November 13, 2025 • 34 mins
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Welcome back, Poultry Nerds! In this packed episode, Jennifer finally gets Carey to spill all the juicy details about his trip to the 2025 Ohio National Poultry Show — one of the largest, loudest, and most legendary poultry events in the country.
Carey shares his full unfiltered experience:
• Meeting fans and podcast listeners in person
• 8,100 crowing birds under one roof
• Anxiety, atmosphere, and the unbelievable energy
• Gamefowl appearing at the show for the first time
• The gorgeous birds… and the birds that should’ve gone straight to chicken dinner
• Youth exhibitors with lab coats, trophies bigger than they are, and serious showmanship
• Modern Game, Silkies, huge modeled birds, and a stand-out black-and-white Polish that stole the show
• What people get wrong about standards
• The chaos of the sale barn
• Traveling challenges, show specials, and how he avoided another hotel trailer theft
• Why Carey might actually show birds next year (even after swearing he wouldn’t)
PLUS — Jennifer reveals details from her new feed trial research, why fertility and chick vigor matter more than anything, and how even small breeders can run accurate feed comparisons like the big commercial companies.
If you’ve ever wondered what it’s like to attend the Ohio National… this is the no-filter, boots-on-the-ground episode you don’t want to miss.
Ohio National Poultry Show, 2025 poultry show, gamefowl standards, poultry exhibition, youth poultry showmanship, poultry breeding, poultry judging, Polish chickens, Silkie chickens, Modern Game birds, sale barn poultry, chicken shows USA, poultry podcast, gamefowl podcast, poultry community, hatching eggs, feed trials, poultry fertility testing, breeder flock management
Join Carey of Show Pro Farm Supply and Jennifer of Bryant's Roost as we delve into chickens and quail (mostly) to help you enjoy your birds more and worry less. Backyard chicken keeping shouldnt be stressfull, let's get back to the simple days
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jennifer (00:38):
Welcome poultry nerds.
So we are going to discuss theOhio National Show because I
didn't go and I have reframedfrom asking Carey all of the
good stuff so that he can tellBo all of us at the same time.
So Carey, give it to me.
(00:59):
Tell me all the juicy gossip.
Carey (01:01):
I really had a good time and this is my third year in a
row going.
And it's, it's like become athing.
I see people that I talk to onthe internet all the time'cause
it's one of the biggest shows ofthe year and I see'em, we get to
chit chat in person, stuff likethat.
(01:23):
So that's a pretty cool aspectof it.
I took a 30 minute long videoWow.
With my camera.
Walking up and down several ofthe aisles looking at the birds,
I probably have to edit parts ofit out because I was judging the
(01:47):
birds in my mind that, you know,that's the whole past my game,
foul judging test.
So like I started going up thatrow and I looked at the birds.
I couldn't take'em out, but Ilooked at'em, made mental notes.
I went back after the judging tosee what the cards say, and I
(02:08):
was really close.
I mean, you really can't judge abird without touching it, but
yeah, that's pretty cool.
But I'm gonna have to do thatbecause a lot of people, if
you've never been, unless you'relike in the room hearing the
extreme number of birds crowing
Jennifer (02:29):
8,100.
Carey (02:31):
Yeah.
And like the people, and it'slike a, it's an atmosphere
thing.
It's really cool.
Now, my anxiety was really highat some points because there's a
lot of people there, but I mean,at least they're all chicken
people.
And I'll say this, this willgive you an idea of the fate
(02:54):
that I have in chicken people.
Last year I was like, okay, I'mgonna.
Pack up my stuff in my trailer,go to the hotel, go to bed
early, get up, make the 500 andsome odd mile drive home.
I'll be good.
Trailer gets broke into at thehotel, they get some of my
(03:16):
inventory, they get my, a lot ofmy tools.
Bam.
This time Jeff says, Hey.
There's no sense in us bothdriving.
Do you have anything in yourtruck that you need?
I said, I have my backpack withmy laptop.
He was like, okay, grab that.
(03:37):
We'll take mine back to thehotel.
I left my truck in the parkinglot at the para ground.
I didn't have a scratch on it.
Jennifer (03:46):
Oh, good.
Carey (03:47):
I was so glad everything was still there and still locked
up.
But I got to meet a lot ofpeople.
That were, first time I'd evermet'em in person.
I had some poultry nerd stickersout on the table and one person
just, you know, I see'em walkingby casually'cause I am a
watcher.
(04:07):
And they looked at the table andthey stopped and they looked at
me and You're Carey.
I said, yeah, I love yourpodcast.
And I was like.
My people, they listen.
I don't know if they all followinstructions, but they listen
(04:30):
and I mean, that made me feelreally good.
And I, I saw Bronwyn and a fewother people that we've had on
the show as guest and some I metbefore, some I haven't.
And I gotta see her birds and Iwill say.
She has made a lot of progressin the past year with her
(04:51):
modeled ginormous birds and youknow, when I first got
introduced to the model birdthing, I really wasn't that into
it.
But now I hate them less thansome other types of birds.
So, yeah, but like, it's anatmosphere thing.
(05:14):
I, I enjoy going, so we'lldefinitely be back next year.
I had several people ask meabout the show specials and, if
I'm there, I'm gonna do'em.
But it, it was, it's a goodtime.
Beautiful birds, the ones thatwon some of the, the places.
(05:38):
I really like seeing the youth'cause I mean, that's the future
of any hobby is the youngpeople.
But like some of those littlekids standing in front of that
big Ohio National sign withtheir trophy, that's almost as
big as they are holding theirbird.
Just proud as they could be.
(05:59):
I'm like, yeah, that's cool.
Jennifer (06:02):
So Michael mjs dad sent me a picture yesterday of
mj and he went up there just todo his showmanship with his
little mankins.
Did you see him up there?
Mm-hmm.
He won third in the juniorshowmanship.
Carey (06:18):
And look, some of those kids are so serious.
Like I saw'em with lab coatsthat had their name on it.
Jennifer (06:26):
He has one.
Carey (06:27):
Probably an embroidery of one of their birds or the same
type bird.
That's, and that's cool.
You know, I really like seeingkids get into stuff and learn a
lot about it.
You know, I, I always thoughtwhen my son was a teenager,
(06:48):
people were like, I can'tbelieve he's does this and does
that.
And I'm like.
