December 22, 2025 • 57 mins
Post show your hormones want a snack and a nap.... listen in to hear why!
The day after the stage is where the real work begins. We open up about reverse dieting’s unglamorous middle—where hunger howls, hormones recalibrate, and your identity feels like it’s slipping—and map out a clear path from brittle discipline to durable strength. If you’ve ever wondered why coming off a cut feels harder than the cut itself, this conversation puts language, strategy, and compassion to the chaos.
We start with physiology in plain English: very low body fat distorts appetite, sleep, mood, and sex hormones. A short recovery bump in calories helps turn the lights back on; a deliberate reverse rebuilds training, libido, and sanity. For women in their 40s and 50s, we connect the dots between adipose tissue, estrogen, and thyroid function—and explain why “staying stage lean” is a health debt, not a badge of honor. Then we tackle timing traps: fall shows collide with shorter days, seasonal affective symptoms, and the holiday buffet line. We share scripts for setting boundaries, a realistic social plan, and why familiar meals beat hyper-palatable snacks when cravings spike.
From there, we shift the target. Bodybuilding isn’t bodyholding; progress after a show lives in the gym log, not the mirror. We lay out a performance-first mindset—chasing PRs, scheduling a powerlifting cycle or new athletic goal—and a daily checklist that actually works on low-motivation days: sunlight, a simple walk, hygiene, one errand, early sleep. We also cover lab work (thyroid, sex hormones), realistic hormone recovery timelines, and the support network that keeps you steady: coach, clinician, partner, and community.
If you’re navigating post-show blues, midlife hormone shifts, or the holiday headwind after a long prep, this episode is your playbook to reverse, recover, and rebuild—without losing your joy. Subscribe, share with a teammate who needs this, and leave a review telling us your best post-show ritual.
Looking for a coach to help you be YOUR best self in bodybuilding or just in life? Let's get in touch!
Team CSFP
IG: @teamcsfp
FB: https://www.facebook.com/teamcsfp
To reach out to Tina @ Center Stage Athletics
www.centerstagethleticscoaching.com
info@centerstageathleticscoaching.com
To reach out to Ginny @ Thrive NutriFit
IG & FB: @ginnygrivas
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:21):
Hello, hello, and welcome to Coaching and
Cocktails the podcast.
And I'm Tina, and you are.
I am Jenny.
Hello.
So now we can actually introduceourselves.
Jenny is officially my newco-host.
Um I do want to addresssomething because um Brandy is
(00:44):
still alive.
I did have some questions.
I think even Brandy was like,was there ever any explanation
about where I went?
Or did people just like thinkI'm dead?
And I was like, I said, no,anytime anybody has asked,
right?
I'm just like, no, she had, Imean, her kids are like
teenagers now, they're superactive in soccer and
(01:06):
cheerleading and like all ofthese things.
And and really, Brandy just hadto take time away from doing all
of this stuff so she could gofocus on her family stuff, which
you know, I absolutely so she'sstill here.
Brandy and I are still besties.
Like, I we did not have afalling out.
We are we are still we stillemail each other daily.
(01:26):
She was just like, Hey, doesanybody know what happened to
me?
That's great.
I was like, Oh no, I don't thinkwe ever explained that.
So anyway, we love you, Brandy.
We love you.
If you're listening or any ofBrandy's friends are listening,
so we didn't mean to just makeit seem like she just went poof
and she was gone.
Um, so anyway, so Ginny and Iare gonna try to pick up the
(01:47):
where where we left off a littlebit.
And I told Jinny she couldsurprise me with whatever topic
she wanted to talk about todaybecause I was just too tired
yesterday to read through theemail on the topics.
I uh I yeah.
So um, why do you want to talkabout?
SPEAKER_00 (02:03):
So today I really want to talk about reverse
dieting and just thatunglamorous side of bodybuilding
and getting to the stage.
It's about what happens afterand kind of just you know, the
the not so pretty part um toreally help ladies, especially
those that are in the midlife,you know, in their 40s and 50s.
Like I'm 50 and I started thispretty late in my life at 46.
(02:23):
There's a lot of ladies outthere that compete that are in
their 20s or 30s and whatnot,which is awesome.
Um, but for those of us that areapproaching sort of that end of
child end of life, end of life,end of children, we're we're on
our way, we're crusty, we're onthe downhill spiral, okay, the
end of life as we know it.
(02:44):
End of life, but you know, it'sit's it's that post-show blues,
and I don't think it's talkedabout enough, and I just want to
talk about that today, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (02:51):
And you know, for people who aren't in
bodybuilding or have shittycoaches that don't actually tell
them anything about reversedieting, and really reverse
dieting applies to everybody.
This isn't just a bodybuildingthing, although it's way less
extreme if you're somebody who'sin like a training and uh just a
typical kind of training cycle.
But um, I call it recovery andreverse dieting because I think
(03:14):
it's it's both.
And so um, really, it'sbasically the process of coming
out of for people who don'tknow, right?
So you diet down, you lose allthe body fat, and you spend all
these weeks lowering caloriesand increasing cardio and all
the things that you got to do sothat you have this really nice
lean physique and you get onstage, and then after you get
off stage, you have to veryslowly bring that back up,
(03:37):
right?
So you have to slowly put bodyfat on.
Some people do it faster thanothers, right?
Um, but I there there really isthis like recovery and reverse
phase.
And um, I forget what there wasanother, there was another coach
out there that sort of startreally started uh coining the
the recovery term.
And because there is this likecouple week period of time
(03:59):
where, in my opinion, like youwe can't go too slow with re
with bringing calories back upbecause then you're just
dragging on all the shittythings that happen to your body
when the body fat was reallylow.
So you kind of have this burstof calories, you get this
recovery, you start to feel alittle bit better, and then you
start slowly sort of reversing.
And I I like to I like to sortof combine the two.
(04:23):
Um, but you're right, but that'swhat it is, right?
You gotta you gotta go low toget into a show, and then you
gotta bring them back, you gottabring your calories back up and
your cardio back down and all ofthose things.
But it's the worst part of theentire process.
It's absolutely the biggest mindfuck you would ever imagine, and
nobody knows it until they're init, and everybody thinks they're
(04:44):
gonna be fine.
I've had clients thatbeautifully got to stage, never
had a slip-up and never had abinge, and never ate a cookie,
and everything was amazing.
We thought everything was gonnabe great when they came off
stage and then they lost theirshit, right?
And so um you don't know ituntil you're in it, but it
really is truly the hardest partof the entire process, and
nobody will understand it unlessyou're in it.
(05:07):
Um, because you don't have ashow on the horizon anymore,
right?
It's real easy in air quotes.
I like to use a lot of airquotes.
It's really easy to stick toyour diet when the show is X
number of weeks away and yougotta get your fat ass into this
little ity bitty bikini, right?
In front of a bunch of people.
And so after the show, you'relike, well, fuck it.
(05:29):
I'm not getting on stage againfor two years or whatever.
It's hard.
It's so much harder, right?
And and then obviously umgetting um getting into, I just
said, I don't want to talk thatmuch about science, but getting
into the what happens in yourbody um getting really lean for
(05:52):
stage, right?
So everything, everything getsreally fucked up, right?
Your hormones are fucked upgoing into the stage, um, your
body fat controls likeeverything using that term
loosely, right?
And so when you have really lowor really too high body fat,
like the rest of your bodysystems get out of whack.
And so when you're coming offstage from an evolutionary
(06:16):
perspective, our bodies are waysmarter than we are.
Um and if you ever want tolisten to a really good book
about this, um shit, I justforgot the name of it.
The hungry brain is one.
But that one's really good.
That gives you a lot ofinformation about what we're
talking about here.
And there's another one, andI'll figure it out and I'll put
it in the podcast notes.
(06:36):
But um from an evolutionaryperspective, our bodies do not
want us to be eight percent bodyfat.
Isn't that what you were, Jenny?
Eight, yeah, ten, something.
Um, your body is like right now,because you're you're probably
kind of out of the actualreverse phase and you're still
there, we're working to get yourecovered, but um your body's
like, fuck this and fuck you.
(06:57):
I can't survive this way, right?
Like this is this is dumb.
I don't know why you did this.
And so the only way for me tosurvive is to like put this body
fat on, like, like right now,right now, because we're gonna
die if I don't.
I mean, that's that's just howour bodies feel.
And so it is going to tell youyou're hungry no matter how much
you've eaten.
It's going to crave things thatyou would probably never in a
(07:20):
million years have even eaten inthe first place, um, because it
just wants, once, wants fuelbecause it really truly needs to
feel like you're not starving itanymore, right?
And it really, really wants tosurvive because that's our
body's only our brain and ourbody, it only cares about
survival and reproduction.
Like it does not care how welook or feel, for that matter.
SPEAKER_00 (07:42):
That's exactly right.
And and on the reproductiveaspect, as you get older and
your reproductive system beginsto change, right?
It's your your hormones arechanging within your body.
You have to understand thatendocrine system within you and
and how it's responding.
Because when you're going intobodybuilding in any kind of an
extreme sport where you'rehaving to restrict your calories
(08:04):
and really play with food,especially playing with body
fat, your brain is adapting tonew hormone environments.
And I say that with a pluralbecause it's going on its own
journey and you have to payattention to it.
And the symptoms of some of thatenvironmental change are your
moods, right?
And your energy level and yoursleep cycle and your menstrual
(08:27):
cycle, all of those things,right?
So you have to listen to thosethings because those are really
symptom symptoms, right, of thatenvironmental change.
And with estrogen, especially aswe get older, you know, the fat
our fat tissue contains anenzyme that converts
testosterone into estrogen.
So fat, we've got to have it.
We have to have this fat aswomen.
(08:47):
And then especially when you'regoing into peri menopause and
then full-blown menopause, fatbecomes a more important source
of that estrogen.
So more body fat equals moreestrogen, less body fat equals
very low estrogen.
So, you know, here we are, andlike with my journey, here I am
at 46 years old.
I guess it wasn't much my firstcompeting year.
(09:08):
So I went through four totalseasons of this, and now it's
taking me this fourth season toreally understand and see this.
I have to, when I go intoanother bodybuilding competition
season, plan not just to thestage date.
I have to plan completely after,not a week after, not two weeks
after.
I got to plan for whatevermonths after, because our bodies
(09:30):
are going to recover in the waythat they feel like recovering,
you know, at the pace thatthey're going to recover.
And this particular year, I'vehurt more.
And I'm saying hurt meaningmentally more than I have in
previous.
And I think it's reallyimportant.
I want to talk about it.
I want to share with people thatjust what you said earlier, the
hardest part of my entire prepthis year, which I thought was
(09:51):
going to be that long 30-weekcut was not.
The hardest part has been thelast 34 days.
The last 34 days since I laststepped off stage.
Um, and here's here's some ofthe things that I I wanted to
tell people about because it'snot glamours, it's not what you
put on IG.
I'm not posting these fabulouspictures of me anymore on.
SPEAKER_01 (10:11):
No, because nobody wants to put the everybody's
like, oh, look how lean I am asin the last 30 weeks as you got
leaner and leaner.
Nobody's like, oh, look howchunky I've gotten again.
I mean, you're not, but nobody,nobody talks about it because
it's just not the fun thing toput out their own social media,
right?
And obviously, which is part ofthe problem.
Yeah.
(10:31):
Um hundred percent.
The dog is biting me in thebutt.
Oh, that's sorry.
So sorry, so sorry, everybody.
She's literally it's calledcobbing.
Did you did you know that pitbulls do this thing called
cobbing?
I know as an aside, I didn'tknow that it was a thing.
I've had pit bulls before, butit's called cobbing and they
(10:52):
nibble and they do like they dothis, and it seems very cute.
It's like a mutual groominguntil the this I'm doing this
little tiny little nibblebecomes like, and then you're
like, okay, anyways.
Now she's doing bites.
Now she's doing zoomies in myoffice.
Okay, sorry.
So, what are you going throughright now?
Why don't you tell telleverybody what's going on in
your in your mind and your bodyright now?
SPEAKER_00 (11:13):
No, absolutely, because it it's I really want to
talk about depression.
I want to talk about thesethings.
They have to be discussed.
So here's one thing that Ididn't think about this year.
This is the first season that Iactually competed in the fall,
as opposed to competing in thespring.
So, what that means to peoplewho aren't familiar with
competing is that if I competein the spring, I'm usually
aiming for, let's say, some ofmy favorite shows that are in
(11:35):
May.
I got to give a big shout out tothe OCB Conquer and Frank
Meekins and Aaron Meekinsbecause I think they're
phenomenal spring showpromoters.
But that's a show that I loveddoing and happily won in 24.
So it was awesome.
But I would cut, I would startcutting for that show the very
beginning of January, rightafter New Year, right?
Have your big last big hurrah,the whole bit, and then start
(11:55):
cutting.
Great.
When you're done in the spring,you've got that summer, and
you've got those beautiful longsummer days full of vitamin D
with that sun shining.
So I felt fantastic coming offof that.
And I was able to go and enjoymy party summer with a
phenomenal physique at thatpoint, right?
Sure, you reverse, sure youthicken up a little bit, sure
(12:17):
some of the cuts go away.
Fine, but you're still in greatswimsuit condition, right?
Wonderful.
I loved it.
This season I decided I reallywant to hit those powerful fall
shows.
I want to do the OCB Chesapeakeclassic.
Bobby Cabino is a phenomenalshow promoter.
I wanted to hit York and Cup.
We love Marjorie and Sully, butI needed to start cutting during
(12:39):
my hot girl summer, right?
So you start cutting.
I got off a wonderful springbreak cruise with my great kid,
my husband, and I started May1st.
Okay.
I went through the whole summer.
Yeah, that sucked.
You miss out on a lot ofconcerts and birthdays and
events and things.
