July 11, 2025 • 59 mins
In this powerful episode of the Champion Mindset Collective, I sit down with Ellie Stone — a biologist turned social entrepreneur and the heart behind MCNZ Group. Originally from Iran, Ellie shares how she went from surviving war and hardship to building a business in New Zealand that offers second chances to former prisoners, recovering addicts, and refugees.
We talk about the raw realities of reintegration, ethical recruitment in industries like construction, and the cracks in our current justice and refugee systems. Ellie and I also explore our shared mission of using business as a vehicle for hope, healing, and human dignity. Whether you’re passionate about social impact, run a business, or just believe in the power of redemption this one’s for you.
✨ Key Episode Highlights & Takeaways:
The power of second chances – Ellie shares real-life stories of people transforming their lives through meaningful employment.
Holistic support matters – It’s not just about jobs. Housing, healthcare, education, and community all play a part in long-term reintegration.
Criminal justice reform through education – Ellie proposes redirecting prison funding into education and rehabilitation.
Breaking stigma – Honest conversations on hiring people with records, working with corrections, and navigating business risk.
A heart-led business model – Ellie’s journey proves that purpose and profit can coexist.
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Connect with Ellie Stone here:
➡️ MCNZ Website: https://tinyurl.com/4v78hu7y
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➡️LinkedIn (Profile 2): https://tinyurl.com/bsnd2vdp
➡️Duncan Garner Interview: https://youtu.be/WDPlpooL7Pc
➡️Mrs. Celebrity Reel: https://tinyurl.com/yc2p45xs
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
What happens when a biologist from Iran becomes New Zealand's
unlikely hero? For those often forgotten, your
work proves that even in challenging times, compassion
and smart solutions can make a huge difference in people's
lives. I could you still remember some
stuff from my child to be for revolution, the freedom that we
had and what happened after that.
(00:23):
And I thought I can do that because I met these people and I
thought they're actually really nice feel that I was born again.
So I feel really good about it. Imagine that like you have two
kids, one of the child you say you're not good, you're not the
most of people that they get released from prison even though
they've been punished. Even government is saying punish
(00:44):
them and then they put them through rehabilitation.
If you don't try it, you don't know what would happen.
Never give up. Never give up.
If you can change one person's life, it's really.
Good. I believe that everyone deserves
a second chance. It's a holistic solution for
everything. We are always able to do things
but it's the right mindset what to use, what tools to use late
(01:09):
to start fresh. Never ever in studying, in jaw,
employment, life, family, everything.
Going to forgive that person arefree of my brain and my mind
about something taking its placeand it's bothering me all the
time. What happens when a biologist
from Iran becomes New Zealand's unlikely hero for those often
(01:30):
forgotten? Join us today as we dive into
Ali Stone's inspiring journey from science to social change as
she champions new beginnings andcommunity care.
Hello and welcome to the Champion Mindset Collective
podcast. I'm your host, Anthony Dyer.
I'm so grateful that you're herewatching or listening to this
episode. We'd love for you to share this
episode with your friends, family and workmate so that we
(01:52):
can get this out to the wider world.
I'm joined by Alice Stone, who in the heart behind the MC NZ
Group and a Trail browser and New Zealand social course ally.
You move to New Zealand from Iran 29 years ago, not knowing
your future would shift from biology to social
(02:14):
entrepreneurship. With EMC NZ Groups, you are
dedicated to help former prisoners, recovering addicts
and refugees, showing that everyone deserves a chance, a
dignity and a fresh start. Your work proves that even in
challenging times, compassion and smart solutions can make a
(02:34):
huge difference in people's lives.
Ellie, you've transformed in your 50s, finding bravery to
follow your dreams and create meaningful change that's touched
hundreds of lives. We would like to welcome you to
the Champion Mindset Collective podcast.
Thank you so much. Thank you.
It's a pleasure to have you here.
So before we kick into some questions, I'd really like to
(02:56):
understand your journey in life from childhood to now to tell us
a little about that. Sure, Yes.
Thank you so much for having me here.
I'm Ellie, born in Iran. So I grew up in Iran until the
age of 27. So for 1st 27 years of my life I
(03:18):
had very challenging life because I was born when we had
Kingdom in my country and I was born in a family that I had a
very comfortable life. When I was 10 years old,
revolution happened that was very challenging for our family.
And again, after one year or a couple of years, we had war
(03:39):
between Iran and Iraq for eight years.
So if you can imagine, at the age of 10, until I was like
1920, we always had revolution, war and everything that you can
name it. I could still remember some
stuff from my childhood before revolution, the freedom that we
had and what happened after that.
(04:00):
It was very challenging. And then going to university was
very challenging as well becausewe had a huge population of
people to apply for university. And it doesn't matter how good
you are, it's a competition. 5 million people are applying for
university and they just need toannuitize and people.
So it was very, very, very difficult.
(04:21):
And then doing a study, being inuniversity again because of
revolution and not having freedom.
It was an easy got married there, came to New Zealand and a
lot of freedom. But again, here life is full of
challenges. You move to a new country and
you start from scratch again. You feel like your child again
(04:43):
because it's a different country, different culture,
different language, everything was very different.
I can say that at least for 40 years in my life, life was
challenging. Then again, you get married, you
have kids. It's different.
I found myself after age of 50, I say.
And that's about my childhood and my life, basically.
(05:06):
Here it was full of challenges. Yeah, I can imagine coming from
a from around to New Zealand would have been a complete shock
to the system. Totally different.
The way that you drive your car,religion and language,
everything. Everything was different.
So Ellie, you described the feeling of rebirth after
(05:27):
starting McGinn Group. Tell us a little about MCZ
Group. What was the moment that made
you leave the corporate world for social impact?
Yes, I've done my masters degreein a UT and at the time that I
was doing it, it was about HR and the subject that I chose was
about the life of labourers in international labours in New
(05:53):
Zealand or any countries. Because when you live in any
country, you know about your rights and you look after your
rights. I remember at home we had many
refugees from Afghanistan that they were coming to Iran and
then our own Persian labourers, they wanted to have their own
rights but not Afghani people. They were working so hard to
(06:16):
make sure that we choose them towork 1st instead of people from
our country and also their rateswas always lower.
So when I came to New Zealand, Irealised it's something's
happening with people from Philippine or people from any
other countries. So they are expecting them to
not having a break and not looking after their rights or
(06:37):
anything and they don't get treated that well like others.
So that was the subject of my study.
So for last 7-8 years I'm doing labour hire and recruiting for
construction companies and I setup a company from scratch for
different people but I never used Filipino workers or any
(06:57):
other countries. I thought I pick a different
market and I help people from prison. 5 want MC people.
Any company that I set off for any other of my employers, it
was a successful business. But for them, they didn't have
the same goal that I had. My goal was helping these
(07:18):
people. They were thinking about them.
They're just a number. So how many people are working
today? Why that person's not at work?
I'll be losing money. It was really bad and the last
company that I was working we had scaling up and also we had
stand up every morning. The only question was ask was
(07:40):
how many people are at what is the profit this week?
Why profit this week is less than the other week?
So I thought that's not me. So I left.
I set up my own company and whatI do is just purely getting
people from corrections and I get people from MSD.
But then I thought people from corrections are Ms. clients as
(08:02):
well. So I just go for people that
they are involved with court system before they go to their
sentencing or meet up with judges.
And then I asked them if I can offer them a job and they can
stay at home. Home deep.
They work for us and they are inhome day, so we are reducing the
(08:24):
cost of taking care of them in prison.
We are sure that they are spending time with their family
and also they get busy and learning things and making
money. So less pressure and for
taxpayers like us. So I thought it's a very good
idea. So now it's just purely people
(08:45):
from corrections 50 runs, charities and court system.
So then because it's just not a number, it's what you could do
for them. It's feel that I was born again,
so I feel really good about it. It's good to be able to help
people who cause a lot of peopleend up in corrections or prison
(09:07):
because their lifestyle, you know, they're able to make ends
meet and what are you doing is you actually providing a
different environment and another way to earn an income
and better themselves. Right.
That's right. Yeah, that's absolutely right.
Imagine that. Like you have two kids, one of
the child, you say you're not good, you're not good.
(09:29):
That child is thinking, nobody believes me.
I'm not going to put chairs anymore, right?
But if you tell them that you'regood, you could be different and
you help them, you can change their life.
So most of the people that they get released from prison, even
though they've been punished, even government is saying punish
(09:51):
them and then they put them through rehabilitation.
But when they want to go and find a job, nobody's giving them
a job. They get punished for all their
life. And everyone saying, sorry, we
can't do this. So they're thinking, okay, so if
I got punished because I was a shoplifter and I don't have a
job, what do you want me to do? They get angry and they keep
reoffending things. But when you offer them a job
(10:13):
and you tell them that you couldmake a change in your life and
then you send them a message andwe can say thank you so much,
you work so hard last week or everybody likes you.
When I send you to any side, people are saying how great he
is. It make a huge.
Absolutely difference in becausea lot of these people haven't
had a good self esteem and self worth and so they've grown up
(10:36):
being told that you're not good enough, you're not used, you're
useless. The only thing I can do is crime
or drivers or whatever. Right.
And what's the difference even if I don't date people telling
me that I'm not good so. Exactly.
And I've interviewed a couple ofpeople, Sean Selby and also
Dylan, forget his name there. And, and both of those guys that
(11:02):
I interviewed previously have been in prison, one for murder,
the other one for drugs and and so on.
But they're both later took tookan opportunity to to change
themselves and build themselves.And now they're actually doing
better here. So I think everyone, I believe
(11:23):
that everyone deserves a second chance, yes.
So in your previous roles, within moments when money
mattered more than morals, And how did those moments add you to
what you do now? Most of the time it was just the
money. It was a business for them.
It was like a business and they were just thinking, who cares
(11:46):
about changing people's life? And then when I was telling
them, let's do this, they were saying, yes, that's a good idea.
And then when I was saying theseguys are asking for pay rise,
they deserve it. And then I remember my boss was
saying they should be happy thatthey have a job.
What are you talking about? They can just go.
And I thought, ohh, I thought you have the same thinking like
(12:08):
me, that you want to help these people.
They said, no, no, they should just be happy that they've got a
job. Or I had another another boss
that during the COVID when people could just sit at home
and get money, we were sending them to Huntly Power station
because it was troubled. And then we sent some guys that
(12:29):
they could see that home in Oakland, spending time with
family and get COVID money. We send them at work and my boss
was paying them minimum wages, but she was charging the client
huge amount of money. And that was one of my argument
with that particular boss when Ileft her company and I went to
previous company that I was working and in that company
again, it was all about money. Hmm.
