October 23, 2025 • 38 mins
The fruit of the Spirit can sound beautiful—but feel out of reach. Ava Pennington shares her journey through spiritual drought and anxiety to true fruitfulness—not through striving, but surrender to the Spirit. Join us to discover how you can flourish in Christ through the Holy Spirit's work—not by working harder, but by surrendering more fully to God's grace.
Check out Ava's new book, Flourish: Grace-Centered Practices to Protect and Grow a Fruitful Life in Christ
Scripture referenced:
- Galatians 5:22-23
- Genesis 3:1
- James 1:14
- Hebrews 10:25
- 2 Corinthians 3:18
- Romans 12:2
- Matthew 26:39
- Ephesians 6:10
Ava's favorite Bible study tools:
ESV Journaling Bible | NASB Large Print | Double-Ended Bible Highlighters | Sticky Note Set | Bible Gateway | Biblehub | Blueletter Bible
Learn more about Ava Pennington:
Website | Facebook | X | Pinterest
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Ellen Krause (00:04):
At the Coffee and Bible Time podcast.
Our goal is to help you delightin God's Word and thrive in
Christian living.
Each week we talk to subjectmatter experts who broaden your
biblical understanding,encourage you in hard times and
provide life-building tips toenhance your Christian walk.
We are so glad you have joinedus.
(00:25):
Welcome back to the Coffee andBible Time podcast.
I'm Ellen, your host, and I amso glad that you are joining us
today.
I want to start thisconversation by reading these
familiar words from Galatians 5.
But the fruit of the Spirit islove, joy, peace, patience,
(00:48):
kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.
Against such things there is nolaw.
We know so many of us know thatpassage, and we know that these
words are more than a list tostrive for.
They're evidence that the HolySpirit is alive and at work in
(01:10):
our hearts.
But if we're honest, many of usfeel like we're not bearing
that kind of fruit as often oras deeply as we would like.
Maybe patience just feels outof reach, maybe joy has faded or
maybe kindness feels costly.
If that's where you are today,this episode is for you.
(01:33):
I'm joined by Ava Pennington,author, bible teacher and
someone who has walked with Godthrough seasons of both
fruitfulness and struggle.
Ava has spent years helpingbelievers grow in their faith
with groups such as theChristian Authors Network and
Bible Study FellowshipInternational.
She is here today to share herwisdom with those of us who are
(01:56):
longing to not just lookspiritually mature, but to truly
live a fruitful life rooted inChrist.
We're going to talk about whatit means to nurture the fruit of
the Spirit, how to protect itwhen life presses in, and why
grace not striving is the soilwhere growth really happens.
(02:19):
Eva, thank you so much forjoining us today.
Ava Pennington (02:22):
Thank you for hosting me.
I appreciate it and I so agreewith what you've just said about
the focus not being just onstriving, because that is
certainly something I've had tolearn.
Ellen Krause (02:32):
Yes, me as well.
Why don't we start by havingyou share a part of your own
spiritual journey where you feltlike you weren't flourishing,
and how God met you there?
Ava Pennington (02:46):
Absolutely.
There was a season in my lifewhere I struggled with anxiety
attacks and it was a time inwhich I was actually teaching
Bible studies, I was leadingsmall groups in my church and I
felt like such a fraud becausehere I was experiencing these
(03:06):
anxiety attacks which I didn'tshare with anybody other than my
husband, and I was working in acorporate career, I was doing a
lot of international travel andthey occurred mostly when I was
in an unfamiliar venue, when Iwas somewhere that I'd never
been before.
I realize now it had a lot todo with my desire to control and
(03:27):
I was out of control in thoseunfamiliar places.
But during that season I triedeverything possible.
I memorized scripture, I readscripture.
In the middle of the panicattack or anxiety attack, I
would pull out my Bible, I wouldpray, nothing, nothing helped.
And then one day I sensed theLord impress on my heart and I,
(03:51):
you know, I didn't hear a loudvoice from heaven.
I just sensed the Holy Spiritsaying to me you trust me for
eternity.
Can you not trust me for thenext five minutes?
And I thought, okay, I can dothat.
So when the anxiety attack hit,I would look at my take off my
(04:11):
watch and look at the time andsay okay, for the next five
minutes, lord, I'm going totrust you.
And then the five minutes wereup and said okay, for the next
five minutes, I'm going to trustyou.
And it became an issue of trustand over.
It didn't change overnight, butover a period of months and
years.
The anxiety attacks vanished asGod met me with his peace, not
(04:38):
a piece I struggled for orstrove for.
Ellen Krause (04:42):
Oh, ava, thank you for just being so vulnerable
and sharing that.
I know so many people whostruggled.
I've had a panic attack beforeand it's quite frightening and,
like you said, it's when you'refeeling this out of control.
But I love how God impressed onyour heart just to trust him
and if you can do that in thosesmall increments, what a
(05:06):
beautiful thing that we'reallowing him right to do the
work, as opposed to us trying todo it all ourselves.
Ava Pennington (05:14):
Absolutely, it really did For me.
I'm somebody who wants tostrive and work and put in the
effort and accomplish the goals.
I'm very task oriented andGod's been working with me on
that too.
But it meant letting go of that, and it was only when I let go
(05:34):
of that that I was able toreceive his peace Incredible.
Ellen Krause (05:40):
Well, why don't you paint a picture for us of
what you see a flourishing,fruitful life in Christ what
that really looks observed whenwe resemble our Savior to a
greater and greater degree.
Ava Pennington (06:11):
To respond to situations, to trouble, to trial
, like he did when he was onearth, To have the priorities he
had, To love like he did, Tohave the patience he did, To
experience peace in storms theway he did, to be faithful and
gentle.
I mean all that fruit of theSpirit, really.
Those nine displays of thefruit of the Spirit are really
(06:35):
the communicable attributes ofGod.
These are his attributes.
I mean we can't have all ofGod's attributes.
Obviously, right, he hasattributes like being omnipotent
, all-powerful or omniscient,all-knowing.
Those are attributes thatbelong to him alone.
But the communicable ones andwhat I mean by that word is that
the ones he can communicate tous and grow in us are attributes
(07:00):
such as the fruit of the Spirit, and so the more we can
resemble Christ.
I think that's a picture of aflourishing life and it's
exemplified in these individualfacets of the fruit.
Ellen Krause (07:17):
You do such an excellent job, you know in the
book of kind of laying out eachone of those and what you said,
that we want to grow to looklike Christ.
But unless we know what Christlooks like, unless we are
prioritizing studying andreading God's word and knowing
who Christ is and what thosecharacters are, that we will
(07:41):
struggle with that.
And I love how you said in yourexample of love that Satan
that's something that he wantsto do is distract us from loving
God first and reallyunderstanding who Christ is.
