October 9, 2025 • 32 mins
Waiting on God isn't wasted time. We sit down with Dove Award–nominated worship leader and new author Jaime Jamgochian to talk about what it truly means to wait on God when your circumstances aren’t changing.
Learn more about Jaime Jamgochian here, and check out her new book, Sacred Surrender 💖
Scriptures referenced:
- 1 Corinthians 1:27
- Isaiah 53:5
- John 8:36
- Luke 22:42
- Galatians 2:20
- 1 Corinthians 15:51-52
- 1 Peter 1:3
- Proverbs 13:23
- Proverbs 3:45
Jaime's faves:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ellen Krause (00:04):
The Coffee of Bible Time podcast, our goal is
to help you delight in God'sWord and thrive in Christian
living.
Each week, we talk to subjectmatter experts who broaden your
biblical understanding,encourage you in hard times, and
provide life-building tips toenhance your Christian walk.
We are so glad you have joinedus.
(00:25):
Hi, friends, and welcome backto the Coffee and Bible Time
podcast.
I'm Ellen, your host, and I'mso excited you're here for
today's conversation.
My guest today is JamieJamgoshin, a Dove
Award-nominated singer,songwriter, worship leader, and
(00:49):
someone whose walk with the Lordhas been shaped by long seasons
of waiting, unexpected detours,and deep surrender.
Over the past two decades,Jamie has experienced the highs
and lows of life and ministry.
But what is so powerful abouther story is that she hasn't
(01:09):
waited to live until the waitingis over.
Instead, she's discovered whatit means to live fully and
abundantly, even when theanswers haven't come yet.
So whether you're in a seasonof uncertainty, holding out hope
for something yet to come, orlearning to let go of what you
(01:31):
can't control, I believe Jamie'swords will speak directly to
your heart.
So grab your coffee, open yourBible, and let's dive in.
Jamie, welcome.
Jaime Jamgochian (01:41):
Thank you.
I brought my coffee.
I don't know where it is, butit's somewhere.
Ellen Krause (01:46):
Well, no worries.
I'm just glad that you're here.
Thank you.
Why don't you start out just bytelling our listeners a little
bit about you and your ministry?
Jaime Jamgochian (01:57):
Yeah.
So I have been singing, leadingworship, Christian songs since
I was 24.
I came to faith at 21 whilestudying jazz piano at Berkeley.
I was singing in the bars, thecruise lines, my funny
valentine, all of that.
And God got a hold of my lifethrough a classmate, and she was
the first one to share thegospel and tell me who Jesus is.
(02:19):
And my heart was ready, and Ithink she could see that.
And I surrendered everything.
That was my first true test ofsurrender, which I know we're
going to talk about, Ellen, in alittle bit.
But that led me from the EastCoast to Seattle, Washington,
where I laid down every musicaldream.
I was set to go to LA, NewYork.
(02:40):
Had really excelled in myprofessional career.
But the Lord said, go toSeattle and take a two-year
Bible internship at a church.
I had never seen hands raisedin worship.
I had never experienced thepower of corporate worship in my
life, was ruined and wreckedfor the glory of God in the best
way.
And that began a journey.
(03:02):
And ever since then, I did endup signing a Christian record
deal that led me here toNashville.
So I've been in ministry thelast 25 years.
I counted an honor to leadpeople into worship, to share
hope, to share what it's like togo from darkness to light, as
we all know.
I reside in the southern partof Tennessee, right outside of
(03:24):
Nashville.
I love my community here.
I have some dear friends thatwe're all kind of in the
ministry Christian music world.
So I love my community, have abeautiful family still back east
in Boston.
And after putting out sevenalbums, God was being funny, I
guess, and decided to say,You're gonna be an author.
(03:45):
I said, I'm the girl that hadthe learning disabilities.
Lord, I'm a singer.
And so I have my first bookcoming out October 7th, and
truly cling to that verse.
God will use the foolish thingsof the world to confound the
wise, because I don't think Ishould have written a book.
But here we are, and I believeit's gonna really unlock and
bring some breakthrough topeople that um have navigated
(04:08):
just long seasons of waiting orsuffering, um, or how to live an
abundant, full life, even insome empty places.
So that's a little bit aboutme.
I'm a earthy, crunchy, organic,holistic girl.
So you can find me at all theholistic uh little crunchy
markets, um, living my bestlife, drinking my golden milk
lattes.
Ellen Krause (04:28):
Oh thank you for that awesome introduction,
Jamie.
I know um because I have readyour beautifully written book
that you have had somechallenges and setbacks.
Tell us about, you know, amoment in your spiritual life
(04:48):
where you felt called to fullysurrender and trust.
Jaime Jamgochian (04:53):
Oh my goodness, I feel like it's a
daily thing, right, Alan?
Like every day, Lord, Isurrender this, or I give you
this desire, I give you thisdream.
I think one of the hardestparts of my story of surrender
would be in 2019 when on theoutside everything looked great.
I was thriving in ministry.
I had actually helped some dearfriends and pastors of mine
(05:17):
plant a church in Nashvillecalled The Belonging, you know,
part of the core small teamwhere we're just seeing it bloom
and bloom.
I was on staff there as the newChristians pastor, and I just
didn't feel well.
I can remember I was stilltaking ministry trips, singing,
leading worship on the road, andI would get home and just
something wasn't quite right.
(05:37):
Well, fast forward, I was uhfinally diagnosed with
late-stage neurological Lymedisease, which I don't ever
remember getting bit by a tick.
I I'm not an like go live inthe forest kind of girl.
I'm more of like, let's go to anice hotel.
So I'm like, how did I get aticky bite?
I don't even hike, you know?
What's funny is now I do, butuh long story.
(05:58):
Um that led me into a season oftrue surrender, truly saying,
God, this doesn't make sense.
I had to sell my condo, moveback home, have my parents care
for me.
Had to really lay down if I'dever be well again, because
there's a lot of doctors thatbelieve Lyme is incurable and
that you'll always have thesetough chronic symptoms.
(06:20):
Something in my spirit did notresonate with that.
Maybe because I'm a lateconvert and I take every word of
that Bible to be true.
And I kept saying, but the Lordsays that by his stripes I can
be healed.
And the Lord says who the sunsets free is free indeed.
So, God, I believe you can freeme from this affliction, from
this infirmity, from thissickness.
(06:42):
And um, we found a clinic inNew York that I actually now
work for very part-timeremotely, and they do advanced
Lyme cases, and I was able toget on the other side, but the
Lord invited me in that seasonafter, gosh, 20 years of travel
and just living the life andministry.
