October 29, 2025 • 37 mins
Ever wonder if refinancing right now actually saves you money—or just sounds good? We get honest about the one test that cuts through the noise: your break-even. By anchoring the decision to your real costs, monthly savings, and how long you’ll stay in the home, you can act with confidence instead of waiting on a prediction no one can guarantee.
With Brendon Bland back on the mic, we map out the practical reasons to refinance—rate-and-term, term changes, and cash-out—and when each makes sense. We also open the hood on what’s pushing mortgage rates day to day: mortgage bond demand, market jitters, and delayed economic data. That mix has nudged top-tier 30-year fixed quotes toward the low 6s, but volatility remains, so we talk through scenarios where locking now beats trying to call the bottom.
If you’re buying, seasonality is your friend. Late Q4 into early Q1 often brings longer days on market and more room to negotiate. We share specific ways to turn that into savings—rate buydowns, closing cost credits, and flexible terms that can outperform a simple price cut—plus a game plan to prep financing so you’re ready when the right home appears. For sellers, we get real about pricing, comps from the last 90 days, and why online price reductions don’t equal falling values. Strategy and transparency beat wishful thinking in a choosier market.
New or nervous about the process? We created a free on-demand First-Time Homebuyer master class that walks through credit, budgeting, and step-by-step prep. Tap the link in the show notes, follow Brendan for smart mortgage breakdowns, and then tell us: are you refinancing soon, buying this winter, or holding your position? If this conversation helped, subscribe, leave a quick review, and share it with a friend who’s weighing their next move.
To connect with Brendon:
Brendon Bland
614-747-3530
bbland@neighborhoodloans.com
https://www.instagram.com/mortgagemademodern/
https://www.facebook.com/brendon.bland
Sarah Thress
614-893-5885
First Time Home Buyer course: https://sarahthress.graphy.com/
Instagram https://www.instagram.com/sarah_thress_realtor/
Facebook https://www.facebook.com/SarahThressRealtor/
https://www.youtube.com/@LIFEINCOLUMBUS
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:40):
Hi, and welcome to this week's episode of Come to
Find Out.
Uh this week we have the amazingBrendan Bland.
Um, if you are a longtimelistener, you will know that uh
this is not his first episode byany stretch of the means.
Uh he's one of my favoritepeople to have on uh because he
just kind of takes theinformation that we all hear out
(01:01):
there uh and he makes it towhere we can understand it.
Um even me, uh, which is sogreat.
So uh thank you so much,Brendan, for uh agreeing to come
back on and um share your wisdomwith us.
SPEAKER_00 (01:14):
Uh you're welcome.
You definitely don't need me tohelp you understand what's going
on, but I'm happy to fill insome gaps.
SPEAKER_01 (01:20):
Well, I appreciate it.
Um, and if you have listenedbefore, I have given shout-outs
to uh Brendan's social mediabecause I do love the way that
he takes these topics that maybe so freaking boring.
It's what you need to know, butwhen you start reading it, it
just you know starts soundinglike uh the the teacher from uh
(01:41):
Charlie Brown.
But whenever he does it, hemakes it so exciting and
interesting.
And so recently he posted uhwhere he was wearing a lemon
shirt and squeezing a lemon,which I thought was so genius.
Uh and he was talking about, youknow, refinancing and is the
juice worth the squeeze?
So I'd love for you to, youknow, just kind of share that
(02:02):
with us and and talk about itbecause it has to do with
refinancing, you know, because alot of people have heard that
interest rates have gone down alittle bit.
And so, you know, they're like,oh, is now the time to
refinance?
So I'd love for you to just kindof walk us through your thought
process on that.
SPEAKER_00 (02:16):
For sure, for sure.
Well, first thing, I wheneverI'm talking mortgage to people,
um, I I can definitely see theeyes start to glaze over.
And I I feel like I am turninginto either a combination of one
of the parents from um from uhCharlie Brown or uh what's the
teacher from um Ferris Bueller'sDay Off for you?
(02:38):
So yeah, I listen, it's ummortgage financing is not
everyone's favorite topic in theworld, but yeah, if we can do
some things to I think make upmore relatable and funny, then
you know we'll do it albeitfull.
So it's fine.
I'll I'll do it uh for the sakeof education.
But yeah, um to your to yourpoint, uh, I think one of the
(02:58):
big questions that I've beengetting here the last six months
is you know, from either my mycurrent clients, um, my current
homeowners, um, friends, family,uh, random people at Starbucks
while I'm waiting in line, ishey, um, what's going on with
mortgage rates?
And is now a good time torefinance?
(03:21):
Um, if I own a house, should Iwait to refinance because are
rates gonna keep coming down?
Um and I yeah, and that's Ithink that's that's the
million-dollar question, right?
And I think we talk about it allthe time in terms of you know,
if if I knew if rates were gonnakeep going down or if they were
about to go up, um, you know, Iwould tell everybody I wouldn't
hoard that information and Iwould, you know, hopefully play
(03:42):
the lottery too and make a lotof money during that.
But um, so it's it's hard to do.
SPEAKER_01 (03:46):
We'd be doing this podcast from our yachts if we
knew that.
SPEAKER_00 (03:49):
That's right.
That's right.
Jordan Belfort, Jordan Belfort.
Um so, you know, to that, Ithink to that end, on you know,
is is now a good time torefinance or not.
Um, I I think for the firstthing, you know, when I'm
talking to someone about it, um,and then I'll get in kind of the
metaphor is the juice worthsqueeze, is you know, hey, what
what's what's the goal, right?
(04:10):
Because um there's differentreasons why people are going to
refinance a mortgage.
Um, some people will do what'scalled a rate and term
refinance, which is probably themost straightforward, which is
like, hey, I have a 7%, I seerates are at 6%, I want a lower
rate, lower monthly payments.
You know, that's a great reason.
Um, some people will refinancebecause they want to change the
term.
Either they want to um givethemselves more flexibility with
(04:34):
the longer term, or they want tokind of put themselves in the
position to pay the home offfaster.
Um, so that that can be a reasonto refinance.
Um, some people will refinanceto gain access to the equity in
their home, um, which is calledlike a cash-out refinance, um,
which is where you know you canuse that equity to do a home
renovation, you can do it tomaybe purchase another home, um,
(04:55):
you can do it to consolidatedebt, so which will help save
you money over time.
That's a very common thing thatpeople do.
Um so there's a bunch ofdifferent reasons why someone
might refinance.
And I think just understandingwhat the reason is that you want
to refinance is I think that'sstep number one.
Um, and once you've identifiedthat reason, then you can have a
(05:15):
conversation about is it now isnow the right time or not to do
it.
Um, I think, Sarah, the majorityof people right now who are
asking me about refinancing arepeople who have purchased a home
in the last few years.
So maybe 2022, 2023, 2024, or ormaybe even the first part of
2025, um, they they've heardthat rates are coming down.
(05:37):
Um, and they want to know, like,hey, does it make sense?
Can I save money?
Um, if I if I have that 7% rateor high six sixes rate, um if I
were to take today's you knowmortgage rate, would that save
me money?
Um and then that kind of getsgets me into what I was thinking
that video about is you know, isthe juice worth the squeeze?
Um because I think no, onceagain, like if if I knew for for
(06:00):
a fact that rates were gonnakeep coming down for the next
two years and by how much, um, Ican tell I could tell people,
hey, no, don't refinance now.
Wait six months because I havethis crystal ball and I know
that rates are gonna be half apercent lower in the next six
months.
So just wait.
Um, but I don't know that.
Um, and no one knows it.
No matter, you know, you know, II listened to a lot of really,
(06:22):
really smart people who who havegiven really what I thought were
coherent predictions aboutwhat's gonna happen with rates,
and they were flat out wrong.
So so it you know, it is it itis it is hard.
I mean, we can look at differentum indicators to let us know
what rates are gonna do, but wedon't really know.
So so I guess I'll get to thepoint, which is is the juice
(06:44):
worth a squeeze.
So um, you know, when I'mlooking at someone's situation
and we let's say they, you know,they're they have a 7% on their
current house right now, theircurrent mortgage is sitting at
7%.
They bought a couple years ago.
And let's say when we look atyou know their their
opportunities or their optionsright now, let's say we can get
them to a six percent, right?
Um, for some people, they'll saythat's kind of the number in
(07:05):
their head, like, okay, if I candrop my rate 1%, that then I
would do it, right?
What's the logic behind that?
Uh, I don't really know if thereis any logic behind it.
It just sounds good, like I'mdropping my rate a percent.
Um, but I I don't I don't thinkit's a bad way to look at it.
But um, but let's say, you know,we want to dive a little bit
deeper to understand does thatactually make sense to do?
(07:26):
Um, so let's say in thatscenario, we go from a 7% rate
to a 6% rate.
Whenever you do a refinance, um,there is going to be some kind
of cost to doing that refinance.
