January 30, 2024 • 33 mins
Today we are talking with members of the Chicago Teachers Union, Ayesha Qazi, David Stieber and Hadeil Abdelfattah. As you may remember from our episode on the victory Chicago’s mayor, a former CTU member, Chicago’s students and educators have lived through a neoliberal hell. From 2003 to 2013 Chicago closed 50 schools, only making conditions for students worse. These closures moved the members of the teachers union to become militant. Their militancy changed the direction of Chicago’s education politics and reignited a labor movement in America that starting to reverse decades of decline of US union membership. Chicago educators recently joined 146 other unions, locals and caucuses, including United Auto Workers, United Electrical Radio and Machine Workers of America and Association of Flight Attendants, signing a letter calling for basics rights to be restored in Gaza, hostages to be released, and for Biden to call for a ceasefire.
Ayesha Qazi-Lampert is an AP Environmental Science Teacher at Chicago Public Schools. She is a member of the Chicago Teacher Union Climate Justice committee and is the Chair of the American Federation of Teachers Climate and Environmental Justice Caucus
Dave Stieber is a 17 year Chicago Public Schools high school social studies and poetry teacher. He is National Board Certified and hold his Masters in Urban Education Policy. His partner is also a CPS teacher and together they have two children that both attend CPS.
Hadeil M. Abdelfattah, Ed.D. is a Palestinian-American born and raised on the northside of the city of Chicago. She is an educator of nearly 28 years and is currently a Lead Instructional Coach at Chicago Public Schools. She holds a doctorate in Educational Leadership and wrote an Autoethnographic study of her experiences as the child of immigrants in a large urban school district.
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Episode Transcript
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Elton LK (00:00):
You are listening to class and official podcast of
(00:02):
the Democratic Socialists ofAmerica National Political
Education Committee.
My name is Elton, LK.
In this episode, I had the honorto meet with some good people.
This one is a little morepersonal.
Today we are talking with themembers of the Chicago Teachers
Union, Azi, David Steber, andHadil Abta.
(00:24):
This episode is a little morepersonal because my family has a
lot of school teachers in it.
Also, my wife and I lived inChicago for a few years.
As you may remember from ourepisode on the victory of the
current mayor of Chicago,Brandon Johnson, a former CTU
member.
Chicago students and educatorshave lived through a neoliberal
(00:46):
hell.
My wife and I experienced asmall piece of that in 2006,
right before the housing boomwent bust.
Investors were rapidlyconverting all the apartments in
Chicago to condos.
There were almost no affordableapartments and we had almost no
money.
So after several stressfulmonths, we determined our time
(01:07):
in Chicago was over schools inChicago were famously
underfunded.
During that time, from 2003 to2013, Chicago closed 50 schools
only making conditions forstudents worse.
These closures moved to themembers of the teacher's union
to become militant.
Their militancy changed thedirection of Chicago's
(01:29):
education, politics, andreignited a labor movement in
America that is starting toreverse decades of decline of US
Union membership.
Chicago educators recentlyjoined 146 other unions, locals
and caucuses including UnitedAuto Workers.
(01:50):
United Electrical Radio andMachine Workers of America, an
association of flight attendantssigning a letter calling for
basic rights to be restored inGaza, hostages to be released,
and for Biden to call for aceasefire.
I also just heard that SEIU,that is the Service Employees
International Union, just calledfor a ceasefire.
(02:13):
I found out first about theletter from a piece David wrote,
and in these times, note that asI record this, Israel just
announced that they're willingto consider a two month pause.
We need to continue calling fora permanent ceasefire.
Okay, let's meet our guests.
Can you please introduceyourself
Ayesha T (02:35):
so good evening everyone.
My name is Lampert.
Dave Stieber (02:40):
Good evening everyone.
Uh, my name's Dave.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (02:42):
My name is born and raised on the north
side of the city.
Um, born to, uh, immigrant,Palestinian parents that came in
the late, early seventies, soit's great to be here.
Elton LK (02:54):
So first question, what motivated you in.
The Chicago Teachers Union toadd your name to a letter with
other unions calling for animmediate ceasefire in Israel
and Palestine.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (03:08):
For myself, it was just a natural thing to
do considering I'm.
Um, have visited my my parents'homeland many, many times, um,
and after having just been therethis past summer, um, and
wondering like, how do peoplelive there on a daily basis, um,
with all the difficulties, thenuances that an average person
(03:32):
here in America doesn't have toface.
So it was, for me, it was a nobrainer.,
Dave Stieber (03:36):
to give a little context too, so, you know, after
October 7th happened, you know,like obviously many teachers
were aware of just the issues inPalestine over the course of
history.
Um, but after October 7thhappened, it really kind of
awakened a lot of teachers andso.
To get even to the signing ontothe letter was, you know, a
discussion that was brought toCTU leadership, by members.
(03:59):
Like Aisha had like lots ofpeople like, who like brought
this to, you know, to like, tomembership and like, Hey, we
need to do something about this,right?
So the discussion was what do wedo as a union?
Like we've never been involvedin international matters before.
Do we even have a place ininternational matters?
Like all those discussions werehappening.
Um, kind of behind the scenes,right, amongst the members, um,
(04:20):
behind the scenes of the generalpublic.
And so, you know, it was becauseof teachers who care and love
their students and care and loveabout other educators and care
and love about people, period.
That.
That discussion really startedgaining momentum as to, you
know, as a union, we need tocome out and take a stand on
this, right?
We need to show up for ourstudents, show up for our
(04:40):
colleagues, and show up for justpeople in humanity.
And so it was like, what do wedo?
How do we do it?
You know?
And then there was lots ofdiscussions for a few weeks.
Um.
Multiple discussions, um, aboutwhat we do.
And then the res, the idea tokind of sign on, came through
the members, went through smallcommittees, went through the
executive board, went to theHouse of Delegates where we were
(05:01):
voted on it as a whole, right?
And so it was, it was a verydemocratic process that for
people who really care about theissue, felt slow.
But in the hindsight, it waslike, you know, a couple week
process.
And we signed this letterNovember 1st, and we're still
waiting for our federalgovernment to call for a
ceasefire now here in January.
Ayesha T (05:18):
And I wanna add, it was really easy for me to sign
on and support this for manydifferent reasons, given the
various identities that I carry.
For example, I'm Bush.
Which is an Afghan identity.
And coming from the Afghandiaspora, our country just came
out of the longest war ever inhistory.
(05:40):
The, um, war in Afghanistan,which lasted about, about 19
years and 10 months.
And so thinking about the impactit has on generations of Afghans
and Afghans within diaspora, butalso I teach.
Environmental environmentalscience.
I teach AP environmentalscience, and I think about the
environmental degradation andthe disrespect and disregard of
(06:04):
earth and all living things.
I also think from the labor,movement and perspective, the
impact the environment has onworkers, worker protections,
fight over resources.
Economic impacts job security.
So there's many differentintersections into this type of
work.
And so this collective drive andneed to make sure that this
(06:26):
never happens again to anyone,uh, and making sure that we are
on the right side of history,promoting peace, and modeling
what peace looks like.
