September 22, 2023 • 21 mins
How does the devastating loss of not one, but two siblings to suicide change a person? It's a question that no one ever wants to face but is the heartbreaking reality for our guest, Ed Paluch. Ed bravely opens up about the tragic passing of his 2 younger brothers, Greg and Andrew, and the profound impact their loss had on his life and his mother's. With raw emotion, he shares about Greg's battle with depression, Andrew's struggle with mental illness, and his mother's indescribable pain. As we remember Greg, his infectious laughter and physical humor bring a poignant reminder of the vibrant lives behind the statistical face of suicide.
Suicide's ripple effect is far-reaching, altering connections and dynamics in unexpected ways. Hear Ed's insights on how Greg's death affected his bond with his remaining brother Andrew and triggered his active involvement in suicide prevention initiatives. We also examine the double-edged sword of social media and the urgent need for improving mental health resources for today's youth. In the midst of grief, Ed's reflections are a wake-up call to the importance of awareness and intervention in mental health issues. Join us for this deeply personal journey that underscores the enduring presence of those we lose and their continuous shaping of our lives.
If you or someone you know is dealing contemplating suicide, dial or text to 988.
https://988lifeline.org/
https://www.samhsa.gov/newsroom/suicide-prevention-month
https://www.amazon.com/This-Night-self-care-impacted-suicidal/dp/0692475907
https://sprc.org/author/annemarie_matulis/
https://www.instagram.com/avoiceatthetable/?hl=en
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Scott (00:00):
This episode deals with sensitive topics of suicide and
mental health.
Although there won't be graphicdetails, please know that the
discussion will venture intoareas that may not be suitable
for children.
Therefore, parental discretionis strongly advised.
The guest today is Ed Paluch.
He's the oldest of threebrothers.
Tragically, his youngest twobrothers, greg, who I've been
(00:20):
friends with from elementaryschool through college, and the
younger brother, andrew, bothtook their own lives.
September is suicide preventionawareness month.
Ed has been kind enough andbrave enough to join me to talk
about his brothers, theirpassing and how he is carrying
on their memories.
Ed, thank you for joining us.
Ed (00:38):
Very happy to be here.
Scott (00:39):
You know you've obviously gone through this more than
once, unfortunately.
Yeah, you start with Greg first.
Were there any signs ofdepression for either of the
guys you know?
Early in life, that kind ofstand out to you now.
Ed (00:49):
Yeah, not so much early in life with them.
I guess we'll start with Greg.
You know, after he got out ofcollege he was a licensed
chiropractor and he decided hedidn't want to practice and be
in that, you know, trying tocollect insurance and what not
medical insurance.
So he moved out to Californiato try and be a movie star and
he actually had some little bitroles in some movies.
(01:12):
When he was doing that, youknow, I kind of started to
notice that he was starting toisolate himself a bit.
He would come back home andstay with my mom every couple of
years and sometimes he wouldn'teven tell us that he was coming
back.
So, you know, I would find outlater that he had come and
visited and we hadn't gotten tosee him.
(01:32):
Really, you know, that wasalways a tough thing, you know,
and talking to a lot of hisfriends afterwards like yourself
he did, you know they losttouch with him.
He kind of self isolated, youknow, just went down a path
where I guess he couldn't seehimself coming back from,
unfortunately.
Scott (01:50):
Yeah, I remember you know , we had gotten out of college
and he was in chiropractorschool in Chicago and all the
guys from high school you knowfive or six of them all decided
to go out and visit him for likethree or four days and I
couldn't make the trip because Iwas driving cross country with
my dad.
We had had this thing plannedwe were coming back from Idaho
(02:12):
and we were going cross countryand that always got to me.
I was always bummed about thatin general, that I missed it.
But then after I heard you know, heard the news about Greg, we
were happy that he went outthere and tried to become a
chiropractor and then turnaround and try to do the acting.
You know it was a kooky Gregthing to do.
Yes, greg was always the kindof guy I mean.
Some of the fondest memories Ihave of Greg are just doing
crazy things, yeah.
Ed (02:32):
And he was very gregarious, you know.
He was Absolutely Fun to bearound.
Scott (02:37):
My favorite memory of him is we were in like eighth grade
.
He slept over my house.
The cool guy sleepovers injunior high.
And he slept over my house onNew Year's Eve and my mother put
out some treats and stuff forus and we, you know, popped on
MTV because that was pretty muchthe only thing you could do as
a cool guy back in eighth gradeand my mom hopped at the shower
and was like you guys be goodboys.
We're like yeah, sure, whatever.
(02:58):
And he picked up his pillow andsmashed me in the head with his
pillow and it exploded and everysingle feather that was in that
pillow came out.
There had to be a million birdsworth of feathers in my living
room and it was a good fourinches on the ground.
And he sat there and that laughhe's had, that laugh that was
(03:19):
just amazingly infectious andjust laughed his head off and I
was freaking out.
I'm like so I grabbed a trashbag and I'm trying to scoop
these feathers back and mymother came out and told her she
was like what the hell are youfreaking out?
And he just laughed at her.
It was the funniest thing I'veever seen in my life.
Never forget that as long as Ilive.
Ed (03:36):
He was big into physical humor type stuff too.
Yes, yes, he would always kindof love you when you weren't
expecting it.
