EP13 Meagen Anderson - Crafting & Pioneering the Non-Alcoholic Revolution - Carney Saves the World

Episode Transcript
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Scott (00:00):
My guest today is Megan Anderson.
Having lived a zero-prooflifestyle since 2020, Meagen has
a passion for elevating thecategory of alcohol-free and
non-alcoholic known today hereas AFNA, and reducing stigmas
associated with the production,sales, marketing and service of
adult beverages.
Megan holds an MBA insustainable business from
Maharishi InternationalUniversity in Fairfield, iowa,

(00:20):
in combination withconsciousness consulting
training with the esteemed DrTony Nader, and is a 20-year
consumer packaged goods industryveteran, with a commercial
portfolio that includes NationalBeer Education role with the
Boston Beer Company, where wemet, as well as global hop sales
management roles with CalSecand NZ Hops Limited from New
Zealand.
She also founded TranscendingTrauma in 2022, a program

(00:42):
created to support survivors andsupporters of the hashtag MeToo
movement by offeringtranscendental meditation,
training and consciousnessprograms to breweries and
individuals.
Outside of a love for trainingand education, megan has
consulted for breweries, hempand cannabis beverage producers
and commercial hop startups.
Meagen is also a certifiedCicerone, a certified BJ CP
judge, and has completed over140 hours of in-person beer

(01:05):
sensory training with theesteemed Dr Bill Simpson.
Megan Anderson welcome toCarney Saves the World.

Meagen Anderson (01:11):
Awesome.
Thank you, scott, it's so goodto see you.
This is amazing.
I just realized I don't have anNA beer in my hand and I have
one in the fridge.
Can I take my computer with meto go get it, or should I run
and get it and come back?
Okay, I hope you have somethingto drink too.
If not, you should grabsomething.

Scott (01:29):
I don't have an NA or regular A beverage, but I'll
drink a Diet Pepsi.
How's that All right?
Should have planned better.

I should have stocked my fridge I even have
some nice glassware.

Scott (01:45):
Excellent.

For my AF sampling.
So I have a full thing and I'mgoing to open an Italian-style
pills.

Scott (01:54):
Oh nice.

Which is from Untitled Art Brewing and they're
out of Wisconsin.

Scott (02:00):
Oh great.

And they're using a vacuum distillation
removal.
So they're just brewingfull-strength beers and then
they're using vacuum to get outthe alcohol.

Scott (02:11):
Oh really.

But it allows you to condense the other
flavors and then you can kind ofbuild really really nice beers
this way and you can actuallyget to a true 0.0.
This one is not, this is a 0.5.
And it's just such a good beer.
Like if I gave this to you, youwould probably not know that
there was alcohol in it.
Like it's such a great product.
I actually just went to theirbrewery and checked it out
recently.
It was so cool.

Scott (02:32):
There's so many options out there nowadays, it's just
great.
The category is just growingmassively.

Yeah, I love it .
I think it's just such a funcategory and you just get used
to the new flavor profilewithout alcohol in it.
Like it does take some time toget used to that, I think, but
once you do I'm like my life'sawesome now, like I feel good
all the time.
And for me, I just took thetechnical approach right.
Like I went and learned thesensory, the primary sensory.

(02:57):
I'm still learning.
I mean, we're still doingresearch to find out the sensory
profiles of these types ofbeverages, what's good and
what's not, because, like noone's really studied it before.
So I'm like very interested inthat.
And like man, they have a teamat Araxa.
You know who does like thesensory compound training.
You know what I mean.
Like you did all those littlecapsules or whatever.
So the guy who invented those,Dr Bill Simpson, has like been a

(03:21):
great mentor and friend to meand he's like personally taught
me a lot and I've gotten to hangout with him on several
occasions and he's brilliant andso good.

Scott (03:29):
So for anybody listening who's not familiar, basically
all these little capsules areextremely potent versions of
aromas and flavors that you mayget in beer and it kind of
shocks it into your memory sothat you can pick that up.
And there's some brutal ones.

Yes, yes, exactly, just this has just been
a really fun, just been areally fun time.

Scott (03:50):
So Megan and I worked together when she was in sales
at Boston Beer Company and thenyou moved into a national
trainer role and became one ofthe trainers for our entire
sales force.
And then you took a differentstep and you left Boston Beer
and you created a consultingprogram.

I did.

Scott (04:06):
But you hopped forward.

Yes, that's correct In 2016.

Scott (04:10):
And you were using some of that training that you'd
learned at Boston Beer and kindof bring other companies out.

Yeah, yeah, a combination of sales training
I'd had from a couple ofcompanies, but Boston Beer was
one of them.
I also worked for Altria rightout of college, so they own a
tobacco company.
So I worked for Philip MorrisUSA and they gave us a lot of
training.
They owned SAB Miller at thetime.
I had a lot of sales trainingpretty early on and I think

(04:36):
Boston Beer made that morespecialized.
They taught me the value ofinvesting in just really good
frameworks and go-to methods for, let's say, negotiation or a
specific selling process, likewhen I got to that level of
detail and understanding of howto actually execute things.
Well then you can be a goodconsultant because you can build

(04:58):
strategies based on the factthat if you give someone a
framework, then they havesomething repeatable and you can
measure it and then you haveinformation and when you have
information you can make abetter decision.
So I use that kind ofmethodology, I guess, to sort of
scale small startups.
That's sort of where I wentafter I left Boston Beer.
I was like, oh, that's cool.
I probably underestimatedreally early on the value of

(05:21):
that.
And Hopford was more like me,just like going in and doing
projects and companies, kind ofmaking up my own framework or
finding really easyopportunities.
Like I consulted for a smallbrewery and they wanted to
expand their draft programs.
The first thing I taught themwas how to clean lines.
I was like if you want yourbeer to taste good and you want

(05:41):
to increase your sales, you needto manage your own draft lines
in this area and if you do that,you're going to be better able
to spot opportunity.
Because I just knew they'd betouching the product more and be
like more and they did that inthat function of the business
crew and they had a reallystrong taproom business.
They were very, very goodarchitects and had a beautiful
space and a lot of loyal friends, I think, in the area and built

(06:04):
a really kind of desirablebusiness model based on that.
And yeah, I think I was able totake what we learned there and,
in many ways, just sort of workit out myself and then hop
forward.
Now, I think, is moresuccessful because I've had more
training.
Of course, I went and got myMBA and it helps to have to know

(06:24):
how to run a company and whatthe different functions are and
I didn't really know thosethings.
But Boston Beer gave me theframeworks and I realized that
those have a lot of value inthem.
You don't have to copy them,but you think like that.
So I've been able to makecreative versions of the names
of stuff we had at Boston Beer.
But for the cannabis industry Inamed part of their

(06:45):
merchandising strategy buds bebuds with the bartenders and the
budtenders.
And things like that that werejust creative and fun and make
it a way that people couldremember it, and then we can
deploy it and we can use it togrow businesses.

