Mari Fong interviews David Shaw of The Revivalists and solo artist, and Farid Hashemi, Wim Hof Certified Instructor. David Shaw shares his story of growing up with fears, insecurities and “not feeling good enough” which led to anxiety and drug and alcohol addiction. One long night of drinking led to a fateful night that shocked and scared the hell out of David, making him decide on getting clean and sober. Hear David’s solutions for recovery which include the Wim Hof Method, what he calls “anxiety training.” We play a clip of “Shaken” from David Shaw’s new, self-titled, debut album dropped in May 2021.
Next, we have expert and certified Wim Hof instructor Farid Hashemi of E-motion Training who shares the secrets behind this unique method. Wim Hof developed these techniques after losing his wife to suicide which helped him recover both mentally and physically. Farid shares how training with Wim Hof on the snowy mountains of Poland changed his life, and how the “three pillars” of this method can benefit your life as well.
“Be brave, ask for help, and be persistent in finding the mental help that you need.” For 125+ free or affordable solutions for mental health recovery, visit: http://checkyourheadpodcast.com/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_04 (00:00):
Welcome to the Check Your Head podcast, the podcast
where notable musicians andexperts share their stories and
solutions for mental health andwellness.
I'm your host, Mari Fong, amusic journalist and life coach
for musicians, and today I'mexcited to share news of our
first benefit concert for mentalhealth with rising rock band
(00:24):
Satellite City on September 4th,2021 at the Troubadour in West
Hollywood, California.
The show benefits our friends atSweet Relief Musicians Fund and
the Check Your Head podcast, andthere's also a special.
If you buy two tickets to theshow on Troubadour.com, bring
your ticket receipt to the merchbooth and receive a free
(00:45):
Satellite City t-shirt.
How cool is that?
We'll also be partying safely,with the Troubadour requiring
proof of vaccination, so comeready to show your vaccine card.
a photo of your vaccine card, orbring a digital vaccine card.
To get your digital vaccinecard, simply Google digital
(01:06):
vaccine card, click on theCalifornia.gov website, and it
takes about 10 seconds to signup and receive your card by text
message.
It's really that easy.
You can also bring proof of anegative COVID test 48 to 72
hours prior to the show.
So come party with us and hearsome great live music for a good
(01:27):
cause.
Now to our featured guests.
Today we have asinger-songwriter, musician,
producer, and philanthropistwhose soulful rock band The
Revivalists broke out with theirsingle Wish I Knew You, which
garnered 525 million streamsglobally on YouTube, went number
one on the Billboard charts,followed by another hit single
(01:49):
entitled All My Friends.
Now with five studio albumsunder his belt, our featured
musical guest is David Shaw ofThe Revivalists, who recently
dropped his self-titled debutsolo album in May of 2021, and a
clip of his song Shaken will beplayed at the end of our
episode.
David Shaw will share how herecovered from drug and alcohol
(02:12):
addiction, his solutions foranxiety, and the one pivotal
moment in David's life thatscared him sober from ever
drinking or doing drugs again.
more than 10 years ago.
One of David's solutions foranxiety is practicing the Wim
Hof method.
So our featured expert today isa Wim Hof certified instructor,
(02:33):
Farid Hashimi of EmotionTraining.
Farid shares his experience withWim Hof, the originator of this
method.
Having trained in the snowymountains of Poland and the
Czech Republic, Wim Hof actuallydeveloped this method after
losing his wife to suicide andfound benefits both mentally and
physically.
Fareed will share these benefitstoday and how the three pillars
(02:57):
of the Wim Hof Method can workfor you too.
But first, let's hear David Shawof The Revivalists share his
story.
I wanted to congratulate you onyour self-titled debut album.
What I really enjoyed was thatyou expressed so many different
sides of you.
And I wanted to start by talkingabout Shaken, which I thought
(03:20):
was a really cool song thatspoke to some of your fears and
insecurities.
SPEAKER_02 (03:25):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_04 (03:26):
So can you explain a little bit about what those
fears and insecurities wereabout?
SPEAKER_02 (03:30):
Well, I'll just say that it's one of those things
where Things can happen to youwhen you're young, you know,
maybe you get picked on or youjust don't feel like you're good
enough.
That kind of thing can creep inslowly and then it can become
this, you know, kind of virus,just a virus of the mind.
(03:51):
And that's something that creptin a little bit and it stuck
around.
As I grew older, it manifestsits ways and really strange and
interesting ways and i thinkthat's one of the reasons why i
had such an issue with addictionsubstances i thought that they
gave me that confidence that ineeded to push through or to
(04:14):
alleviate the anxiety that i wasfeeling because i didn't feel
adequate in certain situations ididn't feel prepared i didn't
feel like i was enough so shakencame about during a time when I
wasn't feeling so great.
We were touring a ton.
I was burning the candle at bothends.
I wasn't using any substances atthis time, but it was just
(04:35):
really hard.
I wasn't sleeping very well.
We were on the bus quite a bit.
And I just realized I wasdepleted.
I needed to just do somethingfor myself to just jar me and
shake me back into reality.
I know that I've got a lot ofcourage in my heart.
I know that I'm a a brave personbecause I step out and walk that
(04:58):
wire every night.
And a lot of times it feels likeit's this big thing that I'm
just like, oh, man, I don't knowif I can conquer this.
You know what I'm saying?
But I was doing it in and outevery single night.
And I just sat down and I waslike, all right, I know that
other people feel this way.
And it's definitely not just me.
You know what I'm saying?
So I wanted to write a song formyself and others to just be
(05:19):
like, you know what?
You might not be feeling great.
You might be feeling reallydown.
You might be shaking in yourboots, but you're still there.
You're going to conquer it.
You're going to figure it out.
You're going to do what's right.
You're going to do all thethings that you need to do to be
in the moment, get there, and besatisfied with the way you feel
(05:40):
inside and just to know thatyou're enough the way that you
are.
SPEAKER_04 (05:46):
Yeah, I think that sometimes we put so much
self-pressure on ourselves.
SPEAKER_03 (05:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (05:51):
with an expectation that everything is gonna go as
planned.
And the thing is, nothing reallygoes as planned.
And we have a hard time allowingourselves to make mistakes.
But other people don't mind whenwe make mistakes because it
shows that we're trying.
You
SPEAKER_02 (06:08):
know what I mean?
Absolutely.
I've seen that when I'll flub alyric on stage and people almost
are like, yeah, he is human.
SPEAKER_04 (06:18):
Right, right, exactly.
And you said something aboutyour past and about not feeling
enough.
And sometimes mental healthissues can lead to addiction.
And sometimes addiction can leadto mental health issues.
SPEAKER_02 (06:33):
What do you
SPEAKER_04 (06:33):
think it was for you?
I
SPEAKER_02 (06:34):
think it was both, honestly.
I think it was one kind of leadin the other and then they fed
each other.
It's like this vicious cyclethat's really tough to get out
of because...
You got to get far away enoughfrom it to have a clear mind.
But then you've got to confrontall those things you've been
(06:56):
running away from.
So it's really, really tough.
You know, I still deal with itevery single day.
SPEAKER_04 (07:04):
Well, that is like you have to peel back your own
layers, things that you try tocover up, like anxieties or
insecurities.
You were saying that when youfirst started with your
addiction, When did it start tospiral out of control?
SPEAKER_02 (07:23):
I would say right when I moved down to New
Orleans.
I was probably 24 when I movedto New Orleans.
And this is like party city, youknow, and it's an amazing city
in a lot of ways.
But if you're somebody who's gota substance abuse issue going
on, it was like me going fromthe frying pan into the fire.
(07:46):
And it was everything all thetime.
Bars never close.
You've got anything at yourfingertips that you want.
I'm a musician, so I'm in thebars doing the thing.
And that was really when it juststarted to spiral.
I've met a lot of the rightpeople, but I'd also met some of
the wrong people.
(08:07):
And it just became too easy toget the things that I was
looking for.
And there you go.
SPEAKER_04 (08:14):
Well, I think...
Being in music also, you know,the whole nightlife atmosphere
and scene, it is everywhere andpeople are offering it to you
all the time.
SPEAKER_03 (08:24):
Absolutely.
It's always free.
SPEAKER_04 (08:27):
It's always free because that's the in, right?
To party with a band orsomething, you know.
But you did say that when youwere 24, you described that
night of partying and it landedyou in the hospital and it
scared the living hell out ofyou.
It
SPEAKER_02 (08:44):
did.
SPEAKER_04 (08:45):
And what is it exactly that happened for that
incident?
SPEAKER_02 (08:50):
Well, I'll just say that I was in a bar.
I had a long night.
I think I bought every singleperson in the bar shots all
night.
It's crazy.
I remember my tab was like$923.
And at that time, I had maybe$950 to my name.
You know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_03 (09:10):
So I
SPEAKER_02 (09:10):
blew my whole bank account.
But that really wasn't the thingthat got to me.
The real thing that absolutelyscared the hell out of me, and
it gives me goosebumps to thisday, is I was in a bar and a
neighbor of mine, a guy, heasked me if I needed a ride
(09:34):
home.
This was 9 a.m., mind you.
9 a.m., we're at a bar, 9 a.m.
I'm not going to name the bar,but a lot of our fans know this
place.
But he gave me a ride home, andwe went to his house for another
beer.
He has a wife.
He had two kids.
Met his two kids.
And then I don't rememberanything.
(09:57):
And then I remember I'm wakingup at my house, mind you,
basically butt naked.
We're getting deep here.
I've told this story before.
one other time, but we'regetting deep here.
And the guy was trying to havehis way with me.
Luckily, our guitarist, he waswalking by at the same time and
(10:20):
comes in the house, sees thedoors open, comes in the house,
this guy runs out.
Crazy.
This is insane.
I can't even believe this.
Every time I tell him, I justget chills.
And he goes, what's going on?
What the hell?
What is happening?
You know, I'm And I'm completelygone.
I'm like roofied, you know?
SPEAKER_04 (10:42):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (10:42):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So the paramedics come, theygive me some smelling salts.
I remember waking up and it'sfunny because I remember saying
something really funny and justmake it, make it every, that's
the only memory I have of likethem putting me on the little
stretcher and carrying me downinto the ambulance.
So yeah, they said my vitalswere pretty low.
(11:04):
It was just not a goodsituation.
I almost, got raped, you know,so yeah, not good.
And that really scared the, thatscared me straight.
SPEAKER_04 (11:18):
Well, when I read about that, I thought that you
had maybe drank too much, takendrugs on your own volition and
maybe overdosed or something,but you never know what's in
your drink as somebody who'soffering you something, uh, And
I've had other people tell mesomething similar to what you're
(11:38):
saying.
And that is really a traumaticexperience.
And from that, what was the nextstep for you?
I mean, it's hard enough toprocess that.
And thank God your guitarist wasthere.
And oh my gosh, thank God.
You know, what was it that youlearned from that experience?
SPEAKER_02 (11:57):
I learned that I don't think I could trust myself
fully at the time.
And I realized that I needed tobe able to rely on myself
because those things can justhappen.
Because I'm just a very trustingindividual.
I'm a Midwesterner.
And like I said, this person wasmy neighbor.
He's got two kids.
Right,
SPEAKER_04 (12:16):
right.
You would never, ever expectanything
SPEAKER_02 (12:18):
like that.
Never expect that.
But that just really made me go,okay, there are true predators
out there.
And you can't see that coming.
You know what I'm
SPEAKER_03 (12:27):
saying?