He invited me into this holyseason of suffering, of
(07:06):
surrender, where I really got tosee him in a new way and trust
him.
And I think that's probably oneof the most profound areas of
surrender where I had to giveeverything up.
If I could never talk rightagain, if I could never walk
right again.
I mean, I'm talking, it washard to get my head off the
pillow, but I found this sweetspot of joy and surrender that
(07:28):
he's enough.
And if nothing else everhappened, the cross of Jesus is
enough.
I'm saved, I know where I'mgoing.
If I never sing another note,play the piano again, which is
my favorite thing to do, God,you're enough.
And that was a great test ofsurrender.
Ellen Krause (07:46):
Jamie, I can completely relate to your story
in that I experienced somethingsimilar with an autoimmune
disease that literally left meon my bed to the point of not
able to get out of bed myself.
I mean, it is a very humblingexperience and one that God used
(08:09):
in my life as well.
So I just I I applaud you forwhat you were able to pull out
and learn from that experienceand grow in that experience.
It's a it's important toacknowledge that there are
challenges we face that are notGod's will.
(08:30):
They are consequences of livingin a fallen world.
So what does patience andsurrender look like for someone
who's in the midst of thatsituation?
Maybe someone who's right theretoday listening.
Jaime Jamgochian (08:44):
Yeah, well, patience is never hard, right?
And you know that.
I didn't know that part of yourstory when you're waiting and
waiting for breakthrough, and itjust feels like groundhog day.
Every day, the same thing,every day the same thing.
Um, but patience is a fruit ofthe spirit, and just like joy
and just like peace and justlike love, we are instructed to
(09:06):
walk in patience.
I fail daily in this area.
Um, we're a microwavegeneration, we want it now, we
want it quick.
Um, but I do think thatlearning patience, um, you you
kind of settle down a littlebit.
You don't freak out aboutthings as much.
Even last night at a Biblestudy I was teaching, we talked
(09:27):
about what position are we in?
Are we in a position of rest?
God, I trust you in thecircumstance that's not changing
that I don't understand.
Are we seated in Him and weknow our identity as a daughter
of God?
So we can be patient, we cansay, God, I don't get it, but I
trust you.
Um or, and I'm I'm not sayingI've always done this perfect,
(09:48):
we try to run ahead, right?
We try to make it happen.
We manipulate a situation tohave it happen sooner than it's
supposed to.
And something the Lord's taughtme is his timing is best.
There's a chapter in my newbook called When Your Plan A was
God's plan B, and how he reallymakes it the best plan because
(10:09):
we think we know what we want,but he's up there saying, Oh, my
daughters, oh my sons, if onlyyou could see what I have for
you.
It's so much better.
The timing might be different,the scenario might be different,
but I'm a good dad and I'm notgonna fail you.
So I think walking andpatience, although hard, it
takes grip, it takes dailydiscipline, takes character, it
(10:31):
takes integrity.
I I mean, I'm telling you, Ifail some days, but it's asking
the Lord for that fruit of thespirit.
Be careful if you pray forpatience because he will test
you.
Ellen Krause (10:44):
Yes, absolutely.
Faith and trust as we wait.
You make a note that there is adifference between waiting well
and not waiting well.
How would you describe thosetwo different scenarios?
Jaime Jamgochian (10:58):
Yeah, so the tagline of the book, uh Sacred
Surrender, the practice ofwaiting well.
I remember when we we dreamedthat up and I thought, oh, I
don't know if I wait well, Lord.
Um but then I realized in thelast 20 plus years, there's been
some significant areas in mylife that I've had to lay down
(11:19):
to the Lord and say, I'm gonnawait for your best in this area.
And I've seen him, I have seenhis faithfulness time and time
again when I take my hands off.
And waiting well, I think isthe posture of the heart.
It's saying, God, not my will,your will be done, which is back
(11:40):
to that posture of living asacred, surrendered life.
So I have tools, I have thingsI've learned along the way that
have helped me to wait well.
Some of those is I'll do atest.
Uh, I'll ask myself every day,am I jumping ahead?
Am I lagging behind?
Lord, am I right on time?
It's a prayer I'll pray, it'ssomething I'll journal, I'll see
(12:01):
what the Holy Spirit says.
Um, I can tell when I'm notwaiting well.
Something I need to do is takea step back and take care of
myself.
Um, not into like the wholeself-love movement.
I think that's very anti-Jesus.
But I do think God wants us totake care of ourselves and love
ourselves enough to be able tolove others, right?
(12:22):
So I'll I'll recognize oh, I'mnot waiting well.
I need to go on some of mysunset walks.
I need to reconnect with someof my dear friends and have some
beautiful dinners that bringlife to me and fuel, fill
yourself up, take care of you sothat you are able to wait upon
the Lord.
If not, you know, Ellen, we getin our flesh and we try to
(12:43):
figure things out and do thingson our own.
And well, we know that doesn'tbenefit us very much.
Those are a few things that Ido.
I ask trusted people in mylife, how do you think I'm doing
in this area?
You know this is hard.
You know, I've been waiting fora long time.
Give me some insight and Ilisten to what they have to say
and get their feedback.
So those are some of my tips ofhow to wait well.
Ellen Krause (13:06):
Thank you so much for that.
You know, all of those thingssort of add up, right?
When you they build upon oneanother and get you to this
place of being able to wait inpeace and trust.
There's an interesting quote Iwant to read from your book.
You say there is a pruning thathappens when we are walking
(13:28):
through a difficult situation,which causes the dead and dying
things in our life to fall tothe ground and be stripped away.
If you are being humbled in aparticular area, do not resist
it, but rather lean in evenfurther into the ways that God
is shaping you through thatchallenging time.
(13:48):
What are some ways that we cannotice where God might be
pruning us?
And what does it look like toactually lean into those
seasons?
Sounds painful.
Jaime Jamgochian (14:03):
Yeah.
Um, I remember when I became aChristian, I had the revelation
that it's no longer I that live,but Christ that lives within
me.
We die to ourselves to liveunto Christ, right?
That's the whole Christianfaith.
It's no longer me, Jamie's nolonger Ellen.
It's Christ within us.
So how do we reflect him thebest we can this side of heaven
(14:26):
until we are in glory, until weare changed in an instant,
right?
Oh, I long for that today.
I think some of the ways thatthe pruning happens is when he's
trying to highlight an area inour life that maybe he does want
to make a little bit more likehim.
Maybe it's a little rougher onthe edges, maybe we're pushing
back in some way.
