December 12, 2022 • 25 mins
It's a pleasure to introduce you to Max... actually, you might not need an introduction for this one, because you might already be familiar with Max, or his work...
During 9-5 he works in policy research, but it's what he does outside of these hours that he's really know for, so well known, Art recognised him the moment he stepped in studio.
Do you know Max? You might already know what he's concealing...
Check it out on the socials:
Instagram: instagram.com/concealedwithartsimone/
Tik Tok: tiktok.com/@concealedwithartsimone
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:08):
What are you something really weird or find out a
juicy little secret. Well, you've come to the right place. Hello,
it is me Art Simone. I have been scouring the
ends of the earth to find people who look painfully
ordinary and seem very regular, but at concealing something exciting,
scandalous or even a little bit naughty. But they're not
(00:29):
going to give up their secret that easily. No, I
have to do a bit of detective work to first
find out what it is. Trust me, it's worth all
of my hard work. This is concealed with me, Art Simone.
Time to meet our guess. Roll the tape.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Hello, I'm Max. I'm thirty six and I live in Melbourne.
My working career is in policy and research, and I
do a lot of consultancy, writing and advocacy on really
nerdy stuff that I'm very passionate about, which is very
different to the other work that I'm probably more well
known for.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Hello, Ah, well I know Max. Well, I know you Max,
So this hasn't happened before I have normally this is
a blind date, all right, But this is a wonderful
reveal for me because I know I recognize you.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Done, Yes, I recognize you.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
I've known you for many a year or slash known
of you. I'm very appreciative of your work in the world.
Thank you. You know it's very aspirational. I don't want
to make you feel bad, but sometimes you make me
feel like I'm quite lazy, which is quite sad because
I'm just juggling a lot of Please. I know it's
a lot of work. It's a lot of work, and
you know, I don't know how you do it. I
(01:54):
actually know what you're concealing, and I have a pretty
good idea of what you're going to reveal. But I'm
not the only one who gets to play this game.
So I'm going to continue as usual and ask you
three questions and see if you listening right now. Yes,
you can figure it out far away. Do you collect anything? Yeah, yes,
I do dust. I collect really nerdy things.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
I have an extensive like board game and Dungeons and Dragons.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
You're part of the Dungeons Crew, Yeah, I am. Okay.
What is your character?
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Oh god, I have a few, but my favorite one
by far is this fantastical druid so like nature magic
person called Kitten, and he's one hundred and twenty.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Years old and he's a big himbo and I love
him very himbo. A himbo is like a masculine bimbo.
So like that just so.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Many times over the years, and I was like, I
don't know what that is, and I just kept scrolling.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah, no thoughts, just that, oh himbo, I call them
prawn Yeah yeah, works, Okay, So himbao is the proem.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
We're all learning things. Ye yeah, okay, that's beautiful. That's
really nice. Okay. And what is the last reality TV
show you binged?
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Oh, there's a lot in my repertoire, but I recently
binged Blown Away.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
It's a competition show, but it's super niche.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
They are professional glass blowers, so they're artists making these
beautiful little sculptures and things. So if you give me
with the glory yeah, yeah, yeah, glory every time there's
a gloryhole joke.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Yeah. After the first episide when they reveal that they
will call gloryholes, I just laughed.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
And now in subsequent seasons it comes up with like
gloryhole and a definition, and it's like, didn't.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Realize in the first season they were like, why is
your road laughing?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
What was going on?
Speaker 2 (03:47):
But they're very serious about their art, and it's very
serious art, and it's not even like putting a spin
on it. They say something like, and I just shove
it in the gloryhole.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
And it's like it's so good, so good. Okay. A
final question, do you have any tattoos?
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Yes, which I would say people would be aware of
considering my work.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
I've got two of.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
My thighs and one on my abdomen. They're not too exciting.
One's just a portrait of this man's head that Potato
artist is kind of known for. They're like a little
bit surrealist and sevador dally like the head flips open
and the stuff coming out.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
But it's pretty cool. I love it.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
Has that been coming out of your head?
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Yes, there's a hand coming out of it and a butterfly.
And then the other one that I really like is
this mythical again nerdy D and D stuff creature that
is like a stag with wings that is meant to
be like a bad fortune, bad omen but mine is
bright pink. So it's kind of like a little bit
(04:51):
more fun gay. Yeah, a lot more gay, a lot
more gay.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Okay. So to recap you, collecked board games and dungeon
and Biggs is things. Yes, beautiful, and your character is
a himbo and you like glory holes from blowing the bay. Yes,
and you have tattoos of a man's head and pink.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Gay things, pink gay things.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Okay, okay, And from that we need to guess what
you are concealing, what you do outside of your nine
to five I'm not going to guess because I already know,
so let's reveal it.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I am a porn performer. When I've had about fifteen releases,
I don't know. It's they all become a blur. I
know that sounds dumb, but they do become a bit
of a blur. But I have been doing that and
other forms of sex work for about a decade.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Now here we are with porn sum mags. I feel
like I'm finally actually going to talk to you now.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Okay, we have to talk around the porn.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
It's like when you see a mole you just want
to say, male, I just wanted to get when it
has come out of my man porn good say now
I feel so free, so free being censored, you know. Okay,
So we just have that Max has a nine to
five job which has something that I don't actually remember
(06:16):
the job of that. Yes, but Max is also a
porn star. Yes, a pond star is in my presence. Oh,
this is going to get interesting. Ah, So I'm here
(06:39):
world famous porn star Max is in my presence. But
I would like to clarify that's not how I know Max.
