November 15, 2025 • 50 mins
In this deeply honest and joy-filled episode of Choosing Joy, host Deborah Joy Winans Williams welcomes actress, producer, and mother Ryan Michelle Bathé for a soul-nourishing conversation about embracing the chaos of life without apology. From navigating marriage with fellow actor Sterling K. Brown to building a life rooted in faith, humor, and resilience, Ryan opens up about the lessons, missteps, and mantras that keep her grounded.
Together, they unpack what it means to redefine womanhood, honor your emotional bandwidth, and build a home full of love—even when your champagne flutes are mismatched. Ryan shares vulnerable reflections on aging, self-care, parenting through exhaustion, and finding joy in a world that rarely slows down. With warmth, wisdom, and a whole lot of laughter, this episode is a celebration of imperfection, intention, and unapologetic Black womanhood.
If you've ever felt the weight of being everything for everyone, or struggled to feel safe in your own skin, this one’s for you.
Chapter Markers
00:00 – Building a Life of Joy
03:00 – Australia, Motherhood & God's Surprises
06:00 – 19 Years of Marriage & Unpredictable Careers
09:00 – Faith, Stubbornness & Acting as a Calling
12:00 – Hollywood Rejection & Learning to Stay
15:00 – Parenting & Losing Yourself in the Process
18:00 – Perimenopause, Health, and Black Women Aging
21:00 – Family, Fear & Avoiding the Doctor
24:00 – Illness, ALS, and Loving Through Change
27:00 – Alzheimer’s, Caregiving & Choosing Joy Daily
30:00 – You Don’t Have to Get Through it Pretty
33:00 – Marriage Realizations & Letting Go of Perfection
36:00 – Church Culture, Legacy & Beautiful Homes
39:00 – Broken Glass & Emotional Meltdowns
42:00 – Stewardship, Provision & Taking Care of What God Gives
44:00 – Growing With Your Partner & Listening Deeply
47:00 – Community, Evolution & Loving the Present
49:00 – One Word She Wants Her Sons to Remember
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
That built a life around what I truly do feel most.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I feel like it's my colleague. I was like, I
made I know, I made up what was that I
was supposed to do? Cross?
Speaker 1 (00:14):
See you see how I got confused? You you didn't
want to give me a hint in the past. So okay, okay,
all right, fine.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And then all of a sudden and then something I have.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Been like, I knew it again. You know, I was
just playing.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
High.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Is Deborah Joy Wining's Williams here and this is Choosing
Joy And I'm so thankful you are tuning in. I
am very, very, very excited for my guest today.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
She is a y'all. Know I love everybody, you know,
I love us.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
I am partial to a little brownskin beauty, and she's
a brown skin beauty.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
She's an incredible.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Actress, producer, most importantly, wife and mother, and she maintains
it all while under the microscope of Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
And that's a task, y'all.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
And so I'm looking.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Forward to picking up some tricks of the trade from
this amazing woman that is sitting next to me.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
So please welcome Ryan Michelle Bethey.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Hi, Hi, I'm so happy you're here. First of all,
you look like a picture of joy. Oh you just
do you look like joy?
Speaker 3 (01:36):
The yellow? It just you look radiant. How are you
feeling today?
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Well, today I feel really good because I'm here with you,
I'm in this beautiful space.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
And I clearly got the slip dress memo. You know,
you know, gray minds think a lot, they.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Do they And this morning, you know it's funny, I said,
I'm choosing I'm going on a podcast that says choosing joy.
And I looked at my dresses and I said, which
one brings me the most joy? I got this actually
in Australia. I was visiting Sterling. Remember you, when we
were growing up, there were things that you could only
get in certain areas of the country, was whether it
was food or or you know, there was one little
(02:14):
ice cream show you couldn't get, you know what I mean.
And now it's not like that. Everything is either you
can either get it online. So I went to this mall.
We gone to the mall. I'm ashamed say more times
in the account because it was raining and you know, kid,
something to do, has something to do and you didn't
get in the water. They were like, ma'am, there's like
a forty mile gale force winds.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
I was like, what that means? So, I mean the
water no water?
Speaker 2 (02:40):
I was like, does that is that why there's.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
No that's why no one else is here?
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Show up the beach, girl, girl. So off to the
mall we went. Yeah, it was.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
It was.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
It was a company that only is Australian.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Oh. I love that.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
So every time I'm wear it. Yeah, I actually did
bring a little bit.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Something and something.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
It's always nice to find something that is really a
piece of somewhere that you know you're not gonna find
anywhere else.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
That's that's beautiful. I love that.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
And it takes a while to get to Australia, so
probably it does be going back.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
Yeah, it takes that's like a day. It took a day. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
My oldest brother lives there. Really, Yeah, he lives in Melbourne.
Remarried a woman from Melbourne and she's lovely. I did
not think he was going to stay there, and he's there. Yes,
And it's so funny because my husband thought it was
like joy, why don't you get it? So they got
married and they were going to be in At the time,
(03:41):
he was living in Boston, so they were going to
be there.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
But on their honeymoon, she got pregnant, and.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
Which is a whole other miracle because they were told, oh,
you guys are gonna really gonna need some work to
get pregnant, and God said, okay, boom.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
So she's pregnant. Fast forward to my wedding.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
She's like maybe six months, seven months, and Carvin was like, well,
Anna's gotta go back because the visa isn't done yet
and so she's pregnant, Like I can't, I gotta go.
I was like, oh, yeah, cool, cool, that makes it
just like but you know, after the baby, we'll be back.
(04:23):
And I remember telling to you, I said, Carvin's coming back,
you know, because because once the baby.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
And then he got pregnant again.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
He's a joy. When are you gonna realize he's not.
He's not coming back. He's not coming back. So yeah,
it takes a long I do.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
I do.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
And their babies, they have three beautiful babies, and so
before I had mine, we would get there once a year.
Now it's been a little bit slow, but you know,
we do, we gotta do.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
But it's beautiful. It's beautiful, no, it is, it is.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
It is, especially if you're in the city parts not.
You know, it's because you know, I do my due diligence,
because I have a thing about the wildlife in Australia.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
It's it's real wild.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, they have things that you shouldn't have anywhere.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Why why is that here?
Speaker 2 (05:06):
And why is it on the side of the road exactly?
And I don't believe in that. Mystry. My ministry is
not wildlife. So my ministry is to figure out where
it is and then go the opposite.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
Direction and we would minister together. See that works. See,
you know, and I knew.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
So when you start following people, I choose to follow
certain people.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
I've been following you for a long time. I'm not
a stalker, but you.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Know, even if you were maybe a little bit, but
I followed you because I just love seeing brown skinned
women doing the work that I love. So to see
that in a way that is beautiful is exciting to me.
It's encouraging. And then you've been you've been married a
long time? How long y'all been married?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Girl? Girl, I have been married? Who is Jesus? I
had to have to do the math in my head.
Nineteen years?
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Wow, this long time I've been in La nineteen years.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
I've been in La longer than that, but yeah, wow,
long time, okay, So and I will I will, I
will be honest.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Some days it feels and I think it's because we've
had so many ups and downs and doing what we do.
I think it would feel I wonder, actually, I don't know,
this is me musing. I wonder if it would feel
different if we had.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Nine to fives.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (06:27):
If life, if our day to day life was so
was predictable, structure yet structure, and it was we could
count time on our vacations, and yeah, I don't know
if it would because because all I know is this,
all I.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Know is I don't know. I know in the next job.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
And would you be happy though in that?
Speaker 1 (06:46):
In that, I don't know that I could live in
La yeah and do a nine to five.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
I don't know how people do it here. I really don't.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
I think I agree with that, you know, because what
keeps me here is this is what I do, and
I've built a life around what I truly do. Feel
most days I feel like it's my colleague something I
was like I made that, and I know I made up,
I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
What was I was supposed to do? Crossborld?
Speaker 1 (07:18):
See you can see how I got confused you you
didn't want to give me a hint in the past,
so okay, you okay, all right, fine, and then all
of a sudden and then something I have to be like,
I knew it, guy, you know, I was just playing.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Thank you, we'd be having common Sometimes.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
I wonder, like I'm like, I really sometimes wonder when
I get to Heaven, is he gonna be like, girl, girl.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
You see me through it.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
I'm want to be like, I'm sorry. Yeah, it's gonna
be a lot of that. It's gonna be like, I know,
I know I did the most. I did the most,
but thank you.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
I'm so glad I'm here right and I love it
through it made it, you know.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
And also that's that's a kind of love that I
think has pushed me to really understand unconditional because I
think a lot of times people get so easily judgmental.
And I was like, man, have you forgotten all the
foolishness you did just today and how you're constantly saying okay, lord,
(08:21):
I'm sorry, or overlook that I didn't mean it like you.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Know my heart.
Speaker 4 (08:25):
You know my heart Jesus, and you know my heart time,
and so that makes it a little bit easier if
I keep that in my forefront.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
It makes it easier to just try to be understanding
and give grace because it's like, Lord, I know, I
don't put Jesus through it. I don't listen on the daily, listen.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
On the day, and and you know it.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
And in all seriousness, that's.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
To me.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
When I when I when I.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
Moved to La and I decided to be an act, well,
I decided to be a not so far I moved
to La.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
But sometimes I.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Wonder, it's like when you know the old folks, the song,
you know.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
A closer walk with the closer walk with.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
These Sometimes I'm like, was this all just to have
a because I don't know if I would have a
closer walk God, if everything, if the war, if I
was in a situation where it was like fill this
out and you get this job and.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Then this happens, and then I even.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
Trust trust the world a little bit more.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Yeah, Like you know, it's like being an actor is
like jumping out of a plane without a parish.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, you know, and you just don't know and you
don't know. And I look at my friends.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Now, everybody's kind of in a similar place because a
lot of women are coming to that that I have,
that are friends of mine, that are lawyers and doctors.
They're like having to ask themselves, okay, so now what
I did all of that, and I kept my head
down and I did everything right now, and I still
didn't get the promotion. So they're kind of in the
(09:58):
position that I'm all ways in, which is like I
did everything right and I still didn't.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Get and didn't get the call, didn't get the car.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
I have been told at auditions. I had this one
audition I'll never forget and I never the actress. You
would know her if I said she's not. You don't anyway.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
And she's lovely and she's wonderful and we've become friends
over the years, and I wonder if she remembers this.