You know what, if he's spendinga couple thousand dollars on a
hunting dog and a hundreddollars here or a couple hundred
dollars there on the chicken, Iain't gotta worry about him with
drugs and women'cause he ain'tgot enough money for neither
(07:09):
one.
And I, I, I can honestly say Inever had a problem with either
with him'cause he was too broke,but he loved his hunting.
He loved his chickens
Jennifer (07:24):
So do you happen to know who came the furthest to
get there?
Yeah, I know they do travel allthe way from the west coast
though.
Carey (07:33):
There was, I do know there was a lady there from
Canada.
I'm not sure what part, but shehad some really nice looking
birds and there was a big dealabout that, probably how she got
'em across the border.
I don't know.
Yeah, because that's achallenge, but you know, they,
(07:53):
it's, the place was Okay.
I did hear rumors that the APAslike big annual national event
is gonna be there again nextyear.
So that'll probably bring awhole lot of extra people.
You know, it might be another12, 14,000 bird year.
(08:17):
And, got the show bug.
Never, never been a fan of itbefore because of all the T that
goes in with it.
And which there, there's stillsome lines that I ain't
crossing, but you know, there'sa show in December, 2025
depending on when you'relistening to this.
(08:39):
And, um.
I've downloaded and printed outin entry form.
Jennifer (08:44):
You said you weren't ever gonna show.
Carey (08:47):
Like I said, I've downloaded it and printed it.
Jennifer (08:52):
Yeah.
You know, I did it for a whileand it's a lot of work.
I mean, it's you washing thebird.
Well, can, you've gotta keep thebirds in condition.
Then you have to wash the birds.
Then you have to clean the, keepthe birds clean after you wash
'em, but before the show andthen box'em, travel with them.
You gotta take feed and waterand baby wipes to keep'em clean.
(09:17):
And then you gotta haul'em inand cage'em in.
Oh, it is a lot of work.
And then on top of that, youknow, all your normal stuff and
then somebody's gotta be here totake care of your stuff while
you're gone.
I just, I think I've pretty muchdecided that it, it just may be
too much for me.
You know, you can't, you can'tdo everything.
(09:38):
And that's one of those,
Carey (09:40):
I'm gonna, do, I have all intentions to take birds up
there.
I'm not saying that won't be theonly time I ever do it.
I'm not real big on using a babywipe on a baby, so I'm gonna
have to just hope my bird don'thave any accidents.
Jennifer (09:59):
So when it Jerry couch from, um, deep south of
Orpingtons, he, he helped me alot when I was getting started
and one of the tricks he told mewas, you know, those.
Those brushes that we had likein the eighties growing up and
had like one spindle every halffor three quarters of an inch.
(10:19):
Yeah.
Those are the perfect size to gothrough the fluffy butts.
So you can brush your chickenbutts.
So we bought a two pack on ourway to the show and I put one in
my purse and then one in mychicken pack.
Mm-hmm.
And I took it out and wasbrushing my hair one day.
(10:40):
And David just looks at me andhe is is that the chicken ass
brush?
Carey (10:44):
And you probably looked at it and you were like.
Is this the extra one or is thisthe one that I actually used?
Jennifer (10:51):
No, I knew what I was doing, but he just thought it
was the same color.
Carey (10:56):
Mm.
Jennifer (10:58):
Okay.
I have to say it was,
Carey (10:58):
I I know he didn't use it.
Jennifer (11:00):
No, he didn't use it.
So the sail barn is supposed tobe as big as the show, right?
Carey (11:06):
It definitely is.
There, there was a lot to beseen in the sale barn.
A lot.
I don't know for sure about acount.
I ain't gonna say that there was8,000 birds in there, but there
was several thousand birds inthere and some of them were
(11:27):
really nice looking.
I.
Some of'em should have been acoal.
Jennifer (11:35):
Well, somebody's coal is somebody else's cream of the
crop, right?
No.
Not that.
We'll go
Carey (11:42):
with that.
Jennifer (11:43):
That one was chicken dinner.
Carey (11:44):
We're being nice.
Jennifer (11:45):
Okay.
Carey (11:47):
Um,
Jennifer (11:47):
so you're going back next year?
Carey (11:49):
Year?
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
I'll go back.
Even if, just for thecamaraderie.
To see the people and the factthat it's going to be, if it is
there, the a P'S big one.
I know there'll be a lot morepeople there, so yeah, I, I'll
go.
(12:09):
I might actually try to talkDavid into going No,
Jennifer (12:12):
no, he won't go.
He doesn't care.
He only cares about chickens'cause I care about chickens.
You have better luck takingTamara.
Carey (12:20):
She's actually going with me to Knoxville.
Jennifer (12:22):
Oh, well good.
Carey (12:23):
Yeah.
Jennifer (12:24):
Yeah.
All right then.
So I guess the only last thingis is how many days exactly is
the show?
Carey (12:32):
So this time the show started at nine on Saturday,
coop in was all day on Friday.
Vendors were unloading theirtrucks and.
Exhibitors were some of thembringing in chickens by the
(12:53):
droves.
One I saw if I wanted to do lotsof showing, I saw what I would
build this dgu.
It is probably even theconditioning cage, like these
birds stay in it for, from thetime they wash'em.
(13:14):
Till the time they go to theshow so they can't get dirty.
This thing's like six foot tall,eight feet long on wheels and it
I wanna say it had five tall andseven across birds
Jennifer (13:34):
silkies.
Yes.
Carey (13:37):
So I saw a lot of silkies in one.
And I saw a lot of them modernsin another.
Jennifer (13:43):
Oh, I love the moderns.
They look like Barbie dolls
Carey (13:46):
to me.
Like they got them, they got thelegs.
Yeah.
Jennifer (13:49):
They look like barbie dolls.
Carey (13:51):
I mean, it is like a chicken nugget with a head and
legs.
Jennifer (13:55):
Okay.
What was the most interestingbird there that you hadn't seen
before?
Or was there one or just themost interesting bird?
Carey (14:05):
I mean, I had seen most of them, but I will say this,
this year is the first time, tomy knowledge that Game F were in
the Ohio show.
And they had a couple rows ofthose.
The owners were either.
(14:25):
Don't know what they had or notbeing fully transparent because
the names that some of'em hadfor breed wasn't what it was.
Hmm.
Which is kind of funny and kindof not because with a game file
world, a lot of stuff has thename that they have given it.
