July 22, 2025 • 46 mins
On Monday's Chris Fabry Live, we talked about the kind of man you to be—or the man you want your sons to become. Tuesday's we look at the kind of woman you want to be—or the woman you want your daughters to become. Who is an example in your own life of a woman you want to emulate? It could be a woman from Scripture, from history, or a woman in your neighborhood. Share your encouragement about the woman you want to become on Chris Fabry Live.
July thank you gift:
Drive Through the Bible by Colin S. Smith
Chris Fabry Live is listener-supported. To support the program, click here.
Become a Back Fence Partner: https://moodyradio.org/donateto/chrisfabrylive/partners
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:05):
Welcome to the radio backyard fence, the safe place for
ideas and struggles, conversations that get to the heart of
what you and I are going through, what you and
I want to become, and all the obstacles we face
in getting there. I wonder if those obstacles are there
for a bigger purpose than keeping us from something. Perhaps
the obstacles might help us climb a little bit higher today.
(00:29):
I think that's what we're going to see on today's
Chris Fabry live as we continue a discussion. We started yesterday.
We did an examination of the kind of man you
want to be, or the man you want your sons
to become. And the catalyst for that was the observation
of a wife who looked at something her husband had done.
She noticed it, first of all, and with great emotion,
(00:50):
she said, that is the kind of man he is.
She was complimenting him for the way his character motivated
him to act in a difficult situation. An obstacle had
come up in his life. So today we're going to
turn the focus on women and ask that same question
what kind of woman do you want to become? What
kind of woman do you want your daughters to become?
(01:13):
Who is an example in your life that you want
to emulate? What qualities does that woman exhibit? And we'll
look at women from the Bible, women from history to
find traits, actions, ways to live that stand out. And
it's my belief that you don't just take on those traits.
You have to see it. You have to see the
(01:35):
value of the qualities in those women around you. And
then there's intentionality. You have to act on what you believe.
I mean, if you say, I want to be a
woman of prayer like my friend or Miss Clara in
War room, I want to be a woman of prayer
like her. You can admire her all day long. You
can talk all about how she does what she does
(01:56):
and did to become a woman of prayer in a
fictional story that was based on a real person. But
it's when you follow through and you make it a
priority that you begin to live it out, you begin
to work out what you believe to be true. So
as you listen today, here's our number (877) 548-3675. The story
(02:17):
you tell the woman you tell us about may be
exactly what somebody else needs to hear that today. Call
that number. Let's see what we can accomplish together. Here's
our team. Ryan. McConaughey's doing all things technical. Tricia is
our producer. Ryan is going to be answering your calls.
And I'm always encouraged when I hear somebody say about
this program. I got in the car. I heard you
(02:38):
talking about this. I couldn't believe it. It's it's what
I'm going through. Or I'll get an email or somebody
will write on Facebook. These topics are so encouraging and challenging.
That's what we do each day here. And we are
enabled to do that by you, by listeners who say, hey,
keep it up, don't stop, keep these kinds of conversations going.
We need them. If you feel that way, take a
(03:00):
minute today. Click through to the website. We have a
great thank you for anyone who gives a gift of
any size in July, which is going to be over
before you can blink a week in a couple of days.
Thank you. Those of you who have given. If you haven't,
become a friend and give a one time gift, become
a partner. It means you give each month. So helpful
(03:21):
to us. I have a copy of Colin Smith's excellent
30 day journey through the scriptures. Drive through the Bible.
It'll help you see how all the back roads and
the dirt paths connect with the interstate of God's grace
and mercy that runs through the entire Bible. I'd love
to send you a copy of Drive Thru the Bible.
Call 86695 Faberry today or if it's easier, just go
(03:45):
to the website you can give right there Chris Fabry.
Chris Fabry live and become a friend or partner today. Well,
I am looking forward to. What are you going to
talk about today on our Facebook page, I asked this
what woman in your life, the Bible or history do
you want to emulate? And Joe said, Mary, the sister
(04:09):
of Martha and Lazarus, who sat at the feet of Jesus,
may I always focus on Jesus as that is all
that matters? What about you? (877) 548-3675 I've asked Jamie Janos
to be first up today. She wrote a book a
few years ago that we've talked about here, titled When
Others Shuttered eight Women Who Refused to Give up. And
(04:33):
I think that perseverance thing, that's one of the quotients
that we're going to hear today, uh, I'm looking forward
to what Jamie has to say. Jamie, start us off
with your nominee or nominees.
S2 (04:45):
Oh, it's hard to narrow it down, Chris, because my
mind is actually just whirling through women that I've known
in my life and women I've read about. But I'll
tell you one woman that has remained impactful to me,
and that's Johnny Erickson. Tada! Um, I saw Johnny's story
when I was, um, going to the movies in junior high.
(05:07):
You know, she her life story was portrayed on film,
where she had this diving accident that left her paralyzed
and devastating. Right. And how really, in that she found God. Um,
but but her story hasn't stopped there. I mean, she
has kept going and had a lifelong marriage and a
(05:27):
lifelong ministry to others with disabilities. She has, you know,
even with physical, um, issues, she continues to to paint
and to write and to speak. And so it just
has been kind of a heroic figure to me, and
an example of not giving up under great duress and
letting God just speak through your story, no matter what
(05:50):
pain you endure.
S1 (05:52):
Oh, that's so good. And there it is again. That.
That place where her deep wound and the needs of
the world meet. Uh. And the place of healing in
her life, though she didn't have physical healing. You know,
she's still dealing with those the things that she was
dealing with when she was a teenager and had the accident.
(06:12):
But that wound that she has been through has become
a source of healing for others all these years later. Right?
S2 (06:22):
Yeah. She's let that pain not turn in on herself.
I think when I go through pain, the temptation is
to make it all about you. You know, it becomes
all about you. And it's just it's so painful. And
it's so draws your focus to yourself. But Johnny has
turned it to the Lord, you know. And she even
said once that her story isn't important unless it's woven
(06:44):
through with Scripture. Like she wants people to turn to
God in His word. And, um, that's a reminder to
me to not ever make it about myself.
S1 (06:53):
Yeah. Reading through Second Corinthians and those words jumped out
at me in chapter four. It says, therefore, since we
have this ministry because we were shown mercy, we do
not give up. And then, uh, we have this treasure
in clay jars, earthen vessels, so that the extraordinary power
may be from God. You know, when we're weak, he
(07:15):
he's strong. There's there's the verse for Johnny. And then
verse 16 says the same thing. Therefore we do not
give up. So a woman after God, after God's own heart,
a woman you want to emulate keeps going, doesn't give up, right?
S2 (07:32):
Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, and it's hard work. I,
I love how humble she is and how open she
is about it. She doesn't hide the fact that sometimes
it's just awful. You know, she was talking about the
frustration of having to wait to have others get her
out of bed in the morning, for example. And I
can't imagine that I complain about much smaller things. Um,
(07:53):
but you know, that that kind of humility of saying, yes,
I am weak, but God is strong. And, um, and
I hope that I can be that kind of person
that tells people I am weak. But God is so strong.
S1 (08:06):
It's a great way to start. Hey, you have to
go back to the book, though, that you wrote a
few years ago when others shuttered. Is there one woman
that you think, oh, I gotta I gotta mention her
here today.
S2 (08:18):
Well, I'll mention Mary McLeod Bethune because she not only
attended Moody, but her home. Her historic home is, um,
a few miles from me here in Florida. And she.
So she was a woman who was, um, born into slavery. Um,
she was actually the first person born free in her family. Um,
(08:39):
but she went on for schooling, aspired to be a missionary,
was told no, um, due to her race and still
kept going. And she has this huge legacy. Her life
is really one that every Christian woman should read and know,
because it's so encouraging to see how she dealt with
the no's in life when God, for some reason and
(09:02):
it's not your own fault, but a door shuts firmly
in your face, what do you do? And for Mary,
God redirected her path and she ended up just doing
all kinds of things for his glory beyond her imagination.
So I think she resonates with me.
S1 (09:19):
So that injustice, or the thing that is unjust, that
can happen to you, a decision that somebody else that
makes it, that that feels, you know, this, this should
not be. And it's true. This should not be us.
She didn't let that stop her. She didn't let that
hold her back.
S2 (09:37):
Right. Right. For for others. They might have considered it
a closed door. And she said maybe God didn't want
me to do that. You know, maybe there's something else
for me. And she kept going, and she made her
way from Chicago down to Florida. Here she started a
little girl, a school in a shack with no money.
She had coins in her pocket and talked them into
(09:58):
giving her a space. Today it's a college. But she
she went on to do much more beyond that, standing
up for people in a time of great racial division,
fighting for their rights. Um, just a woman of faith
that so many admire still today.
S1 (10:16):
Yeah. And might that be, you know, for yesterday, the
man I want to be today, the woman I want
to be. Might that inform our lives with Johnny and
with Mary? Now, what about you? Here's a number (877) 548-3675.
Who is the woman from your life or from the
(10:36):
Bible or from history that you say that's the woman.