Ava Pennington (07:56):
I think often Satan's tactics and he has a
number of them and I do gothrough them in the book but I
think often we look for we wantto be on guard for a frontal
attack from Satan, that he'sgoing to attack our love and say
you can't love this person, andhe does that.
But often his attacks are notfrontal attacks.
(08:20):
They come in the back door orthe side door, where all he has
to do is distract us, change ourpriorities, get us to focus on
other things, focus on our ownneeds or our own desires, our
own agenda, our own wants, andit's not a frontal attack, so
we're not on guard against it.
And that's one of the things,one of his tactics that he uses
(08:43):
to attack all of the fruit ofthe spirit.
We need to be on guard andthat's when I wrote the book.
It was just something I wantedto focus on.
Why are we struggling so much?
And maybe it's because we'reexpecting attacks to come from
one direction and they're comingfrom another.
Ellen Krause (09:01):
Absolutely.
Ava Pennington (09:12):
Hmm, absolutely, what's one practical way that
we can actually protect ourspiritual growth when we feel
like we're under attack?
Independent person Surrenderhas never come easy for me and,
frankly, the problem for many ofus is that, especially myself,
is that we don't know how tosurrender, because the word
(09:35):
surrender has such negativeconnotations, especially in our
Western culture, where surrenderis equated with weakness, and
so we need to or let me startwith me, I needed to learn how
to surrender to God.
I think, again, it boils downto trust, and I love.
(09:57):
There's a great quote from CSLewis that I think describes the
issue so authentically.
See, as Lewis said, we're notnecessarily doubting that God
will do his best for us.
We're just wondering howpainful the best will turn out
to be.
And isn't that often how weview trusting and surrendering
(10:19):
to God?
I want to surrender, I say I am, but then, when trials hit, I'm
wondering okay, you know, Iknow God knows what's best and
he's going to do his best for me, but how much is it going to
hurt?
You know, and again, that's theenemy, appealing to our natural
tendency to want to becomfortable and to pursue
(10:40):
convenience.
So the enemy doesn't have towork very hard.
I think often we blame theenemy for so much.
You know it's the devil's fault, and I wish this weren't true.
But all too often in my ownlife I cooperate with the enemy
in what he's doing so that hedoesn't have to work very hard,
because I'm giving in to my ownnatural desires.
Ellen Krause (11:02):
Right, right.
Well, I was just thinking aboutthe idea of surrender, and
Satan targets our need forcontrol right, and so
surrendering is very hard whenwe want to stay in control
Absolutely.
Ava Pennington (11:20):
Absolutely, and this is coming from.
Absolutely, and this is comingfrom.
Ellen Krause (11:28):
I call myself a recovering control addict.
Yes, I think most of us are toone degree or another.
For sure, you mentioned how theenemy can steal from our
spiritual lives.
Share a little bit about howour listeners can identify those
losses and use biblicalprinciples to reclaim them.
Ava Pennington (11:47):
Sure, we talk about the enemy stealing our
fruit often, that he steals ourjoy how many times?
I mean, I think there are booksthat are written on joy
stealers or peace stealers, andso we use that term.
And the enemy can't actuallysteal what God has given us,
even though it feels that way,and so we use that word to
(12:07):
describe it.
But what he actually does ishe's very practiced at
distracting our focus with liesand planting doubts and serving
up temptations that are gearedto our natural desires.
And the best weapon, the bestway to identify those points of
(12:28):
vulnerability and identify thebiblical principles that God has
given us, to reclaim thoseareas of vulnerability, I
believe, is to know the Word ofGod well, To not just read it
but to study it and tounderstand what God is teaching
us, Because the word of Godincludes encouragement and
(12:49):
exhortation, but it alsoincludes warnings and
preparation to stand against thethings that get in the way of
what God is trying to do andgrow in our life.
I mean those lies and doubts.
They go all the way back toGenesis.
When you know, what did Satansay to Eve?
(13:09):
Did God say?
We need to know what God hassaid.
We need to know what the Wordsays.
We need to be aware oftemptations.
I mean, James 1.14 talks abouthow, when we're tempted, when
we're lured and enticed by ourown desires and we think I'll be
(13:30):
prepared for that frontalattack of Satan and we don't
understand that, that particularverse, the words lured and
enticed in the original Greekthey referred to terms that were
used in setting hunting trapsand fishing with bait.
So we're prepared for thatfrontal attack and meanwhile
(13:51):
Satan is setting a sneaky littletrap or he's luring us in with
bait that looks very attractiveto us and our guard is let down.
So I keep coming back.
I know, you know, most of yourlisteners might say, yeah, yeah,
yeah, we know We've got tostudy God's word.
But yes, we do, we absolutelydo.
(14:11):
What a wonderful weapon God hasgiven us, not just a tool to
grow, but a weapon to standagainst the things that would
get between us and God.
Ellen Krause (14:24):
I couldn't agree with you more, ava, and I would
just add to that at leastsomething that has helped me in
addition to studying God's wordis doing that together with
other believers and some type ofa Bible study group, because
I've gleaned so much just fromwhat other people have shared
(14:49):
and things that are going on intheir life that maybe they're
struggling with.
I'm not right now, but I mightbe one day, and just having sort
of a more expansiveunderstanding of God's word and
how people use it in their lives, I think in that group setting
is just so powerful.
Ava Pennington (15:10):
Absolutely.
I think one of the tactics ofSatan is to isolate us and to
make us think that we're theonly one going through this.
So we can't let anybody elseknow our struggles, because what
would they think of us?
They wouldn't think that wewere this wonderful, mature
(15:31):
included discussion questions atthe end of each chapter of the
book because to me, we grow incommunity.
You know, there are no lonerangers in the church and that's
why the Bible tells us don'tforget to get and we learn.
(15:54):
I mean, as I opened up and toldpeople about my anxiety attacks,
it took me a long time to beable to open up.
I mean, I was a Bible teacherback then and how could I do
this?
But the more I opened up, thenpeople felt safe to say you know
, I've been experiencing thattoo, and all of a sudden you
don't feel alone.
Now you know we're in communityand we can help each other and
(16:18):
encourage each other.
Not that the answers are goingto come from each other, the
answers are going to come fromGod's Word.
But we can encourage each otherto search for those answers
together.
Ellen Krause (16:29):
Absolutely Amen to that.
Eva, were there any challengesthat you faced while studying
and writing about the fruit ofthe Spirit, and how did you
balance staying boththeologically rich while also
being practical?
Ava Pennington (16:48):
Well, the first challenge was starting with my
own dissatisfaction.
Why didn't I have more peaceand joy, and you know all of the
patience and why.
What was the disconnect?
Where was the disconnect?
What was I missing?
