popular, esg starts to getpopular.
So you you think about the riseof that overall, it wasn't too
long ago where people weren'teven thinking about businesses
doing well and doing good.
And now one of the challengingthings is that very same concept
or topic is often under attacknow for odd reasons.
(09:20):
So I think that's somethingthat's a bit of a bummer
recently, just trying to figureout how to make sure that the
work that's really makingfamilies and communities
stronger, making businesses moresuccessful, is not so
politicized that you can'tcontinue to get those outcomes,
and I think that's somethingthat's just been something I've
been wrestling with lately,particularly since our business
(09:41):
model is completely grounded inmaking sure that businesses are
driving social change and profitat the same time.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
That's great.
So how, since times havechanged now, do you feel like it
is more palatable for folks tokind of get into this space?
And, if so, like, how do you,if you have listeners here that
are like, man, I want to, I wantto do something like that, and
I want to support those types ofinitiatives Like what do you,
what do you give those?
Give those folks as advice.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Well, one of the things that we've noticed even
though there's a lot of politicsnow around anything related to
diversity, inclusion andenvironmental, social and
governance, which are usuallythe pillars that people think of
when they're talking aboutimpact with businesses and
investors most large companiesnow have some department or arm.
That's really about impact.
You can really be anentrepreneur now in large
organizations in ways that thoseroles did not exist before.
(10:31):
I'm seeing things like head ofimpact, head of community impact
, head of ESG.
There's just a whole bunch ofdifferent roles now that, even
if you didn't start your companyfrom scratch, like I did, there
are all these opportunitieswithin companies, and the reason
why that's exciting is because,since the field is new in many
(10:52):
ways, that means that you have alot of latitude to drive change
, to try new things, but youhave it within the safety net of
having a large company behindyou.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
That makes a lot of sense.
Now, just so we're all clear,is this what you always wanted
to do for a living?
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Oh, and so I'm actually an electrical engineer.
Computer science double majorundergrad.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Of course you are Got it.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
So my first job out of or you know, my my first
internship, I guess you'd say itwas actually working on
locomotives in Erie,pennsylvania.
So I don't think when mostpeople look at my career
trajectory it looks kind of odd.
And the through line that Ialways tell people is that I'm a
(11:39):
problem solver, so I'm trainedin systems, trained in
engineering, trained initerative thinking, and so it
kind of started with machines, Iguess you will and move to
movements.
So that is the.
That's the through line.
But no, I don't think Idefinitely was not planning on
(12:00):
doing social impact.
But that said, you know myfamily is always really been
committed to the community.
I've always kind of been partof affinity groups or church
groups or other things like thatthat you know, believed in
doing that.
But I didn't think you couldhave a job about that.
I thought that was justsomething that you did on the
side.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Got it.
Tell me more about that.
Where were you born, raised?
What was your upbringing like?
Speaker 1 (12:20):
So I was born in California and I grew up in
Florida.
My dad was in the Air Force I'mthe first person from my
immediate family to go tocollege, so and my parents had
me really young and we lived onAir Force bases.
So you know I'm a military brat, but we didn't really move that
often.
So once we moved to, I movedthe most until I turned eight
(12:42):
and then from eight until Igraduated from high school we
lived in Florida.
So my dad often used to go toTurkey or Korea or other places.
But that's, that's mybackground.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
So yeah, ok, places, but that's, that's my background
.
So, yeah, okay.
So at that point you graduatedhigh school and in your mind,
what is like, what is the rolethat you see yourself doing at
that time?
Speaker 1 (13:01):
So I got to do this program when I was in high
school because, remember, I saidI lived in Florida.
So I got to work at NASA when Iwas in high school.
So I had this program called.
It was called SHARP, the SummerHigh School Apprenticeship
Research Program, and it wasfocused on women and people of
color to try to get them intoSTEM.
So I lived maybe a 45-minutedrive from Kennedy Space Center
(13:23):
and so my first, first job wasactually working on the space
station.
Whoa, now, I was an intern,right.
So working on the space stationas an intern is basically like
taking notes and, you know,following the engineers around,
but like I actually got to be onthe launch pad and see the
space shuttle up front and seethe vehicle assembly building,
(13:46):
and so you know, one of thethings that I love about that
high school experience is itshowed me, it kind of infected
me with this belief thatimpossible is nothing like if
you can send people to space andyou're in the room with all
these just ordinary peopletalking day to day about okay.
(14:06):
So when the space station isbuilt, I remember this is like
the first iteration of the spacestation, so it was more of like
an idea and like how do we makethis work and what technology
we would need and what kind oftools we need to pull together,
and you're just like it soundslike you're in Star Wars or Star
Trek, but like basically tryingto make that happen.
That infected me across mycareer.
(14:26):
So it's basically if we cansend people to space, we can
solve the world's hardestproblems on our planet, and
that's what kind of drives meand why I'm not just excited
about as you said, butoptimistic about it, because
that's kind of how I started mywork.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
That's awesome and that's the beauty of those type
of programs, right, like it'snot necessarily just about
getting folks into STEM, whichyou know by some metrics of that
program.
You're not in STEM, right.
So it's not necessarily athrough line of well, we did
this program and now we havepeople necessarily directly in
this field, but it does have aripple effect on your mentality
(15:03):
and on how you approach theworld and the problems, right?
So I really appreciate whenthose programs are in place,
because they do much more thanthey're intended to.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Absolutely Well.
And if you think about, earlierin my career, I was in STEM for
a while I mentioned working onlocomotives and then I was in IT
.
So I was working in IT rightwhen the interwebs became big.
So we used to call ite-business which is hilarious
(15:33):
now because no one puts the E infront of business but back then
it was like we're going to dobusiness online and we're going
to call it e-business.
That makes me sound very old.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
That's another example of me being part of the
frenetic energy of creatingsomething new and what it looks
like to change an industry andchange in company internally.
I think it's moments like thatwhere I've just had these really
exciting intersections withwhether it's technology and
(16:06):
change early enough in my careerthat I can apply that to
different problems.
So, yeah, I did a lot oftechnology to start and then
shifted, Even if you think aboutafter being in technology
myself when I got out ofbusiness school, my first job
out of business school wasactually running a program
called Year Up, which trainsyoung people in technology and
(16:28):
places them in jobs.
So that was my transition tothe social sector and I was
training young people who wereaged 18 to 24 to take my first
job.
When I came out of college, youknow, doing IT, it wasn't in
e-business, it was more in helpdesk, but just that was the
first time I could see.
It was like, oh, not only am Ibeing able to leverage the
(16:48):
technology I have, but I'm alsoable to support young people who
, but for program, would nothave an opportunity to take care
of themselves and theirfamilies economically and in the
short period of six monthsbeing trained and six months
being on an internship.
They were making $40,000 a yearand these were folks who were
working at McDonald's beforehand.
(17:10):
So that was the transition forme and that's why I started my
company, because I started tosee real time.
Not only were these youngpeople effective in their role,
but they were having an outsizedimpact in their communities and
they were also increasingmorale internally, having lower
turnover, having higherdiversity within the
(17:30):
organization.
So I could see real time.
Oh, there's an outsized rolethat business can play and have
impact in a way that's stillgood for the bottom line.
So that was the transitionpoint.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
So that makes a lot of sense to me.
But tell me more about well.
One, where did you go to gradschool?
And two, at the time when youwere applying to grad school,
why did you go there?
What was your moment to say allright, what do I want to do
with that?
Did you go there Like what was,what was?
Speaker 1 (17:54):
your.
What was your moment to say,all right, what do I want to do
with that?
Yes, so I, um, I went to Dukeundergrad and I went to Harvard
business school and myapplication at the time let's
see this I was, I wanted to bethe general manager of
international finance.
That was my goal.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
That was what I wrote .
Why.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
It does.
Yeah, it does sound fancy.
Right At that time I was in themortgage finance business.
So right before going tobusiness school, I was in
mortgage finance and you're like, wait, wait, weren't you just
doing locomotives?
Yes, got to keep up, got tokeep up.
But I was helping them on thetechnology side.
So I was working in theinternational finance division
(18:42):
of a mortgage insurance companyand I was helping them put all
their processes online andsupport that work.
And as part of that work then Ialso ended up doing mergers and
acquisitions and supportingthem acquiring mortgage banks.
So I loved that.
It was so much fun.
I got to visit all thesedifferent countries.
I went to Sydney, australia, Iwent to Mexico, I was in London,
and all just for work.
I was like, oh, this is cool.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I want to run this.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I want to run something like this.
So when I went to businessschool, that's what I said I
wanted to do, because that waswhat I was steeped in at the
time and it's funny my husbandteases that I'm one of the few
people he knows who went tobusiness school to become a
hippie.
But because I knew what Iwanted to do, I spent my summer
doing something social impactrelated.
It's like, oh well, I've alwaysdone this on the side.
