November 13, 2025 • 42 mins
Most accountants are losing business and don’t even realize it.
In this episode, we break down the 3 silent killers that are costing firms revenue, retention, and referrals, starting with outdated pricing models and ending with what your clients actually care about (hint: it’s not your reconciliations).
Debra Kilsheimer joins to share what actually drives client loyalty, why she ditched hourly billing decades ago, and how she built her firm "Behind the Scenes Accounting" that runs on relationships, not reports.
You’ll learn:
- The 3 questions that close high-value clients fast
- Why your financial reports are being ignored
- The hidden price of sticking to “industry best practices”
- How small touches (like a handwritten note or birthday call) get remembered longer than your year-end package
📲 Want to connect with Debra? Reach out on LinkedIn or email her at debra@bsfaccounting.com.
This one will have you rethinking everything from pricing to client retention. Hit play now.
This episode is brought to you by Bill.com
Ready to take your finances to the next level? See how BILL Spend & Expense can power up your business and get that free grill at http://bill.com/cfochronicles
Ready to turn your firm into a lead-generating, profit-driving machine?
We help Bookkeepers, Accountants & Fractional CFOs generate consistent local leads, book perfect-fit appointments, and close premium clients, without cold outreach or ad guesswork.
Let’s map out your growth plan together → Book your free strategy call
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_02 (00:00):
Welcome to CFO Chronicles, The Secrets Behind
Success, the must-listen showfor fractional CFOs, accounting
firm owners, and finance leaderslooking to land high-value
clients and scale through nextlevel marketing, branding, and
strategy.
I'm your host, James Donovan,and today's guest is Deborah
Kilzheimer, founder of Behindthe Scenes, a transformational
(00:20):
accounting firm.
Deborah's a true visionary who'snot afraid to challenge
conventional wisdom in theindustry.
Today she'll be sharing her ahamoment that led her to quit her
job and build her practiceexactly how she wanted it.
She'll also reveal her biggestmarketing challenge and how she
overcame it, as well as herstrong belief about the use of
timesheets in the industry.
(00:40):
Stay tuned to discover whyDeborah believes that believing
in your ideas is the key tosuccess in the accounting world.
Deborah, welcome to the show.
I'm so excited to have you onhere today.
SPEAKER_01 (00:51):
Me too.
Now, did you write thatyourself?
That was really good.
SPEAKER_02 (00:54):
Oh, thank you so much.
There may have been a little bitof uh some help there with the
team, but we can run with um,you know, me right.
SPEAKER_01 (01:02):
I might have to keep that for my own to use that.
SPEAKER_02 (01:04):
Hey, I'll send it over.
That will be your new intro forall the podcasts you're doing.
SPEAKER_01 (01:08):
Oh, it's really good.
SPEAKER_02 (01:10):
Thank you so much for coming on, though, Deborah.
I've had an absolute blast everytime we've got to connect in
person.
I know we met um back in thespring at GrowCon and we had a
chance to connect again recentlyin Arizona.
Um, it's always a pleasureseeing you.
So I'm again, I'm so excited tohave you on here today and just
chat and and have our listenersget to know you a little bit as
(01:30):
well.
Great.
Perfect.
So let's dive right into things.
Can you tell us about yourjourney to becoming a CPA and
how you eventually decided tostart your own practice?
SPEAKER_01 (01:42):
Well, how much time do you have?
Well, I was um I grew up in anaccounting family.
My dad was a um my dad was ateacher, and he always kept
track of all the money in ourfamily.
My mom was a stay-at-home mom.
They both had master's degreesfrom my dad, Temple University,
my mom, the University ofPennsylvania, and their big
(02:03):
thing was to raise a family.
I'm the oldest of four, and theydid it on a teacher's salary.
I went to Girl Scout camp,church camp, new school clothes
every year, violin lessons,beach summer vacation, camping.
We had a perfect beaver cleaverlife, and my dad did it on a
teacher's salary because Iremember him sitting with my mom
(02:25):
and my mom keeping all thereceipts, and they'd go into the
basement and they would do thebudget, you know, and they'd
say, Okay, we have money forthis and money for that, and
let's so I mean we didn't shopin the fanciest of stores, um,
but we did survive on that kindof a budget, and that to me was
what accounting was.
So when I went to college, Ididn't know what I wanted to be.
(02:46):
So, and my mom told me, by theway, that girls were not good at
math.
Well, you believe your mother,don't you?
So I thought, well, I can't bean accountant, I'm not good at
math, you know.
And in college, I had a roommatewho was taking accounting, and I
needed one more course.
She goes, Take accounting, it'snot hard, I'll help you.
(03:08):
Yeah, but I'm not good at math.
She goes, It's not math, it'slogic.
I'm like, Oh, all right.
So I took it.
I thought, this is fun.
It's like a puzzle.
I mean, if you're solving apuzzle.
So I really liked it.
Well, I go back for the summerand I thought, I just can't, I
still don't know what I want tobe.
(03:29):
So I bought a car, I packed thecar up, and I said, I'm moving
to Florida.
My mom says, Where are yougoing?
I was in Pennsylvania.
I'm moving to Florida.
Who do you know in Florida?
Nobody.
I mean, I'm 21.
You think you can conquer theworld?
So I moved, drove to Florida,got off in Orlando, and thought,
(03:49):
what am I gonna do?
What am I gonna be?
Blah, blah.
So I'm driving around and I sawthe University of Central
Florida.
Back then it was called FloridaTechnological University, but
it's changed to UCF.
I walked in, I said, What's themajor that will get me a job?
And they said, Accounting isgood.
I'm thinking, well, I took thataccounting class, okay, sign me
up.
So I that's how I started myaccounting journey.
(04:12):
Got the degree, got a job in aCPA firm, passed my exam, and
thought, I absolutely hate thisjob.
I thought it was dumb.
It was nothing like I thoughtaccounting was, like my dad
taught me it was, which wasforward thinking.
What do people want?
What's the vision you have foryour life that accounting and
(04:33):
the money can help meet?
Because we were worrying aboutreceipts and six-minute
intervals and how much time didit take.
And I thought, this isbackwards.
I remember having my um annualreview with the partner, and he
says, Debbie, we're reallydisappointed in you.
Why?
I'm I'm bringing in newbusiness, I'm filling out my
(04:55):
timesheets, I'm getting, youknow, I'm I'm really whipping
out these tax returns.
I'm doing a good job.
Why are you disappointed?
He goes, Well, your billing rateis not as high as Tony's.
He was a kid in the office.
Yeah, Tony and I graduated thesame year, passed the exam at
the same time.
We were equal on paper, but Tonytook a long time.
And he goes, and Tony staysevery night till eight o'clock,
(05:17):
and you leave at five.
I said, Yeah, but my work'sdone.
Why do I need to stay till eightjust to make you think that I'm
more committed than he is?
I do more tax returns, blah,blah, blah.
And he goes, but that's just howit's done in accounting.
I said, Well, not for me.
I hate this.
I went home and told my newhusband, my first husband, I got
two.
I traded him in for how.
(05:39):
And uh I said, I really hatethis job.
It's nothing like I thought itwould be.
I mean, six-minute intervalsthat they track, you know,
that's how they price thecustomer.
Why don't we just charge a flatrate?
If I get it done in 10 minutes,why does it, why is that worth
less than a tax return thattakes me two hours?
SPEAKER_02 (05:56):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (05:56):
You know, it just made no sense to me.
I said, you know, what are weafter?
We're after transformingcustomers into what accounting
can do for them in their life.
And I was 25 years old when Ihad this conversation.
And uh my husband said, So whatare you gonna do?
I said, I'm quitting.
I quit.
I I I walked in my Bronzov said,You know what?
(06:19):
I'm not doing this anymore.
SPEAKER_02 (06:20):
I love it.
SPEAKER_01 (06:20):
You just passed your exam.
Yeah, but I cannot live likethis any.
I don't like it.
I'm not having any fun.
I always wanted to have a jobwhere I liked getting up and
having fun, where I wanted to goto work.
You know, I um so I quit and Iwent into sales for 10 years,
which I sold Mary Kay Cosmeticsof all things, had the pink
(06:41):
cadillac, had the the mink coat,the bumblebee, everything.
And um I did I did that, verysuccessful at it, and then
personal computers started tocome out, and I thought, well,
these Mary Kay directors neednewsletters.
So I started a newslettercompany, started to create
newsletters for Mary Kdirectors, and then um they
(07:02):
realized that they could do themon their own.
So I'm like, okay, well, youknow, I'm be I was becoming the
buggy whip salesman.
So then I got a job teachingcomputers to attorneys in a big
in big in a big firm that wasall over the country.
I loved that job.
And 9-11 hits, and all of asudden we're not traveling
(07:23):
anymore.
So they called me in my officeand said, in their office and
said, We're doing away with yourdepartment.
What?
I thought I'd have this job forthe rest of my life.
And they said, Well, we're nottraveling, so we don't need you.
So Friday morning I had a job,Friday afternoon, I did not.
Well, in the interim, my firsthusband and I got a divorce,
(07:45):
unfortunately.
Life happens, and then I decidedI wanted a boyfriend.
So I put an ad on the internetand I said, I want a boyfriend.
And I had a date like everynight for a year.
SPEAKER_02 (07:57):
Where did you go?
SPEAKER_01 (07:59):
I I tell you what, I said, you know what?
They all I'm gonna meeteverybody, you never know.
SPEAKER_02 (08:03):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (08:03):
So um I said, you know what?
You sit through movies that fortwo hours that are stinko.
I could have dinner withsomebody, and maybe I'll meet
somebody nice.
So I just was looking forsomebody to have dinner with, go
to the movies.
I wasn't looking to get married.
I was just, I just wantedsomebody to have fun with.
And um, Hal called Hal was oneof the people that answered.
Hal and Pardon?
(08:25):
Hal in the towel.
Yep.
And uh so when I when he calledme, I he goes, he was 10 years
older than me.
He lived 50 miles away from me.
He kept telling me all this Iown a boat, I own a car, I had a
motorcycle, I go on vacation allthe time.
I'm thinking, who cares?
Are you nice?
Are you decent?
Are you kind?
That's what I was looking for.
And then he's so then I said,What do you do?
(08:46):
Oh, I have my own tax andaccounting firm.
I thought he's probably as dullas dishwater.
And then I said, What's yourname?