And that's one of the reasonsthat, as I I mean, I was
(17:08):
structuring the book and tryingto figure out the best way to
structure it, and I ended up ineach chapter, starting with how
the enemy works, what worksagainst our fruit, and then the
next section of each chapter wasokay, what does God say about
our fruit?
Because I don't know about you,ellen, but often what I think
(17:29):
on a subject and what God saysabout that subject aren't always
the same thing.
So I need to see how God viewshis fruit, and I learned as I
was writing that I needed tochange the way I viewed some of
the facets of the fruit of theSpirit, and the biggest
challenge for me was applying itnot just writing it for
(17:49):
somebody else, but applying it.
And I can tell you that after Iwrote the chapter on patients, I
wrote this chapter and then Iexperienced a season of some
health issues.
I had several surgeries all atonce and it was just.
It was a crazy, crazy time andpeople would ask me well, you
know, how are you doing, how'sthe recovery going?
And I would say, oh, it's fine,it's moving in the right
(18:09):
direction, but I'm just soimpatient because it's not
moving fast enough.
I need it to move faster.
But I'm just so impatientbecause it's not moving fast
enough, I need it to move faster.
And I must have responded thatway once too many times, because
one day after I had had thatconversation with a friend in my
quiet time the next morning Ijust felt the Holy Spirit saying
(18:30):
to me you're impatient.
Huh, didn't you just write awhole chapter on patience?
Maybe you need to go back andreread what you wrote, because
it's not just for your readers,it's for you, ava.
And again, when I've sharedthat, somebody said well, how do
you know you weren't justtelling yourself that?
I said I promise you I wouldnever have told myself that.
(18:50):
But isn't God so good and sogracious that he speaks to our
heart and he teaches us from hisword and that, with the
indwelling, holy Spirit is therenot just to convict but to
encourage too?
And so I really appreciatedthat conviction.
(19:11):
It's just the goodness of Godtoward us.
Yes, absolutely, and you know insome respects it's kind of like
a wink.
Ellen Krause (19:28):
You know God winking saying Ava, remember,
Hello, I gave you the spirit towrite that chapter and right to
to use um is so importantactually.
Well, that's kind of wanted totalk about just encouraging
people in the practicalapplication.
There was a paragraph in yourbook that I just want to read
for our listeners because Ithink it'll be helpful for the
(19:50):
next part of this conversation.
You said the fruit of theSpirit isn't intended for me to
feel better about myself.
Each of the nine displays offruit serves two primary
purposes.
First, for us to become morelike Christ, to give him the
glory among his people.
And second, to grow us asvessels through which the Lord
(20:14):
blesses others.
After all, a tree does not feedon its own fruit.
Rather, it produces fruit tofeed others.
So, really, what you're sayingis the fruit of the Spirit has
these two main purposes becominglike Christ and blessing others
.
How can we stay focused on both, especially when life feels
(20:37):
very overwhelming or spirituallydry?
Ava Pennington (20:42):
And that does happen, right, life does.
It can feel overwhelming and itcan feel spiritually dry.
That's a reality, I think.
From my own experience and fromtalking with others, we've been
taught that the priority of theChristian life is giving to and
serving others.
(21:02):
Right, we're always to beother-focused, not self-focused,
but we're severely limited inour ability to give if we aren't
growing ourselves.
And so it's two sides of thesame coin.
If we're feeling overwhelmed bylife or if I'm feeling as if I'm
stuck in a spiritual wilderness, my first step is to ask why?
(21:27):
Why am I feeling this way?
Have I taken my eyes off theLord?
Have I taken my focus off him?
Am I giving in and throwingmyself a pity party because life
isn't working out the way Iwant it to, and I've thrown my
share of pity parties over theyears?
Or maybe what lies have Ifallen for that I didn't realize
(21:50):
?
And it's only then that I'mfree to share the fruit of the
Holy Spirit, as he's nurturingit in me and I'm cooperating
with Him that I can then shareit with others.
So I think there is that focuson both, understanding that I
(22:13):
can't give unless I am growingin my relationship with the Lord
, and unless I am seeing himnurture that fruit in me, we
can't give what we don't have.
Ellen Krause (22:25):
Right, that makes so much, so much sense.
A lot of us feel like wenaturally show some fruit of the
spirit, maybe more than others,and then we really struggle
with one in particular.
What would you say to the womanwho feels like there is one
(22:46):
fruit she just doesn't see inher life at all?
Ava Pennington (22:51):
I can so relate to that, ellen, I promise you I
am naturally drawn to certainaspects of the fruit.
You know love, talking aboutlove and joy and peace.
When we get to the topics ofpatience and self-control, you
know not so much those, you know, those are a little more
convicting.
Those are a little moreconvicting.
(23:12):
There's always going to beareas that God is going to work
on in us and I think even withthe fruit that we feel
comfortable with and we think,oh, I don't have to work on
those, I'm good, there's alwaysroom for growth and improvement.
Right, wanting to peel backanother layer of that onion and
(23:33):
just see what's the next step ofgrowth.
But it's also willing to behonest with ourselves.
I'll give you an example.
When I first taught on thefruit of the spirit years ago,
early in my Christian walk, Ihad a class at church and it was
a nine-week class or 10-weekclass, and so I started each
(23:57):
week, especially the firstcouple of weeks.
I started by welcoming thepeople who were there and
letting them know this is aclass on the fruit of the Spirit
and we're going to talk aboutlove, joy, peace, patience,
kindness, goodness, faithfulnessand self-control.
And I would hold out my fingersand every time I would look at
(24:17):
my fingers and say wait a minute, that's only eight fingers.
What?
Which?
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah,gentleness Forgot that one.
Well, that happened two orthree weeks in a row and at one
point on the third week, one ofthe class members, who was a
friend and she said it with asmile and I loved her for it but
after I did that for a thirdweek in a row, went through the
(24:39):
whole list, came up with eightfingers up and thinking okay,
what am I missing?
She laughed and she said maybeyou're missing, gentleness,
because that's the one God wantsto work on in your life.
And we all laughed.
The class laughed, I laughedand I looked at her and I said
you're absolutely right, that isan area that God has been
(24:59):
working on in me.
I came out of a corporateculture.
I worked on Wall Street, gent.
I appreciated.
You know we all laughed at thejoke, but that was a fruit I
needed to focus on.
So we all have that.
(25:23):
You know.
Don't be discouraged that weall have to work on all of them,
and God is working on all ofthem in us.
So don't be discouraged, but beopen to the Holy Spirit's
conviction and encouragement andequipping as he nurtures all of
the fruit.
I often say it's not, we don'tpick and choose the fruit.
(25:44):
It's one fruit, nine aspects ofthe one fruit of the Spirit,
and it's a package deal.
In God's eyes it's a packagedeal.
