March 6, 2024 • 60 mins
Ever wonder why your recorded voice seems like a stranger's? Join us as vocal coach extraordinaire John Henny illuminates the path to embracing your natural voice, while I, Jennifer Furlong, get into the nitty-gritty of vocal delivery that makes or breaks effective communication. This episode is a treasure trove for anyone aiming to refine their oratory skills. From the quirky transition of a drummer to a voice guru, John's insights will lead you through the science of vocal perception, and together, we'll tackle the challenge of accents and authenticity in your daily conversations.
Have you ever been caught off guard by a 'salesman voice'? We dissect the pitfalls of this often-repelling pitch and, instead, share the secrets of emotional sincerity that can turn any spiel into a profound connection with your audience. John and I pull back the curtain on transferring acting techniques to public speaking, and I even dare you to sing your next speech—at least in rehearsal! With stories from the stage and strategies for dealing with the unexpected, this episode is your backstage pass to captivating an audience with humor, humility, and a dose of reality.
Finally, for those whose instrument of choice is the voice, we've got your back on maintaining its health. I'll let you in on my favorite vocal care tips, and John will weigh in on shaking off the shackles of perfectionism because sometimes, it's the imperfect note that strikes the deepest chord. Wrap up your vocal cords in a warm blanket of knowledge as we traverse the landscape of voice optimization for both the seasoned professional and the everyday speaker. And remember, it's not just about speaking clearer but touching hearts with clarity and sincerity. Join John and me for an insightful journey into vocal mastery that will have you not just talking, but communicating like never before.
Contact John Henny for more speaker tips at www.compellingspeaker.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Welcome to the Communication 24-7 podcast,
where we communicate about howwe communicate.
I'm your host, jennifer Furlong.
Let me just do something realquick, real quick, before we get
(00:31):
started.
I will now practice mynon-regional diction.
If any of you are wondering,what in the heck is she doing?
I have a vocal coach in thehouse.
Let me introduce John Henney toyou.
(00:52):
He has been around the worldand he has helped thousands of
people become more effectivecommunicators.
He is an author, he is apodcaster and he is going to
help us think about not onlyjust think about, but give us
some really good tips regardingour vocal delivery.
(01:13):
So y'all know, as a publicspeaking coach, I taught public
speaking at the college levelfor 18 years.
This is a person after my ownheart, so I'm excited to have
him as a guest on the show.
I know I'm going to learn a lotfrom him and I guarantee all of
you listeners will also learn alot from him.
So, john, welcome to the show.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Absolutely.
You know, I think being able todeliver a presentation
effectively, it doesn't matterif you are aspiring to be on the
stage, if you want to get onthe speaking circuit, if you
want to be a leader, to be ableto just share your message more
effectively with your employees.
Regardless, this is a skillthat we have to continue to
(02:01):
develop over our lifetime.
So, before we actually diveinto the questions, would you
mind taking a moment for ourlisteners to just introduce
yourself and tell us a littlebit about how you became a vocal
coach to begin with?
What made you want to do thisfor a living?
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Yeah, so my journey to being a vocal coach was not a
straight line and it's notanything I saw myself doing when
I was younger.
When I was a child, my father,who was from Glasgow, scotland,
had this wonderful naturalsinging voice and my attempts at
(02:42):
singing would be met withthat's bloody terrible, which I
know it sounds awful, but it's aScottish thing, yes.
So I just went okay, I'm notgoing to sing.
And I started playing the drumsand I became a professional
drummer in my late teens andplayed professionally all
(03:03):
through my 20s.
And in my early 20s I thoughtyou know, if I could sing just a
little, I could get more gigsbecause I could do at least
backup vocals.
And a friend of mine said hey,I just started taking lessons
with someone who studies withStevie Wonder's voice teacher
and I went Stevie Wonder, I'm in.
So I began studying with aperson named Eric Futer here in
(03:30):
Southern California and heshowed me that the voice really
is an instrument and if youlearn the basics and the
mechanics, you can learn to sing.
And I moved from the drums.
I started becoming a leadvocalist.
I ended up moving on to StevieWonder's teacher himself, seth
Riggs, who taught everybody's hewas Michael Jackson's voice
(03:55):
coach and I then startedtraining other voice teachers.
I started working with singersand voice teachers and from
there I started to be sent fromear, nose and throat doctors.
I would get professional voiceusers, speakers, and I found
that the exercises that workedfor singers.
If I modified them, they workedfor speakers as well.
(04:17):
And I also found that thedevices that great singers use
in order to connect to anaudience and really captivate
them worked for singers, and soit's kind of become my mission
to help people discover themusic in their voice.
We all are born to sing.
(04:38):
They believe that our firstattempts at language prehistoric
humans, our first language, wassomething they call music
language, and it was anemotional communication that was
sung, and so the voice is theconnector of emotion, and music
(04:59):
is really the way, the deepestway, that we can express emotion
, and in taking these devicesand this expressiveness and
bringing it into your speakingvoice, you will have an edge
that most other people aremissing.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Oh, I love that and I just wanted to throw it out
there.
My father was also a drummer,so speaking to another drummer,
it just kind of warms my heart.
And I love that you weretalking about using the concepts
that you learned when you werelearning to sing and how you can
(05:38):
transfer those exact same conyou know those same ideas into
the public speaking or the vocaldelivery area.
So one thing I do want to askyou people love to joke how they
can only sing in the shower.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
And we all, let's get real, we all know certain
people who you know Bueller,Bueller, that monotone voice, on
and on and on.
So are you saying that, yes,even those who have that
monotone voice, they've had itfor years that we can finally
(06:18):
get them into an area where theycan tell a story and deliver it
in a way that we're going to beable to be in that moment with
them through their vocaldelivery.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Absolutely.
I think one of the shames is ifyou go back a hundred years ago
, middle class homes in in,certainly in the US and Europe.
Many of them had pianos.
This was the familyentertainment center and
everyone got around and sang andthey enjoyed it and there
wasn't judgment yeah, certainlysomewhere better than others.
(06:50):
But then came the phonographand the radio and now you could
have world class singers in yourhome on demand and it created
this class of well they sing.
I don't and people started todisconnect from singing and feel
that if I don't do it on thislevel, I can't sing.
And I think you know, whenTiger Woods came on the golf
(07:11):
scene people didn't look atTiger and go, oh well, then I
can't golf.
He brought more people to thegame, he inspired people.
Yet we seem to have thisfeeling that if you can't do
singing at a certain level, youcan't do it, and so we've lost
our birthright of musicalcommunication and in that I
think that speech has become formany a little flatter than it
(07:35):
used to be and a little lessexpressive.
But if you gain an awarenessand you just start to do some
simple exercises, start playingwith your range, play with some
melody, not singing, but justeven within your speaking voice,
you'll start to discover thatyou can have a more profound
(07:55):
level of communication and youwill, you'll engage people.
I mean, the joke from that BenStein character in Ferris
Bueller was the monotony andjust, it's so incredibly boring
and you can.
You can absolutely break out ofthat.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
That's good news.
That's really good news to hear, and you know, I think that's
right.
There's something about growingup in a home where there's
music, and whether you have achild who is learning how to
play guitar or the piano, theyjoin band, you know, in middle
(08:33):
school and high school learningto play the flute, whatever that
instrument is.
I think it's such a powerfultool to be able to learn how to
express yourself in that way,and I think you do naturally
tend to bring that into yourspeaking voice as well, even
though you may not evennecessarily know that that's
what's happening.
So, yeah, I think it's afantastic idea to just have your
(08:57):
kids learn, you know, whetherthey want to join chorus or they
want to join band, whatever itis.
I think it's a greatextracurricular to have any
child get involved with that,because it's going to help them
in more ways than we evenrealize, especially since we're
talking about our speakingvoices.
So let's take it from from thebase level.
(09:20):
I am brand new to this.
I'm scared to death.
I have no idea you know where,where I can begin with this, but
I do know that I want to bemore effective.
I do know that I want to beable to connect with people and
reach them.
On a more emotional level.
What do you say to somebody whois really starting from just
(09:44):
stage one and they have noexperience in this and really
little to no confidence in this?
What do you do with that?
Speaker 1 (09:52):
The beginning is to just connect with your voice on
a deeper level, even if it'sjust humming.
Feel the hum, feel thevibration, move the pitch up and
down, feel how the sensationschange as you move as you, as
you, as you go up, you may feelthe voice lift up behind your
(10:15):
eyes.
As you go down, you may feel itsettle more in your chest and,
of course, the voice isn'tchanging where it is.
It's just how our body isabsorbing the energy changes and
our awareness of it.
And then it's really, I think,the most important thing is
finding your optimal speakingpitch, where your voice is going
(10:37):
to work best.
A lot of people associate andrightly so a deeper voice with
more authority, but what theyend up doing is they mistake
this more authoritative voicefor a lower pitch.
And when people start speakingon a lower pitch, they start to
lose energy in their voice andtrying to make that louder, all
(11:00):
you're going to do is squeeze,which is going to create
physical problems with the voice, fatigue or even worse.
Just to demonstrate veryquickly if I play a pitch and I
speak on this pitch, if I changenot the pitch but my resonance
(11:20):
and I make the resonance go alittle thinner and higher.
My voice sounds higher, but ifI'm on this pitch and I begin to
bring in the deeper resonance,now my voice, I haven't changed
the pitch, but it sounds richer,it sounds deeper.
So it's then discovering notjust the pitch of the voice but
also the resonance, and if youdon't like the sound of your
(11:40):
voice, one or likely both ofthose aren't being used
optimally.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yeah, I hear that often, especially from students.
They hate it when I ask them torecord themselves and play it
back so they can just hear whatthey sound like.
And most of us probably 90% ofthe students that I would talk
to about this I hate the soundof my own voice.
I hate it.
So what is it about that?
(12:09):
What is it that makes us cringewhen we listen to our own voice
, because we're not hearing whateverybody else is hearing,
because most of the time I'mlike what are you talking about?
You have an awesome voice, sowhy is there such a disconnect
there for us?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
So the way the voice works, if you think about it,
when we speak the sound wavesare shooting away from us, so
for us it's as if someone hastheir back turned to us and
they're speaking.
So nature makes up for this byconducting a certain amount of
sound through bone, and thesound waves travel through the
(12:46):
bone to the inner ear.
But bone is not a very goodconductor of higher frequencies.
It tends to be better for lowerparts of the sound wave, and so
when you are speaking, thesense of your own voice that
you're getting tends to be alittle richer than what's being
put out into the room, so thatwhen you hear what your voice
(13:09):
sounds like to others, it's alittle jarring.
But when people say, do I soundlike that, unless the recording
is really poor, yeah, that'swhat you sound like to others
and just know.
What you sound like to otherscan be changed, can absolutely
(13:29):
be changed, and there is a voicethat you have within you that
is your natural, highlyfunctioning voice.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Okay.
So how do we find that?
I get asked this question a lot, especially from students.