The qualities in a woman that I want to emulate. Eight. 7754.
Eight 5483675 Jamie Janos thank you. More straight ahead on
Moody Radio. Yesterday was the man I want to become.
(11:05):
The man I want to be. What kind of qualities
does he exhibit? And we talked about that today. It
is the woman I want to be. What woman in
your life do you want to emulate and why? 8775483. 675.
Wanda is in Tennessee. Wanda, what's your answer to that
(11:25):
question today?
S3 (11:28):
First of all, hi, Chris. How are you?
S1 (11:32):
I'm doing great. I'm doing great. I didn't understand you
there at first. My ears that weren't working, but I'm
doing great.
S4 (11:39):
This is my first time calling in, and I just
wanted to say, first of all, that I love listening
to you. But I called in today because your topic,
it touched my heart. So the woman that I would
choose would be my mother. Her name was Hazel. She
died when I was younger. Um, she cleaned houses for
(12:02):
a living, and she had six kids. Well, seven total,
but she lost one that I never got to meet.
And she had 14 siblings. And at the time, she
was the first one of her siblings to pass. My
mother died from stage four colon cancer. I would watch
this woman get up and go to work, not understanding
the fullness. Now I'm an adult and I do understand
(12:25):
because I'm retired out of the medical field and she's
part of why I went into the medical field. During Thanksgiving,
she died at Thanksgiving Day, but prior to that, she
wanted to have a meal, and she wanted to cook
the meal for all her siblings, their children and her
grandchildren that she had at the time. She wouldn't take
(12:47):
her morphine tablets. They were giving out morphine. Then she
said she wanted to feel and have the experience. I
watched my mom with cancer cook for three days, and
I watched the family come over and everybody was laughing
and happy, and I was sitting there. I remember seeing
her sitting in the corner, um, just smiling. And shortly
(13:10):
after that, she went on to be with the Lord.
My mom would moan and groan. She would, you know,
the old humming moaning that mothers did back in the day.
Now I'm saved. I get it now. But back then
I never understood what she was doing. But the scripture
says that the Holy Spirit makes moanings and groanings that
(13:31):
when we don't know what to say to God, he
does that. And so to watch her go through that,
to love the Lord and to still be a kind, generous,
loving woman in spite of the hand that was dealt
to her, and still loved the Lord and not be bitter. Yes,
I want to emulate that.
S1 (13:51):
Yes.
S4 (13:52):
I love to emulate that.
S1 (13:54):
That's it. That's it right there. And there was a
somebody on Facebook who mentioned Corrie Ten Boom, and they
said about Corrie that even with all that she went through,
with all the loss in her family, you know, and
the concentration camp and all that, she didn't let bitterness
overcome her. She worked through it wasn't that it wasn't
(14:17):
a hard thing. Just like your mom. It's the cancer
thought really, really hard thing to go through. But she
didn't let that turn her. As Jamie was saying, turn
her inward. It turned her outward, didn't it?
S4 (14:31):
I want to add one more thing. And when you
think about this and again, now that I'm an adult
woman in my 50s, I can appreciate it. My mom
knew that she was dying and she had to leave
me behind. I was a little girl, so imagine what
that had to feel like for her to just say, okay, God,
(14:52):
I trust you that this child is going to be fine.
Because me and my mom, it was I was the
last kid at home. So we were very close, you know,
and just she just is an amazing woman to me.
If she wasn't my mother, I would have wanted her
to be my mother.
S1 (15:10):
How old were you when she passed away?
S4 (15:14):
Oh, I wasn't even in grandma's. I wasn't even in. Um,
I was in grammar school. I was in grammar school
when mom passed.
S1 (15:20):
But you remember.
S4 (15:21):
Her.
S1 (15:22):
You've got this image of her in the corner of
the room, smiling, right?
S4 (15:27):
I can't forget, mom. I mean, she left an impact.
I tell you, Chris. When my mother died. This is
going to sound crazy to some believers, but this is
not my home. So I would always tell the Lord
I would like a. Processional. Excuse me? Like my mom had.
It was so many cars in back of that woman's casket.
(15:52):
I remember, I remember thinking that as a kid and
this woman scrubbed toilets for a living. You had rich people,
poor people, black people, Asian people, people that loved Hazel
because Hazel loved them. She left an impact for the kingdom.
And she went through that cancer with grace. With grace.
(16:14):
I just I think the world of that lady. I
can't wait to see her one day again. I miss her.
S1 (16:20):
I can't wait to see the two of you together.
S3 (16:25):
Yeah.
S4 (16:26):
She used to tell this story. You will find me
at the Jordan River, dipping my toe in the water.
I'll be sitting there waiting.
S1 (16:34):
You know.
S4 (16:35):
What.
S1 (16:35):
I think there's. And Randy Alcorn and others talk about this,
that there's something about heaven that is going to capture
the the we're going to have things to do. We're
just not going to sit on a cloud and play
a harp. You know, God is going to have things
for us to do. And I can just imagine the
goodness of God and the the kindness of Jesus to
(16:56):
say to Hazel, hey, Hazel, you're going to have a
banquet and I want you in charge. You know, and
so she has and she's going to sit in the
corner again and smile at what's going on there. Um,
and I want to be in that number. Don't you?
S5 (17:13):
And she was a great cook, so maybe he'll let
her cook.
S1 (17:17):
He better. God bless you. Wanda, thank you for calling
in today. And, uh. And that something she mentioned. It
reminds me of a caller yesterday. Um, it was Robert.
We were talking with Robert about Larry Burkett. There was
a rock ribbed trust that Larry had in his life.
(17:38):
That trickled down to everybody who worked with him alongside him.
Trickled down, trickled down. Trust. And that's what happened in
Wanda's life with Hazel. There was a trust that she had,
even though she was not long for this world, and
she had a little girl, she still trusted God. That's
(18:00):
a big obstacle. That's huge. Are you there now? I
don't know what you're going through. Does that speak into
your life? We have, uh, Eve on the line from Michigan.
Just every and every day. Eva, who's married to a
Michael who has a microphone in Michigan. Eva, how are
you today?
S6 (18:21):
Hey, Chris, great to talk with you.
S1 (18:23):
Uh, so these are really good stories. What bubbles to
the surface for you? When I asked that question about
the woman you want to emulate.
S6 (18:33):
Well, you mentioned her name a minute ago that someone
had indicated on Facebook, Corrie ten boom. She has been
my hero, um, since the 70s when I first read
her book, and she is one of the most outstanding
and courageous people that that I've, that I've come across. And, uh,
(18:55):
she is she would be the person that I want
to be when I grow up. Um, it was interesting
when I her.
S1 (19:02):
Story, though. You don't know her story, but the darkness,
but the, you know, the evil that was all around her. Right.
S6 (19:10):
Well, this is the thing. You know, when I read
her story, I was about 20, I guess, and I thought, oh,
she must have been about 20 when she was doing
all these courageous things of this young Dutch woman with
her family who owned a watch shop, standing against the
Nazis and hiding Jewish people in their home. Well, then,
as I began to really read and know about her,
she was she was already in her late 40s when
(19:32):
she began to work in the resistance against the Nazis.
And she was early 50s when she was put into
concentration camp. You know, this is what what a hero.
And as a result of her efforts to save Jewish
people through the hiding place, through documents, getting false documents
(19:53):
and ration cards and transport information, she personally seems to
have been responsible for the rescue of more than 800
Jewish people. Wow. So she and one of the favorite
things that that she said is that if God sends
you on stony paths, he provides strong shoes. And I thought,
(20:17):
what a great picture, too, because when she was a
young person, when she was a middle aged person, by
the time she went to concentration camp, wooden shoes were
still being worn in the Netherlands. And so when I
picture those strong shoes that God gave her to endure,
her father said to her, when you go through difficult times,
God only gives you the ticket to. And for the
(20:38):
courage when the moment comes that you don't need to
worry in the future, that he doesn't need our advice.
The Lord doesn't need our advice. All we need to
do is to report for duty and obey him.
S1 (20:53):
Each day has enough trouble of its own, right?
S6 (20:56):
Yes, yes. And you know, sometimes we think because her
name is the most well known of of Dutch resistance people,
we feel like. Well, all Holland must have been very
supportive of their Jewish community, when, in fact, of all
the countries in Western Europe, Holland gave up more Jews
to the Nazis than any other country.
S1 (21:15):
Really?
S6 (21:16):
So for her to be standing with the Jewish people
and rescuing them, she was standing not only against the Nazis,
but against the common attitude of the other citizens of
Holland around her. And it makes me think of a proverb?
What do you know, Chris? Makes me think of the
proverb in Proverbs 24. It says, if you are slack
(21:37):
in the day of distress, your strength is limited. Deliver
those who are being taken away to death, and those
who are staggering to slaughter or hold them back. If
you say, see, we did not know this, does not
he consider it? Who weighs the hearts, and does not
he know it? Who keeps your soul? And will he
(21:57):
not render to each man according to his work? So
she was so courageous in her efforts to stand with
the Jewish people during that Nazi era. And one of
the reasons that she is a hero to me, and
a person that I would long to, to her qualities
be lived out for me in my own life is
(22:20):
because we right now in the United States, are facing
conditions that are reminiscent of Nazi Germany. Michael and I
often say it's 1938 all over again. That the tide
of opinion toward Jewish people, toward the nation of Israel is, uh,
as as negative as it has been since the 30s.
