Swammie Shuffle 200 Recap: The Party Pack’s Outer Banks Ultra Adventure

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Well, hello and welcome.
If this is your first time withus, thank you for stopping by.
You're listening to Choose toEndure, the show dedicated to
the non-elite runners, where weshare stories, interviews, gear
and training tips specific tothe tail-end heroes of the Ultra
Universe.
My name's Richard Glebe.

(00:21):
I have been running ultras nowsince 2017, and I've taken on
and finished numerous ultradistances, all the way up
through 220 miles, and I amunashamedly a member of the back
of the pack, just like many ofyou listening out there Now.

(00:47):
A little over a week ago, youmight have seen or heard that I
had an incredible experienceback running the Swami Shuffle
200, a pretty cool multi-dayultra that really tests the
limits.
But what made this race trulyunforgettable for me wasn't just
the miles.
Forgettable for me wasn't justthe miles, it was the people.
And somewhere along the way,the five of us, me included,

(01:09):
found each other stuck togetherand became somehow the
self-proclaimed party pack.
And through the highs, lows, alittle bit of sleep deprivation,
some laughter, a bit ofsuffering, we tackled most of
the second half of the course asa group.
So today I am joined by myfellow Party Pack members as we

(01:34):
relive some of the craziness,the triumphs and everything in
between.
We're going to chat about therace itself, how we ended up
coming together, what kept usmoving and the benefits of
traveling around as a groupdoing these kinds of events.
So buckle up.
This one is going to be kind ofa fun ride.

(01:54):
Let's jump right in.
Discover raw, inspiring storiesfrom runners who've been right
where you are.
This is the Choose to EndureUltra Running Podcast with your
host he's English, notAustralian, richard Gleave.

(02:16):
All right, before we get intowhat went down out there, I
think we should start with aquick roll call.
So we've got the other fourmembers of the party pack here
on the call.
Maybe we kick off with havingeach of you introduce yourself.
Maybe say your name quick,ultra running fact, if you've
got one.

(02:36):
Anyone want to go first?
Otherwise I'm picking like wedo at work.
I'm going left to right on myscreen.
Stephanie, I'm afraid you'refirst as the last into the group
joining the fun here.

Speaker 4 (02:51):
Well, I'm Stephanie Fonda and I started running
ultras in 2012.
And it was kind of by accidentbecause my friend Mark Z we were
running the Marine CorpsMarathon together and he asked
me if I wanted to run Stone Mill50 miler with him and I said I

(03:13):
have no idea what you're talkingabout right now.
And he said, well, it's this 50miler, not too far from home,
and it's at that time in 2012,.
It was $47 to register and hesaid so it's really good value
at less than a dollar a mile andyou can drop out anytime.
So I said, ok, I'll do it, andthat was my introduction to

(03:38):
Ultra.

Speaker 1 (03:39):
Nice, onwards and upwards from there, and I think
am I right in saying this wasyour first 200, stephanie?

Speaker 4 (03:46):
Yes, I think.
I think I'm the only person inthe group who has not done more
than 100 miles before.

Speaker 1 (03:53):
Hold that thought Because I think we definitely
want to get your thoughts onthat from the rest of the group
here how you felt it went onyour first 200.
But let's get everybody elseintroduced first.
Who's up next?
Lisa, you want to go?

Speaker 2 (04:07):
Yes, hey, I am Lisa McFadden.
My fun fact is well, I actuallygot two.
I'm also the race director ofCape Fear 24-Hour Endurance Run,
and I always tell people that Ido not race races, I just
participate.
I am a participant in all ofthese races, so that's why.

(04:27):
I'm in the back of the packwith everybody else.

Speaker 1 (04:30):
Yes, they're not.
They're not races, they'reevents.
We just happen to participatein them.
Yeah, fantastic, I love that.
Elizabeth, mike, one of youguys.
You guys tend to come as a pair, like in a running perspective,
I should say.

Speaker 5 (04:46):
Well, I'll go.
I'm probably the leastexperienced in the ultra world I
started in 2018, but this wasmy first distance past 50 miles,
so I did this race last yearPast 50 miles.

Speaker 1 (05:03):
Right, wow, and here's me giving Stephanie a
hard time Wow.

Speaker 5 (05:08):
I did it last year with Mike, but I only made it to
the turnaround point.
I did 110 over two and a halfdays, but this year I was
determined to complete it.
So I have my first 100 comingup in April at Umstead.
I think Lisa's going to bethere, mike's going to be there,
mike's going to be there, Ithink.
Stephanie, are you going to bethere as well?

Speaker 4 (05:29):
I'm going to be there , all right.

Speaker 5 (05:31):
So it'll be a party reunion.
But that'll actually be myfirst 100 miler, so yeah.
So that's my fun fact.

Speaker 1 (05:39):
First official 100 miler Correct.
If I were you I would stillclaim you got all the way down
to the lighthouse.
So I mean, that's like what?
108, 110, something like that.
So I would claim that one, eventhough it's unofficial.
But yeah, that's really wild,brilliant.
And Mike, you want to give usyour quick lowdown.

Speaker 3 (05:57):
Good afternoon.
My name is Mike Edwards Caveattowards Elizabeth.
Yes, she dropped out at 108,but then she additionally did
what?
60 miles to keep me company.
So she took a little day breakand then she joined me and she I
made the mistake going acrossthe beach.
I got a little competitive withDave Moore this was last year

(06:18):
so we went out with no.
I went across the beach with nosleep for the most part.
We met him at the Hampton Innand went across, but the initial
plan was for us to sleep at theHampton Inn and get up and
Elizabeth would join me for thelast 22 miles.
So in all essence, she wouldhave made a 200-mile run last

(06:38):
year, minus 20 miles that I didby myself.
So everyone other than you,richard, I met Stephanie at
Stone Mill in 2012.
We ran many miles.
I remember her friend, dr Z, aswe call him.
Uh, dr Z loves females.
He had a harem of femalesrunning with him and Stephanie

(06:59):
happened to have one of them.
Help me out, stephanie.
You had.
You had purple hair or greenhair back then.

Speaker 4 (07:06):
Uh, it was purple.
What, yeah, purple, purple andshort yeah, very short.

Speaker 3 (07:11):
So here was this little.
You know we're the same age,but a little punkster running in
the woods with purple hair.
So I met Lisa at HOTS in 2020.
I want to say so that we did acouple.
We had a party boss, a partybarge, I think they called it,
then a handful of us doing that.

(07:31):
I think we stayed together what?
Four days, three days, fivedays, something like that, and
then a couple yesterdays ago,two years ago, elizabeth reached
out to me and wanted to know.
The local club that we belongto advertised that I had done in
Swami Shuffle and Elizabethwanted to know more about that
and I met her at the coffee shopto show her that, yes, we run

(07:54):
along the side of the road, butit's not.
I'm very comfortable running onthe shoulder.
I know Lisa is because a lot ofhots or vol states even smaller
shoulders.
So, um, I understand this bigfear of trucks going by blowing
your hats off and blast you inthe face and all that stuff.

Speaker 1 (08:14):
So I think we should have.
We should have had a runningcount of how many times
elizabeth's hat either blew offor nearly blew off, you know
from the wind or truck orwhatever.
I mean, it was like it was alot, so you might have to find a
tighter hat, elizabeth I don'thave to.

Speaker 5 (08:32):
I mean, I gave myself a sore neck on the beach
because I had my head angleddown so that the wind didn't
blow it off and mike asked melater, like why didn't you just
take it off?
And I was like, because mybrain wasn't working.
By that point it didn't occurto me to just take it off.

Speaker 1 (08:45):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, but well, so I think
, mike, that was a good, a goodlead in, though, to our sort of
first group question, if youwill in that, and we've touched
on a little bit.
But like, why did you guys signup for this race?
Like, what, what, what drew youto Swami Shuffle 2025 as
opposed to other races out therein the first place?

Speaker 2 (09:09):
I'll go.
I've been wanting to do thisrace for several years.
It just does not work out wellwith my calendar.
And this is the first year thatit did work, and so I was
really excited that I was goingto actually be able to do it,
and I've wanted to do a journeyrun in a winter month as opposed

(09:29):
to something in the summermonths which I've normally done,
so this was a little bitdifferent for me this time.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
Yeah, now Lisa, you've done Hots and Vol State
with any other big journey runs,how did this one compare?

Speaker 2 (09:45):
well, and then I've also done a third circle of hell
, and that was 370 miles yeah.
So this one, you know anythingover 100 miles, you know it's
going to take multiple days formost normal people.
And for me this one wasdifferent because you had hotels

(10:07):
and you knew exactly where youwere going to go.
It was an out and back, so youcould kind of divide it up based
on that.
And so for my mind, as Mike hassaid over this whole journey
was it's a beach vacation.
So that just sort of gets stuckin your mind.
You're like oh yeah, I've got ahotel to stay in every night,
I've got real food to eat and Iknow where they're at, going and

(10:31):
coming back, and I don't haveto sleep in a Dollar General
parking lot.
So, that was a bonus.

Speaker 1 (10:39):
That's definitely got to be a bonus, I would imagine.
Yeah, I do think, though, justmentally, it makes a big
difference when you know whereyour end point is every day and
you know you've got some time, Ihave some downtime there or I'm
going to be able to put my feetup or whatever.
When you know that in advance,I think it makes the day more
bearable than if you just setout and said I'm just going to
run this whole thing and I'm notgoing to stop until I need to

(11:01):
and I've have no idea where I'mgoing to stop.
I think that's more of achallenge than kind of having a
defined start finish every day.
How about the rest of you guys?
I think, elizabeth, you talkedabout not finishing last year
and you wanted to definitelycome back and make sure you
righted that wrong, so to speak.
Was that your main driver forsigning up this go around?