SPEAKER_01 (12:57):
I didn't see you missing out on shit.
So I saw you still partying, andyou no, I know you weren't
partying.
I'm again with my air quotes.
Nobody sees my air quotes, so Ishould probably stop using them.
I I if you you may or notremember this, but I was like,
hey, like to and I know youweren't out drinking or doing
anything like that, but you weregoing out a lot.
And I was like, this might bestarting to be a time where you
(13:20):
don't go out so much.
Yes.
Not because I thought you werebeing tempted, but because I'm
like, we really need to preserveyour energy.
And I think I was only, youknow, giving you that advice
because I think your check-inswere talking about, you know,
being tired and all that, youknow, all the things that you
were doing.
And if you were so close to theshows, and I was like, Jenny, we
got a really long prep to dohere.
(13:40):
Like, you really might want tonot do so many social events.
And I actually say that to a lotof clients.
I'm not telling everybody theyneed to hibernate and never go
out anywhere.
But my point is, I don'tactually think you missed.
No, I mean, I think you got apretty active social life, even
in prep.
Well, we tried.
We did, we didn't try.
SPEAKER_00 (14:00):
Because you're right.
I mean, you're right, you'reright.
Uh normally our summers wouldhave been more packed and more
things, you know, like going tomy beach and then doing this
extended trip over an ocean cityand like this and that.
We didn't do that.
Yeah.
We still attended events.
I still went to certainconcerts.
We drank the water, you know, inthe back in the courtroom.
Like, I don't have a water.
Maybe I'll have a Diet Coke.
(14:20):
Woo!
SPEAKER_01 (14:21):
Oh my gosh.
Oh my God, did you add a lime?
And then it was amazing.
Diet Coke lime is so good.
SPEAKER_00 (14:28):
We we I went through that, and you are you are
correct.
I know that your concern, anddefinitely my concern as I got
more lean is the amount ofenergy that I'm exhibiting.
Um, because you know, when yourun your phone battery on such a
low percent for too long, maybeyour cable's broken or you don't
have a charger and you're sick,you're sitting at like 12%, and
(14:48):
then you're watching it go toeight percent, and you're like,
but I've still got to keep myphone alive because I've got to
text this.
I need to see what emails arecoming in, and literally it's
going down to 6% and 4%.
That's how you're feeling asyou're moving through prep.
You're constantly at a lowbattery level.
So great.
So then I get to the stage,phenomenal season, wonderful
shows.
(15:08):
The whole bit's great.
I finish on November the 8th.
I'm in Vegas, we have a blast,right?
It's warm, it's wonderful.
Get on that plane on that flightback, and we land, and it is
like 32 degrees.
And it's dark.
Boom, right?
I did not think about the factthat I'm finishing this season
(15:32):
in a time where most peoplesuffer from seasonal
effectiveness disorder.
Bingo, I'm that person.
I am that person.
As soon as we change those damnclocks back and the sun starts
setting closer and closer to4:45 in the afternoon.
I'm a mess.
I hate it.
I just don't like it.
I don't thrive in that in thewinter season.
(15:52):
I am not a snow person.
I know a lot of you people outthere are.
God bless you for it.
No, you're all weird.
SPEAKER_01 (15:59):
Yes, I'm not.
Cold is weird.
Nobody that likes the cold isnormal.
I'm sorry.
Goodness.
I said what I said.
I'll fight you over.
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (16:08):
She will she's pretty scrappy, everybody.
She's super scrap.
SPEAKER_01 (16:11):
I said what I said, you're weird.
So mostly I'm just jealous thatI can't tolerate the cold
because I have to be out at itall the time.
It's hateful.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
Yes, I have to have 14 layers on.
My husband looks at me when wego out to just try to have a
fire outside.
He goes, honey, you know it'sonly 46 degrees.
I'm like, Yeah, but you neverknow.
It could change at any moment.
I'm dressing if it's negativetwo.
SPEAKER_01 (16:29):
No, I'm Jenny.
I have been known to put my ummy bib overalls, my car heart,
like to sit out at the fire pit.
I have pictures, I shit you not.
And Eric's like, what the fuck?
I'm like, it's freezing outhere.
He's like, we're at the firepit.
(16:50):
And I'm like, no, I got like 20layers on.
I got my car heart, my like farmpants on, I got like all the
fleece.
Yeah, no, don't forget it.
SPEAKER_00 (16:58):
I did this just last night.
I just last night.
What was it last night?
What was it?
Like 42 degrees.
SPEAKER_01 (17:03):
No, I don't know.
I wouldn't be here.
SPEAKER_00 (17:06):
I put snow pants on top of two other layers of
pants, the clava on, I had ascully on, I had my gloves, I
had two blankets.
No, and prints out in asweatshirt.
SPEAKER_01 (17:17):
I'm like, just leave me alone.
I'll be fine.
Nope.
I just ordered um a heated vest.
Yeah, there you go.
Do whatever you gotta do.
A battery operated heated vestfor myself and for Eric.
SPEAKER_00 (17:29):
It's just such a tough time of year.
Point being, it's a really hardtime of year.
Yes.
It is.
So I did not consider that.
I did not consider that.
And I should because I couldhave planned for it mentally a
little bit better.
So then on top of that, right,you start to eat and you start
to reverse a little bit.
And holy moly, that hungerhormone comes back with this
(17:49):
vengeance.
It literally claws into youwhere you are craving everything
and anything at all hours, andyou really then have to moderate
yourself at that point.
That's that mental disciplinethat we learned through the
reduction phase comes into playon that build part because you
can't eat too much.
We can't gain too fast, youknow.
(18:11):
But because again, now here weare with that hormonal
environment changing.
So it is changing.
And at 50, I'm still getting mycycles as normally as I was
before.
Somehow, I have no idea.
But I'm dealing with that rollercoaster that I'm feeling more so
than I did before with thatestrogen low, estrogen high, and
(18:32):
this and that, and progesteronehere and this and that.
And all of a sudden, I'm lookingoutside and I'm going, is it a
full moon?
What happened?
SPEAKER_01 (18:40):
Yes, and it was a full moon last week, and
everything was really, I don'treally get into that much, but
everything was really fuckingweird last week.
It was, it was that super moonthing last week, and I was like,
What is happening?
The dog was nuts, and I feltlike I was losing my shit.
And I was like, What?
I was like, Oh, it's a fullmoon.
That must be what it is.
SPEAKER_00 (18:59):
Yes, but and I don't really follow that either.
But last week I certainly didbecause I never I had never felt
so low in my life.
And I mean, I used to duringprep because you're feeling
great and because you're eatingso well, I was able to jump out
of bed in the morning and I cando this and this and that,
knowing that I needed to managemy energy level though, because
(19:20):
in the morning it's at itshighest, right?
So I've got to make sure that my7 a.m.
genny, or sometimes you know, my5 a.m.
or 4:30 a.m.
genie needs to still be there at3 p.m.
So you're managing it.
But last week, especially lastweek, um, I couldn't get out of
bed.
I did no motivation to doanything.
(19:40):
I mean, it was so low.
I was like, I have got to go andbrush my teeth.
And I just the thought of doingthat was exhausting.
Like, why who am I gonna seetoday?
Do I really have to go?
I had returns I needed to go do,right?
Like Amazon returns.
Like the normal things that youdo, you gotta go to the UPS
store and drop this off, or yougotta go to the grocery store,
or you just gotta run an errorand drop off dry cleaning.
(20:03):
I'm like, I'll do it tomorrow.
I'll do it tomorrow.
I'll do it tomorrow.
I became the world's worstprocrastinator and just so sad.
And then all of a sudden, you'relistening to something in the
car, maybe it's a song, oryou're at home and you're doing
the dishes and the song comeson, and I'm just I start crying,
just bawling your eyes out.
And I'm a mess.
(20:24):
And then your brain starts toplay tricks on you.
I really started feeling alittle bit of a hopelessness or
worthlessness, is kind of wherethe only way that I can describe
it.
And I started recognizing signsthat I knew were dangerous.
Truly, because your brain can soquickly and easily convince you
that you are less than, thatyour value is not what others
(20:48):
perceive it as or whatnot.
Like you just go down a darkspiral hole.
And I thought, nope, nope, nope,nope, nope.
This is where, and this isreally something important that
I want to tell people, you havegot to seek great medical
guidance.
And I'm saying that in the sensethat don't do it when you're
feeling this way.
You need to put this in yourfreaking plan.
Yeah.
(21:08):
Put this in your plan.
If you're looking to competethis coming up year, right now,
write this down.
Put in your plan that in thatreverse diet, you've got
somebody ready waiting in thewings.
Also, you got to make anappointment with your GP or with
your OB.
Go in and tell themspecifically, I just finished a
bodybuilding show.
You know that I've been doingthis.
I've told you about it before.
I want you to check my hormonelevels.
(21:30):
I want you to check my thyroid.
SPEAKER_02 (21:31):
Take a look at this.
SPEAKER_00 (21:33):
Because you've got to have that support system to
catch you when you fall.
Because it's it's not just aboutlooking in the mirror and going,
oh, I don't have that show bodyanymore or whatever.
That's a piece, but that's asymptom.
You have to look at what's goingon in your endocrine system.
What is happening to you?
Because we're not 30 anymore.
(21:54):
We're not these bikini beautifulgirls in their 20s who are
competing who can bounce back sofast.
SPEAKER_01 (22:02):
And I'll say too, in all fairness, this is hard
regardless of your age.
I mean, even my clients in their20s and 30s struggle.
And yes, I think the older weget, it it just complicates
things more, right?
Um, but we're just complicatedhuman beings because women are
(22:22):
just really super fortunate thatway.
Ha ha.
Um, and so everything you'resaying is true, which is also
why it's so important to havethe support of your coach.
So whether it's your coach or uhyour therapist or your doctor,
your spouse, your whatever, umunderstanding.
(22:43):
I think the first step is reallyan understanding that like this
is just because your brain issaying it doesn't mean it's
true, right?
Our brains like to speak reallyloudly when they're lying.
And so that doesn't mean we haveto believe everything it says.
I have suffered from depressionuh off and on over the years
myself, many times.
I am very, very thankful that Ihave the tools to understand it
(23:07):
when it's there.
It doesn't mean it doesn't suck.
It really sucks to not bemotivated.
I mean, and I don't even like touse the term motivation.
I it's it's not even motivation.
I simply do not want to get outof fucking bed because I don't
see a point, right?
I'm just like, I feel like shit,the world sucks, every it's
cold, it's gray, and there'sjust there's you know, and and
(23:27):
life sucks, and and so what'sthe point?
And so yeah, there is ahopelessness to to to
depression, but having the thetools, first of all,
understanding that this is notactually who you are, it's just
some feelings, that's just yourbrain screaming at you really
loudly, and understanding thatthere is a physiological
response for it a good part ofthe time, right?
(23:49):
So whether it's you know, achemical imbalance, a hormonal
imbalance, a you know, justwhatever the case is, and
understanding that doesn't meanthat you're like fucked up and
broken, and you know, because Ithink the majority of women go
through this at some pointanyway.
Um, and then having having thetools, right?
So being prepared for that andunderstanding it first and
foremost, having support system,and then understanding, you
(24:12):
know, and I think some of thetools that we uh use in in prep.
So one of the benefits to umreally cultivating this
discipline, which is really whatthe beauty of this sport does,
right?
Which is why I think this isbeneficial for anybody to listen
(24:32):
to, right?
So when you have thatdiscipline, you cultivate that
discipline over the course ofyour let me get to the stage,
your cutting phase, or even justsomebody who's regularly going
to the gym now and eatinghealthy, you can use that
discipline to get up out of bedand go brush your teeth and go
return your shit to Amazon,right?
Like it's no, I don't fuckingwant to.
(24:54):
When it's cold outside, I'm notcompeting.
I haven't competed since 2012.
I don't want to get up and gowork out in my garage.
I have a little space, I have aheater in there, warms it up
sometimes, but it sucks and it'sdark and it's cold and I don't
want to.
But I have done this for 30years now, and so I just go and
(25:16):
I do it.
And guess what?
I don't always like it.
I fucking think it sucks most ofthe time.
I don't want to be out there.
I'm bored, I hate my garage gym,I hate the winter, I hate all
the things, but I'm gonna do itanyway because that's a
discipline, right?
So, and so my point being, andI'm not talking about you know,
if if you need to seekprofessional help, seek
(25:38):
professional help.
But one of the beautiful thingsabout this sport, cultivating
discipline in your life andwhatever it is that you're
doing, is that you just get upand go, right?
You still do it, you still putone foot in front of the other.
Whatever your best is today isokay.
I don't care what your best wasyesterday, I don't care what you
think your best might betomorrow.
(25:58):
You give it your best shot fortoday.
And if that best isunrecognizable to you, that's
okay.
Because you at least got up andyou did something.
There have been days I've walkedout into my garage gym and I
just feel so low and so shittythat I'm just like, uh I'm gonna
walk on the treadmill for 10minutes.
That's it.
That's all I got.
And I turn around and I walkback out of my garage gym.
(26:18):
But it did something, right?
Like, was it what I planned todo when I walked out there?
No.
Sometimes my body says, fuckoff.
I don't sometimes I go out theresuper motivated.
My body still says fuck off.
My body's like, nah, we're not,you know, I know your brain says
you're motivated, but we're notmotivated.
And so, you know, it's it'sunderstanding that these are the
things going on.
And so I glad I'm glad thatyou're sharing that about your
(26:40):
own journey because a lot ofcoaches aren't out there sharing
it.
Uh, you know, when I think Italked about this in our last
podcast, but when I wascompeting um a million years
ago, there was no post-showadvice other than you go to the
show with a bag full of junk,you come home to cabinets full
of junk.
