February 17, 2024 • 48 mins
In this empowering episode of The Complete Wealth Management Podcast, we delve deep into the heart of retirement planning, providing you with actionable strategies to alleviate your biggest retirement concerns. Hosted by Dave Alison, a seasoned certified financial planner, and joined by esteemed guest Conrad Levesque, CFP, CPA and David Roth, CFP, EA, both experienced retirement planners, this episode promises to be a beacon of guidance in the often murky waters of financial security.
As retirement looms on the horizon, fears about financial stability, healthcare costs, and the uncertainty of the future can cast a shadow over what should be a golden period of life. However, armed with the right knowledge and proactive measures, you can transform those fears into confidence and assurance.
Throughout this insightful discussion, the team at Alison Wealth will explore a myriad of topics, including turning assets into retirement income, strategic investment approaches to safeguard your nest egg, and savvy tips for navigating the complexities of healthcare in retirement.
Moreover, they delve into the psychological aspects of retirement planning, addressing common anxieties and offering practical advice on how to cultivate a mindset of abundance and security.
Whether you're nearing retirement age or just beginning your journey towards financial independence, this episode is an invaluable resource that will equip you with the tools and strategies needed to eliminate your biggest retirement concerns and pave the way for a fulfilling and prosperous future. Tune in now and embark on the path to a worry-free retirement!
The information provided in this presentation is not intended to be individual investment advice or legal advice. The information provided is for informational and training purposes only.
Investment advisory services are provided through Prosperity Capital Advisors LLC (“PCA”) an investment advisor registered with the United States Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). For a detailed discussion of PCA and its investment advisory fees, see the firm’s Form ADV and Form CRS on file with the SEC at www.adviserinfo.sec.gov. The views expressed herein represent the opinions of PCA and are not intended to predict or depict performance of any particular investment.
Advisory services are provided through Prosperity Capital Advisors LLC (“PCA”) an investment advisor registered with the United States Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC). Views expressed herein represent the opinions of PCA and are not intended to predict or depict performance of any particular investment.
All data provided, including any reference to specific securities or sectors, is provided for informational purposes and should not be construed as investment advice. It does not constitute an offer, solicitation, or recommendation to purchase any security. Consider your investment objectives, risks, charges and expenses before investing. These views are as of the date of this publication and are subject to change. Past performance is no guarantee of future performance.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Can you see the red dot?
Now I can.
I see three red dots.
I think we're good to go threered dots means we're live.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Well, let's jump on into it.
Happy Friday everyone.
We are here, live, and we wantto talk about Retirement in this
podcast episode.
So, conrad, you had a greatkind of recommendation for us to
Jump into some of the commonretirement fears.
You know things that we hearfrom clients as they're thinking
(00:29):
about retirement, approachingretirement, need our help in
planning, and we'll talk abouthow to overcome them in today's
episode.
Awesome.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
I'm looking forward to it.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Great.
Well, let's get rolling into it.
All right, so what we're gonnatalk about here is some common
retirement fears and how toovercome them.
I know, conrad, this issomething that you shared, you
(01:01):
wanted to, you know, throw outas a topic today.
So let's, let's jump on intothings.
Let's talk about some of thethings we hear from clients.
When we talk about some of theconcerns, the challenges, the
fears, you know, hypothetically,if there is something that kept
them up at night aboutretirement, what that could be,
what a what do you guys hearfrom clients when they're
approaching us and we need andhelp structuring their
(01:22):
retirement?
Speaker 3 (01:23):
I think the first one is what the heck am I gonna do
with all this time?
Right, there's this fear andI've had this conversation.
My dad and I have had it Idon't know probably 30, 30
different times in the lastmonth and and he's, he's on that
verge of retiring, but he's andhe says to me, well, what am I
gonna do?
(01:44):
I was like I don't know, playgolf, find a hobby, start a
charity, like, do somethingright, identify what your
passion is.
But I think it goes back to youknow, you go to, you grow up,
you hit 18, you go to college.
Let's say it takes five yearsto go through college.
You're 23 when you get out andyou get a job and you work
(02:05):
full-time.
Nine to five, right, a lot ofpeople, for 40 years, 45 years,
right.
And so at the end of 45 yearsthat you get the proverbial
golden watch and they say Thankyou very much, like here's your
nine to five back, like, what doyou do?
So I think that's it'simportant to start building
(02:26):
hobbies or just identify,identifying what you'd like to
do outside of work, well beforeretirement, but but so that you
have something that you knowyou're gonna do in retirement.
I think the worst thing you cando is get to that point and
then stay in bed all day.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Yeah, it's amazing how quick your mind and your
body deteriorate.
You know, and and I was talkingwith one of our clients who is
still working, but they'reapproaching retirement in the
next year or so and the owner oftheir company had sold the
business after you know, kind ofbuilding this family business
(03:02):
over the last 60, 70 years, andhe was in his mid 70s and, like,
he literally cashed out for abillion dollars, so money was
not an issue.
Right and Within about a yearand a half of selling the
business, his health massivelydeteriorated.
He had a stroke and ended uppassing away.
(03:24):
And I think the reality of thatis, for 50, 60 years, his whole
identity, his purpose, what gothim up in the morning was work,
right, it was building thiscompany, it was Continuing to do
all the things that he wasdoing and so like.
When he exited out of thecompany Even though, of course,
(03:48):
I think any of us would be quitehappy with a billion dollar
exit Um, he really lost thatidentity.
And so to your point, conrad, Ithink, as you're preparing for
or thinking about your ownretirement, it's not just about
the financial aspect of it, it'sabout what you're gonna do day
in and day out.
And you know, one of thephrases I always like to you
(04:11):
know kind of lead with is youknow, maybe it's not necessarily
Retirement, maybe you've nowjust earned to the right to have
a work, optional lifestyle, andso you know, there's a lot of
things like I know I asked mylike what would I do if I didn't
have to work, if I was in afinancial advisor doing this
stuff?
And like, hey, I might go workon a fishing charter for one or
(04:35):
two days a week or somethinglike that, just to keep me
moving and to keep me going.
And so I think you're so rightand kind of thinking about you
know what you're gonna do day inand day out.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Dave.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
I hope we don't find you on the TV show.
Deadly is catch.
Anytime soon, though, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
That's not really my style, but I'm more in the
sunshine on a nice calm day, notbattling the bearing sea and 30
foot waves, but, um, you know,I even just getting down to
hobbies.
You know, in a prior episode weinterviewed the pierces, great
clients of ours, who retiredearly, and you know their
passion was they took up sailingand that's obviously a very
(05:15):
physical and engaging activity,kind of sailing, navigating the
world, keeping your mind sharp.
You know Jane was sharing that,she was starting to learn
different languages.
Again, it doesn't mean you haveto necessarily go to work or
become a crabber out in thebearing sea, but it's just doing
stuff that's gonna occupy yourtime.
Keep your mental acuity, youknow, just just stay sharp.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Right, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Yeah, and I know a couple people from the arts
field who they retire and theyget back into music or Crafting
or mosaic work and it's reallygreat to see all that that come
out.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Yeah, 100%, 100%.
So what else what you know?
Obviously we can't prescribehow everybody needs to fill
their time.
I think you know the one thingto know is, when you do retire,
every day is a Saturday and so,to your point, you need to, you
know, have something to get outthere and do.
But what are some of the otherkind of fears or concerns that
(06:12):
you guys hear about?
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Yeah, I think I think kind of the, the next, I'll
call it one or two.
They really work togetherRunning out of money and
ultimately a lot of people lookat it as it's gonna cost me so
much for health insurance orhealth care.
I'm there's a fear of runningout of money because of that.
Right and and so I hear that allthe time.
(06:34):
In fact, I met with a clientjust just about a week ago and
Even though we showed himthere's a plan that he can
retire today and granted, wedon't want any major major
issues to occur, but we laid outa plan that gets him to to a
hundred and five and he stilllooked at me and said I have
(06:55):
this fear of running out ofmoney and so unpacking that and
understanding, you know, I think, when we, when we had that long
talk, ultimately laying out thebucket plan helped ease that
fear.
But again, if you have thatfear and you've built up that
assumption, every little thingis gonna cause some, some unease
(07:15):
, and so understanding orstarting early To identify some
of those pain points or some ofthose fears, I think gives you
more time to to alleviate thosejust through a process like the
bucket plan or leveraging anadvisor.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Yeah, definitely.
I mean, if you think aboutrunning out of money, one of the
the the biggest issues goinginto retirement that that kind
of paralyzes people from living,you know, their dream
retirement and kind of gettingthe fulfillment out of
retirement that they deserve isthat they live what I call this
what if retirement?
Right, they're actually scaredto spend their money in
(07:56):
Retirement because of all thewhat ifs.
What if I do live till ahundred?
What if I have a big healthcare event later on in life?
And so you know that's a bigpart of being prepared and
having a plan.
Like, none of us know exactlyhow long we're gonna live.
None of us know if we're gonnahave a catastrophic extended
(08:19):
care event in retirement.
But you could have a plan inplace and that could mitigate
some of those risks.
I'll give you two examples.
Like If you are so fearfulabout running out of money in
retirement, there are ways thatyou could structure your
(08:40):
retirement assets to provideGuaranteed lifetime income.
Right, it's called an annuityoffered by an insurance company.
Now we know for many of us,when we retire we're gonna have
social security.
That's a form of guaranteedlifetime annuity.
Social security is gonna payUntil the day we pass away.
