July 16, 2025 • 34 mins
In this episode, Karen sits down with her colleague Candace Thomas, Nova Scotia Health's first Vice President of Legal, as well as our General Counsel and Corporate Secretary.
Born and raised in East Preston, Nova Scotia - one of the province's 52 historic African Nova Scotian communities - Candace is used to being the first: Nova Scotia's first African Nova Scotian Deputy Attorney General, first woman and first person of colour to be chair of the Board of Governors of Dalhousie University, and first Vice President of African Nova Scotian descent at Nova Scotia Health.
Candace discusses with Karen her journey to becoming a lawyer and the essential role the legal and policy team plays in providing safe, continuous healthcare for Nova Scotians.
Note - This episode was recorded in April 2025. Candace celebrated her first anniversary with Nova Scotia Health on July 8.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hi, everybody. Hi, Candace.
Hi, Karen. How are you today?
Great. Thank you.
Happy to be here. Yeah, that's great.
So folks, we've got a a bit of atreat this afternoon.
I'm with me this afternoon is Candace Thomas and Candace join
Nova Scotia Health in less than a year, actually July 24 as the
(00:20):
Vice President, legal general counsel and corporate secretary.
So first time we kind of combined legal general counsel
and corporate secretary all in one role.
And before joining us, Candace was the deputy minister of the
Department of Justice and the Office of Equity and anti racism
(00:42):
and as well the deputy attorney general for the province.
So certainly a a long backgroundin the practice of law and also
in administering the law. So before she became a deputy,
Candace was a corporate lawyer at Storp Mckelvey.
And actually that's where I first came to know Candace when
she was practicing at Storp Mckelvey.
(01:02):
I didn't practice with you ever,Candace, but we certainly had
many occasions where paths crossed and Candace was on a
number of occasions. She has been selected as one of
the best corporate lawyers in Canada.
She received her King's Counsel at the time, I guess, Queen's
(01:23):
Counsel. We both got Queen's Counsel, now
King's Counsel, in 2017. And in addition to all of that,
Candace is an active community leader.
She's a champion of literacy andhigher education.
She's a graduate of Saint Mary'sand the school, the Shulick
School of Law at Dalhousie University and a proud native of
(01:45):
East Preston, Nova Scotia and one of the provinces 52 historic
African Nova Scotia communities.And Candace now lives in
Dartmouth with her husband and your daughter.
So, Candace, welcome to the podcast.
Thanks for inviting me. Yeah, I think you.
I think we'll have a good conversation.
(02:06):
So we call it chats on change, really trying to get to know
different people doing differentthings in our healthcare system.
And while our minds note might not quickly turn to what's the
law got to do with it, I know from your busy schedule that the
law actually has a lot to do with what we do here at Nova
(02:27):
Scotia Health. So first, before we get into
what you're doing, let's talk a little bit about your journey.
So you were a corporate lawyer at start, Mcalvey.
You went to government and then came to Nova Scotia Health.
So a couple of big changes alongthe way.
So, you know, talk a little bit about your your journey.
Share, share that with us. How did you choose make the
(02:47):
choices that you did and and howdo you find yourself here?
So it took me 20 years, more than 20 years to get here, the
start. And again, really thank you.
I really don't know how many people want to hear from lawyers
and about lawyers and. We're both lawyers can Here we
are. So here we are.
Exactly. But my, my background, it took
(03:08):
me, It certainly was not a straight path to get to where I
am now. And when I started out, I don't
know if you were clear on what you wanted to do, but I
certainly didn't know what I wanted to do when I was in law
school. And when I finished, all I knew
was that I wanted an opportunityto follow my heart and to not do
what was just expected of me as someone from one of the Black
(03:31):
communities in Nova Scotia. So we should go back, Let's go
back in time. So, you know, I actually do know
when I decided I wanted to go tolaw school.
Like, I kind of do have a recollection.
But you know, how did you even make the decision to go to law
school? Oh, that's interesting.
Wow. I took a totally different path
(03:53):
than where I thought it was going, which was either law
enforcement or fashion. I can hang on to the fashion.
Yeah, I can vouch for that. Yep.
But really it was really wantingto do something bigger and
partly because I had people encouraging me and telling me
that I could actually do this. Go to law school.
(04:14):
Go to law school. So where, where were these
people? High school people, family,
friends, Saint Mary's, You know,where, where did you, where did
these people come from? Candace.
Family mostly. So my sister, one of my oldest
sisters, ended up marrying someone who went to law school.
He they met at DAO, but he went away to London for his legal
studies. He wasn't in Novus Ocean.
(04:36):
And then my sister, after she didn't get into Med school, went
to law school and she encouragedme as well.
Perfect. And you do you have a I'm going
from memory here, but I think you do have a few sisters.
Yes, I do I. Thought so.
Yes. So that was really that set me
on the path and I always knew that I didn't want to.
(04:58):
I wanted to be able to help. I wanted a career that would
actually make me able to contribute to society.
So that took me down the path of, of law school.
The only thing I really knew was, you know, criminal law
maybe and but I didn't know whatI want to do.
So a full service firm is where I had to be headed for my
articles. And when I did that, I really
(05:18):
just kind of fell in love with corporate law, even though I
didn't have a corporate undergrad.
And so I started doing that in afull service firm.
They wouldn't and couldn't offerme a full time corporate
practice in Ottawa, which is where I articled.
And so eventually I made my way back home and when I came home I
knew I wanted to do a corporate law practice.
(05:39):
So there were two options for mein this town and I applied to
one of them and luckily they wanted me.
So I spent 20 years at Stewart Mckelvey practicing corporate
law. Yeah.
So that's, you know, that's obviously a great firm and I'm
sure you made some valuable contributions and that that's
always a two way St. practicing law at a big firm and one I know
(06:02):
well too. Yes.
So then you, you you decided to make the transition to
government. You took the role on as deputy
of justice. So, you know, that's a big
decision point as well and a huge job.
Yeah. So I was doing a lot of
transactional work, you know, Karen, So you know, a lot of
deals. And I think for some, at least
for me, I wasn't looking forwardto the next deal.
(06:25):
There was something else in my heart that I wanted to do.
I was doing pro bono work. That's the good thing about
practicing law in Nova Scotia. You don't have to do all the big
stuff to pay big rents. You can actually do the kind of
work that you want. And I was also doing my
community work and I was gettingmore satisfaction from that then
the next deal. So I started thinking about what
(06:46):
could I do next? It was hard to leave a position
as a partner in a law firm, as you know.
But once I started talking to people, opportunities presented
themselves to me. And when the one about the
deputy came, I absolutely said that is not something that I was
thinking about. I don't know how I could do
that. I'm not qualified to do that.
I'm a, I'm a corporate lawyer. What am I going to do there?
(07:09):
And I was encouraged and supported.