The actual advice was, oh, justtake a week off the gym, eat
(27:03):
whatever you want for a week.
Okay.
Literally the dumbest advice onthe planet, right?
And because then you really fuckyourself up because talk about
fucking up your hormones, right?
Like eating too much too fast,putting on too much body fat fat
too fast.
Eric almost ended up in thehospital once with stomach
ulcers because he ate so muchpost-show and it was fall shows.
(27:24):
The other, so the other thingyou didn't mention about the
problem with fall shows, and I'mnot, you know, some people are
perfectly fine with it, but Iknow every single client I've
ever worked with that competedin fall shows struggles with the
same thing.
I'm glad you brought up theseasonal depression, the cold
and dark.
The fucking holidays.
When you come off of a show andyour last show was the Conquer,
wrong one, your last show wasthe Chesapeake Classic.
(27:47):
What you got?
Halloween, Thanksgiving,Christmas.
And you're trying to maintainsome semblance of discipline and
self-control, and your hormonesare fucked up, and it's cold and
dark, and it's all the holidays,and everybody wants to bring you
treats because oh, well, youhaven't had anything for 30
(28:07):
weeks.
Let's go to lunch.
Everybody wants to schedulelunch, everybody wants to
celebrate with you.
Oh, you missed your birthdaytoo.
Everybody wants to celebrateyour birthday with you now, and
so you got to schedule all thesethings, and you want to see all
the people you didn't see, andyou know, all of those things.
And so it's you have to have aplan, right?
To to manage that because youcannot go out to lunch with
(28:29):
every person that invites you inyour first week post-show.
You cannot go on vacation.
I am so sorry to tell peoplethis.
Do not go on your hot girlJamaica vacation in the day that
you come off the stage inOctober because you will go to
this all-inclusive resort andyou will have absolutely no
ability to control yourself, notbecause you're non- not
(28:52):
disciplined, but because yourbrain is gonna scream at you so
loudly that you know you youneed to get your body fat up
really high and you need to doall these things.
You just put yourself in alittle you can eat buffet, and
you're not gonna be able to doit.
And I've seen it, I've seen ittime and time again.
So I always recommend my clientswhen they come off the stage,
(29:15):
give yourself, I think thedanger zone is two to four
weeks.
Give yourself at least two,preferably four before you
schedule a vacation.
Yep.
Sorry, but do it right.
Um, schedule a photo shoot inthere.
That's great.
Helps you kind of stay on tracka little bit, gives you a little
something, something withoutneeding to be stage lean.
(29:35):
You got a little something inbetween, and that just kind of
help you do that.
Um let your friends and familyknow that you appreciate that
they are all there to they wantto celebrate with you and they
want to bring you all the treatsand they want to take you out,
but you've got to have someboundaries, and you have to tell
them, you have to let themunderstand what this is going to
look like for you.
It is not a I just dieted for 30weeks and now I can eat all the
(29:57):
things because you can't.
And the temptation is so fuckinghard.
Nobody is broken, nobody isweak, nobody just can't do it.
Your body is is going to fightyou tooth and nail to put body
fat on.
This is what people need tounderstand is physiology,
biology, neurology.
(30:19):
It's all the ologies, right?
So don't put yourself in aposition to fail, right?
So have that plan.
Talk to your friends and family,talk to your loved ones,
schedule one a week.
You don't need to go out everyday.
Um, you know, the vacationthing.
So all of those things, and andreally just having a
conversation, not only withyourself, but with the people
(30:39):
around you who love you and whatand want to celebrate with you,
that you just can't do that yet,right?
And so you you might have tohave some uncomfortable
conversations because peopledon't understand this world,
yeah.
Um, and then understanding thatthis is what's happening with
yourself, right?
So, how do you so let me askyou, Jenny, since you're going
(30:59):
through it right now, andinstead of from my perspective
and coaching people, what areyou doing to get yourself out of
bed to go return your Amazonpackages?
What are you doing to get out ofbed and go brush your teeth,
right?
Like what is helping you throughthis period now that you
realize, whoops, I'm in it.
What are you doing now?
SPEAKER_00 (31:20):
Yeah, you know, it's um it's interesting.
Uh on the last podcast, I kindof used the analogy, the analogy
of parenting a toddler when wewere talking about how you
negotiate through that cutphase.
Um, now I'm parenting myself theway I would parent my teenager
when she was, well, now she'sstill a teenager, she's a
freshman in college.
(31:40):
But when you're parenting ateenager that is 15 or 16 years
old, that is stuck on theirphone, that's stuck in their
room, and maybe it's a Saturday,and you want to get them out and
about, and they're, you know,kind of like I am that teenager
right now.
Right now.
So I've going back to myparenting analogy, and I have
been having to literally say outloud to myself, you are going to
get up, you lazy moron.
(32:03):
You know, whatever it is thatyou've got to do to motivate
yourself to do.
So it's small goals, right?
Little teeny tiny little babysteps, baby goals.
And it's you get up and you'regonna go to the bathroom and
you're gonna brush your teeth.
And you know what?
You're gonna take a freakingshower.
Yeah, you might have taken onelast night, take another one,
just get in, and then you'regonna put actual clothes on, not
your freaking pajamas thatyou're gonna be in until your
(32:24):
husband gets home at six o'clockand you're wearing exactly what
you wore when you left, right?
It's it's right.
Oops, oops.
I'm not saying that those thingsare all bad things, but I'm
saying that these are the waysto kind of pull yourself out.
So parent yourself through theprocess.
And in this process, I haverealized for me, my future self
(32:45):
that wants to do this again in27, and for my own clients is
helping to build thiscompassionate framework.
You've got to build thispost-show compassionate
framework.
And I've kind of boiled it downto like for the four pillars in
the sense.
Number one, really being thatsupport that we've been talking
about support and connection.
Talk to your family, talk toyour spouse, um, talk to your
(33:07):
children, anyone that's in yourenvironment.
Your coach.
Yeah, of course.
Of course, your coach.
But you want those people thatare in your environment to
understand and know that, hey,listen, I'm going through this.
I'm about to really go throughthis.
This is gonna be kind of tough.
Just be aware if I'm reallyemotional or if I spout off or
whatever it is, this is what'shappening.
But you've got to understand,too, that there's this
(33:28):
biological repair.
And that's kind of that secondpillar that's there.
And that's where that mind screwhits us, right?
Because here we've been stagelean for a blank period of time.
People have commented nonstopabout how phenomenal we're
looking or how phenomenal welooked on stage.
You almost get to a certainpoint, too, where you feel a
little freakish.
At least that was me.
(33:50):
You're so lean, you're soripped, you're so vascular,
right?
Like every muscle's popping out.
And you almost feel a bitfreakish and you almost want to
gain a few pounds to get back.
So all those things.
But you do need to go throughthis biological repair.
So you've got to focus on thoseproteins.
We're talking about those wholefoods, right?
Being smart, not just trashdieting our way back up, not to
(34:11):
hurt ourselves, like what you'resaying that Eric had done.
Um, and then working with thedoctor, right?
Talking to your coach and allthose things.
But then you also have tounderstand that that that third
pillar is that nervous systemreset.
So you're eating for the rightreasons.
You're biologically repairing,you're also repairing that
nervous system.
And here's something I'm I madea big mistake on this year.
(34:33):
I didn't listen to you.
I didn't listen to my coach inthis one aspect.
You kept telling me after mylast show, all right, you gotta
rest.
You gotta rest.
Like, you need to do nothing, oryou need to go out and do some
walks, the mind-body experience,right?
The breath work, sleeping.
And I was like, No, are youkidding me?
(34:54):
I feel like a rock star.
SPEAKER_01 (34:55):
You were like fired up.
I was like, Jenny, you're gonnalike this is all gonna come
crashing down on you at anymoment.
I was like, because you werejust on this like adrenaline
high.
Yes, right.
And you you were your body wasrunning on pure adrenaline
because you had you had zerobody fat.
There was no way that youactually had that kind of
(35:16):
energy, and you were like a 24hour what wait, wait, five-hour
energy drink and a bottle.
SPEAKER_00 (35:25):
I was I I was manic.
Let's just put it out there.
You become manic because as soonas you step off stage and you do
start to add in some of thoseextra calories, those extra
calories go straight to yourenergy level, which boosts that
adrenaline even further, and youfeel like a freaking rock star.
And I didn't listen though, Ishould have future parented
(35:46):
myself, right?
With that plan and gone, expectto feel fantastic, but know that
you've got to slow it down, calmdown.
And I didn't, and because Ididn't, I crashed so bloody
hard, so hard.
And it was so sad for me.
Um and it was sad for mypartner.
(36:07):
I mean, Britt was looking at melike, what is wrong with you?
You know, and even though hecompetes too and he understands
it, men don't go through thesame hormonal changes that we do
in the adaptations, they don't,right?
So they're wonderful listeners,our husbands, but they don't
understand it.
And I keep trying to explain itto him, like it feels like and
you can't, your partner can'tunderstand it still.
So that was the biggest thingfor me was the nervous system
(36:30):
reset.
It's biology, yeah, but yourbrain has to reset.
So future parent yourself.
And then that last pillar for menow I'm understanding is
understanding the identity andkind of doing that body image
work.
And this is something I thinksomebody may have mentioned is
like, please talk about this.
How do you deal with the factthat your body's changing so
much?
There's a wonderful competitorthat we both saw win the she was
(36:53):
a physique champion, Yorton, OCBChesapeake classic, Kristen
Frey.
I'm a huge, huge, huge, huge,huge fan of hers.
And she was the one who, in onecomment that I had made on a
post, said, I'm focusing on myPRs, baby.
I'm getting back in that gym andI'm eating to fuel up so I can
regain some of that muscle thatyou know gets catabolized during
the point of cut, but also likebuild, build, build.
(37:16):
So she showed me just in hersimple, sweet comment, oh my
gosh, I need to focus now ongoing, listen, your job is done,
stage is done.
Now let's get some of thatbeautiful weight on because we
need it.
We need those fat, we need thatcarb, we need it to push further
so we can really continuerecomposing and building.
(37:37):
And that changed my mindsetbecause it was who am I beyond
my stage photos?
SPEAKER_01 (37:43):
Who am I?
Well, that's okay.
So we have to come back to thebasics that this is called
bodybuilding for a reason.
This is not a dietingcompetition.
Yes, it is about aesthetics onstage, but you don't get
aesthetics without buildingmuscle.
It is what it is, right?
And so we don't get to buildmuscle without body fat, we
don't get to build muscle whilewe stay stage lean all year
(38:03):
long.
This is not about being lean,except on the day of the show.
This is a sport, and I I havesaid this in so many podcasts
before.
This is something that um I knowBrandy and I have talked about
ad nauseum.
A lot of people go into thiswith the wrong mindset and it is
and it's all about looks.
If you're an a true athlete andyou're in the sport for the
(38:27):
right reasons, you're not justdoing it for the aesthetics,
right?
And so, in order to makeyourself a better athlete, if I
was running a marathon and Ijust came off my marathon season
and I just decided to stoprunning, right?
Or I didn't fuel myself, or Ididn't try to improve my run,
then what's the fucking point?
What is the point, right?
(38:48):
Like it it's it's no differentin terms of the sport.
This sport requires you to havebody fat.
It requires you to put onmuscle.
And so if you want to be anathlete in the sport, you must
do those things.
As a natural athlete, I amtalking about natural athletes.
If you're takingperformance-enhancing drugs, you
(39:10):
can throw all everything I justsaid out the window, stay lean
all year long.
I don't fucking care.
Right?
You're killing yourself anyway.
That's a whole nother topic.
Um, but if you you have to havethat mindset, and so you have to
get out of the the mindset thatmy visual is constantly get
(39:32):
leaner, get leaner, get leaner,get leaner.
And now we have just have tochange the narrative to my
mindset is I gotta put some bodyfat back on, I gotta fuel my
training, I gotta get stronger,right?
So you have to start chasingPRs.
I even have, I even recommend alot of my clients come up with
some other athletic goal postshow so that they are no longer
(39:55):
looking at themselves in themirror constantly, like, what
does my body look like?
Let's chase some other athleticgoal.
You want to go do a CrossFitcompetition, go to a CrossFit
competition.
I love my clients coming off ofbodybuilding shows and going
into powerlifting.
It is one of the most amazingthings that you can do, right?
Because suddenly it is about thePR, right?
It is about how strong you are,and you've got to fucking feed
(40:16):
yourself if you want to dopowerlifting, right?
And so I have several clientswho have gone and you know, and
I'm not saying you got to dothat forever, but it is a great
way to give yourself a newathlete.
You want to go run a 5k?
Yeah, running's not really mything, and it's not super
conducive to bodybuilding, butyou gotta have some other goal
that takes your mind off of whatdo I look like and puts it back
(40:38):
into performance as an athlete,right?
So chase the PRs, get stronger,go do some powerlifting, do some
crossfit, do do whatever, right?
But you gotta have something.
Um, you also have to think aboutlike you really just you gotta
give your brain time to reset.
So to your point, but on onanother note, in terms of like
(41:02):
the neurology that comes intoit, right?
The psyche.
And so I have you just looked atyourself for 30 weeks straight
in the mirror with a the visualof new new veins, get leaner,
new ab, new what right?
Like I'm leaner, lean, lean,lean, lean, lean, lean.
It's gonna take your brain awhile to understand that looking
(41:23):
at your body now is different,right?
So your brain wants to keeplooking for leaner, leaner,
leaner.
And so your brain is focused onthat.
So it's just gonna take it'slike adjusting your eyes to the
dark, right?
You get into a dark room, youcan't see shit, but if you're
standing there for long enough,you're gonna be able to see a
little bit of what's going on.
So you just have to give yourbrain some time to go, oh, okay.
(41:45):
Like I to get used to what youlook like again, right?
