December 1, 2025 • 30 mins
What did you think of the episode? Send us a text!
What happens when a celebrated classroom teacher steps onto the policy stage and brings the kids with him? We sit down with Pennsylvania Teacher of the Year Leon Smith to trace the arc from daily bell schedules and ninth‑grade basketball practice to Capitol Hill meetings, op‑eds, and concrete fixes that help students and teachers thrive.
Leon teaches AP U.S. History, AP African American Studies, and a pop culture elective, and he brings that breadth to a candid conversation about belief, representation, and the educator pipeline. He breaks down the subtle power of mentorship—naming potential students can’t yet see—while explaining why it scales only when systems value it. We dig into the real barriers to becoming a teacher: Praxis testing roadblocks, rigid GPA cutoffs, and the costly burden of unpaid student teaching. Leon offers practical alternatives like paid teacher residencies and apprenticeships that pair novices with master teachers and link coursework to authentic classrooms.
If you care about recruiting diverse teachers, keeping great ones in the classroom, and making school feel like it belongs to students again, this conversation will meet you where you are and move you forward. Listen, share with a colleague, and tell us the one change you’ll try this week. If you enjoy the show, follow, rate, and leave a short review so more educators can find it.
Want to learn more about ChangED? Check out our website at: learn.mciu.org/changed
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_03 (00:05):
Welcome back to Change Ed.
Changed.
Change Ed.
Your favorite podcast to tuneinto and listen to all things
education.
I am one of your hosts, AndrewKuhn, Education Consultant.
SPEAKER_01 (00:19):
It feels hard for you to say.
You stutter every time.
SPEAKER_03 (00:21):
Well, I have to like think about it.
Education Consultant fromMontgomery County Intermediate
Unit.
SPEAKER_01 (00:25):
Here with me is Patrice Semichek, also out of
the Montgomery CountyIntermediate Unit, and an
educational consultant.
SPEAKER_00 (00:32):
And everyone's favorite SDF.
Tony Miramito, Carbon LehighIntermediate Unit.
SPEAKER_01 (00:36):
SDF.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
Can we just remind everyone?
Staff development facilitator.
I mean, whatever you want togive.
SPEAKER_01 (00:43):
I feel like we say it every time.
SPEAKER_00 (00:44):
Yeah, educator.
SPEAKER_03 (00:46):
You know, when the fan mail, which we've all know
we've been getting more fancy,speaking of, if you're going to
send fan mail, we need to knowhow to contact you.
Because it's actually beenamazing.
We would love to have some ofyou on, but I'd love to talk.
Let's connect.
Maybe we should wrap up ourepisode saying that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (01:05):
We should not that this is something we have to do
right now, but before we leavetoday, we should record like a
little boop that we can sayevery time at the end.
Yeah, we can slap it right in.
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
A little boop.
Let's put a little boop in the.
Please introduce our guest.
SPEAKER_03 (01:16):
All right.
Well, I I have the distinctprivilege of welcoming this
guest into the space.
I actually met this guest lastyear at the SaaS conference.
Oh yeah?
SPEAKER_01 (01:28):
Uh huh.
SPEAKER_03 (01:28):
We did.
He didn't run away from you.
Well, he didn't know any better.
But when people run, I know howto chase them down.
I know I know what to do.
SPEAKER_01 (01:36):
He's been working on his running.
SPEAKER_03 (01:39):
I am so honored to welcome and introduce to you the
two-time heavy worldweightchampion.
Oh.
And the reigning Pennsylvaniateacher of the year, Leon Smith.
Welcome, Leon.
SPEAKER_04 (01:54):
Thank you.
Thank you.
It's a pleasure to be here.
SPEAKER_03 (01:56):
We are super thrilled and excited to have
you.
And actually, this has been along time coming because we met,
what was it last a year ago?
Last December.
And I'm like, we're going tohave you on the show.
And here we are, two months awayfrom the end of your tenure.
SPEAKER_00 (02:10):
During this poor man's prep period.
We did it, yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_03 (02:13):
So, Leon, you are you are obviously actively a
teacher.
If you don't mind, just tell ouraudience a little bit about
yourself so we we have a betteridea of who this heavyweight
champion is.
SPEAKER_04 (02:22):
First of all, just thank you for letting me be on
your podcast.
I really appreciate it.
It's something just for me, Ilisten to education podcasts
like just in my free time.
So it's I enjoy just talkingabout education.
But yeah, my name is Leon Smith.
I'm in my 25th year of teachinghigh school social studies at
Haberford High School inDelaware County, AP US history.
I teach AP African AmericanStudies.
(02:44):
I teach an elective AfricanAmerican studies course for
students that, you know, don'tnecessarily want to take AP.
And then I also teach 20thcentury pop culture, which is
also an elective as well.
Oh wow.
What a fun schedule.
That is very cool.
Yep, it's a it's a good schedulethis year.
I also coach the ninth gradebasketball team.
So, and and then also outside ofschool, I've recently got into
(03:07):
policy work.
So affiliated with um Teach PlusPennsylvania, and I was a policy
fellow there for a couple years.
And then now I'm working at thefederal level with Teach Plus
doing policy work at the federallevel and just you know
advocating for policies that cansupport students and teachers.
And so that's really beenexciting for me.
(03:28):
Yeah, just really seeing likehow important our voice is as
educators, like outside of theclassroom.
SPEAKER_00 (03:34):
So what got you started into all of the the
Teach Plus work, or how'd youget involved?
SPEAKER_04 (03:39):
I think it was around 2018, 2019, and I feel
like a lot of teachers feel thisway.
I kind of was at a point where Iwas like, all right, like I
still obviously love to teach,but I wanted to see like what
else was going on.
And I I met Laura Boyce, who'sthe executive director at Teach
Plus, and she told me about afellowship they had.
And at that time, I was reallypassionate about how to get more
(04:01):
educators into the classroom,particularly educators of color,
because for many years therewere there were no educators of
color in my building.
And so Teach Plus had thesedifferent strands that you could
do as a policy fellow.
You could do literacy, you coulddo early childhood education.
And so one of their strands wasexpanding and diversifying the
educator pipeline.
(04:21):
And it was something that I hadbeen reading about on my own.
I'd just been reading about likethe legacy of educators from the
past.
And so I was like, whoa, like Iactually get a chance to do a
fellowship where I can like nerdout about something I'm very
passionate about.
And I mean, I haven't stoppedsince it just like unlocked me.
That's awesome.
SPEAKER_03 (04:39):
You know, your speech that you gave your
acceptance speech for winningthe Pennsylvania TJ Year was so
authentic.
And, you know, you shared somuch about yourself, which
really that was like we've gotto have this gentleman on the
show.
I mean, he's he's he's the realdeal.
I'm wondering if you wouldn'tmind sharing just a little bit
(04:59):
with the audience as you reflectback, what what are the things
that are so important to you?
You've actually mentioned someof them already.
Because again, a testament tohow genuine you are.
You're like, this is who I am,this is what I care about.
But you know, what would you sayare some of those things for you
that really just resonate withyou so strongly?
SPEAKER_04 (05:17):
I I think it's so important for students just to
have somebody that believes inthem.
I think one of the things thatI've learned throughout my
career is just the power of aneducator.
Certainly, you think about thefact that everybody remembers
their favorite teacher.
One of the things that I enjoyis when I speak to audiences,
just asking them who theirfavorite teacher is.
And just this joy comes oneveryone.
(05:38):
And so that really is strikingto me.
And the ability as an adult tosee something in a young person
that they may not see inthemselves is really so powerful
to me.
Cause I see it a lot of timeswhen when I'm encouraging my
students, like they're like,really?
You know, and I'm like, yeah,like you can do that, you know,
and and I feel so blessed tohave that opportunity because
(06:01):
that's really what I want to do.
Like I just want to help themreach their highest potential.
And and but I also realize that,you know, it can go the other
way too.
And so that's why I think it'simportant for our teachers to be
supported, to make sure that weunderstand what we're asking
teachers to do, because teacherscan certainly not pour from an
empty cup, you know.
And if teachers are just drainedand stressed out, then that's
(06:24):
going to impact the students.
So that's something that'sreally important to me.
And then I would also add justthe importance of
representation.
You know, when I was in school,I never had a teacher that
looked like me.
And, you know, when I was goingthrough like just kind of
growing up and where to fit in,there wasn't a lot of adults in
the school where I could kind oflook at them and maybe just talk
(06:45):
to them a little bit, pick theirbrain, you know, get a feeling
like it's gonna be okay.