(14:49):
And that's not what the actualtype and breed is of the bird.
And a lot of people don't know.
Two weeks ago I went to a gamefoul show in Alabama.
It was their annual fundraiserhad a good, many good size
(15:12):
turnout.
And there was people showingbirds that didn't even know a
standard existed, which wastragic.
Because a lot of them were verynasty with what they had to say
about what the judge put on theticket.
Jennifer (15:30):
Well, if you're just getting started, I could see
where, you know, you're missinginformation and you don't know.
So
Carey (15:37):
true.
But.
Like when somebody tells youthere's a standard that dictates
everything about that bird,don't argue with'em.
Jennifer (15:48):
No.
You should be open and open tolearning when you go.
Carey (15:52):
But I mean that was, there was some of that going on.
There's definitely a difference,but I will say seeing game foul
at the A PA show and.
Ohio was encouraging for peoplethat do keep and breed game
foul.
(16:12):
And there were some that werepretty, and some I wouldn't have
brought.
Jennifer (16:20):
That's okay.
Carey (16:21):
There was a ton of moderns and there was a ton of
silkies.
Well, I'll say this, so the birdthat I saw that really stuck
out.
It was a polish.
Okay.
Jet Black, beautiful white snowfall, eraser head.
(16:46):
Like poof.
Jennifer (16:49):
The crest was white.
Carey (16:51):
Yes, they were.
They were, the birds were allblack, white, crested, and like,
it just looked really clean tome.
Almost like a, like a penguin intuxedo in one of the cartoon
movies or something.
Jennifer (17:07):
So I'm courting a Polish breeder to come onto the
podcast.
They're interested but haven'tfully committed yet.
Carey (17:16):
That'd be fun.
Jennifer (17:17):
Uhhuh.
Carey (17:18):
cause like, I mean, I've seen a lot of chickens in
person, but I had never seenthese and.
I was unpacking some stuff andthis guy comes by with a cart
that has a lot of them in boxes.
He's got one in his hand and I'mlike, was this your ride or die
(17:43):
buddy that rode in the frontwith you?
You know, you've got like 10, 15boxes on your cart.
Was this an extra, whichapparently was a thing because
one lady says, oh, I brought 15,but I'm going home with 26.
Like, okay.
(18:04):
But he, he was carrying thatbird and I just, I thought it
was pretty.
Jennifer (19:00):
Mm-hmm.
I
Carey (19:01):
liked it.
Jennifer (19:03):
There's a lot of neat birds.
Yeah.
I hope everybody had fun.
I hope everybody remembered tobring all their birds home.
I saw somebody forgot one andYep.
Uhuh saw the post, but I thinkit all worked out.
And, uh, how do,
Carey (19:18):
how do you forget your chicken?
Jennifer (19:20):
Well, I think there was something else that happened
there.
Like maybe that somebody elsebought it and didn't get it, or
I don't know exactly.
I just saw the post.
Carey (19:28):
No, now I have heard of that happening.
Like people buy birds andthey're like, I'm gonna pick it
up on Sunday after awards, andthey don't.
Pick it up.
Jennifer (19:38):
Yeah, I think it all took care.
It, it worked itself out on thepost I saw so.
Well, I'm glad you're home safeand everybody had a good time
and um, so I was working onfinishing up my next feed trial
while you were busy running theroads and talking to show
people.
Carey (19:58):
I mean, feed trials is important.
Jennifer (20:00):
Mm-hmm.
Carey (20:01):
They are.
You need to do that.
Jennifer (20:03):
So the commercial companies like Ross or Cobb,
they're always runningexperiments and testing because
it's all about the bottom line.
It's about how much does it costto get this bird to this point?
What makes this bird a grade, Aquality chick versus mm-hmm.
(20:26):
This other bird what parameterscan change?
And I'm having, I'm not gonnadivulge all of what I'm doing
right now, but I am working.
On some stuff on the side, andI'm more, I couldn't
Carey (20:42):
imagine you working on stuff on the side.
Jennifer (20:44):
I am becoming more and more knowledgeable by the day,
um, with the commercialcompanies and how they operate.
And so like one of the tests maybe if you heat the incubator up
just a little bit, can thatspeed the growth to cut back on
the number of days in theincubator?
(21:07):
Yes, you can make them grow alittle quicker, but you always
sacrifice chick quality.
Carey (21:15):
Mm-hmm.
So
Jennifer (21:15):
there's these, you know, these tests that they do
and these parameters that theyfollow to get it exactly right
and.
And if you're going to learn,then you learn from the
companies that are spending themillions and millions of dollars
to study this stuff.
Carey (21:35):
That's just on research.
Jennifer (21:36):
Yeah, that's, yeah, exactly.
Carey (21:39):
Like I read, I read a book, Jeff told me, he said,
look, if you really wanna seehow a breeding chef program is
done on a large scale look atone of those companies.
And search through theirdocuments and see if you can't
find a breeder manual.
(22:01):
And I was like, okay.
And I did.
One of those companies has a 56page guide for their breeders on
how to, how they want the birdraised from hatch.
To point alay.
(22:21):
Everything from temperature,light type, light, color,
brightness feed the specifics onit, the bedding, every detail is
in there.
And that ram me down a rabbithole one night that was insomnia
(22:45):
driven.
And I saw some where a lot ofresearch is also done in Africa,
which is kind of a weird place,but apparently they study
chickens a lot over there.
And I find the individualstudies where people study for
two and three years, the effectson different lighting on a
(23:10):
chicken and what it does atdifferent points.
Down to how it affects the feedconsumption, feed conversion
ratios fertility, everything.
And I'm like, I thought Istudied it a little bit like
these people.
Jennifer (23:28):
Yes.
Carey (23:29):
Really got granular.
I'd like to have some fundingthat they had to do some study
because some of them was highlyfunded.
Jennifer (23:39):
So chicken is one of those products, you know, people
eat chicken probably daily, ifnot every other day.
Mm-hmm.
And so there's a lot of money inchicken around the world.
And so moving them through theprocess quickly is money driven.
Mm-hmm.
So feed trials, while I ofcourse, am not near on that
(24:03):
scale, for me, I needed to knowwhat feed.
That was available to me woulddo the best for my purposes.
And so to That's fair to figureit out.
The first thing you've gotta dois know what your purposes are.