Scott (06:59):
The acronyms were always helpful.
That's what they're calledright Acronyms.

Acronyms yes, we had a lot of them.

Scott (07:04):
Yes, god, many of you remember every single one of
them.

Being truckers, saying all the acronyms were
like hey, where's your prime?
Get on the execution.
So when did you get your MBA?
So I did all that in thebackground, actually, after I
got my MBA, when I stoppeddrinking alcohol, because I
found out that when I wasn'tthinking about drinking,
planning to drink, talking aboutdrinking, drinking and then

(07:29):
recovering from drinking, I hada lot of time on my hands.
So I consumed a lot of my timeand then I just started feeling
like I needed it, if I needed toget to the next level, because
what I realized during thatperiod was a lot of people told
me you don't need your MBA, likeyou have a good personality,
basically, and I kind of feellike, in a way, that was people

(07:50):
limiting me.
These were mentors of mine, Ithink.
In a way, I'm just atheory-based person, but I'm
also a natural sales person, caninfluence and I like connecting
with people.
So I think I missed thoseopportunities to advocate for
myself and say I wanted it.
So I did it after then, which Istarted in 2021.
And I just graduated in June.

Scott (08:11):
Awesome Congratulations.

And the focus of that MBA was through a very
unique lens of sustainability,focused on starting with human
development.
So I also learned my MBAthrough the lens of making
organizations and people moreconscious and that really, I
think, in terms of my owndevelopment, was the most
valuable part of my educationthere.

Scott (08:33):
Yeah, I'm so interested in the consciousness aspect of
it.
When and why did you make thedecision to stop drinking?
I read somewhere that you saidyou did a 1,000 day cleanse.
Was that specific?
Or did you just go all of asudden, wake up one day after
quitting and be like, oh shit,it's 968 days?

No, no.
Yeah, it was very intentionaland it was starting at day one
and accumulating days and thenbeing like, oh, making it a
little further than I'd evermade it before, and feeling a
lot of freedom in that.
But there's a caveat to that Ihave to.
Let me just say this.
I did a program called One Year, no Beer.

(09:11):
I like to give credit to theproducts that helped me.
I think they taught me thattheir curriculum was very easy
for someone like me and it camewith a community.
You've gotten a privateFacebook community and I was so
moved by the transformationsthere.
I started to become hyper awareof the transformation aspect in

(09:32):
this.
And then, because of theuniversity I was going in and I
was meditating using thismeditation technique.
It's a technology ofconsciousness, so I was actually
doing that.
And then I hired a PhD in theEnneagram to study my ego
structure and stuff and justlike, once I got a wrap on those
things, I was able to put itall together and so it was a

(09:55):
combination of some of the tools.
I think I had learned to bemore aware and to develop sort
of some more resilience.
I needed some resilience.
I think everybody has trauma,but I think I just had to figure
out my real problems, which iswhy was I drinking more than I
really wanted to and why did Ifeel like once I started I

(10:16):
couldn't stop when I wanted to?
And that's actually alcohol usedisorder.
It's just like I lacked sort ofthat internal limiter of how
much was good and healthy and OKand then what wasn't.
And it was just like and I lookat my family history, I mean my
grandfather died of alcoholismin a very horrible, horrific way

(10:37):
and so I think, knowing that Iwas just kind of like and I had
a lot of alcoholism that was inmy family, that just wasn't
talked about and I think it wasjust normalized.
I'd love to hear your versionof that because I think we all
have that story.
Alcohol after prohibition, itreally became a big part of our
society again and I think justthat normalized it.

(10:58):
10 beers was OK, because it wasjust beer, but at the same time
, like if a person's becomingdrunk and then they're doing
that really regularly, it wasobviously, as people got older
you could tell it hadn't beengood to their health or their
relationships.
And then I found myself justkind of playing that out and I
started to wonder is this itLike?

(11:20):
Is this how it's going to be?
You know?

Scott (11:23):
You know it's funny.
So my father was a prettyaggressive alcoholic.
He was in and out of our lives.
He passed away when I was 24.
But when he was around he wouldhave one drink at night and
then two drinks and by 10o'clock it was four or five.
He wasn't rowdy but all of asudden he would just pass out
and he was like dad's done forthe night and you'd wake up in

(11:43):
the morning to go to school andhe'd still be there and you're
like, oh, this is a problem.
So when I got the job at BostonBeer Company right out of
college, my mother was not happy.
It was like wait a minute, youknow, we got something into
family.
Let's just keep an eye on it.
You know, and you tend to getout of control once in a while
when you work for a beer company.
So there were days where youwere like that was a little

(12:04):
aggressive.
But as you get older, obviouslyif you're not dealing with a
problem you can taper it off andslow it down.
And the last couple of yearswe'd take two, three months off
just to see.
But this past year if I didthree months, you know it's
nothing compared to what otherpeople do what you've done, but
you know it's a step in theright direction and you know,
ultimately it's where I knowI've got to go.

What was the result for you Like?
What did you experience?

Scott (12:27):
Oh, massive loss of weight.
Wow, massive loss of weight.
I also was working out, andthen I was doing some keto, and
when I drink, I'll tend to eatsomething nice and unnecessary.
You know, as I was drinking, Iwas also gaining weight.
That way Felt better in themornings though.
Wow cool, my digestive systemwas better.
It was all around a good thing.

(12:48):
So I'm actually thinking abouthanging her up running New
Year's this year, for we'llstart with.

Well, I mean, I think the good thing is if you
know you can do three months andlike you, that's like actually
like a lot of willpower, like atfirst, but I think knowing you
can do that, mix it up for threemonths, I mean I can definitely
advise you on some ways to belike let's develop a drinking
program together where it's like, it's kind of like I choose AF
on these days and I choose drink.

(13:15):
You know, I mean you can kindof like it's a way to like taper
.
I think for people that havemore, if you are in a framework
right Like, it's easier to saylike I'm doing it this way and
there's lots of options for that, and I can refer you to some
great programs that do that too,because it's very difficult for
most people, I think, to thinkabout letting go of something
you really love.