He goes, Oh, my name is HalHickey.
I'm like, I I didn't laugh onthe phone, but inside I was
like, What?
So I thought, no what?
You know what?
I promised I'd meet him all.
(09:08):
So I met him for dinner thefollowing Wednesday.
He called me on a Saturday, Imet him for met him on
Wednesday.
I said, Well, this guy's nice.
I like him.
He can complete a sentence.
He he's just, I just enjoyed hiscompany.
And um that that next weekend, Iwent I came over to Port Orange
where he lived, and we went outon the boat.
We just had a nice timetogether.
(09:29):
I really I really liked it.
So a month later is when I lostmy job.
And I called him up, but I said,guess what?
I don't have a job anymore.
I don't know what I'm gonna do.
I've never not had a job.
He goes, Well, you're a CPA, whydon't you work with me till you
find something?
I said, All right, only if I canrun an accounting firm how I
(09:49):
think it should be run.
No hourly billing, flat ratepricing, use all the
technologies that are availableto streamline the process to
give a proactive result to thecustomers.
And he goes, Good, I like tax,you do you.
I'm like, okay.
So I got QuickBooks.
So that was, you know, that wasthe software back then, and
(10:09):
started to go build thepractice.
And it was like that was like 24years ago.
And uh he was smart enough tolet me run with it.
So I got very active in the theuh QuickBooks community.
I started to attend conferences,I started to do all of that
stuff, and it's turned outreally well.
We have um you know, I built thefirm really big.
We had a lot of staff at onetime, and then I thought, I
(10:32):
don't like I don't like havingpeople work for me.
I don't like getting up andgetting dressed to go into an
office.
I like going from my bedroominto my other bedroom.
This is my office.
Yeah, and when COVID hit, we letgo of a lot of our staff.
Um kept one.
So we still have one, Mary,who's been with me like 18 years
now.
SPEAKER_02 (10:50):
Amazing.
SPEAKER_01 (10:51):
And uh, you know, have I still make a lot of money
and do what we want when wewant, and uh, because we I build
I do the practice how I think itshould be done.
SPEAKER_02 (11:02):
That's what it's all about, right?
You just you're building it theway you want to run the
business.
There's a million ways to run abusiness, and there's a so
that's so awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (11:11):
And my big thing is always making customers, you
know, like what I like, like yousaid in the beginning, transform
customers.
That's always been my mission.
Is how can what I do help themachieve their goals, transform
their lives?
And um, so I would I ask I askquestions.
So, so why did you start yourbusiness?
If I if you had a milliondollars, what would you do with
(11:34):
it?
So they start to tell you andthey start dreaming and all.
Oh, so I see that they havelittle kids at home and they
want to go to their soccergames, they want to pay, or
they're older and they want topay for their kids, their
grandchildren's collegeeducations.
You know, it's beyond, I wouldsay it's beyond the balance
sheet, meaning the that givesthem the everyday stuff they do.
(11:54):
But what the when the profitthey produce, what can they do
with that?
You know, I talk about whatabout your your employees, the
people that work for you?
How can we impact them so theycan have the life they want to
live?
So it goes beyond just that.
And they start to see, well,yeah, you're a little bit
different.
Well, that yeah, because I'mworrying about how accounting
(12:15):
can impact what you do.
And um, so I'm I always keepthat top of mind with them.
So we're always looking at that.
I said, you know, your booksspeak to you through the
transactions.
My job is to interpret it.
Just like some people readFrench romance novels, I read
balance sheets and incomestatements.
(12:36):
And now with AI, I can read themfaster.
You know, I can get moreinsights.
I I can do the AI can take careof the drudge part.
I'm not taking all the stuff andfiguring it all out myself.
Um, the AI can give me theinsights into what I'm seeing.
Um, and then I use all thetechnology tools.
Like one of my favorite tools isFanatical Software, which is a
(12:58):
reporting software that connectswith QuickBooks and exports it
into uh at the Excel level.
So I can customize the reportslike I want.
Restaurants, 445 reports,seven-day flash reports.
I can customize them in Exceland it sucks the data in.
Where before I was exporting it,manipulating it myself with all
the transactions.
(13:19):
But now with fanatical software,it's my favorite.
I use that.
Um, and then of course I useSessant, which imports the data
into the into the into theQuickBooks and uh Bill, which
pays the bills for the, youknow, so I use all the best of
breed softwares, same thing withpayroll, um, you know, make sure
(13:39):
that all gets in.
And then what do the numbersmean?
How can we impact what thecustomer wants to see a
difference?
And uh, and when you do that,you can charge premium prices.
I'm not I'm not competing withthe guy down the street that
says we do bankrupt.
I'm competing with the guy thatsays we change lives.
So we're strategic, morestrategic than we are
(14:01):
transactional.
And when you move with when youtalk about strategy and
strategic, you chart can chargemore.
And a lot of people say, Well,I'm not, I'm I'm just a
bookkeeper.
Doesn't matter, you're stilldoing the same thing.
You know, you're still lookingat what the impact is, the
technology, the freedom, allthis, the space that you can
(14:21):
open up so the business ownercan have the vision to make his
lawn care business the bestthere is.
SPEAKER_02 (14:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (14:28):
You know, for his swimming pool business the best
there is.
They all started the businessfor a reason.
Figure out what it is, how youcan make it bigger and better.
What they want, that's valuepricing.
A lot of people get thatincorrect, I think, because what
we value as accountants, I don'tthink is the same thing clients
value.
Give you an example.
SPEAKER_02 (14:49):
Well, just just real quick there on that, because
there's a lot of great points.
And one, you mentioned Bill, sowe'll just touch on that real
quick because they're uh proudsponsor of the show, and we
can't so shout out, shout out toBill.
Um, appreciate you guys, thankyou so much.
But Debbie, you were talkingabout um it sounds like a big
piece of what you do and a lotof your success, and I'm
(15:11):
guessing the client retentionand just why the firm works so
well is because you you careabout people's why and you're
not just reporting the numbers,like you're asking, well, what
would you do with the milliondollars?
What like what is important toyou?
Why did you start the business?
And you're you're asking thedeeper questions, not just
surfle surface level stuff.
Would you say that has helpedyou?
(15:33):
I I guess let me re rephrasethat.
How would you say that hashelped you by asking those
questions?
I think that's one of likethat's the biggest hack when it
comes to sales is just askingquestions and being a human who
cares.
SPEAKER_01 (16:40):
Well, I think I do think it gives people purpose.
I think people need purpose.
Why do I get up every morningand do what I do?
So, you know, I do it because myfor my family, you know, I I'm
you know, what whatever.
So I figure out what theirpurpose is and keep that top of
mind.
And then you do things to soyou're I don't want to say in
(17:02):
your in their face, but you doreally hospitable things.
Like I read that book by WillGardera on unreasonable
hospitality.
Why aren't we doing that asaccountants?
It's so simple.
You know, like remember theirbirthdays.
Now, what we do here is we haveall their birthdays because we
have to have them on the taxreturn.
Hal and I actually will call upthe client and sing happy
(17:23):
birthday on the phone.
SPEAKER_02 (17:24):
I love it.
SPEAKER_01 (17:25):
I mean, they think we're nuts.
Now, it takes what, fiveminutes, but you can hear them
chuckling on the other end andthey go, Thank you for
remembering.
I mean, you know, I mean, and orsend them a birthday card.
We said a lot of thank younotes.
I like to, I like to handwritethe who does that anymore.
Takes seconds, you know.
So things like that, you know,if there's things are coming up,
(17:45):
like I know with um therestaurants that we have with
the tip, the over the tipcredit, you know, I called up
all the owners and explained tothem as best I could what's
going on with that.
Um, you know, that takes extratime, but to me, that shows that
we care about what they want,what they're on on target of
what they want.
Um, you know, we just talk tothem.
(18:05):
They're people.
I mean, when people say this isbusiness to business, no, it's
people to people.
SPEAKER_02 (18:11):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (18:11):
People are behind every single business.
So you find out what makes themtick, gives them purpose.
And I think I think there was astudy.
What makes people live longer?
It's that they have a socialnetwork and a purpose in life.
It's not health or diet.
So I thought, yahoo, you mean Idon't have to lose weight to
live a long time?
Yay, I'm all for that.
(18:32):
You know, so uh, you know, givepeople purpose.
So it, you know, it matters.
And if you see them struggling,you know, call stuff out.
You know, I was talking aboutthe value.
You know, we think asaccountants, we need to produce
have a meeting with them everymonth to go over the balance
sheet and the income statement.
That's not a bad thing, but it'snot what many clients want, what
(18:52):
they want.
What do you see that we can helpmake a difference in what's
going on?
So I'm looking at ratios,margins, everything like that.
So if I know they're on target,I'll just come, we're on target
this month, keep it going.
Um, any new things coming up?
Nope, everything's good.
Great.
I don't need to meet with them.
It's kind of like, you know,when you go to the doctor and he
gives you a takes the blood workand he says, Okay, let's go over
(19:16):
the blood work, Debbie.
And he shows me all thesenumbers.
I go, uh-uh-uh-uh.
I don't need to know that.
Is there anything you must know?
My goal is to live to 110.
What on there is telling youthat that's not gonna happen?
He goes, No, everything's good.
I go, and can I can I improveanything?
Nope, improve it all.
I mean, you're doing great.
(19:37):
Perfect.
If you see anything whacked,call me up, we'll take care of
that.
I use that philosophy when I'mtalking to clients.
Now, if they want to go overevery line on the lab report,
the income statement,absolutely, I'll do it.
I have one guy, he goes overevery line.
Of course, he pays the mostmoney to me, by the way, you
know, but um I'm fine to do thatbecause that's what makes that's
(19:57):
what he values.
It's not what I value, it's whatthey value.
You gotta find that out byasking good questions.
SPEAKER_02 (20:03):
Something that's really standing out to me, and
I'm curious to get your take onthis.
But in a world where everyone'strying to automate everything,
they're trying to use AI foreverything and just like remove
themselves from the business.
It sounds like you're reallytaking that extra personal touch
to work with your clients.
And like you said, yeah, sure,writing a handwritten letter,
(20:25):
it's going to take more timethan an automated email.
But I'm I can almost guaranteethe impact your clients get from
that handwritten letter or youpicking up the phone and singing
happy birthday.
unknown (20:35):
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (20:36):
They remember that stuff, they don't remember the
email that went out as well.