There's going to be um a loancost, there's going to usually
be a title company involved, um,and there are fees involved in
there.
Um, no matter how we slice it ordice it.
I know a lot of lenders weretalking about completely free
(07:49):
refinances for a long time.
Um, I that's not a realisticrepresentation of what's
happening.
There might be discountedoptions out there.
Some folks feel like ourcompany, you know, we have an
option where we'll we're excuseme, where we will waive.
That was a tongue twister, likeuh our our origination, you
know, in certain circumstances,um that that fee.
(08:10):
But there's still going to be acost.
No matter how you slice it ordice it, there's gonna be a cost
of doing a refinance.
So what we want to understandis, you know, how long um do we
need to stay in that loan andstay in that house for that
refinance to make sense?
So for example, we go from a 7%rate to a 6% rate.
Let's say in that example, we'resaving$200 a month.
(08:33):
That sounds really good.
And it is really good.
Um, and let's say that the theactual cost of doing a refinance
was about$5,000.
Um, whether you pay that out ofpocket or you roll it into your
loan, which is an option, um,that's still a cost that you're
going to feel and experience.
So it's a pretty simplecalculation.
We take that$5,000 divided bythe$200 per month that we're
(08:55):
saving.
And in that situation, we wouldsee that it's just over two
years.
That's how long we would need tostay in that mortgage and stay
in that house for that refinanceto make sense.
So if Sarah was sitting downwith me right now and said, hey,
Brendan, this is what I'mthinking about doing this, you
know.
My first question is, do youthink you're going to move in
(09:15):
the next two years?
And if the answer is, well,yeah, I think we we might move
in the next six months to ayear, well, then I'd say it
probably doesn't make a ton ofsense, right?
Because ultimately you're gonnasay, yeah, you'll save money
month to month, but you spentmoney in the beginning.
And so it just doesn't thenumbers don't number, right?
So, but it but if the answer isyes, I'm going to be in this
(09:37):
home for the next three, four,five years, um, then I think
that's a real, that that's areal opportunity to consider
this, this could be somesavings, right?
This could be some real savingsthat we'll experience over time.
Um, and that's kind of I thinkwhere I think if we can just
start the conversation there andunderstand, okay, here's how
much it's gonna cost to do therefinance, here's how much we're
(09:59):
gonna save.
And if we're gonna be in thishome for at least that amount of
time, then yeah, I think therethe c the answer can be yes, the
juice can be worth the squeeze.
Um and then from there, that'sthat's when you have to make
some judgment calls.
Do we do we think rates aregonna keep going down?
Do we want to wait and see ifthat happens?
Um, or are we just happy knowingthat, hey, we're gonna be saving
(10:21):
a couple hundred bucks a monthright now.
And if rates go down, so be it.
If they go up, then obviously,you know, you'll be like, well,
I made the right decision.
I'm very smart.
So um but that's I think reallykind of that's how I try to keep
it really simple, you know, andjust like, hey, are are we
saving money?
Are we saving enough money overtime for this to make sense?
SPEAKER_01 (10:40):
Yeah, I love that.
Well, and I know the last timethat we talked, um, you know,
there was that Fed rate cut, andyou know, everyone was expecting
interest rates to go down.
And, you know, you explainedthat interest rates actually had
already gone down inanticipation of the Fed cut,
because that's not actually whatdirectly affects, you know,
mortgage rates.
(11:01):
And so, you know, um obviouslyif someone wants to learn more
about that, please listen to theuh previous episode that I
recorded with Brendan, andyou'll be able to hear all of
that.
Um, but then I've also seen, youknow, I know whenever we talked,
we talked about how interestrates may not go down anymore.
You know, they may go down morebefore 2026 and they may not.
(11:22):
Um, you know, and it sounds likethey maybe are going down.
Can you kind of talk to us rightnow about like kind of where
rates are and you know, ifyou've heard anything else in
the mortgage world about it, youknow, going down?
Obviously, no crystal ballinvolved.
SPEAKER_00 (11:35):
Yeah, yeah, 100%.
So yeah, I think, I think rightnow, um it's um depending on how
closely you pay attention, youyou may notice rates go down.
You may, you know, if you kindof dip your toe in today and
then don't look again foranother month, you you know, you
may have missed out on a smalldrop and then rates came back up
a little bit because we're we'reon a little bit of a volatile
(11:57):
period of time right now.
There's um a handful ofdifferent factors that are
really pushing mortgage ratesaround.
I think overall any kind ofinstability in financial markets
um is an opportunity formortgage rates to go down
because um once again, peoplecan invest in mortgage bonds.
(12:21):
Mortgage bonds are very safe toinvest in.
So when other investments don'tfeel so safe, i.e.
the stock market or um, youknow, let's say um in the past
couple days that there therewere some there's some news
about some some banks that youknow that financially weren't
doing very well, that presentsconcern on how financial markets
(12:44):
are doing.
So, so that puts money into themortgage bond market, which then
pushes rates down a little bit.
So, so right now there's acouple things going on like that
where there's just kind ofonesie twosy um, you know,
financial market not great newsthings happening that make
(13:04):
investors say, hey, we're notreally sure what to do with our
money, so we'll just put it inmortgage bonds for now.
And that's pushed mortgage ratesdown a little bit here over the
over the last couple of weeks.
Um right now, uh, I was justlooking earlier.
The the 30-year fixed averagefor a top-tier scenario um is
right around a 6.2, 6.25.
(13:24):
Um, which you know, uh there wasa lot of headlines about that
being near three-year lows.
Um I think that the thethree-year low in uh over the
last few years would have beenin February of 2022, where rates
were just below six percent.
Um so we're we're makingprogress for that.
Um now there are a few thingsthat could pop up here that
(13:47):
could really drive rates ineither direction.
Um one of the bigger pieces ofdata that's that has been
driving rates has been um jobreports and inflation reports.
And right now, um those reportsare those reports are created
with data that comes from theBureau of Labor and Statistics,
(14:10):
which is a governmentorganization, which is currently
closed.
So um, so those reports thatcome out that would normally
drive rates in one direction orthe other um aren't being
produced um right now.
Um and so that's kind of keepingrates at a little bit of a
standstill because once again,these these investors um who
(14:34):
would normally use thatinformation to make decisions,
they don't really have thatinformation.
And then I think somethingthat's gonna be interesting to
see over the next month or twowhen the government does open
back up, um, which it will atsome point, um how much do we
trust the data?
Because you know, a lot of thatdata could be partial data.
(14:56):
Um, because the the folks whoactually gather that information
to then create the report thatthen gets used to make decisions
about mortgage rates, we may nothave all the information.
So it'll be an interesting, Ithink, end of the year for
mortgage rates to kind of seewhat happens.
Um, because there will bereports that get put out about
jobs and about labor andinflation.
(15:16):
Um, but it's hard to knowexactly how trustworthy that
data is gonna be, at least as itinitially trickles out.
So um we'll see.
I guess as well as once again,it's it's hard to know.
That's why, you know, right now,if someone asks me, hey,
Brendan, are rates gonna keepgoing down through the end of
the year?
Should I wait to refinance?
I don't know.
(15:37):
I don't know.
And I it's I as as a as a personwho does this for a living and
you don't want to say that, butI don't know what's gonna happen
to rates through the end of theyear.
Um, I could see two scenarioshappening where rates either go
up or go down.
Um I know that's kind of itseems like a cop-out, but truly,
it's it's really gonna bedictated by by data that comes
out and how that data isinterpreted by people who um
(15:59):
invest in mortgage bonds.
So so we'll see.
Um, I would say, you know, rightnow, if you're in the market to
buy a house, um, rates are aslow as as low as they have been
in the last few years, which isgreat news.
Um and you know, once again, uhwaiting isn't always your friend
from that perspective because wejust don't know exactly what's
(16:21):
gonna happen.
SPEAKER_01 (16:22):
Yeah, exactly.
Well, and it's interestingbecause you know, the uh there's
that saying out there that, youknow, uh you can't time uh the
market, you know, uh you justhave to kind of go based off of
what is, you know, what yourcurrent situation is.
And so, you know, don't wait tobuy, uh, buy and wait, you know.
(16:43):
So, you know, obviously the thebest time to purchase is when it
makes sense for you personally.
And, you know, whenever thatmakes sense, then you're putting
your money into an asset whichis going to continuously grow.
And, you know, so you're notthrowing your money away.
So sometimes instead of tryingto time the market, you know, I
just tell people like if itmakes sense for you and what
you're going through right nowand you can afford it, then yes,
(17:05):
now is the right time.
And then, you know, like lateron, you know, maybe something
else happens and you know itlowers down to to 3% again.
Who knows?
Like, okay, cool.
Then you get to like go back tothat.
Probably not, but you know,yeah.
Um never know.
SPEAKER_00 (17:20):
We never know.
Never say never.
