Revisiting Maggie Jeffries on Whimsy, Advocacy & Balancing Art with Community Care

In this episode, I revisit my conversation with Hobart-based painter Maggie Jeffries, who reflects on her creative path, shaped by childhood wonder, night-time focus, and a deep commitment to disability advocacy. A rising force in the Tasmanian art scene, Maggie shares how volunteering at Creative Growth in Oakland, California, transformed her relationship to both art and care.

We explore her magical painting practice — rich in memory, nature, and detail — and how she balances this with a day job supporting artists of all abilities. Maggie opens up about the emotional and practical tensions of working two roles in the arts, the value of feedback from her creative community, and how residencies and prizes have helped her grow as an artist.

This is a must-listen for those interested in the intersections of creativity and caregiving, the power of quiet persistence, and the ways art can offer both escape and responsibility.

Themes: disability arts and advocacy, whimsical painting, Creative Growth Oakland, Tasmanian artists, emerging painters, night-time creativity, art residencies, artist support roles, community and care in art, Maggie Jeffries artist

🎙️ Connect Curate Create is a podcast about creative courage, community, and place-based storytelling in regional Australia.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome back to the podcast. This week we're sharing one of
my favorite episodes so far, part of our new series of recap
episodes. While we're busy producing new
content for the podcast, YouTubeand our brand new Patreon
channel. That's right, Connect, Curate,

(00:20):
Create is now on Patreon. It's a dedicated space to learn,
share, and grow together, and here's why we built it.
Do you feel like your art has been seen by the right people?
Are you getting the kind of feedback that actually helps you
grow? Do you have a space where you
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(00:44):
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(01:04):
So if you're ready to grow your creative practice with the
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Patreon link in the show notes and join us today.
Now let's get into another brilliant episode packed with
ideas and inspiration for your own creative journey.
Welcome back to the podcast. I'm here in Hobart again and in

(01:30):
a absolutely delightful studio with Maggie Jeffries, Emerging
Artist. Maggie, thank you for coming on
the podcast. Thank you for having me.
I'm very excited. Cool.
Welcome, welcome. We only met this week.
Yes, on Tuesday. Tuesday and it's Friday now and
it's like I, I, we just shared what we did and, and I thought,

(01:54):
oh wow, would be great if Maggiewanted to come on the podcast
and, and he said, oh, can I come?
Yes. Like straight away I was like,
yes, absolutely. Yeah, it was great.
Yeah, it was great. So yeah, we met through Second
Eco Ensemble based here in Hobart.
I've just been spending three days with with everyone there

(02:14):
and having the best time my life.
A well wound of three days, yeah.
Yeah, did so much and so much wecan't talk about.
We made a film and we can't really, you know, with that's
yeah, that's still coming with. There was play rehearsals that
we can't talk about yet, but oh wow.
Check out Second Echo Ensemble. Definitely, yeah.

(02:36):
There's big stuff coming. Yeah.
Second Echo. Yeah, it's exciting.
So what's the work that you do there, Maggie?
We, we perhaps if we talk about that first because you, I mean,
I just got your passion for yourwork there and then we can come
back to your everything. We're surrounded here, this
beautiful artwork of yours because so you you paint with

(02:59):
oils and but that's a performingarts organization.
So what's the connection? Yeah, I so part of my, my
practice kind of splits into I've got my painting practice
and then my practice working as an artist support and
facilitating the work of artistswith all abilities.
And so I've been really interested in that sort of part
of my practice, like sort of finding work in that part of my

(03:23):
practice because it has been volunteered for quite a long
time. But I love it, so it's worth it.
But so I sort of found Second Echo through, there's sort of
like a sort of the timeline of me discovering that I wanted to
be part of that world and, and particularly that part of
Tasmanian contemporary art practice.

(03:44):
Then found Second Echo through Ability to Create, which is the
Hobart City Council exhibition they put on every two years now,
but it was every year for artists with all abilities.
So I saw a performance from Second Echo ensemble in that
sort of exhibition. And I was on King Island at the

(04:05):
time doing a residency and I asked my sister to go along and
FaceTime the whole thing. So I was in the studio on King
Island in the corner of the studio with the best reception
and then watching this performance of Second Echo
Ensemble and just bawling my eyes out because it was so
beautiful. And then I sort of had them sort

(04:28):
of in the corner of my eye waiting for a time that I could
try to be involved. And so I just contacted them and
was like, can I come in and and volunteer or whatever that looks
like. And then that sort of developed
into a small first project with one of the artists and then
moving on to say sort of artistssupport, which is what I do now.

(04:52):
So my role there is to support the artists in whatever
production, performance or project we're working on and
sort of make sure they have everything they need.
Any questions they have, if they're asking for support, we
can do that, whatever that lookslike.
And also facilitate their storytelling.

(05:13):
So I love it. It's it's the best job in the
world. I could see that.
Just spend in the last few days a year.
And yeah, yesterday you weren't in, but you came in for, for,
for band in the afternoon. And you, you came in early, yes.
I. Did yeah.
I mean, you know, you know someone loves their their work
when they come in early to work.Yeah, I love coming in for that

(05:36):
sort of all those really beautiful conversations that
happened. Mm hmm.
Sort of those casual conversations before we start
working. So yeah, I sort of in my head
realize I, I sort of think aboutit and I'm like, when is too
early to go to work? Like when is the like earliest I
can go where I'm not in the way.So then I sort of time it like

(05:56):
that. So yeah, I just, I love being
there and I feel a real sort of pull towards that space.
And the way that they sort of run their programs is a big part
of what I'd like my research to be moving towards a PhD.
So I'm learning so much just getting to be in the space.

(06:17):
So I think I'll probably annoy everyone a little bit by being
overly thankful. I'm sort of like, thank you so
much for allowing me to come in and, and be here.
And they're like, yeah, yeah. Like you're, you're part of the
team now. It's you don't have to keep
saying thank you. I'm like, I'm just, I feel very
lucky. So I love it.
It's it's really fun. And yeah, really good example of

(06:42):
a studio space that's doing thatkind of work really, really
well. Like they're setting their
standard for a lot of other places.
So love to be part of that as well.
Yes, yeah, yeah. Look, hopefully I'll talk to
Kelly and see if we can find a way to do some work, you know,
to, to, to, to, I mean, there's enough going on to to showcase

(07:05):
and promote Second Echo and a lot of people here know about
it, but to share with the wider world just what a a wonderful
thing. Yeah.
My first experience was at Ted Xearlier this year and Luke John
doing the bond and. Wow, I, I wasn't expecting it.
So it came out of nowhere. And yeah, look, I'm incredibly

(07:28):
grateful to like you. I, I thank you, thank you, thank
you all the time. Because it's just you're, you're
taking so much in. Yeah.
Working with people of all abilities and, you know, and
they are artists. That's that's the key.
Yeah, yeah, definitely. Well, let's get back to you,
Maggie. I mean, yeah, you, you, you've,

(07:48):
you've given us a little teaser there alluding to the end of the
podcast because we'll get to, toperhaps talking about, you know,
the future and, and you'd mentioned you'd like to, to, to
work on a PhD, but where did so,you know, you have a painting
practice? Where did it all begin?
How far back do you want me to go?