SPEAKER_01 (20:38):
I don't remember the email, you know, right.
In fact, it's funny, many timesI'll just do a handwritten thank
you note.
I will tell you between me andyou, I I write down in chat GPT
and the rest of the listeners.
Yeah, that I'm writing a thankyou note to this for this
client.
Can you come up with a reallygreat way to say it?
So ChatGBT will actually writethe text.
SPEAKER_02 (20:59):
Yeah, you know, it's all your it's still your prompt.
It's still my idea.
SPEAKER_01 (21:03):
I just have to handwrite it on, and I handwrite
it with my black felt tipmarker, yeah, and then handwrite
the address on the thing.
It always smears because youknow it never dries fast enough.
I don't care.
Put a stamp on it, mail it off.
Looks more authentic.
The number of times people willactually take a picture of the
note and send it.
Thank you for sending me this.
And I'm thinking, what an impactit has.
(21:26):
You know, I mean it takes solittle time.
Um, so anytime somebody doessomething special, I try to find
out their address and might sendthem a quick note.
Thanks so much.
It was great meeting you at aconference.
Love talking with you.
Like I tell you, every podcastguest I have, I send a thank you
note to.
Because we have my on my ownpodcast with Donna, uh Debbie
(21:46):
and Donna, Bookkeepers on Fire.
SPEAKER_02 (21:48):
Well, yeah, let's let's talk about that real quick
because you got the shirt on.
For those, uh for those who areonly listening on video here, go
check it out on YouTube.
But uh, yeah, let's let's hearabout this shirt because it
looks awesome.
So I'd love to hear uh quickly.
Tell us the story behind that.
SPEAKER_01 (22:02):
Well, it's funny.
My friend Donna Reed, I metDonna Reed doing kind of what
I'm doing now.
My the the host said, um, Brad,he said, you have to meet Donna
Reed.
We do an after show where we'renot filming, but everybody comes
on.
You have to meet this girl,Donna Reed.
I said, okay.
So she comes on and we're justlike, you know, like you know,
two mothers from a two sistersfrom a different mother,
(22:24):
whatever that phrase is.
So Brad and Andrew left andwe're talking.
And uh, so but I just we justconnected and she's in
California.
So I'm at QuickBooks Connect twoyears ago and I'm walking in the
in the vendor hall and I see herstanding there.
Now, Donna is very quiet, she'san introvert, she's but she's
(22:47):
brilliant.
And I knew that because I'vetalked to her and I see her
stuff, and I thought, this thisgirl's smart.
I like smart people.
I have a thing for smart people.
So I see her standing there andI walked up to her and I said,
Donna Reed.
I'm Debbie Kilzheimer, I can'tbelieve I finally met her in 3D.
And uh she goes, Oh, great, youknow, blah, blah, blah.
(23:08):
I said, Do you ever think aboutdoing something together?
And she went, I'd love to.
I said, Well, let's let's let'sfigure out something to do.
Well, six months later, here'smy number.
Six months later, she texts me.
Were you serious about doingsomething together?
Because I'm a littleintimidated.
Am I that scary?
(23:30):
And uh she goes, Yes, but you'rewell known, blah, blah, blah.
I said, Look, I'm just me.
So we decided about two yearsago to start a YouTube uh
podcast called Bookkeepers onFire.
And the goal was just to answerbookkeeping questions.
One of my hobbies is I like toknit.
And my favorite YouTube knittingthing is called um is is um they
(23:52):
answer knitting questions.
unknown (23:54):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (23:54):
Yeah.
So I thought, why don't weanswer bookkeeping questions?
So we get asked people, pleasesend us your questions.
So people would ask, how do youdo this?
How do you do that?
And Donna would answer, and thenI would give my take.
And it so it went really well.
So then Donna says, Why don't wedo a YouTube channel?
I said, Okay, we'll just talk,the two of us.
And I said, Why don't we dobookkeepers on fire?
(24:15):
Why don't we interview thepeople in our industry?
Because we need to build it upto see, we make a difference.
You know, we impact people'slives.
So let's it we want to impacttheir life.
So we have we go on once a weekum live.
We were on Tuesdays at threeo'clock.
And um yesterday we had RandyCrabtree on from uh Bridging the
(24:37):
Gap.
He was our guest yesterday.
We've had Ron Baker on, HectorGarcia, Carlos Garcia, you know,
Jeannie Whitehouse is coming on,and plus all of my my friends in
the industry, you know, and wejust chat for half an hour and
everybody says, uh, I don'tthink I could talk for half an
hour.
I said, it's three peopletalking, it's three friends
talking.
You'll be amazed.
And before you know it, the 30minutes is up.
(24:58):
And it's great.
So um, so we started doing that.
I forget we have about, we don'thave any sponsors or anything,
so it's organically grown.
And um, Donna does all the work.
I have to tell you, Donna doesall the work, she's brilliant
with it.
And I'm I always think I'm theidea person.
What do we do this?
What do you think of that?
What do you think of this?
(25:19):
And uh she goes, Oh, I like thatidea, and then she'll institute
it.
So she works very hard at it.
I show up.
So so uh it's it's a lot of fun.
And Don and I meet, you know,every week to go over our plans,
just chit-chat, where do youwant to go with it, things like
that?
And we just have a ball doingit.
We have a great time and uhbookkeepers on fire.
(25:41):
Let's go.
SPEAKER_02 (25:42):
Bookkeepers on fire, check it out wherever you get
your podcasts, I'm guessing.
SPEAKER_01 (25:46):
Podcast and YouTube, yep.
SPEAKER_02 (25:47):
Perfect.
Um so Debbie, I'm I'm reallycurious to know, just kind of
tying this back into amarketing-related podcast so
it's super actionable for therest of the listeners.
I got two questions for you.
Um, one on the front end, whatpart of your marketing engine
keeps you up at night?
SPEAKER_01 (26:07):
I mean, what do I worry about?
SPEAKER_02 (26:09):
Yeah, what from the marketing side of things with
your business, is there anythingthat comes to mind that that
it's that you're worrying about,or you got it, you gotta do it.
Why worry?
SPEAKER_01 (26:17):
Why worry?
Make your wrinkles.
Okay, perfect.
69 years old.
I don't need any more wrinkles.
Okay, I never worried aboutmarketing, if that's your
question.
Okay, I never had a website tillthree years ago.
SPEAKER_02 (26:30):
Amazing.
SPEAKER_01 (26:31):
Now, what I do is I always am talking to customers.
Who do you know that might needmy help?
When I'm out and about, youknow, I ask people all the time,
you know, um, I I like to talkto people.
You have to step out of yourcomfort zone when you're a
business owner, whether you'rean introvert or an extrovert.
People think you need to be boldand loud and a salesperson.
(26:53):
No, you just have to like peopleand be interested in them in
your own way, whether it be aquiet way or a loud way like me.
Because everybody likes talkingabout themselves.
So find the question.
So, so who are you?
Like I introduced myself.
My name is Debbie Kilsheimer.
Who what's your name?
And they'll tell you, Oh, myname's Oh, great.
(27:14):
You know, so what's good in yourlife?
I never like to say, Well, howare you?
Oh, who cares?
You know, sometimes they'll tellyou and go, I'm never asking
that question again.
So um, I go, Well, what's goodin your life?
You know, how do you know thiswherever we are or what whatever
it is?
And they'll start, oh, andthey'll start to talk to you.
And then they'll usually say,Well, what do you do?
or something like that.
Say, Oh, I'm an accountant.
(27:34):
I do have a great accountant.
I always say great accountantbecause everybody has an
accountant.
Yeah, but they have a great one.
And they go, Well, I have anaccountant.
I said, Yeah, but do you reallylike them?
Are they great?
And they go, Well, no.
Well, I'm a great one.
SPEAKER_02 (27:51):
I love that.
SPEAKER_01 (27:52):
And they I they go, Well, I'm thinking about
switching.
I said, I don't want to takebusiness away from anybody.
I think there's enough businessfor all of us.
So I'm never stealing clients.
So they go, Well, my accountantdoesn't do, you know, I had one
guy call me up one time and hewas upset with his accountant.
I said, Well, do you like them?
He goes, Yeah, they're reallygood.
Then why don't you tell themthis?
Don't switch.
(28:13):
Tell them.
If you like what they're doing,talk to them.
Don't be switching becauseunless, you know, I if if you
come to me, I might not knowsomething that's not making you
happy.
So talk to them.
Call them up and talk to them.
They they we're here to serveyou.
So um, I I talk like that allthe time.
(28:33):
And because of that, people wantto work with people like like
me.
Don't you want to go to a placethat welcomes you in and makes
you feel good?
And oh, how are you doing?
Instead of, I can't tell you thenumber of clients we've picked
up because we answer the phonewith a smile on our face.
Well, my last accountant, theyalways were grumpy, or I always
(28:57):
had to go to they never returnedmy call, or their voicemail was
always filled.
So we made it a practice in ourfirm.
Of course, we have voicemail onour cell phones and everything
like that.
Every single client has my cellphone number.
Of course, I get the pushback.
Well, they're gonna be callingme all the time.
They don't.
They respect your time when yourespect them.
(29:17):
It's a give and a take.
Now, I tell them all the time, Isaid, you know, if it's an
accounting emergency and thatwould qualify the IRS is at your
door with guns, you know, 911me.
But other than that, I've neverhad that happen.
You know, you know, I want tomake sure you get your questions
answered.
I will get back to you.
Maybe not in that instant, but Iget back to you.
(29:39):
So I I keep my phone on silentduring the day because I get
distracted easily.
So I focus, put my head down,and then at the end of the day,
I'll pick it up and go.
Well, now I kind of have to keepit around for the dumb code you
got to get for everything youslugged into.
SPEAKER_02 (29:53):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (29:53):
But um, I put everything on Google
Authenticator, so I just have tolook up the number.
But um, when I get a text orsomething, I will return the
text to call at the end of theday.
A lot of times when I get atext, I pick up the phone and
call them.
I got your text.
What do you want to talk about?
SPEAKER_02 (30:08):
You know, now you kind of alluded into what what
that next question was gonna be,but I was I was gonna ask,
you're not you have nothing toworry about on the marketing
front, you're a very relationalperson.
What's been your secret tosuccess?