They're not separate.
They're not nine differentfruit trees with nine different
fruit.
It's one tree with ninedifferent aspects of the fruit.
Ellen Krause (26:04):
And that, to me, is so encouraging, that God does
give that gift of all of themto us, gift of all of them to us
, and through his grace we canstep by step grow in sort of the
sanctification process ofbecoming more like Christ.
What would you say would be oneor two grace-centered practices
(26:30):
from your book Flourish thatlisteners can begin using today
even?
Ava Pennington (26:37):
I think it goes back to resembling Christ and
the concept of surrender andgrowing in our resemblance to
Christ.
The Bible speaks of beingtransformed or conformed to the
image of Christ, and one thing Ihad to learn the hard way is
that cannot happen by tryingharder, working smarter and
(26:57):
doing better.
That's not how it happens.
It happens through surrender,just as Christ, in his earthly
ministry, was fully surrenderedto the will of his Father.
I mean, let's face it, how manytimes have we come across a
difficult situation or a person,a difficult person, and we grit
(27:19):
our teeth and we vow to be morepatient.
If it kills us, we're going tobe more patient with that person
, only to fail miserably.
And so then what do we do?
We beat ourselves up and wedetermine the next time I'm in
that situation or the next timeI see that person, I'm going to
try harder.
And we end up in a constantcycle of failure.
(27:42):
That affects not just ourspiritual health, but it affects
our mental and emotional healthtoo, because when we are in
that situation again, we justtense up and we've got that knot
in our stomach.
You know that I am going to dobetter.
The alternative is to rest inGod's grace and draw strength
from the Holy Spirit, not justdaily.
(28:03):
I gave up on asking for thatdaily a long time ago, minute by
minute.
We need his grace and hisstrength.
There's a Bible verse, and Ithink it's in Galatians, where
Paul says be strong in thestrength of his might.
And if you think about that,there's two pieces to that.
(28:24):
We're to be strong, but what'sthe source of our strength?
It's his might, not ours.
So it's not about me committingto trying harder, working
smarter, doing better.
I'm going to be strong, I'mgoing to pull it up from my toes
if I have to, but it's beingstrong in his strength.
(28:45):
And that brings us back tosurrender A word.
It has taken me a long time tobe able to stay without
clenching my teeth.
Okay, we just it's, but it'skey to the Christian life and
it's key to the Holy Spirit andnurturing his fruit in our life.
Ellen Krause (29:06):
Absolutely.
I would add to that to justprayer and asking God to help us
with accepting his grace and tohelp us to be able to surrender
.
And the other thing, too, isjust I find that having the
accountability, anaccountability partner, to say,
(29:30):
hey, I'm struggling with one ofthese, maybe it's self-control,
maybe it's shopping for me,shopping I'm struggling with
that, or whatever it might befor someone else and just trying
asking to be lifted up inprayer, understanding those
(29:50):
sneaky attacks, like you said,of the enemy and things to watch
out for and be on the alert for, that might be distracting my
attention.
And so thank you so much forjust sharing that.
Those very simple things, butthings that we don't, you know,
necessarily focus on like weshould be.
Ava Pennington (30:15):
And you're absolutely right.
Surrender involves going to theLord and saying I don't have
the ability, I don't have thecapacity.
Lord, I need you to give thatto me.
I need it to come from you, asyour Holy Spirit works in my
life.
We have that privilege.
I mean, that's what Jesus didfor us.
He restored us our relationshipwith the Father, and yet all
(30:40):
too often we still try to dothings on our own.
Ellen Krause (30:42):
Right, right, Eva.
Where can listeners go to findout more information about you
and your ministry and your book?
Ava Pennington (30:52):
Well, the primary starting place would be
my website, and my website is myname, so it's avapenningtoncom.
You can learn about the booksthat I've written and my social
media links, and I want toencourage your listeners in the
coming months.
The book officially releases inOctober and so once the book's
out, I will be hosting a monthlyfruit of the spirit challenge
(31:16):
on social media.
So we're going to do achallenge, you know a month of
kindness or patience, and we'regoing to have some fun
activities focusing on the ninefacets of the fruit, and I hope
your listeners will join us Onthe Nine Facets of the Fruit.
Ellen Krause (31:30):
And I hope your listeners will join us.
I love that.
Okay, well, we will make surewe include those links in our
show notes.
Eva, before you go, I have toask a couple of our favorite
questions.
We ask all of our guests whatBible is your go-to Bible and
what translation is it?
Ava Pennington (31:50):
Well, I actually have two go-tos.
One is my for just reading,just reading, I use the ESV, the
English Standard Version.
It's conversational enough, butit's very accurate and so
that's a favorite for me.
But for in-depth Bible study,my go-to is the New American
Standard Bible, the NASB,because I find that, while it's
(32:16):
not quite as conversational asthe ESV, often when I look up
words from other translationsand they say, well, you know,
this is what it means, and thenI go to my NASB and that's the
word that they actually use.
So I have one for just readingand one for in-depth study.
Ellen Krause (32:40):
Excellent, okay, thanks for sharing that.
Do you have any favorite Biblejournaling supplies that you
like to use?
Ava Pennington (32:46):
Okay, don't judge me, but I am a highlighter
fanatic, highlighters andpost-it notes, and I have
highlighters in every color youcan imagine and that's my
weakness.
Oh, fun.
Ellen Krause (33:03):
That's so great.
Okay, lastly, what is yourfavorite app or website for
Bible study tools?
Ava Pennington (33:12):
I have three.
One is BibleGatewaycom that Iuse for larger passages and kind
of chunks of the Bible.
It also has some greatcommentaries as well.
And then I use BibleHubcom whenI want to compare translations
of individual verses.
So if I'm looking for a verseand I specifically want to see
(33:36):
how various translations handleit, I'll type the verse in
BibleHubcom and it pops up alist of all the different
translations of that particularverse.
So I get to compare and thathelps add a richness where it's
all on one screen.
And then my third and I thinkit's probably my ultimate
(33:59):
favorite would beblueletterbibleorg, because that
not only you can type in anytranslation you want, but that
gives you Greek and Hebrew wordmeanings.
It gives you tools to reallysee so I can look up and look up
a verse, find the word.
It'll tell me the Greek orHebrew definition.
It'll also tell me where elseit was used in the Bible and of
(34:22):
course it has commentaries andother tools as well.
So if I had to pick up thethree, that would probably be my
ultimate favorite.
But I have direct shortcutlinks to all three of those
websites on my laptop and I'mclicking in and out of all three
of them constantly.
Ellen Krause (34:42):
Great advice.
Okay, thank you so much forsharing those with us.
And, ava, what a pleasure tohave had you with us enjoying
your teaching today.
It's been such a delight.