Does it really matter whenwe're talking about our optimal
speaking voice and how we sound?
Does it matter if we have acertain accent?
Does it matter the dialect thatwe have you touched on the
(14:06):
pitch or the tone, like whereyou can find your optimal voice?
But to add to that, there aresome additional concerns that I
know a lot of students have,including myself, because I can
easily look, I'll get back intomy Southern real quick, like
right, quick, in a hurry.
But going to broadcastingschool, they didn't like that so
(14:26):
much in Indianapolis, so that'swhy I learned to change that.
But even for me, sometimes I'mwondering so what if it slips
out a little bit?
I don't know if that reallybothers everybody necessarily.
So how do you get someone tounderstand what their natural
(14:46):
go-to speaking voices or, ifthey are gonna change it,
whether they're changing it in agood way or a positive way?
Speaker 1 (14:54):
What I like to look at at the voice is is it
functioning at its best in termsof health, in terms of
production?
Is there good, healthyresonance?
Is there a ease of productionwhen the vocal cords are
vibrating or phonating, or isthe voice squeezed?
Is it breathy or, hmm, are wefinding a voice that's just nice
(15:18):
and buzzy?
Is the airflow sufficient forwhat we are using the voice for?
And then from there, youraccent is a part of you, it's a
part of your personality.
It's really up to you if youraccent is at a point where it
maybe needs to be, maybe softenslightly, in case people aren't
(15:40):
understanding everything you arehearing.
But I'm not an advocate ofhaving a false voice.
I see people and they talkabout public speaking and it
starts to become this thingright, and they're almost cheeto
.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
I'm an advocate in schools.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
And I'm just not a fan of that.
What I really think connects usto others is emotional honesty,
and the connector of emotion isthe voice.
They did a study out of Yaleand I think it was 1700
participants, and they wanted tosee, as they spoke, how
(16:19):
accurate the listener could bein telling what the other person
was feeling.
And they had them where it was.
They could see and hear eachother, and then it was only body
language and then it was onlysound.
They put an obstruction betweenthem or made the room dark
(16:40):
where they couldn't see thespeaker, and when it was the
voice alone, the accuracy was atits highest.
The voice, the vibration of thevoice, the way we are tuned as
social beings to really listenand gather information from the
voice is quite profound, and soyou can tell when somebody, when
(17:07):
the voice, starts to beinsincere, when you feel like
you're being sold to your spidey, senses start to go up, and so
I'm just really big on infusingthe voice with honest emotional
intention and letting thatreally carry your message.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
Wouldn't you love to captivate audiences and compel
them to act with just your voice?
Your voice isn't merely acommunication tool.
It's a powerful connector andpersuasive asset.
However, its potential is oftenoverlooked, leaving
considerable professional andbusiness advantages untapped.
Imagine what you could gain byhoning your voice to its full
(17:50):
potential Increase your sales,get that promotion, expand your
opportunities.
The compelling speaker byleading voice coach, john Henney
, will guide you in unearthingyour voice's natural rhythm and
melody, captivating interestthrough variations in pitch,
tone and pace, discovereffective strategies to combat
stage fright and impostersyndrome, and learn valuable
(18:12):
health tips to ensure your voiceremains strong and resonant
throughout your lifetime.
Get a copy of the compellingspeaker today by clicking on the
link in the show notes.
Yeah, you're so right thatSpidey-Sinz comment that you
just made.
You do get a feeling, for ifsomeone is being disingenuous
(18:36):
when they're communicating withyou, and I know.
For me, I feel that when I'mtalking to salespeople a lot of
time.
Okay, and I know you're tryingto sell me something, and so
here I am, I can hear it in thevoice.
So I know you work with a lotof different people from many
different industries on theirvocal delivery.
(18:56):
Do you work with salespeople aswell, so that they could
optimize and be more effective.
And so what kind ofconversations do you have with
them?
Because I imagine that isprobably something that comes up
, that, yeah, there's thatsalesman type of vocal delivery
that will probably cause peopleto back away rather than lean in
(19:20):
, and that's problematic forthem.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
It's absolutely problematic and for me it could
be something I'm ready to buy,something I need, but when I get
that vibe I'm gonna go buy itelsewhere.
I just don't like the feelingand I really focus in my
training on really choosingclear emotional intentions and
(19:49):
emotional intentions.
This comes from the actingworld and what it is.
Let's say, the scene for theactor is they're gonna receive
devastating news.
The actor doesn't go.
Okay, I'm going to be upset orI'm going to be sad, because
that's just kind of this staticinstruction.
(20:10):
So what the actor does is no, Iam going to, my intention is to
rebuke, is to not accept, andso to push against.
And so then that struggle ofhearing the news and you're
emotionally know I don't want tohear this starts the true
(20:30):
emotion churning.
So let's say you've got to walkout and it's a sales
presentation, as people walk outand they'll say hello, but they
they're just running throughthe, the greeting, and then
they're going to go off to sale,sell, right.
When you walk out, what if yourintention is to welcome or to
(20:53):
connect, like that's your goal,in the moment You're going to
stop, the moment you might smiledifferently.
You'll you'll have differentconnection with the eyes and the
way you speak and people feelthis.
If you feel it, people get itand it really is.
And then, when you're givingthe sales presentation, as
(21:17):
you're explaining the product,your intention should be to
inform, to reveal, to instruct,to excite, and this this creates
is your intentions build.
Then, when it comes to the sale, it's.
It's not going to be pushy,you're not going to have the
(21:39):
same amount of resistance.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
I love that.
What is your emotionalintention?
And so I could see that appliedand all kinds of different
scenarios, whether you'recreating a speech for a TEDx
talk or if you are delivering apresentation at work, a really
important presentation at work.
What is that emotionalintention?
How is it that you want toconnect with the audience on
(22:04):
that level?
That's a really importantquestion.
I think, at the very beginningstages of you know, let's say
you're, you're starting at thevery beginning and you've
decided today I want to do a TEDtalk.
You know, maybe that's one ofthe first questions you need to
ask yourself what is, what isthe emotional intention of the
talk that you want to deliver?
Is that, is that something thatyou think would be wise for
(22:27):
them to do?
Sit down at the very beginningand really think about that
intention right there.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Absolutely.
I have a book.
It's, I think it's called theActors Thesaurus.
It's just that it's a wholelisting of different intentions
and you can go through your talkand play with different
intentions on each line.
I was speaking with this, thishighly respected acting coach,
and she had a student who wasdoing the Phantom and Phantom of
(22:57):
the Opera.
Oh nice and when he learned howto use intentions, he was just
so ecstatic and he would changehis intentions each night
because it brought something newto the role, as he did it
hundreds and hundreds of timesand it was always fresh and
(23:19):
always exciting.
So you're not locked into these.
You can be very creative withthem and as you play with them
and experiment with them, youwill feel they will ignite
actual emotion.
And you have to remember thevoice is always communicating
emotion and it can communicatelack of emotion, lack of empathy
(23:42):
.
It can communicate people.
People pick up on things youdon't realize they're picking up
on.
And if you are in these reallyhonest, true intentions, it's a
powerful thing.
And on the flip side, I say,and not entirely joking, I've
(24:03):
never seen a cult leader or acon artist with a lousy speaking
voice.
They know how to captivatepeople.
They know how to use theseintention.
They know how to connect onthis level where they can lead
people where everyone else isstanding going.
How could you fall for this?
How could you go with thisperson?
(24:25):
But when you, when somebodyknows how to use these, it's
quite powerful.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
I want to be able to do this right.
I'm sure you've heard this.
I want and I can understand thevalue in this, but I'm just I'm
afraid.
I feel kind of silly if I letmyself go in that direction.
What kind of advice do you giveanyone who says something like
that?
They're, they're afraid to letgo, or they're afraid of looking
(24:52):
silly, or they're afraid thatit's just not going to work for
them.
For, for whatever reasonbecause I know that fear is a
pretty common feeling,especially, you know, in the
field of public speaking-Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
I encourage my clients to play a game I call
the world's worst musical and Iuse the word worst because it
can be intentionally bad and Ihave them take go somewhere
where they know no one can hearthem and I have them take their
talk or maybe some of theirslides and the points they're
(25:30):
going to make, and sing it.
And sing it like you're, justlike like will Ferrell in elf
I'm smiling and I'm singing andand just be incredibly silly
with it.
And then move that to speechand allow that energy and then
go back to singing as badly asyou want and then back to
(25:54):
speaking and you'll notice allof a sudden there's a different
flow there.
There will be melody in yourwords, tone, there'll be
building of tempo and thenpulling back.
And you'll see that, my gosh,just as singers, because singers
have to go out and certainlycontemporary music it's very
(26:15):
repetitive.
You have first course, firstcourse.
The course is repeat the samelines, it's repeating melodies.
But great singers they usethese little subtle devices.
They'll maybe pause when youthink they're going to give you
the word.
They hesitate, they change thetone, they start to increase the
intensity, they pull back andwhat they do is they keep
(26:40):
reawakening interest byintroducing new elements and
when you start discovering musicand how you can have this
melody in these devices to keepreawakening attention, you're
going to enjoy public speakingmuch more because you know that
you can hold an audience'sattention.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
Yeah, and this is a skill.
You got to work at it, todevelop it.
This isn't something thatyou're going to listen to this
podcast today and thenimmediately you're going to go
out there and you're going to bea Martin Luther King Like that
ain't going to happen, right?
This is something thatprofessional speakers work on
this consistently over years tobe able to do this effectively.
(27:25):
So you know, if you try this acouple of times and you feel
like it's just not catching onor you're just not getting it or
whatever, whatever thathesitation is, don't let that
make you give up, because thisis something it's like anything
else you're going to learn,whether it's an instrument or a
sport.
You know you got to practice atit to get good at it, and that
(27:49):
takes time and effort, you know,over the long haul I can't
emphasize that enough One of thethings I would have my students
do when I was in the classroomis I was bringing, I would bring
in children's books and I wouldhave them be, you know, for
example, the three little pigs,and so I'd have like four
(28:10):
students and you know three ofthem would be one of the little
pigs and then the fourth studentwould be the big bad wolf and I
would have them read thedifferent passages and at the
beginning they would always besuper shy.
They didn't want to really getinto it because it's kind of
silly.
But then by the end they wouldjust let it go and everybody
would have a great time with itand they were laughing and just
(28:31):
kidding around and what atransformation that was for them
to be able to learn.
Hey, you know what?
Just let go and enjoy it.
And then that's when thatconnection happened with
everybody in the room.
So I love that you have that.
You know, kind of like a silly,do this as a really bad musical
.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
To practice it.
I love that.
I love that idea.
I think that's fantastic To beable to just have some levity.
I think that's so incrediblyimportant.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
It is.
You know so much of the fearthat we experience with, with
speaking, getting out in frontof others.
It really is.
It's.
It's the ego and I don't meanthe ego in thinking that you're
incredible.
