May 28, 2025 • 33 mins
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Have you ever wondered what makes someone an exceptional second-in-command? In leadership conversations, we often focus on the person at the top, but behind every great leader stands someone who amplifies their vision and transforms dreams into tangible impact.
This episode explores the biblical principles of being a great "number two" – a role that combines humility with competence and faithfulness. Through powerful examples like Timothy serving under Paul, Joshua supporting Moses, and Jonathan standing with David, we uncover the spiritual foundations that make support roles not just necessary but noble.
The most effective leaders surround themselves with exceptional seconds-in-command who complement their weaknesses and create harmony between vision and action. As Harold explains, "You can never be promoted until you become overqualified for your current position" – a biblical principle that transforms how we approach our current roles.
We also examine modern business examples like Gwen Shotwell at SpaceX and Sheryl Sandberg at Facebook, whose operational excellence has translated ambitious visions into world-changing companies. Their stories demonstrate how number twos bridge the crucial gap between strategy and execution.
Whether you're currently in a supporting role or leading an organization, you'll gain practical wisdom on cultivating a servant's heart, aligning with vision, providing wise counsel, and fostering team unity. The episode addresses common challenges like feeling undervalued and balancing loyalty with honest feedback.
Being a great number two isn't about being second-best—it's about faithfully stewarding responsibilities while reflecting Christ's character. As you excel in this role, you'll not only strengthen your organization but prepare yourself for future leadership opportunities in God's perfect timing.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the Christian Business Concepts with
your host, harold Milby.
Christian Business Concepts isdedicated to guiding companies
and business owners in becomingeffective, efficient and
successful through God's Wordand godly principles.
Now, here's your host, haroldMilby.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Thanks, kelly, and welcome everyone to this week's
Christian Business Conceptspodcast.
I'm your host, harold Milby,and I'm so very glad that you
decided to download and listento this week's podcast.
I pray that, as you listen andapply the principles that you
hear today, that you'll beencouraged, that you'll be
(00:39):
enlightened and empowered tofind what we talk about at CBC
as true godly success.
You know, joshua, chapter 1,says that this book of the law
shall not depart out of thymouth, but thou shalt meditate
therein day and night, that thoumayest observe to do according
to all that is written therein,for then thou shalt make thy way
(01:03):
prosperous and then thou shalthave good success.
You know, I believe this verseis for every one of you, every
single one of you.
But the key, I think, isapplying his word to our lives
and following the biblicalprinciples that we talk about
here at CBC every week in ourpodcasts.
(01:24):
That's what CBC is all abouthelping people find godly
success through biblicalprinciples and godly principles.
Now, before we jump intotoday's podcast, let me just
give a big shout out to Phoenix,arizona, right here in the
United States, for their manydownloads over the last week or
so.
Thank you, phoenix.
We really hope.
(01:45):
You're blessed by being a partof the CBC community and we
appreciate all of you who listenevery week or as much as you
possibly can.
I'm so blessed, I am so humbledto know there are so many of
you listening to the ChristianBusiness Concepts podcast.
So thank you all for being apart of what God is doing around
(02:08):
the world.
Now, this week, in our companyhighlight, I want to mention a
company called CovenantTransport.
They're here in the UnitedStates.
They're a transportationcompany, they're a trucking
company and they were founded in1986 by David and Jacqueline
Parker in Chattanooga, tennessee, and David is a very strong
(02:34):
Christian.
He's still the chairman of theboard, even though the CEO role
is now turned over to Joey Hogan.
But understand that they have alot of great impact and they
support Christian charities.
They really have a greatprogram, a welfare program for
(02:55):
their drivers.
They employ over 3,000 peopleand they generate over $1
billion in revenue and theyreally promote integrity in
everything that they do, in alltheir operations.
They promote integrity and theyare of a position within the
(03:15):
industry now that they reallyhave an influence in the
trucking industry.
But it's all because of theirChristian integrity and their
character and their godly way ofdoing business there at
Covenant Transportation.
(03:36):
So keep it up, covenantTransportation.
You guys are doing a great job.
We really appreciate whatyou're doing in the workplace
and we appreciate your Christianvalues that you let shine
through in everything that youguys do on a daily basis.
So we appreciate companies likeCovenant Transport.
(03:57):
Now, in the past, I did apodcast on how to find and how
to recruit a good, or really agreat number two person, but
today I want to look at thebiblical principles, not on
finding this person, but I wantto look at some biblical
(04:19):
principles on being a greatnumber two.
On being a great number two.
I have spent most of my careeras a number two other than the
two churches that I was a seniorpastor of but in my business
career, I have spent my timetrying to be a good or great
(04:44):
number two.
Some people want to be in thatnumber two position because they
feel like, well, that's justone step away for being the head
person, or being the number one, if you want to talk in that
vernacular.
For me, though, I felt that mygiftings and that my purpose was
to be a very good or greatnumber two, a very good or great
(05:08):
number two, and if your goal isto become a number one person,
if that's where you're headed,that's where you feel like
you're moving to, if you feellike that's the direction that
you're going in, then you reallyneed to become a really good
number two and be the best thatyou can possibly be.
First, because I believe thatthe Word of God, I believe that
the Bible, proves out that youcan never be promoted until you
(05:29):
become overqualified for yourcurrent position.
Let me say that again, Ibelieve the Bible proves out
that you can never be promoteduntil you have become
overqualified for your currentposition.
You know, in leadership, being anumber two, that's the second
(05:50):
in command, that's the deputy orthe supportive leader I believe
that that is such a vital roleand it requires humility, it
requires wisdom and really itrequires a servant's heart.
You know, this position is notabout striving for your own
glory, it's not about being seen, but it's about amplifying the
(06:12):
vision of the primary leader,the person that you work for and
at the same time, you'recontributing to the
organization's mission in a veryGod-honoring way.
So I want to give you somebiblical examples of those who
served as absolutelyextraordinary number twos and
(06:35):
these were people that werefaithful supporters.
They were second-in-commandfigures who basically amplified
that mission, like I'm talkingabout, but they did it by
demonstrating loyalty andhumility and that godly service.