I talked to my husband, I talkedto the managing partner of
Stuart Mckelvey at the time, I talked to other close colleagues
and friends and ultimately foundthe confidence to say, OK, I'm
going to give this a try and I'mgoing to do it because I'll be
serving Nova Scotians in a different way than I ever
thought I could. Well, you know, Deputy Minister
of Justice and Attorney general is it's a huge job.
(07:34):
So, you know, what did you what did you learn most from that and
what was your biggest challenge?Tell us a little bit about that.
One of the biggest challenges off the top was that it was
April 1/20/20, which was the height of COVID.
Well, March 13th was the shutdown and then we you were
into it. I was into it, trying not to be
(07:54):
into it, saying you certainly don't want me to come now.
Certainly we need to wait until this is over.
And they said no, you're coming now.
So that when everyone was scrambling and trying to figure
out how to even cope and deal with continuing to to deliver
services to Nova Scotia. Well, with a team you don't
know. A team I don't know, most of
whom had been sent home. And so that transition in was
(08:18):
very challenging, but very supported by the people who I
met and who were there who said I've got you?
And they really did. And the other thing was really
instilled in confidence and, andpeople who said, who is she?
What does she know about what I do?
You know, correctional officers didn't care about some corporate
lawyer coming in, legal services, police, I mean, all of
(08:39):
those interconnecting sectors that are part of the justice
system. I had to somehow come in and say
I actually I've got this and I can play my role and I can
hopefully make a difference in the work that has to be done
here. So when you look back at the
role, what would you say was your greatest achievement in the
period of time? So with the incredible team
(09:02):
that's there and across the deputies table as well, one of
the things, and this is just oneof the things that we stood up
was the African Nova Scotian Justice Institute, which is
similar to a not quite Nova Scotia legal aid.
But it is something that is focused on some of the
(09:23):
inequities that are in the justice system around African
Nova Scotians and other people of African descent.
And actually getting that off the ground.
It was something that was being worked on for many years.
So I didn't do it alone. It was just getting it across
the finish line, establishing it, setting it up for success
from the front end was a fantastic thing to be a part of.
(09:45):
I felt really proud of that on the days that was.
Announced that's very big, I'm sure.
I'm sure that has personal, a lot of personal satisfaction,
but ramifications as well acrossyour community.
And so that's, that's a good one.
I like it. So then we were lucky to lure
you over in July. So 10 months, I guess, not even
(10:08):
8 months. And I'm sure that was a big
transition as well. So here you are.
What are you doing? What's your job?
I know what your job is, but tell people what your job is.
Well, I first have to say thank you because I wouldn't be here
if it wasn't for you. So thank you for even thinking
that I could do this job and asking me to take it on and
(10:30):
encouraging me to take. It on Yeah.
Well, you know, sometimes you just know when a person is right
for a place. So.
So that's a two way St. Candace.
So what are you doing? Well, what I'm doing is with a
very mighty team, I have to say.My role encompasses legal
services. And legal services has two
(10:51):
groups. We have a clinical and corporate
team, and we have a labor law team.
I also have the policy office, which is huge, not huge as in
size, but huge. And what they do when we talk
about scope, which is really 5 people.
And I also have the privacy team.
So, so a legal like almost the size of a law firm split into a
(11:14):
policy group and the privacy group.
So let's let's break it down, talk a little bit about the
policy group because you know, sometimes people say, well,
what, what's what policy? But actually policy is a hugely
important part of of how Nova Scotia Health conducts business.
(11:34):
And maybe you could share why why that is?
Absolutely. And I should also mention and
not forget the corporate secretary role.
Just feel there's. That too, but on the policy side
of things, what people don't realize is how critically
important I call all of these offices really in functions,
part of the foundation, like theother corporate services that
(11:55):
support Nova Scotia Health. There needs to be a skeleton and
part of that skeleton which has to be strong in order to support
all the muscles and the organs and everything else is policy
and everything that we do. In fact, we need to have strong,
clear policies that guide the work that we do for consistency,
(12:15):
to make sure that we are in compliance with rules,
legislation, the laws that govern us, and so that people
understand what they need to do.And how they should example you.
You pick something that you knowspeaks to you or that you would
like to highlight as an example.I'll highlight a real, very real
recent example and how dynamic and effective our teams work,
(12:40):
including the policy team. And that is the search policy
that had to be put in place veryrecently, as you know, in making
sure that in furtherance of a ministerial direction that was
provided. And the policy team came
together, developed that policy within a week, working of course
(13:03):
with legal services. Because there's lots of law
normally embedded and underpinning most of the policy
that we deal with. And that policy will roll out to
help ensure that people, the employees, people who come into
our facilities feel safe and aresafe.
And that's just one example of an important policy that we have
(13:25):
to deal with on a regular basis.It's a great example and you
know, it's also something that is provincial in scope, so it's
not just one place, it's the whole province.
So there's so many different factors that have to come into
play. What about consultation?
Does consultation play a role inthe development of your
policies? Yes.
(13:45):
No. No policy can be rolled up
without consultation, so our policy team, while small, must.
It's essential that they work with the subject matter experts,
the people who live with the operations each and every day.
They have the input in every policy and therefore
consultation once there's a draft of a policy before it goes
(14:07):
any further, go back to anyone that we think is going to impact
or touch on that policy. Yeah.
So that could be a clinical teamor a person or group or it could
be, you know, environmental or it could be anything really.
Exactly. So can you ballpark how many
policies we have at Nova Scotia Health?
Well, this is interesting. This brings us to the one of the
(14:29):
priorities that you gave me as soon as I started, which was we
need to really retire all of those old district health
authority policies and we're there.
The goal is April 1, April 1. OK, so you're saying this
publicly, Candace I? AM so I'll have a report for you
next week. There were over 5000 / 5000
(14:51):
policies, which is impossible for any organization to actually
understand, know or find. For example, we will be making
sure that we're streamlining thepolicies, getting rid of
duplicates, getting rid of policies that just aren't
necessary at all. We should end up, I believe with
(15:12):
fewer than 2000. That's for now and there will be
a Phase 2 when we then go into looking at those Nova Scotia
Health Authority policies and reviewing and revising and
seeing how what we should do with all of those.
Well, that's really great progress and the 5000 would have
come from, you know, 8 differenthealth authorities and and even
(15:35):
more health authorities prior tothat.
So it's the coming together of the health authorities, but the
policies never really being, youknow, reviewed or integrated or
old ones discarded. So how does anybody know what
they're supposed to do other than they know?
Of course people know their job,but when, when, when there's
something particular and you need to revert to a policy, you
(15:56):
know it's nuts. And I had to hats off to
Michelle Halliwell. She's the director of policy of
the Policy Office and her team. This has been the bane of her
existence, I'm sure. A little bit.
She's smiling these days. That's good.
I think I can say that. That's good.