Speaker 5 (11:23):
Oh, absolutely, this go around.
It was, um, my main goal was,was was to complete it.
But I but I had a preview lastyear.
So last year when I signed up,um, I was really ignorant.
I had no idea what I wassigning up for.
I asked a lot of questions butum, it was.
It was a really big unknown forme and I learned a lot of where

(11:48):
I needed to change things, whatI needed to do differently in
my training and my preparation,and I'd seen the whole course.
So, going into it this year Iknew I could do it with the
right training.
There was really no unknown andI put the work in with the sole
goal of completing it.
And Mike and I trained a lot.
I did a lot of road miles thisyear, whereas coming into this

(12:11):
last year it was mostly runningtrails, so the pounding on the
pavement really beat me up.
So, I spent the last year doinga lot of walking on roads and
running on roads, but yeah, Imean, we've been talking about
this all year for the last twoyears because we talked about it
the year before last, goinginto it, and then again this
year just what do we need to doto be successful?
What do I need to do?

(12:32):
Mike is a machine.
He just keeps going, he doesn'tstop.
But I'm a moral, I needed morepreparation.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
So, um, yeah, that was my goal, just get it done
well, we'll get to mike in aminute, but I I am keen to come
back to Stephanie, with thisbeing your first 200, right,
never mind kind of ajourney-style race for a minute,
because I think they're quitedifferent to other 200s out
there as well.
So what was it that drew you tosign up for a Swami Shuffle?

Speaker 4 (13:03):
Well, a couple of things.
One thing is mike he.
He sent me some beautifulphotos from his prior
experiences I'm sensing a themehere mike's the glue, that's for
sure.
And you know beautiful sunriseson the beach.
I was, I was, I was interestedin that and the whole beach

(13:23):
vacation concept.
But it was more than that.
For me, the cause really meanta lot, or means a lot.
I've been working in militaryhealth care and veterans health
care for since 2003.
And so I wanted to I don't knowjust do something more for that

(13:44):
community because it's soimportant to me.
And so the cause mattered a lotand because of that I was very
moved by the story thatunderlies the whole event.
You know the reason for theevent the suicide of this young
veteran and you know I did crymany times during the event when

(14:05):
we encountered veterans, likeat a gas station, a veteran
approached Lisa and shook herhand and I went to pieces seeing
that.
That really mattered a lot.
It felt like what we were doingwas.
You know, it was for us, wewere having a beach vacation,
but it was also meaningful forother people too.

(14:27):
So that was a driver for me.

Speaker 1 (14:30):
I think it's a fantastic cause and it just adds
another dimension to running ajourney race of this length.
When you get to talk to peopleabout the reason why while
you're doing it, I think that'sreally cool and definitely one
of the draws for me aside fromMike's beach vacation is the
cause.

(14:50):
I really love that and I've gotlots of friends and family who
are veterans, and just beingable to feel like I'm doing
something on behalf of that toraise awareness, however I can,
is really awesome.
But let's not forget Mike,because you've done like what is
this?
Was this your third one?

Speaker 4 (15:08):
is that right?

Speaker 2 (15:09):
fourth one oh my gosh I'm, I'm, totally uh it's
totally doing you down for oneof these.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
So next year you're back for the thousand mile
buckle, right?

Speaker 3 (15:18):
yeah, yeah, I don't think they offer that, but they
said something about maybe, apossibly.
They call it bricks.
Apparently they can get a brickfrom the, from the lighthouse
that they're going to offer tome, so that might be kind of
cool.

Speaker 1 (15:30):
So um, let's walk away with a brick.

Speaker 4 (15:34):
A brick, that's a so does that mean, we're all going
back next year, so mike can gethis?

Speaker 3 (15:38):
break.
I told elizabeth I'm gonna sayeliz say Elizabeth is my
currently, she's my trail, myrunning wife.
It's like she was pampered thisyear with her husband being
there and Christina was there.
It's like, okay, how about ifwe try to get with you carrying
your gear again and, if need be?
Last year we were just becomingfriends and we did not really

(16:02):
communicate.
We were very sensitive on eachother's toes, if that makes
sense.
So this year we have a betterunderstanding of what each
other's needs are and I did tellher that I was going to stay
with her to be successful forher.
I know Lisa from pastexperience.
I see her at Umstead every year.
I know what she's able to do.
I know chatting with her whileshe was doing the third circle

(16:25):
of hell.
She was mentally struggling.
The weather was not cooperating.
I can only envision what shehad to go through in order to
complete that.
But I know she's one toughcookie and I've known Stephanie
since forever, so I know whatshe's able to do.
So it's a beach vacation.

Speaker 1 (16:43):
Why so you come a beach vacation?
Why so you come back four times?
Why do you keep coming back tothis race?

Speaker 3 (16:51):
It is a wonderful cause.
What these two guys put on thevery first one I read about and
it was a virtual 200 mile run,and I signed up for this stuff
in 2022 is when I signed up forit and I don't remember.
Maybe there was 22 of us, 18started, maybe something like

(17:12):
that.
I can't remember what, but Ithought I was running 200 miles.
It did not occur to me.
Now there's statistics outthere, there's blogs out there.
It's written out there thatit's more than 220 miles, but I
remember running towards thelighthouse oh, dark hours
watching that light working andthat light was never this is

(17:35):
what I was having.
By timing it, I was actuallycompetitive and it was at 98
miles and that was nowhere closeto two miles away.
Right, yes, when at the finishline that day that year, I
questioned it and they bothlaughed at me, so it's like okay
, so I was the fool.
So, but the cause per se, rightbefore we got on here, if I can

(17:59):
hit you, some statistics.
Statistics, yes, rollcarorg, a20-year survey.
They said 7,057 service peoplewere killed in action Of the 20
years, 30,177 committed suicideof the same time frame.
So we're talking a lot and inmy personal life.

(18:23):
My daughter has struggled withthose thoughts so it resonates
very heavily with me.
So until I can't walk it, I'mgoing to be John Price.

Speaker 1 (18:33):
And they just pulled the trigger for the tap out.
But brilliant, yeah.
So for you guys either firsttime folks or folks that have
done this mileage in this styleof run before, or Mike for you
that's done a couple of Swamisbefore how do you, how do you

(18:57):
guys mentally approach a racelike this?

Speaker 3 (19:01):
This particular one you have to do your homework
with, because the unknown iswhere you're going to stop or
where you're going to get aidfrom.
I had done it's defunct now butthere was a race called Tar
Heel Ultra, running basicallyCorolla up to the state line,
turning around and running allthe way back down to South
Carolina 378 miles in December,and I'm thinking like the

(19:27):
Washington DC area.
Everything is open 24 hours.
For the most part I did notrealize things closed down.
Things didn't either openduring wintertime or things
closed down rarely till likefour or five o'clock.
So it took me two tries to getthat race done.
Um, but from this doing swamishuffle, I did homework.

(19:51):
I shared my homework with, withthis, my little group here of
what stores were open, whattheir hours were, what their
phone numbers were, what hotelswere there, what miles there
were, just because I did notwant to get stuck out in the
middle of nowhere.
So, or similar to what yourexperience last year was, I have
no desire to sleep in thebathroom or the post office.

Speaker 1 (20:14):
Yes, Neither of those were particularly appealing,
uncomfortable.

Speaker 3 (20:19):
Yes, yeah.

Speaker 1 (20:20):
I mean sleeping on a bathroom floor a la Bob Marizzi,
who is the original for doingthat, I think.
So shout out to Bob.
But yeah that was not myfavorite thing to do, I have to
say.
Anybody else have a differentmental approach.
How did you think aboutfinishing this race?

Speaker 2 (20:40):
For me.
I kind of break it into chunks.
Chunks meaning by day.
My original goal was to try tofinish by Thursday afternoon,
because my boys had a basketballgame on Friday night that I was
hoping to get home for, but byWednesday I'm like, no, it's
going to be Friday morning andwe're just going to take this

(21:01):
easy and then break up the nexttwo days or the last two days.
We're just going to take thiseasy and then break up the next
two days or the last two days.
So when I go into these thingsI think about it by days and
number of miles per day that Iwant to get accomplished.
I also had Mike's cheat sheetof mileage and what was open and
what was available.

Speaker 1 (21:18):
I think it's a good idea to just give folks a
rundown, because this is areally interesting journey run
because of what what you guyswere talking about like it's in
the off season in the outerbanks of north carolina and it's
a 110 miles down to a the capehatteras lighthouse.
From sandbridge, virginia.
You run the first 22 miles on abeach, you pop out in corolla

(21:43):
and then you run straight down.
What is it?
Nc12, the road basicallystraight down through a bunch of
towns to the Cape HatterasLighthouse.
You turn around and you goright the way back again.
So I do think the lack of placesopen to get food and water
potentially can be a realchallenge.

(22:05):
Places open to get food and andwater potentially can be a real
challenge.
And there are some bigstretches, the beach being the
first one right out, and then onyour way back which is what was
that?
22 miles, I think, right outthe gate where there's no, I
mean, it's a beach, so there'snothing.
And then you know the the wholep island, bode island stretch,
where there's very little opendown there.
There's one visitor center inthe middle of that, but you have

(22:25):
to catch it at the right timefor it to be open.
So there's a number ofstretches that are fairly
challenging to do.
If you are going solo, if youdon't have a crew, if you've got
a crew that can move along withyou, it's less of a challenge.
But I think there are a numberof people out there me included

(22:46):
I like to do this solo.
I want that experience and thatjourney, but it is a challenge
and you really do have to thinkabout where am I going to stop
and what do I need before Icarry on.
Am I prepped for the next, this22 mile section where I
potentially might not haveaccess to anything?
So I do think it's aninteresting and slightly

(23:09):
different race from thatperspective, just given the time
of year and the location aswell.
Stephanie, how about you?
What were your expectationscoming into this?
How did you like from doing?
You've done a hundred, if Irecall correctly, but this would
be your first 200 and firstjourney race.
So when you were thinking aboutthis like, like, how did you

(23:30):
try to compute?