And each of these exampleshighlight their role and the
(06:55):
qualities that made themeffective and helped them to
align with the Christianbusiness context of being an
outstanding number two InChristian leadership.
Being a number two, the secondin command, it's so important,
it's so powerful.
So I believe that behind everygreat leader, there is a number
(07:21):
two who's amplified their visionand helped them to turn dreams
into tangible impact.
I believe that the best leaders, I believe the very best
leaders in the world, today, Ibelieve they surround themselves
with really good number twosand these are ones who
complement their weaknesses andthey create a harmony of vision
and action.
And thirdly, I greatly believethat a great number two turns
(07:48):
vision into victory by mastering, if you will, that art of
execution with precision andpurpose.
So let's look at our firstexample.
The first one is Timothy in theNew Testament.
You know, timothy traveled withPaul, he delivered his letters,
he pastored churches underPaul's guidance.
(08:10):
That's according to 1Corinthians 4.17, 1 Timothy 4.12
.
Paul mentored him.
He mentored him very, veryclosely.
He was a young man.
He was a very loving young manand one who wanted to be a great
pastor.
But he was tutored, or mentored, under the Apostle Paul.
(08:30):
In fact, apostle Paul calledhim his true son in the faith.
That's in 1 Timothy 1 and 2.
But what kind of qualities didhe demonstrate?
Well, timothy embraced Paul'sinstruction.
He made sure that he listenedto what Paul had to say and he
(08:51):
wanted to grow into this verypowerful and capable leader.
He was very loyal, very loyalto Paul.
He represented him faithfully,even in some of the really
challenging situations.
The Bible talks about it inPhilippians, chapter 2, and you
can read that.
But he not only was teachable,but he was also very courageous.
(09:16):
He led people despite his youthand timidity.
Paul mentions it in 1 Timothy.
In the book of 1 Timothy hetalked about his youth and he
talked to Paul and Paul said donot despise your youth.
Don't despise your youth,because Timothy was struggling.
(09:37):
He was very timid because ofhis youth and he was ministering
to older people, but he reallyfelt empowered by Paul's
encouragement.
He really does, and you can seethat in 2 Timothy, 1.
So you've got to be open tomentorship.
If you're going to be a greatnumber two, you've got to be
open to having somebody mentoryou, and I can't give you steps
(10:02):
one, two, three to figure thatout.
I mean, if you're going to be agreat number two, you have to
figure that out.
Another one is Joshua.
Joshua was second in command toMoses.
You know Joshua was Moses' aide.
He was his successor.
He served faithfully under hisleadership, you know, before he
(10:25):
became Israel's leader.
You can see some of this inExodus, chapter 24, joshua,
chapter 1.
He assisted Moses during somereally critical moments.
He accompanied him partway upMount Sinai.
He led the army against theAmalekites in Exodus, chapter 17
(10:48):
.
He was really trusted by Mosesand he learned from Moses.
He learned from his leadershipand that was preparing him for
his future.
So what were some of thequalities that Joshua portrayed?
Well?
He was loyal.
So what were some of thequalities that Joshua portrayed?
Well, he was loyal.
He remained very devoted toMoses.
He never looked to try toovershadow him or become bigger
(11:11):
than Moses.
He was very humble.
He served in some verysupportive roles.
He was a guard.
He guarded the tent, thetabernacle.
He guarded that.
That's in Exodus 33.
And he didn't ask for anyrecognition.
He wasn't demanding, but he wasalso very faithful.
He was obedient.
(11:33):
He had great courage.
This is found in Numbers,chapter 13.
And he aligned with God'smission that God had given to
Moses.
He lined himself up with thatand I think we can learn from
that.
I think we can learn that whenyou support a leader's vision
with loyalty and then youprepare diligently for future
(11:56):
responsibilities and you got totrust in God's timing, then I
believe that God will raise youup to do greater things, even
now that you're doing this innumber two.
And then we can talk aboutElisha.
We could talk about who wassecond in command to Elijah, the
prophet Elijah.
(12:16):
We could talk about that.
We could talk about Joseph.
He was second in command toPharaoh in all of Egypt.
You know he served as Pharaoh'ssecond in command.
He oversaw all of Egypt'sresources during a great, great
famine.
He oversaw all of it.
And so it's important that youlook at some of these number two
(12:41):
roles because they help you.
Another great one was Jonathan,who was King Saul's son, and yet
his heart was knit towardsDavid and he was there to be a
number two for David.
He supported David when hebecame king when, rightfully, it
would have been him who wouldhave been king next.
(13:02):
But he stood behind David andhe was a great number two for
David and he had a covenantrelationship with him.
And when you become a numbertwo, that's one of the things
that you have to be willing todo.
You know, I said you have to bewilling to be mentored, but you
also have to be willing to walkin a covenant with that leader.
(13:23):
Walk in a covenant with thatleader.
I know for 22 years I was one ofthe number twos for the owner
of the company.
I never felt more.
I think the word is fulfilled.
I don't think I was ever asfulfilled as I was, knowing that
I was there for that purpose.
I knew that I was supposed tobe a number two.
(13:45):
I wasn't looking to be a numberone.
I wanted to be that number twobecause I felt like that's where
my giftings were, that's wheremy purpose was.
But Jonathan was very selflessbecause he should have been king
, but yet he supported David inDavid becoming king and he
protected David.
He risked his life for him.
(14:06):
So he had this covenant withDavid.
He was very humble about it.
He embraced this supportiverole instead of being a king,
and he just trusted God thatGod's purpose was being done.
So you kind of have to, whenyou're number two, you have to
put the organization's missionand even God's plan above your
(14:28):
personal ambition.
You've got to support thatleader with a real selfless
devotion.
I should say so.
Some of these biblical examplesthey illustrate the qualities
that make an outstanding numbertwo.
You've got to support thevision, like Joshua and Timothy
(14:50):
did.
You've got to align with andamplify that person.
That you're the number two forthat number one.
That you're the number two forthat number one.
You've got to align and amplifythat God-given direction.
But notice that in all of thesituations they served with
humility, they acted withintegrity and wisdom, they
(15:14):
prioritized God's plan and allof that prepared them for future
roles.
It prepared them for futureroles.
It prepared them for futureroles.