SPEAKER_01 (17:22):
Yeah.
Well, and we're now going intowinter market, which
historically is a slower time,which is better for buyers.
Uh, you know, especially uh it'snot so awesome for sellers
because you know, they're like,hey, my house is sitting, why?
Yeah.
And you know, this market hasbeen so weird because I have,
you know, I have five listingsright now and they're just
(17:45):
sitting.
And, you know, people are like,why is my house not selling?
And I'm like, well, it's not2020.
And, you know, there's a lotmore, uh, we have a lot more
inventory out there.
So there's more choices.
Whereas, you know, back in 2020,it was like, do you want this
house or not?
Like, you know, either give yourfirstborn child and get this
house or like, you know, keepmoving.
(18:06):
So um, you know, it's just atotally different market.
But I think, you know, talkingwith a lender, making sure that
you can financially afford, youknow, at the rate that it is
now, uh, you know, it makes themost sense.
And then, you know, you have allthese options to go out there.
So, you know, I think settingsomeone up for success right now
is talking with a lender,getting locked into the lower
(18:29):
rate, and then working, youknow, with a with a good builder
that can take you to show all,you know, show you all the
different things and help you tomake a decision, but you have a
little bit more time now becauseit's winter, it's slower, and we
have more inventory out there.
SPEAKER_00 (18:43):
So let's not say it's winter yet.
It still looks pretty fallyoutside.
Let's not I I know we tend tothink a couple months in
advance, but yeah, I don't Idon't want to I don't want to
think about walking through thesnow yet.
You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_01 (18:55):
I don't either.
I don't either.
I've had to start like puttingon sweatshirts and coats and
stuff, and I'm like, ugh, why?
SPEAKER_00 (19:01):
Yeah, 100%.
No, I I a hundred percent agree.
I I think um the the fourthquarter of the year and then the
very beginning of Q1, um, youknow, if you're someone who's
trying to time the market ortake advantage of the market, I
I think this is this is areally, really good time.
Um because to your point, youknow, uh homes do sit longer.
(19:25):
And that's not, I don't thinkthat's a uh a right now
phenomenon.
I think that's a that's aseasonal factor, right?
Um you know, uh there there areless people interested in buying
those times of year.
So if you are interested inbuying, you have less
competition, and you know, thethe folks who are selling are
(19:48):
selling for a reason, right?
Um so they're they're motivated.
Um I was looking at this.
There was actually a um uh Idon't know if it's I don't know
if it's called I guess it's asite uh that I got put out by um
Lending Tree uh that came out Ithink either earlier this week
or later last week.
Um just talking about um basedon a few different metrics.
(20:11):
Um January is by far the bet themost productive time for for
home buyers um with respect tobeing able to negotiate um to
get the best deal.
Um and so to your point, I thinkyou know, where we sit in the
middle almost to the end ofOctober, um starting the process
(20:32):
now, if you haven't started, uhto if you're interested in
buying um and you want to takeadvantage of that market, um,
starts today.
Uh if you start if you start inJanuary, you're you're kind of
behind the ball.
Um so I think starting now,getting your ducks in a row, um,
to your point, getting connectedwith a really good realtor who
can get you set up on a search,get you familiar with the
different opportunities that areout there, um, getting your
(20:54):
financial ducks in a row.
So that way when a when a reallygreat opportunity does present
itself, it's not, okay, I gotta,I gotta figure out my stuff.
It's like, no, I know exactlykind of where I stand and you
can just move forward.
Um But yeah, a couple stats thatthey put out from this article.
And obviously, you know, realestate's hyper local.
(21:15):
I mean, when we look at um eventhe data for central Ohio and
the different markets in centralOhio, um, you know, days on
market is going to vary prettygreatly um from you know zip
code to zip code.
But they but you know,Lenningtree, you know, it's
they're trying to put out youknow national statistics.
So uh what I think is this portsover pretty well.
Um it's it's said, you know, onaverage in January, newly listed
(21:38):
homes um sit on the market foran average of 75 days um before
going into contract, um, whichis the slowest time of year.
And then if you compare thatfrom April to June, on average,
um, you're looking at under 50days.
So, you know, that's a hugeswing in days on market.
And then if we just think aboutthe psychology of that situation
(22:00):
and kind of who holds the cardswhen a home is sitting on the
market for 75 days versus, youknow, for a third of that time
or two-thirds of that time, uh,once again, as a home buyer,
you're gonna you're gonna holdthe cards um in those scenarios.
Um, and that can look like, youknow, um negotiating on when
you're gonna take possession,price, closing costs, rate buy
(22:22):
downs, all kinds of stuff thatcan really make uh maybe a home
that wasn't affordable beforeall of a sudden affordable.
So um, yeah, I don't, you know,if if anyone if if people are
trying to tell you that there'sno deal to be had um as a home
buyer, I I I don't think that'saccurate.
I think there's a lot ofopportunities.
Um and to your point, um, withsome of your sellers, I'm I'm
I'm sure they wouldn't theywould definitely invite you know
(22:44):
a buyer to come in with a with acreative option or creative
offer, right?
So um so yeah, so I I think it'sa great time um that we're
heading into for home buyers.
And if that's that's you andyou're interested, um, yeah, I
would get the process startedsooner rather than later.
SPEAKER_01 (22:59):
Yeah, I totally agree.
Yeah, with sellers, I'm justletting them know, like, hey,
things are sitting and you know,it's not so it used to be so
easy to list a house and withinyou know the first week, you
would know if you had priced itincorrectly, either, you know,
like if you had priced it toohigh.
And uh because then you know noone was coming to see it.
(23:21):
Uh, you know, if someone was,they were given the feedback
that it was, you know, justpriced too high or whatever.
Um, you know, or if you weregetting zero showing requests,
then you know, you could tell.
But now, like there, that isn'ttrue.
You know, your house could bepriced perfectly and there it's
just a just a slower market.
I think a lot of it has to dowith, you know, the the
(23:41):
volatility around uh, you know,our government and just with
every, you know, you can't youcan't predict anything.
Not that we could predict it ifwe had a you know a different
government at this point, butum, you know, there's just so
much out there that is, youknow, just up in the air that it
makes it very difficult, youknow, for people to to pull the
(24:03):
trigger and be like, yep, it'stime for me to, you know, buy
the house.
Or like, you know, they're like,well, what if I lose my job?
Or what if, you know, likethere's so much out there and
this is just a weird, a weirdmarket.
So, you know, it's still verymuch a seller's market because
we don't have enough inventoryout there.
So if you're going by thetraditional rules of sellers and
buyer's market, we still don'thave enough out there for it to
(24:25):
be uh, you know, a mixed marketor a buyer's market.
But um, you know, because if wehave way too much out there,
then it definitely turns into abuyer's market.
But I will say it's feeling moreand more like a hybrid where
it's more of a buyer's market,even though traditionally it's
considered still a seller'smarket.
(24:45):
Buyers are able to go in and askfor um, you know, for like the
two one buy down where theseller pays, you know, for their
rate to be lowered, twopercentage points the first
year, one percentage point thesecond year, and then the third
year on, you know, you're kindof locked into whatever rate,
you know, the 6.25 or whateverit is that you qualified for.
(25:06):
So that's a great savings versusjust asking them to take, you
know,$10,000 off the price orwhatever.
You would end up saving more ifyou had them buy down your rate.
So, you know, there's definitelymore creative things that buyers
can do now in this market uhversus whenever it's a true
seller's market, like back, youknow, in 2020, 2021, whenever,
(25:29):
you know, you couldn't ask foranything.
Like you better be waiving allcontingencies, just you know,
giving away the farm, you know,to be able to purchase this
house or sell.
Um, you know, I think that uh,you know, to your point, like
now is the right time for buyersif they're thinking about it,
because you know, there is somuch flexibility for them.
SPEAKER_00 (25:49):
Do you think I'm I'm curious, um, when you're when
you're working with sellers andpotentially listing their house,
especially this time of year,um, and I know you're a very
data-driven person, and soyou're, you know, you're you're
looking at the market thatthey're in and kind of what's
going on and um, you know, thedays on hand, like the typical
days on hand, especially forhomes that are similar to
(26:09):
theirs.
If you're if you know that rightnow, homes in a specific zip
code that you're gonna be ableto sing a home at are sitting a
little bit longer, um I from anexpectation standpoint, you
know, um what what what wouldyou like if you were trying to
set appropriate expectationswith a seller?
I mean, like how how how wouldyou do that?
(26:30):
And kind of what it if ifsomeone's listening to this and
they're thinking, hey, I want tosell my home and you know, my my
neighbor, you know, two streetsover, their house has been on
the market for a month and ahalf, you know, what would you
how how would you kind of helpthem understand, like, hey,
here's here's what you're gonnabe walking into, and here's some
of the things I think you shouldconsider.
Um, because I I love what youtalked about with, you know,
(26:52):
being creative with like thingslike two-on-by-downs.