I think you kind of alluded tosome of it already, but for
those, for those who arestarting out, for those who are
running a firm that aren'thaving as much fun as you,
(30:28):
because I get the vibe, you justhave a ton of fun at work, your
clients have a ton of fun withyou.
What's what's the secret tosuccess for you?
SPEAKER_01 (30:36):
I think that realize that you are like that you what
you do as an accounting and abookkeeper matters.
That you have value in theservices that you do.
So you have to really feel goodabout who you are and the
service you provide and go out.
And find those people that willvalue you.
(30:58):
Many times I think, especiallynewbies, they'll take anybody
that walks through the door.
So, you know, be discerning,kind of like when I was dating.
I think it's the same thing.
I met a lot of guys, but none ofthem were mine.
SPEAKER_02 (31:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (31:13):
You know, they were decent people, but I thought,
you know, just not clicking.
And then I met Hal said, thatguy I like.
So I did the same thing withclients.
If I if they were aligned withmy values, and you can tell when
you meet them for the firsttime, you know, do they talk
about, well, I really don't wantto pay my employees much because
I make more money?
(31:33):
That's not aligned with myvalues.
You know, I don't want I'mgoing, I I had one guy come in
one time.
It was a pizza place, and I'msitting there talking to him,
and I go, Well, I need your POSsystem, point of sale.
Oh, I I don't use that.
Well, somebody's ringing thatstuff up there.
Yeah, but I only record thesales that are on credit cards,
so I don't have to pay as muchsales tax.
(31:56):
Okay, well, what about yourpayroll?
I don't pay I the cash that Iget for the sale of the pizza is
how I pay my people.
So no one's on payroll?
And you only pay, then we can't.
That's not a client I want.
SPEAKER_02 (32:11):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (32:12):
I don't care how much they paid me.
The guy wants to cheat, lie, andsteal.
Not my customer.
You know, some I talk about, Isaid, look, if you're coming to
me because you don't want to payany income tax, wrong girl.
I said, if you don't want to payany income tax, yeah, if you
don't want to pay income tax,stop working.
I said, or the other, thesecondary route we'll take is on
(32:33):
December 30th, we will see whatyour profit is.
And I will create an invoicefrom me to you for that exact
amount of money.
You pay that invoice, and thenyou have no income tax income,
so you'll pay no tax.
How does that how does that workfor you?
Oh, well, then I won't have anymoney.
Yeah, but I'll pay the tax.
(32:53):
So they seem to get it.
So I said, if you're here to notpay income tax, quit working
because I want people whorealize that the more income tax
they pay, the more money thatthey're making, the wealth that
they're building, I'm afterwealth building, not tax, tax,
no tax.
Now, we will get with you inNovember, December, whatever,
and do tax planning to make surewe can minimize the taxes that
(33:17):
you pay.
But if you're going to try tocheat tax by not recording sales
or not paying your people whatthey want, you know, you know,
not being, you know, not being areally great business person,
then you're not we we won't workwell together.
And they go, oh, and sometimesthey switch.
SPEAKER_02 (33:35):
You know, they go, I love that piece about hey, yeah,
just write me an invoice for thetake me up on that, but I'm w
one day, you know, one day.
You gotta keep asking.
Um, so last question for you.
Um, I'm really curious, and Ithink this is gonna be an
amazing answer.
What is the best piece of adviceyou've ever received?
SPEAKER_01 (33:58):
Oh god, I got so many good pieces of advice.
I don't know to tell you thetruth.
SPEAKER_02 (34:09):
What comes to the top of your head when you hear
that?
SPEAKER_01 (34:14):
Well, this has nothing to do with accounting,
but the best piece of advice Iever got was from my husband who
worked for the Salvation Army.
And, you know, sometimes whenyou want to serve people, you
know, um, you serve you wind upserving bad people.
Meaning he goes, you know, inthe Salvation Army, you know,
they wanted to serve people whatthat were had problems.
(34:36):
And they realized if they hadten people, you know, maybe one
was a crook.
They knew how to work thesystem.
But to serve the nine, they hadto also serve the one.
And um, I thought that was thebest piece, that's the best
thing I've ever heard.
Like, you know, you're gonnasometimes serve people that
don't see your value, like,especially like if you give
(34:57):
charity, I think of like um, youknow, the 9-11, the towers.
We all now have to go throughTSA because there were a couple
of bad guys.
You know, don't I don't want tolive my life on the bad guys.
Yeah, I don't want to worryabout the people that might take
advantage of me.
Well, I don't want to give themmy cell phone number because
that guy might take advantage.
(35:17):
I don't want to do this becauseeverybody else.
I think in a positive mode, ifthe stuff doesn't align or
doesn't work for me, I'm opento, you know, this just isn't
working for me, you know.
Um, and we part ways.
I mean, they're big boys and biggirls.
Yeah, um, I don't have to servepeople that don't serve me and
(35:38):
make me grow up and you know,wake up and want to come into
work and be happy.
And um, other things I think isdon't be afraid.
This is only money, no one died.
Take a chance, take a risk,spend the money.
You know, I see so many timesaccountants especially worry
about the nickels and the dimesand not worrying about the
(35:59):
bigger picture.
Think about it.
I mean, you know, QuickBooksOnline now, if you get a plus
version of what$115 a month, noone likes price increases.
No one.
But it's basically four dollarsa day for the brains of your
business.
You spend more than that atStarbucks every day.
Yeah, so you could go back topaper and pencil.
(36:19):
If it was that much of an issue,you could use paper and pencil.
So invest in the technology thatwill serve you to free up your
time.
I'm willing to spend the moneyto save me time.
Anything that saves you timecosts you money.
That's why people drive carsbecause they don't want to walk.
(36:42):
It does the same function, itgets you there, but it takes a
lot longer.
SPEAKER_02 (36:47):
I love that analogy.
SPEAKER_01 (36:48):
So I'm willing to spend the money to get for
convenience and speed.
And if it doesn't work, youknow, one thing nice about apps
use another one.
You're not married to it.
It's not like, you know, it's uhthe only job you can never quit
is being a mom or a dad.
You know, once I had the kids,oh I don't like these kids.
(37:09):
Can I give them back?
Uh-uh.
I'm stuck.
SPEAKER_02 (37:11):
No return policy.
SPEAKER_01 (37:13):
There's no return policy on them.
But everything else, I mean, youcan you can say, you know what,
this doesn't work for me.
I fact when I was the CPAstarting out, I said this this
career does not work for me.
I need another one.
So I switched until I found how.
I said, now I'm running it how Iwant.
So don't be afraid.
That's a lot of advice I'msaying.
(37:33):
Don't be afraid.
Take a chance.
You won't, you can't lose.
And make sure you join acommunity, like bookkeeping
buds, ask a CPA, you know, um,reframe a society, you know,
round table, something whereyou're around other colleagues
that think like you.
So when you're struggling,meaning I really don't know how
to handle this, or what do youthink?
(37:54):
That they lift you up, that theysay, look, I we're you're not in
this alone.
Um, that was one of the bestthings I did was join a
community and um be around otherpeople that get as excited about
bank rects as I do.
That if I have a pricingproblem, how would you price
this?
You know, how would you handlethis situation?
You can get your the tried mindcomes in.
(38:16):
So join a community.
That was that's I think that'sanother great piece of advice.
Oh, I can go on all day, youknow.
SPEAKER_02 (38:23):
But uh I I appreciate it.
I appreciate it.
Community community is so big.
Um, and I I I love what you'resaying, don't be afraid, take
the risk, like just do thething, do the thing.
Um Debbie You won't die.
SPEAKER_01 (38:35):
You will not die.
No, what's the worst that canhappen?
A lot of times I play that game.
If I made this choice, what'sthe worst that can happen?
If I raised, if I doubled myprices, for example, and every
single client left me, whatwould I think?
Could I handle it?
I'd handle it.
(38:56):
I mean, but then I think then Iwould think I can start over.
I can start over and do it abetter way this time.
So I always think, okay, if Ican handle the worst, and
everybody's had somethingthey've gone through terrible in
their life, every single one ofus.
So you handled that, you canhandle the risk and the chances
(39:19):
you can take in your business.
So that do it.
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
I love it.
I love it.
I'm I'm I'm feeling verymotivated and inspired.
Thank you so much.
Um, Debbie, thank you so muchfor coming on.
I always have such a blastconnecting with you and
chatting, and I can't wait tosee you at the next event,
wherever that may be in thefuture.
Um, yeah, I really appreciatecoming on, and I'm sure the
listeners got a ton out of this.
(39:45):
Do you have any final any finalthoughts before we wrap up this
episode?
SPEAKER_01 (39:48):
No, but I I tell you what, all the people in this
profession are just wonderful.
It's the only place I found thatif you have an idea and I have
an idea, we each have one.
But if we share it, we both havetwo.
There's no competition, I find,between all of us in this space.
And I really love that.
(40:09):
Um, so make friends, you know,go make your colleagues.
We're all rooting for you to besuccessful.
So um reach out, don't beafraid.
We all love you.
SPEAKER_02 (40:20):
What's the best way for people to get in touch with
you, Debbie, to continue theconversation?
SPEAKER_01 (40:23):
On LinkedIn, I'm on LinkedIn.
Find me on LinkedIn, I'm gettingmuch better at LinkedIn.
And uh, you know, of course, mybookkeepers on fire YouTube
channel and my email, DeborahD-E-B-R-A at B S
Faccounting.com.
SPEAKER_02 (40:37):
Perfect.
SPEAKER_01 (40:38):
The best way is LinkedIn.
SPEAKER_02 (40:39):
Perfect.
We'll put those links in theshow notes so people can get in
touch.
Debbie again, thank you so muchfor coming on.
Really appreciate it.
My my pleasure.
Thanks for tuning in to thisepisode of CFO Chronicles, the
secrets behind success.
I hope you found value intoday's conversation.
As we wrap up, I'd love for youto do two things.
First, make sure to subscribe tothis podcast so you don't miss
any future episodes.
(41:01):
If you enjoyed today'sdiscussion, please rate and
review the show.
It helps others discover theinsights we share here.
Second, if you're ready to takeyour business to the next level
and attract the high-end clientsyou deserve, head over to
accountingleadsnow.com or clickthe link in the show notes to
book your strategy call.
It's time to position yourselfas the advisor your clients
need.
(41:21):
And don't forget, you canconnect with me on LinkedIn to
stay up to date on what'shappening in the world of
accounting and financial growth.