(14:46):
And usually that comes throughtesting, through trials.
That's where we are pruned.
We're not pruned wheneverything's great and we're on
the mountaintop and every prayeris coming true.
We're pruned when we're down inthe valley with him, saying,
God, I need you for my nextbreath.
I need you for my nextdecision.
We're pruned when we humblycome before him and say, I can't
(15:08):
do this, but you can do this.
So I think pruning is actuallya beautiful thing, and we don't
talk about that a lot.
Like hidden seasons in Christare some of the most holy,
because that's when God isreally fortifying who we are.
So if you're being pruned rightnow, I would see that as a
loving heavenly father saying,daughter, I've got more for you.
(15:31):
Oh, if you could just seewhat's ahead.
So embrace the pruning, embracewhen there's correction,
embrace when he says, you knowwhat, you didn't quite get that
right.
I still love you, of course,but let's work on it for the
next time.
So I always feel like a pruningseason comes before typically a
next thing God's gonna do inyour life.
(15:52):
Like for me, I had to be prunedas a young believer in my early
20s and learn a lot of stuff.
And then I got the Christianrecord deal.
I couldn't have done that had Inot walked through some of
those prior seasons.
Um, even the health season, thetrial, brought me to a whole
new level of pruning.
Ellen Krause (16:11):
Yes, it's amazing how when after going through
those things, they do equip youfor what God is calling you to
do next.
You know, my husband is alandscape architect, so he is
always making sure our trees arepruned and we have this
incredibly gorgeous crab appletree.
(16:31):
And always when he prunes it,I'm thinking to myself, but it's
so beautiful right now.
And yet when he prunes it, it'slooking a little bit more bare,
but then the next year, when itactually bears fruit and has
less disease, it's just you seehow that that pruning process is
(16:53):
so prolific.
And so it it it's so cool tosee how God does that actually
in our lives.
Well, Jamie, you uh write aboutthe importance of words in
difficult seasons.
I know you're very vulnerablein your book, telling us about
some harsh words that werespoken over you when you were
(17:13):
young.
Tell us about um why thosewords are so important and what
it actually looks like to speaktruth over one another and
ourselves in those seasons.
Jaime Jamgochian (17:27):
Yeah, our words carry power.
You know, the Bible says thatthere's blessing, there's
cursing, there's life, there'sdeath in our words.
So we really need to watchthem, especially as believers.
I think even when we're uhthinking, we're like, are we
flattering someone or are wereally encouraging them?
God's really checked me latelyon the words that come out.
(17:49):
And um yeah, that story thatyou're referencing is one that
happened in my life, gosh, solong ago.
And I was seven or eight, and Ilearned about this later in
life, probably a few years afterit really happened, that I
realized the power of our words.
And I wasn't great in school, Iwas great at the social stuff,
(18:12):
the music stuff, all of that.
Personality was great.
Learning was hard, and I canremember my parents went to
their teacher-parent conference,and for whatever reason, maybe
the teacher was having a badday.
She just decided to speak somereal negative, hurtful words,
and it ended with your daughterwill amount to not much because
(18:34):
she's not comprehending, shecan't, I couldn't get words
outright, which was true.
I had to then start resourcerooms and learning centers and
the Sylvan Learning Center andspeech therapists, and so there
was truth to it, but thedelivery, and I think our words
carry power, and thank God forparents that were like, Oh no,
(18:54):
you didn't.
My little girl is gonna changethe world, and we weren't
saying, we weren't believers.
Um, that was our firstencounter, I would say, with
negative words, and you know,you can latch onto those and
think, Well, I'm never gonnalearn and I'm always gonna have
speech problems.
But actually, I flipped thatscript, and music helped that a
(19:17):
lot.
Uh, they even say that peoplethat deal with learning issues,
if you get your brain goingmusically, creatively,
statistics show it really helps.
And that was my case.
And I ended up graduating.
Kuma sum lata, top of theclass, giving the valedictorian
speech.
Um, all of that, graduate topof the class at Berkeley.
(19:37):
You can you can partner with anegative word, or you can come
out of agreement with it.
And that's for any lie that theenemy would want to throw onto
us.
You can come in agreement withthat lie, or you can see it,
validate it, say, actually, thisis not the truth of who God
says I am, and I'm gonna comeout of agreement with that, and
I'm not gonna walk in thatplace.
So that's what I chose to do,and that's how my parents chose
(20:00):
to raise me that no, you're aworld changer.
This is not gonna hold youback.
Yeah, there's some learningissues.
So I'm really careful aboutwhat I speak about other people
in their hard seasons and theirbroken seasons and their
challenges, because you don'tknow what God's gonna do with
that.
And it's just a reminder to usthat our words really do carry
(20:20):
power.
Ellen Krause (20:21):
They sure do.
And labels like that um can beso detrimental.
I'm sorry you had to go throughthat because that's that's so
hard in a kid.
I love though what you said inthe book, um what you alluded to
about music, but you also saidart.
And my my daughter Ashley waskind of similar to what you're
(20:42):
describing in learning.
And coincidentally, she was inlike an outdoor or an
out-of-school art program, andshe just blossomed and it did
exactly what you said music didfor you.
It's incredible how art andmusic can help the other side of
(21:04):
your brain.
Jaime Jamgochian (21:04):
It does.
I wish I knew the statisticbetter, but I love hearing those
stories that I tore, and I hearthese stories every night on
tour how you know my daughterwas doing so bad, and then we
got her into flute lessons, andall of a sudden, or you know, my
son, and then we got himplaying the drums and the
marching band.
And I'm like, there is there'ssomething about that side of the
brain, the creative side thatclicks on and helps the other
(21:28):
side.
Ellen Krause (21:28):
Yes.
Jaime Jamgochian (21:29):
I need to study it up.
Ellen Krause (21:31):
Absolutely.
One of the big themes in yourbook is hope.
And at one point, you ask yourreaders to consider where their
hope comes from and if it hasbeen hijacked.
So tell us what you mean bythat and how can we know if it's
happened to us?
Jaime Jamgochian (21:49):
Yeah.
I once saw someone in theairport.
I spent a lot of time therewith a t-shirt that says got
hope.
And I thought that's so cool.
And then I started to thinkabout all the places that we as
believers and people that don'tknow the Lord yet put their hope
in.
So we put our hope in ourrelational status.
If we're married, we put ourhope in our dreams coming true.
(22:11):
We put our hope in maybe evenour health, our financial
bracket, where have we reached acertain place financially?
All these things we put ourhope in.