(13:35):
I mean I'm sure you have afavorite bottle of red wine or
like there's got to be.
There's a few things out therethat I this is an important part
of like our culture and theseare delicious beverages that
played a really important partso they can be consumed,
although the way peopleunderstood how much we could
consume without having anegative impact versus what we

(13:56):
know now.
When we consume it it has anintoxicating effect, but it also
has, unfortunately, a toxiceffect because it's a toxin.
So here are the effects of itand you need to know.
But we eat toxins all the time,so it's just like when you know
that you have to just bebalanced about it.
Personally, for me, I think Iassociated the feeling of it
with some sort of like stressrelease or something, because

(14:19):
once I started doing otherthings and I was trained on
knowing why and I think for allthe reasons you just described I
had all these immediate healthimprovements, particularly to my
mental health.

Scott (14:29):
I mean absolutely.

I felt my mental health was not maybe so
good.
I was like really kind of.
I think I had a lot of likeself-esteem issues I think I had
to deal with, you know, all thethings that are like the normal
people encounter.
I say normal because I'm likewhat I think I went through was
kind of like crazy because Iworked for a beer company.
It was very much part of thelifestyle or whatever, and I

(14:51):
didn't think they encouragedreally over drinking where we
worked.
I thought everybody was likeencouraged to just like be
responsible.
But you know there's tragediesassociated with that too and
there were people that passedaway or had illnesses that you
know could have been associatedwith that.
I think the company did a goodjob letting people make their

(15:12):
choices there and there weresober people that worked at
Boston Beer and they supportedthat very early on and I think
those guys actually inspired me.
They were kind of like my seathey guys, if you hear this, you
were my secret mental heroesbecause they did it and like
were successful at work, theywere respected.
But I loved it.

(15:33):
I loved my experience there.
I naively thought when I movedon, when I encountered other
CEOs and stuff, they'd be likeJim and Martin and shocking
they're not and that naiveteultimately led me down this
series of like different typesof career moves, because I think
I kind of stumbled a little bitwhen I fell into cultures and

(15:53):
companies that weren't the samenot that Boston Beer is perfect,
but I think they're pretty good.
Now that I've been able tocompare it to companies of
different sizes and statures, Ithink we had actually a really
good culture and also, usingthat as a framework, a lot of
the best practices that I takefor how to build good teams were
during that time that you and Iwere there when Craft Beer was

(16:15):
growing really fast and thepressure was on right.
We actually were part of likethis really explosive category
growth where business wasgrowing so fast and like we were
all learning and being squeezed, I think in a very interesting
way, and it was a cool kind ofsocial experiment.
But the one thing that I tookfor granted was leadership who
actually is very loving, and Ithink Jim is an example of

(16:40):
people that were loving.

Scott (16:41):
You were in a tough market for Craft Beer too.
You were down at Texas and Ithink I struggled in that job
like.
Yeah, you were in China.

A lot, but I learned a ton and I think,
because I went through thathardship and then ultimately got
to go take this educator role,I had to still learn the same
lesson about how to live lifewith a good relationship with
alcohol, a healthy relationship,and in my case it's refraining
right, it's just beingabstaining from it and that's

(17:09):
because the health benefitsScott were actually kind of
frightening.

Scott (17:14):
What year did you go through that process?

So I stopped four years ago on New Year's Eve
, so that would be the December31st 2019.
Just kind of, only because I amkind of a New Year's resolution
sort of person, I was like, woo, if you're going to do
something, start on thebeginning of the year.
So I stopped.
I remember, and I just very,very bad hangover and my
daughter had just turned one andit was like when she wasn't

(17:39):
sleeping very much and it wasreally pushing myself mentally.
I was working full time, movingcross country, having a toddler
not much older, being in kindof a very difficult home
situation.
So it was just a very tryingtime and I remember like I don't
know if this is the best timeto stop drinking, but I'm going

(18:00):
to go for it.
Then I did it for this firstyear and then COVID hit.
Then everything went inside fora long time and that made it
easier, but it made the internalchanges happen so much faster,
because when you're with onetiny group of people and you're

(18:22):
going through that experience ofnot really being aware, I was
drinking to the point that Ithink I wasn't even really
experiencing much of reality asI could even experience it,
which is shocking Because we'reas humans we only see so little,
like one one millionth ofreality or something.
But I was seeing so far belowthat line, like my level of

(18:44):
conscientiousness was so low,because, unfortunately for me, I
had a very unhealthyrelationship with alcohol and I
went through that experience ofnot having that besides the
health benefits.
I think it opened up my eyes toother things.

Scott (19:00):
So you started the one year no beer program and then
after that one year was up, youjust kind of kept going and then
you hit thousand days and thenyou're good.

Yeah, but I would say I wasn't thinking in
terms of a year when I startedit.
And when I started it I signedup for 30 days.
I was like, okay, let's see ifI can do one month and let's see
how it goes.
And the content was so good, itwas very motivating and I had
read a book called this NakedMind by Annie Grace and it kind
of was like a fun book to readbecause she actually says, and

(19:29):
they're like go ahead and keepdrinking while you read my book
if you want to.
And I think you heard giving methat permission to do that, Let
me do it my way.
And that was.
I think I read that book threemonths before I decided to do to
try a challenge like a programwhich was one year, no beer.
So that kind of like got me inthe mood to sort of like start

(19:50):
with something manageable andsmall, like what you did.
And then I decided to do 90days and I think from 90 I
upgraded to six months and whenI hit that six month mark I
started thinking in terms of howmany days I had been alcohol
free and there was something soliberating about that that I
knew I was going to make it to ayear which I had never in my
life since I had become an adultage person drinking alcohol

(20:14):
pretty regularly.
I had never contemplated thatbefore, so I was like whoa, this
is insane.
And like it was just.
Life was more enjoyable.
I felt like I was justexperiencing it in a more
healthy way, I guess, and I feltbetter and I just felt like I
could give people more love andattention.

Scott (20:32):
It's so interesting because, when you think about it
, probably had a couple beersjunior senior year that's when
you start and maybe in highschool, and this year I just hit
50 and thinking to myself oh myGod, we're talking 34 years of
constantly beating your body upwith just immeasurable amounts
of alcohol, unnecessary amountsof alcohol.

Yeah, I mean more than it was essential back
in colonial times to like stayalive or whatever.
You know what I mean.
Can't drink the water.
Basically it's like that's whenit was necessary, so now it's
just like, it's all like, justknow what it is when you do it
and it's also a great solvent.
So it's a great solvent whenyou're dissolving, say,
expensive grapes into it andletting those flavors naturally

(21:11):
dissolve in there.
I mean what a cool thing tothink about same with beer.
Right Like, create this sort ofliquid from our grain store and
it becomes a.
I have this amazing book that Ijust got at the American Home
Brew Association.
It's called Sacred, herbal andHealing Beers and I just think
this is so fascinating becauseI'm like this is plant medicine.