Elton LK (06:37):
So what kind of organizing had to occur in order
to pass this resolution?
How did you determine you hadthe support of the community
that you needed?
Ayesha T (06:48):
I'm gonna jump in right away because I would say
that organizing was happeningfor a very long time at CTU and
I look back tog.
War and the developments of uspulling out from the Afghan War.
I was supporting young Afghanyouth within the Chicago
community and, um, the Afghanyouth in my community helped to
(07:11):
community protest downtown, andI had CTU Corps members show up
to that protest and that was myway of getting involved in.
The Chicago Teachers Union incore is when I saw core members
present in that space and thatinternational solidarity that
they were showing beyondteaching, that pulled me into
that space.
And it's been many years of justcollaboration and friendships
(07:33):
and connecting with peoplewithin the union that had the
strong moral compass.
And for me it was alwaysPalestine.
Uh, war was a litmus test for meto see where people's values
were.
And by seeing people outside ofthe elements of teaching and
being in these solidarityspaces, I had a clear idea where
(07:55):
people were standing and I feltcomfortable during moments of.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (08:00):
I don't know that there's much more to add to
it than what, uh.
I should just shared, um, Ithink, you know, as, as
educators in one of the largestschool districts in the country,
that serves such a mix ofstudents, um, how could you stay
(08:22):
silent when.
You know that students who areboth invisible and hyper
visible, um, are, are ignored.
And to say that they don't existwould be an injustice within
itself.
And so, um.
You know, every child's lifematters.
(08:43):
Whether they are here in Chicagoor in New York, or in Florida,
or in California or in Reza.
I mean, we have to acknowledgethat as educators, we have the
most profound impact on a child.
Probably alongside theirparents.
For those that have parents andright now the number of of
(09:04):
children who have lost theirlives and who have lost their
parents is just horrendous.
Dave Stieber (09:11):
I didn't come into teaching thinking like, this is
gonna be easy.
Right?
Like the first school I workedat.
I remember walking into thebuilding and it legit felt like
a prison.
Like there was like a, like a, alookup and there was like glass
windows around this littlecourtyard that looked down into
like where the students were.
And the community had beendisinvested in, right?
(09:31):
It had been, it was a schoolthat had been closed and then
reopened and it was just thiswhole process of disinvestment
over and over and over.
And so that's teaching ourstudents here in Chicago, and
that's what you experience as ateacher.
And so.
When you first start teaching,you look around and be like, why
do our students not haveeverything that they possibly
deserve?
And then you go through like,how can I teach them that they
(09:53):
can get everything they theydeserve if they're having to
come to a space where there'snetworking computers and these
types of things.
This is like 20 2007, right?
And so.
Core and Karen Lewis and theChicago Teachers Union radically
changed, right?
In 2012.
Because I remember going as adelegate, going to a meeting
before Karen Lewis came up andbeing like, what are we talking
about here?
(10:13):
Like, what is this?
Right?
And then it, there was adramatic shift, right?
And so that shift has evolvedfrom not only advocating for
everything our students deservein the city, right?
But then starting to thinkabout.
Outside of our classroom, likewhat do they deserve in their
community?
What does they deserve across,you know, everything, right?
So housing and all these typesof things.
And so it's only natural thatthen these teachers, us, who
(10:34):
care about all the things in ourstudents' lives, we look not
only in Chicago, right?
We look around the country andthen you look around the world.
And so it's just, it's aprogression and it's because of
like was mentioned that.
The organizing has happened overvarious issues of things that
our students have deserved, thatit makes something organizing
around something of a globalscale, like not a stretch,
(10:55):
right?
And so it's like, oh yeah, wecare about all these things.
So of course we care about this.
Of course we care about life.
Of course, we don't want a war,right?
And so I think You again know?
Oh yeah.
Like I can know, I can rely onthat person to care about fair
housing for our students.
I can also care about them towanna end to war and brutality.
Elton LK (11:13):
How are your students affected by international
events?
And then, what do you say, uh,to the response that teachers
need to stick to teaching?
Hadeil Abdelfattah (11:27):
We teach life, sir., we, we do it.
All right.
I guess that would be left up toeach person to define what does,
what is teaching.
And so when we look at what weteach and what we do, it is not
within the confines of a bookthat, that are papers that are
(11:50):
bound.
It is real life experiences andthe capacity to think critically
and to teach students, as wellas sometimes their families.
How do you critically andeffectively look at the things
that are offered to you in life,in your community, what your
(12:11):
community deserves, and whatthey have access to, and how do
you fight to make sure that youget what you deserve?
And so, it, it's, it's allencompassing and it, it takes
you out of just teaching, abook, uh, that's been published
by a mass producer, right?
and having the capacity to saythat our students deserve more.
(12:32):
They deserve to be able tocritically think for themselves,
and they deserve the right todetermine what they should be
entitled to.
It's not us to say for them, butwe need to give them the tools
for them to then decide what itthey want it to look like.
Ayesha T (12:45):
And wow, there's been so much going on and there was a
moment in my classroom I willnever, ever forget, and I was
teaching AP EnvironmentalScience and it was the day when
the hospital was bombed, whenthe first hospital was bombed,
and I had no idea that happened.
I was teaching and myPalestinian student and my
(13:06):
classroom was.
Just tears.
And from the back she lookedfine, but when I walked on the
other side, she was holding itso strong like she was taking
notes and she just had, her facewas filled with tears.
I did not know what washappening in Gaza at that time.
(13:27):
I did not know how wellconnected our students are in
these moments of pain.
And not only was she aware.
I had to quickly pivot and makesure that the class was engaging
in a quick prompt, and I pulledher into the hallway and I just
asked her, what's going on?
Are you okay?
(13:47):
And she had a hard time sharing.
I.
What she was feeling and she,she broke that news to me and in
that moment of pain and sadnessthat I will have to forever
carry and she will have toforever carry, is that there's
such a gap in education that thelack of social, emotional
support for our students thatare in direct moments of
(14:12):
conflict and they're worriedabout their families.
And our system has taught ourstudents to stay so strong and
brave.
She really did not have to belike that in that space, in that
moment.
And making sure we give studentsthat space and that moment to
breathe and to walk out and to,just process this.
(14:33):
And so I would say teaching in astate, teaching in a county that
serves the largest Palestinianpopulation in the nation.
students are silently hurting.
And our students, when given theopportunity to share, they will
share.
And our teachers, we're doing somuch with barely any little
(14:55):
support.
And I think of the teachers whoI connected to immediately
within our SWANA diaspora, theSouthwest Asian North African
diaspora, a lot of us in thislarger category.
We barely had a teacher check inwith us how we were doing.
And so when I asked, you know,when we asked each other like,
(15:15):
did anyone check up on you?
The answer was no.
And we're we're always in thisprofession of always giving.
And that's something we signedup for, but also we need to be
taken care of as well in orderto do the jobs that we're also
doing.
Dave Stieber (15:29):
don't teach.
Students, my students are,predominantly black.
They are watching the sametiktoks, they are seeing the
same, you know, videos.
They're seeing the same thingsthat all of us in society are
seeing.
Right.