(09:04):
Maybe some people are fortunateenough to have a pension.
A pension is guaranteedlifetime Income that's gonna pay
out for as long as you're alive.
And what's quite interesting is, of all the people that I've
been able to help retire overthe years, the ones who seem to
(09:24):
be the happiest are the ones whohave the highest amounts of
Guaranteed lifetime income.
Right, it's maybe the theperson that worked for the
government or the school teacherthat is now retired and they
have a huge amount of guaranteedlifetime income because they
don't have to worry about, well,what happens if the stock
(09:46):
market crashes 20 or 30 percent.
They know exactly what theyhave, what they can spend, and
they can go consume that money.
They can travel, they can takethe trips.
They don't live that what ifretirement?
And so one of the things thatsomebody could do if they truly
are scared of running out Ofmoney is they can buy an annuity
(10:08):
.
Now I hear from people onoccasion that will say well,
I've heard annuities have abunch of costs associated with
them, or if I die Early, theinsurance company keeps all the
money, and there are certainannuities that are higher in
cost.
Maybe they have more benefits.
(10:28):
There are annuities that, ifyou pass away, the insurance
company keeps all the money.
But there's also annuities thatcould pay you a lifetime income
and, if you were to pass away,your beneficiaries Receive the
entire balance.
There's just a trade-off, andso you know, what I always share
is what you need to evaluateand Conrad to your point earlier
(10:50):
of working with a financialprofessional or somebody on our
team, for example is what arethe trade-offs like?
What are you gaining by puttingmoney into a lifetime Income
annuity and what are you losingby putting money into the
lifetime income annuity?
Maybe you're gaining the peaceof mind that you know all of
your basic living expenses aregoing to be met For as long as
(11:15):
you're alive, whether you livetill 80, 90, 100 or 120.
But on the flip side, maybeyou're trading off some of the
upside that the stock marketcould have brought about if we
continue to be in a bull market.
But that's a very personaldecision that somebody needs to
(11:36):
kind of just weigh the pros andthe cons in the trade-offs
associated with Something likethat.
But I just kind of want toconclude by saying, like, if
that is something that is a bigConcern of yours, if that's
something that's keeping you upat night running out of money,
for example in retirement.
There are solutions that youcould put in place that
(11:59):
completely eliminate thatconcern, absolutely so.
The other one you mentioned ishealth care.
Um, yeah, health care.
Certainly.
I know you and I and David werejust talking about this for a
client this morning that youknow they they're kind of fed up
, they don't want to workanymore, they're going to be
retiring, they're going to beturning 64 this year and, as we
(12:22):
know, medicare does not kick inuntil you're 65.
So medicare is health insurancethat's available for
individuals who are retired.
It covers, you know, part a isyour general hospitalization if
you're in the hospital.
Medicare part b Generallycovers, like your doctors and
(12:43):
things like that.
And then typically a retireehas to buy a medicare supplement
or a a gap policy to cover allof the rest.
And Once somebody turns age 65,medicare is quite reasonably
priced.
But until then, if you're notcovered by employer health care,
(13:04):
it can be quite expensive,right, guys?
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
I mean, think about it right.
We, a lot of times we have whatwe don't even realize is a
large subsidy coming from ouremployer.
Well then you know, great, youcan extend your coverage for 18
months through Cobra, but youpick up the full cost when you
look at your W-2 at the end ofthe year.
You can go down and see whatthe cost of employer-paid health
(13:31):
insurance is, and a lot oftimes that's $15,000, $20,000
that now you're going to have toplan for in terms of that gap
to get into Medicare.
So you know, and understandingwhat the options are, a lot of
people think I can only get itfrom my employer.
Well, you know, there are waysto get it outside of your
employer.
(13:51):
The Affordable Care Act openedup the exchange for people that
can go and get an individualhealth policy as well.
So there are options out there.
Understanding the cost is adifferent story, right, and
really planning for that gapfrom a cash flow need.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
I want to talk about kind of tax and income planning,
david, with you on that forkind of health insurance,
because I know you've helped alot of our clients navigate this
.
But before we do that, I meanthe baseline is, if you know
you're going to be retiringearly let's say I'm able to
retire at 63, and I know I'mgoing to have a two-year gap
(14:30):
until I'm eligible for MedicareWell, we want to make sure we do
is have airmarked in yourfinancial plan a healthcare
bridge.
And so if we know yourmarketplace, health coverage is
going to be $20,000 a year outof pocket and we know that
there's going to be, let's say,three years before Medicare
(14:53):
kicks on, we're going to want tomake sure we have about $60,000
allocated in that soon bucketto be able to make sure we have
the cash flow to pay yourpremiums for that health
insurance in your financial plan.
And so, again, medicare andbuilding that bridge, or medical
(15:15):
insurance planning and buildingthat bridge is really, really
important to think about.
And honestly, I hear fromclients all the time I want to
go ahead and retire early, whichis great, and they neglect to
think about those high costs ofhealth insurance and then
sometimes that prohibits themfrom actually doing it.
(15:36):
But, conrad, you mentionedearlier ACA and the marketplace.
That's essentially wheresomebody would go for private
health insurance, right?
If they're not covered undertheir company plan and they're
not eligible for Medicare.
At this point, david, talk alittle bit about for our clients
that have retired early, thecost of coverage is dependent on
(16:01):
your income, right?
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Yeah, and it's exactly what you said.
The cost of the coverage isgoing to be dependent on your
income and the way it is isyou're going to get a subsidy
for your health insurancecoverage, but the maximum that
you should pay is going to be8.5% of your adjusted gross
(16:23):
income.
So, again for simple numbers,if you make $100,000, your
health insurance should bearound $8,500.
And it could go up if yourincome goes increases or again,
if your income goes down, theamount could decrease.
But just to give a real lifeexample, what we see, even with
(16:43):
some of our higher net worthclients, in the years that they
are transitioning to retirementthey don't have an income, so
their AGI could substantiallydrop.
They could be making asubstantial amount, but then in
the year of retirement theycould be making under $100,000
just because, again, theincome's not there.
So it's always something toconsider and look at if it makes
(17:07):
sense to go to the marketplacefor a plan.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yeah, and just a couple examples of that.
To think through strategicallyhow you might be able to reduce
the cost of your health care ifyou do retire early is having
tax diversification of yourassets.
So, for example, if you spentyour entire career saving in a
pre-tax 401k or IRA or 403B aqualified retirement plan and
(17:36):
then let's say you're fortunateenough to be able to retire at
age 62, and there's going to bethat three-year period before
you're eligible for Medicare,we're going to have to secure
your health insurance throughthe marketplace.
Now, if we have to take all ofyour supplemental retirement
(17:56):
income out of a pre-taxretirement account like an IRA
or 401k, that's all going to betaxable income to you as we're
taking those distributions.
But if you were able tostrategically accumulate some
non-qualified or after-tax moneyin a brokerage account or a
(18:18):
trust account or some Roth IRAmoney, then in those early years
we might be able to take yourincome out of those after-tax or
tax-free sources whichultimately would substantially
bring down your AGI, which wouldsubstantially bring down your
(18:39):
cost of health insurance.
And so one of the things thatwe really look deep on is, if
you're going to be retiringbefore age 65, we want to figure
out how to build the mosttax-efficient retirement income
distribution plan for you.
And that's not just incometaxes Income taxes are certainly
a big component of it but it'salso looking at the big picture
(19:03):
of these things like healthcare,and it's again where our
approach is very different thana lot of other financial
advisors out there and how wefocus on holistic wealth
management.
It's not just managing yourportfolio for the greatest
investment rate of return.
It's not just managing yourincome to try to minimize taxes.
It's looking at how all ofthese things work together
(19:26):
because, again, every dollar wecan save you for healthcare
costs could be a dollar that youcan go spend on an extra
vacation or taking the grandkidsout to dinner.
So again, this is kind of wherehaving a team of experts like
we are coming together to lookat all of these different areas
could make a big impact.
Now, conrad, you work with aton of business owners.
(19:49):
So let's say that one of thetwo spouses is going to retire
early, but the other spousemaybe still has some part-time
self-employment income, maybelike a Schedule C type of
business.
Are there any things that wecould potentially think about
(20:10):
from a tax savings perspectiveor securing health insurance for
the family, knowing that one ofthem has a business.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
Absolutely.
Yeah, there's a number ofdifferent options here, you know
.
The one that really comes tomind is pretty simple.
Let's say we have a businessowner that has you know, they're
a single member LLC.
They report their income on aschedule C on their personal
return.
We have the ability to reallyput that person as the primary
(20:45):
on an insurance policy, and evencovering the spouse will
qualify and that actuallyqualifies for the self-employed
health insurance deduction,which is different than your
health insurance itemizeddeduction.
Now, the difference between thetwo is pretty distinct.
Self-employed health insurancededuction is actually treated as
(21:08):
an adjustment to your income.
It's technically an above theline deduction.
That means if you have $100,000of income in $10,000 of
self-employed health insurancededuction, your AGI is $90,000.
On the flip side, if you haveto do that through your W-2
employer, those costs areactually subject to itemized
(21:30):
deduction limitations.
Right?
So you have a number of tiersthat you have to hit.
Currently, if you don't spendmore than 7.5% of your adjusted
gross income on health andrelated expenses, you get no
benefit from.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
Right.
We hardly see tax returnsanymore where people are
actually getting itemizeddeduction write-offs for health
insurance because that hurdle isso high.