And I remember one day the Lordreally challenged me and he
said, Do you know that I'm theauthor of hope?
And I'm like, Of course, Lord,you you know you're and he led
me to the scripture that talksabout Jesus.
Once we're born again, we areentering into the resurrection
(22:34):
power, into the living hope.
So Jesus is our actual livinghope, which I think makes so
much sense because I think youcan probably relate to this as
believers.
Even when something isdevastating or there's grief and
you've lost someone so dear toyour heart, we still have that
(22:56):
living hope within us.
We will grieve, we will be sad,yes, but we don't mourn as
those that don't have thatliving hope within us.
And so I like to challengepeople where is your hope?
Where are you placing yourhope?
Is it in the person of Jesus?
Is that your identity, or isyour hope in something that's
(23:18):
gonna happen outside of him?
I I had a few big career goals,and one of them kind of
happened several years ago, andI remember thinking I finally
got the dub nomination, and inmy genre, that's like a big
thing.
It's like the ChristianGrammys, right?
And um got the pretty dress,walked the red carpet, was in
(23:39):
the category with three peoplethat I really look up to, peers.
I didn't win, but I rememberedgetting home that night and
thinking, wow, finally, 20 yearsin, I was nominated for a Dove
Award.
And the Lord asked me aquestion, do you feel any
different?
I said, No.
He said, Do you think you wouldhave felt any different if you
(23:59):
won?
I said, No.
And it was this wake-up call tome that even though it's not a
bad thing, right?
Any earthly accolade or earthlywin, so to speak, it never
fills that god hole.
It never fills true hope orpurpose.
That's only in our relationshipwith Christ.
(24:22):
And it was such a good lessonfor me that if nothing else ever
happens in life, is my hopeanchored in you and are you
enough?
And those are questions I askmyself.
So I ask people, has your hopebeen hijacked?
And if so, let's go in and seewhere that happened.
Let's deal with that wound.
Um, let's do some innerhealing, some prayer there, so
(24:44):
that your heart can be free andyou cannot live under, but you
can live above thatcircumstance.
You know, the Bible says hopedeferred makes the heart sick.
So let's heal that hopedeferred so you don't have a
sick heart.
Ellen Krause (24:59):
Yes, that's that's a good question that we need to
be asking ourselves as acheckpoint.
Well, Jamie, you included um,which I really love at the end
of each chapter, some incrediblereflection questions that
readers can sort of chew on thecontent and ask themselves these
same things that you've askedyourself in that same spirit.
(25:21):
What is a question you wouldwant to leave our listeners
with?
Jaime Jamgochian (25:27):
Yeah.
I think in the days and timeswe're living, um, are you truly
surrendered to the Lord and hispurpose for your life?
Because as believers, and I'mguessing um a lot of your
audience probably are Christfollowers, um, we need to be
more fired up and surrenderedthan ever for what the days
(25:50):
ahead um are gonna entail.
And that takes that posture.
I always just picture it openhands.
I'm letting go and I'm lettingGod.
I'm letting you do whatever youneed to do in my life.
So are you truly surrendered?
Are you surrendering daily tothe plans of God or are we just
coasting?
I think it's easy to coast as abeliever.
We get comfortable, we get inour rhythms.
(26:12):
Um, are we fully living out thecalling and purpose God has
placed in our life?
Because I think it's gonna takeeach one of us, whatever sphere
we're in, if we're the mostamazing mama at home raising
four world changers, right?
That is just as important asthe person traveling in
full-time ministry.
So, whatever God has called youto, are we doing it with all of
(26:34):
our hearts in a posture ofsurrender?
Um, I think that in the days tocome, that's what we're gonna
need.
Ellen Krause (26:42):
Thank you for that encouragement.
Um, it's almost something youwanted, like, you know, put a
put a sign of that up on yourwall and sort of reground
yourself periodically.
Well, such encouraging wordsfrom you, Jamie.
Where can people go to find outmore information about you and
(27:04):
your new book, Sacred Surrender?
Jaime Jamgochian (27:07):
Yeah, so the book is available wherever you
like to get books.
Amazon, Barnes and Noble,Mardell's Christian Bookstore.
Maybe you're an audiobook girlylike me, you can find the
audiobook as well.
I love to connect on socialmedia.
Uh, Instagram is probably thebest place, Facebook.
And my website's Jamie Jam, J AI M E J A M.com.
(27:29):
And uh, you can find all thosespots on jamejam.com.
My name's long Jamie JamGoshen.
So good luck with that one.
But just go to jamiejam.com andit'll help you out.
Ellen Krause (27:40):
Oh, yay, that makes it so much easier.
And we will definitely putthose links in our show notes to
make it easy for you to findher.
Well, before we go, we have toask you a couple of our favorite
questions.
What Bible is your go-to Bible,and what translation is it?
Jaime Jamgochian (27:57):
It's the NLT, the New Living Translation.
I love that one.
I started on the NIV and then Itransitioned to the NLT.
So that's my favorite Bible.
And then, did you ask me myfavorite verse?
Oh, I wasn't going to, but I'dlove for you to share.
My favorite verse is the firstverse I learned that most people
(28:18):
know.
Proverbs 3, 4, and 5.
Trust in the Lord with all yourheart.
Lean not on your ownunderstanding, but acknowledge
him in all your ways, and hewill direct your steps.
So that's the one I cling todaily.
Ellen Krause (28:33):
Love that one.
Okay.
Do you have any favoritejournaling supplies that you
like to use for do you do Biblejournaling?
Jaime Jamgochian (28:42):
I journal, but I don't do Bible journaling.
So I just have like my Bibleand a separate journal, and I'll
journal my thoughts out.
But no, I I know some friendsthat do that.
I haven't gotten into that yet.
Ellen Krause (28:54):
Okay, no problem.
Okay, lastly, what is yourfavorite app or website for
Bible study tools?
Jaime Jamgochian (29:02):
I had U version for a while, and I would
listen to um some audio Bible,but then I switched to an app
called Abide, and I would listenevery morning to the
three-minute little teaching andthe breathing, and I loved it
because I did like breath workwith the scripture.
So I like the Abide app.
Ellen Krause (29:24):
Okay, awesome.
Okay, thank you for sharingyour tips with us.
Well, JB, I just appreciate youbeing here so much, and thank
you for your vulnerability.
I know that God is using yourstory already and will continue
to do so with this book.
Um, so thank you for being withus today.
Jaime Jamgochian (29:45):
Thanks for having me on your show.
Ellen Krause (29:47):
All right, and to our listeners, I hope Jamie's
words encourage you to see yourcurrent season, whatever it
looks like, as a place where Godis still present.