And so they're like, how is thishappening to these young people
here or to this city, or towhatever, right?
But then also like, because Iteach history, right?
(15:50):
They can look back and be like,oh yeah.
During the Black Lives Mattermovement, Palestinians were the
ones that reached out.
To people at Fer when they wereprotesting in Ferguson, they
gave ideas of how to go to aprotest and cover your mouth,
you know, with the gas being putout by the police, right?
And so, like, these are thingsthat, like Palestinians have
been making connections with theAfrican American community here
in the United States for shared,you know, uh, protests and
(16:13):
shared struggles in a way.
And so, like, there's a lot ofhistorical connections there
too, right?
And so the idea of, you know,teachers should stick to the
classroom like.
I mean, the best teachers in theworld, like always teach the
world is the classroom, right?
And so like that's what we wantfor our students.
And so to bring in connectionsacross all disciplines and in
(16:34):
all places, right, is like theideal.
And so that's just by the, youknow, narrow-minded individuals
who don't like teachersactually.
Being vocal.
They just want us to teach from,you know, whatever, to whatever,
and stay silent and all that.
And so, you know, that's justnot the case.
And that's what, thankfully ourunion does not advocate.
They advocate for teaching,right?
Like everyone, and advocatingfor all
Ayesha T (16:56):
I wanna add,, to the second part about, being told
teachers should stick toteaching being part of the
Chicago Teachers Union and.
Just being in the educationalprofession, we're all striving
and constantly working forinclusive learning spaces that
really center around the socialand emotional wellbeing of our
students, and that means beingliterate about issues that are
(17:19):
happening within the community.
And so yes, we are sticking toteaching and we're teaching
international solidarity andwhat it means to be centered
around love and justice for all,and peace for all.
And so this is part of ourcurriculum is for us to become
literate and for us to worktogether and fight for the
resources we need, and also tomodel to students what positive
(17:43):
behavior looks like.
What does conflict resolutionlooks like?
What does negotiation,collaboration, post-conflict
look like?
Hadeil Abdelfattah (17:51):
second.
I think that, you know, I'm, I'mnot in the classroom per se as a
classroom teacher.
I'm an instructional coach and,um, we.
An amazing teacher, she's achemistry teacher and she spends
an entire unit on the, on isms,racism, capitalism, imperialism,
and all these things and how itimpacts community.
(18:12):
And so I think that, you know,real life experiences and what
may be happening 6,000, 7,000miles away does impact.
What is happening here, and, andstudents see it.
We, we can't disregard theaccess that this generation has,
that generations before did nothave.
And so we need to teach them,you know, how do you decipher,
(18:35):
how do you figure out what'sreal and what's not real?
And and give them those tools totake it all in.
Elton LK (18:41):
How have your students in your community responded to
cts stance towards theceasefire?
Ayesha T (18:48):
I would say it's received a lot of encouraging
and positive support frommembers who are looking for that
validation and thatunderstanding that, yes, the
union and the labor movement.
Recognizes workers, protections,justice and rights in all
(19:09):
countries around the world.
And there are times where I'm inconversation with educators who
feel like they may be the onlyteacher or the only worker in a
space with this sort ofmentality or this sort of strong
moral compass or ground.
And to be like, Hey, did youknow CTU signed on?
(19:33):
It's like, wow, this huge unionsigned onto this, gives people
the motivation and push to keeppushing forward within the
spaces that they're in and theleverage to keep advocating for
justice for all.
Elton LK (19:48):
We at Democratic Socialists of America believe
the labor movement isstrategically placed to put
pressure on our political andeconomic system to do the right
thing.
And the Chicago Teachers UnionHistoric 2012 strike was
critical for the American labormovement.
It's hard to imagine that wewould be seeing the labor
(20:09):
activity that we are seeingtoday without CTU.
Can you talk about some of thethings that CTU has accomplished
by standing together in,solidarity?
Dave Stieber (20:21):
the CT as we know, essentially been.
Whole teaching career.
This is my year 17 CPS, youknow, core started kind of
forming before, and then beforethey got, you know, before we
got control or whatever electedinto CTU in 2012.
Right.
And so, like the whole likemodel for it, has just been my
whole experience.
(20:41):
Right.
And so I guess all that to sayis that when.
I started teaching, right.
I looked for, you know, I alwayswas like inspired by people who
were brave and who stood up andspoke out.
And, you know, I wanted to use,you know, my race, like I'm a
white male and I wanted to usethese privileges to like
dismantle, like the systems thathave been always oppressed.
(21:04):
All the people that I looked upto, right?
And so I was like, where can Igo?
Like, who can I be by?
Right?
And so, like, CTU, has begunthat quest and providing that
space to find people like that,right?
And so with all that thenadvocating for.
not closing schools, right?
Like a basic thing, right?
Like 2013.
(21:24):
Like remember marching throughfrom the south side up to
downtown over the course ofmultiple days, right.
To say keep our schools open,right?
And attending, you know, vigilsat churches in the middle of the
night where parents and schoolnights where parents were
protesting keep the schoolsopen, right?
And so like, we clearly likedidn't win that, right?
We had the Chicago close Mostschools in the history of our
(21:45):
country, however.
Right.
Because of those earlystruggles, right.
We now see where we are now.
And so we have, you know, unionsacross the country wanting to
replicate our model and SeanFain at the UAW shouting out
CTU, right?
And Stacey Davis Gates and JesseSharkey and Karen Lewis, right?
For the work that's been doneover the past, you know,
(22:06):
whatever that is, years now.
And so, you know, we now have amayor that came up through our
ranks, right?
And so.
None of this is perfect, right?
Like all of this is because ofthe work that CTU has been doing
since 2012 and before, right.
And the people that have been apart of it, and the teachers
that are literally in theclassrooms every day, um,
working with, you know, thestudents and advocating for our
(22:26):
students.
Right?
And so, you know, like.
We would never be in a spot.
Right now we're in March, we'regonna pass, um, bring Chicago
home, which is gonna bringhousing to our unhoused and
through a tax on the rich rightthrough a tax, if you own a
property more than a milliondollars, you will have to pay a
one-time transition tax.
Right.
And so to the vast majority ofus, we're like, that's cool.
(22:47):
That's no problem to us.
Right?
But there's these few selectindividuals who are making it
seem like it's gonna be likethis whole thing.
Right.
But like.
We're, we're putting legislationin place to radically change our
city, to help our, the studentsand the people that live there,
which before was never the case,or we've seen a city that's had
to like, basically people beenpushed out, through different
policies and throughdisinvestment and through
(23:08):
gentrification.
And so we're trying to reversethat.
So not only are we taking onissues in the classroom, it's
citywide, right?
And that's all because of thework that's been done and
started and continues, kind ofthrough CTU.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (23:21):
I think the activism of our union has grown
over time.
and the lens in which we do it.
So I am in year 26 in CPS, andso I've seen how, you know, you
had leadership that reallydidn't do justice for the
students, families or teachers.
and in recent years, You feelthat it's children first.
(23:45):
And so I think that with havingthat lens and that focus, how
can you go wrong?