I know what maxes work, of course, but that's not
just how I know Max. We have many mutual friends. Okay,
that's that. That's bad to know Max for that. Wow,
I'm doing a whole. I can hear myself. I can
hear myself doing a hole right now. But also, who
gives a shit ified you from your work? It's a
(07:01):
bloody good stuff.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
A lot of people that's like how they know me,
and I like, I think it's interesting. People always like
oh and they get a bit timid about it. But like,
I don't do porn for people not to watch it.
So right, it's very too. So it's it's okay that
you know me from my pawn. Everyone, it's okay. They
probably never heard you speak so much. No, no, absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Probably have a very limited who are yes, yeah, more
if you run into something the look you have a
familiar face if you just go they got that sit
that's it.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
That's where I know.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
I yeah, I have had It's happened quite a few
times where like someone recognizes me and like I am
a bit coy. And I also like, if it's in
a group setting, I don't want to be like I've
done porn.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
You've probably watched.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
It, but instead I just a'm like, oh, oh, you know,
I like I get around. You may have seen me
here and there, and eventually the penny drops and you
can tell they they blush or they lose their words
mid sentence, which is kind of adorable when that happens.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yes, yes, me and pretty fun.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
And look at that.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
It's better than the alternative than like someone interrupting and
being like I've seen your porn and I'm like sitting
there having dinner with my parents or something like that.
Both sound fun, tod like they know they're super supportive,
Like I'm very fortunate as a porn star and as
a sex worker to have that support. Not everyone has that,
but I think you know, if you're having brunch, don't
run up to a porn start and be like you
do porn. I mean, I can already pull so many
(08:28):
comparisons change you and me, right, we're both very well
known for our work. It's just slightly different, ever, so
slightly different, I know, just a little bit. I have
to work with others.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
You do too.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
Yeah, we both play well with others.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Yes. I also have to do solo works. You do too.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Yeah, all the time.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
The big difference probably is the amount of clothing that
we're wearing. Yes, yes, but also you have to do
things that I don't have to, like I don't know,
a bit more upkeep.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
A little bit more upkeep. But it's both performance. I
get perform. Yeah, we're both performers.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yes, it terminology in the porn world.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
That is correct that you are. You're a performer. I
never say porn star myself. I'm happy when others do.
But if I think that's the Australian tall poppy thing
of having tickets on yourself, I would never be like
I'm a pool and star, yeah, whereas other people do
when they're comfortable with that. But I think just with
porn and sex work and stuff in general, it is
(09:23):
sometimes stepping into a role or a persona that you're
really well recognized for that is also different to how
you are in your personal life too, and striking a
balance between that is really important. But I think a
lot of performers outside of porn also need to strike
that balance as well.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
So let's go all the way back. I've got a
lot of questions to you, but let's go back. How
did you get into the porn world.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Well, it was pretty organic and natural because.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
I was.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
I'm so sorry, you were baiting by light w making
stupid dad jokes all the time. Please do not be offended,
but they just come out. I can't hold them back.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Yes, sorry, I mean, look, everything's going to go back
to Gloriahole. But the I think for me, it was
like naturally. I did life modeling for years, so that's
like you know, modeling. I was an artist myself, so
I went to art school and I just got distracted
by the real world and then you know, the grind of.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Making money, stop doing stop it. And then when I
was a student, I started doing life modeling. It pays
really well.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
I had photos and stuff of myself kind of go viral.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
At what point in your life did you look in
the mirror and go, yeah, it's pretty good.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Yeah, that's still a process, that's a work in progress.
But there is one photo that a friend of mine
took of me, maybe like five or six years ago now,
and it changed the perception that I saw of myself.
I'd done a lot of really cool work until then.
It's like a life modeling photo. I'm completely naked, I
look completely amazing. I was vegan at the time and
(11:03):
very hungry, so I'm really ripped and it's this amazing
black and white photo and I was like.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Oh, I'm actually really hard.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
Yeah, I'm pretty hard.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Yeah, And it changed my perception of myself because you know,
people compliment you all the time. You're beautiful, You're gorgeous,
things like that, and like, in reality, maybe it's because
I was like a really unpopular kid and I took
a while to grow into my looks.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
But it's something that you have no control over.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
So I'm always being a person that's I guess being
more concerned with like being clever or being kind or
being personal to people. So when people only compliment you
on your looks, it's like, ah, thanks. Like it's hard
to process, but that photo made me be like, oh fuck, yeah,
you could do this.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
I do want to touch on body image for a second. Yeah,
because I feel like we have parallels that I know
a lot of people that adjacent to the industry and
that look like the most beautiful adonuses you've ever seen
in your life, but they have like the biggest self
body image issues, like and it's so funny because it's
like the same thing for me as.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
A drag queen.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
That's why I like cover myself with so much stuff.
That's so I'm covered in glitter and dimontes and lashes
and anything to be discuring. Literally, I'm excuring what people
can see because like I'm just like, well, I'm not
sure about that what's underneath, but at least I can
make you see what I want to. So it's very
interesting to see the parallels.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Yeah, and I think coming from like life modeling and
stuff like that, I didn't have a very negative view
of my body ever, which is interesting that porn and
performing and stuff, you have to look a certain way,
you have to go to the gym a lot, you
have to be watching what you eat, which is the
bit I hate. I don't mind working out, I don't
mind all of that activity. I just I really hate
(12:46):
saying no to food. I love food, and it is
it's really good. Particularly I have a sweet tooth, so
I'm like, if there's cake on offer, my like my
pupils expand and I hone in on the cake, like
just need it, doesn't need it. But yeah, I think
for me, porn scrutinized my body image a little bit
(13:07):
and put me in a headspace that I wasn't used to.
