July 7, 2025 • 46 mins
The devastating flash floods over the weekend in Texas have resulted in much loss of life. Max Lucado helps us process and pray about the events. Then, youth sports has become an all-consuming pursuit. Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski believe if we don't own the process of discipling our kids as they play sports, sports culture will do it for us. How can you move from spectators on the sidelines of your kids' spiritual lives to mentors of their souls? Navigating youth sports—don't miss Chris Fabry Live.
Featured resources:
Time of Prayer on July 7 at 6pm CT on Max Lucado's Facebook Live
Away Game: A Christian Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth Sports by Brian Smith and Ed Uszynski
July thank you gift:
Drive Through the Bible by Colin S. Smith
Chris Fabry Live is listener-supported. To support the program, click here.
Become a Back Fence Partner: https://moodyradio.org/donateto/chrisfabrylive/partners
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
S1 (00:05):
Welcome to our Monday get together at the Radio Backyard fence.
It was a July 4th weekend with plans for food
and friends and fun. Maybe a little relaxing. I hope
you experience some of that in the last few days,
but when the news of what happened in the Hill
country of Texas came and the girls camp that was flooded,
as well as the other campgrounds along the Guadalupe River,
(00:26):
and the loss of life that continues to mount, it
put all the celebration into a different perspective. I think
for all of us here in our first segment today,
I've invited a guest from that area to join us.
Max Lucado knows the river. He knows the people who
live there. Well, I want you to hear from him.
And after Max, we'll talk about our intended topic today,
(00:50):
which is youth sports and the tension that a lot
of parents feel about providing instruction and all the advantages
that come with travel sports. But we're also going to
talk about the disadvantages. And I'm hoping this will be
helpful to you today. Let's get going with it. Thank
you to Ryan McConaughey doing all things technical. Trish is
our producer. Anthony will be answering your calls. Max Lucado
(01:12):
is a pastor, speaker, bestselling author, lives in San Antonio,
which is just south of the hardest hit areas. And tonight,
he's hosting a prayer meeting on Facebook. We'll have information
about how you can be a part of that at
the website. 7:00 eastern, 6:00 central. There are now 91
people confirmed killed in central Texas as a result of
(01:34):
the flash flooding that began early Friday morning. Max, when
I first saw the news reports and how many were
missing then and then the number, you know, continues to rise,
it was just so hard to wrap my mind and
my heart around. Did you feel the same way?
S2 (01:52):
Exactly. Exactly, Chris. And thanks for giving me a few
minutes to to engage with you and your wonderful audience
about this. Um, yeah. I got a call from, uh,
someone on our staff, uh, about midday, 4th of July.
I was aware of the floods, but I got distracted,
you know, with the morning activities, and I was unaware
(02:15):
of the loss of life. And, uh, it was about noon,
and she texted me and said, Max, you need to
make sure you're watching this. And I turned on the television.
And at that point, I think there were 18 confirmed,
maybe 20, and even that was already, uh, you know,
just tragic. And then it just seemed to get darker
(02:37):
and darker and darker. It's, uh, as you can imagine,
it's been a it's been a sobering experience for all
of us here in South Texas.
S1 (02:46):
Well, and for all of us around the country who
were looking on from a distance and it's like, and I,
you know, I went to the store later that day
and got paper towels or something. It was almost like,
how can I go get paper towels when people are
still looking? There in trees. You know, it's.
S2 (03:02):
Like, that's the truth. Isn't that the truth? And, you know,
and that just the read of the terrific, horrific loss
of life in camp mystic, the beautiful girls camp there,
right on the Guadalupe River. And those young children, I mean,
every life lost. I know you're not mishearing this. Every
(03:24):
life lost is is reason for heartache, but. Oh, my goodness,
that cabin full of young girls is just, uh. It's
just there's simply no words for it. And, and I
want to say that is a beautiful area. I mean, spectacular.
I've pastored, you know, here in San Antonio since 1988,
(03:45):
and 2 or 3 times a year I've gone up
there for one, one, maybe personal getaway or to speak
at a retreat or to or to be at a
conference and I love that. I just love that area.
The people are amazing. The the nature is spectacular, the
river is gorgeous. And uh, so on a personal level,
(04:07):
this is this is this is really tough. We we
have even a couple of families from our church who
were caught in it. Uh, one of them got out
just before the flood came. The other had to seek
higher ground, and they lost their house. So it's a
it's impacting a lot of people.
S1 (04:26):
The thing the picture that I saw that really struck
me was the, the first responder who was just standing
with his head in his hands. And you could tell
the toll that that's going to take for those who
are searching, you know, as well as then you think
of the family members who nearly lost someone and then
family members who did. And I think they're in a
(04:49):
lot of ways they are leading us in the grief
because I've seen so many different messages of tribute to
my daughter, who was the 19 year old counselor who,
you know, was there with the girls and lost her life.
But they are they are kind of leading us in this,
and I, I know you're going to have this prayer
meeting tonight at six central, seven eastern, but I thought,
(05:11):
let's just just hearing your voice helps me. Let's just
have Max come on here and and pray for us
today as we begin the program. Would you do that?
S2 (05:20):
I'm happy to. And and let's remember, as we process
and pray through times of disaster, we always begin with lament.
That's biblical. I mean, there's a whole book in the
Bible called Lamentations, and that means we cry out to God,
not out of disrespect. Indeed, we're connecting with the heart
(05:40):
of our loving father, saying, father, we need your help.
We love you so much and we're begging for your help.
And so we we don't ever want to gloss over
Chris Times like this, we need to allow ourselves to
enter into the pain. Along with these beloved people who
are experiencing it far more deeply than we are. And so, Lord,
(06:03):
that's where we begin. You've told us that the righteous
cry out, and the Lord hears. And so we do
cry out. Out of the depths of our hearts, we
cry out to you. Our hearts are broken for the children,
for the elderly, for the survivors. And we turn to
you because we believe that you are a Lord who
(06:23):
weeps with those who weep. The Bible tells us you're
acquainted with sorrows. You're not distant, you're not harsh. But
you're a high priest who in every way has been
tested just as we are. So we approach the throne
of grace boldly while our hearts are broken. We do
hold on to our faith. Our belief in you is constant. Uh,
(06:46):
we can relate to the Scripture that says we do
not know what to do, but our eyes are upon you,
and we believe in the great promise of the 23rd Psalm,
that though we walk through the valley of the shadow
of death, you are with us, and your rod and
your staff, they will comfort us. So we beg you
to speak words of comfort, especially upon those who have
(07:08):
lost loved ones who have lost siblings, children, parents, co-workers, colleagues, coaches.
Upon those who feel like they are to blame in
some way. Those who wish they had not made decisions
that they made. We pray you'd speak words against any
(07:29):
convictions or fears of regret and let the healing process begin.
And in in the way only you can do. Father,
glorify yourself in this, for we pray for peace for
the first responders, strength for those who are walking right
now up and down the the banks of the Guadalupe,
(07:49):
Those who are digging in underbrush and looking under trees.
We pray for strength for those who are making decisions.
City leaders, state leaders. We pray for the funeral home directors.
We pray for those who are providing food. We pray
for pastors in Kerrville and Hunt, in Ingram, and in
comfort and other areas up and down the Guadalupe River.
(08:13):
We just beg your mercy. Father, we are reminded that
this world is a place of pain, and this is
a time in which even the earth groans as we
look toward your final, victorious and ultimate return through Christ.
We offer this prayer. Amen.
S1 (08:31):
Amen. Amen. Max, thank you for going there with us today. And, uh,
God bless you, friend, and I'll encourage our listeners to
get in touch with you. You'll be on Facebook tonight,
6:00 central time, 7:00 eastern, and you're going to be
doing this. What we've just done praying together. Right?
S2 (08:53):
Yeah, just just a little 10 or 15 minute time
of prayer. Um, I'm wanting to make an opportunity available,
you know, for people around the world who want to
join hearts and pray. Uh, you know, like my good
friend and co-pastor Travis said yesterday to our church, he
said prayers. Not the least that we can do. It's
(09:15):
the most that we can do. I thought that was
a good word. It's the right thing to do. And
so we want to do that.
S1 (09:22):
Thanks for your heart, Max. Thanks for being with us today.
God bless.
S2 (09:25):
You. The very best, Chris. Bye bye.
S1 (09:28):
Um, Max comes along when we have these kinds of
things happen. He comes along and other times as well.
But I'm glad to get. There's something about just hearing
his voice that I think calms my heart. And then
to hear his prayer. And I encourage you to go
to our website, Chris Fabry. live. Org we've got a
(09:48):
link to Max's Facebook page where you can be a
part of that, or you can watch it later. Just
go to Chris Fabry Live.com. Coming up, I want you
to hear from two guests who will talk about the
struggle that a lot of parents are having with youth sports.
Straight ahead on Moody Radio. This is Chris Fabry live.
(10:17):
You just heard from Max Lucado from San Antonio praying
about what's going on with the loss of life and
the flooding. Tomorrow on the program, we're going to do
the whole hour just to how do you how do
you process this? How do you how do you deal
with that? But the the stated topic for today was
youth sports. And how do we navigate that? And I
(10:38):
want you to hear from Brian Smith and Ed Jasinski,
who have written a helpful book for parents who are
struggling with decisions like that away game. A Christian parent's
guide to navigating youth sports. Before I introduce both of you,
let's start. Brian, let me start with you. Respond to
what you've just heard from Max and me.