UNKNOWN (12:27):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_02 (12:27):
I just realized I was like, all right, if I'm
going to make it in this life,I'm going to need to keep my
faculties upon me.
SPEAKER_04 (12:35):
Well, that was really it is really being
conscious and aware all the timeto protect yourself.
Because there was a time whereyou mentioned you were drinking
and there was cocaine, you know,heroin, those kinds of things.
I mean, was there a point whereyou
SPEAKER_02 (12:50):
said...
I never shot it up or anything.
I only had a little bit of that,but never, never.
Okay,
SPEAKER_04 (12:59):
that's good to hear.
Now, was there a point where yousaid, I want to go completely
sober?
Or was it a gradual process?
SPEAKER_02 (13:09):
Um, it was a gradual process.
And then it was like, okay, thisis it.
You know, it was tough.
It's tough.
It's still tough to this day,because there's things that are
probably okay for me, you know,but then there's also the Now
that leads to something else andthat leads to that and that
leads to that.
And now I'm right back where Istarted very quickly.
SPEAKER_04 (13:30):
Yeah, I mean, I've talked to so many musicians
about, you know, mental healthand addiction.
And oftentimes it gets to be anaddictive personality where you,
you
SPEAKER_03 (13:39):
know,
SPEAKER_04 (13:39):
it's hard to start and then do anything in
moderation.
Did you find that with yourself?
Because there's oftentimes a lotof starts and stops and so many
stories along that journey.
I
SPEAKER_02 (13:54):
was getting that for a little while.
And I haven't had a sip ofalcohol since that night.
Dabbled in a few other thingshere and there.
But alcohol and cocaine and anyreally hard thing, that was the
time where it just ceased toexist in my life.
Because if you get alcohol andme going, All my inhibitions go
(14:17):
out the window.
Everything becomes an okay atthat moment.
So I knew that's a no-go.
So it's been a winding road, butI've got a really great handle
on how I'm feeling about allthat right now.
And I'm just taking it one dayat a time.
That's all I can do.
SPEAKER_04 (14:35):
Well, I really congratulate you on that journey
because 10 years is really agood, strong amount of time.
And I know that there's beenstruggles within that time.
You know, it takes a lot ofdiscipline, a lot of discipline.
And so big props to that.
(14:56):
You know, one thing.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely.
You know, one thing youmentioned, you said something
about getting into drugs andrunning away from the things
that we're trying to not lookat.
I know you've done therapy andyou've done different things for
your wellness.
What were some of the thingsthat you think you were running
away from
SPEAKER_03 (15:16):
or
SPEAKER_04 (15:19):
issues or situations?
SPEAKER_02 (15:22):
I think it's a lot of anxiety, just anxiety.
And I don't know if I can put myfinger on one thing or the
other.
And sometimes it can be justlike, oh, I got to do this one
thing.
Oh, man, I got to do that.
You never know when it's goingto come.
It's pretty much a crapshootwhen it comes to that.
Because there could be thingswhere I'm like, oh, man, I don't
(15:43):
think I'm going to be feelingthis.
And then I feel fine.
But then it could be this littlething.
I'm like, oh.
And then it really hits me.
So that's one of those thingswhere I think therapy has helped
me a lot to just go in anddissect various layers of what
could potentially be causingwhat and why I'm feeling a
(16:04):
certain way.
So, yeah, I'm still figuringthat out, honestly.
SPEAKER_04 (16:09):
Because we've had musicians come on and talk about
panic attacks, and I'm not sureif your anxiety has ever gotten
to that level.
SPEAKER_02 (16:15):
It hasn't gotten to that level.
SPEAKER_04 (16:17):
Okay.
But you mentioned breathingexercises and a certain method
that you learned.
Can you explain that?
Because I found that breathingmethods seem to really help with
anxiety.
SPEAKER_02 (16:30):
Yes.
SPEAKER_04 (16:32):
What's this method that you're talking about?
SPEAKER_02 (16:34):
Well, it's the Wim Hof breathing method.
And it's like anxiety training.
Because what I've found is thatwhen you're doing these fast
breaths, it can almost likehyperventilate you.
Not totally, but like a littlebit.
And what it does is it superoxygenates your blood.
But on the other side of it, itgives you a little anxiety, you
(16:57):
know?
Or at least it does for me.
And it feels like anxietytraining.
It feels like it really helpswith changing the relationship
that you have.
with the anxiety, basically.
That's where a lot of the changeoccurred with me was when I
realized that this is a thing weall have to deal with, some to
different varying degrees.
Me being someone who's alwaysperforming, it's going to be a
(17:20):
little more in my life.
So I needed to change therelationship I had to anxiety.
Now I call it that juice.
SPEAKER_04 (17:29):
It's a little bit of an adrenaline thing.
So It could help you on stage asfar as energy levels.
So this, the Wim Hof method, isit more breathing quickly to get
used to that feeling or is it aslowing down of your breathing?
SPEAKER_02 (17:44):
So, so you do these quick in and outs like you do
that.
Okay.
Wow.
Yeah, 50 times.
And so it's in as far as you canand then out, not all the way
(18:04):
out, like pretty much all theway out, but you're not like
really expelling all the airout.
You do that 50 times.
And then when you breathe out,you hold it.
You will be amazed because whenyou're sitting there, your brain
will go, okay, time to get someoxygen from the blood.
And you'll start to go, oh, God,okay.
(18:27):
I need to breathe.
I need to breathe.
But if you just give it asecond, it basically goes, okay,
we got what we need.
I'm telling you, it's trulyamazing.
It really is.
I can hold my breath for fourminutes.
(18:47):
And it's not about holding yourbreath.
It's not a contest or anything.
But the fact that you don'tfreak out, that's a big thing.
You know what I'm saying?
So it definitely calms me, butit's really, yeah, I don't know.
I like
SPEAKER_04 (19:03):
that whole idea of oxygenating your blood because
then everything goes to all yourmajor organs, right?
Everything gets energized.
SPEAKER_02 (19:11):
The thing that really honestly has helped me is
the cold therapy.
Okay.
That's a Wim Hof thing as well.
And just taking a cold shower.
And I will say the colder, thebetter for sure.
And they say that you can'ttrain the autonomic nervous
system.
It's just, it happens.
It's on auto.
But through various things likecold therapy, he has shown that
(19:35):
you
SPEAKER_03 (19:35):
can
SPEAKER_02 (19:36):
regulate these things and not go into freak out
mode when you do jump into a hottub that's filled with ice and
the water's 37 degrees.
Human body can withstand that.
Now, I'm not telling anybody tojust go and do that because I
got to work up to that.
(19:58):
But that's not to say that, youknow, you can't do it.
It's all about awakening thesethings that have basically been
laying dormant in our body for awhile because we live these very
comfortable lifestyles.
And so this is just one waythat, you know, we can wake up
some of our DNA, some of thestuff that's in us that we don't
even notice there.
SPEAKER_04 (20:19):
The cold therapy, I've heard sometimes when people
get really anxious or they startto spiral, they will splash cold
water on their face just toshock it into stopping that
whole spiraling.
SPEAKER_02 (20:34):
Absolutely.
If you have anxiety and you takea cold shower, it just crushes
SPEAKER_04 (20:40):
it.
I think I'm going to get a WimHof method expert on your
episode so they could explainthat a little bit more.
SPEAKER_02 (20:47):
That would be amazing.
SPEAKER_04 (20:49):
You talked about that experience that really
scared you, and you also talkedabout therapy.
Is that something that you hadto deal with and talk about in
therapy?
Not
SPEAKER_02 (21:03):
so much.
The thing is, it's wild.
This is the thing.
I don't remember that.
I have no memory of thesituation.
Thankfully, nothing actuallyhappened.
I had to do the whole rape testkit, you know, and swab
everywhere, and they had to doall this stuff.
So thankfully, they didn't findanything on me or, you know,
(21:23):
anything like that.
So, you know, it's weird.
Maybe it's manifested in otherways that I just don't even
realize.
But I've definitely talked to mytherapist about that kind of
stuff.
But it was one of those thingswhere it was like, it just
happened, and I didn't have anymemory of it.
So it almost didn't affect me ina weird way.
I think if I had a memory of itand it was very traumatic, I
(21:45):
think then, whoa, yeah, I wouldhave had to do some pretty heavy
therapy on it.
Honestly, I'm pretty thankful Idon't have any memory of it.
SPEAKER_04 (21:54):
I'm thankful, too.
I'm thankful that there wasn'tany kind of weird suffering or
thing that you had to endure,that it was more like just a
shock to you, like, what isgoing on?
Yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
and that's mostly how it feels.
SPEAKER_04 (22:09):
Well, you know, I read that During the pandemic,
you were able to really focus onself-care and wellness and
establish some good routines.
But when you go on tour, it'sharder to keep with routines.
And you're touring with yoursolo album and also with the
Revivalists.
What are some things that youwant to implement on tour as far
(22:33):
as self-care on a daily basis?
SPEAKER_02 (22:36):
I need to make sure that I get proper rest.
That is the key thing to mymental health and wellness.
If I don't get proper sleep,everything else just falls by
the wayside.
I realized that very quickly.
I need to get at least sixhours.
Six hours is the minimum.
It's really tough to get 8, 10,12 on tour just because the bus
(22:59):
is rattling around.
Once the sun comes out at 8a.m., I'm up regardless of how
much I've slept through thenight.
So that's the main thing.
I got to make sure that I getthe good sleep.
SPEAKER_04 (23:14):
How do you do that on tour?
Because there's so much going onat night
SPEAKER_02 (23:19):
and you're on a tour bus.
Yeah, I mean, I don't drink, soI'm not in that scene.
But I also like to live a littlevicariously through that.
You know what I'm saying?
Because it was such a big partof my life for so long.
I can't have any alcohol oranything in the green room of
the tour bus.
(23:39):
Honestly, it doesn't bother me.
It almost makes me feel morenormal.
You know what I'm saying?
That's another reason why I'mgrateful for the situation that
I had is it really just put anunpenetrable wall up against me
not messing with that stuffanymore because I know where
(24:01):
that can lead for me.
It's tough, though.
You know, it's really tough.
You just got to make sure you'recomfortable.
You got to make sure you'reeating well.
I have all fruits andvegetables, a little bit of lean
proteins.
I'm eating oatmeal every singleday.
That has changed my life aswell.
I got to say.
SPEAKER_04 (24:22):
The fiber is good for you.
I
SPEAKER_02 (24:24):
got to say, oatmeal is where it's at, y'all.
SPEAKER_04 (24:27):
I think it'd be really delicious, too.
You add some raisins andcinnamon.
SPEAKER_02 (24:31):
Yeah, I'm a manuka honey and almonds and
blueberries and bananas.
SPEAKER_04 (24:39):
That's so good.
SPEAKER_02 (24:40):
And a little bit of a full fat oat milk on there.
SPEAKER_04 (24:45):
Very nice.
Very nice.
Because I hear you eat reallyclean too.
SPEAKER_02 (24:49):
I try.
I try.
Yeah,
SPEAKER_04 (24:53):
but I'm also glad that you talked about sleep
because to me, sleep is really afoundation for mental health and
we really don't realize it.
You have to have really goodexperience to finally realize
that the late nights until 4amand there's a lot of ups and
downs with your hours.
When you get up and when you goto sleep, there's not a lot of
(25:14):
routine with that.
So developing a good routine foryou to get at least six to ten
hours really makes a differencewith your mental health for the
day.
And once you don't get it,you're screwed, right?