Still working and stillinviting you into deeper trust.
We'll see you next time here atthe Coffee and Bible Time
(30:09):
podcast.
Until then, we pray that theGod of Hope will fill you with
all joy and peace as you trustin Him.
Have a blessed day.
The Coffee of Bible Time podcast, our goal is
to help you delight in God'sWord and thrive in Christian
living.
Each week, we talk to subjectmatter experts who broaden your
biblical understanding,encourage you in hard times, and
provide life-building tips toenhance your Christian walk.
We are so glad you have joinedus.
(00:25):
Hi, friends, and welcome backto the Coffee and Bible Time
podcast.
I'm Ellen, your host, and I'mso excited you're here for
today's conversation.
My guest today is JamieJamgoshin, a Dove
Award-nominated singer,songwriter, worship leader, and
(00:49):
someone whose walk with the Lordhas been shaped by long seasons
of waiting, unexpected detours,and deep surrender.
Over the past two decades,Jamie has experienced the highs
and lows of life and ministry.
But what is so powerful abouther story is that she hasn't
(01:09):
waited to live until the waitingis over.
Instead, she's discovered whatit means to live fully and
abundantly, even when theanswers haven't come yet.
So whether you're in a seasonof uncertainty, holding out hope
for something yet to come, orlearning to let go of what you
(01:31):
can't control, I believe Jamie'swords will speak directly to
your heart.
So grab your coffee, open yourBible, and let's dive in.
Jamie, welcome.
Jaime Jamgochian (01:41):
Thank you.
I brought my coffee.
I don't know where it is, butit's somewhere.
Ellen Krause (01:46):
Well, no worries.
I'm just glad that you're here.
Thank you.
Why don't you start out just bytelling our listeners a little
bit about you and your ministry?
Jaime Jamgochian (01:57):
Yeah.
So I have been singing, leadingworship, Christian songs since
I was 24.
I came to faith at 21 whilestudying jazz piano at Berkeley.
I was singing in the bars, thecruise lines, my funny
valentine, all of that.
And God got a hold of my lifethrough a classmate, and she was
the first one to share thegospel and tell me who Jesus is.
(02:19):
And my heart was ready, and Ithink she could see that.
And I surrendered everything.
That was my first true test ofsurrender, which I know we're
going to talk about, Ellen, in alittle bit.
But that led me from the EastCoast to Seattle, Washington,
where I laid down every musicaldream.
I was set to go to LA, NewYork.
(02:40):
Had really excelled in myprofessional career.
But the Lord said, go toSeattle and take a two-year
Bible internship at a church.
I had never seen hands raisedin worship.
I had never experienced thepower of corporate worship in my
life, was ruined and wreckedfor the glory of God in the best
way.
And that began a journey.
(03:02):
And ever since then, I did endup signing a Christian record
deal that led me here toNashville.
So I've been in ministry thelast 25 years.
I counted an honor to leadpeople into worship, to share
hope, to share what it's like togo from darkness to light, as
we all know.
I reside in the southern partof Tennessee, right outside of
(03:24):
Nashville.
I love my community here.
I have some dear friends thatwe're all kind of in the
ministry Christian music world.
So I love my community, have abeautiful family still back east
in Boston.
And after putting out sevenalbums, God was being funny, I
guess, and decided to say,You're gonna be an author.
(03:45):
I said, I'm the girl that hadthe learning disabilities.
Lord, I'm a singer.
And so I have my first bookcoming out October 7th, and
truly cling to that verse.
God will use the foolish thingsof the world to confound the
wise, because I don't think Ishould have written a book.
But here we are, and I believeit's gonna really unlock and
bring some breakthrough topeople that um have navigated
(04:08):
just long seasons of waiting orsuffering, um, or how to live an
abundant, full life, even insome empty places.
So that's a little bit aboutme.
I'm a earthy, crunchy, organic,holistic girl.
So you can find me at all theholistic uh little crunchy
markets, um, living my bestlife, drinking my golden milk
lattes.
Ellen Krause (04:28):
Oh thank you for that awesome introduction,
Jamie.
I know um because I have readyour beautifully written book
that you have had somechallenges and setbacks.
Tell us about, you know, amoment in your spiritual life
(04:48):
where you felt called to fullysurrender and trust.
Jaime Jamgochian (04:53):
Oh my goodness, I feel like it's a
daily thing, right, Alan?
Like every day, Lord, Isurrender this, or I give you
this desire, I give you thisdream.
I think one of the hardestparts of my story of surrender
would be in 2019 when on theoutside everything looked great.
I was thriving in ministry.
I had actually helped some dearfriends and pastors of mine
(05:17):
plant a church in Nashvillecalled The Belonging, you know,
part of the core small teamwhere we're just seeing it bloom
and bloom.
I was on staff there as the newChristians pastor, and I just
didn't feel well.
I can remember I was stilltaking ministry trips, singing,
leading worship on the road, andI would get home and just
something wasn't quite right.
(05:37):
Well, fast forward, I was uhfinally diagnosed with
late-stage neurological Lymedisease, which I don't ever
remember getting bit by a tick.
I I'm not an like go live inthe forest kind of girl.
I'm more of like, let's go to anice hotel.
So I'm like, how did I get aticky bite?
I don't even hike, you know?
What's funny is now I do, butuh long story.
(05:58):
Um that led me into a season oftrue surrender, truly saying,
God, this doesn't make sense.
I had to sell my condo, moveback home, have my parents care
for me.
Had to really lay down if I'dever be well again, because
there's a lot of doctors thatbelieve Lyme is incurable and
that you'll always have thesetough chronic symptoms.
(06:20):
Something in my spirit did notresonate with that.
Maybe because I'm a lateconvert and I take every word of
that Bible to be true.
And I kept saying, but the Lordsays that by his stripes I can
be healed.
And the Lord says who the sunsets free is free indeed.
So, God, I believe you can freeme from this affliction, from
this infirmity, from thissickness.
(06:42):
And um, we found a clinic inNew York that I actually now
work for very part-timeremotely, and they do advanced
Lyme cases, and I was able toget on the other side, but the
Lord invited me in that seasonafter, gosh, 20 years of travel
and just living the life andministry.
He invited me into this holyseason of suffering, of
(07:06):
surrender, where I really got tosee him in a new way and trust
him.
And I think that's probably oneof the most profound areas of
surrender where I had to giveeverything up.
If I could never talk rightagain, if I could never walk
right again.