Scott (03:43):
Oh yeah, he would give you the dooper.
I'm not really sure where thatcame from, but you'd be walking
next to him and all of a suddenhe would just kick you right in
the ass for no reason.
What the hell happened.
How old was Greg when he passed?
Ed (03:57):
He was 40, seven years ago, I think he was about 45 or so
yeah, that's crazy.
Scott (04:06):
I remember Vaughn called me, told me and I was just like
that's no no, right, if youcan't believe yeah.
And that just seems to be thestandard answer when anybody you
hear has done this.
I can't believe it.
No way, not him, not her.
How'd your family react?
How was your mom about it?
And obviously just destroyed.
Ed (04:25):
My mom is still destroyed over him.
Unfortunately, he was stayingwith her and she's the one who
found him.
Oh, I guess that just adds tothe, you know, another layer to
it.
Yeah, you know she's.
She's always struggled over theyears with that and you know,
obviously now with with theAndrew, it just kind of brings
(04:48):
it all back around for her again.
Yeah, and your mom's such asweet woman.
Yeah, she is.
She's been through a lot.
Yeah, unfortunately, withAndrews mental illness he really
wasn't able to work or anything.
So she was fully supporting himand, oh really, um, because of
his mental illness he became notthat great to deal with, you
(05:11):
know.
So you know that just adds alevel of complexity on it for
her.
So, yeah, Andrew go to Syracuse.
He, he went to Syracuse for oneyear.
Okay, he got in a bar fightwhere somebody hit him with a
beer bottle and ripped his faceoff just about.
Oh my god.
Yeah, I do remember that, Okayafter that he he went to
(05:33):
University of Miami and then he,pretty much you know he stayed
down in Miami Beach after that.
What's like a club promoter atone point or he was trying yeah,
he was trying to be like a,like a promoter, you know, set
up party promoter, that type ofthing.
He's in that whole Miami scene.
Yeah, one of his favoritethings to do was to bring out
his photo album and showeverybody all the pictures of
(05:56):
him with the differentCelebrities.
Scott (05:58):
Yeah, I remember seeing the picture with puff Daddy.
Ed (06:01):
Yeah, exactly, yeah, you, you pretty much name it.
You know Miami's a reallyhappening scene for celebrities,
so he really, you really met alot of people.
Scott (06:11):
So you said you know that he struggled with mental
illness.
Was that diagnosed later on?
Ed (06:15):
So we couldn't even get him to go see the general
practitioner.
He would not go see a doctorfor anything.
You know, if we tried, kind oflike I said before, you know, he
would turn things on us.
Yeah, it's always Verydifficult when you have an adult
that Refuses to get help.
(06:36):
This very look.
You know there isn't a lot youcan do, unfortunately.
Scott (06:39):
Yeah, yeah, you know you'd mentioned that he had
isolated as well.
Ed (06:44):
He just stopped coming home to stay to Miami and kind of did
his own thing yeah correct andyou know, like I said, was
really with his mental state,was really unable to work and,
you know, just Just continued tofurther isolate and just think
that you know people were comingto get him in that type of
thing.
Scott (07:04):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
So he, his passing wasrelatively recent.
It was under end of July.
Yeah, I did July.
Okay, yeah, and did you get aphone call?
Is anybody even in contact?
I mean, how did you find out solike?
Ed (07:19):
yeah, so that's, that's quite a story there.
On a Thursday night I think itwas a Thursday night my wife
Paula noticed that she had avoicemail, so she looked at.
You know, on Apple you can seethe transcription of the message
and it was from the Miami-Dadecoroner's office.
Oh my God.
(07:39):
So at that point we're like ohmy God.
And that night I startedcalling the coroner's office and
they run 24 hours but there'sno one there that'll talk to you
at night.
And then we were trying to callthe police department and they
gave us a name of a coupledetectives, but they wouldn't
(07:59):
tell us anything.
So finally, later the next day,we finally talked to an
investigator from the coroner'soffice who gave us a rundown of
what had happened.
So that wasn't a fun experienceby any means.
Scott (08:13):
No, just the anxiety of waiting.
You know something's goingwrong, but you Exactly yeah.
Ed (08:18):
It wasn't a fun night.
Scott (08:19):
I can't believe that they .
I know they have jobs to do andthey do great jobs, but it's
gotta be.
They have to understand whatthe family's going through as
well too.
Right.
Ed (08:28):
Yeah, I can't imagine what you're saying, what it is for
those first responders,especially in an active
community like Miami, but Ididn't get a call back from a
detective for almost a month.
Oh my God.
Scott (08:43):
Yeah, until you found out what happened, or until, like
you had found out what happenedand then further information.
Ed (08:49):
Yeah, so you know, the coroner told us some of the
details from the police report,but I wanted to hear, you know,
there was other things hecouldn't tell me.
So I, you know, obviouslywanted to talk to the detectives
and, you know, get a little bitof closure there.
Scott (09:05):
Yeah, got it, and it took that long to get the
information.
Oh man, I'm sorry.
Ed (09:10):
I'm actually flying down there next week to try and see
how his condo is, because he hadstarted like a small fire.
So I think things are a messdown there.
You know, same kind of thingtrying to get the property
manager to talk to me or let meknow what's going on.
They just nobody responds.
Scott (09:30):
Yeah, you know, without obviously getting into details,
you said that he started a fire.