It was one of my first tests when when I
was still like, I'm testing.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
But we're pilot. This means something, you know, and it
always does.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
I'm always grateful, but lose you the importance of it,
all the specialness, right, So I'm testing for this pilot.
And I went in and I never.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
We were in. This was back in the day.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
We still test in like theaters like CBS and ABC.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
They have theaters on like there.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
They're never on their not sets, on their lot, lot,
the lot.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
And so this was CBS, which is that way that way,
that one that way.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
I don't know some of these one of these ways.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
And so they have this little theater in the bottom.
And she came out and she was shook.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
I don't know what happened in the room. I don't
know what.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
I don't know if she forgot the line. But she
came out and was shape. When I say shook it,
I mean literally she was shaking.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
One of these days I'm asking her it was it
looked too traumatic to yeah, you know, and she was
and she started crying, and I didn't know what to do.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
I didn't know what to do.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
Yeah, because then you know, you got like five seconds
before like Bryan, your turn, and I'm.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Like, I don't want to go in that room. Yeah,
I'll do to her.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Anyway, I went in and it was amazing and I
killed it. And the woman who was uh, the director,
was like she just kept getting better and better and
better and better.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
And it was amazing, you know who got the job. Yes,
the girl came out in the corner.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
Yep, Wow, yep, which just goes to show Yeah, yeah,
just goes to show you that like sometimes you think,
I don't know, I don't know, there's no there's no.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
Rhymes, there's no rhyme or reason.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
And and you get acquainted with particularly in this field,
you get acquainted with nose a lot. And I think
so then my question, I want to ask you a
few things. But my question with regards to that is,
having received knows, what is what is the steady anchor
(12:28):
that keeps you going in this crazy business?
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Because I know you've seen a lot, Ryan, I know
how you have.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
What is the thing that keeps pulling you telling you
this is where you need to be?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
And how do you hold on to that?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
You know? Because it's you.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
I'm going to be very honest and blunt and I
would love to say, you know, I have a deeply
tothered spirit.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
Why did you get something.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
You're supposed to do that? Yeah, I think I'm just
incredibly stubborn. Yeah, I think, I mean I really believe.
What was it Churchill who stood up and gave the
speech and all these I was never never, never, never,
never give up.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
I just for some reason, I think I just and
I don't know if it's a character flaw. Sometimes I
feel like I need to learn how to just be
like I give up. But I'm just I just feel
like and inn all serio. My mother told me the
story once, and she said, and she told it to
(13:35):
she was. My mother was in the industry, and she
was very good friends with a young man named Mario Contone. Yes, yes, right,
And this was before he used to do this look
to do this thing called steam pipe steampunk, steam Pipe Alley.
It was a kids show. It was like this the
thing that kind of like changes. Anyway, so they were
good friends. When I'm telling you, my mother was the
(13:58):
sing the singer to end all singers.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
She really, really, really really is.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
And so.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Anyway, she told him this story where God was how
did it?
Speaker 1 (14:15):
There was a room and somebody was going through these rooms,
and there was an empty room, and then there was
another empty room, and you had to go down this
long hallway. I'm butchering at the point is they get
to the last room and there's nothing but these beautiful presents,
gorgeous rap presents, and the man asked the guy in
the room, why are all these presents here?
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And the man.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
Says, these are the gifts that no one came to
get because they stopped when they went to all the
empty room. And Mario looked at my mother and said,
that's the stupidest story I've ever heard of, because he
was saying, but he getting quick, didn't quit and soon
(15:01):
after that he got steen pipes walk Alley. And so
when my mom told me that story once, I think
I was probably, you know, maybe I just graduated from
grad school, and.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
So I think that that.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Yeah, I keep thinking, what if that was an empty
room in the next door and there was all the.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Presents in it. That's what I keep. I keep, Yeah,
And that's what I guess.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
That's that.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
And then my stubbornness just keeps me because I'm like,
if I give up now, And then you realized, well,
you know, and then you know, little things happen.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
You get it.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
My friend used to call it flint and rock.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
You get a little.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Flint, you get a little rock, and then you then
you make a little spark and the next thing you know,
you have a bit of a flame.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Yeah, and it grows, and it grows. Sometimes it looks
a little dim, but.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
You just need a little oxygen fee, a little oxygen,
little oxygen.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
But this so I hope that answers the question.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Absolutely, No, it was one. It was beautiful.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
It's I being a woman in this industry where you
wear so many hats, and clearly the most important ones
are are your your wife hat, your mother hat, the
things that I think bring you legacy and.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
Your children.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
It's got to be exhausting trying to be everything to everybody.
What do you do to love you?
Speaker 2 (16:33):
That's a really good question. I might have to get
back to you on that one because I don't know
that I know.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
And that's but also that's fair too.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
Yeah, it is, it is, you know, it's the unfortunate
thing about I don't know if it's LA or just
modern parenting, but it is relentless.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
It is go go, go, go, go, go go go,
you know, and especially in LA when you're.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
You have to drive everywhere and you have to like
there's I know it sounds trivial, but like traffic is
a huge part of your life. Like you have some
major right you have to like organize yourself. Yeah, you know,
it's and so I think for me, I have to
remind and I'll be perfectly honesty. When COVID hit m HM,
(17:23):
I slept for three weeks. I slept.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
I was so tired.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Yeah, I remember at one point I felt this little
hand and it was my youngest pulling the covers over.
Oh the wee could go and do because honey, they
were living their best life. They were like, she sleep,
Oh man, we got.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
My cousin she had. They were staying up listening, watching movie.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
I didn't even know until like last week. She remember,
and then I was like, when was all this happening?
She was like, you were sweet sleep And I slept
for three weeks because I was so I did. Wow,
it's there is a relentless pace. And I guess for me,
you know, I don't know. I do think I have
to I'm gonna have to figure that out because I
(18:12):
can't just go go, go, go go hope for the
world to shut down because I don't know how to do. Yeah,
you know, absolutely, because your body will shut down on you.
Speaker 3 (18:22):
And that's the thing. So I just turned forty two,
and I'm thank you.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
I am learning that my body don't move the same
my health does not move the same No, and I
think in particular women's health at this age, it is
just it's not the same as it was in my thirties,
and so I'm looking finding different things that will give
(18:49):
me a little bit more energy. I keep reading up
about this perimenopaulsis. I'm like, well, what is that? And
how do I know if it's done? Hit the moment
I get hot, I'm like, is that it? I don't
know what's going on. What is like, have you done
major changes as far as your health or is that
(19:10):
something that you want to continue to just discover? Well,
you know, I will be when I was, because when
I was in my twenties, my bank account was so fragile.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
I was like, I can't get sick.
Speaker 3 (19:25):
I can't be.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I can, but I can't be. I can't do both
because I will.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Be, but I can't.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
I can't afford the clippers.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Look it was.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
Who got who got.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Vaine? Because that's all I can and Ginger all right, Look, I.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
Couldn't even afford to Ginger. It was slam and slams.
So I think back then, when I was in my twenties,
I really took on whatever I could do for my
health that was free.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Oh yeah, and so I did a lot of I mean, whether.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
It was yoga, running, I did a lot of you know,
because the steady state cardio to release the endorphins. Yeah,
you know, all of literally all of the things that
I could do that were I had a I got
a winter I think it was Target or not. Target
was TJ Max, you know, And I had I found
a VHS tape of yoga from Crunch.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
Remember that is that is and that was my yoga.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
I put that little thing on and then I would
gallop and run around the I was still living in
New York.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
I run around the reservoir.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Remember the Mari windsor remember that.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
There was a lot of she passed away.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
And so literally I think, I just and I'm not
I'm not one of those people that's going to be
like I asked. I'm saying I personally started a regimen
of things that were low cost or free because I
just I literally had no options. Yeah, you know, and
I was, I was, I was like, I literally.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Can't get you can't.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
But that's that's a beautiful thing, I think, especially for
younger women listening. Finding all of the things that are
available to you that you don't have to pay for,
and really digging into your health at an early age
so that you're not stuck. You know, at forty forty two,
we'reever trying to figure out, well, why do I have
(21:27):
this symptom or what's going on here?
Speaker 3 (21:29):
There are things that are naturally going to happen, right,
how can we be preventative?
Speaker 1 (21:33):
And I think growing up in the d in church,
we just we didn't talk a lot about health and
about understanding our.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Bodies and the changes that they will go through.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
We didn't really talk about that. And the older ladies
didn't talk about stuff. They they were just so cryptic. Yeah,
understand when you get older, and it's like, but I don't,
and if you could just help me, I can be
better prepared.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
But it's like they didn't want to talk about it,
any of it, and they.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
And I could not.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Even now as a grown woman, I'm like, I still
don't know why they didn't want to talk about things.
It wasn't like there was no everyone went through with you.
It's not like were you a shame.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
I still think I.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Feel like there's a level of and only speaking from
just maybe the church side of it. I think there
was a level of maybe not shame, but just that's inappropriate.
And then probably a lot of them not fully understanding themselves. Yeah, yeah,
so then they can't really give what they don't know.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
They don't know if it's normal and not normal or whatever.
So it's just that's true.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
I never thought of it that way.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I mean, and also thinking about again, I mean I
made the joke about being poor, but like being afraid
of going to the doctor because you don't know, that's
a lot.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
Of our culture.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Yeah, it's like I'd rather not know.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
Yeah, because if this pain, this pain could just be whatever,
or it could be something better, or it could be
And if you think about even forty fifty years ago,
the the the you know, if you got if you
were diagnosed with cancer, got the bid.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
That was kind of it.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Yeah, you know, now we can have the conversations were
because because there's hope, Yes, there's so much hope.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
There's hope.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Just because you get a diagnosis doesn't mean you know,
we I'm sure we all know and have that friend
that got diagnosed and it's fine now, But I don't
know that our mother's grandmother's aunties had that story. Yea,
like she got diagnosed and was fine. It was she
got diagnosed and she was gone, and she was gone. Yeah,
So maybe that's another reason why they just didn't want
(23:49):
to know.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
I think so too. I think so.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
And it's it's funny because coring up, you always hear
knowledge is power, but for some people it's it's something
that will shift them in a space.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
Where because very few people can get.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
News like that and see it as a way of well,
I'm just gonna live my best life until yeah, very
few people. Yeah they can't. Yeah, my mother in law,
she she has ALUs. And it was interesting because it
was like the minute it was spoken, this is what
(24:26):
you have, it felt like weeks. Yeah, I mean it wasn't,
but I think in my memory it felt like one
minute she was fine and then I mean she wasn't fine,
but you know what I mean, she got that diagnosis
and then it was like it was almost like the
clouds parted and it was like oh and then all
(24:48):
every you know, and she's she's still with us, she's
still with us, but you know, she has ALUs. So
she's I don't even know if they use the word
paralyzed when it comes to al us because it takes
your your muscular Yeah, yeah, your muscles, and but what
but it's taken, it's taken. It's taken everything. Yeah, taken everything.