Yeah.
And I did have a student teacherone time when I was in 10th
grade.
And that was the first glimpse Ihad of an educator in the
building where I could say,like, all right, there we go.
SPEAKER_01 (07:01):
You could see yourself there.
SPEAKER_04 (07:02):
Yeah, it was, it just meant a lot to me.
And so that really inspired me.
I was I also used to watch theCosby show.
And uh towards the later years,Theo started to do some
mentoring.
And I always thought it was socool the way the kids looked at
him.
He was almost like a rock star,you know, the the other
students.
And so, you know, as I got intomy first position, which I've
been in for 25 years, I waslike, this is crazy that the
(07:26):
actual reason why I became ateacher is now what I'm
experiencing, where I'm here for20 years and there's like not
one other teacher that lookslike me.
And so I said, Well, what can Ido?
Because this is such an amazingprofession.
What's happening here?
Where are we, where's thedisconnect?
And that's what really inspiredme to try to figure out what we
need to do to remove obstaclesto get more people to become
(07:49):
teachers because I think that weare the people that have such an
ability to change the world.
SPEAKER_01 (07:55):
Yep.
So, what have you found in yourresearch and what you're digging
into?
What have you found theobstacles to be?
SPEAKER_04 (08:00):
Well, certainly I think one of the things that
popped in my mind is thetesting, the praxis.
I know that's an obstacle forpeople.
There are people that I met thisone young man who, and sometimes
even the GPA, this one young manhad like a 2.9 and he the 3.0 is
is what you need.
And he had he he taught in analternative school for a year,
(08:22):
like he did all the things, andthey were just like, nope.
And I'm just sitting there likeso crazy.
What are we doing?
Like, what are we doing here?
You know, and and even to theextent where you know, we have
teacher apprenticeship, we haveteacher residency.
So if even if you want to saythat there's a probationary
period, but at least have thatteacher supported by a master
(08:42):
teacher that can guide them,because you know, we don't want
to just turn people away thathave it, you know, just have
them.
SPEAKER_01 (08:50):
Because you can have a 4.0 and not have it.
SPEAKER_04 (08:53):
See, you already know, you already know.
So that's part of it.
And I would also say, too,financial barriers, you know,
that's why I think it's so greatwith the student teacher stipend
that that we have inPennsylvania now, because you
know, we understand that that'sa hardship, you know, college
education.
SPEAKER_01 (09:09):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (09:10):
And to ask people to just stop working, yeah, but and
to pay to work.
SPEAKER_01 (09:14):
You have to pay to work.
SPEAKER_04 (09:15):
Correct.
SPEAKER_01 (09:16):
For a semester or more, yeah, it's crazy.
SPEAKER_04 (09:18):
And when you get out, you know, you're gonna have
loans and things like that.
So that's why, you know, I thinkthe apprenticeship model can be,
you know, something that's agood draw.
And then also just making surethat students feel connected in
their educator preparationprograms.
I know that as a high schoolteacher, I'm always inviting
students into the profession.
That's something that I learnedfrom Sharif Al-Meki.
(09:41):
Yeah, he's the uh head of theCenter for Black Educative
Development.
He always talks about that.
So I do that.
Like I talk to students, I said,like, did you ever think about
being a teacher?
And we talk about why they mayor may not have thought about
it.
And sometimes they'll say, Hey,you know, maybe my experience
wasn't that great.
But I let them know that, like,that's okay.
Like, you can design your ownclassroom.
SPEAKER_01 (10:02):
You can be you can be the opposite of what you had
experienced.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (10:05):
I think that sometimes, sometimes, because
listen, you know, everybody's inthis.
We got to work together.
But I do believe that sometimesin our educator preparation
programs, sometimes we just wehave to change it up a little
bit.
And there's a lot of studentsthat enter because they that
because of social justice, theywant to make a change in their
communities.
And I do think it's important tolearn about Vygotsky and Bandora
(10:26):
and Piaget and thoseindividuals.
But I do think it's alsoimportant so that students can
see the practical connectionsbetween, you know, what they're
learning and their methodscourses and how that can impact
their communities.
Because for many of them, that'swhy they came into it in the
first place.
SPEAKER_01 (10:41):
And there's a big disconnect.
The other thing, and I don'tknow if your your research would
verify any of this, it they'retired of hearing me talk about
it.
But when we're looking atunderrepresented kids in gifted
and advanced programs, we'remissing a ton of kids.
And some of those kids, we'remissing them because of the
systems that are in place thatdon't allow for them to be
found.
And then when they are found,the services that are provided
(11:02):
aren't commiserate with wherethey need services.
And I think sometimes that someof that is also connected to
this pipeline for teachers.
If I'm missing kids in this thatfeel successful and feel seen
and feel valued and recognizethat they are making strides
towards their advanced learning,I think if we did a better job
of finding these kids inschools, we might have more
(11:24):
teachers who could be like,okay, like now I've went through
a system that is validating myway of thinking and it doesn't
fit the traditional norm of howschool has been.
Maybe I can then go into thestudy of education.
SPEAKER_04 (11:35):
No, I I totally agree.
I think that there are somestudents that say, like, this
wasn't good for me.
Like, so I don't I'm not reallysure if this is what I wanna I
don't want to do this for mycareer.
SPEAKER_01 (11:46):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (11:46):
I totally agree.
SPEAKER_01 (11:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (11:47):
You were talking about the cycle of mentoring,
and that really strongly hit hita chord with me from remembering
what it was like even for me asa student, and then where I'm at
now in my life.
And you describe perfectly howit was going.
I remember when when I was astudent, people would tell me I
have a face for radio.
SPEAKER_01 (12:05):
And stop he's like, No, that's not cool.
Leon, thank you for it.
SPEAKER_03 (12:10):
He's like, No, I no, I don't I disagree.
Thank you, Leon.
But what but they would tell methings and I would say, uh, you
know, nobody can see what he didor didn't say.
So people would tell me things,and like you described, I'd be
like, What are you talkingabout?
Like, I don't see that inmyself.
We've all we've talked aboutthis before that we're we're
gonna we're in high school andwe're trying to figure out what
is our career.
(12:31):
I'm like, I don't know thesethings about myself, I haven't
been put in a position to learnthat.
So having a mentor as you'redescribing, Leon, is so powerful
to say, I really see this inyou.
Maybe, maybe it's just part ofwho you are, but it could also
be something that you want toexplore.
And I've certainly felt thatshift into that spot where now
we are kind of a lead mentor,right?
(12:53):
Because I think we all have weeven have mentors now.
I have someone who's, you know,multiple people who I'll talk to
and I want to learn more fromand tell me more about life.
Like my questions have changed,and you know, my experiences
inform those questions, but it'sthis interesting cycle that
continues on.
You know, there's a saying thatthe more you notice, the more
you know.
You know, if you don't noticesomething about yourself, you
(13:14):
can't really know it aboutyourself or learn more about it.
So that's really the power ofthe mentor.
But then on the flip side ofthat is then the more you know,
the more you notice.
So this you're you're holdingthis candle up to these students
and you're saying, hey, look,just think about this.
Or you know, I'm I I'mencouraging them to get into
education if it makes sense, butit might lead them to other
places that they didn't evenexpect.
(13:34):
And so really it ultimatelymakes me think of something
Aristotle said, which was themore you know, the more you
realize you don't know.
And that's that's really where Ithink we are as educators.
We're kind of sitting in thatspot where it's like, oh man,
like I can't even hear from you,like this love of learning,
like, give me more.
And then as you learn more,you're like, oh man, there's
even more to find out.
SPEAKER_04 (13:54):
Yeah, yeah.
No, I I totally agree.
And I think, especially at thismoment, too, I think that
there's so much that we arefaced with.
I think this post-COVID, I don'tpost, I don't even know if you
want to say post, but thisenvironment that we're living in
now, I think there's a greatopportunity to try to make sure
that we're meeting the needs ofall students.
(14:16):
Yes.
And how can we do that?
You know, certainly there's newtools out there.
Obviously, AI is a new tool, butI do think it's important for us
to focus on, think about JalenHurts.
I'm coming from the Philadelphiaarea and keeping the main thing
the main thing.
And we think about the idea oflearning and best practices, is
we we need to center that.
But also just what do ourclassrooms look like?
(14:37):
How can we create spaces thatmeet the needs of this current
generation?
One of the things that's so, Idon't know, powerful.
I've been reflecting on is likeI've seen education change in my
career, during my career.