(08:10):
That is entirely up to you. Well, briefly, I, my mom sort of
started taking me to art classeswhen I was 7.
And so I was with Brian ChandlerSchool of Art from 7 to 16, I
think. So it was sort of that thing

(08:31):
that, you know, my parents really wanted me to have
something outside of school to focus on.
Wasn't very into sport. And my sister was doing drama
classes and that was her thing. Drama classes probably would
have helped me now in my role atSecond Echo.
But yeah, we're sort of looking for my sort of my hook as

(08:51):
something that I could sort of sink my teeth into as as a kid
and and have my own thing. So yeah, I started going to art
classes and then that, you know,all the way through school.
And then I started my, I did a arts degree and Fine Arts
degree, some combined double degree, my bachelor's degree

(09:14):
majoring in psychology and painting.
Yeah. So that was interesting.
I, they wouldn't let me do the bachelor.
Yeah, Bachelor of behavioral science and the Fine Arts
degree, which is what I wanted. I wanted a psych degree and a

(09:34):
Fine Arts degree majoring in painting, but they wouldn't let
that be a double degree. So it had to be under arts.
So did everything that was in a behavioral science degree, but
under arts, which I was always sort of a bit like, why can't I
do both at the same time? But, you know, different schools
and that kind of thing. But so, yeah, I sort of did that

(09:55):
for it took me about 4 1/2 yearsto do that, which was great.
And I was sort of wanting to go in a counsellor art therapy
direction. I was gonna ask you where the
what the link with psychology is.
Yeah, yeah. I was really interested in art
therapy and having known how much my art practice had helped

(10:20):
my own mental health, I was like, this is a space that I'd
like to work in and research in as well.
And I also was saying that I waslike, oh, if I don't get to be
an artist and I don't it doesn'twork out.
I can have a career in psychology or counselling or
something like that. And my parents were like, you

(10:42):
don't need a fall back. Just be an artist though, Like
we support you to be an artist. That's so cool.
Which was amazing are. Your parents in the arts.
My dad is an artist, but in his own sort of practice.
But yeah, he's, he's very creative and then does a lot of
sort of model making and, and woodwork and that kind of stuff.

(11:03):
And I would say my mom is very creative, but she's a nurse.
And then my step dad's a nurse as well.
So we have, you know, my dad wasalso retired now, but was a
teacher. So very creative family, but no
one had gone and done the I'm going to be an artist and try
and live off that kind of thing.So that was, I was a bit nervous

(11:27):
about that and also wanted to bea little bit more.
I was like, I'm going to be smart about it.
I'm going to do enough stuff that I'll find something
somewhere that will be my place.And then it towards the end of
my degrees, I was just wanted tobe out of out of Tasmania for a

(11:48):
second and I was like, I need toleave.
So I started researching and found Creative Growth in
Oakland, CA Yeah and I emailed them very long e-mail.
I mean like I love what you guysare doing.
So it's a studio working with atthe time it was over 170 artists
with disabilities in California.Yeah, and amazing work, like

(12:10):
they've huge studio been around for a long time and as gallery
attached to the to the studio space.
And so I emailed them and I was like, I'm really excited.
I'm doing a degree in psychologyand Fine Arts and I'd really
love to come over and volunteer.And I told them about myself and
what I was doing as an artist and they wasn't quite calling

(12:34):
myself or not. No, I was maybe calling myself
an artist then I'm not sure. But then they offered me a, a
fellowship for a month to work in the studio.
So that was great. And I spent all my savings and
just went to California for a month.
And then I went to the studio and I was in the studio for like

(12:55):
half an hour and I was like, I just want to do this forever.
This one, this is my career. I want to do it for the rest of
my life. And I remember telling you that
on Tuesday when I was babbling away, telling you about why I
want to be in that space so much.
And just, yeah, I just walked inthere and saw all of these
artists doing their work and being empowered to have their

(13:18):
own arts practice. And I just thought this, we need
more of this in Tassie. And we need, I've sort of
started thinking about down the track, I'd like to have a studio
space like that in Tasmania. And so, yeah, that was, that was
a big, big thing for me. A really transformative trip,

(13:39):
yes. And then I came back to Hobart
and just started to look for as many ways I could get into that
space. And then eventually finished,
yeah, another semester and I finished my degrees and then I
just started looking for ways todo workshops and tutor artists

(14:00):
and and mental artists in that, in that space down here.
And then eventually worked at a few different disability
organizations and then found a second echo.
So it was yeah, like AI think itwas also part of that process
was me just showing up to placesand being like just present and

(14:21):
being like, I'm really excited and they're like, OK.
And I'm like, no, like, what canI do?
And I'm like, I'm going to keep calling until you give me
something to do. So it was, it was a pushy
approach, but it worked and volunteer for like probably 2
years, I think in doing lots of workshops and different things.

(14:44):
And then I was like, OK, now we probably need to think about how
this can be something that is paid.
Not because I particularly thought I needed that money from
that space or to be paid for it.But I started talking to a few
other artists. And now like, what's what you're
actually doing is you're offering your art tutoring and

(15:06):
your mentorship, and people are now expecting that they can ask
for that for free. So you're setting this sort of
example that people don't have to pay artists for their work.
And I was like, Oh my God, that's not what I wanted to do
at all. So then I had to be like, OK,
no, I need to be paid to do thisnow.

(15:26):
And so that was a really big wake up call because I was just
so excited to be in the spaces that I didn't realize what I was
sort of doing. Yeah.
So that was hard. Yeah, and you wouldn't be alone
in that. I mean, I, I wrote my book
Creative Work Beyond Precarity because I had met so many

(15:49):
artists whose work is undervalued, you know, and, and
I think there are few people in society in, in the economy,
actually. It's not a societal thing.
It's an economic problem. And so, yeah, I guess coming out
of our school, you wouldn't be aware of how, you know, how much
value you offer. And that actually the by

(16:14):
offering value, you know, the, the actually that there's a,
there's a worth in that too, youknow, it's a yeah.
And it's, it's, it's if people, yeah.
And I, so the book is really about how can we find ways to
help people to see how valuable art is in their lives more

(16:37):
generally, not just artists or people working in the arts.
And so they, I mean, there's a knock on effect to that is, is
if if everyone in the arts and disability sector are doing
their work for free and putting on free shows, there is it it's
yeah, there's a knock on effect in, you know, people just start
to expect these things happeningfor free.