Well, I'm really, you know, pleased to hear the progress and
I'm sure staff and employees will will be happy too.
OK. So that's the policy side of the
(16:17):
House. You said two legal, the kind of
transactional and then the Labour.
So how did that all break out? So Marianne Campbell is the
associate General Counsel and she leads the team that the
clinical and corporate team. So they are the, I think there's
about 9 lawyers who deal with a lot of the regular routine legal
(16:44):
services and help that physicians, employees,
leadership require each and every day.
Plus also we advise and it's an advisory obviously function and
role. I I do want to be clear here
because one thing that people seem to confuse lawyers with is
directions and telling people what to do, which is not what we
(17:05):
do. We provide advice, we give
opinions, we provide options, and then someone else, whoever
it is the decision maker, will decide what path they want to
take and how much risk they wantto assume it is risk involved.
So, you know, let's have a couple of examples.
You know, it could be purchase of equipment, it could be a
(17:26):
transaction with a significant partner, it could be some, you
know, a clinical issue, it couldbe any number of things.
Absolutely. So the legal team, we really do
touch on each and everything that happens within health.
Nothing, none of the initiativescan happen in Nova Scotia Health
(17:46):
without legal input. I can give an example from the
everyday contracts. There's a lot of contract work,
reviewing, drafting, negotiating, just providing
advice on. But then there are those
significant projects like W Bedford that we should all be
very proud of. The transitional home that is
now open. The development of that with
external counsel couldn't happenwithout an internal lawyer being
(18:10):
a part of that work, someone whoknows Nova Scotia Health
intimately. So that's an example of the huge
things that we do and some of the smaller things.
That we do, yeah, good example. And I certainly have lot have
had lots of interaction with theLabour lawyers, yes, just given,
you know, what we've had to workon over the last 18 months or
(18:31):
so. But, you know, maybe just a
sense of, of what they're doing,Candice.
Certainly led by Pat Sonnier, manager of the labor law team,
they of course mostly deal with the HRBPS and people services.
So everything from collective agreement, collective
bargaining, arbitrations, grievances, regular
(18:54):
consultations that they may get from day-to-day with
individuals, not individuals about HRBPS who have questions
about a conduct or behavior thatthey need advice on.
So anything related to the unionized labour employment
environment, that's where our labour team has input.
(19:14):
Yes. And that recognizes that we have
over 40,000 staff physicians, volunteers, learners and so
forth. So not all are unionized, of
course, but the labour and employment lawyers would
definitely, well, they're involved in a lot of files.
(19:35):
Yes, definitely. It's very broad in scope as well
and the nature of the files thatcome up, some of them could be
policy grievances to specific grievances by an individual
employee. So it's big now.
OK, Candace, what? What were some of the so you've
been here, as I say, I guess it's like 8 months, 8-9 months.
(19:58):
What were some of the biggest Ahas?
You know, I think I did tell youit was big.
You did. And, and you know, sometimes
people don't understand how big because it's a very significant
organization in size. But the issues are so complex
and deep and wide. So what were your biggest Ahas
(20:20):
your first few weeks and months?Certainly probably some of them
would have been on the privacy side, which is not a place where
I had a lot of experience. So certainly my learning curve
fairly steep there, I would say with the privacy work outside of
Foy Pop, but the the interconnectedness of what my
(20:43):
role is and the other colleaguesacross the executive leadership
team. So I knew that I could always
lean on others to assist me as Iwas in the deep end.
So certainly was Anna and Derek on my first days.
Because on the privacy file, oneof the things that probably
still keeps me up a little bit at night, but not totally would
(21:05):
be around the changes that we have to do systematic,
systematically with respect to privacy.
And the fact that we are custodians of this, really, it's
really important personal data of Nova Scotians and our fellow
employees and the importance of how we actually manage that
data. So one of the things I do feel
(21:27):
that we have to start to shift somewhat within Nova Scotia
Health is the culture of those who have access to that
information and records. Looking at it just for
curiosity's sake and not really appreciating the fact that we
have to protect the privacy assets of individuals in our
custody. So I can't remember, we, we had
(21:49):
a, we had a significant breach last year.
It was both this time last year,I think.
And so maybe just before you came and you know, we started
the shift right then and there. So, you know, it's, it's we, we,
we can't have it is the bottom line.
We, we just cannot have it. We have to protect the privacy
(22:09):
of our patients and our employees information period,
end of story. That's the law.
It's the law. There's a lot of work being
done, Karen. So I, I don't want to downplay
the efforts in the work of the policy of the privacy team.
And we have an interim director there, Cassie Hill, who is dug
in deep, working so hard and theteam that she has helping with
(22:30):
all of that work from privacy impact assessments to the Foy
pop reviews and responses. And again, as the breach
management. So we're working on more the
front end of management, gettingthe policies and protocols in
place. And then we'll be rolling out
some education as well to further impact how we can do
better. Yeah.
So it sounds like you have, you know you've got great plans for
(22:52):
each of the segments. We haven't talked about your
role as corporate secretary, maybe a quick word on that.
So in saying corporate secretarythat is to our board currently
the board service by our administrator.
So what do you do in that part of the role, Candace?
So in that that's, that's a newer role as well.
(23:13):
So what I'm doing mostly in supporting you and supporting
the administrator, Chris Power, is that I want to make sure that
we're doing what we can as far as those meetings, the regular
meetings and how we report the information that you get.
That all lends to your accountability and making sure
that you can and do have all theinformation that you should have
(23:35):
at that most senior level with administrative responsibilities
for Nova Scotia Health Authority.
Exactly. And the part of it that needs to
be public is public and, you know, can continue, continue on.
OK. So I'm going to change horses.
Thanks for that, Candace. I mean, you know, we we may have
some lawyers listening, but we may have some aspiring lawyers
(23:56):
listening too, who are always interested in knowing, like,
what does the lawyer really do, especially if they're not
practicing at a law firm? And you did tell me that you
were going to speak to students at Tallahassee next week.
I think I am. What's your topic?
I am going to talk to them aboutthe role of lawyers in executive
leadership. There you go.
(24:17):
Have you spoken at any of the other universities?
You know, do you have a willingness to, to speak to
students, talk about your journey like I, I get asked, you
know, not, not as much as I usedto.
And I do like to try to help folks.
And you know, it's sometimes as you, as you expressed, it's hard
to figure it out. So, so do you speak at other
(24:38):
places and, and what's your message to these students who
come to hear you and who will come to hear you at Dalhousie?
Yes, thanks for that question. It's critically important to
give back to the generations that are coming up behind us for
sure. We have to support, we have to
share whatever information that we can.
We can provide advice and the more that they collect and they
(24:59):
can make their life choices as they go along.
I have spoken at Saint Mary's inthe past at least twice that I
can think of. I have spoken at Dalhousie in
the law school and other faculties have invited me to
speak. This one coming up, it's the one
else as they call themselves now.