S3 (10:59):
Yeah, I think this is really important to start here,
that with what's going on in Texas. Um, it really
does put everything into perspective really quickly. Um, and that's
not just true for sports, but but really all of life.
And so Ed and I just want to acknowledge to
to the listening audience right off the bat that, um, this,
(11:19):
this will feel like a pretty hard one, 80 to
go from talking and praying about everything that's going on
in Texas to now all of a sudden we're talking
about what to do with sports. And so just to
acknowledge on the front end that this is going to
be a pretty hard shift. And it does. It's okay
if that feels weird, but just to acknowledge that, that
it's a big shift.
S4 (11:41):
Um, when we said to each other that it represents opportunities.
We're talking to parents or grandparents who love their kids,
love their grandkids, and want to keep opening up doors
of opportunity for them, whether it's sending them to a
camp or it's putting them in youth sports or any
of the other other windows and doors that can open
(12:02):
for them. And oftentimes, it seems like we wind up
trying to control that process and put a lot of
energy into things that we really don't have control over,
and we tend to neglect paying attention to the things
we really need to pay more attention to. And that's
really what Brian and I have been talking about in
this whole youth sports context, is how do we start
spending more energy and give more attention as parents, to
(12:25):
what we can control and should be pouring more energy into,
instead of just worrying about playing time and statistics and
things of this nature and winning.
S1 (12:34):
And winning is a okay, so that takes me to
the email that begins the book. It's titled Away Game
A Christian Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth sports. Here's the email.
I have three children, all of whom play sports. I've
coached baseball and basketball for more than five years. My
two older children played travel and AAU basketball, along with travel,
(12:55):
baseball and softball. I have also served as a referee
in the past several years, and you know how dicey
that can be as a parent in youth sports. One
of the issues I see is too much stress on winning.
We forget that our role in coaching and parenting is
to develop our players, not only in their sport, but
to live their life. Sports can teach a lot of
(13:15):
great values such as teamwork, discipline, humility. But if we
only emphasize winning, we miss out on those opportunities. These days,
parents have a huge fear of missing out if their
child does not play travel sports. Sports now are a
12 month commitment, and we train as though everyone is
expected to play in college. You can't participate in one
(13:36):
sport without training for another. The amount of money spent
is out of control. Parents fear their child will fall
behind if they don't play, or if they don't make
the best teams right away. And then at the end,
he says, how are we supposed to know God's will
when it comes to our kids and sports? And Brian,
that's one of the reasons why you two have written this, right?
S3 (14:00):
Yeah. I mean, how are we supposed to know God's
will for anything? We're we're opening up his word, and
we're reading things like love the Lord your God with
all your heart, mind, soul, and strength. Love your neighbor
as yourself. We're not going to read sign your kid
up for this travel league team. So the question that
we're trying to wrestle with in the book is, what
does it look like to bring God's Word to bear
(14:23):
within the context of youth sport? Because we at the
end of the day, we do want our kids to
grow in the in the likeness of Jesus. And what
we're arguing for in the book is that you can
actually partner with the sporting experience and use sports as
a as a model to disciple your kids that youth
sports doesn't have to be the enemy. It can actually
(14:45):
be an opportunity. But but that's going to cause us
to to view sports with a different lens than maybe
of us do at the moment.
S1 (14:52):
But that takes intentionality, and it takes understanding of of what?
And I find that a lot of parents are simply
doing the David and Goliath youth sports, and you call
it youth sports industrial complex. Uh, that youth sports is Goliath.
And we need to slay this because it's taking our
kids away from church and activities. You know that are there.
You use a different metaphor from the Old Testament, and
(15:15):
that is of Daniel. Ed, explain that.
S4 (15:19):
Well, you already said one. One option would be just
to completely separate ourselves from it and isolate ourselves from it.
Another would be that we just get completely carried along
by it and not give any thought at all to
what it might be teaching us that goes against our
our kingdom values and and our pursuit of Jesus. And
(15:40):
Daniel gives us a great example of living in a
Babylonian culture, intensely secular culture, anti Yahweh culture. And he
doesn't do either of those extremes. He he doesn't isolate,
he doesn't get swept up in it. But he figures
out with a handful of friends what obedient involvement will
(16:00):
look like in different situations along the way where he
trusts God to be countercultural, right there in the middle
of all of it, and his life becomes a testimony
to the true God, and he and his friends benefit
by wrestling with what it looks like to stay right
where they're at.
S1 (16:19):
Yes. So there are three sections to away game. It's
our featured resource at Chris Fabry Livorno. The first is
perspective shift and then spiritual formation versus sports formation and
then game day discipleship, which is basically how does a
what's a strategy for parents to instill their values and
(16:41):
to get everything out of this sports experience, if that's
the direction you choose to go. But I found it
really interesting that you, Brian, had a struggle with the
I think your son was playing his final game of football,
and you got a little exercise in the crowd. Tell
(17:01):
me about that.
S3 (17:02):
Yeah, it's one of the first stories we talk about
in the book. Um, but I went into this last
game with the intention of I just I'm just going
to watch my son play and enjoy it. And actually,
when when this game took place, Ed and I were
in the process of writing this book. And so if
anybody should know better, it's the author of the person
telling you all how to do this. Um, faithfully. Um,
(17:24):
so it was it was late in the game and
the referee made a bad call. They had made a
series of bad calls that were just compounding on each other.
And so I yelled out from the stands, Dans um,
what the right call should have been. And the referee
heard me and he looked up into the stands and
he said, who cares? And so that lit a fuse
(17:47):
in the entire stands for both the away team and
the home team. And it it became a chaotic, a
more chaotic environment where parents were yelling, coaches were yelling,
refs were yelling. And at the end of the day,
the the the people that it hurt the most were
the kids who were just there trying to play the
game and enjoy the experience. And so it was another.
(18:11):
And you'll read many of these examples in the book.
It was another example of when parents like me have
too much at stake in the game and feel like
a bad call is some sort of injustice against me
in my kid. In one of those moments where, man,
I just wish I would have shut my mouth and
let the ref make the call. And then on the
(18:31):
back end, have a conversation with my kid about how
he handled the the hard calls that game instead of
having to apologize for him for how I handled the
hard calls.
S5 (18:40):
Well, I think part of the problem.
S1 (18:42):
Was your son didn't get in the game, or at
least up until that point, he hadn't played right.
S3 (18:47):
Yeah, there were about 40 kids on the team, and
so everybody gets a certain amount of playing time. And
he he got maybe a quarter and a half and
that was it. And so that that was a big
part of it, Chris, is the frustration of thinking, yeah,
my kid should be one of the better kids out there.
He deserves playing time. He's entitled to it. And so
(19:07):
instead of letting it out on the coaches, I let
frustration out on the referees.
S1 (19:12):
Yes. And your son pays the price and you do too.
But the interesting thing about that is that you saw
it when you saw everything going on around you. It's like, oops,
I kind of lit the match here and and ignited
everything that was going on. Ed, what do you say
about that? That's a microcosm of some of the problem,
isn't it?
S4 (19:32):
Well, one of the things that we're trying to do
in the book is just realize and really confess that we,
as parents, need to be discipled first. I mean, too
many of us. And again, Brian and I share stories
with each other all the time, and we've really been
working on this for the last 8 or 9 years
with each other of just what's happening inside of us
at games. What are we bringing to the game that's
(19:55):
negatively affecting our child and the other kids that are there?
And can we be honest about it, whether it's regret
from our own past or fears or embarrassment because we're
too attached to our kid, either too much embarrassment when
they play poorly or don't get to play, or we
feel too much pride when they do well and it
starts to become an identity thing for us. And there's
(20:19):
always going to be a certain measure of that. But
when it becomes the driving force behind how we're interacting
with our kids and their youth sport experience, that's when
it becomes a negative thing. So we really need an
intervention with ourselves. That's what we've been saying all along.
The process starts with us realizing what's happening inside of
(20:39):
us and asking, what does it look like for us
to get our our own act together before we try
to teach our kids anything.
S5 (20:46):
That takes.
S1 (20:47):
A level of self-awareness that I'm not sure we're committed to, though,
you know, to be honest. And and my kids now
are older, but I went through a lot of years
and there were no I didn't play sports on a
collegiate level. You know, I was. And so I didn't
have that hope necessarily for my kids, but I could
(21:07):
see it around me and I could see the desire.
And both of you, I believe both of you played
at the collegiate level. Is that right, Brian?
S3 (21:15):
Yeah, we we both have played at the collegiate level.
I have coached Division one track and cross country. I'm
coaching high school, cross country. Now, um, Ed has played
on some pretty high level basketball teams as well. So yeah,
we we've had a we've had experience at the at
the highest levels of sports, but we've also had experience
at the at the more elementary levels too. So everything
(21:38):
in between.
S1 (21:40):
So what is the talk to the parent who says,
I'm afraid that I'm not helping little Johnny or Betty
be all they can be if I don't have them
go on the travel team and spend all this time
in the car, you know, driving and going on all
of these trips. What what do you say to the
(22:02):
parent who has that fear? Editor.