I know I'm going to go domortgage finance.
(19:24):
Let me try something new overthe summer, because I have a
very clear goal.
I know exactly where I'm goingand that's where I found Europe
Up.
I did my internship at Year Upand before I graduated they
asked me to launch their firstexpansion site in Washington DC.
So that's what turned my path.
That's awesome, I know, but thatis not what I said I was going
(19:45):
to do.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
I know Year Up well too.
They do some good work.
But no, it's fascinatingbecause a lot of times we use
grad school either as a shiftingpoint where you're like I need
it to be able to transition andit'll help me tell that story
and help me, like, find to whatit is I want to do, or you're in
(20:08):
a position where, like, I knowexactly what benefit this grad
school program is going to getme and therefore I want to do it
.
So it's just great to see thatyou went in with the first
intention and then it kind ofshifted your entire trajectory
from there and led you to thenEurope and, as you mentioned, a
great place like Living Citiesand other organizations that are
just doing remarkable workthroughout the country and
supporting different communities.
Thank you, yep.
Talk to me about at what pointdo you realize?
(20:29):
You know what, instead ofworking at some of these
organizations, I just need to domy own thing.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
If you kind of think about my career overall, I've
had kind of an entrepreneurialspirit in a lot of the things
that I've been exposed to, or apart of.
So I would say once I launchedYear Up because launching your
first expansion site at thistime, if you think about where
Year Up was in its history, itonly had the Boston location, so
(20:56):
it was founded in Boston andthen they had a satellite
location in Rhode Island, sothat's like, if you're in the
Boston area, that's like a40-minute train ride from Boston
.
So same network of people, sameresources.
You're kind of still within thesphere of influence.
My site, dc, was the first onethat was outside anybody's
(21:17):
network.
So I basically launched thatfrom scratch.
So I went from the first classof 22 young people to serving
several thousand young people,raising $20 million.
President Obama visited duringhis first year.
I mean just really strong growthand outcomes and it was that
experience that said, oh wait, Ibasically have already started
(21:37):
something from scratch.
So I'm going to the next thingwill be mine, and I think one of
the things that's interestingis when you do work and you're
able to do work that you'repassionate about, it's hard to
find your next job, not becauseyou can't get one right, but
because it's hard to trade.
Waking up every day and knowingthat you're on the earth
(21:58):
fulfilling your purpose, andtrading that for a paycheck.
It was just really hard tofigure out.
So for me, starting somethingfrom scratch was the closest
thing I could get to what itfelt like to know every day.
I wake up in the morning and mywork makes sure young people
can take care of themselves andtheir families, and now I have
that multiplied by 10, because Ican do it do that kind of work,
(22:20):
not just with young people, butwith people from different
backgrounds, regardless of whatthe outcomes are.
So that's how I ended up inthat place.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
So I know one of the barriers to becoming an
entrepreneur is the fear of whatthat means from a stability
standpoint, from a providingmeans for your family standpoint
.
Can you give us a range of whatsomeone that owns their own
company, that is in this type ofspace, can make on a given?
Speaker 1 (22:45):
year.
So there's, I think one of thethings as an entrepreneur is you
have to be really clear.
Are you a solopreneur?
So you know, people used to saywhen I was first starting, are
you running a lifestyle businesswhere it's basically, can I
take care of myself and myfamily?
But it's really about you andyour organization, or you, right
, think about that more likeindependent consultant, or are
(23:07):
you building a business?
And they're slightly different.
If you're doing the solopreneurroute with work like this, my
first year and I will say I maybe the exception, but my first
year I want to say I brought inlike $300,000.
So you know, if you think aboutwhat salaries are, you're like
(23:28):
huh, I can do that.
What I will say and this issomething that people who know
of others who go to businessschool think it's kind of built
in the curriculum.
They don't tell you how tostart a business.
They tell you about thestrategy, but there's a whole
bunch of just tactical minutia.
Oh, you got to register withthis, and oh, the taxes look
like this.
And oh, did you get thearticles of incorporation or did
(23:52):
you get insurance articles ofincorporation or did you get
insurance?
I mean, there's just like a lotof these like tiny tactical
things with starting a company,that not just the fear of when
my next paycheck is going tocome, but also the fear of, like
all of the administrivia that'sconnected with running your own
thing, that you're going to dosomething wrong and get in
trouble and like get audited fortaxes and stuff.
So like there's a hump there.
(24:12):
There's definitely a learningcurve there, regardless of if
you have a business backgroundor not.
I think the other hump isespecially if you have a partner
working really closely andbeing transparent about what is
the firewall.
So we would say what's thefirewall between my company and
the family's finances and whatmakes the risk feel comfortable
for both of us.
(24:33):
So my husband and I decidedthat I would save six months of
expenses and have them in thefamily account because the money
can come in in ups and downs.
You have to start to learn howto figure out things like
managing your cash flow, makingsure accounts payable is
happening that one month you canbe bringing in $13,000 and the
next month you can be bringingin $50,000 and the next month
(24:54):
you can be bringing in $50,000.
Well, you know what you got topay for the mortgage every month
.
So there are little things likethat that you have to work
through.
But once you figure that outand you kind of get a sense for
how your cash flow works andwhat kind of roles you have, I
think if your risk tolerance isthere, I tell people, once you
(25:15):
start working for yourself, it'sreally hard to work for anybody
else Got it.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
That's awesome and I love that because I think you
just demystify a lot right andjust make it so that folks feel
like it is all obtainable.
So I appreciate you sharingthat.
So now you have your six monthsof unprepared for anything that
comes together.
One of the things that wedidn't really touch on for the
audience is where did you landon?
(25:40):
Do you want to continue to be asolopreneur versus growing it
and have other folks on yourteam?
Where are you now?
What does that look like?
Speaker 1 (25:48):
So I knew from the beginning that I wanted to
create a company.
I wasn't about being asolopreneur.
If you think about the visionof changing how the world does
business, everything I do youwork backwards from what's the
outcome you're trying to achieve.
So if I want to change how theworld does business, I can't do
that by myself.
I can have little moments whereI can say, wow, that was
(26:08):
awesome, that I just did that.
But you want to be able toscale your impact, and so I knew
one.
I needed to do that through ateam so I could basically touch
more people, and so we builtconsistent processes.
Also, when you think about, whatwe wanted to do is democratize
what we're learning with others,which is why I've written two
books.
So if you want to change howthe world does business, we can
(26:30):
only do it as fast as you are aclient, unless I find other ways
to share what's working, what'snot working and why.
It's why I write articlesmonthly.
It's why I work really hard totranslate what often sounds like
very esoteric into things thatpeople can understand and apply,
because that way, even if youdon't work with CapEQ day to day
(26:50):
, there's some nugget that we'resharing that you can start to
try internally, and I believeequipping the entrepreneurs of
their businesses and investingcompanies with the tools they
need to be successful is just asimportant as the direct client
work we have.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
That's great, okay.
So how many folks do you haveon your team now?
Speaker 1 (27:10):
So we have about 20 people on our team.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
That's huge to grow something from your brain,
somewhere to say all right nowwe have 20 people that are
dedicated to this vision anddoing the things.
What was your first hire andlike?
Why?
Speaker 1 (27:24):
So my first hire is usually okay.
So I think this might get alittle a little in the weeds.
But when you're running aconsulting business, one of the
most important things is youneed to make sure that you can
pay for people.
So the way that I work, you'llhear this I won't hire anybody
full time unless I have sixmonths of their salary in the
(27:46):
bank.
So for me it's really importantthat I can look somebody in the
eye and say I can't control thefuture, but at a minimum, if we
run into hard times, I can lookyou in the eye and say I got
you for the next six monthsRight, and I think that's really
important.
That's something that you know.
When you are hiring somebody,you are not just hiring them,
(28:06):
you're basically hiring theirfamily, if you will, is the way
that I look at it.
So I take that really seriouslywith my employees.
So the first type of employeethat I tend to hire is someone
who can actually serviceprojects with me.
Because how do I pay your bill?
I pay your bill by providingclient service work, and so if
you can do that with me, thenthat's helpful.
(28:27):
Then I go from that tooperations.
So the people who can serviceclients with me.
If they're able to take thatexpertise and then create the
internal processes that allow usto replicate that with others,
it allows me to hire the nextperson but ramp them up more
quickly.
So that's kind of how I balanceout, how I hire.
(28:47):
And then the last, if you startto think about that, okay, so
you have one person, then thetwo person, three people over
time.
Then you start to need to buildthe back office work, right, so
the finance people and theoperations folks.
That's when you kind of startto get there.
But you grow into it and youknow, I think one of the lessons
(29:07):
I learned initially especially,I have that entrepreneurial
spirit.
But it's different running yourown thing.
It's different when, like youknow, it's cash coming out of
your bank and you're managingthat.