Was that method or no?
Ed (09:37):
No, okay, no, but he just felt like setting a fire and
yeah, my guess is he thought hemust have had a break and must
have thought people were gonnabe coming through the door Adam
or something.
So he started the fire and thenhe proceeded to die by suicide
Gosh.
Scott (09:54):
I'm sorry.
Yeah, You've been amazinglybrave on social media, you know
posting stuff, Greg'sanniversary and making sure that
people are aware of mentalillness.
And how do you feel havingthose two brothers go through
such hard times and yeah, youknow, I just feel, you know,
awful and empty.
Ed (10:17):
You know it's something that's, you know, extremely hard
to reconcile.
But, like you said, I, you knowI do what I can to try and get
the message out that mentalillness is no different than
having the flu or cancer or anyother kind of affliction or
illness.
It's not something that shouldbe hidden or, you know, feel
(10:41):
like that you're ashamed to talkabout.
Yeah, you know, the brain isjust one part of the body that
has to be taken care of, likethe rest of it, you know.
Scott (10:50):
Yeah, yeah, you know it's a shame that we still, to this
day, have that kind of a stigmaabout mental illness.
Yes, it's nice that you know asmany people as possible are
still trying to help and getover that, and that's what we're
trying to do, you know.
Do here today.
Yes, in a previous episode wediscussed about one of my other
friends who had also taken herown life, and I went through a
(11:11):
really deep, deep depressionabout four or five years after
college and she saved my life.
The only reason why I nevermoved forward with any other
plans was because I saw theimpact that this had on everyone
.
Yeah, I felt the impact of theloss and I couldn't do that to
anybody else.
Mm-hmm, you know my issues atthat time were not.
(11:31):
I didn't feel that they were asbig as hurting all these other
people and I got lucky.
You know there were a lot ofpeople out there, your brothers
included, that weren't.
Ed (11:39):
Right, I'm guessing that your strong relationship with
your wife and, you know, withyour other friends and family
probably really helped as well.
You know, yeah, yeah, it's allabout connection and having
Having people to talk to thatyou can talk to openly with.
Yeah, you know people that youtrust.
Unfortunately, not everybodyhas that.
Scott (12:01):
Yeah, I think you made a great point about the isolation.
You know, in both yourbrother's instances, isolation
was the key for them to.
You know, maybe shut that off,yeah, and not have to worry
about, you know, hurtingAbsolutely, you know, for folks
listening out there, I think youknow, when you start to see
someone isolating and you knowthat they are going through some
rough times, that isolation isa huge, huge tell.
(12:21):
It's a huge giveaway thatsomething's going on, yeah.
Then comes the challenge oftrying to unisolate them.
You know, trying to find yourway to get back into their life,
forget somebody back into theirlife, and it's, yeah, that's
got to be a rough battle.
Ed (12:33):
Right, because when someone doesn't want to be engaged I've
gone through it twice now, youknow I still haven't figured out
how to, how to get around that.
Oh, you know, I always try andshow unconditional love to all
my family and friends and justhave that door open, but
unfortunately you can't alwaysgo in there with a battering ram
(12:55):
yourself.
Yeah, so I just try and beavailable and let people know
that they're loved and that I'mhere to talk.
We're here to talk.
Scott (13:04):
What was Andrew's feelings towards Greg's passing?
Ed (13:07):
He didn't have a good reaction to Greg's passing.
Yeah, he turned the blame on meactually.
Oh my God, sorry.
After that occurred we didn'ttalk for a few years.
I had to.
You know, for my own mentalhealth I had to separate a
little bit.
Yeah, yeah.
Scott (13:25):
Rightfully so yeah.
Ed (13:28):
And you know he.
You know, unfortunately my momreally took the brunt of it as
well, because you know she kepttalking to him and you know he
would blame her as well when notan easy thing.
Scott (13:38):
No, I can't imagine your mom.
Is she getting help?
How's she doing?
Ed (13:44):
When Greg had passed, my wife and I became very active in
some suicide preventionmovements and, like you said,
you know we've done walks andyou know monthly tabletop
discussions.
I was on the board of a greatgroup called the Taunton
(14:07):
Community Services Incorporatedand Amory Matulaitis is like a
ground break in the industry forsuicide prevention.
One of the folks I met throughthere, steven Palm.
He lost his daughter, casey, tosuicide so he and his wife
started a foundation and youknow, as part of this whole
(14:30):
group we commissioned an authorand we've put you know thousands
of emotional well-being booksin public schools and you know
things like that because that'sreally where you want to catch.
It is when kids are young andjust build those skills in them,
you know, to cope and to haveself-worth and to be able to
talk about things.
Scott (14:50):
Yeah, I'll make sure I put all of those folks in the
show notes too, so that peoplecan check that out.
Ed (14:55):
Yeah, I forwarded an article to you on Steven.
I can get you some stuff on AnnMarie as well, please do Thank
you.
So back to my mom now.
So I used to bring her to thosemonthly tabletop meetings and
she would typically feel worseafter going to them, but she
does have a great counselor thatshe does telehealth
(15:16):
appointments with.
That's a super support, youknow, and just her getting help
herself was a huge step.
