October 25, 2025 • 41 mins
Ever wondered what it’s like to face a life-threatening illness in a foreign country during a global pandemic? Join us for a conversation with debut author Robin Allison Davis, who shares her deeply personal journey of living in Paris while battling cancer. Robin gives us a window into the complexities and emotional toll of navigating the French healthcare system as an American expat, and how isolation during COVID-19 shaped her poignant memoir. Her story is one of resilience, love, and the intricate dance of crafting a compelling narrative from life's hardest moments.
We unpack the nitty-gritty of writing and pitching a memoir proposal, complete with Robin’s expert tips on structuring your author bio, sample chapter, and marketing section. She opens up about the emotional hurdles of revisiting painful experiences, and offers practical strategies like journaling and therapy to help aspiring authors. Robin's insight into the extensive revision process and the nerve-wracking experience of being on submission provides a candid look into the often-surprising world of publishing.
As we wrap up, the excitement peaks with Robin's plans for a spectacular book launch party on a boat in Paris. We discuss her transition from objective journalism to the deeply personal realm of memoir writing, and she shares the thrilling story of securing her literary agent. Plus, get a sneak peek into her next big project—a horror novel! This episode is a treasure trove for anyone interested in the art of memoir writing, the challenges of the publishing journey, and the transformative power of storytelling.
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🎙️ Craft Chat Chronicles with J.D. Myall
Candid conversations on writing, publishing, and creative life — featuring bestselling authors, MFA students, and writers at every stage of the journey.
About J.D. Myall
J.D. Myall is the co-chair of Drexel University’s MFA Alumni Association and a publishing and library professional. She is the creator and host of Craft Chat Chronicles, where she interviews authors, agents, and industry insiders about the art and business of writing.
Her work has appeared in Ms. Magazine, Writer’s Digest, and HuffPost. Her debut novel, Heart’s Gambit, releases with Wednesday Books/Macmillan in February 2026.
When she’s not conjuring magic, murder, and mayhem on the page, J.D. mentors emerging writers through workshops and alumni programs, fostering community among aspiring and published authors alike.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome to Craft Chat Chronicles, the go-to podcast
for tips on craftingbest-selling fiction.
Here at Craft Chat Chronicles,we bring you expert interviews,
insights and tips on writing,publishing and marketing.
Join the conversation andembark on a new chapter in your
(00:26):
writing journey.
For workshops, show notes andmore information, visit
jdmayalcom.
That's jdmayalcom.
Robin Allison Davis’ (00:37):
In season two, episode eight of Craft Chat
Chronicles, we have debutauthor Robin Allison Davis
talking about living in Paris,her memoir about surviving
cancer and Paris and just themany things that she's overcome
(01:00):
and her publishing journey, andshe talks a little bit about the
process of writing proposalsfor your memoir.
So if you're interested inlearning about the process of
writing a proposal for a memoirand hearing her exciting and
interesting journey betweenliving and dating in Paris and
(01:22):
overcoming cancer while she'sthere, then you definitely want
to tune in because season two,episode eight of Craft Chat
Chronicles will be veryentertaining.
So let's get started.
Where are you on the globe?
I'm in Paris.
Oh, that's exciting.
What brings you to Paris?
Is that where you live, or areyou there for work?
(01:43):
Yes, I've been living in Parisfor eight years.
I'm American.
I moved here from New York,from the DC area, and, yeah, I
live and work here.
Do you like it?
Do you love it?
What's Paris like?
It's way more different than Ithought it was going to be,
because I moved, like I said,from New York, and so I thought
(02:06):
there were a lot of similaritieswith the city and not so much,
not as much as I thought.
So that that's been interestingand it's been quite a wild ride
, which is essentially what mybook is about.
Tell me about your publishingjourney.
So I've always wanted to be anauthor.
(02:26):
I've been writing since a veryyoung age a lot of poems, a lot
of short stories, a lot ofstarted and not finished novels,
and I've always been workingtowards something.
But then, when I had mysituation, my health, when I had
my health complications in 2018, it was very what am I trying
(02:54):
to say For me in 2018, when Ihad my health complications,
when I was diagnosed with breastcancer as an expat, I thought,
okay, I haven't really readanything about this, like
everything I've read aboutmoving to Paris is you move to
Paris.
You meet Pierre your second day, because you guys are both
reaching for the same baguette.
And now you're in love and youhave children that call you mama
(03:17):
.