So I started to realize like,oh, I hired too quickly and too
many people when I first startedmy company in ways that I
(29:28):
realized, oh, that's creatingtoo much of a cash flow strain
on the company.
So I learned about how to hirein a way that is sustainable,
where I can make sure I can paypeople consistently.
That's great, I hope this isn'ttoo much in the weeds, but
you're asking me these questions, so I'm going to answer them?
Speaker 2 (29:45):
Not at all.
I think this is perfect, and Ijust feel like there are a lot
of folks that may be on thefence about like, do I do my own
thing?
I'm at this company, I feellike I can do some consulting,
or maybe do it by myself, orwhatever that looks like.
So, just thinking through, well, how do you then end up at a
place where you have 20 peoplein this company?
Speaker 1 (30:03):
It's just helpful for people to understand the path,
so I appreciate you sharing thatWell, and I also think lots of
times people feel like you know,I have 20 people who work with
me day to day, but a lot of themare actually not W-2s, they're
1099s.
So the way that I look at thatis it's part of changing how the
world does business.
If I'm helping another personwho is running their own
business get work, because thehardest thing to do, I think,
(30:26):
when you're a consultant and thefear that you're talking about
is about getting business right.
I'm really good at businessdevelopment.
I'm really good at fundraising,so that's not something that
makes me afraid.
But if I have brilliant peoplearound me where that's a hurdle
for them but I know I can findthe perfect project to put them
(30:47):
on and then they start to buildtheir confidence I'll do that
all day.
In fact, we often at CapEQ.
What we find is there are someprojects that aren't a good fit
for us and we'll send them to alot of we often at CapEQ.
What we find is there are someprojects that aren't a good fit
for us and we'll send them to alot.
We call them our Avengers.
So people who work on projectswith us, we assemble the right
team to solve the problem we'retrying to solve.
So I'll forward work to ourAvengers because I want
(31:08):
different people who are runningtheir companies to thrive.
And if you look at our team, Iwould say we're 90% of color and
probably 85% women.
So you know that's.
That's also changing how theworld does business.
You know, seeing people growingtheir their own individual
businesses, their own individualwealth, having their own agency
, is another ripple effect ofthe way that we do our work.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
That's great and I also appreciate you sharing not
just the kind of composition andintentionality of kind of your
team right, but of partneringwith others right, where you
don't have to take on everyproject and do all the things
and feel like you're incompetition with everyone else.
It's like there's value inhaving this, as you called it,
the Avengers right Of like wecan work in the ecosystem
(31:51):
together and figure out how wecan all add value.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Absolutely yes, and that is something that I will
say is a pet peeve of mine.
I do feel like there's justunnecessary the mindset of
scarcity.
I think that is an undercurrentin the way capitalism I would
say has worked to date is thetype of thing that creates
unnecessary competition at times.
(32:15):
And I don't mean you know, youdon't, you're not.
Obviously you're going tocompete for who's providing the
best product or service.
But if you're trying to changethe way the world does business,
you can't do that by yourself,like you actually can't get to
that outcome by yourself, and soyou need to be able to find the
right partners who are, who aremore focused on solving the
(32:35):
problem than they are of beingthe solution, and I think that's
actually how you get there, andunfortunately, there are too
many people in the space where,like, that's not what they're
centered.
I think there's a lot of folkswho are grounded more in ego and
grounded more in how they lookor what they you know what
credit they get than actuallytrying to solve the problem,
(32:56):
which is part of why it's harderto get some of this stuff done.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
And you.
You've already given us so many, but do you have any other
career cheat codes that you'veencountered along the way that
you're like?
You know that was.
That's something that folksshould think about doing earlier
in their career or just adoptas as good practice.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
So you know this is going to sound super trite, but
I tell you right now, mentorshave been like the inflection.
Like every time I had aninflection point in my life,
I've been really fortunate tohave like the best mentors and
you know, some of them came fromformal programs through my
company, but a lot of times itwas just people who believed in
(33:36):
me and gave me good advice.
The very first mentor I had isDebra Dean Nelson, and I would
not have gone to college outsideof my state if it hadn't been
for her Because, like Imentioned I still don't know if
I mentioned, but neither of myparents went to college, so I
didn't have a very clearunderstanding of where to go.
(33:57):
We didn't make a lot of moneyand so I didn't want to be a
financial burden, so my goalactually was to go to the
community college up the streetfrom our house.
I was like I'm just going to goto a local community college,
that way I can help out aroundthe house, I can still get an
education, but I can besupportive of my family.
And Debra said oh no,girlfriend, we are sending you
(34:20):
to the best schools.
I was like okay, and sheliterally just took me on as a
project and my mom did nails, soI met her.
I came home from school one dayshe asked me what grades are
you getting in school?
I was like who is this lady inmy house?
I was like straight A's.
She's like, oh, I'm going totake you to lunch.
(34:42):
I was like okay, it's likeweird lady, fine.
But like my entire trajectorychanged from that moment.
Right, and I have moments likethat throughout my career.
I had another moment that Iremember in my career with a
mentor.
It was when I was ininternational finance and he was
actually my boss's boss and Iwas having a hard time with
(35:05):
someone who was there's thisdual reporting structure who
said I just was, I was, I wasjust too chipper and I needed to
take it down a notch.
And it really bothered mebecause I was like, oh, I didn't
know that was unprofessional.
I didn't mean to beunprofessional, I just like
(35:28):
making work a place where peopleenjoy coming to.
And my boss's boss said and myboss's boss said, no, he's
absolutely wrong.
You do amazing work and peoplelove working with you and that
helps you actually be successful.
So if people talk to you aboutchanging who you are to be
successful, they're wrong andyou just keep doing what you're
(35:50):
doing.
And so that happened in my early20s, and I'm the type of person
that people often think that,because I'm energetic, because I
find joy in what I do,sometimes people can conflate
that with that not beingsubstantive and like no, this is
a choice.
It's a choice to create a spacewhere the work you do day to
(36:11):
day is really hard.
So how do you create anenvironment where people can
thrive?
And that is a choice on my endand it's something that, but for
that mentor, I would havedimmed my light to get my work
done.
And it's moments like that, Ithink, along the way, that have
been my cheat codes.
My cheat codes are always otherpeople pouring into me.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
That's great and I also appreciate you sharing
different roles that mentors canhave, right, so one that can
help, as you said, make sure youdon't dim your light.
Then there are others that aregoing to be more like on the
tactical side, like, hey, weneed to make sure you apply to
these types of schools and likego away and think about your
major or whatever that lookslike, right, no way I would be
(36:54):
thriving in my career and doingall the things without so many
people pouring into me right,without so many folks taking the
time to just add differentpieces of information.
That kind of helped me shape mypath.
So I just appreciate kind ofthat nod to the mentors that are
out there doing it all the time, and then we're able to then
pass that on and support othersalong our journeys as well.
(37:15):
So you know, I appreciate that.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
And then I have a couple organizational cheat
codes.
I feel like, since it's thecareer cheat code podcast, I
should come with a couple ofdifferent versions.
So some institutional cheatcodes, particularly if you run
your own company.
I found every just about everyregion has like leadership XYZ
right.
So I did leadership GreaterWashington when I lived in DC
(37:39):
and I did leadership Dallas whenwe moved to Dallas, and I think
those are really good cheatcodes for two reasons.
One, it gets you a quicknetwork of people that you have
a shared experience with acrossyour city or your community,
which helps as you're doing work, regardless of what your work
is.
You know, oh, I know anattorney here, I know someone
who works at this bank, or youknow, it's just a quick
(38:00):
relationship cheat code.
But two, it helps you learnyour region really quickly.
It helps you understand oh,this is how education and
transportation play out, orthese are the leaders who are
making different choices andwhat the factors are they're
weighing.
I think the third thing,particularly as a leader, if you
are someone who I used to havea really hard time
(38:21):
distinguishing betweenproductivity and activity, and
these leadership programs tendto be like really time intensive
and it's like I'm just tooimportant.
There's no way I can spend thewhole day away from my job and
you realize like, yeah, you can,and it showed me the importance
of space for you know, thinkingdifferently about things, being
(38:44):
exposed to different things.
It actually helps you be abetter leader if you're not
constantly in the day-to-day ofwhat you do but you have moments
to pull back.
So, like leadership programs,huge cheat code, and then
there's a and those are justlike you know there's Dallas
leadership insert city here, andthen the other cheat code that
I had another leadership program, but just completely amazing,
(39:07):
was the Presidential LeadershipScholars Program that I was part
of, and so that is apartnership with President HW
Bush, president W Bush,president Clinton and the Lyndon
B Johnson Center and it'sanother leadership kind of
program, very time intensive,but it's for people across
(39:27):
partisan lines who care aboutimpact.
So it was just an amazingprogram to be able to meet
presidents and theiradministrations and learn how
they solve crises.