But to your point, if you'reself-employed, that hurdle kind
of goes away Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Absolutely.
Yeah, I mean to put it mildly.
Right, I had a baby and I alsohad shoulder surgery this past
year and I still didn't meetthat qualification Right.
So all of those thingshappening one year, I still
didn't qualify for the itemizeddeduction portion.
(22:21):
So the other options wouldinclude some different
structures, right?
So structurally your businessmust change.
But you could create what'scalled a health reimbursement
arrangement or a qualifiedself-employment health
reimbursement arrangement.
I know that's a mouthful, butthe long and short of it is, if
(22:42):
you have somebody that you hire,including a family member, that
then is the primary on aninsurance policy, you can
reimburse up to certain limitsof that policy without having
that be taxable to the recipient.
But it is technically adeduction for the business, so
it's treated much like theself-employed health insurance
(23:02):
deduction, meaning it reducesthe income.
It just does it on the frontend for the business as well.
So there are some options therefor business owners outside of
normal routes that you could go,but those are two really good,
easy ones that most, if not all,business owners should be
(23:23):
taking advantage of today.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Yeah, the HRA is such a great option and just such a
great way to kind of structuresome savings.
So, again, all of this beingsaid is, the purpose of this is
that if you are going to havethese larger new expenses it
could be health insurance, itcould be additional
out-of-pocket health care coststhere's ways to think about and
(23:46):
structure it.
Whether you're a business ownerand maybe we can classify some
of those as qualified businessexpenses to save some money on
taxes or whether you're just atraditional retiree, maybe
there's ways we can think abouthow to construct your retirement
income to maximize the benefitsyou get through the health care
(24:09):
marketplace and what yourout-of-pocket expenses are.
But either way, there's optionsto take a look at.
And then, last but not least,when we talk about health care
is hopefully much later on inlife, there's a chance that you
have some sort of extended careevent, long-term care, the
(24:31):
things that even once you are onMedicare, medicare does not
cover.
Medicare doesn't cover thenursing home.
Nobody wants to go into anursing home.
Most of us would want to beable to have an extended care
event in our own house, wheremaybe we have to have a nurse
come out to the house to providea specialized care.
(24:52):
Medicare doesn't cover that.
And so, again, a lot of peoplethink about long-term care
insurance.
And many people are scared toeven think about long-term care
insurance because they've heardhow expensive it could be.
And don't get me wrong, itcould be expensive.
But you have to ask yourselfwhat's the greater expense of
(25:18):
paying the premium for along-term care policy or paying
all of the cost of care out ofpocket if you do have that
extended care event.
And so, again, it's justweighing the tradeoffs and
seeing what your personalsituation could look like when
you think about how to cover thecost of that care.
(25:41):
And again, with long-term care,I think a lot of people have
shied away from looking into itbecause they say, yeah, but what
if I never need it?
What if I never go into anursing home?
What if I never have anextended care event?
Now, I paid all those years inand if I don't use it, I lose it
, I die in my sleep, I have aheart attack and I never need
(26:02):
long-term care.
I wasted all that money.
And so there's also policiesavailable these days where, if
you don't use it, that moneygets returned back to your
family.
So just some things to thinkabout when it comes to health
care planning, whether it's onthe front end of Medicare having
to get private marketplaceinsurance or whether it's on the
(26:25):
backside of things thatMedicare doesn't cover.
Dr Justin, Marchegiani.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Absolutely, dr Justin Marchegiani.
Yes, dr Justin Marchegiani.
Yeah, dr Justin Marchegiani.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
So let's kinda you know, shift to.
One of the other big things wehear about quite frequently from
people getting ready to retireis how do I turn my assets into
income right, like I've got toage 65 or 67 or 62 or shoot?
We've had clients at 49 thathave been fortunate enough to be
(26:54):
able to retire, but they've,they're now getting ready to
retire and they have theirnumber a million dollars, three
million dollars, 10 milliondollars, whatever that number is
, it's basically a pile of cash.
It's not just cash, but it'scash.
It's stocks, it's bonds, it'smutual funds, it's ETFs, it's
(27:14):
401k money.
How do they actually go aboutstarting to turn these assets
into an income stream that theycan go and use to buy their
groceries?
Speaker 3 (27:25):
Dr Justin Marchegiani , yeah, Dr Justin Marchegiani,
dave, I so in full disclosure.
I saw this article onKipplergercom and I spread this
one and from the top of my lungsI was screaming the soon bucket
, the soon bucket, the soonbucket, right.
And this is just.
You couldn't have teed it upany better to talk about why the
(27:46):
soon bucket is so important forretirees, for accumulators,
really for everyone, but really,in this context, for retirees.
You know they go into thearticle talking about the
sequence of returns risk.
And for those that don't knowabout the sequence of returns
risk, it's, in short, right, ifyou have, you know, some early
(28:10):
let's call it 10-year trackrecord, and the early years you
have positive returns, middleyears are neutral and last years
are negative.
If you take that sequence andflip it and have zero
distributions, you end up withthe same result after 10 years.
But when you add indistributions, the years that
(28:31):
you start with positive returns,you have a positive number.
At the end of that 10 years,the years that you start with
negative returns, there's amajor, major difference and
oftentimes it could be closer tozero than anybody wants.
And so what we look at is thesoon bucket.
Is really that in between,where this is the the portion of
(28:51):
assets are slowing down.
Right, we don't you don't go ona highway trip and take an
immediate right off theinterstate.
No, we need an off-ramp.
Right, and this is treated asthat off-ramp where we take a
portion of assets and say weneed to really retain these and
protect these so that they canprovide income in the early
years of retirement.
(29:12):
So the assets that arecontinuing to grow, that may
experience volatility, have timeto rebuild and continue to grow
.
Right?
The average 9% return of S&Pdoesn't mean it's 9% every year.
It just means that the averageover time equals 9%, right?
Speaker 2 (29:30):
Yeah, if it was 9% every year, it'd be quite easy
to develop a retirement incomeplan right, get 9%, and as long
as you spend some number under9%, you're in good shape.
But the problem is that ifyou're spending 7% of your money
and the stock market goes down20% now you're burning the
(29:51):
candle at both ends and that'sgoing to cause you to deplete
your account balances a lotquicker.
And so when we think aboutbuilding a retirement income
distribution plan, when we thinkabout taking this pile of money
and creating cash flow, there'sthree ways you can do it, and
(30:11):
there's only three ways you cando it, and not every way is
right for every single person.
It depends on what type ofretirement you want.
The first way is theconventional way I think a lot
of people have historicallythought about retirement, which
is they live off of the yield oftheir portfolio.
(30:33):
So let's say I have a milliondollars of retirement assets.
I don't want to see my milliondollars get eaten into, I just
want to live off of the gains.
And so let's say that myportfolio can generate 3.5% per
(30:54):
year of dividends and interest.
Well, that tells me I couldlive off of $35,000 from that
million dollar portfolio.
Now the reality of it is mostpeople don't have enough money
saved up to be able to just liveon dividends and interest,
(31:14):
right Like for somebody that isamassed a million dollars of
retirement assets 35 grand mightnot be enough.
Now you could make the argumentthat in some years there's also
going to be capitalappreciation.
So if the interest or theincome off of that portfolio is
(31:34):
3.5%, maybe the market goes upanother 5% and you can peel off
some capital gains too.
But as we all know, when you'reinvested in things like stocks,
they are going to generallypick off dividend income.
Hopefully there's going to becapital appreciation, but what
(31:55):
else could happen in any givenyear to that stock portfolio?
Speaker 4 (31:58):
They could go down.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
They could go down right.
And again they can lose valueand so there's no guarantees
that we can pull off capitalappreciation.
And I know for a lot of ourclients and David, I know you
know we've talked about this inmany meetings with clients is
they don't want to have tosacrifice their lifestyle in any
(32:20):
given year just because thestock market is down.
Like David, if we called someof our clients and said, hey, I
know you were thinking abouttaking that phenomenal trip to
Europe this year, but themarket's down, can you guys, you
know, take a road trip to thePanhandle in Florida instead?
Like I don't think they'd bevery happy with us.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
No, that would not be ideal, so again.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
You know thinking about generating portfolio
income.
Of course the yield approach isone way to do it.
And we have some clients, youknow, they have 10, 15, 20, 30
million dollars and, quitehonestly, they can live off of
dividends and interest fromtheir portfolio.
But for most people out there,they need to not only consume
(33:05):
the yield but they are going tohave to tap into some principle
also.
Other clients also.
They don't want to just live oninterest, they want to tap into
their principle because they'renot worried about dying with
this big benefit for theirbeneficiaries, right, they want
to consume this money and enjoyit for themselves.
(33:27):
And so the other way is toestablish what we call a
drawdown approach, where we'redrawing down both principle and
interest in earning.
And so, Conrad, this is thatconcept that you mentioned of
like establishing a soon bucket.
So if we were designing a planfor a client and we determined
(33:52):
that, outside of their socialsecurity, they were going to
need another $65,000 a year tolive off of, so let's say their
social security is 40 grand,they need another $65,000.
That gets them to about$105,000 a year of total
retirement income.
In that soon bucket, David,about how much would we want to
(34:17):
think about putting in somethingthat's going to be invested for
growth to help offset inflationit's just invested
conservatively so that it cangenerate that reliable income
and kind of that drawdown phaseLike if you had maybe a more
aggressive investor about howmuch would be in that soon
bucket, or if you had a moreconservative investor, how much
(34:40):
might be in that soon bucket ifthey needed around 65 grand a
year to tap into their assets.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Yeah, and again it's going to depend.