We've got exciting topics comingup, so stay tuned for the next
episode of CFO Chronicles.
Until then, keep pushingforward.
Your growth is just onestrategic move away.
SPEAKER_00 (41:38):
Thanks for listening to CFO Chronicles, the secrets
behind success.
We hope today's episode providedvaluable strategies to help you
attract more high-payingclients.
Be sure to subscribe, follow,and share with fellow
professionals.
Connect with us on LinkedIn andleave a review or comment to
join the conversation.
(41:59):
Your feedback helps us bring youthe best insights in finance and
marketing.
Until next time, keep strivingfor success and unlocking your
business's potential.
Welcome to CFO Chronicles, The Secrets Behind
Success, the must-listen showfor fractional CFOs, accounting
firm owners, and finance leaderslooking to land high-value
clients and scale through nextlevel marketing, branding, and
strategy.
I'm your host, James Donovan,and today's guest is Deborah
Kilzheimer, founder of Behindthe Scenes, a transformational
(00:20):
accounting firm.
Deborah's a true visionary who'snot afraid to challenge
conventional wisdom in theindustry.
Today she'll be sharing her ahamoment that led her to quit her
job and build her practiceexactly how she wanted it.
She'll also reveal her biggestmarketing challenge and how she
overcame it, as well as herstrong belief about the use of
timesheets in the industry.
(00:40):
Stay tuned to discover whyDeborah believes that believing
in your ideas is the key tosuccess in the accounting world.
Deborah, welcome to the show.
I'm so excited to have you onhere today.
SPEAKER_01 (00:51):
Me too.
Now, did you write thatyourself?
That was really good.
SPEAKER_02 (00:54):
Oh, thank you so much.
There may have been a little bitof uh some help there with the
team, but we can run with um,you know, me right.
SPEAKER_01 (01:02):
I might have to keep that for my own to use that.
SPEAKER_02 (01:04):
Hey, I'll send it over.
That will be your new intro forall the podcasts you're doing.
SPEAKER_01 (01:08):
Oh, it's really good.
SPEAKER_02 (01:10):
Thank you so much for coming on, though, Deborah.
I've had an absolute blast everytime we've got to connect in
person.
I know we met um back in thespring at GrowCon and we had a
chance to connect again recentlyin Arizona.
Um, it's always a pleasureseeing you.
So I'm again, I'm so excited tohave you on here today and just
chat and and have our listenersget to know you a little bit as
(01:30):
well.
Great.
Perfect.
So let's dive right into things.
Can you tell us about yourjourney to becoming a CPA and
how you eventually decided tostart your own practice?
SPEAKER_01 (01:42):
Well, how much time do you have?
Well, I was um I grew up in anaccounting family.
My dad was a um my dad was ateacher, and he always kept
track of all the money in ourfamily.
My mom was a stay-at-home mom.
They both had master's degreesfrom my dad, Temple University,
my mom, the University ofPennsylvania, and their big
(02:03):
thing was to raise a family.
I'm the oldest of four, and theydid it on a teacher's salary.
I went to Girl Scout camp,church camp, new school clothes
every year, violin lessons,beach summer vacation, camping.
We had a perfect beaver cleaverlife, and my dad did it on a
teacher's salary because Iremember him sitting with my mom
(02:25):
and my mom keeping all thereceipts, and they'd go into the
basement and they would do thebudget, you know, and they'd
say, Okay, we have money forthis and money for that, and
let's so I mean we didn't shopin the fanciest of stores, um,
but we did survive on that kindof a budget, and that to me was
what accounting was.
So when I went to college, Ididn't know what I wanted to be.
(02:46):
So, and my mom told me, by theway, that girls were not good at
math.
Well, you believe your mother,don't you?
So I thought, well, I can't bean accountant, I'm not good at
math, you know.
And in college, I had a roommatewho was taking accounting, and I
needed one more course.
She goes, Take accounting, it'snot hard, I'll help you.
(03:08):
Yeah, but I'm not good at math.
She goes, It's not math, it'slogic.
I'm like, Oh, all right.
So I took it.
I thought, this is fun.
It's like a puzzle.
I mean, if you're solving apuzzle.
So I really liked it.
Well, I go back for the summerand I thought, I just can't, I
still don't know what I want tobe.
(03:29):
So I bought a car, I packed thecar up, and I said, I'm moving
to Florida.
My mom says, Where are yougoing?
I was in Pennsylvania.
I'm moving to Florida.
Who do you know in Florida?
Nobody.
I mean, I'm 21.
You think you can conquer theworld?
So I moved, drove to Florida,got off in Orlando, and thought,
(03:49):
what am I gonna do?
What am I gonna be?
Blah, blah.
So I'm driving around and I sawthe University of Central
Florida.
Back then it was called FloridaTechnological University, but
it's changed to UCF.
I walked in, I said, What's themajor that will get me a job?
And they said, Accounting isgood.
I'm thinking, well, I took thataccounting class, okay, sign me
up.
So I that's how I started myaccounting journey.
(04:12):
Got the degree, got a job in aCPA firm, passed my exam, and
thought, I absolutely hate thisjob.
I thought it was dumb.
It was nothing like I thoughtaccounting was, like my dad
taught me it was, which wasforward thinking.
What do people want?
What's the vision you have foryour life that accounting and
(04:33):
the money can help meet?
Because we were worrying aboutreceipts and six-minute
intervals and how much time didit take.
And I thought, this isbackwards.
I remember having my um annualreview with the partner, and he
says, Debbie, we're reallydisappointed in you.
Why?
I'm I'm bringing in newbusiness, I'm filling out my
(04:55):
timesheets, I'm getting, youknow, I'm I'm really whipping
out these tax returns.
I'm doing a good job.
Why are you disappointed?
He goes, Well, your billing rateis not as high as Tony's.
He was a kid in the office.
Yeah, Tony and I graduated thesame year, passed the exam at
the same time.
We were equal on paper, but Tonytook a long time.
And he goes, and Tony staysevery night till eight o'clock,
(05:17):
and you leave at five.
I said, Yeah, but my work'sdone.
Why do I need to stay till eightjust to make you think that I'm
more committed than he is?
I do more tax returns, blah,blah, blah.
And he goes, but that's just howit's done in accounting.
I said, Well, not for me.
I hate this.
I went home and told my newhusband, my first husband, I got
two.
I traded him in for how.
(05:39):
And uh I said, I really hatethis job.
It's nothing like I thought itwould be.
I mean, six-minute intervalsthat they track, you know,
that's how they price thecustomer.
Why don't we just charge a flatrate?
If I get it done in 10 minutes,why does it, why is that worth
less than a tax return thattakes me two hours?
SPEAKER_02 (05:56):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (05:56):
You know, it just made no sense to me.
I said, you know, what are weafter?
We're after transformingcustomers into what accounting
can do for them in their life.
And I was 25 years old when Ihad this conversation.
And uh my husband said, So whatare you gonna do?
I said, I'm quitting.
I quit.
I I I walked in my Bronzov said,You know what?
(06:19):
I'm not doing this anymore.
SPEAKER_02 (06:20):
I love it.
SPEAKER_01 (06:20):
You just passed your exam.
Yeah, but I cannot live likethis any.
I don't like it.
I'm not having any fun.
I always wanted to have a jobwhere I liked getting up and
having fun, where I wanted to goto work.
You know, I um so I quit and Iwent into sales for 10 years,
which I sold Mary Kay Cosmeticsof all things, had the pink
(06:41):
cadillac, had the the mink coat,the bumblebee, everything.
And um I did I did that, verysuccessful at it, and then
personal computers started tocome out, and I thought, well,
these Mary Kay directors neednewsletters.
So I started a newslettercompany, started to create
newsletters for Mary Kdirectors, and then um they
(07:02):
realized that they could do themon their own.
So I'm like, okay, well, youknow, I'm be I was becoming the
buggy whip salesman.
So then I got a job teachingcomputers to attorneys in a big
in big in a big firm that wasall over the country.
I loved that job.
And 9-11 hits, and all of asudden we're not traveling
(07:23):
anymore.
So they called me in my officeand said, in their office and
said, We're doing away with yourdepartment.
What?
I thought I'd have this job forthe rest of my life.
And they said, Well, we're nottraveling, so we don't need you.
So Friday morning I had a job,Friday afternoon, I did not.
Well, in the interim, my firsthusband and I got a divorce,
(07:45):
unfortunately.
Life happens, and then I decidedI wanted a boyfriend.
So I put an ad on the internetand I said, I want a boyfriend.
And I had a date like everynight for a year.
SPEAKER_02 (07:57):
Where did you go?
SPEAKER_01 (07:59):
I I tell you what, I said, you know what?
They all I'm gonna meeteverybody, you never know.
SPEAKER_02 (08:03):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (08:03):
So um I said, you know what?
You sit through movies that fortwo hours that are stinko.
I could have dinner withsomebody, and maybe I'll meet
somebody nice.
So I just was looking forsomebody to have dinner with, go
to the movies.
I wasn't looking to get married.
I was just, I just wantedsomebody to have fun with.
And um, Hal called Hal was oneof the people that answered.
Hal and Pardon?
(08:25):
Hal in the towel.
Yep.
And uh so when I when he calledme, I he goes, he was 10 years
older than me.
He lived 50 miles away from me.
He kept telling me all this Iown a boat, I own a car, I had a
motorcycle, I go on vacation allthe time.
I'm thinking, who cares?
Are you nice?
Are you decent?
Are you kind?
That's what I was looking for.
And then he's so then I said,What do you do?
(08:46):
Oh, I have my own tax andaccounting firm.
I thought he's probably as dullas dishwater.
And then I said, What's yourname?
He goes, Oh, my name is HalHickey.
I'm like, I I didn't laugh onthe phone, but inside I was
like, What?
So I thought, no what?
You know what?
I promised I'd meet him all.
(09:08):
So I met him for dinner thefollowing Wednesday.
He called me on a Saturday, Imet him for met him on
Wednesday.
I said, Well, this guy's nice.
I like him.
He can complete a sentence.
He he's just, I just enjoyed hiscompany.
And um that that next weekend, Iwent I came over to Port Orange
where he lived, and we went outon the boat.
We just had a nice timetogether.
(09:29):
I really I really liked it.
So a month later is when I lostmy job.
And I called him up, but I said,guess what?
