#76 - How to Build a Gym That Lasts: Andy McCloy on World-Class Coaching & Business - Choose Hard with Cody McBroom

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Welcome to the Choose Hard podcast.
I'm your host, Cody Mcbroom. I am a father, husband,
entrepreneur and coach with one sole mission in life, and that
is to help individuals live their best life possible.
Step one, and that is choosing Hard.
I'm gonna help you do today. Today's guest on the show is
Andy McCoy. This is a man that I have known
for 13 years and has been a voice of reason, a voice of

(00:22):
wisdom, a voice of knowledge, experience and so much guidance
over the years. He has somebody who has been a
mentor to me and many ways I methim very early on in my career
as I did. A lot of strength coach, which
we're going to talk about today is just the the what the
strength coaching world is missing in today's age, in
today's industry. What gyms are missing, what

(00:43):
coaches are missing, what business owners do not
understand and what has allowed people like Andy to be running a
gym for 16 years and before that, before this gym opened, 25
years in total of running gyms. And this guy is the epitome of
enduring the long haul of success in the fitness space.
He has trained everybody from moms and dads to NFL players,

(01:04):
NBA players, college athletes. He has taken kids that are
playing football and trained them in the gym all the way
through their high school career, college career and into
the NFL. He has jerseys all around his
gym. It's so unbelievably just cool,
but also impressive and inspiring.
And we are going to pick his brain today and learn how he has
done what he has done in his career, how he has developed the

(01:27):
career in the business that he has developed and how he has
mastered the art of coaching andrefined that over the last two
plus decades. So without any further ado,
let's chat with a good friend and mentor of mine, the one and
only Andy Mccloy. The greatest things in life all
start with a challenge You. Must accept that everything is

(01:49):
hard before it gets easy. Every, every, every, everything
you want in life begins with a hard path.
Begins with a hard path, begins with a hard path.
All right, Andy, rather, I'm excited to have you on the
podcast, man. It's I always enjoy talking to
you, man. You've been somebody in my life
as a mentor from afar and at times near man.

(02:12):
Based on the conversation we were just having, I feel like
it's been probably, dude a decade at least.
I mean, yeah, I think. The first time I met you was
probably 13 years ago when I came out to Renton, yeah.
It is crazy babyface Boom boom. Probably didn't have any tattoos
yet, maybe a couple I. Think you had a couple?
I think you might even had a little bit on the forearm early.

(02:33):
OK, yeah, I was, I was extendingit down to the visible area.
Man, gosh, it's so crazy how much time passes.
And I'm excited about this because of that.
And I think that names and people just look at me with a
blank stare and who people as intrainers and coaches and they
just don't know who I'm talking about.
And it blows my mind. And I feel very grateful because

(02:55):
I'm 33 years old. So I'm in that younger
generation where we're talking about this topic.
But because I got into vigor when I was 18, I immediately was
immersed into a group of guys like you and Luca and, and Steve
Krabs and, and all these people.And it was just tremendous.
I was talking to Mike Robertson just just the other week and it

(03:16):
was like, man, same thing. He he's known me for well over a
decade. And I was just a kid.
So I'm excited about this because it to me, it's like
having somebody who has so much experience in the game coming on
the podcast to shed light and, and touch a lot of those people
because I know a lot of them listen to this podcast.
So, Andy, thank you for taking time to jump on the show and I'm
excited to chat with you today. Yeah, man, my pleasure.

(03:36):
I'm I'm excited. And I would even say really
quick before we get into this, Ithink you even had a leg up
before you made it to Vigor. What was Tim's name that you
went? I remember you went was a
Highland Community College or amI making that up?
Yep, Highline Community College.Tim Vegan.
Tim, like he was a super connected dude.
Like I, I just, he knew, he knewpeople in Huntsville as part of
like the Olympic swim team, likehe, I was, he was a dialed in

(03:59):
guy, man. So shout out to him, you know.
Yeah, dude, I met Brad and Greg Cook.
Who else? Alan Cosgrove, Rachel Cosgrove,
Charlie Weingroff. I met all these people.
I was very young and they were coming into our class to speak
and I was going to seminars withTim and hanging out at his rehab
facility in the hospital, watching him work on patients

(04:21):
and stuff. So it was cool.
And he was the one I'll never forget.
I had like person after person as guest speakers coming to
class and you know, some of themwere PT, some of them owned gems
and they were like not literallywearing khakis and polos, but it
was kind of that vibe it. Was.
That air yeah. And then Luca walked in and I
think he was wearing he had a chain on and I think he was
wearing like a Jordan sweat suitand saying the F word every

(04:44):
other word. And I I remember just looking at
him being like this dude owns a gym.
This is a totally different vibethan what I've seen the last
however many weeks so. But yeah, he introduced me to
him and so many other people, man.
So but dude, Andy, give the listeners just a like a brief
intro of who you are, how you introduce yourself.
And then I have some questions lined up that I kind of want to

(05:05):
roll through. Sure.
I'm a father, I'm a husband, andI'm a gym owner, kind of in that
order right there. The reason I say father first is
because I've been a father of since I was 16 years old.
That's kind of a large part of my journey.
I grew up in the Washington, DC area.
At the age of 22, I moved to Alabama, which I just can kind

(05:28):
of simplify to like, save my life.
There was a very good chance I would be dead or in prison if I
didn't move. And as soon as I got here, I
just arrogantly started a business.
I didn't really know what I didn't know, but I'd had some
exposure to a guy that ran a personal training company in the
Washington, DC area that had a similar background to me.
So I had evidence that it could happen.
I moved across the country. I had an opportunity to recreate

(05:50):
myself and nothing for nothing. The first time I walked into a
Gold's Gym, it was like I've been transported in a time warp.
Like people are still wearing like the MC Hammer pants and the
string tank tops and I was like,wow, there's a real opportunity
here. So I started that personal
training company, eventually took over that gym and multiple
others. Around 2005, I pivoted all the

(06:12):
way into sport performance. From then till now we've, you
know, helped hundreds and hundreds of kids get
scholarships. There's been 15 or so kids that
grew up in our program that havegone on to the NFLNBA.
You know, we're really well respected all over the country
for what we've done with athletes.
And I've kind of traversed that whole path for Mike coach, the
leader, where I was doing everything in the business to

(06:34):
now where I'm I'm pretty much operationally irrelevant.
I just lead my team and a group of people.
We still serve athletes from 7 years old to the professionals.
So we also have an adult fitnessside of things.
And now I'm focused on, you know, paying that forward to
other gym owners and teaching them all the lessons I've
learned and they can benefit from the the wisdom of my
mistakes. I love it, man.

