Mari Fong interviews India Shawn (singer-songwriter) & Dr. Ish Major (Board Certified Psychiatrist, Relationship Expert, “Marriage Boot Camp,” “Tamron Hall Show,” author of Little White Whys).
R & B artist India Shawn shares her experience with toxic relationships, co-dependency, growing up with a single, therapist mother and an alcoholic father, bad dating patterns, and her own struggles with alcohol. Taking accountability, becoming self-aware, what’s in her mental health toolbox, and Wellness Wednesdays. India performs “Be Myself" with Ron Avant of The Free Nationals.
Next, Dr. Ish Major talks about pandemic relationship issues, the one question asked before getting frustrated with your partner, how to increase your lovability level, telling your story from the end, narcissists, how to attract more loving relationships, and how to fall more in love with yourself.
“Be brave, ask for help, and be persistent in finding the mental help that you need.”
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Welcome to the Check Your Head podcast, the podcast
where notable musicians andexperts come and share their
stories and their solutions formental health and wellness.
I'm your host, Mari Fong, amusic journalist and life coach
for musicians, and we're soonapproaching February and
(00:20):
Valentine's Day, so our focustoday is on relationships,
something we can all relate toand something so key to our
mental health and wellness.
We'll get down to thenitty-gritty, starting with how
to avoid toxic relationships andending with how to have more
loving relationships with eachother and with ourselves.
Today I'm thrilled to have theperfect dynamic duo as featured
(00:43):
guests, the beautiful andtalented R&B artist India Sean
and one of America's toppsychiatrists and relationship
experts, the great Dr.
Ish Major.
We start the episode with thesinger-songwriter who's worked
with the likes of Chris Brown,Solange Knowles, Ludacris, and
Carrie Hilson, and recentlydropped her single called Moving
(01:06):
On, featuring Anderson.Paak.
Our featured guest is IndiaShan, who will share her story
and also give us a musicaltreat, performing her song Be
Myself with Ron Avant of theFree Nationals, so be sure to
stay tuned for that.
For a mental health expert, youmay know him from TV shows such
as Marriage Boot Camp and TheTamron Hall Show, but what you
(01:28):
may not know is that Dr.
Ish Major is also on theprestigious list of America's
top psychiatrists for threeyears running.
Dr.
Ish Major is our expert guest,and he'll be giving us couples
advice, tell us the one questionto ask before blowing up at our
partners, and his tips formaking all of our relationships
just better.
(01:49):
But first, let's start our talkwith the beautiful and talented
India Shan.
But I wanted to get torelationships.
I know that's something that youthink about in your songs.
Yes.
And also that you've had somedifficult and even toxic
relationships.
(02:09):
And that's something that I knowa lot of us relate to.
I'm sure there's onerelationship that really stands
out to you.
A couple that stand out.
Well, that's the other thing.
Sometimes we fall into the samepattern.
But a lot of it is aboutrealizing and being conscious
(02:32):
about what's going on.
I mean, I myself have had myshare and had to realize that it
takes two to tango.
It does.
But tell me a little bit aboutthose toxic relationships and
what kind of transpired.
Oh, you know, I realized thisyear that, like you said, I've
(02:56):
been in a pattern of datingpeople who are unavailable,
emotionally unavailable, justunavailable to meet me halfway,
you know, or just to give ofthemselves in a healthy way.
And so I came to the realizationthat I've been dating the same
(03:16):
man in different bodies forlike, so many years, maybe since
I've stuck, like, the beginningof time, you know?
And it's sad, but it's alsoliberating because I don't take
it so personally with eachindividual.
Like, I have to takeaccountability, you know, for
(03:39):
making that same choice over andover.
So, you know, I feel like themusic has been so reflective,
especially these past singles.
They're beautiful and it's funnyhow some people are like, oh,
riding down the highwaylistening to this.
I feel so good.
I'm in LA, but I'm like, if youreally listen to the words, you
(03:59):
know what I mean?
It's actually kind ofmelancholy.
And I feel like the music, thatbatch of music was just so
reflective of the hurt andbitterness of failed
relationships, you know?
And even like now being in amore conscious place and seeing
(04:19):
that and being a little bit moreself-aware, I'm like, man, I
want to, I want to go back tothe drawing board, you know?
And those songs are good becausepeople feel those ways.
And, you know, I think it's goodfor just to, just to release
them and like get the emotionsout.
But I also want to put somethingequally as positive on the
(04:41):
project.
So yeah, I'm just working onbalancing it right now.
I'm just going to say thisbecause I'm not even sure if
it's true.
I mean, you're this beautiful,giving person.
I can see it inside and out.
And sometimes the men that areattracted to that may appear...
(05:06):
giving at first, but they turnout to be very selfish and
sometimes narcissistic.
Oh my gosh, yeah.
Does that hit a chord at all?
Yeah, yeah.
You know, they could sense thegiving and that's where they
(05:26):
want to take, you know?
Right, right.
Yeah, I had a conversationbecause I'm learning, I'm in
therapy and I'm learning aboutthis term codependency, you
know?
And so I was having aconversation the other day about
how most people are codependent,you know?
But then I thought about thesetakers, you know, the people on
(05:49):
that end, not to say thatcodependence can't be takers,
but I'm like, I feel likethere's like codependence and
then there's narcissists andsociopaths.
You know what I mean?
And it's just like, we find eachother.
We find each other.
So that's the dynamic.
But yeah, hopefully, I mean, weall get healthy.
(06:11):
And I've realized that I havethis thing about wanting to
help.
And I think there's something inmy soul that kind of taps into
somebody who's hurting.
And they may not say it, butthere's something that attracts
me to that.
So I have to watch out, youknow?
Because here I'm trying to dothat with the podcast, but I
don't want that in myrelationship.
(06:34):
Right.
Yeah, well, I am the daughter ofa recovering addict father and a
single mother of four.
So, I mean, I think that just,you know, you can't help but
become a person who isconstantly forgiving, constantly
(06:57):
helping, trying to figure outhow to like remedy things and
just making yourself available.
I mean, especially to my mom,you know?
So, I mean, and equally to myfather, you know, as he was
popping in and out and justdealing with all the things that
come with being a drug addictand an alcoholic, you know?
So I feel like I took all ofthose things into my
(07:21):
relationships.
You know, how can I be ofservice to you?
How can I love you with all myheart?
How can I show you that I'malways going to be there for
you?
How many times can you, youknow, shit on me?
And how many times can I forgiveyou and, you know, prove that
whatever, I can help you.
I can fix you.
I'm worthy of your love.
And this is okay.
(07:41):
Like, you know, all of thosethings, all of those things I
took into my relationships.
So it's just right now, like areprogramming.
Because I think that when you'rein the habit of that, it becomes
so much of who you are.
So I'm reprogramming and justtrying to make better decisions
and healthier choices.
(08:03):
Well, I'm so glad that you'vebeen able to see that when you
grew up with that.
And I think that we fall intopatterns from our parents.
And also, there is DNA that canhappen.
an addiction can get passed onthrough generations sometimes.
And so something like a drugaddiction can be triggered by a
(08:27):
bad relationship or a trauma orsomething like that.
And you said that was somethingthat also was part of your life
at one time.
Or was it a relationship thattriggered that or was it
something else?
Well, as you said, I think justgenetically having that that
predisposition.
(08:49):
You know, my family's fromTrinidad.
So I don't know if you knowabout Caribbean culture, but
they drink, you know what Imean?
So it's just like already in me,but then also my father being an
alcoholic.
And then I think just with thepressures of this career that
I've chosen, which, you know, Istarted my career at 15.
(09:12):
So, you know, I was in the clubsearly.
I was in the clubs at like 16,17 performing.
I was in ATL performing and justexposed to a lot.
And that's kind of when Istarted drinking.
And, you know, you take a drinkto ease your nerves, calm your
nerves.
And like you said, it's justlike that addiction is just
(09:35):
built from that pattern of doingit all the time.
So, yeah.
And then I was on tour lastyear, which was like, show after
show after show, need a shot oftequila before I get on stage.
It's still a part of the processin a lot of ways, even
recording.
It's like, I need to getcomfortable.
Let me have a glass of wine.
(09:57):
And I think that's fine.
I think it's fine as long asyou're not overdoing it.
So yeah, working on that.
You know, that's the thing isthat it could kind of sneak up
on you, right?
Just innocently and like, okay,just to calm the nerves.
(10:18):
And then all of a sudden you'renoticing that it could affect
your behavior and can affectyour relationships.
And sometimes, you know, thingsare said and you're on something
or whether you're drinking orhigh.
And I've talked to a number ofmusicians, you know, that have
gone through that.
And it's tough because...
(10:39):
you've got to be really honestwith yourself, you know, when
you get to a point where youfeel like, you know what, I need
to do something about this.
Right, right.
And I just think it's a form ofescapism, you know, drinking,
drugs, love, sex, relationships,all of those things.
(11:00):
We lean into those thingsbecause we don't want to be with
ourselves.
And That is the part that I'mlike, why do I need a drink
right now?
What am I uncomfortable with?
What can I face in this moment?
And so I'm looking at the waysthat we just can't be with
ourselves and have to grab forthose things, those external
(11:24):
things.
Well, I found that one of thegreatest fears of people in
general is the fear of beingalone, but also being alone with
our own thoughts.
Right.
Right.
And for me, that is thebeautiful thing about
meditation.
I'm so happy that I foundmeditation.
(11:45):
It's always been like kind ofwithin reach because I've done
yoga forever.
And so, you know, that's a partof the practice.