Speaker 4 (23:32):
Well, I used the cheat sheet that that Mike
provided I got to get a copy ofthis cheat sheet that Mike
throws out.

Speaker 1 (23:38):
I think I'm missing out for some reason.

Speaker 4 (23:40):
And I had intended to make notes on it as I was
traveling, but I didn't do that.
There were a couple ofunexpected things for me.
I'm sure everyone will talkabout their prep.
I'm going to talk about thethings that surprised me.
One thing that surprised me andI found unsettling initially,
although I think I adapted to it.

(24:01):
I thought the first section wasjust fantastic.
You know, from when we startedto Kitty Hawk, I think we stayed
.
I stayed at the Holiday InnExpress, which was, I think, 47
miles from the start, and all ofthat was just very doable, very
safe from my perspective.
And then I was very surprisedon that second day when I

(24:26):
encountered all that highway.
I'm just not accustomed to that.
I'm accustomed to trail and theshoulder was decent, but for a
trail runner it was unsettlingthat first day.
And the bridges were unsettlingtoo.
And I think I encountered youthat day, richard and that
helped me a lot yeah.
Another surprise for me was thatI thought that from the KOA in

(24:49):
Rodanthe I may be mispronouncingthe name of that town, but
Rodanthe, rodanthe or somethingI thought that the round trip to
and from the KOA to get aroundthe Cape Hatteras Lighthouse was
actually 60 miles.
So imagine my delight when Irealized I was telling Elizabeth
this.

(25:09):
It was like the first time I'veever had a gift like this when
I got to the lighthouse andrealized, oh, this day is going
to be a lot shorter than I wasexpecting.
So that that was prettyfantastic, because I think that
was a 48, 48 mile day.
So my prep was, you know, Itried but it wasn't great.
I think it would be much betterthe next time around.

(25:33):
But obviously I had made some,some mistakes if I didn't
realize that, you know, therewere these long stretches of
highway and that I was going tobe spared 12 miles on that day
to and from the lighthouse, fromthe koa.
So not sure I'm a good personto ask about prep, but that's,

(25:54):
that was my experience.

Speaker 1 (25:55):
So well, apparently mike needs to update his
spreadsheet for that.
Uh, for that particular stretch.

Speaker 3 (26:00):
Read it correctly.
All right, that's what it is.

Speaker 4 (26:02):
Yeah, okay, all right , it's user error, it's well
prepared and I will definitelytake responsibility for not
interpreting that right, butthey're.
They're that section from thekoa to the lighthouse.
You, you do hit some towns, butthere's some long stretches
there too, you know, not justfrom Kitty Hawk to the KOA but

(26:24):
also from the KOA to thelighthouse.
And I was running with Jeremythat day for, yeah, all of that
day, for, yeah, all of that day,and I was really rattled by the
roads that that I encounteredthe prior day.
You know just not used to thatand also was worried about that

(26:45):
being a 60 mile day.
So when he texted me at one 30and said I can't sleep, do you
want to go?
I said sure I can, I'll beready at two 30.
And that was actually a reallycool time to run along that
highway.
It was at 2.30 in the morningbecause there were no cars and
the stars were fantastic, and Ithink I would do that again if I

(27:09):
just wanted to.
Again, I would do a little bitmore of the late night running
than I had expected.
I hadn't planned for that ofthe late night running than I
had expected.
I hadn't planned for that, andit turned out to be really kind
of a high point of the wholeevent.
It was just those quiet hoursin the middle of the night.

Speaker 1 (27:26):
I love those times, and I did the same.
Actually.
I went out from the KOA, Ithink about 12.30 am, but for
the same reason.
First of all, I wanted out tothe sun, but secondly, it's just
so quiet and the stars are sopretty down there.
I will say, though, that thethe only things that bombed past
me on that stretch were these,uh, waste disposal trucks, so

(27:47):
every time they whiz by, you getthis waft of air, and then the
waste disposal stench came withit, so that wasn't super great,
but otherwise, yes, lots ofquiet time out on the roads,
which was cool, and that's quitea good question actually.
Let's go around the group.
Everybody's best day and worstday.

Speaker 2 (28:09):
My best day was the first day.

Speaker 1 (28:11):
It's always the best day yeah.

Speaker 2 (28:13):
And then the worst day is typically always the
second day.
Somewhere between 60 miles and85 miles, I always my stomach
just turns and it typicallymeans I need I need to rest and
I really need calories.
To where we were eating dinneron the second night.

(28:35):
I felt horrible and all Iwanted to do is just take my
food and go lay down.
But by the time I got I leftElizabeth left with me to go to
the KOA from the restaurant andby the time I was in there 15,
20 minutes, had a shower.
I felt so much better and wasable to eat and slept pretty

(28:55):
good Fantastic much better andwas able to eat and slept pretty
good.
Fantastic after that.
It was my body was just used tobeing out there and I knew it
had, you know, 140 somethingmiles to go yeah, I think
sometimes it's just that it'sjust getting over that hump.

Speaker 1 (29:08):
Once you get past it and your body kind of accepts
that, okay, I'm in this and itisn't stopping, it sort of gives
up and for want of a betterterm I'm sure the scientists out
there will correct me on thatbut I do feel like
psychologically, that gettingover that second day is a big
deal in these multi-day racesfor sure, and just kind of

(29:29):
getting into a groove.
Elizabeth, how about you?

Speaker 5 (29:33):
The first day.
I mean, I just love the beach,so anytime I can spend time at
the beach is magical for me.
And it was sunny and we hit thetide just right.
So we were heading out onpretty firm sand and had good
company and you're optimisticand everything's going right and

(29:54):
you're not tired yet.
So I just I love those.
First, those first 20, 20, 22miles on the beach.
And then I would say, because Ihad done this a year prior
unsuccessfully, and I knew whatto expect.
I, you know, unlike Stephanie,where you know I can see where
that those long stretches on thehighway, when you're not

(30:15):
expecting that, can really throwyou for a loop.
I was mentally prepared forthat, so I knew that was coming.

Speaker 1 (30:20):
Right yeah.

Speaker 5 (30:21):
The third day, going to the lighthouse and back,
actually was one of my betterdays too.
I felt great.
I was really surprised at howmy body was able to recover
overnight.
So we slept.
I mean we got up at three or soin the morning, we were out the
door sometime around five, butwe were getting in early enough

(30:43):
that I could take a shower,could relax, could sleep, could
eat, could make sure that I wasfeeling properly.
My experience was completelydifferent than last year.
I felt good the whole time andI was really amazed at how my
body could recover overnight.
My nutrition last year, takingcare of my feet last year, was

(31:04):
completely different.
So I corrected a lot of mymistakes.
And so day three, coming backfrom the lighthouse, I think
knowing that I was sort ofsurpassing where I had gone the
year before, knowing that I wassort of surpassing where I had
gone the year before and wasgoing farther than I had ever
gone, was a real boost to mymood.
Was that on your?

Speaker 1 (31:25):
mind, elizabeth, along the way, Was it playing on
your mind as you got throughday two and you're into day
three and you know, okay, I'mhitting the same stretch now
where I, where I tapped out lastyear, were you, were you
thinking of that as you weregoing, and was that a driver, or
were you just sort of in themoment and doing what you needed
to do?

Speaker 5 (31:42):
I think I think both.
I think it was on my mind I waskind of waiting for the wheels
to fall off and they weren't,Whereas last year they they fell
off much, much earlier and Iwas sort of just hanging on for
dear life trying to get to thatlighthouse, to get a break, and
it never happened.
It was a completely differentexperience for me, and so I was

(32:05):
amazed at what my body could do.
I was amazed at how well mytraining was paying off and how
good I felt.
I wasn't expecting to feel asgood as I felt, and so going
into day three, which Mike keptsaying was the hardest Lisa I
think mentioned it once or twicelike you got to get through day
three because, like mentally,like that was my ending point
last year.

(32:25):
So yeah yeah, I think there wasa build up for that to get
through that and it wasn'tnearly as difficult as I was
making it out to be prior.
So going there and leaving thelighthouse, I felt great.
I felt really good and I wasoptimistic.
I knew at that point that I wasgoing to make it.
There was no doubt in my mindthat this year was going to be
different for me.

Speaker 1 (32:47):
Yeah, that out and back on our day three, I'm sure
for the Zoomy folks out there.
I don't know what day that waslike one and a half, I don't
know but our day three, whenwe're going out from the KOA
back to the KOA, I think it'slike I don't know 45, 46, I
don't know something like thatmiles, it feels like such a long

(33:07):
stretch out and back.
I don't know how you guys feel.
That's always for me I had areally good time going out as
well.
That was my best section of thewhole race, I would say.
Going out to the lighthousefrom the KOA I was able to run.
I ran five miles straight onthat section which I was
absolutely baffled by.
I couldn't figure out how orwhy I could run that morning,

(33:28):
but I did, and then it all felloff coming back.
So it was one of my slowestsections coming back from the
lighthouse.
So it sort of evened out overthe two legs.
But it does feel like such along leg that, especially from
Avon back to, for me anyway,from Avon back to where the KOA

(33:48):
is in I think it's Waves, mightbe the town, I don't know, just
up north of Salvo, rodanth, yeah, in that area.
So yeah, just a good day goingout, rubbish day coming back,
but I think it evened itself outover time.
Mike, how about you?
You've done this a couple oftimes, so like you always seem

(34:11):
kind of positive, lisa too.
I think I told you that, lisa,like, do you have bad days?