(06:55):
It's it's really cool to see like watch from afar.
You work with literally kids andthen they go to the NFL.
Like, I just remember always being amazed by that over the
years of just seeing these people just go through the
entire process at your gym. Was Alabama known for football

(07:17):
and sports and all that when youstarted getting in sports
performance? Or was that pretty new when you
first moved there? Well, I mean, I think there's a
huge sports culture here, but like the University of Alabama
was kind of on a downswing, you know, at that point in time.
So I don't think everybody knew it as much.
But the kids are, they are different down here, man.
And there there is a love for sports and parents support

(07:38):
sports, grandparents like it's, it's a heavy sports community
and it's, it's changed a lot over the past 25 years.
We've got a lot of people from other parts of the country that
have moved here. But I remember just being so
blown away with the the commitment to sports here.
And that was that was really awesome.
It, it the, the thing I want to say is what's in the water down

(08:00):
there because it's just a commonphrase.
But I was talking to a neighbor who had to visit Alabama for
work and I brought you up because you're really the only
person I know in Alabama. And the I said I was like, man,
he sent me some pictures before in the past.
And there's like a 12 year old that towers over me and is just
massive, you know, And I, I was really trying to, this is how I

(08:22):
am. I'm thinking of the science of
like, OK, well, why are they biglike that?
And I'm thinking it can't be thefood.
And is it really hot down there and they get a lot of sun and is
it vitamin D? Is it the sport culture?
And they start so young that it's kind of this neural
development at a young age and they start just growing faster.
Like do you have any idea or is there any science behind it?
I, I think it's probably a little bit of all that, but I
would just say there are generational families here that

(08:45):
have played college sports, likecollege sports here is like
professional sports. So there's just so many of these
like families that have a million relatives and people
that they're akin to. And, and when I say a lot, I
mean a lot. It's kind of there's a, a place
here called Town Creek that it'sactually about 30 minutes from
me. But I want to say per capita in
the US, they've had more professional athletes come out

(09:07):
of there than anywhere else. So and that just kind of it just
moves along and there's kids that grow up here like idolizing
those people. It's not so much about the NFLI
mean there is that influence, but like if you played at
Alabama, that's as big as playing in the NFL here, right?
And I think it's a little bit more accessible to kids, at
least they believe it is. So I think that shapes the

(09:29):
influence, but there's definitely some special kids.
Yeah, well, and it's, it's cool too, cause those, those athletes
are like accessible. They're in your town.
I can imagine as kids seeing that is so cool.
NFL guys on TV, you don't know how he is in in person.
When you see a guy locally who is playing and under the lights
and everybody knows him, that's pretty, that's pretty cool.
That's inspiring. Yeah, But that's one of the

(09:51):
things that we've tried to do inour gym is like, but in between
each rack that we have going down our wall, we've hung an NFL
jersey of a kid that grew up training in our program just to
kind of let the kids know in thebuilding, like, look, like this
is a reality. You know, this is a whole row of
kids, you know, that made that happen.
So I think there is that proximity to success that has

(10:12):
value. A lot of times when guys get to
the pros, they don't come back to their hometown as much.
But I, I will say all the guys that we've worked with, they,
they make their presence known here.
They have big camps and big events and they try to inspire
the community. And I've I've got a lot of
respect for the guys that do that.
It's so cool, man. It's a it is really, really

(10:33):
true. Your your proximity and just the
the group. And I mean, just get even saying
who is my college teacher and then meeting Luca and interning
and meeting you. And it's like who you surround
yourself with is so important inevery facet.
And I want to, I want there's a,a big piece of that element that
I'm going to touch on with regards to business here soon.

(10:53):
But first, just to paint the picture because I want people to
understand how much knowledge you bring to this discussion.
How long have you been running agym, specifically this gym?
Because obviously you've been inthe industry for a long time,
but like your gym out there, which you've written and said
probably multiple times, it's the best gym in Alabama.
And I believe that and, and I think you've earned that title.

(11:15):
How long have you been running that specific gym?
And do you feel like there are any like core pillars, maybe
like one to three? I mean however many you believe
that you think allowed you to actually do that.
So this particular location has been 16 years.
We've been in business for 25 years.
We were kind of the first peopleto ever do sport performance

(11:36):
training in this community. We ran the very first like speed
camps and in those things. So we've been around a long
time. It's it's gone from like Andy's
gym to now BCI, you know, which is kind of cool.
Like the brand kind of stands out just from my name.
But in the beginning, I was not quick to try to become like a
businessman. Like I recognized that like the

(11:57):
main pillar was coaching. It was like I have to learn how
to become a good coach. I, I told this story at one of
our built to last events where when I moved to Alabama, like I
was just kind of a young hustling kid with that example
of a guy running a personal training company.
And I was like, I'm going to move down there, I'm going to
take over gyms and I'm going to get rich.
Well, this is like around early 2000s and you know, the Internet

(12:20):
was a thing you had to suffer through dial up.
And I can still barely turn a computer on.
But back then I would like find these obscure message boards and
like print off articles and readthem.
And because I didn't want to read on a computer, didn't even
like know that was kind of like the way people did things.
But I started to realize, like, this industry is full of
brilliant people. And it kind of smacked me in the

(12:40):
face right away that it's like, OK, if I want to build a gym, I
need to know what the heck I'm doing as a coach 1st.
And I, I knew that in my soul. So my first thing was like,
yeah, I'm going to, I'm going tobuild a company, but I'm going
to invest more time in learning the craft of coaching.
And I don't think that's the message these days.
I think everybody's trying to kind of accelerate their growth

(13:01):
and success as fast as possible.I think all the marketers of our
world know that. So they market to everybody in
that way. In 90 days, you'll be able to do
ABC. And DI didn't care about that.
What I really cared about was like making a name for myself as
a coach. And I knew that I, coming from
the background I came from, needed to do so much that nobody

(13:21):
was ever going to say, hey, like, what college did you go
to? Because like I said, I became a
father at 16 years old. It was earned.
It wasn't go to college. I had, I had a mouth to feed and
but I, I've been a voracious reader my whole life and I just
kind of engrossed myself in all the resources that I could.
Then I started traveling all over the country to meet gym
owners and the people that I respected, reaching out to

(13:43):
strength coaches and just saying, hey, like, this is who I
am. This is what I'm doing.
Like, is it OK if I e-mail you every now and then?
And I studied everything from the the process of attaining
sports mastery that the Russiansmade popular to the tier system
that Joe Ken, who's been a greatmentor of mine, put me on to all
the way down to like Gary Gray, Mike Boyle, you know, Gray Cook,

(14:05):
all those guys. So I was just, I mean, absorbed
in all this. And it's amazing.
Now, the in that talk I gave, I put up a slide of all these
different faces. I was like, can you guys tell me
who that is? Nobody in the room knew who Vern
Gameta was. Like I was devouring Vern Gameta
like VH s s. So there was just that.

(14:26):
That is the foundation of everything that's worked for me
is a like a really compulsion for learning.
And it started out with coaching1st.
And then as we started really getting some traction, it was
like, OK, I, I recognize that I'm not going to be a coach for
forever. There's not a lot of, you know,
60 year old personal trainers. And I ended up getting, you

(14:46):
know, custody of my oldest daughter when she turned about
13. And that smacked me in the face.
It's like I don't really own it like a business.
My business owns me, so I kind of took everything that I
learned from developing a high coaching pedigree and knowledge
and just pivoted all that into business.
So sales, marketing, persuasion,operations, things that I would

(15:08):
have told you 10 years prior that there's no way I could
learn it. Like I'm not good at that, but I
just kind of reverse engineered the same process.
Like who are the best people in the world at it?
How can I pay for their time? How can I buy their products so
I can like, borrow their brain and collapse time a little bit
to become better at the job thanthan really ever thought I could
be? So would you say, I mean,

(15:30):
obviously one pillar is, is coaching, right?
Is there? And I, I love that.
I'm almost glad you didn't mention anything else.
I want you to if, if there is anything else that pops in your
head. But I think it's, it's so cool.
Like talking about this 'cause Ijust get these like flashbacks.
I remember interning and having to watch DVDs of like, I
remember Joe Defranco's DVD and that's even later than some of