It's the ego in the sense ofthe self and the and the self
(29:25):
wants to protect.
And many years ago, when wetraveled in small groups, if you
were ostracized, if you wererejected, you would perish most
likely.
And that, that primal fearstays with us.
This fear of rejection andjudgment is so palpable.
(29:46):
And yet in modern societies,the fear is almost silly.
If you give a talk and itdoesn't go well, your life is
not over.
That's right, but it but it'sthis turning inward.
So I tell people, you know this, this, like doing the three
little pigs is wonderful becausethey start to break out and
(30:06):
they're interacting with eachother and the sense of self
begins to diminish.
And now they're, they're goingback and forth and now their
focus is outward.
And that, I think, is somethingI really try.
That that's really importantfor speakers is when you're
getting up in front of people,your focus should be completely
(30:26):
outward.
And if you start to feel thatnervousness and that inner
chatter and that worry, you'returning inward, yeah, and so
keep, keep it on the audience,keep it on those who've come to
hear you.
And the other thing I always dobefore I go out to speak is I
give people permission to notlike me, because they have that
(30:48):
right.
It's like you know what.
You don't have to like me, butI'm here for the people who need
to hear what I have to say.
I owe it to them.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yeah, I think that's a wonderful philosophy to have,
because, even if you are able toreach just one person out in
that audience, they've been ableto.
You've been able to make thatconnection with them on that
emotional level.
I think it's it's worth it,because you have no idea how you
might impact that one person,you know, in a positive way and
(31:20):
it's it's a really powerful toolto be able to use that.
And I agree, you know it's it'sabout them, it's not really
about you.
So, you know, focus on themessage that they're receiving,
focus on how how is it that thisis going to impact them in some
way?
And I think by doing that, byhaving that mindset, it kind of,
(31:40):
you know, takes the pressureoff of you just a little bit,
because it's like, you know, Idon't really have to go out here
and do cartwheels, you know Idon't have to be that type of
speaker where I'm going outthere and I'm entertaining the
masses in order to make thatconnection.
I think sometimes some of themost powerful speakers that I've
ever watched, they're able tomake that connection with you
(32:04):
and it's still in a very quietand controlled way, you know.
I mean, we all enjoy the, the,the exciting type of presenters.
But there is something to besaid about those presenters that
can just capture your attentionand they're not having to do
all of the cartwheels and the,the, the vocal, you know,
(32:26):
gymnastics and all of that tokeep you captured.
How can we find what type ofspeaker we are?
Naturally, because I know somany people think that they have
to be that, that entertainingperson.
You know that.
Oh, obviously I'm an extrovert,you know, and I just that's
(32:47):
just so, not true?
You don't have to be that inorder to be effective at this.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
No, you don't.
What you want to do is justincorporate all of you, all the
sides of you.
There will be parts of you thatget excited and more animated
and it starts to build and it'syour voice is starting to pick
up speed and then you'll, you'llpull back, you'll get a little
more retrospective, maybe alittle softer.
(33:14):
The tonal change and what thatdoes by providing variety, it
constantly reawakens thelistener's attention.
So I think it's really justjust exploring and I think those
emotional intentions are agreat way to start to allow
those, those parts of youryourself, to be expressed fully.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
Yeah, yeah.
So do you ever haveconversations with them
regarding the actual storytelling itself?
Because I know that's a hugepiece of it.
It's.
It's wonderful to be able tohave this vocal delivery and to
think about All right, I wantthem to feel a certain way.
So if, if I'm telling anexciting story about whitewater
rafting you know that I did overthe weekend that I know I'm
(33:59):
probably going to speak a littlefaster and a little more
excited, you know, versussomething that might require a
little more slow pace, sombermood, whatever it is I'm trying
to strive for.
But if you don't have the rightlanguage or the right story or
the right words or the rightphrasing, sometimes that can
(34:21):
come off as disingenuous if it'snot meshing, if it's not
matching up.
So what kind of tips do youhave for someone when they just
they're sitting down for thefirst time and they really want
to write a speech that's goingto connect with the audience?
How do they go about gettingthat story out of them?
Speaker 1 (34:45):
I think we need to be very judicious with the stories
that we tell.
I have sat through speakersthat I remember once I went to
it was a two-day businessseminar and there was only one
speaker on stage for eight hoursboth days.
(35:05):
That's a really daunting task.
The person got up and hestarted off with an amusing
anecdote.
It's like okay, a story to getthings going, then started to do
a slice, but then it becamestory after story and corny
jokes.
By the end of the first day Irealized this all could have
(35:26):
been done in one day.
We've spent a day listening toyour stories.
Be very careful how manystories you're telling.
Make sure that it builds to apoint that it's relative to what
you're talking about.
Make sure that it'sentertaining.
It doesn't have to be funny,but it should be interesting
(35:51):
Rather than if you feel like youwant to put all these stories
in.
I think these little microstories metaphors can be really
powerful as well.
There are different devices toillustrate what you are trying
to express.
You don't want to be dry, butthen you don't want to be that
person that just drones on andon and on with stories and
(36:15):
people are looking for the exitsas well.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
That can be a really daunting task Thinking about how
am I going to write this in away that I can share my story
and the audience is going to getthat.
I know that's one of the thingswith my students.
They were really, reallyconcerned about that aspect of
it.
I'm working with somebody rightnow.
She's going to have to delivera presentation, she's receiving
(36:38):
an award and we just talkedabout this yesterday and she is
so concerned about andrightfully so.
Congratulations.
If you get nervous at this,guess what?
You're human.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Absolutely, absolutely we all get nervous.
Speaker 2 (36:52):
I think you have to cut yourself a little slack as
well and just know that anypresentation that you give, it's
probably not going to beperfect in any way.
Do you have those types ofconversations as well with your
clients about being able toforgive yourself for some of the
things that will likely gowrong in your presentation?
(37:17):
Or do you have conversationswith them about how do you best
prepare for those things thatwill likely go wrong in a
presentation?
What if it were possible tobridge the gap between you and
your team so that you couldcommunicate with honesty,
compassion and understanding?
What if you could transformyour relationship with your team
(37:39):
so that you can guide them tobe confident, capable adults who
want to open up to you?
If you like the sound of that,you need to get the book titled
you Are Not a Bad Parent.
It's by board-certifiedpediatrician, dr Elizabeth Henry
.
She will guide you down astreamlined path to creating
lasting connection and trueunderstanding between you and
(38:00):
your team.
Get your copy today by clickingon the link in the show notes.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
First of all, nervousness is natural, and
every performer talks about thebutterflies before they go on.
But it's them.
It's really just getting themready for the performance.
It's when it becomesdebilitating.
Then we have to do somethingabout it.
(38:29):
Nothing goes perfectly and justallow imperfection and use it.
How many times?
You know great comedians, whena joke goes, when it bombs, they
will actually get more laughsout of the fact that that joke
didn't get a laugh.
And so if you just go, it'sokay.
(38:53):
I mean, I've stumbled over mywords and just made a joke about
it or an offhand comment.
I don't take myself tooseriously.
And if you make people feellike you're all there together
and you're there for them andyou're not worried about those
who are going to judge you, Ithink the energy is just
(39:14):
completely different.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
I think so as well, and I think you know you
mentioned comedians.
I think that's a fantastic wayto study, you know, getting up
in front of an audience andallowing yourself to just show
them the real you, and you'reright.
If something does happen thatyou didn't intend to happen, you
know what, at the end of theday, the audience really doesn't
(39:36):
know what you practiced.
So I mean, whatever you do upthere, just you know it was
intentional anyway, right.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Yeah, I mean, look, disaster, the wrong slide comes
up.
Right, it skips a slide youwant to freeze and what you
could do is well, that's notwhat I was expecting.
Hold on, we just missedsomething.
Let's go back right.
Technical difficulties everyoneand people will be like oh OK,
they go along with it.
It's almost think of movies,you know, sometimes I don't know
(40:09):
if it's still a thing, but atthe end of the credits they
would show bloopers.
Or on YouTube they'll showbloopers from the office.
People love bloopers.
They love to see professionalsmess up.
It makes them human.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
That's right.
That's how we connect withothers, right.
So it's OK.
It's OK.
I read a book, bird by Bird, byAnne Lamott, and there was one
quote in there that has alwaysstuck with me and that quote is
perfectionism is the voice ofthe oppressor.
(40:45):
And I don't know why, but Iread that quote and I was like,
damn, that is so true.
I mean, anything that we workon, we put so much pressure on
ourselves, especially if we'regoing to stand up in front of a
group, because naturally we wantto do a good job.
Right, we want them to not onlyconnect with the material, but
(41:07):
we want them to connect with usin some way.
You know, I think it's naturalto want to do a good job.
So it's natural to be a littleweary, a little scared, you know
, a little nervous at it, but Ithink there was something
freeing in that quote.
When I read that at least forme, it helped me realize that I
(41:27):
tend to put a lot of pressure onmyself to get it exactly right,
and that's not what we connectwith.
We don't connect with.
We're not robots.
We don't connect with them.
No.
Speaker 1 (41:38):
It was.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
OK, just go with the flow, it'll be all right.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I remember at a singer come to me and she was
quite a successful sessionsinger.
So she would sing on projectthat people would have heard but
wouldn't know who she is,background vocals et cetera, and
she was experiencing some realvocal issues and a part of her
voice this transition area wheresingers can have trouble She'd
(42:07):
been a little hard on her voiceand pushing it and the voice
just wasn't holding.
It was raspy, notes wouldn'thold, they would crack and she
had to sing this song coming upfor an industry audience.
But there was going to be somebig weeks there and she wanted
me to help her with the song andas she began some of the notes
(42:29):
were shaky.
It wasn't sounding great, butshe was such a beautiful artist
and she was so emotionallyconnected that it didn't matter
and by the end I was fightingback tears.
It was so beautiful.
She didn't worry about beingperfect.
She knew, OK, my voice hasissues and we continued OK,
(42:51):
here's some things we can do tofix that, but in its
imperfection it was absolutelybeautiful.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
That's what you connected with.
Speaker 1 (42:59):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Yeah, that's such an important point to make.
So, now that you mention,sometimes with singers and, I
know, with anyone who speaks fora living, how do you prepare
your voice?
If you're somebody who does alot of talking during the day,
are there some things that yourecommend people do to take care
(43:21):
of that voice, because I knowit can easily get tired
throughout the day?
But if you have to get up onstage and deliver, what are some
things that we can do on aday-to-day basis that would help
us really take care of thisinstrument that we have?
Speaker 1 (43:35):
So, overall, your voice is part of your body, just
as you need to care for yourbody Good food, proper hydration
, sleep.
Sleep is when the body repairsitself and the voice loves sleep
.
So if you've got a big vocalday coming up, don't be out at
some loud bar late having a fewdrinks.
(43:59):
You're going to be vocallytrashed when you wake up.
Now, during your heavy vocalday, I highly recommend
phonating through a straw andthis is something that was
discovered by a voice scientist,dr Ingo Titze.