When you and I were in was we were first year, but now they're
(25:22):
one else. So this is their orientation to
law. So all of the first year class
will be there for this and I just always encourage people to
follow whatever it is that they have their interest in and do
the work to get there, but also to use connections,
relationships, critically important in whatever journey
(25:45):
you happen to take. So not to be afraid to pick up
the phone or send an e-mail or ask a question and follow up if
you've heard someone speak and they share something that you
have an interest in. So that curiosity we have to
make sure that we're always feeding in students and we
really want everyone to be successful as you know, as much
(26:07):
and its best I should say, as they can be.
So students for sure. I have a lot of time for
mentoring. I, I can't do that formal meet
every month kind of mentoring, but like you I'm sure doing the
coffee every once in a while, doing a talk for students
whenever you're asked, I can just never say no to that.
Yeah, I'm in the same boat. It's I some I go through fits
(26:30):
and starts with formal mentoring.
You know, I've had three at a time.
Right now I have an informal mentoring arrangement, but you
know, you're, you're, it's hard to say no and it's always
appreciated. And, you know, you just like to
try to treat others as you were treated.
(26:51):
And in my case, you know, I had a lot of support from a lot of
people along the way, right? And I think you probably did as
well. And you were on the you chaired
Saint Mary's board, so we have that in common as.
Well, we do. We do.
So it's, you know, students are the future.
It's it's like our young people here at Nova Scotia Health.
(27:12):
I was really excited earlier this week touring Cape Breton,
Cape Breton Regional, Straight, Richmond, St.
Martha's. What I was excited about was the
relative youth of many of the units where I visited.
So like you like to see the nicecombination of newer staff mid
(27:38):
career and then career folks that are able to mentor guidance
important. And so I saw all of that.
But but most important, I saw the youth.
So I was excited because young means future.
So it's all good now because I know you a little bit and you've
been here for, you know, some period of time.
(27:59):
I know that you have you like me, you have one daughter and
your daughter is it's Marguerite, right?
Yes, very good. Yeah.
I'm going from memory here and so I know she's a, she's a very
smart, I think she's still in school.
Am I right graduating this year or out now?
(28:21):
She's out now. She's out now.
OK, I'm wrong there. So what?
What? What was her field of study?
She's. Smarter than me.
She's in second year engineeringat Dalhousie.
Oh, at Dalhousie. Nice.
So she's doing engineering and does she like it?
She likes it. She's chosen chemical as her
field. Nice.
So I'll see if she can get into a perfumery or something.
(28:41):
We'll see. Yeah.
Well, that's good, you know, so she enjoys what she's doing.
That's excellent. And I want to go back.
So the interest that you expressed at the outset around
community activities and and so forth, what are you doing now?
I mean, you, you served as chairof the board at Dalhousie
(29:03):
University that we didn't talk about that.
So you did that for a while. But you know what, what are some
of the other things that you've done?
But more importantly, what are you doing now?
And is there anything that you would encourage people to think
about as they're considering ways that they can contribute to
the community? Absolutely.
One of the things I'm proud about and I don't get to talk
about very much, and I was Walesout of my comfort zone when I
(29:25):
did it, was Co chaired the capital campaign for the Halifax
Library. So not the building itself, but
everything that went into it we had to raise.
Money for that was a that I musthave been.
It was a. Little while ago.
Yeah, busy with some other thingthat I was doing.
But it was really a challenge for me and I'm glad I took it
on. I met some amazing people.
What we don't know in Nova Scotia sometimes is the depth of
(29:48):
the philanthropy that we have inour leaders and our business
people and others, and how much that contributes to what we're
able to do here and what drives our economy.
So another reason why when I look at volunteerism, I do it
because it's something that's important to me and my core
values, not because I'm looking to get a file or a client.
(30:10):
So depending upon what drives you, some people do it because
they think, oh, this is a good connection and networking,
That's not how I choose where I spend my time.
It has to be something that I value and I think is really
important. So really education is one of
those things. There's an organization that's
really tiny called the Afracadian Empowerment Academy
Society, and it is based in the Preston area.
(30:33):
But what we do is we are helpingindividuals get their Red Seal
certification. So anyone you can be at any age,
you could be someone who's been a contractor for 20 years but
never got your Red Seal, so therefore never really had the
kind of employment and the levelof employment or the money or
the money that you should have and that you deserve to have.
(30:54):
And the younger ones who are coming, there are projects with
Irving and others where those people are getting their red
seals. And there's a huge construction
project in, in that area for housing, as I recall.
I mean, my cottage is passed there.
So I, you know, I drive the number 7 regularly to when I get
a chance to go to my cottage and, and I'm just thinking that
(31:16):
there's a massive housing development off to the right,
isn't there? Am I wrong on that?
I think there is. I'm pretty sure there is.
So there's opportunities. Absolutely.
So doing that volunteer work is great.
And that's really a working board because it's so small, but
it still is great. I get a lot of, I feel good
about what we're doing. We're making changes in a small
way, but it it's important for people.
(31:38):
And the other thing I'm doing right now is still on the
Dartmouth General Hospital Foundation board.
And again, critically important,the foundation, what they're
doing, very progressive, great, great work, super team, people
are enthused, amazing leadership.
So I'm happy to spend my time doing that as well.
That sounds pretty good, so And have you imbued the sense into
(32:00):
your daughter as well? Does she do some of these things
or not? Or aspiring.
She's probably pretty busy with school.
She's busy with school, but she does find a little bit of time.
She has helped out at the at theAfrikanian Empowerment Academy,
for example. She's done some things there
with them. She's a a rider, so I think at
some point she'll get horse riding.
(32:21):
At some point she'll probably start giving back to Lancers,
where she spent a lot of time, but she will.
What they're into sounds good. OK, so Candace, lots to think
about. I think you've given people a
lot to think about. I don't think folks
automatically their mind doesn'tautomatically go to the legal
team or the privacy or the policy.
(32:43):
So this has been really interesting this afternoon, and
I guess I'm going to give you the last word when I ask you,
you know, where would you like to take this all?
We are like we are supporting, we want to be an important part
of of making sure that Nova Scotia Health, the direction
that it wants to go into as an innovator in providing quality
(33:07):
healthcare for all Nova Scotians.
That's what we want to just makesure that we're playing a
significant role in making sure that that happens and that
everyone feels empowered and happy to come to work every day
to be part of this. I honestly think this is a
privilege. It's a privilege that I get to
sit here, that I get to come to work every day, that I get to
work with you when others, and it's pretty amazing to see what
(33:28):
people, what Nova Scotia is really benefiting from the work
and effort of individuals. It's really amazing.
And you know, I, I always, I've said for many years, like
there's two kinds of lawyers, right?