S4 (22:06):
Well, one of the things that we keep reminding ourselves, again,
just to even step back from that question, is to
first realize that youth sports has become an industry. It's
and there's a fascinating history behind it. But we're living
at a time where our, our kids have dollar signs
attached to them. For people, that's a very crass way
(22:26):
to say it, but they really do. Our kids interests
are being undermined by this industry that is trying to
make money and is trying to create new entrepreneurial avenues
for entrepreneurs to create new teams and new experiences. And
so they're creating a sense of fear inside of us.
(22:48):
It's it's it would not have even existed 50 years ago.
This fear that we have inside of us, that our
kids aren't keeping up or we're cheating them of an opportunity,
that's a fear that's been manufactured by marketing and really
an industry that wants us to believe that because it's
really not true. If we can just cut to the chase,
(23:09):
it's whether or not our child winds up being even
on the high school team. Isn't our 13 year old
whether they're going to be on the high school team
is not determined by which select team they wind up
getting on when they're 13. It really isn't. And the
the chances of them actually being on a college team,
these chances haven't changed across the decades. It's less than 2%
(23:34):
to be on any college team and to get scholarship
money is even less than that. So one of the
things that Brian and I have been just trying to
get people to understand is that if your kid winds
up playing at the highest level, it won't primarily be
because of decisions that you've made. It's going to be
because of who God made them to be physically. And
just a natural ability that he gives him or her,
(23:56):
and he will give them an innate desire to pursue it.
It's not going to be because of you putting pressure
on them when they're 13. Yes. Um, or or getting
them on the right team. That puts them on a
trajectory to get there. It's just not really the way
it works.
S1 (24:13):
But what if your what if your student what if
your child says, yeah, but I've got to be on this.
I got you know, you get the pressure from them
because I remember Drew Brees talking about one of the
best things that happened to him when he was a
kid was that he played flag football. That he wasn't
in an organized, you know, in Texas. He wasn't in
(24:34):
this organized thing. And so he didn't have some of
the injuries that some of the other kids came into
high school with because he he was playing, he was
getting the fundamentals down with the flag football rather than
full on tackle.
S3 (24:50):
Yeah. But even with that, with the question you just
asked of what if the kid is coming to us
saying they want this and that to get better, that,
that in our opinion, Chris, that that's the win is
when kids are driving the bus of their athletic journey.
What's happening right now in youth sports culture is that
(25:11):
parents are the ones who are driving the bus. They're we.
I shouldn't say they. We are the ones who are
responding in fear. We are the ones signing our kids
up for another tournament, another league in the. The The
statistics are wild that 70% of kids right now quit
before the age of 13. And so it's really it's
(25:33):
not working with us driving the bus. We need to
we need to stand back and say, kids, what do
you want to do this season? And if they don't
want to play, let's take a season off.
S1 (25:44):
That's Brian Smith, along with editor Jasinski, authors of Away
Game A Christian Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. More
straight ahead. We're talking about youth sports, travel teams, the
(26:06):
emphasis on winning the industrial complex of youth sports, and
the fear that a lot of parents have that their
kids are going to miss out. Our phone lines are open.
Is this what you're living right now? (877) 548-3675. Call us.
I want to hear your question, your comment, the struggle
you're going through, or maybe about the decision that you've made. (877) 548-3675.
(26:33):
And it strikes me this may not be where you
are today. You may not have children in this situation
or even grandchildren. But but the information we share here
and the resource we're talking about is going to help someone.
And that's where you as a supporter, Chris Fabry live,
come in. We are listener supported. We can't do what
we do without your help. So get on the field,
(26:55):
join the team right now. This month is a thank you.
We're sending Pastor Colin Smith's book, Drive Through the Bible
to anyone who gives a gift. I often hear, you know,
I try to read the Bible. I feel lost, especially
when I get in the Old Testament. I don't understand
how this all fits together. This new book is a
roadmap to help you see in 30 days how the
(27:17):
Old and New Testaments, Proverbs, Psalms, how all that literature
Connects us to the heart of God and His plan.
Give a gift of any amount or become a monthly
partner with us and we'll send you drive Through the
Bible by Colin Smith. Go to Chris Fabry, live Chris
(27:38):
Fabry live Fabry, and you'll see it right there along
with our. If you click through today's information, you'll see
the book Away Game A Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth Sports.
It's written by editor Jasinski and Brian Smith. Brian is
on staff with Athletes in Action. He's written several books,
including Away Game. Editor. Jasinski is an author, speaker, sports
(28:02):
minister with more than three decades experience discipling college and
professional athletes. So there's a world of experience here and
a real help in away game. A Christian Parent's Guide
to Navigating Youth Sports. I told you I was going
to ask you a question, but I want to call
an audible here and go back to the youth sports
(28:23):
industrial complex and ESPN. Because in the book editor, you
said that when you grew up, you practiced, uh, little league,
you know, the baseball you got on your bike and
you rode to the park, and then even the place
where you played was about a mile away. So you
could do everything on your own there in the town
that you lived in. But that's not the way that
(28:46):
it is anymore. The the place where you practice is
a half hour away and you got to get, you know,
the baseball bats these days. I priced a baseball bat
for my son one day. It's like, I can't I
can't get a loan for this. So all of that
has changed, hasn't it?
S4 (29:03):
It has changed. And like we talked about in the
last segment, it's really become an industry. And Brian and
I are careful to we feel like we have to
keep disclaiming everything because we're not against the idea of
people making money off of sports or creating environments where
kids can play sports and they're going to be able
to make money there. That's not necessarily bad in and
(29:26):
of itself, but we all know that when money gets
involved and when money becomes a primary concern, our kids
interests and what's best for them tends to slide further
down the list. And that's just that's just the nature
of things. And so unless somebody is extremely intentional to
(29:46):
keep kids first and kids not just their physical growth,
but their emotional growth, their spiritual growth, a more holistic
approach to them, uh, unless somebody is intentional about that,
they're probably just going to try to keep the doors
open on their business. And unless they're training coaches to
have a certain trajectory when it comes to the values
(30:07):
of what we want to embody and what we want
to teach the kids, we're probably just going to focus
on being successful on the field. And it's when that
becomes an extreme that it becomes bad when that's all
we're concerned about winning, because you've mentioned that a couple
of times, Chris. We're not winning, but we are against
that being the only thing that matters. And it's just
been way too easy for that to be the case
(30:29):
in too many of our youth sports experiences these days.
S1 (30:32):
Yes. Which gets us to the heart of what you're
trying to do, whether you do the travel team or
not for your children. Because here's a quote, Christian parent,
our sports investment is buying us a ticket, a front
row seat to scout our kids, experiencing the roller coaster
of emotions and experiences that sports produce. Every day we
(30:53):
get to see the relational tensions on the field. We
monitor how they respond to perceived injustices from officials, other competitors,
other parents, and their own coaches. We observe how they
respond to winning and losing and the effect both have
on their psyche. We watch their post-practice body language coming
(31:14):
toward the car before the ride home. We get to
steward the joy, pain, frustration and pride, constantly working on
their sense of self as they're trying to grow up.
That's the secret sauce behind the scenes, isn't it, Brian?
S3 (31:31):
Yeah, we've we've been jokingly saying for a while now
that when our kids get home from school, we ask
the question, how was your day? And we get the
the 1 or 2 word answer, right? It was fine.
It's good. And because we're not at school during the
whole day, we don't know everything that happened. And so
we don't know who they sat next to and we
don't know what the teacher said and how they responded.
(31:53):
But in sports, we don't have to guess. We have
a front row seat to seeing everything that happens, which
if we began to watch through heavenly metrics, Kingdom, Kingdom metrics,
it becomes an incredible opportunity for us to live out
one of our primary roles in their lives. And that's
to be disciple makers. So when we see them interact
(32:17):
or choose not to interact with the kid who's sitting
on the end of the bench, that becomes a discipleship
opportunity when we see them have a bad call against
them by an official or a referee, that that becomes, yes,
maybe an injustice, but it's a discipleship opportunity. And what
we're trying to do in this book is to say, hey, parent,
whatever you have decided with your kid that your path
(32:40):
is going to be travel team, elite team, YMCA league,
what you're doing is you are giving an opportunity to
yourself and your kid to sharpen them, to help them
look more and more like Jesus. But to do that, you.
And you mentioned this in the last segment. There needs
to be a level of, um, of understanding in your
own heart of what's going on to, to really check
(33:03):
the value system. Like, do I, do I actually want
to do this? Do I want to leverage these moments
for discipleship or not?
S1 (33:11):
Yes. And then being able to to step in their
presence is the main thing. If you're not present there,
you don't have the opportunity to do that. But if
you are present even that, you have to have intentionality.
I think behind all of this is the desire as
a parent who's had kids in sports, I want somebody
(33:32):
to see my child the way I see him or her.
I want someone to validate. I remember there was one
was my youngest son was playing right field and the
team was pretty good, and they were winning a bunch
of games, and there was a sharp liner that was
hit to right field. And there in a runner on first.
(33:55):
And um, he, he got the ball. He fielded it
cleanly and he threw over the head of the cutoff
cutoff kid, you know, at second base all the way
to third base. And it bounced once and hit. And
I thought, you know, great job. The coach went ballistic.
S6 (34:12):
No no, no.
S1 (34:14):
And what he was trying to do was to show
him no. You always hit the cutout. A cut off guy.
I get that, but at the same time, he threw
it a long way and it was on. You know,
he almost got the guy out. Um, so. But but
I always felt like, oh, this coach didn't see. Didn't
see my son. Well, uh, and I had a hard
(34:36):
time getting over that hurdle. Editor.