I mean, I'm talking, it washard to get my head off the
pillow, but I found this sweetspot of joy and surrender that
(07:28):
he's enough.
And if nothing else everhappened, the cross of Jesus is
enough.
I'm saved, I know where I'mgoing.
If I never sing another note,play the piano again, which is
my favorite thing to do, God,you're enough.
And that was a great test ofsurrender.
Ellen Krause (07:46):
Jamie, I can completely relate to your story
in that I experienced somethingsimilar with an autoimmune
disease that literally left meon my bed to the point of not
able to get out of bed myself.
I mean, it is a very humblingexperience and one that God used
(08:09):
in my life as well.
So I just I I applaud you forwhat you were able to pull out
and learn from that experienceand grow in that experience.
It's a it's important toacknowledge that there are
challenges we face that are notGod's will.
(08:30):
They are consequences of livingin a fallen world.
So what does patience andsurrender look like for someone
who's in the midst of thatsituation?
Maybe someone who's right theretoday listening.
Jaime Jamgochian (08:44):
Yeah, well, patience is never hard, right?
And you know that.
I didn't know that part of yourstory when you're waiting and
waiting for breakthrough, and itjust feels like groundhog day.
Every day, the same thing,every day the same thing.
Um, but patience is a fruit ofthe spirit, and just like joy
and just like peace and justlike love, we are instructed to
(09:06):
walk in patience.
I fail daily in this area.
Um, we're a microwavegeneration, we want it now, we
want it quick.
Um, but I do think thatlearning patience, um, you you
kind of settle down a littlebit.
You don't freak out aboutthings as much.
Even last night at a Biblestudy I was teaching, we talked
(09:27):
about what position are we in?
Are we in a position of rest?
God, I trust you in thecircumstance that's not changing
that I don't understand.
Are we seated in Him and weknow our identity as a daughter
of God?
So we can be patient, we cansay, God, I don't get it, but I
trust you.
Um or, and I'm I'm not sayingI've always done this perfect,
(09:48):
we try to run ahead, right?
We try to make it happen.
We manipulate a situation tohave it happen sooner than it's
supposed to.
And something the Lord's taughtme is his timing is best.
There's a chapter in my newbook called When Your Plan A was
God's plan B, and how he reallymakes it the best plan because
(10:09):
we think we know what we want,but he's up there saying, Oh, my
daughters, oh my sons, if onlyyou could see what I have for
you.
It's so much better.
The timing might be different,the scenario might be different,
but I'm a good dad and I'm notgonna fail you.
So I think walking andpatience, although hard, it
takes grip, it takes dailydiscipline, takes character, it
(10:31):
takes integrity.
I I mean, I'm telling you, Ifail some days, but it's asking
the Lord for that fruit of thespirit.
Be careful if you pray forpatience because he will test
you.
Ellen Krause (10:44):
Yes, absolutely.
Faith and trust as we wait.
You make a note that there is adifference between waiting well
and not waiting well.
How would you describe thosetwo different scenarios?
Jaime Jamgochian (10:58):
Yeah, so the tagline of the book, uh Sacred
Surrender, the practice ofwaiting well.
I remember when we we dreamedthat up and I thought, oh, I
don't know if I wait well, Lord.
Um but then I realized in thelast 20 plus years, there's been
some significant areas in mylife that I've had to lay down
(11:19):
to the Lord and say, I'm gonnawait for your best in this area.
And I've seen him, I have seenhis faithfulness time and time
again when I take my hands off.
And waiting well, I think isthe posture of the heart.
It's saying, God, not my will,your will be done, which is back
(11:40):
to that posture of living asacred, surrendered life.
So I have tools, I have thingsI've learned along the way that
have helped me to wait well.
Some of those is I'll do atest.
Uh, I'll ask myself every day,am I jumping ahead?
Am I lagging behind?
Lord, am I right on time?
It's a prayer I'll pray, it'ssomething I'll journal, I'll see
(12:01):
what the Holy Spirit says.
Um, I can tell when I'm notwaiting well.
Something I need to do is takea step back and take care of
myself.
Um, not into like the wholeself-love movement.
I think that's very anti-Jesus.
But I do think God wants us totake care of ourselves and love
ourselves enough to be able tolove others, right?
(12:22):
So I'll I'll recognize oh, I'mnot waiting well.
I need to go on some of mysunset walks.
I need to reconnect with someof my dear friends and have some
beautiful dinners that bringlife to me and fuel, fill
yourself up, take care of you sothat you are able to wait upon
the Lord.
If not, you know, Ellen, we getin our flesh and we try to
(12:43):
figure things out and do thingson our own.
And well, we know that doesn'tbenefit us very much.
Those are a few things that Ido.
I ask trusted people in mylife, how do you think I'm doing
in this area?
You know this is hard.
You know, I've been waiting fora long time.
Give me some insight and Ilisten to what they have to say
and get their feedback.
So those are some of my tips ofhow to wait well.
Ellen Krause (13:06):
Thank you so much for that.
You know, all of those thingssort of add up, right?
When you they build upon oneanother and get you to this
place of being able to wait inpeace and trust.
There's an interesting quote Iwant to read from your book.
You say there is a pruning thathappens when we are walking
(13:28):
through a difficult situation,which causes the dead and dying
things in our life to fall tothe ground and be stripped away.
If you are being humbled in aparticular area, do not resist
it, but rather lean in evenfurther into the ways that God
is shaping you through thatchallenging time.
(13:48):
What are some ways that we cannotice where God might be
pruning us?
And what does it look like toactually lean into those
seasons?
Sounds painful.
Jaime Jamgochian (14:03):
Yeah.
Um, I remember when I became aChristian, I had the revelation
that it's no longer I that live,but Christ that lives within
me.
We die to ourselves to liveunto Christ, right?
That's the whole Christianfaith.
It's no longer me, Jamie's nolonger Ellen.
It's Christ within us.
So how do we reflect him thebest we can this side of heaven
(14:26):
until we are in glory, until weare changed in an instant,
right?
Oh, I long for that today.
I think some of the ways thatthe pruning happens is when he's
trying to highlight an area inour life that maybe he does want
to make a little bit more likehim.
Maybe it's a little rougher onthe edges, maybe we're pushing
back in some way.
(14:46):
And usually that comes throughtesting, through trials.
That's where we are pruned.
We're not pruned wheneverything's great and we're on
the mountaintop and every prayeris coming true.
We're pruned when we're down inthe valley with him, saying,
God, I need you for my nextbreath.
I need you for my nextdecision.