And so it's it's okay to havethe feeling of like watching
your body get softer.
It's okay to feel a littleshitty about that.
Like, I mean, it sucks, right?
Like sometimes it just sucks.
But you have to change thenarrative, and this takes as
much practice and repetition asit does going to the gym, right?
(42:11):
So these aren't the this is whenbecause neuroscience is like
really where I geek out and lovethings.
But if you really understand howour how our brains work, we just
spent all this time making thisneuroscircuit in our brains.
It's like lean, lean, lean, lookat how lean I am.
Well, you gotta we gotta give itsome time to like create a new
(42:33):
circuit, right?
And so you have to give yourselfsome grace and you have to tell
yourself, no, putting on thisbody fat is good.
Putting on this body fat isgood.
Look how strong I'm getting.
Yes, I'm getting softer, butman, look, I I I'm PR ing and
you have to keep tellingyourself those things because
you just spent 30 weeks tellingyourself how lean you were and
how amazing you were.
Now you got to tell yourselfsomething else, and so you got
(42:55):
to build a different story, andyou got and it's just gonna take
some time.
And it's I we talked about thisin the last podcast.
I said it's like my Grand Canyonreference, right?
Like you've just got to, it'sgonna feel stupid, right?
Because you're looking in themirror and you're like, no, I
don't like this extra belly fat.
This fucking sucks.
No, I don't like the cellulitethat's coming back in my ass.
Nobody wants that, nobody likesit, but you gotta look at
(43:18):
yourself and tell yourself adifferent story because it's not
bad, right?
It's like it just is so you justhave to say, This is what it is,
this is who I am, and now I'mchasing these PRs.
And who fucking cares if youhave cellulite on your ass,
right?
Like nobody cares if you'restrong as fuck, right?
Yeah, nobody cares.
Do I care if you have celluliteon your ass on stage?
(43:39):
Yeah, as a judge, you probablyshouldn't, right?
But that's not what we're doinghere.
So that doesn't matter rightnow.
It does not matter that you havesome cellulite on your ass.
It does not matter that yourtricep gets a little jiggly.
No, it doesn't matter.
You gotta get strong, you gottafuel yourself, you gotta be give
(44:00):
yourself some grace.
Um, that's my but you have tochange, right?
You can't just give yourselfgrace, you have to change the
narrative.
Because otherwise, if you ifnothing changes, nothing
changes, and then you're justgonna keep spiraling in this
right, and then then all you cando is give yourself grace
because all you're doing is inthis, like, I suck, okay.
(44:22):
Well, I'll give myself grace.
Okay, I suck, okay.
Well, I'll give myself grace.
Well, that's not helpful, right?
So giving yourself grace ischanging that narrative, right?
It's like, no, no, no, no, no.
Like, let's go over here.
You're not beating yourself upover it, but you're able to kind
of go in and and and start tochange so that it doesn't feel
so painful to look in the mirrorall the time.
SPEAKER_00 (44:42):
Yeah, you have to give, you know, you got to be
respectful of yourself.
You need to have respectfulself-talk.
I mean, think about how hard weare on ourselves as human
beings.
We would never say the things toother people that we say to
ourselves.
SPEAKER_01 (44:55):
Do you remember the um thing we did in the retreat?
Do you remember the the doveself self-talk um video that we
show in the retreat?
And I don't know if you were atthe retreat where we did this
particular exercise, but we hadwe did this for our first couple
of retreats.
We had everybody write down alltheir negative thoughts in a
(45:17):
week, right?
And so we had them on littlepieces of paper.
And you know, I always like tosay, I'm ugly, I'm fat, I'm bad
mom, like nobody loves me,whatever.
Those are the the recurringnarratives that women like to
tell themselves.
And so we put them all in alittle jar and we put teamed
people up, and you would pickone out of a jar and you would
tell the person in front of themthat they were fat, and you
(45:39):
would tell the person in frontof them that that you were ugly,
whatever you pulled out of thejar, and then you would go, and
then we would talk about likewhat does that I don't I get
chills even like saying that.
Like, if I could ever look atsomebody in the face and say,
Man, you really got fatpost-show.
And you know, some assholes outthere, I'm probably gonna say
(46:00):
it, but you have to be your ownbest friend, that's the point,
right?
So you cannot talk to yourselfany differently than you would
talk to your friend, right?
So if you wouldn't say it toyour best friend, you have to
get in the habit of, I can't sayit to myself because we are our
own worst enemy.
And so you have to be your ownbest friend.
(46:20):
So that is the giving yourselfgrace, that is the you know,
compassion, radical acceptance,all the little terms I could
throw on top of it, right?
You have to to get there, but itdoesn't come without practice.
And so if your normal narrativeis I'm fat, I'm not good enough,
I suck, that's always going tobe your narrative.
And your body will believe it,and your brain will believe it,
(46:42):
and your brain will scream it atyou because it's really used to
saying that, it's reallycomfortable for it to say, and
so until you actually just sostart change it to something
else, like no, like you justhave to say, No, I don't believe
you.
This is not what we're doinguntil and until you do believe
it.
SPEAKER_00 (47:01):
Yeah, and that that's why I go back for me as
the analogy of parenting myself,because you know, you you want
to say when you look in themirror, I'm disgusting, I'm
disgusting, and you have tochange that.
And so no, your body'srecovering from something really
extreme.
Yeah, and so I think about thatagain.
Like I've got a beautifulteenage daughter, and of course,
she suffers from body imageissues like every other teenage
(47:22):
girl does, and even teenage boysdo.
Of course, it's totally natural.
But my goodness, if you thinkabout what you would want to say
to your kid, right, yourdaughter, that and you're
looking at your own self andyour own body, think about that.
Think about your body assomething separate and apart
from you, um, as this wonderful,God-created, organic figure, and
(47:46):
think about treating it the sameway that you would the greatest
gift you've ever had in yourlife, which is your kid.
SPEAKER_01 (47:52):
Unless you're a shitty parent, like mine were
and said really shitty things toyour parent.
Don't do that.
Sure.
Well, yeah, and listen, I'm withyou on that.
Okay, and say do that.
I'm still on the kind of parentyou are.
Be the kind of parent you'resupposed to be, be the kind of
parent you had.
Exactly, exactly, exactly.
Be the parent you wish you had,be the parent wish you had.
Don't go out and pick your owntree limb that you can whip
(48:14):
yourself with because nobodyneeds that.
SPEAKER_00 (48:16):
Don't be that parent.
Right or grow up with a lot ofissues with insecurity and
self-confidence, like like me,right?
I I was absolutely 100% that.
So I do pay close attention withmy own daughter.
Like, you know, I really want totreat her with all the love and
(48:36):
respect and help her treatherself with all that love and
respect.
And that goes right back to usand our own bodies.
Exactly.
So I I almost, and this is kindof sound a little weird, sort of
disassociate.
I treat my body as something alittle bit separate.
Yes, it's me, but I'm trying totreat it and look at it and give
it that the care and concern andlove that it needs, which is
giving my brain the care andconcern and love that it needs.
(49:00):
So you you you have to look atit that way.
You've got to give yourself somepositive self-talk and go
through it.
Think about it this way (49:05):
when you became pregnant, okay, you
had this little being growing inyou, and your body starts to
change, and you're hungry, andyou're so excited.
And whatever that craving wasthat you had, like mine was
chicken salad sandwiches oncroissant.
That was my my thing.
SPEAKER_01 (49:19):
Mine was mashed potatoes and marshmallows, which
is why I looked like mashedpotatoes and marshmallows by the
time I gave birth.
50 pounds, 50 pounds of mashedpotatoes and marshmallows,
Jenny.
SPEAKER_00 (49:30):
The weird thing, the weird thing, like I also
eventually had a craving of theWendy's frosties and dipping my
French fries in it or my peanutbutter and jelly sandwiches.
But the point is, you're growingthis little human being, and
your body is growing along withit, and you're eating and you're
eating, but you're not shamed byit because you're growing this
incredible human being.
And then nine months later,funny how that's pretty close to
(49:51):
what a prep cut could be, right?
Right, nine months later, youend up having this gorgeous
being, and you're left with abody that's very, very, very
different.
And you can work on it, and it'snever necessarily going to come
back to exactly what it was pre.
And you're gonna have someadditions, you're gonna have
those stretch marks and thingsof that sort.
And you may look at them in acertain way, but a lot of us
(50:12):
would look at it as a sense ofpride.
For me, I did.
I'm like, I love every stretchmark that I have because I love
my kid.
And there's so you treat yourbody and your brain differently
because of having a child.
So as you get older and asyou're going through some of
these changes, as you get, youknow, into bodybuilding and
you're you're going throughanother extreme.
(50:33):
Your body's going throughanother extreme.
You're not having a baby, butwhat are you birthing at the
end?
And what you end up with is areally resilient mindset.
You get with this a suretywithin your confidence, not just
based on how you look, butbecause of building that muscle
and building that strength andbuilding that mental resilience,
(50:53):
you've all of a sudden come outwith an incredible sense of
confidence you never thoughtthat you could ever have before.
So you've birthed a new versionof yourself.
SPEAKER_01 (51:04):
I'm loving all your child references.
I base it on experience.
I love, I think, well, I thinkit's a great way, it's a it's a
great new way for people to lookat things, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (51:14):
I that's my goal.
That's what I want.
Think about all the women thatyou meet that you now currently
coach, whether it's a livestockclient or a competition client,
and all the freaking baggagethat everybody, all of us come
with.
Oh, yeah, and how we have towork through that.
So this is a transformation,even if it's not a
transformation show, let's sayper se, but we are going through
(51:36):
that transformation.
So we are reversing out ofentering into and reversing out
of.
You need to look at this as anentire full-fledged journey, and
that what you're doing isdeveloping a better you.
It's not gonna always be abetter physical complete
completely.
Yeah, like you don't look atthat as your value, it's the
package.
What's the package?
SPEAKER_01 (51:56):
Yeah, and I I know that we said we were gonna keep
this to 30 minutes, which wehave already not done.
Um, so sorry everybody.
Um, so I the last couple thingsI'll add to because I think we
covered everything, but really,you know, in the reverse diet,
your body's gonna crave junk andyou're gonna think you can have
the junk, and it's not it's okayto have the occasional junk.
(52:18):
I think we even talked aboutthis in the last podcast a
little bit, but the more youcontinue to just eat the same
foods that you ate pre-prep inlarger quantities, the less the
cravings will be, right?
So the more you eat junk, youknow, the food, uh highly
palatable foods are actuallyengineered to make us want more,
right?
That's why I can't eat one Oreoor one Dorito.
(52:40):
Like it's not a thing, right?
So um, the less you eat thosethings, the less you will crave
those things.
And so that you want to kind ofjust eat more of what you've
always been eating.
Add a little variety, but don'tgo mixing it all up, trying to
eat all the things.
That's just gonna wayovercomplicate your life and
make you feel uh it's gonna be awhole lot harder.
Um, and then the whole entire,you know, the the reverse
(53:03):
process in terms of, you know,there's a really good study out
there.
I'll see if I can put it in theshow notes.
Um, and I loved it.
Granted, it was done on menbecause just about all of these
things are done on men.
Women are really hard to studybecause of our hormones and
getting anything.
Um, so it is what it is.
But um, it was a really greatstudy.
So this natural bodybuilder, Ithink it was actually Andrew
Pardue.
This was years ago.
And so he did all of his uhhormonal markers before he
(53:25):
started prep.
He did them at his absoluteleanest, and then um he did them
again when he was at the thesame weight and body fat that he
was when he first had his uhhormones tested.
Expecting the hypothesis waswhen he reached the same body
fat, his hormones would berecovered.
(53:47):
And that is not what happened.
And so while he had was at thelevel of body fat he had been
when he first tested his hishormonal markers, it was not the
case.
So just getting back to thatbody fat level does not mean
you're hormonally recovered.
It can actually take a whole lotlonger than what you think it
(54:07):
might take.
And I think in his case, itended up, I'm I'm throwing these
numbers out there.
I think he had them likeretested around like six months,
but I think it ended up beingsomething like nine to 12 months
later that his hormones wereactually back at the same levels
as testosterone and things likethat that they had been
pre-prep.
So it doesn't always equate.
And so it's not a quick process.
(54:28):
Um, just getting your cycle backdoesn't necessarily mean that, I
mean, it's a good indicator, butit doesn't necessarily mean that
everything's fully recovered.
And so the whole point of likereverse dieting, recovery
dieting, whatever you want tocall it, is to not just get your
hormones back, you know, ontrack, but it is also to recover
(54:48):
mentally, physically,financially, um, socially, um,
all those things, right?
Which is why a three-month offseason is not a thing.
And we can talk about that onanother podcast.
Goodness.
Um, and it's also not an offseason.
It's a growth season, it'simprovement season.
We don't call it bulking.
I don't call it off becausewe're not taking off.
We're also not bulking.
(55:09):
We're not like fucking um, Idon't know, what's we're not
trash.
It's bulk.
Um, those are just like quicklittle things, and we can
certainly get into those, likethe technical things in more
detail.
But I think we kind of coveredthe the gist of really what um
what a post-show looks like, howhard it is, um all the different
(55:32):
things you might go through, andreally how to um manage it,
right?
I mean, in in in whatever wayyou can find to do so without
look completely losing yourshit.
Um so yeah, so is there anythingelse you want to add before we
hop off since we went longerthan 30 minutes?
Sorry to your sorry to tell yourfriend I said I'm sorry.
(55:54):
Oh, no, no, no.
Sorry, friend, you said that ourpodcast was too long.
SPEAKER_00 (55:58):
It's all good.
No, it's all good.
I think we just close it outjust by saying to everybody that
you know your value is notmeasured in your body fat
percentage, right?