I mean, she's still there, so I should say everything. God,
(25:08):
thank God she's still there mentally, but you know, it's
hard to communicate, yeah, because when you can't talk, you know, Yeah,
and you often wonder it's so interesting. I'm very sorry
to hear that. It's it's life is girl life and
life and and in these moments, what is Is there
(25:35):
something that you and and Sterling or just you alone
do to uh, kind of reset your mind, reset the
balance of who you're trying to be and where you're
trying to go, and and understanding why you do what
you do. I think, And I asked that because I
(25:57):
recently did an episode and I was sharing that my
my mom has Alzheimer's and she was diagnosed in January
of twenty twenty and then she lived with me from
twenty twenty two up until this past May. But we
had to make a change because it was just the
decline was happening so fast. My mom's only seventy two,
(26:22):
and so it's just been really is she's so young
and it's heartbreaking to see.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
But you can't not see it.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
And so I think the thing that I try to remember,
and it's something that I have to do every day.
It's like, okay, God, well you know she's your child
and you love her way better than we could. Is
what is the thing that I can do to bring
(26:53):
more joy and to make sure my son sees joy regardless,
because that's what we want. We want our kids to understand.
Life is going to life, Situations will arise.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
How do we find the joy in it?
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Or even if we can't find the joy, how do
we see our way through it without giving up, without
letting go?
Speaker 3 (27:14):
Is there a certain maybe not mantra, but something that
you do that you hold on to that can shift
your perspective when you need it.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Well, first of all, i mean I'm sorry, thank you,
And she.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Has an incredible daughter.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
So if anything gives you peace, no, right.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
Yeah, yeah, thank you. I appreciate that. I do.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
It's hard to see that sometimes, but yeah, you know
we do, we can, and I've picked a great partner.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
I'm grateful.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
I'm like he was over there, I know you're a
great partner.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
You're great.
Speaker 3 (27:53):
Love you.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
He's never closed our door to my family, and he
makes it so that I can do what I want
and need to do for them.
Speaker 3 (28:04):
So I'm grateful. That's amazing. How do you move? How
do you shift? Well?
Speaker 1 (28:10):
I have two mantras. The first one is you don't
have to get through it pretty.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
You just have to get to the end of it.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
That's good.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
And if you are bruised and beaten up, if your eyelashes.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
Off, if yeah, if the roots are.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
Nobody care you get or getting through it pretty yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
And if you're up and bru the car.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
You know the who cap, Yeah, you got.
Speaker 3 (28:40):
To the end. That's all you had to do. That's it.
That's so good.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
The other thing is my grandmother always says she had
to you have to laugh to keep from crying.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Sterlinge and I have.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
Some of the probably darkest senses of humor, I will
tell you. So he's trying to teach me how to
play the I was an only child and as and
I'm very churchy m and I'm very black. The whole
dozens passed me by. I never could get the your mama,
(29:15):
the do I.
Speaker 3 (29:16):
Could never get it.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
I never knew how to get the jokes. I never
knew how to play it back and forth.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
So as an adult, he's been trying to get me
to and I and so the joke in the house is,
you know, Mama's gonna go dark.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
You know Mom's gonna go dark.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
You're the kids, because the kids are learning and.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
Just now it's just your mom has al us. They'll
literally just randomly say that because one time I was
trying to he was trying to teach.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
When he's not that, that's that's too far. You went.
You went over them over the right.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Oh I heard that.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
I heard You're right, that was okay, fine, I tind
to jump. He was like, that's so also because I'm laughing,
I might be dark too, and and that's and that's
where we are.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
And that's where you gotta last. He tells me that.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
He's like, you know, you always seem to find the
line and then go over it. And I'm just like, well,
I'm sorry, I don't mean to try to be We
don't know.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
We're trying.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Yea in progress, and that will have been one day
we will find that line and.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Not go over it.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
I don't know how soon.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
I don't either I'm okay with that.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
I'm okay with it.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
We do the best that we can.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
But these are these are you you really just bless me.
You don't have to get through it pretty. You just
got to get through it. You just gotta get there.
And that is I think that is going to resonate
with a lot of people because we are a constantly
trying to fix ourselves up. So I was gonna ask you,
(31:03):
I think this is funny. Have you what are some
of your self realizations you've had since being married?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
And I asked that at this point because.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
I used to so I thought marriage was a certain way.
I thought it's gonna be a certain thing just how
I grew up. This is what marriage looks like, this
is what it's supposed to be.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
And ain't none of that.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
But I remember at one point my husband telling me, like,
what is wrong with you?
Speaker 3 (31:33):
You are not perfect?
Speaker 1 (31:35):
And I was like, huh oh, Darry, excuse you. And
it really took me aback.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
It's tending me back now you haven't had to me,
like you said.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
It's strong and I and it's not that I ever
thought I was. But it's this idea that you have
to present a certain way, look a certain way, be
a certain way to be received and loved.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
The way that you want to. I see, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
And so like not having just you ain't got to
be pretty, you ain't got to be dressed up. You
just got to get through. You gotta make it. And
I think for me, when I got married, it had
to look a certain way and be a certain way
so that I.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Could be the right wife and be loved the right way.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
And it's like, first of all, you ain't perfect, And
I said, oh, hold on a minute, who did I
marry because what are you talking about? Well, I think
you're perfect, So I like everything I said about him.
Bad choice for you. Yeah, it really it shook me,
but it shook me in a way that's like, okay, joy,
(32:42):
let your guard down and figure out who you are
and what makes you happy and what makes y'all happy.
But that was something that I had to sort of
realize after being married and not trying to put up
a not a front because I've.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
Always been very like it's and I'm always in the day.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I keep pee, that's what it is, and so I'm
always that person. But I think with the family I
grew up in and the way they sort of expected
things from.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Me, right, and the way I felt like I had
to look and move.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
I didn't realize the whole way I was moving was
to try to please other people. And then when he
told me that, I was like, well, hold on a minute,
Well if I'm not and I'm probably not going to be,
how do I figure out who I am and what
that looks like and then get comfortable in that skin
(33:44):
and move? And that didn't happen until probably a couple
of years into our marriage.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
Yeah, no, it is, well I don't unless you marry.
Speaker 1 (33:55):
Okay, So back in the day, people were marrying people
who came from the same lineage in a way, you.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (34:05):
It was like we all they all did.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
When I think about my grandparents could not have and
I never met my grandfather, so I'm this is but
I assume they could not have been more different. They
were also both from the country, okay, you know, one
was from Tennessee, one was from Mississippi. Like yeah, different
but also like the same. Yeah, I never forget we
were We have been married, I don't even know, maybe
(34:29):
two years, maybe maybe eighteen months, and I had these
beautiful glasses. Somebody had given us some glasses for some
champagne flutes. I think from my anniversary, right, and like you,
there are things you're a married woman like you that
your life is going to be a certain thing in
a certain way, and you're building your you know, your
dishes and your glasses. And it wasn't about the things,
(34:52):
but the things represented, right, And in my mind, I
wasn't being materialistic. I was just this is what a
lady does. It's how you have a beautiful home.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
And a beautiful home.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
Is a represent is a representation of a beautiful spirit
and all of the things.
Speaker 3 (35:05):
Yes, oh my god, you get it.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
I get it because that's what we were taught, that
especially from a church. And I mean I grew up Pentecostal.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Yes, I grew up girl what girl, yes with the
thing on the yes honey, speaking of the group.
Speaker 3 (35:22):
That's how I grew up.
Speaker 2 (35:23):
That's that's all I knew. That is all I knew.
That's all I knew. Was speaking in tongue.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
I thought, that's what all churches and running around the
church running black flips I've seen, I've seen.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
I wouldn't bite friends and be like now if she
take off, don't worry about it. Just let her. She
gonna she's gonna take off and she'll be back. It'll
be okay.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
I don't even have friends. Everybody is in church. If
you did not go to my church.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
You couldn't be my friend, Like, how could.
Speaker 1 (35:45):
You be how we were in church twenty four seven?
So how everybody outside of this? You know, yeah, so
we so, but but there was this way of being
again it wasn't. And I realized now, and I've said
this to Sterling. I said, because Sterling grew up in
a in a house where he had a grandfather who
(36:07):
was very much the boss of the house.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
And I grew up with a.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Grandmother who was very much because I didn't even you know,
my grandmother was my grandfather was gone by the time
I was even born. So what was important to her
was the the trappings of I was here and I mattered,
And to her that was beautiful dishes and her her.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
Iron sheets, sets of sheets.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
And it became like, this is what this is how
you know that you've you're you've you're not educated, but
but but having a set of sheets and a set
of towels, and if your guests come and the towel.
You give them a washcloth and a towel and they
don't the baby, what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
You should go somewhere. Consider every choice is made. If
your forks and your knobs don't match.
Speaker 3 (37:04):
Them, baby, you you fail.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
Yeah, because it's something, it's something in your war. Look
at this drawer. Look what happened here? Look I'm not crazy,
she's not crazy. Let's open this cabinet. Now, why you
ain't got not one glass that matches the other?
Speaker 3 (37:20):
Yeah? What have you done?
Speaker 2 (37:22):
Yeah, let's pray. Let's pray because you have made mistakes.
Speaker 3 (37:28):
You don't even care.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Ask for some forgiveness, and God is gonna work it out.
Speaker 3 (37:31):
God knows your heart.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
But this cabinet can't continue. Cat like, what are you doing?
Right back to the back to the champagne flutes? Sterling
broke one.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (37:45):
Oh, I remember standing there, and I remember thinking, I
ain't never gonna have nothing.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Never go ahead?
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Yeah, yeah, because you know, yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
You don't know how to feel.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
You don't know how to build. I don't how to building.
We're gonna beet drinking jelly jaws.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
So I should have woke out, you know not?
Speaker 1 (38:27):
And I'm an actress, right, so have a beautiful imagination,
like do I just get my one little suitcakes?
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Because I don't even have imagine.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
The girl told me you might right up the lifers now.
Speaker 3 (38:44):
He has, girl has no idea And it's so funny.