And I can give you some modernexamples of great number twos.
The first one is my cousin,drew Milby.
Drew was the number two forPapa John's.
For those of you not in thiscountry, papa John is one of the
(15:35):
largest pizza chains in theworld.
They're all over the world.
But she started with him whenthey only had 20 locations and
she rose quickly.
She became the number twoperson within that company and
it was her that helped educateand help promote and help
motivate the employees and shewas the one that helped them to
(15:59):
get onto the New York StockExchange as a publicly traded
company.
So Drew Milby was outstanding,but there's also you can look at
Sheryl Sandberg, who's thenumber two.
She's the COO of Facebook andshe joined Facebook in 2008.
She joined Facebook in 2008.
She's been serving MarkZuckerberg as his
(16:23):
second-in-command.
She used to work at Google.
She was a Google executive andshe brought a lot of operational
expertise to Facebook as it wasgrowing rapidly at that time in
the beginning, and she actuallyscaled Facebook's revenue from
$150 million in annual revenueto over $3.7 billion by 2011.
(16:50):
And she did that through a lotof innovative advertising and
models and things of that natureand she streamlined.
She streamlined theiroperations as well, and when she
started they had 1,000employees and now they've got
over 70,000.
So she focused much on ethicalleadership and empowerment.
(17:12):
She valued excellence.
Though she wasn't explicitly aChristian.
Her ability to translate visionand take that vision and turn
it into executable plans was amodel that almost every business
wanted.
And then you have Gwen Shotwell.
(17:33):
Gwen Shotwell is the presidentand COO of SpaceX.
So she's that number two forElon Musk's vision that he has
for space exploration.
So she's helped SpaceX growfrom $150 billion by 2023.
(17:55):
And a big part of that was GwenShotwell.
She secured a lot of contracts.
She secured a $2.9 billionLunar Lander deal.
She negotiated in such a mannerthat it drove 60% of the global
(18:15):
commercial launch market.
So they own 60% of that launchwhat we call the launch market
and you know there's just a lotof positive things she's done.
I mean she spearheaded STEMoutreach programs.
She really helped to inspirethousands of students to pursue
(18:38):
aerospace careers.
She's just done a lot of greatwork there at SpaceX.
And then there's John Cargill,the COO of Hobby Lobby the same
thing.
I mean he has done a great jobas being a number two for David
Green, which was, you know, whofounded Hobby Lobby in 72.
(19:02):
And you know he's very Cargillis very, very supportive of
Green's faith-driven vision ashis second in command.
So these are some greatexamples.
There's Amy Hood, the CFO atMicrosoft great number two.
(19:22):
So why is it so important to bea good number two?
Well, number one, it's abiblical calling to serve.
You know the Bible says whoeverwants to become great among you
must first be your servant.
So it's part of a biblical callto serve.
That's what we're to do now.
It also it strengthens theprimary leader.
(19:44):
You know, if you look at Aaronand her, they they were like
number twos for Moses as well,and and it was so important in
Exodus, chapter 17, as they leftEgypt, there was a time that
God was using Moses to hold uphis arms to part the Red Sea so
that they could walk across ondry ground, and Moses' arms
(20:04):
began to get tired, and so Aaronand Hur came beside him, one on
each side, and helped hold hisarms up.
And so you know that's whatnumber twos do.
They support that leader duringchallenging times.
So I think that's importantbecause you strengthen the
primary leader.
A third reason is because itadvances the mission.
(20:24):
You know, in a Christianbusiness the mission is beyond
profit.
You know it's there to glorifyGod and serve others.
So it helps to advance themission of the organization.
It also helps to build trustand unity.
You know, because you modelthat integrity and collaboration
, you create a culture whereeverybody works towards that
(20:47):
common goal and that helps youto reflect the unity of the body
of Christ, and then it preparesfor future leadership.
You know, because when youbecome a number two and you're
successful at it, it's often Goduses it as just a season of
preparation for your futureroles, maybe in leadership, like
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God did with Joshua under Moses, or the way God did Elisha
under Elijah.
And then it brings glory to Godbecause you're being faithful,
and when you're faithful, itbrings glory to God because
you're being faithful, and whenyou're faithful, it brings glory
to him.
Colossians 3.23 says whateveryou do, work at it with all your
heart as working for the Lord.
So how do we become an effectivenumber two?
(21:36):
To excel as a number two, Ibelieve that Christian business
leaders, you've got to blendtogether this spiritual maturity
with a practical group ofskills, and so I want to share
with you some actionable stepsthat are rooted in biblical
principles, obviously, and alsothere's some business best
(21:59):
practices here, so that willhelp you to become a great
number two.
So, number one, you have tocultivate a servant's heart.
Well, how do you do that?
Well, you got to pray forhumility.
You need to have a desire toserve more than you do to seek
recognition.
You need to actively listen tothe primary leader's vision and
(22:22):
you need to listen with an ideato understand, and you can't put
your own agenda in that.
You've got to be willing totake on some risk and you've got
to do it with excellence and apositive attitude.
If the primary leader isoverwhelmed, you need to offer
to handle some of thoseadministrative tasks or maybe
(22:46):
lead a project or something,something to lighten their load.
That's one of the reasons thatyou're there is demonstrating
this willingness to serve.
Number two you align with thevision.
Make sure you get lined up.
You don't talk against thevision.
You don't talk differently thanwhat the lined up.
You don't talk against thevision.
You don't talk differently thanwhat the vision is.
You don't try to share your ownvision.
And what helps you to do thatis by regularly meeting with
(23:11):
that primary leader and you gotto make sure you understand
their goals and their priorities.
And then you've got to askclarifying questions to make
sure that you fully understandthat vision.
And then you've got to askclarifying questions to make
sure that you fully understandthat vision.
And then the next thing is yougo out and you begin to
communicate that vision to theteam and you do it clearly and
you do it consistently, and youdo it because you're trying to
(23:35):
reinforce the importance of thatvision, so you help do that.
So if a primary leader's visionis to expand let's say outreach
through a new initiative orresearch, and propose these
actionable steps to make it areality, you got to make sure
that you get out there and youcommunicate that vision, and
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that's part of what you do as anoutstanding number two.