But within the past year or so,I've gone really deep into my
practice.
And I mean, I think that beingable to sit with yourself is
such a simple concept.
(12:06):
And it's crazy that we've madeit this thing where it's like,
oh, I can't just close my eyesand be by myself for five
minutes.
It's too hard.
It's like, that's a damn shamethat that's just such a
challenge for a lot of people.
But I've gotten reallycomfortable with it.
I think the more you getcomfortable in the practice of
(12:30):
meditation, you can like takethat into life and just be good
on your own.
And of course, intimacy isbeautiful and connecting with
people is beautiful, but there'ssomething about just being able
to enjoy your own company and beby yourself and allow those
thoughts to come and be able toprocess things on your own.
(12:50):
So meditation has been key forme.
Well, one thing about meditationis I've tried to understand it.
I've tried to do it the way theydo it.
Like, get all the thoughts outof your mind and, you know,
still.
And then I'm thinking, like,what's supposed to happen at
this point?
What I find is that when I'm outin nature, when I take the dog
(13:15):
out for the walk, I'm in thetree, you know, with the trees
and you hear the birds and yousee the beautiful blue sky.
all of a sudden your mindrelaxes.
And I think that's really thething is once your mind is
relaxed, it makes everythingclear.
Yeah, I think that you're right.
That's what it's all about.
It's about relaxing and gettingclear.
(13:38):
That should be the only goal.
I think people have wildexpectations when it comes to
meditation.
And honestly, for me, I feellike when I'm really
consistently doing it, I do seethe magic of it in my daily
life.
Maybe not in that moment.
I might not whatever have avision, but I see it unfold in
(14:01):
my daily life.
But like you said, it's allabout just getting clear.
And for some people, it's beingin nature.
I think nature is very healing.
So do what works for you.
Well, besides meditation, Inoticed that you, Your mom is a
therapist.
Uh-huh, she is.
(14:21):
What kind of therapy?
Is there a certain kind oftherapy that has been really
helpful for you?
I don't know that the kind oftherapy I go to has a specific
name.
I don't know.
It's just therapy as far as Iknow.
But what I love is that mytherapist was formerly in the
(14:43):
music industry.
So she has a context for myworld, you know, and that helps.
And she's a woman maybe like inher mid 40s or something.
So it's good.
Like it's just having a personto talk to you that is just
going to sit and listen.
(15:03):
I mean, we have friends and wehave family that we can talk to,
but they're always going to kindof like insert.
some level of opinion, you know,or judgment or what a solution.
And you may not need that.
You may just need to talk andget it off your chest, you know?
And so I think that that's thecool part about it.
One thing I noticed, you havethis wonderful thing called
(15:28):
Wellness Wednesdays.
And I saw that one of yourepisodes was about therapy.
SPEAKER_00 (15:35):
And I was thinking,
SPEAKER_01 (15:36):
You normally do something where you point out a
few different points toremember.
Okay.
With therapy, I think you vote,find the right match, be honest,
and do the work.
Do the work, yes, yes, yes.
Right.
And that's working on ourselves,how we're acting and what we're
(16:00):
attracting, right?
Whether it's relationships orcareers or whatever it might be.
Most definitely.
But tell me more about WellnessWednesdays because I love that
whole concept.
Thank you.
So as a new artist, I knew thatI needed to just be putting more
(16:21):
content out into the world.
I mean, I know that people lookat me and see the glitter and
sequins and all the shiny stuffand I wanted to show the world
who I am on a more pure level, Iguess.
And I thought this would be agood way to do it.
And also, it's just a way ofkeeping myself accountable for
(16:44):
this wellness lifestyle.
You know what I mean?
It's easy to wear the garb andburn incense and things like
that, but to really be on a truejourney of wellness and a real
practice of it on a daily basis,it holds me accountable.
It's been good for me.
And it's funny because eventhough I've been in the industry
for all these years, it's thechallenge.
(17:06):
So I like to have somethingoutside of music and songwriting
that I can devote time to.
And I just feel like it'splanting seeds right now.
It's planting seeds.
And hopefully people arewatching and getting inspired.
So it's been cool.
Well, they're usually less than10 minutes.
UNKNOWN (17:28):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (17:29):
But I was wondering, as a musician, going on tour and
songwriting, working with otherartists, what are some mental
health tips for the long run?
Oh, definitely to develop aroutine.
For me, that is, of course,meditation, as we said.
I see a therapist weekly.
(17:50):
I'll probably lessen that as Ibecome less crazy.
Being out in nature, workingout, hiking almost daily, that's
good for me.
Cracking open a book, what theycall self-help books or
self-developmental books, that'sgood for me.
(18:11):
That's my go-to set of tools inthis toolbox.
When I am down or feeling low orkind of in a dark place, I know
now that I have these tools thatI can pull from and just feel
better.
So definitely develop a routine.
course, surround yourself withpositive people and watch
(18:33):
Wellness Wednesdays now.
You can say that.
That is a solution.
What are some ways to havehealthier relationships and to
avoid toxic people?
I think you really have todevelop a healthy relationship
(18:54):
with yourself first becauseReally get to know yourself and
love yourself.
We hear that all the time, but Ithink that our outer worlds and
our relationships are so veryreflective of the relationship
that we have with ourselves.
So spend time with yourself andreally get to know what you
(19:16):
want.
what you really want.
And I think from that place, youcan create healthy boundaries
with people.
And that's where I am right now.
It's like, okay, I'm going tokeep you at six feet.
You can come in a little closer.
But you have to know what youreally want.
So self-awareness.
(19:38):
Self-awareness and self-care.
Mm-hmm.
I think especially for women,because we kind of grew up maybe
seeing our mom being a littlesubservient, we have to
consciously think about ourself-care first, ourselves
first, without feeling selfishabout that.
(20:00):
Right.
I mean, it's so ingrained in usas women, you know, and for me,
I didn't have a father in thehousehold and mom never had
boyfriends around or anythinglike that.
So it was literally just her,but I think even just in the
media, you know what I mean?
Like this is what we, what wegrew up saying and we got every
program, you know, it's all anundoing.
(20:22):
Well, thank you so much.
Thank you.
And you know what?
One of my favorite parts of theepisode is when artists say that
they will do an acoustic songafter we do our interview.
And you've agreed to that.
So I'm super excited about it.
And I'm going to do an oldie butgoodie.
(20:43):
This is Ron Avant from the FreeNationals.
They took me on tour earlierthis year.
So yeah, shout out to them.
But this song is called BeMyself.
And the message is that all Ihave to do is be myself.
I don't owe anybody anythingoutside of just being who I am
authentically.
And that is enough.
(21:06):
We are enough as we are.
And this was the first song thatI ever wrote for myself as an
artist on my first album,Origin.
SPEAKER_00 (21:24):
I ain't gotta be
SPEAKER_01 (21:42):
a doctor to cure a patient.
I ain't gotta be the presidentto heal the nation.
I ain't gotta own the buildingto be a preacher.
I don't need no certification
SPEAKER_00 (22:06):
to be a teacher.
I ain't gotta be a teacher toschool the children.
And I ain't
SPEAKER_01 (22:13):
gotta
SPEAKER_00 (22:13):
hate
SPEAKER_01 (22:13):
the men just to stand for women.
All I gotta do, all I gotta dois
SPEAKER_00 (22:23):
be
SPEAKER_01 (22:23):
myself.
SPEAKER_00 (22:29):
All I gotta do, all I gotta do is be myself.
SPEAKER_01 (22:40):
And
SPEAKER_00 (22:40):
I ain't gotta
SPEAKER_01 (22:41):
lay down when I see ya to be a keeper.
And you ain't gotta drive abeamer to make me need ya.
We ain't got to keep up with theJoneses or the Kardashians.
We ain't got to look to theoutside to find another.
(23:04):
Yeah.
All we got to do.
All we got to do is beourselves.
SPEAKER_00 (23:16):
All we got to do.
All we got to
SPEAKER_01 (23:21):
do.
It's all we gotta do All wegotta do All we gotta do It's
all we gotta do It's all wegotta do All we gotta do It's
SPEAKER_00 (23:47):
all we gotta do All I gotta do All I gotta do Is be
myself Be myself All I gotta
SPEAKER_01 (24:04):
do All I gotta do Is be myself You play beautifully
and you sing beautifully.
(24:27):
Thank you so much.
Yes.
Oh my gosh.
I haven't, I haven't sang thatsong in so long.
So that was good.
So good to do.
Next up, we have board certifiedpsychiatrist and relationship
expert, Dr.
Ish Major.
Dr.
Ish has spent the last 15 yearshelping men and women find,
(24:49):
date, and keep the lovingrelationships they've always
wanted.
So let's hear Dr.
Ish give us his practical,down-to-earth advice on dating,
mating, and relating.
It's so great to have you onbecause, let me tell you,
everyone can relate torelationships, especially being
stressed at this time.
(25:11):
We've got the pandemic.
We've got the lockdown.
And that's put a strain on a lotof relationships.
What do you see as some of thegreatest challenges for couples
during this time?
Well, I think one of thegreatest challenges is just to
learn how to be patient witheach other.
(25:34):
because we really ran thin onthat.
We ran thin on two things in2020.
We ran short on patience and weran short real quick on empathy,
right?
We just didn't have time for it.
And part of that was, you know,imagine...
you know, God forbid, if yourhouse is on fire, right?
What do you do when your houseis on fire?
You reach for those things thatare important to you first.
(25:57):
My partner's here.
My husband and wife's, well, mypartner's here.