I wasn't used to seeing myself so much and having
to look a certain way to be on film. So
even though porn gets a bad rap for like perpetuating
body image stuff, it is also still what people buy
and consume, and there are a lot of negative comments
when performers don't look a certain way. So I don't
know how do we change people's porn habits, but people
(13:31):
want hot bodies that look a certain way.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Unfortunately.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
Yeah, for me, sometimes I can't watch back what I've
feel good of what I've done. Do you watch back
your work?
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Not really, not the big studio stuff as well, because
it's it's weird.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
You see what made the cush.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
So I have watched it like this actually took six hours. Okay,
So that's one thing is that the shoots are so
much longer than maybe the twenty minutes for me. And
this is the other thing is the more people that
are on set scene. So as soon as you go
beyond too into the morsums, into the orgy kind of territory,
it takes a lot longer because there's a lot.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
More moving parts.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Made me laugh, but there's a lot of moving parts
and not just you know, the sexy parts, the crew
plus the crew and everyone's trying to like the pressure
is on in those circumstances as well. You don't want
to be the one that doesn't deliver correct so you
don't even let the tea, don't be the last one.
The bigger the scene, the longer it takes. And it's
also like pretty exhausting. But it actually sound fun, to
(14:30):
be honest, I can't sound less fun than it. It
is super fun.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Like the fans content just seems so like just actually
just shoved the camera up where they had fun. But
the biggest studio stuff, it sounds like so much hard work.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
It's like it's like a mini film set, I guess
in a way, and I'd be so cald.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
I've seen I've seen some of those sets that you
talk about, and if you put a bitch at like
a bedside table that is not a set, thank you
very much. There's no set decided going in.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
There and like lines of stilted, terrible violence.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Oh god, but no, it's like it can be a
little bit rose colored glasses. Like I remember it really nicely,
but then when I watched the scenes back, I'm like, oh,
that was like we've been filming for two hours and
I was over it this day, or like I had
like as an Australian, you often have jet lag on set,
so you're like, I just want to go to bed,
but we have to get this shot. So when you
watch it back, it's not it's not as sexy as
(15:22):
it is for other people that weren't there that are
just getting to appreciate it for face value?
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Do they plan what happens is and they're like, right,
so you're going to go and do this with this
person and then you're going to finish first, but then
you're going to go over and do that.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, So some bits can be all gad, I know,
where's the fun in the moment. Some bits are fun
and in the moment, like if someone's feeling a particular way,
they can complete their scene. But if completely scene, I'm
using that now I've completed my thank you en scene.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Thank you thank you.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Like brand of applause and a wet towel please. But yeah,
so some things can happen organically. But there is also
like times where like they need certain types of content.
Speaker 3 (16:04):
I don't know how explicit I can be, but like we.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Need, yeah, we need we need three more minutes of hardcore,
which might be like close ups of right going in
certain places, yes, or we need a wide shot of
what you were just doing, so you kind of like
like a film, you reset and you do the exact
same position.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
Like continuity. I try to because I have perfection.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
I know. It's like because I've worked on seventy sets
and things and I'm a stickler for concontinuity, and I
think of it like sometimes they don't even care. No,
but when we last did this, I was here and
this was there, so we have to go back to that.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
And it's really simple things like in real life, we
people may be verbal in certain ways. You probably say
a lot of the same things over and over again
or grown in a really similar way, whereas in porn,
if you do it too much, then it's really noticeable,
so like they're like, mix it up, don't say fuck
here anymore, don't say yes daddy, maybe exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Have you ever had to deliver dialogue in a scene?
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Please?
Speaker 1 (17:04):
I have to know because I've seen bits, but I
just see the bits on.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
That's the cringe bit for me, because often I think
you'd be really good at it.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
I think it's about the partners that are actually like
not giving you something to work.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
I need the energy and the energy. No, it can
just be really hard sometimes because they don't give you
keep one seing.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
It's hard. Porn is hard.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
It is hard.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
It can be difficult synonym because they don't necessarily give
you a script, but they give you story beats, so
you kind of have to add a little bit. But
I've had some awkward things. I've had like people being
on holidays and they're like like very cliche, they're like
the pool boy. Or I've had like really complicated step
(17:49):
parent arrangements I've had right, I've had like accidental like
sneaking out on a partner to go hook up.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
I love it already.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
You film the little bee real stuff also completely out
of sequence. You might film that twenty minutes before everything
kicks off, or sometimes you film it at the end
after all of the bells and whistles have happened as well.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Like I just want to go to bed love.
Speaker 3 (18:12):
Yeah, I'm tired the guy.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Do you feel like you like, as queer people we
have to come out?
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Most times I wish that wasn't the reality. Do you
feel like you've had had to have a second coming
out with your career?
Speaker 3 (18:27):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
I think sex work generally, I've definitely had to come
out again in various different ways in various social settings.
With the advocacy that I've done around sex worker riots
and things like that, I've been really conscious of the
I guess the privilege I have being a man like
sis white man that I've been able to be a
face out worker. I've also very fortunate that my family
(18:48):
is super supportive. All of my friends know. Even in
my very boring work, a lot of my colleagues know.
Because it's not something that I try and hide. It's
something that informs my lived experience kind of allows me
to be a little bit more truthful, and it also
allows me to be truthful about things like boundaries and
stuff like that. Why something would make me uncomfortable, which
I think is really important too.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Do you find it's hard for people to separate you
from your job because I struggle all the time. Yeah,
that's like an issue that I have consistently where people
just think that either I am that's the most crazy,
beautiful studying drag queen all the time all the time,
or they're only interested in that side of me.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Yeah. I think that is very similar.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
I think people they like a few things happen is
like they're having, particularly with a porn performance, They're having
an intimate experience with you that I created.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
Yes, but I'm not part.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
I'm not actively part of that intimate moment that they're
making for themselves or with you know, loved ones, because
you know they might spice it up family. They form
a bond with you that you don't necessarily have back.