Ava Pennington (34:55):
Well, thank you, I've just enjoyed having a
conversation with you, so thanksAll right.
Ellen Krause (35:00):
You are welcome to our listeners.
If you want to learn how tobetter nurture the fruit of the
spirit from a Grace-FilledApproach, I hope you'll check
out Ava's book called Flourish.
We have it linked for you inthe show notes.
Thank you all for listening.
May God bless you as youcontinue to grow in love, joy,
(35:21):
peace and every good thing he'scultivating in your life.
Until next time, keepflourishing in Him.
At the Coffee and Bible Time podcast.
Our goal is to help you delightin God's Word and thrive in
Christian living.
Each week we talk to subjectmatter experts who broaden your
biblical understanding,encourage you in hard times and
provide life-building tips toenhance your Christian walk.
We are so glad you have joinedus.
(00:25):
Welcome back to the Coffee andBible Time podcast.
I'm Ellen, your host, and I amso glad that you are joining us
today.
I want to start thisconversation by reading these
familiar words from Galatians 5.
But the fruit of the Spirit islove, joy, peace, patience,
(00:48):
kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.
Against such things there is nolaw.
We know so many of us know thatpassage, and we know that these
words are more than a list tostrive for.
They're evidence that the HolySpirit is alive and at work in
(01:10):
our hearts.
But if we're honest, many of usfeel like we're not bearing
that kind of fruit as often oras deeply as we would like.
Maybe patience just feels outof reach, maybe joy has faded or
maybe kindness feels costly.
If that's where you are today,this episode is for you.
(01:33):
I'm joined by Ava Pennington,author, bible teacher and
someone who has walked with Godthrough seasons of both
fruitfulness and struggle.
Ava has spent years helpingbelievers grow in their faith
with groups such as theChristian Authors Network and
Bible Study FellowshipInternational.
She is here today to share herwisdom with those of us who are
(01:56):
longing to not just lookspiritually mature, but to truly
live a fruitful life rooted inChrist.
We're going to talk about whatit means to nurture the fruit of
the Spirit, how to protect itwhen life presses in, and why
grace not striving is the soilwhere growth really happens.
(02:19):
Eva, thank you so much forjoining us today.
Ava Pennington (02:22):
Thank you for hosting me.
I appreciate it and I so agreewith what you've just said about
the focus not being just onstriving, because that is
certainly something I've had tolearn.
Ellen Krause (02:32):
Yes, me as well.
Why don't we start by havingyou share a part of your own
spiritual journey where you feltlike you weren't flourishing,
and how God met you there?
Ava Pennington (02:46):
Absolutely.
There was a season in my lifewhere I struggled with anxiety
attacks and it was a time inwhich I was actually teaching
Bible studies, I was leadingsmall groups in my church and I
felt like such a fraud becausehere I was experiencing these
(03:06):
anxiety attacks which I didn'tshare with anybody other than my
husband, and I was working in acorporate career, I was doing a
lot of international travel andthey occurred mostly when I was
in an unfamiliar venue, when Iwas somewhere that I'd never
been before.
I realize now it had a lot todo with my desire to control and
(03:27):
I was out of control in thoseunfamiliar places.
But during that season I triedeverything possible.
I memorized scripture, I readscripture.
In the middle of the panicattack or anxiety attack, I
would pull out my Bible, I wouldpray, nothing, nothing helped.
And then one day I sensed theLord impress on my heart and I,
(03:51):
you know, I didn't hear a loudvoice from heaven.
I just sensed the Holy Spiritsaying to me you trust me for
eternity.
Can you not trust me for thenext five minutes?
And I thought, okay, I can dothat.
So when the anxiety attack hit,I would look at my take off my
(04:11):
watch and look at the time andsay okay, for the next five
minutes, lord, I'm going totrust you.
And then the five minutes wereup and said okay, for the next
five minutes, I'm going to trustyou.
And it became an issue of trustand over.
It didn't change overnight, butover a period of months and
years.
The anxiety attacks vanished asGod met me with his peace, not
(04:38):
a piece I struggled for orstrove for.
Ellen Krause (04:42):
Oh, ava, thank you for just being so vulnerable
and sharing that.
I know so many people whostruggled.
I've had a panic attack beforeand it's quite frightening and,
like you said, it's when you'refeeling this out of control.
But I love how God impressed onyour heart just to trust him
and if you can do that in thosesmall increments, what a
(05:06):
beautiful thing that we'reallowing him right to do the
work, as opposed to us trying todo it all ourselves.
Ava Pennington (05:14):
Absolutely, it really did For me.
I'm somebody who wants tostrive and work and put in the
effort and accomplish the goals.
I'm very task oriented andGod's been working with me on
that too.
But it meant letting go of that, and it was only when I let go
(05:34):
of that that I was able toreceive his peace Incredible.
Ellen Krause (05:40):
Well, why don't you paint a picture for us of
what you see a flourishing,fruitful life in Christ what
that really looks observed whenwe resemble our Savior to a
greater and greater degree.
Ava Pennington (06:11):
To respond to situations, to trouble, to trial
, like he did when he was onearth, To have the priorities he
had, To love like he did, Tohave the patience he did, To
experience peace in storms theway he did, to be faithful and
gentle.
I mean all that fruit of theSpirit, really.
Those nine displays of thefruit of the Spirit are really
(06:35):
the communicable attributes ofGod.
These are his attributes.
I mean we can't have all ofGod's attributes.
Obviously, right, he hasattributes like being omnipotent
, all-powerful or omniscient,all-knowing.
Those are attributes thatbelong to him alone.
But the communicable ones andwhat I mean by that word is that
the ones he can communicate tous and grow in us are attributes
(07:00):
such as the fruit of the Spirit, and so the more we can
resemble Christ.
I think that's a picture of aflourishing life and it's
exemplified in these individualfacets of the fruit.
Ellen Krause (07:17):
You do such an excellent job, you know in the
book of kind of laying out eachone of those and what you said,
that we want to grow to looklike Christ.
But unless we know what Christlooks like, unless we are
prioritizing studying andreading God's word and knowing
who Christ is and what thosecharacters are, that we will
(07:41):
struggle with that.
And I love how you said in yourexample of love that Satan
that's something that he wantsto do is distract us from loving
God first and reallyunderstanding who Christ is.
Ava Pennington (07:56):
I think often Satan's tactics and he has a
number of them and I do gothrough them in the book but I
think often we look for we wantto be on guard for a frontal
attack from Satan, that he'sgoing to attack our love and say
you can't love this person, andhe does that.
But often his attacks are notfrontal attacks.
(08:20):
They come in the back door orthe side door, where all he has
to do is distract us, change ourpriorities, get us to focus on
other things, focus on our ownneeds or our own desires, our
own agenda, our own wants, andit's not a frontal attack, so
we're not on guard against it.