(22:41):
And often in a group, if you stand up and
say you support Israel or you stand against anti-Semitism, you're
really looked at as a hater instead of a rescuer.
So we need the courage that Corrie Ten boom had
to stand against hatred of the Jewish people right now
in America, where we are. She's my hero.
S1 (23:02):
There's also this micro-macro thing that, you know, you can
you can think, well, I'm going through something bad, but
at least I'm not going through what Corrie went through.
And we compare, you know, we compare our struggles and
all of that. Right. Right. And I but I think there's,
you know, there's at the end of her life, someone
posted this on Facebook as well. She, she had a stroke.
(23:23):
She was in the hospital. She had physical therapy. But
for the last few years of her life, she didn't
regain her speech. And there are people who are in
the throes of going through that or going through that
with a loved one who are wondering, you know, why
did this happen and why did God allow this to happen?
(23:45):
Why did God allow the bad things to happen in
my life? But she persevered even through that in those
silent years of her life, didn't she?
S6 (23:53):
Right. She did. She trusted God. Um, no matter what
was happening in her life, whether it was the the
death of her father, the murder of her sister, she
had a she had a nephew who was working with
the resistance, and he was 24 years old, was taken
to Bergen-Belsen and was killed in concentration camp there. So
there was a lot more loss in her family in
(24:15):
the Second World War than we are mostly aware of.
But as you say, the outstanding thing about her is
that she forgave the people who were the the most
ungodly and that she traveled around the world from that
from the age 60 to 80 or whatever, uh, teaching
the gospel around the world and in countless countries. And
(24:37):
I was so happy that as a moody student, she
was on campus a couple times, and I got to
meet her. Wow. So she is a great example. Like
you say, it's not just because of what happened in
the war, but it's all that she did afterwards in
proclaiming that Jesus loves you and you need to put
your trust in him because he died for our sins
and rose again no matter what your circumstances are.
S7 (24:59):
Faithful with her story, faithful.
S1 (25:01):
With the pain. Faithful no matter what God has given.
I think there's a lot of lot to be said
for what Wanda said about her mom, Hazel and Corey.
You know, it's the same thing here. Eva, you done
a good thing. Thank you for coming alongside us today.
S6 (25:16):
Uh thank you Chris. It's always a wonderful to talk
with you.
S7 (25:20):
Eva.
S1 (25:21):
Nick takes us to Proverbs every time she comes on here.
How about you? Now, know, who is the woman you've
heard about, Johnny Erickson. Tada! Mary McLeod Bethune. We've heard
about Hazel. Now we've heard about Cary. Who is the
woman that you say? This is who I want to
be by God's grace. This is how I want to
live my life. (877) 548-3675. Woman or man can call us. (877) 548-3675.
(26:04):
I don't know why or how you've stumbled onto our
conversation here today, but I believe something good happens when
we talk about topics like this, when we mine our
own lives and the lives of others. The topic today
is the woman I want to be. Who is the
woman that exhibits qualities that you want to emulate. Eva
(26:25):
mentioned before I talked with her in a break and
she said, Corey said this, you can never. Never hear
I didn't write this. Learn that Christ is all you
need until Christ is all you have. There it is.
You can never learn that Christ is all you need
until Christ is all you have. And maybe that's what
(26:48):
you needed to hear today. Um. Linda's on the line. Linda,
who do you want to nominate for our conversation?
S8 (26:57):
Yes, I would like to nominate my former my friend
and former pastor's wife, Karen Rackets. Karen was a super
of Sunday school, and I was a young adult in
the church. And I actually watched her how she taught
(27:17):
the children and the children were so engaged, and I
was I was also engaged and she taught with enthusiasm
and creativity. And I'm now, um, excuse me, I am
the director of children's church, so I the things that
(27:41):
I saw and heard, I, I wanted to do because
I know that it worked with the children because they learned.
S7 (27:49):
Well, it worked with you, didn't it? Yes. Yes, it.
S8 (27:53):
Worked with me. Yes. That's correct.
S7 (27:55):
So you caught it. Look at that. Yeah. This is
this kind of thing. You catch that.
S1 (28:00):
Vision and my guess is. I'm sorry to interrupt you, Linda,
but I'm so excited about this because this is probably,
you know, uh, I don't know if she did or not,
but probably she didn't write a book. There's not a
movie that was made after her. She didn't win the
World Series. She doesn't have a lot of accolades. She
don't have a doesn't have a lot of awards behind
her name, but she made a deep impression on you.
(28:24):
She spent time with you and with those other children.
She was excited. She poured herself out into that whatever,
however big that group was, and did it unto God
for them. Am I getting her right?
S8 (28:38):
Yes. Yes. Yes. And she actually, um, she's actually still
doing that, you know, on a smaller level. She's not
the superintendent at the church where she is. But, you know,
she used a flannel graph and and she told me,
(29:00):
don't put the, the characters on, on the board by
holding them by their head. I remember so and so
I used that I teach also, I'm the director, but
I teach, I teach the younger children and I just
really love it because they really they just they are.
S1 (29:20):
So I can tell from your voice. You're came alive
when you started talking about the flannelgraph and not holding
by the head. You know, your voice came alive. And
that is the power of somebody who who does what
they do, you know, for other people. But she got
so much joy. It sounds like it still gets so
(29:40):
much joy out of doing that. Now, let that instruct
us today. You and me. What is it that that
God has given us to do, that we could do
in our own strength? Or we could do full tilt,
you know, uh, doing doing it as unto him. Uh,
you've said a really good thing here. I'm glad to
(30:01):
hear about Karen. Linda, thanks for calling today.
S8 (30:05):
All right. Thank you.
S1 (30:07):
Here's one of my favorite people in the world. Uh, author, speaker,
fellow traveler Jan Sylvius. Jan, you've known a lot of
women through the years with the kind of qualities that
we're talking about today. I have a question before you
mention the one that you've thought about or 2 or
3 or however many. And that is we talked about
the men yesterday and some of the qualities of men. Um,
(30:31):
a good listener, the trickle down trust, generosity, forgiveness, perseverance.
And I see what we're talking about. Women, a lot
of the same qualities are in the, you know, for
men as for women. They just come out a little
bit differently. Uh, talk about that comment.
S9 (30:54):
Well, I think, uh, I think for men I see
protection and for women I see nurturing. And it comes
in a little different form as a protector. Um, I
think a man has the strength of the, of the
one who protects, who holds the door when the hurricane
(31:15):
comes through. And then the woman is the one who
is has people huddled, has the children huddled around her
and is still protecting, but is nurturing while she's doing it.
And I just see that as kind of a difference, um,
between the two.
S1 (31:32):
Yeah. No. That's good. That's. And we saw that in
Texas with, uh, the floods and the loss of life there.
You saw these hard, grizzled men going out to do
this hard work and women as well. Um, but you
saw them, and then you saw the tenderness, the gentleness
and how overcome they were. I mentioned this yesterday about,
(31:54):
you know, the picture, the images that we got from that,
that you're doing a job, but at the same time
you're overwhelmed by the the loss of life and the
and the struggle.
S9 (32:05):
Right, absolutely. Their tenderness was so there, but they could
not let it stop them from from doing the really
hard thing.
S1 (32:15):
Bingo. Okay, so can you nominate somebody, some woman that
you've known or that you've seen?
S9 (32:21):
Well, you know, I've always said one of my best
mentors I never met because she died a long time ago,
and that was Amy Carmichael. And she was the missionary
to India for 50 years. And what I loved about
Amy was that she had a mission, and that was
to rescue children from temple prostitution in India. But about
(32:45):
two thirds of the way through her journey, one night
she was going into a house to stay. The missionaries
were taking a journey and she was going to stay
in this house. But the wrong key was used to
open the wrong door. And she walked into a dark
room and she fell into a nightsoil pit, which was
(33:09):
basically a bathroom. And she fell into that and she
fractured and broke her body. And from that time on,
she never was up and walking again. But that began
the time of her life where she was the most
effective that she had ever been, because she began to write,
(33:33):
and she began to write to her students and to
write to the people who had come through her mission
school and whom she had rescued. And in that writing,
we now have her words in books, um, that have
been used all over the world. And, um, I know
(33:55):
so many women who have been impacted by the writing
of Amy Carmichael, and she never would have done that
had she not fallen that night in the wrong house
with the wrong key to the wrong room. And yet
God used it mightily. I love that.
S10 (34:12):
I do too.
S1 (34:13):
And and it gets back to that thing that I
said at the beginning of the program about the obstacles,
the obstacle that is there in front of you right
now can hold you back, and you can get really
upset and angry and bitter, you know, because you can't,
you know, you've got an obstacle there. Or I think
of the apostle Paul, what he must have felt being imprisoned.