I don't have a job anymore.
I don't know what I'm gonna do.
I've never not had a job.
He goes, Well, you're a CPA, whydon't you work with me till you
find something?
I said, All right, only if I canrun an accounting firm how I
(09:49):
think it should be run.
No hourly billing, flat ratepricing, use all the
technologies that are availableto streamline the process to
give a proactive result to thecustomers.
And he goes, Good, I like tax,you do you.
I'm like, okay.
So I got QuickBooks.
So that was, you know, that wasthe software back then, and
(10:09):
started to go build thepractice.
And it was like that was like 24years ago.
And uh he was smart enough tolet me run with it.
So I got very active in the theuh QuickBooks community.
I started to attend conferences,I started to do all of that
stuff, and it's turned outreally well.
We have um you know, I built thefirm really big.
We had a lot of staff at onetime, and then I thought, I
(10:32):
don't like I don't like havingpeople work for me.
I don't like getting up andgetting dressed to go into an
office.
I like going from my bedroominto my other bedroom.
This is my office.
Yeah, and when COVID hit, we letgo of a lot of our staff.
Um kept one.
So we still have one, Mary,who's been with me like 18 years
now.
SPEAKER_02 (10:50):
Amazing.
SPEAKER_01 (10:51):
And uh, you know, have I still make a lot of money
and do what we want when wewant, and uh, because we I build
I do the practice how I think itshould be done.
SPEAKER_02 (11:02):
That's what it's all about, right?
You just you're building it theway you want to run the
business.
There's a million ways to run abusiness, and there's a so
that's so awesome.
SPEAKER_01 (11:11):
And my big thing is always making customers, you
know, like what I like, like yousaid in the beginning, transform
customers.
That's always been my mission.
Is how can what I do help themachieve their goals, transform
their lives?
And um, so I would I ask I askquestions.
So, so why did you start yourbusiness?
If I if you had a milliondollars, what would you do with
(11:34):
it?
So they start to tell you andthey start dreaming and all.
Oh, so I see that they havelittle kids at home and they
want to go to their soccergames, they want to pay, or
they're older and they want topay for their kids, their
grandchildren's collegeeducations.
You know, it's beyond, I wouldsay it's beyond the balance
sheet, meaning the that givesthem the everyday stuff they do.
(11:54):
But what the when the profitthey produce, what can they do
with that?
You know, I talk about whatabout your your employees, the
people that work for you?
How can we impact them so theycan have the life they want to
live?
So it goes beyond just that.
And they start to see, well,yeah, you're a little bit
different.
Well, that yeah, because I'mworrying about how accounting
(12:15):
can impact what you do.
And um, so I'm I always keepthat top of mind with them.
So we're always looking at that.
I said, you know, your booksspeak to you through the
transactions.
My job is to interpret it.
Just like some people readFrench romance novels, I read
balance sheets and incomestatements.
(12:36):
And now with AI, I can read themfaster.
You know, I can get moreinsights.
I I can do the AI can take careof the drudge part.
I'm not taking all the stuff andfiguring it all out myself.
Um, the AI can give me theinsights into what I'm seeing.
Um, and then I use all thetechnology tools.
Like one of my favorite tools isFanatical Software, which is a
(12:58):
reporting software that connectswith QuickBooks and exports it
into uh at the Excel level.
So I can customize the reportslike I want.
Restaurants, 445 reports,seven-day flash reports.
I can customize them in Exceland it sucks the data in.
Where before I was exporting it,manipulating it myself with all
the transactions.
(13:19):
But now with fanatical software,it's my favorite.
I use that.
Um, and then of course I useSessant, which imports the data
into the into the into theQuickBooks and uh Bill, which
pays the bills for the, youknow, so I use all the best of
breed softwares, same thing withpayroll, um, you know, make sure
(13:39):
that all gets in.
And then what do the numbersmean?
How can we impact what thecustomer wants to see a
difference?
And uh, and when you do that,you can charge premium prices.
I'm not I'm not competing withthe guy down the street that
says we do bankrupt.
I'm competing with the guy thatsays we change lives.
So we're strategic, morestrategic than we are
(14:01):
transactional.
And when you move with when youtalk about strategy and
strategic, you chart can chargemore.
And a lot of people say, Well,I'm not, I'm I'm just a
bookkeeper.
Doesn't matter, you're stilldoing the same thing.
You know, you're still lookingat what the impact is, the
technology, the freedom, allthis, the space that you can
(14:21):
open up so the business ownercan have the vision to make his
lawn care business the bestthere is.
SPEAKER_02 (14:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (14:28):
You know, for his swimming pool business the best
there is.
They all started the businessfor a reason.
Figure out what it is, how youcan make it bigger and better.
What they want, that's valuepricing.
A lot of people get thatincorrect, I think, because what
we value as accountants, I don'tthink is the same thing clients
value.
Give you an example.
SPEAKER_02 (14:49):
Well, just just real quick there on that, because
there's a lot of great points.
And one, you mentioned Bill, sowe'll just touch on that real
quick because they're uh proudsponsor of the show, and we
can't so shout out, shout out toBill.
Um, appreciate you guys, thankyou so much.
But Debbie, you were talkingabout um it sounds like a big
piece of what you do and a lotof your success, and I'm
(15:11):
guessing the client retentionand just why the firm works so
well is because you you careabout people's why and you're
not just reporting the numbers,like you're asking, well, what
would you do with the milliondollars?
What like what is important toyou?
Why did you start the business?
And you're you're asking thedeeper questions, not just
surfle surface level stuff.
Would you say that has helpedyou?
(15:33):
I I guess let me re rephrasethat.
How would you say that hashelped you by asking those
questions?
I think that's one of likethat's the biggest hack when it
comes to sales is just askingquestions and being a human who
cares.
SPEAKER_01 (16:40):
Well, I think I do think it gives people purpose.
I think people need purpose.
Why do I get up every morningand do what I do?
So, you know, I do it because myfor my family, you know, I I'm
you know, what whatever.
So I figure out what theirpurpose is and keep that top of
mind.
And then you do things to soyou're I don't want to say in
(17:02):
your in their face, but you doreally hospitable things.
Like I read that book by WillGardera on unreasonable
hospitality.
Why aren't we doing that asaccountants?
It's so simple.
You know, like remember theirbirthdays.
Now, what we do here is we haveall their birthdays because we
have to have them on the taxreturn.
Hal and I actually will call upthe client and sing happy
(17:23):
birthday on the phone.
SPEAKER_02 (17:24):
I love it.
SPEAKER_01 (17:25):
I mean, they think we're nuts.
Now, it takes what, fiveminutes, but you can hear them
chuckling on the other end andthey go, Thank you for
remembering.
I mean, you know, I mean, and orsend them a birthday card.
We said a lot of thank younotes.
I like to, I like to handwritethe who does that anymore.
Takes seconds, you know.
So things like that, you know,if there's things are coming up,
(17:45):
like I know with um therestaurants that we have with
the tip, the over the tipcredit, you know, I called up
all the owners and explained tothem as best I could what's
going on with that.
Um, you know, that takes extratime, but to me, that shows that
we care about what they want,what they're on on target of
what they want.
Um, you know, we just talk tothem.
(18:05):
They're people.
I mean, when people say this isbusiness to business, no, it's
people to people.
SPEAKER_02 (18:11):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (18:11):
People are behind every single business.
So you find out what makes themtick, gives them purpose.
And I think I think there was astudy.
What makes people live longer?
It's that they have a socialnetwork and a purpose in life.
It's not health or diet.
So I thought, yahoo, you mean Idon't have to lose weight to
live a long time?
Yay, I'm all for that.
(18:32):
You know, so uh, you know, givepeople purpose.
So it, you know, it matters.
And if you see them struggling,you know, call stuff out.
You know, I was talking aboutthe value.
You know, we think asaccountants, we need to produce
have a meeting with them everymonth to go over the balance
sheet and the income statement.
That's not a bad thing, but it'snot what many clients want, what
(18:52):
they want.
What do you see that we can helpmake a difference in what's
going on?
So I'm looking at ratios,margins, everything like that.
So if I know they're on target,I'll just come, we're on target
this month, keep it going.
Um, any new things coming up?
Nope, everything's good.
Great.
I don't need to meet with them.
It's kind of like, you know,when you go to the doctor and he
gives you a takes the blood workand he says, Okay, let's go over
(19:16):
the blood work, Debbie.
And he shows me all thesenumbers.
I go, uh-uh-uh-uh.
I don't need to know that.
Is there anything you must know?
My goal is to live to 110.
What on there is telling youthat that's not gonna happen?
He goes, No, everything's good.
I go, and can I can I improveanything?
Nope, improve it all.
I mean, you're doing great.
(19:37):
Perfect.
If you see anything whacked,call me up, we'll take care of
that.
I use that philosophy when I'mtalking to clients.
Now, if they want to go overevery line on the lab report,
the income statement,absolutely, I'll do it.
I have one guy, he goes overevery line.
Of course, he pays the mostmoney to me, by the way, you
know, but um I'm fine to do thatbecause that's what makes that's
(19:57):
what he values.
It's not what I value, it's whatthey value.
You gotta find that out byasking good questions.
SPEAKER_02 (20:03):
Something that's really standing out to me, and
I'm curious to get your take onthis.
But in a world where everyone'strying to automate everything,
they're trying to use AI foreverything and just like remove
themselves from the business.
It sounds like you're reallytaking that extra personal touch
to work with your clients.
And like you said, yeah, sure,writing a handwritten letter,
(20:25):
it's going to take more timethan an automated email.
But I'm I can almost guaranteethe impact your clients get from
that handwritten letter or youpicking up the phone and singing
happy birthday.
unknown (20:35):
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (20:36):
They remember that stuff, they don't remember the
email that went out as well.
SPEAKER_01 (20:38):
I don't remember the email, you know, right.
In fact, it's funny, many timesI'll just do a handwritten thank
you note.
I will tell you between me andyou, I I write down in chat GPT
and the rest of the listeners.
Yeah, that I'm writing a thankyou note to this for this
client.
Can you come up with a reallygreat way to say it?
So ChatGBT will actually writethe text.
SPEAKER_02 (20:59):
Yeah, you know, it's all your it's still your prompt.
It's still my idea.
SPEAKER_01 (21:03):
I just have to handwrite it on, and I handwrite
it with my black felt tipmarker, yeah, and then handwrite
the address on the thing.