(24:24):
So whereas the big companies,their purposes how much weight
can I put on this bird?
In, I think they've got it downto like 38 days or something
now.
My question is, yes, how muchweight goes on this bird?
But really my biggest thing iswhat is the fertility rate of my
(24:48):
eggs and the vigor of thosechicks when they hatch?
Because the model of my businessis shipping hatching eggs.
Mm-hmm.
And I shipped so many of themthat I need the customer.
To have viable eggs when theyreceive them, despite weather in
(25:10):
the transit, despite treatmentof the box in transit de I mean,
it has so many obstacles that ithas to get across.
Then I need that embryo to be asstrong and vigorous as possible
when they receive it.
In order to make it grow andhatch and live vigorously,
Carey (25:34):
and you can only test hatch so much.
Jennifer (25:37):
I can, I mean, I, I do have the ability to scale here
to a point.
I mean, I can't my incubators ofcourse don't hold the a hundred
thousand eggs like the big cobincubators do.
And to me that's just awesome.
I would just like to see one,you know, in person.
But I mean, that's like a wholeroom and they move the eggs on
(25:59):
these big racks.
But anyway, I digress.
Carey (26:01):
Watch the Quail Ladies videos.
Jennifer (26:04):
Well, she
Carey (26:05):
has some really large ones.
Jennifer (26:07):
She does, but that's still, she's only hatching,
50,000, 55,000.
These are incubators that holdonly a hundred to 130,000 eggs.
And they have entire buildingsof these incubators.
Carey (26:23):
Yeah, they're like a walk-in cooler.
Jennifer (26:25):
Yes.
Carey (26:26):
Only it's an incubator,
Jennifer (26:28):
so believe it or not their incubators spend more time
cooling than they do heating.
They actually only heat for thefirst seven days, and then day
seven to 14, they kind ofmaintain that, they call it that
neutral zone, and then 14 to 21,they're actually cooling because
(26:51):
the embryos are so exothermic ontheir heat production that the
heat rises too high in theincubators.
They have to keep cooling themdown in order to keep'em at the
37.8 degrees Celsius.
It's pretty fascinating, thescience.
But anyway, it
Carey (27:11):
sounds to me like you're taking a college course.
Jennifer (27:14):
We're not talking about that right now.
We're talking about my feedtrial.
Carey (27:18):
That's detail.
But yes, it is fascinating athow some of these companies do
it.
And I see people asking all thetime on in different groups, how
much should I charge for this?
Well, if you don't know whatyour costs are and the profit
(27:38):
margin that you would like tohave.
You don't know,
Jennifer (27:42):
and it's not hard, but you do have to have a couple
things.
You have to have no wastefeeders, and a lot of people
don't have those.
It's quail or just wastefuleaters by their very nature.
So in order to have accurateresults, you have to have no
(28:02):
waste feeders.
Um, and you gotta weigheverything.
Otherwise, you're just addingyour waste into your cost and
that is not cost effective.
Carey (28:14):
I would say.
It is great for the compostpile.
But it's not cost effective,
Jennifer (28:19):
right?
So we, um, here I brewed in tubsfor the first five to seven
days, well, depending on theweather.
So let's say seven to 10 days.
And, um.
And then I move them in ontowire.
They have no waste feeders.
It's, it's easier that way.
And um, and I can get a prettyaccurate reading that way.
(28:44):
The little, tiny, less than fivedays, they don't waste a
tremendous amount of food.
Not like the older ones do, butback to my feed trial.
So all I wanted to do.
Was, compare the feeds that wereavailable to me so that I could
get the best fertility, the bestvigor in the chicks, and it be
(29:05):
cost effective and put weight onthe birds at the same time.
And, and I did that.
I got the information, I got allthe raw data.
It's going to actually bepublished this week on bryant
roos.com.
And you'll have all, are yougonna
Carey (29:25):
send out an email to all your subscribers?
Jennifer (29:27):
I, I will.
So if you wanna be on my emaillist, you need to sign up for
that.
But you can go to brian.com, getthe, actually at this point, I
have two feed trials published,so you can download both of
them.
And then I've also done aseparate video explaining what I
did, why I did it, and my takeon the results.
(29:50):
So you know, it's there if youwant more information and if
you, you know, if you havedifferent feeds available to you
where you are.
Just buy two bags of feed andthe next time you hatch two, I
mean, a set of chicks, justdivide it in half and feed them
separately and just weigh thefeed.
It's, uh, sounds easy.
(30:12):
It, the concept is easy.
Tracking it, weighing it notbeing distracted when the phone
rings or the kid walks in theroom or the chick runs by on the
floor and you gotta figure outwhere he belongs to.
'cause I had chicks escapeyesterday.
We're everywhere.
So it's, it sounds simple, butin theory, but in practicality
(30:36):
it's not, it's kind of tedious.
Carey (30:39):
And so if you do what she said.
And decide to hatch two brooderfools, not one, and all of that
good stuff, and you get introuble.
It's jennifer@bryantroos.com.
Not that we're enablers oranything, if, if you have one,
you know, everybody likes theirfeed.
(31:00):
Mm-hmm.
Or wonders about it.
So if you have a feed that youlike or that you wanted to try.
Look at her feed study.
See all the different data thatshe gathers.
See what's important to you.
Put your tenfold hat on andstart tracking.
Jennifer (31:21):
Yep.
And, and you know, maybe there'sI hearing some talk about
another fee called Blue Bonnet.
I guess it's available on Chewy.
Mm-hmm.
Maybe that's something I can,I've never used it.
But maybe that's something I cando next, next summer.
Now I have to do my feed trialsin the summer.
(31:41):
Because shipping season is justabsolutely too chaotic to try to
do anything.
And in the fall I'm trying towhittle down my chicken numbers.
This year we had to whittle downover 200.
Uh, to get'em off the feed billbefore winter.
You know, there's just a lotgoing on in the fall.
So I have to do the feed trialin the summer when I have space
(32:04):
and, and a little bit more time.
And then it takes more time tosit and work all the numbers and
write everything up and make itlook.
Carey (32:12):
I'm gonna say in shipping season, you don't even know if
you ate that day, much less howmuch and have time to track what
your birds ate or how much theyweigh.
You're in shipping season, youdon't really care as long as it
they're maintaining.
Jennifer (32:27):
Yeah, today I'm trying to, I'm hatching and sorting,
getting ready for shippingseason and I went out to the
barn I don't know, about nineo'clock or so this morning.