(34:35):
And look at what God used, the writing that he
did there and chained up. And the same way with Amy.
They the quality is they don't let the obstacles hold
them back from doing what they were called to do
with wherever they are, with, with the strength that they have.
S9 (34:56):
Exactly. And and as and as my friend and mentor
Kay Arthur often said, any old Bush will do in
any old situation, you know, and and that's really I mean,
I saw her I, of course, was friends with her
for so many years and I saw her go through
difficult times, and yet she pressed on and did what
(35:20):
God had called her to do, despite the difficulties around her.
And courage was the thing that I think I, I learned. Um,
I think sometimes you have to learn courage because I
don't think I was that courageous as a kid. I
can remember standing behind people who were a little tougher
than I was, but I learned courage by watching courage
(35:42):
and in women that I would like to be like. And, um,
so now I think I have developed some courage. And, um,
I would hope I could say to those who follow me,
you know, follow me as I follow Christ, um, with courage.
And so I think that's part of the learning.
S1 (36:03):
What do you miss most about Kay these days?
S9 (36:06):
Oh, my, I miss, I miss, uh, picking up the
phone and calling her, or I miss her calling me
and her saying, well, Jan Sylvius, that's you. I said, yes,
that's me. And, um, she just she just had a
warmth and, um, that was special. And she made everyone
(36:30):
feel as if they were the most special people in
her world. And, um, and it was genuine. She loved people,
and I just knew that she loved me, and I
miss that.
S1 (36:42):
Well, and she was a a great encourager to, you know, just. Oh, yes.
By the the smile on her face, you know, if
you'd never met her before, the smile on her face.
But I don't think I ever spoke with her through
the years that she didn't end in some way with, oh,
you're doing a great job. And and you just feel
like you're walking on a cloud after talking with somebody
(37:04):
like that, who lifts you up?
S9 (37:06):
Exactly. I mean, you nailed it. And, you know, Chris,
it was it was funny. I, of course, worked with
her so many years, and I had to teach in
front of her. And and if anyone anyone's heard her teach,
they know she's just the premier teacher. And, um, often
I would say, okay, you cannot be there. I absolutely
(37:28):
cannot teach in front of you. She would say, well,
why not? And I said, is it not obvious? And, um,
but she would find some way to, to make her way,
I would call it sneak into the room and, uh,
she would be in the corner somewhere, and in my
heart I would know she was there, but she wouldn't
let me see her, which was really gracious. And then
(37:50):
I got to the point where I didn't. I didn't mind,
but oh, my. The years that I would say, oh, please,
I don't want to teach in front of you. But
she was always that, that consummate encourager. Um, as you said,
you can do this. Of course you can do this.
I love to hear you teach. So excuse me. So
(38:12):
it was always, um. She was she was a great encourager.
And I think that takes courage, too.
S1 (38:19):
Exactly.
S9 (38:20):
Courage to be an encourager.
S1 (38:22):
That's the. That's the root word of their courage and encourage.
And then you mentioned Amy Carmichael. Oh, this is really good. I, uh,
I'd be listening to this program even if I wasn't
hosting it today, because there's something here for everybody. Of course,
the topic is the woman I want to be, who
I want to emulate. But this this translates to men
(38:43):
and women. We talked about men yesterday. We're talking about
men today. That's Jan Silvius. And next we're going to
the mountains of North Carolina. And, uh, a friend of
our very first caller today, our first guest on the program,
we're going to hear from her. You got to hear
this in our final segment. This is Chris Fabry live
(39:05):
on Moody Radio. So yesterday it was. I want to
be that kind of man. What kind of man? Tell
me about that. Tell me if you go back and
listen to the program yesterday, you'll hear that discussion today. It's.
(39:27):
I'll be that kind of woman. And Jamie talked about
Johnny Erickson Tada and Mary McLeod Bethune. Hazel, who cleaned
houses for a living. But her life spoke to Wanda Corrie,
ten boom. She has spoken to a number of people
through the years, but especially Eva Adesnik, um, Karen, a
(39:47):
pastor's wife who poured her life out into her. The
children that she taught Amy Carmichael. Kay, Arthur Jan just
told us about that. Now we go to the mountains
of North Carolina and hear from award winning children's author
and book editor, Amanda Cleary Estep. And let me mention
her Tree Street Kids series if you're looking for something
this summer for your middle grade children to read, it's
(40:08):
an excellent series. Five books are out right now. We
have one of those listed at the website. Number six
comes out in just a couple of weeks. Jack and
the Red giant Amanda Cleary E-step. Amanda, tell me the
woman you thought of when I asked this question.
S11 (40:24):
Oh, I'm so I'm so glad you invited me. Chris,
it's fun to talk to you again. And, you know, really,
the first thing that popped into my head as far
as the woman I aspire to be, is really a
combination of the best parts of the women who have
influenced me and loved me throughout my life. So, for instance,
(40:46):
I aspire to have my mom's generosity to her family.
I mean, she she loves buying she she clothes all
the littlest people in the family and the extended family.
So we call that shopping for Jesus. Um, and, um,
my grandmother. She really had a heart for storytelling, which
(41:06):
as a writer, that I think really formed me as
I was growing up and listening to all her stories
that she would tell about her growing up in southern Illinois. Um,
and then I think the loyalty of my best friends, um,
I have very long time friends. One you spoke with, um,
at the beginning of the hour, I think Jamie Janos,
(41:29):
the managing editor of today and the word we have
been friends since, um, college. And so she is just, um,
she's she inspires me with her her creativity and her
style and her wisdom. And, um, but there are two
women who inspire me the most, and I think they
(41:51):
they might be surprised for me to say this since
they're younger than I am, but they are my two
daughters and they're grown, grown women now. But my eldest
is Mackenzie. You might remember Mackenzie. She called in when
we were talking. I think it was last year about
favorite books. And she. She surprised us with a call
(42:13):
in to tell us about how she loved To Kill
a mockingbird. And I had to tell you. Hey, that's
my daughter.
S12 (42:21):
That's right.
S11 (42:22):
Yeah, yeah. So. But, Mackenzie, she really inspires me to
be wildly creative again, which is helpful with with the
work that I do. And she's also rekindled for me, um,
a lifelong love of nature and science. And so she's
(42:43):
done formal training, education on that. And I've gone into, um,
some Blue Ridge Naturalist classes to pursue that. So we're
we're sharing that love of that together and, you know,
encouraging each other and our ongoing learning in that. And
then my youngest is Megan. Um, she has really inspired
(43:04):
me over her young life, her her 20 some years
to really be bold in my faith and to step
out of my comfort zone and into the work of
the Holy Spirit. Megan is. I don't think Megan has
ever lived in a comfort zone. Um, so, uh, you know,
18 and her first trip overseas was to a refugee
(43:26):
camp in Algeria. And so, I mean, how can you
not be inspired by something like that? So it's really
all these women, uh, past, present, and they continuously, uh,
point me straight back to Jesus. They they they point
me back to the character of God himself, his goodness,
(43:49):
his kindness, his strength, his love. Um, all of those
all those beautiful things that he is.
S1 (43:56):
Boldness to, you know, I think of Aslan Azlan and
how bold. He's not a tame lion, you know, he's got.
He's got a great heart. He's full of love and
mercy and grace. But boy, he ain't tame. He's. He's
fierce in a way. And I'm so glad that you
mentioned the younger women, because I expect the older women,
(44:16):
the mom, the grandmother. We had another caller who wrote
in a few minutes ago or called and couldn't stay
with us, who mentioned her daughter as well, that she's
an inspiration, that, like Paul said of Timothy, it's like,
don't let anybody look down on you because of your youth,
but live in a way, you know, live in front
(44:36):
of them in a way that shows this godly character
that he has given you. So it's we can learn
so much from those who've gone before, as well as
those who are coming behind. Right.
S11 (44:49):
Right. And, you know, I think with with voicing our
admiration for people who are younger than we are. That
that helps them to maybe aspire to to that, to
to be greater, to to love the Lord more deeply,
to to keep on that right path that they're already on.
(45:14):
And so I think it's really important. Um, you know,
that encouragement of Paul to Timothy, it was instrumental in,
in his ministry.
S1 (45:25):
Here's what I'll say, though, about you, Amanda. And I
don't know your relationship with your daughters other than what
you're telling me about here, but my guess is that
they were on the line. They would say, oh, but mom,
she gave us wings, gave us this wind. We wouldn't do,
(45:45):
you know, be able to do the things we're doing
without your input in their lives to to buoy them
up and to lift them up. So I think it
goes both ways, don't you?
S11 (45:57):
Yes. And that's that. Whole iron sharpens iron, I suppose. Right.
We all need each other to do that and to
encourage each other.
S1 (46:07):
Amanda Clary Estep, if you go to Chris. Org, we've
got one of our books in that Tree Street Kids
series linked right there. Number six comes out in a
couple of weeks. You can find out more. Just go
to Chris Fabry Live. Amanda, thank you for joining us
today and sharing about the women that you want to
emulate and that who inspire you. Now take this two
(46:31):
day series, Men and Women, and see what God can
do inside to cultivate this courage and encouragement and a
whole lot more. Chris Fabry lives production of Moody Radio
ministry of Moody Bible Institute.