You are allowed to change yourgoals, you've got to protect
your mental health, yeah, andyour midlife can be strong and
it can be beautiful withouthaving to be completely extreme.
So just even with cellulite onyour ass, and even with it.
(56:22):
So just love yourself, loveyourself, and just reach out to
us if you're struggling becausethat just means you need a
better coach.
SPEAKER_01 (56:29):
Yes, friends, yes.
Well, thank you, Jenny, forsharing your struggles.
I think it helps other people toum to understand, right?
Like, really, the biggest thingis community and and knowing
you're not crazy, you're notalone, you're not broken, you're
not weak, you're notundisciplined, you're not like
your body is literally liketelling you to fuck off.
(56:50):
And evolution says we need toeat and we need to do it right
now, right?
Like we didn't get this far inlife without that happening.
Um, so understanding thosethings helps a little bit.
Um, but yeah, I mean, the mostimportant thing is to do you
remember that don't get weird.
Use your head, it'll all beokay.
(57:11):
It will all be okay, and thenwe'll say, bye.
unknown (57:14):
Bye.
Hello, hello, and welcome to Coaching and
Cocktails the podcast.
And I'm Tina, and you are.
I am Jenny.
Hello.
So now we can actually introduceourselves.
Jenny is officially my newco-host.
Um I do want to addresssomething because um Brandy is
(00:44):
still alive.
I did have some questions.
I think even Brandy was like,was there ever any explanation
about where I went?
Or did people just like thinkI'm dead?
And I was like, I said, no,anytime anybody has asked,
right?
I'm just like, no, she had, Imean, her kids are like
teenagers now, they're superactive in soccer and
(01:06):
cheerleading and like all ofthese things.
And and really, Brandy just hadto take time away from doing all
of this stuff so she could gofocus on her family stuff, which
you know, I absolutely so she'sstill here.
Brandy and I are still besties.
Like, I we did not have afalling out.
We are we are still we stillemail each other daily.
(01:26):
She was just like, Hey, doesanybody know what happened to
me?
That's great.
I was like, Oh no, I don't thinkwe ever explained that.
So anyway, we love you, Brandy.
We love you.
If you're listening or any ofBrandy's friends are listening,
so we didn't mean to just makeit seem like she just went poof
and she was gone.
Um, so anyway, so Ginny and Iare gonna try to pick up the
(01:47):
where where we left off a littlebit.
And I told Jinny she couldsurprise me with whatever topic
she wanted to talk about todaybecause I was just too tired
yesterday to read through theemail on the topics.
I uh I yeah.
So um, why do you want to talkabout?
SPEAKER_00 (02:03):
So today I really want to talk about reverse
dieting and just thatunglamorous side of bodybuilding
and getting to the stage.
It's about what happens afterand kind of just you know, the
the not so pretty part um toreally help ladies, especially
those that are in the midlife,you know, in their 40s and 50s.
Like I'm 50 and I started thispretty late in my life at 46.
(02:23):
There's a lot of ladies outthere that compete that are in
their 20s or 30s and whatnot,which is awesome.
Um, but for those of us that areapproaching sort of that end of
child end of life, end of life,end of children, we're we're on
our way, we're crusty, we're onthe downhill spiral, okay, the
end of life as we know it.
(02:44):
End of life, but you know, it'sit's it's that post-show blues,
and I don't think it's talkedabout enough, and I just want to
talk about that today, yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (02:51):
And you know, for people who aren't in
bodybuilding or have shittycoaches that don't actually tell
them anything about reversedieting, and really reverse
dieting applies to everybody.
This isn't just a bodybuildingthing, although it's way less
extreme if you're somebody who'sin like a training and uh just a
typical kind of training cycle.
But um, I call it recovery andreverse dieting because I think
(03:14):
it's it's both.
And so um, really, it'sbasically the process of coming
out of for people who don'tknow, right?
So you diet down, you lose allthe body fat, and you spend all
these weeks lowering caloriesand increasing cardio and all
the things that you got to do sothat you have this really nice
lean physique and you get onstage, and then after you get
off stage, you have to veryslowly bring that back up,
(03:37):
right?
So you have to slowly put bodyfat on.
Some people do it faster thanothers, right?
Um, but I there there really isthis like recovery and reverse
phase.
And um, I forget what there wasanother, there was another coach
out there that sort of startreally started uh coining the
the recovery term.
And because there is this likecouple week period of time
(03:59):
where, in my opinion, like youwe can't go too slow with re
with bringing calories back upbecause then you're just
dragging on all the shittythings that happen to your body
when the body fat was reallylow.
So you kind of have this burstof calories, you get this
recovery, you start to feel alittle bit better, and then you
start slowly sort of reversing.
And I I like to I like to sortof combine the two.
(04:23):
Um, but you're right, but that'swhat it is, right?
You gotta you gotta go low toget into a show, and then you
gotta bring them back, you gottabring your calories back up and
your cardio back down and all ofthose things.
But it's the worst part of theentire process.
It's absolutely the biggest mindfuck you would ever imagine, and
nobody knows it until they're init, and everybody thinks they're
(04:44):
gonna be fine.
I've had clients thatbeautifully got to stage, never
had a slip-up and never had abinge, and never ate a cookie,
and everything was amazing.
We thought everything was gonnabe great when they came off
stage and then they lost theirshit, right?
And so um you don't know ituntil you're in it, but it
really is truly the hardest partof the entire process, and
nobody will understand it unlessyou're in it.
(05:07):
Um, because you don't have ashow on the horizon anymore,
right?
It's real easy in air quotes.
I like to use a lot of airquotes.
It's really easy to stick toyour diet when the show is X
number of weeks away and yougotta get your fat ass into this
little ity bitty bikini, right?
In front of a bunch of people.
And so after the show, you'relike, well, fuck it.
(05:29):
I'm not getting on stage againfor two years or whatever.
It's hard.
It's so much harder, right?
And and then obviously umgetting um getting into, I just
said, I don't want to talk thatmuch about science, but getting
into the what happens in yourbody um getting really lean for
(05:52):
stage, right?
So everything, everything getsreally fucked up, right?
Your hormones are fucked upgoing into the stage, um, your
body fat controls likeeverything using that term
loosely, right?
And so when you have really lowor really too high body fat,
like the rest of your bodysystems get out of whack.
And so when you're coming offstage from an evolutionary
(06:16):
perspective, our bodies are waysmarter than we are.
Um and if you ever want tolisten to a really good book
about this, um shit, I justforgot the name of it.
The hungry brain is one.
But that one's really good.
That gives you a lot ofinformation about what we're
talking about here.
And there's another one, andI'll figure it out and I'll put
it in the podcast notes.
(06:36):
But um from an evolutionaryperspective, our bodies do not
want us to be eight percent bodyfat.
Isn't that what you were, Jenny?
Eight, yeah, ten, something.
Um, your body is like right now,because you're you're probably
kind of out of the actualreverse phase and you're still
there, we're working to get yourecovered, but um your body's
like, fuck this and fuck you.
(06:57):
I can't survive this way, right?
Like this is this is dumb.
I don't know why you did this.
And so the only way for me tosurvive is to like put this body
fat on, like, like right now,right now, because we're gonna
die if I don't.
I mean, that's that's just howour bodies feel.
And so it is going to tell youyou're hungry no matter how much
you've eaten.
It's going to crave things thatyou would probably never in a
(07:20):
million years have even eaten inthe first place, um, because it
just wants, once, wants fuelbecause it really truly needs to
feel like you're not starving itanymore, right?
And it really, really wants tosurvive because that's our
body's only our brain and ourbody, it only cares about
survival and reproduction.
Like it does not care how welook or feel, for that matter.
SPEAKER_00 (07:42):
That's exactly right.
And and on the reproductiveaspect, as you get older and
your reproductive system beginsto change, right?
It's your your hormones arechanging within your body.
You have to understand thatendocrine system within you and
and how it's responding.
Because when you're going intobodybuilding in any kind of an
extreme sport where you'rehaving to restrict your calories
(08:04):
and really play with food,especially playing with body
fat, your brain is adapting tonew hormone environments.
And I say that with a pluralbecause it's going on its own
journey and you have to payattention to it.
And the symptoms of some of thatenvironmental change are your
moods, right?
And your energy level and yoursleep cycle and your menstrual
(08:27):
cycle, all of those things,right?
So you have to listen to thosethings because those are really
symptom symptoms, right, of thatenvironmental change.
And with estrogen, especially aswe get older, you know, the fat
our fat tissue contains anenzyme that converts
testosterone into estrogen.
So fat, we've got to have it.
We have to have this fat aswomen.
(08:47):
And then especially when you'regoing into peri menopause and
then full-blown menopause, fatbecomes a more important source
of that estrogen.
So more body fat equals moreestrogen, less body fat equals
very low estrogen.
So, you know, here we are, andlike with my journey, here I am
at 46 years old.
I guess it wasn't much my firstcompeting year.
(09:08):
So I went through four totalseasons of this, and now it's
taking me this fourth season toreally understand and see this.
I have to, when I go intoanother bodybuilding competition
season, plan not just to thestage date.
I have to plan completely after,not a week after, not two weeks
after.
I got to plan for whatevermonths after, because our bodies
(09:30):
are going to recover in the waythat they feel like recovering,
you know, at the pace thatthey're going to recover.
And this particular year, I'vehurt more.
And I'm saying hurt meaningmentally more than I have in
previous.
And I think it's reallyimportant.
I want to talk about it.
I want to share with people thatjust what you said earlier, the
hardest part of my entire prepthis year, which I thought was
(09:51):
going to be that long 30-weekcut was not.
The hardest part has been thelast 34 days.
The last 34 days since I laststepped off stage.
Um, and here's here's some ofthe things that I I wanted to
tell people about because it'snot glamours, it's not what you
put on IG.
I'm not posting these fabulouspictures of me anymore on.
SPEAKER_01 (10:11):
No, because nobody wants to put the everybody's
like, oh, look how lean I am asin the last 30 weeks as you got
leaner and leaner.
Nobody's like, oh, look howchunky I've gotten again.
I mean, you're not, but nobody,nobody talks about it because
it's just not the fun thing toput out their own social media,
right?
And obviously, which is part ofthe problem.
Yeah.
(10:31):
Um hundred percent.
The dog is biting me in thebutt.
Oh, that's sorry.
So sorry, so sorry, everybody.
She's literally it's calledcobbing.
Did you did you know that pitbulls do this thing called
cobbing?
I know as an aside, I didn'tknow that it was a thing.
I've had pit bulls before, butit's called cobbing and they
(10:52):
nibble and they do like they dothis, and it seems very cute.
It's like a mutual groominguntil the this I'm doing this
little tiny little nibblebecomes like, and then you're
like, okay, anyways.
Now she's doing bites.
Now she's doing zoomies in myoffice.
Okay, sorry.
So, what are you going throughright now?
Why don't you tell telleverybody what's going on in
your in your mind and your bodyright now?
SPEAKER_00 (11:13):
No, absolutely, because it it's I really want to
talk about depression.
I want to talk about thesethings.
They have to be discussed.
So here's one thing that Ididn't think about this year.
This is the first season that Iactually competed in the fall,
as opposed to competing in thespring.
So, what that means to peoplewho aren't familiar with
competing is that if I competein the spring, I'm usually
aiming for, let's say, some ofmy favorite shows that are in
(11:35):
May.
I got to give a big shout out tothe OCB Conquer and Frank
Meekins and Aaron Meekinsbecause I think they're
phenomenal spring showpromoters.
But that's a show that I loveddoing and happily won in 24.
So it was awesome.
But I would cut, I would startcutting for that show the very
beginning of January, rightafter New Year, right?
Have your big last big hurrah,the whole bit, and then start
(11:55):
cutting.
Great.
When you're done in the spring,you've got that summer, and
you've got those beautiful longsummer days full of vitamin D
with that sun shining.
So I felt fantastic coming offof that.
And I was able to go and enjoymy party summer with a
phenomenal physique at thatpoint, right?
Sure, you reverse, sure youthicken up a little bit, sure
(12:17):
some of the cuts go away.
Fine, but you're still in greatswimsuit condition, right?
Wonderful.
I loved it.
This season I decided I reallywant to hit those powerful fall
shows.
I want to do the OCB Chesapeakeclassic.
Bobby Cabino is a phenomenalshow promoter.
I wanted to hit York and Cup.
We love Marjorie and Sully, butI needed to start cutting during
(12:39):
my hot girl summer, right?
So you start cutting.
I got off a wonderful springbreak cruise with my great kid,
my husband, and I started May1st.
Okay.
I went through the whole summer.
Yeah, that sucked.
You miss out on a lot ofconcerts and birthdays and
events and things.
SPEAKER_01 (12:57):
I didn't see you missing out on shit.
So I saw you still partying, andyou no, I know you weren't
partying.
I'm again with my air quotes.
Nobody sees my air quotes, so Ishould probably stop using them.
I I if you you may or notremember this, but I was like,
hey, like to and I know youweren't out drinking or doing
anything like that, but you weregoing out a lot.
And I was like, this might bestarting to be a time where you
(13:20):
don't go out so much.
Yes.
Not because I thought you werebeing tempted, but because I'm
like, we really need to preserveyour energy.
And I think I was only, youknow, giving you that advice
because I think your check-inswere talking about, you know,
being tired and all that, youknow, all the things that you
were doing.
And if you were so close to theshows, and I was like, Jenny, we
got a really long prep to dohere.
(13:40):
Like, you really might want tonot do so many social events.
And I actually say that to a lotof clients.
I'm not telling everybody theyneed to hibernate and never go
out anywhere.
But my point is, I don'tactually think you missed.
No, I mean, I think you got apretty active social life, even
in prep.
Well, we tried.
We did, we didn't try.