SPEAKER_01 (14:50):
So much.
SPEAKER_04 (14:51):
And it and it's so like, to me, I don't know, it's
like weird.
Like, because as a historian,like I read about things, but
I'm at the point in my life nowwhere I'm actually like, I'm
like, whoa, like this isdifferent.
Yeah.
And I actually can tell it'sdifferent.
And so, as educators, you know,how can we meet the needs of
this new population of students?
How can we get them connected totheir communities?
(15:14):
They're excited to learn, butthey don't want to just stay
here.
They want to do something withit.
And, you know, I just want tomake sure that we take an
opportunity to jump on this timeperiod because a lot of people,
right after COVID, say, well,let's go back to normal.
I don't know.
What a wasted opportunity.
SPEAKER_01 (15:31):
We had such a great opportunity to manipulate
systems in a different way thatwould meet our kids' needs, and
we kind of drop the ball.
SPEAKER_03 (15:39):
And normal is always evolving.
I found that in most of myconversations are like, Well, I
know it's not normal.
And my response is like, but weall kind of define our own
normal.
Like, what does normal look liketo you in that space?
I don't know.
They're not going to change.
SPEAKER_01 (15:51):
That's the constant.
SPEAKER_03 (15:52):
Yes, normal is change.
But I guess what I'm saying is Ifind that a lot of people feel
like they have to justify whatthey're doing versus being like,
yeah, this this post-COVIDworld, like it's it's should be
very open.
I think you know, human instinctand nature is like, let's get
back to where we were at.
But this is the new normal,whatever that word actually
means.
SPEAKER_04 (16:12):
Yes, yeah, yes, yes.
And our and our students aredifferent.
We're all different.
Yeah.
You know, that was a obviously amajor inflection point.
And I think we're really tryingto figure out now what we can do
to try to meet the needs of ourstudents.
I think there's some positivethings happening where, you
know, even as educators, my thelanguage has changed.
You know, now we say, like, howcan we support you, right?
(16:36):
Like it's not just like, hey, Iasked you to do this thing, you
didn't do it, so now go overthere.
Like now it's like, okay, well,let's let's sit down there.
Let's figure this out.
What what were some obstacles?
Like it's a partnership.
Yeah.
And I think, you know, I've seenthat change, which I think is a
positive thing.
SPEAKER_01 (16:49):
Yeah, it's teaching them responsibility and how to
be an active member of thecommunity.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (16:53):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I have a two-part question foryou.
Your your passion just exudescoming at you, just speaking to
you.
So this is this is awesome.
You've been doing this for 25years.
Two-part question.
What do you see as the biggestchange in yourself from when you
first started to now?
SPEAKER_01 (17:06):
Good one.
SPEAKER_00 (17:06):
I can feel when you're speaking just your
passion.
How do you not get burnt out?
Because there's a there's a lotof people out there.
Two very good ones.
You either do a great job behindit or or you uh this is now
becoming a three-part episode.
Yeah.
Maybe we just need you in a turninto a couch.
Yeah, S E L.
SPEAKER_04 (17:22):
Yeah, S E L.
Getting a couch, okay.
SPEAKER_02 (17:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (17:25):
The the first one is really interesting.
I I I'll probably think ofsomething that has really been
on my mind lately.
And I would say as I became aparent, next year will be the
first year that my daughter willbe the same age as the students
that I teach.
Wow.
And like I've been reallyreflecting on that because it's
like such a heavy moment for mebecause it's always been such a
(17:45):
gap.
Yeah.
And now it's not.
And so as a result, I see thestudents differently.
I've always loved my students,but I just see them differently.
I think I have a differentperspective because many of the
things that are happening intheir homes are happening in my
home, right?
It's like, okay, who's going topractice?
All right, who's taking thisperson here?
(18:06):
And so I think that hopefullyI've provided more grace and
understanding and empathy.
We had to read this book,Culture Responsive Teaching in
the Brain, by Zaretta Hammond.
And one of the things she talksabout is being a warm demander.
And so certainly I'm someonethat has high expectations, but
I also create an environmentwhere the students know I love
(18:27):
them and I care for them andit's an environment of support.
And I think that as I've becomea parent, I think I've been
better at creating thoseenvironments because like I just
understand young people becauseI have my own and I have a
better understanding of like youin front of you.
This is someone's like mostvaluable thing.
Like in front of you, this issomething that somebody loves to
(18:48):
the end of the earth.
And I love my children in thatway.
So like I'm like, okay, let memake sure that we're we're we're
thinking of that.
So I would say that for thefirst question.
And then the second question,you know, I'm I'm very blessed.
Like my wife, my family, like Idon't do this by myself in any,
in any way.
Like, if I if I didn't have thatsupport system, I wouldn't be
(19:11):
able to do it, you know, becauseso much of life is like a
partnership and working togetherwith people.
And just the fact because mywife is an educator as well.
And so the fact that I have theability to go to conferences and
you know, that's that's becausethe other person is like, all
right, cool.
Like you're gonna be able to dothat.
Speak up the load a little bit,yeah.
Exactly, exactly.
I would also give a shout out tomy mom because my mom was a
(19:34):
longtime educator in the schooldistrict of Philadelphia.
And when I think about my mycareer, I've always been able to
go to her and just askquestions.
And she like will, you knowshe's like, hey, here's a book
that because my mom was aprincipal for a long time.
So she's like, here's a bookthat I've given to my teachers.
Here you go.
Like, and so I just feel likeI've I've always had a support
(19:55):
system, whether it's likeemotional, but also like
pedagogically, just mentorship,all of that.
A great answer.
SPEAKER_03 (20:02):
I don't have a great segue from what you just said,
because that was obviouslymultiple excellent answers.
But I want to ask you thisquestion.
Besides you, I've never met a PAteacher of the year.
SPEAKER_01 (20:12):
You met an almost PA teacher of the year, Colleen.
SPEAKER_03 (20:15):
True, true.
I've met many like I and that'sthe thing.
There are so many greatteachers, right?
And and and and you've even saidthat in your speech.
Like any one of us could be uphere because because they're all
a great bunch.
And there's the Pennsylvania isfilled with amazing educators.
I want to ask about the the lifeof a teacher of the year and
what that looks like.
Like, do you have to give backthe cyber truck?
(20:36):
Do you get to keep it?
The cyber truck.
Are you like are you like thepresident?
Like you're gonna have securitydetail for the rest of your
life?
Is it just for this year?
How do you I mean those are myquestions?
SPEAKER_04 (20:46):
Well, listen, I would first say that it has been
such a blessing and an honorbecause I love teaching.
Like it's interesting.
I've gone to workshops beforewhere they've said, like, all
right, write down like likedifferent identity questions,
like who are you?
And then like the first thing islike, but you can't say your
job.
And like I sit there for aminute, I'm like, wow, that's
(21:06):
really bad.
Because like my job is myidentity sometimes.
Like, so much of who I am is isan educator, but it has been an
honor.
It's been a whirlwind.
There's been so many marvelousthings.
I've had the opportunity tospeak to um pre-service
educators at different collegesin Pennsylvania.
I've had the opportunity to givekeynote addresses to programs
(21:28):
into the teaching profession.
I've been tremendously blessed.
I had the opportunity to be onthe Today Show.
And so I think for me, it's it'sa great chance to now have a
platform to talk about somethingthat has been like something
that I've talked about foryears, and that is how we can
recruit, retain, and hire moreeducators, specifically
(21:52):
educators of color.
And it's been something that hasbeen a passion of mine.
And now I say, wow, like I havethis platform where I can really
share my story because, youknow, when I think about Teach
Plus and the policy work thatI've been involved with, I
didn't even really know that Ihad a story.
I didn't even know that that wasa thing.
And as I learned about op-edwriting and as I've learned
(22:13):
about meeting with legislators,just how important it is to
share that story so that theycan get an understanding of like
what's going on in ourclassrooms because they they
don't always know.
And, you know, it's so importantthat they hear from us.
So that has been the mostexciting thing.
And then I would also say, Ithink that many of the students
that I've interacted with overthe years, they have just
(22:36):
reached out to me.
Like it just has doubled down onthat whole idea of the impact of
a teacher.
Just I've been so tremendouslyblessed.
Like people have that I taughtlike 20 years ago, 23 years ago,
email me and just let me knowhow they're doing.
And so that's what I tell otherpeople.
I say, like, this is so great.
Like the fact that you can besomeone that possibly someone
(22:57):
may never forget.