(16:59):
And unfortunately, yeah, it means it's unsustainable.
Yeah. In in so many ways, yeah.
You know, the and the the the struggling artist is a myth,
yeah. Yeah, we don't have to.
You don't have to struggle. Yeah.
Yeah. Now, Laura Purcell talks about
that so well in her in her episode, Let's get back to

(17:20):
painting because yeah, I, I, I mean, we're surrounded by your
painting. We're here in your studio.
And this is a residency. Yes, yes.
Tell us about what now before weget into the residency, we
really, I mean, I can see stuff that isn't on camera and work in

(17:42):
progress and I I'm blown away. So.
So. Yeah.
Tell us about painting and how you know, perhaps your process.
Yeah, What's involved? Yeah, the process has developed
since I've sort of had my studioprac at art school finishing in

(18:04):
2018. So major, my major paintings
finishing in 2018, which is whenI got sort of picked up by
Despot Gallery. And that's when my practice sort
of I started to dedicate like a lot of time to developing that
practice and how it was going tobe a, a, a sustainable process

(18:27):
for me to to, you know, paint work for the gallery and, and
produce work that I was happy tobe public.
That was a big thing because before that there was sort of
lots of painting happening, but stuff that I was just keeping to
myself. So that's another interesting
thing about when you start painting for an audience, how

(18:48):
that sort of changes the processand how much of yourself you
want to sort of show in your work and what you want to keep a
little bit more hidden, I suppose.
But the process developed through started and has
continued to be about childhood wonder and exploring gardens

(19:11):
from my childhood and, and thinking about that sort of
playful approach to discovering all the natural details in our
environment, which is just enduring for, you know, my
practice. It's still a really big part
about how I find like subject matter and look for things to
paint. And it's always plants that I

(19:32):
keep coming back to. There's such a strong tether to
the plants from those childhood gardens and childhood sort of
bushland that I used to explore as a kid.
And it's sort of transformed nowinto, you know, think
remembering those sort of experiences and, and then
looking for those that feeling to be present in my sort of new

(19:59):
environments, but also exploration now.
And it's a really sort of a strong feeling when I get into
that mindset and I'm looking for.
Things to paint, I get that sortof childhood playful feeling
where I'm sort of like running around and looking for things
and looking under leaves and that kind of stuff.

(20:21):
And with magnifying glasses and,yeah, just being just like a bit
of a dork, like really excited to find details.
And I'm like, oh, that would be so fun to paint.
Like, I really want to paint that.
And then there's that very shorttime that I have to start a
painting before that feeling goes away.

(20:41):
So that's really big part of it is that I'll find something and
I'll be like, OK, I have to start this painting in like 2
days time. So I can really start that
process off with that feeling ofbeing so excited by detail and
it's the subjects and the the forms of them.
But in particular details and textures and stuff that I'd sort

(21:05):
of look for stuff that I know isgoing to be challenging to
paint. Because I really enjoy that
process of sort of problem solving of how to get it to feel
really dry or really wet or whatever the texture is and
temperatures as well, trying to make a painting feel warm or
cold or sunny or winter light, that kind of stuff.

(21:26):
So it's a very like process LED practice, but I don't think it
sort of comes across as that in the end because they're sort of
end up being very colourful, detailed paintings.
But yeah, that that process is really driven by my experience

(21:50):
as I'm painting. And so, yeah, I was saying
before that I don't do any preliminary paintings or
drawings before I start the workbecause it's most exciting when
I don't know where it's heading.And I was telling you as well
that in my honors project, I wastalking about unfolding
composition. So we sort of start with one

(22:13):
plant or one subject and then add things to that painting that
sort of feel that aligned with the experience that I've had in
that place, exploring that environment.
But also that I just feel reallyexcited about putting next to
something else on the painting and and testing that contrast or

(22:34):
that harmony on the actual canvas.
So I never know what they're going to look like and I need to
not know what they're going to look like so that I feel
connected and interested in painting it because otherwise I
think it would feel really boring.
And I'd be really sort of just going through the motions of
painting the work and the way I do it now I'm, I'm excited to

(22:58):
come into the studio and, and start a day of painting because
I'm like, I don't know what what's going to happen today.
I might start painting a completely different plant.
And, and when the process started with the gallery, I was
sort of doing a lot of collage in my sort of head as I was
painting. And that's how I, which used to

(23:21):
explain it is that I was doing like real time collage.
So I'd paint one thing and then,you know, oh, I'd start with a
group of photos from of the plant or in that place or
whatever I was painting from alldifferent angles.
And then I would sort of stitch them together as I was painting.
So I'd start with one plant and then go to a different photo and

(23:43):
add a second plant and then at the first plant, but from
behind, you know, all that stuffall in one, one painting and one
sort of picture plane. But then it sort of evolved into
doing that while I was painting each plant.
So I would sort of start painting one plant and then it
would turn into another plant because I would add like petals

(24:05):
from a different photo. And that part was really fun.
As well as that they people, thefeedback I got was that they
looked realistic and I was like,yeah, but it's not a real plan
because I've made it up like I've, I've reconstructed it.
And that was really fun for me. As well as that, I had that sort

(24:27):
of creative control over it, or not even control, just the
ability to to change it based onmy experience and how I was
feeling with the painting. And they're always intended to
to have a feeling of that sort of childhood wonder and that

(24:47):
sort of sort of fairy enchantment like, yeah, magical
feel to them, which is what I was so interested in as a kid.
That was always fairy parties and mermaids and butterflies and
all of those things. And I don't want to include any

(25:07):
of those actual symbols in the works, but I want them to feel
like that kind of feeling like sort of enchanted forest walks,
that kind of stuff where you feel like there's a bit of
energy in the space. And, and I think now where I'm
at currently, I've realized thata lot of that is connected to

(25:29):
the lighting of those places. And I'm sort of very obsessed
with dappled light at the moment.
And thinking about how looking at a space or a garden or
anything with that kind of lighting makes it feel really
sort of enchanted or, you know, that sense of wonder that I'm

(25:50):
really trying to get across in the work.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, the dappled light.
There's a painting behind the camera that is unfinished.
You told me I I wouldn't have known, but the I, it reminds me
of fishing. And I said this before, but also

(26:12):
it's, it's not fishing here in in Tasmania or even Australia.
It's it's like the the riverbankwhere under a Willow tree.
MMM. My dad teaching me how to fish.
You know, it is, it's it, it, ittakes me back to that, that
place. Yeah.
So, yeah. No, I I I can understand what
you're saying, but I could neverdo what you do.

(26:34):
And you told me, I mean, when you said that these works are
unfinished and how many hours you put into them, you know?
Yeah. So like you said, you're about
1/3 of the way through it. That looks like a finished
painting in my eyes. Yeah.
Very naive and very novice eyes.So, I mean, how long does it
take you? And the other thing is you, you
said you come in for the day, but actually you come in at

(26:55):
night. Yeah.
There's a lot going on here. Yeah.
Some of like depending on the size, but the medium to larger
ones can take up to 200 hours. Sometimes it's less than that.
But if I'm really excited about what I'm doing, I kind of want
to spend more time on it and andsort of draw out that process.

(27:18):
But there is like a window of time that I feel connected to
the work. And if I pass that window and it
closes, I feel almost like irritated, I have to finish this
work. So it's a very, it's all
governed by how connected I feelto the paintings and while I'm

(27:39):
doing them. So that part I have sort of in
the back of my mind, I'm like, OK, we've got to keep moving
with this. Even though it's really fun to
spend time on it to get it finished, we need to keep
working. And yeah, so the, the time that
it takes is so varied and that that those hours like spread out

(28:02):
can be, you know, months. If I'm got a deadline, a couple
of weeks. It just depends how how late
I've left the deadline. But this, yeah, while I've been
in this studio space, it's been really nice to paint in the day.
But I do paint best at night andthose night hours, early hours

(28:26):
of the morning when I sort of finishing up something, when I'm
working at home in my home studio before a show, I go down
to the studio at like 10:00 PM and just go until sunrise.
And that is not particularly healthy or sustainable, but it
is when I do feel most productive.