S4 (34:38):
Yep. Feel the same thing. And, you know, you mentioned
this earlier, Chris. Brian and I have spent decades working
with college athletes and some professional, but mostly college athletes.
And one of the main things that we talk to
them about is, is deriving their identity in Christ. The
Bible makes a big deal about what it means to
(35:00):
be in Christ and how that should consume us, and
it should shape everything about the way we view ourselves,
the way we view the world, and the way we
view our relationship to God. And so we just are
pounding that in them all the time. But, you know,
I need to be reminded of what it means to
be in Christ as a parent, I need to I
(35:21):
need to remember that sport is always going to judge
my child on the basis of merit, and that not
even always on a in a fair way. It's always earned,
never given. Unless in those cases where it is given
because of power plays or these sorts of things, in
which case it's not just but the gospel is always
based on grace. And so this is another thing that
(35:44):
Brian and I just keep talking about. We know how
to talk with college athletes about it, but are we
speaking that same thing to ourselves? Do we know what
it means to show up at a game and be
so identified with Christ that we're not primarily affected by
what the crowd thinks, what the coach thinks, how the
ref treats them, how the other team treats them. We
(36:05):
are going to be identified with Jesus. And then how
do we teach our kid to do that? That you
can be sad that you made a mistake. It's always
disappointing to lose, of course, but when this is over,
or do we know what it means to be fully
identified in Christ in such a way that everyone else's
opinions and my performance is not what determines how I
(36:26):
feel about myself, or how I continue to interact with
you after the game. Yes, that's a mature that's a
very mature Christian mature, um, it demands Christian maturity to
be able to do that. And again, for too many
of us parents, it's really kind of exposes that when
it comes to youth sports, I'm pretty immature. I don't
(36:47):
really identify with Christ as much as I identify with
headlines or people's opinions, and that needs to change inside
of me.
S1 (36:55):
I'll preach anywhere, and you know that you can take
that into the workplace. You can take that into the
home and the family. You know, off the field. It
shows you that these things that are touching that nerve
on the inside, It's there for a reason. And actually,
if you, you know, you find yourself limited. The litmus
test has come up and you've failed. This is a
(37:18):
good thing for you because it's showing you something about yourself.
And I think that's what the strength is about. Your
book Away Game is the title A Christian Parents Guide
to Navigating Youth Sports are featured resource. Click through today's
information at Livorno. There is a parent listening right now
I think I'm safe to say this. There's a parent
(37:40):
listening right now who says, I've been doing this for
a long time. I let my child drive the bus
of his or her sports experience and I'm tired. I
need to get off the bus. We'll find out what
they say straight ahead. Brian Smith and editor Jasinski have
(38:07):
written away game. A Christian parent's guide to navigating youth sports.
Jasinski is spelled u z I. I love that name.
That's so good. And you can find out more at
Chris Fabry live for Bobrinski Bobrinsky. That would be good.
Away game A Christian parents guide to navigating youth sports. Okay,
(38:30):
so there's a parent listening right now. And they're driving
down the road and say I can't do it anymore.
This weekend was you know, I was traveling the whole
time and we had to stay overnight. And we're spending
all this money and I can't do this anymore. What
do you say, Brian? What do you say to that parent?
S3 (38:45):
Um, first of all, I'm sure that editor appreciated you
spelling his last name for all your listeners. Every time
I type it into my email, I'm always waiting for
it to pop up so I don't have to try
and spell it.
S4 (38:57):
Same, so am I. After 57 years.
S3 (39:01):
What would I say to the parent who's exhausted and exasperated?
I would say, you don't have to keep doing this anymore. You.
S4 (39:08):
You have.
S3 (39:09):
Permission. You have permission to say we're done. We're done
for a season. We're done for a month. We're done
with this league or with this team. I would say
finish out your commitment first, but then you you are
under no obligation by God to to re-up next year
(39:29):
and do it again. So if it if it is
draining your family, if it is going against your not
only your family values but your Christian values, then you
may actually be doing more harm by continuing to invest
into a system that for the most part, I want
to say this carefully, but for the most part, the
(39:50):
system of youth sports doesn't care about your kid like
you do, and nor should it. And so just to
know you, you have permission to just step away and
trust that God is sovereign and that if your kid
is going to to make it. And I'm putting up
air quotes right now that that God will make a
way for that to happen. It's not going to be
(40:11):
because you spent another thousand dollars on a league to
get them there.
S1 (40:14):
And that's part of your hope for the book editor
is that churches, the people inside the church will be
able to support those who are making these really hard
decisions about their kids and wanting the best for them.
And the book can be this catalyst for that, right?
S4 (40:32):
For sure. And what we hope is there will be conversations.
I just we don't think we talk about this enough
at church. I mean, sport is a massive idol in
our culture. It's a, it's a it's a huge, um,
mental component of our lives. Even if you're not involved
in sports like you talked about earlier, you're still affected
(40:54):
by the machine that sports has become. And so it's
probably a disservice that we don't really know how to
talk about it very well at church. Again, it's it's
just easier to isolate from it entirely, or just go
ahead with whatever it is they serve up to us
and we'll figure it out later. We think we can
do better than that, and it starts by having conversations.
It starts by giving each other permission to step off
(41:16):
the bus. And, you know, it's helpful to to hear
from people who are already on the other side of
high school who can look back and say, yeah, it
really didn't matter. It really didn't matter what team they
were on when they were ten, for sure, but not
even maybe when they were 15 or 16. So much
winds up outside of our control when it comes to
(41:36):
the success, and I'll put success even in quotes of
our kids sports experience teams, coaches, players that come in and,
you know, come to school and leave the school, circumstances, injuries, referees,
there's so many different factors that we're not as in
(41:58):
control of it as we think we are, and it
would be much better to give more energy into who
they're becoming as a person and shaping their hearts and
equipping ourselves to do that more rather than worrying about
their playing time.
S1 (42:11):
That's why one of the sections of the book you
talk about the importance of the ride home. And I've
heard other people talk about the best thing you can
do as a parent is not to give advice or
give a big lecture or this, that and the other.
Ask questions and then be quiet. Be quiet and listen.
Those that ride home, Brian, can be really a great time,
(42:35):
can't it?
S3 (42:36):
Yeah. If you're familiar with the the quote, all is well,
that ends well. There's actually research behind that that shows
we remember things based on how the experience ended. And
for mass amounts of kids, what's happening right now in
youth sports is they're remembering their their games, their youth
sports experience by getting in the car ride home and
(42:57):
having mom or dad and I would add, well-intentioned Intentioned
mom or dad, either coach or critique, or in some
cases maybe criticize. What happens and what the kids want
and need is connection from us, not coaching and critiquing.
And so the encouragement in the book is to to
(43:18):
keep the car ride home. Sacred space where we're learning
how to connect, not not analyze. Maybe, maybe just turn
up the radio and sing together and leave the leave
the game and everything else in the rear view mirror.
S4 (43:33):
Brian said he started doing this years ago and it
stuck to me. I think it's brilliant. He said when
he gets in the car with his kids, the first
thing he asks them after they play is, is there
anything about the game that you want to talk about?
And more often than not, they say, no, they don't
want to talk about the game. So put some music
on the radio and ask them, where do you want
(43:54):
to go get ice cream? You know, and that drives
us crazy. Now think about it again. Why does that
bother me so much that my kids don't want to
talk about the game afterwards, and I do. I've been
sitting there for two hours.
S3 (44:05):
Just because we have answers. We have answers.
S4 (44:07):
We do right. We know we have answers. We're going
to fix it all. We're going to get them the
training they need. And most of the time they're really
not interested in getting better. And again, I know that
sounds terrible. They just want to play. They want to
have fun with their friends. And yeah, of course they're
(44:28):
open to getting better, but most of them don't even
want to put the work in that it would take.
They just want to play. And again, we're talking about kids.
This changes maybe when you get up in high school
and kids start to get a little bit more of
a desire to to want to stand out at a skill.
But most of the damage that's being done is being
done to eight year olds and ten year olds and
(44:50):
12 year olds. And and then we don't have relationship
with them. We've been laughing and tongue in cheek about
this for years. Our goal is that our kids would
come home for Thanksgiving when they're 30. That's really what
we want and sometimes how we've interacted with them in
the car on the way home after games is contributing
a ton to whether or not they're going to want
(45:11):
to do that a decade from now. Yeah.
S1 (45:15):
And you make the point in the book that sports
sports can only do so much teaching, teaching you about
discipline and about teamwork and all of that. The real,
the real teaching comes alongside of that with someone who
mentors and, dare I say, disciples. And that's the the
(45:38):
real heart of the book. It's titled Away Game A
Christian Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. I came into
this thinking as I started reading, oh, you guys are
going to tell us all the reasons why you shouldn't
go on the travel team, and you didn't do that.
And I was I was really glad that you didn't just,
you know, put the imprimatur on there and say, get
(45:59):
out of there. You know, this is all of this
ESPN and everything has conditioned us to think that this
is the most important thing. So well reasoned approach and
a real encouragement away game. A Christian Parents Guide to
Navigating Youth Sports by Editor Jasinski. Now you know how
to spell it. And Brian Smith I know you can
spell that. Brian. Editor. God bless you, friends. Thanks for
(46:22):
doing this today.
S4 (46:23):
Thank you.