Scott (15:23):
So yeah, after going through the research for these
two shows, you know, I sat down,I looked at my own daughter and
you can't imagine being aparent and having to watch your
kid go through that andheartbreak and to your point,
we've had a child that has hadmultiple suicide attempts and
it's just something that leavesa hole in you that can never be
(15:45):
repaired.
Yeah, yeah, it's interestingbecause I used the word
interesting very loosely.
It's interesting when we wereyounger.
I think you're three years old,I mean, I think you were when I
was a freshman.
You were like a senior.
You know, back when we werekids you didn't bring up Suicide
, exactly because if you broughtup suicide, people thought you
were promoting it as opposed totrying to stop it.
(16:07):
And it'd be nice to see Kidslearning about the impacts that
this has and that there's alwayssomebody out there to talk to
them.
Much sooner Then we learn.
My daughter kind of gottraumatized.
Poor kid on the bus next to herthrew up next to her and poor
kid Got super traumatized.
But right, you know, she metwith the guidance counselor and
then there's a resource officerand yeah, and we didn't have
(16:27):
that grow it up, we had oneperson that was in a room and
they just stuck a band-aid onyou and kicked you back into the
class.
Ed (16:32):
So but again, on the flip side, with all the kids have,
that we didn't have is all thissocial media.
It can, while social media Ilike you, I find it nice that it
connects me with People that Iwent to you know high school,
with their childhood friends.
But a lot of the stuff thatfloats around on social media is
really detrimental to kids andtheir mental health?
Scott (16:54):
Yeah, it, I was looking up some statistics and you know
you think that over the years,science and medicine have gotten
better, therapeutical accesshas gotten more prevalent and
you'd think that that numberwould come down.
But I think you know a number Iwas looking at was like from
1996 when one of my friends,heather, committed suicide.
It, I think you know collegeage students.
It was like 31,000 had losttheir lives and then in 2022
(17:16):
that number went up to like49,500.
Right, that's, that's a 50%jump.
I mean that's insanity, right,literally and figuratively, but
right, 50% jump with betterTechnology even though there
have been gains.
Ed (17:29):
Unfortunately, our mental health system is still just very
inadequate.
You know, having gone throughit with various family members
and stuff, it's just yeah, it'stough.
It's really tough.
If I could just say reallyquick, because I've done this
before and and someone was niceenough to correct me but we
(17:50):
don't say committed suicidebecause they didn't commit a
crime, we just say died bysuicide.
Scott (17:56):
Okay, thank you.
Yes, and that absolutely makesway more sense.
And you said you've gonethrough it with one of your
children.
How has it changed yourparenting?
You obviously having a child gothrough it changed your
parenting, but you know, withGreg and Andrew probably changes
it as well.
So make you more cautious or,you know, overly paranoid.
Ed (18:13):
It definitely makes us really paranoid.
Yeah, it's like your adrenalineis always Going because you're
just worried.
You know it's a hard thing.
Scott (18:23):
It's got to be tough, you know you kind of walking on
eggshells, you know right, did Iget too mad?
Did I get say something Ishouldn't have?
Ed (18:29):
and it definitely changes your parenting style.
Scott (18:33):
Yeah, yeah for us our group of friends that were right
there in college that had gonethrough it.
It definitely changed us but itmade us grow up so much quicker
.
We to this day Changes that Imade in my life in 1996.
I see those and you know theycome through in my parenting.
Now I'm sure everybody elsekind of sees that.
You said you've done walks.
(18:54):
I have not done a walk, havebeen meaning to, but it's more
so that I'm just chubby and lazy.
But I do intend on doing some.
What's the atmosphere likethere?
Ed (19:05):
So most of the people at these walks have directly lost a
loved one, so they tend to bepretty somber.
But I would like to think atthe same time a little bit
hopeful of making things betterfor the future and hopefully
preventing it from happening toothers.
Scott (19:27):
I just think of that.
There's got to be some sort ofit's overshadowed by the sadness
, but some sort of enthusiasmthat you have to be hopeful for
that we're doing the right thing.
We're doing something, we'regetting better, slowly but truly
.
We're going to try to getbetter at handling this.
Like myself, I didn't go outand do one.
I should have done one.
It's been doing 27 years sinceI lost my first friend.
(19:47):
It's for Greg, seven or eightyears now.
Yeah, I always felt that Ishould do more and hopefully
this will be the start ofhelping to do a little bit more.
Ed (19:59):
But you know what?
Yeah, you're doing.
This podcast is a great thing.
Scott (20:03):
So hopefully we can get that message out.
Is there anything that you wantto add about Greg or Andrew or
your experience?
Ed (20:10):
I mean just in general, mental health now has its own
911.
You can dial 988 or text to 988and get some compassionate help
.
So that's a huge thing andthere are a lot of good
resources out there which, again, I can forward to you and maybe
you can share.
(20:30):
Yeah, Absolutely.
Scott (20:32):
Well, and I want to thank you again for your kindness and
your bravery today and just ingeneral in life, dealing with
what you've gone through, whatyour family's gone through, and
being a leader in helping othersbe aware, and hopefully we can
put a stop to this as much as wecan.
I really appreciate you beinghere and I wish you all the best
with everything.
Ed (20:51):
Yeah, and I really appreciate you asking me to join
you.
This is a really cool thingthat you're doing and, of course
, it's really nice to catch upwith you as well.