SPEAKER_02 (25:27):
Yeah, you are.
You're behind the eight ball.
You're treading water.
I realized that pretty early on.
And that was one of the thingsthat was going on when I started
to write Shaken.
Coming off that tour, I was notsleeping well at all on the bus.
We're talking laying in thatbunk all night long.
Not a single drop of shut-eye.
(25:50):
And then having to go out and doshows.
And then doing the show, goingback to the bunk, eyes wide
open, just laying there, andthen just trying again.
I don't know how many times thathappened.
Two or three times.
And then finally your body justgoes, you can't do it anymore.
But that was the cycle that Iwas in for a while.
(26:10):
And it was just wreaked havoc.
UNKNOWN (26:14):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_04 (26:15):
You know, we talked about drugs that you're not
taking anymore, and then thereare other medications that can
be healing or even conducive tosleep.
Are there any medications ordrugs that you use?
SPEAKER_02 (26:29):
No.
I've taken the occasional sleeppill, but that was back in that
time as well.
I was just desperate.
I've been prescribed Xanax.
Not a good thing for me becauseit's very addictive, so don't
mess with that.
The sleeping pills definitelyare no good for sleep for me.
I just didn't work.
And the benzos are just, they'renot good for people who have
(26:52):
addictive personalities.
Honestly, my thing is I'm bestwhen I'm just fully, I'm
drinking water, I'm eating good,and I'm getting a full night's
sleep.
And I just said to my girlfriendthe other day, I'm as sober as
they come.
And I'm sleeping the best I'veever slept in my life.
And that's just because I'm nottaking anything.
(27:13):
I'm not, you know, I'm not.
You're clean.
Clean as a whistle.
SPEAKER_04 (27:19):
Sometimes the whole thing with drugs and alcohol,
there's a curiosity there andyou want to try different
things.
But once you're free of a lot ofthat, even caffeine.
SPEAKER_02 (27:30):
I'm not even having caffeine these days, which is
insane.
SPEAKER_04 (27:35):
Me neither.
That's why I'm sleeping better,though.
You know, with all the thingsthat you do for wellness, has
this ever been a part of whatyou do with the band on tour?
It
SPEAKER_02 (27:47):
kind of started to be that way pretty recently,
just because everybody's gettingolder and having kids and it's
just tougher to tour when you'reolder.
And so there's definitely been ashift for a much more palatable
touring schedule.
Obviously, everybody feels goodabout that because everybody's
healthier.
We're not dogging ourselves out.
(28:09):
And we're able to bring ourA-game to the show.
SPEAKER_04 (28:14):
So you take conscious breaks during each leg
of the tour, which is a greatway to pre-plan that because
it's all about how you feelright on stage and your energy
level.
And I'm sure that the fans canalso feel that.
SPEAKER_02 (28:30):
Oh, yeah.
There's been times where I'll doa show.
This was when we were dogging itpretty hard and I'd get
messages, you know, Dave, you'renot looking so good.
You're looking a little con.
Are you eating well?
And I could tell, you know, Iwasn't looking so good.
I wasn't eating well.
So they know for sure.
SPEAKER_04 (28:51):
One thing that I read about you is that you are
an introvert living anextrovert's life.
And I really love that becauseI'm also an introvert that has
to do the same thing.
And there are a lot of musiciansthat feel that way as well.
What advice would you give anintroverted musician on how to
live an extroverted life?
(29:11):
I
SPEAKER_02 (29:13):
would say be patient with yourself and don't be too
hard on yourself.
Give yourself time to acclimateto whatever situation you're in.
Don't run from your anxiety, butalso don't try to just blow down
the doors because that can alsoscar you a little more.
(29:35):
You can give yourself PTSD.
I've heard of that.
So just be patient with yourselfand know that through various
things that you do for yourself,it'll get better.
And you'll get better at knowinghow to play you.
SPEAKER_04 (29:52):
What I thought was really interesting is that you
believe that you're an empath.
SPEAKER_03 (29:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (29:57):
What do you feel are the joys and the burdens of
being an empath?
SPEAKER_02 (30:04):
I would say that some of the joys are just that I
can feel other people's joy.
I feel my joy.
I just feel, you know, like whenI walk into a room, I feel like
I can just get a sense ofhonestly, just like how the
energy is in the room, howpeople are doing.
I've always felt that way.
But like you said, it's a bit ofa double edged sword.
(30:26):
Because I'll be watchingsomething on TV, and if it's one
of these murder mysteries, I'mfeeling every bit of it.
And it's special to be able tofeel that.
I feel like that has gotten intomy art.
The way that I write songs, it'san essential ingredient, I
think.
But yeah, it's tough sometimes.
(30:48):
It's tough.
But I wouldn't change it, forsure.
SPEAKER_04 (30:52):
Well, empaths are really there also to heal.
UNKNOWN (30:55):
Right.
SPEAKER_04 (30:56):
And you're doing that through your music,
bringing lots of joy.
And also the songs of strugglereally relate to people and they
can tap into that.
But yeah, sometimes I feel likeI'm an empath too.
So I know how you feel.
Yeah.
It's tough because I cannot seelike murder.
(31:16):
I know it's fake when somebodyis getting shot, but when they
get shot, I feel that.
And it pains me.
And then the other thing is thatif you come across somebody, you
could pick up on their energy,which that's the part that could
be a double-edged sword.
If they're depressed or anxious,you could pick up on that.
(31:36):
And because it pains us, I thinkwe want to help.
There's something in us thatwants to help that person.
SPEAKER_02 (31:42):
Big time.
That's honestly, yes.
And that's the side of me thatis the most...
prevalent and also i say thisall the time is i'm a giver and
giver sometimes i can just losemyself in the picture and
bringing it back to thedouble-edged sword that's where
it can get a little tricky andtroublesome for people who are
(32:04):
that way because you can depleteyourself pretty quickly you know
and you're not thinking aboutnumero uno you know i'm saying
you're just not That's what thiswhole refocus, reshifting into
personal wellness has made merealize that as long as I'm good
inside, I can bring my energyinto any situation and it's just
(32:30):
bulletproof.
It's just good.
It's just good feeling,transform a room kind of vibe.
I feel like I can do that onlyif I'm feeling good.
SPEAKER_04 (32:39):
Right, right.
I can't wait to see you live.
You guys are
SPEAKER_02 (32:42):
coming to town.
SPEAKER_04 (32:44):
Where are you at?
I'm in Los Angeles.
I know you guys are playing theBeach Life Festival.
Oh, yes.
And you're touring for both.
You're touring with TheRevivalists and also with your
solo album.
So you've been really busy.
You know, one thing also isyou've given back quite a bit.
You have your Rev Causes, whichI think is really wonderful.
(33:06):
It's your philanthropicendeavors.
Can you tell me a little bitabout that?
SPEAKER_02 (33:11):
We got to a point in our career where we were able to
give back and we weren't justscratching for every nickel and
dime.
And it just felt that we hadthis platform.
Let's shine some light on someorganizations that really mean a
lot to us.
I just set up a fundraiser onFacebook for Songs for Kids
Foundation.
(33:31):
And they just bring so much joyto these kids' lives who have
terminal illnesses or issuesthat just hinder them.
So that's a really goodorganization that we work with.
We work with Upturn Arts,Everytown for Gun Safety, which
is also something that is nearand dear to my heart.
I think we've got a big issue inthis country regarding that.
(33:52):
And anything that we can do tohelp push the needle for change
in that direction, I think isimportant.
SPEAKER_04 (33:58):
Thank you so much for doing that.
And it also feels good, right,to give back.
SPEAKER_02 (34:02):
It absolutely does.
I mean, once again, the giver.
Come on.
It feels good.
SPEAKER_04 (34:07):
I feel like you're in this really great chapter of
life.
It's coming out in your music.
SPEAKER_02 (34:13):
It feels good.
I'm glad it's resonating withyou as well.
SPEAKER_04 (34:17):
Yes, it is.
And I was wondering, is thereanything else that you would
like to say about your music orabout mental health?
SPEAKER_02 (34:25):
I guess I would just say to the fans, if you're
having an issue, don't hesitateto reach out and get help
because we all go through thesethings and there's no sense in
just gritting and bearing it.
There's many resources out thereto help you get back on track.
If you're having an issue withaddiction, once again, the first
(34:46):
step is admitting that there'san issue and just admitting
going out there and being braveand doing what you got to do.
So I just want to say that Ilove all my fans.
I love all the people thatsupport me.
And I just thank you guys somuch.
SPEAKER_04 (35:03):
One more question because I get super curious.
But when you were getting sober,were you in a program or what is
it that helps you get off ofthose medications?
Or was it just willpower?
What is it that worked for you?
SPEAKER_02 (35:17):
I went to one AA meeting and I sat down and I
listened to the stories andthere was just this really
powerful feeling and realizationthat came over me in the
meeting.
It was just like, oh my God,I've been in this cycle for X
(35:39):
amount of years.
The guy over here who's 65 yearsold, he was in that cycle for 40
years.
And I just realized, oh my God,okay.
I don't want to be doing thiswhen I'm that old.
I just didn't feel like therewas any real growth that was
possible, both physically,mentally, spiritually, anything.
(36:02):
It just felt like going aroundand around.
So that was one of the mainrealizations.
And then, like I said, I hadthat experience that really
helped me.
But the going to the AA, the onemeeting, And just having that
realization was also imperativeto Nip in that situation.
So
SPEAKER_04 (36:21):
you took yourself off the drugs?
SPEAKER_02 (36:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (36:25):
You didn't have to have any kind of a program or
any kind of...
Like sometimes people will takemedication, something else, in
replace of...
SPEAKER_02 (36:33):
It was a damn hard time to quit smoking cigarettes
after that.
But I'll just tell you, I had toget a tattoo.
Stop smoking.
Quitting smoking cigarettes.
I quit on December 7, 2010.
SPEAKER_04 (36:48):
Congratulations.
SPEAKER_02 (36:50):
Yeah, but that was tough.
SPEAKER_04 (36:51):
Oh, my God.
I bet it was.
But it's one of the best thingsyou could do for your body.
Oh, my
SPEAKER_02 (36:57):
God, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (36:57):
So I'm giving you huge props.
You are a check-your-headsuperhero.
SPEAKER_02 (37:02):
Ah, wow.
You're too kind.
You're too kind.
SPEAKER_04 (37:09):
Next, our featured guest, trained with Wim Hof...
the creator of the Wim HofMethod, who's also known as the
Iceman.
Our expert today is FaridHashimi of Emotion Training, one
of the first 25 certifiedinstructors in the U.S.
on the Wim Hof Method.
Wim Hof first developed thismethod after losing his wife to
(37:30):
suicide and found it not onlyhelped with his mental grief,
but also boosted him physicallyas well.
As a result, Wim Hof is now anextreme athlete and has garnered
26 Guinness World Records forvarious cold water and ice
sports.
So let's hear Wim Hof trainerFarid Hashimi share the benefits
(37:50):
of this unique method.
We just heard from David Shaw ofThe Revivalist who swears by the
Wim Hof method for anxiety andother mental health issues.
Now, I heard that you went toPoland and the Czech Republic to
train with Wim Hof, who theycall the Iceman because part of
the method is cold therapy.
(38:12):
But I wanted to start with yourstory.
What made you first want to trythe Wim Hof method?
SPEAKER_01 (38:17):
There's a Vice documentary on the Wim Hof
method that came out five, sixyears ago.
So I watched that at the time,and I was really impressed by
it.