And I've got them.
(44:19):
I have these metal voice strawsthat I carry with me and you can
use a drink straw, you can usea couple of cocktail straws, but
what you're going to do isyou're going to take this straw
and if it's a drink straw, Ilike to put my finger just
slightly over the tip to createa little more resistance,
because I don't want it to betoo easy.
I want to feel my cheeks puffedout a little bit.
I'll feel a bit of a bullfrogthroat from the resistance and I
(44:42):
just go just some glidesthrough that straw and what that
resistance is going to do isit's going to send air and
energy back down to your vocalcords and it's like a little
massage, and you do that for 30seconds.
(45:03):
You just kind of sneak away andthen, when you've gone through
it, just say hello, how are you?
And feel where your voice is.
Make sure your voice staysthere at that pitch when you
start getting tired.
Watch that your pitch doesn'tstart to drop, because then your
voice doesn't have a lot ofenergy, so you're going to start
to squeeze and all that's goingto do is start to swell your
(45:26):
vocal cords even more, and thenthe pitch is going to drop even
more and you're going to getinto this vicious cycle.
So, it's really exercising yourvoice, getting some good vocal
warm-ups, taking care of yourvoice and then making sure that
you're speaking at a healthypitch.
Speaker 2 (45:45):
Do you recommend certain, like I know, some
singers?
I have a friend who sings inthe choir at church and she has
these hot teas that they're likeher favorite hot teas that she
likes to drink.
Do you ever recommend anythinglike that, like a nice warm tea
or something that would help, Idon't know?
(46:07):
Take care of the vocal cords ormaybe help them relax after
you've used them, after a longday of using your vocal cords.
What are some things that wecould do?
Speaker 1 (46:18):
Well, there's actually a tea I've got a cup of
it right here called throatcoat, and it's made for the
voice.
But yeah, you want to.
When you're drinking beverages,you want to be careful about
too much caffeine because thatcan dry the voice and I love
(46:38):
coffee, so that's a hard one forme.
But just make sure you'regetting plenty of water teas
herbal teas are good and food.
If you're eating water-richfood, that's really good for the
voices.
So fruits and vegetables,things.
If you're going to have a hardvocal day, I wouldn't get up and
(47:01):
eat a cheese pizza forbreakfast, because that is your
body is just going to be in thisreally hard work of digestion.
I mean, that's just, it's hardon your system to digest it.
You're just going to get drylike really salty Foods, things
like that.
You just really think health.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
Yeah, that is such an important point you just made
and I don't think many of usthink about that Foods that
might be a little too salty, orwhat are you eating that day?
You have a big presentationthat afternoon.
What are the things that youare consuming so that your body
is not having to work over timeto digest that?
(47:41):
I don't think that's somethingthat we think about during those
days that we have thosespeeches.
So I'm glad that you mentionedthat.
I did have a question that Ijust remembered I wanted to ask
you a little while ago when youhad mentioned, with the vocal
and the pitch and finding youroptimal pitch, one of the
(48:04):
challenges that I think maybethis is more so for women than
men, but sometimes when we'retalking, we'll have that it's
like a question at the end andthen it just never seems to end.
How do you call their attentionto that as being something that
(48:27):
it's really a distraction ifit's overused?
How do you call someone'sattention to that and then help
them break that type of a habit?
Speaker 1 (48:39):
Well, this is where you're starting to get into
deeper work and where peoplemaybe have to feel slightly
uncomfortable when you startbreaking things down, bringing
their awareness to certainissues, maybe recording them
speaking and say here, do younotice that?
Do you see how that's arepeating pattern?
And then what happens?
(49:00):
And just point out that to thelistener if your speech pattern
becomes predictable, they'regonna tune out.
That's like listening to threeblind mice over and over again.
It's too predictable and whatwe need is a certain amount of
predictability.
But then we need to not deliveron that, that there's new
(49:23):
information coming in.
That's why great singers areconstantly adding nuances.
If you listen to a pop song, theproducer will bring in new
elements as the song repeats andbuilds or pulls things out to
reawaken your interest.
So if we don't want to havehabits that we're unaware of,
(49:44):
that becomes a problem, and I dothat a lot.
Working with singers is they'llhave little vocal ticks, if you
will.
That I have to just point outand go.
You realize that you're doingthis all the time, that you're
sliding to these notes again andagain.
Once in a while that's fine,but that's now becoming
predictable and you don't wantto be too predictable.
Speaker 2 (50:07):
Yeah, that's the value of having a good coach and
when you think about it,whatever industry that you're in
I mean you can be the bestbaseball player out there, you
can be a fantastic footballplayer, whatever you know sports
analogy that you want to usehere they have coaches for a
reason.
I mean, even if you have all ofthe natural talent in the world,
you'll notice I mean gymnastright All over the world they
(50:31):
will have a coach to help themto make those tiny tweaks
that'll help them.
Just take it from just yeah,you're really good, but how do
we get to that next level?
How do we make it really great?
So I think it's really valuableto be able to have a coach that
you can trust that is going totell you those things that you
(50:52):
yeah, you may not necessarilywant to hear it or you know it
might be a little uncomfortableto have that pointed out, but it
is only going to make youbetter at the end.
So, yeah, I appreciate thatabout you know really good
coaches like you to be able towork with people and help them
figure out those things that aregoing to take them to the next
(51:12):
level.
Have you ever worked withanyone?
They were just so resistant tothat, though, that it was like
look, I'm trying to tell you.
Speaker 1 (51:24):
I have worked with some resistant people and
they've tended to come.
They've been sent to me and it'soften been where they've been
sent by a record label and theydon't want voice lessons and
they're really pushing back andusually I can get them on my
(51:47):
side and show them.
Look, there's a way to do thiswithout losing who you are.
I'm not going to turn you intosome you know robot with just
perfect technique who can'texpress, but we have to do this
in a way that keeps your voicehealthy.
I haven't really found voiceusers in resistance if they come
(52:08):
to me because they don't havethe demands that singers do.
They're not pushed to me bysomeone above them.
They've.
Usually they've sought me outand so they're more open.
Not everybody is comfortable atfirst, kind of getting under the
hood of their voice, because wetend to feel that that's who we
(52:32):
are and vocal issues tend toembarrass us in ways that you
know.
If you're learning to playguitar, you're not your first
lesson.
You're not embarrassed that youdon't know how to play a C
chord and then it's hard to movefrom a C to a G chord.
But with the voice we tend tofeel like, oh, I should be able
to do this right away.
That's right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:53):
Yeah, I really appreciate one thing that you
just said there that you knowfor the singer.
I'm not trying to push you tobe someone you're not.
I don't want you to become, youknow someone or something that
you're not, and I think that'ssomething that many of us need
to hear.
You know, even if you're justtrying to practice for a
presentation that's coming up.
You know we watch examples ofall of these amazing speakers
(53:17):
that are online and we wouldlike to hope that we could
emulate you know them in some ofthe skills that they have, but
at the end of the day, youreally don't want to be a
version of somebody else.
You really do want to find whoyou are and then allow that to
(53:37):
be the star of that presentation.
Right, and to be able to pullthem out, not emulate someone
out.
Speaker 1 (53:45):
You know, comparing ourselves to others is the
source of so much misery, and Idon't care.
Well, maybe there are a fewpeople, but whatever your
expertise or what you're talkingabout, there's always going to
be someone who knows more thanyou, who's maybe a better
presenter, right, or you think,has more charisma.
(54:07):
What it really is, when you'reconnecting as you, your voice,
your experience, your journey,and you're doing this in an
honest, connected way, you willbe compelling.
People will want to learn itfrom you.
(54:29):
I can't claim I know there arepeople who know more about the
voice than I do Absolutely Ican't claim to be the world's
best vocal coach.
What I do know is that I have acertain experience, a way of
explaining things, a way ofinteracting with people that's
kind of unique to me and or theperson that I'm the right
(54:52):
teacher for.
It works, and there are peopleI'm not the right teacher for
and that's fine, but it reallyis.
You truly are enough.
It's not a cliche, it really isthis finding your voice.
I would say, if you'restruggling with this, take your
speech or take your presentation, and I want you to mentally
(55:18):
hear yourself giving thepresentation in the absolute
best way, like the ideal ofyourself.
What does that sound like?
What does your voice sound like?
Because that voice is withinyou and if there are certain
physical impediments to that,that can be worked through, that
(55:40):
voice that you hear in yourhead is there and it will move
people.
Speaker 2 (55:47):
Wow, I can see why you are such a sought-after
coach.
Like I'm motivated.
Like after that, I'm like, look, I'm looking at the time We've
been talking for almost 55, Ican't believe 55 minutes now
almost an hour, and that wasjust wonderful.
Like I am motivated right now.
I'm like I take on the world.
(56:08):
What a fantastic message tosend out to anyone who is really
working toward bettering theirvoice, wanting to become a more
effective communicator, wantingto be able to get out there and
make a difference, connect withothers.
That was just so well said.
(56:28):
I have nothing I can add tothat at all.
I really loved that.
I can tell you're a fantasticvocal coach.
I can tell that the people whoyou work with they probably
really appreciate being able towork with you because I think
you probably make a reallystrong connection with them on a
(56:50):
personal level.
Speaker 1 (56:52):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 2 (56:53):
Yeah, absolutely so.
Are there any final words ofwisdom that you would like to
share with our listeners beforewe wrap this up?
Speaker 1 (57:05):
There's music in your voice.
You don't have to be a singer,but there is a musical flow that
goes back so far in our historyand this musical connection,
this emotional connection, thismusic language is incredibly
(57:27):
powerful.
And we all get our slideslooking great and we have our
power stances and we reallythink about what we're going to
wear, but your voice is what'sconnecting you to people.
Your voice is the mostimportant thing on that stage or
in that presentation, in thatroom, and the time that you
(57:48):
spend on your voice will berepaid.
Speaker 2 (57:52):
Beautiful.
Thank you for taking us on thisjourney with you.
This has just been so fantastic.
I know I have learned a lot andI've been doing this for a long
time.
So, like you said earlier,there's always going to be
somebody who knows more than you.
We could always learn fromsomeone.
So if there's a listener outthere and they want to continue
this journey with you, how canthey get in touch with you or
(58:14):
tell us a little bit about yourpodcast?
Maybe they want to take alisten to that.
Speaker 1 (58:18):
Yeah, my podcast is called the Intelligent Vocalist.
It focuses on singers, but ifyou're a professional voice user
, it may be of interest to you,because it also goes into
mindset and vocal health andeven voice science.
This instrument is sofascinating that scientists are
still unsure of exactly how itworks.
(58:40):
It's so remarkably complex andwonderful.
I also have a book called theCompelling Speaker that's
available on Amazon.
You can check out my website,compellingspeakercom.
My main website is johnhennicom.
Speaker 2 (58:58):
All right, fantastic.
All right, you have a new fan.