And you had all this, it was all of it,
all of it.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
This is it I have, I have, I have so funny.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
I have signed on to a life of poverty and
lack and just sweet, just.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
You already introduced and work. He gonna just be something gross.
Ain't nobody gonna want to come out?
Speaker 3 (39:11):
What are we doing?
Speaker 2 (39:12):
What is you doing?
Speaker 3 (39:13):
What is you doing?
Speaker 1 (39:15):
Like you know that picture of the black woman, she's
sitting on the bed and it's and she's.
Speaker 2 (39:21):
That's gonna be me. That's gonna be me with not
not a glass that match. Like I had already gone, yes,
it was over. Were living in a two bedroom condo
in California. Girl, just walk your ass to the darget
and get a Halloween.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
This was in the two bedroom condo and cover is cute,
covert is very cute.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
But you could not have told me I was not
in a shack, and.
Speaker 3 (39:51):
That is funny. I was in a shack.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Oh my good you ain't got.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
You know, I'm relegated.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
I'm relegated to the outhouse. Now.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
I could not have told me.
Speaker 3 (40:08):
Oh my god, I feel you.
Speaker 1 (40:10):
And I think again we talk about the women and
not not that's I recognize now that that's that they
could not help, but tie so much of who they
were what they had because they had so little. And
that seat, that sheet set wasn't just about the sheets,
(40:34):
you know what I mean. It was about I'm gonna
make my home the most beautiful thing that I can
because this is all I can control and this is
all I have. And I prayed for this sheet set.
Pray for this and it is an example of God's provision.
And so everything was tied up into their stuff. And
it wasn't because they were materialistic or bad people. But
(40:56):
what they did try to impart to us was how
important those things were because they wanted us.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
They just wanted us to have a good life. Yeah,
and that's.
Speaker 1 (41:09):
All they knew, yea, and to take care of Don't
don't be the people that ask God for things and
then you don't take care of what he provides. There's
something about that, and that's really I'm so glad you
brought it around to that, because there's there's so many things.
Speaker 3 (41:27):
That we do ask God for.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
And I think a lot of times so I was
his faith without works as dead. So a lot of
times we run in our mouth, God, I need this, God,
I need that God, I want.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
This God, I want that.
Speaker 1 (41:38):
But we don't do the work to prepare for what
it is we're asking for.
Speaker 3 (41:44):
And so then when we do that, and then.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
He does bless us taking care of what God gives you,
big or small. I think when you see everything as
a provision, then you are like, Okay, if I take
care of this, if I'm faithful in this, I can
be faithful in all the other things He's gonna bless
us with.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
I think that's really really really dope.
Speaker 1 (42:09):
I know, especially as women and wives back in the day. Yes, yes,
very much. So okay, only I know I have just
like a couple of minutes. But there's two things I
want to ask. There's two things I want to add.
Please let me two things. It's things I want to
please please because I just there's so much wisdom here.
(42:34):
I want to ask you two things. You and Sterling
y'all been together a long time what would you say
about being married to someone and you guys are continuously
evolving in real time? How do you see them the
(43:01):
way they should be seen?
Speaker 3 (43:05):
And vice versa? Do you know what I mean? Like
it's it's you know, it's.
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Not like like you're growing and evolving together continuously.
Speaker 3 (43:17):
How do you.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Maintain that level of new love and new trust and
new understanding because I think as you evolve, you need
I can't just understand the man you were yesterday or
the man you were ten years ago. How do you
continue to evolve your understanding and love and thinking of him?
Speaker 2 (43:41):
That is an excellent question. That is an excellent question.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
I you know, he would say, he would say he
gets on because he's like, he's like, you don't ask questions.
He's like, you don't ask me any questions. Question And
I think he's right, And I don't think he's right.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
I think I I think.
Speaker 1 (44:02):
I I think I'm trying to listen mm hmm to
what's said and what's unsaid, right, And I really try
to bring the skills that I have learned as an
actress to that to our relationship, which is listening, which
is a very active listening, you know. But he brings
(44:25):
the skills of acting to our relationship because he's infinitely
curious and he's always asking.
Speaker 2 (44:30):
Questions, why did you do that?
Speaker 3 (44:32):
And when you did that? You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
So I think on the surface, sometimes it looks to
me like I'm like.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
And on this and it asks.
Speaker 1 (44:46):
It looks like to him like I'm kind of stowing,
you know, because I'm not asking questions, whereas in my
world I'm actively listening and he's actively asking questions.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
And sometimes I think, oh God, I gotta get better
ask some countries, which I do. I do, but I.
Speaker 1 (45:05):
Definitely think that there's something that is that happens. And
again I hate to go back to the fact that
we do what we do for a living because there's
so much obvious change that happened, you know, because our
world's shifted ten years ago, you know, and nobody, nobody
(45:25):
could have.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
Predicted that, you know.
Speaker 1 (45:27):
As a matter of fact, like the OJ he had
auditioned for OJ it was months later, you know, because
they do the thing where they're like, well, we have
to go to London. We can can't find anyone here
who could pulsively play.
Speaker 2 (45:39):
Christopher Dowden, you know, the great Christopher Dawden Hayward actually
so so he you.
Speaker 1 (45:52):
Know, they did that whole thing, and because God is
still on the throne, miracle work or somebody popped in
his tape and was like.
Speaker 2 (46:01):
Is he from London? They're like, nah, yeah, I love it,
and they're like, where has he been this whole time?
Speaker 1 (46:07):
Right up on your nose exactly, And even at that,
that doesn't mean that your life is going to shift
so dramatic, but you know it did.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
It just happened to shift.
Speaker 1 (46:17):
So I get a front row seat of watching that evolution.
And then I also get a front row seats to
watch him hold so tight to the people he cleaves,
to the people that knew him when none of this
is happening. Yeah, and I've watched him do that.
Speaker 2 (46:37):
So I think that in.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
Terms of the evolution, I get to love I do,
get to love who he was, I get to love
who he's becoming, and I get to love who he
is because all three of those things are so important
right now in terms of staying grounded and staying saying,
staying attached to the to the people that loved us.
(47:01):
When so we have this really wonderful group of friends
that we met at school, met at Stanford, and you know,
part of I think our marriage. I don't want to
say we're bringing other people in the marriage because I
don't want nobody.
Speaker 2 (47:17):
Get consumed, get misconstrued. Although I do love sister wise,
I love I'm obsessed with Mormonism.
Speaker 3 (47:24):
I'm obsessed with all of it.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
That's a whole nother You gotta bring me on just
talk about.
Speaker 2 (47:30):
That is like more my my Roman empire. So we
just got to do the whole thing.
Speaker 1 (47:36):
But I think that for us, having those connections to
who we used to be is very important because that
helps I think it helps us love each other better
because we love each other in the space of community
and not just the two of us having you to
you know, figure it out. We have a community of
(47:59):
people that get to remind us of who we used
to be, of who we are who were becoming, and
and they knew us as a couple, they knew us individually.
So I would say that in terms of that evolution,
loving in community is very important.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
For that, I think, yes, for us, it takes a village.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
Okay, you have one more question.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
I have one more question, and literally I need to appeal.
Speaker 3 (48:23):
It's just a one word that I need.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
The question is what is one word that you would
want your sons to describe your life as.
Speaker 3 (48:42):
Safe?
Speaker 1 (48:44):
That I was a safe space for them, that our
life was a safe space for them to land, to rise,
to fall, to love, to grow, but they were safe.
Speaker 2 (48:55):
Oh my god, you're so good.
Speaker 3 (48:59):
I love her.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
I love her like oh my God.
Speaker 1 (49:06):
For all of the people that wanted to say something different,
Ryan Michelle Batha, you are stunning. You are really really
a gem. Your work is beautiful. It has been for
a long time. You are such a beautiful human. So
(49:27):
thank you for coming and choosing joy with me today.
I appreciate it and I am so changed by.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
It anytime, anytime a time.
Speaker 1 (49:36):
Thank you so much for listening, for watching, for tuning
in to choosing joy with the one and only the
gem that is Ryan Michelle Bathe.
Speaker 3 (49:49):
I learned quite a bit. I know.
Speaker 1 (49:51):
I said in the beginning, I was gonna get some
tricks to the trade.
Speaker 3 (49:55):
I have gotten so much more.
Speaker 1 (49:58):
The way I see myself, my house, my family, my child,
and just this industry has changed because of this conversation today.
Speaker 3 (50:08):
So I'm very grateful.
Speaker 1 (50:09):
I hope you guys learn some things, keep tuning in,
press that subscribe, that like.
Speaker 3 (50:14):
Button, and let us know what you're thinking and feeling.
Thank you, thank you,
That built a life around what I truly do feel most.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
I feel like it's my colleague. I was like, I
made I know, I made up what was that I
was supposed to do? Cross?
Speaker 1 (00:14):
See you see how I got confused? You you didn't
want to give me a hint in the past. So okay, okay,
all right, fine.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
And then all of a sudden and then something I have.
Speaker 3 (00:23):
Been like, I knew it again. You know, I was
just playing.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
High.
Speaker 1 (00:43):
Is Deborah Joy Wining's Williams here and this is Choosing
Joy And I'm so thankful you are tuning in. I
am very, very, very excited for my guest today.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
She is a y'all. Know I love everybody, you know,
I love us.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
I am partial to a little brownskin beauty, and she's
a brown skin beauty.
Speaker 3 (01:03):
She's an incredible.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Actress, producer, most importantly, wife and mother, and she maintains
it all while under the microscope of Hollywood.
Speaker 3 (01:14):
And that's a task, y'all.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
And so I'm looking.
Speaker 1 (01:17):
Forward to picking up some tricks of the trade from
this amazing woman that is sitting next to me.
Speaker 3 (01:23):
So please welcome Ryan Michelle Bethey.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
Hi, Hi, I'm so happy you're here. First of all,
you look like a picture of joy. Oh you just
do you look like joy?
Speaker 3 (01:36):
The yellow? It just you look radiant. How are you
feeling today?
Speaker 1 (01:41):
Well, today I feel really good because I'm here with you,
I'm in this beautiful space.
Speaker 2 (01:46):
And I clearly got the slip dress memo. You know,
you know, gray minds think a lot, they.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Do they And this morning, you know it's funny, I said,
I'm choosing I'm going on a podcast that says choosing joy.
And I looked at my dresses and I said, which
one brings me the most joy? I got this actually
in Australia. I was visiting Sterling. Remember you, when we
were growing up, there were things that you could only
get in certain areas of the country, was whether it
was food or or you know, there was one little
(02:14):
ice cream show you couldn't get, you know what I mean.