S3 (46:24):
Chris.
S1 (46:25):
Coming up tomorrow, we're going to spend the hour kind
of processing what we did at the beginning of the
program with Max Lucado today. And that is the the floods,
the loss of life in Texas. And if you're having
a hard time like I am of dealing with all this,
come on back tomorrow and spend an hour with us
here at the back fence. Chris Fabry lives production of
Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute. Thanks for listening.
Welcome to our Monday get together at the Radio Backyard fence.
It was a July 4th weekend with plans for food
and friends and fun. Maybe a little relaxing. I hope
you experience some of that in the last few days,
but when the news of what happened in the Hill
country of Texas came and the girls camp that was flooded,
as well as the other campgrounds along the Guadalupe River,
(00:26):
and the loss of life that continues to mount, it
put all the celebration into a different perspective. I think
for all of us here in our first segment today,
I've invited a guest from that area to join us.
Max Lucado knows the river. He knows the people who
live there. Well, I want you to hear from him.
And after Max, we'll talk about our intended topic today,
(00:50):
which is youth sports and the tension that a lot
of parents feel about providing instruction and all the advantages
that come with travel sports. But we're also going to
talk about the disadvantages. And I'm hoping this will be
helpful to you today. Let's get going with it. Thank
you to Ryan McConaughey doing all things technical. Trish is
our producer. Anthony will be answering your calls. Max Lucado
(01:12):
is a pastor, speaker, bestselling author, lives in San Antonio,
which is just south of the hardest hit areas. And tonight,
he's hosting a prayer meeting on Facebook. We'll have information
about how you can be a part of that at
the website. 7:00 eastern, 6:00 central. There are now 91
people confirmed killed in central Texas as a result of
(01:34):
the flash flooding that began early Friday morning. Max, when
I first saw the news reports and how many were
missing then and then the number, you know, continues to rise,
it was just so hard to wrap my mind and
my heart around. Did you feel the same way?
S2 (01:52):
Exactly. Exactly, Chris. And thanks for giving me a few
minutes to to engage with you and your wonderful audience
about this. Um, yeah. I got a call from, uh,
someone on our staff, uh, about midday, 4th of July.
I was aware of the floods, but I got distracted,
you know, with the morning activities, and I was unaware
(02:15):
of the loss of life. And, uh, it was about noon,
and she texted me and said, Max, you need to
make sure you're watching this. And I turned on the television.
And at that point, I think there were 18 confirmed,
maybe 20, and even that was already, uh, you know,
just tragic. And then it just seemed to get darker
(02:37):
and darker and darker. It's, uh, as you can imagine,
it's been a it's been a sobering experience for all
of us here in South Texas.
S1 (02:46):
Well, and for all of us around the country who
were looking on from a distance and it's like, and I,
you know, I went to the store later that day
and got paper towels or something. It was almost like,
how can I go get paper towels when people are
still looking? There in trees. You know, it's.
S2 (03:02):
Like, that's the truth. Isn't that the truth? And, you know,
and that just the read of the terrific, horrific loss
of life in camp mystic, the beautiful girls camp there,
right on the Guadalupe River. And those young children, I mean,
every life lost. I know you're not mishearing this. Every
(03:24):
life lost is is reason for heartache, but. Oh, my goodness,
that cabin full of young girls is just, uh. It's
just there's simply no words for it. And, and I
want to say that is a beautiful area. I mean, spectacular.
I've pastored, you know, here in San Antonio since 1988,
(03:45):
and 2 or 3 times a year I've gone up
there for one, one, maybe personal getaway or to speak
at a retreat or to or to be at a
conference and I love that. I just love that area.
The people are amazing. The the nature is spectacular, the
river is gorgeous. And uh, so on a personal level,
(04:07):
this is this is this is really tough. We we
have even a couple of families from our church who
were caught in it. Uh, one of them got out
just before the flood came. The other had to seek
higher ground, and they lost their house. So it's a
it's impacting a lot of people.
S1 (04:26):
The thing the picture that I saw that really struck
me was the, the first responder who was just standing
with his head in his hands. And you could tell
the toll that that's going to take for those who
are searching, you know, as well as then you think
of the family members who nearly lost someone and then
family members who did. And I think they're in a
(04:49):
lot of ways they are leading us in the grief
because I've seen so many different messages of tribute to
my daughter, who was the 19 year old counselor who,
you know, was there with the girls and lost her life.
But they are they are kind of leading us in this,
and I, I know you're going to have this prayer
meeting tonight at six central, seven eastern, but I thought,
(05:11):
let's just just hearing your voice helps me. Let's just
have Max come on here and and pray for us
today as we begin the program. Would you do that?
S2 (05:20):
I'm happy to. And and let's remember, as we process
and pray through times of disaster, we always begin with lament.
That's biblical. I mean, there's a whole book in the
Bible called Lamentations, and that means we cry out to God,
not out of disrespect. Indeed, we're connecting with the heart
(05:40):
of our loving father, saying, father, we need your help.
We love you so much and we're begging for your help.
And so we we don't ever want to gloss over
Chris Times like this, we need to allow ourselves to
enter into the pain. Along with these beloved people who
are experiencing it far more deeply than we are. And so, Lord,
(06:03):
that's where we begin. You've told us that the righteous
cry out, and the Lord hears. And so we do
cry out. Out of the depths of our hearts, we
cry out to you. Our hearts are broken for the children,
for the elderly, for the survivors. And we turn to
you because we believe that you are a Lord who
(06:23):
weeps with those who weep. The Bible tells us you're
acquainted with sorrows. You're not distant, you're not harsh. But
you're a high priest who in every way has been
tested just as we are. So we approach the throne
of grace boldly while our hearts are broken. We do
hold on to our faith. Our belief in you is constant. Uh,
(06:46):
we can relate to the Scripture that says we do
not know what to do, but our eyes are upon you,
and we believe in the great promise of the 23rd Psalm,
that though we walk through the valley of the shadow
of death, you are with us, and your rod and
your staff, they will comfort us. So we beg you
to speak words of comfort, especially upon those who have
(07:08):
lost loved ones who have lost siblings, children, parents, co-workers, colleagues, coaches.
Upon those who feel like they are to blame in
some way. Those who wish they had not made decisions
that they made. We pray you'd speak words against any
(07:29):
convictions or fears of regret and let the healing process begin.
And in in the way only you can do. Father,
glorify yourself in this, for we pray for peace for
the first responders, strength for those who are walking right
now up and down the the banks of the Guadalupe,
(07:49):
Those who are digging in underbrush and looking under trees.
We pray for strength for those who are making decisions.
City leaders, state leaders. We pray for the funeral home directors.
We pray for those who are providing food. We pray
for pastors in Kerrville and Hunt, in Ingram, and in
comfort and other areas up and down the Guadalupe River.
(08:13):
We just beg your mercy. Father, we are reminded that
this world is a place of pain, and this is
a time in which even the earth groans as we
look toward your final, victorious and ultimate return through Christ.
We offer this prayer. Amen.
S1 (08:31):
Amen. Amen. Max, thank you for going there with us today. And, uh,
God bless you, friend, and I'll encourage our listeners to
get in touch with you. You'll be on Facebook tonight,
6:00 central time, 7:00 eastern, and you're going to be
doing this. What we've just done praying together. Right?
S2 (08:53):
Yeah, just just a little 10 or 15 minute time
of prayer. Um, I'm wanting to make an opportunity available,
you know, for people around the world who want to
join hearts and pray. Uh, you know, like my good
friend and co-pastor Travis said yesterday to our church, he
said prayers. Not the least that we can do. It's
(09:15):
the most that we can do. I thought that was
a good word. It's the right thing to do. And
so we want to do that.
S1 (09:22):
Thanks for your heart, Max. Thanks for being with us today.
God bless.
S2 (09:25):
You. The very best, Chris. Bye bye.
S1 (09:28):
Um, Max comes along when we have these kinds of
things happen. He comes along and other times as well.
But I'm glad to get. There's something about just hearing
his voice that I think calms my heart. And then
to hear his prayer. And I encourage you to go
to our website, Chris Fabry. live. Org we've got a
(09:48):
link to Max's Facebook page where you can be a
part of that, or you can watch it later. Just
go to Chris Fabry Live.com. Coming up, I want you
to hear from two guests who will talk about the
struggle that a lot of parents are having with youth sports.
Straight ahead on Moody Radio. This is Chris Fabry live.
(10:17):
You just heard from Max Lucado from San Antonio praying
about what's going on with the loss of life and
the flooding. Tomorrow on the program, we're going to do
the whole hour just to how do you how do
you process this? How do you how do you deal
with that? But the the stated topic for today was
youth sports. And how do we navigate that? And I
(10:38):
want you to hear from Brian Smith and Ed Jasinski,
who have written a helpful book for parents who are
struggling with decisions like that away game. A Christian parent's
guide to navigating youth sports. Before I introduce both of you,
let's start. Brian, let me start with you. Respond to
what you've just heard from Max and me.
S3 (10:59):
Yeah, I think this is really important to start here,
that with what's going on in Texas. Um, it really
does put everything into perspective really quickly. Um, and that's
not just true for sports, but but really all of life.