Scott (21:32):
Wow.

That's like a lot.
That's what we're seeing in thehemp beverage movement, right
Like it's plant medicine.

Scott (21:37):
Yeah, essentially.
Yeah, you're right.

That's what beer is, and I think
non-alcoholic beer is veryhealthy.
I drink it all the time and,like I never gain any weight, I
never.
I never have a hangover or aheadache from.
Most of the time I mean I cantaste because of my sensory
training and my desire.
I think, especially for anybeer, like I'm probably like
crazy niche person in the spacebecause of what?

(21:59):
All the things I've done, youknow, like I've made beverages
with the biggest breweries inthe world.
I've actually gotten to helpthem formulate things you know.
So I have this strangeexperience.
And then for AF and NA beer, Imean I wrote a book on it, like
I wrote the world's first bookon AF and NA beer.
I was like you know what I knowso much about this dumb topic.
I'm just going to write aboutit.

Scott (22:20):
And I'm going to put that in the show notes too.

Yes, please do.
Yeah, thank you I.
But as I wrote it and I have tosay, as my team wrote it, I did
not write this alone.
There were so many amazingpeople, scott, that contributed
to it Like wow.
But as I was putting ittogether and seeing it come to a
live, I'm like what an awesomething to put out there.
Like that's so cool, what aniche topic.

(22:45):
But it's growing and when I gotthat book it reminded me of why
I am so passionate about it.
Like beer is just that's whatwe studied, right, that's what
we know and appreciate about it.
Alcoholic beer, the same Like itwas a delivery method for
people in their grain store, intheir spice house.
It was a way to dispensemedicine.

(23:05):
I mean, that's how theEgyptians use it was for
nourishment.
They knew that.
They knew that they were lowalcohol beverages.
But at that time you kind ofneeded to have fermentation
going on or you were probablygoing to die because the water
was not clean.
You know, like, how could it bewhen you're living like that?
You know so and I think, aspeople got more sophisticated,
like it just got more specialtyand there's so many cool things

(23:27):
about beer and there's so manystyles and those all really
trace back to that story of howthey were delivering some
benefit or belief or whatever.
And I'm like now we know theeffect of alcohol, let's adjust
the operational system, let'seducate the public and then
let's encourage them to drinkmore beer because you can do it

(23:48):
and it's healthy for you.
Like, how do you think athleticbrewing is getting their base
of people?
These are healthy people thatlove beer.
They want to optimize theirlife and I think that that
applies to whether you'rerunning a marathon, to whether
you want to have the bestpodcast out there.
I think that all those thingsthat people really want to see
themselves do and achieve,they're probably better

(24:10):
positioned to do when they'redrinking mostly non-alcoholic
beer.
Let's say, if you're a beerdrinker, or wine, or RTDs or
spirits or whatever, and thenblending in or substituting a
fully alcoholic version or lowalcoholic version when the
occasion fits, because then youcan appreciate it for what it is
.
That's tasting the history ofit and that's where I think the

(24:34):
future is going is that way.

Scott (24:38):
It's really interesting because the market, from a craft
beer standpoint, is justlittered with 8% gigantic IPAs
and then you have the NA sec.
It feels like there's nothingin the middle.
I mean, I know there is, but itfeels like there's nothing in
the middle.
But it's nice that this NAsegment has so much to choose
from.
We're seeing spirits.

There's hemp derived now.
So if you want to feel analcohol adjacent thing with
exponentially, if you want totalk about herbal beverages
like-.

Scott (25:07):
Never in a million years thought you'd see that.

This is basically plant medicine gone
mainstream, but the public isn'taware yet, so it's kind of
transitioning out.
But they're finding anintersection, for whatever
reason, of people that are inthe alcohol beverage space that
want to either substitute fouror five nights a week or they're
going all the way.
Either way there's a person inthat.

(25:29):
They're all in that spacereally, so it's the entire
Alkbev industry.
So I'm projecting it to bevalued about $25 billion over
the next seven to 10 years, justto hemp derived, and that's
only through the traditionalchannels.
It's also got probably anexponentially larger rate of
growth.
If you look at the e-commerceside of it, it's crazy, the
e-commerce.

(25:50):
I mean women are buying thestuff online and shipping it to
their house because it'sdiscreet, they don't want to go
to dispensaries.

Scott (25:55):
Yes.

They see their THC consumption as private and
they want that informationprotected.
And I think the sooner that theindustry realizes that and
invests in that message to theconsumer that they can just swap
out their at home drinking forthese other beverages.
And I think they have to see ifit fits for them too, because I
mean hemp can probably givesome people headaches.
It probably has a certaineffect on people.

(26:17):
That's all different.
So they should start with a lowdose option, at like a 2.5
milligram, and then find whatthey like.
But the beverages taste good.
They taste like RTDs, theytaste like their analog.

Scott (26:30):
Yeah, I did.
I forgot what episode it was,but I had the high tide boys on,
yes, josh and Shay.
I know you've worked with thema little bit when we did some
tasting.
I did not get any samples fromthem because that's illegal, but
let's just say I had anotherfriend who sent me some and I
did try it.
I will say that you definitelydo need to pace yourself and

(26:50):
understand that side, thatcategory, because I had two you
said you had two, fivemilligrams.
Yeah, five milligrams.
And I remember staring at thecouch loving my pillows I was
just in awe of my pillows.

Yeah, that's pretty, depending on your
tolerance level, I mean, andyour own individual body.
Remember this is connected toyour endocannabinoid system.
It's a secondary nervous systemin your body and the plant
molecule fits into theendocannabinoid system, kind of
like a lock and key.
So when that cannabinoid goesin there now it's part of you,

(27:25):
it's a medicine.
It's bringing you intohomeostasis, which can take you
to the couch, my friend.
It can take you to therefrigerator, it can do all the
things.
So you have to be aware of itsimpact.
You have to know that also, itdoes have an impact in the brain
, because there are receptorsfor this in our brain that fit
with this, which is why Delta9THC is one of those.

(27:46):
There are others, but that'sthe one people classically think
about when they think aboutdoing using these things.
So that's what I'm doing now.
I'm just educating people aboutthe category and what they can
do.
But let me also say back toJosh and Che from Hi-Tide they
are going to be doing hempderived.
So I think I can say thatHopefully I'm not in trouble,

(28:06):
guys, but we can give it to youbecause under the same bill that
lets you buy CBD at the grocerystore that farm bill right now
allows for the Delta 9THC fromhemp and we can synthesize it
too.
So basically we are able totake just like in hops.
We can make a hops extract andyou can make beer just bitter,
you can make it just aromatic.