(12:52):
I do understand we need money. We run a business.
I need to have money to get petrol to be able to come here.
But you could bring your thinking of just making money
different to be able to provide opportunity for other people.
What's the difference between what I provide a service for
(13:13):
people or other companies is other companies are having
people that they have cars, theyhave no problem, no challenges.
And then I've got my guys. I always call my clients and I
said I can understand you can goto any companies, but let's say
you need to pay $50 per hour forthose people.
(13:35):
But if you use my guys, which they have challenges, you can
save $20, you can pay me 30 and there's a $30.
Oh my So I'll bring the money that I can make very, very low,
low profit nothing basically, and then provide employment for
(13:56):
them. So this way I'll provide a very
great service for community, forbusiness owners or provide a
service for corrections because the guys are employed are
enjoying my job and also I'll make some money.
So how did you like when you first started your business, you
obviously you talked about how you did the study at 8.
(14:20):
That's a bold step to go out to the corrections and I and do
that and MST yeah. What was it like when you first
ventured out into? I had a person that she was
running training for people fromprison, and then I thought, ohh,
that's very interesting. So what's the point of providing
(14:40):
training for these people when they cannot get a job?
There's no outcome. And I thought I can do that
because I met these people and Ithought they're actually really
nice when you nice with them. And then I start doing it.
It was so much challenges involved with it, but after a
while you actually really enjoy it.
(15:00):
If I want to shift anything frommy house, look at these people
to come and help me. And people are saying why you
doing that? And I'm saying it shows the
trust, how much you trust them and they're doing it really
well. I had guys that you won't
believe it that they were thinking there's no way they can
get a job as this is somebody who was involved in major job,
(15:23):
for example. And then you see that person,
you think how did he do it? Because it doesn't look like
that person ever did something wrong.
But you cannot judge people because you didn't know what was
going wrong. And then when you are offering
them a job, you invite them out for dinner to talk with them and
discuss stuff with them, not at work, somewhere neutral.
(15:47):
They feel really good and they are trying to do their best to
always doing good. And I believe that if you can
change one person's life, it's really good.
But in my job, sometimes I really like to think at least I
change one person's per week. They're claiming an impact,
right? Ohh yeah.
It's really good. Yeah, so you said that it felt
(16:08):
like if it felt like standing ona Cliff ready for something new.
What phase did you face and whatpushed you to make that such a
big change? Because I had a good job, I had
a huge salary, I had a good package.
It was dealing like 2021 when many people were thinking what
would happen with new governmentif everything goes wrong, if we
(16:31):
lose our job. I had a secure job.
Okay, so I left that job and I set up a company and I was just
thinking I'm not going to tell anyone because if I tell them
they're telling me I'm crazy. So I decided to just keep it
secret and I set up the company.It was very fearful that who's
(16:53):
going to pay my mortgage, who's going to pay for everything?
But I thought if you don't try it, you don't know what would
happen. So I've got the ability to go
back and get a job again. So what I'm going to do it.
So I started setting up the business.
So I was very excited. I start running the business 1st
of November, get a little from my ex boss.
(17:15):
Now you cannot do this business because you left and for six
months you cannot do anything. I sent a letter to him and I
said take me to the court. Like if I go to the court and
telling judge that I'm a recruiter, I cannot do anything
else. And also my boss wanted me to
not offering job to 30 people that they get released from
(17:37):
prison and they could do something positive for
community. He wants to stop me for that
even though he doesn't have thatbusiness anymore.
And then again, I had lots of challenges, challenges of
getting involved with his matterto take me to the court for
that. And also brand new business, not
(17:59):
having a salary. But it was OK.
It was OK. You know me, my, I always say
never give up, never give up. And then if you don't try
something, you cannot do anything else.
And also, I can say that I grew up with challenges, revolution
(18:20):
or moving to new countries. Set up a business.
Even if it fails, it's not a bigdeal.
Yeah. Right.
You can stand up again. Hmm.
We are like a kid. Kids are start walking, fall,
work, fall until they can run. We're this thing at any age?
Yeah, absolutely. So you've helped to groups that
(18:42):
many businesses avoid, and how do you work to change those
opinions? Because I'm a bridge between
those people and my clients. They're telling me do not send a
person like this, this, this. And I said, don't worry, it's
under my company name. Anything happens, it happens to
(19:02):
me, just give them a chance. Then I don't disclose.
I'm telling them I'm not going to disclose what they did, but
I'm going to send it to you and I'll make sure that it's
guaranteed that they're not going to do anything wrong.
And it's suit for your situationwhen I send them.
And then they keep asking me forthat particular person, send it
(19:23):
to me. And then they said, now we want
to employ this guy. And I said, now it's time to
tell you this is the background.They said we don't care because
now we know the person, but if that person would go and apply
for a job directly to them, theywould definitely say no.
OK, I had a guy because I'm changing my office.
I met with him yesterday. And then he said I'll come to
(19:45):
your office to meet you guys to see if I want to rent at my
space to them. And then he was very worried
that they were from corrections.And I told him the cafe and
bakery that you had in your building, they've been making so
much money few months ago for auntie, few months ago for two
years, correct? He said yes.
(20:05):
And I said 90% of those guys that they were building the
property. Again, opposite your property
was Michael guys, how come they could come and have coffee, tea,
bringing money to your tenants and also bakery?
But if I have an office here, you say no, so I'm sorry.
I said yeah, that's okay. So you lost a good tenant?
(20:25):
Okay, So you don't ask for a miracle from people, but then
you just let them to? Give these people opportunity
through us because we are a bridge between them.
And then as as soon as they knowthem, they're OK with them.
OK. Yeah, absolutely.
So can you share a story that really shows the difference a
(20:47):
second chance can make? There was a guy that I remember
one time I was in a charity event, my boss called me from ex
was called me from Australia. He said go and check the Herald.
We are in Herald. And I said why?
He said I don't know, you've done something about that guy.
He mentioned the name and I saidohh, okay.
And I read the paper. I couldn't even believe it.
It was a guy that he was 50 ones.
(21:09):
He did something in Australia and then after he was released
he sent him to New Zealand. His wife was Australian
pregnant. So he came, he went to the court
and then he had to go back to the court and then definitely
sentence to the prison. So he called me, offered him a
job and then I supported him forhis court and I wrote a letter
(21:32):
to George and I said I support him for his employment as long
as he's in home D and he's with his family.
So he's got home. Did George said that was the
word in a paper from George. Your employer said that could
you please let him to be at homewhen his baby's born?
(21:53):
And then I support the whole family.
And then he stayed at home, homethe working for us and baby was
born and he was. So it was a moment when the baby
was born, they sent the photo tome.
So it was a really amazing. And then that guy became more
like a supervisor and now he's running a company himself in
(22:16):
Dunedin. And then he needs labourers.
He's calling me sauce and labourers to him.
So he was, I want his family when baby was born and he's
sorting good new life here. And then the people that are
sent to him, they are in the same situation I've seen before
and he always telling them you're going to be like me in
(22:36):
future. So they're always in this
honest. Yeah, You know, Yeah.
And they can relate as well, right?
Yeah, yeah. Whereas you seen the people who
have never witnessed that you don't understand.
What do you tell businesses thatare hesitant and hiring people
from these groups? And their insurance companies,
Hmm. If you are offering, if you have
(22:59):
a jewellery shop and you offer ajob to somebody who did
shoplifting, if anything missingin the shop, that person they're
thinking is that person, even ifit's the owner of the shop, does
it for insurance purpose. Insurance companies are having
(23:20):
negative mind about everything. If in this room, 10 people
sitting and one person has a background of shoplifting,
something is missing. Everybody's thinking it's them.
So some people are thinking I'm not going to do that because I
don't want to put that person ona risk.
They're thinking positive about that, which is great.
(23:42):
Some people are saying if I offer a job to that person,
something is missing. Then insurance companies asking
about the background of people in my work, then that person has
that background. Then the answer is no.
So what we do is we are always putting these people in a
different job. I will never, ever put a truck
(24:02):
driver who's got driving offencein a job, but I'll put a truck
driver who's got the offence of driving, drinking alcohol or
whatever. Then I'll put him in a labouring
job, building job. Because then I think this is not
related, correct? And there are so many people
(24:22):
that they've been misjudged in their life.
And also there are so many peoples that their offence is so
minor. I've got so many guys that they
are with me and they're all because of their assault.
And when you read their cases, assault wife and husband.
And I would say because I'm froma country that women don't have
(24:46):
much rights, men have more rights.
But in New Zealand, because we're giving so much rights to
women, if a man does something like that, they said he wanted
to help me. So police doesn't even listen to
them. They take them to custody and
they've got a assault conviction.
But maybe they really didn't do it.
You need to give them a benefit of the.
(25:06):
Yeah, yeah. So if somebody is in done
assault, of course we don't put them somewhere that there is a
risk for them. Depends the logistics of you
put. This exactly.
You wouldn't put them back in that environment that they yeah,
yeah. So you focus on helping New
Zealanders but also deal with the wider immigration issues.
(25:27):
How do you manage the balancing?Totally two different fields.
So I was dealing in Labour government, I was dealing with a
couple of MPs that they were dealing with people for refugees
and they were saying that they have so many female refugees
that they are not allowed to work.
(25:48):
Their husbands doesn't want themto work.
So I was saying, how about if they do just house cleaning,
there's no need for any sort of qualification or anything.
And we helped them. They helped him.
And I, I don't have that business myself to do cleaning,
it's constructions, but I send them to people that I know to
(26:09):
help them, even though I'm a recruiter and I have to charge
people for that. But I don't because as soon as I
want to charge people to send someone to go and work for them,
they're thinking they get fussy to see how good is that person.
Otherwise they don't give them that opportunity because they
have to pay me money. But if I say no recruiting fees,
(26:30):
just use their service to see how good they are, give them the
opportunity, they do that. And because no recruiting fees
is involved and these people arevery pleased to have a job, so
it works over for them. Hmm, pretty much works over.
For them, yeah, Yeah. And like, how do you deal with
(26:51):
them immigration issues? Most of the because they are
refugees and because they are all refugees and they're allowed
to work straight away, OK, they have their rights.