And so Ed and I just want to acknowledge to
to the listening audience right off the bat that, um, this,
(11:19):
this will feel like a pretty hard one, 80 to
go from talking and praying about everything that's going on
in Texas to now all of a sudden we're talking
about what to do with sports. And so just to
acknowledge on the front end that this is going to
be a pretty hard shift. And it does. It's okay
if that feels weird, but just to acknowledge that, that
it's a big shift.
S4 (11:41):
Um, when we said to each other that it represents opportunities.
We're talking to parents or grandparents who love their kids,
love their grandkids, and want to keep opening up doors
of opportunity for them, whether it's sending them to a
camp or it's putting them in youth sports or any
of the other other windows and doors that can open
(12:02):
for them. And oftentimes, it seems like we wind up
trying to control that process and put a lot of
energy into things that we really don't have control over,
and we tend to neglect paying attention to the things
we really need to pay more attention to. And that's
really what Brian and I have been talking about in
this whole youth sports context, is how do we start
spending more energy and give more attention as parents, to
(12:25):
what we can control and should be pouring more energy into,
instead of just worrying about playing time and statistics and
things of this nature and winning.
S1 (12:34):
And winning is a okay, so that takes me to
the email that begins the book. It's titled Away Game
A Christian Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth sports. Here's the email.
I have three children, all of whom play sports. I've
coached baseball and basketball for more than five years. My
two older children played travel and AAU basketball, along with travel,
(12:55):
baseball and softball. I have also served as a referee
in the past several years, and you know how dicey
that can be as a parent in youth sports. One
of the issues I see is too much stress on winning.
We forget that our role in coaching and parenting is
to develop our players, not only in their sport, but
to live their life. Sports can teach a lot of
(13:15):
great values such as teamwork, discipline, humility. But if we
only emphasize winning, we miss out on those opportunities. These days,
parents have a huge fear of missing out if their
child does not play travel sports. Sports now are a
12 month commitment, and we train as though everyone is
expected to play in college. You can't participate in one
(13:36):
sport without training for another. The amount of money spent
is out of control. Parents fear their child will fall
behind if they don't play, or if they don't make
the best teams right away. And then at the end,
he says, how are we supposed to know God's will
when it comes to our kids and sports? And Brian,
that's one of the reasons why you two have written this, right?
S3 (14:00):
Yeah. I mean, how are we supposed to know God's
will for anything? We're we're opening up his word, and
we're reading things like love the Lord your God with
all your heart, mind, soul, and strength. Love your neighbor
as yourself. We're not going to read sign your kid
up for this travel league team. So the question that
we're trying to wrestle with in the book is, what
does it look like to bring God's Word to bear
(14:23):
within the context of youth sport? Because we at the
end of the day, we do want our kids to
grow in the in the likeness of Jesus. And what
we're arguing for in the book is that you can
actually partner with the sporting experience and use sports as
a as a model to disciple your kids that youth
sports doesn't have to be the enemy. It can actually
(14:45):
be an opportunity. But but that's going to cause us
to to view sports with a different lens than maybe
of us do at the moment.
S1 (14:52):
But that takes intentionality, and it takes understanding of of what?
And I find that a lot of parents are simply
doing the David and Goliath youth sports, and you call
it youth sports industrial complex. Uh, that youth sports is Goliath.
And we need to slay this because it's taking our
kids away from church and activities. You know that are there.
You use a different metaphor from the Old Testament, and
(15:15):
that is of Daniel. Ed, explain that.
S4 (15:19):
Well, you already said one. One option would be just
to completely separate ourselves from it and isolate ourselves from it.
Another would be that we just get completely carried along
by it and not give any thought at all to
what it might be teaching us that goes against our
our kingdom values and and our pursuit of Jesus. And
(15:40):
Daniel gives us a great example of living in a
Babylonian culture, intensely secular culture, anti Yahweh culture. And he
doesn't do either of those extremes. He he doesn't isolate,
he doesn't get swept up in it. But he figures
out with a handful of friends what obedient involvement will
(16:00):
look like in different situations along the way where he
trusts God to be countercultural, right there in the middle
of all of it, and his life becomes a testimony
to the true God, and he and his friends benefit
by wrestling with what it looks like to stay right
where they're at.
S1 (16:19):
Yes. So there are three sections to away game. It's
our featured resource at Chris Fabry Livorno. The first is
perspective shift and then spiritual formation versus sports formation and
then game day discipleship, which is basically how does a
what's a strategy for parents to instill their values and
(16:41):
to get everything out of this sports experience, if that's
the direction you choose to go. But I found it
really interesting that you, Brian, had a struggle with the
I think your son was playing his final game of football,
and you got a little exercise in the crowd. Tell
(17:01):
me about that.
S3 (17:02):
Yeah, it's one of the first stories we talk about
in the book. Um, but I went into this last
game with the intention of I just I'm just going
to watch my son play and enjoy it. And actually,
when when this game took place, Ed and I were
in the process of writing this book. And so if
anybody should know better, it's the author of the person
telling you all how to do this. Um, faithfully. Um,
(17:24):
so it was it was late in the game and
the referee made a bad call. They had made a
series of bad calls that were just compounding on each other.
And so I yelled out from the stands, Dans um,
what the right call should have been. And the referee
heard me and he looked up into the stands and
he said, who cares? And so that lit a fuse
(17:47):
in the entire stands for both the away team and
the home team. And it it became a chaotic, a
more chaotic environment where parents were yelling, coaches were yelling,
refs were yelling. And at the end of the day,
the the the people that it hurt the most were
the kids who were just there trying to play the
game and enjoy the experience. And so it was another.
(18:11):
And you'll read many of these examples in the book.
It was another example of when parents like me have
too much at stake in the game and feel like
a bad call is some sort of injustice against me
in my kid. In one of those moments where, man,
I just wish I would have shut my mouth and
let the ref make the call. And then on the
(18:31):
back end, have a conversation with my kid about how
he handled the the hard calls that game instead of
having to apologize for him for how I handled the
hard calls.
S5 (18:40):
Well, I think part of the problem.
S1 (18:42):
Was your son didn't get in the game, or at
least up until that point, he hadn't played right.
S3 (18:47):
Yeah, there were about 40 kids on the team, and
so everybody gets a certain amount of playing time. And
he he got maybe a quarter and a half and
that was it. And so that that was a big
part of it, Chris, is the frustration of thinking, yeah,
my kid should be one of the better kids out there.
He deserves playing time. He's entitled to it. And so
(19:07):
instead of letting it out on the coaches, I let
frustration out on the referees.
S1 (19:12):
Yes. And your son pays the price and you do too.
But the interesting thing about that is that you saw
it when you saw everything going on around you. It's like, oops,
I kind of lit the match here and and ignited
everything that was going on. Ed, what do you say
about that? That's a microcosm of some of the problem,
isn't it?
S4 (19:32):
Well, one of the things that we're trying to do
in the book is just realize and really confess that we,
as parents, need to be discipled first. I mean, too
many of us. And again, Brian and I share stories
with each other all the time, and we've really been
working on this for the last 8 or 9 years
with each other of just what's happening inside of us
at games. What are we bringing to the game that's
(19:55):
negatively affecting our child and the other kids that are there?
And can we be honest about it, whether it's regret
from our own past or fears or embarrassment because we're
too attached to our kid, either too much embarrassment when
they play poorly or don't get to play, or we
feel too much pride when they do well and it
starts to become an identity thing for us. And there's
(20:19):
always going to be a certain measure of that. But
when it becomes the driving force behind how we're interacting
with our kids and their youth sport experience, that's when
it becomes a negative thing. So we really need an
intervention with ourselves. That's what we've been saying all along.
The process starts with us realizing what's happening inside of
(20:39):
us and asking, what does it look like for us
to get our our own act together before we try
to teach our kids anything.
S5 (20:46):
That takes.
S1 (20:47):
A level of self-awareness that I'm not sure we're committed to, though,
you know, to be honest. And and my kids now
are older, but I went through a lot of years
and there were no I didn't play sports on a
collegiate level. You know, I was. And so I didn't
have that hope necessarily for my kids, but I could
(21:07):
see it around me and I could see the desire.
And both of you, I believe both of you played
at the collegiate level. Is that right, Brian?
S3 (21:15):
Yeah, we we both have played at the collegiate level.
I have coached Division one track and cross country. I'm
coaching high school, cross country. Now, um, Ed has played
on some pretty high level basketball teams as well. So yeah,
we we've had a we've had experience at the at
the highest levels of sports, but we've also had experience
at the at the more elementary levels too. So everything
(21:38):
in between.
S1 (21:40):
So what is the talk to the parent who says,
I'm afraid that I'm not helping little Johnny or Betty
be all they can be if I don't have them
go on the travel team and spend all this time
in the car, you know, driving and going on all
of these trips. What what do you say to the
(22:02):
parent who has that fear? Editor.
S4 (22:06):
Well, one of the things that we keep reminding ourselves, again,
just to even step back from that question, is to
first realize that youth sports has become an industry. It's
and there's a fascinating history behind it. But we're living
at a time where our, our kids have dollar signs
attached to them. For people, that's a very crass way
(22:26):
to say it, but they really do. Our kids interests
are being undermined by this industry that is trying to
make money and is trying to create new entrepreneurial avenues
for entrepreneurs to create new teams and new experiences. And
so they're creating a sense of fear inside of us.
(22:48):
It's it's it would not have even existed 50 years ago.