You can have that type of impacton someone's life.
And and so I just I've enjoyedit.
I also say it's a lot, it's avery hectic schedule.
When I've talked to people fromother states, sometimes people
are surprised that I'm not onsabbatical.
Yeah.
You know, they'll say, Oh, areyou still teaching?
And I say, Yeah, I'm I'm gradingpapers and writing lesson plans
and PLCing and you know, doingall of that, you know.
(23:21):
But it's been a is I've beenvery fortunate.
And I will also say, too, I'mjust very happy for the
community here in Havertown.
I'm so fortunate to have theadministration like they have
allowed me to, I'm I'm last yearI missed a lot of days because I
had to go to different eventsand things, and my
administration has embracedthat.
And I think it's good for thecommunity, it's good for the
(23:41):
school that you know, peoplethat go here, you know, can can
have that type of recognition.
SPEAKER_03 (23:46):
So I would like to make a special note of your
intentional avoidance of thequestion about the security
detail, which in itself is ananswer.
unknown (23:56):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (24:00):
He's got five security guards surrounding him
on the body.
SPEAKER_04 (24:08):
I will say this though, my kid, my children,
because they're young, but theylike my my son, like he'll say,
Dad, you're you're famous now.
You're famous, dad.
SPEAKER_01 (24:16):
That's nice because mine would be like, Mom, you're
cringy.
Well, choo-gee is probably whatthey would say.
Not cringy, choogy.
SPEAKER_04 (24:22):
And I'm like, okay, yes.
That's I am a son.
I am son.
You know, it's it's cool.
It's cool that my my my childrenwere there.
They got an opportunity to seethat.
You know, as parents, we just wealways want our our children to
be proud of us.
So I was just, I was so happy.
The one moment that stands out.
Andrew, definitely meeting youstands out.
SPEAKER_02 (24:43):
Oh, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_03 (24:46):
That's coming from I wouldn't tell everyone.
That's coming from the teacherof the year who's saying it was
a joy to meet me.
Thank you.
Please, please see what's goingon, folks.
Let him continue.
SPEAKER_04 (24:56):
But the one it really got me because after the
ceremony was over, my son cameup to me and I was holding it
together.
And then my son came up to me,and it was just waterworks.
Um, and it was that's a momentI'll I'll never forget.
SPEAKER_01 (25:11):
That's awesome.
SPEAKER_04 (25:12):
That's very cool.
SPEAKER_03 (25:13):
This is this question, it's important.
Is there a podcaster of theyear?
Because I would like one of youto nominate.
SPEAKER_01 (25:17):
I'm sure there is a podcaster of the year.
SPEAKER_04 (25:19):
Leon's gonna win that too.
SPEAKER_03 (25:20):
So yeah, great.
Thanks, Leon.
Yeah, great.
SPEAKER_04 (25:24):
I'll get a vote for you guys.
I love I love your interactionbecause I listened to one of
your episodes prior to comingon, and and I I love the the
back and forth.
It's really cool.
SPEAKER_01 (25:33):
It's definitely real life.
This is what it's like on andoff in the air.
We don't pretend.
SPEAKER_03 (25:38):
And that and you know what, if the behind the
scenes is that we all love beingwith each other and spending
time together.
SPEAKER_01 (25:42):
So it's well, Tony and I enjoy each other a little
bit.
SPEAKER_03 (25:45):
Yeah, and I love taking along, clearly.
But but it's three friends whoare just so committed to what
we're doing and passionate abouteducation and all in for
everything that you're saying.
We're like, yes, this man needsa platform, and and we know you
had one, but we also want to putit on our podcast so that so
four more people can hear it.
Yes, and that would be ourparents and anytime we can work
(26:05):
at jail.
SPEAKER_00 (26:06):
And hopefully your son.
I'm in for it.
SPEAKER_03 (26:08):
Let's add your kids, Leon.
Let's have them listen.
SPEAKER_04 (26:10):
So they will.
They will.
I'm gonna tell them to be like,dad, they're gonna be so
excited.
SPEAKER_03 (26:14):
Yeah, that's cool.
So, Leon, one of the things thatwe'd like to do, a tradition
here for on our podcast, is togive our guests the second to
last final thought.
And we took a vote before westarted, and it was that I had
to give the final thought.
So we're gonna give you thesecond to last final thought.
That was a unilateral decision.
SPEAKER_04 (26:30):
Well, I just well, first of all, again, thank you
for you know giving me the timeto be here.
And I and I think one of thethings I'm really thinking about
right now is not only how we canget more teachers into the
profession, but how we can keepveteran teachers there.
SPEAKER_01 (26:43):
Yep.
And one of the things when I waslistening to the yeah,
especially in the schools thatneed the veteran teachers to be
there.
I know when I was inPhiladelphia, the attrition rate
was crazy.
SPEAKER_04 (26:51):
Yes.
Yeah.
And so I think one of the thingsthat I've I've really been
interested in lately is thestrategic staffing model where
we're looking at how teacherscan be mentors, how they can be
coaches, but they can still beteachers.
And I just think that that helpson both sides.
It helps because now, as aveteran teacher, you've had your
administrator come to you andsay, Hey, like we see something
(27:13):
in you, like you're special.
We want you to now kind of be aleader of like three other
teachers, some novice teachers.
And then on the other side ofit, we know the attrition rate
for teachers one through five isvery high.
So now you have this masterteacher who feels validated.
You have teachers that are earlyin their career that is going to
get that mentorship.
And so I think, and they'regonna hopefully stay in the
(27:34):
profession.
And, you know, some people don'twant to leave the classroom, but
they want something.
They they they feel like theywant to do something else.
And so for me, that that's beenreally something I'm passionate
about.
And I I'm I'm starting to hearit gain a little bit more
traction, this idea of uhstrategic staffing.
So hopefully that'll besomething that kind of picks up
soon.
SPEAKER_01 (27:52):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (27:55):
I was gonna do a throwback to something you said
earlier.
However, you queued it up justlike we rehearsed so
beautifully, Leon.
And I'm so sorry.
The thing that you said wasteachers can't pour from an
empty cup.
And what that reminded me of wasthat when your car battery dies
and you need to jump, you'reactually borrowing some of the
(28:16):
energy from another battery toget your car up and running.
Well, if someone's walkingaround constantly jumping other
people's batteries, eventuallytheir battery runs down and they
can't continue to be thatperson.
And we see that transition ineducators when they're like, I'm
drained.
I'm done, I got nothing left.
I've done nothing but give.
It can be a system that takesand takes and takes.
(28:37):
So hearing your advocacy forhealthy balance, for empowering
each other, for building upleaders.
Because a lot of times you'll bea leader in your classroom, but
maybe not recognized as a leaderwithin the bigger system or
within the school.
So I greatly appreciate yourencouragement of that and how
you're saying let's validatethose that have been here for a
(28:57):
while.
Because honestly, that's a lotof how our society works.
We value older individualswho've been there before us.
And if we're gonna go fullcircle with this, Leon, it comes
back to what you're talkingabout being a mentor.
You're you're looking ahead,saying, look, there are mentors
ahead of me who have been herelonger than me.
And how can we value what theyhave to say?
Because I'm listening to them.
I want to hear what they have tosay.
(29:18):
We all should be doing that, andwe could learn a lot.
Well, education does lookdifferent.
Well, it is changing.
There are still valuable thingsthat we can take away from those
that have been there before usand have walked before us, and
we can learn from them, but alsohave a lot of value added, which
you're showing as well.
So, Leon, it is our pleasure tohave had you on the show.
(29:39):
Thank you.
Thank you for that.
You're someone to watch, someoneto follow, and most importantly,
someone to listen to.
So thank you for adding to ourshow.
It's been a pleasure.
And for all of our listeners,make sure you like, subscribe,
follow, share.
SPEAKER_01 (29:52):
Send us some messages with some identifying
information.
SPEAKER_03 (29:55):
Yeah, so we can get back and touch.
Yes.
Yeah.
It's been so great.
Like this is To Leon's point,this is becoming what we've
always wanted to be is amulti-way conversation.
And we love hearing from ourfans, but give us a way to get
back in touch with you becausewe want it to be a conversation,
not just fans.
SPEAKER_01 (30:11):
It feels weird to call them fans.
SPEAKER_03 (30:13):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (30:14):
Listeners.
SPEAKER_03 (30:14):
Listeners.
People who accidentally believefans of the trade.
Andrew believes they're fans.
All of my fans.
Well, I am I'm working onpodcasts of the year, so I'm
working on my own.