(28:49):
So it's been a real balance of trying to still be productive in
the space and and paint when I'mhere, but then also allowing
some time for that really like that those night hours of
painting that I feel really connected and really motivated

(29:11):
to work. So like, sometimes I'll let
myself work in the night becauseI know it feels good and I'm not
going to get distracted by anything.
That was the word you used before.
Yeah. I was thinking, Yeah, it you're
distraction free. There's nothing else going on.
Yeah, you can just because I focus it.
I mean, I don't know if you usedthe word focus before the

(29:32):
interview. I don't know.
I I, but. Yeah.
So it's your word. Well, let's use your word focus.
You know, there's a an attentionto detail, there's and, and the
fact that you're not doing any preliminary sketches and, and
you're really drawing on memory a lot and, and following a

(29:53):
feeling, Yeah. And you just become so immersed
I I guess. Definitely, yeah, I think that
part of it is what I'm really looking for.
And I set up a lot of sort of environmental aspects of the
studio to make sure I can get into that immersive state.
But it, yeah, it is like I, I don't feel like I can do

(30:16):
anything if I don't have like a minimum of five hours.
Because anything less than that,it feels like I can't get into
that flow state and that focus. Because, yeah, like the there's
this sort of like a warm up period when I've started
painting where I'm still figuring out for that day,
figuring out what I'm going to do that day.

(30:38):
And then once I get into it, if it's going to be interrupted by
something, I, I feel like I can't commit to getting sort of
deep into that process. So there's a really big problem.
If I have something on in the afternoon or something and I
come in, in the morning, I can'tcommit to, to focusing on the

(30:58):
work because I know it's going to be interrupted at some point.
That part is I'm, I'm frustratedabout how my brain works in that
way because I'm like, you've still got 3 1/2 hours.
You could do a lot of work, but my brain is like, no, we can't.
We can't sink into it because you'll have to stop at some
point. So that's why working at night

(31:20):
is so great because there's no interruptions.
But I'm also free to paint as long as I like, as long as I can
be awake and just keep going if it's working.
And that's a really big part of the process that I've talked
about before with other people is just like, it's not like a
regular job where you go in and you can just do the work.

(31:42):
You have to feel in the mood andfeel motivated and feel inspired
and creative at that time for itto work.
So sometimes I get into the studio and I sit here and I'm
like, why can't I do anything? I'm so annoyed I can't do
anything today, but that's why when I do feel like painting, I
have to be like, you know, cancel plans and be like, I

(32:03):
can't come and get coffee. I feel like painting and this
might not happen for another four days.
I got to use it while it's here.So that same thing with painting
at night is that if I feel like doing it, I'll sort of make a
cup of tea and go down and just commit to it, even if it means I

(32:23):
end up having three hours sleep.But I don't do it before work.
I used to when I had other casual jobs, I'd sort of paint
all night and finish at 6:00 AM and go to bed for a few hours
and get up and go to work and that seemed to be OK.
But not with the work I do now. I need to be focused.

(32:45):
It's not like retail. I have to, I have to be present
in the space and it's pretty hard to do when you're tired.
But yeah, the night painting is I think will be a a problem, but
also a positive of my practice for the rest of my life.
It's just that my brain works best at night.

(33:05):
Yes, yeah. It's interesting that that's
sort of the juxtaposition. Not a juxtaposition, but the
fact, you know, you say you haveto work to be able to live, pay
the rent, put food on the table and, but also, and also to be

(33:25):
able to paint. But then it's, I guess in, in
the ideal world is if, if the world really valued art in the
way it should be valued, there would be a, a way to, for you to
be in the studio whenever you want and working as much as you
do, you know, and that's the, the, I think that's the ultimate
tragedy of the, of, of it all. Yeah.

(33:47):
Yeah, that's why I've, I apply for so many residencies because
it means that for that month or six weeks that you're on
residency, you can fully commit to your practice.
And if you can get that time offwork, it just means that you've
got a solid amount of time to just wake up, paint, go to
sleep, paint, you know, just do that, get into a routine of

(34:12):
committing to it. And there are moments in those
residency times as well that youstill can't do anything, but
you're still in that space and there's no interruptions that
are going to pull you out of that mindset.
So I think that is why I keep looking for residencies because
I'm sort of like, this is if I can do that for a month, I can

(34:33):
get probably like a work done that I'm really, really
satisfied with. But also find out so many things
about what's working in the practice during that process,
because you're sort of reflecting constantly and
there's nothing else getting in the way.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you did tell me.
So you've been in this residencyfor a year at Contemporary Art

(34:58):
Tasmania. Yeah, yeah.
Any. Chance you get that one.
This one was, it was I had applied for something else
through Contemporary Arts Tasmania and not gotten it.
And then this applications for the studios opened up and I was
like, you know, when you get a rejection letter, I feel like
that just motivates me to apply for like 10 other things because

(35:19):
I'm like, OK, I didn't get that one, but what else could I get?
And that part is it's kind of addictive applying for stuff
because you sort of it's like that.
What if thing like this would work really well.
I really, really want it. And then if you don't get it,
you get that rejection letter and you can't let that stop you
from applying to stuff. So I think it just spurs me on

(35:43):
to do more stuff because I will apply for more stuff.
Lots of rejection letters. It happens constantly, but it's
it's part of the process. So yeah, had got a rejection,
but then applied for this other one.
And then I actually didn't get it.
Another artist got it, but then they weren't able to do the
residency. So I was the next on the list

(36:05):
and they'd contacted me with feedback for my studio proposal
and they were like, gave me lotsof feedback, was really great
and really helpful. And then they said, look, you,
you didn't get it, but you're next on the list if someone's
going to pull out. And I was like, no one would
pull out of this. It's an amazing opportunity.
And then someone did. So that was really lucky.

(36:27):
And I've been yeah, here since December last year and it'll be
finishing up in December this year.
And yeah, it's been so amazing to have the space to work on the
scale of paintings that I was interested in doing, but also to
have sort of create a really healthy process of coming to the

(36:50):
studio during the day and, and going home at a reasonable hour.
Yeah. And there's been so many
opportunities for conversation and creates and feedback in this
space and artist talks. And then this is also where the
collaboration started up with Alex, Alex Moss.
So yeah, lots come out of the residency and it's just really

(37:13):
nice to change the scenery a little bit for a while with your
practice and see what happens toyour your work in a different
environment. So yeah, this is sort of opened
up a pretty big space in my brain for this kind of work that
I don't think I, well, I know I wouldn't have been able to do in

(37:33):
my current studio. So it's very exciting.
Yeah. I'll be sad to leave.
I love it. But then you you're an avid
applicant of yeah. So, so something will come up.
Yes, I guess that you, I mean something we again we talked
about before the interview and you've just mentioned there is
just the opportunity. I mean, there, there's a window

(37:55):
and door through to the next artist's space, a studio.
And so, yeah, I mean, just the the chance to be able to get
that feedback. But what you were talking about
was that, you know, when we whenpeople leave art school, I never
went when people, but I mean, I even engineering school, you

(38:16):
know, there's a engineering a lot of labs and things and I
always missed that when I just problem solving, you know, so
crits and you're getting feedback, but there's problem
solving and you're doing it together or whatever.
But you were saying before how, you know, the when you leave our
school, you can go in all sorts of different directions and you

