November 24, 2025 • 43 mins
We trade Movember jokes and candy nostalgia for a frank look at health setbacks, rehab, and the quiet habits that restore capacity. Then we map the arc of a modern career—from early exploration to mid-career forks and what “peak” can mean beyond job titles.
• mustache banter and seasonal candy nostalgia
• long illness frustrations and exercise interruptions
• back injury, rehab protocols, and core strength
• hinge movements, pilates, and posture benefits
• defining career peak beyond titles and promotions
• early-career exploration across industries and functions
• mid-career fork: switch function or industry, not both
• executive track in your 40s versus craft excellence
• avoiding comfort creep and staying employable
• community updates, discord access, and listener support
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:02):
Hey, he's back.
Our boy Kriggers.
Excuse me, I'm I'm uh strokingdown the stash.
Yeah, I want people to realizewe are in the height of
Movember.
And Bruce is rocking a stash, astash and a half, and he is just
patting that thing down.
He's raising one eyebrow.
(00:23):
I'll be honest, you look goodwith a stash.
I think you should do anall-year-old.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
So I uh I actually went to an event in Tampa
yesterday, which is about atwo-hour drive from where I
live, and I had to give apresentation.
And it was kind of weird becausethere was this camera that kept
showing my face as I was preventpresenting.
I could see myself, and I'mlike, dang, I really do rock
this stash.
Like it is a look for me, and II enjoy it.
(00:49):
I feel like it actually makes melook more approachable.
Like in in some ways, themustache can be a deterrent.
Like, don't talk to him.
He's got a mustache.
But I feel like in my case, itmakes me look really goofy and
safe.
SPEAKER_00 (01:02):
So oh, that's incredible.
Well, no, I think I think thereason it worked for you is it's
it's full, it's thick, it likerounds down on the on the lips a
little bit.
SPEAKER_02 (01:17):
It comes past the corners, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (01:18):
So it's not the corners, but you're clean shaven
around it, no sole patch.
SPEAKER_02 (01:23):
I think it just looks clean.
So when I uh because I kind of Iwanted to grow a full beard this
time, yeah, and I tried to, andI learned my the left side of my
face has no hair, and the rightside does.
So I looked like freaking Jekylland Hyde.
So when I started to shave itdown to get back to the
mustache, which I can grow, Idid leave a little soul patch
(01:44):
there, and I look like the most1920s English gentleman you've
ever seen.
And I was so tempted to keep it.
But I'm like, you know what?
Nothing beats the classic stash.
I'll keep the stash.
Let's go.
Let's can't remember.
Did you say you're a sidesleeper or not?
Uh I am a everything sleeper.
SPEAKER_00 (02:03):
Okay, so you're just all over the place.
I was gonna say, you know whatthey say, if you sleep on that
one side, you just don't growhair there.
SPEAKER_02 (02:09):
Um that might actually explain it because I do
that's not true.
My left side.
That's not true at all.
SPEAKER_00 (02:17):
Because then you're heavy.
You know, I mean, maybe I can'tprove it wrong for you.
You might be right, actually,though.
I got a couple like empty spots.
See, the problem with my stash,I don't I just gotta shape it.
Like I gotta go to like amustache groomer because mine
just gets unwieldy and I can'tgroom it.
I'm bad.
SPEAKER_02 (02:36):
I I just use a trimmer and keep it from
touching the actual lip skin andkeep it from going past because
I have a little bald spot uhright below the corners.
So it's very easy for me to kindof keep it groomed and in line.
The problem is, and you'll kindof you'll kind of see like right
here, it looks like there's nohair.
It's blonde.
It literally goes from brown toblonde.
(02:57):
You'll see when you see me nextweek.
It is literally blonde.
So I have like eight inches ofblonde in my stash, which is
super interesting.
Yeah, I have gray in my beardnow.
You know how old I am.
That's unacceptable.
I mean, you were you were in thecoal mines when I was but a
baby, so it kind of makes sensethat you'd be graying as you
are.
It's true.
SPEAKER_00 (03:17):
Yeah, it's it's crazy.
Like I even talked to my dad,and he's like, I asked him,
like, I don't remember you beingthis gray when you were my age.
And he's like, I was not.
I was not gray at all when I wasyour age.
Like, what happened to me?
You know what does that to you?
SPEAKER_02 (03:31):
Oh, what's that?
Welcome back to CorporateStrategy, the podcast that could
have been an email.
I'm Bruce.
SPEAKER_00 (03:36):
And I'm Greg Clark.
SPEAKER_02 (03:39):
Clark! Clark Ray?
Clark Ray.
Yeah, Clark the Great.
Uh dropping uh, you're notdropping a ring in a mordor,
you're dropping your what is it,the uh the AARP check off at the
bank.
Uh can't wait.
SPEAKER_00 (03:57):
Can't wait to roll up, get my McDonald's coffee,
roll up the check on the earlybird special at the iHop.
SPEAKER_02 (04:07):
I was once told by one of my mentors as I was
chewing a not chewing, I wouldplopped a hard cinnamon candy in
my mouth.
Uh, I was like, I don't care ifthis makes me look elderly.
And he said, You're not an elderfor liking hard candy.
You're an elder when you findthem in your pocket and you
don't know how they got there.
I was like, Oh, that's good.
That's actually really good.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (04:26):
Thanks for making me feel better today.
I love that so much.
Yeah, I love uh Werther'soriginals.
We have a lot of internationalpeople.
I don't know if this is aninternational thing, but people
who don't know what a Werther'sis, it's just a hard piece of
caramel that you just sunk.
You can just suck on them.
My my grandma used to have themall the time.
We'd go to what do you do withthem?
(04:46):
Church, you just you just suckon them.
You just go to church and shewould just have them in her
pockets, like, hey, here you go,kid.
Take some Werther's originals,and honestly, it make it makes
me really nostalgic and I loveit.
unknown (04:58):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (04:58):
Yep.
I I mean they're they'redelicious.
SPEAKER_02 (05:01):
Delicious candy.
I you know, I'm not if I had tochoose, my candy preference is
gummy.
I always like gummy overeverything else.
SPEAKER_03 (05:09):
That's a texture you like.
SPEAKER_02 (05:10):
Flavorful hard candy, that's I'll take it.
I will take it.
Like a sour hard candy, aWerthers, a cinnamon hard candy.
If it's got a good extremeflavor to it, I'm into it.
I'm a chocolate guy.
Ah, see, that's my bottom.
I don't I don't really care forchocolate all that much.
SPEAKER_00 (05:27):
Like I put chocolate, like a Reese's cup.
I'd put that over anything.
Rolo's.
Oh, Rolo's so good.
Underrated.
SPEAKER_02 (05:36):
See, I'm I I do enjoy chocolate, but
unfortunately, I've beenBruges-pilled uh or Belgium
pilled.
So I will only eat chocolate ifit is like of the highest of
quality.
So I'll you know, go to theselittle boutique shops and spend
like$30 on six tiny littlechocolate pieces.
And I wish I was exaggerating,but I just did this last week,
(05:59):
and I'll eat that.
Uh you're out of control.
Uh delicious though.
It's delicious.
And you know what?
I can't eat like a Hershey's ora you know, I could pop a peanut
butter cup.
I can pop a peanut butter cup,but it's not it's not by choice.
Like I'm never like, I want togo buy a peanut butter cup.
(06:21):
It's like it's around.
Okay.
I guess I'll eat this becauseI'm kind of snacky.
SPEAKER_00 (06:25):
A peanut butter cup is like at the top for me.
But what's above that is theseasonal peanut butter cups
where it's like an Easter egg,an Easter egg peanut butter cup.
You know, they just put them indifferent shapes.
Yeah, they just put them theReese's just puts them in
shapes, they make a bunny out ofit.
I don't know why.
Those are way better.
Every time I eat one of those,way better.
(06:45):
Interesting.
SPEAKER_02 (06:46):
Interesting.
Exactly.
It very well could be because ofthe mold.
They have to do it in adifferent factory.
Yeah, because it's a differentfactory, they're importing
ingredients from like bettersources, maybe different
locations that have betterquality ingredients.
So that I mean, that's aninteresting little bit.
SPEAKER_00 (07:02):
I think they have notice that you've you've picked
up there.
Like, I think the peanut butterReese's cup has like a very thin
layer on top and on bottom.
No, no, it's got a thick layeron the bottom and like a very
thin thing on top.
But when they do the seasonalones, it's just a ton of peanut
butter in like very lightchocolate.
I just love biting into a littlecrisp, you're right through the
chocolate, you're into thepeanut butter.
(07:23):
Ooh, ooh, I want one right now.
I'm craving a peanut butter.
I mean, are they are they gonnado them for Christmas?
I don't know.
Maybe they do trees.
SPEAKER_02 (07:30):
I feel like I think we might need to do like a live
uh tasting.
If if you find some, let meknow.
I'll go to the the local grocerand get one for myself and on a
on the screen or on the on thepod, we'll do a live.
Does this taste better than aReese's cup?
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
People have to listen to this because they
can't even see us.
Great radio.
SPEAKER_02 (07:48):
Great, great radio.
SPEAKER_00 (07:49):
I'll make sure to chew into the mic just so you
can.
Just so you guys can hear it.
Yeah, I want you guys, I'll turnnoise cancellation off, and I
want you to just hear everysingle part.
ASM ASMR is a thing.
Yeah, it can be a thing for us.
Who doesn't want to hear mychompers going wild on some
chocolate and peanut butter?
Uh speaking that vibe check foryou.
Hey, you're starting.
(08:10):
I haven't vibe checked with youin a minute.
You're starting.
Last time you did it.
SPEAKER_02 (08:15):
It was a bad idea.
It was a bad idea.
It was a really bad idea.
So I've been sick for a month.
SPEAKER_03 (08:25):
Starting so strong.
You're starting so strong.
SPEAKER_02 (08:28):
Remember like four weeks ago when we potted, and I
was like, my voice is gone.
That was like a virus.
Uh I went and got tested.
I think I mentioned this.
It was like, it wasn't COVID,wasn't strep, but I literally
just had this hoarse cough, sorethroat, fevers, hallucinations.
You know, it was three days ofreal bad, and then it slowly
started to taper off.
(08:49):
I have continued to cough on andoff uh since then, and I have a
consistent sore throat.
And like I look at the back ofmy throat, and the back right of
my throat is like still red andinflamed.
It's been a month, man.
It's been a month.
SPEAKER_00 (09:03):
Yeah.
We talked about before on thispodcast, like how you take just
being a healthy human being forgranted, and then you have like
an inconvenience, like a sorethroat for a day, and you're
like, this is the worst.
The worst.
I don't even and you haven't hadit for a month.
SPEAKER_02 (09:17):
I can't even imagine.
It it's wild because you know,I've this this year, um, my wife
and I have actually tried to doa little bit more physical
activity per day, either go fora 30-minute walk or exercise.
And we've been really big intoApple Fitness, uh, specifically
strength.
And I've got a whole likedumbbell set now, and we'll do
strength training.
And it's been it's been such a aburden because I'll start to
(09:39):
exercise and I'll just starthacking and coughing.
It's like, well, I don't wantto, I don't want to lose my
gains.
I gotta keep going.
But like, dude, it is, I am soready for this thing to be over.
And the funniest thing is, youknow, talking about it today, I
was like, you know, I've beensick for a month.