SPEAKER_00 (14:00):
Because you're right.
I mean, you're right, you'reright.
Uh normally our summers wouldhave been more packed and more
things, you know, like going tomy beach and then doing this
extended trip over an ocean cityand like this and that.
We didn't do that.
Yeah.
We still attended events.
I still went to certainconcerts.
We drank the water, you know, inthe back in the courtroom.
Like, I don't have a water.
Maybe I'll have a Diet Coke.
(14:20):
Woo!
SPEAKER_01 (14:21):
Oh my gosh.
Oh my God, did you add a lime?
And then it was amazing.
Diet Coke lime is so good.
SPEAKER_00 (14:28):
We we I went through that, and you are you are
correct.
I know that your concern, anddefinitely my concern as I got
more lean is the amount ofenergy that I'm exhibiting.
Um, because you know, when yourun your phone battery on such a
low percent for too long, maybeyour cable's broken or you don't
have a charger and you're sick,you're sitting at like 12%, and
(14:48):
then you're watching it go toeight percent, and you're like,
but I've still got to keep myphone alive because I've got to
text this.
I need to see what emails arecoming in, and literally it's
going down to 6% and 4%.
That's how you're feeling asyou're moving through prep.
You're constantly at a lowbattery level.
So great.
So then I get to the stage,phenomenal season, wonderful
shows.
(15:08):
The whole bit's great.
I finish on November the 8th.
I'm in Vegas, we have a blast,right?
It's warm, it's wonderful.
Get on that plane on that flightback, and we land, and it is
like 32 degrees.
And it's dark.
Boom, right?
I did not think about the factthat I'm finishing this season
(15:32):
in a time where most peoplesuffer from seasonal
effectiveness disorder.
Bingo, I'm that person.
I am that person.
As soon as we change those damnclocks back and the sun starts
setting closer and closer to4:45 in the afternoon.
I'm a mess.
I hate it.
I just don't like it.
I don't thrive in that in thewinter season.
(15:52):
I am not a snow person.
I know a lot of you people outthere are.
God bless you for it.
No, you're all weird.
SPEAKER_01 (15:59):
Yes, I'm not.
Cold is weird.
Nobody that likes the cold isnormal.
I'm sorry.
Goodness.
I said what I said.
I'll fight you over.
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (16:08):
She will she's pretty scrappy, everybody.
She's super scrap.
SPEAKER_01 (16:11):
I said what I said, you're weird.
So mostly I'm just jealous thatI can't tolerate the cold
because I have to be out at itall the time.
It's hateful.
SPEAKER_00 (16:19):
Yes, I have to have 14 layers on.
My husband looks at me when wego out to just try to have a
fire outside.
He goes, honey, you know it'sonly 46 degrees.
I'm like, Yeah, but you neverknow.
It could change at any moment.
I'm dressing if it's negativetwo.
SPEAKER_01 (16:29):
No, I'm Jenny.
I have been known to put my ummy bib overalls, my car heart,
like to sit out at the fire pit.
I have pictures, I shit you not.
And Eric's like, what the fuck?
I'm like, it's freezing outhere.
He's like, we're at the firepit.
(16:50):
And I'm like, no, I got like 20layers on.
I got my car heart, my like farmpants on, I got like all the
fleece.
Yeah, no, don't forget it.
SPEAKER_00 (16:58):
I did this just last night.
I just last night.
What was it last night?
What was it?
Like 42 degrees.
SPEAKER_01 (17:03):
No, I don't know.
I wouldn't be here.
SPEAKER_00 (17:06):
I put snow pants on top of two other layers of
pants, the clava on, I had ascully on, I had my gloves, I
had two blankets.
No, and prints out in asweatshirt.
SPEAKER_01 (17:17):
I'm like, just leave me alone.
I'll be fine.
Nope.
I just ordered um a heated vest.
Yeah, there you go.
Do whatever you gotta do.
A battery operated heated vestfor myself and for Eric.
SPEAKER_00 (17:29):
It's just such a tough time of year.
Point being, it's a really hardtime of year.
Yes.
It is.
So I did not consider that.
I did not consider that.
And I should because I couldhave planned for it mentally a
little bit better.
So then on top of that, right,you start to eat and you start
to reverse a little bit.
And holy moly, that hungerhormone comes back with this
(17:49):
vengeance.
It literally claws into youwhere you are craving everything
and anything at all hours, andyou really then have to moderate
yourself at that point.
That's that mental disciplinethat we learned through the
reduction phase comes into playon that build part because you
can't eat too much.
We can't gain too fast, youknow.
(18:11):
But because again, now here weare with that hormonal
environment changing.
So it is changing.
And at 50, I'm still getting mycycles as normally as I was
before.
Somehow, I have no idea.
But I'm dealing with that rollercoaster that I'm feeling more so
than I did before with thatestrogen low, estrogen high, and
(18:32):
this and that, and progesteronehere and this and that.
And all of a sudden, I'm lookingoutside and I'm going, is it a
full moon?
What happened?
SPEAKER_01 (18:40):
Yes, and it was a full moon last week, and
everything was really, I don'treally get into that much, but
everything was really fuckingweird last week.
It was, it was that super moonthing last week, and I was like,
What is happening?
The dog was nuts, and I feltlike I was losing my shit.
And I was like, What?
I was like, Oh, it's a fullmoon.
That must be what it is.
SPEAKER_00 (18:59):
Yes, but and I don't really follow that either.
But last week I certainly didbecause I never I had never felt
so low in my life.
And I mean, I used to duringprep because you're feeling
great and because you're eatingso well, I was able to jump out
of bed in the morning and I cando this and this and that,
knowing that I needed to managemy energy level though, because
(19:20):
in the morning it's at itshighest, right?
So I've got to make sure that my7 a.m.
genny, or sometimes you know, my5 a.m.
or 4:30 a.m.
genie needs to still be there at3 p.m.
So you're managing it.
But last week, especially lastweek, um, I couldn't get out of
bed.
I did no motivation to doanything.
(19:40):
I mean, it was so low.
I was like, I have got to go andbrush my teeth.
And I just the thought of doingthat was exhausting.
Like, why who am I gonna seetoday?
Do I really have to go?
I had returns I needed to go do,right?
Like Amazon returns.
Like the normal things that youdo, you gotta go to the UPS
store and drop this off, or yougotta go to the grocery store,
or you just gotta run an errorand drop off dry cleaning.
(20:03):
I'm like, I'll do it tomorrow.
I'll do it tomorrow.
I'll do it tomorrow.
I became the world's worstprocrastinator and just so sad.
And then all of a sudden, you'relistening to something in the
car, maybe it's a song, oryou're at home and you're doing
the dishes and the song comeson, and I'm just I start crying,
just bawling your eyes out.
And I'm a mess.
(20:24):
And then your brain starts toplay tricks on you.
I really started feeling alittle bit of a hopelessness or
worthlessness, is kind of wherethe only way that I can describe
it.
And I started recognizing signsthat I knew were dangerous.
Truly, because your brain can soquickly and easily convince you
that you are less than, thatyour value is not what others
(20:48):
perceive it as or whatnot.
Like you just go down a darkspiral hole.
And I thought, nope, nope, nope,nope, nope.
This is where, and this isreally something important that
I want to tell people, you havegot to seek great medical
guidance.
And I'm saying that in the sensethat don't do it when you're
feeling this way.
You need to put this in yourfreaking plan.
Yeah.
(21:08):
Put this in your plan.
If you're looking to competethis coming up year, right now,
write this down.
Put in your plan that in thatreverse diet, you've got
somebody ready waiting in thewings.
Also, you got to make anappointment with your GP or with
your OB.
Go in and tell themspecifically, I just finished a
bodybuilding show.
You know that I've been doingthis.
I've told you about it before.
I want you to check my hormonelevels.
(21:30):
I want you to check my thyroid.
SPEAKER_02 (21:31):
Take a look at this.
SPEAKER_00 (21:33):
Because you've got to have that support system to
catch you when you fall.
Because it's it's not just aboutlooking in the mirror and going,
oh, I don't have that show bodyanymore or whatever.
That's a piece, but that's asymptom.
You have to look at what's goingon in your endocrine system.
What is happening to you?
Because we're not 30 anymore.
(21:54):
We're not these bikini beautifulgirls in their 20s who are
competing who can bounce back sofast.
SPEAKER_01 (22:02):
And I'll say too, in all fairness, this is hard
regardless of your age.
I mean, even my clients in their20s and 30s struggle.
And yes, I think the older weget, it it just complicates
things more, right?
Um, but we're just complicatedhuman beings because women are
(22:22):
just really super fortunate thatway.
Ha ha.
Um, and so everything you'resaying is true, which is also
why it's so important to havethe support of your coach.
So whether it's your coach or uhyour therapist or your doctor,
your spouse, your whatever, umunderstanding.
(22:43):
I think the first step is reallyan understanding that like this
is just because your brain issaying it doesn't mean it's
true, right?
Our brains like to speak reallyloudly when they're lying.
And so that doesn't mean we haveto believe everything it says.
I have suffered from depressionuh off and on over the years
myself, many times.
I am very, very thankful that Ihave the tools to understand it
(23:07):
when it's there.
It doesn't mean it doesn't suck.
It really sucks to not bemotivated.
I mean, and I don't even like touse the term motivation.
I it's it's not even motivation.
I simply do not want to get outof fucking bed because I don't
see a point, right?
I'm just like, I feel like shit,the world sucks, every it's
cold, it's gray, and there'sjust there's you know, and and
(23:27):
life sucks, and and so what'sthe point?
And so yeah, there is ahopelessness to to to
depression, but having the thetools, first of all,
understanding that this is notactually who you are, it's just
some feelings, that's just yourbrain screaming at you really
loudly, and understanding thatthere is a physiological
response for it a good part ofthe time, right?
(23:49):
So whether it's you know, achemical imbalance, a hormonal
imbalance, a you know, justwhatever the case is, and
understanding that doesn't meanthat you're like fucked up and
broken, and you know, because Ithink the majority of women go
through this at some pointanyway.
Um, and then having having thetools, right?
So being prepared for that andunderstanding it first and
foremost, having support system,and then understanding, you
(24:12):
know, and I think some of thetools that we uh use in in prep.
So one of the benefits to umreally cultivating this
discipline, which is really whatthe beauty of this sport does,
right?
Which is why I think this isbeneficial for anybody to listen
(24:32):
to, right?
So when you have thatdiscipline, you cultivate that
discipline over the course ofyour let me get to the stage,
your cutting phase, or even justsomebody who's regularly going
to the gym now and eatinghealthy, you can use that
discipline to get up out of bedand go brush your teeth and go
return your shit to Amazon,right?
Like it's no, I don't fuckingwant to.
(24:54):
When it's cold outside, I'm notcompeting.
I haven't competed since 2012.
I don't want to get up and gowork out in my garage.
I have a little space, I have aheater in there, warms it up
sometimes, but it sucks and it'sdark and it's cold and I don't
want to.
But I have done this for 30years now, and so I just go and
(25:16):
I do it.
And guess what?
I don't always like it.
I fucking think it sucks most ofthe time.
I don't want to be out there.
I'm bored, I hate my garage gym,I hate the winter, I hate all
the things, but I'm gonna do itanyway because that's a
discipline, right?
So, and so my point being, andI'm not talking about you know,
if if you need to seekprofessional help, seek
(25:38):
professional help.
But one of the beautiful thingsabout this sport, cultivating
discipline in your life andwhatever it is that you're
doing, is that you just get upand go, right?
You still do it, you still putone foot in front of the other.
Whatever your best is today isokay.
I don't care what your best wasyesterday, I don't care what you
think your best might betomorrow.
(25:58):
You give it your best shot fortoday.
And if that best isunrecognizable to you, that's
okay.
Because you at least got up andyou did something.
There have been days I've walkedout into my garage gym and I
just feel so low and so shittythat I'm just like, uh I'm gonna
walk on the treadmill for 10minutes.
That's it.
That's all I got.
And I turn around and I walkback out of my garage gym.
(26:18):
But it did something, right?
Like, was it what I planned todo when I walked out there?
No.
Sometimes my body says, fuckoff.
I don't sometimes I go out theresuper motivated.
My body still says fuck off.
My body's like, nah, we're not,you know, I know your brain says
you're motivated, but we're notmotivated.
And so, you know, it's it'sunderstanding that these are the
things going on.
And so I glad I'm glad thatyou're sharing that about your
(26:40):
own journey because a lot ofcoaches aren't out there sharing
it.
Uh, you know, when I think Italked about this in our last
podcast, but when I wascompeting um a million years
ago, there was no post-showadvice other than you go to the
show with a bag full of junk,you come home to cabinets full
of junk.
The actual advice was, oh, justtake a week off the gym, eat
(27:03):
whatever you want for a week.
Okay.
Literally the dumbest advice onthe planet, right?
And because then you really fuckyourself up because talk about
fucking up your hormones, right?
Like eating too much too fast,putting on too much body fat fat
too fast.
Eric almost ended up in thehospital once with stomach
ulcers because he ate so muchpost-show and it was fall shows.
(27:24):
The other, so the other thingyou didn't mention about the
problem with fall shows, and I'mnot, you know, some people are
perfectly fine with it, but Iknow every single client I've
ever worked with that competedin fall shows struggles with the
same thing.
I'm glad you brought up theseasonal depression, the cold
and dark.
The fucking holidays.
When you come off of a show andyour last show was the Conquer,
wrong one, your last show wasthe Chesapeake Classic.
(27:47):
What you got?
Halloween, Thanksgiving,Christmas.
And you're trying to maintainsome semblance of discipline and
self-control, and your hormonesare fucked up, and it's cold and
dark, and it's all the holidays,and everybody wants to bring you
treats because oh, well, youhaven't had anything for 30
(28:07):
weeks.