Like, where are the kids?
Honey, grab the kids.
Now I got the car keys.
I got the money, right?
We need, these are some clothes.
We need some things to be okay.
And so in 2020, you know, we allrealized that we weren't okay.
And it was like our house was onfire.
And so we kept those things thatwe needed to feel good, super,
(26:18):
super close.
And we had very little patiencefor anything and anyone else who
didn't help us feel that way.
And a lot of us figured out thatour partner was one of those
people.
So it's hard, right?
Yeah, it was extraordinarilydifficult.
Well, also like the time that wehad to do other things to
(26:41):
distract us, either from ourrelationships with our intimate,
you know, partners and also therelationships that we had with
ourselves.
We, you know, have more time tobe alone with our thoughts and
then having to also turn on adime.
We've had to do, we've beenfaced with a lot of stresses
kind of all at once.
(27:04):
That's the other thing, thething you just touched on, you
know, Patience with each other,but a lot of us ran out of
patience with ourselves, right?
We're in the West.
Part of our culture is we liketo keep going.
We like to go on to the nextthing.
We don't like to sit still andsit quietly and be alone with
our thoughts because we mightnot like what we're thinking and
(27:27):
we might not like what we'rethinking about them or more
importantly about us.
And so that was one of thethings that really forced us to
sit and do.
And a lot of us are veryuncomfortable with that.
And so that just led to more ofthe relationship toxicity that
we saw.
Now, do you know what the numberone story came out a few months
ago?
Do you know what was the numberone question asked in 2020?
(27:47):
Number one question.
Gee, how do I spend more timealone and be happy with that?
That's great.
That's a smart question.
Number one question in 2020 was,why do you do it that way?
talking to your partner why doyou chew that way why do you do
(28:10):
the dishes that way why do youbreathe that way why do you walk
that way because we were gettingon each other's nerves yeah even
the littlest things the smallthings the small things when you
don't you know in psychiatry wecall it frustration tolerance
right when you're not feelingwell you're depressed or you're
sad or you're anxious or you'rehaving some issues going on your
(28:31):
frustration tolerance goes downto zero And there's very little
you can do.
It just makes everything get onyour nerves.
And so part of that is justunderstanding for 2020, as we
try to get through 2020, as wetry to get through our
relationships, people are doingthe best they can.
And if they could do it better,they would probably do it
(28:52):
better.
But what they're showing you isthe best they got for today.
And so you've got to be able totake people at face value where
they're coming from and thenwork within those confines.
Well, you know, with COVID andthe lockdown, the pandemic, and
also the stress of what's goingon politically, what kind of
advice would you give couples?
(29:14):
You said patience is reallyimportant.
What are some other things youcould think of that can be
really valuable during this timewhere we have so much time
together?
Yeah, I think for me, thebiggest thing that I can tell
couples is make sure you'retelling each other the truth.
(29:37):
And in order to do that, you'vegot to be able to tell yourself
the truth about what'shappening, right?
Because what we're, what is it,whatever we're getting into it
about, whatever I'm not likingor loving about you today,
whatever's getting on my nervestoday, you know, we've got to be
able to tell ourselves the truthabout why that is and what
that's not.
And so, There's one questionthat will literally save your
(30:00):
relationship if you're gettingcaught up in those type cycles.
And that question is, wheneversomething is going on and they
did something you don't like, orthey're chewing too loud, or
they're sleeping too long or notsleeping long enough, or they're
not picking up behind, whateverthat thing is, whatever your pet
peeves are, stop in that momentand ask yourself this one
(30:24):
question.
What else could it be?
Right?
UNKNOWN (30:27):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (30:28):
And let your partner know about that.
Right.
Are they intentionally justgetting off my nerves?
Don't they know that I don'tlike it like that?
Could be that.
Or what else could it be?
I texted you two hours ago.
You just texted me back now.
That must mean you don't.
What else could it be?
Stop and ask yourself just thatone question and allow the time
(30:51):
for you to run through a fewdifferent scenarios.
Could be their phone truly died.
Could be they're truly busy.
Maybe they're stuck in trafficsomewhere where they don't have
any.
Could be a million other reasonsthat don't have anything to do
with them not loving Lou likethey're supposed to.
And so if you can just stop andask yourself that, it's much
easier to not take what yourpartner is doing personally and
(31:13):
you can have a much moreenjoyable time tonight.
That's good advice.
Okay, so we had the interviewwith India Sean.
And, you know, we talked aboutgivers and takers and
codependency.
Can you explain what it means tohave a codependent relationship?
(31:34):
Yeah, so that's a good question.
A lot of us are in codependentrelationships and we don't even
realize it.
We don't even know why.
So traditionally, what you'rethinking about when you talk
about, you know, the moreclassic example is you're in a
relationship, one partnerdrinks, one partner's a flat-out
alcoholic, the other onedoesn't.
What happens is the non-drinkingpartner will spend 90% of their
(31:56):
time trying to take care of thepartner who drinks, trying to
manage their situation, tryingto clear all the alcohol in our
house, trying to clear alltriggers out of their way,
trying to keep them sober andkeep them emotionally stable
while everybody's life isfalling apart.
The true definition of acodependent relationship is when
(32:16):
I am taking responsibility foryour life.
What you think, what you feel,what you do.
I feel overly responsible forthat.
I'm here to fix it.
I'm here to mend it.
I'm here to make it as smooth aspossible to my own detriment.
Because the other thing thathappens in a codependent
relationship is we think thatthe sick part, right?
(32:38):
And this can be, so this couldbe a drinker, a non-drinker,
right?
This could be a drug user,non-drug user.
This could be somebody who's gotan eating problem.
and the other partner doesn't,this could be somebody who's got
any type of compulsive thingthat's happening, right?
Whether it's eating, whetheryou're an eater or a gambler,
shopper, sexer, rager, hoarder,whatever those things are,
right?
(32:59):
That sets up the dynamic for acodependent relationship, right?
Now, the other person doesn'tnecessarily have to be,
quote-unquote, sick.
You could just be one of thosepeople who like to take
responsibility for folks who arenot functioning on a level that
you are, and you still have thatcodependency that's happening,
you know?
You know, I do think thathappens quite a bit.
I mean, I'm going to bring it tomyself just because, you know,
(33:23):
I'm trying to figure this outmyself too, but I noticed that
there's a part of me that reallycan sense when somebody is
hurting.
And I think there's part of methat wants to help and heal.
I'm conscious of it now, but Iwasn't before.
And I think sometimes it, itattracts the wrong people for
(33:47):
you.
It could lead possibly to atoxic situation.
No possibly about it.
It definitely can't.
And it's like bees to honey,right?
Because what do we do when we'reout in the world and we all, I
don't care who you are, I don'tcare where you're from, I don't
(34:08):
care what type of life or familyyou come from, whether you had a
whole lot or very, very little,You know, once you show up here,
especially here in the West,it's almost impossible not to
suffer from that disease callednot enough itis, right?
Who I am isn't enough.
Every time we open our eyes andwake up in the morning, we're
(34:30):
immediately bombarded with theimages that tell us that who we
are isn't enough.
I go on Instagram and Iimmediately see a guy who's
taller, more handsome, got moremoney, got a nicer car, got a
prettier apartment, all thesethings, right?
People on TV, they got moremoney.
Their life is more fancy thanmine.
I scroll through people'shighlight reels and they're
going on better vacations.
They got better...
All of these things.
(34:51):
And so we all suffer from thatin some way, shape, or form.
And so what we're doing is we'retrying to go through life trying
to get whole.
We're trying to look for thenext thing.
What's the thing that's going tohelp me feel more whole today
and more full today?
And that's typically...
how we attract our partners,right?
(35:12):
They have something that we maybe missing, right?
If I'm bad at saying no, I'mgoing to naturally be drawn to
people who are really good atsaying no.
If I'm bad at functioning inthis area of life, I'm going to
be attracted to somebody who'sbetter at functioning because
together, we got a shot atbalancing this thing out and
coming out whole.
(35:32):
And so that's usually, right?
It's like bees to honey.
You can't describe it.
You put those two people in aroom, Nine times out of ten,
they're going to find each otherby the end of the night, and
they're going to be off to theraces.
That's how it works.
Well, how do we recognize, let'ssay, when something about
(35:52):
ourselves is attracting thewrong kind of person and kind of
reprogramming ourselves toattract the right person, a
healthier relationship?
Yeah.
So the way you recognize it, wewere all born with this amazing
navigation system.
called emotions.
And they are always guiding youto whether you're doing the
(36:12):
right thing or the wrong thing.
You've got to just check in withhow you feel.
If you're doing something andyou feel joyful, you're probably
doing the right thing.
Keep going.
If you're doing something andyou feel less than, if you're
doing something and you feelhesitant, you're doing something
that just feels downright icky,it's not the right thing, don't
continue to do that.
The other thing we were taughthere is that in order for me to
(36:35):
be deserving, to have the fulllife that I say I want, I have
to suffer through some things,right?
I got to bear the cross and Igot to suffer and I got to have
the trials and I got to have thetribulation.
And you don't have to do any ofit, right?
You're here, right?
You won the lottery.
You got a brain that functions.
(36:55):
You got a body that functions.
So there's nothing else you needto do to deserve that joy and
that happiness that you want.
So don't get caught up infeeling like you've got to go
through this struggle in orderto come out on the other side
and be rewarded.
You know, life can be its ownreward.
So that's the first thing.
But when you talk aboutreprogramming and understanding
(37:16):
this, so trust your emotions,right?