Now the third thing is youprovide wise counsel.
Now, how do you do that?
Well, first of all, you need toknow that organization's
operations.
You've got to know markettrends.
You've got to know what thechallenges are, to provide
really good advice.
And then make sure that youoffer feedback, but do that
(24:21):
privately.
I encourage you offer thefeedback privately, do it
respectfully.
Don't say well, I think you'rereally making a stupid decision.
That's not the way you handlethat.
You're a number two.
You got to rise above that.
You got to be very respectful.
You've got to frame yoursuggestions in a way that really
supports the leader's goals.
(24:43):
I think that's what's important.
And then I think you've got touse discernment to know when to
speak and when to listen.
If the primary leader is maybeconsidering a risky financial
decision.
You shouldn't just go to himand say I think this is a
problem, but be sure to do someresearch, find out what could
happen if he goes down this pathand then try to give him a very
(25:06):
good analysis.
Make sure you've got data, makesure you've got facts to back
up what you're saying and sharewith him what the potential
outcomes could be.
At the same time, you've got toreaffirm their authority in
that they see that youunderstand they are the one in
(25:27):
the position of being thatnumber one.
They're in the position ofauthority.
But just make sure theyunderstand that you know that.
The fourth thing you can do tobe a great number two is to
complement the primary leader'sstrengths.
So you need to look at theleader's strengths and their
weaknesses just by watching them, just observing them, or maybe
(25:49):
a very candid discussion whereyou can talk about them.
But you've got to take on thoseresponsibilities.
That uses your strength inareas where maybe that leader
maybe doesn't have the strengths, maybe it's a weakness, but
they need that support there.
It might be in operations, itmay be finance, it might be team
(26:09):
management.
But then you've got to offersolutions and do that in a very,
very proactive way.
Don't bring in problems.
He's got enough people bringinghim problems or she's got
enough people bringing himproblems.
You've got to offer solutions.
Be very proactive about that.
Don't overstep your role.
But you take him and hersolutions.
(26:33):
For example, if the leader theprimary leader if he's great at
setting a vision, casting avision, but he struggles with
the operational details In otherwords, he knows he's got a
vision for getting from point Ato point B but doesn't quite
know what needs to happenoperationally to get from point
A to point B, then you shouldprobably take ownership of that.
(26:55):
You can also take ownership ofsome project management issues
that may be going on and thenyou can make sure that
everything's working out to meetthe you know, whatever may be
deadlines or something.
So you've got to check thatNumber five.
You've got to bridge, build abridge from the strategy to the
(27:17):
execution, and that's kind of apart of number four, but you
need to bridge execution, andthat's kind of a part of number
four, but you need to bridgethat.
You need to go from strategy toexecution, because not every
primary leader can do that.
So that may be something thatyou have to do.
The next thing is you have tofoster a team unity.
You should not have employeesthat look at you as a leader but
(27:39):
not the leader that you'reunder as a number two.
You've got to make sure thatyou do that and you communicate
that through sharing thatprimary leader's vision to the
team.
But you can do it withenthusiasm and clarity, but they
need to know this is comingfrom our leader, right?
And then make sure that youaddress conflicts very quickly,
(28:02):
very fairly, and you need tomake sure you celebrate the
team's successes.
So I think those are someimportant things that you do.
And then make sure youdemonstrate loyalty to this
leader.
Make sure you do that.
Make sure that you develop,demonstrate, I should say,
(28:23):
loyalty.
Speak very positively about theprimary leader whenever you're
in public and in private.
Don't allow gossip about theleader.
Don't accept criticism aboutthe leader.
You're there to be as numbertwo.
You've got to be the one thatdefends their decisions when
(28:44):
that's appropriate.
You've got to, at times, offerconstructive feedback.
Yes, but you do that in private.
In public, you defend theleader's decisions.
Stay committed.
Stay committed to the mission.
Stay committed Even duringchallenges.
Stay committed If a team memberquestions the primary leader's
(29:08):
say, strategy, then you need totake the time to explain why the
leader reached this decision tooperate this way.
You need to explain that to them, stand behind them and
encourage them to trust theleader and then help address
maybe some of their concerns andmaybe some of those concerns
(29:29):
are valid and maybe you can helpaddress them.
But you want to demonstratethat loyalty and then make sure
that you develop your skills andcharacter.
You want to invest in yourselfpersonally for growth, but you
also want to invest in yourselfto help his weaknesses or her
weaknesses.
(29:49):
You need to be able to do thatand then you need to rely on
prayer and discernment.
Now you're going to have somechallenges.
There are going to be times whenmaybe you feel undervalued.
There's going to be times whenyou feel like you've got to
balance loyalty and, at the sametime, be honest about things.
(30:10):
You've got to be able to manageup the chain and down the chain
.
You've got to be able to manageup and down, and sometimes
that's hard to do.
So those are probably the threebiggest challenges and being
the number one, one I think tome is feeling undervalued,
because there's going to betimes when you do, you just
don't feel like you're valuedand you feel like you carry so
(30:32):
much for the leader, but youfeel undervalued.
Listen, don't let that botheryou, don't let it get you down.
It's very common, so you justcontinue to do what you are
supposed to do and I believethat being a good number two.
I believe it's a very highcalling.
I believe it combines humilityand competence, and even
(30:55):
faithfulness, and I think byserving with a Christ-like heart
and aligning yourself withtheir vision and executing not
just executing, but executingwith excellence I believe you'll
contribute to yourorganization's success and it'll
bring God glory.
(31:15):
This role is not about beingsecond best, because it's not
really about that.
It's about being faithful,being a faithful steward of the
responsibilities that's beenentrusted to you, and as you
grow in this role, I know thatyou'll not only strengthen the
organization itself, but it'llalso prepare you for future
(31:40):
leadership opportunities, andthe whole time this is happening
, you're reflecting thecharacter of Christ.
Father, I come before you in thename of Jesus and I pray for
all those who have listened tothis podcast today and whether
they are trying to fill a numbertwo role in their organization
or they are in a number two roleor they're going to become a
(32:02):
number two role.
Lord, I pray that you'll helpthem utilize these principles to
excel to excel, lord, at whatthey are doing, and that they
will be extremely, extremelysuccessful.