I literally gave a presentationto like a room full of people
yesterday, and like my voice iskilling me, I'm dying.
(10:02):
Um, I should go to the doctor,but like next week's
Thanksgiving, which is a big USholiday, and there's I there's
no way.
So like now I'm in the phasewhere it's like, well, I guess
I'll just wait two more weeksand see if I'm better then.
And then if I'm not, maybe thenI'll go get checked out.
And by then they're gonna say,you're dying.
So that's yeah, that's where I'mat.
How are you doing?
SPEAKER_00 (10:23):
Great start, awesome vibe check.
It's so I'm always just sohappy, like how you're hearing.
I am hearing about you thrivingand prosperous and just doing so
well.
So thank you for sharing thatand bringing up everybody.
Absolutely.
It's what I'm here for.
Uh I also have an ailment.
I hurt my back.
I hurt my back, and it's it'sbad.
(10:46):
It's bad.
So I I've had like an on and offever since I was an athlete, so
I played college sports and Ihurt my back.
And like over time, when you'reyoung, you bounce back, you
know.
And as I got older, I wouldoccasionally like re-injure it
if I'm lifting weights that aretoo heavy, like squatting too
much.
And I'm like, okay, I did it.
I did it.
(11:06):
Like, I'm gonna stop.
In a month or two, I was like,okay, I'm back, like I can gain
the strength up.
And it happened like once everyyear or so.
I would like really throw itout.
Yeah, well, we were uh moving,as I think I talked about, I
moved into a new house, and Idid it.
I threw it out.
I knew exactly the feeling.
I was like, okay, it's gonnatake me a month to bounce back
from this.
It's been three months, and no,it still is a problem.
(11:29):
Like, I can't pick up more thanlike I I did go to a doctor, I
can't pick up more than like 20pounds off the ground.
And I went to the doctor, I gotan x-ray.
Turns out, my I'm gonna say itall wrong now.
You have like your S1 joint atthe bottom of your spine that
connects to your L5, and you'resupposed to have like a good
amount of cushion in you know,in the cartilage in between
(11:50):
those two things.
And basically he showed me theX-ray.
He's like, You see how these,these, uh, your spine is
actually like you have like halfan inch of cartilage between
each thing, and then let's takea look at this one.
And he's like, there's like twomillimeters of cartilage between
these things.
He's like, What?
This is pretty bad.
He's like, You're gonna have totake like two months off, rehab
(12:11):
every single day, do this listof 30 exercises, and just hope
that helps.
And if it doesn't, we'll get anMRI, we'll take a deeper look at
it and see if you did some likeserious nerve damage.
I'm like, oh boy, here we go.
So it's been like it's been likefour, this was week four, but I
was stupid last week and I movedsomething in my yard and I did
it again.
I'm like, gosh dang it.
(12:32):
So now I'm just gonna give itlike two more or three more
weeks, and then I'm gonna goback in for a checkup.
We're gonna talk about it, and Ithink I'm gonna have to get an
MRI because it's not gettingmuch better.
Dude, we're gonna have to renamethis podcast to getting old.
Mm-hmm.
Well, it's funny you say I'vegot a topic for you today.
Oh no.
SPEAKER_01 (12:51):
Oh no.
SPEAKER_00 (12:52):
But anyways, I want all of our listeners to be
really happy.
Protect your back.
Um, yeah, well, you protect yourback for sure.
Word of the wise.
Don't do stupid things like Idid.
But two, also, we're doing thisfor you, injured, sick, we're
here.
We're here over and over everyweek.
SPEAKER_02 (13:08):
I want to ask you a question, uh, since you know,
we're we're here before we getinto the topic about dying.
Um, I want to so one of thethings, you know, I mentioned
the Apple Fitness and thestrength training.
One of the things I've noticedthey really go hard on is the
hinge, which I've never reallydone before in exercise.
But it's like every every otherfreaking exercise they make you
do in their strength training issome kind of hinge.
(13:29):
And like at first, I'm like, myback just hurts all the time.
It's sore.
But now I've I feel so strong inthe back.
So just a shout out to hingeexercises.
And if you're not doing them, dothem because your posture will
improve.
Your just level of sit seatedstanding comfort improves.
And I feel like you get a niceuh just reinforcement to your
(13:52):
core.
Everyone assumes core is front,but core is also back, you know,
and like shout-outs to thehinge.
SPEAKER_00 (13:58):
Yeah, it's it's so interesting.
Like as you get older, how muchmore you need to like warm up
and focus on that, just becauselike your core like you can lift
a lot of weight, but your corecan just not be strong, even
though you can do a bunch ofcrunches.
Yes, it's your back, it's yourstabilizer muscles in your lower
back and like the top of yourglutes that you have to really
work on, and that's what givesyou a solid core.
(14:19):
And I never thought about that.
So now I'm doing all of that.
SPEAKER_02 (14:22):
Shout outs, Pilates.
Uh, you think they're you knowan exercise that is just for
women?
Absolutely not.
Fantastic.
Uh, 30-minute floor.
It's great because you're layingon the ground, it's almost like
a nap where you're moving uh andyou're sweating and sometimes
screaming because your bodyhates you.
But uh Pilates, great shoutouts.
SPEAKER_00 (14:43):
I I think people people who make fun of it for
like not being that hard of anexercise have never tried it.
SPEAKER_02 (14:49):
Yeah, dude.
Like if you tried it, do aminute of clamshells on both
sides and then come back to meand tell me how easy it is.
SPEAKER_00 (14:58):
Well, even the rehab, because I consider myself
to be pretty fit.
You're you're very fit.
I was like, dude, rehab, gonnabe easy.
Like these exercises, no bigdeal.
Like three sets of 15 bodyweight squats, no problem.
And then I'm doing them all inuh in sequence.
And it is just sorry, I'mshowing my cat to Bruce here.
She's right up on my standingdesk, climbed all the way up
(15:18):
here.
But um, I was uh I was doingthese exercises, and I'm like,
holy cow, I'm like sweatingbuckets, my heart rate's going
through the roof.
I'm like, I'm just on thewarmups, I haven't even gotten
to the real deal yet.
So now after a couple weeks,like it's starting to get
easier, but to your point, it'slike don't mess around with the
core, don't mess around with thecore.
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (15:38):
It's uh it's it's an important set of muscles.
And and you know, truly, Clark,I do hope you have a
rejuvenative healing journeythrough your rehab and you get
back to that sweet, sweet, solidback that you once had that I
admired so fondly.
So good luck.
SPEAKER_00 (15:56):
Good luck on your recovery.
I hope when I see you onTuesday, I can scare the
sickness right out of you.
Oh, I hope so too.
That'll be just magical.
We'll do an exorcism.
It'll be great.
I can't wait.
I can't wait till we do thattogether.
Well, speaking of getting oldand things happening to your
body and us just falling apartat every single angle.
(16:18):
Um I have a topic today.
I want to hear it.
And it's about what is the peakof your career?
Oh, like are we are we in thepeak now?
I was thinking about this.
I was like, like what part wehaven't got we're we're
relatively young, but we're notnew in our careers.
So we have a long way to go.
(16:38):
Like, if you considerretirement, we got decades to
go.
And so I was trying to think,I'm like looking around the
people that I work with, thedifferent age groups, the
demographics, the differentpositions, the titles, and I'm
like, what's the peak?
Like, when are you at the peak?
SPEAKER_02 (16:53):
I I do want to stop you uh because what you just
said freaking horrifies me.
I've got less than two decades,so calm yourself.
I'm counting down the months.
I've got it.
54.
I can piece right the F out andnever work again.
SPEAKER_03 (17:11):
I'm on a plan.
SPEAKER_02 (17:12):
I'm on a plan.
It's not that far away.
That boo-doo on me.
Uh, but I love this.
I love this because uhinterestingly enough, I was
thinking about this.
Like, it's weird you bring thisup because I was thinking about
this just in regards to uppermanagement, right?
I'm a director, you know.
I I mentioned in the past Iapplied for a VP role this year.
(17:32):
I was thinking about like, do Iwant to be a VP ever in the
future?
Looking at what my boss doesnow, looking at his workload,
uh, considering, you know, do Iwant to go into executive?
And no, is the answer.
So then I thought, well, is thisactually where, you know, my
last stop basically?
And then do I go to uh a lesserjob or back to like an IC, get
(17:56):
out of management, get out ofdirectorship, more focused work?
And yes, is is is likely theanswer.
So I I do think this is probablymy peak from where I go from a
hierarchical perspective, butthis is not my peak on the
journey of cool things I get toaccomplish in my job.
(18:16):
I absolutely believe that thereare some way cool things I'll
get to work on in the futurethat have nothing to do with
title.
Waiting for my clock to finish.
Yeah, I can hear it veryslightly.
But it's nice, I like it.
Okay, so the the chimes havecome in.
I am old now, I am dead now, anduh, I I I think you gotta
separate the two because for me,no, but also yes.
SPEAKER_00 (18:40):
You know, when I hear those bells, I just think
of like the the ghost ofChristmas past or present coming
in or future.
Yeah.
Like I just imagine that's thetransition.
Like, is I think that's fromlike the what the Disney movie.
The Muppets?
The Muppet Christmas Carol?
No, no, no.
No, no, the one where uh oh man,maybe it is the Muppets.
(19:00):
It might be the best one.
SPEAKER_02 (19:02):
The Muppet Christmas Carol is actually one of the
most accurate uh retellings ofCharles Dickens' Christmas
Carol.
SPEAKER_00 (19:08):
Really?
Okay, huh?
Yeah.
I I think it might be that, butthat's what it brings me back to
every time I hear your bell.
I'm like, all right, we'retransitioning.
Time to go go to the ghosts ofthe future.
SPEAKER_03 (19:17):
And Gonzo's like, you will be visited with the
battle tolls won!
SPEAKER_00 (19:22):
That was actually really good.
I was probably yeah, no, Ididn't do I'll do a little gonzo
here and there.
But yeah, I'm I'm right therewith you.
I was thinking today, because Iwas talking with someone who's
relatively new, but they're mypeer on the team.
I'm also at the director level,so I also applied for VP role,
and I did a lot of the samethings.
I was like, huh.
You know, looking at what theydo, looking at the age they're
(19:42):
at, like, is that where I wantto be?
Right, like for so long you gothrough that, we're like, of
course it is.
Like through through the lastdecade of working, I'm like,
yeah, of course.
You know, I want to be like theCEO, I want to be the top dog.
And then, like, as you getolder, perspective and life
comes in, and you see the workthat happens, and you're like,
yeah, but are they happy?
Like, are they fulfilled doingthe work that they're doing?
(20:05):
And the person I work with thatjust came in, they're like, hey,
this is like the peak for me.
Like, I have no aspirations togo above this, but I'm really
good in this position.
Like, I'm happy where this isat.
I've kind of mastered it.
I love building teams, but notbeing directly working day to
day with smaller teams.
They're like, not individualcontributor in a level of
management, but not big enoughof a team to like be working
(20:27):
24-7, 365.
So, like, that's the sweet spotfor me.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (20:32):
They know what they want.
I think that's perfect.
And interestingly enough, I feellike you and I are probably
figuring that out right now aswe're hitting this sort of
moment in our careers where wecould go up or or other
directions.