This fear that we have inside of us, that our
kids aren't keeping up or we're cheating them of an opportunity,
that's a fear that's been manufactured by marketing and really
an industry that wants us to believe that because it's
really not true. If we can just cut to the chase,
(23:09):
it's whether or not our child winds up being even
on the high school team. Isn't our 13 year old
whether they're going to be on the high school team
is not determined by which select team they wind up
getting on when they're 13. It really isn't. And the
the chances of them actually being on a college team,
these chances haven't changed across the decades. It's less than 2%
(23:34):
to be on any college team and to get scholarship
money is even less than that. So one of the
things that Brian and I have been just trying to
get people to understand is that if your kid winds
up playing at the highest level, it won't primarily be
because of decisions that you've made. It's going to be
because of who God made them to be physically. And
just a natural ability that he gives him or her,
(23:56):
and he will give them an innate desire to pursue it.
It's not going to be because of you putting pressure
on them when they're 13. Yes. Um, or or getting
them on the right team. That puts them on a
trajectory to get there. It's just not really the way
it works.
S1 (24:13):
But what if your what if your student what if
your child says, yeah, but I've got to be on this.
I got you know, you get the pressure from them
because I remember Drew Brees talking about one of the
best things that happened to him when he was a
kid was that he played flag football. That he wasn't
in an organized, you know, in Texas. He wasn't in
(24:34):
this organized thing. And so he didn't have some of
the injuries that some of the other kids came into
high school with because he he was playing, he was
getting the fundamentals down with the flag football rather than
full on tackle.
S3 (24:50):
Yeah. But even with that, with the question you just
asked of what if the kid is coming to us
saying they want this and that to get better, that,
that in our opinion, Chris, that that's the win is
when kids are driving the bus of their athletic journey.
What's happening right now in youth sports culture is that
(25:11):
parents are the ones who are driving the bus. They're we.
I shouldn't say they. We are the ones who are
responding in fear. We are the ones signing our kids
up for another tournament, another league in the. The The
statistics are wild that 70% of kids right now quit
before the age of 13. And so it's really it's
(25:33):
not working with us driving the bus. We need to
we need to stand back and say, kids, what do
you want to do this season? And if they don't
want to play, let's take a season off.
S1 (25:44):
That's Brian Smith, along with editor Jasinski, authors of Away
Game A Christian Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. More
straight ahead. We're talking about youth sports, travel teams, the
(26:06):
emphasis on winning the industrial complex of youth sports, and
the fear that a lot of parents have that their
kids are going to miss out. Our phone lines are open.
Is this what you're living right now? (877) 548-3675. Call us.
I want to hear your question, your comment, the struggle
you're going through, or maybe about the decision that you've made. (877) 548-3675.
(26:33):
And it strikes me this may not be where you
are today. You may not have children in this situation
or even grandchildren. But but the information we share here
and the resource we're talking about is going to help someone.
And that's where you as a supporter, Chris Fabry live,
come in. We are listener supported. We can't do what
we do without your help. So get on the field,
(26:55):
join the team right now. This month is a thank you.
We're sending Pastor Colin Smith's book, Drive Through the Bible
to anyone who gives a gift. I often hear, you know,
I try to read the Bible. I feel lost, especially
when I get in the Old Testament. I don't understand
how this all fits together. This new book is a
roadmap to help you see in 30 days how the
(27:17):
Old and New Testaments, Proverbs, Psalms, how all that literature
Connects us to the heart of God and His plan.
Give a gift of any amount or become a monthly
partner with us and we'll send you drive Through the
Bible by Colin Smith. Go to Chris Fabry, live Chris
(27:38):
Fabry live Fabry, and you'll see it right there along
with our. If you click through today's information, you'll see
the book Away Game A Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth Sports.
It's written by editor Jasinski and Brian Smith. Brian is
on staff with Athletes in Action. He's written several books,
including Away Game. Editor. Jasinski is an author, speaker, sports
(28:02):
minister with more than three decades experience discipling college and
professional athletes. So there's a world of experience here and
a real help in away game. A Christian Parent's Guide
to Navigating Youth Sports. I told you I was going
to ask you a question, but I want to call
an audible here and go back to the youth sports
(28:23):
industrial complex and ESPN. Because in the book editor, you
said that when you grew up, you practiced, uh, little league,
you know, the baseball you got on your bike and
you rode to the park, and then even the place
where you played was about a mile away. So you
could do everything on your own there in the town
that you lived in. But that's not the way that
(28:46):
it is anymore. The the place where you practice is
a half hour away and you got to get, you know,
the baseball bats these days. I priced a baseball bat
for my son one day. It's like, I can't I
can't get a loan for this. So all of that
has changed, hasn't it?
S4 (29:03):
It has changed. And like we talked about in the
last segment, it's really become an industry. And Brian and
I are careful to we feel like we have to
keep disclaiming everything because we're not against the idea of
people making money off of sports or creating environments where
kids can play sports and they're going to be able
to make money there. That's not necessarily bad in and
(29:26):
of itself, but we all know that when money gets
involved and when money becomes a primary concern, our kids
interests and what's best for them tends to slide further
down the list. And that's just that's just the nature
of things. And so unless somebody is extremely intentional to
(29:46):
keep kids first and kids not just their physical growth,
but their emotional growth, their spiritual growth, a more holistic
approach to them, uh, unless somebody is intentional about that,
they're probably just going to try to keep the doors
open on their business. And unless they're training coaches to
have a certain trajectory when it comes to the values
(30:07):
of what we want to embody and what we want
to teach the kids, we're probably just going to focus
on being successful on the field. And it's when that
becomes an extreme that it becomes bad when that's all
we're concerned about winning, because you've mentioned that a couple
of times, Chris. We're not winning, but we are against
that being the only thing that matters. And it's just
been way too easy for that to be the case
(30:29):
in too many of our youth sports experiences these days.
S1 (30:32):
Yes. Which gets us to the heart of what you're
trying to do, whether you do the travel team or
not for your children. Because here's a quote, Christian parent,
our sports investment is buying us a ticket, a front
row seat to scout our kids, experiencing the roller coaster
of emotions and experiences that sports produce. Every day we
(30:53):
get to see the relational tensions on the field. We
monitor how they respond to perceived injustices from officials, other competitors,
other parents, and their own coaches. We observe how they
respond to winning and losing and the effect both have
on their psyche. We watch their post-practice body language coming
(31:14):
toward the car before the ride home. We get to
steward the joy, pain, frustration and pride, constantly working on
their sense of self as they're trying to grow up.
That's the secret sauce behind the scenes, isn't it, Brian?
S3 (31:31):
Yeah, we've we've been jokingly saying for a while now
that when our kids get home from school, we ask
the question, how was your day? And we get the
the 1 or 2 word answer, right? It was fine.
It's good. And because we're not at school during the
whole day, we don't know everything that happened. And so
we don't know who they sat next to and we
don't know what the teacher said and how they responded.
(31:53):
But in sports, we don't have to guess. We have
a front row seat to seeing everything that happens, which
if we began to watch through heavenly metrics, Kingdom, Kingdom metrics,
it becomes an incredible opportunity for us to live out
one of our primary roles in their lives. And that's
to be disciple makers. So when we see them interact
(32:17):
or choose not to interact with the kid who's sitting
on the end of the bench, that becomes a discipleship
opportunity when we see them have a bad call against
them by an official or a referee, that that becomes, yes,
maybe an injustice, but it's a discipleship opportunity. And what
we're trying to do in this book is to say, hey, parent,
whatever you have decided with your kid that your path
(32:40):
is going to be travel team, elite team, YMCA league,
what you're doing is you are giving an opportunity to
yourself and your kid to sharpen them, to help them
look more and more like Jesus. But to do that, you.
And you mentioned this in the last segment. There needs
to be a level of, um, of understanding in your
own heart of what's going on to, to really check
(33:03):
the value system. Like, do I, do I actually want
to do this? Do I want to leverage these moments
for discipleship or not?
S1 (33:11):
Yes. And then being able to to step in their
presence is the main thing. If you're not present there,
you don't have the opportunity to do that. But if
you are present even that, you have to have intentionality.
I think behind all of this is the desire as
a parent who's had kids in sports, I want somebody
(33:32):
to see my child the way I see him or her.
I want someone to validate. I remember there was one
was my youngest son was playing right field and the
team was pretty good, and they were winning a bunch
of games, and there was a sharp liner that was
hit to right field. And there in a runner on first.
(33:55):
And um, he, he got the ball. He fielded it
cleanly and he threw over the head of the cutoff
cutoff kid, you know, at second base all the way
to third base. And it bounced once and hit. And
I thought, you know, great job. The coach went ballistic.
S6 (34:12):
No no, no.
S1 (34:14):
And what he was trying to do was to show
him no. You always hit the cutout. A cut off guy.
I get that, but at the same time, he threw
it a long way and it was on. You know,
he almost got the guy out. Um, so. But but
I always felt like, oh, this coach didn't see. Didn't
see my son. Well, uh, and I had a hard
(34:36):
time getting over that hurdle. Editor.
S4 (34:38):
Yep. Feel the same thing. And, you know, you mentioned
this earlier, Chris. Brian and I have spent decades working
with college athletes and some professional, but mostly college athletes.