SPEAKER_00 (30:23):
Oh, his head's not going to fit.
Thanks again, Leon.
This is awesome.
Pleasure.
SPEAKER_04 (30:27):
Thank you guys.
SPEAKER_03 (30:28):
Hey, we appreciate you, Leon.
Take care.
Excuse me.
So we need the two timeheavyweight champion of the
world and the teacher of theyear, Leon Smith.
And for lunch today, we haveteen cuts.
SPEAKER_01 (30:41):
This is like a 45 minute announce, right?
Welcome back to Change Ed.
Changed.
Change Ed.
Your favorite podcast to tuneinto and listen to all things
education.
I am one of your hosts, AndrewKuhn, Education Consultant.
SPEAKER_01 (00:19):
It feels hard for you to say.
You stutter every time.
SPEAKER_03 (00:21):
Well, I have to like think about it.
Education Consultant fromMontgomery County Intermediate
Unit.
SPEAKER_01 (00:25):
Here with me is Patrice Semichek, also out of
the Montgomery CountyIntermediate Unit, and an
educational consultant.
SPEAKER_00 (00:32):
And everyone's favorite SDF.
Tony Miramito, Carbon LehighIntermediate Unit.
SPEAKER_01 (00:36):
SDF.
SPEAKER_00 (00:37):
Can we just remind everyone?
Staff development facilitator.
I mean, whatever you want togive.
SPEAKER_01 (00:43):
I feel like we say it every time.
SPEAKER_00 (00:44):
Yeah, educator.
SPEAKER_03 (00:46):
You know, when the fan mail, which we've all know
we've been getting more fancy,speaking of, if you're going to
send fan mail, we need to knowhow to contact you.
Because it's actually beenamazing.
We would love to have some ofyou on, but I'd love to talk.
Let's connect.
Maybe we should wrap up ourepisode saying that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (01:05):
We should not that this is something we have to do
right now, but before we leavetoday, we should record like a
little boop that we can sayevery time at the end.
Yeah, we can slap it right in.
SPEAKER_00 (01:13):
A little boop.
Let's put a little boop in the.
Please introduce our guest.
SPEAKER_03 (01:16):
All right.
Well, I I have the distinctprivilege of welcoming this
guest into the space.
I actually met this guest lastyear at the SaaS conference.
Oh yeah?
SPEAKER_01 (01:28):
Uh huh.
SPEAKER_03 (01:28):
We did.
He didn't run away from you.
Well, he didn't know any better.
But when people run, I know howto chase them down.
I know I know what to do.
SPEAKER_01 (01:36):
He's been working on his running.
SPEAKER_03 (01:39):
I am so honored to welcome and introduce to you the
two-time heavy worldweightchampion.
Oh.
And the reigning Pennsylvaniateacher of the year, Leon Smith.
Welcome, Leon.
SPEAKER_04 (01:54):
Thank you.
Thank you.
It's a pleasure to be here.
SPEAKER_03 (01:56):
We are super thrilled and excited to have
you.
And actually, this has been along time coming because we met,
what was it last a year ago?
Last December.
And I'm like, we're going tohave you on the show.
And here we are, two months awayfrom the end of your tenure.
SPEAKER_00 (02:10):
During this poor man's prep period.
We did it, yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_03 (02:13):
So, Leon, you are you are obviously actively a
teacher.
If you don't mind, just tell ouraudience a little bit about
yourself so we we have a betteridea of who this heavyweight
champion is.
SPEAKER_04 (02:22):
First of all, just thank you for letting me be on
your podcast.
I really appreciate it.
It's something just for me, Ilisten to education podcasts
like just in my free time.
So it's I enjoy just talkingabout education.
But yeah, my name is Leon Smith.
I'm in my 25th year of teachinghigh school social studies at
Haberford High School inDelaware County, AP US history.
I teach AP African AmericanStudies.
(02:44):
I teach an elective AfricanAmerican studies course for
students that, you know, don'tnecessarily want to take AP.
And then I also teach 20thcentury pop culture, which is
also an elective as well.
Oh wow.
What a fun schedule.
That is very cool.
Yep, it's a it's a good schedulethis year.
I also coach the ninth gradebasketball team.
So, and and then also outside ofschool, I've recently got into
(03:07):
policy work.
So affiliated with um Teach PlusPennsylvania, and I was a policy
fellow there for a couple years.
And then now I'm working at thefederal level with Teach Plus
doing policy work at the federallevel and just you know
advocating for policies that cansupport students and teachers.
And so that's really beenexciting for me.
(03:28):
Yeah, just really seeing likehow important our voice is as
educators, like outside of theclassroom.
SPEAKER_00 (03:34):
So what got you started into all of the the
Teach Plus work, or how'd youget involved?
SPEAKER_04 (03:39):
I think it was around 2018, 2019, and I feel
like a lot of teachers feel thisway.
I kind of was at a point where Iwas like, all right, like I
still obviously love to teach,but I wanted to see like what
else was going on.
And I I met Laura Boyce, who'sthe executive director at Teach
Plus, and she told me about afellowship they had.
And at that time, I was reallypassionate about how to get more
(04:01):
educators into the classroom,particularly educators of color,
because for many years therewere there were no educators of
color in my building.
And so Teach Plus had thesedifferent strands that you could
do as a policy fellow.
You could do literacy, you coulddo early childhood education.
And so one of their strands wasexpanding and diversifying the
educator pipeline.
(04:21):
And it was something that I hadbeen reading about on my own.
I'd just been reading about likethe legacy of educators from the
past.
And so I was like, whoa, like Iactually get a chance to do a
fellowship where I can like nerdout about something I'm very
passionate about.
And I mean, I haven't stoppedsince it just like unlocked me.
That's awesome.
SPEAKER_03 (04:39):
You know, your speech that you gave your
acceptance speech for winningthe Pennsylvania TJ Year was so
authentic.
And, you know, you shared somuch about yourself, which
really that was like we've gotto have this gentleman on the
show.
I mean, he's he's he's the realdeal.
I'm wondering if you wouldn'tmind sharing just a little bit
(04:59):
with the audience as you reflectback, what what are the things
that are so important to you?
You've actually mentioned someof them already.
Because again, a testament tohow genuine you are.
You're like, this is who I am,this is what I care about.
But you know, what would you sayare some of those things for you
that really just resonate withyou so strongly?
SPEAKER_04 (05:17):
I I think it's so important for students just to
have somebody that believes inthem.
I think one of the things thatI've learned throughout my
career is just the power of aneducator.
Certainly, you think about thefact that everybody remembers
their favorite teacher.
One of the things that I enjoyis when I speak to audiences,
just asking them who theirfavorite teacher is.
And just this joy comes oneveryone.
(05:38):
And so that really is strikingto me.
And the ability as an adult tosee something in a young person
that they may not see inthemselves is really so powerful
to me.
Cause I see it a lot of timeswhen when I'm encouraging my
students, like they're like,really?
You know, and I'm like, yeah,like you can do that, you know,
and and I feel so blessed tohave that opportunity because
(06:01):
that's really what I want to do.
Like I just want to help themreach their highest potential.
And and but I also realize that,you know, it can go the other
way too.
And so that's why I think it'simportant for our teachers to be
supported, to make sure that weunderstand what we're asking
teachers to do, because teacherscan certainly not pour from an
empty cup, you know.
And if teachers are just drainedand stressed out, then that's
(06:24):
going to impact the students.
So that's something that'sreally important to me.
And then I would also add justthe importance of
representation.
You know, when I was in school,I never had a teacher that
looked like me.
And, you know, when I was goingthrough like just kind of
growing up and where to fit in,there wasn't a lot of adults in
the school where I could kind oflook at them and maybe just talk
(06:45):
to them a little bit, pick theirbrain, you know, get a feeling
like it's gonna be okay.
Yeah.
And I did have a student teacherone time when I was in 10th
grade.
And that was the first glimpse Ihad of an educator in the
building where I could say,like, all right, there we go.
SPEAKER_01 (07:01):
You could see yourself there.
SPEAKER_04 (07:02):
Yeah, it was, it just meant a lot to me.
And so that really inspired me.
I was I also used to watch theCosby show.
And uh towards the later years,Theo started to do some
mentoring.
And I always thought it was socool the way the kids looked at
him.
He was almost like a rock star,you know, the the other
students.
And so, you know, as I got intomy first position, which I've
been in for 25 years, I waslike, this is crazy that the
(07:26):
actual reason why I became ateacher is now what I'm
experiencing, where I'm here for20 years and there's like not
one other teacher that lookslike me.