And now it's not like that. Everything is either you
can either get it online. So I went to this mall.
We gone to the mall. I'm ashamed say more times
in the account because it was raining and you know, kid,
something to do, has something to do and you didn't
get in the water. They were like, ma'am, there's like
a forty mile gale force winds.
Speaker 3 (02:36):
I was like, what that means? So, I mean the
water no water?
Speaker 2 (02:40):
I was like, does that is that why there's.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
No that's why no one else is here?
Speaker 2 (02:45):
Show up the beach, girl, girl. So off to the
mall we went. Yeah, it was.
Speaker 3 (02:54):
It was.
Speaker 2 (02:54):
It was a company that only is Australian.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Oh. I love that.
Speaker 2 (02:58):
So every time I'm wear it. Yeah, I actually did
bring a little bit.
Speaker 3 (03:02):
Something and something.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
It's always nice to find something that is really a
piece of somewhere that you know you're not gonna find
anywhere else.
Speaker 3 (03:10):
That's that's beautiful. I love that.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
And it takes a while to get to Australia, so
probably it does be going back.
Speaker 3 (03:16):
Yeah, it takes that's like a day. It took a day. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:19):
My oldest brother lives there. Really, Yeah, he lives in Melbourne.
Remarried a woman from Melbourne and she's lovely. I did
not think he was going to stay there, and he's there. Yes,
And it's so funny because my husband thought it was
like joy, why don't you get it? So they got
married and they were going to be in At the time,
(03:41):
he was living in Boston, so they were going to
be there.
Speaker 3 (03:45):
But on their honeymoon, she got pregnant, and.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
Which is a whole other miracle because they were told, oh,
you guys are gonna really gonna need some work to
get pregnant, and God said, okay, boom.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
So she's pregnant. Fast forward to my wedding.
Speaker 1 (04:01):
She's like maybe six months, seven months, and Carvin was like, well,
Anna's gotta go back because the visa isn't done yet
and so she's pregnant, Like I can't, I gotta go.
I was like, oh, yeah, cool, cool, that makes it
just like but you know, after the baby, we'll be back.
(04:23):
And I remember telling to you, I said, Carvin's coming back,
you know, because because once the baby.
Speaker 3 (04:29):
And then he got pregnant again.
Speaker 1 (04:30):
He's a joy. When are you gonna realize he's not.
He's not coming back. He's not coming back. So yeah,
it takes a long I do.
Speaker 3 (04:38):
I do.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
And their babies, they have three beautiful babies, and so
before I had mine, we would get there once a year.
Now it's been a little bit slow, but you know,
we do, we gotta do.
Speaker 3 (04:49):
But it's beautiful. It's beautiful, no, it is, it is.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
It is, especially if you're in the city parts not.
You know, it's because you know, I do my due diligence,
because I have a thing about the wildlife in Australia.
Speaker 3 (04:59):
It's it's real wild.
Speaker 2 (05:01):
Yeah, they have things that you shouldn't have anywhere.
Speaker 3 (05:04):
Why why is that here?
Speaker 2 (05:06):
And why is it on the side of the road exactly?
And I don't believe in that. Mystry. My ministry is
not wildlife. So my ministry is to figure out where
it is and then go the opposite.
Speaker 3 (05:16):
Direction and we would minister together. See that works. See,
you know, and I knew.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
So when you start following people, I choose to follow
certain people.
Speaker 3 (05:27):
I've been following you for a long time. I'm not
a stalker, but you.
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Know, even if you were maybe a little bit, but
I followed you because I just love seeing brown skinned
women doing the work that I love. So to see
that in a way that is beautiful is exciting to me.
It's encouraging. And then you've been you've been married a
long time? How long y'all been married?
Speaker 2 (05:51):
Girl? Girl, I have been married? Who is Jesus? I
had to have to do the math in my head.
Nineteen years?
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Wow, this long time I've been in La nineteen years.
Speaker 2 (06:04):
I've been in La longer than that, but yeah, wow,
long time, okay, So and I will I will, I
will be honest.
Speaker 1 (06:11):
Some days it feels and I think it's because we've
had so many ups and downs and doing what we do.
I think it would feel I wonder, actually, I don't know,
this is me musing. I wonder if it would feel
different if we had.
Speaker 2 (06:24):
Nine to fives.
Speaker 3 (06:26):
Yeah, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (06:27):
If life, if our day to day life was so
was predictable, structure yet structure, and it was we could
count time on our vacations, and yeah, I don't know
if it would because because all I know is this,
all I.
Speaker 2 (06:40):
Know is I don't know. I know in the next job.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
And would you be happy though in that?
Speaker 1 (06:46):
In that, I don't know that I could live in
La yeah and do a nine to five.
Speaker 3 (06:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:54):
I don't know how people do it here. I really don't.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
I think I agree with that, you know, because what
keeps me here is this is what I do, and
I've built a life around what I truly do. Feel
most days I feel like it's my colleague something I
was like I made that, and I know I made up,
I'm sorry.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
What was I was supposed to do? Crossborld?
Speaker 1 (07:18):
See you can see how I got confused you you
didn't want to give me a hint in the past,
so okay, you okay, all right, fine, and then all
of a sudden and then something I have to be like,
I knew it, guy, you know, I was just playing.
Speaker 2 (07:29):
Thank you, we'd be having common Sometimes.
Speaker 1 (07:35):
I wonder, like I'm like, I really sometimes wonder when
I get to Heaven, is he gonna be like, girl, girl.
Speaker 3 (07:40):
You see me through it.
Speaker 1 (07:42):
I'm want to be like, I'm sorry. Yeah, it's gonna
be a lot of that. It's gonna be like, I know,
I know I did the most. I did the most,
but thank you.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
I'm so glad I'm here right and I love it
through it made it, you know.
Speaker 1 (07:58):
And also that's that's a kind of love that I
think has pushed me to really understand unconditional because I
think a lot of times people get so easily judgmental.
And I was like, man, have you forgotten all the
foolishness you did just today and how you're constantly saying okay, lord,
(08:21):
I'm sorry, or overlook that I didn't mean it like you.
Speaker 2 (08:24):
Know my heart.
Speaker 4 (08:25):
You know my heart Jesus, and you know my heart time,
and so that makes it a little bit easier if
I keep that in my forefront.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
It makes it easier to just try to be understanding
and give grace because it's like, Lord, I know, I
don't put Jesus through it. I don't listen on the daily, listen.
Speaker 3 (08:46):
On the day, and and you know it.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
And in all seriousness, that's.
Speaker 3 (08:51):
To me.
Speaker 2 (08:53):
When I when I when I.
Speaker 1 (08:55):
Moved to La and I decided to be an act, well,
I decided to be a not so far I moved
to La.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
But sometimes I.
Speaker 1 (09:00):
Wonder, it's like when you know the old folks, the song,
you know.
Speaker 2 (09:04):
A closer walk with the closer walk with.
Speaker 1 (09:06):
These Sometimes I'm like, was this all just to have
a because I don't know if I would have a
closer walk God, if everything, if the war, if I
was in a situation where it was like fill this
out and you get this job and.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Then this happens, and then I even.
Speaker 2 (09:24):
Trust trust the world a little bit more.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Yeah, Like you know, it's like being an actor is
like jumping out of a plane without a parish.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, you know, and you just don't know and you
don't know. And I look at my friends.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Now, everybody's kind of in a similar place because a
lot of women are coming to that that I have,
that are friends of mine, that are lawyers and doctors.
They're like having to ask themselves, okay, so now what
I did all of that, and I kept my head
down and I did everything right now, and I still
didn't get the promotion. So they're kind of in the
(09:58):
position that I'm all ways in, which is like I
did everything right and I still didn't.
Speaker 3 (10:02):
Get and didn't get the call, didn't get the car.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
I have been told at auditions. I had this one
audition I'll never forget and I never the actress. You
would know her if I said she's not. You don't anyway.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
And she's lovely and she's wonderful and we've become friends
over the years, and I wonder if she remembers this.
It was one of my first tests when when I
was still like, I'm testing.
Speaker 2 (10:26):
But we're pilot. This means something, you know, and it
always does.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
I'm always grateful, but lose you the importance of it,
all the specialness, right, So I'm testing for this pilot.
And I went in and I never.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
We were in. This was back in the day.
Speaker 1 (10:42):
We still test in like theaters like CBS and ABC.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
They have theaters on like there.
Speaker 1 (10:48):
They're never on their not sets, on their lot, lot,
the lot.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
And so this was CBS, which is that way that way,
that one that way.
Speaker 3 (11:01):
I don't know some of these one of these ways.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
And so they have this little theater in the bottom.
And she came out and she was shook.
Speaker 2 (11:09):
I don't know what happened in the room. I don't
know what.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
I don't know if she forgot the line. But she
came out and was shape. When I say shook it,
I mean literally she was shaking.
Speaker 2 (11:17):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
One of these days I'm asking her it was it
looked too traumatic to yeah, you know, and she was
and she started crying, and I didn't know what to do.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
I didn't know what to do.
Speaker 1 (11:27):
Yeah, because then you know, you got like five seconds
before like Bryan, your turn, and I'm.
Speaker 3 (11:31):
Like, I don't want to go in that room. Yeah,
I'll do to her.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
Anyway, I went in and it was amazing and I
killed it. And the woman who was uh, the director,
was like she just kept getting better and better and
better and better.
Speaker 2 (11:44):
And it was amazing, you know who got the job. Yes,
the girl came out in the corner.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
Yep, Wow, yep, which just goes to show Yeah, yeah,
just goes to show you that like sometimes you think,
I don't know, I don't know, there's no there's no.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
Rhymes, there's no rhyme or reason.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
And and you get acquainted with particularly in this field,
you get acquainted with nose a lot. And I think
so then my question, I want to ask you a
few things. But my question with regards to that is,
having received knows, what is what is the steady anchor
(12:28):
that keeps you going in this crazy business?
Speaker 3 (12:33):
Because I know you've seen a lot, Ryan, I know
how you have.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
What is the thing that keeps pulling you telling you
this is where you need to be?
Speaker 3 (12:40):
And how do you hold on to that?
Speaker 2 (12:43):
You know? Because it's you.
Speaker 1 (12:44):
I'm going to be very honest and blunt and I
would love to say, you know, I have a deeply
tothered spirit.