You're sitting there talking tothe person who was working on
the TARP program, right, likeyou're sitting, you're just
(39:48):
getting like completely insideknowledge on what it was like to
really have to solve hugecrises or challenges across the
country and you start to seethat even presidents are just
ordinary people doingextraordinary things and you
also have the opportunity totalk to you.
I have.
I've been really fortunate that, particularly if you think
(40:09):
about elections and politics andhow, how polarizing things have
been in so many ways, that'schallenging.
It's been really helpful for meto have a group of folks who
have different ideologies that Ican talk to as humans and just
say I don't understand why thisis showing up this way.
Tell me why.
And I think that has also beensomething that's just been a joy
(40:32):
to have that network to reallybe able to talk to, a joy to
have that network to really beable to talk to, and it helps me
not it helps keep me fromdehumanizing people just because
they have a differentperspective.
So those are my institutionalcheat codes.
Mentors are the people and hereare the leadership programs
with institutionals.
I've done my homeworkassignment.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
You are crushing this cheat code thing.
I appreciate that.
That's great.
Are there other forms of, maybeforms of media that could be
books, podcasts, newslettersthat you have consumed, that
have helped you personally orprofessionally?
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Yes, I mean there's so many podcasts that I adore.
So first of all, I will say myhusband is the one who listens
to podcasts more than I do.
I like to listen to fun onesbecause my brain needs a break.
But one podcast that I love,and I'm sure a lot of people
love, is Adam Grant's Work Life.
I just think he does an amazingjob of taking really complex.
(41:29):
I like when people take complexissues and make them really
accessible.
So I love Work Life with AdamGrant.
I love Freakonomics, so similarreason, and I actually got to be
on a Freakonomics episoderecently about the NFL and
diversity.
So I've been like a StephenDubner Freakonomics fan for like
decades.
So the fangirling with bothFreakonomics and NFL like can
(41:54):
you get any better than that?
Both for economics and the NFL,can you get any better than
that?
So I love for economics as well.
I like the oh there's this onepodcast that what is it called?
Planet Money?
I love Planet Money as well.
So I like things that helpdemystify the world around you.
So those are just several ofthe podcasts that I like.
I read a lot of books One of thebooks that I've read recently
(42:18):
that has been instructive to meand my company has been how to
10x your life.
So the frame is basically asyou're growing something, people
tend to grow things in anincremental way, but if you have
to 10x what you're doing, ithelps you lift your head up and
think about new ways to attack aproblem.
(42:40):
So I like books like that.
When I'm reading books, it'susually around, if it's not
fiction, because frankly, mostof the books I read are fiction
and something sci-fi related orfantasy related.
We've got vampires, we've gotfairies.
This is what I do with myfiction.
But if I'm reading nonfiction,it's usually around business
related issues like that thatmakes sense.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
I mean, you grew up near NASA, so your mind is in
space somewhere.
So that tracks Love that.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
That is fair.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
That's awesome.
Is there anything that we havenot discussed, that the world
should know about you today?
Speaker 1 (43:13):
I think that it's really important that we own the
future that we're trying tobuild, and I think that's
something that I take anownership and accountability for
the kind of world we'recreating around us.
And I feel like when peoplefeel like they're disconnected,
there's a hopelessness there,and so I think one thing that I
(43:35):
would just encourage people ifthere's anything about my
journey that I would hope wouldencourage people is that you can
create the life and you cancreate the world that you see in
your head, but you just have tobe willing to take that step.
There's this beautiful poemthat I really clung to when I
started my business.
It was called On Boldness andit basically says that when man
(44:00):
takes the first step, providencemeets you with beauty that you
could never imagine.
And that's that on boldness.
That spirit of taking the stepand feeling like there's a
spiritual response in a way tohelp meet you where you are, is
something that I hope, if fornothing else, that my journey
(44:22):
inspires others to take theirown first bold step.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
That is a beautiful note to end on.
Really appreciate you coming onthe podcast today.
Thank you for everything.
Thanks for all the tea cups.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Thanks for having me.
It's been fun Awesome.
Speaker 2 (44:36):
I hope you enjoyed this episode.
If you did and believe on themission we're on, please like,
rate and subscribe to thispodcast on whatever platform
you're using, and share thispodcast with your friends and
your networks.
Make sure you follow us onInstagram and LinkedIn at Career
Cheat Code and tell us peopleor careers you would like to see
highlighted.
See you next week with somemore cheat codes.
Peace.
Our very first client was Walmart, which is an odd
client to have to start,especially when you think about
oftentimes people when theythink of Walmart they think
about them in a way that'sextractive.
But my very first job with them, project with them actually led
to them changing minimum wagefor the entire company, which
results in millions of dollarsin the hands of pockets across
(00:21):
the country.
And that was just my very firstproject.
That's just one example, and soas we kind of add up the types
of things we've been able toachieve it, I just get really
excited about it because I canpoint to the outcomes and the
impact that we're having.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
Welcome to Career Cheat Code.
In this podcast, you'll hearhow everyday people impact the
world through their careers.
Learn about their journey,career hacks and obstacles along
the way.
Whether you're already havingthe impact you want or are
searching for it, this is thepodcast for you.
All right, ty, welcome to theshow.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
So let's dive right in there.
Let's tell the world what it isyou do for a living.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Well, I am an impact consultant is the shorthand for
what I do.
So basically work withbusinesses and investors to help
them embed equitable impactinto their practice.
And then, when they run intobarriers, I partner with
foundations and associations tobuild tools and resources to
remove those barriers.
But the shorthand for it is I'ma consultant that drives social
(01:19):
change.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
That's great.
What is the name of yourorganization where you do this
at?
Speaker 1 (01:23):
I am the CEO of Cappy Q, and I founded the
organization about 13 years agonow, so I've been doing it for a
while.
Speaker 2 (01:31):
That's great, so tell me more what that means.
So, as a founder of thisorganization, what is your
day-to-day week look like?
Speaker 1 (01:38):
Well, one of the great things about running your
own thing is that if yourday-to-day isn't working for you
, that's your fault.
So my day-to-day is prettyflexible, honestly.
So I have two kids and mostdays I am either dropping off or
picking up in the morning.
I do most of my work from home,and I've been working from home
even before COVID.
So everyone else, welcome tothe virtual technology space.
(02:01):
I've been doing that for awhile and I spend most of my
time on meetings, whether it'smeetings directly with clients,
whether it's conversations likethis one, but that's generally
my day, and then, I would say,about twice a month, I'm usually
on the road for something.
So either flying to a clientspeaking at a conference,
organizing an event, but that'sgenerally what my typical day
(02:23):
looks like, all while foldinglaundry.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
That's great.
What are your type of clientsand what are the type of events
that you're going to Like?
Are these conferences allregional, in the same area or
just spread out throughout thecountry?
Speaker 1 (02:38):
It's spread throughout the country.
And the cool thing about myclients is when you think about
embedding equitable impact onthe it's.
We have such a range oforganizations, but it tends to
be either large for-profitbusinesses or investors, so
everybody from Walmart toMassMutual to the Carlyle Group.
Or on the building, the toolsand resources side, it tends to
(02:58):
be large philanthropies, so FordFoundation, kellogg Foundation,
cerdna Foundation, and thatseems like an odd mix of people.
But the thing is, when you'reworking on making sure people's
business models are actuallydriving outcomes that are
helpful for the community, lotsof times the business side and
the investor side is not goingto resource the types of things
(03:20):
that are gaps in their practices.
So they'll pay you to help themfigure out things like oh, we
need to figure out our supplierdiversity and have that do
something differently.
Or, oh, we want to build animpact fund.
But then when you're under thehood in their organization and
you run into issues like well,we say we want to invest in a
way that's equitable, but thereare all these processes that are
(03:40):
actually barriers to usachieving that goal, oh well, I
guess it doesn't work.
It's usually what happens on thebusiness investor side and
because we have a balcony viewand get to look across all of
these organizations, we canstart to see patterns and say,
hey, foundation, look, these arethe barriers people are
experiencing.
Would you be able to fund us tohelp build some tools and
(04:01):
resources to show them whatthose barriers are and provide
outcomes and next steps thatthey can then use?
And then we take those toolsand resources to show them what
those barriers are and provideoutcomes and next steps that
they can then use.
And then we take those toolsand resources back to the
businesses and investors andstart to move the needle.
So it's a virtuous cycle whenit works.
Speaker 2 (04:14):
That's great.
Can you give me an example of aproject that you were involved
with or led you're really proudof?
You don't have to give thespecifics of who the
organization was, but just someof the things that you were able
to support them with.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Sure.
So one of the ones that wehelped build several years ago
that has been something thatI've been able to use quite
frequently is the investorblueprint for racial and
economic equity.
So when you think aboutinvesting and all these people
said they wanted to start seeingmore capital landing in the
hands of black and brownfounders, fund managers and
(04:46):
others, and what we started tosee is, like I mentioned before,
there were just so manybarriers to that for folks.