Scott (21:02):
You were one of the big brothers that didn't really beat
us up, but you would butoccasionally poke the bear with
Greg and beat Greg up in frontof us, just to embarrass him a
little.
Ed (21:10):
You know, like you said, we had.
We had kind of a physicalrelationship, but not,
definitely not abusive.
Scott (21:16):
So what a big brother's supposed to do?
Ed (21:17):
Yeah, right, I loved him very much and, like back when we
were in high school, it wasjust just so awesome Having him
on the us, being on the tennisteam together and able to do
that type of stuff, and yeahgreat times yeah.
Scott (21:33):
Yeah, he's a good guy and intro us to.
Yeah, thank you, they're missedevery day.
Well, thank you again, ed.
Thanks.
This episode deals with sensitive topics of suicide and
mental health.
Although there won't be graphicdetails, please know that the
discussion will venture intoareas that may not be suitable
for children.
Therefore, parental discretionis strongly advised.
The guest today is Ed Paluch.
He's the oldest of threebrothers.
Tragically, his youngest twobrothers, greg, who I've been
(00:20):
friends with from elementaryschool through college, and the
younger brother, andrew, bothtook their own lives.
September is suicide preventionawareness month.
Ed has been kind enough andbrave enough to join me to talk
about his brothers, theirpassing and how he is carrying
on their memories.
Ed, thank you for joining us.
Ed (00:38):
Very happy to be here.
Scott (00:39):
You know you've obviously gone through this more than
once, unfortunately.
Yeah, you start with Greg first.
Were there any signs ofdepression for either of the
guys you know?
Early in life, that kind ofstand out to you now.
Ed (00:49):
Yeah, not so much early in life with them.
I guess we'll start with Greg.
You know, after he got out ofcollege he was a licensed
chiropractor and he decided hedidn't want to practice and be
in that, you know, trying tocollect insurance and what not
medical insurance.
So he moved out to Californiato try and be a movie star and
he actually had some little bitroles in some movies.
(01:12):
When he was doing that, youknow, I kind of started to
notice that he was starting toisolate himself a bit.
He would come back home andstay with my mom every couple of
years and sometimes he wouldn'teven tell us that he was coming
back.
So, you know, I would find outlater that he had come and
visited and we hadn't gotten tosee him.
(01:32):
Really, you know, that wasalways a tough thing, you know,
and talking to a lot of hisfriends afterwards like yourself
he did, you know they losttouch with him.
He kind of self isolated, youknow, just went down a path
where I guess he couldn't seehimself coming back from,
unfortunately.
Scott (01:50):
Yeah, I remember you know , we had gotten out of college
and he was in chiropractorschool in Chicago and all the
guys from high school you knowfive or six of them all decided
to go out and visit him for likethree or four days and I
couldn't make the trip because Iwas driving cross country with
my dad.
We had had this thing plannedwe were coming back from Idaho
(02:12):
and we were going cross countryand that always got to me.
I was always bummed about thatin general, that I missed it.
But then after I heard you know, heard the news about Greg, we
were happy that he went outthere and tried to become a
chiropractor and then turnaround and try to do the acting.
You know it was a kooky Gregthing to do.
Yes, greg was always the kindof guy I mean.
Some of the fondest memories Ihave of Greg are just doing
crazy things, yeah.
Ed (02:32):
And he was very gregarious, you know.
He was Absolutely Fun to bearound.
Scott (02:37):
My favorite memory of him is we were in like eighth grade
.
He slept over my house.
The cool guy sleepovers injunior high.
And he slept over my house onNew Year's Eve and my mother put
out some treats and stuff forus and we, you know, popped on
MTV because that was pretty muchthe only thing you could do as
a cool guy back in eighth gradeand my mom hopped at the shower
and was like you guys be goodboys.
We're like yeah, sure, whatever.
(02:58):
And he picked up his pillow andsmashed me in the head with his
pillow and it exploded and everysingle feather that was in that
pillow came out.
There had to be a million birdsworth of feathers in my living
room and it was a good fourinches on the ground.
And he sat there and that laughhe's had, that laugh that was
(03:19):
just amazingly infectious andjust laughed his head off and I
was freaking out.
I'm like so I grabbed a trashbag and I'm trying to scoop
these feathers back and mymother came out and told her she
was like what the hell are youfreaking out?
And he just laughed at her.
It was the funniest thing I'veever seen in my life.
Never forget that as long as Ilive.
Ed (03:36):
He was big into physical humor type stuff too.
Yes, yes, he would always kindof love you when you weren't
expecting it.
Scott (03:43):
Oh yeah, he would give you the dooper.
I'm not really sure where thatcame from, but you'd be walking
next to him and all of a suddenhe would just kick you right in
the ass for no reason.
What the hell happened.
How old was Greg when he passed?
Ed (03:57):
He was 40, seven years ago, I think he was about 45 or so
yeah, that's crazy.
Scott (04:06):
I remember Vaughn called me, told me and I was just like
that's no no, right, if youcan't believe yeah.
And that just seems to be thestandard answer when anybody you
hear has done this.
I can't believe it.
No way, not him, not her.
How'd your family react?
How was your mom about it?
And obviously just destroyed.
Ed (04:25):
My mom is still destroyed over him.
Unfortunately, he was stayingwith her and she's the one who
found him.