Like when you're saying you'redoing right by the next
generation or two, you know,the, the counterbalances of, you
know, what's what might be quoteunquote fiscally correct.
Right.
versus the impact that it wouldhave on, on, on students and
(24:05):
their families and, and thelives that they live is just,,
there are no words to describeit.
And so for that, I'm, I'm, I'mreally proud, uh, of the work
that's happened and, uh, I'm nota delegate and, you know, and I
know the contract inside and outfrom when I was a former
principal and, and things likethat.
(24:26):
But it's just, it's, it'samazing to see the work that CTU
has done.
and that others are trying,really trying hard, to, to try
to pull that together.
And, and that we're leading thework I'm truly honored.
Ayesha T (24:40):
And I wanna add, now that you brought up delegate, I
never saw myself this active ina union space, I would say seven
years ago when I first startedteaching.
And so much has changed withinthe labor movement, and myself
and Dave and others were on thefloor.
Of the house, the delegatesmeeting, speaking in favor of
(25:03):
this resolution that passed.
And standing in that line withmy good friend Aaron and being
ready to speak was a powerfulmoment and out of body
experience for myself.
'cause I never visioned myselfto be in that space, but I, we
needed to be in that spacebecause our responsibility as
(25:24):
delegates in these union spacesis to speak for.
Is to really advocate andrepresent and speak for our
members.
And our members consist ofPalestinian educators and
students.
And so I wanna add on to haddeal sharing that shift that's
(25:45):
been happening and that drasticshift in representation,
creating space, opening up spacefor different members to start
to speak up and advocate on thefloor..
Elton LK (25:57):
Is there anything that you want to say to other
teachers and other unions
Hadeil Abdelfattah (26:04):
I don't think that it's a matter of not
necessarily having anything.
It's like, where do you start,right?
So it's like if you are silentand complicit, you are guilty.
If you are advocating and feellike you're coming up against a
wall because people are tellingyou using words, throwing them
(26:24):
at you that have really beenspun out of control, um, you
have allies, you just need tofind them.
They are there I think that ifthere's anything that I would
say to, to another teacheranywhere, in the country or
anyone listening to the podcastwould be that what will you tell
your children in 10, 15, 20years?
(26:47):
What, what's the story thatyou're gonna tell your
grandchildren when they learnabout the atrocities that are
going on in Zen?
That you stood silent and didnothing about it.
What will you, what will you sayto them?
On your deathbed, will you beokay with the fact that you did
nothing or felt like you didn'tdo enough?
And it doesn't mean, you know,showing up at board meetings and
(27:10):
screaming and yelling, and it'snot about that.
It's about teaching politicaladvocacy.
Pick up the phone and call yourelected officials.
Take a stand on something, dosomething about it.
There are so many different waysof support.
It's like, find your niche andjust do it.
And don't feel that you're,you're, you're alone or in a
world, on an island by yourself.
(27:31):
Because if, if I, as aPalestinian educator don't feel
that way, then I don't thinkthat anybody really should have
to feel that way.
So you are here, you havesupport.
You just have to find it..
Ayesha T (27:44):
I think it's important for any educator who's not sure
or anyone in the labor movementthat's not sure where to start,
is to start with that personalconnection.
I just think of my parents inmoments of conflict.
When I was a student, the firstthing that asked me is like,
what did your teacher say?
Like, what did they say inschool?
They were also learning with meand do we wanna be that teacher?
(28:08):
Student at home, they didn't sayanything.
Wasn't that important?
I.
I, I asked my classes, is thissomething they wanted to talk
about?
It was a simple democratic poll.
Is there, do we wanna createspace in my classroom today to
talk about this?
(28:29):
Overwhelmingly, all my classesvoted in favor to talk about.
If I did not ask that question,how would I have known that they
wanted that space to talk aboutthis during the first couple
weeks of October?
And so create that space, createthat personal connection,
humanize everyone in each other.
Because we are going to have tonavigate what collaboration
(28:52):
looks like.
We have to model to studentswhat conflict resolution looks
like, and students have tounderstand that listening to
each other goes a very long wayand looking at each other as
human beings goes a very longway.
Track 1 (29:07):
hardest things that, like I've had to learn, I guess,
is that, No school system, Iguess.
Very few system.
They probably say no schoolsystem.
Do students get what theydeserve?
Right.
And Chicago, our studentsdefinitely don't get what they
deserve.
And I kind of naively thoughtwhen I started teaching that
people would get that.
Like I was like, oh, adults willunderstand that.
You know, politicians willunderstand that our students
(29:28):
deserve more.
And I remember like my firstyear couple, you know, first
month of teaching.
Coming home and being like, man,our students don't have this,
that, and the other.
And I just had this conversationwith this adult and they didn't
get it at all.
My wife is like, who's also ateacher?
She was like, you gotta teachthem too.
And I was like, I didn't sign upto teach adults.
I signed up to teach, you know,14 year olds.
Like, I understand they don'tknow things and they're gonna
(29:49):
teach me things.
I'm gonna teach'em and it'sgonna be great.
but you quickly realize thatlike.
When you advocate for yourstudents, you have to advocate
fully for your students.
And that means putting yourselfout there because if you don't
advocate for your students, theymight not always be there,
right?
Things can happen in our cityand things can happen in this
world as we're seeing inPalestine.
(30:10):
So you have to put yourself outthere.
And when you do that though.
There'll be lots of people thatlove and support you, and
there's also people that sayterrible things about you and
threaten you.
And that's also something thatyou need to realize as well,
depending on what level ofadvocacy you, which route you
go.
And so obviously find yourgroup, find your people, find
your support, find your therapy,right?
(30:31):
Like open up and talk to peoplebecause holding it all in isn't
gonna help you or your students.
And so.
I think about my students allthe time.
I think about students.
I lost all the time.
I think about my own childrenall the time.
Like, what do I want all mystudents to have my own children
to have?
What do they, how should I want?
How do I want them to rememberme?
(30:51):
How do I want them to, what do Iwant them to have?
Right?
And so like, you can't.
You can't watch the news and seewhat's happening in Palestine or
watch the news and see what'shappening in Chicago as a
teacher no matter where, and notlike if you've let it, I mean,
like it's so painful if youcan't even describe it.
(31:12):
Right.
And so like I.
To add to that too, like myfather was in Vietnam, he was
drafted into Vietnam, he was incombat in Vietnam, and you know,
he didn't drink and he didn't,you know, disappear and he
didn't go homeless like a lot ofveterans did.
Um, but he wasn't there.
He was there physically, but hewasn't there emotionally.
And it took many, many, manyyears for him to open up about
(31:34):
anything.
And he doesn't open up aboutmuch.
But I know if my kids cry, hecan't deal with it.
I know.
Now I know why that's the case.
Right?
And I'm thankful he speaks outagainst wars and he joined
Veterans for Peace and thesetypes of things.
But I know what war does toeveryone.
Like I know what it does to thepeople who are impacted in it,
and I know the people who aretold to go do it.
(31:57):
and so that's something I don'twant on my students either.
I don't want them to be sentover to some country to go kill
people, right?
Because that's, they're notgonna come home the same and.