(28:27):
We can separate those thingsnow so that technology exists in
hemp so we can take CBD, let'ssay add a catalyst to it, so put
something in it, kind of like achemical reaction.
If you will and there's naturalversions of this you can do it
with hydrogen peroxide, forexample, as a catalyst.
So you can use different typesof methods to make this stuff

(28:49):
and then you convert it into THC, delta 9, which is the same
stuff you and other products.
It'll make other things too.
It's kind of like afermentation.
If you think about it like that,you're creating a reaction.
So you've got to kind of knowwhat's in there.
So the good producers have kindof figured this out.
They're like for Tosa.
I have a lot of respect fortheir company.
They've done a lot of researchand they have figured out how to

(29:12):
kind of separate these thingsand give you just those aspects
you want which peopletraditionally think about when
they think about they've evertried marijuana, in the sense
that they've thought about itLike people have smoked a joint
in their life or something likethat.
That's the same molecule, butyou had a really high dose
because you inhaled it.
So when you take micro amountsof this stuff and you put them

(29:33):
in your body in conjunction withCBD, let's say, or CBN, which
are other non-intoxicatingcannabinoids, you put all those
together.
Well, now you are administeringsomething to yourself that has
going to have a reaction for youand you should see if those are
beneficial, because there'ssome scientific studies that
suggest some of these have apositive impact on some people.

(29:56):
I mean, I just think everybodyhas to try it for themselves and
if you get a headache, I'dprobably back off.
That could just be a reactionthat you have where you have
maybe an allergy to it.
Maybe try another dose, tryanother brand, but if it gives
you a headache a few times,maybe it's not for you.
And then you just know hey, Idon't take aspirin or ibuprofen,
maybe you just don't takecannabis-infused products with

(30:19):
THC because you're probablyhaving some sort of negative
reaction to that.
I just pay attention to whatyou're taking and see how you
feel, but for a lot of people.
They feel good, they feelrelaxed, they feel social, they
can have it with their friends.
And I think drinks are a greatmechanism, a delivery system for
this, because you don't go tosomeone's house to split a gummy
, as my friend Joe likes to say.

(30:40):
We take a six-pack, we take abottle of wine, we take drinks.
That's how we connect withpeople, that's how we commune
with them.
So I think beverages are agreat mechanism for this.
And Lee, one of my colleaguesfrom Boston Beer, who I'm in
this strategic alliance with andwe're building just this
phenomenal business at HopForward around hemp beverages,

(31:05):
and she is just a genius andshe's created all these really
cool podcasts that you shouldcheck out, called the
Enlightened Buzz, and they're afew minutes long but they're
educational and they'reeducating people on what is THC.
What are these products goingto do to me?
If I take them, how am I goingto feel?
So she's doing this really cooleducation.

(31:27):
That's actually just from theperspective of someone.
That's like I might be lookingfor a replacement for alcohol.
I kind of don't want to feelhungover because it kind of
steals my time and I read aboutits negative health impacts and
I feel better when I take breaks, or maybe I want to take some
breaks, and then once in a whileI'm going to have a glass of
wine, but I'm going to prettymuch live this other lifestyle.

(31:49):
It's like being keto or beingpaleo or whatever.
You can pulse it in to yourlife and I think that's how
everybody kind of starts.
But these beverages on just theNA side have to go hand in hand
with that, because to yourpoint, you drink two high tides
and you're not in its fivemilligrams apiece.
That might be too much for you,which is why.

(32:11):
That's why I think people shouldexpect to see these things in
smaller formats and happy thisclient of ours that we've worked
with at Hop Forward.
We have a 7.5 ounce can, whichfor women, is kind of a perfect
size.
It's sort of the way the miniCoca-Cola's exist.
I don't want to drink a wholecan, I just want to drink a
little bit and it feels like acocktail and looks like a

(32:32):
cocktail and can be served likea cocktail, even in a wine glass
or mixed with a plain seltzerwater, and you can walk around
and have it in your Yeti.
And I think they're finding outhow they can put it all together
and how it works for them, andshe's really driving a lot of
that.
So I think her work and herknowledge and her ability to
grow brand she's a very goodsales leader as well has led to

(32:54):
her being very passionate abouteducating the public on cannabis
beverages as an alternative.
And as she's doing that, she'ssimultaneously having this
journey.
Where she's actually doing this, she's seeing these beverages
have a positive benefit and Ithink she would be happy to
share that story.
But it's just been a reallycool thing to experience with

(33:17):
her, because I know that feelingfrom a different perspective,
but really from being like Ithink I'm done forever, and that
was four years ago and Ihaven't had any alcohol since
then.
My health is off the charts good.
I'll be 42 in February and Ifeel great.
I feel like I could be my owndaughter sometimes compared to

(33:39):
before.
But I also see I went fromhaving a broken heart to having
my heart fulfilled and realizingall these amazing things that I
have and just personally andhaving an amazing support system
of people that really steppedup and cared about me and have

(34:00):
helped me grow my business ormentored me or just let me share
my story with them, and Iappreciate that, because I
actually ran into Jim Cookrecently.
Oh yeah yeah, I got to give hima hug and I got to tell him
about what I was up to and hesaid something really cool to me
.
He said, megan, you know, youcould have gone one of two ways

(34:20):
in life.
You definitely could have goneup, or you could have gone the
other way and you chose up.
He's like good job.
And I really appreciated that,because that's the culture of
building, like these people thatwere great role models to me.
That's awesome.
Okay, like I'm the sober personon vacation now How's everybody
doing?
And it was like really kind offunny for me, like dude dancing

(34:42):
sober had never done that before.
What is that, you know justlike what is that?
as an adult, I know would neverdo that so, but, like you know,
the things I realized aboutmyself were just sort of like
fears of being like sociallyawkward were some of the
characteristics that actually Ithink people were telling me
they really appreciated about me, which is like I could be more
loving and fun because I wasn't,you know, kind of just consumed

(35:04):
in myself and I didn't thinkalcohol at the end of the day,
turned me into a better personeither.
I found I had more conflict inmy relationships as a result of
that and like kind of likethings.
I just saw patterns in my lifedeveloping that I wasn't very
excited about and I was justlike.
I thought I was going to beable to do more by now but I

(35:24):
thought, well, maybe let's justinventory your life and see
what's happening and try tochange things up a little.
When I did, I would, you know,got some pretty pretty decent
results.