Oh, I guess that just adds tothe, you know, another layer to
it.
Yeah, you know she's.
She's always struggled over theyears with that and you know,
obviously now with with theAndrew, it just kind of brings
(04:48):
it all back around for her again.
Yeah, and your mom's such asweet woman.
Yeah, she is.
She's been through a lot.
Yeah, unfortunately, withAndrews mental illness he really
wasn't able to work or anything.
So she was fully supporting himand, oh really, um, because of
his mental illness he became notthat great to deal with, you
(05:11):
know.
So you know that just adds alevel of complexity on it for
her.
So, yeah, Andrew go to Syracuse.
He, he went to Syracuse for oneyear.
Okay, he got in a bar fightwhere somebody hit him with a
beer bottle and ripped his faceoff just about.
Oh my god.
Yeah, I do remember that, Okayafter that he he went to
(05:33):
University of Miami and then he,pretty much you know he stayed
down in Miami Beach after that.
What's like a club promoter atone point or he was trying yeah,
he was trying to be like a,like a promoter, you know, set
up party promoter, that type ofthing.
He's in that whole Miami scene.
Yeah, one of his favoritethings to do was to bring out
his photo album and showeverybody all the pictures of
(05:56):
him with the differentCelebrities.
Scott (05:58):
Yeah, I remember seeing the picture with puff Daddy.
Ed (06:01):
Yeah, exactly, yeah, you, you pretty much name it.
You know Miami's a reallyhappening scene for celebrities,
so he really, you really met alot of people.
Scott (06:11):
So you said you know that he struggled with mental
illness.
Was that diagnosed later on?
Ed (06:15):
So we couldn't even get him to go see the general
practitioner.
He would not go see a doctorfor anything.
You know, if we tried, kind oflike I said before, you know, he
would turn things on us.
Yeah, it's always Verydifficult when you have an adult
that Refuses to get help.
(06:36):
This very look.
You know there isn't a lot youcan do, unfortunately.
Scott (06:39):
Yeah, yeah, you know you'd mentioned that he had
isolated as well.
Ed (06:44):
He just stopped coming home to stay to Miami and kind of did
his own thing yeah correct andyou know, like I said, was
really with his mental state,was really unable to work and,
you know, just Just continued tofurther isolate and just think
that you know people were comingto get him in that type of
thing.
Scott (07:04):
Yeah, oh my gosh.
So he, his passing wasrelatively recent.
It was under end of July.
Yeah, I did July.
Okay, yeah, and did you get aphone call?
Is anybody even in contact?
I mean, how did you find out solike?
Ed (07:19):
yeah, so that's, that's quite a story there.
On a Thursday night I think itwas a Thursday night my wife
Paula noticed that she had avoicemail, so she looked at.
You know, on Apple you can seethe transcription of the message
and it was from the Miami-Dadecoroner's office.
Oh my God.
(07:39):
So at that point we're like ohmy God.
And that night I startedcalling the coroner's office and
they run 24 hours but there'sno one there that'll talk to you
at night.
And then we were trying to callthe police department and they
gave us a name of a coupledetectives, but they wouldn't
(07:59):
tell us anything.
So finally, later the next day,we finally talked to an
investigator from the coroner'soffice who gave us a rundown of
what had happened.
So that wasn't a fun experienceby any means.
Scott (08:13):
No, just the anxiety of waiting.
You know something's goingwrong, but you Exactly yeah.
Ed (08:18):
It wasn't a fun night.
Scott (08:19):
I can't believe that they .
I know they have jobs to do andthey do great jobs, but it's
gotta be.
They have to understand whatthe family's going through as
well too.
Right.
Ed (08:28):
Yeah, I can't imagine what you're saying, what it is for
those first responders,especially in an active
community like Miami, but Ididn't get a call back from a
detective for almost a month.
Oh my God.
Scott (08:43):
Yeah, until you found out what happened, or until, like
you had found out what happenedand then further information.
Ed (08:49):
Yeah, so you know, the coroner told us some of the
details from the police report,but I wanted to hear, you know,
there was other things hecouldn't tell me.
So I, you know, obviouslywanted to talk to the detectives
and, you know, get a little bitof closure there.
Scott (09:05):
Yeah, got it, and it took that long to get the
information.
Oh man, I'm sorry.
Ed (09:10):
I'm actually flying down there next week to try and see
how his condo is, because he hadstarted like a small fire.
So I think things are a messdown there.
You know, same kind of thingtrying to get the property
manager to talk to me or let meknow what's going on.
They just nobody responds.
Scott (09:30):
Yeah, you know, without obviously getting into details,
you said that he started a fire.
Was that method or no?
Ed (09:37):
No, okay, no, but he just felt like setting a fire and
yeah, my guess is he thought hemust have had a break and must
have thought people were gonnabe coming through the door Adam
or something.
So he started the fire and thenhe proceeded to die by suicide
Gosh.
Scott (09:54):
I'm sorry.
Yeah, You've been amazinglybrave on social media, you know
posting stuff, Greg'sanniversary and making sure that
people are aware of mentalillness.
And how do you feel havingthose two brothers go through
such hard times and yeah, youknow, I just feel, you know,
awful and empty.
Ed (10:17):
You know it's something that's, you know, extremely hard
to reconcile.