Speaker 3 (12:56):
Why did you get something.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
You're supposed to do that? Yeah, I think I'm just
incredibly stubborn. Yeah, I think, I mean I really believe.
What was it Churchill who stood up and gave the
speech and all these I was never never, never, never,
never give up.
Speaker 1 (13:14):
I just for some reason, I think I just and
I don't know if it's a character flaw. Sometimes I
feel like I need to learn how to just be
like I give up. But I'm just I just feel
like and inn all serio. My mother told me the
story once, and she said, and she told it to
(13:35):
she was. My mother was in the industry, and she
was very good friends with a young man named Mario Contone. Yes, yes, right,
And this was before he used to do this look
to do this thing called steam pipe steampunk, steam Pipe Alley.
It was a kids show. It was like this the
thing that kind of like changes. Anyway, so they were
good friends. When I'm telling you, my mother was the
(13:58):
sing the singer to end all singers.
Speaker 2 (14:01):
She really, really, really really is.
Speaker 3 (14:03):
And so.
Speaker 2 (14:05):
Anyway, she told him this story where God was how
did it?
Speaker 1 (14:15):
There was a room and somebody was going through these rooms,
and there was an empty room, and then there was
another empty room, and you had to go down this
long hallway. I'm butchering at the point is they get
to the last room and there's nothing but these beautiful presents,
gorgeous rap presents, and the man asked the guy in
the room, why are all these presents here?
Speaker 2 (14:38):
And the man.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
Says, these are the gifts that no one came to
get because they stopped when they went to all the
empty room. And Mario looked at my mother and said,
that's the stupidest story I've ever heard of, because he
was saying, but he getting quick, didn't quit and soon
(15:01):
after that he got steen pipes walk Alley. And so
when my mom told me that story once, I think
I was probably, you know, maybe I just graduated from
grad school, and.
Speaker 2 (15:12):
So I think that that.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Yeah, I keep thinking, what if that was an empty
room in the next door and there was all the.
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Presents in it. That's what I keep. I keep, Yeah,
And that's what I guess.
Speaker 3 (15:24):
That's that.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
And then my stubbornness just keeps me because I'm like,
if I give up now, And then you realized, well,
you know, and then you know, little things happen.
Speaker 3 (15:33):
You get it.
Speaker 2 (15:33):
My friend used to call it flint and rock.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
You get a little.
Speaker 2 (15:36):
Flint, you get a little rock, and then you then
you make a little spark and the next thing you know,
you have a bit of a flame.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Yeah, and it grows, and it grows. Sometimes it looks
a little dim, but.
Speaker 3 (15:46):
You just need a little oxygen fee, a little oxygen,
little oxygen.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
But this so I hope that answers the question.
Speaker 3 (15:55):
Absolutely, No, it was one. It was beautiful.
Speaker 1 (15:58):
It's I being a woman in this industry where you
wear so many hats, and clearly the most important ones
are are your your wife hat, your mother hat, the
things that I think bring you legacy and.
Speaker 3 (16:20):
Your children.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
It's got to be exhausting trying to be everything to everybody.
What do you do to love you?
Speaker 2 (16:33):
That's a really good question. I might have to get
back to you on that one because I don't know
that I know.
Speaker 3 (16:39):
And that's but also that's fair too.
Speaker 1 (16:42):
Yeah, it is, it is, you know, it's the unfortunate
thing about I don't know if it's LA or just
modern parenting, but it is relentless.
Speaker 2 (16:55):
It is go go, go, go, go, go go go,
you know, and especially in LA when you're.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
You have to drive everywhere and you have to like
there's I know it sounds trivial, but like traffic is
a huge part of your life. Like you have some
major right you have to like organize yourself. Yeah, you know,
it's and so I think for me, I have to
remind and I'll be perfectly honesty. When COVID hit m HM,
(17:23):
I slept for three weeks. I slept.
Speaker 2 (17:26):
I was so tired.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
Yeah, I remember at one point I felt this little
hand and it was my youngest pulling the covers over.
Oh the wee could go and do because honey, they
were living their best life. They were like, she sleep,
Oh man, we got.
Speaker 2 (17:46):
My cousin she had. They were staying up listening, watching movie.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
I didn't even know until like last week. She remember,
and then I was like, when was all this happening?
She was like, you were sweet sleep And I slept
for three weeks because I was so I did. Wow,
it's there is a relentless pace. And I guess for me,
you know, I don't know. I do think I have
to I'm gonna have to figure that out because I
(18:12):
can't just go go, go, go go hope for the
world to shut down because I don't know how to do. Yeah,
you know, absolutely, because your body will shut down on you.
Speaker 3 (18:22):
And that's the thing. So I just turned forty two,
and I'm thank you.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
I am learning that my body don't move the same
my health does not move the same No, and I
think in particular women's health at this age, it is
just it's not the same as it was in my thirties,
and so I'm looking finding different things that will give
(18:49):
me a little bit more energy. I keep reading up
about this perimenopaulsis. I'm like, well, what is that? And
how do I know if it's done? Hit the moment
I get hot, I'm like, is that it? I don't
know what's going on. What is like, have you done
major changes as far as your health or is that
(19:10):
something that you want to continue to just discover? Well,
you know, I will be when I was, because when
I was in my twenties, my bank account was so fragile.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
I was like, I can't get sick.
Speaker 3 (19:25):
I can't be.
Speaker 2 (19:27):
I can, but I can't be. I can't do both
because I will.
Speaker 3 (19:32):
Be, but I can't.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
I can't afford the clippers.
Speaker 3 (19:36):
Look it was.
Speaker 2 (19:39):
Who got who got.
Speaker 3 (19:42):
Vaine? Because that's all I can and Ginger all right, Look, I.
Speaker 1 (19:47):
Couldn't even afford to Ginger. It was slam and slams.
So I think back then, when I was in my twenties,
I really took on whatever I could do for my
health that was free.
Speaker 2 (20:02):
Oh yeah, and so I did a lot of I mean, whether.
Speaker 1 (20:05):
It was yoga, running, I did a lot of you know,
because the steady state cardio to release the endorphins. Yeah,
you know, all of literally all of the things that
I could do that were I had a I got
a winter I think it was Target or not. Target
was TJ Max, you know, And I had I found
a VHS tape of yoga from Crunch.
Speaker 3 (20:26):
Remember that is that is and that was my yoga.
Speaker 1 (20:31):
I put that little thing on and then I would
gallop and run around the I was still living in
New York.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
I run around the reservoir.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Remember the Mari windsor remember that.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
There was a lot of she passed away.
Speaker 1 (20:44):
And so literally I think, I just and I'm not
I'm not one of those people that's going to be
like I asked. I'm saying I personally started a regimen
of things that were low cost or free because I
just I literally had no options. Yeah, you know, and
I was, I was, I was like, I literally.
Speaker 3 (21:05):
Can't get you can't.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
But that's that's a beautiful thing, I think, especially for
younger women listening. Finding all of the things that are
available to you that you don't have to pay for,
and really digging into your health at an early age
so that you're not stuck. You know, at forty forty two,
we'reever trying to figure out, well, why do I have
(21:27):
this symptom or what's going on here?
Speaker 3 (21:29):
There are things that are naturally going to happen, right,
how can we be preventative?
Speaker 1 (21:33):
And I think growing up in the d in church,
we just we didn't talk a lot about health and
about understanding our.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Bodies and the changes that they will go through.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
We didn't really talk about that. And the older ladies
didn't talk about stuff. They they were just so cryptic. Yeah,
understand when you get older, and it's like, but I don't,
and if you could just help me, I can be
better prepared.
Speaker 3 (22:05):
But it's like they didn't want to talk about it,
any of it, and they.
Speaker 2 (22:09):
And I could not.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Even now as a grown woman, I'm like, I still
don't know why they didn't want to talk about things.
It wasn't like there was no everyone went through with you.
It's not like were you a shame.
Speaker 2 (22:21):
I still think I.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Feel like there's a level of and only speaking from
just maybe the church side of it. I think there
was a level of maybe not shame, but just that's inappropriate.
And then probably a lot of them not fully understanding themselves. Yeah, yeah,
so then they can't really give what they don't know.
Speaker 3 (22:43):
They don't know if it's normal and not normal or whatever.
So it's just that's true.
Speaker 2 (22:50):
I never thought of it that way.
Speaker 1 (22:51):
I mean, and also thinking about again, I mean I
made the joke about being poor, but like being afraid
of going to the doctor because you don't know, that's
a lot.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
Of our culture.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
Yeah, it's like I'd rather not know.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
Yeah, because if this pain, this pain could just be whatever,
or it could be something better, or it could be
And if you think about even forty fifty years ago,
the the the you know, if you got if you
were diagnosed with cancer, got the bid.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
That was kind of it.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Yeah, you know, now we can have the conversations were
because because there's hope, Yes, there's so much hope.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
There's hope.
Speaker 1 (23:29):
Just because you get a diagnosis doesn't mean you know,
we I'm sure we all know and have that friend
that got diagnosed and it's fine now, But I don't
know that our mother's grandmother's aunties had that story. Yea,
like she got diagnosed and was fine. It was she
got diagnosed and she was gone, and she was gone. Yeah,
So maybe that's another reason why they just didn't want
(23:49):
to know.
Speaker 3 (23:49):
I think so too. I think so.
Speaker 1 (23:51):
And it's it's funny because coring up, you always hear
knowledge is power, but for some people it's it's something
that will shift them in a space.
Speaker 3 (24:03):
Where because very few people can get.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
News like that and see it as a way of well,
I'm just gonna live my best life until yeah, very
few people. Yeah they can't. Yeah, my mother in law,
she she has ALUs. And it was interesting because it
was like the minute it was spoken, this is what
(24:26):
you have, it felt like weeks. Yeah, I mean it wasn't,
but I think in my memory it felt like one
minute she was fine and then I mean she wasn't fine,
but you know what I mean, she got that diagnosis
and then it was like it was almost like the
clouds parted and it was like oh and then all
(24:48):
every you know, and she's she's still with us, she's
still with us, but you know, she has ALUs. So
she's I don't even know if they use the word
paralyzed when it comes to al us because it takes
your your muscular Yeah, yeah, your muscles, and but what
but it's taken, it's taken. It's taken everything. Yeah, taken everything.