We've been talking withdifferent clients and they have
different appetites for how muchthey want to put in their soon
bucket.
But if you're on the moreconservative side, you might
want to load that up for a10-year time horizon.
So if it's $65,000 a year youneed, you might need $650,000 to
fill that gap just to get youthrough those 10 years.
(35:09):
And that's not even accountingfor inflation or anything else.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
So $650,000 there and that basically would say, all
right, we've pretty much secureda 10-15 year time horizon in
your soon bucket Because, again,that $650,000 is going to be
invested for growth.
It's going to earn money overthat 10-15 year time period and
what that does is it allows usto take $65,000 a year out every
(35:37):
year to go spend without havingto worry about really what's
going on in the stock market.
Now, let's say, a client had$1.65 million of total assets.
If they have $650,000 in thesoon bucket and we're drawing
that down, that means they haveanother million out in the later
bucket for long-term growth andeventually, maybe 10, 15, 16
(36:02):
years into the future, that soonbucket is going to be depleting
down.
But what are we going to do,conrad?
Speaker 3 (36:12):
Well, I mean and this is where, when you have good
years, right, let's think aboutthat example of sequence of
returns when the market is up,let's harvest those gains and
move them into the soon bucket.
Right.
When the market is down, let'slet the market come back right,
let's let the portfolio rebuildand get into a positive position
(36:34):
.
That by giving us 10 years, wehave a time horizon.
We can actually now for theproverbial time in the market.
Right, we're just timing it,not for top-end growth or
bottom-end buying.
It's opportunistic when we movefunds from a higher growth
portfolio to a more income-styleportfolio.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Exactly.
You know, I like to go to Vegasevery year ago with one of our
clients, as you guys know, andthe way I like to think about it
is like if I'm sitting at theblackjack table gambling and I
win a bunch of money, I takewhat I started with off the
table and I put it in my pocketand now I'm just playing with
house money and I think of thebucket plan kind of very
(37:17):
similarly.
It's like let's take our incomemoney off the table from
massive stock market risk sothat again we can have a
reliable, sustainable incomestream that later bucket.
We're going to be kind ofbetting on the long-term growth
of the stock market.
It's going to have its ups anddowns, but when we find that
(37:40):
we've gone through a winningstreak maybe, like we have the
last 10 years we want to peeloff some gains and reload our
soon bucket back up.
And so what's really uniqueabout this philosophy and
strategy is it can really betailored to the individual.
So I was just emailing and youguys were both on the email
chain with one of our clientslast night and over the last
(38:03):
couple of days.
He's getting ready to retire.
They are fortunate enough tohave a very large pension.
They will also have socialsecurity, so right out of the
gate they're going to have$100,000 to $150,000 a year of
guaranteed income, on top of allof the retirement assets that
(38:25):
they've built up, which areseveral millions of dollars as
well.
And so in their situation hehas much more of an appetite to
keep more of his money in thelater bucket.
He only wants about three tofour years in the soon bucket,
basically to be able to providehis supplemental income in any
(38:45):
big years that the market isdown.
But again, his appetite forgrowth is much greater than
maybe somebody else who doesn'thave that same kind of mentality
of wanting more of their moneyout in the later bucket and less
having reliability andguarantees in the soon bucket.
(39:06):
And again, it's maybe a lotbecause he already has such a
large source of guaranteedlifetime income via that
$150,000 pension and socialsecurity.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Right, and that reminds me, circling back to
what we talked about earlier.
You mentioned creating anincome stream, you know, through
the utilization of, potentially, an annuity, and maybe this is
where understanding how thatcould fit and guarantee an
income.
maybe you have less of yourportfolio in the soon bucket
(39:43):
because that's in place, right?
It doesn't have to be a pension, it could be some other vehicle
, but I think that's thetailoring it to each and every
client and understanding themoving parts and how they work
together is that, in my opinion,the true power of the bucket
plan and really the true powerof how we serve clients.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
It is.
I just kind of to recap.
I mentioned there's three waysto generate retirement income.
One is the portfolio yield.
Unless you're ultra high networth, that's probably not going
to be the only solution for you.
The other approach is adrawdown solution, where we're
doing something like three, four, five, 10 years worth of income
(40:28):
in that soon bucket and we'redrawing it down.
The last one is lifetime income.
This is where you are turningover a lump sum of your
retirement assets to aninsurance company.
You're purchasing an annuitythat is contractually going to
give you, or you and your spouse, a lifetime guaranteed income
(40:51):
stream.
For example, let's say that I'm65 years old and my spouse is
65 years old and I give theinsurance company $100,000, I
might get back $6,000 a year ofguaranteed income for as long as
I'm alive.
Now you could do the simplemath and say okay, I gave them
(41:14):
$100,000, they're going to giveme back $6,000 a year If I live
20 years, that's $120,000 that Igot back.
I gave them $100,000, I getback $120,000.
That's if I were to live tillage 85, one of the two of us.
What if I live till 95?
(41:37):
Now I get $6,000 a year for 30years.
My internal rate of return justwent up.
Your internal rate of return ona lifetime income annuity is
determined by you how long youlive it really protects and is
that longevity insurance.
What we've seen with manyclients is that we all go
(42:01):
through three phases ofretirement.
We go through what I call thego-go years, the slo-go years
and the no-go years.
I have a little section of thison our website under retirement
, the go-go years are when we'reyounger, we're healthy, we can
(42:21):
be active and we want to gospend more of our retirement
assets.
Let's say I'm retiring at 65,I'm probably going to be more
active from 65 to 75 than I willbe from 75 to 85, and certainly
from 85 to 95.
That's those go-go years,slo-go years and no-go years.
(42:46):
Maybe I realize I need $40,000 ayear on top of my social
security just for my basicstandard of living, whether I'm
in the go-go years, the slo-goyears or the no-go years.
Maybe we purchase an annuity toguarantee $40,000 a year On top
(43:11):
of that.
Maybe I actually want $100,000a year during my go-go years.
That other $60,000 in additionto my annuity income is going to
come from my portfolio.
Maybe I get to my slo-go yearsand now I don't need $100,000
because I'm not traveling allover the world as much Now.
(43:34):
Maybe.
I only need $75,000.
So $40,000 is coming from myguaranteed annuity.
The other $35,000 is comingfrom my portfolio.
And then, last but not least,we enter our no-go years and I
have my $40,000 guaranteedincome annuity.
I have my social security, andthen we're just supplementing
(43:55):
anything above and beyond thatfrom the portfolio that we need,
and so that's one great way tokind of think about these life
phases of retirement and how tostructure a retirement income
distribution plan that couldalign with your goals and
objectives.
I love it.
(44:15):
Well, I think that gives us agood place.
Again, I know this is stuff wedo all day long.
I mean, one of the things thatI love about retirement income
planning is that there are notwo identical plans.
Everybody's retirement is alittle bit different.
Right, you might have anapproach where you want to die
with zero.
When your family writes thatcheck to the funeral home, it
(44:38):
bounces.
You want to spend every dollaryou have enjoying retirement.
Maybe your retirement plan isyou want to be able to enjoy as
much as you can, but you alsohave a legacy planning intent.
You want to be able to leavethe kids and grandkids some
money behind.
Maybe you've accumulated abunch of money in your primary
(44:59):
house, in your real estate, andyou need to figure out how to
tap into that housing wealth tobe able to support your
retirement.
There's just so many differentthings to think about and I
think our perspective, as always, is to educate, to be able to
share tradeoffs associated withall these decisions and really
to craft a customized retirementincome plan that meets your
(45:23):
goals and objectives.
And I know you guys do such agreat job at that with our
clients also.
So any closing comments on justconcerns or priorities people
have as they go into retirementConrad or David.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
Yeah, I think you know and I'll sing this from the
rooftops till the day I die thesooner you start, the less fear
you're going to feel at thetime that you retire.
Right, and I say that for myclients that are in their 20s
right, start saving now.
Clients that are in their 30sand 40s, start saving now, start
(45:58):
planning now.
And certainly, in talking aboutthis stuff, the sooner we can
start, the better off we'll allbe.
But leveraging help right, justfind somebody you trust, come
up with a plan that worked foryou, identify the things that
you really like and don't likeand get a plan in place.
Speaker 1 (46:21):
Yeah, and I would say just to add to that you know
we're talking about things thatpeople are fearful about in
retirement, one thing you alwayswant to look at are these fears
real or are they not?
And that's why it's importantto work with a professional,
because all these things thatwe're talking about, we've seen
clients who are very fearful andthey're scared of it.
Some of them it's not real.
(46:43):
Some of it they're completelyfine.
Others we have to have a quitefrank talk and say, no, this is
a problem.
And so that's why it isimportant to work with a
professional, because whilewe're saying these are fears,
these are fears and things thatmight actually become an issue
if your situation is such thatyou don't have enough funds.
(47:07):
But if you do, you can model itout, you can ease your mind as
long as you're working withsomebody and you have a good
plan.
Speaker 2 (47:15):
Yeah, that's great.
Planning is key with I meanthink about you.
Most people spend more timeplanning their annual vacation
than they do their retirement,and so this is what we're here
for.
Hopefully you found thisepisode helpful.
If you have any questions,please reach out to us and
appreciate your time joining us.