SPEAKER_00 (20:47):
Yeah, yeah, it's it's an interesting topic.
And I was trying to think like,okay, early career.
You don't really know anything.
So, like, you're walking in,you're like, I don't even
understand how corporationswork.
Oh, you're a you're a manager,you're a supervisor, like you're
a lead.
What does that mean?
Like, what do I do?
(21:07):
Where do I go?
And like, I think fondly back tothose times because it's almost
like the naivety makes the workmore fun.
Because you're just learning somany new things.
You're like, the world is myoyster.
I go left, I go right, I godown, I can do a spin, I can, I
could go all these differentdirections, and you don't know
what what to do.
So, like that that time, whileyou're not getting paid a lot,
(21:28):
usually, you're learning a lot,and you'll never be able to go
back to that time.
No, I know it sucks.
Isn't that crazy?
SPEAKER_02 (21:36):
I was thinking about that.
So I I agree, but I do thinkthere's when you start out, and
I think this is important foranyone who's who's younger
listening to this podcast.
When you start out, you don'thave industry knowledge.
And a lot of, and I see thiswhen we we hire young people at
(21:56):
my company, a lot of what theybutt up against is not the
responsibilities of the role,but it's industry knowledge, not
understanding industry acronyms,keywords, phrases, yeah, ideas.
Like there's a lot of thingstied to the field that is not
directly related to your job andyour job responsibilities, but
(22:18):
it does hinder you from doingthem because you don't know that
industry knowledge andexpertise.
I do think though, you know,yeah, we know everything about
our respective industries.
So it doesn't matter where wego, what position we're in,
we're not gonna be learning thatagain unless we truly do a
radical shift.
Like if I become an art dealer,I'm in for a just rug pull of
(22:41):
emotion and and life experiencebecause I know nothing about
art, I know nothing aboutselling art or collecting it,
etc.
But that doesn't really happen.
People stay in their their sortof industry of comfort, but I do
think there is learning andexploration that can happen,
like what happened with you andme.
It's like go from development tosales to marketing to product
management to whatever.
(23:02):
You get to learn a little bit ofa different set of functional
skills, uh, being an individualcontributor, being a manager,
you know, being an upper levelmanager, right?
But all of that is still nuancedand an opportunity to grow and
learn.
And then there's also just theidea that industries change,
grow, evolve.
So you're you're keeping up withtrends if you're doing a good
(23:23):
job and you're trying to stayahead of your customers' wants
and desires.
But you're never gonna be inthat deer in the headlights.
I don't understand what any ofthis is ever again.
That's for sure.
Yeah.
unknown (23:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:37):
You are definitely in your like peak.
I think we're in our peakproductivity right now for sure.
I don't think that we becomemore productive as the years go
by.
SPEAKER_00 (23:46):
Yeah, I look at even the last like three years, and
I'm like, I think I already hitmy peak peak productivity.
I don't know that I could bemore productive than I was in
the last three years.
I'm like, I'm more tired now.
I'm my back hurts.
I'm like, maybe that was it.
(24:07):
But going back to what you said,before we go younger than me.
Before we go into that, I dowant to touch on like early
career and the early career andlike the things that you should
be doing.
And it's exactly what you justsaid.
It's like learning, tryingdifferent things, and finding
(24:29):
what industry you like and whattype of job you like doing.
Like that's your time.
Because I feel like after that,you kind of have to choose if
you want to earn more money orgo up the ladder.
Like you have to decide what isthat role or what is that
industry I'm gonna focus in onfor the rest of my career.
(24:51):
Because if you decide, hey, I'mgonna spend 10 years in this
industry and then I'm gonnaswitch and spend 10 years in
that industry, very likelyyou're gonna be starting over.
Salary-wise, experience-wise,gear in the headlights,
acronym-wise, like you you thinkthat's possible when you're
young, but then when you getolder, you're like, I can't do
that.
That's not economical for me.
(25:11):
Yeah, I don't have it in me, butalso what's the game?
Like, yeah, I lose everything bydoing that, and I'm gonna have
to restart.
Like, that doesn't sound fun.
So, like, that is the peak timeto be doing that.
It's in your early career, maybefive to ten years, starting off
as like try different things,find out what you like, find out
the industries you enjoy, andpick one.
Pick one to focus your middlecareer on, of like, this is
(25:32):
where I'm going to get really,really good industry domain
knowledge, skill set wise, andthen also, you know, finding
what kind of company I want towork for, what kind of company I
want to build.
SPEAKER_02 (25:42):
And I I do think, you know, to to your point and
to my own, there is anopportunity if you feel like
you're you hit your mid-30s, youmight be a little burnt out, you
might feel a little tired, orlike, is this it?
Is this all there is till I hit54 and I can retire comfortably?
No, um, you absolutely canchange jobs or you can change
(26:02):
industries, you just can't doboth.
Uh, and that would be goodpoint.
I think that is really where youhave to decide.
Like, do I not like the folksaround me, which is that that's
your industry, right?
Or do I not like what I'm doing?
That's your job.
And I think you are able to kindof deftly do that because you
have experience.
Once you hit your mid-30s, youknow a lot about your job and
(26:25):
you know a lot about theindustry.
Whatever you take with you tothe next location is valuable,
but you will have to learnsomething, right?
So if you're staying in theindustry, you could you could
swap jobs at a differentcompany, potentially, you know,
I gotta learn a little bit newprocess, a little bit new
technology, a little bit newfunctionality, but you could do
it.
Or hey, I'm gonna go be, I'm amarketer today, I'm gonna go be
(26:46):
a marketer, you know, I'm in I'min storage today, I wanna go be
in security tomorrow.
I'm gonna go take the securitycourse, learn some security, and
then I'm gonna go become amarketer there.
You can do that.
SPEAKER_00 (26:55):
Yeah, that's absolutely good point.
That is a really good point.
It's like if you manage, if ifyou build expertise in the
function of your role, you canchange industries and probably
be okay.
Yeah.
In in most industries, I wouldsay some, probably not, but in a
lot of industries that'd be thecase.
(27:16):
You can't go from like, youknow, storage to healthcare,
right?
Like, yeah, yeah.
But then yeah, if you'rechanging industries and your
functional piece, like thatwould be just a recipe for
you're literally starting over.
unknown (27:31):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:31):
And while you might be capable and be able to do it
quickly, you're still startingover, and it's gonna be a
learning curve.
And that's okay.
To your point, like you mighthave to do it.
Yeah, take a pay cut, find out,and be like, oh man, I really
found something else that Ienjoyed.
And that is interesting becauseit's like you get into the
middle career, and I think bothyou and I have found, would you
say the well, I mean, you pickedan industry.
(27:53):
Yeah.
I picked a function.
Yes, yeah, we we did theopposite, really.
SPEAKER_03 (27:58):
Yeah, we did the opposite.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:00):
That's interesting.
So either of us could still jumpinto like a tangential either
function or industry andprobably be okay.
And I don't know that we wouldswitch both.
SPEAKER_02 (28:11):
I I do think that is my next jump, though.
I've thought a lot about it, isI I don't want to be in the
industry I'm in anymore.
Uh, so I will I will probably doone of the jobs I've done in the
past somewhere else.
Um done.
SPEAKER_00 (28:25):
Yeah.
That's like the I think there'sa fork in the road once you get
to like the second stage of yourcareer.
I won't say half because it'snot half yet, but it's like the
second stage of your career,you've learned.
It is.
Yeah, you're yeah, that's true,actually.
Like you get to this fork in theroad where it's like, okay,
during the stage after yourearly career where you've kind
(28:47):
of solidified yourself, you'vegot the experience, you've got
the knowledge, you've got theexpertise.
You're probably earning goodmoney, depending on what you do.
Now you've set yourself upfinancially.
You've solidified your life in alot of ways, like where you're
likely going to spend a lot ofyour time, the people you're
gonna be spending your timewith, maybe you got married,
whatever.
(29:08):
And so then you kind of hit thatfork in the road to say, okay,
I've solidified that.
Before I jump into this next arcof my career, I hit this fork in
the road of, is this what I wantto do for the rest?
Or do I want to split and dosomething else?
Like I think there is a fork inthe road there to be like, do I
make a big jump and just dosomething function and industry
different just because I trulyam burnt out and I've been
(29:30):
hating what I've been doing?
Or do you just decide to gosomething completely different
where you're like, I'm gonna gobe an entrepreneur instead of a
career person in a company?
SPEAKER_02 (29:40):
There's, I mean, there's definitely a time window
and a uh sort of finality oflife, right?
I wouldn't say when you're 45,that's the time to strike out
and take a big risk, right?
Because you, you know, you mightbe 10 years from retirement, and
that could totally throw offyour investments and your
ability to hit.
That unless you're okay withthat level of risk, I would say
(30:03):
it's probably better to stay ina somewhat safe bubble of career
growth.
Whereas when you're in your 20s,there's literally nothing you
can't try because you're poorand you're going to be poor for
a long time.
So go be poor doing somethingwild or something interesting
that you might strike it bigwith.
I do I do think 30s is kind oflike that's that's the end of
(30:27):
the experimentation uh for thewild risks.
Uh if you want to retirecomfortably, uh otherwise you do
whatever you want, right?
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (30:37):
I agree.
Because like during your 30s,you could be starting a family,
and you know, your your ties toother things and your
responsibilities have grownquite significantly from being a
kid, you know.
So it is kind of your limitedwindow to say, I'm gonna go try
something else, maybe, or I'mgonna stick with what I know and
(30:57):
continue growing in that.
And that's an exciting time.
It's also a scary time.
And I feel like the stage afterthat is when you're in your
peak.
It's like you've known enough,you've set yourself up
financially, you've gained theskill set to actually say, okay,
I kind of know whether I want totry something new or whether I
want to stay with what I'mdoing.
I've got some clarity.
And then from there, it's like,okay, now maybe I need a jump
(31:20):
and a wrist to try to coursecorrect a little bit and make
myself a little happier or getmyself financially in a good
spot or whatever my goals are.
And then I feel like the nextstage, like in your 40s, is like
the peak.
It's like I've learned, I've gotall this wisdom from things I've
done, things I've seen, peopleI've worked with, uh, skill sets
that I've achieved, and I know Iknow what I want, and I've got
(31:42):
clarity over where I want to go.
SPEAKER_02 (31:44):
I got feeling that's the peak.
40s is definitely when if youare executive bound, you can do
that comfortably in a corporateladder climb, right?
Like this is a I didn't go getan MBA and start my own
business, I'm an exec.
This is a I have climbed theladder.
I know everything I need to knowto be a CPO, a CFO, a CMO,
(32:06):
whatever it is.
You have that knowledge, youhave the industry experience.
You've been you've been working20 years, right?
Like you actually have 20 yearsof experience.
So that is when you can reallyset out and achieve those
executive goals if you wantthem.
And companies will hire you forthem because you have all that
domain expertise.
SPEAKER_00 (32:23):
Right.
Absolutely.
Yeah, I just feel like that'sgot to be the peak, right?
Like you've got things figuredout, you know what you want to
do.
I feel like the next arc is likewhen you're starting to fade
out, you're focusing on thebigger picture.
You're like, okay, I workedhard.
Like, I think now it's time forme to relax a little bit and
like step.
Maybe not.