And I think it might be sensethat I want to hear your answer,
is you know, if if from thebeginning sellers can be open to
different ideas about what theymay end up needing to do to get
their house in contract, I thinkif they if they can accept that
from the beginning, it's gonnabe less, less painful um in the
(27:13):
middle of the process.
Um, so just just curious, youknow, uh how you know, if if you
were talking to a seller rightnow in that situation, kind of
how would you help setappropriate expectations of
them?
SPEAKER_01 (27:25):
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, you know, to your point,um, what you said earlier when
talking with buyers, you know,it's really just figuring out
what their uh, you know, whatwhat's their motivation to sell?
Um, you know, have they found aplace that they just absolutely
love?
Uh are they downsizers?
Can they no longer afford theirhouse?
Can uh, you know, did their uhdid they add to their family?
(27:47):
You know, so now they need abigger house.
And, you know, like so there'sso many different things to just
kind of understand like whythey're selling.
And so then, you know, and thenI just let them know, like, hey,
here's the data from yourneighborhood.
You know, nothing has sold uh inyour neighborhood in the last,
you know, three months.
Uh, or, you know, I don't gofurther back.
Six months is about the mostI'll go back.
(28:10):
But in this market, really,like, you know, three months uh
is probably the best to givethem the best picture of what
we're looking at.
And then I'll show them, like,you know, look, this house is,
you know, like it doesn't havevery much update.
Uh it's been sitting in themarket for, you know, 75 days,
whatever.
Um, so let's take that intoconsideration.
Let's look at your house.
(28:30):
Um, you know, just because yourneighbor sold last year uh for
top dollar doesn't mean thatyou're gonna sell for top dollar
right now.
It's just, you know, you mightmaybe, you know, maybe you
updated every single port, youknow, like every single thing in
your house, like everything'sbeen touched and everything's
been updated.
Then, you know, yeah, there is agreater chance because again,
(28:51):
buyers get the option to bechoosy and they would much
rather have a house that theycan walk into that's been fully
updated and, you know, and theywill pay more for that.
But let's say that you're in asituation where you're like,
hey, like I can't afford to doanything to this house.
I also just need to get out.
Um, you know, and in thatsituation, then I'm like, okay,
well, then here's where weshould probably price it.
(29:12):
And it may not be where theywant it to.
Um, you know, and ultimatelyit's up to the seller to decide.
You know, they can say, hey, Isaw your data, screw that.
I'm still, I still want to, youknow, I still want to lose my
house if this is a high number.
And I'm like, I mean, we can,but like realistically, it's
likely not going to sell atthat.
(29:32):
But if that's truly, you know,like if you need to learn the
hard way, sure, let's do it, youknow.
Um, because I I'm not here totalk someone into, you know, or
out of what they what they wantto do because it's their their
house, but I am here to guide,give all of the information.
And if I've given you all theinformation and you still are
like screw that, okay.
(29:52):
That's on you.
But yeah, but I I just alwaystry to let them know, like, hey,
look, on average, houses are,you know, here in central Ohio,
like, you know, there are stillsome areas that literally you
list a house and it's incontract within the first few
days.
So that's great.
But most areas here in centralOhio, you know, like it's on
average, it's like 50 days rightnow.
(30:14):
Um so you know, it just, andthat's not to say that yours
wouldn't sell faster.
It might, you know, but again,depending on how your
circumstances and how fast youneed to get rid of it uh and get
moving to your next, you know,destination, uh, you know, we
may be doing um priceimprovements more often than you
(30:34):
know, than out anybody else outthere just because.
You know, a lot of times peopleare like, hey, you know, even
though my house has been sittinghere, I'm not willing to go
below this.
And, you know, that's fine.
They still may end up sellingit, but it may end up being, you
know, 80 days, 90 days, 100 daysin.
SPEAKER_00 (30:51):
So Yeah.
No, I you know, I'm not sellingmy house today, but if I if I
were, I may I I definitely wouldrather have, you know, Sarah
Tress who's telling me the truthversus, you know, Joe Schmoe,
real estate person who is justgonna do um what I want to hear.
(31:11):
Right.
Um, and so I I think that's Ithink that's key too.
I mean, if I was selling myhouse today and you're someone
who's thinking about sellingyour house is, you know, make
sure you're working with arealtor who's not afraid to tell
you what's actually going on,right?
If if they're just nodding theirhead at everything you say, you
know, um, I I would look forsomeone who's who's gonna who's
(31:32):
gonna use real data to helpinform the the decision about
how to market your home.
Um because that will that willself-aster for hire versus you
know someone who just is justyou know shooting in the dark.
So it's really, I think becauseit because this sounds like you
know, it's it's so interesting.
As long as we were doing thispodcast like three years ago, it
(31:53):
was like, hey, we're reallytrying to, you know, keep our
buyers motivated.
And now it's a little bitreverse, like, hey, we gotta
keep our sellers motivated,right?
Because it, you know, thingslike things can change and they
will always change.
Um, but I you know, when I I wastalking with someone else the
other day, like, I was like,hey, this is a reminder, man,
you know, you bought this housein 2017.
Um 2020, 21, 22.
(32:14):
Like you had double digitappreciation those years.
Um so yeah, like in 2025, didyour house appreciate for 15%
like it did in 2021?
No.
But like on the whole, overtime, like sellers who sell
today who have been in theirhome for a reasonable amount of
time, like they're they'remaking money.
(32:35):
Um, right.
I mean, there are some of thoseunfortunate situations, you
know, where someone, you know,is moving in and out really
quickly, and that, you know, maynot be ideal, but by and large,
you know, real estate prices arestubbornly strong and they
continue to go up.
So, you know, I because like youknow, people say, oh, hey, I see
these price price reductions onZillow.
(32:56):
It means housing market crashingor prices coming down.
That's not what's happening.
I mean, we are seeing home homevalues, you know, home from from
where they're listed to wherethey go in a contract for, you
know, in in a handful ofscenarios be less.
But if we look at the value ofthat home over time, the value
of that home has gone up.
And so I just think that that'sthe reminder is that just
(33:17):
because we're seeing prices bereduced from where they
originally listed, that doesn'tmean that housing overall is
slipping backwards.
It's quite the opposite.
Trust me.
Ask anyone who's trying to buy ahouse today versus five years
ago.
So it's you know, housing pricesare still strong, they're still
going up over time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:35):
Yeah, no, absolutely.
And I think that um thatreminded me of another uh thing.
I had a uh seller the other dayreach out and they're like, hey,
I got something in the mail thattold me that my house is, you
know, uh gone up in value.
Uh so you know, I want to goahead and sell.
And, you know, they've only beenthere for a couple of years.
And uh, you know, and so I said,okay, great.
(33:57):
Like, let me look at it.
Well, you know, where thisperson is, nothing has sold in
over a year in that area.
So finding like a true comp isvery difficult.
So I had to open it up to thezip code with, you know, um
similar properties with the sameuh bedroom, same bathroom, same
square footage in that zip code,um, which also, you know, can
(34:20):
give you a good picture, butit's still not a crystal ball.
So, you know, I was like lookingat those, you know, those houses
are now selling for less thanwhat yours is selling for.
Now I'm not telling you that wecouldn't list it for, you know,
for around what you paid for it,but uh, you know, unfortunately,
like I don't have a crystalball.
So, and they're like, well, butI got this thing in the mail.
(34:41):
And I'm like, well, I'm I'm realglad you got that thing in the
mail.
But, you know, the biggest thingthat I always try and let
sellers know is that a house isworth what someone's willing to
pay for it.
Like, yeah, it doesn't matterwhat you list it for, it doesn't
matter what Zillow tells you, itdoesn't matter what, you know,
an appraiser tells you that it'sworth, it is worth what someone
is willing to pay for it.
So even though you may thinkthat it is the most amazing
(35:03):
piece of property you've everlived in in your entire life and
someone should be spendingmillions on buying it.
If someone else that's ready tobuy doesn't see that that value,
then it's not going to sell atthe price that you think it
should sell for.
So 100%.
100%.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, Brendan, thank you so muchfor coming on.
(35:25):
I really appreciate it.
Um, as always, you gave someamazing advice and made things
um make sense.
So uh, and if you're listeningto this and you are a first-time
homebuyer and you are stillthinking, holy crap, I don't
even know where to start.
Uh, Brendan and I have created auh a master class where you are
able to log in at any time it'sfree.
(35:49):
Uh, and there's the link in theshow notes, but also uh you can
go to my social media pages andthere's always a link there.
Um but again, I'll make surethat it's in the show notes.
But uh that class literallywalks you through what goes into
getting ready to be a homeowner,um, what goes into credit, um,
you know, all the super funthings, but it's on a recording,
(36:10):
so you can go back and watch itas many times as you want to
make sure that it makes sensefor you.