I'm going to follow yourpodcast and start listening
because, like we said earlier,always room for improvement.
Thank you again so much, john,for being a guest on the show
and sharing your wisdom with howto become a better vocal.
I don't want to say vocalartist oh yeah, some people out
(59:18):
there might be a vocal artistbut just anyone out there who
wants to do a better job atdelivering a presentation or
speaking more effectively.
This has been jam-packed withall kinds of goodies, so I know
the listeners really doappreciate this hour that you
have spent with us.
So thanks again for being here.
Speaker 1 (59:38):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (59:40):
All right, everyone.
Have a great rest of your dayand we'll see you next time.
Bye, thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed this episode andyou'd like to help support the
podcast, please share it withothers, post about it on social
(01:00:01):
media or leave a rating and areview.
Welcome to the Communication 24-7 podcast,
where we communicate about howwe communicate.
I'm your host, jennifer Furlong.
Let me just do something realquick, real quick, before we get
(00:31):
started.
I will now practice mynon-regional diction.
If any of you are wondering,what in the heck is she doing?
I have a vocal coach in thehouse.
Let me introduce John Henney toyou.
(00:52):
He has been around the worldand he has helped thousands of
people become more effectivecommunicators.
He is an author, he is apodcaster and he is going to
help us think about not onlyjust think about, but give us
some really good tips regardingour vocal delivery.
(01:13):
So y'all know, as a publicspeaking coach, I taught public
speaking at the college levelfor 18 years.
This is a person after my ownheart, so I'm excited to have
him as a guest on the show.
I know I'm going to learn a lotfrom him and I guarantee all of
you listeners will also learn alot from him.
So, john, welcome to the show.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Absolutely.
You know, I think being able todeliver a presentation
effectively, it doesn't matterif you are aspiring to be on the
stage, if you want to get onthe speaking circuit, if you
want to be a leader, to be ableto just share your message more
effectively with your employees.
Regardless, this is a skillthat we have to continue to
(02:01):
develop over our lifetime.
So, before we actually diveinto the questions, would you
mind taking a moment for ourlisteners to just introduce
yourself and tell us a littlebit about how you became a vocal
coach to begin with?
What made you want to do thisfor a living?
Speaker 1 (02:21):
Yeah, so my journey to being a vocal coach was not a
straight line and it's notanything I saw myself doing when
I was younger.
When I was a child, my father,who was from Glasgow, scotland,
had this wonderful naturalsinging voice and my attempts at
(02:42):
singing would be met withthat's bloody terrible, which I
know it sounds awful, but it's aScottish thing, yes.
So I just went okay, I'm notgoing to sing.
And I started playing the drumsand I became a professional
drummer in my late teens andplayed professionally all
(03:03):
through my 20s.
And in my early 20s I thoughtyou know, if I could sing just a
little, I could get more gigsbecause I could do at least
backup vocals.
And a friend of mine said hey,I just started taking lessons
with someone who studies withStevie Wonder's voice teacher
and I went Stevie Wonder, I'm in.
So I began studying with aperson named Eric Futer here in
(03:30):
Southern California and heshowed me that the voice really
is an instrument and if youlearn the basics and the
mechanics, you can learn to sing.
And I moved from the drums.
I started becoming a leadvocalist.
I ended up moving on to StevieWonder's teacher himself, seth
Riggs, who taught everybody's hewas Michael Jackson's voice
(03:55):
coach and I then startedtraining other voice teachers.
I started working with singersand voice teachers and from
there I started to be sent fromear, nose and throat doctors.
I would get professional voiceusers, speakers, and I found
that the exercises that workedfor singers.
If I modified them, they workedfor speakers as well.
(04:17):
And I also found that thedevices that great singers use
in order to connect to anaudience and really captivate
them worked for singers, and soit's kind of become my mission
to help people discover themusic in their voice.
We all are born to sing.
(04:38):
They believe that our firstattempts at language prehistoric
humans, our first language, wassomething they call music
language, and it was anemotional communication that was
sung, and so the voice is theconnector of emotion, and music
(04:59):
is really the way, the deepestway, that we can express emotion
, and in taking these devicesand this expressiveness and
bringing it into your speakingvoice, you will have an edge
that most other people aremissing.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Oh, I love that and I just wanted to throw it out
there.
My father was also a drummer,so speaking to another drummer,
it just kind of warms my heart.
And I love that you weretalking about using the concepts
that you learned when you werelearning to sing and how you can
(05:38):
transfer those exact same conyou know those same ideas into
the public speaking or the vocaldelivery area.
So one thing I do want to askyou people love to joke how they
can only sing in the shower.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
And we all, let's get real, we all know certain
people who you know Bueller,Bueller, that monotone voice, on
and on and on.
So are you saying that, yes,even those who have that
monotone voice, they've had itfor years that we can finally
(06:18):
get them into an area where theycan tell a story and deliver it
in a way that we're going to beable to be in that moment with
them through their vocaldelivery.
Speaker 1 (06:28):
Absolutely.
I think one of the shames is ifyou go back a hundred years ago
, middle class homes in in,certainly in the US and Europe.
Many of them had pianos.
This was the familyentertainment center and
everyone got around and sang andthey enjoyed it and there
wasn't judgment yeah, certainlysomewhere better than others.
(06:50):
But then came the phonographand the radio and now you could
have world class singers in yourhome on demand and it created
this class of well they sing.
I don't and people started todisconnect from singing and feel
that if I don't do it on thislevel, I can't sing.
And I think you know, whenTiger Woods came on the golf
(07:11):
scene people didn't look atTiger and go, oh well, then I
can't golf.
He brought more people to thegame, he inspired people.
Yet we seem to have thisfeeling that if you can't do
singing at a certain level, youcan't do it, and so we've lost
our birthright of musicalcommunication and in that I
think that speech has become formany a little flatter than it
(07:35):
used to be and a little lessexpressive.
But if you gain an awarenessand you just start to do some
simple exercises, start playingwith your range, play with some
melody, not singing, but justeven within your speaking voice,
you'll start to discover thatyou can have a more profound
(07:55):
level of communication and youwill, you'll engage people.
I mean, the joke from that BenStein character in Ferris
Bueller was the monotony andjust, it's so incredibly boring
and you can.
You can absolutely break out ofthat.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
That's good news.
That's really good news to hear, and you know, I think that's
right.
There's something about growingup in a home where there's
music, and whether you have achild who is learning how to
play guitar or the piano, theyjoin band, you know, in middle
(08:33):
school and high school learningto play the flute, whatever that
instrument is.
I think it's such a powerfultool to be able to learn how to
express yourself in that way,and I think you do naturally
tend to bring that into yourspeaking voice as well, even
though you may not evennecessarily know that that's
what's happening.
So, yeah, I think it's afantastic idea to just have your
(08:57):
kids learn, you know, whetherthey want to join chorus or they
want to join band, whatever itis.
I think it's a greatextracurricular to have any
child get involved with that,because it's going to help them
in more ways than we evenrealize, especially since we're
talking about our speakingvoices.
So let's take it from from thebase level.
(09:20):
I am brand new to this.
I'm scared to death.
I have no idea you know where,where I can begin with this, but
I do know that I want to bemore effective.
I do know that I want to beable to connect with people and
reach them.
On a more emotional level.
What do you say to somebody whois really starting from just
(09:44):
stage one and they have noexperience in this and really
little to no confidence in this?
What do you do with that?
Speaker 1 (09:52):
The beginning is to just connect with your voice on
a deeper level, even if it'sjust humming.
Feel the hum, feel thevibration, move the pitch up and
down, feel how the sensationschange as you move as you, as
you, as you go up, you may feelthe voice lift up behind your
(10:15):
eyes.
As you go down, you may feel itsettle more in your chest and,
of course, the voice isn'tchanging where it is.
It's just how our body isabsorbing the energy changes and
our awareness of it.
And then it's really, I think,the most important thing is
finding your optimal speakingpitch, where your voice is going
(10:37):
to work best.
A lot of people associate andrightly so a deeper voice with
more authority, but what theyend up doing is they mistake
this more authoritative voicefor a lower pitch.
And when people start speakingon a lower pitch, they start to
lose energy in their voice andtrying to make that louder, all
(11:00):
you're going to do is squeeze,which is going to create
physical problems with the voice, fatigue or even worse.
Just to demonstrate veryquickly if I play a pitch and I
speak on this pitch, if I changenot the pitch but my resonance
(11:20):
and I make the resonance go alittle thinner and higher.
My voice sounds higher, but ifI'm on this pitch and I begin to
bring in the deeper resonance,now my voice, I haven't changed
the pitch, but it sounds richer,it sounds deeper.
So it's then discovering notjust the pitch of the voice but
also the resonance, and if youdon't like the sound of your
(11:40):
voice, one or likely both ofthose aren't being used
optimally.
Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yeah, I hear that often, especially from students.
They hate it when I ask them torecord themselves and play it
back so they can just hear whatthey sound like.
And most of us probably 90% ofthe students that I would talk
to about this I hate the soundof my own voice.
I hate it.
So what is it about that?
(12:09):
What is it that makes us cringewhen we listen to our own voice
, because we're not hearing whateverybody else is hearing,
because most of the time I'mlike what are you talking about?
You have an awesome voice, sowhy is there such a disconnect
there for us?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
So the way the voice works, if you think about it,
when we speak the sound wavesare shooting away from us, so
for us it's as if someone hastheir back turned to us and
they're speaking.
So nature makes up for this byconducting a certain amount of
sound through bone, and thesound waves travel through the
(12:46):
bone to the inner ear.
But bone is not a very goodconductor of higher frequencies.
It tends to be better for lowerparts of the sound wave, and so
when you are speaking, thesense of your own voice that
you're getting tends to be alittle richer than what's being
put out into the room, so thatwhen you hear what your voice
(13:09):
sounds like to others, it's alittle jarring.
But when people say, do I soundlike that, unless the recording
is really poor, yeah, that'swhat you sound like to others
and just know.
What you sound like to otherscan be changed, can absolutely
(13:29):
be changed, and there is a voicethat you have within you that
is your natural, highlyfunctioning voice.
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Okay.
So how do we find that?
I get asked this question a lot, especially from students.
Does it really matter whenwe're talking about our optimal
speaking voice and how we sound?
Does it matter if we have acertain accent?
Does it matter the dialect thatwe have you touched on the
(14:06):
pitch or the tone, like whereyou can find your optimal voice?
But to add to that, there aresome additional concerns that I
know a lot of students have,including myself, because I can
easily look, I'll get back intomy Southern real quick, like
right, quick, in a hurry.
But going to broadcastingschool, they didn't like that so
(14:26):
much in Indianapolis, so that'swhy I learned to change that.
But even for me, sometimes I'mwondering so what if it slips
out a little bit?
I don't know if that reallybothers everybody necessarily.
So how do you get someone tounderstand what their natural
(14:46):
go-to speaking voices or, ifthey are gonna change it,
whether they're changing it in agood way or a positive way?