Like maybe you continue tochallenge yourself, but at that
(32:43):
point, it's like, yeah, I'm notgonna kill myself like I was
before, and I know the path thatI'm taking to get to retirement.
SPEAKER_02 (32:49):
That's when you have peak wisdom and life skill.
Like you're no longer peakproductivity, you're you're peak
living your best life, I feel.
Uh, because you know, I I I'mserious here.
Like, I spent a lot of timetalking to my five guy and
putting money away and makingsure that I can get to
retirement as early as humanlypossible.
(33:12):
And that that has been my goalfor a long time because I hate
work and I don't want to work.
That's you know, that's alwaysbeen the goal is to not work.
So, you know, uh planning mypath, charting my course to get
there, that is my peak, is whenI don't have to ever work again,
right?
And I can just sit at home anddo whatever the hell I want all
day.
That sounds magical to me.
(33:33):
So you you do have to kind ofevaluate like maybe I don't want
to retire early, maybe I want tokeep playing the game, maybe I
want to be a CEO.
Well, you know, that a lot ofCEOs are in their late 40s,
early 50s.
So you can you can go that routetoo.
It's it's all about theexperience you have and the
ability to delegate and managethat experience downwards for
(33:56):
those that work for you.
SPEAKER_00 (33:57):
Yep, 100%.
Like at that point, you'vebuilt, hopefully, if you haven't
made a bunch of jumps fromindustry and function because
you can't figure out what youwant to do.
Hopefully, you've made enoughmoney where you're sitting
pretty comfy.
Yeah.
You're like, I could I could getlaid off next week and I'll be
fine.
I'll find another job in theindustry.
I'll use my network.
I've built a strong network.
(34:18):
I know people, like I can justfind another job.
You know, worse comes to worse.
Yeah.
So I feel like that's some ofthe benefit of being at that
stage.
It's like you've built all theseconnections and now you're able
to leverage those too.
SPEAKER_02 (34:30):
I I will say, and just a cautionary piece of
advice for the older listenersout there, um, because we've
seen this.
You and I have seen this in realscenarios.
Don't be too comfy, right?
Like continue to learn, continueto push yourself and experience
new technologies, learn newthings, don't be complacent,
(34:52):
don't be easy to replace,because it is gonna be much
harder for you to get a job ifyou are laid off and you are
comfy than if you are scrappy,resilient, staying on the
cutting edge of things.
You will get rehired.
But I do think comfort does lenda little bit of uh difficulty,
especially as you get up therein age, because companies are
like they're gonna retire infive years anyway.
(35:12):
I'm not gonna hire them.
They they bring nothing to thethe org.
And like they're not supposed todo that, they're not supposed to
profile, but I promise you theydo.
So that's something to consider.
SPEAKER_00 (35:24):
Yeah, I 100% agree with you.
Well, yeah, that's the maintopic I want to talk about.
You know, we live it every day,and I I've just been looking
around and I'm like, when is thepeak?
Like, am I in it?
I don't wanna I don't want torealize it's multiple times.
I don't want to realize it's thegood old times when I'm in when
I'm out of the good old times.
I want to be in the good oldtimes when I really happened.
I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_02 (35:46):
Those were in our 20s, Clark.
SPEAKER_00 (35:48):
We're we're never going back.
Yeah.
For us, that was prettyincredible.
I mean, we weren't making goodmoney, but it was pretty
incredible.
Those were the golden days,those were the good old times,
they're dead.
SPEAKER_02 (35:58):
Uh so now we have to deal with the at least we're
paid well times.
And then we get to go to the atleast it's only 10 years till we
retire times.
So there are multiple peaks.
There are multiple peaks, andit's all about how you summit
them.
I love it.
Well, that was my discussion fortoday.
Thanks for hearing about it.
We've not talked about thatbefore.
So good job coming up with onethat's uh a little bit
(36:20):
different.
SPEAKER_00 (36:21):
Yeah, almost 200 episodes.
We haven't talked about that,which is wild.
So we we had uh we had to findsomething new.
People are sick of us.
Hundred episodes.
Can you believe it?
I was hoping we'd hit 200 beforethe end of the year.
We're 10 away, there's no waythat's gonna happen.
SPEAKER_03 (36:41):
Yeah, it ain't happening.
SPEAKER_00 (36:42):
I just I just looked at the calendar no, no, there's
just no way through theholidays, no, unless we just
start sneaking in randos hereand there, like Discord only.
Well, actually, now ouraccount's all screwed up because
we did a Discord only episodethat we released to our members.
I still counted it.
Oh, did you?
Okay, so you still up thenumber.
SPEAKER_02 (37:01):
Okay, I have the number, yeah.
You just you if you're not inthe discord, you didn't get to
hear it.
It's like, why did they skip anumber?
Man, can they not count?
No, it's in the discord.
It's in the discord, but youknow what's sad is there are
folks that listen that don'tknow how to get to the discord.
They don't?
No, they don't know how to getto really is it is it really
difficult or something?
I just checked uh and uh someonesaid this Discord is the most
(37:24):
difficult thing I've ever seenin my life to get into.
Wow, it's challenging.
It's crazy.
SPEAKER_00 (37:28):
Well, I've got a tip for you.
Oh, oh.
We built a super easy way to doit.
What?
It's pretty hard to keep theriffraff out.
I know you would you would thinkit would be, and you'd think
everybody would be in it withwhat I'm about to say, but
they're not, and you're missingout on exclusive concept, on
great community, on a Danishsailor, a marine engine
(37:49):
engineer.
You're missing out.
He's there.
SPEAKER_02 (37:51):
Well, he he is there, but I mean, do we want
people to know how to get there?
Is that something we want toshare publicly?
This sounds like a secret that'stoo good to be true.
Yeah, you're right.
Maybe we don't tell him.
SPEAKER_01 (38:02):
Okay, yeah, good call.
Good call.
You can give us money though.
You can give us money.
SPEAKER_00 (38:10):
So so should we tell them how to do that?
Should we keep that?
Well, okay, so for the people, Iwon't tell you how to do it, but
what I will say is all you gottado is scroll down and tap a link
with your butt with your withyour thumb.
I was about to say button, andthen just tapped a butt.
(38:30):
So tap the link with your butt.
SPEAKER_02 (38:32):
Un uncheek, roll down your pants so at least one
cheek is exposed.
Please don't.
Smash the cheek with the face ofyour phone.
That's the only way to get intothe Discord.
SPEAKER_00 (38:43):
That's the only way.
Immediate.
Immediately you will be enteredinto the Discord.
It's crazy.
It's crazy how that works.
This requires a cheek smack,that's all.
Yeah, there's a link.
Scroll down, hit the link.
All the stuff is there.
You can buy us a coffee, you cango join the Discord, you can
have a chat with a marineengineer, you can see Bruce's
mustache.
You actually can't do that.
But maybe if you join, he'llpost a pick.
(39:06):
I'll post that's what I'mtalking about.
Yeah, you know, if you just flipyour head upside down now that
you have a mustache, how do youthink that would look?
It looks weird.
I'm trying.
I need like a side by side.
I need a Bruce head upwards.
The blood flowing my brain.
I need a Bruce head downwards,and I wanted them side by side.
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
Okay.
I will post a picture of meupside down so everyone can see
my mustache.
Good.
That's an incentive to getthere, get in there right now.
Oh, yeah.
Join.
Uh, and do and shout outs forthose again.
In case you didn't hear our lastepisode, uh, we did fail to
notice that some of y'all didspend money and buy us those
coffees to support the show.
And you've actually given uslike over three months of uh
(39:46):
essentially what is our abilityto host this podcast.
So thank you from the bottom ofour hearts.
And Clark will do a better jobof reading the email for when
you do uh give us those bias ofcoffees in the future.
So thanks, Clark.
Yeah, you wonder how many otherpeople have emailed us, so we
just haven't looked.
We just have no idea because Idon't know how to access the
(40:06):
email anymore, and you have theownership of it.
So I'm doubling this one to you.
SPEAKER_00 (40:11):
I get the questions.
I get questions at corporatestrategy.biz, but I don't get I
don't get Bruce or Clark, whichis an issue.
So we're gonna have to fix that.
SPEAKER_02 (40:20):
It's not Bruce or Clark, it's the other one, it's
the one we use for the accounts.
Oh boy.
Okay, I'm gonna have to checkit.
SPEAKER_00 (40:26):
I gotta pull it down.
SPEAKER_02 (40:27):
Okay, we'll we'll figure that one out.
We'll take it offline.
We'll double-click into thatlater.
Uh but until we do that, deepdot double-click, check out that
link tree, join the discord,give us money.
Uh, share the podcast with yourfriends.
Really, that's a that's a bigthing, right?
Like, I've noticed we set a goalthis year that we would buy you
all baby onesies if we had like15,000 listens.
(40:49):
We ain't getting close to that.
So none of y'all are getting thebaby onesie.
But truly, we don't market thispodcast.
I don't pay a damn red cent toput this thing anywhere.
So if you wanted to share onLinkedIn with your friends, with
your family, with yourneighbors, with your coworkers,
please do so.
Uh, we have heard stories offolks that share the pod with
people they work with andthey're all like, This is great.
Thank you so much.
(41:10):
Like, I need this.
So it's the least you can do tohelp us out.
If you can't do anything else,we would really appreciate it.
So thank you in advance forthat.
Uh, and uh thanks for being alistener as always.
SPEAKER_01 (41:22):
That's all I got.
I miss when we used to havePepsi facts.
Do you miss Pepsi facts?
SPEAKER_00 (41:29):
Those were fun.
I'll be honest with you.
I could drink a Pepsi right now.
I could eat a Reese's cup anddrink a Pepsi.
I want both at the same time?
At the same time.
Do you want to be sick?
That's how you get sick.
All right, next episode.
Pepsi and Reese's, here we go.
SPEAKER_02 (41:44):
Pepsi and Reese's.
Let's make it happen.
All right.
Next up.
That should be the Halloweenapp, but we're well past that.
So we are well past.
We're almost going to turkeyweek.
Who who doesn't think aboutReese's Cups and Pepsi for
Thanksgiving?
Who doesn't think about it?
Could you imagine a turkeystuffed with Pepsi and Reese's?
Oh, how would that be a lot?
SPEAKER_00 (42:06):
I'm in.
You know what?
I'm in.
Why not?
I'll take a bite.
I'll take one bite.
Why not?
I'll take a bite.
You gotta try everything once,you know?
SPEAKER_02 (42:14):
Ooh, ooh, you're giving me an idea here.
Okay, so so you know howstuffing.
Turkey has stuffing, right?
I'm I'm with you, I'm following.
So they say.
Uh so the the stuffing is verysimilar in texture to the
stuffing of a Rihe cup.
SPEAKER_01 (42:29):
Can you imagine if they took a turkey-shaped Rihe
cup mold and just stuffed thatbad boy with crumbs?
Ricky peanut butter?
SPEAKER_02 (42:42):
Ooh, that would be I mean, I think.
As you knop on that Riheeturkey, mmm, buddy.
SPEAKER_00 (42:54):
See, the chocolate outer shell needs to be with the
right ratio with the peanutbutter.
That's the only issue.
If it's too much one, too muchthe other, I'm out.
But if you can balance themright, I'm in.
SPEAKER_02 (43:06):
So we basically need to make like a turkey-shaped
Rihee cake.