And then obviously you canalways reach out to either one
of us uh with questions.
All our information is in theshow notes, so you can reach out
at any time.
Uh, and like I said, youdefinitely want to be following
Brendan Bland's social media uhbecause he brings some really
good information in a really uhyou know humorous way, or at
(36:31):
least, you know, he makes it asfun as you possibly can make
mortgage.
SPEAKER_00 (36:35):
Fun as you can.
As fun as you can.
That's always for my homebuyers.
It's like I'm gonna make it asfun as possible to borrow a few
hundred thousand dollars.
SPEAKER_01 (36:42):
So yes, exactly.
But yeah, like I said, uh clickon that uh if you're interested.
Uh it's free.
And uh, you know, we're alwayshere to answer questions.
And definitely if you enjoyedthis episode, make sure that you
leave a review.
Five star uh review would beamazing.
Um, you know, rate and review,and then share it uh with anyone
(37:02):
that you think might beinterested in this information.
So thanks so much for tuning in,and we'll see you next time on
Come to Find Out.
Hi, and welcome to this week's episode of Come to
Find Out.
Uh this week we have the amazingBrendan Bland.
Um, if you are a longtimelistener, you will know that uh
this is not his first episode byany stretch of the means.
Uh he's one of my favoritepeople to have on uh because he
just kind of takes theinformation that we all hear out
(01:01):
there uh and he makes it towhere we can understand it.
Um even me, uh, which is sogreat.
So uh thank you so much,Brendan, for uh agreeing to come
back on and um share your wisdomwith us.
SPEAKER_00 (01:14):
Uh you're welcome.
You definitely don't need me tohelp you understand what's going
on, but I'm happy to fill insome gaps.
SPEAKER_01 (01:20):
Well, I appreciate it.
Um, and if you have listenedbefore, I have given shout-outs
to uh Brendan's social mediabecause I do love the way that
he takes these topics that maybe so freaking boring.
It's what you need to know, butwhen you start reading it, it
just you know starts soundinglike uh the the teacher from uh
(01:41):
Charlie Brown.
But whenever he does it, hemakes it so exciting and
interesting.
And so recently he posted uhwhere he was wearing a lemon
shirt and squeezing a lemon,which I thought was so genius.
Uh and he was talking about, youknow, refinancing and is the
juice worth the squeeze?
So I'd love for you to, youknow, just kind of share that
(02:02):
with us and and talk about itbecause it has to do with
refinancing, you know, because alot of people have heard that
interest rates have gone down alittle bit.
And so, you know, they're like,oh, is now the time to
refinance?
So I'd love for you to just kindof walk us through your thought
process on that.
SPEAKER_00 (02:16):
For sure, for sure.
Well, first thing, I wheneverI'm talking mortgage to people,
um, I I can definitely see theeyes start to glaze over.
And I I feel like I am turninginto either a combination of one
of the parents from um from uhCharlie Brown or uh what's the
teacher from um Ferris Bueller'sDay Off for you?
(02:38):
So yeah, I listen, it's ummortgage financing is not
everyone's favorite topic in theworld, but yeah, if we can do
some things to I think make upmore relatable and funny, then
you know we'll do it albeitfull.
So it's fine.
I'll I'll do it uh for the sakeof education.
But yeah, um to your to yourpoint, uh, I think one of the
(02:58):
big questions that I've beengetting here the last six months
is you know, from either my mycurrent clients, um, my current
homeowners, um, friends, family,uh, random people at Starbucks
while I'm waiting in line, ishey, um, what's going on with
mortgage rates?
And is now a good time torefinance?
(03:21):
Um, if I own a house, should Iwait to refinance because are
rates gonna keep coming down?
Um and I yeah, and that's Ithink that's that's the
million-dollar question, right?
And I think we talk about it allthe time in terms of you know,
if if I knew if rates were gonnakeep going down or if they were
about to go up, um, you know, Iwould tell everybody I wouldn't
hoard that information and Iwould, you know, hopefully play
(03:42):
the lottery too and make a lotof money during that.
But um, so it's it's hard to do.
SPEAKER_01 (03:46):
We'd be doing this podcast from our yachts if we
knew that.
SPEAKER_00 (03:49):
That's right.
That's right.
Jordan Belfort, Jordan Belfort.
Um so, you know, to that, Ithink to that end, on you know,
is is now a good time torefinance or not.
Um, I I think for the firstthing, you know, when I'm
talking to someone about it, um,and then I'll get in kind of the
metaphor is the juice worthsqueeze, is you know, hey, what
what's what's the goal, right?
(04:10):
Because um there's differentreasons why people are going to
refinance a mortgage.
Um, some people will do what'scalled a rate and term
refinance, which is probably themost straightforward, which is
like, hey, I have a 7%, I seerates are at 6%, I want a lower
rate, lower monthly payments.
You know, that's a great reason.
Um, some people will refinancebecause they want to change the
term.
Either they want to um givethemselves more flexibility with
(04:34):
the longer term, or they want tokind of put themselves in the
position to pay the home offfaster.
Um, so that that can be a reasonto refinance.
Um, some people will refinanceto gain access to the equity in
their home, um, which is calledlike a cash-out refinance, um,
which is where you know you canuse that equity to do a home
renovation, you can do it tomaybe purchase another home, um,
(04:55):
you can do it to consolidatedebt, so which will help save
you money over time.
That's a very common thing thatpeople do.
Um so there's a bunch ofdifferent reasons why someone
might refinance.
And I think just understandingwhat the reason is that you want
to refinance is I think that'sstep number one.
Um, and once you've identifiedthat reason, then you can have a
(05:15):
conversation about is it now isnow the right time or not to do
it.
Um, I think, Sarah, the majorityof people right now who are
asking me about refinancing arepeople who have purchased a home
in the last few years.
So maybe 2022, 2023, 2024, or ormaybe even the first part of
2025, um, they they've heardthat rates are coming down.
(05:37):
Um, and they want to know, like,hey, does it make sense?
Can I save money?
Um, if I if I have that 7% rateor high six sixes rate, um if I
were to take today's you knowmortgage rate, would that save
me money?
Um and then that kind of getsgets me into what I was thinking
that video about is you know, isthe juice worth the squeeze?
Um because I think no, onceagain, like if if I knew for for
(06:00):
a fact that rates were gonnakeep coming down for the next
two years and by how much, um, Ican tell I could tell people,
hey, no, don't refinance now.
Wait six months because I havethis crystal ball and I know
that rates are gonna be half apercent lower in the next six
months.
So just wait.
Um, but I don't know that.
Um, and no one knows it.
No matter, you know, you know, II listened to a lot of really,
(06:22):
really smart people who who havegiven really what I thought were
coherent predictions aboutwhat's gonna happen with rates,
and they were flat out wrong.
So so it you know, it is it itis it is hard.
I mean, we can look at differentum indicators to let us know
what rates are gonna do, but wedon't really know.
So so I guess I'll get to thepoint, which is is the juice
(06:44):
worth a squeeze.
So um, you know, when I'mlooking at someone's situation
and we let's say they, you know,they're they have a 7% on their
current house right now, theircurrent mortgage is sitting at
7%.
They bought a couple years ago.
And let's say when we look atyou know their their
opportunities or their optionsright now, let's say we can get
them to a six percent, right?
Um, for some people, they'll saythat's kind of the number in
(07:05):
their head, like, okay, if I candrop my rate 1%, that then I
would do it, right?
What's the logic behind that?
Uh, I don't really know if thereis any logic behind it.
It just sounds good, like I'mdropping my rate a percent.
Um, but I I don't I don't thinkit's a bad way to look at it.
But um, but let's say, you know,we want to dive a little bit
deeper to understand does thatactually make sense to do?
(07:26):
Um, so let's say in thatscenario, we go from a 7% rate
to a 6% rate.
Whenever you do a refinance, um,there is going to be some kind
of cost to doing that refinance.
There's going to be um a loancost, there's going to usually
be a title company involved, um,and there are fees involved in
there.
Um, no matter how we slice it ordice it.
I know a lot of lenders weretalking about completely free
(07:49):
refinances for a long time.
Um, I that's not a realisticrepresentation of what's
happening.
There might be discountedoptions out there.
Some folks feel like ourcompany, you know, we have an
option where we'll we're excuseme, where we will waive.
That was a tongue twister, likeuh our our origination, you
know, in certain circumstances,um that that fee.
(08:10):
But there's still going to be acost.
No matter how you slice it ordice it, there's gonna be a cost
of doing a refinance.
So what we want to understandis, you know, how long um do we
need to stay in that loan andstay in that house for that
refinance to make sense?
So for example, we go from a 7%rate to a 6% rate.
Let's say in that example, we'resaving$200 a month.
(08:33):
That sounds really good.
And it is really good.
Um, and let's say that the theactual cost of doing a refinance
was about$5,000.