And I was just like, okay, Ireally don't know how to
navigate this cancer journeyliving abroad.
I don't know anything aboutabroad.
I don't know anything aboutthis.
I don't have any family here.
I'm not even fluent in thelanguage.
So when that happened, I waslike you know what?
I think it would be a goodmemoir that would be helpful for
people that are maybe scared tomove abroad.
(03:39):
They can see that you can do itand bad stuff can happen and
you can still make it through.
And then I kind of put it tothe side.
Around 2020, when the pandemichappened, I was just like is
this really the book that I wantto do?
Is this really the story I wantto tell?
And then, after the firstlockdown that France had, I was
(04:01):
diagnosed with breast canceragain.
So at this time it wasn't justa surgery like I had last time
where I had a mastectomy, it waschemo and radiation and it was
all of these things during theworldwide pandemic where my
family could not fly to be withme because the borders were
closed, and I said, okay, okay,I think I get it now.
(04:22):
I think this is definitely thestory that I need to tell and
it's never the story I thoughtwould be my first book or my
debut.
But here I am.
Love that.
How's your health now?
My health is good.
I've had an all clear for aboutthree years now.
That's a blessing.
(04:42):
That's good to hear.
And have you met Pierre?
Yet I have not met Pierre, butI have met someone who is very
special to me.
That's good to hear.
What was the hardest part of thebook to write?
For me, the hardest part of thebook to write was the, the
(05:03):
portions that I'm stillprocessing myself when I was
writing my novels.
Um, it was different because Iwas trying to put myself in the
head space of the character andyou know, do all this world
building.
But I mean there was no realworld building in the same sense
for a memoir.
For me it was trying to go backand get deep into those
(05:26):
feelings that I have.
Like how did I feel when I wasfirst diagnosed?
How did I feel after mymastectomy and I lost a breast.
How did I feel after all thesethings?
And it's still.
It's still difficult, it'sstill it still can be very
emotional.
For me, it's the it's honestlythe lowest points of my life,
and having to put myself back inthose spaces and describe it
(05:51):
and talk about it in a way thatothers will connect with has
been the hardest part.
Can you walk me through yourwriting process and for writing
this memoir, and how did youstructure your writing routines?
Well, I first started off withwriting a lot of different
(06:12):
vignettes because I wasn't surewhat order I wanted to put
everything in.
So I said, well, let me do afew vignettes.
I figured, okay, I definitelywill talk about my surgery, let
me talk about how it was dating,even how, how it was moving to
Paris before all this happened.
All these different things.
I didn't want to write in alinear fashion, because I find
(06:33):
that a lot of times I getanxious about writing and the
anxiety comes from what is thefirst line going to be?
How do I start this?
So I said, ok, let me just hoparound, hop around and it'll all
come together in the end.
And in the end I sold onproposal Um and I wrote my
proposal over several years Iguess from 2018 to um, 2020,
(06:57):
2021, ish, no 2020.
Cause I I I queried agents inJanuary of 2021.
So I worked on the proposal fortwo years and I had friends who
had worked in publishing orfriends who were authors who
kind of helped me with theproposal structure and in the
(07:18):
end I had my sample chapter,which I tweaked and I was really
happy with.
It was not the first chapter ofmy book and I sent that out
with my proposal, and so that'show, basically, the ball got
rolling for me.
But it was difficult trying tofigure out the exact path that I
wanted to take with the bookand even now, now that I'm still
(07:41):
in this process and onrevisions, it looks nothing like
the proposal.
The sample chapter doesn't evenexist anymore.
It's not even like it'sdifferent.
It's completely different.
What structure did you use forthe proposal?
For the proposal, I mostly wentin chronological order, but I
had a lot of thematic chapters,a lot of thematic chapters and
(08:09):
the thematic chapters in termsof you know, advocating for
yourself, dating, making youknow how to make the move abroad
and things like that, and inthe end, once I had the entire
manuscript, it just didn't work.
It was a bit even.
I had my sister read one of mybe one of my beta readers
readers and she was like I wasreally confused on the timeline
of this and that I was like,well, okay, if you were here for
(08:30):
all of this and you're confusedon the timeline.
Obviously this is not workingin this fashion.
So I had to kind of rework, um,the order of the book and just
make it a bit more chronological, because it is difficult to
follow if you don't realize thatI had cancer twice and all of
those different things I meant.
(08:50):
Like the physical structure foryour proposal, did you do like a
pitch?
And then like how many chaptersdid you use?