We're pruned when we humblycome before him and say, I can't
(15:08):
do this, but you can do this.
So I think pruning is actuallya beautiful thing, and we don't
talk about that a lot.
Like hidden seasons in Christare some of the most holy,
because that's when God isreally fortifying who we are.
So if you're being pruned rightnow, I would see that as a
loving heavenly father saying,daughter, I've got more for you.
(15:31):
Oh, if you could just seewhat's ahead.
So embrace the pruning, embracewhen there's correction,
embrace when he says, you knowwhat, you didn't quite get that
right.
I still love you, of course,but let's work on it for the
next time.
So I always feel like a pruningseason comes before typically a
next thing God's gonna do inyour life.
(15:52):
Like for me, I had to be prunedas a young believer in my early
20s and learn a lot of stuff.
And then I got the Christianrecord deal.
I couldn't have done that had Inot walked through some of
those prior seasons.
Um, even the health season, thetrial, brought me to a whole
new level of pruning.
Ellen Krause (16:11):
Yes, it's amazing how when after going through
those things, they do equip youfor what God is calling you to
do next.
You know, my husband is alandscape architect, so he is
always making sure our trees arepruned and we have this
incredibly gorgeous crab appletree.
(16:31):
And always when he prunes it,I'm thinking to myself, but it's
so beautiful right now.
And yet when he prunes it, it'slooking a little bit more bare,
but then the next year, when itactually bears fruit and has
less disease, it's just you seehow that that pruning process is
(16:53):
so prolific.
And so it it it's so cool tosee how God does that actually
in our lives.
Well, Jamie, you uh write aboutthe importance of words in
difficult seasons.
I know you're very vulnerablein your book, telling us about
some harsh words that werespoken over you when you were
(17:13):
young.
Tell us about um why thosewords are so important and what
it actually looks like to speaktruth over one another and
ourselves in those seasons.
Jaime Jamgochian (17:27):
Yeah, our words carry power.
You know, the Bible says thatthere's blessing, there's
cursing, there's life, there'sdeath in our words.
So we really need to watchthem, especially as believers.
I think even when we're uhthinking, we're like, are we
flattering someone or are wereally encouraging them?
God's really checked me latelyon the words that come out.
(17:49):
And um yeah, that story thatyou're referencing is one that
happened in my life, gosh, solong ago.
And I was seven or eight, and Ilearned about this later in
life, probably a few years afterit really happened, that I
realized the power of our words.
And I wasn't great in school, Iwas great at the social stuff,
(18:12):
the music stuff, all of that.
Personality was great.
Learning was hard, and I canremember my parents went to
their teacher-parent conference,and for whatever reason, maybe
the teacher was having a badday.
She just decided to speak somereal negative, hurtful words,
and it ended with your daughterwill amount to not much because
(18:34):
she's not comprehending, shecan't, I couldn't get words
outright, which was true.
I had to then start resourcerooms and learning centers and
the Sylvan Learning Center andspeech therapists, and so there
was truth to it, but thedelivery, and I think our words
carry power, and thank God forparents that were like, Oh no,
(18:54):
you didn't.
My little girl is gonna changethe world, and we weren't
saying, we weren't believers.
Um, that was our firstencounter, I would say, with
negative words, and you know,you can latch onto those and
think, Well, I'm never gonnalearn and I'm always gonna have
speech problems.
But actually, I flipped thatscript, and music helped that a
(19:17):
lot.
Uh, they even say that peoplethat deal with learning issues,
if you get your brain goingmusically, creatively,
statistics show it really helps.
And that was my case.
And I ended up graduating.
Kuma sum lata, top of theclass, giving the valedictorian
speech.
Um, all of that, graduate topof the class at Berkeley.
(19:37):
You can you can partner with anegative word, or you can come
out of agreement with it.
And that's for any lie that theenemy would want to throw onto
us.
You can come in agreement withthat lie, or you can see it,
validate it, say, actually, thisis not the truth of who God
says I am, and I'm gonna comeout of agreement with that, and
I'm not gonna walk in thatplace.
So that's what I chose to do,and that's how my parents chose
(20:00):
to raise me that no, you're aworld changer.
This is not gonna hold youback.
Yeah, there's some learningissues.
So I'm really careful aboutwhat I speak about other people
in their hard seasons and theirbroken seasons and their
challenges, because you don'tknow what God's gonna do with
that.
And it's just a reminder to usthat our words really do carry
(20:20):
power.
Ellen Krause (20:21):
They sure do.
And labels like that um can beso detrimental.
I'm sorry you had to go throughthat because that's that's so
hard in a kid.
I love though what you said inthe book, um what you alluded to
about music, but you also saidart.
And my my daughter Ashley waskind of similar to what you're
(20:42):
describing in learning.
And coincidentally, she was inlike an outdoor or an
out-of-school art program, andshe just blossomed and it did
exactly what you said music didfor you.
It's incredible how art andmusic can help the other side of
(21:04):
your brain.
Jaime Jamgochian (21:04):
It does.
I wish I knew the statisticbetter, but I love hearing those
stories that I tore, and I hearthese stories every night on
tour how you know my daughterwas doing so bad, and then we
got her into flute lessons, andall of a sudden, or you know, my
son, and then we got himplaying the drums and the
marching band.
And I'm like, there is there'ssomething about that side of the
brain, the creative side thatclicks on and helps the other
(21:28):
side.
Ellen Krause (21:28):
Yes.
Jaime Jamgochian (21:29):
I need to study it up.
Ellen Krause (21:31):
Absolutely.
One of the big themes in yourbook is hope.
And at one point, you ask yourreaders to consider where their
hope comes from and if it hasbeen hijacked.
So tell us what you mean bythat and how can we know if it's
happened to us?
Jaime Jamgochian (21:49):
Yeah.
I once saw someone in theairport.
I spent a lot of time therewith a t-shirt that says got
hope.
And I thought that's so cool.
And then I started to thinkabout all the places that we as
believers and people that don'tknow the Lord yet put their hope
in.
So we put our hope in ourrelational status.
If we're married, we put ourhope in our dreams coming true.
(22:11):
We put our hope in maybe evenour health, our financial
bracket, where have we reached acertain place financially?
All these things we put ourhope in.
And I remember one day the Lordreally challenged me and he
said, Do you know that I'm theauthor of hope?
And I'm like, Of course, Lord,you you know you're and he led
me to the scripture that talksabout Jesus.
Once we're born again, we areentering into the resurrection
(22:34):
power, into the living hope.
So Jesus is our actual livinghope, which I think makes so
much sense because I think youcan probably relate to this as
believers.