And then just tell yourself thetruth about where you are and
what you're feeling and why.
And then the way you reallystart to take ownership and
start to reprogram in your lifeis to start changing the story
that you're telling yourself.
My dad used to say, you know,there's no mystery to anything.
You just think about it a lotand you can figure it out.
(37:39):
And so in life, right, thereason you don't have everything
it is that you think you wantand deserve is because of the
story you're telling yourselfand why you don't have it.
Right?
Yeah, I agree.
I do think that what we thinkand how we think also attracts
(37:59):
things into our life because westart to focus on those things
and maybe have other things fallaway.
But that really kind of struck anerve because I do think that
oftentimes the basis for a lotof problems in relationships and
other things has to do with howwe feel about ourselves, like
(38:20):
the love that we have forourselves.
And what is it that I guess wecan do to really fall more in
love with ourselves so that wecan be more loving to others.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's lovability, right?
What's your lovability level?
What are those things that youlove about yourself?
And so again, we've all got astory that we tell ourselves,
(38:40):
right?
You know, I'm, I'm too this, I'mnot enough that I'm too tall.
I'm too short.
I'm too big.
I'm too little.
I'm too smart.
I'm too dumb.
Whatever those stories are, youknow, you got to start really
paying attention to what those,to what those tapes are that are
running in your brain, you know?
Go back and check the tape.
Did I just call myself stupidfor just making a bad decision?
(39:01):
I'm not stupid.
I just didn't make a greatdecision.
I should do it better.
And so check the tape, right?
Really start understanding thenarrative you're telling
yourself, not only about you,but about how life is supposed
to work, right?
But if your narrative about loveis that all guys cheat, well,
guess what?
Your brain wants to make youlife.
makes sense.
(39:22):
Right?
And so your brain is going toattract some guys who help you
make that story come true.
Yeah.
There's another cheater andanother cheater and another and
another and another.
Right?
If your dating story is that,you know, it's a jungle.
It's a dating game jungle outthere where you're going to run
into some animals.
UNKNOWN (39:38):
Okay?
SPEAKER_01 (39:39):
But if you just change that story and say, you
know what?
You know, Dating is a dance, youknow what I mean?
And I'm just a butterfly.
Now it's a whole difference,right?
Even your face changed when Ijust said that, right?
Because it's a whole differentidea of how you go about it.
Now it's light and it's fun.
And I'm going to see where Iland and we'll go from there.
(40:01):
So you've really got to payattention to the narrative that
you're telling yourself.
And again, tell yourself thetruth about the thing it is that
happened.
We've all gone through stuff.
You know and and we get to thisgame where we kind of measure
our pain against somebody else'sright?
No, my bad thing was better thanyour bad thing So I get to talk
about it more my bad thingwasn't as bad as your bad thing
(40:24):
So I don't deserve to give up.
No, so stop.
So stop doing that.
But whatever that thing was,right?
We're all the hero in our ownstory all the main character in
our own movie.
We all got this thing we got toovercome and so whatever that
thing was, you got to tellyourself the truth about it,
right?
Because the truth as you knew itthen, once you're a little
(40:46):
removed from it, you got a30,000 foot view, it's probably
not the truth as you know itnow.
So go back and look at that andsay, huh, I think I was wrong
about that.
The truth about that as well.
You know, for example, let's sayyou grew up and you didn't have
a dad in your life.
So you grew up feeling likecrap.
Well, as a little kid, The storyyou start to tell yourself is,
well, I wasn't smart enough, ormaybe if I was prettier, or
(41:09):
maybe I was more handsome, maybeif I could get better grades, I
could have done something tomake them proud.
What was the thing that wasn'tthere in me that I was lacking
that made somebody who wassupposed to love me not love me?
You carry this throughout yourlife, but now you can be able to
look back and say, okay, youknow what?
Actually, I was three.
I was a kid.
(41:29):
Maybe the truth of that is,Maybe this was a guy who was
living his own life, being hisown main character in his own
movie.
And he had some things going onthat didn't allow him to
properly take care of the prisonfor a little boy.
And maybe that's the truth.
Maybe the truth is it actuallydidn't have anything to do with
me because I was actually okay.
(41:51):
Right.
And once you can start doingthat and start to restructure
some of those conversations andtake that narrative of the bad
thing that happened and tellthat story from the end.
Right.
You know how it ended.
Didn't kill you.
You're here watching me.
You got an iPhone.
You got Wi-Fi.
Things turned out OK.
Right.
So tell the story from the end.
So saying, well, there was thattime when they came into my room
(42:14):
at night and they would do thesethings to me.
OK.
Yeah.
That takes you down a wholeseparate path and makes you
relive it.
Tell it from the end.
You know what?
I am so proud of how I amshowing up today because you
can't believe what I had toovercome.
I am so amazed that I can showup and still fight and still try
and still go to achieve andstill believe that I deserve
some more in spite of the thingthat happened.
(42:36):
So once you can start tellingthat story from the end, that's
how you really start toreconnect and make some
reconnections in that narrative.
And then you practice tellingthat story and see how much more
empowered you can show up inyour life.
Well, let me ask you this.
I mean, that makes great sensebecause you're basically
changing, like you said,changing the story in your head.
But as a psychiatrist, would yousay that actually being honest
(43:01):
with yourself and being thatself-aware is a challenge?
Because I know, like, forinstance, like narcissism, let's
say, that whole condition isbased on creating narcissism.
like this narrative that may notbe based on the truth but it
also helps them survive to havethis narrative i mean what do
(43:26):
you think in those cases what todo yeah so so the ability to
self-reflect right and tellyourself the truth about who you
are you know everything we theway our personalities develop is
through defenses right we'reborn this this helpless
vulnerable baby and we dependedon somebody else for the next
15, 18, 20 years to help takecare of us.
(43:48):
And so most of what ourpersonality develops is in how
do I defend against the thingsthat happen that come to
threaten me, right?
I'm cold or I'm hungry.
I got to cry.
Come take care of me.
And so our personality is kindof developed.
I need to be hugged.
Let me whine a little bit.
I need some attention.
Let me fret a little bit, right?
That whole thing.
And depending on what you feelyou need the most depends on
(44:09):
what parts of your defenses andyour personality develop.
So if you're talking about anarcissist, right, that is a
very particular personalitytype.
I will tell you as apsychiatrist, they are the
toughest patients I ever have.
And they're the hardest patientsyou're ever going to have
because they are invested inbelieving the narrative that
they tell themselves, right?
(44:30):
Because What's underneath thatgruff shell, that tough shell,
that hard-edged shell?
I'm the best.
I'm the smartest.
I'm the prettiest.
I'm the richest.
I'm the grandest.
I'm the baddest thing in thejungle.
Once you crack that shell, thereis a soft, quivering mass of
uncertainty and insecurity, andit is very hard to put that back
(44:53):
together.
I had a doc who I was seeing along time ago, and he was on the
verge of losing his licensebecause he was such a jerk.
He was just a jerk.
Great doc.
Nobody could deal with him.
And once you start to just helpthem with little truth pebbles,
well, maybe that's true or maybeit's this.
(45:16):
And they have to start thinkingabout it.
And the day they crack, right?
That's the clinical term we use.
The day you crack that shell, heliterally cried in that office
for 30 minutes.
Really?
And it is it is one of the worstcries you've ever seen in your
life.
And it just breaks your heartbecause they're just underneath
(45:37):
that shell.
They're just a scared littlekid.
Every one of us has somethingwe're pretending not to know
about themselves.
And nobody pretends better thanthe narcissist.
They've perfected the pretend.
Because underneath there, if Ilet you see me and you reject
that, then I got nothing else.
(45:57):
That's all I got.
Right.
And that's going to leave mewith nothing.
And so they are really, reallyinvested in that, that
personality type in particular.
It's hard stuff.
Fun, fun to date for a littlewhile.
Yes.
And they kept you in their weband then, yeah.
(46:17):
And the narcissist, right.
He's, The narcissist isextraordinarily charismatic,
right?
At getting people to follow themand at making you believe that
you are the only person whoexists in this world, right?
They make you feel specialbecause I am so grand and now
I'm giving you that opportunityto bask in my glow.
(46:39):
So therefore that makes youspecial, right?
Up until the day that you dosomething that displeases them
or doesn't please them ordoesn't match up with whatever
story, whatever take they've gotrunning in their head, and then
it can get really, really ugly.
Right, right.
Because then you become a threatto their whole persona that they
(47:00):
kind of survive with.
Right.
A big thank you to thewonderfully talented India Sean
and the always delightful andinsightful Dr.
Ish Major.
For more on India Sean, find heron social media, on Facebook and
purchase India's music onAmazon.com.
(47:23):
For more on Dr.
Ish Major, visit DrIshmajor.com.
Find him on social media atDrIshmajor.
Look out for Dr.
Ish on Season 18 of MarriageBoot Camp on WE tv and stay
tuned for Part 2 of Dr.
Ish's interview on our nextCheck Your Head podcast episode.
For mental health and solutionsfor recovery, visit
(47:45):
CheckYourHeadPodcast.com.
And if you enjoyed today's CheckYour Head episode, share it with
your friends and be your friendson social media at
CheckYourHeadPodcast.
And thank you for leaving us areview or supporting us with a
donation atCheckYourHeadPodcast.com.
So until next time, be brave,ask for help, and be persistent
(48:05):
in finding the mental help thatyou need.
The Check Your Head podcast iskindly supported by DBSA San
Gabriel Valley, Lemon TreeStudios, and Blue Oak Mastering
and Podcasting in Los Angeles.