Welcome to the radio backyard fence, the safe place for
ideas and struggles, conversations that get to the heart of
what you and I are going through, what you and
I want to become, and all the obstacles we face
in getting there. I wonder if those obstacles are there
for a bigger purpose than keeping us from something. Perhaps
the obstacles might help us climb a little bit higher today.
(00:29):
I think that's what we're going to see on today's
Chris Fabry live as we continue a discussion. We started yesterday.
We did an examination of the kind of man you
want to be, or the man you want your sons
to become. And the catalyst for that was the observation
of a wife who looked at something her husband had done.
She noticed it, first of all, and with great emotion,
(00:50):
she said, that is the kind of man he is.
She was complimenting him for the way his character motivated
him to act in a difficult situation. An obstacle had
come up in his life. So today we're going to
turn the focus on women and ask that same question
what kind of woman do you want to become? What
kind of woman do you want your daughters to become?
(01:13):
Who is an example in your life that you want
to emulate? What qualities does that woman exhibit? And we'll
look at women from the Bible, women from history to
find traits, actions, ways to live that stand out. And
it's my belief that you don't just take on those traits.
You have to see it. You have to see the
(01:35):
value of the qualities in those women around you. And
then there's intentionality. You have to act on what you believe.
I mean, if you say, I want to be a
woman of prayer like my friend or Miss Clara in
War room, I want to be a woman of prayer
like her. You can admire her all day long. You
can talk all about how she does what she does
(01:56):
and did to become a woman of prayer in a
fictional story that was based on a real person. But
it's when you follow through and you make it a
priority that you begin to live it out, you begin
to work out what you believe to be true. So
as you listen today, here's our number (877) 548-3675. The story
(02:17):
you tell the woman you tell us about may be
exactly what somebody else needs to hear that today. Call
that number. Let's see what we can accomplish together. Here's
our team. Ryan. McConaughey's doing all things technical. Tricia is
our producer. Ryan is going to be answering your calls.
And I'm always encouraged when I hear somebody say about
this program. I got in the car. I heard you
(02:38):
talking about this. I couldn't believe it. It's it's what
I'm going through. Or I'll get an email or somebody
will write on Facebook. These topics are so encouraging and challenging.
That's what we do each day here. And we are
enabled to do that by you, by listeners who say, hey,
keep it up, don't stop, keep these kinds of conversations going.
We need them. If you feel that way, take a
(03:00):
minute today. Click through to the website. We have a
great thank you for anyone who gives a gift of
any size in July, which is going to be over
before you can blink a week in a couple of days.
Thank you. Those of you who have given. If you haven't,
become a friend and give a one time gift, become
a partner. It means you give each month. So helpful
(03:21):
to us. I have a copy of Colin Smith's excellent
30 day journey through the scriptures. Drive through the Bible.
It'll help you see how all the back roads and
the dirt paths connect with the interstate of God's grace
and mercy that runs through the entire Bible. I'd love
to send you a copy of Drive Thru the Bible.
Call 86695 Faberry today or if it's easier, just go
(03:45):
to the website you can give right there Chris Fabry.
Chris Fabry live and become a friend or partner today. Well,
I am looking forward to. What are you going to
talk about today on our Facebook page, I asked this
what woman in your life, the Bible or history do
you want to emulate? And Joe said, Mary, the sister
(04:09):
of Martha and Lazarus, who sat at the feet of Jesus,
may I always focus on Jesus as that is all
that matters? What about you? (877) 548-3675 I've asked Jamie Janos
to be first up today. She wrote a book a
few years ago that we've talked about here, titled When
Others Shuttered eight Women Who Refused to Give up. And
(04:33):
I think that perseverance thing, that's one of the quotients
that we're going to hear today, uh, I'm looking forward
to what Jamie has to say. Jamie, start us off
with your nominee or nominees.
S2 (04:45):
Oh, it's hard to narrow it down, Chris, because my
mind is actually just whirling through women that I've known
in my life and women I've read about. But I'll
tell you one woman that has remained impactful to me,
and that's Johnny Erickson. Tada! Um, I saw Johnny's story
when I was, um, going to the movies in junior high.
(05:07):
You know, she her life story was portrayed on film,
where she had this diving accident that left her paralyzed
and devastating. Right. And how really, in that she found God. Um,
but but her story hasn't stopped there. I mean, she
has kept going and had a lifelong marriage and a
(05:27):
lifelong ministry to others with disabilities. She has, you know,
even with physical, um, issues, she continues to to paint
and to write and to speak. And so it just
has been kind of a heroic figure to me, and
an example of not giving up under great duress and
letting God just speak through your story, no matter what
(05:50):
pain you endure.
S1 (05:52):
Oh, that's so good. And there it is again. That.
That place where her deep wound and the needs of
the world meet. Uh. And the place of healing in
her life, though she didn't have physical healing. You know,
she's still dealing with those the things that she was
dealing with when she was a teenager and had the accident.
(06:12):
But that wound that she has been through has become
a source of healing for others all these years later. Right?
S2 (06:22):
Yeah. She's let that pain not turn in on herself.
I think when I go through pain, the temptation is
to make it all about you. You know, it becomes
all about you. And it's just it's so painful. And
it's so draws your focus to yourself. But Johnny has
turned it to the Lord, you know. And she even
said once that her story isn't important unless it's woven
(06:44):
through with Scripture. Like she wants people to turn to
God in His word. And, um, that's a reminder to
me to not ever make it about myself.
S1 (06:53):
Yeah. Reading through Second Corinthians and those words jumped out
at me in chapter four. It says, therefore, since we
have this ministry because we were shown mercy, we do
not give up. And then, uh, we have this treasure
in clay jars, earthen vessels, so that the extraordinary power
may be from God. You know, when we're weak, he
(07:15):
he's strong. There's there's the verse for Johnny. And then
verse 16 says the same thing. Therefore we do not
give up. So a woman after God, after God's own heart,
a woman you want to emulate keeps going, doesn't give up, right?
S2 (07:32):
Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, and it's hard work. I,
I love how humble she is and how open she
is about it. She doesn't hide the fact that sometimes
it's just awful. You know, she was talking about the
frustration of having to wait to have others get her
out of bed in the morning, for example. And I
can't imagine that I complain about much smaller things. Um,
(07:53):
but you know, that that kind of humility of saying, yes,
I am weak, but God is strong. And, um, and
I hope that I can be that kind of person
that tells people I am weak. But God is so strong.
S1 (08:06):
It's a great way to start. Hey, you have to
go back to the book, though, that you wrote a
few years ago when others shuttered. Is there one woman
that you think, oh, I gotta I gotta mention her
here today.
S2 (08:18):
Well, I'll mention Mary McLeod Bethune because she not only
attended Moody, but her home. Her historic home is, um,
a few miles from me here in Florida. And she.
So she was a woman who was, um, born into slavery. Um,
she was actually the first person born free in her family. Um,
(08:39):
but she went on for schooling, aspired to be a missionary,
was told no, um, due to her race and still
kept going. And she has this huge legacy. Her life
is really one that every Christian woman should read and know,
because it's so encouraging to see how she dealt with
the no's in life when God, for some reason and
(09:02):
it's not your own fault, but a door shuts firmly
in your face, what do you do? And for Mary,
God redirected her path and she ended up just doing
all kinds of things for his glory beyond her imagination.
So I think she resonates with me.
S1 (09:19):
So that injustice, or the thing that is unjust, that
can happen to you, a decision that somebody else that
makes it, that that feels, you know, this, this should
not be. And it's true. This should not be us.
She didn't let that stop her. She didn't let that
hold her back.
S2 (09:37):
Right. Right. For for others. They might have considered it
a closed door. And she said maybe God didn't want
me to do that. You know, maybe there's something else
for me. And she kept going, and she made her
way from Chicago down to Florida. Here she started a
little girl, a school in a shack with no money.
She had coins in her pocket and talked them into
(09:58):
giving her a space. Today it's a college. But she
she went on to do much more beyond that, standing
up for people in a time of great racial division,
fighting for their rights. Um, just a woman of faith
that so many admire still today.
S1 (10:16):
Yeah. And might that be, you know, for yesterday, the
man I want to be today, the woman I want
to be. Might that inform our lives with Johnny and
with Mary? Now, what about you? Here's a number (877) 548-3675.
Who is the woman from your life or from the
(10:36):
Bible or from history that you say that's the woman.
The qualities in a woman that I want to emulate. Eight. 7754.
Eight 5483675 Jamie Janos thank you. More straight ahead on
Moody Radio. Yesterday was the man I want to become.
(11:05):
The man I want to be. What kind of qualities
does he exhibit? And we talked about that today. It
is the woman I want to be. What woman in
your life do you want to emulate and why? 8775483. 675.
Wanda is in Tennessee. Wanda, what's your answer to that
(11:25):
question today?