Even when something isdevastating or there's grief and
you've lost someone so dear toyour heart, we still have that
(22:56):
living hope within us.
We will grieve, we will be sad,yes, but we don't mourn as
those that don't have thatliving hope within us.
And so I like to challengepeople where is your hope?
Where are you placing yourhope?
Is it in the person of Jesus?
Is that your identity, or isyour hope in something that's
(23:18):
gonna happen outside of him?
I I had a few big career goals,and one of them kind of
happened several years ago, andI remember thinking I finally
got the dub nomination, and inmy genre, that's like a big
thing.
It's like the ChristianGrammys, right?
And um got the pretty dress,walked the red carpet, was in
(23:39):
the category with three peoplethat I really look up to, peers.
I didn't win, but I rememberedgetting home that night and
thinking, wow, finally, 20 yearsin, I was nominated for a Dove
Award.
And the Lord asked me aquestion, do you feel any
different?
I said, No.
He said, Do you think you wouldhave felt any different if you
(23:59):
won?
I said, No.
And it was this wake-up call tome that even though it's not a
bad thing, right?
Any earthly accolade or earthlywin, so to speak, it never
fills that god hole.
It never fills true hope orpurpose.
That's only in our relationshipwith Christ.
(24:22):
And it was such a good lessonfor me that if nothing else ever
happens in life, is my hopeanchored in you and are you
enough?
And those are questions I askmyself.
So I ask people, has your hopebeen hijacked?
And if so, let's go in and seewhere that happened.
Let's deal with that wound.
Um, let's do some innerhealing, some prayer there, so
(24:44):
that your heart can be free andyou cannot live under, but you
can live above thatcircumstance.
You know, the Bible says hopedeferred makes the heart sick.
So let's heal that hopedeferred so you don't have a
sick heart.
Ellen Krause (24:59):
Yes, that's that's a good question that we need to
be asking ourselves as acheckpoint.
Well, Jamie, you included um,which I really love at the end
of each chapter, some incrediblereflection questions that
readers can sort of chew on thecontent and ask themselves these
same things that you've askedyourself in that same spirit.
(25:21):
What is a question you wouldwant to leave our listeners
with?
Jaime Jamgochian (25:27):
Yeah.
I think in the days and timeswe're living, um, are you truly
surrendered to the Lord and hispurpose for your life?
Because as believers, and I'mguessing um a lot of your
audience probably are Christfollowers, um, we need to be
more fired up and surrenderedthan ever for what the days
(25:50):
ahead um are gonna entail.
And that takes that posture.
I always just picture it openhands.
I'm letting go and I'm lettingGod.
I'm letting you do whatever youneed to do in my life.
So are you truly surrendered?
Are you surrendering daily tothe plans of God or are we just
coasting?
I think it's easy to coast as abeliever.
We get comfortable, we get inour rhythms.
(26:12):
Um, are we fully living out thecalling and purpose God has
placed in our life?
Because I think it's gonna takeeach one of us, whatever sphere
we're in, if we're the mostamazing mama at home raising
four world changers, right?
That is just as important asthe person traveling in
full-time ministry.
So, whatever God has called youto, are we doing it with all of
(26:34):
our hearts in a posture ofsurrender?
Um, I think that in the days tocome, that's what we're gonna
need.
Ellen Krause (26:42):
Thank you for that encouragement.
Um, it's almost something youwanted, like, you know, put a
put a sign of that up on yourwall and sort of reground
yourself periodically.
Well, such encouraging wordsfrom you, Jamie.
Where can people go to find outmore information about you and
(27:04):
your new book, Sacred Surrender?
Jaime Jamgochian (27:07):
Yeah, so the book is available wherever you
like to get books.
Amazon, Barnes and Noble,Mardell's Christian Bookstore.
Maybe you're an audiobook girlylike me, you can find the
audiobook as well.
I love to connect on socialmedia.
Uh, Instagram is probably thebest place, Facebook.
And my website's Jamie Jam, J AI M E J A M.com.
(27:29):
And uh, you can find all thosespots on jamejam.com.
My name's long Jamie JamGoshen.
So good luck with that one.
But just go to jamiejam.com andit'll help you out.
Ellen Krause (27:40):
Oh, yay, that makes it so much easier.
And we will definitely putthose links in our show notes to
make it easy for you to findher.
Well, before we go, we have toask you a couple of our favorite
questions.
What Bible is your go-to Bible,and what translation is it?
Jaime Jamgochian (27:57):
It's the NLT, the New Living Translation.
I love that one.
I started on the NIV and then Itransitioned to the NLT.
So that's my favorite Bible.
And then, did you ask me myfavorite verse?
Oh, I wasn't going to, but I'dlove for you to share.
My favorite verse is the firstverse I learned that most people
(28:18):
know.
Proverbs 3, 4, and 5.
Trust in the Lord with all yourheart.
Lean not on your ownunderstanding, but acknowledge
him in all your ways, and hewill direct your steps.
So that's the one I cling todaily.
Ellen Krause (28:33):
Love that one.
Okay.
Do you have any favoritejournaling supplies that you
like to use for do you do Biblejournaling?
Jaime Jamgochian (28:42):
I journal, but I don't do Bible journaling.
So I just have like my Bibleand a separate journal, and I'll
journal my thoughts out.
But no, I I know some friendsthat do that.
I haven't gotten into that yet.
Ellen Krause (28:54):
Okay, no problem.
Okay, lastly, what is yourfavorite app or website for
Bible study tools?
Jaime Jamgochian (29:02):
I had U version for a while, and I would
listen to um some audio Bible,but then I switched to an app
called Abide, and I would listenevery morning to the
three-minute little teaching andthe breathing, and I loved it
because I did like breath workwith the scripture.
So I like the Abide app.
Ellen Krause (29:24):
Okay, awesome.
Okay, thank you for sharingyour tips with us.
Well, JB, I just appreciate youbeing here so much, and thank
you for your vulnerability.
I know that God is using yourstory already and will continue
to do so with this book.
Um, so thank you for being withus today.
Jaime Jamgochian (29:45):
Thanks for having me on your show.
Ellen Krause (29:47):
All right, and to our listeners, I hope Jamie's
words encourage you to see yourcurrent season, whatever it
looks like, as a place where Godis still present.
Still working and stillinviting you into deeper trust.
We'll see you next time here atthe Coffee and Bible Time
(30:09):
podcast.
Until then, we pray that theGod of Hope will fill you with
all joy and peace as you trustin Him.
Have a blessed day.
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