I should say, blown away by hisability to take random people
that are not in any specialshape and take them on this cold
exposure training and teach themabout breathing and their body
(38:39):
so they can tap into what seemedlike supernatural powers or some
things that we had locked up, soto speak.
And this seemed like a reallycool adventure, a cool way to
gain some abilities that wedon't know.
And that's how I did it.
I signed up for the course.
When I watched the documentary,it was a winter expedition,
which is...
A week you spend in Poland,which is close to Czech
(39:00):
Republic.
There's 26 of us from all overthe world, all different
backgrounds, different ages.
And we all met at his house,stayed there for a week as we
did meditation, breath work,cold training, and just vibe
with each other and learn fromeach other and really connected.
And that was probably the mostprofound week of my life.
(39:22):
There's nothing really that Iexpected for it because there
was really no information.
Very, very few people had doneit at the time.
No one knew about it.
It was like 10,000 views on thatvideo at the time when I watched
it.
Now it has 4 million views.
I didn't know anything about it.
I hadn't practiced it.
I hadn't done any cold exposure.
And so it was a complete shock,literal and metaphorical sense
(39:43):
of the word.
But it was a very eye-openingand introspective experience.
And I can say that it reallyfreed me a lot.
You know, it taught me a lotabout myself and it gave me the
tools really to sort myself out.
I thought now that I know this,I can definitely help other
people too.
SPEAKER_04 (40:03):
Were you a personal trainer at the time that you
decided to do this training?
SPEAKER_01 (40:07):
Yes, I was applying for physical therapy doctorate
programs.
I had my own business and I wasworking for a boutique gym.
I applied for schools and in theinterim of waiting, that's when
I saw the video and I decided togo there.
And here's the cool part aboutit.
Once I did the experience and Icame back, the long story short,
(40:27):
I got all these rejectionletters and it was more like,
I'm going to go do this formyself.
Now that I learned that thereare masters of the body, mind,
breath that can teach you andshow you the ways that you may
never learn it.
You know, I'm going to go seekthe knowledge.
So I basically dropped out ofschool and I started to build my
personal training and thisperformance practice into what
(40:49):
it is today over the past five,six years.
SPEAKER_04 (40:52):
Very nice.
Well, you know, one thing yousaid is that it was a
life-changing experience foryou.
I mean, what were some of theselife-changing things that you
learned about yourself that havechanged you mentally,
physically?
SPEAKER_01 (41:05):
There's two things in particular that come to mind.
Number one is the breathingexperience, what we would call
the DMT breathwork.
It's a breathwork techniquethat's a little bit more
advanced, not just the Wim Hofmethod, but that had a very...
I don't even know how to say it,mind-blowing internal
(41:26):
experience.
So this is when I gained a lotof insight into so many things I
didn't even know I had going onwith me.
Namely, I've never known mymother.
And so I had an experience that,you know, it was so strange.
When we were doing thisbreathing technique, once I got
into it, my body changed.
(41:47):
I'm going to leave out all thedetails because I like people to
experience their own thing.
But let's just say I got intouch with how I felt at a very
early stage of life, having nothad a mother.
And you live that, youexperience it like an ayahuasca
experience, but naturally.
So you got to gain a lot ofinsight into your psyche, into
(42:07):
your mental, emotional, soulfulstate when nothing else was
there.
It was incredible.
And I had a good cry, a reallygood cry.
Something that was so gutturaland so deep and so locked up
that immediately after, it waslike you were empty.
Empty, empty, like a brand newhuman.
SPEAKER_04 (42:31):
Well, it sounds like it was a release of something
that was being held inside,maybe pain or confusion or
whatever it is with your mother.
And then once it was released,it lightens you, right?
It's something heavy you werecarrying.
Maybe you weren't even sure thatyou were carrying this, but with
that release comes just alightness of being, I'm sure.
(42:53):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (42:55):
That was the first experience.
That's the one that reallytaught me about the breath,
about the body, the mind, thesoul.
This is what really justpropelled me onto a whole other
realm of life, to the unseenpart of life, the things that
we're not told.
You have to seek.
You have to want.
You have to suffer.
You have to find the ways, likeWim found the way.
(43:15):
You know, there are people likethis in all aspects of life.
Through enough suffering andenough desire of yourself,
you're going to find thesepractices or these methods or
these things that are going tobe hugely beneficial for the
soul, the mind, the body toconnect all and to understand
self.
So that's the most profoundthing.
(43:36):
And the next thing was themountain hike that was about six
and a half hours wearing nothingbut shorts in this freezing
mountain, you know, and therewas a few times I genuinely
wanted to throw in the towel andI thought I was going to maybe
lose body parts to frostbite orsomething because, you know, it
was extreme.
Like I said, I couldn't preparefor it.
(43:57):
And I had a decent ego goinginto it, thinking that if this
person has done it, then Icertainly can do it because I'm
in better shape.
I have a stronger mind, etcetera, et cetera.
And when you went out there,you'd be humbled by seeing a
76-year-old woman with arthritisin the knees walking up the same
mountain as you with a smile onher face while you're shivering.
(44:19):
That by itself was somethingamazing to really experience.
Be dependent on self and thebreath and your comrades and see
what you're capable of.
It's another mind-opening,mind-blowing, body-opening,
body-blowing experience.
SPEAKER_04 (44:37):
Well, you know, I read that Wim Hof actually
developed his method after helost his wife to suicide and it
was his way of coping.
And through that, he was able todeal with her death and then
wanted to spread the word.
You already talked about thecold therapy and also some of
the breathing.
(44:57):
Can you explain exactly what theWim Hof method is?
I guess in simple terms so thatwe can understand it.
SPEAKER_01 (45:04):
Yeah, very simple.
This is the best part about itis the simplicity and the
information is out there foreveryone to use.
for free you don't need to payanyone to learn there's tutorial
videos on youtube on theirwebsite lots of scientific
articles but in this practiceit's very simple but there's
very deep layers to thispractice the simplicity is this
(45:26):
there's three pillars there'sthe breathing pillar there's the
mindset pillar and there's thecold exposure pillar and these
three in conjunction togethermakes the practice exponentially
more powerful they havephysiological mental and
emotional effects and one ofthem increases the next one so
(45:53):
if you do the breathing it getsyour mindset and your focus
right and your physiology andchemistry to endure the cold the
pain of the cold the shocking ofthe cold all of that it actually
numbs your body through naturalpain medication so you do that
You're going to set up your bodyphysically.
(46:14):
You're going to set up your mindmentally.
That's the breathing to themeditation to the physiological
state.
Now the effects of the painmodulation, you're going to be
sitting in an ice bath offreezing water that first
crushed you.
And then within 45 seconds to aminute and a half, you're going
to be blown away by how you'reone with the water.
SPEAKER_03 (46:38):
And
SPEAKER_01 (46:39):
you can't feel it.
And you're sitting there withyour eyes wide open in a state
of clear meditation, an extremepresence for two, three minutes,
whatever time it is that you'redoing.
SPEAKER_04 (46:49):
I read that Wim Hof has quite a few Guinness World
Records for all these differentfeats.
And one of them was being in icewater for almost two hours.
And it sounds like this trainingis allows you to meditate or
have mind control to the pointwhere you can control your
(47:11):
physical ability, I guess, toendure pain and cold.
Is that what it is?
SPEAKER_01 (47:17):
First of all, you're able to release and get out of
the overthinking mind.
So most of our problem actuallyarises from being disconnected,
is that when we're doing onething, we're really never doing
one thing.
We're usually doing one thingand the mind is diverted on your
kids, on your work, on somethingelse.
(47:38):
So that disconnection itself,not having your 100% focus, if
your mind is active and it'schattery and it's making up
questions and problems, then theother parts cannot also be
released to do what they do aswell.
So your chemistry changesthrough the mindset because
parts of your brain, like yourhypothalamus, are going to
actually work.
(47:58):
You're training it to work.
Your conscious mind stopsoverthinking.
You can't focus on anything butthe present moment.
And so you have a cascade ofphysiological effects that take
place then.
There's actually thingshappening in your body that
allow you to stand there for twohours and you can increase the
practice like that.
SPEAKER_04 (48:18):
You have taught clients.
What are some of the things thatyou hear from them as far as the
benefits they receive?
SPEAKER_01 (48:24):
The number one thing is everyone just feels great.
They love it.
I have one client that comes in,before I even say anything, he's
like, let's do meditation.
Let's do Wim Hofman.
That's how much he loves therelease and the stress release
and the clarity and the peacethat he gets from doing the
meditation.
(48:45):
And ice bath, everyone justloves the feeling.
They love when they're in thereand they're able to endure it
and enjoy it.
They laugh, they giggle.
There's pictures of likehundreds and hundreds of
Polaroids that I have of peoplethat I've put in this ice bath
and they're smiling or they'rein deep meditation or they're
very chill.
You feel good.
(49:06):
You feel possible and capable.
They're more emotional, not in anegative way, but in a positive
way where they tap in, wheretypically they can be unaware of
themselves and how they feel orwhere they just know they're
stagnant.
And so I recognize this stuff.
I see the energy shift.
SPEAKER_04 (49:25):
I mean, David Shaw mentioned anxiety and how the
breathing techniques actuallycan transform his anxiety to
adrenaline, which can help himperform better.
Does it help for other kinds ofmental health issues like
depression or OCD or what elseyou hear from your clients as
(49:46):
far as that, how it mentally canhelp them?
SPEAKER_01 (49:49):
You know, anxiety is your mind being overactive,
thinking forward, creating andpredicting problems that are not
there.
Just an overactive running mind.
It's tiring.
You're trying to do somethingelse.
You can't do that one thing.
And depression is you're down ondumps.
I speak from experience.
I was studying for my psychologyportion.
(50:10):
My thing was on depression.
That was my life for about 16years.
So my point is when you domeditation has been shown
scientifically.
to improve mental health byitself, just doing the ability
to be present.
Now, you take a powerfultechnique like this where it's
made for anyone, where you canlet go and you can tap in and go
(50:33):
deep and go as far as you wantto.
The answer to how does it help?
I would say how much can beingpresent and how much can that
help with any mental challengesthat you have?
It's profound.
SPEAKER_04 (50:47):
A big thank you to our musical guest, David Shaw of
The Revivalists, and our expert,Farid Hashemi of Emotion
Training.
For more information on DavidShaw's debut solo album and
tour, visit davidshaw.com andfollow him on his socials, at
TheDavidShawMusic and atTheDavidShaw.
(51:07):
And for more information on TheRevivalists, visit
therevivalists.com.
Follow them on their socials, atThe Revivalists.
and stay tuned for a clip ofDavid Shaw's single Shaken from
his new self-titled debut album.
For more information on FaridHashimi and the Wim Hof Method,
visit e-motion-training.com andfollow him on Instagram at
(51:33):
e-motion-training.
Thank you to all of our loyallisteners for your reviews and
for following us on our socialsat Check Your Head Podcast and
on our YouTube channel.
Visit CheckYourHeadPodcast.comto find more than 125 mental
health solutions for recovery.
So until next time, be brave,ask for help, and be persistent
(51:57):
in finding the mental healththat you need.
I
SPEAKER_00 (52:00):
won't tell you lies.
I wasn't raised up that way.
I won't tell you lies.
I can't carry that weight.
(52:25):
Oh, those walls are coming down.
SPEAKER_04 (52:44):
Check Your Head Podcast is kindly supported and
partnered with Sweet ReliefMusicians Fund, DBSA San Gabriel
Valley, Earshot Media, and LemonTree Studios in Los Angeles.