Um, whether you pay that out ofpocket or you roll it into your
loan, which is an option, um,that's still a cost that you're
going to feel and experience.
So it's a pretty simplecalculation.
We take that$5,000 divided bythe$200 per month that we're
(08:55):
saving.
And in that situation, we wouldsee that it's just over two
years.
That's how long we would need tostay in that mortgage and stay
in that house for that refinanceto make sense.
So if Sarah was sitting downwith me right now and said, hey,
Brendan, this is what I'mthinking about doing this, you
know.
My first question is, do youthink you're going to move in
(09:15):
the next two years?
And if the answer is, well,yeah, I think we we might move
in the next six months to ayear, well, then I'd say it
probably doesn't make a ton ofsense, right?
Because ultimately you're gonnasay, yeah, you'll save money
month to month, but you spentmoney in the beginning.
And so it just doesn't thenumbers don't number, right?
So, but it but if the answer isyes, I'm going to be in this
(09:37):
home for the next three, four,five years, um, then I think
that's a real, that that's areal opportunity to consider
this, this could be somesavings, right?
This could be some real savingsthat we'll experience over time.
Um, and that's kind of I thinkwhere I think if we can just
start the conversation there andunderstand, okay, here's how
much it's gonna cost to do therefinance, here's how much we're
(09:59):
gonna save.
And if we're gonna be in thishome for at least that amount of
time, then yeah, I think therethe c the answer can be yes, the
juice can be worth the squeeze.
Um and then from there, that'sthat's when you have to make
some judgment calls.
Do we do we think rates aregonna keep going down?
Do we want to wait and see ifthat happens?
Um, or are we just happy knowingthat, hey, we're gonna be saving
(10:21):
a couple hundred bucks a monthright now.
And if rates go down, so be it.
If they go up, then obviously,you know, you'll be like, well,
I made the right decision.
I'm very smart.
So um but that's I think reallykind of that's how I try to keep
it really simple, you know, andjust like, hey, are are we
saving money?
Are we saving enough money overtime for this to make sense?
SPEAKER_01 (10:40):
Yeah, I love that.
Well, and I know the last timethat we talked, um, you know,
there was that Fed rate cut, andyou know, everyone was expecting
interest rates to go down.
And, you know, you explainedthat interest rates actually had
already gone down inanticipation of the Fed cut,
because that's not actually whatdirectly affects, you know,
mortgage rates.
(11:01):
And so, you know, um obviouslyif someone wants to learn more
about that, please listen to theuh previous episode that I
recorded with Brendan, andyou'll be able to hear all of
that.
Um, but then I've also seen, youknow, I know whenever we talked,
we talked about how interestrates may not go down anymore.
You know, they may go down morebefore 2026 and they may not.
(11:22):
Um, you know, and it sounds likethey maybe are going down.
Can you kind of talk to us rightnow about like kind of where
rates are and you know, ifyou've heard anything else in
the mortgage world about it, youknow, going down?
Obviously, no crystal ballinvolved.
SPEAKER_00 (11:35):
Yeah, yeah, 100%.
So yeah, I think, I think rightnow, um it's um depending on how
closely you pay attention, youyou may notice rates go down.
You may, you know, if you kindof dip your toe in today and
then don't look again foranother month, you you know, you
may have missed out on a smalldrop and then rates came back up
a little bit because we're we'reon a little bit of a volatile
(11:57):
period of time right now.
There's um a handful ofdifferent factors that are
really pushing mortgage ratesaround.
I think overall any kind ofinstability in financial markets
um is an opportunity formortgage rates to go down
because um once again, peoplecan invest in mortgage bonds.
(12:21):
Mortgage bonds are very safe toinvest in.
So when other investments don'tfeel so safe, i.e.
the stock market or um, youknow, let's say um in the past
couple days that there therewere some there's some news
about some some banks that youknow that financially weren't
doing very well, that presentsconcern on how financial markets
(12:44):
are doing.
So, so that puts money into themortgage bond market, which then
pushes rates down a little bit.
So, so right now there's acouple things going on like that
where there's just kind ofonesie twosy um, you know,
financial market not great newsthings happening that make
(13:04):
investors say, hey, we're notreally sure what to do with our
money, so we'll just put it inmortgage bonds for now.
And that's pushed mortgage ratesdown a little bit here over the
over the last couple of weeks.
Um right now, uh, I was justlooking earlier.
The the 30-year fixed averagefor a top-tier scenario um is
right around a 6.2, 6.25.
(13:24):
Um, which you know, uh there wasa lot of headlines about that
being near three-year lows.
Um I think that the thethree-year low in uh over the
last few years would have beenin February of 2022, where rates
were just below six percent.
Um so we're we're makingprogress for that.
Um now there are a few thingsthat could pop up here that
(13:47):
could really drive rates ineither direction.
Um one of the bigger pieces ofdata that's that has been
driving rates has been um jobreports and inflation reports.
And right now, um those reportsare those reports are created
with data that comes from theBureau of Labor and Statistics,
(14:10):
which is a governmentorganization, which is currently
closed.
So um, so those reports thatcome out that would normally
drive rates in one direction orthe other um aren't being
produced um right now.
Um and so that's kind of keepingrates at a little bit of a
standstill because once again,these these investors um who
(14:34):
would normally use thatinformation to make decisions,
they don't really have thatinformation.
And then I think somethingthat's gonna be interesting to
see over the next month or twowhen the government does open
back up, um, which it will atsome point, um how much do we
trust the data?
Because you know, a lot of thatdata could be partial data.
(14:56):
Um, because the the folks whoactually gather that information
to then create the report thatthen gets used to make decisions
about mortgage rates, we may nothave all the information.
So it'll be an interesting, Ithink, end of the year for
mortgage rates to kind of seewhat happens.
Um, because there will bereports that get put out about
jobs and about labor andinflation.
(15:16):
Um, but it's hard to knowexactly how trustworthy that
data is gonna be, at least as itinitially trickles out.
So um we'll see.
I guess as well as once again,it's it's hard to know.
That's why, you know, right now,if someone asks me, hey,
Brendan, are rates gonna keepgoing down through the end of
the year?
Should I wait to refinance?
I don't know.
(15:37):
I don't know.
And I it's I as as a as a personwho does this for a living and
you don't want to say that, butI don't know what's gonna happen
to rates through the end of theyear.
Um, I could see two scenarioshappening where rates either go
up or go down.
Um I know that's kind of itseems like a cop-out, but truly,
it's it's really gonna bedictated by by data that comes
out and how that data isinterpreted by people who um
(15:59):
invest in mortgage bonds.
So so we'll see.
Um, I would say, you know, rightnow, if you're in the market to
buy a house, um, rates are aslow as as low as they have been
in the last few years, which isgreat news.
Um and you know, once again, uhwaiting isn't always your friend
from that perspective because wejust don't know exactly what's
(16:21):
gonna happen.
SPEAKER_01 (16:22):
Yeah, exactly.
Well, and it's interestingbecause you know, the uh there's
that saying out there that, youknow, uh you can't time uh the
market, you know, uh you justhave to kind of go based off of
what is, you know, what yourcurrent situation is.
And so, you know, don't wait tobuy, uh, buy and wait, you know.
(16:43):
So, you know, obviously the thebest time to purchase is when it
makes sense for you personally.
And, you know, whenever thatmakes sense, then you're putting
your money into an asset whichis going to continuously grow.
And, you know, so you're notthrowing your money away.
So sometimes instead of tryingto time the market, you know, I
just tell people like if itmakes sense for you and what
you're going through right nowand you can afford it, then yes,
(17:05):
now is the right time.
And then, you know, like lateron, you know, maybe something
else happens and you know itlowers down to to 3% again.
Who knows?
Like, okay, cool.
Then you get to like go back tothat.
Probably not, but you know,yeah.
Um never know.
SPEAKER_00 (17:20):
We never know.
Never say never.
SPEAKER_01 (17:22):
Yeah.
Well, and we're now going intowinter market, which
historically is a slower time,which is better for buyers.
Uh, you know, especially uh it'snot so awesome for sellers
because you know, they're like,hey, my house is sitting, why?
Yeah.
And you know, this market hasbeen so weird because I have,
you know, I have five listingsright now and they're just
(17:45):
sitting.
And, you know, people are like,why is my house not selling?
And I'm like, well, it's not2020.
And, you know, there's a lotmore, uh, we have a lot more
inventory out there.
So there's more choices.
Whereas, you know, back in 2020,it was like, do you want this
house or not?
Like, you know, either give yourfirstborn child and get this
house or like, you know, keepmoving.
(18:06):
So um, you know, it's just atotally different market.
But I think, you know, talkingwith a lender, making sure that
you can financially afford, youknow, at the rate that it is
now, uh, you know, it makes themost sense.
And then, you know, you have allthese options to go out there.