(15:52):
the guys you mentioned. I think it was Bill Parisi.
I think I had to watch some of his stuff.
But like there was all these DVDs on the bookshelf that I'd
take home and watch, right? And you can't, you don't get
that anymore because it's almostlike it almost sucks that it's
so accessible to put things on YouTube because anybody can do
it. And there's, I mean, Instagram.
I finally started making these videos of like just me

(16:14):
critiquing and just trying to show people what actually works
and what doesn't because there'sso many influencers that are
just putting out their, what they do and it's just so wild
and not helpful for the everydayperson.
But coaching is a lost art form.So I love that you guys are
really pushing that and you're trying to step forward and, and
really show this to people, 'cause I think that's what

(16:35):
allows you to be in business for25 years and this gym's 16.
That's crazy. I'm gonna hit eight in October
and that feels like a long time.You know, it's crazy.
It is. It is.
And most, I think most businesses in general, fail
before five years is like the stereotypical thing, right?
For sure. Yeah, for sure.
I mean, I think there's there's data on that that might even be

(16:56):
like less than that, like less time.
Like people are out of the door these days in like 18 months.
Like they they fail faster thesedays.
I think they have a misaligned expectations.
I was under no illusion that this was going to be easy, but I
didn't have this constant influxof marketers telling me that in

(17:17):
90 days I'd make $1,000,000. I was just, my expectations were
aligned. I knew it was going to be hard
and I didn't expect it to be anything other than hard.
And I did have I had better learning paths.
Like, I don't even think a lot of people learn through YouTube.
I think today's fitness professional is learning through
Instagram and they're getting these very small bits of

(17:37):
information and I think it makesthem hard to really, truly know
what they're doing and they don't dig deeper because of the
accessibility of stuff online. So I mean, I think another,
it's, it's the same thing, but it's like learning to learn.
Like if there's a topic that youwant to learn, like get off
social media, you know, find outwho the best people in the world
are. Like if you want to learn about

(17:58):
copywriting, like go all the wayback and like study John
Carlton, don't get on ChatGPT and ask it to write your
copyright. I'm, and I'm not saying that's
not a, a decent strategy, but ifyou've studied John Carlton and
other people, you're going to bemuch better at like massaging
that copy to be more reflective or in talking to your audience
and your customer. But if you don't know, like you

(18:20):
don't have anything to match that up against, you're just
going to rock with what ChatGPT tells you.
And then it's apples versus apples.
Everybody sounds the same. And yeah.
Yeah, I coming from somebody whouses ChatGPT and I know you do
too for different things. I'll say that I, I echo it
completely. There's never been anything from

(18:42):
a copy perspective or a content perspective that doesn't get
spit out that I don't tweak or adjust or review.
And then on top of that, if you're trying to teach your team
how to use ChatGPT to sound likeyou and brand like you and
market like you, good luck trusting just that because even
the way they prompted is going to be different than you, right?
So it's, it's not something you can just completely rely on,

(19:03):
man, You, you, you have studied so many different topics, so
many different things. You said, you know, learning to
learn and everything. What do you feel like is, I
mean, what, what was your purpose behind it in the
beginning? I mean, because, you know, I, I
feel like the one of the common things I see with you and other
guys like you is you have to be really passionate about coaching

(19:25):
specifically like it. You know, back then it wasn't a
get rich thing like it is today,because now online marketers and
stuff can say, Hey, you're goingto make a bunch of money and
you're going to go sit on the beach and do whatever.
Back then there was no illusion of that.
But I would imagine maybe just Ilike to lift weights, so I'm
going to do this right. It's cool to be a fitness guy.
Whatever. What was your why like back

(19:46):
then? Why did you want this so bad?
It is a hard journey. I mean I wish I had a like one
of those like stories that like people would normally tell you.
It's like I figured out my why was to do ABC and DB.
If I were to give you 2 things that drove me, I mean it was
survival and trauma man. Like it's like I had to survive.
I had to feed a kid and I joked with a buddy of mine who's got a

(20:06):
similar but different background.
It was like we're just enough traumatized through our life
experience to have something to prove, but like not so
traumatized that we can't take action on it.
I, I personally think a lot of people when they're asked that
question, they kind of give the answer that the audience wants
to hear. And while I would never wish
trauma or like being thrust intosurvival mode at an early age on

(20:28):
anyone, there's probably something in your life like that
that you can leverage that you're not thinking about.
For me, it's like I didn't want,you know, I moved away from an
area and I never wanted to be another story of all the people
I grew up with that were just locked up and in trouble and
made nothing of their life. So when I came out here, it was
like my wife was like to start over.

(20:50):
I didn't know how to redefine myself or how to shift my
identity. I didn't even know what that
meant. I just knew that like I had a
kid to feed. This was the only path that made
sense to me. I was virtually unemployable.
I had, you know, I quite frankly, I sold drugs when I was
younger. It wasn't like I had a lot of
job experience to anchor onto, but I was like, this is what I

(21:10):
think I can do well. And for some reason, I had an
intuition about that and I just doubled down on it.
And, you know, I'd like to thinkthat was, you know, God in my
life before I was even aware of that.
And, you know, I've just kind offollowed that path, you know,
for my whole life. So that's just, I wish I had a
better story for the listeners, but that's just the truth.
I think that's good, man. I think that it, I don't know if

(21:33):
you've ever done this, but it's interesting if you kind of like
dig into your past and, and not literally relive, but kind of
relive some of the stories, someof the things that maybe
terrible situations and just average situations, people that
came and went or whatever. And if you actually start to
investigate, you'll find a purpose behind all of those in
your path to where you are now. And I think that it, it just

(21:56):
anchors you to it. And you just, I mean, even just
trusting your gut and knowing like this is for whatever reason
is the path God has for me. I'm going to, I'm going to lean
into it and I'm going to roll with it.
And obviously it's worked out pretty well, you know?
Yeah. I mean, I think everything that
I went through in my youth, likeone of the reasons I've worked
with so many high level athletesis that I speak the language
where a lot of these guys come from.

(22:17):
Like I understand it. So even professional athletes
that aren't from this area that I've ended up working with, they
might be from New Jersey or Philly or like I know the
environment that they're from. I know how to speak to that kid.
When I got my first high school contract here at a local high
school, it was a private school,but they did mission work in the

(22:38):
local projects. Well, they would bring these
kids over from the projects and the first thing they would do is
like, hey, send them to go talk to Andy because they knew like I
could, I could talk to those kids.
So I do think there's been so many things in my life that have
led to this point. There was certainly purpose
behind that, that struggle. Even learning how to, you know,

(22:58):
wake up early and work late nights.
Like I had a had a lot of struggle early on in my life
where I was, I was doing that toovercome certain struggles.
I was up early hustling and I was going to bed late.
So I mean, it really fed and lent itself really to to what I
used to do. Now I want to be home by 5:00 PM
and bed at 9:00 and if I can sleep till 6:00 that's ideal.