(38:39):
don't have that same sort of feel that that group dynamic
that yeah. So you're getting that when you
with a residency like. This, yeah, definitely.
And, and I really miss that partof all those conversations that
just happen while you're sort ofsomeone's walking by the studio
and you say, come in here. Can you just give me some

(39:00):
feedback quickly? Like I just, I'm doing this
thing and I need some, some helpor some advice.
And this happens in this space quite a lot as we sort of grab
someone on their way out and youcan say, do you have two seconds
to come and look at this and tell me what to think?
That not having that as part of a regular part of the work is

(39:22):
old working is really like you. I think my practice particularly
suffers for that because I don'thave that sort of very regular
feedback. But then sometimes it can be
good because you just get to focus on what you're doing and
just go down a pathway with yourpractice that you know, that

(39:43):
you're really interested in investigating.
And no one's going to turn you around and tell you to go a
different way. But that sort of that community
of artists talking about their work is something that I think
everyone who is, you know, in work, a practicing artist
should, should get a chance to be involved in because it just

(40:04):
changes the way you relate to your work.
And, and also it's so healthy and helpful to be looking at
other artwork and thinking aboutwhat's working and balance and
all of those things. That's such an important part
of. Being active in an art space is
that you're also looking at things and you're critiquing

(40:26):
other people's work and giving feedback of your own to them.
I think that's we need that to keep moving and to not feel
stagnant. So I think that's what's really
good about second echo that we feedback is if really be part of
that, that space and being really good audience members is

(40:47):
is something that we work on a lot and think about a lot.
And then also in personal practice, like I just get my
friends who are also painters orartists and I'm like, can you
come round to have a look? People in the sort of the arts
community that I know when I'm working in my home studio, I'd

(41:09):
like to prioritize inviting people to come and have a look
and give me feedback. And then I've also got really
close friends who I send photos to constantly, just like
peppering people with photos of like, what do you think about
this one? And this is what I've done.
And those friends always send their work back.
So we have this sort of online conversation happening

(41:32):
constantly, especially with a couple of really close friends,
where you're sort of sharing work, sort of little thumbnails
of your work all the time. But it's not the same as having
someone in the real space. We need that for sure.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, it's yeah.I mean, I think I mean, you said

(41:55):
much earlier about for a a long time that your public, your work
wasn't being shown in public. And that was that that was a
thing for me was for making photographs of my life, but no
one ever saw them. And but finding the, you know,
being brave, finding the braveryand the confidence to do that.

(42:17):
And it was only it was actually by joining a a photography group
and starting to to get that feedback on a regular basis and
and learning actually this is what artists do.
Yes. Yeah.
Yeah, we're all talking about our work constantly.
It's, it's, it's so important tobe in those spaces and meeting

(42:40):
people who are also making and to sort of like share the, like
the honesty of, of struggling with your own work.
I think that that is sometimes not talked enough about is that,
you know, if you are making yourwork available to the public,
they're seeing finished work andthat's great.

(43:02):
But there's all these things that happen to get you there and
all of these versions of the work as it's getting made that
no one gets to see. And I really like seeing works
in progress because you can see,you might be able to see where
an artist is going with their work, but you also, when you do
see that final work, you know how much has happened to get

(43:24):
them there. I find that really interesting.
And I think that we need that sort of that perspective of
making artists that like, it doesn't just happen and there
are a lot of mistakes on the waythat make the work finished or,
you know, resolved or not resolved at all.

(43:46):
That might be the point of it. But yeah, I think that being in
those those community spaces and, and sharing your work and
yeah, you like you said, being brave to share your work, even
if it is unfinished or, you know, unresolved.
That's really, it's important tokeep doing that so that we

(44:09):
continue to show our work to people because it is easy to do
a work and if you don't like it,to paint over it or to get rid
of it or throw it away or hide it forever.
But I think some of the most interesting conversations come
out of showing the works that you really don't like and asking
people, you know, to give you that feedback that is, you know,

(44:34):
probably going to feel quite scary to be like, this is a
painting or artwork that I know is not working at all.
But not saying that, just saying, can I get your feedback?
And yeah, people can confirm what you've felt about the work.
Or they might give you completely different reasons why
it's not working, which is really interesting.

(44:58):
Yeah. I think that's that's all worth
it. And with art school, like that's
happening all the time because your work is always in, you
know, half finished or whatever.And, and people are seeing it
and open plan studios, they can always see your work.
And that's sometimes something that I really struggle with is
that I'm sort of can be quite private about my work sometimes

(45:20):
before I feel I'm happy to show it to people, but I need to
consciously remind myself that that's I'm missing opportunities
by doing that. So yeah, being brave, show your
work. Well, it's incredibly, it's an
incredibly vulnerable position, particularly when you're putting
so much of yourself in into yourwork.

(45:41):
And yeah, yeah, look, it's whatever your practice is and
finding I guess, yeah, communityis where you've used there.
But yeah, people, trust is important and feeling safe in
sharing. Yeah, yeah.
And you're going to get yeah, a group of people who are open

(46:04):
minded to to your work and, and to give feedback that isn't
just, I don't like it. Like that doesn't help.
Great. That's the feedback you get from
gallery audiences is that that happens all the time.
People like, I don't like your work.
And I'm like, oh, cool. I can't do much with that right
now, you know, So I always say, why don't you like it?

(46:26):
Can you, Can you tell me? And that was a really the
interesting part about starting up with Death Wide Gallery is
that I, when I started showing work there, they, I got offered
a job as gallery assistant. So sometimes I would not tell
people that I was the artist to just see what they were going to
say because I was like, I want the honest feedback.

(46:47):
And some of it was brutal. Wow.
But it was good because I was like, you know, people you're
always going to to your face be like, oh, it's beautiful.
And it's like, yeah, that's thank you so much for saying
that. But I also would love to hear
why it might not be finished or whatever.
Like you can also say that and people are scared to do that.

(47:09):
So I think that's also a good thing about the community, sort
of engagement with feedback is that you also get brave in
saying to someone, this is not in with my eyes particularly
sitting well with me and my my viewing experience is that my
eye goes straight to this part. And maybe you don't want that.

(47:31):
So yeah, even just providing feedback by explaining your
viewing experience can really help the artist to sort of
decide if they want that or if it's not at all what they're
after and what changes they might need to make to make it
better or to improve the viewingexperience, if that's what they
would like to do. Maybe they want that audience to

(47:53):
feel like it's uncomfortable or or there's sort of tension in
the work. But yeah, it's always helpful to
show someone something and be like, just tell me what your
first, like what your eye direction is doing.
Like where, where is your, if it's a visual art piece, like
where are you? Where is your attention settling

(48:15):
when you're looking at the work?Because that might not be what
you're after. So you need to adjust the work
or be OK with it. That is a red hot tip.
Yeah, I, I like to ask people that.
And I also when I, when I provide feedback, I usually
that's the first thing I say. I say this is what's what's

(48:37):
happening in my experience when I look at the work.
So I'll be like, my eye goes here and then it comes up here
in this motion, or I can't quitesee past this shape or this
color. That's really drawing my
attention. And my attention is staying in
that one place for a longer period of time.
That kind of stuff is really, I think I'm, well, some artists

(49:01):
might not want to hear that, butthat's normally my approach to
feedback is to start off with this is what happened when I
looked at the work. Well, that's it, I suppose.
If you're speaking to people whocan't express what what what it
is immediately to just give thema few pointers, a little bit of
a guideline to to to tease it out of them.
Yeah, definitely, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I experienced, I

(49:24):
experienced that at Second Echo yesterday where we had
rehearsals and feedback constantly throughout the day.
And there was something that I'dbeen noticing, but I it was, it
was subconscious. But it was by the end of the
morning, it suddenly became clear, oh, actually everybody is
moving in this direction and towards the audience and OK.