Visit checkyourheadpodcast.comwhere we have over 100 solutions
for mental health.
Be our friends on social mediaat Check Your Head Podcast.
(53:05):
Watch us on YouTube and supportus with a kind donation on
checkyourheadpodcast.com.
Check Your Head podcast issponsored by a 501c3 nonprofit
with all donations being taxdeductible.
Thank you for your support andthank you for listening.
Welcome to the Check Your Head podcast, the podcast
where notable musicians andexperts share their stories and
solutions for mental health andwellness.
I'm your host, Mari Fong, amusic journalist and life coach
for musicians, and today I'mexcited to share news of our
first benefit concert for mentalhealth with rising rock band
(00:24):
Satellite City on September 4th,2021 at the Troubadour in West
Hollywood, California.
The show benefits our friends atSweet Relief Musicians Fund and
the Check Your Head podcast, andthere's also a special.
If you buy two tickets to theshow on Troubadour.com, bring
your ticket receipt to the merchbooth and receive a free
(00:45):
Satellite City t-shirt.
How cool is that?
We'll also be partying safely,with the Troubadour requiring
proof of vaccination, so comeready to show your vaccine card.
a photo of your vaccine card, orbring a digital vaccine card.
To get your digital vaccinecard, simply Google digital
(01:06):
vaccine card, click on theCalifornia.gov website, and it
takes about 10 seconds to signup and receive your card by text
message.
It's really that easy.
You can also bring proof of anegative COVID test 48 to 72
hours prior to the show.
So come party with us and hearsome great live music for a good
(01:27):
cause.
Now to our featured guests.
Today we have asinger-songwriter, musician,
producer, and philanthropistwhose soulful rock band The
Revivalists broke out with theirsingle Wish I Knew You, which
garnered 525 million streamsglobally on YouTube, went number
one on the Billboard charts,followed by another hit single
(01:49):
entitled All My Friends.
Now with five studio albumsunder his belt, our featured
musical guest is David Shaw ofThe Revivalists, who recently
dropped his self-titled debutsolo album in May of 2021, and a
clip of his song Shaken will beplayed at the end of our
episode.
David Shaw will share how herecovered from drug and alcohol
(02:12):
addiction, his solutions foranxiety, and the one pivotal
moment in David's life thatscared him sober from ever
drinking or doing drugs again.
more than 10 years ago.
One of David's solutions foranxiety is practicing the Wim
Hof method.
So our featured expert today isa Wim Hof certified instructor,
(02:33):
Farid Hashimi of EmotionTraining.
Farid shares his experience withWim Hof, the originator of this
method.
Having trained in the snowymountains of Poland and the
Czech Republic, Wim Hof actuallydeveloped this method after
losing his wife to suicide andfound benefits both mentally and
physically.
Fareed will share these benefitstoday and how the three pillars
(02:57):
of the Wim Hof Method can workfor you too.
But first, let's hear David Shawof The Revivalists share his
story.
I wanted to congratulate you onyour self-titled debut album.
What I really enjoyed was thatyou expressed so many different
sides of you.
And I wanted to start by talkingabout Shaken, which I thought
(03:20):
was a really cool song thatspoke to some of your fears and
insecurities.
SPEAKER_02 (03:25):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_04 (03:26):
So can you explain a little bit about what those
fears and insecurities wereabout?
SPEAKER_02 (03:30):
Well, I'll just say that it's one of those things
where Things can happen to youwhen you're young, you know,
maybe you get picked on or youjust don't feel like you're good
enough.
That kind of thing can creep inslowly and then it can become
this, you know, kind of virus,just a virus of the mind.
(03:51):
And that's something that creptin a little bit and it stuck
around.
As I grew older, it manifestsits ways and really strange and
interesting ways and i thinkthat's one of the reasons why i
had such an issue with addictionsubstances i thought that they
gave me that confidence that ineeded to push through or to
(04:14):
alleviate the anxiety that i wasfeeling because i didn't feel
adequate in certain situations ididn't feel prepared i didn't
feel like i was enough so shakencame about during a time when I
wasn't feeling so great.
We were touring a ton.
I was burning the candle at bothends.
I wasn't using any substances atthis time, but it was just
(04:35):
really hard.
I wasn't sleeping very well.
We were on the bus quite a bit.
And I just realized I wasdepleted.
I needed to just do somethingfor myself to just jar me and
shake me back into reality.
I know that I've got a lot ofcourage in my heart.
I know that I'm a a brave personbecause I step out and walk that
(04:58):
wire every night.
And a lot of times it feels likeit's this big thing that I'm
just like, oh, man, I don't knowif I can conquer this.
You know what I'm saying?
But I was doing it in and outevery single night.
And I just sat down and I waslike, all right, I know that
other people feel this way.
And it's definitely not just me.
You know what I'm saying?
So I wanted to write a song formyself and others to just be
(05:19):
like, you know what?
You might not be feeling great.
You might be feeling reallydown.
You might be shaking in yourboots, but you're still there.
You're going to conquer it.
You're going to figure it out.
You're going to do what's right.
You're going to do all thethings that you need to do to be
in the moment, get there, and besatisfied with the way you feel
(05:40):
inside and just to know thatyou're enough the way that you
are.
SPEAKER_04 (05:46):
Yeah, I think that sometimes we put so much
self-pressure on ourselves.
SPEAKER_03 (05:51):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (05:51):
with an expectation that everything is gonna go as
planned.
And the thing is, nothing reallygoes as planned.
And we have a hard time allowingourselves to make mistakes.
But other people don't mind whenwe make mistakes because it
shows that we're trying.
You
SPEAKER_02 (06:08):
know what I mean?
Absolutely.
I've seen that when I'll flub alyric on stage and people almost
are like, yeah, he is human.
SPEAKER_04 (06:18):
Right, right, exactly.
And you said something aboutyour past and about not feeling
enough.
And sometimes mental healthissues can lead to addiction.
And sometimes addiction can leadto mental health issues.
SPEAKER_02 (06:33):
What do you
SPEAKER_04 (06:33):
think it was for you?
I
SPEAKER_02 (06:34):
think it was both, honestly.
I think it was one kind of leadin the other and then they fed
each other.
It's like this vicious cyclethat's really tough to get out
of because...
You got to get far away enoughfrom it to have a clear mind.
But then you've got to confrontall those things you've been
(06:56):
running away from.
So it's really, really tough.
You know, I still deal with itevery single day.
SPEAKER_04 (07:04):
Well, that is like you have to peel back your own
layers, things that you try tocover up, like anxieties or
insecurities.
You were saying that when youfirst started with your
addiction, When did it start tospiral out of control?
SPEAKER_02 (07:23):
I would say right when I moved down to New
Orleans.
I was probably 24 when I movedto New Orleans.
And this is like party city, youknow, and it's an amazing city
in a lot of ways.
But if you're somebody who's gota substance abuse issue going
on, it was like me going fromthe frying pan into the fire.
(07:46):
And it was everything all thetime.
Bars never close.
You've got anything at yourfingertips that you want.
I'm a musician, so I'm in thebars doing the thing.
And that was really when it juststarted to spiral.
I've met a lot of the rightpeople, but I'd also met some of
the wrong people.
(08:07):
And it just became too easy toget the things that I was
looking for.
And there you go.
SPEAKER_04 (08:14):
Well, I think...
Being in music also, you know,the whole nightlife atmosphere
and scene, it is everywhere andpeople are offering it to you
all the time.
SPEAKER_03 (08:24):
Absolutely.
It's always free.
SPEAKER_04 (08:27):
It's always free because that's the in, right?
To party with a band orsomething, you know.
But you did say that when youwere 24, you described that
night of partying and it landedyou in the hospital and it
scared the living hell out ofyou.
It
SPEAKER_02 (08:44):
did.
SPEAKER_04 (08:45):
And what is it exactly that happened for that
incident?
SPEAKER_02 (08:50):
Well, I'll just say that I was in a bar.
I had a long night.
I think I bought every singleperson in the bar shots all
night.
It's crazy.
I remember my tab was like$923.
And at that time, I had maybe$950 to my name.
You know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_03 (09:10):
So I
SPEAKER_02 (09:10):
blew my whole bank account.
But that really wasn't the thingthat got to me.
The real thing that absolutelyscared the hell out of me, and
it gives me goosebumps to thisday, is I was in a bar and a
neighbor of mine, a guy, heasked me if I needed a ride
(09:34):
home.
This was 9 a.m., mind you.
9 a.m., we're at a bar, 9 a.m.
I'm not going to name the bar,but a lot of our fans know this
place.
But he gave me a ride home, andwe went to his house for another
beer.
He has a wife.
He had two kids.
Met his two kids.
And then I don't rememberanything.
(09:57):
And then I remember I'm wakingup at my house, mind you,
basically butt naked.
We're getting deep here.
I've told this story before.
one other time, but we'regetting deep here.
And the guy was trying to havehis way with me.
Luckily, our guitarist, he waswalking by at the same time and
(10:20):
comes in the house, sees thedoors open, comes in the house,
this guy runs out.
Crazy.
This is insane.
I can't even believe this.
Every time I tell him, I justget chills.
And he goes, what's going on?
What the hell?
What is happening?
You know, I'm And I'm completelygone.
I'm like roofied, you know?
SPEAKER_04 (10:42):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (10:42):
Yeah.
Yeah.
So the paramedics come, theygive me some smelling salts.
I remember waking up and it'sfunny because I remember saying
something really funny and justmake it, make it every, that's
the only memory I have of likethem putting me on the little
stretcher and carrying me downinto the ambulance.
So yeah, they said my vitalswere pretty low.
(11:04):
It was just not a goodsituation.
I almost, got raped, you know,so yeah, not good.
And that really scared the, thatscared me straight.
SPEAKER_04 (11:18):
Well, when I read about that, I thought that you
had maybe drank too much, takendrugs on your own volition and
maybe overdosed or something,but you never know what's in
your drink as somebody who'soffering you something, uh, And
I've had other people tell mesomething similar to what you're
(11:38):
saying.
And that is really a traumaticexperience.
And from that, what was the nextstep for you?
I mean, it's hard enough toprocess that.
And thank God your guitarist wasthere.
And oh my gosh, thank God.
You know, what was it that youlearned from that experience?
SPEAKER_02 (11:57):
I learned that I don't think I could trust myself
fully at the time.
And I realized that I needed tobe able to rely on myself
because those things can justhappen.
Because I'm just a very trustingindividual.
I'm a Midwesterner.
And like I said, this person wasmy neighbor.
He's got two kids.
Right,
SPEAKER_04 (12:16):
right.
You would never, ever expectanything
SPEAKER_02 (12:18):
like that.
Never expect that.
But that just really made me go,okay, there are true predators
out there.
And you can't see that coming.
You know what I'm
SPEAKER_03 (12:27):
saying?
UNKNOWN (12:27):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_02 (12:27):
I just realized I was like, all right, if I'm
going to make it in this life,I'm going to need to keep my
faculties upon me.
SPEAKER_04 (12:35):
Well, that was really it is really being
conscious and aware all the timeto protect yourself.
Because there was a time whereyou mentioned you were drinking
and there was cocaine, you know,heroin, those kinds of things.
I mean, was there a point whereyou
SPEAKER_02 (12:50):
said...
I never shot it up or anything.
I only had a little bit of that,but never, never.
Okay,
SPEAKER_04 (12:59):
that's good to hear.