Let's go to lunch.
Everybody wants to schedulelunch, everybody wants to
celebrate with you.
Oh, you missed your birthdaytoo.
Everybody wants to celebrateyour birthday with you now, and
so you got to schedule all thesethings, and you want to see all
the people you didn't see, andyou know, all of those things.
And so it's you have to have aplan, right?
To to manage that because youcannot go out to lunch with
(28:29):
every person that invites you inyour first week post-show.
You cannot go on vacation.
I am so sorry to tell peoplethis.
Do not go on your hot girlJamaica vacation in the day that
you come off the stage inOctober because you will go to
this all-inclusive resort andyou will have absolutely no
ability to control yourself, notbecause you're non- not
(28:52):
disciplined, but because yourbrain is gonna scream at you so
loudly that you know you youneed to get your body fat up
really high and you need to doall these things.
You just put yourself in alittle you can eat buffet, and
you're not gonna be able to doit.
And I've seen it, I've seen ittime and time again.
So I always recommend my clientswhen they come off the stage,
(29:15):
give yourself, I think thedanger zone is two to four
weeks.
Give yourself at least two,preferably four before you
schedule a vacation.
Yep.
Sorry, but do it right.
Um, schedule a photo shoot inthere.
That's great.
Helps you kind of stay on tracka little bit, gives you a little
something, something withoutneeding to be stage lean.
(29:35):
You got a little something inbetween, and that just kind of
help you do that.
Um let your friends and familyknow that you appreciate that
they are all there to they wantto celebrate with you and they
want to bring you all the treatsand they want to take you out,
but you've got to have someboundaries, and you have to tell
them, you have to let themunderstand what this is going to
look like for you.
It is not a I just dieted for 30weeks and now I can eat all the
(29:57):
things because you can't.
And the temptation is so fuckinghard.
Nobody is broken, nobody isweak, nobody just can't do it.
Your body is is going to fightyou tooth and nail to put body
fat on.
This is what people need tounderstand is physiology,
biology, neurology.
(30:19):
It's all the ologies, right?
So don't put yourself in aposition to fail, right?
So have that plan.
Talk to your friends and family,talk to your loved ones,
schedule one a week.
You don't need to go out everyday.
Um, you know, the vacationthing.
So all of those things, and andreally just having a
conversation, not only withyourself, but with the people
(30:39):
around you who love you and whatand want to celebrate with you,
that you just can't do that yet,right?
And so you you might have tohave some uncomfortable
conversations because peopledon't understand this world,
yeah.
Um, and then understanding thatthis is what's happening with
yourself, right?
So, how do you so let me askyou, Jenny, since you're going
(30:59):
through it right now, andinstead of from my perspective
and coaching people, what areyou doing to get yourself out of
bed to go return your Amazonpackages?
What are you doing to get out ofbed and go brush your teeth,
right?
Like what is helping you throughthis period now that you
realize, whoops, I'm in it.
What are you doing now?
SPEAKER_00 (31:20):
Yeah, you know, it's um it's interesting.
Uh on the last podcast, I kindof used the analogy, the analogy
of parenting a toddler when wewere talking about how you
negotiate through that cutphase.
Um, now I'm parenting myself theway I would parent my teenager
when she was, well, now she'sstill a teenager, she's a
freshman in college.
(31:40):
But when you're parenting ateenager that is 15 or 16 years
old, that is stuck on theirphone, that's stuck in their
room, and maybe it's a Saturday,and you want to get them out and
about, and they're, you know,kind of like I am that teenager
right now.
Right now.
So I've going back to myparenting analogy, and I have
been having to literally say outloud to myself, you are going to
get up, you lazy moron.
(32:03):
You know, whatever it is thatyou've got to do to motivate
yourself to do.
So it's small goals, right?
Little teeny tiny little babysteps, baby goals.
And it's you get up and you'regonna go to the bathroom and
you're gonna brush your teeth.
And you know what?
You're gonna take a freakingshower.
Yeah, you might have taken onelast night, take another one,
just get in, and then you'regonna put actual clothes on, not
your freaking pajamas thatyou're gonna be in until your
(32:24):
husband gets home at six o'clockand you're wearing exactly what
you wore when you left, right?
It's it's right.
Oops, oops.
I'm not saying that those thingsare all bad things, but I'm
saying that these are the waysto kind of pull yourself out.
So parent yourself through theprocess.
And in this process, I haverealized for me, my future self
(32:45):
that wants to do this again in27, and for my own clients is
helping to build thiscompassionate framework.
You've got to build thispost-show compassionate
framework.
And I've kind of boiled it downto like for the four pillars in
the sense.
Number one, really being thatsupport that we've been talking
about support and connection.
Talk to your family, talk toyour spouse, um, talk to your
(33:07):
children, anyone that's in yourenvironment.
Your coach.
Yeah, of course.
Of course, your coach.
But you want those people thatare in your environment to
understand and know that, hey,listen, I'm going through this.
I'm about to really go throughthis.
This is gonna be kind of tough.
Just be aware if I'm reallyemotional or if I spout off or
whatever it is, this is what'shappening.
But you've got to understand,too, that there's this
(33:28):
biological repair.
And that's kind of that secondpillar that's there.
And that's where that mind screwhits us, right?
Because here we've been stagelean for a blank period of time.
People have commented nonstopabout how phenomenal we're
looking or how phenomenal welooked on stage.
You almost get to a certainpoint, too, where you feel a
little freakish.
At least that was me.
(33:50):
You're so lean, you're soripped, you're so vascular,
right?
Like every muscle's popping out.
And you almost feel a bitfreakish and you almost want to
gain a few pounds to get back.
So all those things.
But you do need to go throughthis biological repair.
So you've got to focus on thoseproteins.
We're talking about those wholefoods, right?
Being smart, not just trashdieting our way back up, not to
(34:11):
hurt ourselves, like what you'resaying that Eric had done.
Um, and then working with thedoctor, right?
Talking to your coach and allthose things.
But then you also have tounderstand that that that third
pillar is that nervous systemreset.
So you're eating for the rightreasons.
You're biologically repairing,you're also repairing that
nervous system.
And here's something I'm I madea big mistake on this year.
(34:33):
I didn't listen to you.
I didn't listen to my coach inthis one aspect.
You kept telling me after mylast show, all right, you gotta
rest.
You gotta rest.
Like, you need to do nothing, oryou need to go out and do some
walks, the mind-body experience,right?
The breath work, sleeping.
And I was like, No, are youkidding me?
(34:54):
I feel like a rock star.
SPEAKER_01 (34:55):
You were like fired up.
I was like, Jenny, you're gonnalike this is all gonna come
crashing down on you at anymoment.
I was like, because you werejust on this like adrenaline
high.
Yes, right.
And you you were your body wasrunning on pure adrenaline
because you had you had zerobody fat.
There was no way that youactually had that kind of
(35:16):
energy, and you were like a 24hour what wait, wait, five-hour
energy drink and a bottle.
SPEAKER_00 (35:25):
I was I I was manic.
Let's just put it out there.
You become manic because as soonas you step off stage and you do
start to add in some of thoseextra calories, those extra
calories go straight to yourenergy level, which boosts that
adrenaline even further, and youfeel like a freaking rock star.
And I didn't listen though, Ishould have future parented
(35:46):
myself, right?
With that plan and gone, expectto feel fantastic, but know that
you've got to slow it down, calmdown.
And I didn't, and because Ididn't, I crashed so bloody
hard, so hard.
And it was so sad for me.
Um and it was sad for mypartner.
(36:07):
I mean, Britt was looking at melike, what is wrong with you?
You know, and even though hecompetes too and he understands
it, men don't go through thesame hormonal changes that we do
in the adaptations, they don't,right?
So they're wonderful listeners,our husbands, but they don't
understand it.
And I keep trying to explain itto him, like it feels like and
you can't, your partner can'tunderstand it still.
So that was the biggest thingfor me was the nervous system
(36:30):
reset.
It's biology, yeah, but yourbrain has to reset.
So future parent yourself.
And then that last pillar for menow I'm understanding is
understanding the identity andkind of doing that body image
work.
And this is something I thinksomebody may have mentioned is
like, please talk about this.
How do you deal with the factthat your body's changing so
much?
There's a wonderful competitorthat we both saw win the she was
(36:53):
a physique champion, Yorton, OCBChesapeake classic, Kristen
Frey.
I'm a huge, huge, huge, huge,huge fan of hers.
And she was the one who, in onecomment that I had made on a
post, said, I'm focusing on myPRs, baby.
I'm getting back in that gym andI'm eating to fuel up so I can
regain some of that muscle thatyou know gets catabolized during
the point of cut, but also likebuild, build, build.
(37:16):
So she showed me just in hersimple, sweet comment, oh my
gosh, I need to focus now ongoing, listen, your job is done,
stage is done.
Now let's get some of thatbeautiful weight on because we
need it.
We need those fat, we need thatcarb, we need it to push further
so we can really continuerecomposing and building.
(37:37):
And that changed my mindsetbecause it was who am I beyond
my stage photos?
SPEAKER_01 (37:43):
Who am I?
Well, that's okay.
So we have to come back to thebasics that this is called
bodybuilding for a reason.
This is not a dietingcompetition.
Yes, it is about aesthetics onstage, but you don't get
aesthetics without buildingmuscle.
It is what it is, right?
And so we don't get to buildmuscle without body fat, we
don't get to build muscle whilewe stay stage lean all year
(38:03):
long.
This is not about being lean,except on the day of the show.
This is a sport, and I I havesaid this in so many podcasts
before.
This is something that um I knowBrandy and I have talked about
ad nauseum.
A lot of people go into thiswith the wrong mindset and it is
and it's all about looks.
If you're an a true athlete andyou're in the sport for the
(38:27):
right reasons, you're not justdoing it for the aesthetics,
right?
And so, in order to makeyourself a better athlete, if I
was running a marathon and Ijust came off my marathon season
and I just decided to stoprunning, right?
Or I didn't fuel myself, or Ididn't try to improve my run,
then what's the fucking point?
What is the point, right?
(38:48):
Like it it's it's no differentin terms of the sport.
This sport requires you to havebody fat.
It requires you to put onmuscle.
And so if you want to be anathlete in the sport, you must
do those things.
As a natural athlete, I amtalking about natural athletes.
If you're takingperformance-enhancing drugs, you
(39:10):
can throw all everything I justsaid out the window, stay lean
all year long.
I don't fucking care.
Right?
You're killing yourself anyway.
That's a whole nother topic.
Um, but if you you have to havethat mindset, and so you have to
get out of the the mindset thatmy visual is constantly get
(39:32):
leaner, get leaner, get leaner,get leaner.
And now we have just have tochange the narrative to my
mindset is I gotta put some bodyfat back on, I gotta fuel my
training, I gotta get stronger,right?
So you have to start chasingPRs.
I even have, I even recommend alot of my clients come up with
some other athletic goal postshow so that they are no longer
(39:55):
looking at themselves in themirror constantly, like, what
does my body look like?
Let's chase some other athleticgoal.
You want to go do a CrossFitcompetition, go to a CrossFit
competition.
I love my clients coming off ofbodybuilding shows and going
into powerlifting.
It is one of the most amazingthings that you can do, right?
Because suddenly it is about thePR, right?
It is about how strong you are,and you've got to fucking feed
(40:16):
yourself if you want to dopowerlifting, right?
And so I have several clientswho have gone and you know, and
I'm not saying you got to dothat forever, but it is a great
way to give yourself a newathlete.
You want to go run a 5k?
Yeah, running's not really mything, and it's not super
conducive to bodybuilding, butyou gotta have some other goal
that takes your mind off of whatdo I look like and puts it back
(40:38):
into performance as an athlete,right?
So chase the PRs, get stronger,go do some powerlifting, do some
crossfit, do do whatever, right?
But you gotta have something.
Um, you also have to think aboutlike you really just you gotta
give your brain time to reset.
So to your point, but on onanother note, in terms of like
(41:02):
the neurology that comes intoit, right?
The psyche.
And so I have you just looked atyourself for 30 weeks straight
in the mirror with a the visualof new new veins, get leaner,
new ab, new what right?
Like I'm leaner, lean, lean,lean, lean, lean, lean.
It's gonna take your brain awhile to understand that looking
(41:23):
at your body now is different,right?
So your brain wants to keeplooking for leaner, leaner,
leaner.
And so your brain is focused onthat.
So it's just gonna take it'slike adjusting your eyes to the
dark, right?
You get into a dark room, youcan't see shit, but if you're
standing there for long enough,you're gonna be able to see a
little bit of what's going on.
So you just have to give yourbrain some time to go, oh, okay.
(41:45):
Like I to get used to what youlook like again, right?
And so it's it's okay to havethe feeling of like watching
your body get softer.
It's okay to feel a littleshitty about that.
Like, I mean, it sucks, right?
Like sometimes it just sucks.
But you have to change thenarrative, and this takes as
much practice and repetition asit does going to the gym, right?
(42:11):
So these aren't the this is whenbecause neuroscience is like
really where I geek out and lovethings.
But if you really understand howour how our brains work, we just
spent all this time making thisneuroscircuit in our brains.
It's like lean, lean, lean, lookat how lean I am.
Well, you gotta we gotta give itsome time to like create a new
(42:33):
circuit, right?
And so you have to give yourselfsome grace and you have to tell
yourself, no, putting on thisbody fat is good.
Putting on this body fat isgood.
Look how strong I'm getting.
Yes, I'm getting softer, butman, look, I I I'm PR ing and
you have to keep tellingyourself those things because
you just spent 30 weeks tellingyourself how lean you were and
how amazing you were.
Now you got to tell yourselfsomething else, and so you got
(42:55):
to build a different story, andyou got and it's just gonna take
some time.