Speaker 3 (34:24):
Like you always seem so chipper rich on your way back
.
How long did you?

Speaker 1 (34:25):
spend at the lighthouse?
Oh, next to nothing.
Okay, it was cold.
I I didn't.
I I hit the, uh, warm restroomthere.
I might have had 10 or 15minutes in there just warming up
, because it was really cold.
I mean, I don't know whathappened that morning, but I
felt that was I had to put on mybig jacket and everything, but,
yeah, not too long.
I did, though, stop in avon foran hour at the food lion
because I hadn't eaten.

(34:45):
I left at 12 45 that morningand obviously nothing open at
all.
So I went all the way out, 22miles out, and then all the way
back to avon before I could findanything that was remotely open
for food.
So I had to stop there and uh,and and get some something to
eat, and I looked fairlydisheveled and cold and sort of

(35:05):
homeless when I walked in there.
Um, I had to explain myself tothe cashier, yeah, and, and she
helped me find some something,rather, but uh, how about.
So, mike what, what did you havebad days?

Speaker 3 (35:16):
mike what, what, uh, and were they the same as prior
years or no, I can't.
I've had some low moments,similar to you guys.
I had day three coming back, Ican't say the wheels fell off,
but they were wobbling.
I think the discussion I hadwith we were walking out of the
lighthouse and it took us six,six and a half hours to get to

(35:39):
the lighthouse and I toldElizabeth it's going to take us
about eight hours to get backand that that lit a fire in her
ass as she went off to the woodsbecause even walking out, Lisa
and I watching her walk past us,like walking out of the state
park or the federal, whateverthat park is and then she

(35:59):
started running.
It's like holy crap, she's gone.
So I hadn't even gotten out ofthe state park.
You know how that big left-handturn coming out, coming back
down towards Avon, she hadalready gone around the corner,
it's like because Lisa and Icouldn't find her.
It's like, did she stop intothe bathroom?
Did she stop at the drugstore?
It wasn't until we came around.

(36:20):
It's like, do I need to callher husband?
Because her husband wasn't evenaware what she had asked him
already.
So on a mission.

Speaker 1 (36:28):
Elizabeth, what was going on?

Speaker 3 (36:30):
She was on a mission to get back.

Speaker 5 (36:32):
I was on a mission to get back, I felt good.
It was a sunny day, I wasfeeling good and farther than
I'd ever gone, so I just thinkthat that just made my day, so I
had extra energy.
No-transcript.

Speaker 1 (37:04):
It is a strange optical illusion that, but it's
very true.

Speaker 3 (37:06):
It doesn't matter which way you go, and it does
look like you're going uphill,slightly uphill Journey runs
that I know Lisa has done morethan I have, but you tend to
stay more towards the nighttimejust to get out of the heat or
get out of the traffic.
But, as you alluded to, nothingis open.
So you really like Stephanie.

(37:26):
She's probably grateful thatshe had Drew, but that's a risky
thing.
I think there's 7-Eleven andKitty Hawk that's open 24 hours
a day, and then there's onemight be in Nags Head, but other
than that everything closeddown.
So if you're not crude, you'repretty well carrying everything
that you need until the worldstarts opening up in the morning

(37:49):
, and sometimes you expect themto be opening up regular
business hours and they areopening up hours later because
there's no traffic.
So last year we were trying toget to the Liberty Gas Station.
I knew from calling them theywere closing at 8, and then that
day they decided to close anhour early at 7 because there

(38:12):
wasn't enough foot traffic,because there wasn't enough foot
traffic, and so I did not havethe heart to tell Elizabeth, as
we're trying to make it to theKOA on day two, that our rest
stop at, and then we weresupposed to stop at the
restaurant, which was Goodwins,like a mile down the road.
Both were closed for the seasonalready.
One was closing early and theother one hadn't opened up for

(38:34):
the season yet.
So I think that took a mentaltoll.
And then I didn't have the heartto tell that.
We walked right past Kim Drakeand she had dropped out and I
didn't want to tell Elizabeththat hey, she's just taking a
little break.
You know she's going to getgoing any moment now and I had
chatted with her that apparentlyher knees were really bothering
me.
This was last year that shedidn't want to, uh, continue.

(38:57):
So yeah, I think, uh, I think,as long as you kind of stay
positive and keep positivepeople around you, you have a
better fighting chance.
They, I've always been told daythree and more people drop out
starting day three.

Speaker 1 (39:12):
So yeah, that's when it all kicks in, when you've
been going for so long and andyou realize in these kind of
races you've still got a way togo yet and it sort of gets a
little bit overwhelming andyou're already out of calories,
you're already hot and sore andstiff and lacking sleep.
So now I think the koa actuallyis a great segue into into the
next segment.

(39:32):
Like, when did we all startrunning together?
Because it sounds like you guyswere already kind of running
together on the way down.
But I know stephanie and I hadwe shared some miles on day two
over the over the p islandbridge and coming in.
When I left the koa on, I'm noteven sure what morning it was,
was it must have been wednesdaymorning.

(39:52):
I I think I left right behindMike, you and Elizabeth.
I had no idea.
Lisa must have gone earlier.

Speaker 2 (40:01):
About 15 minutes.

Speaker 1 (40:03):
Yeah, you guys were like, hey, there's a green dot
up there and we're trying tochase and get to Lisa.
But I have no idea, Stephanie,where were you on the Wednesday
morning?
Were you involved in that?

Speaker 4 (40:16):
I left after you guys , I was fixing Bert the blister.

Speaker 1 (40:22):
Ah, bert, the blister and.

Speaker 4 (40:25):
Mike and Elizabeth had left the KOA and then Mike
knew that I was going to hitthose bridges and have anxiety,
because I definitely did.
I'm not afraid of heights, Iwas afraid of just having no
egress with those cars whizzingby.
And so that's when Mike saidwell, we'll wait for you at the
P Island visitor center.

(40:47):
And that that's when wecoalesced as a group, and for me
that was actually the best partof the run.
It wasn't day three, it waswhen we it was starting at that
meeting point at P Island andthen all the way to the end Just
as a side note, by the way Idid.
I thought I found $700 lying onthe side of the road on the way

(41:08):
to that visitor center and Ipicked up all these hundred
dollar bills.
But when I scrutinized themlater they said something like
for motion picture use only.
But I had a real rush ofexcitement in that moment.
Right after that first bridge,I came off that first bridge,
saw this, what appeared to bemoney on the side of the road,

(41:30):
picked it up, which delayed me afew minutes because I was
walking through the grasspicking up these fake hundred
dollar bills and yeah and then Itried it to you guys, and so I
think what's?

Speaker 1 (41:42):
what's interesting about that, stephanie, is I
don't remember you saying hey, Ijust found 700 bucks, uh, lying
in the road so were you likejust sort of keeping it, keeping
it dumb at that point you werelike.

Speaker 4 (41:53):
I collected my race with this.
I was.
I was envisioning a party atthat hotel in Corolla.
You were like I collected myrace with this I I was.
I was envisioning a party atthat hotel in corolla, you know,
like let's do dinner, I don'tknow but we don't yeah but when
I looked at them closely, that'swhen I saw the, the writing
that said for motion picture useonly.
So I'd had the elation and thenthe deflation before I saw, you

(42:15):
guys.

Speaker 1 (42:16):
So did you like put them back where you found them,
or did you put?
What did you do with the notes?

Speaker 3 (42:20):
I threw them out.

Speaker 1 (42:21):
Yeah, you just chucked them off for the next
person to find and have somelike have a nice moment there
before they also realized thatit was fake money, monopoly
money yeah, very coolno-transcript.

Speaker 3 (43:03):
Right right at the liberty gas stations where you
start talking about, got upbehind us.
I know elizabeth uh and I were.
We left together.
I know lisa said that the planwas to leave at five and at 4 45
lisa said that she was headingout to catch up with her.
But I know Lisa, I'm going towalk and then her walking is
running down the street so Iknew we couldn't spend too much

(43:26):
time dilly-dallying.
We would never be able to catchup with Lisa.
And then when doing laundry thenight before in the laundry
room I met Stephanie's boyfriend, drew, and he said that told me
again Stephanie was going tohave challenges going over the
bridge.
So that was in the back of myhead, saying hey, if she goes

(43:47):
out with us, we have to makesure that she stays with us over
the bridges.
So the first bridge is finebecause it's dark hours and very
few traffic I was moreconcerned about.
The second bridge is where shecaught up with us.

Speaker 1 (43:58):
The big bridge yeah, the big bridge.
Mike, do you want to paint us apicture of you doing laundry
for a minute, because I think aspart of our run, you were
definitely quite vivid in yourdescription of yourself doing
laundry at the KOA.

Speaker 3 (44:17):
Coming back in from the lighthouse, lisa and I
stopped at the Dollar Generaland I wanted to.
You know, I run very minimal,so if I have a chance to do
laundry, I will do laundry.
So I bought detergent from theDollar General, I will do
laundry.
So I bought detergent from theDollar General and I bought a

(44:41):
three-pack of Hanes T-shirts andI took all my clothes off, put
my Hanes T-shirt on andproceeded to go down to the
laundry room, and that's where Ifigured at what dark hours no
one's going to see me.
So of course Drew's doing hislaundry there too.
So we did chat about it.
It wasn't until the nextmorning, when Stephanie spilt

(45:01):
the beans, that he he told herhey, I saw your friend Mike down
there.