Now, was there a point where yousaid, I want to go completely
sober?
Or was it a gradual process?
SPEAKER_02 (13:09):
Um, it was a gradual process.
And then it was like, okay, thisis it.
You know, it was tough.
It's tough.
It's still tough to this day,because there's things that are
probably okay for me, you know,but then there's also the Now
that leads to something else andthat leads to that and that
leads to that.
And now I'm right back where Istarted very quickly.
SPEAKER_04 (13:30):
Yeah, I mean, I've talked to so many musicians
about, you know, mental healthand addiction.
And oftentimes it gets to be anaddictive personality where you,
you
SPEAKER_03 (13:39):
know,
SPEAKER_04 (13:39):
it's hard to start and then do anything in
moderation.
Did you find that with yourself?
Because there's oftentimes a lotof starts and stops and so many
stories along that journey.
I
SPEAKER_02 (13:54):
was getting that for a little while.
And I haven't had a sip ofalcohol since that night.
Dabbled in a few other thingshere and there.
But alcohol and cocaine and anyreally hard thing, that was the
time where it just ceased toexist in my life.
Because if you get alcohol andme going, All my inhibitions go
(14:17):
out the window.
Everything becomes an okay atthat moment.
So I knew that's a no-go.
So it's been a winding road, butI've got a really great handle
on how I'm feeling about allthat right now.
And I'm just taking it one dayat a time.
That's all I can do.
SPEAKER_04 (14:35):
Well, I really congratulate you on that journey
because 10 years is really agood, strong amount of time.
And I know that there's beenstruggles within that time.
You know, it takes a lot ofdiscipline, a lot of discipline.
And so big props to that.
(14:56):
You know, one thing.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely.
You know, one thing youmentioned, you said something
about getting into drugs andrunning away from the things
that we're trying to not lookat.
I know you've done therapy andyou've done different things for
your wellness.
What were some of the thingsthat you think you were running
away from
SPEAKER_03 (15:16):
or
SPEAKER_04 (15:19):
issues or situations?
SPEAKER_02 (15:22):
I think it's a lot of anxiety, just anxiety.
And I don't know if I can put myfinger on one thing or the
other.
And sometimes it can be justlike, oh, I got to do this one
thing.
Oh, man, I got to do that.
You never know when it's goingto come.
It's pretty much a crapshootwhen it comes to that.
Because there could be thingswhere I'm like, oh, man, I don't
(15:43):
think I'm going to be feelingthis.
And then I feel fine.
But then it could be this littlething.
I'm like, oh.
And then it really hits me.
So that's one of those thingswhere I think therapy has helped
me a lot to just go in anddissect various layers of what
could potentially be causingwhat and why I'm feeling a
(16:04):
certain way.
So, yeah, I'm still figuringthat out, honestly.
SPEAKER_04 (16:09):
Because we've had musicians come on and talk about
panic attacks, and I'm not sureif your anxiety has ever gotten
to that level.
SPEAKER_02 (16:15):
It hasn't gotten to that level.
SPEAKER_04 (16:17):
Okay.
But you mentioned breathingexercises and a certain method
that you learned.
Can you explain that?
Because I found that breathingmethods seem to really help with
anxiety.
SPEAKER_02 (16:30):
Yes.
SPEAKER_04 (16:32):
What's this method that you're talking about?
SPEAKER_02 (16:34):
Well, it's the Wim Hof breathing method.
And it's like anxiety training.
Because what I've found is thatwhen you're doing these fast
breaths, it can almost likehyperventilate you.
Not totally, but like a littlebit.
And what it does is it superoxygenates your blood.
But on the other side of it, itgives you a little anxiety, you
(16:57):
know?
Or at least it does for me.
And it feels like anxietytraining.
It feels like it really helpswith changing the relationship
that you have.
with the anxiety, basically.
That's where a lot of the changeoccurred with me was when I
realized that this is a thing weall have to deal with, some to
different varying degrees.
Me being someone who's alwaysperforming, it's going to be a
(17:20):
little more in my life.
So I needed to change therelationship I had to anxiety.
Now I call it that juice.
SPEAKER_04 (17:29):
It's a little bit of an adrenaline thing.
So It could help you on stage asfar as energy levels.
So this, the Wim Hof method, isit more breathing quickly to get
used to that feeling or is it aslowing down of your breathing?
SPEAKER_02 (17:44):
So, so you do these quick in and outs like you do
that.
Okay.
Wow.
Yeah, 50 times.
And so it's in as far as you canand then out, not all the way
(18:04):
out, like pretty much all theway out, but you're not like
really expelling all the airout.
You do that 50 times.
And then when you breathe out,you hold it.
You will be amazed because whenyou're sitting there, your brain
will go, okay, time to get someoxygen from the blood.
And you'll start to go, oh, God,okay.
(18:27):
I need to breathe.
I need to breathe.
But if you just give it asecond, it basically goes, okay,
we got what we need.
I'm telling you, it's trulyamazing.
It really is.
I can hold my breath for fourminutes.
(18:47):
And it's not about holding yourbreath.
It's not a contest or anything.
But the fact that you don'tfreak out, that's a big thing.
You know what I'm saying?
So it definitely calms me, butit's really, yeah, I don't know.
I like
SPEAKER_04 (19:03):
that whole idea of oxygenating your blood because
then everything goes to all yourmajor organs, right?
Everything gets energized.
SPEAKER_02 (19:11):
The thing that really honestly has helped me is
the cold therapy.
Okay.
That's a Wim Hof thing as well.
And just taking a cold shower.
And I will say the colder, thebetter for sure.
And they say that you can'ttrain the autonomic nervous
system.
It's just, it happens.
It's on auto.
But through various things likecold therapy, he has shown that
(19:35):
you
SPEAKER_03 (19:35):
can
SPEAKER_02 (19:36):
regulate these things and not go into freak out
mode when you do jump into a hottub that's filled with ice and
the water's 37 degrees.
Human body can withstand that.
Now, I'm not telling anybody tojust go and do that because I
got to work up to that.
(19:58):
But that's not to say that, youknow, you can't do it.
It's all about awakening thesethings that have basically been
laying dormant in our body for awhile because we live these very
comfortable lifestyles.
And so this is just one waythat, you know, we can wake up
some of our DNA, some of thestuff that's in us that we don't
even notice there.
SPEAKER_04 (20:19):
The cold therapy, I've heard sometimes when people
get really anxious or they startto spiral, they will splash cold
water on their face just toshock it into stopping that
whole spiraling.
SPEAKER_02 (20:34):
Absolutely.
If you have anxiety and you takea cold shower, it just crushes
SPEAKER_04 (20:40):
it.
I think I'm going to get a WimHof method expert on your
episode so they could explainthat a little bit more.
SPEAKER_02 (20:47):
That would be amazing.
SPEAKER_04 (20:49):
You talked about that experience that really
scared you, and you also talkedabout therapy.
Is that something that you hadto deal with and talk about in
therapy?
Not
SPEAKER_02 (21:03):
so much.
The thing is, it's wild.
This is the thing.
I don't remember that.
I have no memory of thesituation.
Thankfully, nothing actuallyhappened.
I had to do the whole rape testkit, you know, and swab
everywhere, and they had to doall this stuff.
So thankfully, they didn't findanything on me or, you know,
(21:23):
anything like that.
So, you know, it's weird.
Maybe it's manifested in otherways that I just don't even
realize.
But I've definitely talked to mytherapist about that kind of
stuff.
But it was one of those thingswhere it was like, it just
happened, and I didn't have anymemory of it.
So it almost didn't affect me ina weird way.
I think if I had a memory of itand it was very traumatic, I
(21:45):
think then, whoa, yeah, I wouldhave had to do some pretty heavy
therapy on it.
Honestly, I'm pretty thankful Idon't have any memory of it.
SPEAKER_04 (21:54):
I'm thankful, too.
I'm thankful that there wasn'tany kind of weird suffering or
thing that you had to endure,that it was more like just a
shock to you, like, what isgoing on?
Yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (22:06):
and that's mostly how it feels.
SPEAKER_04 (22:09):
Well, you know, I read that During the pandemic,
you were able to really focus onself-care and wellness and
establish some good routines.
But when you go on tour, it'sharder to keep with routines.
And you're touring with yoursolo album and also with the
Revivalists.
What are some things that youwant to implement on tour as far
(22:33):
as self-care on a daily basis?
SPEAKER_02 (22:36):
I need to make sure that I get proper rest.
That is the key thing to mymental health and wellness.
If I don't get proper sleep,everything else just falls by
the wayside.
I realized that very quickly.
I need to get at least sixhours.
Six hours is the minimum.
It's really tough to get 8, 10,12 on tour just because the bus
(22:59):
is rattling around.
Once the sun comes out at 8a.m., I'm up regardless of how
much I've slept through thenight.
So that's the main thing.
I got to make sure that I getthe good sleep.
SPEAKER_04 (23:14):
How do you do that on tour?
Because there's so much going onat night
SPEAKER_02 (23:19):
and you're on a tour bus.
Yeah, I mean, I don't drink, soI'm not in that scene.
But I also like to live a littlevicariously through that.
You know what I'm saying?
Because it was such a big partof my life for so long.
I can't have any alcohol oranything in the green room of
the tour bus.
(23:39):
Honestly, it doesn't bother me.
It almost makes me feel morenormal.
You know what I'm saying?
That's another reason why I'mgrateful for the situation that
I had is it really just put anunpenetrable wall up against me
not messing with that stuffanymore because I know where
(24:01):
that can lead for me.
It's tough, though.
You know, it's really tough.
You just got to make sure you'recomfortable.
You got to make sure you'reeating well.
I have all fruits andvegetables, a little bit of lean
proteins.
I'm eating oatmeal every singleday.
That has changed my life aswell.
I got to say.
SPEAKER_04 (24:22):
The fiber is good for you.
I
SPEAKER_02 (24:24):
got to say, oatmeal is where it's at, y'all.
SPEAKER_04 (24:27):
I think it'd be really delicious, too.
You add some raisins andcinnamon.
SPEAKER_02 (24:31):
Yeah, I'm a manuka honey and almonds and
blueberries and bananas.
SPEAKER_04 (24:39):
That's so good.
SPEAKER_02 (24:40):
And a little bit of a full fat oat milk on there.
SPEAKER_04 (24:45):
Very nice.
Very nice.
Because I hear you eat reallyclean too.
SPEAKER_02 (24:49):
I try.
I try.
Yeah,
SPEAKER_04 (24:53):
but I'm also glad that you talked about sleep
because to me, sleep is really afoundation for mental health and
we really don't realize it.
You have to have really goodexperience to finally realize
that the late nights until 4amand there's a lot of ups and
downs with your hours.
When you get up and when you goto sleep, there's not a lot of
(25:14):
routine with that.
So developing a good routine foryou to get at least six to ten
hours really makes a differencewith your mental health for the
day.
And once you don't get it,you're screwed, right?
SPEAKER_02 (25:27):
Yeah, you are.
You're behind the eight ball.
You're treading water.
I realized that pretty early on.
And that was one of the thingsthat was going on when I started
to write Shaken.
Coming off that tour, I was notsleeping well at all on the bus.
We're talking laying in thatbunk all night long.
Not a single drop of shut-eye.
(25:50):
And then having to go out and doshows.
And then doing the show, goingback to the bunk, eyes wide
open, just laying there, andthen just trying again.
I don't know how many times thathappened.
Two or three times.