And it's I we talked about thisin the last podcast.
I said it's like my Grand Canyonreference, right?
Like you've just got to, it'sgonna feel stupid, right?
Because you're looking in themirror and you're like, no, I
don't like this extra belly fat.
This fucking sucks.
No, I don't like the cellulitethat's coming back in my ass.
Nobody wants that, nobody likesit, but you gotta look at
(43:18):
yourself and tell yourself adifferent story because it's not
bad, right?
It's like it just is so you justhave to say, This is what it is,
this is who I am, and now I'mchasing these PRs.
And who fucking cares if youhave cellulite on your ass,
right?
Like nobody cares if you'restrong as fuck, right?
Yeah, nobody cares.
Do I care if you have celluliteon your ass on stage?
(43:39):
Yeah, as a judge, you probablyshouldn't, right?
But that's not what we're doinghere.
So that doesn't matter rightnow.
It does not matter that you havesome cellulite on your ass.
It does not matter that yourtricep gets a little jiggly.
No, it doesn't matter.
You gotta get strong, you gottafuel yourself, you gotta be give
(44:00):
yourself some grace.
Um, that's my but you have tochange, right?
You can't just give yourselfgrace, you have to change the
narrative.
Because otherwise, if you ifnothing changes, nothing
changes, and then you're justgonna keep spiraling in this
right, and then then all you cando is give yourself grace
because all you're doing is inthis, like, I suck, okay.
(44:22):
Well, I'll give myself grace.
Okay, I suck, okay.
Well, I'll give myself grace.
Well, that's not helpful, right?
So giving yourself grace ischanging that narrative, right?
It's like, no, no, no, no, no.
Like, let's go over here.
You're not beating yourself upover it, but you're able to kind
of go in and and and start tochange so that it doesn't feel
so painful to look in the mirrorall the time.
SPEAKER_00 (44:42):
Yeah, you have to give, you know, you got to be
respectful of yourself.
You need to have respectfulself-talk.
I mean, think about how hard weare on ourselves as human
beings.
We would never say the things toother people that we say to
ourselves.
SPEAKER_01 (44:55):
Do you remember the um thing we did in the retreat?
Do you remember the the doveself self-talk um video that we
show in the retreat?
And I don't know if you were atthe retreat where we did this
particular exercise, but we hadwe did this for our first couple
of retreats.
We had everybody write down alltheir negative thoughts in a
(45:17):
week, right?
And so we had them on littlepieces of paper.
And you know, I always like tosay, I'm ugly, I'm fat, I'm bad
mom, like nobody loves me,whatever.
Those are the the recurringnarratives that women like to
tell themselves.
And so we put them all in alittle jar and we put teamed
people up, and you would pickone out of a jar and you would
tell the person in front of themthat they were fat, and you
(45:39):
would tell the person in frontof them that that you were ugly,
whatever you pulled out of thejar, and then you would go, and
then we would talk about likewhat does that I don't I get
chills even like saying that.
Like, if I could ever look atsomebody in the face and say,
Man, you really got fatpost-show.
And you know, some assholes outthere, I'm probably gonna say
(46:00):
it, but you have to be your ownbest friend, that's the point,
right?
So you cannot talk to yourselfany differently than you would
talk to your friend, right?
So if you wouldn't say it toyour best friend, you have to
get in the habit of, I can't sayit to myself because we are our
own worst enemy.
And so you have to be your ownbest friend.
(46:20):
So that is the giving yourselfgrace, that is the you know,
compassion, radical acceptance,all the little terms I could
throw on top of it, right?
You have to to get there, but itdoesn't come without practice.
And so if your normal narrativeis I'm fat, I'm not good enough,
I suck, that's always going tobe your narrative.
And your body will believe it,and your brain will believe it,
(46:42):
and your brain will scream it atyou because it's really used to
saying that, it's reallycomfortable for it to say, and
so until you actually just sostart change it to something
else, like no, like you justhave to say, No, I don't believe
you.
This is not what we're doinguntil and until you do believe
it.
SPEAKER_00 (47:01):
Yeah, and that that's why I go back for me as
the analogy of parenting myself,because you know, you you want
to say when you look in themirror, I'm disgusting, I'm
disgusting, and you have tochange that.
And so no, your body'srecovering from something really
extreme.
Yeah, and so I think about thatagain.
Like I've got a beautifulteenage daughter, and of course,
she suffers from body imageissues like every other teenage
(47:22):
girl does, and even teenage boysdo.
Of course, it's totally natural.
But my goodness, if you thinkabout what you would want to say
to your kid, right, yourdaughter, that and you're
looking at your own self andyour own body, think about that.
Think about your body assomething separate and apart
from you, um, as this wonderful,God-created, organic figure, and
(47:46):
think about treating it the sameway that you would the greatest
gift you've ever had in yourlife, which is your kid.
SPEAKER_01 (47:52):
Unless you're a shitty parent, like mine were
and said really shitty things toyour parent.
Don't do that.
Sure.
Well, yeah, and listen, I'm withyou on that.
Okay, and say do that.
I'm still on the kind of parentyou are.
Be the kind of parent you'resupposed to be, be the kind of
parent you had.
Exactly, exactly, exactly.
Be the parent you wish you had,be the parent wish you had.
Don't go out and pick your owntree limb that you can whip
(48:14):
yourself with because nobodyneeds that.
SPEAKER_00 (48:16):
Don't be that parent.
Right or grow up with a lot ofissues with insecurity and
self-confidence, like like me,right?
I I was absolutely 100% that.
So I do pay close attention withmy own daughter.
Like, you know, I really want totreat her with all the love and
(48:36):
respect and help her treatherself with all that love and
respect.
And that goes right back to usand our own bodies.
Exactly.
So I I almost, and this is kindof sound a little weird, sort of
disassociate.
I treat my body as something alittle bit separate.
Yes, it's me, but I'm trying totreat it and look at it and give
it that the care and concern andlove that it needs, which is
giving my brain the care andconcern and love that it needs.
(49:00):
So you you you have to look atit that way.
You've got to give yourself somepositive self-talk and go
through it.
Think about it this way (49:05):
when you became pregnant, okay, you
had this little being growing inyou, and your body starts to
change, and you're hungry, andyou're so excited.
And whatever that craving wasthat you had, like mine was
chicken salad sandwiches oncroissant.
That was my my thing.
SPEAKER_01 (49:19):
Mine was mashed potatoes and marshmallows, which
is why I looked like mashedpotatoes and marshmallows by the
time I gave birth.
50 pounds, 50 pounds of mashedpotatoes and marshmallows,
Jenny.
SPEAKER_00 (49:30):
The weird thing, the weird thing, like I also
eventually had a craving of theWendy's frosties and dipping my
French fries in it or my peanutbutter and jelly sandwiches.
But the point is, you're growingthis little human being, and
your body is growing along withit, and you're eating and you're
eating, but you're not shamed byit because you're growing this
incredible human being.
And then nine months later,funny how that's pretty close to
(49:51):
what a prep cut could be, right?
Right, nine months later, youend up having this gorgeous
being, and you're left with abody that's very, very, very
different.
And you can work on it, and it'snever necessarily going to come
back to exactly what it was pre.
And you're gonna have someadditions, you're gonna have
those stretch marks and thingsof that sort.
And you may look at them in acertain way, but a lot of us
(50:12):
would look at it as a sense ofpride.
For me, I did.
I'm like, I love every stretchmark that I have because I love
my kid.
And there's so you treat yourbody and your brain differently
because of having a child.
So as you get older and asyou're going through some of
these changes, as you get, youknow, into bodybuilding and
you're you're going throughanother extreme.
(50:33):
Your body's going throughanother extreme.
You're not having a baby, butwhat are you birthing at the
end?
And what you end up with is areally resilient mindset.
You get with this a suretywithin your confidence, not just
based on how you look, butbecause of building that muscle
and building that strength andbuilding that mental resilience,
(50:53):
you've all of a sudden come outwith an incredible sense of
confidence you never thoughtthat you could ever have before.
So you've birthed a new versionof yourself.
SPEAKER_01 (51:04):
I'm loving all your child references.
I base it on experience.
I love, I think, well, I thinkit's a great way, it's a it's a
great new way for people to lookat things, you know.
SPEAKER_00 (51:14):
I that's my goal.
That's what I want.
Think about all the women thatyou meet that you now currently
coach, whether it's a livestockclient or a competition client,
and all the freaking baggagethat everybody, all of us come
with.
Oh, yeah, and how we have towork through that.
So this is a transformation,even if it's not a
transformation show, let's sayper se, but we are going through
(51:36):
that transformation.
So we are reversing out ofentering into and reversing out
of.
You need to look at this as anentire full-fledged journey, and
that what you're doing isdeveloping a better you.
It's not gonna always be abetter physical complete
completely.
Yeah, like you don't look atthat as your value, it's the
package.
What's the package?
SPEAKER_01 (51:56):
Yeah, and I I know that we said we were gonna keep
this to 30 minutes, which wehave already not done.
Um, so sorry everybody.
Um, so I the last couple thingsI'll add to because I think we
covered everything, but really,you know, in the reverse diet,
your body's gonna crave junk andyou're gonna think you can have
the junk, and it's not it's okayto have the occasional junk.
(52:18):
I think we even talked aboutthis in the last podcast a
little bit, but the more youcontinue to just eat the same
foods that you ate pre-prep inlarger quantities, the less the
cravings will be, right?
So the more you eat junk, youknow, the food, uh highly
palatable foods are actuallyengineered to make us want more,
right?
That's why I can't eat one Oreoor one Dorito.
(52:40):
Like it's not a thing, right?
So um, the less you eat thosethings, the less you will crave
those things.
And so that you want to kind ofjust eat more of what you've
always been eating.
Add a little variety, but don'tgo mixing it all up, trying to
eat all the things.
That's just gonna wayovercomplicate your life and
make you feel uh it's gonna be awhole lot harder.
Um, and then the whole entire,you know, the the reverse
(53:03):
process in terms of, you know,there's a really good study out
there.
I'll see if I can put it in theshow notes.
Um, and I loved it.
Granted, it was done on menbecause just about all of these
things are done on men.
Women are really hard to studybecause of our hormones and
getting anything.
Um, so it is what it is.
But um, it was a really greatstudy.
So this natural bodybuilder, Ithink it was actually Andrew
Pardue.
This was years ago.
And so he did all of his uhhormonal markers before he
(53:25):
started prep.
He did them at his absoluteleanest, and then um he did them
again when he was at the thesame weight and body fat that he
was when he first had his uhhormones tested.
Expecting the hypothesis waswhen he reached the same body
fat, his hormones would berecovered.
(53:47):
And that is not what happened.
And so while he had was at thelevel of body fat he had been
when he first tested his hishormonal markers, it was not the
case.
So just getting back to thatbody fat level does not mean
you're hormonally recovered.
It can actually take a whole lotlonger than what you think it
(54:07):
might take.
And I think in his case, itended up, I'm I'm throwing these
numbers out there.
I think he had them likeretested around like six months,
but I think it ended up beingsomething like nine to 12 months
later that his hormones wereactually back at the same levels
as testosterone and things likethat that they had been
pre-prep.
So it doesn't always equate.
And so it's not a quick process.
(54:28):
Um, just getting your cycle backdoesn't necessarily mean that, I
mean, it's a good indicator, butit doesn't necessarily mean that
everything's fully recovered.
And so the whole point of likereverse dieting, recovery
dieting, whatever you want tocall it, is to not just get your
hormones back, you know, ontrack, but it is also to recover
(54:48):
mentally, physically,financially, um, socially, um,
all those things, right?
Which is why a three-month offseason is not a thing.
And we can talk about that onanother podcast.
Goodness.
Um, and it's also not an offseason.
It's a growth season, it'simprovement season.
We don't call it bulking.
I don't call it off becausewe're not taking off.
We're also not bulking.
(55:09):
We're not like fucking um, Idon't know, what's we're not
trash.
It's bulk.
Um, those are just like quicklittle things, and we can
certainly get into those, likethe technical things in more
detail.
But I think we kind of coveredthe the gist of really what um
what a post-show looks like, howhard it is, um all the different
(55:32):
things you might go through, andreally how to um manage it,
right?
I mean, in in in whatever wayyou can find to do so without
look completely losing yourshit.
Um so yeah, so is there anythingelse you want to add before we
hop off since we went longerthan 30 minutes?
Sorry to your sorry to tell yourfriend I said I'm sorry.
(55:54):
Oh, no, no, no.
Sorry, friend, you said that ourpodcast was too long.
SPEAKER_00 (55:58):
It's all good.
No, it's all good.
I think we just close it outjust by saying to everybody that
you know your value is notmeasured in your body fat
percentage, right?
You are allowed to change yourgoals, you've got to protect
your mental health, yeah, andyour midlife can be strong and
it can be beautiful withouthaving to be completely extreme.
So just even with cellulite onyour ass, and even with it.
(56:22):
So just love yourself, loveyourself, and just reach out to
us if you're struggling becausethat just means you need a
better coach.
SPEAKER_01 (56:29):
Yes, friends, yes.
Well, thank you, Jenny, forsharing your struggles.
I think it helps other people toum to understand, right?
Like, really, the biggest thingis community and and knowing
you're not crazy, you're notalone, you're not broken, you're
not weak, you're notundisciplined, you're not like
your body is literally liketelling you to fuck off.
(56:50):
And evolution says we need toeat and we need to do it right
now, right?
Like we didn't get this far inlife without that happening.
Um, so understanding thosethings helps a little bit.
Um, but yeah, I mean, the mostimportant thing is to do you
remember that don't get weird.
Use your head, it'll all beokay.
(57:11):
It will all be okay, and thenwe'll say, bye.
unknown (57:14):
Bye.
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