The lawyers that find the way and the lawyers that tell you
there's no way. So I, I like to think that our,
ours under your leadership are really, you know, they're
(33:50):
finding the ways because we needthem to help us innovate.
So that mindset, that culture, that you're, the tone that
you're setting is it's, it's really helping.
So I appreciate the team, appreciate the work that you're
doing. And I'm really glad that you
shared 1/2 an hour here with us to tell us what's going on.
Thanks, Karen. It's nice to be here.
Hi, everybody. Hi, Candace.
Hi, Karen. How are you today?
Great. Thank you.
Happy to be here. Yeah, that's great.
So folks, we've got a a bit of atreat this afternoon.
I'm with me this afternoon is Candace Thomas and Candace join
Nova Scotia Health in less than a year, actually July 24 as the
(00:20):
Vice President, legal general counsel and corporate secretary.
So first time we kind of combined legal general counsel
and corporate secretary all in one role.
And before joining us, Candace was the deputy minister of the
Department of Justice and the Office of Equity and anti racism
(00:42):
and as well the deputy attorney general for the province.
So certainly a a long backgroundin the practice of law and also
in administering the law. So before she became a deputy,
Candace was a corporate lawyer at Storp Mckelvey.
And actually that's where I first came to know Candace when
she was practicing at Storp Mckelvey.
(01:02):
I didn't practice with you ever,Candace, but we certainly had
many occasions where paths crossed and Candace was on a
number of occasions. She has been selected as one of
the best corporate lawyers in Canada.
She received her King's Counsel at the time, I guess, Queen's
(01:23):
Counsel. We both got Queen's Counsel, now
King's Counsel, in 2017. And in addition to all of that,
Candace is an active community leader.
She's a champion of literacy andhigher education.
She's a graduate of Saint Mary'sand the school, the Shulick
School of Law at Dalhousie University and a proud native of
(01:45):
East Preston, Nova Scotia and one of the provinces 52 historic
African Nova Scotia communities.And Candace now lives in
Dartmouth with her husband and your daughter.
So, Candace, welcome to the podcast.
Thanks for inviting me. Yeah, I think you.
I think we'll have a good conversation.
(02:06):
So we call it chats on change, really trying to get to know
different people doing differentthings in our healthcare system.
And while our minds note might not quickly turn to what's the
law got to do with it, I know from your busy schedule that the
law actually has a lot to do with what we do here at Nova
(02:27):
Scotia Health. So first, before we get into
what you're doing, let's talk a little bit about your journey.
So you were a corporate lawyer at start, Mcalvey.
You went to government and then came to Nova Scotia Health.
So a couple of big changes alongthe way.
So, you know, talk a little bit about your your journey.
Share, share that with us. How did you choose make the
(02:47):
choices that you did and and howdo you find yourself here?
So it took me 20 years, more than 20 years to get here, the
start. And again, really thank you.
I really don't know how many people want to hear from lawyers
and about lawyers and. We're both lawyers can Here we
are. So here we are.
Exactly. But my, my background, it took
(03:08):
me, It certainly was not a straight path to get to where I
am now. And when I started out, I don't
know if you were clear on what you wanted to do, but I
certainly didn't know what I wanted to do when I was in law
school. And when I finished, all I knew
was that I wanted an opportunityto follow my heart and to not do
what was just expected of me as someone from one of the Black
(03:31):
communities in Nova Scotia. So we should go back, Let's go
back in time. So, you know, I actually do know
when I decided I wanted to go tolaw school.
Like, I kind of do have a recollection.
But you know, how did you even make the decision to go to law
school? Oh, that's interesting.
Wow. I took a totally different path
(03:53):
than where I thought it was going, which was either law
enforcement or fashion. I can hang on to the fashion.
Yeah, I can vouch for that. Yep.
But really it was really wantingto do something bigger and
partly because I had people encouraging me and telling me
that I could actually do this. Go to law school.
(04:14):
Go to law school. So where, where were these
people? High school people, family,
friends, Saint Mary's, You know,where, where did you, where did
these people come from? Candace.
Family mostly. So my sister, one of my oldest
sisters, ended up marrying someone who went to law school.
He they met at DAO, but he went away to London for his legal
studies. He wasn't in Novus Ocean.
(04:36):
And then my sister, after she didn't get into Med school, went
to law school and she encouragedme as well.
Perfect. And you do you have a I'm going
from memory here, but I think you do have a few sisters.
Yes, I do I. Thought so.
Yes. So that was really that set me
on the path and I always knew that I didn't want to.
(04:58):
I wanted to be able to help. I wanted a career that would
actually make me able to contribute to society.
So that took me down the path of, of law school.
The only thing I really knew was, you know, criminal law
maybe and but I didn't know whatI want to do.
So a full service firm is where I had to be headed for my
articles. And when I did that, I really
(05:18):
just kind of fell in love with corporate law, even though I
didn't have a corporate undergrad.
And so I started doing that in afull service firm.
They wouldn't and couldn't offerme a full time corporate
practice in Ottawa, which is where I articled.
And so eventually I made my way back home and when I came home I
knew I wanted to do a corporate law practice.
(05:39):
So there were two options for mein this town and I applied to
one of them and luckily they wanted me.
So I spent 20 years at Stewart Mckelvey practicing corporate
law. Yeah.
So that's, you know, that's obviously a great firm and I'm
sure you made some valuable contributions and that that's
always a two way St. practicing law at a big firm and one I know
(06:02):
well too. Yes.
So then you, you you decided to make the transition to
government. You took the role on as deputy
of justice. So, you know, that's a big
decision point as well and a huge job.
Yeah. So I was doing a lot of
transactional work, you know, Karen, So you know, a lot of
deals. And I think for some, at least
for me, I wasn't looking forwardto the next deal.
(06:25):
There was something else in my heart that I wanted to do.
I was doing pro bono work. That's the good thing about
practicing law in Nova Scotia. You don't have to do all the big
stuff to pay big rents. You can actually do the kind of
work that you want. And I was also doing my
community work and I was gettingmore satisfaction from that then
the next deal. So I started thinking about what
(06:46):
could I do next? It was hard to leave a position
as a partner in a law firm, as you know.
But once I started talking to people, opportunities presented
themselves to me. And when the one about the
deputy came, I absolutely said that is not something that I was
thinking about. I don't know how I could do
that. I'm not qualified to do that.
I'm a, I'm a corporate lawyer. What am I going to do there?
(07:09):
And I was encouraged and supported.
I talked to my husband, I talkedto the managing partner of
Stuart Mckelvey at the time, I talked to other close colleagues
and friends and ultimately foundthe confidence to say, OK, I'm
going to give this a try and I'mgoing to do it because I'll be
serving Nova Scotians in a different way than I ever
thought I could. Well, you know, Deputy Minister
of Justice and Attorney general is it's a huge job.