And then finally your body justgoes, you can't do it anymore.
But that was the cycle that Iwas in for a while.
(26:10):
And it was just wreaked havoc.
UNKNOWN (26:14):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_04 (26:15):
You know, we talked about drugs that you're not
taking anymore, and then thereare other medications that can
be healing or even conducive tosleep.
Are there any medications ordrugs that you use?
SPEAKER_02 (26:29):
No.
I've taken the occasional sleeppill, but that was back in that
time as well.
I was just desperate.
I've been prescribed Xanax.
Not a good thing for me becauseit's very addictive, so don't
mess with that.
The sleeping pills definitelyare no good for sleep for me.
I just didn't work.
And the benzos are just, they'renot good for people who have
(26:52):
addictive personalities.
Honestly, my thing is I'm bestwhen I'm just fully, I'm
drinking water, I'm eating good,and I'm getting a full night's
sleep.
And I just said to my girlfriendthe other day, I'm as sober as
they come.
And I'm sleeping the best I'veever slept in my life.
And that's just because I'm nottaking anything.
(27:13):
I'm not, you know, I'm not.
You're clean.
Clean as a whistle.
SPEAKER_04 (27:19):
Sometimes the whole thing with drugs and alcohol,
there's a curiosity there andyou want to try different
things.
But once you're free of a lot ofthat, even caffeine.
SPEAKER_02 (27:30):
I'm not even having caffeine these days, which is
insane.
SPEAKER_04 (27:35):
Me neither.
That's why I'm sleeping better,though.
You know, with all the thingsthat you do for wellness, has
this ever been a part of whatyou do with the band on tour?
It
SPEAKER_02 (27:47):
kind of started to be that way pretty recently,
just because everybody's gettingolder and having kids and it's
just tougher to tour when you'reolder.
And so there's definitely been ashift for a much more palatable
touring schedule.
Obviously, everybody feels goodabout that because everybody's
healthier.
We're not dogging ourselves out.
(28:09):
And we're able to bring ourA-game to the show.
SPEAKER_04 (28:14):
So you take conscious breaks during each leg
of the tour, which is a greatway to pre-plan that because
it's all about how you feelright on stage and your energy
level.
And I'm sure that the fans canalso feel that.
SPEAKER_02 (28:30):
Oh, yeah.
There's been times where I'll doa show.
This was when we were dogging itpretty hard and I'd get
messages, you know, Dave, you'renot looking so good.
You're looking a little con.
Are you eating well?
And I could tell, you know, Iwasn't looking so good.
I wasn't eating well.
So they know for sure.
SPEAKER_04 (28:51):
One thing that I read about you is that you are
an introvert living anextrovert's life.
And I really love that becauseI'm also an introvert that has
to do the same thing.
And there are a lot of musiciansthat feel that way as well.
What advice would you give anintroverted musician on how to
live an extroverted life?
(29:11):
I
SPEAKER_02 (29:13):
would say be patient with yourself and don't be too
hard on yourself.
Give yourself time to acclimateto whatever situation you're in.
Don't run from your anxiety, butalso don't try to just blow down
the doors because that can alsoscar you a little more.
(29:35):
You can give yourself PTSD.
I've heard of that.
So just be patient with yourselfand know that through various
things that you do for yourself,it'll get better.
And you'll get better at knowinghow to play you.
SPEAKER_04 (29:52):
What I thought was really interesting is that you
believe that you're an empath.
SPEAKER_03 (29:57):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (29:57):
What do you feel are the joys and the burdens of
being an empath?
SPEAKER_02 (30:04):
I would say that some of the joys are just that I
can feel other people's joy.
I feel my joy.
I just feel, you know, like whenI walk into a room, I feel like
I can just get a sense ofhonestly, just like how the
energy is in the room, howpeople are doing.
I've always felt that way.
But like you said, it's a bit ofa double edged sword.
(30:26):
Because I'll be watchingsomething on TV, and if it's one
of these murder mysteries, I'mfeeling every bit of it.
And it's special to be able tofeel that.
I feel like that has gotten intomy art.
The way that I write songs, it'san essential ingredient, I
think.
But yeah, it's tough sometimes.
(30:48):
It's tough.
But I wouldn't change it, forsure.
SPEAKER_04 (30:52):
Well, empaths are really there also to heal.
UNKNOWN (30:55):
Right.
SPEAKER_04 (30:56):
And you're doing that through your music,
bringing lots of joy.
And also the songs of strugglereally relate to people and they
can tap into that.
But yeah, sometimes I feel likeI'm an empath too.
So I know how you feel.
Yeah.
It's tough because I cannot seelike murder.
(31:16):
I know it's fake when somebodyis getting shot, but when they
get shot, I feel that.
And it pains me.
And then the other thing is thatif you come across somebody, you
could pick up on their energy,which that's the part that could
be a double-edged sword.
If they're depressed or anxious,you could pick up on that.
(31:36):
And because it pains us, I thinkwe want to help.
There's something in us thatwants to help that person.
SPEAKER_02 (31:42):
Big time.
That's honestly, yes.
And that's the side of me thatis the most...
prevalent and also i say thisall the time is i'm a giver and
giver sometimes i can just losemyself in the picture and
bringing it back to thedouble-edged sword that's where
it can get a little tricky andtroublesome for people who are
(32:04):
that way because you can depleteyourself pretty quickly you know
and you're not thinking aboutnumero uno you know i'm saying
you're just not That's what thiswhole refocus, reshifting into
personal wellness has made merealize that as long as I'm good
inside, I can bring my energyinto any situation and it's just
(32:30):
bulletproof.
It's just good.
It's just good feeling,transform a room kind of vibe.
I feel like I can do that onlyif I'm feeling good.
SPEAKER_04 (32:39):
Right, right.
I can't wait to see you live.
You guys are
SPEAKER_02 (32:42):
coming to town.
SPEAKER_04 (32:44):
Where are you at?
I'm in Los Angeles.
I know you guys are playing theBeach Life Festival.
Oh, yes.
And you're touring for both.
You're touring with TheRevivalists and also with your
solo album.
So you've been really busy.
You know, one thing also isyou've given back quite a bit.
You have your Rev Causes, whichI think is really wonderful.
(33:06):
It's your philanthropicendeavors.
Can you tell me a little bitabout that?
SPEAKER_02 (33:11):
We got to a point in our career where we were able to
give back and we weren't justscratching for every nickel and
dime.
And it just felt that we hadthis platform.
Let's shine some light on someorganizations that really mean a
lot to us.
I just set up a fundraiser onFacebook for Songs for Kids
Foundation.
(33:31):
And they just bring so much joyto these kids' lives who have
terminal illnesses or issuesthat just hinder them.
So that's a really goodorganization that we work with.
We work with Upturn Arts,Everytown for Gun Safety, which
is also something that is nearand dear to my heart.
I think we've got a big issue inthis country regarding that.
(33:52):
And anything that we can do tohelp push the needle for change
in that direction, I think isimportant.
SPEAKER_04 (33:58):
Thank you so much for doing that.
And it also feels good, right,to give back.
SPEAKER_02 (34:02):
It absolutely does.
I mean, once again, the giver.
Come on.
It feels good.
SPEAKER_04 (34:07):
I feel like you're in this really great chapter of
life.
It's coming out in your music.
SPEAKER_02 (34:13):
It feels good.
I'm glad it's resonating withyou as well.
SPEAKER_04 (34:17):
Yes, it is.
And I was wondering, is thereanything else that you would
like to say about your music orabout mental health?
SPEAKER_02 (34:25):
I guess I would just say to the fans, if you're
having an issue, don't hesitateto reach out and get help
because we all go through thesethings and there's no sense in
just gritting and bearing it.
There's many resources out thereto help you get back on track.
If you're having an issue withaddiction, once again, the first
(34:46):
step is admitting that there'san issue and just admitting
going out there and being braveand doing what you got to do.
So I just want to say that Ilove all my fans.
I love all the people thatsupport me.
And I just thank you guys somuch.
SPEAKER_04 (35:03):
One more question because I get super curious.
But when you were getting sober,were you in a program or what is
it that helps you get off ofthose medications?
Or was it just willpower?
What is it that worked for you?
SPEAKER_02 (35:17):
I went to one AA meeting and I sat down and I
listened to the stories andthere was just this really
powerful feeling and realizationthat came over me in the
meeting.
It was just like, oh my God,I've been in this cycle for X
(35:39):
amount of years.
The guy over here who's 65 yearsold, he was in that cycle for 40
years.
And I just realized, oh my God,okay.
I don't want to be doing thiswhen I'm that old.
I just didn't feel like therewas any real growth that was
possible, both physically,mentally, spiritually, anything.
(36:02):
It just felt like going aroundand around.
So that was one of the mainrealizations.
And then, like I said, I hadthat experience that really
helped me.
But the going to the AA, the onemeeting, And just having that
realization was also imperativeto Nip in that situation.
So
SPEAKER_04 (36:21):
you took yourself off the drugs?
SPEAKER_02 (36:24):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (36:25):
You didn't have to have any kind of a program or
any kind of...
Like sometimes people will takemedication, something else, in
replace of...
SPEAKER_02 (36:33):
It was a damn hard time to quit smoking cigarettes
after that.
But I'll just tell you, I had toget a tattoo.
Stop smoking.
Quitting smoking cigarettes.
I quit on December 7, 2010.
SPEAKER_04 (36:48):
Congratulations.
SPEAKER_02 (36:50):
Yeah, but that was tough.
SPEAKER_04 (36:51):
Oh, my God.
I bet it was.
But it's one of the best thingsyou could do for your body.
Oh, my
SPEAKER_02 (36:57):
God, yeah.
SPEAKER_04 (36:57):
So I'm giving you huge props.
You are a check-your-headsuperhero.
SPEAKER_02 (37:02):
Ah, wow.
You're too kind.
You're too kind.
SPEAKER_04 (37:09):
Next, our featured guest, trained with Wim Hof...
the creator of the Wim HofMethod, who's also known as the
Iceman.
Our expert today is FaridHashimi of Emotion Training, one
of the first 25 certifiedinstructors in the U.S.
on the Wim Hof Method.
Wim Hof first developed thismethod after losing his wife to
(37:30):
suicide and found it not onlyhelped with his mental grief,
but also boosted him physicallyas well.
As a result, Wim Hof is now anextreme athlete and has garnered
26 Guinness World Records forvarious cold water and ice
sports.
So let's hear Wim Hof trainerFarid Hashimi share the benefits
(37:50):
of this unique method.
We just heard from David Shaw ofThe Revivalist who swears by the
Wim Hof method for anxiety andother mental health issues.
Now, I heard that you went toPoland and the Czech Republic to
train with Wim Hof, who theycall the Iceman because part of
the method is cold therapy.
(38:12):
But I wanted to start with yourstory.
What made you first want to trythe Wim Hof method?
SPEAKER_01 (38:17):
There's a Vice documentary on the Wim Hof
method that came out five, sixyears ago.
So I watched that at the time,and I was really impressed by
it.
I should say, blown away by hisability to take random people
that are not in any specialshape and take them on this cold
exposure training and teach themabout breathing and their body
(38:39):
so they can tap into what seemedlike supernatural powers or some
things that we had locked up, soto speak.
And this seemed like a reallycool adventure, a cool way to
gain some abilities that wedon't know.
And that's how I did it.
I signed up for the course.
When I watched the documentary,it was a winter expedition,
which is...
A week you spend in Poland,which is close to Czech
(39:00):
Republic.