David and Conrad, thanks forhaving us.
Speaker 4 (47:37):
Thanks for having us.
Financial planning and advisoryservices are offered through
Prosperity Capital Advisor PCA,an SEC registered investment
advisor with its principal placeof business in the state of
Ohio.
Allison Wealth Management andPCA are separate, non-affiliated
entities.
Pca does not provide tax orlegal advice.
Insurance and tax servicesoffered through Allison Wealth
(47:58):
Management are not affiliatedwith PCA.
Information received from thisvideo should not be viewed as
individual investment advice.
Content may have been createdby a third party and was not
written or created by a PCAaffiliated advisor and does not
represent the views and opinionsof PCA or its subsidiary.
For information pertaining tothe registration status of PCA,
please contact the firm or referto the Investment Advisor
(48:20):
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Can you see the red dot?
Now I can.
I see three red dots.
I think we're good to go threered dots means we're live.
Speaker 2 (00:07):
Well, let's jump on into it.
Happy Friday everyone.
We are here, live, and we wantto talk about Retirement in this
podcast episode.
So, conrad, you had a greatkind of recommendation for us to
Jump into some of the commonretirement fears.
You know things that we hearfrom clients as they're thinking
(00:29):
about retirement, approachingretirement, need our help in
planning, and we'll talk abouthow to overcome them in today's
episode.
Awesome.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
I'm looking forward to it.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
Great.
Well, let's get rolling into it.
All right, so what we're gonnatalk about here is some common
retirement fears and how toovercome them.
I know, conrad, this issomething that you shared, you
(01:01):
wanted to, you know, throw outas a topic today.
So let's, let's jump on intothings.
Let's talk about some of thethings we hear from clients.
When we talk about some of theconcerns, the challenges, the
fears, you know, hypothetically,if there is something that kept
them up at night aboutretirement, what that could be,
what a what do you guys hearfrom clients when they're
approaching us and we need andhelp structuring their
(01:22):
retirement?
Speaker 3 (01:23):
I think the first one is what the heck am I gonna do
with all this time?
Right, there's this fear andI've had this conversation.
My dad and I have had it Idon't know probably 30, 30
different times in the lastmonth and and he's, he's on that
verge of retiring, but he's andhe says to me, well, what am I
gonna do?
(01:44):
I was like I don't know, playgolf, find a hobby, start a
charity, like, do somethingright, identify what your
passion is.
But I think it goes back to youknow, you go to, you grow up,
you hit 18, you go to college.
Let's say it takes five yearsto go through college.
You're 23 when you get out andyou get a job and you work
(02:05):
full-time.
Nine to five, right, a lot ofpeople, for 40 years, 45 years,
right.
And so at the end of 45 yearsthat you get the proverbial
golden watch and they say Thankyou very much, like here's your
nine to five back, like, what doyou do?
So I think that's it'simportant to start building
(02:26):
hobbies or just identify,identifying what you'd like to
do outside of work, well beforeretirement, but but so that you
have something that you knowyou're gonna do in retirement.
I think the worst thing you cando is get to that point and
then stay in bed all day.
Speaker 2 (02:41):
Yeah, it's amazing how quick your mind and your
body deteriorate.
You know, and and I was talkingwith one of our clients who is
still working, but they'reapproaching retirement in the
next year or so and the owner oftheir company had sold the
business after you know, kind ofbuilding this family business
(03:02):
over the last 60, 70 years, andhe was in his mid 70s and, like,
he literally cashed out for abillion dollars, so money was
not an issue.
Right and Within about a yearand a half of selling the
business, his health massivelydeteriorated.
He had a stroke and ended uppassing away.
(03:24):
And I think the reality of thatis, for 50, 60 years, his whole
identity, his purpose, what gothim up in the morning was work,
right, it was building thiscompany, it was Continuing to do
all the things that he wasdoing and so like.
When he exited out of thecompany Even though, of course,
(03:48):
I think any of us would be quitehappy with a billion dollar
exit Um, he really lost thatidentity.
And so to your point, conrad, Ithink, as you're preparing for
or thinking about your ownretirement, it's not just about
the financial aspect of it, it'sabout what you're gonna do day
in and day out.
And you know, one of thephrases I always like to you
(04:11):
know kind of lead with is youknow, maybe it's not necessarily
Retirement, maybe you've nowjust earned to the right to have
a work, optional lifestyle, andso you know, there's a lot of
things like I know I asked mylike what would I do if I didn't
have to work, if I was in afinancial advisor doing this
stuff?
And like, hey, I might go workon a fishing charter for one or
(04:35):
two days a week or somethinglike that, just to keep me
moving and to keep me going.
And so I think you're so rightand kind of thinking about you
know what you're gonna do day inand day out.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Dave.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
I hope we don't find you on the TV show.
Deadly is catch.
Anytime soon, though, yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:52):
That's not really my style, but I'm more in the
sunshine on a nice calm day, notbattling the bearing sea and 30
foot waves, but, um, you know,I even just getting down to
hobbies.
You know, in a prior episode weinterviewed the pierces, great
clients of ours, who retiredearly, and you know their
passion was they took up sailingand that's obviously a very
(05:15):
physical and engaging activity,kind of sailing, navigating the
world, keeping your mind sharp.
You know Jane was sharing that,she was starting to learn
different languages.
Again, it doesn't mean you haveto necessarily go to work or
become a crabber out in thebearing sea, but it's just doing
stuff that's gonna occupy yourtime.
Keep your mental acuity, youknow, just just stay sharp.
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Right, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (05:40):
Yeah, and I know a couple people from the arts
field who they retire and theyget back into music or Crafting
or mosaic work and it's reallygreat to see all that that come
out.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
Yeah, 100%, 100%.
So what else what you know?
Obviously we can't prescribehow everybody needs to fill
their time.
I think you know the one thingto know is, when you do retire,
every day is a Saturday and so,to your point, you need to, you
know, have something to get outthere and do.
But what are some of the otherkind of fears or concerns that
(06:12):
you guys hear about?
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Yeah, I think I think kind of the, the next, I'll
call it one or two.
They really work togetherRunning out of money and
ultimately a lot of people lookat it as it's gonna cost me so
much for health insurance orhealth care.
I'm there's a fear of runningout of money because of that.
Right and and so I hear that allthe time.
(06:34):
In fact, I met with a clientjust just about a week ago and
Even though we showed himthere's a plan that he can
retire today and granted, wedon't want any major major
issues to occur, but we laid outa plan that gets him to to a
hundred and five and he stilllooked at me and said I have
(06:55):
this fear of running out ofmoney and so unpacking that and
understanding, you know, I think, when we, when we had that long
talk, ultimately laying out thebucket plan helped ease that
fear.
But again, if you have thatfear and you've built up that
assumption, every little thingis gonna cause some, some unease
(07:15):
, and so understanding orstarting early To identify some
of those pain points or some ofthose fears, I think gives you
more time to to alleviate thosejust through a process like the
bucket plan or leveraging anadvisor.
Speaker 2 (07:31):
Yeah, definitely.
I mean, if you think aboutrunning out of money, one of the
the the biggest issues goinginto retirement that that kind
of paralyzes people from living,you know, their dream
retirement and kind of gettingthe fulfillment out of
retirement that they deserve isthat they live what I call this
what if retirement?
Right, they're actually scaredto spend their money in
(07:56):
Retirement because of all thewhat ifs.
What if I do live till ahundred?
What if I have a big healthcare event later on in life?
And so you know that's a bigpart of being prepared and
having a plan.
Like, none of us know exactlyhow long we're gonna live.
None of us know if we're gonnahave a catastrophic extended
(08:19):
care event in retirement.
But you could have a plan inplace and that could mitigate
some of those risks.
I'll give you two examples.
Like If you are so fearfulabout running out of money in
retirement, there are ways thatyou could structure your
(08:40):
retirement assets to provideGuaranteed lifetime income.
Right, it's called an annuityoffered by an insurance company.
Now we know for many of us,when we retire we're gonna have
social security.
That's a form of guaranteedlifetime annuity.
Social security is gonna payUntil the day we pass away.
(09:04):
Maybe some people are fortunateenough to have a pension.
A pension is guaranteedlifetime Income that's gonna pay
out for as long as you're alive.
And what's quite interesting is, of all the people that I've
been able to help retire overthe years, the ones who seem to
(09:24):
be the happiest are the ones whohave the highest amounts of
Guaranteed lifetime income.
Right, it's maybe the theperson that worked for the
government or the school teacherthat is now retired and they
have a huge amount of guaranteedlifetime income because they
don't have to worry about, well,what happens if the stock
(09:46):
market crashes 20 or 30 percent.
They know exactly what theyhave, what they can spend, and
they can go consume that money.
They can travel, they can takethe trips.
They don't live that what ifretirement?
And so one of the things thatsomebody could do if they truly
are scared of running out Ofmoney is they can buy an annuity
(10:08):
.
Now I hear from people onoccasion that will say well,
I've heard annuities have abunch of costs associated with
them, or if I die Early, theinsurance company keeps all the
money, and there are certainannuities that are higher in
cost.
Maybe they have more benefits.
(10:28):
There are annuities that, ifyou pass away, the insurance
company keeps all the money.
But there's also annuities thatcould pay you a lifetime income
and, if you were to pass away,your beneficiaries Receive the
entire balance.
There's just a trade-off, andso you know, what I always share
is what you need to evaluateand Conrad to your point earlier
(10:50):
of working with a financialprofessional or somebody on our
team, for example is what arethe trade-offs like?