They're not like people that they're here with the work visa
or they have to work with a particular employer or
particular job. They could do anything to earn
(27:11):
some money. Most of them are in MC money.
If they get a full time job, then it's good for government.
Some of them are working casual because their mom and they have
kids and whatever. They work casual and this casual
work is helping them to learn the language as well and know
the culture. Yeah.
What role do you think government policy should have in
(27:35):
this? To me, there's no harmony in
what's happening in our system. We've got justice system that
they're thinking these people should get punished for what
they've done. Then they put them through
rehabilitation courses and then they expect them to get back to
the community. But the first place, The first
(27:59):
place that they're always sayingno to these people is government
jobs. OK, so most of the private
companies, they can use my guys,but City Council, which is
belong to government, they don'taccept these guys.
They said no even to empty the rubbish, they say no and I'm
thinking hey, you're part of this process, so if you don't
(28:23):
support these guys then who do you expect to support, You know,
And then I'm not a politician and I don't want to get involved
with politics. But to me, since I came to New
Zealand, we have two major governments, either Labour or
National. In Labour the rights goes to
(28:44):
Labours, In National they're against Labour.
So and we keep going through thechanges and by the time we get
used to 1 some changes, then thenew governments alright.
And then none of them are, at the end of the day, supportive
of people that they put them through the justice system.
(29:05):
And this is totally wrong. If they don't support people,
why they expect other people to do the same thing?
Yeah, just shows that there's noalignment between between the
government and also the local government entities, right.
And look, I've worked in local government, I've worked at
Auckland Transport and local Council and there was no
(29:28):
alignment between the two, whichwas one of the reasons I was
like happy to get out of corporate energy, start my own
business. That's true.
And so, yeah, I, I feel that there needs to be more
alignment. And you're right, because then
it's gonna serve people not, not, you know, it's really
(29:48):
disjointed at the moment. Yep, I was in a Rotary lunch
with Christopher Luxon and then he was saying that we're
building the prisons and the good news is we can give them
more channels with Sky TV. And I thought, if they're
supposed to get punished, why doyou want to provide such a
luxury place for them? So how about if you reduce the
(30:12):
money for building new prisons but put that money in, educate
them, rehabilitation and supporting them, organise a part
of City Council for people for this matter, instead of saying
no, anybody's going to City Council, they should not have
criminal conviction. When I spoke to Sean Selby, who
(30:35):
was the he will and he went intoprison for murder for at the age
of 18 and lovely guy. I've had lunch with him and and
I had him on the podcast and he said that he took the
opportunity to to better himselfby doing a degree with from
within prison. And I feel like if that kind of
(30:59):
approach was taken with what youjust said is that the money was
invested and educating people when they're in prison so that
they can actually do some type of degree or certification that
when they come out, they're morelikely to be able to get into a
role. Right?
Yes. And so, yeah, I agree.
(31:20):
Like TV channels aren't going ain't going to educate or no
don't help people no. So help them by giving them
equipped with the right yes. And especially in the day and
age they were in with a I, there's a lot more they can do.
Yeah. You're absolutely right.
Plus you've got a podcast you are training people with.
(31:47):
Like you have lots of training programmes to teach people how
they can do things differently. Some people take it, some people
leave it. OK, you don't expect 100% of
people to listen to you. That's the same thing in prison.
So if they run positive courses for people there, if 50% even
take it, it's a good news, right?
(32:09):
Even 20% because gradually you can make the changes.
But again, less government. They were thinking people should
be out of prison and their national people were saying ohh,
crime is everywhere because of them.
Then again, yeah, they're thinking, okay, we build more
prisons and we put those people in prison.
More prison, more prison officers, more security and more
(32:34):
expenses and all the taxpayers money goes to them.
Those people are not going to stay there forever.
They get released again and theyget angry.
So why not provide a right training, education.
Yeah, employment. Yeah, them.
Even the nail on the head because we're just going round
in circles. Yeah, right.
(32:55):
And it depends on which governments and depends on what
fashion they're going to implement, right.
So it's like, yeah, absolutely. There needs to be a more
consistent approach where peoplein prison can be educated.
And because a lot of these people who have gone on there
are not well educated, yes, someof them are not, Not everyone
(33:19):
else. And when you educate someone, it
brings awareness to their situation.
It helps them change themselves to become a new identity and a
new person. So, yeah.
So I feel that there needs to bemore work done there.
So your group takes on education, employment, housing
(33:39):
and healthcare. That's quite a lot, right?
Yeah. Why is it so important to cover
all of these areas? Because it's a holistic solution
for everything. My idea is we provide training
for people with the train. When we provide training for
them, they get a job. Employment and plan is we have
(34:01):
not done anything about social housing yet, but it's on a
process. The reason we haven't done
anything yet because we want to come up with a great idea.
The idea is people get trained, they get a job and then we've
got some lands that it shouldn'tbe Avis land or anything.
It should be done by people thatthey are philanthropists and
(34:22):
they can they're happy to provide a land and then these
people, they're building their own tiny houses.
So while they're building their own houses, they get paid for
it. And then when they leave there,
they pay for it and it's rent tobuy.
This basically built for people that there is no chance for them
to get loan from government or from banks or anything.
(34:44):
No credit, right? So we do that.
And also at the moment we are helping some people that they do
not have a place to get released.
So we rent some properties and then they come and live there
because with our credit they canhave power, water connections,
Wi-Fi connections. If somebody doesn't have a
(35:06):
creative hack, can they have theelectricity or anything that's a
transition for them to be able to move later and get their own
house. Then we were thinking why not
doing this social housing? That's the plan.
We are working on setting up a school and training school.
(35:26):
Now it's we are in process. It will be ready end of this
year and the focus is just four different courses and one of
them is mining for people that they like to do, coal mining in
South Island if they want to move there and also for some
people that they are in New Zealand, there is no job for
them. They can pass these scores and
(35:48):
move to Australia and do morning.
Yeah, nice. That's great.
Could you explain how these services work together?
Yes, it's a MCZ is a main company and we have different
trading adds 1 is our labour hire company that we offer job
to people, recruiting, sending people to Australia, training,
(36:12):
healthcare. If you're thinking about
healthcare, because we have a big group of elderly people here
and I don't know if it's the fashion now or what, that we
have lots of retirement villagesin New Zealand for 29 years, for
the last five years, many buildings are demolished and
(36:32):
they're building retirement villages.
And I was just thinking that that's interesting, why is like
that? Especially because my mom is now
in a different age and I'm thinking, oh, that's why maybe
we have very young generation here, many children's and adult
people. So then I realised that they
(36:55):
don't need nurses, they need some people to just go and look
after them, to make sure they can do their blood pressure,
they can just look after them. They give them their pills
because they have dementia, theyforgot if they had it or not.
They may take 20 pills in one day, right?
So we are doing that and the main reason is we have so many
(37:16):
educated people from other countries that they came here
and they can't even get registered here to be a nurse or
be a midwife or a doctor or a dentist.
So these people easily can work in aged care and and helping
them. So we do the recruiting for
MetLife Care and other places, and that's very easy.
(37:37):
What partnerships are key to your work and maintaining the
quality of service? The partners, yes, MSN
Corrections, MSN Corrections arework with all of Corrections
officers and they're sending people to me.
They do their main, the first interview and they send people
(38:01):
to me. They're very transparent with me
about all of them. And when these people come to me
because there's no stability, maybe they just come and do the
training and then they decided, no, that's not me and go I would
be losing so much money. Government MC and corrections
are saying we take some of that risk.
(38:22):
So if we take this person on board, we pay for their
training, we pay for their PP, you just offer them a job.
And I'm thinking, OK, I have notlost any money for training.
I have not lost money for PP. I'll give it a go, whether it
was not that I guess I had to befussy because for each training
(38:44):
and pp are lose 3000 if that person changed their mind,
right? So without their help I could
not do what I'm doing definitely.
Yeah. How how is that relationship
work as it does it work really well or very?
Well, yeah, yes, the they, they have a target to meet, right MC
(39:07):
people, their job is to make sure every month this many
people are getting employed not in EMC money corrections work
workers wanted to show that every month they were
successfully find job for five to 10 people, for example.
So those people need me, I need them.
(39:29):
So we are working together and they send people to me, are
accepted and they support me to make sure their training is
done, everything is done. Nice, so you were interested in
studying how social media affects job searching.
(39:50):
How does it relate to your work and what changes do you hope to
see? This is something that I'm
working very hard on it and thenI don't get the answer for it
because. Are ticket many times to
different places they're saying this is a free country and
people have the right to know what happened to a person.
If I have a person who is a sex offender that person the name is
(40:14):
everywhere so my client doesn't care because I would say I'll
take the responsibility and I'llmake sure that I didn't send
this person where is public school or park or anywhere and
they work under supervision of asupervisor.
But the other guys, the other guys like them and said they
(40:34):
said OHH or they want to work with this person.
And I'm thinking why this shouldbe open for public because if a
sex offender seeing somebody nowoutside that person doesn't say
can I have your name? Can I check to see if your sex
offender or not? That's doesn't make sense,
right? And then I'm just thinking that
(40:57):
that should be available for if you come and work for us.
And I would say, can you let me to check everything about you?
Then we know what's going on. But when they keep it open for
public, other people create problem for each other.
Just normal people, not employer, not employee or
(41:17):
whatever, to friends, neighbors.We had people to put them in a
area because they got released from prison and people are
saying, ohh, check it, that guy is a sex offender.
So we don't want them. They're going to make a
complaint to City Council that they don't want them.
So what? That person could live in a park
homeless. Yeah, it's even worse.
(41:39):
So that's what the fact that they put it in open for public,
it's wrong. Hmm, yeah.
And are they low? Are they laws that the
government? Has to follow.
Change it. No, they don't change.
They think it's frequently. It's freedom.
People should know. It went through the court
system, yes, but it's not right.They're saying if matter happen,
(42:06):
they don't mention the name of victim.
They say for the privacy of victim, but they mentioned that
person's name. But when they mentioned that
person's name, people who know the victim or that person, they
know what was going on. It's pretty much like the fact
that they put them through theirjustice system and training
(42:27):
rehabilitation, but they don't offer them a job.
They cut their support in one part and it create problems.
So that's the same thing here aswell.
Wow. What major obstacles do you see
in reintegration and which can be overcome?
The major thing is the stuff that we discussed, the
(42:48):
government doesn't support people from A-Z.
They stop it in the middle and they first support and then they
cut the support. They make one wrong decision
that it's ruining whatever that they've done.