I had a piece of toast on my wayout there and it was over, it
was like two 30 and I was like,good board.
What is wrong with me?
And I realized it needed to comeback in and eat breakfast.
(32:48):
And so I had some scrambledeggs.
'cause we have a multitude ofeggs.
Carey (32:52):
You can, when you have chickens.
Jennifer (32:54):
Yep.
Carey (32:56):
You should have eggs.
Jennifer (32:57):
Yep.
All righty.
So don't forget to check thatout.
It, by the time you hear thisit, it will be live on bryant
roos.com.
And if you have any, go topoultry
Carey (33:09):
nerd podcast.com and subscribe.
Jennifer (33:12):
Mm-hmm.
Please.
So
Carey (33:13):
you can get all the latest tidbits on stuff that
we're working on.
Jennifer (33:17):
And we will be back next week.
Carey (33:19):
All right.
Have a good one.
Welcome poultry nerds.
So we are going to discuss theOhio National Show because I
didn't go and I have reframedfrom asking Carey all of the
good stuff so that he can tellBo all of us at the same time.
So Carey, give it to me.
(00:59):
Tell me all the juicy gossip.
Carey (01:01):
I really had a good time and this is my third year in a
row going.
And it's, it's like become athing.
I see people that I talk to onthe internet all the time'cause
it's one of the biggest shows ofthe year and I see'em, we get to
chit chat in person, stuff likethat.
(01:23):
So that's a pretty cool aspectof it.
I took a 30 minute long videoWow.
With my camera.
Walking up and down several ofthe aisles looking at the birds,
I probably have to edit parts ofit out because I was judging the
(01:47):
birds in my mind that, you know,that's the whole past my game,
foul judging test.
So like I started going up thatrow and I looked at the birds.
I couldn't take'em out, but Ilooked at'em, made mental notes.
I went back after the judging tosee what the cards say, and I
(02:08):
was really close.
I mean, you really can't judge abird without touching it, but
yeah, that's pretty cool.
But I'm gonna have to do thatbecause a lot of people, if
you've never been, unless you'relike in the room hearing the
extreme number of birds crowing
Jennifer (02:29):
8,100.
Carey (02:31):
Yeah.
And like the people, and it'slike a, it's an atmosphere
thing.
It's really cool.
Now, my anxiety was really highat some points because there's a
lot of people there, but I mean,at least they're all chicken
people.
And I'll say this, this willgive you an idea of the fate
(02:54):
that I have in chicken people.
Last year I was like, okay, I'mgonna.
Pack up my stuff in my trailer,go to the hotel, go to bed
early, get up, make the 500 andsome odd mile drive home.
I'll be good.
Trailer gets broke into at thehotel, they get some of my
(03:16):
inventory, they get my, a lot ofmy tools.
Bam.
This time Jeff says, Hey.
There's no sense in us bothdriving.
Do you have anything in yourtruck that you need?
I said, I have my backpack withmy laptop.
He was like, okay, grab that.
(03:37):
We'll take mine back to thehotel.
I left my truck in the parkinglot at the para ground.
I didn't have a scratch on it.
Jennifer (03:46):
Oh, good.
Carey (03:47):
I was so glad everything was still there and still locked
up.
But I got to meet a lot ofpeople.
That were, first time I'd evermet'em in person.
I had some poultry nerd stickersout on the table and one person
just, you know, I see'em walkingby casually'cause I am a
watcher.
(04:07):
And they looked at the table andthey stopped and they looked at
me and You're Carey.
I said, yeah, I love yourpodcast.
And I was like.
My people, they listen.
I don't know if they all followinstructions, but they listen
(04:30):
and I mean, that made me feelreally good.
And I, I saw Bronwyn and a fewother people that we've had on
the show as guest and some I metbefore, some I haven't.
And I gotta see her birds and Iwill say.
She has made a lot of progressin the past year with her
(04:51):
modeled ginormous birds and youknow, when I first got
introduced to the model birdthing, I really wasn't that into
it.
But now I hate them less thansome other types of birds.
So, yeah, but like, it's anatmosphere thing.
(05:14):
I, I enjoy going, so we'lldefinitely be back next year.
I had several people ask meabout the show specials and, if
I'm there, I'm gonna do'em.
But it, it was, it's a goodtime.
Beautiful birds, the ones thatwon some of the, the places.
(05:38):
I really like seeing the youth'cause I mean, that's the future
of any hobby is the youngpeople.
But like some of those littlekids standing in front of that
big Ohio National sign withtheir trophy, that's almost as
big as they are holding theirbird.
Just proud as they could be.
(05:59):
I'm like, yeah, that's cool.
Jennifer (06:02):
So Michael mjs dad sent me a picture yesterday of
mj and he went up there just todo his showmanship with his
little mankins.
Did you see him up there?
Mm-hmm.
He won third in the juniorshowmanship.
Carey (06:18):
And look, some of those kids are so serious.
Like I saw'em with lab coatsthat had their name on it.
Jennifer (06:26):
He has one.
Carey (06:27):
Probably an embroidery of one of their birds or the same
type bird.
That's, and that's cool.
You know, I really like seeingkids get into stuff and learn a
lot about it.
You know, I, I always thoughtwhen my son was a teenager,
(06:48):
people were like, I can'tbelieve he's does this and does
that.
And I'm like.
You know what, if he's spendinga couple thousand dollars on a
hunting dog and a hundreddollars here or a couple hundred
dollars there on the chicken, Iain't gotta worry about him with
drugs and women'cause he ain'tgot enough money for neither
(07:09):
one.
And I, I, I can honestly say Inever had a problem with either
with him'cause he was too broke,but he loved his hunting.
He loved his chickens
Jennifer (07:24):
So do you happen to know who came the furthest to
get there?
Yeah, I know they do travel allthe way from the west coast
though.
Carey (07:33):
There was, I do know there was a lady there from
Canada.
I'm not sure what part, but shehad some really nice looking
birds and there was a big dealabout that, probably how she got
'em across the border.
I don't know.
Yeah, because that's achallenge, but you know, they,
(07:53):
it's, the place was Okay.
I did hear rumors that the APAslike big annual national event
is gonna be there again nextyear.
So that'll probably bring awhole lot of extra people.
You know, it might be another12, 14,000 bird year.