But, like you said, I, you knowI do what I can to try and get
the message out that mentalillness is no different than
having the flu or cancer or anyother kind of affliction or
illness.
It's not something that shouldbe hidden or, you know, feel
(10:41):
like that you're ashamed to talkabout.
Yeah, you know, the brain isjust one part of the body that
has to be taken care of, likethe rest of it, you know.
Scott (10:50):
Yeah, yeah, you know it's a shame that we still, to this
day, have that kind of a stigmaabout mental illness.
Yes, it's nice that you know asmany people as possible are
still trying to help and getover that, and that's what we're
trying to do, you know.
Do here today.
Yes, in a previous episode wediscussed about one of my other
friends who had also taken herown life, and I went through a
(11:11):
really deep, deep depressionabout four or five years after
college and she saved my life.
The only reason why I nevermoved forward with any other
plans was because I saw theimpact that this had on everyone
.
Yeah, I felt the impact of theloss and I couldn't do that to
anybody else.
Mm-hmm, you know my issues atthat time were not.
(11:31):
I didn't feel that they were asbig as hurting all these other
people and I got lucky.
You know there were a lot ofpeople out there, your brothers
included, that weren't.
Ed (11:39):
Right, I'm guessing that your strong relationship with
your wife and, you know, withyour other friends and family
probably really helped as well.
You know, yeah, yeah, it's allabout connection and having
Having people to talk to thatyou can talk to openly with.
Yeah, you know people that youtrust.
Unfortunately, not everybodyhas that.
Scott (12:01):
Yeah, I think you made a great point about the isolation.
You know, in both yourbrother's instances, isolation
was the key for them to.
You know, maybe shut that off,yeah, and not have to worry
about, you know, hurtingAbsolutely, you know, for folks
listening out there, I think youknow, when you start to see
someone isolating and you knowthat they are going through some
rough times, that isolation isa huge, huge tell.
(12:21):
It's a huge giveaway thatsomething's going on, yeah.
Then comes the challenge oftrying to unisolate them.
You know, trying to find yourway to get back into their life,
forget somebody back into theirlife, and it's, yeah, that's
got to be a rough battle.
Ed (12:33):
Right, because when someone doesn't want to be engaged I've
gone through it twice now, youknow I still haven't figured out
how to, how to get around that.
Oh, you know, I always try andshow unconditional love to all
my family and friends and justhave that door open, but
unfortunately you can't alwaysgo in there with a battering ram
(12:55):
yourself.
Yeah, so I just try and beavailable and let people know
that they're loved and that I'mhere to talk.
We're here to talk.
Scott (13:04):
What was Andrew's feelings towards Greg's passing?
Ed (13:07):
He didn't have a good reaction to Greg's passing.
Yeah, he turned the blame on meactually.
Oh my God, sorry.
After that occurred we didn'ttalk for a few years.
I had to.
You know, for my own mentalhealth I had to separate a
little bit.
Yeah, yeah.
Scott (13:25):
Rightfully so yeah.
Ed (13:28):
And you know he.
You know, unfortunately my momreally took the brunt of it as
well, because you know she kepttalking to him and you know he
would blame her as well when notan easy thing.
Scott (13:38):
No, I can't imagine your mom.
Is she getting help?
How's she doing?
Ed (13:44):
When Greg had passed, my wife and I became very active in
some suicide preventionmovements and, like you said,
you know we've done walks andyou know monthly tabletop
discussions.
I was on the board of a greatgroup called the Taunton
(14:07):
Community Services Incorporatedand Amory Matulaitis is like a
ground break in the industry forsuicide prevention.
One of the folks I met throughthere, steven Palm.
He lost his daughter, casey, tosuicide so he and his wife
started a foundation and youknow, as part of this whole
(14:30):
group we commissioned an authorand we've put you know thousands
of emotional well-being booksin public schools and you know
things like that because that'sreally where you want to catch.
It is when kids are young andjust build those skills in them,
you know, to cope and to haveself-worth and to be able to
talk about things.
Scott (14:50):
Yeah, I'll make sure I put all of those folks in the
show notes too, so that peoplecan check that out.
Ed (14:55):
Yeah, I forwarded an article to you on Steven.
I can get you some stuff on AnnMarie as well, please do Thank
you.
So back to my mom now.
So I used to bring her to thosemonthly tabletop meetings and
she would typically feel worseafter going to them, but she
does have a great counselor thatshe does telehealth
(15:16):
appointments with.
That's a super support, youknow, and just her getting help
herself was a huge step.
Scott (15:23):
So yeah, after going through the research for these
two shows, you know, I sat down,I looked at my own daughter and
you can't imagine being aparent and having to watch your
kid go through that andheartbreak and to your point,
we've had a child that has hadmultiple suicide attempts and
it's just something that leavesa hole in you that can never be
(15:45):
repaired.
Yeah, yeah, it's interestingbecause I used the word
interesting very loosely.
It's interesting when we wereyounger.
I think you're three years old,I mean, I think you were when I
was a freshman.
You were like a senior.
You know, back when we werekids you didn't bring up Suicide
, exactly because if you broughtup suicide, people thought you
were promoting it as opposed totrying to stop it.
(16:07):
And it'd be nice to see Kidslearning about the impacts that
this has and that there's alwayssomebody out there to talk to
them.
Much sooner Then we learn.