So the investor blueprint,which we built in partnership
with PolicyLink, actually laysout this is exactly what it
looks like to invest in a waythat's equitable.
It's not just about the capitalgoing outside the door.
It's about what's your duediligence process.
My shorthand for it is whoselects your investments, how do
(05:07):
you select your investments andwhat's your return on your
investment, and so giving veryclear steps on.
These are the five steps ineach of these Global Impact
(05:29):
Investing Network or largeinvestor organizations to
actually put those tools inpractice.
And it's great because beforethe investor blueprint that's a
great example of I had theseclients saying they wanted to do
investor work in ways that wasdriving equity, but they would
get stuck, and so now, when theygot stuck.
It was like hey, this is thestep you're on, you need to move
(05:50):
to this, this and this, and itreally helped accelerate the
process and accelerate theoutcomes for folks.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Oh, that's awesome.
What was the catalyst for youcoming up with this or
supporting with this blueprint?
How did that all come?
Speaker 1 (06:03):
you know Michael McAfee and PolicyLink have been
leading equity work for decadesand I actually know Michael from
you know before when I used tobe the chief impact officer at
Living Cities and you know theystarted taking on equity and
business practices a littlewhile ago and that's something
he and I had kicked around for awhile.
So I mean I think PolicyLink isjust a great partner.
(06:24):
And the woman I worked withthere is Mahalik Ghatacho, and
you know I remember callingMichael when he was just named
the CEO and saying, ok, michael,I'm seeing all these barriers,
we've got to fix it, let's workon it together.
And he's like I probably needto hire someone first.
Ok, so I kind of was likewaiting, waiting for Mahalette
to get hired, to start to workon that with her, because I knew
(06:47):
that if you wanted to centerequity, even if it was something
that was a new field for policy, I couldn't think of a better
partner to do that with otherthan them.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
So that's part of why that's awesome.
You seem very excited when youtalk about the work.
What's your favorite part ofyour role?
Speaker 1 (07:01):
You know, I think one of the things that I just feel
really fortunate about is for anorganization that I founded 13
years ago.
The number and types of thingswe've been able to do is
something, one of those thingswhere I can say when I die, I
can say I did my part on mywatch.
You know, our very first clientwas Walmart, which is an odd
(07:23):
client to have to start,especially when you think about.
Oftentimes people when theythink of Walmart they think
about them in a way that'sextractive.
But my very first job with themproject with them actually led
to them changing minimum wagefor the entire company, which
results in millions of dollarsin the hands of pockets across
the country.
And like that was just my veryfirst project.
(07:43):
That's just one example, and soas we kind of add up the types
of things we've been able toachieve it, I just get really
excited about it because youknow I can point to the outcomes
and the impact that we'rehaving, and our company's vision
is to change how the world doesbusiness and so that that
umbrella is broad enough thatwherever I see barriers to
(08:03):
business actually being a force,that's not just about making
money.
But you know how you do well bydoing good.
There's always a new problem ora new challenge to solve for,
and I love solving problems.
Speaker 2 (08:15):
That's great, and, you know, I love that example
too, because these are verytangible things that you can
point to to say you know, wereally supported that effort and
we really changed something,that is, you know, helping
families throughout the country,right?
So that's amazing.
I'm glad you were able to sharethat.
So then, on the contrast,what's the most challenging part
(08:35):
of your role?
Speaker 1 (08:36):
I would say right now is a challenging time with a
lot of the work that you know.
If you think about when I firststarted my company and I said I
believe companies have a role toplay and that can drive social
impact, like, everybody waslooking at me like I was crazy.
I had several patronizingmoments where people were like
(08:57):
that's not how the world works,honey, and I'm like OK, and then
you fast forward a couple ofyears and B Corp start to get
popular, esg starts to getpopular.
So you you think about the riseof that overall, it wasn't too
long ago where people weren'teven thinking about businesses
doing well and doing good.
And now one of the challengingthings is that very same concept
or topic is often under attacknow for odd reasons.
(09:20):
So I think that's somethingthat's a bit of a bummer
recently, just trying to figureout how to make sure that the
work that's really makingfamilies and communities
stronger, making businesses moresuccessful, is not so
politicized that you can'tcontinue to get those outcomes,
and I think that's somethingthat's just been something I've
been wrestling with lately,particularly since our business
(09:41):
model is completely grounded inmaking sure that businesses are
driving social change and profitat the same time.
Speaker 2 (09:48):
That's great.
So how, since times havechanged now, do you feel like it
is more palatable for folks tokind of get into this space?
And, if so, like, how do you,if you have listeners here that
are like, man, I want to, I wantto do something like that, and
I want to support those types ofinitiatives Like what do you,
what do you give those?
Give those folks as advice.
Speaker 1 (10:11):
Well, one of the things that we've noticed even
though there's a lot of politicsnow around anything related to
diversity, inclusion andenvironmental, social and
governance, which are usuallythe pillars that people think of
when they're talking aboutimpact with businesses and
investors most large companiesnow have some department or arm.
That's really about impact.
You can really be anentrepreneur now in large
organizations in ways that thoseroles did not exist before.
(10:31):
I'm seeing things like head ofimpact, head of community impact
, head of ESG.
There's just a whole bunch ofdifferent roles now that, even
if you didn't start your companyfrom scratch, like I did, there
are all these opportunitieswithin companies, and the reason
why that's exciting is because,since the field is new in many
(10:52):
ways, that means that you have alot of latitude to drive change
, to try new things, but youhave it within the safety net of
having a large company behindyou.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
That makes a lot of sense.
Now, just so we're all clear,is this what you always wanted
to do for a living?
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Oh, and so I'm actually an electrical engineer.
Computer science double majorundergrad.
Speaker 2 (11:15):
Of course you are Got it.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
So my first job out of or you know, my my first
internship, I guess you'd say itwas actually working on
locomotives in Erie,pennsylvania.
So I don't think when mostpeople look at my career
trajectory it looks kind of odd.
And the through line that Ialways tell people is that I'm a
(11:39):
problem solver, so I'm trainedin systems, trained in
engineering, trained initerative thinking, and so it
kind of started with machines, Iguess you will and move to
movements.
So that is the.
That's the through line.
But no, I don't think Idefinitely was not planning on
(12:00):
doing social impact.
But that said, you know myfamily is always really been
committed to the community.
I've always kind of been partof affinity groups or church
groups or other things like thatthat you know, believed in
doing that.
But I didn't think you couldhave a job about that.
I thought that was justsomething that you did on the
side.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
Got it.
Tell me more about that.
Where were you born, raised?
What was your upbringing like?
Speaker 1 (12:20):
So I was born in California and I grew up in
Florida.
My dad was in the Air Force I'mthe first person from my
immediate family to go tocollege, so and my parents had
me really young and we lived onAir Force bases.
So you know I'm a military brat, but we didn't really move that
often.
So once we moved to, I movedthe most until I turned eight
(12:42):
and then from eight until Igraduated from high school we
lived in Florida.
So my dad often used to go toTurkey or Korea or other places.
But that's, that's mybackground.
Speaker 2 (12:52):
So yeah, ok, places, but that's, that's my background
.
So, yeah, okay.
So at that point you graduatedhigh school and in your mind,
what is like, what is the rolethat you see yourself doing at
that time?
Speaker 1 (13:01):
So I got to do this program when I was in high
school because, remember, I saidI lived in Florida.
So I got to work at NASA when Iwas in high school.
So I had this program called.
It was called SHARP, the SummerHigh School Apprenticeship
Research Program, and it wasfocused on women and people of
color to try to get them intoSTEM.
So I lived maybe a 45-minutedrive from Kennedy Space Center
(13:23):
and so my first, first job wasactually working on the space
station.
Whoa, now, I was an intern,right.
So working on the space stationas an intern is basically like
taking notes and, you know,following the engineers around,
but like I actually got to be onthe launch pad and see the
space shuttle up front and seethe vehicle assembly building,
(13:46):
and so you know, one of thethings that I love about that
high school experience is itshowed me, it kind of infected
me with this belief thatimpossible is nothing like if
you can send people to space andyou're in the room with all
these just ordinary peopletalking day to day about okay.
(14:06):
So when the space station isbuilt, I remember this is like
the first iteration of the spacestation, so it was more of like
an idea and like how do we makethis work and what technology
we would need and what kind oftools we need to pull together,
and you're just like it soundslike you're in Star Wars or Star
Trek, but like basically tryingto make that happen.
That infected me across mycareer.
(14:26):
So it's basically if we cansend people to space, we can
solve the world's hardestproblems on our planet, and
that's what kind of drives meand why I'm not just excited
about as you said, butoptimistic about it, because
that's kind of how I started mywork.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
That's awesome and that's the beauty of those type
of programs, right, like it'snot necessarily just about
getting folks into STEM, whichyou know by some metrics of that
program.