Yep.
Yeah.
Served with peps.
Served with pepsy on the side.
Bet.
Next week we'll do it.
Uh until then, thanks as alwaysfor listening.
I'm Bruce.
And I'm Clark.
And you're on mute.
(43:26):
We'll see you next week.
Hey, he's back.
Our boy Kriggers.
Excuse me, I'm I'm uh strokingdown the stash.
Yeah, I want people to realizewe are in the height of
Movember.
And Bruce is rocking a stash, astash and a half, and he is just
patting that thing down.
He's raising one eyebrow.
(00:23):
I'll be honest, you look goodwith a stash.
I think you should do anall-year-old.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
So I uh I actually went to an event in Tampa
yesterday, which is about atwo-hour drive from where I
live, and I had to give apresentation.
And it was kind of weird becausethere was this camera that kept
showing my face as I was preventpresenting.
I could see myself, and I'mlike, dang, I really do rock
this stash.
Like it is a look for me, and II enjoy it.
(00:49):
I feel like it actually makes melook more approachable.
Like in in some ways, themustache can be a deterrent.
Like, don't talk to him.
He's got a mustache.
But I feel like in my case, itmakes me look really goofy and
safe.
SPEAKER_00 (01:02):
So oh, that's incredible.
Well, no, I think I think thereason it worked for you is it's
it's full, it's thick, it likerounds down on the on the lips a
little bit.
SPEAKER_02 (01:17):
It comes past the corners, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (01:18):
So it's not the corners, but you're clean shaven
around it, no sole patch.
SPEAKER_02 (01:23):
I think it just looks clean.
So when I uh because I kind of Iwanted to grow a full beard this
time, yeah, and I tried to, andI learned my the left side of my
face has no hair, and the rightside does.
So I looked like freaking Jekylland Hyde.
So when I started to shave itdown to get back to the
mustache, which I can grow, Idid leave a little soul patch
(01:44):
there, and I look like the most1920s English gentleman you've
ever seen.
And I was so tempted to keep it.
But I'm like, you know what?
Nothing beats the classic stash.
I'll keep the stash.
Let's go.
Let's can't remember.
Did you say you're a sidesleeper or not?
Uh I am a everything sleeper.
SPEAKER_00 (02:03):
Okay, so you're just all over the place.
I was gonna say, you know whatthey say, if you sleep on that
one side, you just don't growhair there.
SPEAKER_02 (02:09):
Um that might actually explain it because I do
that's not true.
My left side.
That's not true at all.
SPEAKER_00 (02:17):
Because then you're heavy.
You know, I mean, maybe I can'tprove it wrong for you.
You might be right, actually,though.
I got a couple like empty spots.
See, the problem with my stash,I don't I just gotta shape it.
Like I gotta go to like amustache groomer because mine
just gets unwieldy and I can'tgroom it.
I'm bad.
SPEAKER_02 (02:36):
I I just use a trimmer and keep it from
touching the actual lip skin andkeep it from going past because
I have a little bald spot uhright below the corners.
So it's very easy for me to kindof keep it groomed and in line.
The problem is, and you'll kindof you'll kind of see like right
here, it looks like there's nohair.
It's blonde.
It literally goes from brown toblonde.
(02:57):
You'll see when you see me nextweek.
It is literally blonde.
So I have like eight inches ofblonde in my stash, which is
super interesting.
Yeah, I have gray in my beardnow.
You know how old I am.
That's unacceptable.
I mean, you were you were in thecoal mines when I was but a
baby, so it kind of makes sensethat you'd be graying as you
are.
It's true.
SPEAKER_00 (03:17):
Yeah, it's it's crazy.
Like I even talked to my dad,and he's like, I asked him,
like, I don't remember you beingthis gray when you were my age.
And he's like, I was not.
I was not gray at all when I wasyour age.
Like, what happened to me?
You know what does that to you?
SPEAKER_02 (03:31):
Oh, what's that?
Welcome back to CorporateStrategy, the podcast that could
have been an email.
I'm Bruce.
SPEAKER_00 (03:36):
And I'm Greg Clark.
SPEAKER_02 (03:39):
Clark! Clark Ray?
Clark Ray.
Yeah, Clark the Great.
Uh dropping uh, you're notdropping a ring in a mordor,
you're dropping your what is it,the uh the AARP check off at the
bank.
Uh can't wait.
SPEAKER_00 (03:57):
Can't wait to roll up, get my McDonald's coffee,
roll up the check on the earlybird special at the iHop.
SPEAKER_02 (04:07):
I was once told by one of my mentors as I was
chewing a not chewing, I wouldplopped a hard cinnamon candy in
my mouth.
Uh, I was like, I don't care ifthis makes me look elderly.
And he said, You're not an elderfor liking hard candy.
You're an elder when you findthem in your pocket and you
don't know how they got there.
I was like, Oh, that's good.
That's actually really good.
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (04:26):
Thanks for making me feel better today.
I love that so much.
Yeah, I love uh Werther'soriginals.
We have a lot of internationalpeople.
I don't know if this is aninternational thing, but people
who don't know what a Werther'sis, it's just a hard piece of
caramel that you just sunk.
You can just suck on them.
My my grandma used to have themall the time.
We'd go to what do you do withthem?
(04:46):
Church, you just you just suckon them.
You just go to church and shewould just have them in her
pockets, like, hey, here you go,kid.
Take some Werther's originals,and honestly, it make it makes
me really nostalgic and I loveit.
unknown (04:58):
Yep.
SPEAKER_00 (04:58):
Yep.
I I mean they're they'redelicious.
SPEAKER_02 (05:01):
Delicious candy.
I you know, I'm not if I had tochoose, my candy preference is
gummy.
I always like gummy overeverything else.
SPEAKER_03 (05:09):
That's a texture you like.
SPEAKER_02 (05:10):
Flavorful hard candy, that's I'll take it.
I will take it.
Like a sour hard candy, aWerthers, a cinnamon hard candy.
If it's got a good extremeflavor to it, I'm into it.
I'm a chocolate guy.
Ah, see, that's my bottom.
I don't I don't really care forchocolate all that much.
SPEAKER_00 (05:27):
Like I put chocolate, like a Reese's cup.
I'd put that over anything.
Rolo's.
Oh, Rolo's so good.
Underrated.
SPEAKER_02 (05:36):
See, I'm I I do enjoy chocolate, but
unfortunately, I've beenBruges-pilled uh or Belgium
pilled.
So I will only eat chocolate ifit is like of the highest of
quality.
So I'll you know, go to theselittle boutique shops and spend
like$30 on six tiny littlechocolate pieces.
And I wish I was exaggerating,but I just did this last week,
(05:59):
and I'll eat that.
Uh you're out of control.
Uh delicious though.
It's delicious.
And you know what?
I can't eat like a Hershey's ora you know, I could pop a peanut
butter cup.
I can pop a peanut butter cup,but it's not it's not by choice.
Like I'm never like, I want togo buy a peanut butter cup.
(06:21):
It's like it's around.
Okay.
I guess I'll eat this becauseI'm kind of snacky.
SPEAKER_00 (06:25):
A peanut butter cup is like at the top for me.
But what's above that is theseasonal peanut butter cups
where it's like an Easter egg,an Easter egg peanut butter cup.
You know, they just put them indifferent shapes.
Yeah, they just put them theReese's just puts them in
shapes, they make a bunny out ofit.
I don't know why.
Those are way better.
Every time I eat one of those,way better.
(06:45):
Interesting.
SPEAKER_02 (06:46):
Interesting.
Exactly.
It very well could be because ofthe mold.
They have to do it in adifferent factory.
Yeah, because it's a differentfactory, they're importing
ingredients from like bettersources, maybe different
locations that have betterquality ingredients.
So that I mean, that's aninteresting little bit.
SPEAKER_00 (07:02):
I think they have notice that you've you've picked
up there.
Like, I think the peanut butterReese's cup has like a very thin
layer on top and on bottom.
No, no, it's got a thick layeron the bottom and like a very
thin thing on top.
But when they do the seasonalones, it's just a ton of peanut
butter in like very lightchocolate.
I just love biting into a littlecrisp, you're right through the
chocolate, you're into thepeanut butter.
(07:23):
Ooh, ooh, I want one right now.
I'm craving a peanut butter.
I mean, are they are they gonnado them for Christmas?
I don't know.
Maybe they do trees.
SPEAKER_02 (07:30):
I feel like I think we might need to do like a live
uh tasting.
If if you find some, let meknow.
I'll go to the the local grocerand get one for myself and on a
on the screen or on the on thepod, we'll do a live.
Does this taste better than aReese's cup?
SPEAKER_00 (07:44):
People have to listen to this because they
can't even see us.
Great radio.
SPEAKER_02 (07:48):
Great, great radio.
SPEAKER_00 (07:49):
I'll make sure to chew into the mic just so you
can.
Just so you guys can hear it.
Yeah, I want you guys, I'll turnnoise cancellation off, and I
want you to just hear everysingle part.
ASM ASMR is a thing.
Yeah, it can be a thing for us.
Who doesn't want to hear mychompers going wild on some
chocolate and peanut butter?
Uh speaking that vibe check foryou.
Hey, you're starting.
(08:10):
I haven't vibe checked with youin a minute.
You're starting.
Last time you did it.
SPEAKER_02 (08:15):
It was a bad idea.
It was a bad idea.
It was a really bad idea.
So I've been sick for a month.
SPEAKER_03 (08:25):
Starting so strong.
You're starting so strong.
SPEAKER_02 (08:28):
Remember like four weeks ago when we potted, and I
was like, my voice is gone.
That was like a virus.
Uh I went and got tested.
I think I mentioned this.
It was like, it wasn't COVID,wasn't strep, but I literally
just had this hoarse cough, sorethroat, fevers, hallucinations.
You know, it was three days ofreal bad, and then it slowly
started to taper off.
(08:49):
I have continued to cough on andoff uh since then, and I have a
consistent sore throat.
And like I look at the back ofmy throat, and the back right of
my throat is like still red andinflamed.
It's been a month, man.
It's been a month.
SPEAKER_00 (09:03):
Yeah.
We talked about before on thispodcast, like how you take just
being a healthy human being forgranted, and then you have like
an inconvenience, like a sorethroat for a day, and you're
like, this is the worst.
The worst.
I don't even and you haven't hadit for a month.
SPEAKER_02 (09:17):
I can't even imagine.
It it's wild because you know,I've this this year, um, my wife
and I have actually tried to doa little bit more physical
activity per day, either go fora 30-minute walk or exercise.
And we've been really big intoApple Fitness, uh, specifically
strength.
And I've got a whole likedumbbell set now, and we'll do
strength training.
And it's been it's been such a aburden because I'll start to
(09:39):
exercise and I'll just starthacking and coughing.
It's like, well, I don't wantto, I don't want to lose my
gains.
I gotta keep going.
But like, dude, it is, I am soready for this thing to be over.
And the funniest thing is, youknow, talking about it today, I
was like, you know, I've beensick for a month.
I literally gave a presentationto like a room full of people
yesterday, and like my voice iskilling me, I'm dying.
(10:02):
Um, I should go to the doctor,but like next week's
Thanksgiving, which is a big USholiday, and there's I there's
no way.
So like now I'm in the phasewhere it's like, well, I guess
I'll just wait two more weeksand see if I'm better then.