And that's one of the things,one of his tactics that he uses
(08:43):
to attack all of the fruit ofthe spirit.
We need to be on guard andthat's when I wrote the book.
It was just something I wantedto focus on.
Why are we struggling so much?
And maybe it's because we'reexpecting attacks to come from
one direction and they're comingfrom another.
Ellen Krause (09:01):
Absolutely.
Ava Pennington (09:12):
Hmm, absolutely, what's one practical way that
we can actually protect ourspiritual growth when we feel
like we're under attack?
Independent person Surrenderhas never come easy for me and,
frankly, the problem for many ofus is that, especially myself,
is that we don't know how tosurrender, because the word
(09:35):
surrender has such negativeconnotations, especially in our
Western culture, where surrenderis equated with weakness, and
so we need to or let me startwith me, I needed to learn how
to surrender to God.
I think, again, it boils downto trust, and I love.
(09:57):
There's a great quote from CSLewis that I think describes the
issue so authentically.
See, as Lewis said, we're notnecessarily doubting that God
will do his best for us.
We're just wondering howpainful the best will turn out
to be.
And isn't that often how weview trusting and surrendering
(10:19):
to God?
I want to surrender, I say I am, but then, when trials hit, I'm
wondering okay, you know, Iknow God knows what's best and
he's going to do his best for me, but how much is it going to
hurt?
You know, and again, that's theenemy, appealing to our natural
tendency to want to becomfortable and to pursue
(10:40):
convenience.
So the enemy doesn't have towork very hard.
I think often we blame theenemy for so much.
You know it's the devil's fault, and I wish this weren't true.
But all too often in my ownlife I cooperate with the enemy
in what he's doing so that hedoesn't have to work very hard,
because I'm giving in to my ownnatural desires.
Ellen Krause (11:02):
Right, right.
Well, I was just thinking aboutthe idea of surrender, and
Satan targets our need forcontrol right, and so
surrendering is very hard whenwe want to stay in control
Absolutely.
Ava Pennington (11:20):
Absolutely, and this is coming from.
Absolutely, and this is comingfrom.
Ellen Krause (11:28):
I call myself a recovering control addict.
Yes, I think most of us are toone degree or another.
For sure, you mentioned how theenemy can steal from our
spiritual lives.
Share a little bit about howour listeners can identify those
losses and use biblicalprinciples to reclaim them.
Ava Pennington (11:47):
Sure, we talk about the enemy stealing our
fruit often, that he steals ourjoy how many times?
I mean, I think there are booksthat are written on joy
stealers or peace stealers, andso we use that term.
And the enemy can't actuallysteal what God has given us,
even though it feels that way,and so we use that word to
(12:07):
describe it.
But what he actually does ishe's very practiced at
distracting our focus with liesand planting doubts and serving
up temptations that are gearedto our natural desires.
And the best weapon, the bestway to identify those points of
(12:28):
vulnerability and identify thebiblical principles that God has
given us, to reclaim thoseareas of vulnerability, I
believe, is to know the Word ofGod well, To not just read it
but to study it and tounderstand what God is teaching
us, Because the word of Godincludes encouragement and
(12:49):
exhortation, but it alsoincludes warnings and
preparation to stand against thethings that get in the way of
what God is trying to do andgrow in our life.
I mean those lies and doubts.
They go all the way back toGenesis.
When you know, what did Satansay to Eve?
(13:09):
Did God say?
We need to know what God hassaid.
We need to know what the Wordsays.
We need to be aware oftemptations.
I mean, James 1.14 talks abouthow, when we're tempted, when
we're lured and enticed by ourown desires and we think I'll be
(13:30):
prepared for that frontalattack of Satan and we don't
understand that, that particularverse, the words lured and
enticed in the original Greekthey referred to terms that were
used in setting hunting trapsand fishing with bait.
So we're prepared for thatfrontal attack and meanwhile
(13:51):
Satan is setting a sneaky littletrap or he's luring us in with
bait that looks very attractiveto us and our guard is let down.
So I keep coming back.
I know, you know, most of yourlisteners might say, yeah, yeah,
yeah, we know We've got tostudy God's word.
But yes, we do, we absolutelydo.
(14:11):
What a wonderful weapon God hasgiven us, not just a tool to
grow, but a weapon to standagainst the things that would
get between us and God.
Ellen Krause (14:24):
I couldn't agree with you more, ava, and I would
just add to that at leastsomething that has helped me in
addition to studying God's wordis doing that together with
other believers and some type ofa Bible study group, because
I've gleaned so much just fromwhat other people have shared
(14:49):
and things that are going on intheir life that maybe they're
struggling with.
I'm not right now, but I mightbe one day, and just having sort
of a more expansiveunderstanding of God's word and
how people use it in their lives, I think in that group setting
is just so powerful.
Ava Pennington (15:10):
Absolutely.
I think one of the tactics ofSatan is to isolate us and to
make us think that we're theonly one going through this.
So we can't let anybody elseknow our struggles, because what
would they think of us?
They wouldn't think that wewere this wonderful, mature
(15:31):
included discussion questions atthe end of each chapter of the
book because to me, we grow incommunity.
You know, there are no lonerangers in the church and that's
why the Bible tells us don'tforget to get and we learn.
(15:54):
I mean, as I opened up and toldpeople about my anxiety attacks,
it took me a long time to beable to open up.
I mean, I was a Bible teacherback then and how could I do
this?
But the more I opened up, thenpeople felt safe to say you know
, I've been experiencing thattoo, and all of a sudden you
don't feel alone.
Now you know we're in communityand we can help each other and
(16:18):
encourage each other.
Not that the answers are goingto come from each other, the
answers are going to come fromGod's Word.
But we can encourage each otherto search for those answers
together.
Ellen Krause (16:29):
Absolutely Amen to that.
Eva, were there any challengesthat you faced while studying
and writing about the fruit ofthe Spirit, and how did you
balance staying boththeologically rich while also
being practical?
Ava Pennington (16:48):
Well, the first challenge was starting with my
own dissatisfaction.
Why didn't I have more peaceand joy, and you know all of the
patience and why.
What was the disconnect?
Where was the disconnect?
What was I missing?
And that's one of the reasonsthat, as I I mean, I was
(17:08):
structuring the book and tryingto figure out the best way to
structure it, and I ended up ineach chapter, starting with how
the enemy works, what worksagainst our fruit, and then the
next section of each chapter wasokay, what does God say about
our fruit?
Because I don't know about you,ellen, but often what I think
(17:29):
on a subject and what God saysabout that subject aren't always
the same thing.
So I need to see how God viewshis fruit, and I learned as I
was writing that I needed tochange the way I viewed some of
the facets of the fruit of theSpirit, and the biggest
challenge for me was applying itnot just writing it for
(17:49):
somebody else, but applying it.