You're not in STEM, right.
So it's not necessarily athrough line of well, we did
this program and now we havepeople necessarily directly in
this field, but it does have aripple effect on your mentality
(15:03):
and on how you approach theworld and the problems, right?
So I really appreciate whenthose programs are in place,
because they do much more thanthey're intended to.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Absolutely Well.
And if you think about, earlierin my career, I was in STEM for
a while I mentioned working onlocomotives and then I was in IT
.
So I was working in IT rightwhen the interwebs became big.
So we used to call ite-business which is hilarious
(15:33):
now because no one puts the E infront of business but back then
it was like we're going to dobusiness online and we're going
to call it e-business.
That makes me sound very old.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
That's another example of me being part of the
frenetic energy of creatingsomething new and what it looks
like to change an industry andchange in company internally.
I think it's moments like thatwhere I've just had these really
exciting intersections withwhether it's technology and
(16:06):
change early enough in my careerthat I can apply that to
different problems.
So, yeah, I did a lot oftechnology to start and then
shifted, Even if you think aboutafter being in technology
myself when I got out ofbusiness school, my first job
out of business school wasactually running a program
called Year Up, which trainsyoung people in technology and
(16:28):
places them in jobs.
So that was my transition tothe social sector and I was
training young people who wereaged 18 to 24 to take my first
job.
When I came out of college, youknow, doing IT, it wasn't in
e-business, it was more in helpdesk, but just that was the
first time I could see.
It was like, oh, not only am Ibeing able to leverage the
(16:48):
technology I have, but I'm alsoable to support young people who
, but for program, would nothave an opportunity to take care
of themselves and theirfamilies economically and in the
short period of six monthsbeing trained and six months
being on an internship.
They were making $40,000 a yearand these were folks who were
working at McDonald's beforehand.
(17:10):
So that was the transition forme and that's why I started my
company, because I started tosee real time.
Not only were these youngpeople effective in their role,
but they were having an outsizedimpact in their communities and
they were also increasingmorale internally, having lower
turnover, having higherdiversity within the
(17:30):
organization.
So I could see real time.
Oh, there's an outsized rolethat business can play and have
impact in a way that's stillgood for the bottom line.
So that was the transitionpoint.
Speaker 2 (17:41):
So that makes a lot of sense to me.
But tell me more about well.
One, where did you go to gradschool?
And two, at the time when youwere applying to grad school,
why did you go there?
What was your moment to say allright, what do I want to do
with that?
Did you go there Like what was,what was?
Speaker 1 (17:54):
your.
What was your moment to say,all right, what do I want to do
with that?
Yes, so I, um, I went to Dukeundergrad and I went to Harvard
business school and myapplication at the time let's
see this I was, I wanted to bethe general manager of
international finance.
That was my goal.
Speaker 2 (18:10):
That was what I wrote .
Why.
Speaker 1 (18:12):
It does.
Yeah, it does sound fancy.
Right At that time I was in themortgage finance business.
So right before going tobusiness school, I was in
mortgage finance and you're like, wait, wait, weren't you just
doing locomotives?
Yes, got to keep up, got tokeep up.
But I was helping them on thetechnology side.
So I was working in theinternational finance division
(18:42):
of a mortgage insurance companyand I was helping them put all
their processes online andsupport that work.
And as part of that work then Ialso ended up doing mergers and
acquisitions and supportingthem acquiring mortgage banks.
So I loved that.
It was so much fun.
I got to visit all thesedifferent countries.
I went to Sydney, australia, Iwent to Mexico, I was in London,
and all just for work.
I was like, oh, this is cool.
Speaker 2 (19:01):
I want to run this.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
I want to run something like this.
So when I went to businessschool, that's what I said I
wanted to do, because that waswhat I was steeped in at the
time and it's funny my husbandteases that I'm one of the few
people he knows who went tobusiness school to become a
hippie.
But because I knew what Iwanted to do, I spent my summer
doing something social impactrelated.
It's like, oh well, I've alwaysdone this on the side.
I know I'm going to go domortgage finance.
(19:24):
Let me try something new overthe summer, because I have a
very clear goal.
I know exactly where I'm goingand that's where I found Europe
Up.
I did my internship at Year Upand before I graduated they
asked me to launch their firstexpansion site in Washington DC.
So that's what turned my path.
That's awesome, I know, but thatis not what I said I was going
(19:45):
to do.
Speaker 2 (19:46):
I know Year Up well too.
They do some good work.
But no, it's fascinatingbecause a lot of times we use
grad school either as a shiftingpoint where you're like I need
it to be able to transition andit'll help me tell that story
and help me, like, find to whatit is I want to do, or you're in
(20:08):
a position where, like, I knowexactly what benefit this grad
school program is going to getme and therefore I want to do it
.
So it's just great to see thatyou went in with the first
intention and then it kind ofshifted your entire trajectory
from there and led you to thenEurope and, as you mentioned, a
great place like Living Citiesand other organizations that are
just doing remarkable workthroughout the country and
supporting different communities.
Thank you, yep.
Talk to me about at what pointdo you realize?
(20:29):
You know what, instead ofworking at some of these
organizations, I just need to domy own thing.
Speaker 1 (20:34):
If you kind of think about my career overall, I've
had kind of an entrepreneurialspirit in a lot of the things
that I've been exposed to, or apart of.
So I would say once I launchedYear Up because launching your
first expansion site at thistime, if you think about where
Year Up was in its history, itonly had the Boston location, so
(20:56):
it was founded in Boston andthen they had a satellite
location in Rhode Island, sothat's like, if you're in the
Boston area, that's like a40-minute train ride from Boston
.
So same network of people, sameresources.
You're kind of still within thesphere of influence.
My site, dc, was the first onethat was outside anybody's
(21:17):
network.
So I basically launched thatfrom scratch.
So I went from the first classof 22 young people to serving
several thousand young people,raising $20 million.
President Obama visited duringhis first year.
I mean just really strong growthand outcomes and it was that
experience that said, oh wait, Ibasically have already started
(21:37):
something from scratch.
So I'm going to the next thingwill be mine, and I think one of
the things that's interestingis when you do work and you're
able to do work that you'repassionate about, it's hard to
find your next job, not becauseyou can't get one right, but
because it's hard to trade.
Waking up every day and knowingthat you're on the earth
(21:58):
fulfilling your purpose, andtrading that for a paycheck.
It was just really hard tofigure out.
So for me, starting somethingfrom scratch was the closest
thing I could get to what itfelt like to know every day.
I wake up in the morning and mywork makes sure young people
can take care of themselves andtheir families, and now I have
that multiplied by 10, because Ican do it do that kind of work,
(22:20):
not just with young people, butwith people from different
backgrounds, regardless of whatthe outcomes are.
So that's how I ended up inthat place.
Speaker 2 (22:27):
So I know one of the barriers to becoming an
entrepreneur is the fear of whatthat means from a stability
standpoint, from a providingmeans for your family standpoint
.
Can you give us a range of whatsomeone that owns their own
company, that is in this type ofspace, can make on a given?
Speaker 1 (22:45):
year.
So there's, I think one of thethings as an entrepreneur is you
have to be really clear.
Are you a solopreneur?
So you know, people used to saywhen I was first starting, are
you running a lifestyle businesswhere it's basically, can I
take care of myself and myfamily?
But it's really about you andyour organization, or you, right
, think about that more likeindependent consultant, or are
(23:07):
you building a business?
And they're slightly different.
If you're doing the solopreneurroute with work like this, my
first year and I will say I maybe the exception, but my first
year I want to say I brought inlike $300,000.
So you know, if you think aboutwhat salaries are, you're like
(23:28):
huh, I can do that.
What I will say and this issomething that people who know
of others who go to businessschool think it's kind of built
in the curriculum.
They don't tell you how tostart a business.
They tell you about thestrategy, but there's a whole
bunch of just tactical minutia.
Oh, you got to register withthis, and oh, the taxes look
like this.
And oh, did you get thearticles of incorporation or did
(23:52):
you get insurance articles ofincorporation or did you get
insurance?
I mean, there's just like a lotof these like tiny tactical
things with starting a company,that not just the fear of when
my next paycheck is going tocome, but also the fear of, like
all of the administrivia that'sconnected with running your own
thing, that you're going to dosomething wrong and get in
trouble and like get audited fortaxes and stuff.
So like there's a hump there.
(24:12):
There's definitely a learningcurve there, regardless of if
you have a business backgroundor not.
I think the other hump isespecially if you have a partner
working really closely andbeing transparent about what is
the firewall.
So we would say what's thefirewall between my company and
the family's finances and whatmakes the risk feel comfortable
for both of us.
(24:33):
So my husband and I decidedthat I would save six months of
expenses and have them in thefamily account because the money
can come in in ups and downs.