(23:20):
I got the same schedule now, man.
So kind of going back to what I had said just a minute ago
about, you know, sometimes I feel like even in my own
generation, I'm like, I'm like the old soul in that because I
started at a young age and everything.
What do you feel like the newer generation of coaches is

(23:45):
missing? Because and now you'd probably
agree with this, I remember always saying, especially in the
online space, I would tell people like I hire on my team,
if they've been an in person coach before, like that's a
prerequisite to be in an online coach.
In fact, that was the advice given to me.
Hey, do this for five years straight and then you have the
right to go online and do something.
And I did it for 6 1/2 before I started doing anything online,

(24:07):
but, but then COVID hit and thatwas the excuse of like, well,
you can't go find a gym like that anymore, you know, and all
these gyms are shutting down. There's not as many places.
And then like, hey, there's not as many seminars anymore.
I can't really go to these events because everything is
online. And a webinar just does not,
it's not even remotely close to the same thing as going live in
person somewhere. And so I feel like there's been,

(24:28):
and I don't even always have theanswer as to like debate that
because I'm like, it's true, sorry, it's true.
That sucks, but you got to do something about it.
What do you feel like is missingand what is the advice you would
give the younger generation likeme if I wasn't, you know, eight
years into my business, 15 yearsinto coaching already, but the
youngins in the game. I think I think what's missing

(24:49):
is that there's a perception that going online and doing
everything digitally is easier and a more proven path to
success. Marketers communicate in
certainty, but if you think about like how I mean, digital
marketing has been around for a long time, but like you said,
COVID was a pivot point where you saw a lot of people like

(25:11):
give up on the idea of being an in person coach and they're
going to go online. That certainty that those
marketers like sold them on. I think his has made them a
little, it's an illusion. You know, if you can't become
the best trainer in your community amongst say 100 other
trainers, OK, what makes you think you're going to stand out
amongst 100,000 other ones when everybody's buying the same

(25:34):
products with the same tactics, with the same messaging and it.
So I think there's this illusionthat it's easier online.
I also think that there is a level of entitlement now where
people believe that they should be making more money right away.
And I think that's another kind of product of our times.

(25:56):
The reality is how good you are is what determines how well
you're paid, not that you checked off a couple
certifications or that you had afancy dancy internship
somewhere. Like none of that really matters
until like you've got some skin in the game and you're doing the
job. And I think a lot of young
coaches think it's easier to do it on their own.

(26:17):
Like, quite frankly, most coaches would make way more
money working for somebody like me than they will on their own.
That's just a fact. I can pay better.
I can give you benefits. I do all your like acquisition
and lead Gen. We provide kind of ancillary
support to help with retention. Like you get paid time off like

(26:38):
so it's like that message, I think is overshadowed by all the
talk of like being entrepreneur ownership, which listen, I'm a
huge fan of that. I just don't think that it's for
everybody. In fact, I don't think it's for
most people. I, I would never discourage
somebody for like walking that road like at all.
But the reality is it's a lonelyRd.

(27:00):
You know, it's not for everybody.
And you spend, you know, you're 20, so from 20 to 26, right?
When everybody tells you Yolo and you're out here trying to
build your own thing and you never get anywhere, you know,
that's six years missed of you being able to be mentored by
somebody who could really help collapse time and put you in a
much better position. So I think the online world is

(27:22):
here to stay, but I think it's an illusion that it's easier and
you're more likely to be successful, and that ownership
and entrepreneurship is the pathfor everybody, because it's just
not. It's not what everybody wants to
hear, but it's so true, man. It's so true.
You know, I don't know, Have youever said, I don't know if this
is like I'm stealing your slogan, but like coaching first.

(27:45):
I feel like maybe that's. Something you said, that's what
we talk about all the time. Coaching first.
Like I was thinking maybe I've heard this from you before, but
I mean, dude, like I didn't get somebody to tell me that advice
really back then. I just naturally, and it's
because when I started, there was no Instagram, you know, like

(28:06):
I started just trying to be a great coach.
And the more I saw that I didn'tunderstand, the more desire I
had to learn and figure it out, right?
And I wanted to just, I, I just became obsessed with training
and programming and, and, and working out because I was
learning and I was, for me, I, Iwas really blessed.
I was working out with dudes that were in their 30s and I was

(28:28):
just turning 20. You know, it was life changing
for me. But I, I didn't even realize it
at the time because it just seemed like an obvious path.
And I do think nowadays it's notas obvious and there's not as
many. I don't want to say opportunity
because I think that opportunity, if I say there's
not as many opportunities, people would assume that to be a
bad thing. But you have to seek out

(28:50):
opportunities. I had to find a place and then I
had to apply an interview for aninternship and then I had to
work for free for months. And then I had to, to your
point, try to become the best. While I didn't have a big client
load, I was running classes while also going to school and
working at a Community Center, graveyard shifts like trying to
make some extra cash when reallyI was just sitting there reading
like articles, you know, and, and funny that you said print it

(29:13):
out 'cause I would print out articles all the time and read
them. But I did that for so long, you
know, before I, I remember getting credit cards to be able
to like, I, I would say, yes, I'll go to the porn better
Summit with you. And then I would have to go to
the bank, try to get a new credit card 'cause I didn't have
any money. I was like, I know this is gonna
pay off and it did. But there is this unfortunate

(29:34):
side of the world today that I think there is so much
entitlement that people don't have that grind in them.
And it didn't seem like a grind to me.
It was, it was fun. It was part of the process, you
know, do you have, I mean, how do you lead people on your team
and like young coaches that reach out to you or even your
kids, man of like making sure you know, and that's a hard one

(29:55):
for me 'cause my daughter's young and I want to give her
everything and we, I make more money than what I saw when I was
a kid. So I want to just spoil her.
But I also, you know, there's that fine line that I'm trying
to teach her. What is your mentality around
that man? And making sure that the ones
that look up to you are doing itthe right way.
I'm. I'm honest with them and I I ask

(30:18):
a lot of questions about what like really matters to them.
I think a lot of people are trying to fill in a hole in
their heart with success and whatever looks like the most
successful path to the most money and significance.
That's what people choose. And you know, to kind of, you
know, reference Tony Robbins andI'll, and I'll share this a

(30:38):
little bit differently than mostpeople, but it's like there's
six human needs, certainty, uncertainty, significance,
growth, love and contribution. I believe this is a little bit
different than what Tony talks about.
This is kind of what I've taken from this is that I think
significance is the ultimate thing that every human being is
seeking significance and belonging, right?

(30:59):
So in pursuit of significance, people will usually choose
certainty as a means to try to get it.
If I have a big online following, that means I'm
significant. If Cody's successful and he has
a certain type of business, if Istart one like that, well, that
makes me significant too becauseI'm doing what Cody's doing or a
gym or whatever. But I don't really think that

(31:21):
that really provides significance.
Those lower level ones, which are actually the higher level
versions of your needs, are growth, love and contribution.
That's how you find real significance through personal
growth, like really leading fromthe heart, loving and caring for
people and then contributing in their lives.