For my proposal, I had anauthor bio, I had a sample
chapter.
I had a chapter outline.
I had a sample chapter.
I had a chapter outline, I hada marketing section, I had comp
titles and I believe that thatmight be it.
(09:16):
I might be leaving somethingout, but I that's how I queried
agents and then my agent is avery editorial agent and he
helped me with the proposal aswell before we went on sub.
And who is your agent?
William Clark of William Clarkand Associates.
I was curious about that.
I haven't really heard of toomany people querying on proposal
(09:37):
.
Usually people go out onproposal when they have an agent
already, so I was just a littlecurious.
Yes, mean it's normal formemoir you query, you query
agents with a proposal and thenyou sell on submission on
proposal, which I was glad forbecause I didn't want to have to
do all the emotional labor offinishing the book and then
(09:59):
nobody wants it in the end.
So that is true.
You mentioned emotional labor.
You mentioned anxiety aboutwriting certain parts and you
also mentioned that you werebasically exploring some of your
deepest pains.
Can you walk me through how youovercame the challenges of
recalling and writing aboutpainful experiences?
(10:23):
I did several things in termsof overcoming it and just kind
of remembering it, because thething is when you go through
something traumatic, a lot oftimes your brain will block it
out.
So, thankfully, I have been afaithful journaler most of my
life.
So I went through my journalsand I was like, oh my gosh, I
(10:43):
forgot that this happened or oh,it's interesting.
I felt this way when thathappened and reading that kind
of opened up more of theemotions as well as I took
physical field trips, I putmyself back in the same spaces.
I'm still seeing all the samedoctors, I go off into the same
hospitals.
So doing that when I'm there Imake sure I just kind of open up
(11:04):
my brain like okay, rememberyou were here before.
J.D. Myall (11:07):
How does it?
Robin Allison Davis’ (11:08):
look, how does it smell, how does it, and
all those things start to bringme back more into the emotions
and I I mean I sometimes justjot it down in a notebook or jot
it down on my phone, but itreally helps put me back in that
place In terms of the anxietyand the sadness of it all.
I am an advocate for therapy,which I started therapy right
(11:31):
after I was diagnosed and I wasworking with my therapist to
make sure that while I am doingthe emotional labor it's not
overwhelming for me and itdoesn't cause any sort of
breakdown, because there is alot of PTSD when you're
diagnosed with cancer.
What do you most hope thatpeople get from your memoir?
(11:53):
I hope that in my memoir peopleunderstand that there's a whole
big world out there and I thinka lot of people want to explore
it and they want to get outthere and they want to try to
live abroad and different thingslike that.
But they're afraid.
They're afraid of what couldhappen and one of people's
(12:14):
biggest fears in life in general, whether they're living at home
or an expat is getting cancerand I'm hoping that my book
shows that you can still takethat leap.
You can still do somethingoutside of your comfort zone and
the bad stuff will still happen.
It still could happen, butyou're going to make it through.
It's not the end.
You can do it, you can stickwith it and everything.
(12:35):
Well, fingers crossed, buthopefully everything works out
well in the end.
It's not going to be easy, butit's worth it.
How many revisions do you thinkyou guys did on this?
We are still in the revisionprocess.
(12:55):
So, because I did sell onproposal, I'm a bit later in the
process than some of our fellowdebuts.
So I am still just, I'mbasically just starting
revisions, but I the draft thatI turned into my publisher was
my fifth draft.
Exciting, when are you, um, dueto launch fall of 2025?
And they didn't.
(13:17):
I just asked because I didn'tknow if we had an exact like
month or day or anything.
I don't okay.
So, yeah, at first it was goingto be uh like spring or summer,
but, um, it's fall, so I don'tknow that I'm assuming probably
september, but I don't know.
Have you had any talk aboutyour covering stuff yet?
(13:37):
Uh, they told me to think ofsome ideas and it's funny
because I said I know what Idon't like, but I don't know I
like, especially when it comesto memoirs.
I know you know the celebrityones, they always have the
person's picture on it.
The non-celebrity ones, theyreally seem to vary, so I don't
exactly know.
I'm trying to keep like aPinterest page of different ones
(14:00):
that I like so I can get somesort of inspiration of what I
want.
I love that.
And who are you?
How long were you on submission?
First, I was on submission forlike six months and how did you
cope with that anxiety of that?
Oh gosh, not well, not well atall.
(14:26):
It was just not a very.