Visit our website atcheckyourheadpodcast.com where
you'll find free and affordableresources for mental health and
(48:26):
where you can also support us bydonating or subscribing to our
Patreon page.
Thank you so much for liking andfollowing us on Facebook and
Instagram at Check Your HeadPodcast.
And the Check Your Head Podcastis sponsored by a 501c3
nonprofit, so all donations aretax deductible.
Thank you so much for listeningand for your support.
Welcome to the Check Your Head podcast, the podcast
where notable musicians andexperts come and share their
stories and their solutions formental health and wellness.
I'm your host, Mari Fong, amusic journalist and life coach
for musicians, and we're soonapproaching February and
(00:20):
Valentine's Day, so our focustoday is on relationships,
something we can all relate toand something so key to our
mental health and wellness.
We'll get down to thenitty-gritty, starting with how
to avoid toxic relationships andending with how to have more
loving relationships with eachother and with ourselves.
Today I'm thrilled to have theperfect dynamic duo as featured
(00:43):
guests, the beautiful andtalented R&B artist India Sean
and one of America's toppsychiatrists and relationship
experts, the great Dr.
Ish Major.
We start the episode with thesinger-songwriter who's worked
with the likes of Chris Brown,Solange Knowles, Ludacris, and
Carrie Hilson, and recentlydropped her single called Moving
(01:06):
On, featuring Anderson.Paak.
Our featured guest is IndiaShan, who will share her story
and also give us a musicaltreat, performing her song Be
Myself with Ron Avant of theFree Nationals, so be sure to
stay tuned for that.
For a mental health expert, youmay know him from TV shows such
as Marriage Boot Camp and TheTamron Hall Show, but what you
(01:28):
may not know is that Dr.
Ish Major is also on theprestigious list of America's
top psychiatrists for threeyears running.
Dr.
Ish Major is our expert guest,and he'll be giving us couples
advice, tell us the one questionto ask before blowing up at our
partners, and his tips formaking all of our relationships
just better.
(01:49):
But first, let's start our talkwith the beautiful and talented
India Shan.
But I wanted to get torelationships.
I know that's something that youthink about in your songs.
Yes.
And also that you've had somedifficult and even toxic
relationships.
(02:09):
And that's something that I knowa lot of us relate to.
I'm sure there's onerelationship that really stands
out to you.
A couple that stand out.
Well, that's the other thing.
Sometimes we fall into the samepattern.
But a lot of it is aboutrealizing and being conscious
(02:32):
about what's going on.
I mean, I myself have had myshare and had to realize that it
takes two to tango.
It does.
But tell me a little bit aboutthose toxic relationships and
what kind of transpired.
Oh, you know, I realized thisyear that, like you said, I've
(02:56):
been in a pattern of datingpeople who are unavailable,
emotionally unavailable, justunavailable to meet me halfway,
you know, or just to give ofthemselves in a healthy way.
And so I came to the realizationthat I've been dating the same
(03:16):
man in different bodies forlike, so many years, maybe since
I've stuck, like, the beginningof time, you know?
And it's sad, but it's alsoliberating because I don't take
it so personally with eachindividual.
Like, I have to takeaccountability, you know, for
(03:39):
making that same choice over andover.
So, you know, I feel like themusic has been so reflective,
especially these past singles.
They're beautiful and it's funnyhow some people are like, oh,
riding down the highwaylistening to this.
I feel so good.
I'm in LA, but I'm like, if youreally listen to the words, you
(03:59):
know what I mean?
It's actually kind ofmelancholy.
And I feel like the music, thatbatch of music was just so
reflective of the hurt andbitterness of failed
relationships, you know?
And even like now being in amore conscious place and seeing
(04:19):
that and being a little bit moreself-aware, I'm like, man, I
want to, I want to go back tothe drawing board, you know?
And those songs are good becausepeople feel those ways.
And, you know, I think it's goodfor just to, just to release
them and like get the emotionsout.
But I also want to put somethingequally as positive on the
(04:41):
project.
So yeah, I'm just working onbalancing it right now.
I'm just going to say thisbecause I'm not even sure if
it's true.
I mean, you're this beautiful,giving person.
I can see it inside and out.
And sometimes the men that areattracted to that may appear...
(05:06):
giving at first, but they turnout to be very selfish and
sometimes narcissistic.
Oh my gosh, yeah.
Does that hit a chord at all?
Yeah, yeah.
You know, they could sense thegiving and that's where they
(05:26):
want to take, you know?
Right, right.
Yeah, I had a conversationbecause I'm learning, I'm in
therapy and I'm learning aboutthis term codependency, you
know?
And so I was having aconversation the other day about
how most people are codependent,you know?
But then I thought about thesetakers, you know, the people on
(05:49):
that end, not to say thatcodependence can't be takers,
but I'm like, I feel likethere's like codependence and
then there's narcissists andsociopaths.
You know what I mean?
And it's just like, we find eachother.
We find each other.
So that's the dynamic.
But yeah, hopefully, I mean, weall get healthy.
(06:11):
And I've realized that I havethis thing about wanting to
help.
And I think there's something inmy soul that kind of taps into
somebody who's hurting.
And they may not say it, butthere's something that attracts
me to that.
So I have to watch out, youknow?
Because here I'm trying to dothat with the podcast, but I
don't want that in myrelationship.
(06:34):
Right.
Yeah, well, I am the daughter ofa recovering addict father and a
single mother of four.
So, I mean, I think that just,you know, you can't help but
become a person who isconstantly forgiving, constantly
(06:57):
helping, trying to figure outhow to like remedy things and
just making yourself available.
I mean, especially to my mom,you know?
So, I mean, and equally to myfather, you know, as he was
popping in and out and justdealing with all the things that
come with being a drug addictand an alcoholic, you know?
So I feel like I took all ofthose things into my
(07:21):
relationships.
You know, how can I be ofservice to you?
How can I love you with all myheart?
How can I show you that I'malways going to be there for
you?
How many times can you, youknow, shit on me?
And how many times can I forgiveyou and, you know, prove that
whatever, I can help you.
I can fix you.
I'm worthy of your love.
And this is okay.
(07:41):
Like, you know, all of thosethings, all of those things I
took into my relationships.
So it's just right now, like areprogramming.
Because I think that when you'rein the habit of that, it becomes
so much of who you are.
So I'm reprogramming and justtrying to make better decisions
and healthier choices.
(08:03):
Well, I'm so glad that you'vebeen able to see that when you
grew up with that.
And I think that we fall intopatterns from our parents.
And also, there is DNA that canhappen.
an addiction can get passed onthrough generations sometimes.
And so something like a drugaddiction can be triggered by a
(08:27):
bad relationship or a trauma orsomething like that.
And you said that was somethingthat also was part of your life
at one time.
Or was it a relationship thattriggered that or was it
something else?
Well, as you said, I think justgenetically having that that
predisposition.
(08:49):
You know, my family's fromTrinidad.
So I don't know if you knowabout Caribbean culture, but
they drink, you know what Imean?
So it's just like already in me,but then also my father being an
alcoholic.
And then I think just with thepressures of this career that
I've chosen, which, you know, Istarted my career at 15.
(09:12):
So, you know, I was in the clubsearly.
I was in the clubs at like 16,17 performing.
I was in ATL performing and justexposed to a lot.
And that's kind of when Istarted drinking.
And, you know, you take a drinkto ease your nerves, calm your
nerves.
And like you said, it's justlike that addiction is just
(09:35):
built from that pattern of doingit all the time.
So, yeah.
And then I was on tour lastyear, which was like, show after
show after show, need a shot oftequila before I get on stage.
It's still a part of the processin a lot of ways, even
recording.
It's like, I need to getcomfortable.
Let me have a glass of wine.
(09:57):
And I think that's fine.
I think it's fine as long asyou're not overdoing it.
So yeah, working on that.
You know, that's the thing isthat it could kind of sneak up
on you, right?
Just innocently and like, okay,just to calm the nerves.
(10:18):
And then all of a sudden you'renoticing that it could affect
your behavior and can affectyour relationships.
And sometimes, you know, thingsare said and you're on something
or whether you're drinking orhigh.
And I've talked to a number ofmusicians, you know, that have
gone through that.
And it's tough because...
(10:39):
you've got to be really honestwith yourself, you know, when
you get to a point where youfeel like, you know what, I need
to do something about this.
Right, right.
And I just think it's a form ofescapism, you know, drinking,
drugs, love, sex, relationships,all of those things.
(11:00):
We lean into those thingsbecause we don't want to be with
ourselves.
And That is the part that I'mlike, why do I need a drink
right now?
What am I uncomfortable with?
What can I face in this moment?
And so I'm looking at the waysthat we just can't be with
ourselves and have to grab forthose things, those external
(11:24):
things.
Well, I found that one of thegreatest fears of people in
general is the fear of beingalone, but also being alone with
our own thoughts.
Right.
Right.
And for me, that is thebeautiful thing about
meditation.
I'm so happy that I foundmeditation.
(11:45):
It's always been like kind ofwithin reach because I've done
yoga forever.
And so, you know, that's a partof the practice.
But within the past year or so,I've gone really deep into my
practice.
And I mean, I think that beingable to sit with yourself is
such a simple concept.
(12:06):
And it's crazy that we've madeit this thing where it's like,
oh, I can't just close my eyesand be by myself for five
minutes.
It's too hard.
It's like, that's a damn shamethat that's just such a
challenge for a lot of people.
But I've gotten reallycomfortable with it.