Speaker 1 (45:05):
He wasn't wearing nothing, so Well, we won't quite
go into what.

Speaker 3 (45:10):
Drew was doing down there or what he was wearing.
He was doing laundry too.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
What a good boyfriend he was so that's how I picture
it just somebody doing theirlaundry.
But mike you, you did, and Ithink you know you talked about
running, running minimally, Imight even have said this to you
at some point during the race,but like it seemed like your
pack is magic because it neverseemed to get any bigger or
smaller and you were just likepulling out different outfits
from that pack and then suddenlyyou would appear in a whole

(45:36):
different shirt and pants kindof combo and I'm like where the
hell is this thing?
Where, like how do you fit thatin your back, in your pack?
It never seems to get anybigger or smaller.
Where was all this stuff?

Speaker 3 (45:46):
we kind of alluded in our conversation.
I I'm very concerned about, uh,sun protection so I always wear
like a fishing shirt.
It's a long sleeve.
If I get warm I can roll up thesleeves.
You'll find me.
I have a convertible pants.
For the most part I try to keepthem on.
They're super lightweight.
They're 1980s, they're likebell-bottom but they're super

(46:11):
light.
If they get wet, they dryimmediately for the most part.
If they get wet, they dryimmediately for the most part.
I can probably go 35 degreesbefore I have to put more
insulation on there.
And then in my pack is really apuffy jacket and a rain suit and

(46:32):
then, other than theelectronics and the toiletries
and the first couple of times,the electronics, each, each,
each Kwame shuffle.
I can't see journey one.
I get.
I bring less and less becauseit's like I carry this brick and
I never even used it.
So next year I'm not going tocarry the brick electric brick
and it's like there's enoughplaces that we stop along the
way that we could.
I could plug in even if Ididn't need to, just to pop off

(46:55):
my phone.
For the most part, as most ofthem know, I intentionally left
my watch at home because Ididn't want to be bothered by
like, oh, this is going slowerthan I want it to, or you know,
this section is too long.
It's just okay, we know we needto get to this place in the
morning.
Or, you know, coming off thebeach, it's Uncle Ike's Bar and

(47:17):
Grill.
I'm going to have a, you know,crab cake sandwich and a pint of
beer, and okay, how long isthat going to get us there?
And then the year before,elizabeth and I and her husband
found bonefish which had greatchowder.
So that was in South, south,south Southern Shores.
So that was in South, South,south Southern Shores.
I made a point to say, ok, Iwant to stop and have that, even

(47:40):
though on the way back we weresurprised with Drew and the Duck
Donuts.

Speaker 1 (47:45):
So that was delightful Shout out to Duck
Donuts, by the way.
Well, drew, first for going toDuck Donuts and finding when
they were open, because thosefolks are, it's like a mystery
van when Duck donuts is is openthey're not open very much,
folks, you have to really be ontop of that.
And they make them fresh thereand then, which, which I guess
is the the thing about duckdonuts.

Speaker 3 (48:07):
But I tell you what they were amazing.

Speaker 1 (48:09):
they were even good the second day when we when we
were I think it was you and Igot to eat those, uh, before got
on the beach.
But duck donuts shout out,great, great donuts.

Speaker 5 (48:19):
I was so disappointed last year.
That's all I wanted.
I kept talking about it.
Poor Mike had to listen to mego on and on about it.
And so this year, Drew was likemy hero, coming in with a duck
donut on the second to last day.
You're right, we would go by somany of them and they were
either closed for the seasonstill or we missed the timing.
And yeah, so that was a hugetopic of conversation.

(48:43):
We're in Duck.
Where are the donuts?

Speaker 1 (48:45):
It was, and so Duck Donuts, if you're listening out
there, duck Donuts, for goodnesssake, have some longer opening
hours, because we'd really liketo eat more donuts, especially
while we're doing these races.
But we struggled mightily,although we did find I'm going
to butcher the name.
Was it Wee Winks?
Was that the name of thegrocery store?

Speaker 2 (49:04):
It was.

Speaker 1 (49:04):
That was a brilliant grocery store.
Last year when I ran this itwas shut every time I went by.
But that was a fantastic placeand I'm sorry to Wee Winks,
because I think at least lisaand I went and got refills of
soda in that place and I don'tthink they actually do refills,
free refills oh, did you pay?
oh, then now I feel, terriblebecause I did not pay.

(49:25):
I just went and grabbed arefill, so I feel terrible.
Sorry, we wings, if you'relistening, yes, we, we just uh,
we abused that that.
Uh, I think when we rolled inthere, it's in Duck, is it not?
Yes, I think it's in.
Duck.
Yes, Wee Wings.
But, fantastic place to govisit.

Speaker 4 (49:44):
One of the things I learned from Lisa was to call
ahead and place your order at arestaurant close to your hotel.
That was brilliant, becausewhat was that place?
Called Pelican or something?
Black Pelican?

Speaker 3 (49:55):
Black.
Pelican Black.

Speaker 2 (49:57):
Pelican.

Speaker 4 (49:58):
That was the best meal that I ate.
I think I licked the container.
I did not call ahead like youdid, but I ordered and and then
got it after and it was.
That's just such a great.
It's just a great strategy.
You know, pick up your dinnerright before you hit the hotel,
and that's one of the greatthings about Suami is that you
can do that.

Speaker 1 (50:20):
Yeah, stephanie, you went to Black Pelican as well.
Lisa has a great story ofspilling Black Pelican shrimp
and grits all over the floor ofthe Holiday Inn whilst trying to
check in.
So I'm positive unless they'vegot some really good rug doctor
out there that their check-inarea, if you go next year, is
probably going to smell ofshrimp and grits.

Speaker 2 (50:39):
It was terrible.
It was all over my shoe and mygaiter and I didn't realize, or
I would have washed it out thatnight before.
But when I was getting dressedthe next morning it stunk so bad
but it tasted so good.
Lovely shrimp and grits comingback.

Speaker 1 (50:55):
I'm sure it tasted great, but the smell of it in
the morning might be somethingmore than I really want.

Speaker 3 (51:00):
It was not good.

Speaker 1 (51:01):
Indeed, indeed.
So we had some fun conversationalong the way.
Were there any other cool orinteresting or notable
conversation topics that we canshare with folks out there that
you remember from the journey?

Speaker 3 (51:14):
that we were on.
I think we all took a timecoming back on the beach.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
For me, there's I don't think anything really just
jumped out, but I just enjoygetting to know the people
everybody in our group.
Everybody's just so differentand so much fun.
Well, we have differentbackgrounds, but we're all doing
the same crazy stuff, so thatthat what brings us together
well, it was interesting.

Speaker 1 (51:37):
I didn't realize that Mike, elizabeth and Stephanie
were all kind of I'm not goingto say together, but all knew
each other.
Let's say, shall we?
And then Lisa, you and Mikeknew each other.
So I'm like, okay, I'm the oddone out here, I got to get to
know someone Well you knew Mikefrom last year though, didn't
you?

(51:57):
I did last year though, didn'tyou?
I did mike and elizabeth I Ihad met last year, uh, along the
way.
So so I did at least know, knowthose folks.
But yeah, I would agree it was.
It was a lot of fun and I thinkwhat was really cool was that
you know we spend time with witha person and you talk to them
for a while and then you knowpeople kind of come back and
forth and you'd end up kind ofon your own, maybe for a little
bit, or you'd switch outnaturally, and you'd end up next
to somebody else and so thenyou'd talk to somebody else for

(52:19):
a while.
So I think just the groupdynamic like that was great.
We were all always within youknow, a short distance of each
other, but there was a lot ofsort of in my opinion anyway,
there was a lot of sort of backand forth and the opportunity to
chat with a whole bunch ofdifferent people along the way
and and just kind of get to knowfolks, which for me and others
at the back of the pack, I thinkthat's part of the journey,

(52:40):
right, it's part of the appealis just getting to know people
and listening to other storiesout there.
True.

Speaker 2 (52:48):
But the one thing that I do want to work on.
It's what I learned fromElizabeth.
I really want to learn how towalk as fast as she can.
It's just amazing.
I was just I would have to run50 steps and then walk just to
barely keep up with her and Iwas like I got to keep running.
I cannot keep up with herwalking pace.
So I have been so impressedwith that, With her walking pace

(53:09):
, so I have been so impressedwith that.

Speaker 1 (53:11):
Yes, there was a day, was it the?
It was the P Island section,elizabeth when you were like on
a tear.
Yeah, she was, you were goneand I think Did you say at some
point Like I was just I neededchicken or something.
I was like I just want to getto the KFC and get some.
But you were on a proper tearthat day.
What's behind that?

Speaker 5 (53:32):
Yeah.
So some of the time, well, Iwas really cognizant of not
holding up the group.
I know, from the beginning Iwas with Mike and Lisa and I
learned from last year that Ineeded to take care of my feet a
little better and I needed tofuel a little better than I did
last year, little better than Idid last year.

(53:53):
And so when I knew that Wamsi,my husband, was going to be up
ahead at a certain point,sometimes I would run ahead or I
would walk ahead so that Icould do what I needed to do,
but not hold up the group whenthey caught up with me.
So sometimes I was doing thatand other times I was just
hungry.
So I was food oriented.
Like when we were coming into Idon't know where we were Nags
Head, kitty Hawk, somewhere withthe KFC.