I mean, she's still there, so I should say everything. God,
(25:08):
thank God she's still there mentally, but you know, it's
hard to communicate, yeah, because when you can't talk, you know, Yeah,
and you often wonder it's so interesting. I'm very sorry
to hear that. It's it's life is girl life and
life and and in these moments, what is Is there
(25:35):
something that you and and Sterling or just you alone
do to uh, kind of reset your mind, reset the
balance of who you're trying to be and where you're
trying to go, and and understanding why you do what
you do. I think, And I asked that because I
(25:57):
recently did an episode and I was sharing that my
my mom has Alzheimer's and she was diagnosed in January
of twenty twenty and then she lived with me from
twenty twenty two up until this past May. But we
had to make a change because it was just the
decline was happening so fast. My mom's only seventy two,
(26:22):
and so it's just been really is she's so young
and it's heartbreaking to see.
Speaker 3 (26:30):
But you can't not see it.
Speaker 1 (26:32):
And so I think the thing that I try to remember,
and it's something that I have to do every day.
It's like, okay, God, well you know she's your child
and you love her way better than we could. Is
what is the thing that I can do to bring
(26:53):
more joy and to make sure my son sees joy regardless,
because that's what we want. We want our kids to understand.
Life is going to life, Situations will arise.
Speaker 3 (27:05):
How do we find the joy in it?
Speaker 1 (27:07):
Or even if we can't find the joy, how do
we see our way through it without giving up, without
letting go?
Speaker 3 (27:14):
Is there a certain maybe not mantra, but something that
you do that you hold on to that can shift
your perspective when you need it.
Speaker 1 (27:24):
Well, first of all, i mean I'm sorry, thank you,
And she.
Speaker 2 (27:29):
Has an incredible daughter.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (27:32):
So if anything gives you peace, no, right.
Speaker 3 (27:36):
Yeah, yeah, thank you. I appreciate that. I do.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
It's hard to see that sometimes, but yeah, you know
we do, we can, and I've picked a great partner.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
I'm grateful.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
I'm like he was over there, I know you're a
great partner.
Speaker 2 (27:52):
You're great.
Speaker 3 (27:53):
Love you.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
He's never closed our door to my family, and he
makes it so that I can do what I want
and need to do for them.
Speaker 3 (28:04):
So I'm grateful. That's amazing. How do you move? How
do you shift? Well?
Speaker 1 (28:10):
I have two mantras. The first one is you don't
have to get through it pretty.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
You just have to get to the end of it.
Speaker 3 (28:18):
That's good.
Speaker 2 (28:20):
And if you are bruised and beaten up, if your eyelashes.
Speaker 3 (28:23):
Off, if yeah, if the roots are.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
Nobody care you get or getting through it pretty yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
And if you're up and bru the car.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
You know the who cap, Yeah, you got.
Speaker 3 (28:40):
To the end. That's all you had to do. That's it.
That's so good.
Speaker 1 (28:45):
The other thing is my grandmother always says she had
to you have to laugh to keep from crying.
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Sterlinge and I have.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
Some of the probably darkest senses of humor, I will
tell you. So he's trying to teach me how to
play the I was an only child and as and
I'm very churchy m and I'm very black. The whole
dozens passed me by. I never could get the your mama,
(29:15):
the do I.
Speaker 3 (29:16):
Could never get it.
Speaker 2 (29:17):
I never knew how to get the jokes. I never
knew how to play it back and forth.
Speaker 1 (29:22):
So as an adult, he's been trying to get me
to and I and so the joke in the house is,
you know, Mama's gonna go dark.
Speaker 2 (29:30):
You know Mom's gonna go dark.
Speaker 3 (29:31):
You're the kids, because the kids are learning and.
Speaker 2 (29:34):
Just now it's just your mom has al us. They'll
literally just randomly say that because one time I was
trying to he was trying to teach.
Speaker 3 (29:47):
When he's not that, that's that's too far. You went.
You went over them over the right.
Speaker 2 (29:54):
Oh I heard that.
Speaker 1 (29:55):
I heard You're right, that was okay, fine, I tind
to jump. He was like, that's so also because I'm laughing,
I might be dark too, and and that's and that's
where we are.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
And that's where you gotta last. He tells me that.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
He's like, you know, you always seem to find the
line and then go over it. And I'm just like, well,
I'm sorry, I don't mean to try to be We
don't know.
Speaker 2 (30:25):
We're trying.
Speaker 1 (30:26):
Yea in progress, and that will have been one day
we will find that line and.
Speaker 2 (30:32):
Not go over it.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
I don't know how soon.
Speaker 1 (30:36):
I don't either I'm okay with that.
Speaker 3 (30:40):
I'm okay with it.
Speaker 2 (30:42):
We do the best that we can.
Speaker 1 (30:43):
But these are these are you you really just bless me.
You don't have to get through it pretty. You just
got to get through it. You just gotta get there.
And that is I think that is going to resonate
with a lot of people because we are a constantly
trying to fix ourselves up. So I was gonna ask you,
(31:03):
I think this is funny. Have you what are some
of your self realizations you've had since being married?
Speaker 3 (31:12):
And I asked that at this point because.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
I used to so I thought marriage was a certain way.
I thought it's gonna be a certain thing just how
I grew up. This is what marriage looks like, this
is what it's supposed to be.
Speaker 3 (31:26):
And ain't none of that.
Speaker 1 (31:28):
But I remember at one point my husband telling me, like,
what is wrong with you?
Speaker 3 (31:33):
You are not perfect?
Speaker 1 (31:35):
And I was like, huh oh, Darry, excuse you. And
it really took me aback.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
It's tending me back now you haven't had to me,
like you said.
Speaker 1 (31:45):
It's strong and I and it's not that I ever
thought I was. But it's this idea that you have
to present a certain way, look a certain way, be
a certain way to be received and loved.
Speaker 3 (32:00):
The way that you want to. I see, you know
what I mean.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
And so like not having just you ain't got to
be pretty, you ain't got to be dressed up. You
just got to get through. You gotta make it. And
I think for me, when I got married, it had
to look a certain way and be a certain way
so that I.
Speaker 3 (32:15):
Could be the right wife and be loved the right way.
Speaker 1 (32:18):
And it's like, first of all, you ain't perfect, And
I said, oh, hold on a minute, who did I
marry because what are you talking about? Well, I think
you're perfect, So I like everything I said about him.
Bad choice for you. Yeah, it really it shook me,
but it shook me in a way that's like, okay, joy,
(32:42):
let your guard down and figure out who you are
and what makes you happy and what makes y'all happy.
But that was something that I had to sort of
realize after being married and not trying to put up
a not a front because I've.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
Always been very like it's and I'm always in the day.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
I keep pee, that's what it is, and so I'm
always that person. But I think with the family I
grew up in and the way they sort of expected
things from.
Speaker 3 (33:20):
Me, right, and the way I felt like I had
to look and move.
Speaker 1 (33:24):
I didn't realize the whole way I was moving was
to try to please other people. And then when he
told me that, I was like, well, hold on a minute,
Well if I'm not and I'm probably not going to be,
how do I figure out who I am and what
that looks like and then get comfortable in that skin
(33:44):
and move? And that didn't happen until probably a couple
of years into our marriage.
Speaker 2 (33:49):
Yeah, no, it is, well I don't unless you marry.
Speaker 1 (33:55):
Okay, So back in the day, people were marrying people
who came from the same lineage in a way, you.
Speaker 3 (34:04):
Know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (34:05):
It was like we all they all did.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
When I think about my grandparents could not have and
I never met my grandfather, so I'm this is but
I assume they could not have been more different. They
were also both from the country, okay, you know, one
was from Tennessee, one was from Mississippi. Like yeah, different
but also like the same. Yeah, I never forget we
were We have been married, I don't even know, maybe
(34:29):
two years, maybe maybe eighteen months, and I had these
beautiful glasses. Somebody had given us some glasses for some
champagne flutes. I think from my anniversary, right, and like you,
there are things you're a married woman like you that
your life is going to be a certain thing in
a certain way, and you're building your you know, your
dishes and your glasses. And it wasn't about the things,
(34:52):
but the things represented, right, And in my mind, I
wasn't being materialistic. I was just this is what a
lady does. It's how you have a beautiful home.
Speaker 2 (35:01):
And a beautiful home.
Speaker 1 (35:02):
Is a represent is a representation of a beautiful spirit
and all of the things.
Speaker 3 (35:05):
Yes, oh my god, you get it.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
I get it because that's what we were taught, that
especially from a church. And I mean I grew up Pentecostal.
Speaker 1 (35:14):
Yes, I grew up girl what girl, yes with the
thing on the yes honey, speaking of the group.
Speaker 3 (35:22):
That's how I grew up.
Speaker 2 (35:23):
That's that's all I knew. That is all I knew.
That's all I knew. Was speaking in tongue.
Speaker 1 (35:28):
I thought, that's what all churches and running around the
church running black flips I've seen, I've seen.
Speaker 3 (35:34):
I wouldn't bite friends and be like now if she
take off, don't worry about it. Just let her. She
gonna she's gonna take off and she'll be back. It'll
be okay.
Speaker 2 (35:40):
I don't even have friends. Everybody is in church. If
you did not go to my church.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
You couldn't be my friend, Like, how could.
Speaker 1 (35:45):
You be how we were in church twenty four seven?
So how everybody outside of this? You know, yeah, so
we so, but but there was this way of being
again it wasn't. And I realized now, and I've said
this to Sterling. I said, because Sterling grew up in
a in a house where he had a grandfather who
(36:07):
was very much the boss of the house.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
And I grew up with a.
Speaker 1 (36:11):
Grandmother who was very much because I didn't even you know,
my grandmother was my grandfather was gone by the time
I was even born. So what was important to her
was the the trappings of I was here and I mattered,
And to her that was beautiful dishes and her her.
Speaker 2 (36:34):
Iron sheets, sets of sheets.
Speaker 1 (36:37):
And it became like, this is what this is how
you know that you've you're you've you're not educated, but
but but having a set of sheets and a set
of towels, and if your guests come and the towel.
You give them a washcloth and a towel and they
don't the baby, what are you doing?
Speaker 2 (36:58):
You should go somewhere. Consider every choice is made. If
your forks and your knobs don't match.
Speaker 3 (37:04):
Them, baby, you you fail.
Speaker 2 (37:06):
Yeah, because it's something, it's something in your war. Look
at this drawer. Look what happened here? Look I'm not crazy,
she's not crazy. Let's open this cabinet. Now, why you
ain't got not one glass that matches the other?
Speaker 3 (37:20):
Yeah? What have you done?