Elton LK (32:08):
This is Class, an official podcast of the
Democratic Socialists of AmericaNational Political Education
Committee.
My name is Elton LK.
Thank you to Casey Stikker, whodeserves a big thanks for sound
engineering and theme music.
Thank you to Palmer Conrad forediting.
if you're inspired by anythingwe've been talking about, if you
(32:28):
think the system is rigged anddemocracy is the solution, join
DSA.
Become a member.
I've put a link in the shownotes to DSA's website.
if you're already a member ofDSA, please share this podcast
with your local chapter.
Class is intended to be aresource for chapters and
members to articulate, apply,and share socialist theory with
(32:50):
DSA and the wider working class.
Also, remember to rate andreview us on iTunes or your
favorite podcatcher.
As you know from listening toother podcasts, this is an
important way to get out theword about class.
You are listening to class and official podcast of
(00:02):
the Democratic Socialists ofAmerica National Political
Education Committee.
My name is Elton, LK.
In this episode, I had the honorto meet with some good people.
This one is a little morepersonal.
Today we are talking with themembers of the Chicago Teachers
Union, Azi, David Steber, andHadil Abta.
(00:24):
This episode is a little morepersonal because my family has a
lot of school teachers in it.
Also, my wife and I lived inChicago for a few years.
As you may remember from ourepisode on the victory of the
current mayor of Chicago,Brandon Johnson, a former CTU
member.
Chicago students and educatorshave lived through a neoliberal
(00:46):
hell.
My wife and I experienced asmall piece of that in 2006,
right before the housing boomwent bust.
Investors were rapidlyconverting all the apartments in
Chicago to condos.
There were almost no affordableapartments and we had almost no
money.
So after several stressfulmonths, we determined our time
(01:07):
in Chicago was over schools inChicago were famously
underfunded.
During that time, from 2003 to2013, Chicago closed 50 schools
only making conditions forstudents worse.
These closures moved to themembers of the teacher's union
to become militant.
Their militancy changed thedirection of Chicago's
(01:29):
education, politics, andreignited a labor movement in
America that is starting toreverse decades of decline of US
Union membership.
Chicago educators recentlyjoined 146 other unions, locals
and caucuses including UnitedAuto Workers.
(01:50):
United Electrical Radio andMachine Workers of America, an
association of flight attendantssigning a letter calling for
basic rights to be restored inGaza, hostages to be released,
and for Biden to call for aceasefire.
I also just heard that SEIU,that is the Service Employees
International Union, just calledfor a ceasefire.
(02:13):
I found out first about theletter from a piece David wrote,
and in these times, note that asI record this, Israel just
announced that they're willingto consider a two month pause.
We need to continue calling fora permanent ceasefire.
Okay, let's meet our guests.
Can you please introduceyourself
Ayesha T (02:35):
so good evening everyone.
My name is Lampert.
Dave Stieber (02:40):
Good evening everyone.
Uh, my name's Dave.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (02:42):
My name is born and raised on the north
side of the city.
Um, born to, uh, immigrant,Palestinian parents that came in
the late, early seventies, soit's great to be here.
Elton LK (02:54):
So first question, what motivated you in.
The Chicago Teachers Union toadd your name to a letter with
other unions calling for animmediate ceasefire in Israel
and Palestine.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (03:08):
For myself, it was just a natural thing to
do considering I'm.
Um, have visited my my parents'homeland many, many times, um,
and after having just been therethis past summer, um, and
wondering like, how do peoplelive there on a daily basis, um,
with all the difficulties, thenuances that an average person
(03:32):
here in America doesn't have toface.
So it was, for me, it was a nobrainer.,
Dave Stieber (03:36):
to give a little context too, so, you know, after
October 7th happened, you know,like obviously many teachers
were aware of just the issues inPalestine over the course of
history.
Um, but after October 7thhappened, it really kind of
awakened a lot of teachers andso.
To get even to the signing ontothe letter was, you know, a
discussion that was brought toCTU leadership, by members.
(03:59):
Like Aisha had like lots ofpeople like, who like brought
this to, you know, to like, tomembership and like, Hey, we
need to do something about this,right?
So the discussion was what do wedo as a union?
Like we've never been involvedin international matters before.
Do we even have a place ininternational matters?
Like all those discussions werehappening.
Um, kind of behind the scenes,right, amongst the members, um,
(04:20):
behind the scenes of the generalpublic.
And so, you know, it was becauseof teachers who care and love
their students and care and loveabout other educators and care
and love about people, period.
That.
That discussion really startedgaining momentum as to, you
know, as a union, we need tocome out and take a stand on
this, right?
We need to show up for ourstudents, show up for our
(04:40):
colleagues, and show up for justpeople in humanity.
And so it was like, what do wedo?
How do we do it?
You know?
And then there was lots ofdiscussions for a few weeks.
Um.
Multiple discussions, um, aboutwhat we do.
And then the res, the idea tokind of sign on, came through
the members, went through smallcommittees, went through the
executive board, went to theHouse of Delegates where we were
(05:01):
voted on it as a whole, right?
And so it was, it was a verydemocratic process that for
people who really care about theissue, felt slow.
But in the hindsight, it waslike, you know, a couple week
process.
And we signed this letterNovember 1st, and we're still
waiting for our federalgovernment to call for a
ceasefire now here in January.
Ayesha T (05:18):
And I wanna add, it was really easy for me to sign
on and support this for manydifferent reasons, given the
various identities that I carry.
For example, I'm Bush.
Which is an Afghan identity.
And coming from the Afghandiaspora, our country just came
out of the longest war ever inhistory.
(05:40):
The, um, war in Afghanistan,which lasted about, about 19
years and 10 months.
And so thinking about the impactit has on generations of Afghans
and Afghans within diaspora, butalso I teach.
Environmental environmentalscience.
I teach AP environmentalscience, and I think about the
environmental degradation andthe disrespect and disregard of
(06:04):
earth and all living things.
I also think from the labor,movement and perspective, the
impact the environment has onworkers, worker protections,
fight over resources.
Economic impacts job security.
So there's many differentintersections into this type of
work.
And so this collective drive andneed to make sure that this
(06:26):
never happens again to anyone,uh, and making sure that we are
on the right side of history,promoting peace, and modeling
what peace looks like.
Elton LK (06:37):
So what kind of organizing had to occur in order
to pass this resolution?
How did you determine you hadthe support of the community
that you needed?
Ayesha T (06:48):
I'm gonna jump in right away because I would say
that organizing was happeningfor a very long time at CTU and
I look back tog.
War and the developments of uspulling out from the Afghan War.
I was supporting young Afghanyouth within the Chicago
community and, um, the Afghanyouth in my community helped to
(07:11):
community protest downtown, andI had CTU Corps members show up
to that protest and that was myway of getting involved in.
The Chicago Teachers Union incore is when I saw core members
present in that space and thatinternational solidarity that
they were showing beyondteaching, that pulled me into
that space.
And it's been many years of justcollaboration and friendships
(07:33):
and connecting with peoplewithin the union that had the
strong moral compass.
And for me it was alwaysPalestine.