I thank you, lord, that theirmotives will be pure and I thank
you that they will excel In thename of Jesus Christ.
(32:24):
Amen and amen.
Well, thank you again fortuning in.
Be sure to share the podcastwith four or five other people.
Post this podcast link ontoyour Facebook and LinkedIn pages
.
We're so blessed that you're apart of us, and that's all the
time we have for today, so untilnext time, remember Jesus is
(32:47):
Lord and he wants you blessed.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
Thank you for tuning into this week's Christian
Business Concepts podcast.
Go tochristianbusinessconceptscom for
more information and resources.
Be sure to check out otherpodcasts that will help you take
your business and your personallife to a whole new level of
success.
Welcome to the Christian Business Concepts with
your host, harold Milby.
Christian Business Concepts isdedicated to guiding companies
and business owners in becomingeffective, efficient and
successful through God's Wordand godly principles.
Now, here's your host, haroldMilby.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
Thanks, kelly, and welcome everyone to this week's
Christian Business Conceptspodcast.
I'm your host, harold Milby,and I'm so very glad that you
decided to download and listento this week's podcast.
I pray that, as you listen andapply the principles that you
hear today, that you'll beencouraged, that you'll be
(00:39):
enlightened and empowered tofind what we talk about at CBC
as true godly success.
You know, joshua, chapter 1,says that this book of the law
shall not depart out of thymouth, but thou shalt meditate
therein day and night, that thoumayest observe to do according
to all that is written therein,for then thou shalt make thy way
(01:03):
prosperous and then thou shalthave good success.
You know, I believe this verseis for every one of you, every
single one of you.
But the key, I think, isapplying his word to our lives
and following the biblicalprinciples that we talk about
here at CBC every week in ourpodcasts.
(01:24):
That's what CBC is all abouthelping people find godly
success through biblicalprinciples and godly principles.
Now, before we jump intotoday's podcast, let me just
give a big shout out to Phoenix,arizona, right here in the
United States, for their manydownloads over the last week or
so.
Thank you, phoenix.
We really hope.
(01:45):
You're blessed by being a partof the CBC community and we
appreciate all of you who listenevery week or as much as you
possibly can.
I'm so blessed, I am so humbledto know there are so many of
you listening to the ChristianBusiness Concepts podcast.
So thank you all for being apart of what God is doing around
(02:08):
the world.
Now, this week, in our companyhighlight, I want to mention a
company called CovenantTransport.
They're here in the UnitedStates.
They're a transportationcompany, they're a trucking
company and they were founded in1986 by David and Jacqueline
Parker in Chattanooga, tennessee, and David is a very strong
(02:34):
Christian.
He's still the chairman of theboard, even though the CEO role
is now turned over to Joey Hogan.
But understand that they have alot of great impact and they
support Christian charities.
They really have a greatprogram, a welfare program for
(02:55):
their drivers.
They employ over 3,000 peopleand they generate over $1
billion in revenue and theyreally promote integrity in
everything that they do, in alltheir operations.
They promote integrity and theyare of a position within the
(03:15):
industry now that they reallyhave an influence in the
trucking industry.
But it's all because of theirChristian integrity and their
character and their godly way ofdoing business there at
Covenant Transportation.
(03:36):
So keep it up, covenantTransportation.
You guys are doing a great job.
We really appreciate whatyou're doing in the workplace
and we appreciate your Christianvalues that you let shine
through in everything that youguys do on a daily basis.
So we appreciate companies likeCovenant Transport.
(03:57):
Now, in the past, I did apodcast on how to find and how
to recruit a good, or really agreat number two person, but
today I want to look at thebiblical principles, not on
finding this person, but I wantto look at some biblical
(04:19):
principles on being a greatnumber two.
On being a great number two.
I have spent most of my careeras a number two other than the
two churches that I was a seniorpastor of but in my business
career, I have spent my timetrying to be a good or great
(04:44):
number two.
Some people want to be in thatnumber two position because they
feel like, well, that's justone step away for being the head
person, or being the number one, if you want to talk in that
vernacular.
For me, though, I felt that mygiftings and that my purpose was
to be a very good or greatnumber two, a very good or great
(05:08):
number two, and if your goal isto become a number one person,
if that's where you're headed,that's where you feel like
you're moving to, if you feellike that's the direction that
you're going in, then you reallyneed to become a really good
number two and be the best thatyou can possibly be.
First, because I believe thatthe Word of God, I believe that
the Bible, proves out that youcan never be promoted until you
(05:29):
become overqualified for yourcurrent position.
Let me say that again, Ibelieve the Bible proves out
that you can never be promoteduntil you have become
overqualified for your currentposition.
You know, in leadership, being anumber two, that's the second
(05:50):
in command, that's the deputy orthe supportive leader I believe
that that is such a vital roleand it requires humility, it
requires wisdom and really itrequires a servant's heart.
You know, this position is notabout striving for your own
glory, it's not about being seen, but it's about amplifying the
(06:12):
vision of the primary leader,the person that you work for and
at the same time, you'recontributing to the
organization's mission in a veryGod-honoring way.
So I want to give you somebiblical examples of those who
served as absolutelyextraordinary number twos and
(06:35):
these were people that werefaithful supporters.
They were second-in-commandfigures who basically amplified
that mission, like I'm talkingabout, but they did it by
demonstrating loyalty andhumility and that godly service.
And each of these exampleshighlight their role and the
(06:55):
qualities that made themeffective and helped them to
align with the Christianbusiness context of being an
outstanding number two InChristian leadership.
Being a number two, the secondin command, it's so important,
it's so powerful.
So I believe that behind everygreat leader, there is a number
(07:21):
two who's amplified their visionand helped them to turn dreams
into tangible impact.
I believe that the best leaders, I believe the very best
leaders in the world, today, Ibelieve they surround themselves
with really good number twosand these are ones who
complement their weaknesses andthey create a harmony of vision
and action.
And thirdly, I greatly believethat a great number two turns
(07:48):
vision into victory by mastering, if you will, that art of
execution with precision andpurpose.
So let's look at our firstexample.
The first one is Timothy in theNew Testament.