S3 (11:28):
First of all, hi, Chris. How are you?
S1 (11:32):
I'm doing great. I'm doing great. I didn't understand you
there at first. My ears that weren't working, but I'm
doing great.
S4 (11:39):
This is my first time calling in, and I just
wanted to say, first of all, that I love listening
to you. But I called in today because your topic,
it touched my heart. So the woman that I would
choose would be my mother. Her name was Hazel. She
died when I was younger. Um, she cleaned houses for
(12:02):
a living, and she had six kids. Well, seven total,
but she lost one that I never got to meet.
And she had 14 siblings. And at the time, she
was the first one of her siblings to pass. My
mother died from stage four colon cancer. I would watch
this woman get up and go to work, not understanding
the fullness. Now I'm an adult and I do understand
(12:25):
because I'm retired out of the medical field and she's
part of why I went into the medical field. During Thanksgiving,
she died at Thanksgiving Day, but prior to that, she
wanted to have a meal, and she wanted to cook
the meal for all her siblings, their children and her
grandchildren that she had at the time. She wouldn't take
(12:47):
her morphine tablets. They were giving out morphine. Then she
said she wanted to feel and have the experience. I
watched my mom with cancer cook for three days, and
I watched the family come over and everybody was laughing
and happy, and I was sitting there. I remember seeing
her sitting in the corner, um, just smiling. And shortly
(13:10):
after that, she went on to be with the Lord.
My mom would moan and groan. She would, you know,
the old humming moaning that mothers did back in the day.
Now I'm saved. I get it now. But back then
I never understood what she was doing. But the scripture
says that the Holy Spirit makes moanings and groanings that
(13:31):
when we don't know what to say to God, he
does that. And so to watch her go through that,
to love the Lord and to still be a kind, generous,
loving woman in spite of the hand that was dealt
to her, and still loved the Lord and not be bitter. Yes,
I want to emulate that.
S1 (13:51):
Yes.
S4 (13:52):
I love to emulate that.
S1 (13:54):
That's it. That's it right there. And there was a
somebody on Facebook who mentioned Corrie Ten Boom, and they
said about Corrie that even with all that she went through,
with all the loss in her family, you know, and
the concentration camp and all that, she didn't let bitterness
overcome her. She worked through it wasn't that it wasn't
(14:17):
a hard thing. Just like your mom. It's the cancer
thought really, really hard thing to go through. But she
didn't let that turn her. As Jamie was saying, turn
her inward. It turned her outward, didn't it?
S4 (14:31):
I want to add one more thing. And when you
think about this and again, now that I'm an adult
woman in my 50s, I can appreciate it. My mom
knew that she was dying and she had to leave
me behind. I was a little girl, so imagine what
that had to feel like for her to just say, okay, God,
(14:52):
I trust you that this child is going to be fine.
Because me and my mom, it was I was the
last kid at home. So we were very close, you know,
and just she just is an amazing woman to me.
If she wasn't my mother, I would have wanted her
to be my mother.
S1 (15:10):
How old were you when she passed away?
S4 (15:14):
Oh, I wasn't even in grandma's. I wasn't even in. Um,
I was in grammar school. I was in grammar school
when mom passed.
S1 (15:20):
But you remember.
S4 (15:21):
Her.
S1 (15:22):
You've got this image of her in the corner of
the room, smiling, right?
S4 (15:27):
I can't forget, mom. I mean, she left an impact.
I tell you, Chris. When my mother died. This is
going to sound crazy to some believers, but this is
not my home. So I would always tell the Lord
I would like a. Processional. Excuse me? Like my mom had.
It was so many cars in back of that woman's casket.
(15:52):
I remember, I remember thinking that as a kid and
this woman scrubbed toilets for a living. You had rich people,
poor people, black people, Asian people, people that loved Hazel
because Hazel loved them. She left an impact for the kingdom.
And she went through that cancer with grace. With grace.
(16:14):
I just I think the world of that lady. I
can't wait to see her one day again. I miss her.
S1 (16:20):
I can't wait to see the two of you together.
S3 (16:25):
Yeah.
S4 (16:26):
She used to tell this story. You will find me
at the Jordan River, dipping my toe in the water.
I'll be sitting there waiting.
S1 (16:34):
You know.
S4 (16:35):
What.
S1 (16:35):
I think there's. And Randy Alcorn and others talk about this,
that there's something about heaven that is going to capture
the the we're going to have things to do. We're
just not going to sit on a cloud and play
a harp. You know, God is going to have things
for us to do. And I can just imagine the
goodness of God and the the kindness of Jesus to
(16:56):
say to Hazel, hey, Hazel, you're going to have a
banquet and I want you in charge. You know, and
so she has and she's going to sit in the
corner again and smile at what's going on there. Um,
and I want to be in that number. Don't you?
S5 (17:13):
And she was a great cook, so maybe he'll let
her cook.
S1 (17:17):
He better. God bless you. Wanda, thank you for calling
in today. And, uh. And that something she mentioned. It
reminds me of a caller yesterday. Um, it was Robert.
We were talking with Robert about Larry Burkett. There was
a rock ribbed trust that Larry had in his life.
(17:38):
That trickled down to everybody who worked with him alongside him.
Trickled down, trickled down. Trust. And that's what happened in
Wanda's life with Hazel. There was a trust that she had,
even though she was not long for this world, and
she had a little girl, she still trusted God. That's
(18:00):
a big obstacle. That's huge. Are you there now? I
don't know what you're going through. Does that speak into
your life? We have, uh, Eve on the line from Michigan.
Just every and every day. Eva, who's married to a
Michael who has a microphone in Michigan. Eva, how are
you today?
S6 (18:21):
Hey, Chris, great to talk with you.
S1 (18:23):
Uh, so these are really good stories. What bubbles to
the surface for you? When I asked that question about
the woman you want to emulate.
S6 (18:33):
Well, you mentioned her name a minute ago that someone
had indicated on Facebook, Corrie ten boom. She has been
my hero, um, since the 70s when I first read
her book, and she is one of the most outstanding
and courageous people that that I've, that I've come across. And, uh,
(18:55):
she is she would be the person that I want
to be when I grow up. Um, it was interesting
when I her.
S1 (19:02):
Story, though. You don't know her story, but the darkness,
but the, you know, the evil that was all around her. Right.
S6 (19:10):
Well, this is the thing. You know, when I read
her story, I was about 20, I guess, and I thought, oh,
she must have been about 20 when she was doing
all these courageous things of this young Dutch woman with
her family who owned a watch shop, standing against the
Nazis and hiding Jewish people in their home. Well, then,
as I began to really read and know about her,
she was she was already in her late 40s when
(19:32):
she began to work in the resistance against the Nazis.
And she was early 50s when she was put into
concentration camp. You know, this is what what a hero.
And as a result of her efforts to save Jewish
people through the hiding place, through documents, getting false documents
(19:53):
and ration cards and transport information, she personally seems to
have been responsible for the rescue of more than 800
Jewish people. Wow. So she and one of the favorite
things that that she said is that if God sends
you on stony paths, he provides strong shoes. And I thought,
(20:17):
what a great picture, too, because when she was a
young person, when she was a middle aged person, by
the time she went to concentration camp, wooden shoes were
still being worn in the Netherlands. And so when I
picture those strong shoes that God gave her to endure,
her father said to her, when you go through difficult times,
God only gives you the ticket to. And for the
(20:38):
courage when the moment comes that you don't need to
worry in the future, that he doesn't need our advice.
The Lord doesn't need our advice. All we need to
do is to report for duty and obey him.
S1 (20:53):
Each day has enough trouble of its own, right?
S6 (20:56):
Yes, yes. And you know, sometimes we think because her
name is the most well known of of Dutch resistance people,
we feel like. Well, all Holland must have been very
supportive of their Jewish community, when, in fact, of all
the countries in Western Europe, Holland gave up more Jews
to the Nazis than any other country.
S1 (21:15):
Really?
S6 (21:16):
So for her to be standing with the Jewish people
and rescuing them, she was standing not only against the Nazis,
but against the common attitude of the other citizens of
Holland around her. And it makes me think of a proverb?
What do you know, Chris? Makes me think of the
proverb in Proverbs 24. It says, if you are slack
(21:37):
in the day of distress, your strength is limited. Deliver
those who are being taken away to death, and those
who are staggering to slaughter or hold them back. If
you say, see, we did not know this, does not
he consider it? Who weighs the hearts, and does not
he know it? Who keeps your soul? And will he
(21:57):
not render to each man according to his work? So
she was so courageous in her efforts to stand with
the Jewish people during that Nazi era. And one of
the reasons that she is a hero to me, and
a person that I would long to, to her qualities
be lived out for me in my own life is
(22:20):
because we right now in the United States, are facing
conditions that are reminiscent of Nazi Germany. Michael and I
often say it's 1938 all over again. That the tide
of opinion toward Jewish people, toward the nation of Israel is, uh,
as as negative as it has been since the 30s.