You know, my agent is amazingand he is very transparent, but
the whole process in general isjust not very transparent.
You just don't know what peopleare thinking, if they've read
it or if they're just taking toolong to get to it or everything
that's going on.
So I don't know.
I really just kind of threwmyself into my other aspects of
life, other hobbies, traveling,like social life, different
(14:47):
things like that.
I said if it's meant to be outthere, it'll be out there.
I love that.
What were your biggest surprisesso far in your publishing
journey?
Hmm, what are the surprises?
(15:09):
I think I was very surprisedthat people seem to not.
It seems like health memoirsare not that popular, which
(17:03):
surprised me because I mean, forone Suleikha Juwad's book has
done amazing.
It's been like a New York Timesbestseller and there's so many
others like that and I'm justlike, oh really.
But that was something that Iheard a lot from agents, where
they were at times a bithesitant, which was also very
surprising to me, because Parisis always such a big pull for
(17:24):
people.
I've read books about Pariswhere it was just surprising to
me that it was published.
So I was very surprised by thefact that the fact that it had
that health angle, they justreally were like hands off about
that.
That's surprising to me too,because we all go through it.
(17:45):
You know everybody ExactlyHealth issues and whatnot.
If you live long enough, you'regoing to experience it.
Exactly, You're also ajournalist.
Tell me a little bit about yourjournalism and that side of
your writing.
So in journalism, I amprimarily a television
journalist.
I started well, most of mycareer, honestly, has been at
(18:05):
NBC.
Right now I'm a freelancer, butI've been working on long form
true crime shows such asDateline network specials.
I did a lot with them, mostrecently working on morning show
, today show type things, andI've always really loved
television.
(18:26):
Television actually is how Igot into.
I got my broadcast journalismdegree.
I was a child who loved actingand loved writing and I was just
like, oh well, what about thesepeople that are on TV with the
news?
I was like that seems likethat's a mix of the two.
So no, I was not on screen, butI decided not to do that once I
(18:49):
was in college.
But I've always really enjoyedtelevision, watching it,
learning about it, writing thescripts for it and, as a result,
I find that, because I'mworking news, my writing for my
manuscript was a bit tight, alittle too tight.
I'm so used to saying, okay,you've got a minute 45 to get
(19:10):
this script and then we'll putit on.
I'm like, okay, I can write aminute 45 script, but no, I can
let the piece breathe.
For my book I can let itbreathe.
Everything doesn't have to beso tightly written.
So I found that I had to keepexpanding to reach my word count
because I was so concernedabout having things written in a
(19:30):
tight way.
Mm-hmm, Love that.
How did you get started in TVand film?
What do you think you did right?
Because I just I was soconcerned about having things
written in a tight way Love that.
How did you get started in TVand film?
What do you think you did rightthat helped you break into that
industry?
Multiple internships I was ahuge advocate of doing
internships, even when myparents didn't want me to.
I did them in the local station, I did them at the network
stations.
I did whatever I could.
(19:51):
Even I did a summer camp.
Local station, I did them atthe network stations.
I I did whatever I could.
If it was even I did a summercamp when I was in high school
for journalism, for televisionjournalism, Two of them in fact
and any sort of weekendworkshops I could do, I would do
it because I just knew that itis important to be good,
important to be hardworking, tomake your way in, but it's also
important who you know which issad but true.
(20:14):
And the more of these type ofthings you do, the more people
you get to know.
The more professionalorganizations you join, like the
National Association of BlackJournalists, the more people you
know that can help you get thatfoot in or can talk to someone
for you or can even just mentoryou.
And so when I started, I did aninternship at NBC News at
(20:34):
Weekend Today actually in NewYork the summer after my junior
year of college, worked reallyhard on that show.
They said, okay, it's the endof your internship.
If you need anything, let usknow.
So of course, I reached back mysenior year.
I said, well, hey, I'mgraduating in a month or two.
Is there anything?
And they said, okay, well,we'll contact you.
And they did, and I graduatedwith a job.
(20:56):
So, yes, and it was not easy,it was definitely work your way
up the ranks in a not so fun way, but I enjoyed it.
It paid off and as long as youlove what you're doing, then
it's not so bad.
And how about in writing andpublishing?
(21:16):
What do you think you did writethat helped you secure your
book deal and get on the pathyou're on now?
I think it was also talking topeople that genuinely wanted to
help me.