You know, timothy traveled withPaul, he delivered his letters,
he pastored churches underPaul's guidance.
(08:10):
That's according to 1Corinthians 4.17, 1 Timothy 4.12
.
Paul mentored him.
He mentored him very, veryclosely.
He was a young man.
He was a very loving young manand one who wanted to be a great
pastor.
But he was tutored, or mentored, under the Apostle Paul.
(08:30):
In fact, apostle Paul calledhim his true son in the faith.
That's in 1 Timothy 1 and 2.
But what kind of qualities didhe demonstrate?
Well, timothy embraced Paul'sinstruction.
He made sure that he listenedto what Paul had to say and he
(08:51):
wanted to grow into this verypowerful and capable leader.
He was very loyal, very loyalto Paul.
He represented him faithfully,even in some of the really
challenging situations.
The Bible talks about it inPhilippians, chapter 2, and you
can read that.
But he not only was teachable,but he was also very courageous.
(09:16):
He led people despite his youthand timidity.
Paul mentions it in 1 Timothy.
In the book of 1 Timothy hetalked about his youth and he
talked to Paul and Paul said donot despise your youth.
Don't despise your youth,because Timothy was struggling.
(09:37):
He was very timid because ofhis youth and he was ministering
to older people, but he reallyfelt empowered by Paul's
encouragement.
He really does, and you can seethat in 2 Timothy, 1.
So you've got to be open tomentorship.
If you're going to be a greatnumber two, you've got to be
open to having somebody mentoryou, and I can't give you steps
(10:02):
one, two, three to figure thatout.
I mean, if you're going to be agreat number two, you have to
figure that out.
Another one is Joshua.
Joshua was second in command toMoses.
You know Joshua was Moses' aide.
He was his successor.
He served faithfully under hisleadership, you know, before he
(10:25):
became Israel's leader.
You can see some of this inExodus, chapter 24, joshua,
chapter 1.
He assisted Moses during somereally critical moments.
He accompanied him partway upMount Sinai.
He led the army against theAmalekites in Exodus, chapter 17
(10:48):
.
He was really trusted by Mosesand he learned from Moses.
He learned from his leadershipand that was preparing him for
his future.
So what were some of thequalities that Joshua portrayed?
Well?
He was loyal.
So what were some of thequalities that Joshua portrayed?
Well, he was loyal.
He remained very devoted toMoses.
He never looked to try toovershadow him or become bigger
(11:11):
than Moses.
He was very humble.
He served in some verysupportive roles.
He was a guard.
He guarded the tent, thetabernacle.
He guarded that.
That's in Exodus 33.
And he didn't ask for anyrecognition.
He wasn't demanding, but he wasalso very faithful.
He was obedient.
(11:33):
He had great courage.
This is found in Numbers,chapter 13.
And he aligned with God'smission that God had given to
Moses.
He lined himself up with thatand I think we can learn from
that.
I think we can learn that whenyou support a leader's vision
with loyalty and then youprepare diligently for future
(11:56):
responsibilities and you got totrust in God's timing, then I
believe that God will raise youup to do greater things, even
now that you're doing this innumber two.
And then we can talk aboutElisha.
We could talk about who wassecond in command to Elijah, the
prophet Elijah.
(12:16):
We could talk about that.
We could talk about Joseph.
He was second in command toPharaoh in all of Egypt.
You know he served as Pharaoh'ssecond in command.
He oversaw all of Egypt'sresources during a great, great
famine.
He oversaw all of it.
And so it's important that youlook at some of these number two
(12:41):
roles because they help you.
Another great one was Jonathan,who was King Saul's son, and yet
his heart was knit towardsDavid and he was there to be a
number two for David.
He supported David when hebecame king when, rightfully, it
would have been him who wouldhave been king next.
(13:02):
But he stood behind David andhe was a great number two for
David and he had a covenantrelationship with him.
And when you become a numbertwo, that's one of the things
that you have to be willing todo.
You know, I said you have to bewilling to be mentored, but you
also have to be willing to walkin a covenant with that leader.
(13:23):
Walk in a covenant with thatleader.
I know for 22 years I was one ofthe number twos for the owner
of the company.
I never felt more.
I think the word is fulfilled.
I don't think I was ever asfulfilled as I was, knowing that
I was there for that purpose.
I knew that I was supposed tobe a number two.
(13:45):
I wasn't looking to be a numberone.
I wanted to be that number twobecause I felt like that's where
my giftings were, that's wheremy purpose was.
But Jonathan was very selflessbecause he should have been king
, but yet he supported David inDavid becoming king and he
protected David.
He risked his life for him.
(14:06):
So he had this covenant withDavid.
He was very humble about it.
He embraced this supportiverole instead of being a king,
and he just trusted God thatGod's purpose was being done.
So you kind of have to, whenyou're number two, you have to
put the organization's missionand even God's plan above your
(14:28):
personal ambition.
You've got to support thatleader with a real selfless
devotion.
I should say so.
Some of these biblical examplesthey illustrate the qualities
that make an outstanding numbertwo.
You've got to support thevision, like Joshua and Timothy
(14:50):
did.
You've got to align with andamplify that person.
That you're the number two forthat number one.
That you're the number two forthat number one.
You've got to align and amplifythat God-given direction.
But notice that in all of thesituations they served with
humility, they acted withintegrity and wisdom, they
(15:14):
prioritized God's plan and allof that prepared them for future
roles.
It prepared them for futureroles.
It prepared them for futureroles.
And I can give you some modernexamples of great number twos.
The first one is my cousin,drew Milby.
Drew was the number two forPapa John's.
For those of you not in thiscountry, papa John is one of the
(15:35):
largest pizza chains in theworld.
They're all over the world.
But she started with him whenthey only had 20 locations and
she rose quickly.
She became the number twoperson within that company and
it was her that helped educateand help promote and help
motivate the employees and shewas the one that helped them to
(15:59):
get onto the New York StockExchange as a publicly traded
company.
So Drew Milby was outstanding,but there's also you can look at
Sheryl Sandberg, who's thenumber two.
She's the COO of Facebook andshe joined Facebook in 2008.
She joined Facebook in 2008.
She's been serving MarkZuckerberg as his
(16:23):
second-in-command.