They cannot just support them but not offering the job in
(43:09):
local government jobs or their public any job from government.
If a person is got conviction because they did assault, they
could work in Oakland transport,but because it's a government
job, they don't accept them because they have policies.
(43:30):
Yeah. OK, so this is wrong.
Make it exception. Or the fact that they put in
their duty reintegration. There's a move on.
That's that's gone. Put it on, pass, move on.
Go and do a normal life. Then again, they put the name of
that person everywhere and then that person cannot get a job,
cannot move on, and people keep questioning them about things
(43:54):
that's wrong. Yeah.
And that, that is a conversationI had with someone else also as
well, that that a lot of these companies, organisations have
got these policies and you're not allowed to, you know, and
feel that there needs to be a change there as well.
Yeah. If you could speak to other
(44:16):
business leaders, what would youtell them about the potential
and the people that you help? To, to support us mean I do that
all the time. I'm very pushy.
I'll go to them and I say you cannot judge them.
Just give them a job and see what they do.
And if they're good, you can take them on board free, no
(44:38):
recruiting and let them to work in my company for you to check
them to see if there is a risk to take them on board or not.
After six months, one year, if you want to take them on board,
you think it's good, take them on board.
And then even though I tell thembetween six months to one year,
(44:58):
some of them after 2 and said what happened, if we want to
take this guy on board and I said no six months, they said
why? I said two months is too early
for you to make a decision, led them to work for you 6 months to
one year. And then if you think that
they're good, you can take them on board and so many of them.
Attacking them, they take them on board.
(45:19):
And it's a big shame because some of them are really good and
I spend money on their health and taste and everything and
giving them away. But then I'm thinking makes more
space for new people. Yeah.
And you know, it's, it's giving,it's giving those people a sense
of purpose, right? It's giving them a new identity.
(45:40):
Yeah, because the old identity was that they were whatever they
did if intervened. But when you give people a new
identity, then they've then theyfeel like a new person.
That's right. And so, yeah, I think it's so
important that everyone has mademistakes.
(46:02):
Yeah. And you know, everyone of us has
done something that we're not proud of.
No, right, Exactly. And everyone there are people
who have made decisions, unfortunately the wrong
decision. That's paved the path to go that
way. That's so.
But then, like for me, I remember when I was 16, I was
(46:27):
that close to becoming a street kid on the streets of
Wellington. The only thing that changed was
that and I could have ended up in prison or dead or anything
but I one moment where my best friends mum took me in and
invited me to a youth camp. I see this amazing.
(46:49):
And that changed my life my my path in.
Life, forget that person. I could have ended up on the
street. I could have been, like I said,
dead or in prison or something. So it's important that we give
these people counts and give them the benefit of the doubt
that they are going to better themselves and change.
(47:10):
We do the wrong judgement about ourself.
Like I drink and then sometimes I think definitely I'm not
drunk. I am totally sober if I'm
driving my car. But you don't know when you feel
that you're sober. But if police stop me, maybe
they're saying, okay, so you have two or three glasses of
(47:30):
wine. This is over the limit because
how I feel sober, maybe one person is drunk with one glass
of wine, one person with five. OK, but when they test you, what
they test is very different withwhat you feel.
I can say maybe so many times I could get stuck with driving,
drinking. So many of us did it, so many
(47:52):
people doing wrong, but they never get caught.
So many people doing right, but then they get misjudged or one
time they made the mistake or whatever.
And also when I'm talking about people that are working, they
don't tell the truth sometimes when like if somebody's saying
(48:13):
that, if somebody's coming to meand say I've got family issues
and I cannot work anymore, can you please write an e-mail to
EMC that I cannot work anymore? And then they're saying they
were not working for five monthseven though they finished two
weeks ago. Okay.
When I see that, I get very upset, but I think I'm not in
their situation to see what happened that they said that.
(48:36):
But it could happen to anyone tolie about something.
Yeah, there's no perfect life and nobody's perfect.
They're not perfect either, but we're not thinking about judging
them. We just want a holistic
solutions for people's life and our life because any changes
(48:58):
that we make in a community, it's affecting the whole people.
Yes, absolutely. Alright, thank you so much for
sharing all those. We added the quick fire
questions now and you can chooseto answer these questions with a
single word or short sentence. The first question is what is
your definition of success and has that definition changed for
(49:22):
you over time? Success is about being happy
about what you're doing, not fooling yourself.
Just be honest with yourself. If you wake up in the morning to
go to work and you're not thinking, ohh, not again, not
again, and not feeling that do Ilike to go to work or not?
(49:47):
And then you're working, but youare excited about what you do
and you never treat your work asa work.
It's fun that you have or it's something that you're
interested. You don't feel like that you're
working is more hobby. To me, that's the success
(50:07):
without considering the dollar that you make.
OK, if somebody pays me money tobe an IT person and saying
you're in $2,000,000 salary to be an IT person, I cannot do it
or won't be happy because that'snot me.
But if I do a job that is $100,000 per year for me, but I
(50:28):
enjoy it and I feel that I'm making a change in one person's
life. And also it's not work, it's a
hobby. That's sexist to me.
Hmm. Pretty good.
Who's been your greatest inspiration and why?
My dad, my dad and my dad had a great job at home in Iran.
(50:51):
He was involved with let's say like macro energy business,
something like that in power company.
When he came to New Zealand, because he was a very hard
working person, he said I need to work.
And I said that you can't even register yourself.
You can't say one word in English.
He learned how to be a Barber, okay?
(51:11):
And he could not say one word inEnglish.
And he had his sheet, it says 123, number 123.
He was asking people, I guess hewas unemployed just for one week
in New Zealand. He wanted to work.
He was asking me about rugby andI said why do you want to know?
I've been here for such a long time and I don't even know how
it works. He said I wanna communicate with
(51:31):
my people about rugby. And he was the sort of person
that he never ever cared about what people are thinking or
saying or doing. He was just thinking about his
own life. And he had his routine, going to
the gym, doing this, having fun.And I thought, you are so
(51:52):
fearless. He never thought, Oh my God, no.
How about if I say word that it,it's wrong or how can I work?
I'm so new. He came here when he was old,
over 60. My dad passed away at the age of
74 and he came to New Zealand when he was 60 and at that age
he was not thinking that I'm going to be retired in five
(52:16):
years. I don't need to work.
He work until the last day that he was alive.
So for me, he was the biggest inspiration in my life.
That's great. What is something that you
believe that others may disagreewith?
I believe to having fun. I am 56 and I always think if
(52:39):
I'd be alive just same age as mydad or have 18 years, 20 years.
I don't sleep much. I'm staying alive.
I'm staying awake because that gives me alive because I want to
see more people. I wanna do more things, I wanna
read more stuff and I wanna see people.
To me, people are the biggest asset in my life and I love to
(53:04):
know more people in my own smallfamily, my husband and my kids,
they're thinking you're always, are you having fun with people?
And I'm saying that's good. That's a part of life that I
enjoy. But my husband believes for
sleep 8 hours is better for my health.
Sometimes if you are lucky to have quality life.
Shorter life maybe, but enjoyingit and not putting anything like
(53:29):
a regular bar. I didn't do that.
I quite enjoy my life now, but if you ask my family, probably
they say she's always having fun.
Maybe she should have more rest,but not me.
Yeah, well, some people believe that you don't rest until you
actually gone, right? Yeah, like I remember someone
(53:53):
said you don't retire until you actually did on the ground.
Exactly. So yeah, you're right.
So if you could go back and giveyour younger self a piece of
advice, what would it be? I wish I was seeing what I'm
doing. Hmm.
Many years ago, yeah. I wish I was in a path with the
idea that I am not. Many years ago, but it's never
(54:14):
late. Well, you were being, you were
being prepared for this time, right?
Yeah. So there's it's all about timing
and we have to go through some of the adversities, some of the
challenges in life to to level. Up.
Be able to yes, it's like we need, we have to be able to be
(54:34):
able to contain what's come there for.
Us that's. Right.
And if we can't contain it, thenit's like you don't have the
resilience, the right attitude, but also the right mindset.
That's right. Yeah, you're right.
When I was 30 years old, maybe if they were telling me do this
job and I wouldn't be ready and I wouldn't have the same
(54:57):
passion. Yeah, that I have now.
Yeah. I was meeting someone few days
ago and then right beside me there were two guys sitting
beside each other dealing with passion about this many issues,
this cages of sugar. If you send it tonnes of sugar,
you send it to this country, youmake this much money.
And I was thinking they're so passionate about it, maybe
(55:19):
because of the money that is involved with it.
I'm sure they're not thinking wesend sugar to that country
because those people need sugar because avoid drug, drugs and
then but it's the money. So people have different
passions. Yeah.
And so for me, if somebody come to me today and say, how about
(55:39):
if I give you 20 million, go andhave fun, get retired, don't do
this job. Send no way, no way.
I want to do the same thing. I just enjoy it I guess.
If I don't do it, I lost something in my life.
Hmm, yeah. What is 1 message that you'd
like to share with the world? Never give up, it's never late
(56:04):
to start fresh. Never ever in studying, in job,
employment, life, family, everything.
Never give up. And also for giving things like
forgive people. People are making mistakes.
If you want to hold grudges, it hurts you before they help
others. Totally.
(56:25):
Yeah, when you forgive someone, people are thinking why you like
a door mat let people to do thisto you said no, no, you're
wrong, because when I forgive that person are free up my brain
and my mind about something taking its place and it's
bothering me all the time. Absolutely.
And last question is what does it mean to to you to be a
champion and to have a champion mindset?
(56:48):
I wish I was a champion. Where you at?
Ohh. You for the work you're doing,
you are a. Champion.
You're really kind to say that, but to have a champion mindset
is if you believe in yourself and you are true to your with
yourself, to know what are your limits, what are your abilities
(57:09):
and be honest with that, then it's totally okay if I don't
have legs. I cannot run with my legs, but I
can strong make my arms strong to push, use the wheels on the
wheelchair, right? Yeah, so we are always able to
do things, but it's the right mindset, what to use, what tools
(57:31):
to use. You need to be like that.
Awesome Allie, thank you for sharing your story with us.
It's never too late to change our paths.
Whether it's personal transformation or helping others
finding their way. Your work through MCZ Group
proves that businesses can create profound social change.
(57:54):
When lid with the heart, grit and the unshakeable belief in
people, you often say that it's all about It's all about hope,
dignity, and believing in others.