(31:42):
So that's what I try to do. The people that work for me,
like we talked earlier, like I want everybody to be family.
The reality is they're not, but I treat them like that, like
it's from my heart. I contribute in their lives.
I invest in their personal growth.
And like that's what I would tell somebody.
If you don't have somebody doingthat for you, that's the path to
significance. It's not just like, oh, that's a

(32:02):
hot new brand of clothes. I'm going to wear that.
Oh, this is the type of content everybody's creating.
I'm just going to replicate that.
I I understand why people choosethat path, but I think it's the
okey doke. It sets people up for a lot of
failure And to like reference Cal Newport.
He's got a, a great book called so good They can't ignore you.
Like that's the mission. And how are you going to be so

(32:25):
good that nobody can ignore you if you're just doing what
everybody else does? And I think that is what
unfortunately this kind of online world has facilitated.
And I'm not hating like if there's anybody listening like
you're don't let me deter you, man, like get after it.
But but I would ask yourself some questions like, am I doing
this for the right reason? Because there's a lot of people
that can be significant in otherways, as you know, like not

(32:50):
everybody would have big following has any idea how to
monetize that following. There are people with big
followings that are nowhere nearas successful as people that are
working at Equinox, right? It's just they perceive it to be
more successful. I know the coaches in my
building have a real opportunityto grow.
They make a gigantic impact in the community.
We talk about becoming local legends.

(33:12):
You know, you help a couple 100 kids make their dreams come
true. I would argue that's more
significant than having a million followers online.
You just have to make the decision about like what matters
most to you. Oh, that's so good, man.
I think that, I mean, this is all coming, you know, I agree
100%. And this is coming from somebody
who solely runs an online business.
They don't do anything in person, man.

(33:33):
We were at one of my daughter's cheerleading practices like a
month or so ago, and it was at the track and this guy who I
didn't know who it was, was walking around the track in a
tailored shirt. And so I hopped the fence and I
wouldn't start talking to him. And he was somebody who worked
with one of my coaches. And then this other lady walks
up and she's like, Hey, I don't know if you Remember Me, I work
with Coach Brandon. And I'm like, Oh my God.
And, you know, and then the dudecoaching the football, the

(33:55):
peewee football walks over. And it was a guy used to train
when he was in college football at Vigor in the summers.
And he was like, hey, Cody, it'sbeen a minute, man.
And it was like this moment of, you know, community and people.
And my daughter just started playing sports.
This is like the first exposure,this kind of stuff.
I can't tell you how great that feels.
You know what I mean? And that has that has nothing to
do with followers because those people don't give a shit about

(34:18):
how many followers I have or anything like that.
And, and I think that I know forme, I'm not going to take it
this route, but that's actually what got me on a path trying to
find God in my life, because I did have a hole in my heart and
I checked off all these boxes and I was still empty.
And I actually felt even more alone.
Because when you build a business, you, you see a lot of
people's true colors, unfortunately, you know, And so

(34:39):
IA 100% agreement. I could not agree more.
And I think it's, it's, it is brutal advice, but it is really,
really good advice to give thesepeople.
Well, I'll take it there real quick.
I think people undervalue the importance of believing in
something bigger than yourself. We are engrossed in a world of
me and I don't think that's the best position to create impact

(35:01):
from. I would never tell anybody what
to believe in. Happy to share what I believe,
but I think you need to have something bigger than you, even
if that's just simply a set of values that you stand for that
are your North Star that pull you in the right direction.
And I'd have you consider that if your North Star is just
becoming popular and making a lot of money, there will be a

(35:22):
point in time in your life whereyou have to look yourself in the
mirror and go, man, like this isn't it?
There are very few people that find fulfillment or what they
would call in the world of positive psychology, a life that
is flourishing simply by chasingthose things.
So we need to have things biggerthan us.
And maybe that's building a business, maybe that's impact,
maybe it's God. Like, again, I'm not going to

(35:44):
tell anybody what to believe, but you need something bigger
than you to pull you along, especially during the hard
times. So you mentioned something
earlier and I feel like it kind of is it relates this a little
bit or it's a good transition with it.
You mentioned like a chip on your shoulder, just briefly, you
know, and I think I had that similar thing and I think it's

(36:04):
looked, it sounds negative saying you have a chip on your
shoulder, but man, it drove me, you know, and it helps.
Was there a point where people stopped doubting you or it was
clear that you weren't going to fail because it's known by you
and those around you Like you'regoing to make shit happen no
matter what, you're going to keep moving forward.
You're very motivated and drivento be successful and to help
serve those around you. Where that chip on your shoulder

(36:27):
left and it was almost like a bad thing for you personally.
Or did you evolve through that process and it didn't faze you?
I think I probably evolved through it.
Like I don't remember a certain moment.
Like what I I know there were people that doubted me.
People said you'll never train professional athletes down there
like that. People told me, I remember going
back home and visiting friends and hearing that somebody said

(36:48):
this or somebody said that. And I was like, oh, OK, word.
Like really like that's what youbelieve.
But I kind of positioned it in my mind like it's none of my
business. Like that's none of my business,
but there was a moment, I won't say who it was, but I drove a
very long way to go meet this gym owner who was really well
respected. And when I got in there and I

(37:09):
looked around, I was like, oh, wow.
Like he's just a human. Like he's just a dude.
And I think that and I was training some very significant
athletes at that time, but not really getting the, the credit
or online significance for it. And I remember having this
moment where it's like, oh, I, Ican do this.
And I think it allowed me to kind of drop the chip a little

(37:30):
bit, at least at least becoming more tactical with how I would
leverage it and use it instead of it like being my main driver.
When I realized, like, sometimeswe build our heroes and our
idols up bigger than they are and that can kind of, it can
keep that chip on our shoulder as the main driver for our
success. But the minute that I, I got

(37:51):
humanized that person, I was like, oh man, like he bleeds
red, I bleed red. Like I'm doing things similar to
this, like I don't need to have a chip, I just need to keep
doing what I'm doing and if I keep doing it, it's going to pay
off. See, and I feel like that's the
positive side of comparison. You know, the, you know,
comparison is the thief of joy. And I don't necessarily disagree
with that quote, but I do think that sometimes, you know, like

(38:13):
if I'm a gym owner and I'm looking at you and I'm a little
part of me, not a negative way, but it's envious.
Like I'm like, man, I want what he has.
He's crushing it and instead of me getting down that I don't
have it, you can say that you'vebeen in business for twice as
long. And it fires me up.
And I'm like, there's nothing that separates me from him

(38:35):
outside of time. And I got time, you know?
And I think that too many peoplecompare and just stop right
there instead of just digging into it.
Compare the whole picture. Compare their background,
compare their environment, compare their history, compare
their struggles. Like what did they go through to
get there? How long did it take?
And when you really realize all that stuff, to your point, it
does humanize them and it it fuels you to be able to do the

(38:55):
same thing. 100% And I think yousaid it earlier on, like the key
is to not create this like envious type of thing because
you don't know their struggles. You, you don't know really
what's going on behind the scenes.
Don't build them up so high in your mind that it creates this
delta between you and them. Use what you see as motivation.

(39:17):
Oh, he's been doing it this long.
I've been doing it this long. I just got to stay the path.
Oh, he learned from this person.He learned from that person.
How can I pay them to learn fromthem?
Right. So it's just kind of the
comparison can have value. It's all the frame you know that
you put in your mind regarding it.
One of my favorite quotes aroundthat is from a guy Pastor Keith
Craft. He's author, pastor,

(39:39):
entrepreneur. He says there's three responses
that people have when they're around greatness and that's
envy, insecurity or inspiration,right.
So envy being like you hate on them.
We all know those people insecure where you just you go
away, you quit, you, you, you don't hide.
And then inspiration is like youfollow, you tag along, you try
to ask questions, you try to digdeeper and learn about that.