(49:48):
And then I thought, OK, now I'vegot the words for that.
Yes, yeah. And it was just, it was just, it
was just, it's not prompting butor probing, but it was just this
sort of just having enough of a dialogue to tease it out.
Yeah, Yeah, yeah. That's the part I think that we
sort of, it means if we're practicing that quite often, you

(50:13):
get more comfortable with sort of your first responses just
sort of like come out if something if you asked to
provide feedback. But if you don't practice that
or that doesn't happen very often, it feels really foreign
to think like, oh, I do have feelings about this work and I
do have observations, but I don't know how to explain it.

(50:34):
Like, and that's also something that you can say it can be like
something feels like off or something feels clunky or
something like that. And I can't figure out what it
is. But even that is is valuable
feedback so that the people likethe artists or the creatives can
be like, OK, we don't want it tofeel clunky, so let's work on

(50:55):
that. Yeah.
So that it's a good thing to practice.
It is, and it's something that you can apply to all walks of
life. Something that just came up for
me right then was was sort of, you know, so with social media
and looking at imagery and or listening to things, watching, I

(51:15):
think it's it's almost sort of like dislike, like dislike, like
dislike, dislike, dislike, dislike.
Yeah, yeah. And you the, the, and so there's
a perhaps a habit developing there for so many of us, me
included, that perhaps is a little bit counter or a lot

(51:39):
counter to what you've just described is to actually to be
able to spend time together and feel comfortable having a
dialogue about a piece of work because everyone's going to
benefit from that in the long run.
Yeah, definitely, yeah. And it's just also like times I
go to exhibitions and I'll go around and there'll be works
that I like, I like, and I'll belike, I like this.

(52:03):
And then I'll try and actively think about why I like it.
Like, what is it that is drawingme to that work?
And why do I feel, you know, that it has given me a nice
experience. And the same with disliking the
work. I can't just walk around and be
like, I don't like that because it doesn't.

(52:25):
And sometimes I do. Sometimes I'm just like, I just
don't like it. And I couldn't tell you why.
I just don't don't feel connected to that work at all.
But it's always good just to practice in your own head like,
oh, initially I felt, no, I don't like this.
And then you might look at it a bit longer and ask yourself why,
like what's bothering you about the work or what do you not feel

(52:45):
engaged by? And then through that sort of
internal conversation, you can figure out what kind of like
what elements of successful workyou really like and you might
want to incorporate in your own practice or you think about when
you are giving feedback to otherpeople.

(53:06):
If you see a really successful work and then you say, oh, This
is why I think it's really great, then you can see when
that might not be happening in someone else's work and be like,
oh, I saw this work the other day and this is what I really
loved about it. And then this might be helpful
for improving your, you know, offering of your work.

(53:26):
And it's also like being giving feedback is also to be aware
that the artist can completely reject your feedback.
I think that's also something that isn't practiced enough in
art school is that like teacherswill provide a lot of feedback
and then not always so open to the students being like, I don't

(53:50):
want to do that. And I don't feel like that's
going to be good. And then they sort of think of,
you know, you're resisting my advice.
And it's like, well, you, you can, you can totally resist
feedback and advice. I think it's just about being
open to receiving it in the first place and then you can
decide. But it's it doesn't help when

(54:13):
you are, you know, getting feedback from a group or one
person and you are already very resistant to what they're going
to say, you know, like that doesn't lead anywhere.
Well, I see in part of the crit,yeah, regular crit school, the
process of that just repeatedly is to be, is to help students to

(54:34):
feel more comfortable with that.And those who just can't break
down that resistance, they must,you know, they, they probably
need something else to be able to help with that or it's never
going to be right for them. Yeah, I think that it, it's
something that we're like, you know, they talk about like real
world outside of art school is that you will encounter people

(54:58):
not liking your work. If you continue to make art work
out of art school, you're not going to get the feedback that
is as considered as the feedbackfrom other artists, if that sort
of makes sense. Like the best feedback that
you'll get is from other artistsbecause they're thinking about

(55:18):
process and form and context andconcept and all of those things.
The feedback from audiences thataren't artists is.
Is. Sometimes really hard to accept
because it doesn't. It's not rooted in any sort of
understanding of art. Sometime like sometimes that

(55:39):
would just be like I had to somefeedback for excuse.
Me. Had feedback from a painting I
had at Despot gallery which was audience member or gallery
visitor. Was just really angry that I had
painted rhododendrons because they were an invasive species

(56:04):
and she was just like really upset about it.
And I was like, oh, I was like, I'm sorry.
But she was like, I hate it. I hate the work because it's
rhododendrons. And I was like, OK, is there
anything about the painting thatyou might like, like form wise?
And she was just like, no, I hate it.
Like I hate it. So that sort of feedback is

(56:27):
really sometimes a little bit confusing because it's not based
in and understanding of art. So the best thing we can do is,
I suppose, expose our work to somany different audiences that
you're getting all this sort of feedback, but also really
valuing feedback from other artists because it's going to be

(56:49):
helpful. Yeah.
And I think being able to acknowledge and understand that
that particular person, you know, clearly has a there's a
reason that they haven't revealed, but to accept that
that's their stuff. Yeah.
And that, that it's not, not, not you're you know, you're not
going to get another 100 people saying I I hate it because it's,

(57:13):
you've got invasive species. Yeah.
You know, it's that's a that's aone off.
It's it's their stuff. They for them to work out for
themselves if they choose. Yeah, it did open my sort of
mind a little bit to how I hadn't really considered that
flowers or plants could be offensive.
And that was helpful to think about.

(57:35):
I was like, maybe I need to be more conscious of what I choose
or not that it would affect the choice of plants that I would
use, but just to be aware that some choices might be taken in a
certain way. And I won't, wouldn't change
what I would choose to paint and, and why I would paint it.

(57:55):
But just to be aware that that'seven a thing.
Because I was really surprised that it was so upsetting and I
hadn't thought of that before. So it is always, you know,
everything has a, you know, if you want to take it and take it
on board as, as feedback in general, it can have a place,

(58:17):
but it doesn't mean you have to change anything about your
practice. It's just just good to hear what
people feel when they look at a work.
And that's usually what I'm whatI'm trying to do is to create a
feeling in the works like the paintings that I do.
And it doesn't have to match thefeeling that I am drawing from

(58:40):
as I'm making the work. But if anyone comes back and has
like a sensory or emotional reaction to the work, I'm like,
this is this is great. This is what I was trying to
get. Like, I really want that.
And that means that you have to be open to all of the emotional
or sensory responses that peoplehave.
Yeah, absolutely. Well, Josh Foley talked about

(59:02):
this in Josh's episode. He painted his car and and he he
has, you know, bits of lumps of epoxy.
And I mean, they're quiet, they're sculpted, and it's
striking, you know, you can't miss it.
But yeah, he said. You know, there are people who
who are really quite offended that he drives down their St.