(22:41):
And often in a group, if you stand up and
say you support Israel or you stand against anti-Semitism, you're
really looked at as a hater instead of a rescuer.
So we need the courage that Corrie Ten boom had
to stand against hatred of the Jewish people right now
in America, where we are. She's my hero.
S1 (23:02):
There's also this micro-macro thing that, you know, you can
you can think, well, I'm going through something bad, but
at least I'm not going through what Corrie went through.
And we compare, you know, we compare our struggles and
all of that. Right. Right. And I but I think there's,
you know, there's at the end of her life, someone
posted this on Facebook as well. She, she had a stroke.
(23:23):
She was in the hospital. She had physical therapy. But
for the last few years of her life, she didn't
regain her speech. And there are people who are in
the throes of going through that or going through that
with a loved one who are wondering, you know, why
did this happen and why did God allow this to happen?
(23:45):
Why did God allow the bad things to happen in
my life? But she persevered even through that in those
silent years of her life, didn't she?
S6 (23:53):
Right. She did. She trusted God. Um, no matter what
was happening in her life, whether it was the the
death of her father, the murder of her sister, she
had a she had a nephew who was working with
the resistance, and he was 24 years old, was taken
to Bergen-Belsen and was killed in concentration camp there. So
there was a lot more loss in her family in
(24:15):
the Second World War than we are mostly aware of.
But as you say, the outstanding thing about her is
that she forgave the people who were the the most
ungodly and that she traveled around the world from that
from the age 60 to 80 or whatever, uh, teaching
the gospel around the world and in countless countries. And
(24:37):
I was so happy that as a moody student, she
was on campus a couple times, and I got to
meet her. Wow. So she is a great example. Like
you say, it's not just because of what happened in
the war, but it's all that she did afterwards in
proclaiming that Jesus loves you and you need to put
your trust in him because he died for our sins
and rose again no matter what your circumstances are.
S7 (24:59):
Faithful with her story, faithful.
S1 (25:01):
With the pain. Faithful no matter what God has given.
I think there's a lot of lot to be said
for what Wanda said about her mom, Hazel and Corey.
You know, it's the same thing here. Eva, you done
a good thing. Thank you for coming alongside us today.
S6 (25:16):
Uh thank you Chris. It's always a wonderful to talk
with you.
S7 (25:20):
Eva.
S1 (25:21):
Nick takes us to Proverbs every time she comes on here.
How about you? Now, know, who is the woman you've
heard about, Johnny Erickson. Tada! Mary McLeod Bethune. We've heard
about Hazel. Now we've heard about Cary. Who is the
woman that you say? This is who I want to
be by God's grace. This is how I want to
live my life. (877) 548-3675. Woman or man can call us. (877) 548-3675.
(26:04):
I don't know why or how you've stumbled onto our
conversation here today, but I believe something good happens when
we talk about topics like this, when we mine our
own lives and the lives of others. The topic today
is the woman I want to be. Who is the
woman that exhibits qualities that you want to emulate. Eva
(26:25):
mentioned before I talked with her in a break and
she said, Corey said this, you can never. Never hear
I didn't write this. Learn that Christ is all you
need until Christ is all you have. There it is.
You can never learn that Christ is all you need
until Christ is all you have. And maybe that's what
(26:48):
you needed to hear today. Um. Linda's on the line. Linda,
who do you want to nominate for our conversation?
S8 (26:57):
Yes, I would like to nominate my former my friend
and former pastor's wife, Karen Rackets. Karen was a super
of Sunday school, and I was a young adult in
the church. And I actually watched her how she taught
(27:17):
the children and the children were so engaged, and I
was I was also engaged and she taught with enthusiasm
and creativity. And I'm now, um, excuse me, I am
the director of children's church, so I the things that
(27:41):
I saw and heard, I, I wanted to do because
I know that it worked with the children because they learned.
S7 (27:49):
Well, it worked with you, didn't it? Yes. Yes, it.
S8 (27:53):
Worked with me. Yes. That's correct.
S7 (27:55):
So you caught it. Look at that. Yeah. This is
this kind of thing. You catch that.
S1 (28:00):
Vision and my guess is. I'm sorry to interrupt you, Linda,
but I'm so excited about this because this is probably,
you know, uh, I don't know if she did or not,
but probably she didn't write a book. There's not a
movie that was made after her. She didn't win the
World Series. She doesn't have a lot of accolades. She
don't have a doesn't have a lot of awards behind
her name, but she made a deep impression on you.
(28:24):
She spent time with you and with those other children.
She was excited. She poured herself out into that whatever,
however big that group was, and did it unto God
for them. Am I getting her right?
S8 (28:38):
Yes. Yes. Yes. And she actually, um, she's actually still
doing that, you know, on a smaller level. She's not
the superintendent at the church where she is. But, you know,
she used a flannel graph and and she told me,
(29:00):
don't put the, the characters on, on the board by
holding them by their head. I remember so and so
I used that I teach also, I'm the director, but
I teach, I teach the younger children and I just
really love it because they really they just they are.
S1 (29:20):
So I can tell from your voice. You're came alive
when you started talking about the flannelgraph and not holding
by the head. You know, your voice came alive. And
that is the power of somebody who who does what
they do, you know, for other people. But she got
so much joy. It sounds like it still gets so
(29:40):
much joy out of doing that. Now, let that instruct
us today. You and me. What is it that that
God has given us to do, that we could do
in our own strength? Or we could do full tilt,
you know, uh, doing doing it as unto him. Uh,
you've said a really good thing here. I'm glad to
(30:01):
hear about Karen. Linda, thanks for calling today.
S8 (30:05):
All right. Thank you.
S1 (30:07):
Here's one of my favorite people in the world. Uh, author, speaker,
fellow traveler Jan Sylvius. Jan, you've known a lot of
women through the years with the kind of qualities that
we're talking about today. I have a question before you
mention the one that you've thought about or 2 or
3 or however many. And that is we talked about
the men yesterday and some of the qualities of men. Um,
(30:31):
a good listener, the trickle down trust, generosity, forgiveness, perseverance.
And I see what we're talking about. Women, a lot
of the same qualities are in the, you know, for
men as for women. They just come out a little
bit differently. Uh, talk about that comment.
S9 (30:54):
Well, I think, uh, I think for men I see
protection and for women I see nurturing. And it comes
in a little different form as a protector. Um, I
think a man has the strength of the, of the
one who protects, who holds the door when the hurricane
(31:15):
comes through. And then the woman is the one who
is has people huddled, has the children huddled around her
and is still protecting, but is nurturing while she's doing it.
And I just see that as kind of a difference, um,
between the two.
S1 (31:32):
Yeah. No. That's good. That's. And we saw that in
Texas with, uh, the floods and the loss of life there.
You saw these hard, grizzled men going out to do
this hard work and women as well. Um, but you
saw them, and then you saw the tenderness, the gentleness
and how overcome they were. I mentioned this yesterday about,
(31:54):
you know, the picture, the images that we got from that,
that you're doing a job, but at the same time
you're overwhelmed by the the loss of life and the
and the struggle.
S9 (32:05):
Right, absolutely. Their tenderness was so there, but they could
not let it stop them from from doing the really
hard thing.
S1 (32:15):
Bingo. Okay, so can you nominate somebody, some woman that
you've known or that you've seen?
S9 (32:21):
Well, you know, I've always said one of my best
mentors I never met because she died a long time ago,
and that was Amy Carmichael. And she was the missionary
to India for 50 years. And what I loved about
Amy was that she had a mission, and that was
to rescue children from temple prostitution in India. But about
(32:45):
two thirds of the way through her journey, one night
she was going into a house to stay. The missionaries
were taking a journey and she was going to stay
in this house. But the wrong key was used to
open the wrong door. And she walked into a dark
room and she fell into a nightsoil pit, which was
(33:09):
basically a bathroom. And she fell into that and she
fractured and broke her body. And from that time on,
she never was up and walking again. But that began
the time of her life where she was the most
effective that she had ever been, because she began to write,
(33:33):
and she began to write to her students and to
write to the people who had come through her mission
school and whom she had rescued. And in that writing,
we now have her words in books, um, that have
been used all over the world. And, um, I know
(33:55):
so many women who have been impacted by the writing
of Amy Carmichael, and she never would have done that
had she not fallen that night in the wrong house
with the wrong key to the wrong room. And yet
God used it mightily. I love that.
S10 (34:12):
I do too.
S1 (34:13):
And and it gets back to that thing that I
said at the beginning of the program about the obstacles,
the obstacle that is there in front of you right
now can hold you back, and you can get really
upset and angry and bitter, you know, because you can't,
you know, you've got an obstacle there. Or I think
of the apostle Paul, what he must have felt being imprisoned.
(34:35):
And look at what God used, the writing that he
did there and chained up. And the same way with Amy.
They the quality is they don't let the obstacles hold
them back from doing what they were called to do
with wherever they are, with, with the strength that they have.
S9 (34:56):
Exactly. And and as and as my friend and mentor
Kay Arthur often said, any old Bush will do in
any old situation, you know, and and that's really I mean,
I saw her I, of course, was friends with her
for so many years and I saw her go through
difficult times, and yet she pressed on and did what
(35:20):
God had called her to do, despite the difficulties around her.