(08:17):
And, got the show bug.
Never, never been a fan of itbefore because of all the T that
goes in with it.
And which there, there's stillsome lines that I ain't
crossing, but you know, there'sa show in December, 2025
depending on when you'relistening to this.
(08:39):
And, um.
I've downloaded and printed outin entry form.
Jennifer (08:44):
You said you weren't ever gonna show.
Carey (08:47):
Like I said, I've downloaded it and printed it.
Jennifer (08:52):
Yeah.
You know, I did it for a whileand it's a lot of work.
I mean, it's you washing thebird.
Well, can, you've gotta keep thebirds in condition.
Then you have to wash the birds.
Then you have to clean the, keepthe birds clean after you wash
'em, but before the show andthen box'em, travel with them.
You gotta take feed and waterand baby wipes to keep'em clean.
(09:17):
And then you gotta haul'em inand cage'em in.
Oh, it is a lot of work.
And then on top of that, youknow, all your normal stuff and
then somebody's gotta be here totake care of your stuff while
you're gone.
I just, I think I've pretty muchdecided that it, it just may be
too much for me.
You know, you can't, you can'tdo everything.
(09:38):
And that's one of those,
Carey (09:40):
I'm gonna, do, I have all intentions to take birds up
there.
I'm not saying that won't be theonly time I ever do it.
I'm not real big on using a babywipe on a baby, so I'm gonna
have to just hope my bird don'thave any accidents.
Jennifer (09:59):
So when it Jerry couch from, um, deep south of
Orpingtons, he, he helped me alot when I was getting started
and one of the tricks he told mewas, you know, those.
Those brushes that we had likein the eighties growing up and
had like one spindle every halffor three quarters of an inch.
(10:19):
Yeah.
Those are the perfect size to gothrough the fluffy butts.
So you can brush your chickenbutts.
So we bought a two pack on ourway to the show and I put one in
my purse and then one in mychicken pack.
Mm-hmm.
And I took it out and wasbrushing my hair one day.
(10:40):
And David just looks at me andhe is is that the chicken ass
brush?
Carey (10:44):
And you probably looked at it and you were like.
Is this the extra one or is thisthe one that I actually used?
Jennifer (10:51):
No, I knew what I was doing, but he just thought it
was the same color.
Carey (10:56):
Mm.
Jennifer (10:58):
Okay.
I have to say it was,
Carey (10:58):
I I know he didn't use it.
Jennifer (11:00):
No, he didn't use it.
So the sail barn is supposed tobe as big as the show, right?
Carey (11:06):
It definitely is.
There, there was a lot to beseen in the sale barn.
A lot.
I don't know for sure about acount.
I ain't gonna say that there was8,000 birds in there, but there
was several thousand birds inthere and some of them were
(11:27):
really nice looking.
I.
Some of'em should have been acoal.
Jennifer (11:35):
Well, somebody's coal is somebody else's cream of the
crop, right?
No.
Not that.
We'll go
Carey (11:42):
with that.
Jennifer (11:43):
That one was chicken dinner.
Carey (11:44):
We're being nice.
Jennifer (11:45):
Okay.
Carey (11:47):
Um,
Jennifer (11:47):
so you're going back next year?
Carey (11:49):
Year?
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
I'll go back.
Even if, just for thecamaraderie.
To see the people and the factthat it's going to be, if it is
there, the a P'S big one.
I know there'll be a lot morepeople there, so yeah, I, I'll
go.
(12:09):
I might actually try to talkDavid into going No,
Jennifer (12:12):
no, he won't go.
He doesn't care.
He only cares about chickens'cause I care about chickens.
You have better luck takingTamara.
Carey (12:20):
She's actually going with me to Knoxville.
Jennifer (12:22):
Oh, well good.
Carey (12:23):
Yeah.
Jennifer (12:24):
Yeah.
All right then.
So I guess the only last thingis is how many days exactly is
the show?
Carey (12:32):
So this time the show started at nine on Saturday,
coop in was all day on Friday.
Vendors were unloading theirtrucks and.
Exhibitors were some of thembringing in chickens by the
(12:53):
droves.
One I saw if I wanted to do lotsof showing, I saw what I would
build this dgu.
It is probably even theconditioning cage, like these
birds stay in it for, from thetime they wash'em.
(13:14):
Till the time they go to theshow so they can't get dirty.
This thing's like six foot tall,eight feet long on wheels and it
I wanna say it had five tall andseven across birds
Jennifer (13:34):
silkies.
Yes.
Carey (13:37):
So I saw a lot of silkies in one.
And I saw a lot of them modernsin another.
Jennifer (13:43):
Oh, I love the moderns.
They look like Barbie dolls
Carey (13:46):
to me.
Like they got them, they got thelegs.
Yeah.
Jennifer (13:49):
They look like barbie dolls.
Carey (13:51):
I mean, it is like a chicken nugget with a head and
legs.
Jennifer (13:55):
Okay.
What was the most interestingbird there that you hadn't seen
before?
Or was there one or just themost interesting bird?
Carey (14:05):
I mean, I had seen most of them, but I will say this,
this year is the first time, tomy knowledge that Game F were in
the Ohio show.
And they had a couple rows ofthose.
The owners were either.
(14:25):
Don't know what they had or notbeing fully transparent because
the names that some of'em hadfor breed wasn't what it was.
Hmm.
Which is kind of funny and kindof not because with a game file
world, a lot of stuff has thename that they have given it.
(14:49):
And that's not what the actualtype and breed is of the bird.
And a lot of people don't know.
Two weeks ago I went to a gamefoul show in Alabama.
It was their annual fundraiserhad a good, many good size
(15:12):
turnout.
And there was people showingbirds that didn't even know a
standard existed, which wastragic.
Because a lot of them were verynasty with what they had to say
about what the judge put on theticket.
Jennifer (15:30):
Well, if you're just getting started, I could see
where, you know, you're missinginformation and you don't know.
So
Carey (15:37):
true.
But.
Like when somebody tells youthere's a standard that dictates
everything about that bird,don't argue with'em.
Jennifer (15:48):
No.
You should be open and open tolearning when you go.
Carey (15:52):
But I mean that was, there was some of that going on.
There's definitely a difference,but I will say seeing game foul
at the A PA show and.
Ohio was encouraging for peoplethat do keep and breed game
foul.