(07:34):
So, you know, what did you what did you learn most from that and
what was your biggest challenge?Tell us a little bit about that.
One of the biggest challenges off the top was that it was
April 1/20/20, which was the height of COVID.
Well, March 13th was the shutdown and then we you were
into it. I was into it, trying not to be
(07:54):
into it, saying you certainly don't want me to come now.
Certainly we need to wait until this is over.
And they said no, you're coming now.
So that when everyone was scrambling and trying to figure
out how to even cope and deal with continuing to to deliver
services to Nova Scotia. Well, with a team you don't
know. A team I don't know, most of
whom had been sent home. And so that transition in was
(08:18):
very challenging, but very supported by the people who I
met and who were there who said I've got you?
And they really did. And the other thing was really
instilled in confidence and, andpeople who said, who is she?
What does she know about what I do?
You know, correctional officers didn't care about some corporate
lawyer coming in, legal services, police, I mean, all of
(08:39):
those interconnecting sectors that are part of the justice
system. I had to somehow come in and say
I actually I've got this and I can play my role and I can
hopefully make a difference in the work that has to be done
here. So when you look back at the
role, what would you say was your greatest achievement in the
period of time? So with the incredible team
(09:02):
that's there and across the deputies table as well, one of
the things, and this is just oneof the things that we stood up
was the African Nova Scotian Justice Institute, which is
similar to a not quite Nova Scotia legal aid.
But it is something that is focused on some of the
(09:23):
inequities that are in the justice system around African
Nova Scotians and other people of African descent.
And actually getting that off the ground.
It was something that was being worked on for many years.
So I didn't do it alone. It was just getting it across
the finish line, establishing it, setting it up for success
from the front end was a fantastic thing to be a part of.
(09:45):
I felt really proud of that on the days that was.
Announced that's very big, I'm sure.
I'm sure that has personal, a lot of personal satisfaction,
but ramifications as well acrossyour community.
And so that's, that's a good one.
I like it. So then we were lucky to lure
you over in July. So 10 months, I guess, not even
(10:08):
8 months. And I'm sure that was a big
transition as well. So here you are.
What are you doing? What's your job?
I know what your job is, but tell people what your job is.
Well, I first have to say thank you because I wouldn't be here
if it wasn't for you. So thank you for even thinking
that I could do this job and asking me to take it on and
(10:30):
encouraging me to take. It on Yeah.
Well, you know, sometimes you just know when a person is right
for a place. So.
So that's a two way St. Candace.
So what are you doing? Well, what I'm doing is with a
very mighty team, I have to say.My role encompasses legal
services. And legal services has two
(10:51):
groups. We have a clinical and corporate
team, and we have a labor law team.
I also have the policy office, which is huge, not huge as in
size, but huge. And what they do when we talk
about scope, which is really 5 people.
And I also have the privacy team.
So, so a legal like almost the size of a law firm split into a
(11:14):
policy group and the privacy group.
So let's let's break it down, talk a little bit about the
policy group because you know, sometimes people say, well,
what, what's what policy? But actually policy is a hugely
important part of of how Nova Scotia Health conducts business.
(11:34):
And maybe you could share why why that is?
Absolutely. And I should also mention and
not forget the corporate secretary role.
Just feel there's. That too, but on the policy side
of things, what people don't realize is how critically
important I call all of these offices really in functions,
part of the foundation, like theother corporate services that
(11:55):
support Nova Scotia Health. There needs to be a skeleton and
part of that skeleton which has to be strong in order to support
all the muscles and the organs and everything else is policy
and everything that we do. In fact, we need to have strong,
clear policies that guide the work that we do for consistency,
(12:15):
to make sure that we are in compliance with rules,
legislation, the laws that govern us, and so that people
understand what they need to do.And how they should example you.
You pick something that you knowspeaks to you or that you would
like to highlight as an example.I'll highlight a real, very real
recent example and how dynamic and effective our teams work,
(12:40):
including the policy team. And that is the search policy
that had to be put in place veryrecently, as you know, in making
sure that in furtherance of a ministerial direction that was
provided. And the policy team came
together, developed that policy within a week, working of course
(13:03):
with legal services. Because there's lots of law
normally embedded and underpinning most of the policy
that we deal with. And that policy will roll out to
help ensure that people, the employees, people who come into
our facilities feel safe and aresafe.
And that's just one example of an important policy that we have
(13:25):
to deal with on a regular basis.It's a great example and you
know, it's also something that is provincial in scope, so it's
not just one place, it's the whole province.
So there's so many different factors that have to come into
play. What about consultation?
Does consultation play a role inthe development of your
policies? Yes.
(13:45):
No. No policy can be rolled up
without consultation, so our policy team, while small, must.
It's essential that they work with the subject matter experts,
the people who live with the operations each and every day.
They have the input in every policy and therefore
consultation once there's a draft of a policy before it goes
(14:07):
any further, go back to anyone that we think is going to impact
or touch on that policy. Yeah.
So that could be a clinical teamor a person or group or it could
be, you know, environmental or it could be anything really.
Exactly. So can you ballpark how many
policies we have at Nova Scotia Health?
Well, this is interesting. This brings us to the one of the
(14:29):
priorities that you gave me as soon as I started, which was we
need to really retire all of those old district health
authority policies and we're there.
The goal is April 1, April 1. OK, so you're saying this
publicly, Candace I? AM so I'll have a report for you
next week. There were over 5000 / 5000
(14:51):
policies, which is impossible for any organization to actually
understand, know or find. For example, we will be making
sure that we're streamlining thepolicies, getting rid of
duplicates, getting rid of policies that just aren't
necessary at all. We should end up, I believe with
(15:12):
fewer than 2000. That's for now and there will be
a Phase 2 when we then go into looking at those Nova Scotia
Health Authority policies and reviewing and revising and
seeing how what we should do with all of those.
Well, that's really great progress and the 5000 would have
come from, you know, 8 differenthealth authorities and and even
(15:35):
more health authorities prior tothat.
So it's the coming together of the health authorities, but the
policies never really being, youknow, reviewed or integrated or
old ones discarded. So how does anybody know what
they're supposed to do other than they know?
Of course people know their job,but when, when, when there's
something particular and you need to revert to a policy, you
(15:56):
know it's nuts. And I had to hats off to
Michelle Halliwell. She's the director of policy of
the Policy Office and her team. This has been the bane of her
existence, I'm sure. A little bit.
She's smiling these days. That's good.
I think I can say that. That's good.
Well, I'm really, you know, pleased to hear the progress and
I'm sure staff and employees will will be happy too.
OK. So that's the policy side of the
(16:17):
House. You said two legal, the kind of
transactional and then the Labour.
So how did that all break out? So Marianne Campbell is the
associate General Counsel and she leads the team that the
clinical and corporate team. So they are the, I think there's
about 9 lawyers who deal with a lot of the regular routine legal
(16:44):
services and help that physicians, employees,
leadership require each and every day.