And one of the main things that we talk to
them about is, is deriving their identity in Christ. The
Bible makes a big deal about what it means to
(35:00):
be in Christ and how that should consume us, and
it should shape everything about the way we view ourselves,
the way we view the world, and the way we
view our relationship to God. And so we just are
pounding that in them all the time. But, you know,
I need to be reminded of what it means to
be in Christ as a parent, I need to I
(35:21):
need to remember that sport is always going to judge
my child on the basis of merit, and that not
even always on a in a fair way. It's always earned,
never given. Unless in those cases where it is given
because of power plays or these sorts of things, in
which case it's not just but the gospel is always
based on grace. And so this is another thing that
(35:44):
Brian and I just keep talking about. We know how
to talk with college athletes about it, but are we
speaking that same thing to ourselves? Do we know what
it means to show up at a game and be
so identified with Christ that we're not primarily affected by
what the crowd thinks, what the coach thinks, how the
ref treats them, how the other team treats them. We
(36:05):
are going to be identified with Jesus. And then how
do we teach our kid to do that? That you
can be sad that you made a mistake. It's always
disappointing to lose, of course, but when this is over,
or do we know what it means to be fully
identified in Christ in such a way that everyone else's
opinions and my performance is not what determines how I
(36:26):
feel about myself, or how I continue to interact with
you after the game. Yes, that's a mature that's a
very mature Christian mature, um, it demands Christian maturity to
be able to do that. And again, for too many
of us parents, it's really kind of exposes that when
it comes to youth sports, I'm pretty immature. I don't
(36:47):
really identify with Christ as much as I identify with
headlines or people's opinions, and that needs to change inside
of me.
S1 (36:55):
I'll preach anywhere, and you know that you can take
that into the workplace. You can take that into the
home and the family. You know, off the field. It
shows you that these things that are touching that nerve
on the inside, It's there for a reason. And actually,
if you, you know, you find yourself limited. The litmus
test has come up and you've failed. This is a
(37:18):
good thing for you because it's showing you something about yourself.
And I think that's what the strength is about. Your
book Away Game is the title A Christian Parents Guide
to Navigating Youth Sports are featured resource. Click through today's
information at Livorno. There is a parent listening right now
I think I'm safe to say this. There's a parent
(37:40):
listening right now who says, I've been doing this for
a long time. I let my child drive the bus
of his or her sports experience and I'm tired. I
need to get off the bus. We'll find out what
they say straight ahead. Brian Smith and editor Jasinski have
(38:07):
written away game. A Christian parent's guide to navigating youth sports.
Jasinski is spelled u z I. I love that name.
That's so good. And you can find out more at
Chris Fabry live for Bobrinski Bobrinsky. That would be good.
Away game A Christian parents guide to navigating youth sports. Okay,
(38:30):
so there's a parent listening right now. And they're driving
down the road and say I can't do it anymore.
This weekend was you know, I was traveling the whole
time and we had to stay overnight. And we're spending
all this money and I can't do this anymore. What
do you say, Brian? What do you say to that parent?
S3 (38:45):
Um, first of all, I'm sure that editor appreciated you
spelling his last name for all your listeners. Every time
I type it into my email, I'm always waiting for
it to pop up so I don't have to try
and spell it.
S4 (38:57):
Same, so am I. After 57 years.
S3 (39:01):
What would I say to the parent who's exhausted and exasperated?
I would say, you don't have to keep doing this anymore. You.
S4 (39:08):
You have.
S3 (39:09):
Permission. You have permission to say we're done. We're done
for a season. We're done for a month. We're done
with this league or with this team. I would say
finish out your commitment first, but then you you are
under no obligation by God to to re-up next year
(39:29):
and do it again. So if it if it is
draining your family, if it is going against your not
only your family values but your Christian values, then you
may actually be doing more harm by continuing to invest
into a system that for the most part, I want
to say this carefully, but for the most part, the
(39:50):
system of youth sports doesn't care about your kid like
you do, and nor should it. And so just to
know you, you have permission to just step away and
trust that God is sovereign and that if your kid
is going to to make it. And I'm putting up
air quotes right now that that God will make a
way for that to happen. It's not going to be
(40:11):
because you spent another thousand dollars on a league to
get them there.
S1 (40:14):
And that's part of your hope for the book editor
is that churches, the people inside the church will be
able to support those who are making these really hard
decisions about their kids and wanting the best for them.
And the book can be this catalyst for that, right?
S4 (40:32):
For sure. And what we hope is there will be conversations.
I just we don't think we talk about this enough
at church. I mean, sport is a massive idol in
our culture. It's a, it's a it's a huge, um,
mental component of our lives. Even if you're not involved
in sports like you talked about earlier, you're still affected
(40:54):
by the machine that sports has become. And so it's
probably a disservice that we don't really know how to
talk about it very well at church. Again, it's it's
just easier to isolate from it entirely, or just go
ahead with whatever it is they serve up to us
and we'll figure it out later. We think we can
do better than that, and it starts by having conversations.
It starts by giving each other permission to step off
(41:16):
the bus. And, you know, it's helpful to to hear
from people who are already on the other side of
high school who can look back and say, yeah, it
really didn't matter. It really didn't matter what team they
were on when they were ten, for sure, but not
even maybe when they were 15 or 16. So much
winds up outside of our control when it comes to
(41:36):
the success, and I'll put success even in quotes of
our kids sports experience teams, coaches, players that come in and,
you know, come to school and leave the school, circumstances, injuries, referees,
there's so many different factors that we're not as in
(41:58):
control of it as we think we are, and it
would be much better to give more energy into who
they're becoming as a person and shaping their hearts and
equipping ourselves to do that more rather than worrying about
their playing time.
S1 (42:11):
That's why one of the sections of the book you
talk about the importance of the ride home. And I've
heard other people talk about the best thing you can
do as a parent is not to give advice or
give a big lecture or this, that and the other.
Ask questions and then be quiet. Be quiet and listen.
Those that ride home, Brian, can be really a great time,
(42:35):
can't it?
S3 (42:36):
Yeah. If you're familiar with the the quote, all is well,
that ends well. There's actually research behind that that shows
we remember things based on how the experience ended. And
for mass amounts of kids, what's happening right now in
youth sports is they're remembering their their games, their youth
sports experience by getting in the car ride home and
(42:57):
having mom or dad and I would add, well-intentioned Intentioned
mom or dad, either coach or critique, or in some
cases maybe criticize. What happens and what the kids want
and need is connection from us, not coaching and critiquing.
And so the encouragement in the book is to to
(43:18):
keep the car ride home. Sacred space where we're learning
how to connect, not not analyze. Maybe, maybe just turn
up the radio and sing together and leave the leave
the game and everything else in the rear view mirror.
S4 (43:33):
Brian said he started doing this years ago and it
stuck to me. I think it's brilliant. He said when
he gets in the car with his kids, the first
thing he asks them after they play is, is there
anything about the game that you want to talk about?
And more often than not, they say, no, they don't
want to talk about the game. So put some music
on the radio and ask them, where do you want
(43:54):
to go get ice cream? You know, and that drives
us crazy. Now think about it again. Why does that
bother me so much that my kids don't want to
talk about the game afterwards, and I do. I've been
sitting there for two hours.
S3 (44:05):
Just because we have answers. We have answers.
S4 (44:07):
We do right. We know we have answers. We're going
to fix it all. We're going to get them the
training they need. And most of the time they're really
not interested in getting better. And again, I know that
sounds terrible. They just want to play. They want to
have fun with their friends. And yeah, of course they're
(44:28):
open to getting better, but most of them don't even
want to put the work in that it would take.
They just want to play. And again, we're talking about kids.
This changes maybe when you get up in high school
and kids start to get a little bit more of
a desire to to want to stand out at a skill.
But most of the damage that's being done is being
done to eight year olds and ten year olds and
(44:50):
12 year olds. And and then we don't have relationship
with them. We've been laughing and tongue in cheek about
this for years. Our goal is that our kids would
come home for Thanksgiving when they're 30. That's really what
we want and sometimes how we've interacted with them in
the car on the way home after games is contributing
a ton to whether or not they're going to want
(45:11):
to do that a decade from now. Yeah.
S1 (45:15):
And you make the point in the book that sports
sports can only do so much teaching, teaching you about
discipline and about teamwork and all of that. The real,
the real teaching comes alongside of that with someone who
mentors and, dare I say, disciples. And that's the the
(45:38):
real heart of the book. It's titled Away Game A
Christian Parent's Guide to Navigating Youth Sports. I came into
this thinking as I started reading, oh, you guys are
going to tell us all the reasons why you shouldn't
go on the travel team, and you didn't do that.
And I was I was really glad that you didn't just,
you know, put the imprimatur on there and say, get
(45:59):
out of there. You know, this is all of this
ESPN and everything has conditioned us to think that this
is the most important thing. So well reasoned approach and
a real encouragement away game. A Christian Parents Guide to
Navigating Youth Sports by Editor Jasinski. Now you know how
to spell it. And Brian Smith I know you can
spell that. Brian. Editor. God bless you, friends. Thanks for
(46:22):
doing this today.
S4 (46:23):
Thank you.
S3 (46:24):
Chris.
S1 (46:25):
Coming up tomorrow, we're going to spend the hour kind
of processing what we did at the beginning of the
program with Max Lucado today. And that is the the floods,
the loss of life in Texas. And if you're having
a hard time like I am of dealing with all this,
come on back tomorrow and spend an hour with us
here at the back fence. Chris Fabry lives production of
Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute. Thanks for listening.
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