I think the more you getcomfortable in the practice of
(12:30):
meditation, you can like takethat into life and just be good
on your own.
And of course, intimacy isbeautiful and connecting with
people is beautiful, but there'ssomething about just being able
to enjoy your own company and beby yourself and allow those
thoughts to come and be able toprocess things on your own.
(12:50):
So meditation has been key forme.
Well, one thing about meditationis I've tried to understand it.
I've tried to do it the way theydo it.
Like, get all the thoughts outof your mind and, you know,
still.
And then I'm thinking, like,what's supposed to happen at
this point?
What I find is that when I'm outin nature, when I take the dog
(13:15):
out for the walk, I'm in thetree, you know, with the trees
and you hear the birds and yousee the beautiful blue sky.
all of a sudden your mindrelaxes.
And I think that's really thething is once your mind is
relaxed, it makes everythingclear.
Yeah, I think that you're right.
That's what it's all about.
It's about relaxing and gettingclear.
(13:38):
That should be the only goal.
I think people have wildexpectations when it comes to
meditation.
And honestly, for me, I feellike when I'm really
consistently doing it, I do seethe magic of it in my daily
life.
Maybe not in that moment.
I might not whatever have avision, but I see it unfold in
(14:01):
my daily life.
But like you said, it's allabout just getting clear.
And for some people, it's beingin nature.
I think nature is very healing.
So do what works for you.
Well, besides meditation, Inoticed that you, Your mom is a
therapist.
Uh-huh, she is.
(14:21):
What kind of therapy?
Is there a certain kind oftherapy that has been really
helpful for you?
I don't know that the kind oftherapy I go to has a specific
name.
I don't know.
It's just therapy as far as Iknow.
But what I love is that mytherapist was formerly in the
(14:43):
music industry.
So she has a context for myworld, you know, and that helps.
And she's a woman maybe like inher mid 40s or something.
So it's good.
Like it's just having a personto talk to you that is just
going to sit and listen.
(15:03):
I mean, we have friends and wehave family that we can talk to,
but they're always going to kindof like insert.
some level of opinion, you know,or judgment or what a solution.
And you may not need that.
You may just need to talk andget it off your chest, you know?
And so I think that that's thecool part about it.
One thing I noticed, you havethis wonderful thing called
(15:28):
Wellness Wednesdays.
And I saw that one of yourepisodes was about therapy.
SPEAKER_00 (15:35):
And I was thinking,
SPEAKER_01 (15:36):
You normally do something where you point out a
few different points toremember.
Okay.
With therapy, I think you vote,find the right match, be honest,
and do the work.
Do the work, yes, yes, yes.
Right.
And that's working on ourselves,how we're acting and what we're
(16:00):
attracting, right?
Whether it's relationships orcareers or whatever it might be.
Most definitely.
But tell me more about WellnessWednesdays because I love that
whole concept.
Thank you.
So as a new artist, I knew thatI needed to just be putting more
(16:21):
content out into the world.
I mean, I know that people lookat me and see the glitter and
sequins and all the shiny stuffand I wanted to show the world
who I am on a more pure level, Iguess.
And I thought this would be agood way to do it.
And also, it's just a way ofkeeping myself accountable for
(16:44):
this wellness lifestyle.
You know what I mean?
It's easy to wear the garb andburn incense and things like
that, but to really be on a truejourney of wellness and a real
practice of it on a daily basis,it holds me accountable.
It's been good for me.
And it's funny because eventhough I've been in the industry
for all these years, it's thechallenge.
(17:06):
So I like to have somethingoutside of music and songwriting
that I can devote time to.
And I just feel like it'splanting seeds right now.
It's planting seeds.
And hopefully people arewatching and getting inspired.
So it's been cool.
Well, they're usually less than10 minutes.
UNKNOWN (17:28):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (17:29):
But I was wondering, as a musician, going on tour and
songwriting, working with otherartists, what are some mental
health tips for the long run?
Oh, definitely to develop aroutine.
For me, that is, of course,meditation, as we said.
I see a therapist weekly.
(17:50):
I'll probably lessen that as Ibecome less crazy.
Being out in nature, workingout, hiking almost daily, that's
good for me.
Cracking open a book, what theycall self-help books or
self-developmental books, that'sgood for me.
(18:11):
That's my go-to set of tools inthis toolbox.
When I am down or feeling low orkind of in a dark place, I know
now that I have these tools thatI can pull from and just feel
better.
So definitely develop a routine.
course, surround yourself withpositive people and watch
(18:33):
Wellness Wednesdays now.
You can say that.
That is a solution.
What are some ways to havehealthier relationships and to
avoid toxic people?
I think you really have todevelop a healthy relationship
(18:54):
with yourself first becauseReally get to know yourself and
love yourself.
We hear that all the time, but Ithink that our outer worlds and
our relationships are so veryreflective of the relationship
that we have with ourselves.
So spend time with yourself andreally get to know what you
(19:16):
want.
what you really want.
And I think from that place, youcan create healthy boundaries
with people.
And that's where I am right now.
It's like, okay, I'm going tokeep you at six feet.
You can come in a little closer.
But you have to know what youreally want.
So self-awareness.
(19:38):
Self-awareness and self-care.
Mm-hmm.
I think especially for women,because we kind of grew up maybe
seeing our mom being a littlesubservient, we have to
consciously think about ourself-care first, ourselves
first, without feeling selfishabout that.
(20:00):
Right.
I mean, it's so ingrained in usas women, you know, and for me,
I didn't have a father in thehousehold and mom never had
boyfriends around or anythinglike that.
So it was literally just her,but I think even just in the
media, you know what I mean?
Like this is what we, what wegrew up saying and we got every
program, you know, it's all anundoing.
(20:22):
Well, thank you so much.
Thank you.
And you know what?
One of my favorite parts of theepisode is when artists say that
they will do an acoustic songafter we do our interview.
And you've agreed to that.
So I'm super excited about it.
And I'm going to do an oldie butgoodie.
(20:43):
This is Ron Avant from the FreeNationals.
They took me on tour earlierthis year.
So yeah, shout out to them.
But this song is called BeMyself.
And the message is that all Ihave to do is be myself.
I don't owe anybody anythingoutside of just being who I am
authentically.
And that is enough.
(21:06):
We are enough as we are.
And this was the first song thatI ever wrote for myself as an
artist on my first album,Origin.
SPEAKER_00 (21:24):
I ain't gotta be
SPEAKER_01 (21:42):
a doctor to cure a patient.
I ain't gotta be the presidentto heal the nation.
I ain't gotta own the buildingto be a preacher.
I don't need no certification
SPEAKER_00 (22:06):
to be a teacher.
I ain't gotta be a teacher toschool the children.
And I ain't
SPEAKER_01 (22:13):
gotta
SPEAKER_00 (22:13):
hate
SPEAKER_01 (22:13):
the men just to stand for women.
All I gotta do, all I gotta dois
SPEAKER_00 (22:23):
be
SPEAKER_01 (22:23):
myself.
SPEAKER_00 (22:29):
All I gotta do, all I gotta do is be myself.
SPEAKER_01 (22:40):
And
SPEAKER_00 (22:40):
I ain't gotta
SPEAKER_01 (22:41):
lay down when I see ya to be a keeper.
And you ain't gotta drive abeamer to make me need ya.
We ain't got to keep up with theJoneses or the Kardashians.
We ain't got to look to theoutside to find another.
(23:04):
Yeah.
All we got to do.
All we got to do is beourselves.
SPEAKER_00 (23:16):
All we got to do.
All we got to
SPEAKER_01 (23:21):
do.
It's all we gotta do All wegotta do All we gotta do It's
all we gotta do It's all wegotta do All we gotta do It's
SPEAKER_00 (23:47):
all we gotta do All I gotta do All I gotta do Is be
myself Be myself All I gotta
SPEAKER_01 (24:04):
do All I gotta do Is be myself You play beautifully
and you sing beautifully.
(24:27):
Thank you so much.
Yes.
Oh my gosh.
I haven't, I haven't sang thatsong in so long.
So that was good.
So good to do.
Next up, we have board certifiedpsychiatrist and relationship
expert, Dr.
Ish Major.
Dr.
Ish has spent the last 15 yearshelping men and women find,
(24:49):
date, and keep the lovingrelationships they've always
wanted.
So let's hear Dr.
Ish give us his practical,down-to-earth advice on dating,
mating, and relating.
It's so great to have you onbecause, let me tell you,
everyone can relate torelationships, especially being
stressed at this time.
(25:11):
We've got the pandemic.
We've got the lockdown.
And that's put a strain on a lotof relationships.
What do you see as some of thegreatest challenges for couples
during this time?
Well, I think one of thegreatest challenges is just to
learn how to be patient witheach other.
(25:34):
because we really ran thin onthat.
We ran thin on two things in2020.
We ran short on patience and weran short real quick on empathy,
right?
We just didn't have time for it.
And part of that was, you know,imagine...
you know, God forbid, if yourhouse is on fire, right?
What do you do when your houseis on fire?
You reach for those things thatare important to you first.
(25:57):
My partner's here.
My husband and wife's, well, mypartner's here.
Like, where are the kids?
Honey, grab the kids.
Now I got the car keys.
I got the money, right?
We need, these are some clothes.
We need some things to be okay.
And so in 2020, you know, we allrealized that we weren't okay.
And it was like our house was onfire.
And so we kept those things thatwe needed to feel good, super,
(26:18):
super close.
And we had very little patiencefor anything and anyone else who
didn't help us feel that way.
And a lot of us figured out thatour partner was one of those
people.