Speaker 1 (14:54):
What I like to look at at the voice is is it
functioning at its best in termsof health, in terms of
production?
Is there good, healthyresonance?
Is there a ease of productionwhen the vocal cords are
vibrating or phonating, or isthe voice squeezed?
Is it breathy or, hmm, are wefinding a voice that's just nice
(15:18):
and buzzy?
Is the airflow sufficient forwhat we are using the voice for?
And then from there, youraccent is a part of you, it's a
part of your personality.
It's really up to you if youraccent is at a point where it
maybe needs to be, maybe softenslightly, in case people aren't
(15:40):
understanding everything you arehearing.
But I'm not an advocate ofhaving a false voice.
I see people and they talkabout public speaking and it
starts to become this thingright, and they're almost cheeto
.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
I'm an advocate in schools.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
And I'm just not a fan of that.
What I really think connects usto others is emotional honesty,
and the connector of emotion isthe voice.
They did a study out of Yaleand I think it was 1700
participants, and they wanted tosee, as they spoke, how
(16:19):
accurate the listener could bein telling what the other person
was feeling.
And they had them where it was.
They could see and hear eachother, and then it was only body
language and then it was onlysound.
They put an obstruction betweenthem or made the room dark
(16:40):
where they couldn't see thespeaker, and when it was the
voice alone, the accuracy was atits highest.
The voice, the vibration of thevoice, the way we are tuned as
social beings to really listenand gather information from the
voice is quite profound, and soyou can tell when somebody, when
(17:07):
the voice, starts to beinsincere, when you feel like
you're being sold to your spidey, senses start to go up, and so
I'm just really big on infusingthe voice with honest emotional
intention and letting thatreally carry your message.
Speaker 2 (17:29):
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them to act with just your voice?
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It's a powerful connector andpersuasive asset.
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(17:50):
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The compelling speaker byleading voice coach, john Henney
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(18:12):
health tips to ensure your voiceremains strong and resonant
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Get a copy of the compellingspeaker today by clicking on the
link in the show notes.
Yeah, you're so right thatSpidey-Sinz comment that you
just made.
You do get a feeling, for ifsomeone is being disingenuous
(18:36):
when they're communicating withyou, and I know.
For me, I feel that when I'mtalking to salespeople a lot of
time.
Okay, and I know you're tryingto sell me something, and so
here I am, I can hear it in thevoice.
So I know you work with a lotof different people from many
different industries on theirvocal delivery.
(18:56):
Do you work with salespeople aswell, so that they could
optimize and be more effective.
And so what kind ofconversations do you have with
them?
Because I imagine that isprobably something that comes up
, that, yeah, there's thatsalesman type of vocal delivery
that will probably cause peopleto back away rather than lean in
(19:20):
, and that's problematic forthem.
Speaker 1 (19:23):
It's absolutely problematic and for me it could
be something I'm ready to buy,something I need, but when I get
that vibe I'm gonna go buy itelsewhere.
I just don't like the feelingand I really focus in my
training on really choosingclear emotional intentions and
(19:49):
emotional intentions.
This comes from the actingworld and what it is.
Let's say, the scene for theactor is they're gonna receive
devastating news.
The actor doesn't go.
Okay, I'm going to be upset orI'm going to be sad, because
that's just kind of this staticinstruction.
(20:10):
So what the actor does is no, Iam going to, my intention is to
rebuke, is to not accept, andso to push against.
And so then that struggle ofhearing the news and you're
emotionally know I don't want tohear this starts the true
(20:30):
emotion churning.
So let's say you've got to walkout and it's a sales
presentation, as people walk outand they'll say hello, but they
they're just running throughthe, the greeting, and then
they're going to go off to sale,sell, right.
When you walk out, what if yourintention is to welcome or to
(20:53):
connect, like that's your goal,in the moment You're going to
stop, the moment you might smiledifferently.
You'll you'll have differentconnection with the eyes and the
way you speak and people feelthis.
If you feel it, people get itand it really is.
And then, when you're givingthe sales presentation, as
(21:17):
you're explaining the product,your intention should be to
inform, to reveal, to instruct,to excite, and this this creates
is your intentions build.
Then, when it comes to the sale, it's.
It's not going to be pushy,you're not going to have the
(21:39):
same amount of resistance.
Speaker 2 (21:42):
I love that.
What is your emotionalintention?
And so I could see that appliedand all kinds of different
scenarios, whether you'recreating a speech for a TEDx
talk or if you are delivering apresentation at work, a really
important presentation at work.
What is that emotionalintention?
How is it that you want toconnect with the audience on
(22:04):
that level?
That's a really importantquestion.
I think, at the very beginningstages of you know, let's say
you're, you're starting at thevery beginning and you've
decided today I want to do a TEDtalk.
You know, maybe that's one ofthe first questions you need to
ask yourself what is, what isthe emotional intention of the
talk that you want to deliver?
Is that, is that something thatyou think would be wise for
(22:27):
them to do?
Sit down at the very beginningand really think about that
intention right there.
Speaker 1 (22:34):
Absolutely.
I have a book.
It's, I think it's called theActors Thesaurus.
It's just that it's a wholelisting of different intentions
and you can go through your talkand play with different
intentions on each line.
I was speaking with this, thishighly respected acting coach,
and she had a student who wasdoing the Phantom and Phantom of
(22:57):
the Opera.
Oh nice and when he learned howto use intentions, he was just
so ecstatic and he would changehis intentions each night
because it brought something newto the role, as he did it
hundreds and hundreds of timesand it was always fresh and
(23:19):
always exciting.
So you're not locked into these.
You can be very creative withthem and as you play with them
and experiment with them, youwill feel they will ignite
actual emotion.
And you have to remember thevoice is always communicating
emotion and it can communicatelack of emotion, lack of empathy
(23:42):
.
It can communicate people.
People pick up on things youdon't realize they're picking up
on.
And if you are in these reallyhonest, true intentions, it's a
powerful thing.
And on the flip side, I say,and not entirely joking, I've
(24:03):
never seen a cult leader or acon artist with a lousy speaking
voice.
They know how to captivatepeople.
They know how to use theseintention.
They know how to connect onthis level where they can lead
people where everyone else isstanding going.
How could you fall for this?
How could you go with thisperson?
(24:25):
But when you, when somebodyknows how to use these, it's
quite powerful.
Speaker 2 (24:32):
I want to be able to do this right.
I'm sure you've heard this.
I want and I can understand thevalue in this, but I'm just I'm
afraid.
I feel kind of silly if I letmyself go in that direction.
What kind of advice do you giveanyone who says something like
that?
They're, they're afraid to letgo, or they're afraid of looking
(24:52):
silly, or they're afraid thatit's just not going to work for
them.
For, for whatever reasonbecause I know that fear is a
pretty common feeling,especially, you know, in the
field of public speaking-Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (25:07):
I encourage my clients to play a game I call
the world's worst musical and Iuse the word worst because it
can be intentionally bad and Ihave them take go somewhere
where they know no one can hearthem and I have them take their
talk or maybe some of theirslides and the points they're
(25:30):
going to make, and sing it.
And sing it like you're, justlike like will Ferrell in elf
I'm smiling and I'm singing andand just be incredibly silly
with it.
And then move that to speechand allow that energy and then
go back to singing as badly asyou want and then back to
(25:54):
speaking and you'll notice allof a sudden there's a different
flow there.
There will be melody in yourwords, tone, there'll be
building of tempo and thenpulling back.
And you'll see that, my gosh,just as singers, because singers
have to go out and certainlycontemporary music it's very
(26:15):
repetitive.
You have first course, firstcourse.
The course is repeat the samelines, it's repeating melodies.
But great singers they usethese little subtle devices.
They'll maybe pause when youthink they're going to give you
the word.
They hesitate, they change thetone, they start to increase the
intensity, they pull back andwhat they do is they keep
(26:40):
reawakening interest byintroducing new elements and
when you start discovering musicand how you can have this
melody in these devices to keepreawakening attention, you're
going to enjoy public speakingmuch more because you know that
you can hold an audience'sattention.
Speaker 2 (27:00):
Yeah, and this is a skill.
You got to work at it, todevelop it.
This isn't something thatyou're going to listen to this
podcast today and thenimmediately you're going to go
out there and you're going to bea Martin Luther King Like that
ain't going to happen, right?
This is something thatprofessional speakers work on
this consistently over years tobe able to do this effectively.
(27:25):
So you know, if you try this acouple of times and you feel
like it's just not catching onor you're just not getting it or
whatever, whatever thathesitation is, don't let that
make you give up, because thisis something it's like anything
else you're going to learn,whether it's an instrument or a
sport.
You know you got to practice atit to get good at it, and that
(27:49):
takes time and effort, you know,over the long haul I can't
emphasize that enough One of thethings I would have my students
do when I was in the classroomis I was bringing, I would bring
in children's books and I wouldhave them be, you know, for
example, the three little pigs,and so I'd have like four
(28:10):
students and you know three ofthem would be one of the little
pigs and then the fourth studentwould be the big bad wolf and I
would have them read thedifferent passages and at the
beginning they would always besuper shy.
They didn't want to really getinto it because it's kind of
silly.
But then by the end they wouldjust let it go and everybody
would have a great time with itand they were laughing and just
(28:31):
kidding around and what atransformation that was for them
to be able to learn.
Hey, you know what?
Just let go and enjoy it.
And then that's when thatconnection happened with
everybody in the room.
So I love that you have that.
You know, kind of like a silly,do this as a really bad musical
.
Speaker 1 (28:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (28:52):
To practice it.
I love that.
I love that idea.
I think that's fantastic To beable to just have some levity.
I think that's so incrediblyimportant.
Speaker 1 (29:03):
It is.
You know so much of the fearthat we experience with, with
speaking, getting out in frontof others.
It really is.
It's.
It's the ego and I don't meanthe ego in thinking that you're
incredible.
It's the ego in the sense ofthe self and the and the self
(29:25):
wants to protect.
And many years ago, when wetraveled in small groups, if you
were ostracized, if you wererejected, you would perish most
likely.
And that, that primal fearstays with us.
This fear of rejection andjudgment is so palpable.
(29:46):
And yet in modern societies,the fear is almost silly.
If you give a talk and itdoesn't go well, your life is
not over.
That's right, but it but it'sthis turning inward.
So I tell people, you know this, this, like doing the three
little pigs is wonderful becausethey start to break out and
(30:06):
they're interacting with eachother and the sense of self
begins to diminish.
And now they're, they're goingback and forth and now their
focus is outward.
And that, I think, is somethingI really try.
That that's really importantfor speakers is when you're
getting up in front of people,your focus should be completely
(30:26):
outward.
And if you start to feel thatnervousness and that inner
chatter and that worry, you'returning inward, yeah, and so
keep, keep it on the audience,keep it on those who've come to
hear you.
And the other thing I always dobefore I go out to speak is I
give people permission to notlike me, because they have that
(30:48):
right.