And courage was the thing that I think I, I learned. Um,
I think sometimes you have to learn courage because I
don't think I was that courageous as a kid. I
can remember standing behind people who were a little tougher
than I was, but I learned courage by watching courage
(35:42):
and in women that I would like to be like. And, um,
so now I think I have developed some courage. And, um,
I would hope I could say to those who follow me,
you know, follow me as I follow Christ, um, with courage.
And so I think that's part of the learning.
S1 (36:03):
What do you miss most about Kay these days?
S9 (36:06):
Oh, my, I miss, I miss, uh, picking up the
phone and calling her, or I miss her calling me
and her saying, well, Jan Sylvius, that's you. I said, yes,
that's me. And, um, she just she just had a
warmth and, um, that was special. And she made everyone
(36:30):
feel as if they were the most special people in
her world. And, um, and it was genuine. She loved people,
and I just knew that she loved me, and I
miss that.
S1 (36:42):
Well, and she was a a great encourager to, you know, just. Oh, yes.
By the the smile on her face, you know, if
you'd never met her before, the smile on her face.
But I don't think I ever spoke with her through
the years that she didn't end in some way with, oh,
you're doing a great job. And and you just feel
like you're walking on a cloud after talking with somebody
(37:04):
like that, who lifts you up?
S9 (37:06):
Exactly. I mean, you nailed it. And, you know, Chris,
it was it was funny. I, of course, worked with
her so many years, and I had to teach in
front of her. And and if anyone anyone's heard her teach,
they know she's just the premier teacher. And, um, often
I would say, okay, you cannot be there. I absolutely
(37:28):
cannot teach in front of you. She would say, well,
why not? And I said, is it not obvious? And, um,
but she would find some way to, to make her way,
I would call it sneak into the room and, uh,
she would be in the corner somewhere, and in my
heart I would know she was there, but she wouldn't
let me see her, which was really gracious. And then
(37:50):
I got to the point where I didn't. I didn't mind,
but oh, my. The years that I would say, oh, please,
I don't want to teach in front of you. But
she was always that, that consummate encourager. Um, as you said,
you can do this. Of course you can do this.
I love to hear you teach. So excuse me. So
(38:12):
it was always, um. She was she was a great encourager.
And I think that takes courage, too.
S1 (38:19):
Exactly.
S9 (38:20):
Courage to be an encourager.
S1 (38:22):
That's the. That's the root word of their courage and encourage.
And then you mentioned Amy Carmichael. Oh, this is really good. I, uh,
I'd be listening to this program even if I wasn't
hosting it today, because there's something here for everybody. Of course,
the topic is the woman I want to be, who
I want to emulate. But this this translates to men
(38:43):
and women. We talked about men yesterday. We're talking about
men today. That's Jan Silvius. And next we're going to
the mountains of North Carolina. And, uh, a friend of
our very first caller today, our first guest on the program,
we're going to hear from her. You got to hear
this in our final segment. This is Chris Fabry live
(39:05):
on Moody Radio. So yesterday it was. I want to
be that kind of man. What kind of man? Tell
me about that. Tell me if you go back and
listen to the program yesterday, you'll hear that discussion today. It's.
(39:27):
I'll be that kind of woman. And Jamie talked about
Johnny Erickson Tada and Mary McLeod Bethune. Hazel, who cleaned
houses for a living. But her life spoke to Wanda Corrie,
ten boom. She has spoken to a number of people
through the years, but especially Eva Adesnik, um, Karen, a
(39:47):
pastor's wife who poured her life out into her. The
children that she taught Amy Carmichael. Kay, Arthur Jan just
told us about that. Now we go to the mountains
of North Carolina and hear from award winning children's author
and book editor, Amanda Cleary Estep. And let me mention
her Tree Street Kids series if you're looking for something
this summer for your middle grade children to read, it's
(40:08):
an excellent series. Five books are out right now. We
have one of those listed at the website. Number six
comes out in just a couple of weeks. Jack and
the Red giant Amanda Cleary E-step. Amanda, tell me the
woman you thought of when I asked this question.
S11 (40:24):
Oh, I'm so I'm so glad you invited me. Chris,
it's fun to talk to you again. And, you know, really,
the first thing that popped into my head as far
as the woman I aspire to be, is really a
combination of the best parts of the women who have
influenced me and loved me throughout my life. So, for instance,
(40:46):
I aspire to have my mom's generosity to her family.
I mean, she she loves buying she she clothes all
the littlest people in the family and the extended family.
So we call that shopping for Jesus. Um, and, um,
my grandmother. She really had a heart for storytelling, which
(41:06):
as a writer, that I think really formed me as
I was growing up and listening to all her stories
that she would tell about her growing up in southern Illinois. Um,
and then I think the loyalty of my best friends, um,
I have very long time friends. One you spoke with, um,
at the beginning of the hour, I think Jamie Janos,
(41:29):
the managing editor of today and the word we have
been friends since, um, college. And so she is just, um,
she's she inspires me with her her creativity and her
style and her wisdom. And, um, but there are two
women who inspire me the most, and I think they
(41:51):
they might be surprised for me to say this since
they're younger than I am, but they are my two
daughters and they're grown, grown women now. But my eldest
is Mackenzie. You might remember Mackenzie. She called in when
we were talking. I think it was last year about
favorite books. And she. She surprised us with a call
(42:13):
in to tell us about how she loved To Kill
a mockingbird. And I had to tell you. Hey, that's
my daughter.
S12 (42:21):
That's right.
S11 (42:22):
Yeah, yeah. So. But, Mackenzie, she really inspires me to
be wildly creative again, which is helpful with with the
work that I do. And she's also rekindled for me, um,
a lifelong love of nature and science. And so she's
(42:43):
done formal training, education on that. And I've gone into, um,
some Blue Ridge Naturalist classes to pursue that. So we're
we're sharing that love of that together and, you know,
encouraging each other and our ongoing learning in that. And
then my youngest is Megan. Um, she has really inspired
(43:04):
me over her young life, her her 20 some years
to really be bold in my faith and to step
out of my comfort zone and into the work of
the Holy Spirit. Megan is. I don't think Megan has
ever lived in a comfort zone. Um, so, uh, you know,
18 and her first trip overseas was to a refugee
(43:26):
camp in Algeria. And so, I mean, how can you
not be inspired by something like that? So it's really
all these women, uh, past, present, and they continuously, uh,
point me straight back to Jesus. They they they point
me back to the character of God himself, his goodness,
(43:49):
his kindness, his strength, his love. Um, all of those
all those beautiful things that he is.
S1 (43:56):
Boldness to, you know, I think of Aslan Azlan and
how bold. He's not a tame lion, you know, he's got.
He's got a great heart. He's full of love and
mercy and grace. But boy, he ain't tame. He's. He's
fierce in a way. And I'm so glad that you
mentioned the younger women, because I expect the older women,
(44:16):
the mom, the grandmother. We had another caller who wrote
in a few minutes ago or called and couldn't stay
with us, who mentioned her daughter as well, that she's
an inspiration, that, like Paul said of Timothy, it's like,
don't let anybody look down on you because of your youth,
but live in a way, you know, live in front
(44:36):
of them in a way that shows this godly character
that he has given you. So it's we can learn
so much from those who've gone before, as well as
those who are coming behind. Right.
S11 (44:49):
Right. And, you know, I think with with voicing our
admiration for people who are younger than we are. That
that helps them to maybe aspire to to that, to
to be greater, to to love the Lord more deeply,
to to keep on that right path that they're already on.
(45:14):
And so I think it's really important. Um, you know,
that encouragement of Paul to Timothy, it was instrumental in,
in his ministry.
S1 (45:25):
Here's what I'll say, though, about you, Amanda. And I
don't know your relationship with your daughters other than what
you're telling me about here, but my guess is that
they were on the line. They would say, oh, but mom,
she gave us wings, gave us this wind. We wouldn't do,
(45:45):
you know, be able to do the things we're doing
without your input in their lives to to buoy them
up and to lift them up. So I think it
goes both ways, don't you?
S11 (45:57):
Yes. And that's that. Whole iron sharpens iron, I suppose. Right.
We all need each other to do that and to
encourage each other.
S1 (46:07):
Amanda Clary Estep, if you go to Chris. Org, we've
got one of our books in that Tree Street Kids
series linked right there. Number six comes out in a
couple of weeks. You can find out more. Just go
to Chris Fabry Live. Amanda, thank you for joining us
today and sharing about the women that you want to
emulate and that who inspire you. Now take this two
(46:31):
day series, Men and Women, and see what God can
do inside to cultivate this courage and encouragement and a
whole lot more. Chris Fabry lives production of Moody Radio
ministry of Moody Bible Institute.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Special Summer Offer: Exclusively on Apple Podcasts, try our Dateline Premium subscription completely free for one month! With Dateline Premium, you get every episode ad-free plus exclusive bonus content.