And then if I'm not, maybe thenI'll go get checked out.
And by then they're gonna say,you're dying.
So that's yeah, that's where I'mat.
How are you doing?
SPEAKER_00 (10:23):
Great start, awesome vibe check.
It's so I'm always just sohappy, like how you're hearing.
I am hearing about you thrivingand prosperous and just doing so
well.
So thank you for sharing thatand bringing up everybody.
Absolutely.
It's what I'm here for.
Uh I also have an ailment.
I hurt my back.
I hurt my back, and it's it'sbad.
(10:46):
It's bad.
So I I've had like an on and offever since I was an athlete, so
I played college sports and Ihurt my back.
And like over time, when you'reyoung, you bounce back, you
know.
And as I got older, I wouldoccasionally like re-injure it
if I'm lifting weights that aretoo heavy, like squatting too
much.
And I'm like, okay, I did it.
I did it.
(11:06):
Like, I'm gonna stop.
In a month or two, I was like,okay, I'm back, like I can gain
the strength up.
And it happened like once everyyear or so.
I would like really throw itout.
Yeah, well, we were uh moving,as I think I talked about, I
moved into a new house, and Idid it.
I threw it out.
I knew exactly the feeling.
I was like, okay, it's gonnatake me a month to bounce back
from this.
It's been three months, and no,it still is a problem.
(11:29):
Like, I can't pick up more thanlike I I did go to a doctor, I
can't pick up more than like 20pounds off the ground.
And I went to the doctor, I gotan x-ray.
Turns out, my I'm gonna say itall wrong now.
You have like your S1 joint atthe bottom of your spine that
connects to your L5, and you'resupposed to have like a good
amount of cushion in you know,in the cartilage in between
(11:50):
those two things.
And basically he showed me theX-ray.
He's like, You see how these,these, uh, your spine is
actually like you have like halfan inch of cartilage between
each thing, and then let's takea look at this one.
And he's like, there's like twomillimeters of cartilage between
these things.
He's like, What?
This is pretty bad.
He's like, You're gonna have totake like two months off, rehab
(12:11):
every single day, do this listof 30 exercises, and just hope
that helps.
And if it doesn't, we'll get anMRI, we'll take a deeper look at
it and see if you did some likeserious nerve damage.
I'm like, oh boy, here we go.
So it's been like it's been likefour, this was week four, but I
was stupid last week and I movedsomething in my yard and I did
it again.
I'm like, gosh dang it.
(12:32):
So now I'm just gonna give itlike two more or three more
weeks, and then I'm gonna goback in for a checkup.
We're gonna talk about it, and Ithink I'm gonna have to get an
MRI because it's not gettingmuch better.
Dude, we're gonna have to renamethis podcast to getting old.
Mm-hmm.
Well, it's funny you say I'vegot a topic for you today.
Oh no.
SPEAKER_01 (12:51):
Oh no.
SPEAKER_00 (12:52):
But anyways, I want all of our listeners to be
really happy.
Protect your back.
Um, yeah, well, you protect yourback for sure.
Word of the wise.
Don't do stupid things like Idid.
But two, also, we're doing thisfor you, injured, sick, we're
here.
We're here over and over everyweek.
SPEAKER_02 (13:08):
I want to ask you a question, uh, since you know,
we're we're here before we getinto the topic about dying.
Um, I want to so one of thethings, you know, I mentioned
the Apple Fitness and thestrength training.
One of the things I've noticedthey really go hard on is the
hinge, which I've never reallydone before in exercise.
But it's like every every otherfreaking exercise they make you
do in their strength training issome kind of hinge.
(13:29):
And like at first, I'm like, myback just hurts all the time.
It's sore.
But now I've I feel so strong inthe back.
So just a shout out to hingeexercises.
And if you're not doing them, dothem because your posture will
improve.
Your just level of sit seatedstanding comfort improves.
And I feel like you get a niceuh just reinforcement to your
(13:52):
core.
Everyone assumes core is front,but core is also back, you know,
and like shout-outs to thehinge.
SPEAKER_00 (13:58):
Yeah, it's it's so interesting.
Like as you get older, how muchmore you need to like warm up
and focus on that, just becauselike your core like you can lift
a lot of weight, but your corecan just not be strong, even
though you can do a bunch ofcrunches.
Yes, it's your back, it's yourstabilizer muscles in your lower
back and like the top of yourglutes that you have to really
work on, and that's what givesyou a solid core.
(14:19):
And I never thought about that.
So now I'm doing all of that.
SPEAKER_02 (14:22):
Shout outs, Pilates.
Uh, you think they're you knowan exercise that is just for
women?
Absolutely not.
Fantastic.
Uh, 30-minute floor.
It's great because you're layingon the ground, it's almost like
a nap where you're moving uh andyou're sweating and sometimes
screaming because your bodyhates you.
But uh Pilates, great shoutouts.
SPEAKER_00 (14:43):
I I think people people who make fun of it for
like not being that hard of anexercise have never tried it.
SPEAKER_02 (14:49):
Yeah, dude.
Like if you tried it, do aminute of clamshells on both
sides and then come back to meand tell me how easy it is.
SPEAKER_00 (14:58):
Well, even the rehab, because I consider myself
to be pretty fit.
You're you're very fit.
I was like, dude, rehab, gonnabe easy.
Like these exercises, no bigdeal.
Like three sets of 15 bodyweight squats, no problem.
And then I'm doing them all inuh in sequence.
And it is just sorry, I'mshowing my cat to Bruce here.
She's right up on my standingdesk, climbed all the way up
(15:18):
here.
But um, I was uh I was doingthese exercises, and I'm like,
holy cow, I'm like sweatingbuckets, my heart rate's going
through the roof.
I'm like, I'm just on thewarmups, I haven't even gotten
to the real deal yet.
So now after a couple weeks,like it's starting to get
easier, but to your point, it'slike don't mess around with the
core, don't mess around with thecore.
Yep.
SPEAKER_02 (15:38):
It's uh it's it's an important set of muscles.
And and you know, truly, Clark,I do hope you have a
rejuvenative healing journeythrough your rehab and you get
back to that sweet, sweet, solidback that you once had that I
admired so fondly.
So good luck.
SPEAKER_00 (15:56):
Good luck on your recovery.
I hope when I see you onTuesday, I can scare the
sickness right out of you.
Oh, I hope so too.
That'll be just magical.
We'll do an exorcism.
It'll be great.
I can't wait.
I can't wait till we do thattogether.
Well, speaking of getting oldand things happening to your
body and us just falling apartat every single angle.
(16:18):
Um I have a topic today.
I want to hear it.
And it's about what is the peakof your career?
Oh, like are we are we in thepeak now?
I was thinking about this.
I was like, like what part wehaven't got we're we're
relatively young, but we're notnew in our careers.
So we have a long way to go.
(16:38):
Like, if you considerretirement, we got decades to
go.
And so I was trying to think,I'm like looking around the
people that I work with, thedifferent age groups, the
demographics, the differentpositions, the titles, and I'm
like, what's the peak?
Like, when are you at the peak?
SPEAKER_02 (16:53):
I I do want to stop you uh because what you just
said freaking horrifies me.
I've got less than two decades,so calm yourself.
I'm counting down the months.
I've got it.
54.
I can piece right the F out andnever work again.
SPEAKER_03 (17:11):
I'm on a plan.
SPEAKER_02 (17:12):
I'm on a plan.
It's not that far away.
That boo-doo on me.
Uh, but I love this.
I love this because uhinterestingly enough, I was
thinking about this.
Like, it's weird you bring thisup because I was thinking about
this just in regards to uppermanagement, right?
I'm a director, you know.
I I mentioned in the past Iapplied for a VP role this year.
(17:32):
I was thinking about like, do Iwant to be a VP ever in the
future?
Looking at what my boss doesnow, looking at his workload,
uh, considering, you know, do Iwant to go into executive?
And no, is the answer.
So then I thought, well, is thisactually where, you know, my
last stop basically?
And then do I go to uh a lesserjob or back to like an IC, get
(17:56):
out of management, get out ofdirectorship, more focused work?
And yes, is is is likely theanswer.
So I I do think this is probablymy peak from where I go from a
hierarchical perspective, butthis is not my peak on the
journey of cool things I get toaccomplish in my job.
(18:16):
I absolutely believe that thereare some way cool things I'll
get to work on in the futurethat have nothing to do with
title.
Waiting for my clock to finish.
Yeah, I can hear it veryslightly.
But it's nice, I like it.
Okay, so the the chimes havecome in.
I am old now, I am dead now, anduh, I I I think you gotta
separate the two because for me,no, but also yes.
SPEAKER_00 (18:40):
You know, when I hear those bells, I just think
of like the the ghost ofChristmas past or present coming
in or future.
Yeah.
Like I just imagine that's thetransition.
Like, is I think that's fromlike the what the Disney movie.
The Muppets?
The Muppet Christmas Carol?
No, no, no.
No, no, the one where uh oh man,maybe it is the Muppets.
(19:00):
It might be the best one.
SPEAKER_02 (19:02):
The Muppet Christmas Carol is actually one of the
most accurate uh retellings ofCharles Dickens' Christmas
Carol.
SPEAKER_00 (19:08):
Really?
Okay, huh?
Yeah.
I I think it might be that, butthat's what it brings me back to
every time I hear your bell.
I'm like, all right, we'retransitioning.
Time to go go to the ghosts ofthe future.
SPEAKER_03 (19:17):
And Gonzo's like, you will be visited with the
battle tolls won!
SPEAKER_00 (19:22):
That was actually really good.
I was probably yeah, no, Ididn't do I'll do a little gonzo
here and there.
But yeah, I'm I'm right therewith you.
I was thinking today, because Iwas talking with someone who's
relatively new, but they're mypeer on the team.
I'm also at the director level,so I also applied for VP role,
and I did a lot of the samethings.
I was like, huh.
You know, looking at what theydo, looking at the age they're
(19:42):
at, like, is that where I wantto be?
Right, like for so long you gothrough that, we're like, of
course it is.
Like through through the lastdecade of working, I'm like,
yeah, of course.
You know, I want to be like theCEO, I want to be the top dog.
And then, like, as you getolder, perspective and life
comes in, and you see the workthat happens, and you're like,
yeah, but are they happy?
Like, are they fulfilled doingthe work that they're doing?
(20:05):
And the person I work with thatjust came in, they're like, hey,
this is like the peak for me.
Like, I have no aspirations togo above this, but I'm really
good in this position.
Like, I'm happy where this isat.
I've kind of mastered it.
I love building teams, but notbeing directly working day to
day with smaller teams.
They're like, not individualcontributor in a level of
management, but not big enoughof a team to like be working
(20:27):
24-7, 365.
So, like, that's the sweet spotfor me.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (20:32):
They know what they want.
I think that's perfect.
And interestingly enough, I feellike you and I are probably
figuring that out right now aswe're hitting this sort of
moment in our careers where wecould go up or or other
directions.
SPEAKER_00 (20:47):
Yeah, yeah, it's it's an interesting topic.
And I was trying to think like,okay, early career.
You don't really know anything.
So, like, you're walking in,you're like, I don't even
understand how corporationswork.
Oh, you're a you're a manager,you're a supervisor, like you're
a lead.
What does that mean?
Like, what do I do?