(16:12):
And there were some that werepretty, and some I wouldn't have
brought.
Jennifer (16:20):
That's okay.
Carey (16:21):
There was a ton of moderns and there was a ton of
silkies.
Well, I'll say this, so the birdthat I saw that really stuck
out.
It was a polish.
Okay.
Jet Black, beautiful white snowfall, eraser head.
(16:46):
Like poof.
Jennifer (16:49):
The crest was white.
Carey (16:51):
Yes, they were.
They were, the birds were allblack, white, crested, and like,
it just looked really clean tome.
Almost like a, like a penguin intuxedo in one of the cartoon
movies or something.
Jennifer (17:07):
So I'm courting a Polish breeder to come onto the
podcast.
They're interested but haven'tfully committed yet.
Carey (17:16):
That'd be fun.
Jennifer (17:17):
Uhhuh.
Carey (17:18):
cause like, I mean, I've seen a lot of chickens in
person, but I had never seenthese and.
I was unpacking some stuff andthis guy comes by with a cart
that has a lot of them in boxes.
He's got one in his hand and I'mlike, was this your ride or die
(17:43):
buddy that rode in the frontwith you?
You know, you've got like 10, 15boxes on your cart.
Was this an extra, whichapparently was a thing because
one lady says, oh, I brought 15,but I'm going home with 26.
Like, okay.
(18:04):
But he, he was carrying thatbird and I just, I thought it
was pretty.
Jennifer (19:00):
Mm-hmm.
I
Carey (19:01):
liked it.
Jennifer (19:03):
There's a lot of neat birds.
Yeah.
I hope everybody had fun.
I hope everybody remembered tobring all their birds home.
I saw somebody forgot one andYep.
Uhuh saw the post, but I thinkit all worked out.
And, uh, how do,
Carey (19:18):
how do you forget your chicken?
Jennifer (19:20):
Well, I think there was something else that happened
there.
Like maybe that somebody elsebought it and didn't get it, or
I don't know exactly.
I just saw the post.
Carey (19:28):
No, now I have heard of that happening.
Like people buy birds andthey're like, I'm gonna pick it
up on Sunday after awards, andthey don't.
Pick it up.
Jennifer (19:38):
Yeah, I think it all took care.
It, it worked itself out on thepost I saw so.
Well, I'm glad you're home safeand everybody had a good time
and um, so I was working onfinishing up my next feed trial
while you were busy running theroads and talking to show
people.
Carey (19:58):
I mean, feed trials is important.
Jennifer (20:00):
Mm-hmm.
Carey (20:01):
They are.
You need to do that.
Jennifer (20:03):
So the commercial companies like Ross or Cobb,
they're always runningexperiments and testing because
it's all about the bottom line.
It's about how much does it costto get this bird to this point?
What makes this bird a grade, Aquality chick versus mm-hmm.
(20:26):
This other bird what parameterscan change?
And I'm having, I'm not gonnadivulge all of what I'm doing
right now, but I am working.
On some stuff on the side, andI'm more, I couldn't
Carey (20:42):
imagine you working on stuff on the side.
Jennifer (20:44):
I am becoming more and more knowledgeable by the day,
um, with the commercialcompanies and how they operate.
And so like one of the tests maybe if you heat the incubator up
just a little bit, can thatspeed the growth to cut back on
the number of days in theincubator?
(21:07):
Yes, you can make them grow alittle quicker, but you always
sacrifice chick quality.
Carey (21:15):
Mm-hmm.
So
Jennifer (21:15):
there's these, you know, these tests that they do
and these parameters that theyfollow to get it exactly right
and.
And if you're going to learn,then you learn from the
companies that are spending themillions and millions of dollars
to study this stuff.
Carey (21:35):
That's just on research.
Jennifer (21:36):
Yeah, that's, yeah, exactly.
Carey (21:39):
Like I read, I read a book, Jeff told me, he said,
look, if you really wanna seehow a breeding chef program is
done on a large scale look atone of those companies.
And search through theirdocuments and see if you can't
find a breeder manual.
(22:01):
And I was like, okay.
And I did.
One of those companies has a 56page guide for their breeders on
how to, how they want the birdraised from hatch.
To point alay.
(22:21):
Everything from temperature,light type, light, color,
brightness feed the specifics onit, the bedding, every detail is
in there.
And that ram me down a rabbithole one night that was insomnia
(22:45):
driven.
And I saw some where a lot ofresearch is also done in Africa,
which is kind of a weird place,but apparently they study
chickens a lot over there.
And I find the individualstudies where people study for
two and three years, the effectson different lighting on a
(23:10):
chicken and what it does atdifferent points.
Down to how it affects the feedconsumption, feed conversion
ratios fertility, everything.
And I'm like, I thought Istudied it a little bit like
these people.
Jennifer (23:28):
Yes.
Carey (23:29):
Really got granular.
I'd like to have some fundingthat they had to do some study
because some of them was highlyfunded.
Jennifer (23:39):
So chicken is one of those products, you know, people
eat chicken probably daily, ifnot every other day.
Mm-hmm.
And so there's a lot of money inchicken around the world.
And so moving them through theprocess quickly is money driven.
Mm-hmm.
So feed trials, while I ofcourse, am not near on that
(24:03):
scale, for me, I needed to knowwhat feed.
That was available to me woulddo the best for my purposes.
And so to That's fair to figureit out.
The first thing you've gotta dois know what your purposes are.
(24:24):
So whereas the big companies,their purposes how much weight
can I put on this bird?
In, I think they've got it downto like 38 days or something
now.
My question is, yes, how muchweight goes on this bird?
But really my biggest thing iswhat is the fertility rate of my
(24:48):
eggs and the vigor of thosechicks when they hatch?
Because the model of my businessis shipping hatching eggs.
Mm-hmm.
And I shipped so many of themthat I need the customer.
To have viable eggs when theyreceive them, despite weather in
(25:10):
the transit, despite treatmentof the box in transit de I mean,
it has so many obstacles that ithas to get across.
Then I need that embryo to be asstrong and vigorous as possible
when they receive it.
In order to make it grow andhatch and live vigorously,
Carey (25:34):
and you can only test hatch so much.
Jennifer (25:37):
I can, I mean, I, I do have the ability to scale here
to a point.
I mean, I can't my incubators ofcourse don't hold the a hundred
thousand eggs like the big cobincubators do.
And to me that's just awesome.