My daughter kind of gottraumatized.
Poor kid on the bus next to herthrew up next to her and poor
kid Got super traumatized.
But right, you know, she metwith the guidance counselor and
then there's a resource officerand yeah, and we didn't have
(16:27):
that grow it up, we had oneperson that was in a room and
they just stuck a band-aid onyou and kicked you back into the
class.
Ed (16:32):
So but again, on the flip side, with all the kids have,
that we didn't have is all thissocial media.
It can, while social media Ilike you, I find it nice that it
connects me with People that Iwent to you know high school,
with their childhood friends.
But a lot of the stuff thatfloats around on social media is
really detrimental to kids andtheir mental health?
Scott (16:54):
Yeah, it, I was looking up some statistics and you know
you think that over the years,science and medicine have gotten
better, therapeutical accesshas gotten more prevalent and
you'd think that that numberwould come down.
But I think you know a number Iwas looking at was like from
1996 when one of my friends,heather, committed suicide.
It, I think you know collegeage students.
It was like 31,000 had losttheir lives and then in 2022
(17:16):
that number went up to like49,500.
Right, that's, that's a 50%jump.
I mean that's insanity, right,literally and figuratively, but
right, 50% jump with betterTechnology even though there
have been gains.
Ed (17:29):
Unfortunately, our mental health system is still just very
inadequate.
You know, having gone throughit with various family members
and stuff, it's just yeah, it'stough.
It's really tough.
If I could just say reallyquick, because I've done this
before and and someone was niceenough to correct me but we
(17:50):
don't say committed suicidebecause they didn't commit a
crime, we just say died bysuicide.
Scott (17:56):
Okay, thank you.
Yes, and that absolutely makesway more sense.
And you said you've gonethrough it with one of your
children.
How has it changed yourparenting?
You obviously having a child gothrough it changed your
parenting, but you know, withGreg and Andrew probably changes
it as well.
So make you more cautious or,you know, overly paranoid.
Ed (18:13):
It definitely makes us really paranoid.
Yeah, it's like your adrenalineis always Going because you're
just worried.
You know it's a hard thing.
Scott (18:23):
It's got to be tough, you know you kind of walking on
eggshells, you know right, did Iget too mad?
Did I get say something Ishouldn't have?
Ed (18:29):
and it definitely changes your parenting style.
Scott (18:33):
Yeah, yeah for us our group of friends that were right
there in college that had gonethrough it.
It definitely changed us but itmade us grow up so much quicker
.
We to this day Changes that Imade in my life in 1996.
I see those and you know theycome through in my parenting.
Now I'm sure everybody elsekind of sees that.
You said you've done walks.
(18:54):
I have not done a walk, havebeen meaning to, but it's more
so that I'm just chubby and lazy.
But I do intend on doing some.
What's the atmosphere likethere?
Ed (19:05):
So most of the people at these walks have directly lost a
loved one, so they tend to bepretty somber.
But I would like to think atthe same time a little bit
hopeful of making things betterfor the future and hopefully
preventing it from happening toothers.
Scott (19:27):
I just think of that.
There's got to be some sort ofit's overshadowed by the sadness
, but some sort of enthusiasmthat you have to be hopeful for
that we're doing the right thing.
We're doing something, we'regetting better, slowly but truly
.
We're going to try to getbetter at handling this.
Like myself, I didn't go outand do one.
I should have done one.
It's been doing 27 years sinceI lost my first friend.
(19:47):
It's for Greg, seven or eightyears now.
Yeah, I always felt that Ishould do more and hopefully
this will be the start ofhelping to do a little bit more.
Ed (19:59):
But you know what?
Yeah, you're doing.
This podcast is a great thing.
Scott (20:03):
So hopefully we can get that message out.
Is there anything that you wantto add about Greg or Andrew or
your experience?
Ed (20:10):
I mean just in general, mental health now has its own
911.
You can dial 988 or text to 988and get some compassionate help
.
So that's a huge thing andthere are a lot of good
resources out there which, again, I can forward to you and maybe
you can share.
(20:30):
Yeah, Absolutely.
Scott (20:32):
Well, and I want to thank you again for your kindness and
your bravery today and just ingeneral in life, dealing with
what you've gone through, whatyour family's gone through, and
being a leader in helping othersbe aware, and hopefully we can
put a stop to this as much as wecan.
I really appreciate you beinghere and I wish you all the best
with everything.
Ed (20:51):
Yeah, and I really appreciate you asking me to join
you.
This is a really cool thingthat you're doing and, of course
, it's really nice to catch upwith you as well.
Scott (21:02):
You were one of the big brothers that didn't really beat
us up, but you would butoccasionally poke the bear with
Greg and beat Greg up in frontof us, just to embarrass him a
little.
Ed (21:10):
You know, like you said, we had.
We had kind of a physicalrelationship, but not,
definitely not abusive.
Scott (21:16):
So what a big brother's supposed to do?
Ed (21:17):
Yeah, right, I loved him very much and, like back when we
were in high school, it wasjust just so awesome Having him
on the us, being on the tennisteam together and able to do
that type of stuff, and yeahgreat times yeah.
Scott (21:33):
Yeah, he's a good guy and intro us to.
Yeah, thank you, they're missedevery day.
Well, thank you again, ed.
Thanks.
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