Uh, war was a litmus test for meto see where people's values
were.
And by seeing people outside ofthe elements of teaching and
being in these solidarityspaces, I had a clear idea where
(07:55):
people were standing and I feltcomfortable during moments of.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (08:00):
I don't know that there's much more to add to
it than what, uh.
I should just shared, um, Ithink, you know, as, as
educators in one of the largestschool districts in the country,
that serves such a mix ofstudents, um, how could you stay
(08:22):
silent when.
You know that students who areboth invisible and hyper
visible, um, are, are ignored.
And to say that they don't existwould be an injustice within
itself.
And so, um.
You know, every child's lifematters.
(08:43):
Whether they are here in Chicagoor in New York, or in Florida,
or in California or in Reza.
I mean, we have to acknowledgethat as educators, we have the
most profound impact on a child.
Probably alongside theirparents.
For those that have parents andright now the number of of
(09:04):
children who have lost theirlives and who have lost their
parents is just horrendous.
Dave Stieber (09:11):
I didn't come into teaching thinking like, this is
gonna be easy.
Right?
Like the first school I workedat.
I remember walking into thebuilding and it legit felt like
a prison.
Like there was like a, like a, alookup and there was like glass
windows around this littlecourtyard that looked down into
like where the students were.
And the community had beendisinvested in, right?
(09:31):
It had been, it was a schoolthat had been closed and then
reopened and it was just thiswhole process of disinvestment
over and over and over.
And so that's teaching ourstudents here in Chicago, and
that's what you experience as ateacher.
And so.
When you first start teaching,you look around and be like, why
do our students not haveeverything that they possibly
deserve?
And then you go through like,how can I teach them that they
(09:53):
can get everything they theydeserve if they're having to
come to a space where there'snetworking computers and these
types of things.
This is like 20 2007, right?
And so.
Core and Karen Lewis and theChicago Teachers Union radically
changed, right?
In 2012.
Because I remember going as adelegate, going to a meeting
before Karen Lewis came up andbeing like, what are we talking
about here?
(10:13):
Like, what is this?
Right?
And then it, there was adramatic shift, right?
And so that shift has evolvedfrom not only advocating for
everything our students deservein the city, right?
But then starting to thinkabout.
Outside of our classroom, likewhat do they deserve in their
community?
What does they deserve across,you know, everything, right?
So housing and all these typesof things.
And so it's only natural thatthen these teachers, us, who
(10:34):
care about all the things in ourstudents' lives, we look not
only in Chicago, right?
We look around the country andthen you look around the world.
And so it's just, it's aprogression and it's because of
like was mentioned that.
The organizing has happened overvarious issues of things that
our students have deserved, thatit makes something organizing
around something of a globalscale, like not a stretch,
(10:55):
right?
And so it's like, oh yeah, wecare about all these things.
So of course we care about this.
Of course we care about life.
Of course, we don't want a war,right?
And so I think You again know?
Oh yeah.
Like I can know, I can rely onthat person to care about fair
housing for our students.
I can also care about them towanna end to war and brutality.
Elton LK (11:13):
How are your students affected by international
events?
And then, what do you say, uh,to the response that teachers
need to stick to teaching?
Hadeil Abdelfattah (11:27):
We teach life, sir., we, we do it.
All right.
I guess that would be left up toeach person to define what does,
what is teaching.
And so when we look at what weteach and what we do, it is not
within the confines of a bookthat, that are papers that are
(11:50):
bound.
It is real life experiences andthe capacity to think critically
and to teach students, as wellas sometimes their families.
How do you critically andeffectively look at the things
that are offered to you in life,in your community, what your
(12:11):
community deserves, and whatthey have access to, and how do
you fight to make sure that youget what you deserve?
And so, it, it's, it's allencompassing and it, it takes
you out of just teaching, abook, uh, that's been published
by a mass producer, right?
and having the capacity to saythat our students deserve more.
(12:32):
They deserve to be able tocritically think for themselves,
and they deserve the right todetermine what they should be
entitled to.
It's not us to say for them, butwe need to give them the tools
for them to then decide what itthey want it to look like.
Ayesha T (12:45):
And wow, there's been so much going on and there was a
moment in my classroom I willnever, ever forget, and I was
teaching AP EnvironmentalScience and it was the day when
the hospital was bombed, whenthe first hospital was bombed,
and I had no idea that happened.
I was teaching and myPalestinian student and my
(13:06):
classroom was.
Just tears.
And from the back she lookedfine, but when I walked on the
other side, she was holding itso strong like she was taking
notes and she just had, her facewas filled with tears.
I did not know what washappening in Gaza at that time.
(13:27):
I did not know how wellconnected our students are in
these moments of pain.
And not only was she aware.
I had to quickly pivot and makesure that the class was engaging
in a quick prompt, and I pulledher into the hallway and I just
asked her, what's going on?
Are you okay?
(13:47):
And she had a hard time sharing.
I.
What she was feeling and she,she broke that news to me and in
that moment of pain and sadnessthat I will have to forever
carry and she will have toforever carry, is that there's
such a gap in education that thelack of social, emotional
support for our students thatare in direct moments of
(14:12):
conflict and they're worriedabout their families.
And our system has taught ourstudents to stay so strong and
brave.
She really did not have to belike that in that space, in that
moment.
And making sure we give studentsthat space and that moment to
breathe and to walk out and to,just process this.
(14:33):
And so I would say teaching in astate, teaching in a county that
serves the largest Palestinianpopulation in the nation.
students are silently hurting.
And our students, when given theopportunity to share, they will
share.
And our teachers, we're doing somuch with barely any little
(14:55):
support.
And I think of the teachers whoI connected to immediately
within our SWANA diaspora, theSouthwest Asian North African
diaspora, a lot of us in thislarger category.
We barely had a teacher check inwith us how we were doing.
And so when I asked, you know,when we asked each other like,
(15:15):
did anyone check up on you?
The answer was no.
And we're we're always in thisprofession of always giving.
And that's something we signedup for, but also we need to be
taken care of as well in orderto do the jobs that we're also
doing.
Dave Stieber (15:29):
don't teach.
Students, my students are,predominantly black.
They are watching the sametiktoks, they are seeing the
same, you know, videos.
They're seeing the same thingsthat all of us in society are
seeing.
Right.
And so they're like, how is thishappening to these young people
here or to this city, or towhatever, right?
But then also like, because Iteach history, right?
(15:50):
They can look back and be like,oh yeah.
During the Black Lives Mattermovement, Palestinians were the
ones that reached out.
To people at Fer when they wereprotesting in Ferguson, they
gave ideas of how to go to aprotest and cover your mouth,
you know, with the gas being putout by the police, right?
And so, like, these are thingsthat, like Palestinians have
been making connections with theAfrican American community here
in the United States for shared,you know, uh, protests and
(16:13):
shared struggles in a way.
And so, like, there's a lot ofhistorical connections there
too, right?
And so the idea of, you know,teachers should stick to the
classroom like.
I mean, the best teachers in theworld, like always teach the
world is the classroom, right?
And so like that's what we wantfor our students.