Scott (35:32):
Amazing, amazing stories we were talking earlier.
Like you, just recently gotmarried and one of the greatest
stories I've ever heard.
It made me tear up a little.
Could just give a brief summaryof that, because it's it's like
a magical story, yeah thanks,yeah, I appreciate it.

We call it like an epic love story.
So yeah, I had a childhood love, I guess you know we met when
we were in middle school.
We used to like play basketballin my driveway and all the
things you know.
I moved away and we just sortof lost touch in life and
everything and 25 years later Ihad become sober and was, you
know, kind of my, my family withmy kids.

(36:08):
That was going through a lot ofchange, put a lot of pressure
on our relationship and we weregoing to go separate ways and I
was ready to kind of just Icouldn't believe it, I was going
to have to start all over againat my age, you know.
But I was prepared to do thatand then kind of said a prayer a
first prayer I'd said in a verylong time for God to fix my
love life and my first love kindof reemerged and as a friend

(36:32):
and a support person, I think wehelped each other through a lot
.
You know his.
He had a death in his immediatefamily, his sister passed away
very unexpectedly.
It was very hard on him.
He had been through a reallytough relationship and divorce
and stress and he also has avery stressful job.
He's a nuclear reactor operator, so you know he didn't like

(36:53):
shlub around.
After high school he went intothe Navy and became part of
their nuclear program.
He spent two years under in asubmarine, so like I used to be
the most interesting person inalcohol, like background and
knowing a lot about beer.
But I'm like talk to this guyLike he works at a nuclear
reactor, Like there's like nopeople that he would ever meet,
that, do that, and he's just agreat guy.

(37:16):
And we just went.
When we'd gone through thesehard things together, we were
like are we crazy enough tothink that like we could have
like a marriage and like betogether, like we just still had
that same love.
You know, we shared a lot ofcool experiences together when
we were younger.
Like divine things that wethought were sort of signs to us
, that kind of brought us backtogether again because we

(37:36):
remembered them from when wewere young, you know, and that
became real love and we got alot of counseling and advice and
we got married a couple ofweeks ago and we have six kids
between the two of us.
And I also live part time inMichigan and he's in Illinois
because of his job and family.
So it's the craziest life thatI never realized I would get

(37:58):
when I said that prayer.
But I am so grateful and he isjust, yeah, an amazing human,
very supportive of my endeavorsand really just a good leader in
the community.
He's a JV basketball coach andI'm like his assistant coach now
, like I was, like I can make agood assistant coach, like I can
do that.
You know, I like supportive.
I'm like I don't have to knowall the rules, you know, but I

(38:20):
love basketball and I get to seehim accomplishing these crazy
time capsule dreams, because Idon't really remember him from,
you know.
Besides, like 25 years ago andwe were very young.
So it's a very new andinteresting perspective on life,
but a beautiful one, and we'reboth really grateful for the
opportunity and the challenge ofraising six kids in a blended

(38:42):
home, right?
So it's like you got to kind ofI get to be that good assistant
coach.
You know you're not reallytrying to parent someone else's
kids and you know you don'tnecessarily want them trying to
parent your kids, but you wantthem to be very loving and
supportive, and so what we findthis easy for us is just like
demonstrating our love and likebeing happy and having a good
home.
So I changed my last name, myname, to an easy, from an easy

(39:04):
last name to a hard last name,from Anderson to Kester, and
then decided to, you know, marry, like the love of my life,
which was like such a great,such a great epic thing that was
, I felt, like very, a reallygreat gift.

Scott (39:20):
That's amazing.
Thanks, that's amazing.
It's such a great story.
I'm so happy for you.
Congratulations.
So we go through this wholeperiod where you're not drinking
, and when does transcendingtrauma come out?

Yeah, so, and that was about that was 2022.
So I guess I would have been intwo years of being alcohol free
.
And that's when that like ratmagnet movement happened, when
all those women spoke out onInstagram about you know some
basically being sexuallyharassed or abused in the
alcohol industry.
So I think that, from a genderperspective, I think there's a
lot of you know, a lot ofopenness there to, for people of

(39:55):
you know all affiliations andall gender identifications that
kind of participate in that.
So it kind of became thisreally interesting community of
people that spoke out and I justsaw hurt in people.

Scott (40:06):
So for folks who are not familiar with the rat magnet, a
woman had been, had she beensexually assaulted.

Her rat, I think really horribly harassed,
but like abused I mean she wasused yes.
She was really traumatized.
She described her pain and theimpact that these events had on
her life, and then more womencame out with that same.
So like the details to me werelike were like what.
They were all awful becauseobviously somebody felt like
they had been, they had beenharmed to the point that, like

(40:35):
they had been traumatized andlike when people write about
their story, and that encourageda lot of women to write about
their story, and I think, youknow, there's always people that
I think take advantage of thattoo.
I think there were some storiesthat were probably not all true
or maybe people werechallenging them or saying, like
you know, I think it created alot of conversations like that

(40:55):
needed to happen and I think insome cases, like highlighted
worse, culture needed to befixed.
You know, but I did think therewas.
It got really bad for a while.
I think it got to a point whereit was like a lot of over, like
, wow, everyone's pain was outthere and it was just the
industry did not react well toit.
I think there was like a reallyAbsolutely not.

Scott (41:17):
The industry didn't know how to act to all of those
things because society was theyget caught a lot of people off
guard because the the brewingindustry is such a tight knit
group of folks and no breweryhates another brewery.
There's no rival breweries,everybody's friends and but a
lot of them had their own littlesecrets and those secrets had
never come to light until youknow.

(41:37):
This woman posted yeah.