What are you gaining by puttingmoney into a lifetime Income
annuity and what are you losingby putting money into the
lifetime income annuity?
Maybe you're gaining the peaceof mind that you know all of
your basic living expenses aregoing to be met For as long as
(11:15):
you're alive, whether you livetill 80, 90, 100 or 120.
But on the flip side, maybeyou're trading off some of the
upside that the stock marketcould have brought about if we
continue to be in a bull market.
But that's a very personaldecision that somebody needs to
(11:36):
kind of just weigh the pros andthe cons in the trade-offs
associated with Something likethat.
But I just kind of want toconclude by saying, like, if
that is something that is a bigConcern of yours, if that's
something that's keeping you upat night running out of money,
for example in retirement.
There are solutions that youcould put in place that
(11:59):
completely eliminate thatconcern, absolutely so.
The other one you mentioned ishealth care.
Um, yeah, health care.
Certainly.
I know you and I and David werejust talking about this for a
client this morning that youknow they they're kind of fed up
, they don't want to workanymore, they're going to be
retiring, they're going to beturning 64 this year and, as we
(12:22):
know, medicare does not kick inuntil you're 65.
So medicare is health insurancethat's available for
individuals who are retired.
It covers, you know, part a isyour general hospitalization if
you're in the hospital.
Medicare part b Generallycovers, like your doctors and
(12:43):
things like that.
And then typically a retireehas to buy a medicare supplement
or a a gap policy to cover allof the rest.
And Once somebody turns age 65,medicare is quite reasonably
priced.
But until then, if you're notcovered by employer health care,
(13:04):
it can be quite expensive,right, guys?
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
I mean, think about it right.
We, a lot of times we have whatwe don't even realize is a
large subsidy coming from ouremployer.
Well then you know, great, youcan extend your coverage for 18
months through Cobra, but youpick up the full cost when you
look at your W-2 at the end ofthe year.
You can go down and see whatthe cost of employer-paid health
(13:31):
insurance is, and a lot oftimes that's $15,000, $20,000
that now you're going to have toplan for in terms of that gap
to get into Medicare.
So you know, and understandingwhat the options are, a lot of
people think I can only get itfrom my employer.
Well, you know, there are waysto get it outside of your
employer.
(13:51):
The Affordable Care Act openedup the exchange for people that
can go and get an individualhealth policy as well.
So there are options out there.
Understanding the cost is adifferent story, right, and
really planning for that gapfrom a cash flow need.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
I want to talk about kind of tax and income planning,
david, with you on that forkind of health insurance,
because I know you've helped alot of our clients navigate this
.
But before we do that, I meanthe baseline is, if you know
you're going to be retiringearly let's say I'm able to
retire at 63, and I know I'mgoing to have a two-year gap
(14:30):
until I'm eligible for MedicareWell, we want to make sure we do
is have airmarked in yourfinancial plan a healthcare
bridge.
And so if we know yourmarketplace, health coverage is
going to be $20,000 a year outof pocket and we know that
there's going to be, let's say,three years before Medicare
(14:53):
kicks on, we're going to want tomake sure we have about $60,000
allocated in that soon bucketto be able to make sure we have
the cash flow to pay yourpremiums for that health
insurance in your financial plan.
And so, again, medicare andbuilding that bridge, or medical
(15:15):
insurance planning and buildingthat bridge is really, really
important to think about.
And honestly, I hear fromclients all the time I want to
go ahead and retire early, whichis great, and they neglect to
think about those high costs ofhealth insurance and then
sometimes that prohibits themfrom actually doing it.
(15:36):
But, conrad, you mentionedearlier ACA and the marketplace.
That's essentially wheresomebody would go for private
health insurance, right?
If they're not covered undertheir company plan and they're
not eligible for Medicare.
At this point, david, talk alittle bit about for our clients
that have retired early, thecost of coverage is dependent on
(16:01):
your income, right?
Speaker 1 (16:03):
Yeah, and it's exactly what you said.
The cost of the coverage isgoing to be dependent on your
income and the way it is isyou're going to get a subsidy
for your health insurancecoverage, but the maximum that
you should pay is going to be8.5% of your adjusted gross
(16:23):
income.
So, again for simple numbers,if you make $100,000, your
health insurance should bearound $8,500.
And it could go up if yourincome goes increases or again,
if your income goes down, theamount could decrease.
But just to give a real lifeexample, what we see, even with
(16:43):
some of our higher net worthclients, in the years that they
are transitioning to retirementthey don't have an income, so
their AGI could substantiallydrop.
They could be making asubstantial amount, but then in
the year of retirement theycould be making under $100,000
just because, again, theincome's not there.
So it's always something toconsider and look at if it makes
(17:07):
sense to go to the marketplacefor a plan.
Speaker 2 (17:10):
Yeah, and just a couple examples of that.
To think through strategicallyhow you might be able to reduce
the cost of your health care ifyou do retire early is having
tax diversification of yourassets.
So, for example, if you spentyour entire career saving in a
pre-tax 401k or IRA or 403B aqualified retirement plan and
(17:36):
then let's say you're fortunateenough to be able to retire at
age 62, and there's going to bethat three-year period before
you're eligible for Medicare,we're going to have to secure
your health insurance throughthe marketplace.
Now, if we have to take all ofyour supplemental retirement
(17:56):
income out of a pre-taxretirement account like an IRA
or 401k, that's all going to betaxable income to you as we're
taking those distributions.
But if you were able tostrategically accumulate some
non-qualified or after-tax moneyin a brokerage account or a
(18:18):
trust account or some Roth IRAmoney, then in those early years
we might be able to take yourincome out of those after-tax or
tax-free sources whichultimately would substantially
bring down your AGI, which wouldsubstantially bring down your
(18:39):
cost of health insurance.
And so one of the things thatwe really look deep on is, if
you're going to be retiringbefore age 65, we want to figure
out how to build the mosttax-efficient retirement income
distribution plan for you.
And that's not just incometaxes Income taxes are certainly
a big component of it but it'salso looking at the big picture
(19:03):
of these things like healthcare,and it's again where our
approach is very different thana lot of other financial
advisors out there and how wefocus on holistic wealth
management.
It's not just managing yourportfolio for the greatest
investment rate of return.
It's not just managing yourincome to try to minimize taxes.
It's looking at how all ofthese things work together
(19:26):
because, again, every dollar wecan save you for healthcare
costs could be a dollar that youcan go spend on an extra
vacation or taking the grandkidsout to dinner.
So again, this is kind of wherehaving a team of experts like
we are coming together to lookat all of these different areas
could make a big impact.
Now, conrad, you work with aton of business owners.
(19:49):
So let's say that one of thetwo spouses is going to retire
early, but the other spousemaybe still has some part-time
self-employment income, maybelike a Schedule C type of
business.
Are there any things that wecould potentially think about
(20:10):
from a tax savings perspectiveor securing health insurance for
the family, knowing that one ofthem has a business.
Speaker 3 (20:21):
Absolutely.
Yeah, there's a number ofdifferent options here, you know
.
The one that really comes tomind is pretty simple.
Let's say we have a businessowner that has you know, they're
a single member LLC.
They report their income on aschedule C on their personal
return.
We have the ability to reallyput that person as the primary
(20:45):
on an insurance policy, and evencovering the spouse will
qualify and that actuallyqualifies for the self-employed
health insurance deduction,which is different than your
health insurance itemizeddeduction.
Now, the difference between thetwo is pretty distinct.
Self-employed health insurancededuction is actually treated as
(21:08):
an adjustment to your income.
It's technically an above theline deduction.
That means if you have $100,000of income in $10,000 of
self-employed health insurancededuction, your AGI is $90,000.
On the flip side, if you haveto do that through your W-2
employer, those costs areactually subject to itemized
(21:30):
deduction limitations.
Right?
So you have a number of tiersthat you have to hit.
Currently, if you don't spendmore than 7.5% of your adjusted
gross income on health andrelated expenses, you get no
benefit from.
Speaker 2 (21:46):
Right.
We hardly see tax returnsanymore where people are
actually getting itemizeddeduction write-offs for health
insurance because that hurdle isso high.
But to your point, if you'reself-employed, that hurdle kind
of goes away Absolutely.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Absolutely.
Yeah, I mean to put it mildly.
Right, I had a baby and I alsohad shoulder surgery this past
year and I still didn't meetthat qualification Right.
So all of those thingshappening one year, I still
didn't qualify for the itemizeddeduction portion.
(22:21):
So the other options wouldinclude some different
structures, right?
So structurally your businessmust change.
But you could create what'scalled a health reimbursement
arrangement or a qualifiedself-employment health
reimbursement arrangement.
I know that's a mouthful, butthe long and short of it is, if
(22:42):
you have somebody that you hire,including a family member, that
then is the primary on aninsurance policy, you can
reimburse up to certain limitsof that policy without having
that be taxable to the recipient.
But it is technically adeduction for the business, so
it's treated much like theself-employed health insurance
(23:02):
deduction, meaning it reducesthe income.
It just does it on the frontend for the business as well.
So there are some options therefor business owners outside of
normal routes that you could go,but those are two really good,
easy ones that most, if not all,business owners should be
(23:23):
taking advantage of today.
Speaker 2 (23:25):
Yeah, the HRA is such a great option and just such a
great way to kind of structuresome savings.