It's like you know what.
You don't have to like me, butI'm here for the people who need
to hear what I have to say.
I owe it to them.
Speaker 2 (30:58):
Yeah, I think that's a wonderful philosophy to have,
because, even if you are able toreach just one person out in
that audience, they've been ableto.
You've been able to make thatconnection with them on that
emotional level.
I think it's it's worth it,because you have no idea how you
might impact that one person,you know, in a positive way and
(31:20):
it's it's a really powerful toolto be able to use that.
And I agree, you know it's it'sabout them, it's not really
about you.
So, you know, focus on themessage that they're receiving,
focus on how how is it that thisis going to impact them in some
way?
And I think by doing that, byhaving that mindset, it kind of,
(31:40):
you know, takes the pressureoff of you just a little bit,
because it's like, you know, Idon't really have to go out here
and do cartwheels, you know Idon't have to be that type of
speaker where I'm going outthere and I'm entertaining the
masses in order to make thatconnection.
I think sometimes some of themost powerful speakers that I've
ever watched, they're able tomake that connection with you
(32:04):
and it's still in a very quietand controlled way, you know.
I mean, we all enjoy the, the,the exciting type of presenters.
But there is something to besaid about those presenters that
can just capture your attentionand they're not having to do
all of the cartwheels and the,the, the vocal, you know,
(32:26):
gymnastics and all of that tokeep you captured.
How can we find what type ofspeaker we are?
Naturally, because I know somany people think that they have
to be that, that entertainingperson.
You know that.
Oh, obviously I'm an extrovert,you know, and I just that's
(32:47):
just so, not true?
You don't have to be that inorder to be effective at this.
Speaker 1 (32:52):
No, you don't.
What you want to do is justincorporate all of you, all the
sides of you.
There will be parts of you thatget excited and more animated
and it starts to build and it'syour voice is starting to pick
up speed and then you'll, you'llpull back, you'll get a little
more retrospective, maybe alittle softer.
(33:14):
The tonal change and what thatdoes by providing variety, it
constantly reawakens thelistener's attention.
So I think it's really justjust exploring and I think those
emotional intentions are agreat way to start to allow
those, those parts of youryourself, to be expressed fully.
Speaker 2 (33:38):
Yeah, yeah.
So do you ever haveconversations with them
regarding the actual storytelling itself?
Because I know that's a hugepiece of it.
It's.
It's wonderful to be able tohave this vocal delivery and to
think about All right, I wantthem to feel a certain way.
So if, if I'm telling anexciting story about whitewater
rafting you know that I did overthe weekend that I know I'm
(33:59):
probably going to speak a littlefaster and a little more
excited, you know, versussomething that might require a
little more slow pace, sombermood, whatever it is I'm trying
to strive for.
But if you don't have the rightlanguage or the right story or
the right words or the rightphrasing, sometimes that can
(34:21):
come off as disingenuous if it'snot meshing, if it's not
matching up.
So what kind of tips do youhave for someone when they just
they're sitting down for thefirst time and they really want
to write a speech that's goingto connect with the audience?
How do they go about gettingthat story out of them?
Speaker 1 (34:45):
I think we need to be very judicious with the stories
that we tell.
I have sat through speakersthat I remember once I went to
it was a two-day businessseminar and there was only one
speaker on stage for eight hoursboth days.
(35:05):
That's a really daunting task.
The person got up and hestarted off with an amusing
anecdote.
It's like okay, a story to getthings going, then started to do
a slice, but then it becamestory after story and corny
jokes.
By the end of the first day Irealized this all could have
(35:26):
been done in one day.
We've spent a day listening toyour stories.
Be very careful how manystories you're telling.
Make sure that it builds to apoint that it's relative to what
you're talking about.
Make sure that it'sentertaining.
It doesn't have to be funny,but it should be interesting
(35:51):
Rather than if you feel like youwant to put all these stories
in.
I think these little microstories metaphors can be really
powerful as well.
There are different devices toillustrate what you are trying
to express.
You don't want to be dry, butthen you don't want to be that
person that just drones on andon and on with stories and
(36:15):
people are looking for the exitsas well.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
That can be a really daunting task Thinking about how
am I going to write this in away that I can share my story
and the audience is going to getthat.
I know that's one of the thingswith my students.
They were really, reallyconcerned about that aspect of
it.
I'm working with somebody rightnow.
She's going to have to delivera presentation, she's receiving
(36:38):
an award and we just talkedabout this yesterday and she is
so concerned about andrightfully so.
Congratulations.
If you get nervous at this,guess what?
You're human.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Absolutely, absolutely we all get nervous.
Speaker 2 (36:52):
I think you have to cut yourself a little slack as
well and just know that anypresentation that you give, it's
probably not going to beperfect in any way.
Do you have those types ofconversations as well with your
clients about being able toforgive yourself for some of the
things that will likely gowrong in your presentation?
(37:17):
Or do you have conversationswith them about how do you best
prepare for those things thatwill likely go wrong in a
presentation?
What if it were possible tobridge the gap between you and
your team so that you couldcommunicate with honesty,
compassion and understanding?
What if you could transformyour relationship with your team
(37:39):
so that you can guide them tobe confident, capable adults who
want to open up to you?
If you like the sound of that,you need to get the book titled
you Are Not a Bad Parent.
It's by board-certifiedpediatrician, dr Elizabeth Henry
.
She will guide you down astreamlined path to creating
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(38:00):
your team.
Get your copy today by clickingon the link in the show notes.
Speaker 1 (38:08):
First of all, nervousness is natural, and
every performer talks about thebutterflies before they go on.
But it's them.
It's really just getting themready for the performance.
It's when it becomesdebilitating.
Then we have to do somethingabout it.
(38:29):
Nothing goes perfectly and justallow imperfection and use it.
How many times?
You know great comedians, whena joke goes, when it bombs, they
will actually get more laughsout of the fact that that joke
didn't get a laugh.
And so if you just go, it'sokay.
(38:53):
I mean, I've stumbled over mywords and just made a joke about
it or an offhand comment.
I don't take myself tooseriously.
And if you make people feellike you're all there together
and you're there for them andyou're not worried about those
who are going to judge you, Ithink the energy is just
(39:14):
completely different.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
I think so as well, and I think you know you
mentioned comedians.
I think that's a fantastic wayto study, you know, getting up
in front of an audience andallowing yourself to just show
them the real you, and you'reright.
If something does happen thatyou didn't intend to happen, you
know what, at the end of theday, the audience really doesn't
(39:36):
know what you practiced.
So I mean, whatever you do upthere, just you know it was
intentional anyway, right.
Speaker 1 (39:44):
Yeah, I mean, look, disaster, the wrong slide comes
up.
Right, it skips a slide youwant to freeze and what you
could do is well, that's notwhat I was expecting.
Hold on, we just missedsomething.
Let's go back right.
Technical difficulties everyoneand people will be like oh OK,
they go along with it.
It's almost think of movies,you know, sometimes I don't know
(40:09):
if it's still a thing, but atthe end of the credits they
would show bloopers.
Or on YouTube they'll showbloopers from the office.
People love bloopers.
They love to see professionalsmess up.
It makes them human.
Speaker 2 (40:25):
That's right.
That's how we connect withothers, right.
So it's OK.
It's OK.
I read a book, bird by Bird, byAnne Lamott, and there was one
quote in there that has alwaysstuck with me and that quote is
perfectionism is the voice ofthe oppressor.
(40:45):
And I don't know why, but Iread that quote and I was like,
damn, that is so true.
I mean, anything that we workon, we put so much pressure on
ourselves, especially if we'regoing to stand up in front of a
group, because naturally we wantto do a good job.
Right, we want them to not onlyconnect with the material, but
(41:07):
we want them to connect with usin some way.
You know, I think it's naturalto want to do a good job.
So it's natural to be a littleweary, a little scared, you know
, a little nervous at it, but Ithink there was something
freeing in that quote.
When I read that at least forme, it helped me realize that I
(41:27):
tend to put a lot of pressure onmyself to get it exactly right,
and that's not what we connectwith.
We don't connect with.
We're not robots.
We don't connect with them.
No.
Speaker 1 (41:38):
It was.
Speaker 2 (41:39):
OK, just go with the flow, it'll be all right.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
I remember at a singer come to me and she was
quite a successful sessionsinger.
So she would sing on projectthat people would have heard but
wouldn't know who she is,background vocals et cetera, and
she was experiencing some realvocal issues and a part of her
voice this transition area wheresingers can have trouble She'd
(42:07):
been a little hard on her voiceand pushing it and the voice
just wasn't holding.
It was raspy, notes wouldn'thold, they would crack and she
had to sing this song coming upfor an industry audience.
But there was going to be somebig weeks there and she wanted
me to help her with the song andas she began some of the notes
(42:29):
were shaky.
It wasn't sounding great, butshe was such a beautiful artist
and she was so emotionallyconnected that it didn't matter
and by the end I was fightingback tears.
It was so beautiful.
She didn't worry about beingperfect.
She knew, OK, my voice hasissues and we continued OK,
(42:51):
here's some things we can do tofix that, but in its
imperfection it was absolutelybeautiful.
Speaker 2 (42:56):
That's what you connected with.
Speaker 1 (42:59):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (43:00):
Yeah, that's such an important point to make.
So, now that you mention,sometimes with singers and, I
know, with anyone who speaks fora living, how do you prepare
your voice?
If you're somebody who does alot of talking during the day,
are there some things that yourecommend people do to take care
(43:21):
of that voice, because I knowit can easily get tired
throughout the day?
But if you have to get up onstage and deliver, what are some
things that we can do on aday-to-day basis that would help
us really take care of thisinstrument that we have?
Speaker 1 (43:35):
So, overall, your voice is part of your body, just
as you need to care for yourbody Good food, proper hydration
, sleep.
Sleep is when the body repairsitself and the voice loves sleep
.
So if you've got a big vocalday coming up, don't be out at
some loud bar late having a fewdrinks.
(43:59):
You're going to be vocallytrashed when you wake up.
Now, during your heavy vocalday, I highly recommend
phonating through a straw andthis is something that was
discovered by a voice scientist,dr Ingo Titze.
And I've got them.
(44:19):
I have these metal voice strawsthat I carry with me and you can
use a drink straw, you can usea couple of cocktail straws, but
what you're going to do isyou're going to take this straw
and if it's a drink straw, Ilike to put my finger just
slightly over the tip to createa little more resistance,
because I don't want it to betoo easy.
I want to feel my cheeks puffedout a little bit.
I'll feel a bit of a bullfrogthroat from the resistance and I
(44:42):
just go just some glidesthrough that straw and what that
resistance is going to do isit's going to send air and
energy back down to your vocalcords and it's like a little
massage, and you do that for 30seconds.
(45:03):
You just kind of sneak away andthen, when you've gone through
it, just say hello, how are you?
And feel where your voice is.
Make sure your voice staysthere at that pitch when you
start getting tired.