Your approach is a reminder thatwhen we include everyone, our
communities become stronger. Thank you.
So thank you so much for your sharing your journey.
If people, businesses or people looking for work who have been
(58:18):
in those situations would like to get in touch with you, how
can they can hold hold of. You said our website and MCZ
group dot NZ my phone number andalso I keep placing an ad in
social media and also in V Magazine.
(58:39):
I have different podcasts on Lucky to be in your podcast so
this way people can get hold of.Us, we'll put the we'll put all
the links and stuff into the show notes.
There's a, if you've been listening to this episode and if
it's anything that has shared has touched you, encourage you
to get in touch and also share it with someone that might
(59:02):
benefit from this episode. And lastly, I just want to say
you are loved, you are worthy. Champion your life, champion
your greatness and have an amazing day.
What happens when a biologist from Iran becomes New Zealand's
unlikely hero? For those often forgotten, your
work proves that even in challenging times, compassion
and smart solutions can make a huge difference in people's
lives. I could you still remember some
stuff from my child to be for revolution, the freedom that we
had and what happened after that.
(00:23):
And I thought I can do that because I met these people and I
thought they're actually really nice feel that I was born again.
So I feel really good about it. Imagine that like you have two
kids, one of the child you say you're not good, you're not the
most of people that they get released from prison even though
they've been punished. Even government is saying punish
(00:44):
them and then they put them through rehabilitation.
If you don't try it, you don't know what would happen.
Never give up. Never give up.
If you can change one person's life, it's really.
Good. I believe that everyone deserves
a second chance. It's a holistic solution for
everything. We are always able to do things
but it's the right mindset what to use, what tools to use late
(01:09):
to start fresh. Never ever in studying, in jaw,
employment, life, family, everything.
Going to forgive that person arefree of my brain and my mind
about something taking its placeand it's bothering me all the
time. What happens when a biologist
from Iran becomes New Zealand's unlikely hero for those often
(01:30):
forgotten? Join us today as we dive into
Ali Stone's inspiring journey from science to social change as
she champions new beginnings andcommunity care.
Hello and welcome to the Champion Mindset Collective
podcast. I'm your host, Anthony Dyer.
I'm so grateful that you're herewatching or listening to this
episode. We'd love for you to share this
episode with your friends, family and workmate so that we
(01:52):
can get this out to the wider world.
I'm joined by Alice Stone, who in the heart behind the MC NZ
Group and a Trail browser and New Zealand social course ally.
You move to New Zealand from Iran 29 years ago, not knowing
your future would shift from biology to social
(02:14):
entrepreneurship. With EMC NZ Groups, you are
dedicated to help former prisoners, recovering addicts
and refugees, showing that everyone deserves a chance, a
dignity and a fresh start. Your work proves that even in
challenging times, compassion and smart solutions can make a
(02:34):
huge difference in people's lives.
Ellie, you've transformed in your 50s, finding bravery to
follow your dreams and create meaningful change that's touched
hundreds of lives. We would like to welcome you to
the Champion Mindset Collective podcast.
Thank you so much. Thank you.
It's a pleasure to have you here.
So before we kick into some questions, I'd really like to
(02:56):
understand your journey in life from childhood to now to tell us
a little about that. Sure, Yes.
Thank you so much for having me here.
I'm Ellie, born in Iran. So I grew up in Iran until the
age of 27. So for 1st 27 years of my life I
(03:18):
had very challenging life because I was born when we had
Kingdom in my country and I was born in a family that I had a
very comfortable life. When I was 10 years old,
revolution happened that was very challenging for our family.
And again, after one year or a couple of years, we had war
(03:39):
between Iran and Iraq for eight years.
So if you can imagine, at the age of 10, until I was like
1920, we always had revolution, war and everything that you can
name it. I could still remember some
stuff from my childhood before revolution, the freedom that we
had and what happened after that.
(04:00):
It was very challenging. And then going to university was
very challenging as well becausewe had a huge population of
people to apply for university. And it doesn't matter how good
you are, it's a competition. 5 million people are applying for
university and they just need toannuitize and people.
So it was very, very, very difficult.
(04:21):
And then doing a study, being inuniversity again because of
revolution and not having freedom.
It was an easy got married there, came to New Zealand and a
lot of freedom. But again, here life is full of
challenges. You move to a new country and
you start from scratch again. You feel like your child again
(04:43):
because it's a different country, different culture,
different language, everything was very different.
I can say that at least for 40 years in my life, life was
challenging. Then again, you get married, you
have kids. It's different.
I found myself after age of 50, I say.
And that's about my childhood and my life, basically.
(05:06):
Here it was full of challenges. Yeah, I can imagine coming from
a from around to New Zealand would have been a complete shock
to the system. Totally different.
The way that you drive your car,religion and language,
everything. Everything was different.
So Ellie, you described the feeling of rebirth after
(05:27):
starting McGinn Group. Tell us a little about MCZ
Group. What was the moment that made
you leave the corporate world for social impact?
Yes, I've done my masters degreein a UT and at the time that I
was doing it, it was about HR and the subject that I chose was
about the life of labourers in international labours in New
(05:53):
Zealand or any countries. Because when you live in any
country, you know about your rights and you look after your
rights. I remember at home we had many
refugees from Afghanistan that they were coming to Iran and
then our own Persian labourers, they wanted to have their own
rights but not Afghani people. They were working so hard to
(06:16):
make sure that we choose them towork 1st instead of people from
our country and also their rateswas always lower.
So when I came to New Zealand, Irealised it's something's
happening with people from Philippine or people from any
other countries. So they are expecting them to
not having a break and not looking after their rights or
(06:37):
anything and they don't get treated that well like others.
So that was the subject of my study.
So for last 7-8 years I'm doing labour hire and recruiting for
construction companies and I setup a company from scratch for
different people but I never used Filipino workers or any
(06:57):
other countries. I thought I pick a different
market and I help people from prison. 5 want MC people.
Any company that I set off for any other of my employers, it
was a successful business. But for them, they didn't have
the same goal that I had. My goal was helping these
(07:18):
people. They were thinking about them.
They're just a number. So how many people are working
today? Why that person's not at work?
I'll be losing money. It was really bad and the last
company that I was working we had scaling up and also we had
stand up every morning. The only question was ask was
(07:40):
how many people are at what is the profit this week?
Why profit this week is less than the other week?
So I thought that's not me. So I left.
I set up my own company and whatI do is just purely getting
people from corrections and I get people from MSD.
But then I thought people from corrections are Ms. clients as
(08:02):
well. So I just go for people that
they are involved with court system before they go to their
sentencing or meet up with judges.
And then I asked them if I can offer them a job and they can
stay at home. Home deep.
They work for us and they are inhome day, so we are reducing the
(08:24):
cost of taking care of them in prison.
We are sure that they are spending time with their family
and also they get busy and learning things and making
money. So less pressure and for
taxpayers like us. So I thought it's a very good
idea. So now it's just purely people
(08:45):
from corrections 50 runs, charities and court system.
So then because it's just not a number, it's what you could do
for them. It's feel that I was born again,
so I feel really good about it. It's good to be able to help
people who cause a lot of peopleend up in corrections or prison
(09:07):
because their lifestyle, you know, they're able to make ends
meet and what are you doing is you actually providing a
different environment and another way to earn an income
and better themselves. Right.
That's right. Yeah, that's absolutely right.
Imagine that. Like you have two kids, one of
the child, you say you're not good, you're not good.
(09:29):
That child is thinking, nobody believes me.
I'm not going to put chairs anymore, right?
But if you tell them that you'regood, you could be different and
you help them, you can change their life.
So most of the people that they get released from prison, even
though they've been punished, even government is saying punish
(09:51):
them and then they put them through rehabilitation.
But when they want to go and find a job, nobody's giving them
a job. They get punished for all their
life. And everyone saying, sorry, we
can't do this. So they're thinking, okay, so if
I got punished because I was a shoplifter and I don't have a
job, what do you want me to do? They get angry and they keep
reoffending things. But when you offer them a job
(10:13):
and you tell them that you couldmake a change in your life and
then you send them a message andwe can say thank you so much,
you work so hard last week or everybody likes you.
When I send you to any side, people are saying how great he
is. It make a huge.
Absolutely difference in becausea lot of these people haven't
had a good self esteem and self worth and so they've grown up
(10:36):
being told that you're not good enough, you're not used, you're
useless. The only thing I can do is crime
or drivers or whatever. Right.
And what's the difference even if I don't date people telling
me that I'm not good so. Exactly.
And I've interviewed a couple ofpeople, Sean Selby and also
Dylan, forget his name there. And, and both of those guys that
(11:02):
I interviewed previously have been in prison, one for murder,
the other one for drugs and and so on.
But they're both later took tookan opportunity to to change
themselves and build themselves.And now they're actually doing
better here. So I think everyone, I believe
(11:23):
that everyone deserves a second chance, yes.
So in your previous roles, within moments when money
mattered more than morals, And how did those moments add you to
what you do now? Most of the time it was just the
money. It was a business for them.
It was like a business and they were just thinking, who cares
(11:46):
about changing people's life? And then when I was telling
them, let's do this, they were saying, yes, that's a good idea.
And then when I was saying theseguys are asking for pay rise,
they deserve it. And then I remember my boss was
saying they should be happy thatthey have a job.
What are you talking about? They can just go.
And I thought, ohh, I thought you have the same thinking like
(12:08):
me, that you want to help these people.
They said, no, no, they should just be happy that they've got a
job. Or I had another another boss
that during the COVID when people could just sit at home
and get money, we were sending them to Huntly Power station
because it was troubled. And then we sent some guys that
(12:29):
they could see that home in Oakland, spending time with
family and get COVID money. We send them at work and my boss
was paying them minimum wages, but she was charging the client
huge amount of money. And that was one of my argument
with that particular boss when Ileft her company and I went to
previous company that I was working and in that company
again, it was all about money. Hmm.
(12:52):
I do understand we need money. We run a business.
I need to have money to get petrol to be able to come here.
But you could bring your thinking of just making money
different to be able to provide opportunity for other people.
What's the difference between what I provide a service for
(13:13):
people or other companies is other companies are having
people that they have cars, theyhave no problem, no challenges.
And then I've got my guys. I always call my clients and I
said I can understand you can goto any companies, but let's say
you need to pay $50 per hour forthose people.
(13:35):
But if you use my guys, which they have challenges, you can
save $20, you can pay me 30 and there's a $30.