(59:23):
Yes, yeah. And he loves it, yes, but I
mean, not every artist is wants to be controversial and nor
should they need to be. But it's.
Yeah, as you say, I think the way you've described it, Maggie
is beautiful in that. Yeah.
You, you want to evoke, invoke emotion and you have to be open

(59:43):
to arrange. And that's a wonderful thing.
There's something that that sortof.
I really want to come back to just before we press record.
You were talking to me about the.
What is an emerging artist? You know, so you, you, you, you,
you, you say you're an emerging artist.

(01:00:05):
And then you were sort of sayingthat there are different
perceptions of what that is. And I think it ties into what we
what you've just been telling inthat, you know, these are the
sorts of things that emerging artists go through, you know,
how leaving art school or putting it, you know, first
putting your work out into the world and then getting feedback.

(01:00:27):
And and you use the word successbefore as well, you know, and it
is this sort of question of of, you know, you to sort of root it
in your practice. What I understand of it, you
know, you follow a feeling, you evoke emotion through through

(01:00:48):
the work that you produce in this really extensive process
and you carry on making you keepapplying for residencies.
You find you make the time and space to do this work.
You get represented by a gallery.
You have residencies. I think you just said that the
but it's this you're you're constantly evolving your

(01:01:11):
practice and as an emergency. So how do you feel about this
moniker of the emerging artist? And yeah, what what do you, when
will you no longer be at emerging?
I'd say there's there's there's,there's the question.
The question, yeah. And it's, it's so I have no

(01:01:34):
idea. And I think we're all a little
bit unsure of that. And we kind of I'm always sort
of looking for someone to tell me when that will be, if, if
that will be. I mean, I might be emerging
forever, I don't know. I am, by the way, yeah.
It's. Just yeah.
In in everything in life. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(01:01:57):
I mean, if it's defined by, if you're still learning and
figuring it out, then I don't think that will ever stop.
So yeah, emerging forever. Some people do define it as in
very like sort of timeline basedsort of descriptions of like I

(01:02:17):
think it was five years after your first solo exhibition or
it's like a certain amount of time passed since you left uni.
I think it's the, the Tasmania, the Women's Art Prize Tasmania,
when you apply for that, they have a section where you can

(01:02:39):
elect that you're an emerging artist and they have a
description, a few descriptions in there.
And, and, but then they say it's, it's up to you whether you
still consider yourself an emerging artist.
So if that is the case and we get to decide I, I don't know if
I would ever feel like I have. Reached.
Reached mid. Korea or anything beyond which I

(01:03:02):
can't even think about because that's, you know, established
artist seems, you know, way in the, you know, not even actually
on my mind because I'm still a little bit unsure of what's
what's happening. And and when I was asked to have
so I was had my work up in the grad show for 2018, the end of

(01:03:27):
my major paintings, not the end of my degree.
I hadn't graduated yet. I still had electives and things
to do, but I that was when Steven Joyce from Despot Gallery
saw my work in the Grad show andasked if I would be part of the
summer show that was coming up. Which is how that you sort of

(01:03:49):
enter the space as the Despot Gallery space as an emerging
artist. And I remember exactly where I
was when I read the e-mail from Steven and I called him in like
2 1/2 minutes since he sent the e-mail because I just saw it
come up. And I was like, Oh my God.
And I was like, it's a gallery. And my art teacher, I bet what

(01:04:13):
was talking to me about installing the grad show and
they said they were like, what will you do if you get asked to
be represented by a gallery? And I was like, oh, don't be
ridiculous, like to be silly. That's not going to happen.
And then, yeah, like, I didn't even realize that there were
galleries coming around to look at the work.

(01:04:34):
Like I didn't know that that wasa thing.
So I was like, extremely shocked, but extremely excited.
And I rang Steven and was, you know, just about crying in the
car because I was just so excited.
And. And then they were like, do you
want to come into the gallery? And I was like, whenever you'd
like me to like, just tell me when it is.

(01:04:55):
Like, you know, I was, I was tooenthusiastic.
And they said that. Well, they didn't say that
later, but that was just like, yeah, we could tell you were
like very keen. Yeah.
This is like the dream of a gallery wanting to show you
where I come. And so that was some very fun,
but also scary and big for me. But so I've been represented by

(01:05:22):
them since 2018. I don't.
I think the emerging artist thing is also tied up in if you
are moving forward in your career as an artist and you are
getting recognition or showing your work multiple times to the

(01:05:43):
public. If you do still call yourself an
emerging artist, does that mean you take space away from other
emerging artists at the beginning?
So I think about that sometimes in terms of like applying for
emerging art prizes and stuff. And we've got Henry Jones
Emerging Art Prize coming up, which I would like to apply for,

(01:06:05):
but I kind of think that it might be the last year that I
can apply for it. Because even though I still feel
like I'm emerging and I'm not anywhere near leaving that
space, applying for things like that might mean that I, you
know, take up space from, you know, students who are just

(01:06:25):
coming out of the art school or something like that.
So I think it, it, it's like being emerging, but like
consciously being emerging so that you recognize that you are
not at the starting point anymore, but that you still feel
like you're not at the end of emerging either.
You know, like it's, it's reallyhard to think about.

(01:06:49):
But I think about it a lot. And I think about it in terms of
how someone who hasn't had public shows or something like
that might look at someone like me who has had two solo shows
and, and group shows and stuff, and they might think, you know,
why are they applying for this emerging art prize?

(01:07:10):
Because they have, you know, being, you know, somewhat
successful in the art space. So yeah, I think I, I think that
it's, it's a judgment call of your own and it is based on
where you feel you are. But I think you also have to be

(01:07:31):
honest with yourself as well about, you know, that if you
have achieved some stuff, it's OK to be like I'm, I have done
some things. Yeah.
Because I feel very, very, stillshy and very, I want to be very
humble about all of the amazing opportunities.

(01:07:52):
And I don't think it's part of, I don't want it to be part of my
presentation of my work that I'mlike, oh, look at, look at these
things. It's, it's not.
I don't like that at all. It does.
There is none of that. Maggie, You you use the word
humble. I mean, you are so considerate
of others. Yeah.
You're always thinking of othersand that that's that's a that's

(01:08:14):
a gift. And yeah, Look, I think I
hadn't, you've just raised something I hadn't thought of is
about how to consider others because, you know, it's going
back to this idea of we're all evolving in our practice and and
there there's always someone coming through and yeah, and
that's why those prizes will tryto categorize, you know,

(01:08:39):
categorization I have a problem with.
Me too. Generally speaking in life, but
there's a good reason for in those sort of circumstances.
Yeah, yeah, it does help you sort of define who you're up
against, I guess. I mean, if you're thinking about
entering into something and the thought of being sort of judged

(01:09:01):
alongside someone who has, you know, 25 years of gallery
representation or something likethat, it's sort of things like,
oh, well, I won't even bother, you know?
But then at the same time, I think that it would be so nice
if we could all feel a little bit less pressure to define our

(01:09:23):
sort of practice as reaching a certain level of success.
And then something meaning something like, you know, you
sort of that there are like universal milestones where I, I
don't actually think that there are in each practice is
completely different and the trajectory is going to be very
different. Speed of, you know, practice

(01:09:44):
development will be totally different.
So that's some, I have so many questions about prizes and those
sort of opportunities. It's sort of like this is, it's
great to enter into them and youknow, exposure and all of those
things. But then I'm sort of like, but
it's also kind of like, I don't know if we should all be lining

(01:10:07):
up all the paintings and being like, this one's the best one
and this one's the worst one. Like that, that feels really
because you're just getting a snapshot of that person's whole
practice. And yeah, it's, it's, it's
interesting. I think it's a sort of bigger
conversation with a lot of. It is, it is.
It keeps coming up on the podcast.