And it was a crazy time.
I mean, there was a lot ofgrowth, there was a lot of
alcohol.
I think when that good beerhunting article came out, yes,
that mark, uh, that mark wroteon the culture of over drinking.
You know, when I met him and weconnected over what that
lifestyle was like, it was easyfor some people to get totally
overwhelmed by that and I thinkfor some of us who are more

(42:00):
prone than others, like that'sjust a risk that's associated
and being in that environmentwhere a lot of heavy drinking
and maybe what we call bingedrinking, just there were a lot
of opportunities for that, Isuppose.
So you know, there's, uh, youknow, people that I don't think
and it was ever encouraged, butit's just a reality of how a
certain percentage of peoplewould likely act when, when

(42:23):
presented that opportunity.
So I think when you looked atthat, we connected over like man
, you know we'd both been reallyimpacted by this and I was kind
of like this is like mycomeback story from alcohol.
You know, like I want to giveback.
I actually the reason I createdaficionado is because I wanted
to fund transcending trauma,because I want to teach
everybody in the industry.
I want everybody in theindustry to have access to my

(42:44):
toolbox because I was like I'vegot to find a way to give out,
like if somebody's hurting, likein this industry, as a result
of alcohol or alcohol inducedevent, like please come to me
somehow and like I can at leastget you in touch with the same
people that helped me.
I want that information outthere and I think for me,
meditation and the understandingof my own consciousness and

(43:06):
development and having supportsystems, like a teacher that I
could talk to whenever I wantedto, that was like trauma
informed, would talk to me aboutit as long as I wanted to.
There's group meditations andall this stuff and then
combining that with a programlike one year, no beer.
That taught me about alcohol,really taught me about myself,
because it made me ask.
And then I did a lot ofpersonal development and

(43:28):
psychologist and like all thethings.
You don't have to go to thatlevel, I think, for everybody
else.
I just, if you're hurting, cometo me, I'll show you my toolbox
.
You might not want everything,take the hammer, take the
screwdriver, but if, whateveryou want, if you have something
broken, I might know a way or aprogram because, like I was

(43:48):
hurting for a long time and Ialso was impacted by
overconsumption of alcohol.
So like, if you, if we havethat in common you don't have to
tell me your trauma.
I'll just tell you what minewas kind of like.
If people ask or sometimesthey're just like I just want to
know how you got alcohol freeLike they care a lot about that,
I think, but there's so muchmore to that.

(44:10):
So I think for me giving, havinga way to keep the med, so I
have a meditation meetingtonight.
Like we've actually trainedalready eight or nine women in
this meditation technique and soand I've been able to fund a
lot of that through aficionadoand companies like BrewDog, for
example, that have invested inmy program and are taking it out
to companies like Total Wineand Whole Foods and Andrew's

(44:31):
Distributing and talking topeople about getting trained and
certified in AF and NA beer,because for all the reasons I
just talked about, like it'sgoing to help the category grow.
You know it's a.
It's a really big opportunity.
I think the whole AFNA categoryis about $35 billion.
It has seven to 10 years tomature and I want to help the

(44:52):
that industry grow and when indoing so, I want to give back to
people that are impacted bythis or hurting, and that's why
I started transcending trauma.

Scott (45:00):
That's amazing.
It's so great Thanks to that inthe show notes as well, which
brings us to aficionado.
So you and I are both certifiedcisterns, so that is certified
in all things beer.

I'm a BJCP judge also, yeah.

Scott (45:15):
Which is amazing.
That's a super hard one.
I haven't even tackled that one.
You know, there's all thesecertifications out there.
I have a WSET2 for wine, butthere are all these other ones
out there, but there isn't onefor non-alcohol or AFTA.
Until you come along.

Yeah, yeah, exactly.
That's why I created it.
So my very last job at BostonBeer was I ran beer education
from North America.
It was a really cool job and Iam so honored that I got to be
in that position because I gotto build training programs that
basically directly added revenueto the company.
We were the type of companythat invested in training.

(45:50):
So we saw deploying privatizedtraining to clients like
retailers that wanted to knowmore about the category.
We would go train them how topass the cistern exam, but
through the lens of Boston Beer.
So we had frameworks fortraining.
We had a lot of resources.
We could buy all the samplesyou know.
So it wasn't like a traditionaldry-sponsored training.
It was very personalized and ithelped them achieve

(46:12):
certification, which ultimatelyhelped those organizations
better spot opportunity in craftbeer.
So I took that same model andmade a Fisianado for what we
call AFNA, af and NA right.
So in Dr Keith Via, who hasSaria Brewing, which is a really
also created Blue Moon, so afew people might know of that.
But Keith is the one thatencouraged me to create the

(46:34):
program.
I knew he was making a 0.0 beerand it was really good and he
had invested a lot in it.
Keith's a pretty smart guy andhe tends to know where the
market's going, so he said youshould make this.
I realized that we needed moreresources and we needed to step
it up a little bit.
So I basically just hired atechnical beer writer, katie

(47:00):
Nishaka, from Odell Brewing, andthen she went on to work for
the US Fish and WildlifeDepartment now and she's a
forensic scientist, but she'salso a hops expert and a really,
really excellent technicalwriter with a master's degree in
science.
So she is very good at writingtechnical stuff and I am a
technical person.
So I knew I wanted to build itlike a Ciceroan Level 1, let's

(47:23):
say, like a beer server.
I wanted it to just.
If you took it one day, youwould get ROI from it like
within a few days.
I wanted it to be meaningfulenough that I did this program
and it helped me learn a lot soI can recognize I could better
spot opportunity.
Today I sold five more cases ofstuff.
Today I helped five more peoplebecause I saw the guy order a

(47:46):
water and I asked him if hewanted any beer and he was like
oh yeah, I didn't see that onyour menu.
Or hey, I saw somebody whoasked me about NA and I told
them about the benefits and nowthey came back three weeks later
and that's all they're drinkingand I sold them more.
Or tonight I encouraged a drink, a beer, drink, a NA kind of

(48:10):
campaign thing, and I sold eightbeers instead of four.
And I mean so I think that andit's for premium eyes because
it's harder to make it actuallyrequires a lot of.
It's pretty hard because you'rereally kind of creating
typically an analog of a productfor a lot of brands.
They want to put their name onit, so they want it to taste

(48:33):
like their stuff.
So that's actually a technicalchallenge, right?
Because normally speaking, withKraft you just keep ruining the
tank until you get somethingyou like, and that's the way
we're reverse engineering thatwe're saying we want it to be
like something that tastes likea Sam Adams, for example.
That's hard.
Or like a Deschutes.
It's hard to do that.

Scott (48:52):
I mean alcohol is a component of taste.
It does give a certain amountof flavor to whatever beverage
it is, and it fully extracts it.
It's not going to taste exactlylike the original.
So you've created the program.
You worked with Ray Danielsfrom the Ciceroen program as
well.

So I consulted I actually to Chris who was
running the Ciceroen program,and I also talked to other
people that worked at Ciceroenor with them and to a lot of
master Ciceroens.
So most of the master Ciceroenshelped me.
For example, mirella Amatowrote my non-alcoholic beer and
food pairing part of my section.
I consulted with Neil Witte whois a draft expert on the draft

(49:30):
piece.
He sent me David Quain's work.
I've consulted over the yearswith people like Grant Wood who
we worked with at Boston Beer.
I mean Grant is an expert inmany topics and I would say a
lot of the things I've done atHop Forward.
I learned a lot from Grant andhe's very well connected.
He's helped to make a lot ofintroductions for me and just
been really fun to work with andstill be friends with.