Speaker 2 (37:22):
Yeah, let's pray. Let's pray because you have made mistakes.
Speaker 3 (37:28):
You don't even care.
Speaker 2 (37:29):
Ask for some forgiveness, and God is gonna work it out.
Speaker 3 (37:31):
God knows your heart.
Speaker 2 (37:33):
But this cabinet can't continue. Cat like, what are you doing?
Right back to the back to the champagne flutes? Sterling
broke one.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (37:45):
Oh, I remember standing there, and I remember thinking, I
ain't never gonna have nothing.
Speaker 2 (38:00):
Never go ahead?
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Yeah, yeah, because you know, yeah.
Speaker 3 (38:10):
You don't know how to feel.
Speaker 2 (38:12):
You don't know how to build. I don't how to building.
We're gonna beet drinking jelly jaws.
Speaker 3 (38:21):
So I should have woke out, you know not?
Speaker 1 (38:27):
And I'm an actress, right, so have a beautiful imagination,
like do I just get my one little suitcakes?
Speaker 2 (38:33):
Because I don't even have imagine.
Speaker 1 (38:35):
The girl told me you might right up the lifers now.
Speaker 3 (38:44):
He has, girl has no idea And it's so funny.
And you had all this, it was all of it,
all of it.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
This is it I have, I have, I have so funny.
Speaker 1 (38:54):
I have signed on to a life of poverty and
lack and just sweet, just.
Speaker 2 (39:02):
You already introduced and work. He gonna just be something gross.
Ain't nobody gonna want to come out?
Speaker 3 (39:11):
What are we doing?
Speaker 2 (39:12):
What is you doing?
Speaker 3 (39:13):
What is you doing?
Speaker 1 (39:15):
Like you know that picture of the black woman, she's
sitting on the bed and it's and she's.
Speaker 2 (39:21):
That's gonna be me. That's gonna be me with not
not a glass that match. Like I had already gone, yes,
it was over. Were living in a two bedroom condo
in California. Girl, just walk your ass to the darget
and get a Halloween.
Speaker 1 (39:42):
This was in the two bedroom condo and cover is cute,
covert is very cute.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
But you could not have told me I was not
in a shack, and.
Speaker 3 (39:51):
That is funny. I was in a shack.
Speaker 1 (39:53):
Oh my good you ain't got.
Speaker 2 (40:00):
You know, I'm relegated.
Speaker 3 (40:03):
I'm relegated to the outhouse. Now.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
I could not have told me.
Speaker 3 (40:08):
Oh my god, I feel you.
Speaker 1 (40:10):
And I think again we talk about the women and
not not that's I recognize now that that's that they
could not help, but tie so much of who they
were what they had because they had so little. And
that seat, that sheet set wasn't just about the sheets,
(40:34):
you know what I mean. It was about I'm gonna
make my home the most beautiful thing that I can
because this is all I can control and this is
all I have. And I prayed for this sheet set.
Pray for this and it is an example of God's provision.
And so everything was tied up into their stuff. And
it wasn't because they were materialistic or bad people. But
(40:56):
what they did try to impart to us was how
important those things were because they wanted us.
Speaker 2 (41:06):
They just wanted us to have a good life. Yeah,
and that's.
Speaker 1 (41:09):
All they knew, yea, and to take care of Don't
don't be the people that ask God for things and
then you don't take care of what he provides. There's
something about that, and that's really I'm so glad you
brought it around to that, because there's there's so many things.
Speaker 3 (41:27):
That we do ask God for.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
And I think a lot of times so I was
his faith without works as dead. So a lot of
times we run in our mouth, God, I need this, God,
I need that God, I want.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
This God, I want that.
Speaker 1 (41:38):
But we don't do the work to prepare for what
it is we're asking for.
Speaker 3 (41:44):
And so then when we do that, and then.
Speaker 1 (41:47):
He does bless us taking care of what God gives you,
big or small. I think when you see everything as
a provision, then you are like, Okay, if I take
care of this, if I'm faithful in this, I can
be faithful in all the other things He's gonna bless
us with.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
I think that's really really really dope.
Speaker 1 (42:09):
I know, especially as women and wives back in the day. Yes, yes,
very much. So okay, only I know I have just
like a couple of minutes. But there's two things I
want to ask. There's two things I want to add.
Please let me two things. It's things I want to
please please because I just there's so much wisdom here.
(42:34):
I want to ask you two things. You and Sterling
y'all been together a long time what would you say
about being married to someone and you guys are continuously
evolving in real time? How do you see them the
(43:01):
way they should be seen?
Speaker 3 (43:05):
And vice versa? Do you know what I mean? Like
it's it's you know, it's.
Speaker 1 (43:10):
Not like like you're growing and evolving together continuously.
Speaker 3 (43:17):
How do you.
Speaker 1 (43:20):
Maintain that level of new love and new trust and
new understanding because I think as you evolve, you need
I can't just understand the man you were yesterday or
the man you were ten years ago. How do you
continue to evolve your understanding and love and thinking of him?
Speaker 2 (43:41):
That is an excellent question. That is an excellent question.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
I you know, he would say, he would say he
gets on because he's like, he's like, you don't ask questions.
He's like, you don't ask me any questions. Question And
I think he's right, And I don't think he's right.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
I think I I think.
Speaker 1 (44:02):
I I think I'm trying to listen mm hmm to
what's said and what's unsaid, right, And I really try
to bring the skills that I have learned as an
actress to that to our relationship, which is listening, which
is a very active listening, you know. But he brings
(44:25):
the skills of acting to our relationship because he's infinitely
curious and he's always asking.
Speaker 2 (44:30):
Questions, why did you do that?
Speaker 3 (44:32):
And when you did that? You know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
So I think on the surface, sometimes it looks to
me like I'm like.
Speaker 2 (44:44):
And on this and it asks.
Speaker 1 (44:46):
It looks like to him like I'm kind of stowing,
you know, because I'm not asking questions, whereas in my
world I'm actively listening and he's actively asking questions.
Speaker 2 (44:57):
And sometimes I think, oh God, I gotta get better
ask some countries, which I do. I do, but I.
Speaker 1 (45:05):
Definitely think that there's something that is that happens. And
again I hate to go back to the fact that
we do what we do for a living because there's
so much obvious change that happened, you know, because our
world's shifted ten years ago, you know, and nobody, nobody
(45:25):
could have.
Speaker 2 (45:25):
Predicted that, you know.
Speaker 1 (45:27):
As a matter of fact, like the OJ he had
auditioned for OJ it was months later, you know, because
they do the thing where they're like, well, we have
to go to London. We can can't find anyone here
who could pulsively play.
Speaker 2 (45:39):
Christopher Dowden, you know, the great Christopher Dawden Hayward actually
so so he you.
Speaker 1 (45:52):
Know, they did that whole thing, and because God is
still on the throne, miracle work or somebody popped in
his tape and was like.
Speaker 2 (46:01):
Is he from London? They're like, nah, yeah, I love it,
and they're like, where has he been this whole time?
Speaker 1 (46:07):
Right up on your nose exactly, And even at that,
that doesn't mean that your life is going to shift
so dramatic, but you know it did.
Speaker 2 (46:16):
It just happened to shift.
Speaker 1 (46:17):
So I get a front row seat of watching that evolution.
And then I also get a front row seats to
watch him hold so tight to the people he cleaves,
to the people that knew him when none of this
is happening. Yeah, and I've watched him do that.
Speaker 2 (46:37):
So I think that in.
Speaker 1 (46:38):
Terms of the evolution, I get to love I do,
get to love who he was, I get to love
who he's becoming, and I get to love who he
is because all three of those things are so important
right now in terms of staying grounded and staying saying,
staying attached to the to the people that loved us.
(47:01):
When so we have this really wonderful group of friends
that we met at school, met at Stanford, and you know,
part of I think our marriage. I don't want to
say we're bringing other people in the marriage because I
don't want nobody.
Speaker 2 (47:17):
Get consumed, get misconstrued. Although I do love sister wise,
I love I'm obsessed with Mormonism.
Speaker 3 (47:24):
I'm obsessed with all of it.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
That's a whole nother You gotta bring me on just
talk about.
Speaker 2 (47:30):
That is like more my my Roman empire. So we
just got to do the whole thing.
Speaker 1 (47:36):
But I think that for us, having those connections to
who we used to be is very important because that
helps I think it helps us love each other better
because we love each other in the space of community
and not just the two of us having you to
you know, figure it out. We have a community of
(47:59):
people that get to remind us of who we used
to be, of who we are who were becoming, and
and they knew us as a couple, they knew us individually.
So I would say that in terms of that evolution,
loving in community is very important.
Speaker 3 (48:14):
For that, I think, yes, for us, it takes a village.
Speaker 1 (48:17):
Okay, you have one more question.
Speaker 2 (48:19):
I have one more question, and literally I need to appeal.
Speaker 3 (48:23):
It's just a one word that I need.
Speaker 1 (48:27):
The question is what is one word that you would
want your sons to describe your life as.
Speaker 3 (48:42):
Safe?
Speaker 1 (48:44):
That I was a safe space for them, that our
life was a safe space for them to land, to rise,
to fall, to love, to grow, but they were safe.
Speaker 2 (48:55):
Oh my god, you're so good.
Speaker 3 (48:59):
I love her.
Speaker 2 (49:01):
I love her like oh my God.
Speaker 1 (49:06):
For all of the people that wanted to say something different,
Ryan Michelle Batha, you are stunning. You are really really
a gem. Your work is beautiful. It has been for
a long time. You are such a beautiful human. So
(49:27):
thank you for coming and choosing joy with me today.
I appreciate it and I am so changed by.
Speaker 2 (49:34):
It anytime, anytime a time.
Speaker 1 (49:36):
Thank you so much for listening, for watching, for tuning
in to choosing joy with the one and only the
gem that is Ryan Michelle Bathe.
Speaker 3 (49:49):
I learned quite a bit. I know.
Speaker 1 (49:51):
I said in the beginning, I was gonna get some
tricks to the trade.
Speaker 3 (49:55):
I have gotten so much more.
Speaker 1 (49:58):
The way I see myself, my house, my family, my child,
and just this industry has changed because of this conversation today.
Speaker 3 (50:08):
So I'm very grateful.
Speaker 1 (50:09):
I hope you guys learn some things, keep tuning in,
press that subscribe, that like.
Speaker 3 (50:14):
Button, and let us know what you're thinking and feeling.
Thank you, thank you,
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