So it's hard, right?
Yeah, it was extraordinarilydifficult.
Well, also like the time that wehad to do other things to
(26:41):
distract us, either from ourrelationships with our intimate,
you know, partners and also therelationships that we had with
ourselves.
We, you know, have more time tobe alone with our thoughts and
then having to also turn on adime.
We've had to do, we've beenfaced with a lot of stresses
kind of all at once.
(27:04):
That's the other thing, thething you just touched on, you
know, Patience with each other,but a lot of us ran out of
patience with ourselves, right?
We're in the West.
Part of our culture is we liketo keep going.
We like to go on to the nextthing.
We don't like to sit still andsit quietly and be alone with
our thoughts because we mightnot like what we're thinking and
(27:27):
we might not like what we'rethinking about them or more
importantly about us.
And so that was one of thethings that really forced us to
sit and do.
And a lot of us are veryuncomfortable with that.
And so that just led to more ofthe relationship toxicity that
we saw.
Now, do you know what the numberone story came out a few months
ago?
Do you know what was the numberone question asked in 2020?
(27:47):
Number one question.
Gee, how do I spend more timealone and be happy with that?
That's great.
That's a smart question.
Number one question in 2020 was,why do you do it that way?
talking to your partner why doyou chew that way why do you do
(28:10):
the dishes that way why do youbreathe that way why do you walk
that way because we were gettingon each other's nerves yeah even
the littlest things the smallthings the small things when you
don't you know in psychiatry wecall it frustration tolerance
right when you're not feelingwell you're depressed or you're
sad or you're anxious or you'rehaving some issues going on your
(28:31):
frustration tolerance goes downto zero And there's very little
you can do.
It just makes everything get onyour nerves.
And so part of that is justunderstanding for 2020, as we
try to get through 2020, as wetry to get through our
relationships, people are doingthe best they can.
And if they could do it better,they would probably do it
(28:52):
better.
But what they're showing you isthe best they got for today.
And so you've got to be able totake people at face value where
they're coming from and thenwork within those confines.
Well, you know, with COVID andthe lockdown, the pandemic, and
also the stress of what's goingon politically, what kind of
advice would you give couples?
(29:14):
You said patience is reallyimportant.
What are some other things youcould think of that can be
really valuable during this timewhere we have so much time
together?
Yeah, I think for me, thebiggest thing that I can tell
couples is make sure you'retelling each other the truth.
(29:37):
And in order to do that, you'vegot to be able to tell yourself
the truth about what'shappening, right?
Because what we're, what is it,whatever we're getting into it
about, whatever I'm not likingor loving about you today,
whatever's getting on my nervestoday, you know, we've got to be
able to tell ourselves the truthabout why that is and what
that's not.
And so, There's one questionthat will literally save your
(30:00):
relationship if you're gettingcaught up in those type cycles.
And that question is, wheneversomething is going on and they
did something you don't like, orthey're chewing too loud, or
they're sleeping too long or notsleeping long enough, or they're
not picking up behind, whateverthat thing is, whatever your pet
peeves are, stop in that momentand ask yourself this one
(30:24):
question.
What else could it be?
Right?
UNKNOWN (30:27):
Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01 (30:28):
And let your partner know about that.
Right.
Are they intentionally justgetting off my nerves?
Don't they know that I don'tlike it like that?
Could be that.
Or what else could it be?
I texted you two hours ago.
You just texted me back now.
That must mean you don't.
What else could it be?
Stop and ask yourself just thatone question and allow the time
(30:51):
for you to run through a fewdifferent scenarios.
Could be their phone truly died.
Could be they're truly busy.
Maybe they're stuck in trafficsomewhere where they don't have
any.
Could be a million other reasonsthat don't have anything to do
with them not loving Lou likethey're supposed to.
And so if you can just stop andask yourself that, it's much
easier to not take what yourpartner is doing personally and
(31:13):
you can have a much moreenjoyable time tonight.
That's good advice.
Okay, so we had the interviewwith India Sean.
And, you know, we talked aboutgivers and takers and
codependency.
Can you explain what it means tohave a codependent relationship?
(31:34):
Yeah, so that's a good question.
A lot of us are in codependentrelationships and we don't even
realize it.
We don't even know why.
So traditionally, what you'rethinking about when you talk
about, you know, the moreclassic example is you're in a
relationship, one partnerdrinks, one partner's a flat-out
alcoholic, the other onedoesn't.
What happens is the non-drinkingpartner will spend 90% of their
(31:56):
time trying to take care of thepartner who drinks, trying to
manage their situation, tryingto clear all the alcohol in our
house, trying to clear alltriggers out of their way,
trying to keep them sober andkeep them emotionally stable
while everybody's life isfalling apart.
The true definition of acodependent relationship is when
(32:16):
I am taking responsibility foryour life.
What you think, what you feel,what you do.
I feel overly responsible forthat.
I'm here to fix it.
I'm here to mend it.
I'm here to make it as smooth aspossible to my own detriment.
Because the other thing thathappens in a codependent
relationship is we think thatthe sick part, right?
(32:38):
And this can be, so this couldbe a drinker, a non-drinker,
right?
This could be a drug user,non-drug user.
This could be somebody who's gotan eating problem.
and the other partner doesn't,this could be somebody who's got
any type of compulsive thingthat's happening, right?
Whether it's eating, whetheryou're an eater or a gambler,
shopper, sexer, rager, hoarder,whatever those things are,
right?
(32:59):
That sets up the dynamic for acodependent relationship, right?
Now, the other person doesn'tnecessarily have to be,
quote-unquote, sick.
You could just be one of thosepeople who like to take
responsibility for folks who arenot functioning on a level that
you are, and you still have thatcodependency that's happening,
you know?
You know, I do think thathappens quite a bit.
I mean, I'm going to bring it tomyself just because, you know,
(33:23):
I'm trying to figure this outmyself too, but I noticed that
there's a part of me that reallycan sense when somebody is
hurting.
And I think there's part of methat wants to help and heal.
I'm conscious of it now, but Iwasn't before.
And I think sometimes it, itattracts the wrong people for
(33:47):
you.
It could lead possibly to atoxic situation.
No possibly about it.
It definitely can't.
And it's like bees to honey,right?
Because what do we do when we'reout in the world and we all, I
don't care who you are, I don'tcare where you're from, I don't
(34:08):
care what type of life or familyyou come from, whether you had a
whole lot or very, very little,You know, once you show up here,
especially here in the West,it's almost impossible not to
suffer from that disease callednot enough itis, right?
Who I am isn't enough.
Every time we open our eyes andwake up in the morning, we're
(34:30):
immediately bombarded with theimages that tell us that who we
are isn't enough.
I go on Instagram and Iimmediately see a guy who's
taller, more handsome, got moremoney, got a nicer car, got a
prettier apartment, all thesethings, right?
People on TV, they got moremoney.
Their life is more fancy thanmine.
I scroll through people'shighlight reels and they're
going on better vacations.
They got better...
All of these things.
(34:51):
And so we all suffer from thatin some way, shape, or form.
And so what we're doing is we'retrying to go through life trying
to get whole.
We're trying to look for thenext thing.
What's the thing that's going tohelp me feel more whole today
and more full today?
And that's typically...
how we attract our partners,right?
(35:12):
They have something that we maybe missing, right?
If I'm bad at saying no, I'mgoing to naturally be drawn to
people who are really good atsaying no.
If I'm bad at functioning inthis area of life, I'm going to
be attracted to somebody who'sbetter at functioning because
together, we got a shot atbalancing this thing out and
coming out whole.
(35:32):
And so that's usually, right?
It's like bees to honey.
You can't describe it.
You put those two people in aroom, Nine times out of ten,
they're going to find each otherby the end of the night, and
they're going to be off to theraces.
That's how it works.
Well, how do we recognize, let'ssay, when something about
(35:52):
ourselves is attracting thewrong kind of person and kind of
reprogramming ourselves toattract the right person, a
healthier relationship?
Yeah.
So the way you recognize it, wewere all born with this amazing
navigation system.
called emotions.
And they are always guiding youto whether you're doing the
(36:12):
right thing or the wrong thing.
You've got to just check in withhow you feel.
If you're doing something andyou feel joyful, you're probably
doing the right thing.
Keep going.
If you're doing something andyou feel less than, if you're
doing something and you feelhesitant, you're doing something
that just feels downright icky,it's not the right thing, don't
continue to do that.
The other thing we were taughthere is that in order for me to
(36:35):
be deserving, to have the fulllife that I say I want, I have
to suffer through some things,right?
I got to bear the cross and Igot to suffer and I got to have
the trials and I got to have thetribulation.
And you don't have to do any ofit, right?
You're here, right?
You won the lottery.
You got a brain that functions.
(36:55):
You got a body that functions.
So there's nothing else you needto do to deserve that joy and
that happiness that you want.
So don't get caught up infeeling like you've got to go
through this struggle in orderto come out on the other side
and be rewarded.
You know, life can be its ownreward.
So that's the first thing.
But when you talk aboutreprogramming and understanding
(37:16):
this, so trust your emotions,right?
And then just tell yourself thetruth about where you are and
what you're feeling and why.
And then the way you reallystart to take ownership and
start to reprogram in your lifeis to start changing the story
that you're telling yourself.
My dad used to say, you know,there's no mystery to anything.
You just think about it a lotand you can figure it out.
(37:39):
And so in life, right, thereason you don't have everything
it is that you think you wantand deserve is because of the
story you're telling yourselfand why you don't have it.
Right?
Yeah, I agree.