There's 26 of us from all overthe world, all different
backgrounds, different ages.
And we all met at his house,stayed there for a week as we
did meditation, breath work,cold training, and just vibe
with each other and learn fromeach other and really connected.
And that was probably the mostprofound week of my life.
(39:22):
There's nothing really that Iexpected for it because there
was really no information.
Very, very few people had doneit at the time.
No one knew about it.
It was like 10,000 views on thatvideo at the time when I watched
it.
Now it has 4 million views.
I didn't know anything about it.
I hadn't practiced it.
I hadn't done any cold exposure.
And so it was a complete shock,literal and metaphorical sense
(39:43):
of the word.
But it was a very eye-openingand introspective experience.
And I can say that it reallyfreed me a lot.
You know, it taught me a lotabout myself and it gave me the
tools really to sort myself out.
I thought now that I know this,I can definitely help other
people too.
SPEAKER_04 (40:03):
Were you a personal trainer at the time that you
decided to do this training?
SPEAKER_01 (40:07):
Yes, I was applying for physical therapy doctorate
programs.
I had my own business and I wasworking for a boutique gym.
I applied for schools and in theinterim of waiting, that's when
I saw the video and I decided togo there.
And here's the cool part aboutit.
Once I did the experience and Icame back, the long story short,
(40:27):
I got all these rejectionletters and it was more like,
I'm going to go do this formyself.
Now that I learned that thereare masters of the body, mind,
breath that can teach you andshow you the ways that you may
never learn it.
You know, I'm going to go seekthe knowledge.
So I basically dropped out ofschool and I started to build my
personal training and thisperformance practice into what
(40:49):
it is today over the past five,six years.
SPEAKER_04 (40:52):
Very nice.
Well, you know, one thing yousaid is that it was a
life-changing experience foryou.
I mean, what were some of theselife-changing things that you
learned about yourself that havechanged you mentally,
physically?
SPEAKER_01 (41:05):
There's two things in particular that come to mind.
Number one is the breathingexperience, what we would call
the DMT breathwork.
It's a breathwork techniquethat's a little bit more
advanced, not just the Wim Hofmethod, but that had a very...
I don't even know how to say it,mind-blowing internal
(41:26):
experience.
So this is when I gained a lotof insight into so many things I
didn't even know I had going onwith me.
Namely, I've never known mymother.
And so I had an experience that,you know, it was so strange.
When we were doing thisbreathing technique, once I got
into it, my body changed.
(41:47):
I'm going to leave out all thedetails because I like people to
experience their own thing.
But let's just say I got intouch with how I felt at a very
early stage of life, having nothad a mother.
And you live that, youexperience it like an ayahuasca
experience, but naturally.
So you got to gain a lot ofinsight into your psyche, into
(42:07):
your mental, emotional, soulfulstate when nothing else was
there.
It was incredible.
And I had a good cry, a reallygood cry.
Something that was so gutturaland so deep and so locked up
that immediately after, it waslike you were empty.
Empty, empty, like a brand newhuman.
SPEAKER_04 (42:31):
Well, it sounds like it was a release of something
that was being held inside,maybe pain or confusion or
whatever it is with your mother.
And then once it was released,it lightens you, right?
It's something heavy you werecarrying.
Maybe you weren't even sure thatyou were carrying this, but with
that release comes just alightness of being, I'm sure.
(42:53):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (42:55):
That was the first experience.
That's the one that reallytaught me about the breath,
about the body, the mind, thesoul.
This is what really justpropelled me onto a whole other
realm of life, to the unseenpart of life, the things that
we're not told.
You have to seek.
You have to want.
You have to suffer.
You have to find the ways, likeWim found the way.
(43:15):
You know, there are people likethis in all aspects of life.
Through enough suffering andenough desire of yourself,
you're going to find thesepractices or these methods or
these things that are going tobe hugely beneficial for the
soul, the mind, the body toconnect all and to understand
self.
So that's the most profoundthing.
(43:36):
And the next thing was themountain hike that was about six
and a half hours wearing nothingbut shorts in this freezing
mountain, you know, and therewas a few times I genuinely
wanted to throw in the towel andI thought I was going to maybe
lose body parts to frostbite orsomething because, you know, it
was extreme.
Like I said, I couldn't preparefor it.
(43:57):
And I had a decent ego goinginto it, thinking that if this
person has done it, then Icertainly can do it because I'm
in better shape.
I have a stronger mind, etcetera, et cetera.
And when you went out there,you'd be humbled by seeing a
76-year-old woman with arthritisin the knees walking up the same
mountain as you with a smile onher face while you're shivering.
(44:19):
That by itself was somethingamazing to really experience.
Be dependent on self and thebreath and your comrades and see
what you're capable of.
It's another mind-opening,mind-blowing, body-opening,
body-blowing experience.
SPEAKER_04 (44:37):
Well, you know, I read that Wim Hof actually
developed his method after helost his wife to suicide and it
was his way of coping.
And through that, he was able todeal with her death and then
wanted to spread the word.
You already talked about thecold therapy and also some of
the breathing.
(44:57):
Can you explain exactly what theWim Hof method is?
I guess in simple terms so thatwe can understand it.
SPEAKER_01 (45:04):
Yeah, very simple.
This is the best part about itis the simplicity and the
information is out there foreveryone to use.
for free you don't need to payanyone to learn there's tutorial
videos on youtube on theirwebsite lots of scientific
articles but in this practiceit's very simple but there's
very deep layers to thispractice the simplicity is this
(45:26):
there's three pillars there'sthe breathing pillar there's the
mindset pillar and there's thecold exposure pillar and these
three in conjunction togethermakes the practice exponentially
more powerful they havephysiological mental and
emotional effects and one ofthem increases the next one so
(45:53):
if you do the breathing it getsyour mindset and your focus
right and your physiology andchemistry to endure the cold the
pain of the cold the shocking ofthe cold all of that it actually
numbs your body through naturalpain medication so you do that
You're going to set up your bodyphysically.
(46:14):
You're going to set up your mindmentally.
That's the breathing to themeditation to the physiological
state.
Now the effects of the painmodulation, you're going to be
sitting in an ice bath offreezing water that first
crushed you.
And then within 45 seconds to aminute and a half, you're going
to be blown away by how you'reone with the water.
SPEAKER_03 (46:38):
And
SPEAKER_01 (46:39):
you can't feel it.
And you're sitting there withyour eyes wide open in a state
of clear meditation, an extremepresence for two, three minutes,
whatever time it is that you'redoing.
SPEAKER_04 (46:49):
I read that Wim Hof has quite a few Guinness World
Records for all these differentfeats.
And one of them was being in icewater for almost two hours.
And it sounds like this trainingis allows you to meditate or
have mind control to the pointwhere you can control your
(47:11):
physical ability, I guess, toendure pain and cold.
Is that what it is?
SPEAKER_01 (47:17):
First of all, you're able to release and get out of
the overthinking mind.
So most of our problem actuallyarises from being disconnected,
is that when we're doing onething, we're really never doing
one thing.
We're usually doing one thingand the mind is diverted on your
kids, on your work, on somethingelse.
(47:38):
So that disconnection itself,not having your 100% focus, if
your mind is active and it'schattery and it's making up
questions and problems, then theother parts cannot also be
released to do what they do aswell.
So your chemistry changesthrough the mindset because
parts of your brain, like yourhypothalamus, are going to
actually work.
(47:58):
You're training it to work.
Your conscious mind stopsoverthinking.
You can't focus on anything butthe present moment.
And so you have a cascade ofphysiological effects that take
place then.
There's actually thingshappening in your body that
allow you to stand there for twohours and you can increase the
practice like that.
SPEAKER_04 (48:18):
You have taught clients.
What are some of the things thatyou hear from them as far as the
benefits they receive?
SPEAKER_01 (48:24):
The number one thing is everyone just feels great.
They love it.
I have one client that comes in,before I even say anything, he's
like, let's do meditation.
Let's do Wim Hofman.
That's how much he loves therelease and the stress release
and the clarity and the peacethat he gets from doing the
meditation.
(48:45):
And ice bath, everyone justloves the feeling.
They love when they're in thereand they're able to endure it
and enjoy it.
They laugh, they giggle.
There's pictures of likehundreds and hundreds of
Polaroids that I have of peoplethat I've put in this ice bath
and they're smiling or they'rein deep meditation or they're
very chill.
You feel good.
(49:06):
You feel possible and capable.
They're more emotional, not in anegative way, but in a positive
way where they tap in, wheretypically they can be unaware of
themselves and how they feel orwhere they just know they're
stagnant.
And so I recognize this stuff.
I see the energy shift.
SPEAKER_04 (49:25):
I mean, David Shaw mentioned anxiety and how the
breathing techniques actuallycan transform his anxiety to
adrenaline, which can help himperform better.
Does it help for other kinds ofmental health issues like
depression or OCD or what elseyou hear from your clients as
(49:46):
far as that, how it mentally canhelp them?
SPEAKER_01 (49:49):
You know, anxiety is your mind being overactive,
thinking forward, creating andpredicting problems that are not
there.
Just an overactive running mind.
It's tiring.
You're trying to do somethingelse.
You can't do that one thing.
And depression is you're down ondumps.
I speak from experience.
I was studying for my psychologyportion.
(50:10):
My thing was on depression.
That was my life for about 16years.
So my point is when you domeditation has been shown
scientifically.
to improve mental health byitself, just doing the ability
to be present.
Now, you take a powerfultechnique like this where it's
made for anyone, where you canlet go and you can tap in and go
(50:33):
deep and go as far as you wantto.
The answer to how does it help?
I would say how much can beingpresent and how much can that
help with any mental challengesthat you have?
It's profound.
SPEAKER_04 (50:47):
A big thank you to our musical guest, David Shaw of
The Revivalists, and our expert,Farid Hashemi of Emotion
Training.
For more information on DavidShaw's debut solo album and
tour, visit davidshaw.com andfollow him on his socials, at
TheDavidShawMusic and atTheDavidShaw.
(51:07):
And for more information on TheRevivalists, visit
therevivalists.com.
Follow them on their socials, atThe Revivalists.
and stay tuned for a clip ofDavid Shaw's single Shaken from
his new self-titled debut album.
For more information on FaridHashimi and the Wim Hof Method,
visit e-motion-training.com andfollow him on Instagram at
(51:33):
e-motion-training.
Thank you to all of our loyallisteners for your reviews and
for following us on our socialsat Check Your Head Podcast and
on our YouTube channel.
Visit CheckYourHeadPodcast.comto find more than 125 mental
health solutions for recovery.
So until next time, be brave,ask for help, and be persistent
(51:57):
in finding the mental healththat you need.
I
SPEAKER_00 (52:00):
won't tell you lies.
I wasn't raised up that way.
I won't tell you lies.
I can't carry that weight.
(52:25):
Oh, those walls are coming down.
SPEAKER_04 (52:44):
Check Your Head Podcast is kindly supported and
partnered with Sweet ReliefMusicians Fund, DBSA San Gabriel
Valley, Earshot Media, and LemonTree Studios in Los Angeles.
Visit checkyourheadpodcast.comwhere we have over 100 solutions
for mental health.
Be our friends on social mediaat Check Your Head Podcast.
(53:05):
Watch us on YouTube and supportus with a kind donation on
checkyourheadpodcast.com.
Check Your Head podcast issponsored by a 501c3 nonprofit
with all donations being taxdeductible.
Thank you for your support andthank you for listening.
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