It always smears because youknow it never dries fast enough.
I don't care.
Put a stamp on it, mail it off.
Looks more authentic.
The number of times people willactually take a picture of the
note and send it.
Thank you for sending me this.
And I'm thinking, what an impactit has.
(21:26):
You know, I mean it takes solittle time.
Um, so anytime somebody doessomething special, I try to find
out their address and might sendthem a quick note.
Thanks so much.
It was great meeting you at aconference.
Love talking with you.
Like I tell you, every podcastguest I have, I send a thank you
note to.
Because we have my on my ownpodcast with Donna, uh Debbie
(21:46):
and Donna, Bookkeepers on Fire.
SPEAKER_02 (21:48):
Well, yeah, let's let's talk about that real quick
because you got the shirt on.
For those, uh for those who areonly listening on video here, go
check it out on YouTube.
But uh, yeah, let's let's hearabout this shirt because it
looks awesome.
So I'd love to hear uh quickly.
Tell us the story behind that.
SPEAKER_01 (22:02):
Well, it's funny.
My friend Donna Reed, I metDonna Reed doing kind of what
I'm doing now.
My the the host said, um, Brad,he said, you have to meet Donna
Reed.
We do an after show where we'renot filming, but everybody comes
on.
You have to meet this girl,Donna Reed.
I said, okay.
So she comes on and we're justlike, you know, like you know,
two mothers from a two sistersfrom a different mother,
(22:24):
whatever that phrase is.
So Brad and Andrew left andwe're talking.
And uh, so but I just we justconnected and she's in
California.
So I'm at QuickBooks Connect twoyears ago and I'm walking in the
in the vendor hall and I see herstanding there.
Now, Donna is very quiet, she'san introvert, she's but she's
(22:47):
brilliant.
And I knew that because I'vetalked to her and I see her
stuff, and I thought, this thisgirl's smart.
I like smart people.
I have a thing for smart people.
So I see her standing there andI walked up to her and I said,
Donna Reed.
I'm Debbie Kilzheimer, I can'tbelieve I finally met her in 3D.
And uh she goes, Oh, great, youknow, blah, blah, blah.
(23:08):
I said, Do you ever think aboutdoing something together?
And she went, I'd love to.
I said, Well, let's let's let'sfigure out something to do.
Well, six months later, here'smy number.
Six months later, she texts me.
Were you serious about doingsomething together?
Because I'm a littleintimidated.
Am I that scary?
(23:30):
And uh she goes, Yes, but you'rewell known, blah, blah, blah.
I said, Look, I'm just me.
So we decided about two yearsago to start a YouTube uh
podcast called Bookkeepers onFire.
And the goal was just to answerbookkeeping questions.
One of my hobbies is I like toknit.
And my favorite YouTube knittingthing is called um is is um they
(23:52):
answer knitting questions.
unknown (23:54):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (23:54):
Yeah.
So I thought, why don't weanswer bookkeeping questions?
So we get asked people, pleasesend us your questions.
So people would ask, how do youdo this?
How do you do that?
And Donna would answer, and thenI would give my take.
And it so it went really well.
So then Donna says, Why don't wedo a YouTube channel?
I said, Okay, we'll just talk,the two of us.
And I said, Why don't we dobookkeepers on fire?
(24:15):
Why don't we interview thepeople in our industry?
Because we need to build it upto see, we make a difference.
You know, we impact people'slives.
So let's it we want to impacttheir life.
So we have we go on once a weekum live.
We were on Tuesdays at threeo'clock.
And um yesterday we had RandyCrabtree on from uh Bridging the
(24:37):
Gap.
He was our guest yesterday.
We've had Ron Baker on, HectorGarcia, Carlos Garcia, you know,
Jeannie Whitehouse is coming on,and plus all of my my friends in
the industry, you know, and wejust chat for half an hour and
everybody says, uh, I don'tthink I could talk for half an
hour.
I said, it's three peopletalking, it's three friends
talking.
You'll be amazed.
And before you know it, the 30minutes is up.
(24:58):
And it's great.
So um, so we started doing that.
I forget we have about, we don'thave any sponsors or anything,
so it's organically grown.
And um, Donna does all the work.
I have to tell you, Donna doesall the work, she's brilliant
with it.
And I'm I always think I'm theidea person.
What do we do this?
What do you think of that?
What do you think of this?
(25:19):
And uh she goes, Oh, I like thatidea, and then she'll institute
it.
So she works very hard at it.
I show up.
So so uh it's it's a lot of fun.
And Don and I meet, you know,every week to go over our plans,
just chit-chat, where do youwant to go with it, things like
that?
And we just have a ball doingit.
We have a great time and uhbookkeepers on fire.
(25:41):
Let's go.
SPEAKER_02 (25:42):
Bookkeepers on fire, check it out wherever you get
your podcasts, I'm guessing.
SPEAKER_01 (25:46):
Podcast and YouTube, yep.
SPEAKER_02 (25:47):
Perfect.
Um so Debbie, I'm I'm reallycurious to know, just kind of
tying this back into amarketing-related podcast so
it's super actionable for therest of the listeners.
I got two questions for you.
Um, one on the front end, whatpart of your marketing engine
keeps you up at night?
SPEAKER_01 (26:07):
I mean, what do I worry about?
SPEAKER_02 (26:09):
Yeah, what from the marketing side of things with
your business, is there anythingthat comes to mind that that
it's that you're worrying about,or you got it, you gotta do it.
Why worry?
SPEAKER_01 (26:17):
Why worry?
Make your wrinkles.
Okay, perfect.
69 years old.
I don't need any more wrinkles.
Okay, I never worried aboutmarketing, if that's your
question.
Okay, I never had a website tillthree years ago.
SPEAKER_02 (26:30):
Amazing.
SPEAKER_01 (26:31):
Now, what I do is I always am talking to customers.
Who do you know that might needmy help?
When I'm out and about, youknow, I ask people all the time,
you know, um, I I like to talkto people.
You have to step out of yourcomfort zone when you're a
business owner, whether you'rean introvert or an extrovert.
People think you need to be boldand loud and a salesperson.
(26:53):
No, you just have to like peopleand be interested in them in
your own way, whether it be aquiet way or a loud way like me.
Because everybody likes talkingabout themselves.
So find the question.
So, so who are you?
Like I introduced myself.
My name is Debbie Kilsheimer.
Who what's your name?
And they'll tell you, Oh, myname's Oh, great.
(27:14):
You know, so what's good in yourlife?
I never like to say, Well, howare you?
Oh, who cares?
You know, sometimes they'll tellyou and go, I'm never asking
that question again.
So um, I go, Well, what's goodin your life?
You know, how do you know thiswherever we are or what whatever
it is?
And they'll start, oh, andthey'll start to talk to you.
And then they'll usually say,Well, what do you do?
or something like that.
Say, Oh, I'm an accountant.
(27:34):
I do have a great accountant.
I always say great accountantbecause everybody has an
accountant.
Yeah, but they have a great one.
And they go, Well, I have anaccountant.
I said, Yeah, but do you reallylike them?
Are they great?
And they go, Well, no.
Well, I'm a great one.
SPEAKER_02 (27:51):
I love that.
SPEAKER_01 (27:52):
And they I they go, Well, I'm thinking about
switching.
I said, I don't want to takebusiness away from anybody.
I think there's enough businessfor all of us.
So I'm never stealing clients.
So they go, Well, my accountantdoesn't do, you know, I had one
guy call me up one time and hewas upset with his accountant.
I said, Well, do you like them?
He goes, Yeah, they're reallygood.
Then why don't you tell themthis?
Don't switch.
(28:13):
Tell them.
If you like what they're doing,talk to them.
Don't be switching becauseunless, you know, I if if you
come to me, I might not knowsomething that's not making you
happy.
So talk to them.
Call them up and talk to them.
They they we're here to serveyou.
So um, I I talk like that allthe time.
(28:33):
And because of that, people wantto work with people like like
me.
Don't you want to go to a placethat welcomes you in and makes
you feel good?
And oh, how are you doing?
Instead of, I can't tell you thenumber of clients we've picked
up because we answer the phonewith a smile on our face.
Well, my last accountant, theyalways were grumpy, or I always
(28:57):
had to go to they never returnedmy call, or their voicemail was
always filled.
So we made it a practice in ourfirm.
Of course, we have voicemail onour cell phones and everything
like that.
Every single client has my cellphone number.
Of course, I get the pushback.
Well, they're gonna be callingme all the time.
They don't.
They respect your time when yourespect them.
(29:17):
It's a give and a take.
Now, I tell them all the time, Isaid, you know, if it's an
accounting emergency and thatwould qualify the IRS is at your
door with guns, you know, 911me.
But other than that, I've neverhad that happen.
You know, you know, I want tomake sure you get your questions
answered.
I will get back to you.
Maybe not in that instant, but Iget back to you.
(29:39):
So I I keep my phone on silentduring the day because I get
distracted easily.
So I focus, put my head down,and then at the end of the day,
I'll pick it up and go.
Well, now I kind of have to keepit around for the dumb code you
got to get for everything youslugged into.
SPEAKER_02 (29:53):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (29:53):
But um, I put everything on Google
Authenticator, so I just have tolook up the number.
But um, when I get a text orsomething, I will return the
text to call at the end of theday.
A lot of times when I get atext, I pick up the phone and
call them.
I got your text.
What do you want to talk about?
SPEAKER_02 (30:08):
You know, now you kind of alluded into what what
that next question was gonna be,but I was I was gonna ask,
you're not you have nothing toworry about on the marketing
front, you're a very relationalperson.
What's been your secret tosuccess?
I think you kind of alluded tosome of it already, but for
those, for those who arestarting out, for those who are
running a firm that aren'thaving as much fun as you,
(30:28):
because I get the vibe, you justhave a ton of fun at work, your
clients have a ton of fun withyou.
What's what's the secret tosuccess for you?
SPEAKER_01 (30:36):
I think that realize that you are like that you what
you do as an accounting and abookkeeper matters.
That you have value in theservices that you do.
So you have to really feel goodabout who you are and the
service you provide and go out.
And find those people that willvalue you.
(30:58):
Many times I think, especiallynewbies, they'll take anybody
that walks through the door.
So, you know, be discerning,kind of like when I was dating.
I think it's the same thing.
I met a lot of guys, but none ofthem were mine.