(40:02):
And that's actually something that I think helped me early on
too, like the easiest. Memory of it is meditation.
I was so it's like woo woo and Idon't all this crap, you know,
and I remember being like, oh, Tony Robbins does that, Oh, this
guy does that. And then Rob Dyrdek was the one
for me because I grew up skateboarding.
So as soon as I heard Rob Dyrdekdoes all this stuff and how

(40:23):
successful he was, especially ifcompared to any other
skateboarder, I instantly was like, OK, maybe there's more to
this. And I started just getting
obsessed with learning about, you know, I don't know if you
listen to founders podcast, but that's a good example of like
listening to their story and howthey did things, what they did,
what were their habits, what wastheir lifestyle and trying to
like learn from people's, you know, documented journey.
It's just such a powerful thing.Yeah, I mean, I, I think I

(40:46):
always, I call it finding gold. And I've said if I was given
like one talent, it was the ability to find the gold.
And like other people's path, meaning like who did they learn
from? What books do they read?
What do their behaviors look like?
And then looking like, what's what am I not doing in that
area? And then being open minded
enough to step into it. And I had a very similar

(41:07):
experience with meditation that I often attribute to changing my
life. I mean, it was like around 2013
when I started meditating. And man, it was, it was rocket
fuel for me. I had a lot of, I was all
sympathetic, you know, just all fire and drive.
I had no idea how to shut down and turn off that allowed me to

(41:27):
createspace for thinking and reflection and really get clear
on like who I wanted to become. Who do I really want to be
instead of getting locked in this identity of like somebody
that needs to smash red lines and ephedrine and, you know,
always be on fire all the time. And then, you know, chase it
down with some drinks at night to calm down.
And you know, it's like it really it helped me shift into a

(41:48):
into a better person, but that'sI'm addicted to books.
I mean, I think, you know, you've done a lot of reading and
it's somebody tells. If somebody that I respect tells
me they read a book and they loved it, I'm already on Amazon,
right? If I hear about a course or I
hear about somebody else like I'm already on.
And it's like, I think some people, their ego doesn't allow
them to do that for some reason.But it's really hard for me to

(42:10):
understand. You know, for me, it's like if
they are successful and I believe they're smart and I
respect them, I'm going to stealor borrow as much of that as I
can. And if they're open to me about
what those resources are like, I'm not going to take that for
granted either. I'm going to make sure that I
take action on that. Yeah.
And because that doesn't take away from anything, you know,

(42:31):
right. It just, it just adds to it,
which that's actually a good segue because I had a question
for you around mentorship. And I think that I've often told
people at times like, hey, at the end of the day, sometimes
you got to pay to be in certain circles, you know, whether it's
just literally not, not necessarily just because you
want their network, which is an added benefit to investing in

(42:53):
mentorship. But also when you hire somebody,
they just know more than you. They've done more than you,
they've lost more than you, they've won more than you.
It's like learn from them. So you can skip ahead a little
bit. And I know you're big on this,
especially with what you guys doat these events around the
country. How important is mentorship?
Has it been for you and your success in in in what role it

(43:16):
plays? You think it plays in people who
are building their Business Today?
I it's everything I there's nothing special about me other
than a willingness to like step into environments and pay for
people better than these time. I just got back from visiting 2
buddies of mine that between them both they own about 1415
gyms. I needed to figure out a

(43:38):
specific hiring funnel and I'd say, hey, like what I got to do
to come up there. And they said this is what it
is. We'll come up, we'll spend the
whole day together. So well, here, here's the money.
Take that fly up there and do it.
I, I spend forty, $50,000 a yearon coaches for myself.
And I have for, I mean, at leasta decade, probably more than
that. Honestly, it's probably closer

(43:58):
to 13 to 15 years. I've invested a couple college
educations in mentorship for sure.
And it's, it's been the most significant thing in my life.
And I, I made a point and now I pay that forward.
You know, Luke and I have built to last and we teach people the
same things. And I shot a video for our
community literally yesterday, and I posted it today inside our

(44:20):
circle community where I was talking about the value of live
events for that specifically that nowadays people don't want
to get out and connect with other people.
And what I shared with them is this idea like there really is
no such thing as an online community.
This is a term that we've used, but there is engagement, but
there's no real connection. Connection happens when you get

(44:42):
in the same room with other people who are trying to do what
you want to do. And you sure you've got a leader
who's been there, but you've gotother people that are sharing
that experience in that journey.And I think the combination of
those two things and then takingit back to your staff or your
team and teaching it to other people, that's how you solidify
knowledge. And it's like, without me
driving across the country, fly,I'm, I'm 46 years old.

(45:05):
You couldn't learn through a median like this, you know, 13
years ago. So we had to do it.
And if I look at all the dudes that I was in masterminds with,
mentorships with, they're all names.
Everybody would know if I just started rattling them off right
now. They're all people that are the
most successful in the entire industry.
And they're a handful of dudes like my 2 buddies that I paid
between them both. They probably have less than

(45:26):
2000 followers online and combination they've got about
$18 million or so in my estimatebased on their real estate and
their company revenue and they aren't that well known and they
smash 90% of well known gym owners.
Yeah, it's it's such AI think followers are not currency and I

(45:47):
think people forget that. You know, it's one thing that
I've I feel like I've always known I've leveraged the online
marketing game and social media and pocket stuff, obviously,
because that's, you know, it's what we do.
It's online. But even to this day, man, it's
like people ask me, what's your like number one source of legion
and they'll ask you said Instagrams, YouTube and I'm

(46:09):
like, no, it's word of mouth referrals.
We get really good results. What about ads?
Do you we don't run ads. How do you get people from
online? It's like, honestly, most people
it's SEOI don't have to have a following for SEO.
It's my website. So I think people, which is
funny because the thing that actually helped me build my
following, which isn't super massive but to what it is, was

(46:31):
not trying to get leads. It was because I loved creating
content and educating people. And you're good and you're good.
Like you care, like I mean, you,you care about being good.
And like, as long as I've known you, you've been that type of
person when I met you 13 years ago, like I recognized like this
dude's like he's got it. Like you, you cared, right?
And I don't think people care asmuch now about being good is

(46:53):
they care about being significant and popular and
having the vanity metrics. I think that's something that
it's, it's very hard to overcome.
Like, I get it. And I'm empathetic to it.
Like, I I get it. But I do think that causes a lot
more problems than most people would admit.
And there's plenty of like online marketers that are, you
know, here to exploit that, you know, for their own benefit.