It's also a weird fan space because you know, there's
a lot of stigma around sex work and stuff like that.
So I was already a pretty shy person even though
(20:06):
I'm an exhibitionist.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
It doesn't make sense like I'm a porn performer.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
And I love being naked and I love being sexy,
and I love making people feel sexy.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
On your terms correct.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
And I think that's where people forget, is that they
think that they can interact with me like I'm this
porn object, this sex doll, and I'm not. I'm a person,
And I think boundaries are really important. And I also
think like it's also maybe raising the awareness to like
sometimes you're burnout and you don't have time to re
educate someone, but in the times that you.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Do, it can be really important to do that.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
Like like one thing that I'm sure you've probably experienced
as well as people have an entitlement to your body
that doesn't reflect normal social norms.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
There's a lot of parallel. So I'm going to keep
bringing it back. Drag and porn, dragon porn. Oh, there
we go, dragon pod, dungeons and dragons porn.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
Ah.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
I feel like I can play the dragon. I put
the drag and dragon. But how are you juggling your
nine to five really interesting job that I can't remember
with your other work At the moment.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
In Australia, our industry is a lot smaller. The studios
aren't really based here, so at the moment I haven't
really been filming big studio porn because Australia's borders were
shut for a large chunk of the last couple of years,
and even with OnlyFans. Lately, I've not been posting as
much because really the pandemic affected me like it has
(21:29):
affected a lot of people. I've experienced a lot of
burnout and then it was very weird space to still
be making content and making porn and trying to feel
sexy when you can't leave the house wasn't really a
vibe and it really did burn me out. And also
as well, like I was studying full time and doing
my masters across the pandemic as well, so I just
(21:50):
had all of these other things happening that weren't porn related,
and it also felt like porn was taken off the
table a little bit because I couldn't travel anymore, which
was a total boma. But I'm keen to as things
are changing and I find a new balance with my
very boring guys, it's.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Really exciting job that I can't get your career, Okay,
I don't want to give you. Don't I give you
feel bad that at all.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Sorry, it's just lots of big words. So but yeah,
I think with as I find this new balance, I
should be able to do it again. And also what
I've really struggled with at the time is that I'd
produce things and put money and effort into things, and
you put it on your only fans, and then you
know a week later it's been like screen captured from
(22:40):
your only fans, and then it's on a free porn site.
And that was really damaging in the lockdown because I
was like, I this is I have no other income
and someone's stealing from me. It's fine if it's one
of the big studios, because like I've been paid and
I've got you're not getting any more money past that point.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
But when it's your own content being taken, I'm a
small business. How do care you? Just from business? This
is my lemonade stands.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
It looks a little bit different to everyone else's, but
this is my little lemonade.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
It's just squeezing things. There's some really strange scenes in
the world, and really strange with if you could guess
in and perform in any one of them. I'm talking
like spice, aliens, intergalactic or medieval lapping or.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
I want to do this is going to reveal me
a little bit, but I love the porn parodies where
they throw a bit of coin at it and it's
actually substantive and it makes a lot of sense. I'd
either want to do that where you get a proper
script and like like your yeah, maybe yeah, or being
the extra that does like the not in front of
(23:43):
my salad kind of like you shot up for twenty minutes,
you collect your paycheck, you go home and he.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Walks in, or it's like yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
Oh your mom haws you with our steps up who knows? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (23:59):
Like that that that is a great paycheck to get
is twenty minutes of work and then on my way.
Speaker 3 (24:05):
That's so good. That's so good.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
I just want to close out with a bit of
a like brainstorm such game.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
I thought one hundred percent thought you want to say,
I'm going to close out with a dick joke is
what I thought you.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
But we can be very close to it. I'm not
going so obvious, but I want to know what you
can say in both your jobs. What's something you can say?
What are your performances that you can also say, you're nine.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
To five, let's make the world a better place.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
Ah, what a treat. Max was so good to see
him again. And you know he's got two laughs, two jobs,
two careers. Get both of them. He's working hard change
the world. And that is a wrap on Season one
of Concealed with Art Simone. Oh, it has been an
absolute pleasure talking into your little earlobes. You've been listening
(25:09):
to an iHeart Australia and Kiss Production. Listen for free
on the iHeart app and listen to your arts content
and to check out this hot and sexy performer. Oh
and Max two check us out on the socials. Bye.
What are you something really weird or find out a
juicy little secret. Well, you've come to the right place. Hello,
it is me Art Simone. I have been scouring the
ends of the earth to find people who look painfully
ordinary and seem very regular, but at concealing something exciting,
scandalous or even a little bit naughty. But they're not
(00:29):
going to give up their secret that easily. No, I
have to do a bit of detective work to first
find out what it is. Trust me, it's worth all
of my hard work. This is concealed with me, Art Simone.
Time to meet our guess. Roll the tape.
Speaker 2 (00:46):
Hello, I'm Max. I'm thirty six and I live in Melbourne.
My working career is in policy and research, and I
do a lot of consultancy, writing and advocacy on really
nerdy stuff that I'm very passionate about, which is very
different to the other work that I'm probably more well
known for.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
Hello, Ah, well I know Max. Well, I know you Max,
So this hasn't happened before I have normally this is
a blind date, all right, But this is a wonderful
reveal for me because I know I recognize you.