So, again, all of this beingsaid is, the purpose of this is
that if you are going to havethese larger new expenses it
could be health insurance, itcould be additional
out-of-pocket health care coststhere's ways to think about and
(23:46):
structure it.
Whether you're a business ownerand maybe we can classify some
of those as qualified businessexpenses to save some money on
taxes or whether you're just atraditional retiree, maybe
there's ways we can think abouthow to construct your retirement
income to maximize the benefitsyou get through the health care
(24:09):
marketplace and what yourout-of-pocket expenses are.
But either way, there's optionsto take a look at.
And then, last but not least,when we talk about health care
is hopefully much later on inlife, there's a chance that you
have some sort of extended careevent, long-term care, the
(24:31):
things that even once you are onMedicare, medicare does not
cover.
Medicare doesn't cover thenursing home.
Nobody wants to go into anursing home.
Most of us would want to beable to have an extended care
event in our own house, wheremaybe we have to have a nurse
come out to the house to providea specialized care.
(24:52):
Medicare doesn't cover that.
And so, again, a lot of peoplethink about long-term care
insurance.
And many people are scared toeven think about long-term care
insurance because they've heardhow expensive it could be.
And don't get me wrong, itcould be expensive.
But you have to ask yourselfwhat's the greater expense of
(25:18):
paying the premium for along-term care policy or paying
all of the cost of care out ofpocket if you do have that
extended care event.
And so, again, it's justweighing the tradeoffs and
seeing what your personalsituation could look like when
you think about how to cover thecost of that care.
(25:41):
And again, with long-term care,I think a lot of people have
shied away from looking into itbecause they say, yeah, but what
if I never need it?
What if I never go into anursing home?
What if I never have anextended care event?
Now, I paid all those years inand if I don't use it, I lose it
, I die in my sleep, I have aheart attack and I never need
(26:02):
long-term care.
I wasted all that money.
And so there's also policiesavailable these days where, if
you don't use it, that moneygets returned back to your
family.
So just some things to thinkabout when it comes to health
care planning, whether it's onthe front end of Medicare having
to get private marketplaceinsurance or whether it's on the
(26:25):
backside of things thatMedicare doesn't cover.
Dr Justin, Marchegiani.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Absolutely, dr Justin Marchegiani.
Yes, dr Justin Marchegiani.
Yeah, dr Justin Marchegiani.
Speaker 2 (26:31):
So let's kinda you know, shift to.
One of the other big things wehear about quite frequently from
people getting ready to retireis how do I turn my assets into
income right, like I've got toage 65 or 67 or 62 or shoot?
We've had clients at 49 thathave been fortunate enough to be
(26:54):
able to retire, but they've,they're now getting ready to
retire and they have theirnumber a million dollars, three
million dollars, 10 milliondollars, whatever that number is
, it's basically a pile of cash.
It's not just cash, but it'scash.
It's stocks, it's bonds, it'smutual funds, it's ETFs, it's
(27:14):
401k money.
How do they actually go aboutstarting to turn these assets
into an income stream that theycan go and use to buy their
groceries?
Speaker 3 (27:25):
Dr Justin Marchegiani , yeah, Dr Justin Marchegiani,
dave, I so in full disclosure.
I saw this article onKipplergercom and I spread this
one and from the top of my lungsI was screaming the soon bucket
, the soon bucket, the soonbucket, right.
And this is just.
You couldn't have teed it upany better to talk about why the
(27:46):
soon bucket is so important forretirees, for accumulators,
really for everyone, but really,in this context, for retirees.
You know they go into thearticle talking about the
sequence of returns risk.
And for those that don't knowabout the sequence of returns
risk, it's, in short, right, ifyou have, you know, some early
(28:10):
let's call it 10-year trackrecord, and the early years you
have positive returns, middleyears are neutral and last years
are negative.
If you take that sequence andflip it and have zero
distributions, you end up withthe same result after 10 years.
But when you add indistributions, the years that
(28:31):
you start with positive returns,you have a positive number.
At the end of that 10 years,the years that you start with
negative returns, there's amajor, major difference and
oftentimes it could be closer tozero than anybody wants.
And so what we look at is thesoon bucket.
Is really that in between,where this is the the portion of
(28:51):
assets are slowing down.
Right, we don't you don't go ona highway trip and take an
immediate right off theinterstate.
No, we need an off-ramp.
Right, and this is treated asthat off-ramp where we take a
portion of assets and say weneed to really retain these and
protect these so that they canprovide income in the early
years of retirement.
(29:12):
So the assets that arecontinuing to grow, that may
experience volatility, have timeto rebuild and continue to grow
.
Right?
The average 9% return of S&Pdoesn't mean it's 9% every year.
It just means that the averageover time equals 9%, right?
Speaker 2 (29:30):
Yeah, if it was 9% every year, it'd be quite easy
to develop a retirement incomeplan right, get 9%, and as long
as you spend some number under9%, you're in good shape.
But the problem is that ifyou're spending 7% of your money
and the stock market goes down20% now you're burning the
(29:51):
candle at both ends and that'sgoing to cause you to deplete
your account balances a lotquicker.
And so when we think aboutbuilding a retirement income
distribution plan, when we thinkabout taking this pile of money
and creating cash flow, there'sthree ways you can do it, and
(30:11):
there's only three ways you cando it, and not every way is
right for every single person.
It depends on what type ofretirement you want.
The first way is theconventional way I think a lot
of people have historicallythought about retirement, which
is they live off of the yield oftheir portfolio.
(30:33):
So let's say I have a milliondollars of retirement assets.
I don't want to see my milliondollars get eaten into, I just
want to live off of the gains.
And so let's say that myportfolio can generate 3.5% per
(30:54):
year of dividends and interest.
Well, that tells me I couldlive off of $35,000 from that
million dollar portfolio.
Now the reality of it is mostpeople don't have enough money
saved up to be able to just liveon dividends and interest,
(31:14):
right Like for somebody that isamassed a million dollars of
retirement assets 35 grand mightnot be enough.
Now you could make the argumentthat in some years there's also
going to be capitalappreciation.
So if the interest or theincome off of that portfolio is
(31:34):
3.5%, maybe the market goes upanother 5% and you can peel off
some capital gains too.
But as we all know, when you'reinvested in things like stocks,
they are going to generallypick off dividend income.
Hopefully there's going to becapital appreciation, but what
(31:55):
else could happen in any givenyear to that stock portfolio?
Speaker 4 (31:58):
They could go down.
Speaker 2 (31:59):
They could go down right.
And again they can lose valueand so there's no guarantees
that we can pull off capitalappreciation.
And I know for a lot of ourclients and David, I know you
know we've talked about this inmany meetings with clients is
they don't want to have tosacrifice their lifestyle in any
(32:20):
given year just because thestock market is down.
Like David, if we called someof our clients and said, hey, I
know you were thinking abouttaking that phenomenal trip to
Europe this year, but themarket's down, can you guys, you
know, take a road trip to thePanhandle in Florida instead?
Like I don't think they'd bevery happy with us.
Speaker 1 (32:40):
No, that would not be ideal, so again.
Speaker 2 (32:43):
You know thinking about generating portfolio
income.
Of course the yield approach isone way to do it.
And we have some clients, youknow, they have 10, 15, 20, 30
million dollars and, quitehonestly, they can live off of
dividends and interest fromtheir portfolio.
But for most people out there,they need to not only consume
(33:05):
the yield but they are going tohave to tap into some principle
also.
Other clients also.
They don't want to just live oninterest, they want to tap into
their principle because they'renot worried about dying with
this big benefit for theirbeneficiaries, right, they want
to consume this money and enjoyit for themselves.
(33:27):
And so the other way is toestablish what we call a
drawdown approach, where we'redrawing down both principle and
interest in earning.
And so, Conrad, this is thatconcept that you mentioned of
like establishing a soon bucket.
So if we were designing a planfor a client and we determined
(33:52):
that, outside of their socialsecurity, they were going to
need another $65,000 a year tolive off of, so let's say their
social security is 40 grand,they need another $65,000.
That gets them to about$105,000 a year of total
retirement income.
In that soon bucket, David,about how much would we want to
(34:17):
think about putting in somethingthat's going to be invested for
growth to help offset inflationit's just invested
conservatively so that it cangenerate that reliable income
and kind of that drawdown phaseLike if you had maybe a more
aggressive investor about howmuch would be in that soon
bucket, or if you had a moreconservative investor, how much
(34:40):
might be in that soon bucket ifthey needed around 65 grand a
year to tap into their assets.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Yeah, and again it's going to depend.
We've been talking withdifferent clients and they have
different appetites for how muchthey want to put in their soon
bucket.
But if you're on the moreconservative side, you might
want to load that up for a10-year time horizon.
So if it's $65,000 a year youneed, you might need $650,000 to
fill that gap just to get youthrough those 10 years.
(35:09):
And that's not even accountingfor inflation or anything else.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
So $650,000 there and that basically would say, all
right, we've pretty much secureda 10-15 year time horizon in
your soon bucket Because, again,that $650,000 is going to be
invested for growth.
It's going to earn money overthat 10-15 year time period and
what that does is it allows usto take $65,000 a year out every
(35:37):
year to go spend without havingto worry about really what's
going on in the stock market.
Now, let's say, a client had$1.65 million of total assets.
If they have $650,000 in thesoon bucket and we're drawing
that down, that means they haveanother million out in the later
bucket for long-term growth andeventually, maybe 10, 15, 16
(36:02):
years into the future, that soonbucket is going to be depleting
down.