Oh my So I'll bring the money that I can make very, very low,
low profit nothing basically, and then provide employment for
(13:56):
them. So this way I'll provide a very
great service for community, forbusiness owners or provide a
service for corrections because the guys are employed are
enjoying my job and also I'll make some money.
So how did you like when you first started your business, you
obviously you talked about how you did the study at 8.
(14:20):
That's a bold step to go out to the corrections and I and do
that and MST yeah. What was it like when you first
ventured out into? I had a person that she was
running training for people fromprison, and then I thought, ohh,
that's very interesting. So what's the point of providing
(14:40):
training for these people when they cannot get a job?
There's no outcome. And I thought I can do that
because I met these people and Ithought they're actually really
nice when you nice with them. And then I start doing it.
It was so much challenges involved with it, but after a
while you actually really enjoy it.
(15:00):
If I want to shift anything frommy house, look at these people
to come and help me. And people are saying why you
doing that? And I'm saying it shows the
trust, how much you trust them and they're doing it really
well. I had guys that you won't
believe it that they were thinking there's no way they can
get a job as this is somebody who was involved in major job,
(15:23):
for example. And then you see that person,
you think how did he do it? Because it doesn't look like
that person ever did something wrong.
But you cannot judge people because you didn't know what was
going wrong. And then when you are offering
them a job, you invite them out for dinner to talk with them and
discuss stuff with them, not at work, somewhere neutral.
(15:47):
They feel really good and they are trying to do their best to
always doing good. And I believe that if you can
change one person's life, it's really good.
But in my job, sometimes I really like to think at least I
change one person's per week. They're claiming an impact,
right? Ohh yeah.
It's really good. Yeah, so you said that it felt
(16:08):
like if it felt like standing ona Cliff ready for something new.
What phase did you face and whatpushed you to make that such a
big change? Because I had a good job, I had
a huge salary, I had a good package.
It was dealing like 2021 when many people were thinking what
would happen with new governmentif everything goes wrong, if we
(16:31):
lose our job. I had a secure job.
Okay, so I left that job and I set up a company and I was just
thinking I'm not going to tell anyone because if I tell them
they're telling me I'm crazy. So I decided to just keep it
secret and I set up the company.It was very fearful that who's
(16:53):
going to pay my mortgage, who's going to pay for everything?
But I thought if you don't try it, you don't know what would
happen. So I've got the ability to go
back and get a job again. So what I'm going to do it.
So I started setting up the business.
So I was very excited. I start running the business 1st
of November, get a little from my ex boss.
(17:15):
Now you cannot do this business because you left and for six
months you cannot do anything. I sent a letter to him and I
said take me to the court. Like if I go to the court and
telling judge that I'm a recruiter, I cannot do anything
else. And also my boss wanted me to
not offering job to 30 people that they get released from
(17:37):
prison and they could do something positive for
community. He wants to stop me for that
even though he doesn't have thatbusiness anymore.
And then again, I had lots of challenges, challenges of
getting involved with his matterto take me to the court for
that. And also brand new business, not
(17:59):
having a salary. But it was OK.
It was OK. You know me, my, I always say
never give up, never give up. And then if you don't try
something, you cannot do anything else.
And also, I can say that I grew up with challenges, revolution
(18:20):
or moving to new countries. Set up a business.
Even if it fails, it's not a bigdeal.
Yeah. Right.
You can stand up again. Hmm.
We are like a kid. Kids are start walking, fall,
work, fall until they can run. We're this thing at any age?
Yeah, absolutely. So you've helped to groups that
(18:42):
many businesses avoid, and how do you work to change those
opinions? Because I'm a bridge between
those people and my clients. They're telling me do not send a
person like this, this, this. And I said, don't worry, it's
under my company name. Anything happens, it happens to
(19:02):
me, just give them a chance. Then I don't disclose.
I'm telling them I'm not going to disclose what they did, but
I'm going to send it to you and I'll make sure that it's
guaranteed that they're not going to do anything wrong.
And it's suit for your situationwhen I send them.
And then they keep asking me forthat particular person, send it
(19:23):
to me. And then they said, now we want
to employ this guy. And I said, now it's time to
tell you this is the background.They said we don't care because
now we know the person, but if that person would go and apply
for a job directly to them, theywould definitely say no.
OK, I had a guy because I'm changing my office.
I met with him yesterday. And then he said I'll come to
(19:45):
your office to meet you guys to see if I want to rent at my
space to them. And then he was very worried
that they were from corrections.And I told him the cafe and
bakery that you had in your building, they've been making so
much money few months ago for auntie, few months ago for two
years, correct? He said yes.
(20:05):
And I said 90% of those guys that they were building the
property. Again, opposite your property
was Michael guys, how come they could come and have coffee, tea,
bringing money to your tenants and also bakery?
But if I have an office here, you say no, so I'm sorry.
I said yeah, that's okay. So you lost a good tenant?
(20:25):
Okay, So you don't ask for a miracle from people, but then
you just let them to? Give these people opportunity
through us because we are a bridge between them.
And then as as soon as they knowthem, they're OK with them.
OK. Yeah, absolutely.
So can you share a story that really shows the difference a
(20:47):
second chance can make? There was a guy that I remember
one time I was in a charity event, my boss called me from ex
was called me from Australia. He said go and check the Herald.
We are in Herald. And I said why?
He said I don't know, you've done something about that guy.
He mentioned the name and I saidohh, okay.
And I read the paper. I couldn't even believe it.
It was a guy that he was 50 ones.
(21:09):
He did something in Australia and then after he was released
he sent him to New Zealand. His wife was Australian
pregnant. So he came, he went to the court
and then he had to go back to the court and then definitely
sentence to the prison. So he called me, offered him a
job and then I supported him forhis court and I wrote a letter
(21:32):
to George and I said I support him for his employment as long
as he's in home D and he's with his family.
So he's got home. Did George said that was the
word in a paper from George. Your employer said that could
you please let him to be at homewhen his baby's born?
(21:53):
And then I support the whole family.
And then he stayed at home, homethe working for us and baby was
born and he was. So it was a moment when the baby
was born, they sent the photo tome.
So it was a really amazing. And then that guy became more
like a supervisor and now he's running a company himself in
(22:16):
Dunedin. And then he needs labourers.
He's calling me sauce and labourers to him.
So he was, I want his family when baby was born and he's
sorting good new life here. And then the people that are
sent to him, they are in the same situation I've seen before
and he always telling them you're going to be like me in
(22:36):
future. So they're always in this
honest. Yeah, You know, Yeah.
And they can relate as well, right?
Yeah, yeah. Whereas you seen the people who
have never witnessed that you don't understand.
What do you tell businesses thatare hesitant and hiring people
from these groups? And their insurance companies,
Hmm. If you are offering, if you have
(22:59):
a jewellery shop and you offer ajob to somebody who did
shoplifting, if anything missingin the shop, that person they're
thinking is that person, even ifit's the owner of the shop, does
it for insurance purpose. Insurance companies are having
(23:20):
negative mind about everything. If in this room, 10 people
sitting and one person has a background of shoplifting,
something is missing. Everybody's thinking it's them.
So some people are thinking I'm not going to do that because I
don't want to put that person ona risk.
They're thinking positive about that, which is great.
(23:42):
Some people are saying if I offer a job to that person,
something is missing. Then insurance companies asking
about the background of people in my work, then that person has
that background. Then the answer is no.
So what we do is we are always putting these people in a
different job. I will never, ever put a truck
(24:02):
driver who's got driving offencein a job, but I'll put a truck
driver who's got the offence of driving, drinking alcohol or
whatever. Then I'll put him in a labouring
job, building job. Because then I think this is not
related, correct? And there are so many people
(24:22):
that they've been misjudged in their life.
And also there are so many peoples that their offence is so
minor. I've got so many guys that they
are with me and they're all because of their assault.
And when you read their cases, assault wife and husband.
And I would say because I'm froma country that women don't have
(24:46):
much rights, men have more rights.
But in New Zealand, because we're giving so much rights to
women, if a man does something like that, they said he wanted
to help me. So police doesn't even listen to
them. They take them to custody and
they've got a assault conviction.
But maybe they really didn't do it.
You need to give them a benefit of the.
(25:06):
Yeah, yeah. So if somebody is in done
assault, of course we don't put them somewhere that there is a
risk for them. Depends the logistics of you
put. This exactly.
You wouldn't put them back in that environment that they yeah,
yeah. So you focus on helping New
Zealanders but also deal with the wider immigration issues.
(25:27):
How do you manage the balancing?Totally two different fields.
So I was dealing in Labour government, I was dealing with a
couple of MPs that they were dealing with people for refugees
and they were saying that they have so many female refugees
that they are not allowed to work.
(25:48):
Their husbands doesn't want themto work.
So I was saying, how about if they do just house cleaning,
there's no need for any sort of qualification or anything.
And we helped them. They helped him.
And I, I don't have that business myself to do cleaning,
it's constructions, but I send them to people that I know to
(26:09):
help them, even though I'm a recruiter and I have to charge
people for that. But I don't because as soon as I
want to charge people to send someone to go and work for them,
they're thinking they get fussy to see how good is that person.
Otherwise they don't give them that opportunity because they
have to pay me money. But if I say no recruiting fees,
(26:30):
just use their service to see how good they are, give them the
opportunity, they do that. And because no recruiting fees
is involved and these people arevery pleased to have a job, so
it works over for them. Hmm, pretty much works over.
For them, yeah, Yeah. And like, how do you deal with
(26:51):
them immigration issues? Most of the because they are
refugees and because they are all refugees and they're allowed
to work straight away, OK, they have their rights.
They're not like people that they're here with the work visa
or they have to work with a particular employer or
particular job. They could do anything to earn
(27:11):
some money. Most of them are in MC money.
If they get a full time job, then it's good for government.
Some of them are working casual because their mom and they have
kids and whatever. They work casual and this casual
work is helping them to learn the language as well and know
the culture. Yeah.
What role do you think government policy should have in
(27:35):
this? To me, there's no harmony in
what's happening in our system. We've got justice system that
they're thinking these people should get punished for what
they've done. Then they put them through
rehabilitation courses and then they expect them to get back to
the community. But the first place, The first
(27:59):
place that they're always sayingno to these people is government
jobs. OK, so most of the private
companies, they can use my guys,but City Council, which is
belong to government, they don'taccept these guys.