You have to start to learn howto figure out things like
managing your cash flow, makingsure accounts payable is
happening that one month you canbe bringing in $13,000 and the
next month you can be bringingin $50,000 and the next month
(24:54):
you can be bringing in $50,000.
Well, you know what you got topay for the mortgage every month
.
So there are little things likethat that you have to work
through.
But once you figure that outand you kind of get a sense for
how your cash flow works andwhat kind of roles you have, I
think if your risk tolerance isthere, I tell people, once you
(25:15):
start working for yourself, it'sreally hard to work for anybody
else Got it.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
That's awesome and I love that because I think you
just demystify a lot right andjust make it so that folks feel
like it is all obtainable.
So I appreciate you sharingthat.
So now you have your six monthsof unprepared for anything that
comes together.
One of the things that wedidn't really touch on for the
audience is where did you landon?
(25:40):
Do you want to continue to be asolopreneur versus growing it
and have other folks on yourteam?
Where are you now?
What does that look like?
Speaker 1 (25:48):
So I knew from the beginning that I wanted to
create a company.
I wasn't about being asolopreneur.
If you think about the visionof changing how the world does
business, everything I do youwork backwards from what's the
outcome you're trying to achieve.
So if I want to change how theworld does business, I can't do
that by myself.
I can have little moments whereI can say, wow, that was
(26:08):
awesome, that I just did that.
But you want to be able toscale your impact, and so I knew
one.
I needed to do that through ateam so I could basically touch
more people, and so we builtconsistent processes.
Also, when you think about, whatwe wanted to do is democratize
what we're learning with others,which is why I've written two
books.
So if you want to change howthe world does business, we can
(26:30):
only do it as fast as you are aclient, unless I find other ways
to share what's working, what'snot working and why.
It's why I write articlesmonthly.
It's why I work really hard totranslate what often sounds like
very esoteric into things thatpeople can understand and apply,
because that way, even if youdon't work with CapEQ day to day
(26:50):
, there's some nugget that we'resharing that you can start to
try internally, and I believeequipping the entrepreneurs of
their businesses and investingcompanies with the tools they
need to be successful is just asimportant as the direct client
work we have.
Speaker 2 (27:07):
That's great, okay.
So how many folks do you haveon your team now?
Speaker 1 (27:10):
So we have about 20 people on our team.
Speaker 2 (27:12):
That's huge to grow something from your brain,
somewhere to say all right nowwe have 20 people that are
dedicated to this vision anddoing the things.
What was your first hire andlike?
Why?
Speaker 1 (27:24):
So my first hire is usually okay.
So I think this might get alittle a little in the weeds.
But when you're running aconsulting business, one of the
most important things is youneed to make sure that you can
pay for people.
So the way that I work, you'llhear this I won't hire anybody
full time unless I have sixmonths of their salary in the
(27:46):
bank.
So for me it's really importantthat I can look somebody in the
eye and say I can't control thefuture, but at a minimum, if we
run into hard times, I can lookyou in the eye and say I got
you for the next six monthsRight, and I think that's really
important.
That's something that you know.
When you are hiring somebody,you are not just hiring them,
(28:06):
you're basically hiring theirfamily, if you will, is the way
that I look at it.
So I take that really seriouslywith my employees.
So the first type of employeethat I tend to hire is someone
who can actually serviceprojects with me.
Because how do I pay your bill?
I pay your bill by providingclient service work, and so if
you can do that with me, thenthat's helpful.
(28:27):
Then I go from that tooperations.
So the people who can serviceclients with me.
If they're able to take thatexpertise and then create the
internal processes that allow usto replicate that with others,
it allows me to hire the nextperson but ramp them up more
quickly.
So that's kind of how I balanceout, how I hire.
(28:47):
And then the last, if you startto think about that, okay, so
you have one person, then thetwo person, three people over
time.
Then you start to need to buildthe back office work, right, so
the finance people and theoperations folks.
That's when you kind of startto get there.
But you grow into it and youknow, I think one of the lessons
(29:07):
I learned initially especially,I have that entrepreneurial
spirit.
But it's different running yourown thing.
It's different when, like youknow, it's cash coming out of
your bank and you're managingthat.
So I started to realize like,oh, I hired too quickly and too
many people when I first startedmy company in ways that I
(29:28):
realized, oh, that's creatingtoo much of a cash flow strain
on the company.
So I learned about how to hirein a way that is sustainable,
where I can make sure I can paypeople consistently.
That's great, I hope this isn'ttoo much in the weeds, but
you're asking me these questions, so I'm going to answer them?
Speaker 2 (29:45):
Not at all.
I think this is perfect, and Ijust feel like there are a lot
of folks that may be on thefence about like, do I do my own
thing?
I'm at this company, I feellike I can do some consulting,
or maybe do it by myself, orwhatever that looks like.
So, just thinking through, well, how do you then end up at a
place where you have 20 peoplein this company?
Speaker 1 (30:03):
It's just helpful for people to understand the path,
so I appreciate you sharing thatWell, and I also think lots of
times people feel like you know,I have 20 people who work with
me day to day, but a lot of themare actually not W-2s, they're
1099s.
So the way that I look at thatis it's part of changing how the
world does business.
If I'm helping another personwho is running their own
business get work, because thehardest thing to do, I think,
(30:26):
when you're a consultant and thefear that you're talking about
is about getting business right.
I'm really good at businessdevelopment.
I'm really good at fundraising,so that's not something that
makes me afraid.
But if I have brilliant peoplearound me where that's a hurdle
for them but I know I can findthe perfect project to put them
(30:47):
on and then they start to buildtheir confidence I'll do that
all day.
In fact, we often at CapEQ.
What we find is there are someprojects that aren't a good fit
for us and we'll send them to alot of we often at CapEQ.
What we find is there are someprojects that aren't a good fit
for us and we'll send them to alot.
We call them our Avengers.
So people who work on projectswith us, we assemble the right
team to solve the problem we'retrying to solve.
So I'll forward work to ourAvengers because I want
(31:08):
different people who are runningtheir companies to thrive.
And if you look at our team, Iwould say we're 90% of color and
probably 85% women.
So you know that's.
That's also changing how theworld does business.
You know, seeing people growingtheir their own individual
businesses, their own individualwealth, having their own agency
, is another ripple effect ofthe way that we do our work.
Speaker 2 (31:30):
That's great and I also appreciate you sharing not
just the kind of composition andintentionality of kind of your
team right, but of partneringwith others right, where you
don't have to take on everyproject and do all the things
and feel like you're incompetition with everyone else.
It's like there's value inhaving this, as you called it,
the Avengers right Of like wecan work in the ecosystem
(31:51):
together and figure out how wecan all add value.
Speaker 1 (31:54):
Absolutely yes, and that is something that I will
say is a pet peeve of mine.
I do feel like there's justunnecessary the mindset of
scarcity.
I think that is an undercurrentin the way capitalism I would
say has worked to date is thetype of thing that creates
unnecessary competition at times.
(32:15):
And I don't mean you know, youdon't, you're not.
Obviously you're going tocompete for who's providing the
best product or service.
But if you're trying to changethe way the world does business,
you can't do that by yourself,like you actually can't get to
that outcome by yourself, and soyou need to be able to find the
right partners who are, who aremore focused on solving the
(32:35):
problem than they are of beingthe solution, and I think that's
actually how you get there, andunfortunately, there are too
many people in the space where,like, that's not what they're
centered.
I think there's a lot of folkswho are grounded more in ego and
grounded more in how they lookor what they you know what
credit they get than actuallytrying to solve the problem,
(32:56):
which is part of why it's harderto get some of this stuff done.
Speaker 2 (33:00):
And you.
You've already given us so many, but do you have any other
career cheat codes that you'veencountered along the way that
you're like?
You know that was.
That's something that folksshould think about doing earlier
in their career or just adoptas as good practice.
Speaker 1 (33:14):
So you know this is going to sound super trite, but
I tell you right now, mentorshave been like the inflection.
Like every time I had aninflection point in my life,
I've been really fortunate tohave like the best mentors and
you know, some of them came fromformal programs through my
company, but a lot of times itwas just people who believed in
(33:36):
me and gave me good advice.
The very first mentor I had isDebra Dean Nelson, and I would
not have gone to college outsideof my state if it hadn't been
for her Because, like Imentioned I still don't know if
I mentioned, but neither of myparents went to college, so I
didn't have a very clearunderstanding of where to go.
(33:57):
We didn't make a lot of moneyand so I didn't want to be a
financial burden, so my goalactually was to go to the
community college up the streetfrom our house.
I was like I'm just going to goto a local community college,
that way I can help out aroundthe house, I can still get an
education, but I can besupportive of my family.
And Debra said oh no,girlfriend, we are sending you
(34:20):
to the best schools.
I was like okay, and sheliterally just took me on as a
project and my mom did nails, soI met her.