Speaker 1 (54:13):
I just had chicken and rice.

Speaker 5 (54:14):
I was just like I'm hungry.
It's time for lunch.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
It's time to go eat.
So I think you know, elizabeth.
You mentioned your husbandthere, wamsi.
Fantastic Shout out to Wamsiand to Drew Stephanie's husband,
stephanie.

Speaker 4 (54:29):
Boyfriend Significant other.

Speaker 1 (54:32):
Significant other.
Okay, we'll go with significantother.
Those guys really helped us outas a group, although I don't
think that was initially theplan necessarily, but it ended
up being that we'd all becausewe were all together.
We all sort of ran into Drewand Wamsley at regular intervals
anyway.
But do you think like thiswould be a very different race

(54:52):
if you were running this purelysolo and I think we talked about
mike.
Mike talked about this earlier.
Like you, you really got tosort of understand where you are
and where you're going andwhat's open along the way.
I think this would be amassively different race if you
were pure solo.
It would be a completelydifferent experience, I think so

(55:12):
.

Speaker 5 (55:12):
So for me last year I mean, wamsi was with us just
really the first day coming offthe beach, getting into the
hotel, and then Mike and I wereon our own.
And again, I'm probably theleast experienced here I am the
least experienced here, so themiles were enough of a challenge
for me.
All those additional obstacleswere really weighing heavy on me

(55:37):
.
We expected places to be openthat weren't open, or they
weren't open for the season yet,or they closed early, and so I
just was unprepared, mentally aswell as just with what I was
carrying and what I had accessto, and I don't feel like I'm at
the place in my journey to dothis solo.

(55:59):
And so I told Mike from thebeginning he's like we got to do
it again, and I said yeah,absolutely, but I'm going to do
it.
I'm going to be spoiled.
I kept saying that I'm spoiled.
You know, I want, I want toknow that I'm going to have
proper food, I want to be ableto change out my clothing if I
need to.
I just didn't have theconfidence that I could do it

(56:20):
unsupported, because I didn'thave a great experience last
year trying to do it unsupported.
I felt like getting the propertraining and putting in the
miles for me at this stage ofthe game was enough of an
accomplishment.
Maybe down the road I could dosomething like what Mike does or
Lisa does, but for thisgo-around I really felt like I
needed the additional support.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
Yeah, lisa, how about you?
Because you're kind of a vet ofthese sorts of races.

Speaker 2 (56:51):
Well, I want to say that I really appreciated Wamsi
and Christina, because once Iknew we were kind of all staying
together and after I had takenout half the crap that I had
packed between the KLA and thelighthouse and coming back it
was so much nicer and so theyallowed me to put my stuff in
their car and I never touchedthat stuff again.
so that was a lesson I didn'tneed half the crap that I

(57:13):
brought, but I packed my fearsbecause you never know what
you're going to need.
So I packed too many warmclothes and I needed well, I
packed too many like pants andshirts and jackets and I really
needed some more shorts becauseit was a lot warmer than I was
expecting it to be on certaindays.

Speaker 1 (57:34):
Yeah, I just and I think I saw somewhere along the
line on my internetting that isit Vol State this year has sort
of banned crews for their race.
So no longer are you ableyou're not even able to have a
crew on on Vol vol state, whichis another big journey run that
folks out there might have,might have heard of.

(57:54):
So that in itself I think isreally interesting to see how
people handle that.
But yeah, I just think this,this race to me has always stood
out because of those issues wetalked about earlier, like
there's not a lot of stuff openand there's a few sections that
are really long for you not tohave food and water, or at least
the ability to get it if yourtiming is slightly off, I think

(58:17):
this would be a reallychallenging race to try to do
completely solo, under your ownsteam, so to speak.
Stephanie, what was yourexperience?
You had Drew and God bless Drew, he was trying to sell us hard.
He went burger crazy on.
Uh, was it the tuesday?
yeah coming off the big bridgeyeah, monday there you go.

(58:39):
He was selling those burgershard and they were some good
burgers, I have to say, althoughI only had the fries, and I
think I found out later lisa andI might have been eaten from
the same fries, but but yeahlike what was it so for?
For you um is this somethingyou feel like you could have
done without drew?

Speaker 4 (58:58):
no, first of all, I probably couldn't have gotten
there without drew, because I,you know, I I'm kind of famous
for making stupid decisions.
The week of a race and theMonday before the event, I was
dragging my indoor trees aroundto spray them with neem oil and
I dragged him outside and I hurtmy back.

(59:19):
So I was, you know, sitting wasextremely painful.
So I had this kind of strangeride down there, lying down in
the back of the car.
So I probably couldn't havegotten there if he hadn't, if he
hadn't chauffeured me downthere with me lying in the back
of the car.
Interestingly, I had no problemswith my back at all during

(59:40):
Swami.
So I think sitting is theculprit.
That and dragging trees around,I think for the first time no,
I don't know.
On the one hand, having someonethere for you means that you
can leave, you know, like youdon't have to wait for the, the

(01:00:01):
wagon to come pick you up whenyou decide that you've had
enough, and so that that waskind of in the back of my mind.
But well, I didn't take thatroute, obviously.

Speaker 1 (01:00:12):
um, so it is, it is.
It is there for you, though,right?
So?
It's in your back in the backof your mind.
I could tap out it's.
It would be okay, I have drewright here, I could just get in
the car and and we could call itquits and we would drive back
to wherever right, yeah, I couldget to the lighthouse and, in
some respects, that's probablymore difficult because it
because it would be very easyfor you to tap out at that point

(01:00:35):
where, if you're a solo andyou're halfway to avon, uh, you
know, 90 miles into the race,like what am I going to do here?
Like there's no way for me togo anywhere from from where I'm
at.
So I mean I do think there's a.
It does seem like a benefit tohave somebody following you
along, and I think you can setyour own timeline with that,
like you could say.
Right, I'm going to wake up at1 am and I'm going to start even

(01:00:56):
though there's nothing at allopen.
I know that my person is goingto be there, shall we say, uh,
five miles down the road, so Iknow I can get food and water,
whereas until I sort of morphedinto the group, my 1245 set off
from the KOA, I knew 100% therewas nothing, there was no option

(01:01:18):
to get over.
If I'm honest, lisa was talkingabout you bring what you fear,
right?
So you end up packing all thisstuff on you because you're not

(01:01:40):
sure when you might be able tonext get at some water or food,
whatever.
It is so kind of interesting torun this as a solo.
Kind of interesting to run thisas a solo.
Eventually, though, we all kindof made our way up back through
Nag's Head, having demolishedKFC.
Shout out to KFC and Nag's Head.

(01:02:01):
I don't think they've ever hadas many people order as much in
one shot as we did when werolled in.
Did anybody have the Taco Bell?
Because it's a dual KFC TacoBell.
I did, lisa you had.
How were the tacos?
They were great.
Did you take them to go?

Speaker 2 (01:02:18):
No, I ate a mashed potato bowl and one taco.
And then I went back and I gottwo more tacos and a spicy
chicken sandwich.
So I ate all the food exceptspicy chicken sandwich and I
took that with me.
I was so hungry by the time wegot there and that spicy chicken
sandwich was probably the bestchicken sandwich I've ever eaten

(01:02:38):
in my life.
But it really hurts when you'vegot spicy sauce and sunburnt
lips, but it was worth it.

Speaker 1 (01:02:47):
That, I think, is definitely a talking point for
anybody considering this race.
Do not sleep on the lip balm,because my lips, the wind out
there is constant and the sunthat you're going to get, just
my lips were all kinds ofchapped and I think I don't
think I was the only one outthere.
But, yeah, if you're going todo this race, make sure you take

(01:03:07):
a sunscreen and be lip balm.
Those two things we're going toare going to see.
See you, right, and I don'tknow that I packed enough of
that.
I had to stop at the 7-elevenfor some sunscreen, uh, but I
even I had lip balm and it, likeyou, got to have the what do
you call it?
The sun protection spf.
Yeah, exactly, you got to havethat in your uh, in your lip

(01:03:28):
balm as well.
But, yeah, so you, you prettymuch demolished that, lisa,
because just up the road thenthat was your Black Pelican
stuff.
So that wasn't too much.
After the KFC feast, shall wesay that we all had.
So, yeah, it was a prettyhungry day.
It was For sure, for sure.
So we made our way back up.
We went back through Duck,southern Shores, up through Duck

(01:03:52):
into the Hampton Inn.
I thought this was a reallyinteresting quirk of this race
versus previous races and, mike,you might be able to comment
more on this, having done a fewof these in the past but this
year we were absolutely notallowed to go back through the
last six miles of the course onthe beach and then off the beach

(01:04:14):
to the finish through thewildlife preserve, the Back Bay
Wildlife Preserve, because ofpermits, and in previous years I
don't know if I'm probablydoing the race wrong, but we'd
sort of skirted around that alittle bit.

Speaker 3 (01:04:28):
They didn't know that we were what it is.

Speaker 1 (01:04:54):
Correct.
They didn't know that we wererunning going to do where how
close can we get?
And the timing challenge ofhitting that 6 am or to start
the last six miles, or being outof the wildlife preserve and
and to the finish before 6 pmona day.
I thought that was a reallyinteresting and different mental
challenge and I feel like wehad a lot of group discussion
about this going towards thatspot and I wondered how other

(01:05:14):
people approach this.
But yeah, I, just how did youguys feel about that?