SPEAKER_02 (31:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (31:13):
You know, they were decent people, but I thought,
you know, just not clicking.
And then I met Hal said, thatguy I like.
So I did the same thing withclients.
If I if they were aligned withmy values, and you can tell when
you meet them for the firsttime, you know, do they talk
about, well, I really don't wantto pay my employees much because
I make more money?
(31:33):
That's not aligned with myvalues.
You know, I don't want I'mgoing, I I had one guy come in
one time.
It was a pizza place, and I'msitting there talking to him,
and I go, Well, I need your POSsystem, point of sale.
Oh, I I don't use that.
Well, somebody's ringing thatstuff up there.
Yeah, but I only record thesales that are on credit cards,
so I don't have to pay as muchsales tax.
(31:56):
Okay, well, what about yourpayroll?
I don't pay I the cash that Iget for the sale of the pizza is
how I pay my people.
So no one's on payroll?
And you only pay, then we can't.
That's not a client I want.
SPEAKER_02 (32:11):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (32:12):
I don't care how much they paid me.
The guy wants to cheat, lie, andsteal.
Not my customer.
You know, some I talk about, Isaid, look, if you're coming to
me because you don't want to payany income tax, wrong girl.
I said, if you don't want to payany income tax, yeah, if you
don't want to pay income tax,stop working.
I said, or the other, thesecondary route we'll take is on
(32:33):
December 30th, we will see whatyour profit is.
And I will create an invoicefrom me to you for that exact
amount of money.
You pay that invoice, and thenyou have no income tax income,
so you'll pay no tax.
How does that how does that workfor you?
Oh, well, then I won't have anymoney.
Yeah, but I'll pay the tax.
(32:53):
So they seem to get it.
So I said, if you're here to notpay income tax, quit working
because I want people whorealize that the more income tax
they pay, the more money thatthey're making, the wealth that
they're building, I'm afterwealth building, not tax, tax,
no tax.
Now, we will get with you inNovember, December, whatever,
and do tax planning to make surewe can minimize the taxes that
(33:17):
you pay.
But if you're going to try tocheat tax by not recording sales
or not paying your people whatthey want, you know, you know,
not being, you know, not being areally great business person,
then you're not we we won't workwell together.
And they go, oh, and sometimesthey switch.
SPEAKER_02 (33:35):
You know, they go, I love that piece about hey, yeah,
just write me an invoice for thetake me up on that, but I'm w
one day, you know, one day.
You gotta keep asking.
Um, so last question for you.
Um, I'm really curious, and Ithink this is gonna be an
amazing answer.
What is the best piece of adviceyou've ever received?
SPEAKER_01 (33:58):
Oh god, I got so many good pieces of advice.
I don't know to tell you thetruth.
SPEAKER_02 (34:09):
What comes to the top of your head when you hear
that?
SPEAKER_01 (34:14):
Well, this has nothing to do with accounting,
but the best piece of advice Iever got was from my husband who
worked for the Salvation Army.
And, you know, sometimes whenyou want to serve people, you
know, um, you serve you wind upserving bad people.
Meaning he goes, you know, inthe Salvation Army, you know,
they wanted to serve people whatthat were had problems.
(34:36):
And they realized if they hadten people, you know, maybe one
was a crook.
They knew how to work thesystem.
But to serve the nine, they hadto also serve the one.
And um, I thought that was thebest piece, that's the best
thing I've ever heard.
Like, you know, you're gonnasometimes serve people that
don't see your value, like,especially like if you give
(34:57):
charity, I think of like um, youknow, the 9-11, the towers.
We all now have to go throughTSA because there were a couple
of bad guys.
You know, don't I don't want tolive my life on the bad guys.
Yeah, I don't want to worryabout the people that might take
advantage of me.
Well, I don't want to give themmy cell phone number because
that guy might take advantage.
(35:17):
I don't want to do this becauseeverybody else.
I think in a positive mode, ifthe stuff doesn't align or
doesn't work for me, I'm opento, you know, this just isn't
working for me, you know.
Um, and we part ways.
I mean, they're big boys and biggirls.
Yeah, um, I don't have to servepeople that don't serve me and
(35:38):
make me grow up and you know,wake up and want to come into
work and be happy.
And um, other things I think isdon't be afraid.
This is only money, no one died.
Take a chance, take a risk,spend the money.
You know, I see so many timesaccountants especially worry
about the nickels and the dimesand not worrying about the
(35:59):
bigger picture.
Think about it.
I mean, you know, QuickBooksOnline now, if you get a plus
version of what$115 a month, noone likes price increases.
No one.
But it's basically four dollarsa day for the brains of your
business.
You spend more than that atStarbucks every day.
Yeah, so you could go back topaper and pencil.
(36:19):
If it was that much of an issue,you could use paper and pencil.
So invest in the technology thatwill serve you to free up your
time.
I'm willing to spend the moneyto save me time.
Anything that saves you timecosts you money.
That's why people drive carsbecause they don't want to walk.
(36:42):
It does the same function, itgets you there, but it takes a
lot longer.
SPEAKER_02 (36:47):
I love that analogy.
SPEAKER_01 (36:48):
So I'm willing to spend the money to get for
convenience and speed.
And if it doesn't work, youknow, one thing nice about apps
use another one.
You're not married to it.
It's not like, you know, it's uhthe only job you can never quit
is being a mom or a dad.
You know, once I had the kids,oh I don't like these kids.
(37:09):
Can I give them back?
Uh-uh.
I'm stuck.
SPEAKER_02 (37:11):
No return policy.
SPEAKER_01 (37:13):
There's no return policy on them.
But everything else, I mean, youcan you can say, you know what,
this doesn't work for me.
I fact when I was the CPAstarting out, I said this this
career does not work for me.
I need another one.
So I switched until I found how.
I said, now I'm running it how Iwant.
So don't be afraid.
That's a lot of advice I'msaying.
(37:33):
Don't be afraid.
Take a chance.
You won't, you can't lose.
And make sure you join acommunity, like bookkeeping
buds, ask a CPA, you know, um,reframe a society, you know,
round table, something whereyou're around other colleagues
that think like you.
So when you're struggling,meaning I really don't know how
to handle this, or what do youthink?
(37:54):
That they lift you up, that theysay, look, I we're you're not in
this alone.
Um, that was one of the bestthings I did was join a
community and um be around otherpeople that get as excited about
bank rects as I do.
That if I have a pricingproblem, how would you price
this?
You know, how would you handlethis situation?
You can get your the tried mindcomes in.
(38:16):
So join a community.
That was that's I think that'sanother great piece of advice.
Oh, I can go on all day, youknow.
SPEAKER_02 (38:23):
But uh I I appreciate it.
I appreciate it.
Community community is so big.
Um, and I I I love what you'resaying, don't be afraid, take
the risk, like just do thething, do the thing.
Um Debbie You won't die.
SPEAKER_01 (38:35):
You will not die.
No, what's the worst that canhappen?
A lot of times I play that game.
If I made this choice, what'sthe worst that can happen?
If I raised, if I doubled myprices, for example, and every
single client left me, whatwould I think?
Could I handle it?
I'd handle it.
(38:56):
I mean, but then I think then Iwould think I can start over.
I can start over and do it abetter way this time.
So I always think, okay, if Ican handle the worst, and
everybody's had somethingthey've gone through terrible in
their life, every single one ofus.
So you handled that, you canhandle the risk and the chances
(39:19):
you can take in your business.
So that do it.
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
I love it.
I love it.
I'm I'm I'm feeling verymotivated and inspired.
Thank you so much.
Um, Debbie, thank you so muchfor coming on.
I always have such a blastconnecting with you and
chatting, and I can't wait tosee you at the next event,
wherever that may be in thefuture.
Um, yeah, I really appreciatecoming on, and I'm sure the
listeners got a ton out of this.
(39:45):
Do you have any final any finalthoughts before we wrap up this
episode?
SPEAKER_01 (39:48):
No, but I I tell you what, all the people in this
profession are just wonderful.
It's the only place I found thatif you have an idea and I have
an idea, we each have one.
But if we share it, we both havetwo.
There's no competition, I find,between all of us in this space.
And I really love that.
(40:09):
Um, so make friends, you know,go make your colleagues.
We're all rooting for you to besuccessful.
So um reach out, don't beafraid.
We all love you.
SPEAKER_02 (40:20):
What's the best way for people to get in touch with
you, Debbie, to continue theconversation?
SPEAKER_01 (40:23):
On LinkedIn, I'm on LinkedIn.
Find me on LinkedIn, I'm gettingmuch better at LinkedIn.
And uh, you know, of course, mybookkeepers on fire YouTube
channel and my email, DeborahD-E-B-R-A at B S
Faccounting.com.
SPEAKER_02 (40:37):
Perfect.
SPEAKER_01 (40:38):
The best way is LinkedIn.
SPEAKER_02 (40:39):
Perfect.
We'll put those links in theshow notes so people can get in
touch.
Debbie again, thank you so muchfor coming on.
Really appreciate it.
My my pleasure.
Thanks for tuning in to thisepisode of CFO Chronicles, the
secrets behind success.
I hope you found value intoday's conversation.
As we wrap up, I'd love for youto do two things.
First, make sure to subscribe tothis podcast so you don't miss
any future episodes.
(41:01):
If you enjoyed today'sdiscussion, please rate and
review the show.
It helps others discover theinsights we share here.
Second, if you're ready to takeyour business to the next level
and attract the high-end clientsyou deserve, head over to
accountingleadsnow.com or clickthe link in the show notes to
book your strategy call.
It's time to position yourselfas the advisor your clients
need.
(41:21):
And don't forget, you canconnect with me on LinkedIn to
stay up to date on what'shappening in the world of
accounting and financial growth.
We've got exciting topics comingup, so stay tuned for the next
episode of CFO Chronicles.
Until then, keep pushingforward.
Your growth is just onestrategic move away.
SPEAKER_00 (41:38):
Thanks for listening to CFO Chronicles, the secrets
behind success.
We hope today's episode providedvaluable strategies to help you
attract more high-payingclients.
Be sure to subscribe, follow,and share with fellow
professionals.
Connect with us on LinkedIn andleave a review or comment to
join the conversation.
(41:59):
Your feedback helps us bring youthe best insights in finance and
marketing.
Until next time, keep strivingfor success and unlocking your
business's potential.
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