Speaker 3 (01:28):
Done, Yes, I recognize you.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
I've known you for many a year or slash known
of you. I'm very appreciative of your work in the world.
Thank you. You know it's very aspirational. I don't want
to make you feel bad, but sometimes you make me
feel like I'm quite lazy, which is quite sad because
I'm just juggling a lot of Please. I know it's
a lot of work. It's a lot of work, and
you know, I don't know how you do it. I
(01:54):
actually know what you're concealing, and I have a pretty
good idea of what you're going to reveal. But I'm
not the only one who gets to play this game.
So I'm going to continue as usual and ask you
three questions and see if you listening right now. Yes,
you can figure it out far away. Do you collect anything? Yeah, yes,
I do dust. I collect really nerdy things.
Speaker 2 (02:17):
I have an extensive like board game and Dungeons and Dragons.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
You're part of the Dungeons Crew, Yeah, I am. Okay.
What is your character?
Speaker 2 (02:28):
Oh god, I have a few, but my favorite one
by far is this fantastical druid so like nature magic
person called Kitten, and he's one hundred and twenty.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Years old and he's a big himbo and I love
him very himbo. A himbo is like a masculine bimbo.
So like that just so.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Many times over the years, and I was like, I
don't know what that is, and I just kept scrolling.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Yeah, no thoughts, just that, oh himbo, I call them
prawn Yeah yeah, works, Okay, So himbao is the proem.
Speaker 1 (03:03):
We're all learning things. Ye yeah, okay, that's beautiful. That's
really nice. Okay. And what is the last reality TV
show you binged?
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Oh, there's a lot in my repertoire, but I recently
binged Blown Away.
Speaker 3 (03:19):
It's a competition show, but it's super niche.
Speaker 2 (03:21):
They are professional glass blowers, so they're artists making these
beautiful little sculptures and things. So if you give me
with the glory yeah, yeah, yeah, glory every time there's
a gloryhole joke.
Speaker 1 (03:31):
Yeah. After the first episide when they reveal that they
will call gloryholes, I just laughed.
Speaker 2 (03:37):
And now in subsequent seasons it comes up with like
gloryhole and a definition, and it's like, didn't.
Speaker 1 (03:43):
Realize in the first season they were like, why is
your road laughing?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
What was going on?
Speaker 2 (03:47):
But they're very serious about their art, and it's very
serious art, and it's not even like putting a spin
on it. They say something like, and I just shove
it in the gloryhole.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
And it's like it's so good, so good. Okay. A
final question, do you have any tattoos?
Speaker 2 (04:04):
Yes, which I would say people would be aware of
considering my work.
Speaker 3 (04:11):
I've got two of.
Speaker 2 (04:12):
My thighs and one on my abdomen. They're not too exciting.
One's just a portrait of this man's head that Potato
artist is kind of known for. They're like a little
bit surrealist and sevador dally like the head flips open
and the stuff coming out.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
But it's pretty cool. I love it.
Speaker 1 (04:29):
Has that been coming out of your head?
Speaker 2 (04:30):
Yes, there's a hand coming out of it and a butterfly.
And then the other one that I really like is
this mythical again nerdy D and D stuff creature that
is like a stag with wings that is meant to
be like a bad fortune, bad omen but mine is
bright pink. So it's kind of like a little bit
(04:51):
more fun gay. Yeah, a lot more gay, a lot
more gay.
Speaker 1 (04:55):
Okay. So to recap you, collecked board games and dungeon
and Biggs is things. Yes, beautiful, and your character is
a himbo and you like glory holes from blowing the bay. Yes,
and you have tattoos of a man's head and pink.
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Gay things, pink gay things.
Speaker 1 (05:13):
Okay, okay, And from that we need to guess what
you are concealing, what you do outside of your nine
to five I'm not going to guess because I already know,
so let's reveal it.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I am a porn performer. When I've had about fifteen releases,
I don't know. It's they all become a blur. I
know that sounds dumb, but they do become a bit
of a blur. But I have been doing that and
other forms of sex work for about a decade.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Now here we are with porn sum mags. I feel
like I'm finally actually going to talk to you now.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
Okay, we have to talk around the porn.
Speaker 1 (05:54):
It's like when you see a mole you just want
to say, male, I just wanted to get when it
has come out of my man porn good say now
I feel so free, so free being censored, you know. Okay,
So we just have that Max has a nine to
five job which has something that I don't actually remember
(06:16):
the job of that. Yes, but Max is also a
porn star. Yes, a pond star is in my presence. Oh,
this is going to get interesting. Ah, So I'm here
(06:39):
world famous porn star Max is in my presence. But
I would like to clarify that's not how I know Max.
I know what maxes work, of course, but that's not
just how I know Max. We have many mutual friends. Okay,
that's that. That's bad to know Max for that. Wow,
I'm doing a whole. I can hear myself. I can
hear myself doing a hole right now. But also, who
gives a shit ified you from your work? It's a
(07:01):
bloody good stuff.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
A lot of people that's like how they know me,
and I like, I think it's interesting. People always like
oh and they get a bit timid about it. But like,
I don't do porn for people not to watch it.
So right, it's very too. So it's it's okay that
you know me from my pawn. Everyone, it's okay. They
probably never heard you speak so much. No, no, absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Probably have a very limited who are yes, yeah, more
if you run into something the look you have a
familiar face if you just go they got that sit
that's it.
Speaker 3 (07:32):
That's where I know.
Speaker 2 (07:33):
I yeah, I have had It's happened quite a few
times where like someone recognizes me and like I am
a bit coy. And I also like, if it's in
a group setting, I don't want to be like I've
done porn.