I came home from school one dayshe asked me what grades are
you getting in school?
I was like who is this lady inmy house?
I was like straight A's.
She's like, oh, I'm going totake you to lunch.
(34:42):
I was like okay, it's likeweird lady, fine.
But like my entire trajectorychanged from that moment.
Right, and I have moments likethat throughout my career.
I had another moment that Iremember in my career with a
mentor.
It was when I was ininternational finance and he was
actually my boss's boss and Iwas having a hard time with
(35:05):
someone who was there's thisdual reporting structure who
said I just was, I was, I wasjust too chipper and I needed to
take it down a notch.
And it really bothered mebecause I was like, oh, I didn't
know that was unprofessional.
I didn't mean to beunprofessional, I just like
(35:28):
making work a place where peopleenjoy coming to.
And my boss's boss said and myboss's boss said, no, he's
absolutely wrong.
You do amazing work and peoplelove working with you and that
helps you actually be successful.
So if people talk to you aboutchanging who you are to be
successful, they're wrong andyou just keep doing what you're
(35:50):
doing.
And so that happened in my early20s, and I'm the type of person
that people often think that,because I'm energetic, because I
find joy in what I do,sometimes people can conflate
that with that not beingsubstantive and like no, this is
a choice.
It's a choice to create a spacewhere the work you do day to
(36:11):
day is really hard.
So how do you create anenvironment where people can
thrive?
And that is a choice on my endand it's something that, but for
that mentor, I would havedimmed my light to get my work
done.
And it's moments like that, Ithink, along the way, that have
been my cheat codes.
My cheat codes are always otherpeople pouring into me.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
That's great and I also appreciate you sharing
different roles that mentors canhave, right, so one that can
help, as you said, make sure youdon't dim your light.
Then there are others that aregoing to be more like on the
tactical side, like, hey, weneed to make sure you apply to
these types of schools and likego away and think about your
major or whatever that lookslike, right, no way I would be
(36:54):
thriving in my career and doingall the things without so many
people pouring into me right,without so many folks taking the
time to just add differentpieces of information.
That kind of helped me shape mypath.
So I just appreciate kind ofthat nod to the mentors that are
out there doing it all the time, and then we're able to then
pass that on and support othersalong our journeys as well.
(37:15):
So you know, I appreciate that.
Yes.
Speaker 1 (37:17):
And then I have a couple organizational cheat
codes.
I feel like, since it's thecareer cheat code podcast, I
should come with a couple ofdifferent versions.
So some institutional cheatcodes, particularly if you run
your own company.
I found every just about everyregion has like leadership XYZ
right.
So I did leadership GreaterWashington when I lived in DC
(37:39):
and I did leadership Dallas whenwe moved to Dallas, and I think
those are really good cheatcodes for two reasons.
One, it gets you a quicknetwork of people that you have
a shared experience with acrossyour city or your community,
which helps as you're doing work, regardless of what your work
is.
You know, oh, I know anattorney here, I know someone
who works at this bank, or youknow, it's just a quick
(38:00):
relationship cheat code.
But two, it helps you learnyour region really quickly.
It helps you understand oh,this is how education and
transportation play out, orthese are the leaders who are
making different choices andwhat the factors are they're
weighing.
I think the third thing,particularly as a leader, if you
are someone who I used to havea really hard time
(38:21):
distinguishing betweenproductivity and activity, and
these leadership programs tendto be like really time intensive
and it's like I'm just tooimportant.
There's no way I can spend thewhole day away from my job and
you realize like, yeah, you can,and it showed me the importance
of space for you know, thinkingdifferently about things, being
(38:44):
exposed to different things.
It actually helps you be abetter leader if you're not
constantly in the day-to-day ofwhat you do but you have moments
to pull back.
So, like leadership programs,huge cheat code, and then
there's a and those are justlike you know there's Dallas
leadership insert city here, andthen the other cheat code that
I had another leadership program, but just completely amazing,
(39:07):
was the Presidential LeadershipScholars Program that I was part
of, and so that is apartnership with President HW
Bush, president W Bush,president Clinton and the Lyndon
B Johnson Center and it'sanother leadership kind of
program, very time intensive,but it's for people across
(39:27):
partisan lines who care aboutimpact.
So it was just an amazingprogram to be able to meet
presidents and theiradministrations and learn how
they solve crises.
You're sitting there talking tothe person who was working on
the TARP program, right, likeyou're sitting, you're just
(39:48):
getting like completely insideknowledge on what it was like to
really have to solve hugecrises or challenges across the
country and you start to seethat even presidents are just
ordinary people doingextraordinary things and you
also have the opportunity totalk to you.
I have.
I've been really fortunate that, particularly if you think
(40:09):
about elections and politics andhow, how polarizing things have
been in so many ways, that'schallenging.
It's been really helpful for meto have a group of folks who
have different ideologies that Ican talk to as humans and just
say I don't understand why thisis showing up this way.
Tell me why.
And I think that has also beensomething that's just been a joy
(40:32):
to have that network to reallybe able to talk to, a joy to
have that network to really beable to talk to, and it helps me
not it helps keep me fromdehumanizing people just because
they have a differentperspective.
So those are my institutionalcheat codes.
Mentors are the people and hereare the leadership programs
with institutionals.
I've done my homeworkassignment.
Speaker 2 (40:52):
You are crushing this cheat code thing.
I appreciate that.
That's great.
Are there other forms of, maybeforms of media that could be
books, podcasts, newslettersthat you have consumed, that
have helped you personally orprofessionally?
Speaker 1 (41:07):
Yes, I mean there's so many podcasts that I adore.
So first of all, I will say myhusband is the one who listens
to podcasts more than I do.
I like to listen to fun onesbecause my brain needs a break.
But one podcast that I love,and I'm sure a lot of people
love, is Adam Grant's Work Life.
I just think he does an amazingjob of taking really complex.
(41:29):
I like when people take complexissues and make them really
accessible.
So I love Work Life with AdamGrant.
I love Freakonomics, so similarreason, and I actually got to be
on a Freakonomics episoderecently about the NFL and
diversity.
So I've been like a StephenDubner Freakonomics fan for like
decades.
So the fangirling with bothFreakonomics and NFL like can
(41:54):
you get any better than that?
Both for economics and the NFL,can you get any better than
that?
So I love for economics as well.
I like the oh there's this onepodcast that what is it called?
Planet Money?
I love Planet Money as well.
So I like things that helpdemystify the world around you.
So those are just several ofthe podcasts that I like.
I read a lot of books One of thebooks that I've read recently
(42:18):
that has been instructive to meand my company has been how to
10x your life.
So the frame is basically asyou're growing something, people
tend to grow things in anincremental way, but if you have
to 10x what you're doing, ithelps you lift your head up and
think about new ways to attack aproblem.
(42:40):
So I like books like that.
When I'm reading books, it'susually around, if it's not
fiction, because frankly, mostof the books I read are fiction
and something sci-fi related orfantasy related.
We've got vampires, we've gotfairies.
This is what I do with myfiction.
But if I'm reading nonfiction,it's usually around business
related issues like that thatmakes sense.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
I mean, you grew up near NASA, so your mind is in
space somewhere.
So that tracks Love that.
Speaker 1 (43:08):
That is fair.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
That's awesome.
Is there anything that we havenot discussed, that the world
should know about you today?
Speaker 1 (43:13):
I think that it's really important that we own the
future that we're trying tobuild, and I think that's
something that I take anownership and accountability for
the kind of world we'recreating around us.
And I feel like when peoplefeel like they're disconnected,
there's a hopelessness there,and so I think one thing that I
(43:35):
would just encourage people ifthere's anything about my
journey that I would hope wouldencourage people is that you can
create the life and you cancreate the world that you see in
your head, but you just have tobe willing to take that step.
There's this beautiful poemthat I really clung to when I
started my business.
It was called On Boldness andit basically says that when man
(44:00):
takes the first step, providencemeets you with beauty that you
could never imagine.
And that's that on boldness.
That spirit of taking the stepand feeling like there's a
spiritual response in a way tohelp meet you where you are, is
something that I hope, if fornothing else, that my journey
(44:22):
inspires others to take theirown first bold step.
Speaker 2 (44:26):
That is a beautiful note to end on.
Really appreciate you coming onthe podcast today.
Thank you for everything.
Thanks for all the tea cups.
Speaker 1 (44:33):
Thanks for having me.
It's been fun Awesome.
Speaker 2 (44:36):
I hope you enjoyed this episode.
If you did and believe on themission we're on, please like,
rate and subscribe to thispodcast on whatever platform
you're using, and share thispodcast with your friends and
your networks.
Make sure you follow us onInstagram and LinkedIn at Career
Cheat Code and tell us peopleor careers you would like to see
highlighted.
See you next week with somemore cheat codes.
Peace.
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