They said no even to empty the rubbish, they say no and I'm
thinking hey, you're part of this process, so if you don't
(28:23):
support these guys then who do you expect to support, You know,
And then I'm not a politician and I don't want to get involved
with politics. But to me, since I came to New
Zealand, we have two major governments, either Labour or
National. In Labour the rights goes to
(28:44):
Labours, In National they're against Labour.
So and we keep going through thechanges and by the time we get
used to 1 some changes, then thenew governments alright.
And then none of them are, at the end of the day, supportive
of people that they put them through the justice system.
(29:05):
And this is totally wrong. If they don't support people,
why they expect other people to do the same thing?
Yeah, just shows that there's noalignment between between the
government and also the local government entities, right.
And look, I've worked in local government, I've worked at
Auckland Transport and local Council and there was no
(29:28):
alignment between the two, whichwas one of the reasons I was
like happy to get out of corporate energy, start my own
business. That's true.
And so, yeah, I, I feel that there needs to be more
alignment. And you're right, because then
it's gonna serve people not, not, you know, it's really
(29:48):
disjointed at the moment. Yep, I was in a Rotary lunch
with Christopher Luxon and then he was saying that we're
building the prisons and the good news is we can give them
more channels with Sky TV. And I thought, if they're
supposed to get punished, why doyou want to provide such a
luxury place for them? So how about if you reduce the
(30:12):
money for building new prisons but put that money in, educate
them, rehabilitation and supporting them, organise a part
of City Council for people for this matter, instead of saying
no, anybody's going to City Council, they should not have
criminal conviction. When I spoke to Sean Selby, who
(30:35):
was the he will and he went intoprison for murder for at the age
of 18 and lovely guy. I've had lunch with him and and
I had him on the podcast and he said that he took the
opportunity to to better himselfby doing a degree with from
within prison. And I feel like if that kind of
(30:59):
approach was taken with what youjust said is that the money was
invested and educating people when they're in prison so that
they can actually do some type of degree or certification that
when they come out, they're morelikely to be able to get into a
role. Right?
Yes. And so, yeah, I agree.
(31:20):
Like TV channels aren't going ain't going to educate or no
don't help people no. So help them by giving them
equipped with the right yes. And especially in the day and
age they were in with a I, there's a lot more they can do.
Yeah. You're absolutely right.
Plus you've got a podcast you are training people with.
(31:47):
Like you have lots of training programmes to teach people how
they can do things differently. Some people take it, some people
leave it. OK, you don't expect 100% of
people to listen to you. That's the same thing in prison.
So if they run positive courses for people there, if 50% even
take it, it's a good news, right?
(32:09):
Even 20% because gradually you can make the changes.
But again, less government. They were thinking people should
be out of prison and their national people were saying ohh,
crime is everywhere because of them.
Then again, yeah, they're thinking, okay, we build more
prisons and we put those people in prison.
More prison, more prison officers, more security and more
(32:34):
expenses and all the taxpayers money goes to them.
Those people are not going to stay there forever.
They get released again and theyget angry.
So why not provide a right training, education.
Yeah, employment. Yeah, them.
Even the nail on the head because we're just going round
in circles. Yeah, right.
(32:55):
And it depends on which governments and depends on what
fashion they're going to implement, right.
So it's like, yeah, absolutely. There needs to be a more
consistent approach where peoplein prison can be educated.
And because a lot of these people who have gone on there
are not well educated, yes, someof them are not, Not everyone
(33:19):
else. And when you educate someone, it
brings awareness to their situation.
It helps them change themselves to become a new identity and a
new person. So, yeah.
So I feel that there needs to bemore work done there.
So your group takes on education, employment, housing
(33:39):
and healthcare. That's quite a lot, right?
Yeah. Why is it so important to cover
all of these areas? Because it's a holistic solution
for everything. My idea is we provide training
for people with the train. When we provide training for
them, they get a job. Employment and plan is we have
(34:01):
not done anything about social housing yet, but it's on a
process. The reason we haven't done
anything yet because we want to come up with a great idea.
The idea is people get trained, they get a job and then we've
got some lands that it shouldn'tbe Avis land or anything.
It should be done by people thatthey are philanthropists and
(34:22):
they can they're happy to provide a land and then these
people, they're building their own tiny houses.
So while they're building their own houses, they get paid for
it. And then when they leave there,
they pay for it and it's rent tobuy.
This basically built for people that there is no chance for them
to get loan from government or from banks or anything.
(34:44):
No credit, right? So we do that.
And also at the moment we are helping some people that they do
not have a place to get released.
So we rent some properties and then they come and live there
because with our credit they canhave power, water connections,
Wi-Fi connections. If somebody doesn't have a
(35:06):
creative hack, can they have theelectricity or anything that's a
transition for them to be able to move later and get their own
house. Then we were thinking why not
doing this social housing? That's the plan.
We are working on setting up a school and training school.
(35:26):
Now it's we are in process. It will be ready end of this
year and the focus is just four different courses and one of
them is mining for people that they like to do, coal mining in
South Island if they want to move there and also for some
people that they are in New Zealand, there is no job for
them. They can pass these scores and
(35:48):
move to Australia and do morning.
Yeah, nice. That's great.
Could you explain how these services work together?
Yes, it's a MCZ is a main company and we have different
trading adds 1 is our labour hire company that we offer job
to people, recruiting, sending people to Australia, training,
(36:12):
healthcare. If you're thinking about
healthcare, because we have a big group of elderly people here
and I don't know if it's the fashion now or what, that we
have lots of retirement villagesin New Zealand for 29 years, for
the last five years, many buildings are demolished and
(36:32):
they're building retirement villages.
And I was just thinking that that's interesting, why is like
that? Especially because my mom is now
in a different age and I'm thinking, oh, that's why maybe
we have very young generation here, many children's and adult
people. So then I realised that they
(36:55):
don't need nurses, they need some people to just go and look
after them, to make sure they can do their blood pressure,
they can just look after them. They give them their pills
because they have dementia, theyforgot if they had it or not.
They may take 20 pills in one day, right?
So we are doing that and the main reason is we have so many
(37:16):
educated people from other countries that they came here
and they can't even get registered here to be a nurse or
be a midwife or a doctor or a dentist.
So these people easily can work in aged care and and helping
them. So we do the recruiting for
MetLife Care and other places, and that's very easy.
(37:37):
What partnerships are key to your work and maintaining the
quality of service? The partners, yes, MSN
Corrections, MSN Corrections arework with all of Corrections
officers and they're sending people to me.
They do their main, the first interview and they send people
(38:01):
to me. They're very transparent with me
about all of them. And when these people come to me
because there's no stability, maybe they just come and do the
training and then they decided, no, that's not me and go I would
be losing so much money. Government MC and corrections
are saying we take some of that risk.
(38:22):
So if we take this person on board, we pay for their
training, we pay for their PP, you just offer them a job.
And I'm thinking, OK, I have notlost any money for training.
I have not lost money for PP. I'll give it a go, whether it
was not that I guess I had to befussy because for each training
(38:44):
and pp are lose 3000 if that person changed their mind,
right? So without their help I could
not do what I'm doing definitely.
Yeah. How how is that relationship
work as it does it work really well or very?
Well, yeah, yes, the they, they have a target to meet, right MC
(39:07):
people, their job is to make sure every month this many
people are getting employed not in EMC money corrections work
workers wanted to show that every month they were
successfully find job for five to 10 people, for example.
So those people need me, I need them.
(39:29):
So we are working together and they send people to me, are
accepted and they support me to make sure their training is
done, everything is done. Nice, so you were interested in
studying how social media affects job searching.
(39:50):
How does it relate to your work and what changes do you hope to
see? This is something that I'm
working very hard on it and thenI don't get the answer for it
because. Are ticket many times to
different places they're saying this is a free country and
people have the right to know what happened to a person.
If I have a person who is a sex offender that person the name is
(40:14):
everywhere so my client doesn't care because I would say I'll
take the responsibility and I'llmake sure that I didn't send
this person where is public school or park or anywhere and
they work under supervision of asupervisor.
But the other guys, the other guys like them and said they
(40:34):
said OHH or they want to work with this person.
And I'm thinking why this shouldbe open for public because if a
sex offender seeing somebody nowoutside that person doesn't say
can I have your name? Can I check to see if your sex
offender or not? That's doesn't make sense,
right? And then I'm just thinking that
(40:57):
that should be available for if you come and work for us.
And I would say, can you let me to check everything about you?
Then we know what's going on. But when they keep it open for
public, other people create problem for each other.
Just normal people, not employer, not employee or
(41:17):
whatever, to friends, neighbors.We had people to put them in a
area because they got released from prison and people are
saying, ohh, check it, that guy is a sex offender.
So we don't want them. They're going to make a
complaint to City Council that they don't want them.
So what? That person could live in a park
homeless. Yeah, it's even worse.
(41:39):
So that's what the fact that they put it in open for public,
it's wrong. Hmm, yeah.
And are they low? Are they laws that the
government? Has to follow.
Change it. No, they don't change.
They think it's frequently. It's freedom.
People should know. It went through the court
system, yes, but it's not right.They're saying if matter happen,
(42:06):
they don't mention the name of victim.
They say for the privacy of victim, but they mentioned that
person's name. But when they mentioned that
person's name, people who know the victim or that person, they
know what was going on. It's pretty much like the fact
that they put them through theirjustice system and training
(42:27):
rehabilitation, but they don't offer them a job.
They cut their support in one part and it create problems.
So that's the same thing here aswell.
Wow. What major obstacles do you see
in reintegration and which can be overcome?
The major thing is the stuff that we discussed, the
(42:48):
government doesn't support people from A-Z.
They stop it in the middle and they first support and then they
cut the support. They make one wrong decision
that it's ruining whatever that they've done.
They cannot just support them but not offering the job in
(43:09):
local government jobs or their public any job from government.
If a person is got conviction because they did assault, they
could work in Oakland transport,but because it's a government
job, they don't accept them because they have policies.
(43:30):
Yeah. OK, so this is wrong.
Make it exception. Or the fact that they put in
their duty reintegration. There's a move on.
That's that's gone. Put it on, pass, move on.
Go and do a normal life. Then again, they put the name of
that person everywhere and then that person cannot get a job,
cannot move on, and people keep questioning them about things
(43:54):
that's wrong. Yeah.
And that, that is a conversationI had with someone else also as
well, that that a lot of these companies, organisations have
got these policies and you're not allowed to, you know, and
feel that there needs to be a change there as well.