Speaker 3 (07:42):
You've probably watched.
Speaker 2 (07:43):
It, but instead I just a'm like, oh, oh, you know,
I like I get around. You may have seen me
here and there, and eventually the penny drops and you
can tell they they blush or they lose their words
mid sentence, which is kind of adorable when that happens.
Speaker 1 (08:02):
Yes, yes, me and pretty fun.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
And look at that.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
It's better than the alternative than like someone interrupting and
being like I've seen your porn and I'm like sitting
there having dinner with my parents or something like that.
Both sound fun, tod like they know they're super supportive,
Like I'm very fortunate as a porn star and as
a sex worker to have that support. Not everyone has that,
but I think you know, if you're having brunch, don't
run up to a porn start and be like you
do porn. I mean, I can already pull so many
(08:28):
comparisons change you and me, right, we're both very well
known for our work. It's just slightly different, ever, so
slightly different, I know, just a little bit. I have
to work with others.
Speaker 1 (08:39):
You do too.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
Yeah, we both play well with others.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
Yes. I also have to do solo works. You do too.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Yeah, all the time.
Speaker 1 (08:45):
The big difference probably is the amount of clothing that
we're wearing. Yes, yes, but also you have to do
things that I don't have to, like I don't know,
a bit more upkeep.
Speaker 3 (08:53):
A little bit more upkeep. But it's both performance. I
get perform. Yeah, we're both performers.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yes, it terminology in the porn world.
Speaker 2 (09:03):
That is correct that you are. You're a performer. I
never say porn star myself. I'm happy when others do.
But if I think that's the Australian tall poppy thing
of having tickets on yourself, I would never be like
I'm a pool and star, yeah, whereas other people do
when they're comfortable with that. But I think just with
porn and sex work and stuff in general, it is
(09:23):
sometimes stepping into a role or a persona that you're
really well recognized for that is also different to how
you are in your personal life too, and striking a
balance between that is really important. But I think a
lot of performers outside of porn also need to strike
that balance as well.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
So let's go all the way back. I've got a
lot of questions to you, but let's go back. How
did you get into the porn world.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
Well, it was pretty organic and natural because.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
I was.
Speaker 1 (09:54):
I'm so sorry, you were baiting by light w making
stupid dad jokes all the time. Please do not be offended,
but they just come out. I can't hold them back.
Speaker 2 (10:06):
Yes, sorry, I mean, look, everything's going to go back
to Gloriahole. But the I think for me, it was
like naturally. I did life modeling for years, so that's
like you know, modeling. I was an artist myself, so
I went to art school and I just got distracted
by the real world and then you know, the grind of.
Speaker 3 (10:26):
Making money, stop doing stop it. And then when I
was a student, I started doing life modeling. It pays
really well.
Speaker 2 (10:35):
I had photos and stuff of myself kind of go viral.
Speaker 1 (10:39):
At what point in your life did you look in
the mirror and go, yeah, it's pretty good.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Yeah, that's still a process, that's a work in progress.
But there is one photo that a friend of mine
took of me, maybe like five or six years ago now,
and it changed the perception that I saw of myself.
I'd done a lot of really cool work until then.
It's like a life modeling photo. I'm completely naked, I
look completely amazing. I was vegan at the time and
(11:03):
very hungry, so I'm really ripped and it's this amazing
black and white photo and I was like.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
Oh, I'm actually really hard.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
Yeah, I'm pretty hard.
Speaker 2 (11:14):
Yeah, And it changed my perception of myself because you know,
people compliment you all the time. You're beautiful, You're gorgeous,
things like that, and like, in reality, maybe it's because
I was like a really unpopular kid and I took
a while to grow into my looks.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
But it's something that you have no control over.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
So I'm always being a person that's I guess being
more concerned with like being clever or being kind or
being personal to people. So when people only compliment you
on your looks, it's like, ah, thanks. Like it's hard
to process, but that photo made me be like, oh fuck, yeah,
you could do this.
Speaker 1 (11:48):
I do want to touch on body image for a second. Yeah,
because I feel like we have parallels that I know
a lot of people that adjacent to the industry and
that look like the most beautiful adonuses you've ever seen
in your life, but they have like the biggest self
body image issues, like and it's so funny because it's
like the same thing for me as.
Speaker 3 (12:07):
A drag queen.
Speaker 1 (12:09):
That's why I like cover myself with so much stuff.
That's so I'm covered in glitter and dimontes and lashes
and anything to be discuring. Literally, I'm excuring what people
can see because like I'm just like, well, I'm not
sure about that what's underneath, but at least I can
make you see what I want to. So it's very
interesting to see the parallels.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
Yeah, and I think coming from like life modeling and
stuff like that, I didn't have a very negative view
of my body ever, which is interesting that porn and
performing and stuff, you have to look a certain way,
you have to go to the gym a lot, you
have to be watching what you eat, which is the
bit I hate. I don't mind working out, I don't
mind all of that activity. I just I really hate
(12:46):
saying no to food. I love food, and it is
it's really good. Particularly I have a sweet tooth, so
I'm like, if there's cake on offer, my like my
pupils expand and I hone in on the cake, like
just need it, doesn't need it. But yeah, I think
for me, porn scrutinized my body image a little bit
(13:07):
and put me in a headspace that I wasn't used to.
I wasn't used to seeing myself so much and having
to look a certain way to be on film. So
even though porn gets a bad rap for like perpetuating
body image stuff, it is also still what people buy
and consume, and there are a lot of negative comments
when performers don't look a certain way. So I don't
know how do we change people's porn habits, but people
(13:31):
want hot bodies that look a certain way.