(21:07):
Where do I go?
And like, I think fondly back tothose times because it's almost
like the naivety makes the workmore fun.
Because you're just learning somany new things.
You're like, the world is myoyster.
I go left, I go right, I godown, I can do a spin, I can, I
could go all these differentdirections, and you don't know
what what to do.
So, like that that time, whileyou're not getting paid a lot,
(21:28):
usually, you're learning a lot,and you'll never be able to go
back to that time.
No, I know it sucks.
Isn't that crazy?
SPEAKER_02 (21:36):
I was thinking about that.
So I I agree, but I do thinkthere's when you start out, and
I think this is important foranyone who's who's younger
listening to this podcast.
When you start out, you don'thave industry knowledge.
And a lot of, and I see thiswhen we we hire young people at
(21:56):
my company, a lot of what theybutt up against is not the
responsibilities of the role,but it's industry knowledge, not
understanding industry acronyms,keywords, phrases, yeah, ideas.
Like there's a lot of thingstied to the field that is not
directly related to your job andyour job responsibilities, but
(22:18):
it does hinder you from doingthem because you don't know that
industry knowledge andexpertise.
I do think though, you know,yeah, we know everything about
our respective industries.
So it doesn't matter where wego, what position we're in,
we're not gonna be learning thatagain unless we truly do a
radical shift.
Like if I become an art dealer,I'm in for a just rug pull of
(22:41):
emotion and and life experiencebecause I know nothing about
art, I know nothing aboutselling art or collecting it,
etc.
But that doesn't really happen.
People stay in their their sortof industry of comfort, but I do
think there is learning andexploration that can happen,
like what happened with you andme.
It's like go from development tosales to marketing to product
management to whatever.
(23:02):
You get to learn a little bit ofa different set of functional
skills, uh, being an individualcontributor, being a manager,
you know, being an upper levelmanager, right?
But all of that is still nuancedand an opportunity to grow and
learn.
And then there's also just theidea that industries change,
grow, evolve.
So you're you're keeping up withtrends if you're doing a good
(23:23):
job and you're trying to stayahead of your customers' wants
and desires.
But you're never gonna be inthat deer in the headlights.
I don't understand what any ofthis is ever again.
That's for sure.
Yeah.
unknown (23:37):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (23:37):
You are definitely in your like peak.
I think we're in our peakproductivity right now for sure.
I don't think that we becomemore productive as the years go
by.
SPEAKER_00 (23:46):
Yeah, I look at even the last like three years, and
I'm like, I think I already hitmy peak peak productivity.
I don't know that I could bemore productive than I was in
the last three years.
I'm like, I'm more tired now.
I'm my back hurts.
I'm like, maybe that was it.
(24:07):
But going back to what you said,before we go younger than me.
Before we go into that, I dowant to touch on like early
career and the early career andlike the things that you should
be doing.
And it's exactly what you justsaid.
It's like learning, tryingdifferent things, and finding
(24:29):
what industry you like and whattype of job you like doing.
Like that's your time.
Because I feel like after that,you kind of have to choose if
you want to earn more money orgo up the ladder.
Like you have to decide what isthat role or what is that
industry I'm gonna focus in onfor the rest of my career.
(24:51):
Because if you decide, hey, I'mgonna spend 10 years in this
industry and then I'm gonnaswitch and spend 10 years in
that industry, very likelyyou're gonna be starting over.
Salary-wise, experience-wise,gear in the headlights,
acronym-wise, like you you thinkthat's possible when you're
young, but then when you getolder, you're like, I can't do
that.
That's not economical for me.
(25:11):
Yeah, I don't have it in me, butalso what's the game?
Like, yeah, I lose everything bydoing that, and I'm gonna have
to restart.
Like, that doesn't sound fun.
So, like, that is the peak timeto be doing that.
It's in your early career, maybefive to ten years, starting off
as like try different things,find out what you like, find out
the industries you enjoy, andpick one.
Pick one to focus your middlecareer on, of like, this is
(25:32):
where I'm going to get really,really good industry domain
knowledge, skill set wise, andthen also, you know, finding
what kind of company I want towork for, what kind of company I
want to build.
SPEAKER_02 (25:42):
And I I do think, you know, to to your point and
to my own, there is anopportunity if you feel like
you're you hit your mid-30s, youmight be a little burnt out, you
might feel a little tired, orlike, is this it?
Is this all there is till I hit54 and I can retire comfortably?
No, um, you absolutely canchange jobs or you can change
(26:02):
industries, you just can't doboth.
Uh, and that would be goodpoint.
I think that is really where youhave to decide.
Like, do I not like the folksaround me, which is that that's
your industry, right?
Or do I not like what I'm doing?
That's your job.
And I think you are able to kindof deftly do that because you
have experience.
Once you hit your mid-30s, youknow a lot about your job and
(26:25):
you know a lot about theindustry.
Whatever you take with you tothe next location is valuable,
but you will have to learnsomething, right?
So if you're staying in theindustry, you could you could
swap jobs at a differentcompany, potentially, you know,
I gotta learn a little bit newprocess, a little bit new
technology, a little bit newfunctionality, but you could do
it.
Or hey, I'm gonna go be, I'm amarketer today, I'm gonna go be
(26:46):
a marketer, you know, I'm in I'min storage today, I wanna go be
in security tomorrow.
I'm gonna go take the securitycourse, learn some security, and
then I'm gonna go become amarketer there.
You can do that.
SPEAKER_00 (26:55):
Yeah, that's absolutely good point.
That is a really good point.
It's like if you manage, if ifyou build expertise in the
function of your role, you canchange industries and probably
be okay.
Yeah.
In in most industries, I wouldsay some, probably not, but in a
lot of industries that'd be thecase.
(27:16):
You can't go from like, youknow, storage to healthcare,
right?
Like, yeah, yeah.
But then yeah, if you'rechanging industries and your
functional piece, like thatwould be just a recipe for
you're literally starting over.
unknown (27:31):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (27:31):
And while you might be capable and be able to do it
quickly, you're still startingover, and it's gonna be a
learning curve.
And that's okay.
To your point, like you mighthave to do it.
Yeah, take a pay cut, find out,and be like, oh man, I really
found something else that Ienjoyed.
And that is interesting becauseit's like you get into the
middle career, and I think bothyou and I have found, would you
say the well, I mean, you pickedan industry.
(27:53):
Yeah.
I picked a function.
Yes, yeah, we we did theopposite, really.
SPEAKER_03 (27:58):
Yeah, we did the opposite.
Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (28:00):
That's interesting.
So either of us could still jumpinto like a tangential either
function or industry andprobably be okay.
And I don't know that we wouldswitch both.
SPEAKER_02 (28:11):
I I do think that is my next jump, though.
I've thought a lot about it, isI I don't want to be in the
industry I'm in anymore.
Uh, so I will I will probably doone of the jobs I've done in the
past somewhere else.
Um done.
SPEAKER_00 (28:25):
Yeah.
That's like the I think there'sa fork in the road once you get
to like the second stage of yourcareer.
I won't say half because it'snot half yet, but it's like the
second stage of your career,you've learned.
It is.
Yeah, you're yeah, that's true,actually.
Like you get to this fork in theroad where it's like, okay,
during the stage after yourearly career where you've kind
(28:47):
of solidified yourself, you'vegot the experience, you've got
the knowledge, you've got theexpertise.
You're probably earning goodmoney, depending on what you do.
Now you've set yourself upfinancially.
You've solidified your life in alot of ways, like where you're
likely going to spend a lot ofyour time, the people you're
gonna be spending your timewith, maybe you got married,
whatever.
(29:08):
And so then you kind of hit thatfork in the road to say, okay,
I've solidified that.
Before I jump into this next arcof my career, I hit this fork in
the road of, is this what I wantto do for the rest?
Or do I want to split and dosomething else?
Like I think there is a fork inthe road there to be like, do I
make a big jump and just dosomething function and industry
different just because I trulyam burnt out and I've been
(29:30):
hating what I've been doing?
Or do you just decide to gosomething completely different
where you're like, I'm gonna gobe an entrepreneur instead of a
career person in a company?
SPEAKER_02 (29:40):
There's, I mean, there's definitely a time window
and a uh sort of finality oflife, right?
I wouldn't say when you're 45,that's the time to strike out
and take a big risk, right?
Because you, you know, you mightbe 10 years from retirement, and
that could totally throw offyour investments and your
ability to hit.
That unless you're okay withthat level of risk, I would say
(30:03):
it's probably better to stay ina somewhat safe bubble of career
growth.
Whereas when you're in your 20s,there's literally nothing you
can't try because you're poorand you're going to be poor for
a long time.
So go be poor doing somethingwild or something interesting
that you might strike it bigwith.
I do I do think 30s is kind oflike that's that's the end of
(30:27):
the experimentation uh for thewild risks.
Uh if you want to retirecomfortably, uh otherwise you do
whatever you want, right?
Yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_00 (30:37):
I agree.
Because like during your 30s,you could be starting a family,
and you know, your your ties toother things and your
responsibilities have grownquite significantly from being a
kid, you know.
So it is kind of your limitedwindow to say, I'm gonna go try
something else, maybe, or I'mgonna stick with what I know and
(30:57):
continue growing in that.
And that's an exciting time.
It's also a scary time.
And I feel like the stage afterthat is when you're in your
peak.
It's like you've known enough,you've set yourself up
financially, you've gained theskill set to actually say, okay,
I kind of know whether I want totry something new or whether I
want to stay with what I'mdoing.
I've got some clarity.
And then from there, it's like,okay, now maybe I need a jump
(31:20):
and a wrist to try to coursecorrect a little bit and make
myself a little happier or getmyself financially in a good
spot or whatever my goals are.
And then I feel like the nextstage, like in your 40s, is like
the peak.
It's like I've learned, I've gotall this wisdom from things I've
done, things I've seen, peopleI've worked with, uh, skill sets
that I've achieved, and I know Iknow what I want, and I've got
(31:42):
clarity over where I want to go.
SPEAKER_02 (31:44):
I got feeling that's the peak.
40s is definitely when if youare executive bound, you can do
that comfortably in a corporateladder climb, right?
Like this is a I didn't go getan MBA and start my own
business, I'm an exec.
This is a I have climbed theladder.
I know everything I need to knowto be a CPO, a CFO, a CMO,
(32:06):
whatever it is.
You have that knowledge, youhave the industry experience.
You've been you've been working20 years, right?
Like you actually have 20 yearsof experience.
So that is when you can reallyset out and achieve those
executive goals if you wantthem.
And companies will hire you forthem because you have all that
domain expertise.
SPEAKER_00 (32:23):
Right.
Absolutely.
Yeah, I just feel like that'sgot to be the peak, right?
Like you've got things figuredout, you know what you want to
do.
I feel like the next arc is likewhen you're starting to fade
out, you're focusing on thebigger picture.
You're like, okay, I workedhard.
Like, I think now it's time forme to relax a little bit and
like step.
Maybe not.
Like maybe you continue tochallenge yourself, but at that
(32:43):
point, it's like, yeah, I'm notgonna kill myself like I was
before, and I know the path thatI'm taking to get to retirement.
SPEAKER_02 (32:49):
That's when you have peak wisdom and life skill.
Like you're no longer peakproductivity, you're you're peak
living your best life, I feel.