Yeah. If you could speak to other
(44:16):
business leaders, what would youtell them about the potential
and the people that you help? To, to support us mean I do that
all the time. I'm very pushy.
I'll go to them and I say you cannot judge them.
Just give them a job and see what they do.
And if they're good, you can take them on board free, no
(44:38):
recruiting and let them to work in my company for you to check
them to see if there is a risk to take them on board or not.
After six months, one year, if you want to take them on board,
you think it's good, take them on board.
And then even though I tell thembetween six months to one year,
(44:58):
some of them after 2 and said what happened, if we want to
take this guy on board and I said no six months, they said
why? I said two months is too early
for you to make a decision, led them to work for you 6 months to
one year. And then if you think that
they're good, you can take them on board and so many of them.
Attacking them, they take them on board.
(45:19):
And it's a big shame because some of them are really good and
I spend money on their health and taste and everything and
giving them away. But then I'm thinking makes more
space for new people. Yeah.
And you know, it's, it's giving,it's giving those people a sense
of purpose, right? It's giving them a new identity.
(45:40):
Yeah, because the old identity was that they were whatever they
did if intervened. But when you give people a new
identity, then they've then theyfeel like a new person.
That's right. And so, yeah, I think it's so
important that everyone has mademistakes.
(46:02):
Yeah. And you know, everyone of us has
done something that we're not proud of.
No, right, Exactly. And everyone there are people
who have made decisions, unfortunately the wrong
decision. That's paved the path to go that
way. That's so.
But then, like for me, I remember when I was 16, I was
(46:27):
that close to becoming a street kid on the streets of
Wellington. The only thing that changed was
that and I could have ended up in prison or dead or anything
but I one moment where my best friends mum took me in and
invited me to a youth camp. I see this amazing.
(46:49):
And that changed my life my my path in.
Life, forget that person. I could have ended up on the
street. I could have been, like I said,
dead or in prison or something. So it's important that we give
these people counts and give them the benefit of the doubt
that they are going to better themselves and change.
(47:10):
We do the wrong judgement about ourself.
Like I drink and then sometimes I think definitely I'm not
drunk. I am totally sober if I'm
driving my car. But you don't know when you feel
that you're sober. But if police stop me, maybe
they're saying, okay, so you have two or three glasses of
(47:30):
wine. This is over the limit because
how I feel sober, maybe one person is drunk with one glass
of wine, one person with five. OK, but when they test you, what
they test is very different withwhat you feel.
I can say maybe so many times I could get stuck with driving,
drinking. So many of us did it, so many
(47:52):
people doing wrong, but they never get caught.
So many people doing right, but then they get misjudged or one
time they made the mistake or whatever.
And also when I'm talking about people that are working, they
don't tell the truth sometimes when like if somebody's saying
(48:13):
that, if somebody's coming to meand say I've got family issues
and I cannot work anymore, can you please write an e-mail to
EMC that I cannot work anymore? And then they're saying they
were not working for five monthseven though they finished two
weeks ago. Okay.
When I see that, I get very upset, but I think I'm not in
their situation to see what happened that they said that.
(48:36):
But it could happen to anyone tolie about something.
Yeah, there's no perfect life and nobody's perfect.
They're not perfect either, but we're not thinking about judging
them. We just want a holistic
solutions for people's life and our life because any changes
(48:58):
that we make in a community, it's affecting the whole people.
Yes, absolutely. Alright, thank you so much for
sharing all those. We added the quick fire
questions now and you can chooseto answer these questions with a
single word or short sentence. The first question is what is
your definition of success and has that definition changed for
(49:22):
you over time? Success is about being happy
about what you're doing, not fooling yourself.
Just be honest with yourself. If you wake up in the morning to
go to work and you're not thinking, ohh, not again, not
again, and not feeling that do Ilike to go to work or not?
(49:47):
And then you're working, but youare excited about what you do
and you never treat your work asa work.
It's fun that you have or it's something that you're
interested. You don't feel like that you're
working is more hobby. To me, that's the success
(50:07):
without considering the dollar that you make.
OK, if somebody pays me money tobe an IT person and saying
you're in $2,000,000 salary to be an IT person, I cannot do it
or won't be happy because that'snot me.
But if I do a job that is $100,000 per year for me, but I
(50:28):
enjoy it and I feel that I'm making a change in one person's
life. And also it's not work, it's a
hobby. That's sexist to me.
Hmm. Pretty good.
Who's been your greatest inspiration and why?
My dad, my dad and my dad had a great job at home in Iran.
(50:51):
He was involved with let's say like macro energy business,
something like that in power company.
When he came to New Zealand, because he was a very hard
working person, he said I need to work.
And I said that you can't even register yourself.
You can't say one word in English.
He learned how to be a Barber, okay?
(51:11):
And he could not say one word inEnglish.
And he had his sheet, it says 123, number 123.
He was asking people, I guess hewas unemployed just for one week
in New Zealand. He wanted to work.
He was asking me about rugby andI said why do you want to know?
I've been here for such a long time and I don't even know how
it works. He said I wanna communicate with
(51:31):
my people about rugby. And he was the sort of person
that he never ever cared about what people are thinking or
saying or doing. He was just thinking about his
own life. And he had his routine, going to
the gym, doing this, having fun.And I thought, you are so
(51:52):
fearless. He never thought, Oh my God, no.
How about if I say word that it,it's wrong or how can I work?
I'm so new. He came here when he was old,
over 60. My dad passed away at the age of
74 and he came to New Zealand when he was 60 and at that age
he was not thinking that I'm going to be retired in five
(52:16):
years. I don't need to work.
He work until the last day that he was alive.
So for me, he was the biggest inspiration in my life.
That's great. What is something that you
believe that others may disagreewith?
I believe to having fun. I am 56 and I always think if
(52:39):
I'd be alive just same age as mydad or have 18 years, 20 years.
I don't sleep much. I'm staying alive.
I'm staying awake because that gives me alive because I want to
see more people. I wanna do more things, I wanna
read more stuff and I wanna see people.
To me, people are the biggest asset in my life and I love to
(53:04):
know more people in my own smallfamily, my husband and my kids,
they're thinking you're always, are you having fun with people?
And I'm saying that's good. That's a part of life that I
enjoy. But my husband believes for
sleep 8 hours is better for my health.
Sometimes if you are lucky to have quality life.
Shorter life maybe, but enjoyingit and not putting anything like
(53:29):
a regular bar. I didn't do that.
I quite enjoy my life now, but if you ask my family, probably
they say she's always having fun.
Maybe she should have more rest,but not me.
Yeah, well, some people believe that you don't rest until you
actually gone, right? Yeah, like I remember someone
(53:53):
said you don't retire until you actually did on the ground.
Exactly. So yeah, you're right.
So if you could go back and giveyour younger self a piece of
advice, what would it be? I wish I was seeing what I'm
doing. Hmm.
Many years ago, yeah. I wish I was in a path with the
idea that I am not. Many years ago, but it's never
(54:14):
late. Well, you were being, you were
being prepared for this time, right?
Yeah. So there's it's all about timing
and we have to go through some of the adversities, some of the
challenges in life to to level. Up.
Be able to yes, it's like we need, we have to be able to be
(54:34):
able to contain what's come there for.
Us that's. Right.
And if we can't contain it, thenit's like you don't have the
resilience, the right attitude, but also the right mindset.
That's right. Yeah, you're right.
When I was 30 years old, maybe if they were telling me do this
job and I wouldn't be ready and I wouldn't have the same
(54:57):
passion. Yeah, that I have now.
Yeah. I was meeting someone few days
ago and then right beside me there were two guys sitting
beside each other dealing with passion about this many issues,
this cages of sugar. If you send it tonnes of sugar,
you send it to this country, youmake this much money.
And I was thinking they're so passionate about it, maybe
(55:19):
because of the money that is involved with it.
I'm sure they're not thinking wesend sugar to that country
because those people need sugar because avoid drug, drugs and
then but it's the money. So people have different
passions. Yeah.
And so for me, if somebody come to me today and say, how about
(55:39):
if I give you 20 million, go andhave fun, get retired, don't do
this job. Send no way, no way.
I want to do the same thing. I just enjoy it I guess.
If I don't do it, I lost something in my life.
Hmm, yeah. What is 1 message that you'd
like to share with the world? Never give up, it's never late
(56:04):
to start fresh. Never ever in studying, in job,
employment, life, family, everything.
Never give up. And also for giving things like
forgive people. People are making mistakes.
If you want to hold grudges, it hurts you before they help
others. Totally.
(56:25):
Yeah, when you forgive someone, people are thinking why you like
a door mat let people to do thisto you said no, no, you're
wrong, because when I forgive that person are free up my brain
and my mind about something taking its place and it's
bothering me all the time. Absolutely.
And last question is what does it mean to to you to be a
champion and to have a champion mindset?
(56:48):
I wish I was a champion. Where you at?
Ohh. You for the work you're doing,
you are a. Champion.
You're really kind to say that, but to have a champion mindset
is if you believe in yourself and you are true to your with
yourself, to know what are your limits, what are your abilities
(57:09):
and be honest with that, then it's totally okay if I don't
have legs. I cannot run with my legs, but I
can strong make my arms strong to push, use the wheels on the
wheelchair, right? Yeah, so we are always able to
do things, but it's the right mindset, what to use, what tools
(57:31):
to use. You need to be like that.
Awesome Allie, thank you for sharing your story with us.
It's never too late to change our paths.
Whether it's personal transformation or helping others
finding their way. Your work through MCZ Group
proves that businesses can create profound social change.
(57:54):
When lid with the heart, grit and the unshakeable belief in
people, you often say that it's all about It's all about hope,
dignity, and believing in others.
Your approach is a reminder thatwhen we include everyone, our
communities become stronger. Thank you.
So thank you so much for your sharing your journey.
If people, businesses or people looking for work who have been
(58:18):
in those situations would like to get in touch with you, how
can they can hold hold of. You said our website and MCZ
group dot NZ my phone number andalso I keep placing an ad in
social media and also in V Magazine.
(58:39):
I have different podcasts on Lucky to be in your podcast so
this way people can get hold of.Us, we'll put the we'll put all
the links and stuff into the show notes.
There's a, if you've been listening to this episode and if
it's anything that has shared has touched you, encourage you
to get in touch and also share it with someone that might
(59:02):
benefit from this episode. And lastly, I just want to say
you are loved, you are worthy. Champion your life, champion
your greatness and have an amazing day.
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