Speaker 3 (13:32):
Unfortunately.
Speaker 1 (13:33):
Yeah, for me, sometimes I can't watch back what I've
feel good of what I've done. Do you watch back
your work?
Speaker 2 (13:40):
Not really, not the big studio stuff as well, because
it's it's weird.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
You see what made the cush.
Speaker 2 (13:47):
So I have watched it like this actually took six hours. Okay,
So that's one thing is that the shoots are so
much longer than maybe the twenty minutes for me. And
this is the other thing is the more people that
are on set scene. So as soon as you go
beyond too into the morsums, into the orgy kind of territory,
it takes a lot longer because there's a lot.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
More moving parts.
Speaker 2 (14:09):
Made me laugh, but there's a lot of moving parts
and not just you know, the sexy parts, the crew
plus the crew and everyone's trying to like the pressure
is on in those circumstances as well. You don't want
to be the one that doesn't deliver correct so you
don't even let the tea, don't be the last one.
The bigger the scene, the longer it takes. And it's
also like pretty exhausting. But it actually sound fun, to
(14:30):
be honest, I can't sound less fun than it. It
is super fun.
Speaker 1 (14:33):
Like the fans content just seems so like just actually
just shoved the camera up where they had fun. But
the biggest studio stuff, it sounds like so much hard work.
Speaker 2 (14:41):
It's like it's like a mini film set, I guess
in a way, and I'd be so cald.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
I've seen I've seen some of those sets that you
talk about, and if you put a bitch at like
a bedside table that is not a set, thank you
very much. There's no set decided going in.
Speaker 3 (14:58):
There and like lines of stilted, terrible violence.
Speaker 2 (15:01):
Oh god, but no, it's like it can be a
little bit rose colored glasses. Like I remember it really nicely,
but then when I watched the scenes back, I'm like, oh,
that was like we've been filming for two hours and
I was over it this day, or like I had
like as an Australian, you often have jet lag on set,
so you're like, I just want to go to bed,
but we have to get this shot. So when you
watch it back, it's not it's not as sexy as
(15:22):
it is for other people that weren't there that are
just getting to appreciate it for face value?
Speaker 1 (15:27):
Do they plan what happens is and they're like, right,
so you're going to go and do this with this
person and then you're going to finish first, but then
you're going to go over and do that.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, So some bits can be all gad, I know,
where's the fun in the moment. Some bits are fun
and in the moment, like if someone's feeling a particular way,
they can complete their scene. But if completely scene, I'm
using that now I've completed my thank you en scene.
Speaker 3 (15:53):
Thank you thank you.
Speaker 2 (15:55):
Like brand of applause and a wet towel please. But yeah,
so some things can happen organically. But there is also
like times where like they need certain types of content.
Speaker 3 (16:04):
I don't know how explicit I can be, but like we.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Need, yeah, we need we need three more minutes of hardcore,
which might be like close ups of right going in
certain places, yes, or we need a wide shot of
what you were just doing, so you kind of like
like a film, you reset and you do the exact
same position.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
Like continuity. I try to because I have perfection.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
I know. It's like because I've worked on seventy sets
and things and I'm a stickler for concontinuity, and I
think of it like sometimes they don't even care. No,
but when we last did this, I was here and
this was there, so we have to go back to that.
Speaker 2 (16:37):
And it's really simple things like in real life, we
people may be verbal in certain ways. You probably say
a lot of the same things over and over again
or grown in a really similar way, whereas in porn,
if you do it too much, then it's really noticeable,
so like they're like, mix it up, don't say fuck
here anymore, don't say yes daddy, maybe exactly.
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Have you ever had to deliver dialogue in a scene?
Speaker 3 (17:04):
Please?
Speaker 1 (17:04):
I have to know because I've seen bits, but I
just see the bits on.
Speaker 2 (17:12):
That's the cringe bit for me, because often I think
you'd be really good at it.
Speaker 1 (17:15):
I think it's about the partners that are actually like
not giving you something to work.
Speaker 2 (17:19):
I need the energy and the energy. No, it can
just be really hard sometimes because they don't give you
keep one seing.
Speaker 3 (17:24):
It's hard. Porn is hard.
Speaker 1 (17:26):
It is hard.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
It can be difficult synonym because they don't necessarily give
you a script, but they give you story beats, so
you kind of have to add a little bit. But
I've had some awkward things. I've had like people being
on holidays and they're like like very cliche, they're like
the pool boy. Or I've had like really complicated step
(17:49):
parent arrangements I've had right, I've had like accidental like
sneaking out on a partner to go hook up.
Speaker 1 (17:59):
I love it already.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
You film the little bee real stuff also completely out
of sequence. You might film that twenty minutes before everything
kicks off, or sometimes you film it at the end
after all of the bells and whistles have happened as well.
Speaker 1 (18:11):
Like I just want to go to bed love.
Speaker 3 (18:12):
Yeah, I'm tired the guy.
Speaker 1 (18:15):
Do you feel like you like, as queer people we
have to come out?
Speaker 3 (18:20):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:20):
Most times I wish that wasn't the reality. Do you
feel like you've had had to have a second coming
out with your career?
Speaker 3 (18:27):
Yeah, definitely.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
I think sex work generally, I've definitely had to come
out again in various different ways in various social settings.
With the advocacy that I've done around sex worker riots
and things like that, I've been really conscious of the
I guess the privilege I have being a man like
sis white man that I've been able to be a
face out worker. I've also very fortunate that my family
(18:48):
is super supportive. All of my friends know. Even in
my very boring work, a lot of my colleagues know.