Uh, because you know, I I I'mserious here.
Like, I spent a lot of timetalking to my five guy and
putting money away and makingsure that I can get to
retirement as early as humanlypossible.
(33:12):
And that that has been my goalfor a long time because I hate
work and I don't want to work.
That's you know, that's alwaysbeen the goal is to not work.
So, you know, uh planning mypath, charting my course to get
there, that is my peak, is whenI don't have to ever work again,
right?
And I can just sit at home anddo whatever the hell I want all
day.
That sounds magical to me.
(33:33):
So you you do have to kind ofevaluate like maybe I don't want
to retire early, maybe I want tokeep playing the game, maybe I
want to be a CEO.
Well, you know, that a lot ofCEOs are in their late 40s,
early 50s.
So you can you can go that routetoo.
It's it's all about theexperience you have and the
ability to delegate and managethat experience downwards for
(33:56):
those that work for you.
SPEAKER_00 (33:57):
Yep, 100%.
Like at that point, you'vebuilt, hopefully, if you haven't
made a bunch of jumps fromindustry and function because
you can't figure out what youwant to do.
Hopefully, you've made enoughmoney where you're sitting
pretty comfy.
Yeah.
You're like, I could I could getlaid off next week and I'll be
fine.
I'll find another job in theindustry.
I'll use my network.
I've built a strong network.
(34:18):
I know people, like I can justfind another job.
You know, worse comes to worse.
Yeah.
So I feel like that's some ofthe benefit of being at that
stage.
It's like you've built all theseconnections and now you're able
to leverage those too.
SPEAKER_02 (34:30):
I I will say, and just a cautionary piece of
advice for the older listenersout there, um, because we've
seen this.
You and I have seen this in realscenarios.
Don't be too comfy, right?
Like continue to learn, continueto push yourself and experience
new technologies, learn newthings, don't be complacent,
(34:52):
don't be easy to replace,because it is gonna be much
harder for you to get a job ifyou are laid off and you are
comfy than if you are scrappy,resilient, staying on the
cutting edge of things.
You will get rehired.
But I do think comfort does lenda little bit of uh difficulty,
especially as you get up therein age, because companies are
like they're gonna retire infive years anyway.
(35:12):
I'm not gonna hire them.
They they bring nothing to thethe org.
And like they're not supposed todo that, they're not supposed to
profile, but I promise you theydo.
So that's something to consider.
SPEAKER_00 (35:24):
Yeah, I 100% agree with you.
Well, yeah, that's the maintopic I want to talk about.
You know, we live it every day,and I I've just been looking
around and I'm like, when is thepeak?
Like, am I in it?
I don't wanna I don't want torealize it's multiple times.
I don't want to realize it's thegood old times when I'm in when
I'm out of the good old times.
I want to be in the good oldtimes when I really happened.
I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_02 (35:46):
Those were in our 20s, Clark.
SPEAKER_00 (35:48):
We're we're never going back.
Yeah.
For us, that was prettyincredible.
I mean, we weren't making goodmoney, but it was pretty
incredible.
Those were the golden days,those were the good old times,
they're dead.
SPEAKER_02 (35:58):
Uh so now we have to deal with the at least we're
paid well times.
And then we get to go to the atleast it's only 10 years till we
retire times.
So there are multiple peaks.
There are multiple peaks, andit's all about how you summit
them.
I love it.
Well, that was my discussion fortoday.
Thanks for hearing about it.
We've not talked about thatbefore.
So good job coming up with onethat's uh a little bit
(36:20):
different.
SPEAKER_00 (36:21):
Yeah, almost 200 episodes.
We haven't talked about that,which is wild.
So we we had uh we had to findsomething new.
People are sick of us.
Hundred episodes.
Can you believe it?
I was hoping we'd hit 200 beforethe end of the year.
We're 10 away, there's no waythat's gonna happen.
SPEAKER_03 (36:41):
Yeah, it ain't happening.
SPEAKER_00 (36:42):
I just I just looked at the calendar no, no, there's
just no way through theholidays, no, unless we just
start sneaking in randos hereand there, like Discord only.
Well, actually, now ouraccount's all screwed up because
we did a Discord only episodethat we released to our members.
I still counted it.
Oh, did you?
Okay, so you still up thenumber.
SPEAKER_02 (37:01):
Okay, I have the number, yeah.
You just you if you're not inthe discord, you didn't get to
hear it.
It's like, why did they skip anumber?
Man, can they not count?
No, it's in the discord.
It's in the discord, but youknow what's sad is there are
folks that listen that don'tknow how to get to the discord.
They don't?
No, they don't know how to getto really is it is it really
difficult or something?
I just checked uh and uh someonesaid this Discord is the most
(37:24):
difficult thing I've ever seenin my life to get into.
Wow, it's challenging.
It's crazy.
SPEAKER_00 (37:28):
Well, I've got a tip for you.
Oh, oh.
We built a super easy way to doit.
What?
It's pretty hard to keep theriffraff out.
I know you would you would thinkit would be, and you'd think
everybody would be in it withwhat I'm about to say, but
they're not, and you're missingout on exclusive concept, on
great community, on a Danishsailor, a marine engine
(37:49):
engineer.
You're missing out.
He's there.
SPEAKER_02 (37:51):
Well, he he is there, but I mean, do we want
people to know how to get there?
Is that something we want toshare publicly?
This sounds like a secret that'stoo good to be true.
Yeah, you're right.
Maybe we don't tell him.
SPEAKER_01 (38:02):
Okay, yeah, good call.
Good call.
You can give us money though.
You can give us money.
SPEAKER_00 (38:10):
So so should we tell them how to do that?
Should we keep that?
Well, okay, so for the people, Iwon't tell you how to do it, but
what I will say is all you gottado is scroll down and tap a link
with your butt with your withyour thumb.
I was about to say button, andthen just tapped a butt.
(38:30):
So tap the link with your butt.
SPEAKER_02 (38:32):
Un uncheek, roll down your pants so at least one
cheek is exposed.
Please don't.
Smash the cheek with the face ofyour phone.
That's the only way to get intothe Discord.
SPEAKER_00 (38:43):
That's the only way.
Immediate.
Immediately you will be enteredinto the Discord.
It's crazy.
It's crazy how that works.
This requires a cheek smack,that's all.
Yeah, there's a link.
Scroll down, hit the link.
All the stuff is there.
You can buy us a coffee, you cango join the Discord, you can
have a chat with a marineengineer, you can see Bruce's
mustache.
You actually can't do that.
But maybe if you join, he'llpost a pick.
(39:06):
I'll post that's what I'mtalking about.
Yeah, you know, if you just flipyour head upside down now that
you have a mustache, how do youthink that would look?
It looks weird.
I'm trying.
I need like a side by side.
I need a Bruce head upwards.
The blood flowing my brain.
I need a Bruce head downwards,and I wanted them side by side.
SPEAKER_02 (39:24):
Okay.
I will post a picture of meupside down so everyone can see
my mustache.
Good.
That's an incentive to getthere, get in there right now.
Oh, yeah.
Join.
Uh, and do and shout outs forthose again.
In case you didn't hear our lastepisode, uh, we did fail to
notice that some of y'all didspend money and buy us those
coffees to support the show.
And you've actually given uslike over three months of uh
(39:46):
essentially what is our abilityto host this podcast.
So thank you from the bottom ofour hearts.
And Clark will do a better jobof reading the email for when
you do uh give us those bias ofcoffees in the future.
So thanks, Clark.
Yeah, you wonder how many otherpeople have emailed us, so we
just haven't looked.
We just have no idea because Idon't know how to access the
(40:06):
email anymore, and you have theownership of it.
So I'm doubling this one to you.
SPEAKER_00 (40:11):
I get the questions.
I get questions at corporatestrategy.biz, but I don't get I
don't get Bruce or Clark, whichis an issue.
So we're gonna have to fix that.
SPEAKER_02 (40:20):
It's not Bruce or Clark, it's the other one, it's
the one we use for the accounts.
Oh boy.
Okay, I'm gonna have to checkit.
SPEAKER_00 (40:26):
I gotta pull it down.
SPEAKER_02 (40:27):
Okay, we'll we'll figure that one out.
We'll take it offline.
We'll double-click into thatlater.
Uh but until we do that, deepdot double-click, check out that
link tree, join the discord,give us money.
Uh, share the podcast with yourfriends.
Really, that's a that's a bigthing, right?
Like, I've noticed we set a goalthis year that we would buy you
all baby onesies if we had like15,000 listens.
(40:49):
We ain't getting close to that.
So none of y'all are getting thebaby onesie.
But truly, we don't market thispodcast.
I don't pay a damn red cent toput this thing anywhere.
So if you wanted to share onLinkedIn with your friends, with
your family, with yourneighbors, with your coworkers,
please do so.
Uh, we have heard stories offolks that share the pod with
people they work with andthey're all like, This is great.
Thank you so much.
(41:10):
Like, I need this.
So it's the least you can do tohelp us out.
If you can't do anything else,we would really appreciate it.
So thank you in advance forthat.
Uh, and uh thanks for being alistener as always.
SPEAKER_01 (41:22):
That's all I got.
I miss when we used to havePepsi facts.
Do you miss Pepsi facts?
SPEAKER_00 (41:29):
Those were fun.
I'll be honest with you.
I could drink a Pepsi right now.
I could eat a Reese's cup anddrink a Pepsi.
I want both at the same time?
At the same time.
Do you want to be sick?
That's how you get sick.
All right, next episode.
Pepsi and Reese's, here we go.
SPEAKER_02 (41:44):
Pepsi and Reese's.
Let's make it happen.
All right.
Next up.
That should be the Halloweenapp, but we're well past that.
So we are well past.
We're almost going to turkeyweek.
Who who doesn't think aboutReese's Cups and Pepsi for
Thanksgiving?
Who doesn't think about it?
Could you imagine a turkeystuffed with Pepsi and Reese's?
Oh, how would that be a lot?
SPEAKER_00 (42:06):
I'm in.
You know what?
I'm in.
Why not?
I'll take a bite.
I'll take one bite.
Why not?
I'll take a bite.
You gotta try everything once,you know?
SPEAKER_02 (42:14):
Ooh, ooh, you're giving me an idea here.
Okay, so so you know howstuffing.
Turkey has stuffing, right?
I'm I'm with you, I'm following.
So they say.
Uh so the the stuffing is verysimilar in texture to the
stuffing of a Rihe cup.
SPEAKER_01 (42:29):
Can you imagine if they took a turkey-shaped Rihe
cup mold and just stuffed thatbad boy with crumbs?
Ricky peanut butter?
SPEAKER_02 (42:42):
Ooh, that would be I mean, I think.
As you knop on that Riheeturkey, mmm, buddy.
SPEAKER_00 (42:54):
See, the chocolate outer shell needs to be with the
right ratio with the peanutbutter.
That's the only issue.
If it's too much one, too muchthe other, I'm out.
But if you can balance themright, I'm in.
SPEAKER_02 (43:06):
So we basically need to make like a turkey-shaped
Rihee cake.
Yep.
Yeah.
Served with peps.
Served with pepsy on the side.
Bet.
Next week we'll do it.
Uh until then, thanks as alwaysfor listening.
I'm Bruce.
And I'm Clark.
And you're on mute.
(43:26):
We'll see you next week.
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