And I can tell you that after Iwrote the chapter on patients, I
wrote this chapter and then Iexperienced a season of some
health issues.
I had several surgeries all atonce and it was just.
It was a crazy, crazy time andpeople would ask me well, you
know, how are you doing, how'sthe recovery going?
And I would say, oh, it's fine,it's moving in the right
(18:09):
direction, but I'm just soimpatient because it's not
moving fast enough.
I need it to move faster.
But I'm just so impatientbecause it's not moving fast
enough, I need it to move faster.
And I must have responded thatway once too many times, because
one day after I had had thatconversation with a friend in my
quiet time the next morning Ijust felt the Holy Spirit saying
(18:30):
to me you're impatient.
Huh, didn't you just write awhole chapter on patience?
Maybe you need to go back andreread what you wrote, because
it's not just for your readers,it's for you, ava.
And again, when I've sharedthat, somebody said well, how do
you know you weren't justtelling yourself that?
I said I promise you I wouldnever have told myself that.
(18:50):
But isn't God so good and sogracious that he speaks to our
heart and he teaches us from hisword and that, with the
indwelling, holy Spirit is therenot just to convict but to
encourage too?
And so I really appreciatedthat conviction.
(19:11):
It's just the goodness of Godtoward us.
Yes, absolutely, and you know insome respects it's kind of like
a wink.
Ellen Krause (19:28):
You know God winking saying Ava, remember,
Hello, I gave you the spirit towrite that chapter and right to
to use um is so importantactually.
Well, that's kind of wanted totalk about just encouraging
people in the practicalapplication.
There was a paragraph in yourbook that I just want to read
for our listeners because Ithink it'll be helpful for the
(19:50):
next part of this conversation.
You said the fruit of theSpirit isn't intended for me to
feel better about myself.
Each of the nine displays offruit serves two primary
purposes.
First, for us to become morelike Christ, to give him the
glory among his people.
And second, to grow us asvessels through which the Lord
(20:14):
blesses others.
After all, a tree does not feedon its own fruit.
Rather, it produces fruit tofeed others.
So, really, what you're sayingis the fruit of the Spirit has
these two main purposes becominglike Christ and blessing others
.
How can we stay focused on both, especially when life feels
(20:37):
very overwhelming or spirituallydry?
Ava Pennington (20:42):
And that does happen, right, life does.
It can feel overwhelming and itcan feel spiritually dry.
That's a reality, I think.
From my own experience and fromtalking with others, we've been
taught that the priority of theChristian life is giving to and
serving others.
(21:02):
Right, we're always to beother-focused, not self-focused,
but we're severely limited inour ability to give if we aren't
growing ourselves.
And so it's two sides of thesame coin.
If we're feeling overwhelmed bylife or if I'm feeling as if I'm
stuck in a spiritual wilderness, my first step is to ask why?
(21:27):
Why am I feeling this way?
Have I taken my eyes off theLord?
Have I taken my focus off him?
Am I giving in and throwingmyself a pity party because life
isn't working out the way Iwant it to, and I've thrown my
share of pity parties over theyears?
Or maybe what lies have Ifallen for that I didn't realize
(21:50):
?
And it's only then that I'mfree to share the fruit of the
Holy Spirit, as he's nurturingit in me and I'm cooperating
with Him that I can then shareit with others.
So I think there is that focuson both, understanding that I
(22:13):
can't give unless I am growingin my relationship with the Lord
, and unless I am seeing himnurture that fruit in me, we
can't give what we don't have.
Ellen Krause (22:25):
Right, that makes so much, so much sense.
A lot of us feel like wenaturally show some fruit of the
spirit, maybe more than others,and then we really struggle
with one in particular.
What would you say to the womanwho feels like there is one
(22:46):
fruit she just doesn't see inher life at all?
Ava Pennington (22:51):
I can so relate to that, ellen, I promise you I
am naturally drawn to certainaspects of the fruit.
You know love, talking aboutlove and joy and peace.
When we get to the topics ofpatience and self-control, you
know not so much those, you know, those are a little more
convicting.
Those are a little moreconvicting.
(23:12):
There's always going to beareas that God is going to work
on in us and I think even withthe fruit that we feel
comfortable with and we think,oh, I don't have to work on
those, I'm good, there's alwaysroom for growth and improvement.
Right, wanting to peel backanother layer of that onion and
(23:33):
just see what's the next step ofgrowth.
But it's also willing to behonest with ourselves.
I'll give you an example.
When I first taught on thefruit of the spirit years ago,
early in my Christian walk, Ihad a class at church and it was
a nine-week class or 10-weekclass, and so I started each
(23:57):
week, especially the firstcouple of weeks.
I started by welcoming thepeople who were there and
letting them know this is aclass on the fruit of the Spirit
and we're going to talk aboutlove, joy, peace, patience,
kindness, goodness, faithfulnessand self-control.
And I would hold out my fingersand every time I would look at
(24:17):
my fingers and say wait a minute, that's only eight fingers.
What?
Which?
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah,gentleness Forgot that one.
Well, that happened two orthree weeks in a row and at one
point on the third week, one ofthe class members, who was a
friend and she said it with asmile and I loved her for it but
after I did that for a thirdweek in a row, went through the
(24:39):
whole list, came up with eightfingers up and thinking okay,
what am I missing?
She laughed and she said maybeyou're missing, gentleness,
because that's the one God wantsto work on in your life.
And we all laughed.
The class laughed, I laughedand I looked at her and I said
you're absolutely right, that isan area that God has been
(24:59):
working on in me.
I came out of a corporateculture.
I worked on Wall Street, gent.
I appreciated.
You know we all laughed at thejoke, but that was a fruit I
needed to focus on.
So we all have that.
(25:23):
You know.
Don't be discouraged that weall have to work on all of them,
and God is working on all ofthem in us.
So don't be discouraged, but beopen to the Holy Spirit's
conviction and encouragement andequipping as he nurtures all of
the fruit.
I often say it's not, we don'tpick and choose the fruit.
(25:44):
It's one fruit, nine aspects ofthe one fruit of the Spirit,
and it's a package deal.
In God's eyes it's a packagedeal.
They're not separate.
They're not nine differentfruit trees with nine different
fruit.
It's one tree with ninedifferent aspects of the fruit.
Ellen Krause (26:04):
And that, to me, is so encouraging, that God does
give that gift of all of themto us, gift of all of them to us
, and through his grace we canstep by step grow in sort of the
sanctification process ofbecoming more like Christ.
What would you say would be oneor two grace-centered practices
(26:30):
from your book Flourish thatlisteners can begin using today
even?