Because it's not something that I try and hide. It's
something that informs my lived experience kind of allows me
to be a little bit more truthful, and it also
allows me to be truthful about things like boundaries and
stuff like that. Why something would make me uncomfortable, which
I think is really important too.
Speaker 1 (19:10):
Do you find it's hard for people to separate you
from your job because I struggle all the time. Yeah,
that's like an issue that I have consistently where people
just think that either I am that's the most crazy,
beautiful studying drag queen all the time all the time,
or they're only interested in that side of me.
Speaker 3 (19:31):
Yeah. I think that is very similar.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
I think people they like a few things happen is
like they're having, particularly with a porn performance, They're having
an intimate experience with you that I created.
Speaker 3 (19:44):
Yes, but I'm not part.
Speaker 2 (19:45):
I'm not actively part of that intimate moment that they're
making for themselves or with you know, loved ones, because
you know they might spice it up family. They form
a bond with you that you don't necessarily have back.
It's also a weird fan space because you know, there's
a lot of stigma around sex work and stuff like that.
So I was already a pretty shy person even though
(20:06):
I'm an exhibitionist.
Speaker 3 (20:07):
It doesn't make sense like I'm a porn performer.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
And I love being naked and I love being sexy,
and I love making people feel sexy.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
On your terms correct.
Speaker 2 (20:15):
And I think that's where people forget, is that they
think that they can interact with me like I'm this
porn object, this sex doll, and I'm not. I'm a person,
And I think boundaries are really important. And I also
think like it's also maybe raising the awareness to like
sometimes you're burnout and you don't have time to re
educate someone, but in the times that you.
Speaker 3 (20:35):
Do, it can be really important to do that.
Speaker 2 (20:37):
Like like one thing that I'm sure you've probably experienced
as well as people have an entitlement to your body
that doesn't reflect normal social norms.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
There's a lot of parallel. So I'm going to keep
bringing it back. Drag and porn, dragon porn. Oh, there
we go, dragon pod, dungeons and dragons porn.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
Ah.
Speaker 1 (20:56):
I feel like I can play the dragon. I put
the drag and dragon. But how are you juggling your
nine to five really interesting job that I can't remember
with your other work At the moment.
Speaker 2 (21:09):
In Australia, our industry is a lot smaller. The studios
aren't really based here, so at the moment I haven't
really been filming big studio porn because Australia's borders were
shut for a large chunk of the last couple of years,
and even with OnlyFans. Lately, I've not been posting as
much because really the pandemic affected me like it has
(21:29):
affected a lot of people. I've experienced a lot of
burnout and then it was very weird space to still
be making content and making porn and trying to feel
sexy when you can't leave the house wasn't really a
vibe and it really did burn me out. And also
as well, like I was studying full time and doing
my masters across the pandemic as well, so I just
(21:50):
had all of these other things happening that weren't porn related,
and it also felt like porn was taken off the
table a little bit because I couldn't travel anymore, which
was a total boma. But I'm keen to as things
are changing and I find a new balance with my
very boring guys, it's.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Really exciting job that I can't get your career, Okay,
I don't want to give you. Don't I give you
feel bad that at all.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
Sorry, it's just lots of big words. So but yeah,
I think with as I find this new balance, I
should be able to do it again. And also what
I've really struggled with at the time is that I'd
produce things and put money and effort into things, and
you put it on your only fans, and then you
know a week later it's been like screen captured from
(22:40):
your only fans, and then it's on a free porn site.
And that was really damaging in the lockdown because I
was like, I this is I have no other income
and someone's stealing from me. It's fine if it's one
of the big studios, because like I've been paid and
I've got you're not getting any more money past that point.
Speaker 1 (22:54):
But when it's your own content being taken, I'm a
small business. How do care you? Just from business? This
is my lemonade stands.
Speaker 2 (23:03):
It looks a little bit different to everyone else's, but
this is my little lemonade.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
It's just squeezing things. There's some really strange scenes in
the world, and really strange with if you could guess
in and perform in any one of them. I'm talking
like spice, aliens, intergalactic or medieval lapping or.
Speaker 2 (23:21):
I want to do this is going to reveal me
a little bit, but I love the porn parodies where
they throw a bit of coin at it and it's
actually substantive and it makes a lot of sense. I'd
either want to do that where you get a proper
script and like like your yeah, maybe yeah, or being
the extra that does like the not in front of
(23:43):
my salad kind of like you shot up for twenty minutes,
you collect your paycheck, you go home and he.
Speaker 1 (23:49):
Walks in, or it's like yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (23:50):
Oh your mom haws you with our steps up who knows? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (23:59):
Like that that that is a great paycheck to get
is twenty minutes of work and then on my way.
Speaker 3 (24:05):
That's so good. That's so good.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
I just want to close out with a bit of
a like brainstorm such game.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
I thought one hundred percent thought you want to say,
I'm going to close out with a dick joke is
what I thought you.
Speaker 1 (24:20):
But we can be very close to it. I'm not
going so obvious, but I want to know what you
can say in both your jobs. What's something you can say?
What are your performances that you can also say, you're nine.
Speaker 3 (24:33):
To five, let's make the world a better place.
Speaker 1 (24:47):
Ah, what a treat. Max was so good to see
him again. And you know he's got two laughs, two jobs,
two careers. Get both of them. He's working hard change
the world. And that is a wrap on Season one
of Concealed with Art Simone. Oh, it has been an
absolute pleasure talking into your little earlobes. You've been listening
(25:09):
to an iHeart Australia and Kiss Production. Listen for free
on the iHeart app and listen to your arts content
and to check out this hot and sexy performer. Oh
and Max two check us out on the socials. Bye.
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