(01:10:28):
And for me, having spent time with artists mostly in the UK
but elsewhere in the world, yeah, it's, it's very much an
Australian thing, this idea of the art prize.
I mean, there are art prizes in all corners of the world, but
the, there's something about theculture of that.

(01:10:49):
Yeah. And I haven't really got a
handle on it yet, so that's all I'll say.
But I'm, I'm intrigued by it andI'm not engaged in that myself,
but yeah, yeah. Look, it's.
Yeah. Anyway, yeah, I, I, yeah, I.
I I'm in danger going in political.

(01:11:10):
So I said that's what I'm tryingto segue.
We can keep it away from that. Yeah, yeah.
I, I, yeah. Look.
No, but Maggie, I mean, there's so much in that for, for all of
us who are listening in, you know, I think to, for us to
think about our own practices and how we want to engage with

(01:11:33):
whether it's arts prizes or, or just be part of communities and
communities practice or, or whatever.
But it it's this thing of I think you've given us.
A few red hot tips there about. Just how to be in in these
spaces, to be with others and to, to, to, yeah, to be

(01:11:55):
considerate of others as well. And that we did tease the, the
PhD. It's, it's something you let's,
you know. So I always end with what's
next? Where are you going?
So perhaps if we where's your painting going and then, and
then you also, but I mean, your work and PhD is a consideration

(01:12:22):
around again, involving your working practice.
Yeah, so painting wise, I've. Got my.
Next solo show? At Best Buy Gallery, August,
September next year, 2025. And so that sort of set up as
sort of have a solo show every two years and then this group

(01:12:46):
show opportunities in between. But yes, and my last solo was
2023. OK, I don't know.
But yeah. So my next one's coming up.
So I'm working on work. For that at the moment.
And so that will. Take up.

(01:13:06):
The next period of painting these works around here will be
in that show, which is really exciting.
And then, yeah, just with options for local residencies
stuff. Got one in Queenstown coming up

(01:13:27):
in November. And then for my working
practice, Yeah, I'm really excited about doing, hopefully
doing PhD stop recording. But did we use it all?
While. This is this.
This is great. So those are.
So the cameras are still recording.

(01:13:49):
So sorry to interrupt you, Maggie.
Sorry, audience. The.
So yeah, the audio's run out. So we've definitely, this is
definitely you. You're the record holder for the
longest podcast. But look, I did tell you I was
going to talk a lot like. This is great.
I'm I'm, I love to listen. So, Maggie.
Sorry so please carry on. I was just wanting to do a PhD

(01:14:15):
eventually. That's sort of in my.
On my list of things I'd really like to do and investigate
really positive and successful ways of empowering.
Artists to make their. Work artists with disabilities,
but also just anyone in general who wants to tell their stories

(01:14:36):
through making art. So I think the PhD would like it
to be sort of the intersection between art and health, I
suppose, or sort of positive psychology of like ways that
really good things that we can do to continue engaging with our
own practice, but also in the community with other people

(01:14:58):
collaborating and all of the beautiful things that Second
echo really sort of champions inthat space.
And so the PHDI think I haven't figured out how I will sort of
teach it, but I think I would love it to be an involving
research project that sort of looks at really good ways to

(01:15:23):
support artists. But also I imagine that there
would have to be some sort of personal inclusion of how these
beautiful artists inspired me tocontinue developing my practice.
So there is that crossover of the size of my practice that

(01:15:45):
they sort of meet in the middle and feed into one another.
But I'm really. Interested in how working?
In that space with those artistshas has influenced my own work
and it definitely has. It's made me feel a lot more
willing to be more honest in my work and more like unapologetic

(01:16:06):
with my ideas and creativity. And so that part is really
important. So I'm not sure how that will
come together as research, but you know, a lot of the advice
has been that I should go to do this research in sort of
countries and studios and spacesthat have done this really well

(01:16:29):
and have been doing it really well for a long time.
But one of the really important things about doing research is
that I want it to be based on Tasmanian artists.
So I want it to be about this community in this space and how
we are making artwork in this tiny corner of the world.
So maybe it will include some travel to other studio spaces,

(01:16:51):
but I want the research to generally be about Tasmanian
population. So that will hopefully happen at
some point. We'll see.
Yeah. I'm excited.
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, look, there is something. Special.
About this little Isle of revise, I don't know if I can
call it mine yet. I've only been here four years,

(01:17:11):
but this? Aren't.
Yours. Yeah.
Here are You. You can, you're.
It's like an emerging artist thing.
You decide. When you're a local.
I think I just did. Happy to have you.
Yeah, my dog's Tasmanian. He was born in bred.
Oh, well, there you go. Definitely my.
Family. Is now Tasmanian.
Oh, look, Maggie, thanks. So much where can where can

(01:17:35):
people find you? Instagram or yeah my Instagram
is Maggie Mae and Jeffries. And I've got my photo on
Instagram is me as a kid wearinga tiara, like laughing.
So that's it's not a painting and it should be, but I just
can't take it down. It's just love that.

(01:17:56):
But that's what. People looking for me as an
artist and then there's that face me as a kid with a very
funny haircut. So that's me on Instagram and
then I've got my artist page on Despot gallery website as well.
And yeah, I think that's probably it for now.

(01:18:17):
I'm, I need to develop a websiteand all of these things, but
that that part of it admin that I all the admin that I need to
do is not as interesting as actually painting.
That's a sign of a successful artist, you see, so.
So so so. Yeah, when they when they have

(01:18:38):
someone who can do all that stuff for them, Yeah.
Then do we really want that? Yeah.
Now, look, Maggie, that's enough.
We Instagram. I mean, you know, Instagram is
the place to go. Despard.
Well, I'll make sure there are links to to you and to Despard
in the show notes. And I just say thank you so

(01:19:00):
much. It's been such a joy.
Thank you so much for doing this.
This is great. I it was.
It was. So lovely and we talked so fast
and briefly at 2nd. Echo that I was.
Just like this is going to be a fun conversation and I did tell
you that I would just keep running into you told me to stop
talking. So that's good.
I'll stop now, thank. You so much.

(01:19:23):
Thanks for listening to. This episode of Connect.
Curate. Create.
I hope you found inspiration andinsights.
That you can apply to your. Own creative work.
For highlights and links, check out the show.
Notes and be sure. To follow us on your favorite
podcast player so you never missan episode.
TuneIn next time as I continue to explore.

(01:19:44):
Life and work in the. Arts.