And so to bring in connectionsacross all disciplines and in
(16:34):
all places, right, is like theideal.
And so that's just by the, youknow, narrow-minded individuals
who don't like teachersactually.
Being vocal.
They just want us to teach from,you know, whatever, to whatever,
and stay silent and all that.
And so, you know, that's justnot the case.
And that's what, thankfully ourunion does not advocate.
They advocate for teaching,right?
Like everyone, and advocatingfor all
Ayesha T (16:56):
I wanna add,, to the second part about, being told
teachers should stick toteaching being part of the
Chicago Teachers Union and.
Just being in the educationalprofession, we're all striving
and constantly working forinclusive learning spaces that
really center around the socialand emotional wellbeing of our
students, and that means beingliterate about issues that are
(17:19):
happening within the community.
And so yes, we are sticking toteaching and we're teaching
international solidarity andwhat it means to be centered
around love and justice for all,and peace for all.
And so this is part of ourcurriculum is for us to become
literate and for us to worktogether and fight for the
resources we need, and also tomodel to students what positive
(17:43):
behavior looks like.
What does conflict resolutionlooks like?
What does negotiation,collaboration, post-conflict
look like?
Hadeil Abdelfattah (17:51):
second.
I think that, you know, I'm, I'mnot in the classroom per se as a
classroom teacher.
I'm an instructional coach and,um, we.
An amazing teacher, she's achemistry teacher and she spends
an entire unit on the, on isms,racism, capitalism, imperialism,
and all these things and how itimpacts community.
(18:12):
And so I think that, you know,real life experiences and what
may be happening 6,000, 7,000miles away does impact.
What is happening here, and, andstudents see it.
We, we can't disregard theaccess that this generation has,
that generations before did nothave.
And so we need to teach them,you know, how do you decipher,
(18:35):
how do you figure out what'sreal and what's not real?
And and give them those tools totake it all in.
Elton LK (18:41):
How have your students in your community responded to
cts stance towards theceasefire?
Ayesha T (18:48):
I would say it's received a lot of encouraging
and positive support frommembers who are looking for that
validation and thatunderstanding that, yes, the
union and the labor movement.
Recognizes workers, protections,justice and rights in all
(19:09):
countries around the world.
And there are times where I'm inconversation with educators who
feel like they may be the onlyteacher or the only worker in a
space with this sort ofmentality or this sort of strong
moral compass or ground.
And to be like, Hey, did youknow CTU signed on?
(19:33):
It's like, wow, this huge unionsigned onto this, gives people
the motivation and push to keeppushing forward within the
spaces that they're in and theleverage to keep advocating for
justice for all.
Elton LK (19:48):
We at Democratic Socialists of America believe
the labor movement isstrategically placed to put
pressure on our political andeconomic system to do the right
thing.
And the Chicago Teachers UnionHistoric 2012 strike was
critical for the American labormovement.
It's hard to imagine that wewould be seeing the labor
(20:09):
activity that we are seeingtoday without CTU.
Can you talk about some of thethings that CTU has accomplished
by standing together in,solidarity?
Dave Stieber (20:21):
the CT as we know, essentially been.
Whole teaching career.
This is my year 17 CPS, youknow, core started kind of
forming before, and then beforethey got, you know, before we
got control or whatever electedinto CTU in 2012.
Right.
And so, like the whole likemodel for it, has just been my
whole experience.
(20:41):
Right.
And so I guess all that to sayis that when.
I started teaching, right.
I looked for, you know, I alwayswas like inspired by people who
were brave and who stood up andspoke out.
And, you know, I wanted to use,you know, my race, like I'm a
white male and I wanted to usethese privileges to like
dismantle, like the systems thathave been always oppressed.
(21:04):
All the people that I looked upto, right?
And so I was like, where can Igo?
Like, who can I be by?
Right?
And so, like, CTU, has begunthat quest and providing that
space to find people like that,right?
And so with all that thenadvocating for.
not closing schools, right?
Like a basic thing, right?
Like 2013.
(21:24):
Like remember marching throughfrom the south side up to
downtown over the course ofmultiple days, right.
To say keep our schools open,right?
And attending, you know, vigilsat churches in the middle of the
night where parents and schoolnights where parents were
protesting keep the schoolsopen, right?
And so like, we clearly likedidn't win that, right?
We had the Chicago close Mostschools in the history of our
(21:45):
country, however.
Right.
Because of those earlystruggles, right.
We now see where we are now.
And so we have, you know, unionsacross the country wanting to
replicate our model and SeanFain at the UAW shouting out
CTU, right?
And Stacey Davis Gates and JesseSharkey and Karen Lewis, right?
For the work that's been doneover the past, you know,
(22:06):
whatever that is, years now.
And so, you know, we now have amayor that came up through our
ranks, right?
And so.
None of this is perfect, right?
Like all of this is because ofthe work that CTU has been doing
since 2012 and before, right.
And the people that have been apart of it, and the teachers
that are literally in theclassrooms every day, um,
working with, you know, thestudents and advocating for our
(22:26):
students.
Right?
And so, you know, like.
We would never be in a spot.
Right now we're in March, we'regonna pass, um, bring Chicago
home, which is gonna bringhousing to our unhoused and
through a tax on the rich rightthrough a tax, if you own a
property more than a milliondollars, you will have to pay a
one-time transition tax.
Right.
And so to the vast majority ofus, we're like, that's cool.
(22:47):
That's no problem to us.
Right?
But there's these few selectindividuals who are making it
seem like it's gonna be likethis whole thing.
Right.
But like.
We're, we're putting legislationin place to radically change our
city, to help our, the studentsand the people that live there,
which before was never the case,or we've seen a city that's had
to like, basically people beenpushed out, through different
policies and throughdisinvestment and through
(23:08):
gentrification.
And so we're trying to reversethat.
So not only are we taking onissues in the classroom, it's
citywide, right?
And that's all because of thework that's been done and
started and continues, kind ofthrough CTU.
Hadeil Abdelfattah (23:21):
I think the activism of our union has grown
over time.
and the lens in which we do it.
So I am in year 26 in CPS, andso I've seen how, you know, you
had leadership that reallydidn't do justice for the
students, families or teachers.
and in recent years, You feelthat it's children first.
(23:45):
And so I think that with havingthat lens and that focus, how
can you go wrong?
Like when you're saying you'redoing right by the next
generation or two, you know,the, the counterbalances of, you
know, what's what might be quoteunquote fiscally correct.
Right.
versus the impact that it wouldhave on, on, on students and
(24:05):
their families and, and thelives that they live is just,,
there are no words to describeit.
And so for that, I'm, I'm, I'mreally proud, uh, of the work
that's happened and, uh, I'm nota delegate and, you know, and I
know the contract inside and outfrom when I was a former
principal and, and things likethat.
(24:26):
But it's just, it's, it'samazing to see the work that CTU
has done.
and that others are trying,really trying hard, to, to try
to pull that together.
And, and that we're leading thework I'm truly honored.
Ayesha T (24:40):
And I wanna add, now that you brought up delegate, I
never saw myself this active ina union space, I would say seven
years ago when I first startedteaching.