And so I said, Well, what can Ido?
Because this is such an amazingprofession.
What's happening here?
Where are we, where's thedisconnect?
And that's what really inspiredme to try to figure out what we
need to do to remove obstaclesto get more people to become
(07:49):
teachers because I think that weare the people that have such an
ability to change the world.
SPEAKER_01 (07:55):
Yep.
So, what have you found in yourresearch and what you're digging
into?
What have you found theobstacles to be?
SPEAKER_04 (08:00):
Well, certainly I think one of the things that
popped in my mind is thetesting, the praxis.
I know that's an obstacle forpeople.
There are people that I met thisone young man who, and sometimes
even the GPA, this one young manhad like a 2.9 and he the 3.0 is
is what you need.
And he had he he taught in analternative school for a year,
(08:22):
like he did all the things, andthey were just like, nope.
And I'm just sitting there likeso crazy.
What are we doing?
Like, what are we doing here?
You know, and and even to theextent where you know, we have
teacher apprenticeship, we haveteacher residency.
So if even if you want to saythat there's a probationary
period, but at least have thatteacher supported by a master
(08:42):
teacher that can guide them,because you know, we don't want
to just turn people away thathave it, you know, just have
them.
SPEAKER_01 (08:50):
Because you can have a 4.0 and not have it.
SPEAKER_04 (08:53):
See, you already know, you already know.
So that's part of it.
And I would also say, too,financial barriers, you know,
that's why I think it's so greatwith the student teacher stipend
that that we have inPennsylvania now, because you
know, we understand that that'sa hardship, you know, college
education.
SPEAKER_01 (09:09):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (09:10):
And to ask people to just stop working, yeah, but and
to pay to work.
SPEAKER_01 (09:14):
You have to pay to work.
SPEAKER_04 (09:15):
Correct.
SPEAKER_01 (09:16):
For a semester or more, yeah, it's crazy.
SPEAKER_04 (09:18):
And when you get out, you know, you're gonna have
loans and things like that.
So that's why, you know, I thinkthe apprenticeship model can be,
you know, something that's agood draw.
And then also just making surethat students feel connected in
their educator preparationprograms.
I know that as a high schoolteacher, I'm always inviting
students into the profession.
That's something that I learnedfrom Sharif Al-Meki.
(09:41):
Yeah, he's the uh head of theCenter for Black Educative
Development.
He always talks about that.
So I do that.
Like I talk to students, I said,like, did you ever think about
being a teacher?
And we talk about why they mayor may not have thought about
it.
And sometimes they'll say, Hey,you know, maybe my experience
wasn't that great.
But I let them know that, like,that's okay.
Like, you can design your ownclassroom.
SPEAKER_01 (10:02):
You can be you can be the opposite of what you had
experienced.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (10:05):
I think that sometimes, sometimes, because
listen, you know, everybody's inthis.
We got to work together.
But I do believe that sometimesin our educator preparation
programs, sometimes we just wehave to change it up a little
bit.
And there's a lot of studentsthat enter because they that
because of social justice, theywant to make a change in their
communities.
And I do think it's important tolearn about Vygotsky and Bandora
(10:26):
and Piaget and thoseindividuals.
But I do think it's alsoimportant so that students can
see the practical connectionsbetween, you know, what they're
learning and their methodscourses and how that can impact
their communities.
Because for many of them, that'swhy they came into it in the
first place.
SPEAKER_01 (10:41):
And there's a big disconnect.
The other thing, and I don'tknow if your your research would
verify any of this, it they'retired of hearing me talk about
it.
But when we're looking atunderrepresented kids in gifted
and advanced programs, we'remissing a ton of kids.
And some of those kids, we'remissing them because of the
systems that are in place thatdon't allow for them to be
found.
And then when they are found,the services that are provided
(11:02):
aren't commiserate with wherethey need services.
And I think sometimes that someof that is also connected to
this pipeline for teachers.
If I'm missing kids in this thatfeel successful and feel seen
and feel valued and recognizethat they are making strides
towards their advanced learning,I think if we did a better job
of finding these kids inschools, we might have more
(11:24):
teachers who could be like,okay, like now I've went through
a system that is validating myway of thinking and it doesn't
fit the traditional norm of howschool has been.
Maybe I can then go into thestudy of education.
SPEAKER_04 (11:35):
No, I I totally agree.
I think that there are somestudents that say, like, this
wasn't good for me.
Like, so I don't I'm not reallysure if this is what I wanna I
don't want to do this for mycareer.
SPEAKER_01 (11:46):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (11:46):
I totally agree.
SPEAKER_01 (11:47):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (11:47):
You were talking about the cycle of mentoring,
and that really strongly hit hita chord with me from remembering
what it was like even for me asa student, and then where I'm at
now in my life.
And you describe perfectly howit was going.
I remember when when I was astudent, people would tell me I
have a face for radio.
SPEAKER_01 (12:05):
And stop he's like, No, that's not cool.
Leon, thank you for it.
SPEAKER_03 (12:10):
He's like, No, I no, I don't I disagree.
Thank you, Leon.
But what but they would tell methings and I would say, uh, you
know, nobody can see what he didor didn't say.
So people would tell me things,and like you described, I'd be
like, What are you talkingabout?
Like, I don't see that inmyself.
We've all we've talked aboutthis before that we're we're
gonna we're in high school andwe're trying to figure out what
is our career.
(12:31):
I'm like, I don't know thesethings about myself, I haven't
been put in a position to learnthat.
So having a mentor as you'redescribing, Leon, is so powerful
to say, I really see this inyou.
Maybe, maybe it's just part ofwho you are, but it could also
be something that you want toexplore.
And I've certainly felt thatshift into that spot where now
we are kind of a lead mentor,right?
(12:53):
Because I think we all have weeven have mentors now.
I have someone who's, you know,multiple people who I'll talk to
and I want to learn more fromand tell me more about life.
Like my questions have changed,and you know, my experiences
inform those questions, but it'sthis interesting cycle that
continues on.
You know, there's a saying thatthe more you notice, the more
you know.
You know, if you don't noticesomething about yourself, you
(13:14):
can't really know it aboutyourself or learn more about it.
So that's really the power ofthe mentor.
But then on the flip side ofthat is then the more you know,
the more you notice.
So this you're you're holdingthis candle up to these students
and you're saying, hey, look,just think about this.
Or you know, I'm I I'mencouraging them to get into
education if it makes sense, butit might lead them to other
places that they didn't evenexpect.
(13:34):
And so really it ultimatelymakes me think of something
Aristotle said, which was themore you know, the more you
realize you don't know.
And that's that's really where Ithink we are as educators.
We're kind of sitting in thatspot where it's like, oh man,
like I can't even hear from you,like this love of learning,
like, give me more.
And then as you learn more,you're like, oh man, there's
even more to find out.
SPEAKER_04 (13:54):
Yeah, yeah.
No, I I totally agree.
And I think, especially at thismoment, too, I think that
there's so much that we arefaced with.
I think this post-COVID, I don'tpost, I don't even know if you
want to say post, but thisenvironment that we're living in
now, I think there's a greatopportunity to try to make sure
that we're meeting the needs ofall students.
(14:16):
Yes.
And how can we do that?
You know, certainly there's newtools out there.
Obviously, AI is a new tool, butI do think it's important for us
to focus on, think about JalenHurts.
I'm coming from the Philadelphiaarea and keeping the main thing
the main thing.
And we think about the idea oflearning and best practices, is
we we need to center that.
But also just what do ourclassrooms look like?
(14:37):
How can we create spaces thatmeet the needs of this current
generation?
One of the things that's so, Idon't know, powerful.
I've been reflecting on is likeI've seen education change in my
career, during my career.
SPEAKER_01 (14:50):
So much.
SPEAKER_04 (14:51):
And it and it's so like, to me, I don't know, it's
like weird.
Like, because as a historian,like I read about things, but
I'm at the point in my life nowwhere I'm actually like, I'm
like, whoa, like this isdifferent.
Yeah.
And I actually can tell it'sdifferent.
And so, as educators, you know,how can we meet the needs of
this new population of students?
How can we get them connected totheir communities?
(15:14):
They're excited to learn, butthey don't want to just stay
here.
They want to do something withit.
And, you know, I just want tomake sure that we take an
opportunity to jump on this timeperiod because a lot of people,
right after COVID, say, well,let's go back to normal.