Plus also we advise and it's an advisory obviously function and
role. I I do want to be clear here
because one thing that people seem to confuse lawyers with is
directions and telling people what to do, which is not what we
(17:05):
do. We provide advice, we give
opinions, we provide options, and then someone else, whoever
it is the decision maker, will decide what path they want to
take and how much risk they wantto assume it is risk involved.
So, you know, let's have a couple of examples.
You know, it could be purchase of equipment, it could be a
(17:26):
transaction with a significant partner, it could be some, you
know, a clinical issue, it couldbe any number of things.
Absolutely. So the legal team, we really do
touch on each and everything that happens within health.
Nothing, none of the initiativescan happen in Nova Scotia Health
(17:46):
without legal input. I can give an example from the
everyday contracts. There's a lot of contract work,
reviewing, drafting, negotiating, just providing
advice on. But then there are those
significant projects like W Bedford that we should all be
very proud of. The transitional home that is
now open. The development of that with
external counsel couldn't happenwithout an internal lawyer being
(18:10):
a part of that work, someone whoknows Nova Scotia Health
intimately. So that's an example of the huge
things that we do and some of the smaller things.
That we do, yeah, good example. And I certainly have lot have
had lots of interaction with theLabour lawyers, yes, just given,
you know, what we've had to workon over the last 18 months or
(18:31):
so. But, you know, maybe just a
sense of, of what they're doing,Candice.
Certainly led by Pat Sonnier, manager of the labor law team,
they of course mostly deal with the HRBPS and people services.
So everything from collective agreement, collective
bargaining, arbitrations, grievances, regular
(18:54):
consultations that they may get from day-to-day with
individuals, not individuals about HRBPS who have questions
about a conduct or behavior thatthey need advice on.
So anything related to the unionized labour employment
environment, that's where our labour team has input.
(19:14):
Yes. And that recognizes that we have
over 40,000 staff physicians, volunteers, learners and so
forth. So not all are unionized, of
course, but the labour and employment lawyers would
definitely, well, they're involved in a lot of files.
(19:35):
Yes, definitely. It's very broad in scope as well
and the nature of the files thatcome up, some of them could be
policy grievances to specific grievances by an individual
employee. So it's big now.
OK, Candace, what? What were some of the so you've
been here, as I say, I guess it's like 8 months, 8-9 months.
(19:58):
What were some of the biggest Ahas?
You know, I think I did tell youit was big.
You did. And, and you know, sometimes
people don't understand how big because it's a very significant
organization in size. But the issues are so complex
and deep and wide. So what were your biggest Ahas
(20:20):
your first few weeks and months?Certainly probably some of them
would have been on the privacy side, which is not a place where
I had a lot of experience. So certainly my learning curve
fairly steep there, I would say with the privacy work outside of
Foy Pop, but the the interconnectedness of what my
(20:43):
role is and the other colleaguesacross the executive leadership
team. So I knew that I could always
lean on others to assist me as Iwas in the deep end.
So certainly was Anna and Derek on my first days.
Because on the privacy file, oneof the things that probably
still keeps me up a little bit at night, but not totally would
(21:05):
be around the changes that we have to do systematic,
systematically with respect to privacy.
And the fact that we are custodians of this, really, it's
really important personal data of Nova Scotians and our fellow
employees and the importance of how we actually manage that
data. So one of the things I do feel
(21:27):
that we have to start to shift somewhat within Nova Scotia
Health is the culture of those who have access to that
information and records. Looking at it just for
curiosity's sake and not really appreciating the fact that we
have to protect the privacy assets of individuals in our
custody. So I can't remember, we, we had
(21:49):
a, we had a significant breach last year.
It was both this time last year,I think.
And so maybe just before you came and you know, we started
the shift right then and there. So, you know, it's, it's we, we,
we can't have it is the bottom line.
We, we just cannot have it. We have to protect the privacy
(22:09):
of our patients and our employees information period,
end of story. That's the law.
It's the law. There's a lot of work being
done, Karen. So I, I don't want to downplay
the efforts in the work of the policy of the privacy team.
And we have an interim director there, Cassie Hill, who is dug
in deep, working so hard and theteam that she has helping with
(22:30):
all of that work from privacy impact assessments to the Foy
pop reviews and responses. And again, as the breach
management. So we're working on more the
front end of management, gettingthe policies and protocols in
place. And then we'll be rolling out
some education as well to further impact how we can do
better. Yeah.
So it sounds like you have, you know you've got great plans for
(22:52):
each of the segments. We haven't talked about your
role as corporate secretary, maybe a quick word on that.
So in saying corporate secretarythat is to our board currently
the board service by our administrator.
So what do you do in that part of the role, Candace?
So in that that's, that's a newer role as well.
(23:13):
So what I'm doing mostly in supporting you and supporting
the administrator, Chris Power, is that I want to make sure that
we're doing what we can as far as those meetings, the regular
meetings and how we report the information that you get.
That all lends to your accountability and making sure
that you can and do have all theinformation that you should have
(23:35):
at that most senior level with administrative responsibilities
for Nova Scotia Health Authority.
Exactly. And the part of it that needs to
be public is public and, you know, can continue, continue on.
OK. So I'm going to change horses.
Thanks for that, Candace. I mean, you know, we we may have
some lawyers listening, but we may have some aspiring lawyers
(23:56):
listening too, who are always interested in knowing, like,
what does the lawyer really do, especially if they're not
practicing at a law firm? And you did tell me that you
were going to speak to students at Tallahassee next week.
I think I am. What's your topic?
I am going to talk to them aboutthe role of lawyers in executive
leadership. There you go.
(24:17):
Have you spoken at any of the other universities?
You know, do you have a willingness to, to speak to
students, talk about your journey like I, I get asked, you
know, not, not as much as I usedto.
And I do like to try to help folks.
And you know, it's sometimes as you, as you expressed, it's hard
to figure it out. So, so do you speak at other
(24:38):
places and, and what's your message to these students who
come to hear you and who will come to hear you at Dalhousie?
Yes, thanks for that question. It's critically important to
give back to the generations that are coming up behind us for
sure. We have to support, we have to
share whatever information that we can.
We can provide advice and the more that they collect and they
(24:59):
can make their life choices as they go along.
I have spoken at Saint Mary's inthe past at least twice that I
can think of. I have spoken at Dalhousie in
the law school and other faculties have invited me to
speak. This one coming up, it's the one
else as they call themselves now.
When you and I were in was we were first year, but now they're
(25:22):
one else. So this is their orientation to
law. So all of the first year class
will be there for this and I just always encourage people to
follow whatever it is that they have their interest in and do
the work to get there, but also to use connections,
relationships, critically important in whatever journey
(25:45):
you happen to take. So not to be afraid to pick up
the phone or send an e-mail or ask a question and follow up if
you've heard someone speak and they share something that you
have an interest in. So that curiosity we have to
make sure that we're always feeding in students and we
really want everyone to be successful as you know, as much
(26:07):
and its best I should say, as they can be.