She used to work at Google.
She was a Google executive andshe brought a lot of operational
expertise to Facebook as it wasgrowing rapidly at that time in
the beginning, and she actuallyscaled Facebook's revenue from
$150 million in annual revenueto over $3.7 billion by 2011.
(16:50):
And she did that through a lotof innovative advertising and
models and things of that natureand she streamlined.
She streamlined theiroperations as well, and when she
started they had 1,000employees and now they've got
over 70,000.
So she focused much on ethicalleadership and empowerment.
(17:12):
She valued excellence.
Though she wasn't explicitly aChristian.
Her ability to translate visionand take that vision and turn
it into executable plans was amodel that almost every business
wanted.
And then you have Gwen Shotwell.
(17:33):
Gwen Shotwell is the presidentand COO of SpaceX.
So she's that number two forElon Musk's vision that he has
for space exploration.
So she's helped SpaceX growfrom $150 billion by 2023.
(17:55):
And a big part of that was GwenShotwell.
She secured a lot of contracts.
She secured a $2.9 billionLunar Lander deal.
She negotiated in such a mannerthat it drove 60% of the global
(18:15):
commercial launch market.
So they own 60% of that launchwhat we call the launch market
and you know there's just a lotof positive things she's done.
I mean she spearheaded STEMoutreach programs.
She really helped to inspirethousands of students to pursue
(18:38):
aerospace careers.
She's just done a lot of greatwork there at SpaceX.
And then there's John Cargill,the COO of Hobby Lobby the same
thing.
I mean he has done a great jobas being a number two for David
Green, which was, you know, whofounded Hobby Lobby in 72.
(19:02):
And you know he's very Cargillis very, very supportive of
Green's faith-driven vision ashis second in command.
So these are some greatexamples.
There's Amy Hood, the CFO atMicrosoft great number two.
(19:22):
So why is it so important to bea good number two?
Well, number one, it's abiblical calling to serve.
You know the Bible says whoeverwants to become great among you
must first be your servant.
So it's part of a biblical callto serve.
That's what we're to do now.
It also it strengthens theprimary leader.
(19:44):
You know, if you look at Aaronand her, they they were like
number twos for Moses as well,and and it was so important in
Exodus, chapter 17, as they leftEgypt, there was a time that
God was using Moses to hold uphis arms to part the Red Sea so
that they could walk across ondry ground, and Moses' arms
(20:04):
began to get tired, and so Aaronand Hur came beside him, one on
each side, and helped hold hisarms up.
And so you know that's whatnumber twos do.
They support that leader duringchallenging times.
So I think that's importantbecause you strengthen the
primary leader.
A third reason is because itadvances the mission.
(20:24):
You know, in a Christianbusiness the mission is beyond
profit.
You know it's there to glorifyGod and serve others.
So it helps to advance themission of the organization.
It also helps to build trustand unity.
You know, because you modelthat integrity and collaboration
, you create a culture whereeverybody works towards that
(20:47):
common goal and that helps youto reflect the unity of the body
of Christ, and then it preparesfor future leadership.
You know, because when youbecome a number two and you're
successful at it, it's often Goduses it as just a season of
preparation for your futureroles, maybe in leadership, like
(21:11):
God did with Joshua under Moses, or the way God did Elisha
under Elijah.
And then it brings glory to Godbecause you're being faithful,
and when you're faithful, itbrings glory to God because
you're being faithful, and whenyou're faithful, it brings glory
to him.
Colossians 3.23 says whateveryou do, work at it with all your
heart as working for the Lord.
So how do we become an effectivenumber two?
(21:36):
To excel as a number two, Ibelieve that Christian business
leaders, you've got to blendtogether this spiritual maturity
with a practical group ofskills, and so I want to share
with you some actionable stepsthat are rooted in biblical
principles, obviously, and alsothere's some business best
(21:59):
practices here, so that willhelp you to become a great
number two.
So, number one, you have tocultivate a servant's heart.
Well, how do you do that?
Well, you got to pray forhumility.
You need to have a desire toserve more than you do to seek
recognition.
You need to actively listen tothe primary leader's vision and
(22:22):
you need to listen with an ideato understand, and you can't put
your own agenda in that.
You've got to be willing totake on some risk and you've got
to do it with excellence and apositive attitude.
If the primary leader isoverwhelmed, you need to offer
to handle some of thoseadministrative tasks or maybe
(22:46):
lead a project or something,something to lighten their load.
That's one of the reasons thatyou're there is demonstrating
this willingness to serve.
Number two you align with thevision.
Make sure you get lined up.
You don't talk against thevision.
You don't talk differently thanwhat the lined up.
You don't talk against thevision.
You don't talk differently thanwhat the vision is.
You don't try to share your ownvision.
And what helps you to do thatis by regularly meeting with
(23:11):
that primary leader and you gotto make sure you understand
their goals and their priorities.
And then you've got to askclarifying questions to make
sure that you fully understandthat vision.
And then you've got to askclarifying questions to make
sure that you fully understandthat vision.
And then the next thing is yougo out and you begin to
communicate that vision to theteam and you do it clearly and
you do it consistently, and youdo it because you're trying to
(23:35):
reinforce the importance of thatvision, so you help do that.
So if a primary leader's visionis to expand let's say outreach
through a new initiative orresearch, and propose these
actionable steps to make it areality, you got to make sure
that you get out there and youcommunicate that vision, and
(23:58):
that's part of what you do as anoutstanding number two.
Now the third thing is youprovide wise counsel.
Now, how do you do that?
Well, first of all, you need toknow that organization's
operations.
You've got to know markettrends.
You've got to know what thechallenges are, to provide
really good advice.
And then make sure that youoffer feedback, but do that
(24:21):
privately.
I encourage you offer thefeedback privately, do it
respectfully.
Don't say well, I think you'rereally making a stupid decision.
That's not the way you handlethat.
You're a number two.
You got to rise above that.
You got to be very respectful.
You've got to frame yoursuggestions in a way that really
supports the leader's goals.
(24:43):
I think that's what's important.
And then I think you've got touse discernment to know when to
speak and when to listen.
If the primary leader is maybeconsidering a risky financial
decision.