I don't know.
What a wasted opportunity.
SPEAKER_01 (15:31):
We had such a great opportunity to manipulate
systems in a different way thatwould meet our kids' needs, and
we kind of drop the ball.
SPEAKER_03 (15:39):
And normal is always evolving.
I found that in most of myconversations are like, Well, I
know it's not normal.
And my response is like, but weall kind of define our own
normal.
Like, what does normal look liketo you in that space?
I don't know.
They're not going to change.
SPEAKER_01 (15:51):
That's the constant.
SPEAKER_03 (15:52):
Yes, normal is change.
But I guess what I'm saying is Ifind that a lot of people feel
like they have to justify whatthey're doing versus being like,
yeah, this this post-COVIDworld, like it's it's should be
very open.
I think you know, human instinctand nature is like, let's get
back to where we were at.
But this is the new normal,whatever that word actually
means.
SPEAKER_04 (16:12):
Yes, yeah, yes, yes.
And our and our students aredifferent.
We're all different.
Yeah.
You know, that was a obviously amajor inflection point.
And I think we're really tryingto figure out now what we can do
to try to meet the needs of ourstudents.
I think there's some positivethings happening where, you
know, even as educators, my thelanguage has changed.
You know, now we say, like, howcan we support you, right?
(16:36):
Like it's not just like, hey, Iasked you to do this thing, you
didn't do it, so now go overthere.
Like now it's like, okay, well,let's let's sit down there.
Let's figure this out.
What what were some obstacles?
Like it's a partnership.
Yeah.
And I think, you know, I've seenthat change, which I think is a
positive thing.
SPEAKER_01 (16:49):
Yeah, it's teaching them responsibility and how to
be an active member of thecommunity.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (16:53):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I have a two-part question foryou.
Your your passion just exudescoming at you, just speaking to
you.
So this is this is awesome.
You've been doing this for 25years.
Two-part question.
What do you see as the biggestchange in yourself from when you
first started to now?
SPEAKER_01 (17:06):
Good one.
SPEAKER_00 (17:06):
I can feel when you're speaking just your
passion.
How do you not get burnt out?
Because there's a there's a lotof people out there.
Two very good ones.
You either do a great job behindit or or you uh this is now
becoming a three-part episode.
Yeah.
Maybe we just need you in a turninto a couch.
Yeah, S E L.
SPEAKER_04 (17:22):
Yeah, S E L.
Getting a couch, okay.
SPEAKER_02 (17:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (17:25):
The the first one is really interesting.
I I I'll probably think ofsomething that has really been
on my mind lately.
And I would say as I became aparent, next year will be the
first year that my daughter willbe the same age as the students
that I teach.
Wow.
And like I've been reallyreflecting on that because it's
like such a heavy moment for mebecause it's always been such a
(17:45):
gap.
Yeah.
And now it's not.
And so as a result, I see thestudents differently.
I've always loved my students,but I just see them differently.
I think I have a differentperspective because many of the
things that are happening intheir homes are happening in my
home, right?
It's like, okay, who's going topractice?
All right, who's taking thisperson here?
(18:06):
And so I think that hopefullyI've provided more grace and
understanding and empathy.
We had to read this book,Culture Responsive Teaching in
the Brain, by Zaretta Hammond.
And one of the things she talksabout is being a warm demander.
And so certainly I'm someonethat has high expectations, but
I also create an environmentwhere the students know I love
(18:27):
them and I care for them andit's an environment of support.
And I think that as I've becomea parent, I think I've been
better at creating thoseenvironments because like I just
understand young people becauseI have my own and I have a
better understanding of like youin front of you.
This is someone's like mostvaluable thing.
Like in front of you, this issomething that somebody loves to
(18:48):
the end of the earth.
And I love my children in thatway.
So like I'm like, okay, let memake sure that we're we're we're
thinking of that.
So I would say that for thefirst question.
And then the second question,you know, I'm I'm very blessed.
Like my wife, my family, like Idon't do this by myself in any,
in any way.
Like, if I if I didn't have thatsupport system, I wouldn't be
(19:11):
able to do it, you know, becauseso much of life is like a
partnership and working togetherwith people.
And just the fact because mywife is an educator as well.
And so the fact that I have theability to go to conferences and
you know, that's that's becausethe other person is like, all
right, cool.
Like you're gonna be able to dothat.
Speak up the load a little bit,yeah.
Exactly, exactly.
I would also give a shout out tomy mom because my mom was a
(19:34):
longtime educator in the schooldistrict of Philadelphia.
And when I think about my mycareer, I've always been able to
go to her and just askquestions.
And she like will, you knowshe's like, hey, here's a book
that because my mom was aprincipal for a long time.
So she's like, here's a bookthat I've given to my teachers.
Here you go.
Like, and so I just feel likeI've I've always had a support
(19:55):
system, whether it's likeemotional, but also like
pedagogically, just mentorship,all of that.
A great answer.
SPEAKER_03 (20:02):
I don't have a great segue from what you just said,
because that was obviouslymultiple excellent answers.
But I want to ask you thisquestion.
Besides you, I've never met a PAteacher of the year.
SPEAKER_01 (20:12):
You met an almost PA teacher of the year, Colleen.
SPEAKER_03 (20:15):
True, true.
I've met many like I and that'sthe thing.
There are so many greatteachers, right?
And and and and you've even saidthat in your speech.
Like any one of us could be uphere because because they're all
a great bunch.
And there's the Pennsylvania isfilled with amazing educators.
I want to ask about the the lifeof a teacher of the year and
what that looks like.
Like, do you have to give backthe cyber truck?
(20:36):
Do you get to keep it?
The cyber truck.
Are you like are you like thepresident?
Like you're gonna have securitydetail for the rest of your
life?
Is it just for this year?
How do you I mean those are myquestions?
SPEAKER_04 (20:46):
Well, listen, I would first say that it has been
such a blessing and an honorbecause I love teaching.
Like it's interesting.
I've gone to workshops beforewhere they've said, like, all
right, write down like likedifferent identity questions,
like who are you?
And then like the first thing islike, but you can't say your
job.
And like I sit there for aminute, I'm like, wow, that's
(21:06):
really bad.
Because like my job is myidentity sometimes.
Like, so much of who I am is isan educator, but it has been an
honor.
It's been a whirlwind.
There's been so many marvelousthings.
I've had the opportunity tospeak to um pre-service
educators at different collegesin Pennsylvania.
I've had the opportunity to givekeynote addresses to programs
(21:28):
into the teaching profession.
I've been tremendously blessed.
I had the opportunity to be onthe Today Show.
And so I think for me, it's it'sa great chance to now have a
platform to talk about somethingthat has been like something
that I've talked about foryears, and that is how we can
recruit, retain, and hire moreeducators, specifically
(21:52):
educators of color.
And it's been something that hasbeen a passion of mine.
And now I say, wow, like I havethis platform where I can really
share my story because, youknow, when I think about Teach
Plus and the policy work thatI've been involved with, I
didn't even really know that Ihad a story.
I didn't even know that that wasa thing.
And as I learned about op-edwriting and as I've learned
(22:13):
about meeting with legislators,just how important it is to
share that story so that theycan get an understanding of like
what's going on in ourclassrooms because they they
don't always know.
And, you know, it's so importantthat they hear from us.
So that has been the mostexciting thing.
And then I would also say, Ithink that many of the students
that I've interacted with overthe years, they have just
(22:36):
reached out to me.
Like it just has doubled down onthat whole idea of the impact of
a teacher.
Just I've been so tremendouslyblessed.
Like people have that I taughtlike 20 years ago, 23 years ago,
email me and just let me knowhow they're doing.
And so that's what I tell otherpeople.
I say, like, this is so great.
Like the fact that you can besomeone that possibly someone
(22:57):
may never forget.
You can have that type of impacton someone's life.
And and so I just I've enjoyedit.
I also say it's a lot, it's avery hectic schedule.
When I've talked to people fromother states, sometimes people
are surprised that I'm not onsabbatical.
Yeah.
You know, they'll say, Oh, areyou still teaching?
And I say, Yeah, I'm I'm gradingpapers and writing lesson plans
and PLCing and you know, doingall of that, you know.
(23:21):
But it's been a is I've beenvery fortunate.
And I will also say, too, I'mjust very happy for the
community here in Havertown.
I'm so fortunate to have theadministration like they have
allowed me to, I'm I'm last yearI missed a lot of days because I
had to go to different eventsand things, and my
administration has embracedthat.