(47:14):
Yeah. That means a lot.
First of all, good for you. Thank you man.
I appreciate that a ton. And so I think this kind of
encapsulates a lot of this topic, but if you had to put
your finger on it, what separates world class gyms slash
world class coaches, let's say, and just the average Joe Jim, or

(47:35):
the the businesses that do fail within the first five years, you
know, in in this industry? I think there's two main things,
operational excellence and personal leadership.
So like really understanding, like the cost of doing business,
understanding your numbers, understanding margins, using
that data to make strategic decisions, it's something that

(47:55):
people don't talk about enough. I think that is way more
important than a lot of things that are promoted.
Yes, you need to learn how to market.
Yes, you need to learn how to sell.
Those are incredibly important qualities.
But how you operate your gym from the top down and how you
use data and metrics to make decisions is incredibly
important. There are many people that I

(48:16):
talked to that their margins aretoo tight to grow because the
decisions they made five years ago, they don't really
understand the implications of that.
The the second side of it is personal leadership, being the
type of person that does the things that are required to
grow, whether you want to do it or not, you have to be willing
to submit to the suck in the process, tamp down the ego, hire

(48:38):
mentors and coaches, get close to people doing it better than
you and extract as much as you can from them.
But once you've done that, you have to put it into action.
And if things don't go the way you want it to go, you've got to
look yourself in the mirror and ask why and not project it onto
the Internet or onto your community.
Or the fact everybody in my world believes trainers don't

(48:59):
want to work these days. Like, it's something about you.
Maybe you aren't good enough as a leader yet to attract those
people. So if we focus on operational
excellence and personal leadership, I think you got a
heck of a chance. And then like, if you're not
good enough, you're just not good enough.
And nobody wants to tell anybodythat these days.
But that's just the truth. I'm not going to sell you the

(49:21):
free lunch man. Like most people will fail.
But if you're willing to do the work, you got a much better
chance of not failing. Would you say that those two
things almost take care of the sales and marketing to an
extent? Because if you, I don't know,
the way I look at it is because I've had people ask me like,
have you done like I'm if I get on sales call, it's done like

(49:43):
I'm great. But people ask me like what
sales training have you done? I'm like, really, I do like a
Tony Robbins thing like a decadeago, maybe more, but like never
done any sales training. And the reason is because we get
great results and I have a high level of education, so I can
answer any question and I can prove that what we do works.
So when you have that level of confidence, it's kind of like it

(50:05):
just sells itself, you know? But if you tackle those two
things, that's what you get. And you and you believe in what
you do, right? It's like when you're trying to
enroll like the the used car salesman thing, right?
They get a lot of bad, a bad name, but a lot of time they're,
there's this perception they're selling you a lemon, right?
And they're trying to talk you into buying it.
Whereas like, you know, I'm goodat this and I've got an

(50:27):
opportunity here for you. Would you like to take it or
not? And I think when you sell from
that certainty and you have a high level of education, it is
much easier to sell. And then if you now I have done
a ton of sales stuff from Sandler to Tom Hopkins, Zig
Ziglar to any PQ like I could, I've done a ton of it.
So then if you do like sharpen up on the skills, you'll be even

(50:50):
better. But a lot of people just want to
know the hack, like what's the script?
Like what do I say? What's the flow?
But if you don't have that certainty and then that
education to really back it up, you're not going to sell as well
as you would if you did have that.
So again, it's like back to coaching and like doing what's
required to be really good at the job and then taking that

(51:10):
skill and transferring it into everything else, whether that's
sales or marketing or or whatever.
Well into your point, you know, when you lead a team, you got to
make sure that they can perform like you can.
And so if you're great at selling, but you don't have the
confidence in the fulfillment from your team, that's hard.
And that makes selling harder because you don't have

(51:31):
confidence unless the fulfillment's there, you know
it's. Why a lot of coaches stay doing
all the work themselves? Because they, they aren't as
confident that when they unplug themselves that the product will
still be good. And I think that is something
that, I mean, I've had to confront it.
I've had to really one, I had tounderstand that I have great

(51:52):
coaches, but they're probably not going to be as good as me.
They haven't done it as long. But if they're 80% as good as me
and I've put bumpers around things, right?
This is how we do things here. They can certainly serve people
at a very high level. And then as a, as a leader, like
you got to give people the opportunity to, to do it.
And then you have to be able to measure that performance in some

(52:13):
way and reflect back to them whether it's good enough or not.
If it's not, guess what, it's still on you to help them fix
it. Right now.
It's time for you to invest in their ability, whether that's
sales, coaching, training, marketing, or whatever their
role is inside the business. You know, the, the leader
mentality is like it's always onyou no matter what.
The question is, are you willingto do what's required to grow

(52:34):
your team, or do you want to take the ball back and just kind
of do it all on your own? Yeah, man, it's it took way
longer to figure out how to build a team that can perform
really well and that can get results and that way longer than
I expected. I'm like, well, I'm great at
this. I'm just going to show them what
I do and they're going to do it too.

(52:55):
Nope. Not how it goes.
It's still still, I'm still getting better at I'm still
paying for guidance in that areaand I probably will for forever.
You know, I mean, that's, that'sa being a leader is a lot bigger
than just reading a book like extreme ownership or whatever.
Like great book, by the way. But it's like you can't just
like read a leadership book and become a leader.

(53:18):
Like there's so much nuance to it that you got to be really in
the game. You got to be in the fight.
Well, and I think that goes backto the however many, I think you
said 6 needs of humans, you saidgrowth was one of them.
Like you just said it. You're going to keep learning
that probably forever. You know, even if you feel like
you got shit on lock, you're going to keep learning because
the part of growing and knowing more and learning more and being

(53:39):
better, like that's part of fulfilment life, right?
I love it, man. OK, so we got a a few wrap up
questions here to to finish things off.
Speaking of extreme ownership, this first segment is sponsored
by Jocko Fuel. So you use choose hard as the
coupon code, you get 20%. That's what I'm drinking right
now. Is this Jocko?

(54:01):
So the question for this segmentsponsored by Jocko Fuel is
what's something you saw or weretaught?
Well, I'm excited about this while growing up that helped you
shape your success today, which you feel today's world has lost
touch of or needs a reminder. So something that sticks out
that really helped shape who youare from, you know, childhood or

(54:22):
teenage years or early career oranything, just like as you were
developing as a man and you feellike today's world is not
getting enough of that today. What's that lesson?
I don't know if anybody directly, directly taught me
this, but I realized very early on that like nobody owes you
anything. Like you're, you're not owed
anything. Like you've got to scrap, you've

(54:43):
got to fight, you've got to do what you got to do to keep your
head above water. And if you learn how to do that
and you build skills around it, it's it's a master skill.
The minute you think you're entitled to some outcome because
you've done things that somebodyelse you respect has done,
you're setting yourself up for alot of misery and headache.
I love that. I think I agree.

(55:04):
I think doing things because youwant to serve others, not
because you want something in return from others.
Yeah. That alone, man, is just you
remove that resentment or that expectation and you're just
doing things. This was actually a big shift
for me in the midst of my entrepreneurial career.
And when I really found my faith, it helped a lot because

(55:26):
it was almost like, you know, I,I love languages are great.
There's nothing like bad againstthem, but I found that I, you
know, I read it took the test. I mean, what?
And I'm I'm words of affirmation.
I was like, that makes sense. But then I found myself noticing
I'm like seeking that more. And if I didn't get it, now I'm
upset and I'm like, well, was that why I did it?
You know, And once I for me, once I got more in touch with

(55:48):
God, then it was this internal voice of like, Cody, you're
doing the right thing. You're leading the way.
You need to lead and following your purpose.
That's all I needed. And it wasn't about getting
anything returned from other people.
That makes sense. Yeah, it totally.
Yeah, It resonates with me a lot.
I totally get that and a similarprinciple.

(56:08):
But what came to mind before youwent that deep on me was this
idea of what I call Commission breath.
It's like I can tell when somebody is like selling me on
something. They want to do something for me
so they can benefit from it later on.
And I think if you're around a lot of, if you're a savvy
person, you see more that now than ever.