So, you know, I think settingsomeone up for success right now
is talking with a lender,getting locked into the lower
(18:29):
rate, and then working, youknow, with a with a good builder
that can take you to show all,you know, show you all the
different things and help you tomake a decision, but you have a
little bit more time now becauseit's winter, it's slower, and we
have more inventory out there.
SPEAKER_00 (18:43):
So let's not say it's winter yet.
It still looks pretty fallyoutside.
Let's not I I know we tend tothink a couple months in
advance, but yeah, I don't Idon't want to I don't want to
think about walking through thesnow yet.
You know what I mean?
SPEAKER_01 (18:55):
I don't either.
I don't either.
I've had to start like puttingon sweatshirts and coats and
stuff, and I'm like, ugh, why?
SPEAKER_00 (19:01):
Yeah, 100%.
No, I I a hundred percent agree.
I I think um the the fourthquarter of the year and then the
very beginning of Q1, um, youknow, if you're someone who's
trying to time the market ortake advantage of the market, I
I think this is this is areally, really good time.
Um because to your point, youknow, uh homes do sit longer.
(19:25):
And that's not, I don't thinkthat's a uh a right now
phenomenon.
I think that's a that's aseasonal factor, right?
Um you know, uh there there areless people interested in buying
those times of year.
So if you are interested inbuying, you have less
competition, and you know, thethe folks who are selling are
(19:48):
selling for a reason, right?
Um so they're they're motivated.
Um I was looking at this.
There was actually a um uh Idon't know if it's I don't know
if it's called I guess it's asite uh that I got put out by um
Lending Tree uh that came out Ithink either earlier this week
or later last week.
Um just talking about um basedon a few different metrics.
(20:11):
Um January is by far the bet themost productive time for for
home buyers um with respect tobeing able to negotiate um to
get the best deal.
Um and so to your point, I thinkyou know, where we sit in the
middle almost to the end ofOctober, um starting the process
(20:32):
now, if you haven't started, uhto if you're interested in
buying um and you want to takeadvantage of that market, um,
starts today.
Uh if you start if you start inJanuary, you're you're kind of
behind the ball.
Um so I think starting now,getting your ducks in a row, um,
to your point, getting connectedwith a really good realtor who
can get you set up on a search,get you familiar with the
different opportunities that areout there, um, getting your
(20:54):
financial ducks in a row.
So that way when a when a reallygreat opportunity does present
itself, it's not, okay, I gotta,I gotta figure out my stuff.
It's like, no, I know exactlykind of where I stand and you
can just move forward.
Um But yeah, a couple stats thatthey put out from this article.
And obviously, you know, realestate's hyper local.
(21:15):
I mean, when we look at um eventhe data for central Ohio and
the different markets in centralOhio, um, you know, days on
market is going to vary prettygreatly um from you know zip
code to zip code.
But they but you know,Lenningtree, you know, it's
they're trying to put out youknow national statistics.
So uh what I think is this portsover pretty well.
Um it's it's said, you know, onaverage in January, newly listed
(21:38):
homes um sit on the market foran average of 75 days um before
going into contract, um, whichis the slowest time of year.
And then if you compare thatfrom April to June, on average,
um, you're looking at under 50days.
So, you know, that's a hugeswing in days on market.
And then if we just think aboutthe psychology of that situation
(22:00):
and kind of who holds the cardswhen a home is sitting on the
market for 75 days versus, youknow, for a third of that time
or two-thirds of that time, uh,once again, as a home buyer,
you're gonna you're gonna holdthe cards um in those scenarios.
Um, and that can look like, youknow, um negotiating on when
you're gonna take possession,price, closing costs, rate buy
(22:22):
downs, all kinds of stuff thatcan really make uh maybe a home
that wasn't affordable beforeall of a sudden affordable.
So um, yeah, I don't, you know,if if anyone if if people are
trying to tell you that there'sno deal to be had um as a home
buyer, I I I don't think that'saccurate.
I think there's a lot ofopportunities.
Um and to your point, um, withsome of your sellers, I'm I'm
I'm sure they wouldn't theywould definitely invite you know
(22:44):
a buyer to come in with a with acreative option or creative
offer, right?
So um so yeah, so I I think it'sa great time um that we're
heading into for home buyers.
And if that's that's you andyou're interested, um, yeah, I
would get the process startedsooner rather than later.
SPEAKER_01 (22:59):
Yeah, I totally agree.
Yeah, with sellers, I'm justletting them know, like, hey,
things are sitting and you know,it's not so it used to be so
easy to list a house and withinyou know the first week, you
would know if you had priced itincorrectly, either, you know,
like if you had priced it toohigh.
And uh because then you know noone was coming to see it.
(23:21):
Uh, you know, if someone was,they were given the feedback
that it was, you know, justpriced too high or whatever.
Um, you know, or if you weregetting zero showing requests,
then you know, you could tell.
But now, like there, that isn'ttrue.
You know, your house could bepriced perfectly and there it's
just a just a slower market.
I think a lot of it has to dowith, you know, the the
(23:41):
volatility around uh, you know,our government and just with
every, you know, you can't youcan't predict anything.
Not that we could predict it ifwe had a you know a different
government at this point, butum, you know, there's just so
much out there that is, youknow, just up in the air that it
makes it very difficult, youknow, for people to to pull the
(24:03):
trigger and be like, yep, it'stime for me to, you know, buy
the house.
Or like, you know, they're like,well, what if I lose my job?
Or what if, you know, likethere's so much out there and
this is just a weird, a weirdmarket.
So, you know, it's still verymuch a seller's market because
we don't have enough inventoryout there.
So if you're going by thetraditional rules of sellers and
buyer's market, we still don'thave enough out there for it to
(24:25):
be uh, you know, a mixed marketor a buyer's market.
But um, you know, because if wehave way too much out there,
then it definitely turns into abuyer's market.
But I will say it's feeling moreand more like a hybrid where
it's more of a buyer's market,even though traditionally it's
considered still a seller'smarket.
(24:45):
Buyers are able to go in and askfor um, you know, for like the
two one buy down where theseller pays, you know, for their
rate to be lowered, twopercentage points the first
year, one percentage point thesecond year, and then the third
year on, you know, you're kindof locked into whatever rate,
you know, the 6.25 or whateverit is that you qualified for.
(25:06):
So that's a great savings versusjust asking them to take, you
know,$10,000 off the price orwhatever.
You would end up saving more ifyou had them buy down your rate.
So, you know, there's definitelymore creative things that buyers
can do now in this market uhversus whenever it's a true
seller's market, like back, youknow, in 2020, 2021, whenever,
(25:29):
you know, you couldn't ask foranything.
Like you better be waiving allcontingencies, just you know,
giving away the farm, you know,to be able to purchase this
house or sell.
Um, you know, I think that uh,you know, to your point, like
now is the right time for buyersif they're thinking about it,
because you know, there is somuch flexibility for them.
SPEAKER_00 (25:49):
Do you think I'm I'm curious, um, when you're when
you're working with sellers andpotentially listing their house,
especially this time of year,um, and I know you're a very
data-driven person, and soyou're, you know, you're you're
looking at the market thatthey're in and kind of what's
going on and um, you know, thedays on hand, like the typical
days on hand, especially forhomes that are similar to
(26:09):
theirs.
If you're if you know that rightnow, homes in a specific zip
code that you're gonna be ableto sing a home at are sitting a
little bit longer, um I from anexpectation standpoint, you
know, um what what what wouldyou like if you were trying to
set appropriate expectationswith a seller?
I mean, like how how how wouldyou do that?
(26:30):
And kind of what it if ifsomeone's listening to this and
they're thinking, hey, I want tosell my home and you know, my my
neighbor, you know, two streetsover, their house has been on
the market for a month and ahalf, you know, what would you
how how would you kind of helpthem understand, like, hey,
here's here's what you're gonnabe walking into, and here's some
of the things I think you shouldconsider.
Um, because I I love what youtalked about with, you know,
(26:52):
being creative with like thingslike two-on-by-downs.
And I think it might be sensethat I want to hear your answer,
is you know, if if from thebeginning sellers can be open to
different ideas about what theymay end up needing to do to get
their house in contract, I thinkif they if they can accept that
from the beginning, it's gonnabe less, less painful um in the
(27:13):
middle of the process.
Um, so just just curious, youknow, uh how you know, if if you
were talking to a seller rightnow in that situation, kind of
how would you help setappropriate expectations of
them?
SPEAKER_01 (27:25):
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, you know, to your point,um, what you said earlier when
talking with buyers, you know,it's really just figuring out
what their uh, you know, whatwhat's their motivation to sell?
Um, you know, have they found aplace that they just absolutely
love?
Uh are they downsizers?
Can they no longer afford theirhouse?
Can uh, you know, did their uhdid they add to their family?
(27:47):
You know, so now they need abigger house.
And, you know, like so there'sso many different things to just
kind of understand like whythey're selling.