And so much has changed withinthe labor movement, and myself
and Dave and others were on thefloor.
Of the house, the delegatesmeeting, speaking in favor of
(25:03):
this resolution that passed.
And standing in that line withmy good friend Aaron and being
ready to speak was a powerfulmoment and out of body
experience for myself.
'cause I never visioned myselfto be in that space, but I, we
needed to be in that spacebecause our responsibility as
(25:24):
delegates in these union spacesis to speak for.
Is to really advocate andrepresent and speak for our
members.
And our members consist ofPalestinian educators and
students.
And so I wanna add on to haddeal sharing that shift that's
(25:45):
been happening and that drasticshift in representation,
creating space, opening up spacefor different members to start
to speak up and advocate on thefloor..
Elton LK (25:57):
Is there anything that you want to say to other
teachers and other unions
Hadeil Abdelfattah (26:04):
I don't think that it's a matter of not
necessarily having anything.
It's like, where do you start,right?
So it's like if you are silentand complicit, you are guilty.
If you are advocating and feellike you're coming up against a
wall because people are tellingyou using words, throwing them
(26:24):
at you that have really beenspun out of control, um, you
have allies, you just need tofind them.
They are there I think that ifthere's anything that I would
say to, to another teacheranywhere, in the country or
anyone listening to the podcastwould be that what will you tell
your children in 10, 15, 20years?
(26:47):
What, what's the story thatyou're gonna tell your
grandchildren when they learnabout the atrocities that are
going on in Zen?
That you stood silent and didnothing about it.
What will you, what will you sayto them?
On your deathbed, will you beokay with the fact that you did
nothing or felt like you didn'tdo enough?
And it doesn't mean, you know,showing up at board meetings and
(27:10):
screaming and yelling, and it'snot about that.
It's about teaching politicaladvocacy.
Pick up the phone and call yourelected officials.
Take a stand on something, dosomething about it.
There are so many different waysof support.
It's like, find your niche andjust do it.
And don't feel that you're,you're, you're alone or in a
world, on an island by yourself.
(27:31):
Because if, if I, as aPalestinian educator don't feel
that way, then I don't thinkthat anybody really should have
to feel that way.
So you are here, you havesupport.
You just have to find it..
Ayesha T (27:44):
I think it's important for any educator who's not sure
or anyone in the labor movementthat's not sure where to start,
is to start with that personalconnection.
I just think of my parents inmoments of conflict.
When I was a student, the firstthing that asked me is like,
what did your teacher say?
Like, what did they say inschool?
They were also learning with meand do we wanna be that teacher?
(28:08):
Student at home, they didn't sayanything.
Wasn't that important?
I.
I, I asked my classes, is thissomething they wanted to talk
about?
It was a simple democratic poll.
Is there, do we wanna createspace in my classroom today to
talk about this?
(28:29):
Overwhelmingly, all my classesvoted in favor to talk about.
If I did not ask that question,how would I have known that they
wanted that space to talk aboutthis during the first couple
weeks of October?
And so create that space, createthat personal connection,
humanize everyone in each other.
Because we are going to have tonavigate what collaboration
(28:52):
looks like.
We have to model to studentswhat conflict resolution looks
like, and students have tounderstand that listening to
each other goes a very long wayand looking at each other as
human beings goes a very longway.
Track 1 (29:07):
hardest things that, like I've had to learn, I guess,
is that, No school system, Iguess.
Very few system.
They probably say no schoolsystem.
Do students get what theydeserve?
Right.
And Chicago, our studentsdefinitely don't get what they
deserve.
And I kind of naively thoughtwhen I started teaching that
people would get that.
Like I was like, oh, adults willunderstand that.
You know, politicians willunderstand that our students
(29:28):
deserve more.
And I remember like my firstyear couple, you know, first
month of teaching.
Coming home and being like, man,our students don't have this,
that, and the other.
And I just had this conversationwith this adult and they didn't
get it at all.
My wife is like, who's also ateacher?
She was like, you gotta teachthem too.
And I was like, I didn't sign upto teach adults.
I signed up to teach, you know,14 year olds.
Like, I understand they don'tknow things and they're gonna
(29:49):
teach me things.
I'm gonna teach'em and it'sgonna be great.
but you quickly realize thatlike.
When you advocate for yourstudents, you have to advocate
fully for your students.
And that means putting yourselfout there because if you don't
advocate for your students, theymight not always be there,
right?
Things can happen in our cityand things can happen in this
world as we're seeing inPalestine.
(30:10):
So you have to put yourself outthere.
And when you do that though.
There'll be lots of people thatlove and support you, and
there's also people that sayterrible things about you and
threaten you.
And that's also something thatyou need to realize as well,
depending on what level ofadvocacy you, which route you
go.
And so obviously find yourgroup, find your people, find
your support, find your therapy,right?
(30:31):
Like open up and talk to peoplebecause holding it all in isn't
gonna help you or your students.
And so.
I think about my students allthe time.
I think about students.
I lost all the time.
I think about my own childrenall the time.
Like, what do I want all mystudents to have my own children
to have?
What do they, how should I want?
How do I want them to rememberme?
(30:51):
How do I want them to, what do Iwant them to have?
Right?
And so like, you can't.
You can't watch the news and seewhat's happening in Palestine or
watch the news and see what'shappening in Chicago as a
teacher no matter where, and notlike if you've let it, I mean,
like it's so painful if youcan't even describe it.
(31:12):
Right.
And so like I.
To add to that too, like myfather was in Vietnam, he was
drafted into Vietnam, he was incombat in Vietnam, and you know,
he didn't drink and he didn't,you know, disappear and he
didn't go homeless like a lot ofveterans did.
Um, but he wasn't there.
He was there physically, but hewasn't there emotionally.
And it took many, many, manyyears for him to open up about
(31:34):
anything.
And he doesn't open up aboutmuch.
But I know if my kids cry, hecan't deal with it.
I know.
Now I know why that's the case.
Right?
And I'm thankful he speaks outagainst wars and he joined
Veterans for Peace and thesetypes of things.
But I know what war does toeveryone.
Like I know what it does to thepeople who are impacted in it,
and I know the people who aretold to go do it.
(31:57):
and so that's something I don'twant on my students either.
I don't want them to be sentover to some country to go kill
people, right?
Because that's, they're notgonna come home the same and.
Elton LK (32:08):
This is Class, an official podcast of the
Democratic Socialists of AmericaNational Political Education
Committee.
My name is Elton LK.
Thank you to Casey Stikker, whodeserves a big thanks for sound
engineering and theme music.
Thank you to Palmer Conrad forediting.
if you're inspired by anythingwe've been talking about, if you
(32:28):
think the system is rigged anddemocracy is the solution, join
DSA.
Become a member.
I've put a link in the shownotes to DSA's website.
if you're already a member ofDSA, please share this podcast
with your local chapter.
Class is intended to be aresource for chapters and
members to articulate, apply,and share socialist theory with
(32:50):
DSA and the wider working class.
Also, remember to rate andreview us on iTunes or your
favorite podcatcher.
As you know from listening toother podcasts, this is an
important way to get out theword about class.
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