You shouldn't just go to himand say I think this is a
problem, but be sure to do someresearch, find out what could
happen if he goes down this pathand then try to give him a very
(25:06):
good analysis.
Make sure you've got data, makesure you've got facts to back
up what you're saying and sharewith him what the potential
outcomes could be.
At the same time, you've got toreaffirm their authority in
that they see that youunderstand they are the one in
(25:27):
the position of being thatnumber one.
They're in the position ofauthority.
But just make sure theyunderstand that you know that.
The fourth thing you can do tobe a great number two is to
complement the primary leader'sstrengths.
So you need to look at theleader's strengths and their
weaknesses just by watching them, just observing them, or maybe
(25:49):
a very candid discussion whereyou can talk about them.
But you've got to take on thoseresponsibilities.
That uses your strength inareas where maybe that leader
maybe doesn't have the strengths, maybe it's a weakness, but
they need that support there.
It might be in operations, itmay be finance, it might be team
(26:09):
management.
But then you've got to offersolutions and do that in a very,
very proactive way.
Don't bring in problems.
He's got enough people bringinghim problems or she's got
enough people bringing himproblems.
You've got to offer solutions.
Be very proactive about that.
Don't overstep your role.
But you take him and hersolutions.
(26:33):
For example, if the leader theprimary leader if he's great at
setting a vision, casting avision, but he struggles with
the operational details In otherwords, he knows he's got a
vision for getting from point Ato point B but doesn't quite
know what needs to happenoperationally to get from point
A to point B, then you shouldprobably take ownership of that.
(26:55):
You can also take ownership ofsome project management issues
that may be going on and thenyou can make sure that
everything's working out to meetthe you know, whatever may be
deadlines or something.
So you've got to check thatNumber five.
You've got to bridge, build abridge from the strategy to the
(27:17):
execution, and that's kind of apart of number four, but you
need to bridge execution, andthat's kind of a part of number
four, but you need to bridgethat.
You need to go from strategy toexecution, because not every
primary leader can do that.
So that may be something thatyou have to do.
The next thing is you have tofoster a team unity.
You should not have employeesthat look at you as a leader but
(27:39):
not the leader that you'reunder as a number two.
You've got to make sure thatyou do that and you communicate
that through sharing thatprimary leader's vision to the
team.
But you can do it withenthusiasm and clarity, but they
need to know this is comingfrom our leader, right?
And then make sure that youaddress conflicts very quickly,
(28:02):
very fairly, and you need tomake sure you celebrate the
team's successes.
So I think those are someimportant things that you do.
And then make sure youdemonstrate loyalty to this
leader.
Make sure you do that.
Make sure that you develop,demonstrate, I should say,
(28:23):
loyalty.
Speak very positively about theprimary leader whenever you're
in public and in private.
Don't allow gossip about theleader.
Don't accept criticism aboutthe leader.
You're there to be as numbertwo.
You've got to be the one thatdefends their decisions when
(28:44):
that's appropriate.
You've got to, at times, offerconstructive feedback.
Yes, but you do that in private.
In public, you defend theleader's decisions.
Stay committed.
Stay committed to the mission.
Stay committed Even duringchallenges.
Stay committed If a team memberquestions the primary leader's
(29:08):
say, strategy, then you need totake the time to explain why the
leader reached this decision tooperate this way.
You need to explain that to them, stand behind them and
encourage them to trust theleader and then help address
maybe some of their concerns andmaybe some of those concerns
(29:29):
are valid and maybe you can helpaddress them.
But you want to demonstratethat loyalty and then make sure
that you develop your skills andcharacter.
You want to invest in yourselfpersonally for growth, but you
also want to invest in yourselfto help his weaknesses or her
weaknesses.
(29:49):
You need to be able to do thatand then you need to rely on
prayer and discernment.
Now you're going to have somechallenges.
There are going to be times whenmaybe you feel undervalued.
There's going to be times whenyou feel like you've got to
balance loyalty and, at the sametime, be honest about things.
(30:10):
You've got to be able to manageup the chain and down the chain
.
You've got to be able to manageup and down, and sometimes
that's hard to do.
So those are probably the threebiggest challenges and being
the number one, one I think tome is feeling undervalued,
because there's going to betimes when you do, you just
don't feel like you're valuedand you feel like you carry so
(30:32):
much for the leader, but youfeel undervalued.
Listen, don't let that botheryou, don't let it get you down.
It's very common, so you justcontinue to do what you are
supposed to do and I believethat being a good number two.
I believe it's a very highcalling.
I believe it combines humilityand competence, and even
(30:55):
faithfulness, and I think byserving with a Christ-like heart
and aligning yourself withtheir vision and executing not
just executing, but executingwith excellence I believe you'll
contribute to yourorganization's success and it'll
bring God glory.
(31:15):
This role is not about beingsecond best, because it's not
really about that.
It's about being faithful,being a faithful steward of the
responsibilities that's beenentrusted to you, and as you
grow in this role, I know thatyou'll not only strengthen the
organization itself, but it'llalso prepare you for future
(31:40):
leadership opportunities, andthe whole time this is happening
, you're reflecting thecharacter of Christ.
Father, I come before you in thename of Jesus and I pray for
all those who have listened tothis podcast today and whether
they are trying to fill a numbertwo role in their organization
or they are in a number two roleor they're going to become a
(32:02):
number two role.
Lord, I pray that you'll helpthem utilize these principles to
excel to excel, lord, at whatthey are doing, and that they
will be extremely, extremelysuccessful.
I thank you, lord, that theirmotives will be pure and I thank
you that they will excel In thename of Jesus Christ.
(32:24):
Amen and amen.
Well, thank you again fortuning in.
Be sure to share the podcastwith four or five other people.
Post this podcast link ontoyour Facebook and LinkedIn pages
.
We're so blessed that you're apart of us, and that's all the
time we have for today, so untilnext time, remember Jesus is
(32:47):
Lord and he wants you blessed.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
Thank you for tuning into this week's Christian
Business Concepts podcast.
Go tochristianbusinessconceptscom for
more information and resources.
Be sure to check out otherpodcasts that will help you take
your business and your personallife to a whole new level of
success.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!