And so then, you know, and thenI just let them know, like, hey,
here's the data from yourneighborhood.
You know, nothing has sold uh inyour neighborhood in the last,
you know, three months.
Uh, or, you know, I don't gofurther back.
Six months is about the mostI'll go back.
(28:10):
But in this market, really,like, you know, three months uh
is probably the best to givethem the best picture of what
we're looking at.
And then I'll show them, like,you know, look, this house is,
you know, like it doesn't havevery much update.
Uh it's been sitting in themarket for, you know, 75 days,
whatever.
Um, so let's take that intoconsideration.
Let's look at your house.
(28:30):
Um, you know, just because yourneighbor sold last year uh for
top dollar doesn't mean thatyou're gonna sell for top dollar
right now.
It's just, you know, you mightmaybe, you know, maybe you
updated every single port, youknow, like every single thing in
your house, like everything'sbeen touched and everything's
been updated.
Then, you know, yeah, there is agreater chance because again,
(28:51):
buyers get the option to bechoosy and they would much
rather have a house that theycan walk into that's been fully
updated and, you know, and theywill pay more for that.
But let's say that you're in asituation where you're like,
hey, like I can't afford to doanything to this house.
I also just need to get out.
Um, you know, and in thatsituation, then I'm like, okay,
well, then here's where weshould probably price it.
(29:12):
And it may not be where theywant it to.
Um, you know, and ultimatelyit's up to the seller to decide.
You know, they can say, hey, Isaw your data, screw that.
I'm still, I still want to, youknow, I still want to lose my
house if this is a high number.
And I'm like, I mean, we can,but like realistically, it's
likely not going to sell atthat.
(29:32):
But if that's truly, you know,like if you need to learn the
hard way, sure, let's do it, youknow.
Um, because I I'm not here totalk someone into, you know, or
out of what they what they wantto do because it's their their
house, but I am here to guide,give all of the information.
And if I've given you all theinformation and you still are
like screw that, okay.
(29:52):
That's on you.
But yeah, but I I just alwaystry to let them know, like, hey,
look, on average, houses are,you know, here in central Ohio,
like, you know, there are stillsome areas that literally you
list a house and it's incontract within the first few
days.
So that's great.
But most areas here in centralOhio, you know, like it's on
average, it's like 50 days rightnow.
(30:14):
Um so you know, it just, andthat's not to say that yours
wouldn't sell faster.
It might, you know, but again,depending on how your
circumstances and how fast youneed to get rid of it uh and get
moving to your next, you know,destination, uh, you know, we
may be doing um priceimprovements more often than you
(30:34):
know, than out anybody else outthere just because.
You know, a lot of times peopleare like, hey, you know, even
though my house has been sittinghere, I'm not willing to go
below this.
And, you know, that's fine.
They still may end up sellingit, but it may end up being, you
know, 80 days, 90 days, 100 daysin.
SPEAKER_00 (30:51):
So Yeah.
No, I you know, I'm not sellingmy house today, but if I if I
were, I may I I definitely wouldrather have, you know, Sarah
Tress who's telling me the truthversus, you know, Joe Schmoe,
real estate person who is justgonna do um what I want to hear.
(31:11):
Right.
Um, and so I I think that's Ithink that's key too.
I mean, if I was selling myhouse today and you're someone
who's thinking about sellingyour house is, you know, make
sure you're working with arealtor who's not afraid to tell
you what's actually going on,right?
If if they're just nodding theirhead at everything you say, you
know, um, I I would look forsomeone who's who's gonna who's
(31:32):
gonna use real data to helpinform the the decision about
how to market your home.
Um because that will that willself-aster for hire versus you
know someone who just is justyou know shooting in the dark.
So it's really, I think becauseit because this sounds like you
know, it's it's so interesting.
As long as we were doing thispodcast like three years ago, it
(31:53):
was like, hey, we're reallytrying to, you know, keep our
buyers motivated.
And now it's a little bitreverse, like, hey, we gotta
keep our sellers motivated,right?
Because it, you know, thingslike things can change and they
will always change.
Um, but I you know, when I I wastalking with someone else the
other day, like, I was like,hey, this is a reminder, man,
you know, you bought this housein 2017.
Um 2020, 21, 22.
(32:14):
Like you had double digitappreciation those years.
Um so yeah, like in 2025, didyour house appreciate for 15%
like it did in 2021?
No.
But like on the whole, overtime, like sellers who sell
today who have been in theirhome for a reasonable amount of
time, like they're they'remaking money.
(32:35):
Um, right.
I mean, there are some of thoseunfortunate situations, you
know, where someone, you know,is moving in and out really
quickly, and that, you know, maynot be ideal, but by and large,
you know, real estate prices arestubbornly strong and they
continue to go up.
So, you know, I because like youknow, people say, oh, hey, I see
these price price reductions onZillow.
(32:56):
It means housing market crashingor prices coming down.
That's not what's happening.
I mean, we are seeing home homevalues, you know, home from from
where they're listed to wherethey go in a contract for, you
know, in in a handful ofscenarios be less.
But if we look at the value ofthat home over time, the value
of that home has gone up.
And so I just think that that'sthe reminder is that just
(33:17):
because we're seeing prices bereduced from where they
originally listed, that doesn'tmean that housing overall is
slipping backwards.
It's quite the opposite.
Trust me.
Ask anyone who's trying to buy ahouse today versus five years
ago.
So it's you know, housing pricesare still strong, they're still
going up over time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:35):
Yeah, no, absolutely.
And I think that um thatreminded me of another uh thing.
I had a uh seller the other dayreach out and they're like, hey,
I got something in the mail thattold me that my house is, you
know, uh gone up in value.
Uh so you know, I want to goahead and sell.
And, you know, they've only beenthere for a couple of years.
And uh, you know, and so I said,okay, great.
(33:57):
Like, let me look at it.
Well, you know, where thisperson is, nothing has sold in
over a year in that area.
So finding like a true comp isvery difficult.
So I had to open it up to thezip code with, you know, um
similar properties with the sameuh bedroom, same bathroom, same
square footage in that zip code,um, which also, you know, can
(34:20):
give you a good picture, butit's still not a crystal ball.
So, you know, I was like lookingat those, you know, those houses
are now selling for less thanwhat yours is selling for.
Now I'm not telling you that wecouldn't list it for, you know,
for around what you paid for it,but uh, you know, unfortunately,
like I don't have a crystalball.
So, and they're like, well, butI got this thing in the mail.
(34:41):
And I'm like, well, I'm I'm realglad you got that thing in the
mail.
But, you know, the biggest thingthat I always try and let
sellers know is that a house isworth what someone's willing to
pay for it.
Like, yeah, it doesn't matterwhat you list it for, it doesn't
matter what Zillow tells you, itdoesn't matter what, you know,
an appraiser tells you that it'sworth, it is worth what someone
is willing to pay for it.
So even though you may thinkthat it is the most amazing
(35:03):
piece of property you've everlived in in your entire life and
someone should be spendingmillions on buying it.
If someone else that's ready tobuy doesn't see that that value,
then it's not going to sell atthe price that you think it
should sell for.
So 100%.
100%.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Well, Brendan, thank you so muchfor coming on.
(35:25):
I really appreciate it.
Um, as always, you gave someamazing advice and made things
um make sense.
So uh, and if you're listeningto this and you are a first-time
homebuyer and you are stillthinking, holy crap, I don't
even know where to start.
Uh, Brendan and I have created auh a master class where you are
able to log in at any time it'sfree.
(35:49):
Uh, and there's the link in theshow notes, but also uh you can
go to my social media pages andthere's always a link there.
Um but again, I'll make surethat it's in the show notes.
But uh that class literallywalks you through what goes into
getting ready to be a homeowner,um, what goes into credit, um,
you know, all the super funthings, but it's on a recording,
(36:10):
so you can go back and watch itas many times as you want to
make sure that it makes sensefor you.
And then obviously you canalways reach out to either one
of us uh with questions.
All our information is in theshow notes, so you can reach out
at any time.
Uh, and like I said, youdefinitely want to be following
Brendan Bland's social media uhbecause he brings some really
good information in a really uhyou know humorous way, or at
(36:31):
least, you know, he makes it asfun as you possibly can make
mortgage.
SPEAKER_00 (36:35):
Fun as you can.
As fun as you can.
That's always for my homebuyers.
It's like I'm gonna make it asfun as possible to borrow a few
hundred thousand dollars.
SPEAKER_01 (36:42):
So yes, exactly.
But yeah, like I said, uh clickon that uh if you're interested.
Uh it's free.
And uh, you know, we're alwayshere to answer questions.
And definitely if you enjoyedthis episode, make sure that you
leave a review.
Five star uh review would beamazing.
Um, you know, rate and review,and then share it uh with anyone
(37:02):
that you think might beinterested in this information.
So thanks so much for tuning in,and we'll see you next time on
Come to Find Out.
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.