(56:29):
So it's like doing things for others with no expectation of
anything in return. I think it's an incredible
character trait that more peopleshould try on because
ironically, you do that for realand good things usually come
back to you. Hey, you know, what's crazy is
like something we were talking about before we start recording.
One of the reasons I had a resistance to text that
individual was because I didn't want that assumption to be made

(56:53):
'cause I'm like, I don't, I don't need anything.
This isn't about that. And I don't want it to be 'cause
I know how it is. And sometimes that happens more
often than somebody just generally being nice.
You know, it's like they want something.
What is it? So like, how do I word this to
make sure that that he, he knows, you know, that's not what
this is. So it's funny you say that

(57:14):
'cause I haven't, I haven't. I've never heard that you called
it what Commission breath? Commission breath.
You you can smell it on them, Yeah.
I like that. All right, this next one is
sponsored by our merch shop. So again, Choose hard is the
coupon code for everything, 20% on all of our merch journals,
hats, everything like that. This one's probably gonna be
hard for you 'cause I know you're a reader, man.

(57:35):
What book does everyone listening to this podcast right
now need to listen to or need toread?
Yeah, that's as. You got like stacks of.
Books, yeah, 'cause I mean, I can give it like for different
things. I'll give you an answer that
probably everybody has said because it's just one of those

(57:56):
classic books that everybody should read, but it allows me to
to kind of be neutral in this area.
It's how to win friends and influence people.
That is still an absolute classic.
Every coach that comes into our world, we have them read it and
I think it lends itself to like what we were just talking about,
not just doing things to get something out of it.
I think that is a fantastic book.

(58:18):
I'll give you a charisma myth I think is really good for people
that have to be out in the open and communicating and connecting
with people. I think Crucial Conversations is
another one we have every coach read.
Just like learning how to communicate is so, so important.

(58:38):
The Laws of Human Nature by Robert Greene, I think is
incredibly fascinating. Pretty much everything.
Robert Greene Mastery, Robert Greene and all his other ones.
Ryan Holiday, you know, the obstacle is the way, ego is the
enemy. Those are fantastic books and
reads. Yeah, I could, I could rattle

(59:00):
books for forever on this. But there, there's a couple that
I think the four agreements, I'll throw that one out there
too. If everybody reads those books
right there, I think your life would be a little bit better.
Yeah, I have all those books except the Charisma myth.
I'm gonna have to check that out'cause that one I haven't.
Personal question around this. Are you strictly reading?
Do you listen audio books? Are you?

(59:21):
I do this sometimes I do both. I listen while I read it.
That helps me. What is your style?
I do that sometimes, especially on airplanes.
It kind of just helps me lock ineven more.
But my method for I read three books at a time and I usually
listen to one to two audio booksa month.
So I read 10 pages in the morning and one book 10 pages at
lunch and another 10 pages at night.

(59:42):
That gets me through three booksa month because the average book
is about 300 pages. And then when I'm in my car, I'm
always listening to an audio book or a podcast as well.
So that's kind of my personal method of information
consumption. That's really worked well for
me. Strategic.
I like that man All right, last segment and then we'll wrap up

(01:00:03):
with the final question that I ask everybody.
And this one is sponsored by ourapp to the trainer, which you
can download and actually just use for free if you need
workouts. Premium version costs money.
Not everything's for free, as hesaid, no free lunch, but go
check out the the freemium version, overrated and
underrated. Choose anything you want 1
overrated, 1 underrated. And anything goes here.

(01:00:26):
So you can be talking business, life, social media, just the
world today, whatever you know, sports, anything, music,
whatever you want. Everybody's gonna hate me on
this one, Cody. Overrated.
Social media. Everybody's gonna hate me on
that one. But I'm, I'm gonna say it.
Overrated. I don't think they will.

(01:00:47):
I, I think everybody would be like, I agree, but I have to do
it. I feel like it's the answer for
a lot of people. It's the ratio of creation and
consumption, right? All right.
So that's my overrated and kind of in the spirit of
communication, I'm going to say underrated is like face to face
connection with people, actuallycalling people on the phone and

(01:01:11):
talking to them, you know, goingand meeting with people in
person. I just think that that is real
connection and there's certain people that like you can only
reach them by text. You're never going to see them
in person. We live behind digital
communications and I just think in person connection and all.

(01:01:31):
Like I said, I'll even throw thephone in there if I can hear
your voice, that's better than me.
Just like that's why I send so many voice notes.
It's that I want people to hear my voice and I want to hear
yours, you know, So that that's what I'll give you.
Overrated. Underrated.
I love it, man. All right, last one to wrap it
up. What does choose hard mean to
you? Man, that's AI love choose hard

(01:01:55):
step into the the arena. I love.
There's another book called the comfort crisis.
I don't know if you ever read that, but like.
Just got that. Did you?
Yeah, that's a that's a great book.
And so I guess, you know, I've had bilateral hip replacements
and that was about 7 years ago. But about three years, four
years ago, me and a buddy of mine did the rim to rim in the
Grand Canyon. And that was my first misogi in

(01:02:17):
which they talk about in comfortcrisis where it's like you do
something so challenging every year that you don't know if
you're going to be able to finish it or not.
And I think that helps reset your temperature, your belief in
yourself or what you think is possible.
In fact, in October, I'll, I'll share something that I'm going
to go do that's pretty wild. I'm going to be taking almost

(01:02:37):
the whole month of October off to go do this.
I don't want to put it out here to the world.
They, all these people don't know me.
They might think I'm kind of crazy, but it's a pretty big
deal and it's certainly my misogi for this year.
So I think, you know, choosing hard means stepping into things
that allow you to redefine yourself and become a better
version because of the struggle associated with it.
So good. I love that answer and I'm not

(01:03:00):
done with the book yet, but highly recommended so far.
Everything that guy does it's it's really cool his his
journey, his story and everything like that.
So dude, thank you so much for everything today.
This has been a blast and for everything over the years, man.
You've been a huge guide and mentor and friend of me for a
long time now and I appreciate it more than I can say.
So just let everybody know real quick one where they can find

(01:03:21):
you on the thing that you think is overrated, social media and
and also where they can check out your events that you're
doing with Luca, 'cause I know you guys got something coming
up. Yeah, yeah.
So you can find me on the Instagram.
I am there. I may not respond immediately,
give me a day or two, but it's Andy Mccloy under score BCIB as
in boy C as in cat I as incorporated that stands
technically for Body Creations Incorporated.

(01:03:43):
So Andy Mccloy under score BCI. Luke and I run a mastermind for
gym owners where we help them become operationally excellent.
We teach them how to like install personal leadership
strategies and amongst other things, we have an event coming
up in December in Nashville. We've got an event coming up in
February in Phoenix and another one in July that will actually

(01:04:05):
be in good old Seattle, Renton area.
And you can learn more about that by going to Built to
lastgym.com or you can certainlysend me a private message and
I'll shoot you over the details.I'll put all that in the
description of this podcast so you guys can just click and go
check those out immediately and follow Andy, which I highly
recommend because he has just somuch experience in the game,

(01:04:25):
extremely knowledgeable, and youcan definitely pull a lot of
wisdom from this man. So dude, thank you for your
time. I appreciate it and we got to
have you back on again soon. Anytime, brother.

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#76 - How to Build a Gym That Lasts: Andy McCloy on World-Class Coaching & Business

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}#76 - How to Build a Gym That Lasts: Andy McCloy on World-Class Coaching & Business