Watch that your pitch doesn'tstart to drop, because then your
voice doesn't have a lot ofenergy, so you're going to start
to squeeze and all that's goingto do is start to swell your
(45:26):
vocal cords even more, and thenthe pitch is going to drop even
more and you're going to getinto this vicious cycle.
So, it's really exercising yourvoice, getting some good vocal
warm-ups, taking care of yourvoice and then making sure that
you're speaking at a healthypitch.
Speaker 2 (45:45):
Do you recommend certain, like I know, some
singers?
I have a friend who sings inthe choir at church and she has
these hot teas that they're likeher favorite hot teas that she
likes to drink.
Do you ever recommend anythinglike that, like a nice warm tea
or something that would help, Idon't know?
(46:07):
Take care of the vocal cords ormaybe help them relax after
you've used them, after a longday of using your vocal cords.
What are some things that wecould do?
Speaker 1 (46:18):
Well, there's actually a tea I've got a cup of
it right here called throatcoat, and it's made for the
voice.
But yeah, you want to.
When you're drinking beverages,you want to be careful about
too much caffeine because thatcan dry the voice and I love
(46:38):
coffee, so that's a hard one forme.
But just make sure you'regetting plenty of water teas
herbal teas are good and food.
If you're eating water-richfood, that's really good for the
voices.
So fruits and vegetables,things.
If you're going to have a hardvocal day, I wouldn't get up and
(47:01):
eat a cheese pizza forbreakfast, because that is your
body is just going to be in thisreally hard work of digestion.
I mean, that's just, it's hardon your system to digest it.
You're just going to get drylike really salty Foods, things
like that.
You just really think health.
Speaker 2 (47:20):
Yeah, that is such an important point you just made
and I don't think many of usthink about that Foods that
might be a little too salty, orwhat are you eating that day?
You have a big presentationthat afternoon.
What are the things that youare consuming so that your body
is not having to work over timeto digest that?
(47:41):
I don't think that's somethingthat we think about during those
days that we have thosespeeches.
So I'm glad that you mentionedthat.
I did have a question that Ijust remembered I wanted to ask
you a little while ago when youhad mentioned, with the vocal
and the pitch and finding youroptimal pitch, one of the
(48:04):
challenges that I think maybethis is more so for women than
men, but sometimes when we'retalking, we'll have that it's
like a question at the end andthen it just never seems to end.
How do you call their attentionto that as being something that
(48:27):
it's really a distraction ifit's overused?
How do you call someone'sattention to that and then help
them break that type of a habit?
Speaker 1 (48:39):
Well, this is where you're starting to get into
deeper work and where peoplemaybe have to feel slightly
uncomfortable when you startbreaking things down, bringing
their awareness to certainissues, maybe recording them
speaking and say here, do younotice that?
Do you see how that's arepeating pattern?
And then what happens?
(49:00):
And just point out that to thelistener if your speech pattern
becomes predictable, they'regonna tune out.
That's like listening to threeblind mice over and over again.
It's too predictable and whatwe need is a certain amount of
predictability.
But then we need to not deliveron that, that there's new
(49:23):
information coming in.
That's why great singers areconstantly adding nuances.
If you listen to a pop song, theproducer will bring in new
elements as the song repeats andbuilds or pulls things out to
reawaken your interest.
So if we don't want to havehabits that we're unaware of,
(49:44):
that becomes a problem, and I dothat a lot.
Working with singers is they'llhave little vocal ticks, if you
will.
That I have to just point outand go.
You realize that you're doingthis all the time, that you're
sliding to these notes again andagain.
Once in a while that's fine,but that's now becoming
predictable and you don't wantto be too predictable.
Speaker 2 (50:07):
Yeah, that's the value of having a good coach and
when you think about it,whatever industry that you're in
I mean you can be the bestbaseball player out there, you
can be a fantastic footballplayer, whatever you know sports
analogy that you want to usehere they have coaches for a
reason.
I mean, even if you have all ofthe natural talent in the world,
you'll notice I mean gymnastright All over the world they
(50:31):
will have a coach to help themto make those tiny tweaks
that'll help them.
Just take it from just yeah,you're really good, but how do
we get to that next level?
How do we make it really great?
So I think it's really valuableto be able to have a coach that
you can trust that is going totell you those things that you
(50:52):
yeah, you may not necessarilywant to hear it or you know it
might be a little uncomfortableto have that pointed out, but it
is only going to make youbetter at the end.
So, yeah, I appreciate thatabout you know really good
coaches like you to be able towork with people and help them
figure out those things that aregoing to take them to the next
(51:12):
level.
Have you ever worked withanyone?
They were just so resistant tothat, though, that it was like
look, I'm trying to tell you.
Speaker 1 (51:24):
I have worked with some resistant people and
they've tended to come.
They've been sent to me and it'soften been where they've been
sent by a record label and theydon't want voice lessons and
they're really pushing back andusually I can get them on my
(51:47):
side and show them.
Look, there's a way to do thiswithout losing who you are.
I'm not going to turn you intosome you know robot with just
perfect technique who can'texpress, but we have to do this
in a way that keeps your voicehealthy.
I haven't really found voiceusers in resistance if they come
(52:08):
to me because they don't havethe demands that singers do.
They're not pushed to me bysomeone above them.
They've.
Usually they've sought me outand so they're more open.
Not everybody is comfortable atfirst, kind of getting under the
hood of their voice, because wetend to feel that that's who we
(52:32):
are and vocal issues tend toembarrass us in ways that you
know.
If you're learning to playguitar, you're not your first
lesson.
You're not embarrassed that youdon't know how to play a C
chord and then it's hard to movefrom a C to a G chord.
But with the voice we tend tofeel like, oh, I should be able
to do this right away.
That's right, yeah.
Speaker 2 (52:53):
Yeah, I really appreciate one thing that you
just said there that you knowfor the singer.
I'm not trying to push you tobe someone you're not.
I don't want you to become, youknow someone or something that
you're not, and I think that'ssomething that many of us need
to hear.
You know, even if you're justtrying to practice for a
presentation that's coming up.
You know we watch examples ofall of these amazing speakers
(53:17):
that are online and we wouldlike to hope that we could
emulate you know them in some ofthe skills that they have, but
at the end of the day, youreally don't want to be a
version of somebody else.
You really do want to find whoyou are and then allow that to
(53:37):
be the star of that presentation.
Right, and to be able to pullthem out, not emulate someone
out.
Speaker 1 (53:45):
You know, comparing ourselves to others is the
source of so much misery, and Idon't care.
Well, maybe there are a fewpeople, but whatever your
expertise or what you're talkingabout, there's always going to
be someone who knows more thanyou, who's maybe a better
presenter, right, or you think,has more charisma.
(54:07):
What it really is, when you'reconnecting as you, your voice,
your experience, your journey,and you're doing this in an
honest, connected way, you willbe compelling.
People will want to learn itfrom you.
(54:29):
I can't claim I know there arepeople who know more about the
voice than I do Absolutely Ican't claim to be the world's
best vocal coach.
What I do know is that I have acertain experience, a way of
explaining things, a way ofinteracting with people that's
kind of unique to me and or theperson that I'm the right
(54:52):
teacher for.
It works, and there are peopleI'm not the right teacher for
and that's fine, but it reallyis.
You truly are enough.
It's not a cliche, it really isthis finding your voice.
I would say, if you'restruggling with this, take your
speech or take your presentation, and I want you to mentally
(55:18):
hear yourself giving thepresentation in the absolute
best way, like the ideal ofyourself.
What does that sound like?
What does your voice sound like?
Because that voice is withinyou and if there are certain
physical impediments to that,that can be worked through, that
(55:40):
voice that you hear in yourhead is there and it will move
people.
Speaker 2 (55:47):
Wow, I can see why you are such a sought-after
coach.
Like I'm motivated.
Like after that, I'm like, look, I'm looking at the time We've
been talking for almost 55, Ican't believe 55 minutes now
almost an hour, and that wasjust wonderful.
Like I am motivated right now.
I'm like I take on the world.
(56:08):
What a fantastic message tosend out to anyone who is really
working toward bettering theirvoice, wanting to become a more
effective communicator, wantingto be able to get out there and
make a difference, connect withothers.
That was just so well said.
(56:28):
I have nothing I can add tothat at all.
I really loved that.
I can tell you're a fantasticvocal coach.
I can tell that the people whoyou work with they probably
really appreciate being able towork with you because I think
you probably make a reallystrong connection with them on a
(56:50):
personal level.
Speaker 1 (56:52):
Well, thank you.
Speaker 2 (56:53):
Yeah, absolutely so.
Are there any final words ofwisdom that you would like to
share with our listeners beforewe wrap this up?
Speaker 1 (57:05):
There's music in your voice.
You don't have to be a singer,but there is a musical flow that
goes back so far in our historyand this musical connection,
this emotional connection, thismusic language is incredibly
(57:27):
powerful.
And we all get our slideslooking great and we have our
power stances and we reallythink about what we're going to
wear, but your voice is what'sconnecting you to people.
Your voice is the mostimportant thing on that stage or
in that presentation, in thatroom, and the time that you
(57:48):
spend on your voice will berepaid.
Speaker 2 (57:52):
Beautiful.
Thank you for taking us on thisjourney with you.
This has just been so fantastic.
I know I have learned a lot andI've been doing this for a long
time.
So, like you said earlier,there's always going to be
somebody who knows more than you.
We could always learn fromsomeone.
So if there's a listener outthere and they want to continue
this journey with you, how canthey get in touch with you or
(58:14):
tell us a little bit about yourpodcast?
Maybe they want to take alisten to that.
Speaker 1 (58:18):
Yeah, my podcast is called the Intelligent Vocalist.
It focuses on singers, but ifyou're a professional voice user
, it may be of interest to you,because it also goes into
mindset and vocal health andeven voice science.
This instrument is sofascinating that scientists are
still unsure of exactly how itworks.
(58:40):
It's so remarkably complex andwonderful.
I also have a book called theCompelling Speaker that's
available on Amazon.
You can check out my website,compellingspeakercom.
My main website is johnhennicom.
Speaker 2 (58:58):
All right, fantastic.
All right, you have a new fan.
I'm going to follow yourpodcast and start listening
because, like we said earlier,always room for improvement.
Thank you again so much, john,for being a guest on the show
and sharing your wisdom with howto become a better vocal.
I don't want to say vocalartist oh yeah, some people out
(59:18):
there might be a vocal artistbut just anyone out there who
wants to do a better job atdelivering a presentation or
speaking more effectively.
This has been jam-packed withall kinds of goodies, so I know
the listeners really doappreciate this hour that you
have spent with us.
So thanks again for being here.
Speaker 1 (59:38):
Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 2 (59:40):
All right, everyone.
Have a great rest of your dayand we'll see you next time.
Bye, thanks for listening.
If you enjoyed this episode andyou'd like to help support the
podcast, please share it withothers, post about it on social
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