So students for sure. I have a lot of time for
mentoring. I, I can't do that formal meet
every month kind of mentoring, but like you I'm sure doing the
coffee every once in a while, doing a talk for students
whenever you're asked, I can just never say no to that.
Yeah, I'm in the same boat. It's I some I go through fits
(26:30):
and starts with formal mentoring.
You know, I've had three at a time.
Right now I have an informal mentoring arrangement, but you
know, you're, you're, it's hard to say no and it's always
appreciated. And, you know, you just like to
try to treat others as you were treated.
(26:51):
And in my case, you know, I had a lot of support from a lot of
people along the way, right? And I think you probably did as
well. And you were on the you chaired
Saint Mary's board, so we have that in common as.
Well, we do. We do.
So it's, you know, students are the future.
It's it's like our young people here at Nova Scotia Health.
(27:12):
I was really excited earlier this week touring Cape Breton,
Cape Breton Regional, Straight, Richmond, St.
Martha's. What I was excited about was the
relative youth of many of the units where I visited.
So like you like to see the nicecombination of newer staff mid
(27:38):
career and then career folks that are able to mentor guidance
important. And so I saw all of that.
But but most important, I saw the youth.
So I was excited because young means future.
So it's all good now because I know you a little bit and you've
been here for, you know, some period of time.
(27:59):
I know that you have you like me, you have one daughter and
your daughter is it's Marguerite, right?
Yes, very good. Yeah.
I'm going from memory here and so I know she's a, she's a very
smart, I think she's still in school.
Am I right graduating this year or out now?
(28:21):
She's out now. She's out now.
OK, I'm wrong there. So what?
What? What was her field of study?
She's. Smarter than me.
She's in second year engineeringat Dalhousie.
Oh, at Dalhousie. Nice.
So she's doing engineering and does she like it?
She likes it. She's chosen chemical as her
field. Nice.
So I'll see if she can get into a perfumery or something.
(28:41):
We'll see. Yeah.
Well, that's good, you know, so she enjoys what she's doing.
That's excellent. And I want to go back.
So the interest that you expressed at the outset around
community activities and and so forth, what are you doing now?
I mean, you, you served as chairof the board at Dalhousie
(29:03):
University that we didn't talk about that.
So you did that for a while. But you know what, what are some
of the other things that you've done?
But more importantly, what are you doing now?
And is there anything that you would encourage people to think
about as they're considering ways that they can contribute to
the community? Absolutely.
One of the things I'm proud about and I don't get to talk
about very much, and I was Walesout of my comfort zone when I
(29:25):
did it, was Co chaired the capital campaign for the Halifax
Library. So not the building itself, but
everything that went into it we had to raise.
Money for that was a that I musthave been.
It was a. Little while ago.
Yeah, busy with some other thingthat I was doing.
But it was really a challenge for me and I'm glad I took it
on. I met some amazing people.
What we don't know in Nova Scotia sometimes is the depth of
(29:48):
the philanthropy that we have inour leaders and our business
people and others, and how much that contributes to what we're
able to do here and what drives our economy.
So another reason why when I look at volunteerism, I do it
because it's something that's important to me and my core
values, not because I'm looking to get a file or a client.
(30:10):
So depending upon what drives you, some people do it because
they think, oh, this is a good connection and networking,
That's not how I choose where I spend my time.
It has to be something that I value and I think is really
important. So really education is one of
those things. There's an organization that's
really tiny called the Afracadian Empowerment Academy
Society, and it is based in the Preston area.
(30:33):
But what we do is we are helpingindividuals get their Red Seal
certification. So anyone you can be at any age,
you could be someone who's been a contractor for 20 years but
never got your Red Seal, so therefore never really had the
kind of employment and the levelof employment or the money or
the money that you should have and that you deserve to have.
(30:54):
And the younger ones who are coming, there are projects with
Irving and others where those people are getting their red
seals. And there's a huge construction
project in, in that area for housing, as I recall.
I mean, my cottage is passed there.
So I, you know, I drive the number 7 regularly to when I get
a chance to go to my cottage and, and I'm just thinking that
(31:16):
there's a massive housing development off to the right,
isn't there? Am I wrong on that?
I think there is. I'm pretty sure there is.
So there's opportunities. Absolutely.
So doing that volunteer work is great.
And that's really a working board because it's so small, but
it still is great. I get a lot of, I feel good
about what we're doing. We're making changes in a small
way, but it it's important for people.
(31:38):
And the other thing I'm doing right now is still on the
Dartmouth General Hospital Foundation board.
And again, critically important,the foundation, what they're
doing, very progressive, great, great work, super team, people
are enthused, amazing leadership.
So I'm happy to spend my time doing that as well.
That sounds pretty good, so And have you imbued the sense into
(32:00):
your daughter as well? Does she do some of these things
or not? Or aspiring.
She's probably pretty busy with school.
She's busy with school, but she does find a little bit of time.
She has helped out at the at theAfrikanian Empowerment Academy,
for example. She's done some things there
with them. She's a a rider, so I think at
some point she'll get horse riding.
(32:21):
At some point she'll probably start giving back to Lancers,
where she spent a lot of time, but she will.
What they're into sounds good. OK, so Candace, lots to think
about. I think you've given people a
lot to think about. I don't think folks
automatically their mind doesn'tautomatically go to the legal
team or the privacy or the policy.
(32:43):
So this has been really interesting this afternoon, and
I guess I'm going to give you the last word when I ask you,
you know, where would you like to take this all?
We are like we are supporting, we want to be an important part
of of making sure that Nova Scotia Health, the direction
that it wants to go into as an innovator in providing quality
(33:07):
healthcare for all Nova Scotians.
That's what we want to just makesure that we're playing a
significant role in making sure that that happens and that
everyone feels empowered and happy to come to work every day
to be part of this. I honestly think this is a
privilege. It's a privilege that I get to
sit here, that I get to come to work every day, that I get to
work with you when others, and it's pretty amazing to see what
(33:28):
people, what Nova Scotia is really benefiting from the work
and effort of individuals. It's really amazing.
And you know, I, I always, I've said for many years, like
there's two kinds of lawyers, right?
The lawyers that find the way and the lawyers that tell you
there's no way. So I, I like to think that our,
ours under your leadership are really, you know, they're
(33:50):
finding the ways because we needthem to help us innovate.
So that mindset, that culture, that you're, the tone that
you're setting is it's, it's really helping.
So I appreciate the team, appreciate the work that you're
doing. And I'm really glad that you
shared 1/2 an hour here with us to tell us what's going on.
Thanks, Karen. It's nice to be here.
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