I do think that what we thinkand how we think also attracts
(37:59):
things into our life because westart to focus on those things
and maybe have other things fallaway.
But that really kind of struck anerve because I do think that
oftentimes the basis for a lotof problems in relationships and
other things has to do with howwe feel about ourselves, like
(38:20):
the love that we have forourselves.
And what is it that I guess wecan do to really fall more in
love with ourselves so that wecan be more loving to others.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's lovability, right?
What's your lovability level?
What are those things that youlove about yourself?
And so again, we've all got astory that we tell ourselves,
(38:40):
right?
You know, I'm, I'm too this, I'mnot enough that I'm too tall.
I'm too short.
I'm too big.
I'm too little.
I'm too smart.
I'm too dumb.
Whatever those stories are, youknow, you got to start really
paying attention to what those,to what those tapes are that are
running in your brain, you know?
Go back and check the tape.
Did I just call myself stupidfor just making a bad decision?
(39:01):
I'm not stupid.
I just didn't make a greatdecision.
I should do it better.
And so check the tape, right?
Really start understanding thenarrative you're telling
yourself, not only about you,but about how life is supposed
to work, right?
But if your narrative about loveis that all guys cheat, well,
guess what?
Your brain wants to make youlife.
makes sense.
(39:22):
Right?
And so your brain is going toattract some guys who help you
make that story come true.
Yeah.
There's another cheater andanother cheater and another and
another and another.
Right?
If your dating story is that,you know, it's a jungle.
It's a dating game jungle outthere where you're going to run
into some animals.
UNKNOWN (39:38):
Okay?
SPEAKER_01 (39:39):
But if you just change that story and say, you
know what?
You know, Dating is a dance, youknow what I mean?
And I'm just a butterfly.
Now it's a whole difference,right?
Even your face changed when Ijust said that, right?
Because it's a whole differentidea of how you go about it.
Now it's light and it's fun.
And I'm going to see where Iland and we'll go from there.
(40:01):
So you've really got to payattention to the narrative that
you're telling yourself.
And again, tell yourself thetruth about the thing it is that
happened.
We've all gone through stuff.
You know and and we get to thisgame where we kind of measure
our pain against somebody else'sright?
No, my bad thing was better thanyour bad thing So I get to talk
about it more my bad thingwasn't as bad as your bad thing
(40:24):
So I don't deserve to give up.
No, so stop.
So stop doing that.
But whatever that thing was,right?
We're all the hero in our ownstory all the main character in
our own movie.
We all got this thing we got toovercome and so whatever that
thing was, you got to tellyourself the truth about it,
right?
Because the truth as you knew itthen, once you're a little
(40:46):
removed from it, you got a30,000 foot view, it's probably
not the truth as you know itnow.
So go back and look at that andsay, huh, I think I was wrong
about that.
The truth about that as well.
You know, for example, let's sayyou grew up and you didn't have
a dad in your life.
So you grew up feeling likecrap.
Well, as a little kid, The storyyou start to tell yourself is,
well, I wasn't smart enough, ormaybe if I was prettier, or
(41:09):
maybe I was more handsome, maybeif I could get better grades, I
could have done something tomake them proud.
What was the thing that wasn'tthere in me that I was lacking
that made somebody who wassupposed to love me not love me?
You carry this throughout yourlife, but now you can be able to
look back and say, okay, youknow what?
Actually, I was three.
I was a kid.
(41:29):
Maybe the truth of that is,Maybe this was a guy who was
living his own life, being hisown main character in his own
movie.
And he had some things going onthat didn't allow him to
properly take care of the prisonfor a little boy.
And maybe that's the truth.
Maybe the truth is it actuallydidn't have anything to do with
me because I was actually okay.
(41:51):
Right.
And once you can start doingthat and start to restructure
some of those conversations andtake that narrative of the bad
thing that happened and tellthat story from the end.
Right.
You know how it ended.
Didn't kill you.
You're here watching me.
You got an iPhone.
You got Wi-Fi.
Things turned out OK.
Right.
So tell the story from the end.
So saying, well, there was thattime when they came into my room
(42:14):
at night and they would do thesethings to me.
OK.
Yeah.
That takes you down a wholeseparate path and makes you
relive it.
Tell it from the end.
You know what?
I am so proud of how I amshowing up today because you
can't believe what I had toovercome.
I am so amazed that I can showup and still fight and still try
and still go to achieve andstill believe that I deserve
some more in spite of the thingthat happened.
(42:36):
So once you can start tellingthat story from the end, that's
how you really start toreconnect and make some
reconnections in that narrative.
And then you practice tellingthat story and see how much more
empowered you can show up inyour life.
Well, let me ask you this.
I mean, that makes great sensebecause you're basically
changing, like you said,changing the story in your head.
But as a psychiatrist, would yousay that actually being honest
(43:01):
with yourself and being thatself-aware is a challenge?
Because I know, like, forinstance, like narcissism, let's
say, that whole condition isbased on creating narcissism.
like this narrative that may notbe based on the truth but it
also helps them survive to havethis narrative i mean what do
(43:26):
you think in those cases what todo yeah so so the ability to
self-reflect right and tellyourself the truth about who you
are you know everything we theway our personalities develop is
through defenses right we'reborn this this helpless
vulnerable baby and we dependedon somebody else for the next
15, 18, 20 years to help takecare of us.
(43:48):
And so most of what ourpersonality develops is in how
do I defend against the thingsthat happen that come to
threaten me, right?
I'm cold or I'm hungry.
I got to cry.
Come take care of me.
And so our personality is kindof developed.
I need to be hugged.
Let me whine a little bit.
I need some attention.
Let me fret a little bit, right?
That whole thing.
And depending on what you feelyou need the most depends on
(44:09):
what parts of your defenses andyour personality develop.
So if you're talking about anarcissist, right, that is a
very particular personalitytype.
I will tell you as apsychiatrist, they are the
toughest patients I ever have.
And they're the hardest patientsyou're ever going to have
because they are invested inbelieving the narrative that
they tell themselves, right?
(44:30):
Because What's underneath thatgruff shell, that tough shell,
that hard-edged shell?
I'm the best.
I'm the smartest.
I'm the prettiest.
I'm the richest.
I'm the grandest.
I'm the baddest thing in thejungle.
Once you crack that shell, thereis a soft, quivering mass of
uncertainty and insecurity, andit is very hard to put that back
(44:53):
together.
I had a doc who I was seeing along time ago, and he was on the
verge of losing his licensebecause he was such a jerk.
He was just a jerk.
Great doc.
Nobody could deal with him.
And once you start to just helpthem with little truth pebbles,
well, maybe that's true or maybeit's this.
(45:16):
And they have to start thinkingabout it.
And the day they crack, right?
That's the clinical term we use.
The day you crack that shell, heliterally cried in that office
for 30 minutes.
Really?
And it is it is one of the worstcries you've ever seen in your
life.
And it just breaks your heartbecause they're just underneath
(45:37):
that shell.
They're just a scared littlekid.
Every one of us has somethingwe're pretending not to know
about themselves.
And nobody pretends better thanthe narcissist.
They've perfected the pretend.
Because underneath there, if Ilet you see me and you reject
that, then I got nothing else.
(45:57):
That's all I got.
Right.
And that's going to leave mewith nothing.
And so they are really, reallyinvested in that, that
personality type in particular.
It's hard stuff.
Fun, fun to date for a littlewhile.
Yes.
And they kept you in their weband then, yeah.
(46:17):
And the narcissist, right.
He's, The narcissist isextraordinarily charismatic,
right?
At getting people to follow themand at making you believe that
you are the only person whoexists in this world, right?
They make you feel specialbecause I am so grand and now
I'm giving you that opportunityto bask in my glow.
(46:39):
So therefore that makes youspecial, right?
Up until the day that you dosomething that displeases them
or doesn't please them ordoesn't match up with whatever
story, whatever take they've gotrunning in their head, and then
it can get really, really ugly.
Right, right.
Because then you become a threatto their whole persona that they
(47:00):
kind of survive with.
Right.
A big thank you to thewonderfully talented India Sean
and the always delightful andinsightful Dr.
Ish Major.
For more on India Sean, find heron social media, on Facebook and
purchase India's music onAmazon.com.
(47:23):
For more on Dr.
Ish Major, visit DrIshmajor.com.
Find him on social media atDrIshmajor.
Look out for Dr.
Ish on Season 18 of MarriageBoot Camp on WE tv and stay
tuned for Part 2 of Dr.
Ish's interview on our nextCheck Your Head podcast episode.
For mental health and solutionsfor recovery, visit
(47:45):
CheckYourHeadPodcast.com.
And if you enjoyed today's CheckYour Head episode, share it with
your friends and be your friendson social media at
CheckYourHeadPodcast.
And thank you for leaving us areview or supporting us with a
donation atCheckYourHeadPodcast.com.
So until next time, be brave,ask for help, and be persistent
(48:05):
in finding the mental help thatyou need.
The Check Your Head podcast iskindly supported by DBSA San
Gabriel Valley, Lemon TreeStudios, and Blue Oak Mastering
and Podcasting in Los Angeles.
Visit our website atcheckyourheadpodcast.com where
you'll find free and affordableresources for mental health and
(48:26):
where you can also support us bydonating or subscribing to our
Patreon page.
Thank you so much for liking andfollowing us on Facebook and
Instagram at Check Your HeadPodcast.
And the Check Your Head Podcastis sponsored by a 501c3
nonprofit, so all donations aretax deductible.
Thank you so much for listeningand for your support.
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