But what are we going to do,conrad?
Speaker 3 (36:12):
Well, I mean and this is where, when you have good
years, right, let's think aboutthat example of sequence of
returns when the market is up,let's harvest those gains and
move them into the soon bucket.
Right.
When the market is down, let'slet the market come back right,
let's let the portfolio rebuildand get into a positive position
(36:34):
.
That by giving us 10 years, wehave a time horizon.
We can actually now for theproverbial time in the market.
Right, we're just timing it,not for top-end growth or
bottom-end buying.
It's opportunistic when we movefunds from a higher growth
portfolio to a more income-styleportfolio.
Speaker 2 (36:56):
Exactly.
You know, I like to go to Vegasevery year ago with one of our
clients, as you guys know, andthe way I like to think about it
is like if I'm sitting at theblackjack table gambling and I
win a bunch of money, I takewhat I started with off the
table and I put it in my pocketand now I'm just playing with
house money and I think of thebucket plan kind of very
(37:17):
similarly.
It's like let's take our incomemoney off the table from
massive stock market risk sothat again we can have a
reliable, sustainable incomestream that later bucket.
We're going to be kind ofbetting on the long-term growth
of the stock market.
It's going to have its ups anddowns, but when we find that
(37:40):
we've gone through a winningstreak maybe, like we have the
last 10 years we want to peeloff some gains and reload our
soon bucket back up.
And so what's really uniqueabout this philosophy and
strategy is it can really betailored to the individual.
So I was just emailing and youguys were both on the email
chain with one of our clientslast night and over the last
(38:03):
couple of days.
He's getting ready to retire.
They are fortunate enough tohave a very large pension.
They will also have socialsecurity, so right out of the
gate they're going to have$100,000 to $150,000 a year of
guaranteed income, on top of allof the retirement assets that
(38:25):
they've built up, which areseveral millions of dollars as
well.
And so in their situation hehas much more of an appetite to
keep more of his money in thelater bucket.
He only wants about three tofour years in the soon bucket,
basically to be able to providehis supplemental income in any
(38:45):
big years that the market isdown.
But again, his appetite forgrowth is much greater than
maybe somebody else who doesn'thave that same kind of mentality
of wanting more of their moneyout in the later bucket and less
having reliability andguarantees in the soon bucket.
(39:06):
And again, it's maybe a lotbecause he already has such a
large source of guaranteedlifetime income via that
$150,000 pension and socialsecurity.
Speaker 3 (39:22):
Right, and that reminds me, circling back to
what we talked about earlier.
You mentioned creating anincome stream, you know, through
the utilization of, potentially, an annuity, and maybe this is
where understanding how thatcould fit and guarantee an
income.
maybe you have less of yourportfolio in the soon bucket
(39:43):
because that's in place, right?
It doesn't have to be a pension, it could be some other vehicle
, but I think that's thetailoring it to each and every
client and understanding themoving parts and how they work
together is that, in my opinion,the true power of the bucket
plan and really the true powerof how we serve clients.
Speaker 2 (40:04):
It is.
I just kind of to recap.
I mentioned there's three waysto generate retirement income.
One is the portfolio yield.
Unless you're ultra high networth, that's probably not going
to be the only solution for you.
The other approach is adrawdown solution, where we're
doing something like three, four, five, 10 years worth of income
(40:28):
in that soon bucket and we'redrawing it down.
The last one is lifetime income.
This is where you are turningover a lump sum of your
retirement assets to aninsurance company.
You're purchasing an annuitythat is contractually going to
give you, or you and your spouse, a lifetime guaranteed income
(40:51):
stream.
For example, let's say that I'm65 years old and my spouse is
65 years old and I give theinsurance company $100,000, I
might get back $6,000 a year ofguaranteed income for as long as
I'm alive.
Now you could do the simplemath and say okay, I gave them
(41:14):
$100,000, they're going to giveme back $6,000 a year If I live
20 years, that's $120,000 that Igot back.
I gave them $100,000, I getback $120,000.
That's if I were to live tillage 85, one of the two of us.
What if I live till 95?
(41:37):
Now I get $6,000 a year for 30years.
My internal rate of return justwent up.
Your internal rate of return ona lifetime income annuity is
determined by you how long youlive it really protects and is
that longevity insurance.
What we've seen with manyclients is that we all go
(42:01):
through three phases ofretirement.
We go through what I call thego-go years, the slo-go years
and the no-go years.
I have a little section of thison our website under retirement
, the go-go years are when we'reyounger, we're healthy, we can
(42:21):
be active and we want to gospend more of our retirement
assets.
Let's say I'm retiring at 65,I'm probably going to be more
active from 65 to 75 than I willbe from 75 to 85, and certainly
from 85 to 95.
That's those go-go years,slo-go years and no-go years.
(42:46):
Maybe I realize I need $40,000 ayear on top of my social
security just for my basicstandard of living, whether I'm
in the go-go years, the slo-goyears or the no-go years.
Maybe we purchase an annuity toguarantee $40,000 a year On top
(43:11):
of that.
Maybe I actually want $100,000a year during my go-go years.
That other $60,000 in additionto my annuity income is going to
come from my portfolio.
Maybe I get to my slo-go yearsand now I don't need $100,000
because I'm not traveling allover the world as much Now.
(43:34):
Maybe.
I only need $75,000.
So $40,000 is coming from myguaranteed annuity.
The other $35,000 is comingfrom my portfolio.
And then, last but not least,we enter our no-go years and I
have my $40,000 guaranteedincome annuity.
I have my social security, andthen we're just supplementing
(43:55):
anything above and beyond thatfrom the portfolio that we need,
and so that's one great way tokind of think about these life
phases of retirement and how tostructure a retirement income
distribution plan that couldalign with your goals and
objectives.
I love it.
(44:15):
Well, I think that gives us agood place.
Again, I know this is stuff wedo all day long.
I mean, one of the things thatI love about retirement income
planning is that there are notwo identical plans.
Everybody's retirement is alittle bit different.
Right, you might have anapproach where you want to die
with zero.
When your family writes thatcheck to the funeral home, it
(44:38):
bounces.
You want to spend every dollaryou have enjoying retirement.
Maybe your retirement plan isyou want to be able to enjoy as
much as you can, but you alsohave a legacy planning intent.
You want to be able to leavethe kids and grandkids some
money behind.
Maybe you've accumulated abunch of money in your primary
(44:59):
house, in your real estate, andyou need to figure out how to
tap into that housing wealth tobe able to support your
retirement.
There's just so many differentthings to think about and I
think our perspective, as always, is to educate, to be able to
share tradeoffs associated withall these decisions and really
to craft a customized retirementincome plan that meets your
(45:23):
goals and objectives.
And I know you guys do such agreat job at that with our
clients also.
So any closing comments on justconcerns or priorities people
have as they go into retirementConrad or David.
Speaker 3 (45:37):
Yeah, I think you know and I'll sing this from the
rooftops till the day I die thesooner you start, the less fear
you're going to feel at thetime that you retire.
Right, and I say that for myclients that are in their 20s
right, start saving now.
Clients that are in their 30sand 40s, start saving now, start
(45:58):
planning now.
And certainly, in talking aboutthis stuff, the sooner we can
start, the better off we'll allbe.
But leveraging help right, justfind somebody you trust, come
up with a plan that worked foryou, identify the things that
you really like and don't likeand get a plan in place.
Speaker 1 (46:21):
Yeah, and I would say just to add to that you know
we're talking about things thatpeople are fearful about in
retirement, one thing you alwayswant to look at are these fears
real or are they not?
And that's why it's importantto work with a professional,
because all these things thatwe're talking about, we've seen
clients who are very fearful andthey're scared of it.
Some of them it's not real.
(46:43):
Some of it they're completelyfine.
Others we have to have a quitefrank talk and say, no, this is
a problem.
And so that's why it isimportant to work with a
professional, because whilewe're saying these are fears,
these are fears and things thatmight actually become an issue
if your situation is such thatyou don't have enough funds.
(47:07):
But if you do, you can model itout, you can ease your mind as
long as you're working withsomebody and you have a good
plan.
Speaker 2 (47:15):
Yeah, that's great.
Planning is key with I meanthink about you.
Most people spend more timeplanning their annual vacation
than they do their retirement,and so this is what we're here
for.
Hopefully you found thisepisode helpful.
If you have any questions,please reach out to us and
appreciate your time joining us.
David and Conrad, thanks forhaving us.
Speaker 4 (47:37):
Thanks for having us.
Financial planning and advisoryservices are offered through
Prosperity Capital Advisor PCA,an SEC registered investment
advisor with its principal placeof business in the state of
Ohio.
Allison Wealth Management andPCA are separate, non-affiliated
entities.
Pca does not provide tax orlegal advice.
Insurance and tax servicesoffered through Allison Wealth
(47:58):
Management are not affiliatedwith PCA.
Information received from thisvideo should not be viewed as
individual investment advice.
Content may have been createdby a third party and was not
written or created by a PCAaffiliated advisor and does not
represent the views and opinionsof PCA or its subsidiary.
For information pertaining tothe registration status of PCA,
please contact the firm or referto the Investment Advisor
(48:20):
Public Disclosure website.
For additional informationabout PCA, including fees and
services, send for ourdisclosure statement as set
forth on Form ADB from PCA usingthe contact information here.
Please read the disclosurestatement carefully before you
invest or send money.
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