Speaker 2 (01:05:20):
I was fine as long as we were just going to wait
until after it stopped raining.
I really didn't want to go outthere and get all wet and then
be in the cold wind at the beachbeing the cold wind at the
beach.
So once we figured out whattime we needed to leave the
hotel, and then we just adjustedit based on the weather
forecast, so we knew between 12and 12.30 am we could leave and

(01:05:44):
not get wet.

Speaker 1 (01:05:45):
And I will tell you my corner, if you're listening.
We didn't do it this year.
Thank you very much for lastyear when you dragged me across
the beach in a raging storm andwe got soaking wet and freezing
cold.
We made the decision to avoidthat this year and I'm very
thankful we did.
That was a much betterexperience, but I do think it
was.
I think Elizabeth was.

(01:06:07):
I sat with yourself andChristina.
We were just chatting and I waslike this is really weird.
We're just sort of sitting satwith yourself and christina, we
were just chatting, and I waslike this is really weird.
We're just sort of sittingwaiting for I don't know how
long we sat in in the hotel.
So the hampton inn is aboutit's kind of the last realistic
hotel.
You've got before the finishline and, for folks listening,
it's about 32 miles from thereto the finish and the last six
of those is through this reserve.

(01:06:28):
So you've a bit of mileage togo to get to the wildlife
reserve first and then the lastsix miles to to the finish
through it and out the otherside.
So so, yeah, it's just.
I think I was.
I think I was with yourself andchristina at the time who took
over from wamsi as your crew,and we were just saying this is
really weird.
We're just sort of sitting here, I think, because we arrived at

(01:06:48):
the hampton inn uh, miles fromthe finish, I don't know.
Two, three, three o'clock, twoo'clock in the afternoon.

Speaker 5 (01:06:55):
Was it earlier than that?
It was 1.30.

Speaker 1 (01:06:58):
Yeah.
And so we were like well, wecan't make it, we can't make it
by six, we can't make it throughthe reserve by 6 pm.
That's not on, so we have towait now at the hotel in order
to be there by 6 am at theearliest right.
I just thought that was weird.
We ended up just sitting around.

Speaker 5 (01:07:17):
So we had two challenges.
We had the challenge of thereserve being off limits past
sunset.
So had we continued on, wewould have A got caught in the
rain and B had arrived six hoursearly and just had to wait on
the beach for for the sunrise ormore and um.

(01:07:37):
So yeah, it was just this weirdblock of time where we didn't
know what to do with ourselves,because had it not been raining,
we could have left at nineo'clock and we could have timed
it so that we would have arrivedat the reserve at sunrise and
continued on, but we had therain to deal with, so it was an
unusually long period of time.

(01:07:57):
I mean, mike and I went and werealternating between the hot tub
and the pool, you know, justtrying to kill time, took a rest
, tried to take a nap, but itfelt weird, it felt like
cheating in a way.
It's like, you know, we're inthis, this multi-day race and
we're like hanging out at ahotel in the swimming pool and

(01:08:17):
it's like what are we doing?

Speaker 3 (01:08:19):
I think that's going to be a play for all future
races because, uh and I kind oflike the element of the previous
race I mentioned uh, tar Heel,altar, you had the time that
fairies, and if you screwed upon the fairies then you were
sitting outside with nowhere togo.
So I kind of liked this thatyou have to kind of in the back

(01:08:40):
of your head.
You got a time.
You can't just keep going, keepgoing, keep going.
You got to stop and say okay,what Nick did?
Nick Yates did?
He went to the beach towns upbefore the state line.
He was up in that area.

Speaker 1 (01:08:58):
I can't remember the name of the town, carova Carova.

Speaker 3 (01:09:02):
But he was saying that he was sleeping on
someone's porch, so waiting for6 am to kick in.
So just to kill time there.
I mean, I know it was weird,but I'd rather be in a hotel, in
a pool and jacuzzi, thansleeping on someone's porch in
the freezing cold waiting forthe six o'clock time.

Speaker 1 (01:09:18):
Yeah, so um for sure.
That was interesting, though,because I think it clumped a
bunch of people together,correct, who were of a similar
pace, which didn't happen lastyear and presumably years before
.
Everybody, everybody just wentthrough.
As you approached that, youjust carried on and you went
through.
But even the faster folks youknow, I think Michelle, lisa,

(01:09:39):
katie and others who were upfront, they all bunched together
at the hotel too and waited.
So you ended up with these bigclumps of people sort of
finishing together, where,certainly last year when I ran
it, and probably years before,people were just coming in as as
and when they as and when theyfinished it.

Speaker 5 (01:09:57):
You know a bit more spread out maybe it was unique
because you had the beach priorto the reserve.
So you know, once you enteredthe beach, there was no place to
stop, and that's you know.
You're 22 miles from when youenter the beach to the finish
line.
So you really have to plan itso that you're not waiting on
the beach for hours and hours.

(01:10:17):
It's a very unique situation.

Speaker 1 (01:10:20):
Absolutely so.
Talking of the finish line,four of us not quite sure what
happened to Stephanie, but alongthe way she was there shortly
after us, but four of us crossedthe line literally together in
our tombstone scenario that wewere doing who knows.
We crossed the line together,which was awesome.

(01:10:42):
And then Stephanie I don'tthink you were that.
You were only half an hourbehind, maybe that?

Speaker 4 (01:10:47):
if so, I was calling Lisa, asking her where the trail
is.

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
That's right.
Where's the blue trail you?

Speaker 4 (01:10:53):
guys were sitting there at the finish and I was
saying I can't find it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:57):
Oh no, we weren't at the finish yet when you called,
we were getting close.

Speaker 1 (01:11:02):
We were close, but not quite.

Speaker 4 (01:11:04):
I had tried to plan that, you know, finding that
trail.
I had taken a photo the day weleft, but there was snow on the
ground that day, so it lookedtotally different on the way
back and I was disoriented and Ihad a splitting headache at
that point, so I just couldn'tfigure it out.
So thank you, lisa, for keepingme from going all the way to

(01:11:25):
who knows where on that beach.

Speaker 1 (01:11:28):
You're welcome, I mean I and so I mentioned and I
had mentioned that to josh andjames too because I think it
seems really easy to pick thattrail when you're coming back
and I think if you're fullycompos mentis it probably is.
But at that point when you're218 miles into a 220 mile race,
especially if it's, if ithappens to be dark which maybe

(01:11:49):
that won't happen again, becauseit seems like it'll always be
light now, given the parametersaround the finish but in the
dark that trail is really hardto pick out, even though you
kind of know where you're goingwith those posts at the end.
So yeah, I just wanted so weeach finished.
Are there any big lessons orthings you feel like you've
learned from finishing that race?

(01:12:10):
Now that we're what?
A week after, and everybody'suh sort of had a little time,
lisa's gonna run 18 miles againtoday, which put us all to shame
.
What is?
What is a lesson that you'vetaken away from this race, if
any?

Speaker 2 (01:12:25):
I think I would redo my packing strategy packing yes,
my packing strategy.
I packed a lot of things Inever even used, and I would
just pack a little differentlybecause I that's interesting
lisa because I'll do it um solo,screwed.
However you want to do it.
No crew, except for in casepeople adopt me, like drew and

(01:12:49):
womzy and christina did.

Speaker 1 (01:12:52):
Yes, other than that, thanks to them if all the stuff
that I've got to pack, I wouldjust pack a little differently I
just I feel like that's that'spretty interesting, because
you're probably, of all of ushere, you've done the most of
these sort of journey runs andstill that overpacking or not
overpacking but just packingthings you didn't end up using,

(01:13:14):
which is what I did last year,and, like Mike, I packed stuff
this year again that I didn'tend up using.
So every year it sort of getsless and less, but I guess it's.
I guess maybe that's racespecific.

Speaker 2 (01:13:25):
To me it is because where you're going, the
temperature, time of year kindof stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:13:32):
Yeah, yeah, and the temperature changes every time.
I mean last year, as I wasalluding to Mike Horner, and I
got absolutely soaking, wet andfreezing.
So I packed, of course, awaterproof jacket this year and
carried that for 220 mileswithout getting it out the
backpack once.
But I was okay with thatbecause I did not want to get
wet and soaking and cold againas last go around.

(01:13:54):
And then Mike and his magic bag, which stuff disappears in it
and it's forever light.
So I need one of those bags,mike.
Anyone else got a big lesson orsomething they've taken away
from this that they feelcompelled to share?

Speaker 3 (01:14:09):
One of the nice things the last two years of
this race they've been able toget a house that they feel
compelled to share.
One of the nice things the lasttwo years of this race they've
been able to get a house walkingdistance to the start-finish
line and that allows the runnersto get together before the race
.
And you know, everyone takes aweek off because we don't know
when we're going to finish, andit allows.
I know there's some people who,as soon as they finish, they

(01:14:30):
get in their car, they race backhome again, but there's a
handful of us who, regardless ofwhen we're going to finish, we
know we're going to head outSaturday because we've taken the
entire week off and it's justnice to be able to talk with
other runners and shareexperiences with it.
So I'm hoping they can continuegetting different houses every

(01:14:53):
year that they put this event on.

Speaker 1 (01:14:56):
Yeah, that for me is one of the real differences of
this race to other races outthere.
I don't know that.
I've done another race that hassort of a runner house for the
week, so that you can arrive inadvance, talk to people before
you go, get out, do your run,come back and there's still
people hanging around at thehouse.
Afterwards you can kind ofcommiserate or celebrate or

(01:15:18):
whatever you need to do.

Speaker 4 (01:15:20):
It's fantastic.

Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
It's so, it's so communal, and I and I love the
interaction and and justrelationship development.
You get to meet so manyinteresting people and I love
that too, that it's not just us,towards the back of the pack
that hang around, that you knowthere's the michelles and others
michelle gray and rick um whoare, you know, really good
runners, very good runners, butthey hang around and they and

(01:15:44):
that house is so close to thefinish line that people can come
back to the finish line andcheer everybody in.
I think that that's just from acommunity standpoint, that can
only help that race.
It's just tremendous.

Speaker 3 (01:15:58):
I'm hoping they can open up a little bit more.
I understand the concept ofkeeping everything 22, and I
know they opened it up a littlebit more this year, so we'll
have to figure out what they'regoing to do next year.

Speaker 1 (01:16:11):
Indeed?
Let's hope so, because I reallywish, and part of me was guilty
this year of signing up again,because I was like I really want
other people to experience thisrace because it's really cool.
But then I thought, no, Ididn't sign up originally.
I got FOMO when everybody elsewas signing up and then I was
like, oh shoot, I'm going gonnahave to put my name on uh, just
to have it on there, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:16:32):
But uh, yeah, I really would like more people to
experience this race because Ithink it's for a terrific cause,
as we know, but also it's aterrific race to do and there's
a lot of that community feel toit, which I, which I think is
terrific as well I think it'sbetter than uh the communities
that uh the other journey walksor journey runs do and I can't

(01:16:55):
place my hand on it, but I thinkeveryone tends because maybe
it's the colder months or maybeit's more isolated you tend to
be more aware of people aroundyou and make sure that everyone
is around you, that everyone'sdoing okay.

Speaker 1 (01:17:09):
Absolutely, yeah, yeah, everyone's doing okay.
So, absolutely so, yeah, yeah,okay.
So one of the things we like todo here on the show, we do like
to encourage any guest thatcomes on to choose a song to add
to the free spotify.
Choose to enjoy playlist, therunning playlist that's out
there.
Typically it's something familyfriendly to lift you up or

(01:17:30):
motivate or just sort of keepyou moving while you're out on
the trail.
Now I did throw that out to youguys.
Um, maybe we'll go around thetable real quick and so what
song did each of you pick andmaybe why did that song resonate
particularly with you?
Mike, I'm gonna start with you,because I think you sent in

(01:17:52):
about 15 songs, so pick one Ifyou really think?

Speaker 3 (01:17:57):
about this specific race.
Every single song applies tothis race.
But the sun rises.
The last day we all stopped,got our phones out.
We watched the sun come up, sohere comes the sun by the
Beatles, brilliant song.
Phones out, we watched the suncome up, so here comes the sun
by the beatles, brilliant song.

(01:18:17):
So I obviously that a beautifulday, other than the snow in the
beginning.
Every day, weather-wise, was abeautiful day.
Yes, we had our highs and lows,but weather-wise we were not in
the rain.
Yeah, it was a little windyhere and there, but uh, every
day for runners it was perfect.

Speaker 1 (01:18:34):
It was, and I don't know if you guys saw, but I
think, running along the beachboth ways I saw dolphins only
feet off the shore, which wasincredibly cool to watch the
dolphins a pod of dolphins kindof go along with us, really cool
.
We saw horses coming and goingand the horses, yeah, I didn't
see them last year, so very,very nice.

(01:18:55):
So here comes the sun, thebeatles we'll get that one on
there.
Yeah, elizabeth, how about you?
Did you pick a song?

Speaker 5 (01:19:03):
I'm a huge indigo girls fan and mike knows this,
so I just I played a lot ofindigo girls and and whenever
Mike would ask me, he's like, isit closer to fine yet?
Is it closer to fine yet, whichis one of their major songs
that most people know?
So one time he asked me and itactually was that song was
playing, so I would say that'smy song.

Speaker 1 (01:19:24):
Closer to Fine Indigo Girls.
Yeah, I don't know that.
I'm familiar with it.
I'm very lame.
You're going to have to checkit out, so for me music stopped
in about 1992.

Speaker 3 (01:19:36):
This is before that.

Speaker 1 (01:19:37):
Yeah, I know, oh, is it?
Oh well, I'm definitely goingto have to go find that song and
listen to it and see what wecan do, but in the meantime, I'm
going to add it to the Spotifyplaylist so that others can
enjoy it.

Speaker 4 (01:19:54):
Stephanie, what was your song that you picked?
Well, I had, uh, I didn't.
I didn't actually listen tomusic at all on this journey, um
by choice, or just that's howit played out by choice, you
normally listen to music.
I I will listen to music ifit's like at night and 100, and
I need a little boost or I'm atthe end or something, but I was
just really engrossed in Dodgingcars.

(01:20:14):
Yeah, dodging cars?
Yeah, definitely that, but justthe experience, you know,
looking at the scenery and Idon't know, but I did listen to
Imagine Dragons Take Me to theBeach leading up to the event.
I think that's who does thesongs and I love, I really love
a song from the early 80s.
I think it's who does the songsand I love, I really love song
from the early eighties.

(01:20:34):
I think it's Frankie Smith.
It's double Dutch bus, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:20:39):
So you send me that, you send me the YouTube link for
that.

Speaker 3 (01:20:43):
And I was like what is this?

Speaker 1 (01:20:45):
I've never heard this before, but it was a very fun
video.

Speaker 4 (01:20:48):
Yeah, I love that.
And then somebody sent me avideo during the event when I
shared it with some people.
Lisa, I think you saw it.
I think you saw it.
It's this guy dancing shirtless, with a helmet on and glasses
and he's feeding his pig andit's what was the song Born to
be Alive.
That was in my brain.

Speaker 1 (01:21:10):
It's like a brain worm through a lot of the the
latter part of the event born tobe alive folks, when you do a
200 mile and it's a journey runat some point you too will look
at your phone and see a guy witha helmet on no shirt dancing
with a pig and go.
You know what that's it.

Speaker 4 (01:21:29):
That's the song he's doing it for me, parent in the
background in this video,sitting on his chicken.

Speaker 1 (01:21:36):
It's a great if you if you don't get to that point,
you haven't run hard enough.
I think in a in a 200.
So what are we going with withstephanie?
Are we going with?
Um, what's your choice?
What's your choice?
To add to the to the list?

Speaker 4 (01:21:49):
oh gosh, um, I've got my fingers crossed that it's
not the pig shirtless guy okay,we'll go with uh, we'll go with
um double dutch bus, that's, yousaid, family friendly and that,
yes, absolutely yeah, well, ifthey have it on spotify, I will
happily put that on there, andlisa looks like she knows that
song so she may be dancing along.

Speaker 1 (01:22:12):
Yes, exactly, it was a fun video too.

Speaker 3 (01:22:15):
I don't know if you've ever seen the video, but
that's a good video too.

Speaker 1 (01:22:19):
Yeah, it's a fun youtube video, um for sure, and
so, lisa, what was, what wasyour pick?
What would you like to share?

Speaker 2 (01:22:26):
like stephanie, I didn't listen to music during
the at all, during this wholerace.
It's either I'm talking tosomebody or, you know, I'm fine
with being in my own head for along time too.
So there's a lot of stuff thatI can get worked on, work stuff
and planning stuff.
But my song is by Miley Cyrus,the Climb, because it's really

(01:22:47):
not about getting to the finish,it's always about the journey.
So that's why I like the songthe Climb.

Speaker 1 (01:22:54):
Brilliant.
I don't know that I've heardthat one and I didn't have a
chance to listen to it prior tocoming on air here.
So I'm definitely going to look.
I'm going to hide it from mywife and son that I'm looking
for a Miley Cyrus song, but I amgoing to go look it up on
Spotify just to see what itsounds like.
But it's probably good.
If you're picking it, I'm sureit's great, especially with that
message behind it.

(01:23:14):
Absolutely Good job.
Well, this has been an absoluteblast.
Huge thanks to all of you fortaking the time to relive our
crazy journey with me.
I think it's one thing tofinish a race like Swami the 200
miler, but it's something elseentirely when you get to share
it with some amazing people likeyourselves.

(01:23:37):
So thank you very much to allthe listeners out there.
If you are grinding throughmiles, struggling in the back of
the pack or wondering if youtoo can take on something
particularly crazy, let this beproof that sometimes the best
experiences come when youdeliberately choose to run with
others.
I think, if I'm not mistaken,the sign up for the 2026 Swami

(01:24:02):
shuffle opens on April the 1st,which is a great yeah, great day
for the race uh, for the raceto open up signing.
I wonder if they thought of thatand did that deliberately.
But either way, I'm pretty sureit opens on April the 1st.
So make sure, if you'relistening, you head over to
Ultra Sign Up and get your namein the hat as one of those 22,

(01:24:23):
or maybe 30 if they're opening,expanding it up again and be on
the lookout for it.
While you're out there browsingthe internet, don't forget to
subscribe to this show and thatway you'll get notified each
time a new episode drops.
And if you're enjoying what youhear, please do follow, share,
maybe even leave a review.

(01:24:44):
That would mean the world to me.
Your support helps grow thepodcast, connects more runners
to this amazing community andspreads the word to those who
can benefit from the informationthat we share.
Right here, you can find us onInstagram and Facebook at Choose
to Endure, or visit anytime atchoosetoendurecom.

(01:25:06):
I absolutely love hearing fromyou guys, whether it's just to
say hello, suggest a topic oreven share your story so that we
can talk about it on air here.
You can email me directly atinfo at choosetoeenjoycom.
Absolutely love interactingwith you guys.
It's one of my favorite partsof doing the show, so definitely

(01:25:27):
don't be shy about reaching outUntil next time.
This is the Party Pack.
Check it out, run long, runstrong and keep choosing to
endure as a group.

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