(49:51):
We actually went and ate at alinea together in Chicago for
his birthday one year, grantWood, you know I think I saw
that on Facebook.

Scott (49:59):
It was so cool.

I cried during the dinner because it was so
emotional and I bought the fullalcohol pack and I was back when
I was still drinking.
So I'm sure it was a veryintoxicating, but it was
actually an unforgettable one,just one that I think, when I
talk about people that canmoderate or are able to do that
man, good for you if you can, Ithink that's cool because that

(50:21):
was such a memorable experiencethat I think was totally reason
to imbibe in something beautiful.
That was the most well curated,coolest meal.
Actually, another friend wasthere, megan.
She used to work at Boston Beer.
She was there at this dinner.

Scott (50:39):
That's awesome.
It was a really memorablereunion.

I got to be a part of a really cool group that
night and it was a very peoplethat really appreciate food and
drink.
So when I created a Fiscianano,I actually didn't want it to be
like dogging the alcoholindustry, if you know what I
mean.
I kind of created it because Ivalue the alcohol industry.
I don't want my storynecessarily to overshadow the

(51:02):
fact that the alcohol categorybeverage category should still
exist.
I just think that people aregoing to be more aware of their
habits and I think we'restarting to see the result of
that in the US market.
So we're seeing a shift inthose consumers because of
everything that's happened,primarily COVID it was such a
big thing.
Then, of course, prohibition2.0, which is sort of the

(51:24):
legalization of cannabis andcannabis products, I think is
also influencing that.
But it's a moderation movement.
People are doing it becausethey don't want to be hung over.
If that's affecting theindustry, then that's telling
you who some of those primaryconsumers are and they're
looking for more options.
So the industry is going toevolve into that.
But I knew the alcohol industryneeds to grow and I actually

(51:47):
think this is a big category forit to grow if some of the
brands begin to invest in thisinnovation, like Anheuser-Busch
was.
They're investing.
They just invested millions andmillions of dollars, I think
between 35 and 50 million maybein new de-alcoolization
equipment, because they areactually behind on their own.

(52:07):
Just like operationally it'sreally hard to make that much NA
beer.
They're just capacity-wise andother brand focuses, depending
on the market where you're at, Ithink, of influence that growth
.
But it is happening.
They recognize it because inEurope 15% of the beer market is
non-alcoholic, so here it's 1%.

(52:29):
So it's already happened therebecause they have more of a
moderate approach definitelymore of like the—and the NAB
Labs are also growing there.
That category of low alcoholand no alcohol is also growing
exponentially in Europe,especially in the UK.
So they're also going throughthis big moderation mindset
shift.
I think we're going to see itimpact the industry.

(52:52):
My thought was create somethingthat bolts onto those programs.
I didn't go recreate beerstyles 101 or wine styles 101,
let's say.
I said here is a training onalcohol-free and non-alcoholic
processes, ingredients, history,specific to that niche, so that
it bolts onto the other product, so that if you have a Cabernet

(53:14):
I don't have to retrain youabout that.
You can talk in depth aboutthat from your training.
But you can now talk about thatspecific piece of the
non-alcoholic that bolts on andthat allows you to sell more and
generate more revenue, and thatconsumer is looking for that.
So if you're going to focus onthat as a business, I'm

(53:35):
challenging businesses to dothat.

Scott (53:38):
That's awesome.
I'm so excited that somebody isdoing what you're doing.
It's something long overdue.
I'm super happy for you.
I look forward to reading yourbook.
I read my preview, but I'll begetting my copy.
I'll link that in the shownotes as well All the links for
aficionado in there as well.
If people want to keep up withwhat you're doing, how do they

(53:59):
keep up with you?

I'd say follow me on LinkedIn.
If you want to follow where Ithink the best content's coming
from, go to the aficionadocertification program LinkedIn
page and follow us there.
Hop forward consulting theEnlightened Buzz, which is Lee's
work.
Please follow that.
It's really really good content.
It's so good.

Scott (54:20):
Okay.

I'm going to go to the link and me at Megan
Anderson on LinkedIn, but alsoon LinkedIn just on Megan
Anderson, which is a great wayto follow me.
I do plan to start buildingmore content on LinkedIn and
connecting with people on thatplatform.

Scott (54:36):
It's M-E-A-G-E-N Anderson .

Yes, thank you, scott.
Thank you, yes.
M-e-a-g-e-n Anderson.
Yes, an alcohol-freeaficionadoscom is our website.
You can get the link to ourbook there, which is on Amazon
Kindle, which is the world'sfirst book on AF and NA beer
called the AFNA Beer CertifiedLearning Manual.

Scott (54:57):
Definitely check that out .
The spelling is very specific.
I typed in just a regular MeganAnderson.
I wasn't thinking.
I know how to spell your nameMegan Anderson and then
aficionado.
What popped up was MeganAnderson, the MMA fighter who
apparently is an aficionado inkicking ass.
That showed up first.
Don't make that mistake.

Hey, that's kind of funny because I've seen
that before.
Yes, how you spell Megan doesmatter on this one.

Scott (55:25):
Yes, exactly right, she's apparently in it.
The first article was like anaficionado in ass kicking.

I was like oh all right, I actually feel cool,
like way cooler now, anyway,because now I feel like it's
kind of like what people see,then they'll find the real me,
but they can't forget that part.
Yeah, that's so good.

Scott (55:43):
I'm pretty sure that I am not the coolest Scott Carney.

Yeah, I think you are.
I definitely am.

Scott (55:49):
Oh, thank you so much.
Thank you so much for comingout today and going through all
your successes Personally andprofessionally.
It's been an amazing ride todayJust listening to that stuff.
It's awesome to see you.
You make me smile.
Thanks, You're the best.
We'll definitely keep in touch.

Let me know when you want to talk live.
Let's go through a 90 daychallenge plan for you.
I'll help you find a good setlist.

Scott (56:10):
Absolutely.
Thank you so much for being on.

There's a lot we can cover.
It might be multiple podcasts.
Part six the saga continues.
We've got a trilogy going on,yeah.

Scott (56:22):
Part six Part nine Part nine Part nine Part nine Part
nine Part nine Part nine Partnine Part.
Nine Part nine Part.
Nine Part nine Part.
Nine Part nine.

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EP13 Meagen Anderson - Crafting & Pioneering the Non-Alcoholic Revolution

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}EP13 Meagen Anderson - Crafting & Pioneering the Non-Alcoholic Revolution