And I think it's good for thecommunity, it's good for the
(23:41):
school that you know, peoplethat go here, you know, can can
have that type of recognition.
SPEAKER_03 (23:46):
So I would like to make a special note of your
intentional avoidance of thequestion about the security
detail, which in itself is ananswer.
unknown (23:56):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (24:00):
He's got five security guards surrounding him
on the body.
SPEAKER_04 (24:08):
I will say this though, my kid, my children,
because they're young, but theylike my my son, like he'll say,
Dad, you're you're famous now.
You're famous, dad.
SPEAKER_01 (24:16):
That's nice because mine would be like, Mom, you're
cringy.
Well, choo-gee is probably whatthey would say.
Not cringy, choogy.
SPEAKER_04 (24:22):
And I'm like, okay, yes.
That's I am a son.
I am son.
You know, it's it's cool.
It's cool that my my my childrenwere there.
They got an opportunity to seethat.
You know, as parents, we just wealways want our our children to
be proud of us.
So I was just, I was so happy.
The one moment that stands out.
Andrew, definitely meeting youstands out.
SPEAKER_02 (24:43):
Oh, no, no, no.
SPEAKER_03 (24:46):
That's coming from I wouldn't tell everyone.
That's coming from the teacherof the year who's saying it was
a joy to meet me.
Thank you.
Please, please see what's goingon, folks.
Let him continue.
SPEAKER_04 (24:56):
But the one it really got me because after the
ceremony was over, my son cameup to me and I was holding it
together.
And then my son came up to me,and it was just waterworks.
Um, and it was that's a momentI'll I'll never forget.
SPEAKER_01 (25:11):
That's awesome.
SPEAKER_04 (25:12):
That's very cool.
SPEAKER_03 (25:13):
This is this question, it's important.
Is there a podcaster of theyear?
Because I would like one of youto nominate.
SPEAKER_01 (25:17):
I'm sure there is a podcaster of the year.
SPEAKER_04 (25:19):
Leon's gonna win that too.
SPEAKER_03 (25:20):
So yeah, great.
Thanks, Leon.
Yeah, great.
SPEAKER_04 (25:24):
I'll get a vote for you guys.
I love I love your interactionbecause I listened to one of
your episodes prior to comingon, and and I I love the the
back and forth.
It's really cool.
SPEAKER_01 (25:33):
It's definitely real life.
This is what it's like on andoff in the air.
We don't pretend.
SPEAKER_03 (25:38):
And that and you know what, if the behind the
scenes is that we all love beingwith each other and spending
time together.
SPEAKER_01 (25:42):
So it's well, Tony and I enjoy each other a little
bit.
SPEAKER_03 (25:45):
Yeah, and I love taking along, clearly.
But but it's three friends whoare just so committed to what
we're doing and passionate abouteducation and all in for
everything that you're saying.
We're like, yes, this man needsa platform, and and we know you
had one, but we also want to putit on our podcast so that so
four more people can hear it.
Yes, and that would be ourparents and anytime we can work
(26:05):
at jail.
SPEAKER_00 (26:06):
And hopefully your son.
I'm in for it.
SPEAKER_03 (26:08):
Let's add your kids, Leon.
Let's have them listen.
SPEAKER_04 (26:10):
So they will.
They will.
I'm gonna tell them to be like,dad, they're gonna be so
excited.
SPEAKER_03 (26:14):
Yeah, that's cool.
So, Leon, one of the things thatwe'd like to do, a tradition
here for on our podcast, is togive our guests the second to
last final thought.
And we took a vote before westarted, and it was that I had
to give the final thought.
So we're gonna give you thesecond to last final thought.
That was a unilateral decision.
SPEAKER_04 (26:30):
Well, I just well, first of all, again, thank you
for you know giving me the timeto be here.
And I and I think one of thethings I'm really thinking about
right now is not only how we canget more teachers into the
profession, but how we can keepveteran teachers there.
SPEAKER_01 (26:43):
Yep.
And one of the things when I waslistening to the yeah,
especially in the schools thatneed the veteran teachers to be
there.
I know when I was inPhiladelphia, the attrition rate
was crazy.
SPEAKER_04 (26:51):
Yes.
Yeah.
And so I think one of the thingsthat I've I've really been
interested in lately is thestrategic staffing model where
we're looking at how teacherscan be mentors, how they can be
coaches, but they can still beteachers.
And I just think that that helpson both sides.
It helps because now, as aveteran teacher, you've had your
administrator come to you andsay, Hey, like we see something
(27:13):
in you, like you're special.
We want you to now kind of be aleader of like three other
teachers, some novice teachers.
And then on the other side ofit, we know the attrition rate
for teachers one through five isvery high.
So now you have this masterteacher who feels validated.
You have teachers that are earlyin their career that is going to
get that mentorship.
And so I think, and they'regonna hopefully stay in the
(27:34):
profession.
And, you know, some people don'twant to leave the classroom, but
they want something.
They they they feel like theywant to do something else.
And so for me, that that's beenreally something I'm passionate
about.
And I I'm I'm starting to hearit gain a little bit more
traction, this idea of uhstrategic staffing.
So hopefully that'll besomething that kind of picks up
soon.
SPEAKER_01 (27:52):
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03 (27:55):
I was gonna do a throwback to something you said
earlier.
However, you queued it up justlike we rehearsed so
beautifully, Leon.
And I'm so sorry.
The thing that you said wasteachers can't pour from an
empty cup.
And what that reminded me of wasthat when your car battery dies
and you need to jump, you'reactually borrowing some of the
(28:16):
energy from another battery toget your car up and running.
Well, if someone's walkingaround constantly jumping other
people's batteries, eventuallytheir battery runs down and they
can't continue to be thatperson.
And we see that transition ineducators when they're like, I'm
drained.
I'm done, I got nothing left.
I've done nothing but give.
It can be a system that takesand takes and takes.
(28:37):
So hearing your advocacy forhealthy balance, for empowering
each other, for building upleaders.
Because a lot of times you'll bea leader in your classroom, but
maybe not recognized as a leaderwithin the bigger system or
within the school.
So I greatly appreciate yourencouragement of that and how
you're saying let's validatethose that have been here for a
(28:57):
while.
Because honestly, that's a lotof how our society works.
We value older individualswho've been there before us.
And if we're gonna go fullcircle with this, Leon, it comes
back to what you're talkingabout being a mentor.
You're you're looking ahead,saying, look, there are mentors
ahead of me who have been herelonger than me.
And how can we value what theyhave to say?
Because I'm listening to them.
I want to hear what they have tosay.
(29:18):
We all should be doing that, andwe could learn a lot.
Well, education does lookdifferent.
Well, it is changing.
There are still valuable thingsthat we can take away from those
that have been there before usand have walked before us, and
we can learn from them, but alsohave a lot of value added, which
you're showing as well.
So, Leon, it is our pleasure tohave had you on the show.
(29:39):
Thank you.
Thank you for that.
You're someone to watch, someoneto follow, and most importantly,
someone to listen to.
So thank you for adding to ourshow.
It's been a pleasure.
And for all of our listeners,make sure you like, subscribe,
follow, share.
SPEAKER_01 (29:52):
Send us some messages with some identifying
information.
SPEAKER_03 (29:55):
Yeah, so we can get back and touch.
Yes.
Yeah.
It's been so great.
Like this is To Leon's point,this is becoming what we've
always wanted to be is amulti-way conversation.
And we love hearing from ourfans, but give us a way to get
back in touch with you becausewe want it to be a conversation,
not just fans.
SPEAKER_01 (30:11):
It feels weird to call them fans.
SPEAKER_03 (30:13):
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (30:14):
Listeners.
SPEAKER_03 (30:14):
Listeners.
People who accidentally believefans of the trade.
Andrew believes they're fans.
All of my fans.
Well, I am I'm working onpodcasts of the year, so I'm
working on my own.
SPEAKER_00 (30:23):
Oh, his head's not going to fit.
Thanks again, Leon.
This is awesome.
Pleasure.
SPEAKER_04 (30:27):
Thank you guys.
SPEAKER_03 (30:28):
Hey, we appreciate you, Leon.
Take care.
Excuse me.
So we need the two timeheavyweight champion of the
world and the teacher of theyear, Leon Smith.
And for lunch today, we haveteen cuts.
SPEAKER_01 (30:41):
This is like a 45 minute announce, right?
Popular Podcasts
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Bobby Bones Show
Listen to 'The Bobby Bones Show' by downloading the daily full replay.