I would just like to see one,you know, in person.
But I mean, that's like a wholeroom and they move the eggs on
(25:59):
these big racks.
But anyway, I digress.
Carey (26:01):
Watch the Quail Ladies videos.
Jennifer (26:04):
Well, she
Carey (26:05):
has some really large ones.
Jennifer (26:07):
She does, but that's still, she's only hatching,
50,000, 55,000.
These are incubators that holdonly a hundred to 130,000 eggs.
And they have entire buildingsof these incubators.
Carey (26:23):
Yeah, they're like a walk-in cooler.
Jennifer (26:25):
Yes.
Carey (26:26):
Only it's an incubator,
Jennifer (26:28):
so believe it or not their incubators spend more time
cooling than they do heating.
They actually only heat for thefirst seven days, and then day
seven to 14, they kind ofmaintain that, they call it that
neutral zone, and then 14 to 21,they're actually cooling because
(26:51):
the embryos are so exothermic ontheir heat production that the
heat rises too high in theincubators.
They have to keep cooling themdown in order to keep'em at the
37.8 degrees Celsius.
It's pretty fascinating, thescience.
But anyway, it
Carey (27:11):
sounds to me like you're taking a college course.
Jennifer (27:14):
We're not talking about that right now.
We're talking about my feedtrial.
Carey (27:18):
That's detail.
But yes, it is fascinating athow some of these companies do
it.
And I see people asking all thetime on in different groups, how
much should I charge for this?
Well, if you don't know whatyour costs are and the profit
(27:38):
margin that you would like tohave.
You don't know,
Jennifer (27:42):
and it's not hard, but you do have to have a couple
things.
You have to have no wastefeeders, and a lot of people
don't have those.
It's quail or just wastefuleaters by their very nature.
So in order to have accurateresults, you have to have no
(28:02):
waste feeders.
Um, and you gotta weigheverything.
Otherwise, you're just addingyour waste into your cost and
that is not cost effective.
Carey (28:14):
I would say.
It is great for the compostpile.
But it's not cost effective,
Jennifer (28:19):
right?
So we, um, here I brewed in tubsfor the first five to seven
days, well, depending on theweather.
So let's say seven to 10 days.
And, um.
And then I move them in ontowire.
They have no waste feeders.
It's, it's easier that way.
And um, and I can get a prettyaccurate reading that way.
(28:44):
The little, tiny, less than fivedays, they don't waste a
tremendous amount of food.
Not like the older ones do, butback to my feed trial.
So all I wanted to do.
Was, compare the feeds that wereavailable to me so that I could
get the best fertility, the bestvigor in the chicks, and it be
(29:05):
cost effective and put weight onthe birds at the same time.
And, and I did that.
I got the information, I got allthe raw data.
It's going to actually bepublished this week on bryant
roos.com.
And you'll have all, are yougonna
Carey (29:25):
send out an email to all your subscribers?
Jennifer (29:27):
I, I will.
So if you wanna be on my emaillist, you need to sign up for
that.
But you can go to brian.com, getthe, actually at this point, I
have two feed trials published,so you can download both of
them.
And then I've also done aseparate video explaining what I
did, why I did it, and my takeon the results.
(29:50):
So you know, it's there if youwant more information and if
you, you know, if you havedifferent feeds available to you
where you are.
Just buy two bags of feed andthe next time you hatch two, I
mean, a set of chicks, justdivide it in half and feed them
separately and just weigh thefeed.
It's, uh, sounds easy.
(30:12):
It, the concept is easy.
Tracking it, weighing it notbeing distracted when the phone
rings or the kid walks in theroom or the chick runs by on the
floor and you gotta figure outwhere he belongs to.
'cause I had chicks escapeyesterday.
We're everywhere.
So it's, it sounds simple, butin theory, but in practicality
(30:36):
it's not, it's kind of tedious.
Carey (30:39):
And so if you do what she said.
And decide to hatch two brooderfools, not one, and all of that
good stuff, and you get introuble.
It's jennifer@bryantroos.com.
Not that we're enablers oranything, if, if you have one,
you know, everybody likes theirfeed.
(31:00):
Mm-hmm.
Or wonders about it.
So if you have a feed that youlike or that you wanted to try.
Look at her feed study.
See all the different data thatshe gathers.
See what's important to you.
Put your tenfold hat on andstart tracking.
Jennifer (31:21):
Yep.
And, and you know, maybe there'sI hearing some talk about
another fee called Blue Bonnet.
I guess it's available on Chewy.
Mm-hmm.
Maybe that's something I can,I've never used it.
But maybe that's something I cando next, next summer.
Now I have to do my feed trialsin the summer.
(31:41):
Because shipping season is justabsolutely too chaotic to try to
do anything.
And in the fall I'm trying towhittle down my chicken numbers.
This year we had to whittle downover 200.
Uh, to get'em off the feed billbefore winter.
You know, there's just a lotgoing on in the fall.
So I have to do the feed trialin the summer when I have space
(32:04):
and, and a little bit more time.
And then it takes more time tosit and work all the numbers and
write everything up and make itlook.
Carey (32:12):
I'm gonna say in shipping season, you don't even know if
you ate that day, much less howmuch and have time to track what
your birds ate or how much theyweigh.
You're in shipping season, youdon't really care as long as it
they're maintaining.
Jennifer (32:27):
Yeah, today I'm trying to, I'm hatching and sorting,
getting ready for shippingseason and I went out to the
barn I don't know, about nineo'clock or so this morning.
I had a piece of toast on my wayout there and it was over, it
was like two 30 and I was like,good board.
What is wrong with me?
And I realized it needed to comeback in and eat breakfast.
(32:48):
And so I had some scrambledeggs.
'cause we have a multitude ofeggs.
Carey (32:52):
You can, when you have chickens.
Jennifer (32:54):
Yep.
Carey (32:56):
You should have eggs.
Jennifer (32:57):
Yep.
All righty.
So don't forget to check thatout.
It, by the time you hear thisit, it will be live on bryant
roos.com.
And if you have any, go topoultry
Carey (33:09):
nerd podcast.com and subscribe.
Jennifer (33:12):
Mm-hmm.
Please.
So
Carey (33:13):
you can get all the latest tidbits on stuff that
we're working on.
Jennifer (33:17):
And we will be back next week.
Carey (33:19):
All right.
Have a good one.
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