Ava Pennington (26:37):
I think it goes back to resembling Christ and
the concept of surrender andgrowing in our resemblance to
Christ.
The Bible speaks of beingtransformed or conformed to the
image of Christ, and one thing Ihad to learn the hard way is
that cannot happen by tryingharder, working smarter and
(26:57):
doing better.
That's not how it happens.
It happens through surrender,just as Christ, in his earthly
ministry, was fully surrenderedto the will of his Father.
I mean, let's face it, how manytimes have we come across a
difficult situation or a person,a difficult person, and we grit
(27:19):
our teeth and we vow to be morepatient.
If it kills us, we're going tobe more patient with that person
, only to fail miserably.
And so then what do we do?
We beat ourselves up and wedetermine the next time I'm in
that situation or the next timeI see that person, I'm going to
try harder.
And we end up in a constantcycle of failure.
(27:42):
That affects not just ourspiritual health, but it affects
our mental and emotional healthtoo, because when we are in
that situation again, we justtense up and we've got that knot
in our stomach.
You know that I am going to dobetter.
The alternative is to rest inGod's grace and draw strength
from the Holy Spirit, not justdaily.
(28:03):
I gave up on asking for thatdaily a long time ago, minute by
minute.
We need his grace and hisstrength.
There's a Bible verse, and Ithink it's in Galatians, where
Paul says be strong in thestrength of his might.
And if you think about that,there's two pieces to that.
(28:24):
We're to be strong, but what'sthe source of our strength?
It's his might, not ours.
So it's not about me committingto trying harder, working
smarter, doing better.
I'm going to be strong, I'mgoing to pull it up from my toes
if I have to, but it's beingstrong in his strength.
(28:45):
And that brings us back tosurrender A word.
It has taken me a long time tobe able to stay without
clenching my teeth.
Okay, we just it's, but it'skey to the Christian life and
it's key to the Holy Spirit andnurturing his fruit in our life.
Ellen Krause (29:06):
Absolutely.
I would add to that to justprayer and asking God to help us
with accepting his grace and tohelp us to be able to surrender
.
And the other thing, too, isjust I find that having the
accountability, anaccountability partner, to say,
(29:30):
hey, I'm struggling with one ofthese, maybe it's self-control,
maybe it's shopping for me,shopping I'm struggling with
that, or whatever it might befor someone else and just trying
asking to be lifted up inprayer, understanding those
(29:50):
sneaky attacks, like you said,of the enemy and things to watch
out for and be on the alert for, that might be distracting my
attention.
And so thank you so much forjust sharing that.
Those very simple things, butthings that we don't, you know,
necessarily focus on like weshould be.
Ava Pennington (30:15):
And you're absolutely right.
Surrender involves going to theLord and saying I don't have
the ability, I don't have thecapacity.
Lord, I need you to give thatto me.
I need it to come from you, asyour Holy Spirit works in my
life.
We have that privilege.
I mean, that's what Jesus didfor us.
He restored us our relationshipwith the Father, and yet all
(30:40):
too often we still try to dothings on our own.
Ellen Krause (30:42):
Right, right, Eva.
Where can listeners go to findout more information about you
and your ministry and your book?
Ava Pennington (30:52):
Well, the primary starting place would be
my website, and my website is myname, so it's avapenningtoncom.
You can learn about the booksthat I've written and my social
media links, and I want toencourage your listeners in the
coming months.
The book officially releases inOctober and so once the book's
out, I will be hosting a monthlyfruit of the spirit challenge
(31:16):
on social media.
So we're going to do achallenge, you know a month of
kindness or patience, and we'regoing to have some fun
activities focusing on the ninefacets of the fruit, and I hope
your listeners will join us Onthe Nine Facets of the Fruit.
Ellen Krause (31:30):
And I hope your listeners will join us.
I love that.
Okay, well, we will make surewe include those links in our
show notes.
Eva, before you go, I have toask a couple of our favorite
questions.
We ask all of our guests whatBible is your go-to Bible and
what translation is it?
Ava Pennington (31:50):
Well, I actually have two go-tos.
One is my for just reading,just reading, I use the ESV, the
English Standard Version.
It's conversational enough, butit's very accurate and so
that's a favorite for me.
But for in-depth Bible study,my go-to is the New American
Standard Bible, the NASB,because I find that, while it's
(32:16):
not quite as conversational asthe ESV, often when I look up
words from other translationsand they say, well, you know,
this is what it means, and thenI go to my NASB and that's the
word that they actually use.
So I have one for just readingand one for in-depth study.
Ellen Krause (32:40):
Excellent, okay, thanks for sharing that.
Do you have any favorite Biblejournaling supplies that you
like to use?
Ava Pennington (32:46):
Okay, don't judge me, but I am a highlighter
fanatic, highlighters andpost-it notes, and I have
highlighters in every color youcan imagine and that's my
weakness.
Oh, fun.
Ellen Krause (33:03):
That's so great.
Okay, lastly, what is yourfavorite app or website for
Bible study tools?
Ava Pennington (33:12):
I have three.
One is BibleGatewaycom that Iuse for larger passages and kind
of chunks of the Bible.
It also has some greatcommentaries as well.
And then I use BibleHubcom whenI want to compare translations
of individual verses.
So if I'm looking for a verseand I specifically want to see
(33:36):
how various translations handleit, I'll type the verse in
BibleHubcom and it pops up alist of all the different
translations of that particularverse.
So I get to compare and thathelps add a richness where it's
all on one screen.
And then my third and I thinkit's probably my ultimate
(33:59):
favorite would beblueletterbibleorg, because that
not only you can type in anytranslation you want, but that
gives you Greek and Hebrew wordmeanings.
It gives you tools to reallysee so I can look up and look up
a verse, find the word.
It'll tell me the Greek orHebrew definition.
It'll also tell me where elseit was used in the Bible and of
(34:22):
course it has commentaries andother tools as well.
So if I had to pick up thethree, that would probably be my
ultimate favorite.
But I have direct shortcutlinks to all three of those
websites on my laptop and I'mclicking in and out of all three
of them constantly.
Ellen Krause (34:42):
Great advice.
Okay, thank you so much forsharing those with us.
And, ava, what a pleasure tohave had you with us enjoying
your teaching today.
It's been such a delight.
Ava Pennington (34:55):
Well, thank you, I've just enjoyed having a
conversation with you, so thanksAll right.
Ellen Krause (35:00):
You are welcome to our listeners.
If you want to learn how tobetter nurture the fruit of the
spirit from a Grace-FilledApproach, I hope you'll check
out Ava's book called Flourish.
We have it linked for you inthe show notes.
Thank you all for listening.
May God bless you as youcontinue to grow in love, joy,
(35:21):
peace and every good thing he'scultivating in your life.
Until next time, keepflourishing in Him.
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