Because one thing I havenoticed is that there can be
sometimes a bit of a gatekeeperattitude in terms of publishing
(21:37):
and some people that I felt Iwas friends with, that had gone
through the process, didn'treally want to give me any
advice or help me with that.
I'm like, okay, interesting.
But then I had other people oneof my very best friends who was
incredibly helpful, likesharing her proposal with me
that got her her book deal andthis and that and other people
that I know that worked inpublishing.
They told me that they wouldtake a look and it was just
(22:00):
having their advice and havingthe support and they were
helping to motivate me.
I think that really helped me,because sometimes I was just
like you know what it just seemstoo hard.
I'm reading on the internethere where nobody gets a book
deal, where nobody getspublished, where 1% of people
(22:21):
all those crazy stats that youread about you can read that and
you can get very disheartenedand demoralized and I think that
my circle, my group of friends,the people that I've met, they
were really, really helpful tome.
I love that.
Do you remember your elevatorpitch?
(22:43):
Can you tell me your pitch.
Oh, I don't think I had anelevator pitch.
Be honest, elevated pitchesmake me so.
They make me anxious, because Ihave actually witnessed someone
giving an elevator pitch in theelevator to my boss and it was
the most awkward thing I'd everseen in my life.
Like everyone was just.
(23:04):
Like you could just seeeveryone's faces turning red out
of embarrassment, like is thisreally happening?
I don't have an elevator pitch,but I will have one before the
book comes out.
I'll make sure that I willperfect that, but yeah, no, I
don't have one.
How are you liking our debutgroup so far?
I like it.
(23:24):
I like it.
I wish it was a bit morediversity in the types of books.
It seems like I'm the onlynonfiction, which is surprising
because I know a lot ofnonfiction authors the majority
of the ones I know but it'sreally.
I like how supportive it is andI feel like you can ask a
question about anything andpeople.
(23:45):
Someone will have an answer, orat least try to have an answer
about it.
Have you made any friends fromthe group so far, or is it just
more of a casual conversation?
It's casual conversation, butthere's some people I talk to
more than others.
There's one person in the groupthat lives in France and I've
talked to her.
Yeah, I think she's going to beleaving France soon, but yeah,
(24:07):
she's been living here for a PhDprogram and we've been chatting
.
And then there's someone elsein the accountability groups
that I chat with.
Now, have you started makingyour own plans for launch yet?
As far as, like, if you'regoing to do a party or what you
want to do on social media orany of that good stuff, I am
definitely having a party.
I like having parties very much.
(24:31):
I like to have my party on aboat.
That's my plan and it will bein Paris and I've told my
friends you know, if you want tofly in, you can, or it could be
just the Paris people.
But yeah, I would love to havesome sort of branded items as a
like party favor.
Of course, lots of books thathopefully people can buy and I
(24:52):
can sign, and I just want it tobe a good time.
Good music, like pop, somechampagne, do a little dancing
at the end, like just a goodtime, because it's been oh my
God, I went through what fiveyears of hell and then just
going through the process ofgetting the book out.
(25:13):
It's just it'll be time toparty.
You owe yourself a good time,definitely.
Yes, yes, what are you workingon currently?
Currently, I am working on acouple of things.
I'm kind of toying around witha novel, a horror novel.
I'm a big horror fan.
So working on something likethat, um, just basically kind of
(25:34):
starting out on it, using it todistract me from getting my
edits back.
But those will be back soon andthen I'll be cracking down on
um, my book, but right now justtinkering around with the horror
novel.
I'm sorry, sorry, I'm going outof order.
I'm just conversational today.
Yeah, it's fine.
So, because I'm about to jumpagain.
(25:57):
That's why I was warning you.
So we talked about you gettingyour agent.
We didn't talk about the call.
Did you get a call?
Did you get an email?
How did that process go?
My agent sent an email sayingthat he was very interested in,
you know, meeting with me,possibly representing me.
So then we did a zoom call.
(26:19):
I was in Florida with my familybecause it was my father's 75th
birthday.
We had gone.
We went to Fort Lauderdale.
Yeah, we went to randomly FortLauderdale to celebrate my dad's
birthday, um, so I took thezoom call in the lobby of the
hotel and I was like, oh, thisguy is like really.
I was like he's really nice,he's really on top of it.
(26:42):
Um, he only, uh, representsnon-fiction.
So I like that.
He has a specialty.
And I asked him if I couldspeak with one or two of his
clients and he agreed and helinked me with one of them.
And then of course you know youhave to go back to the other
agents that your work was out to.
So I did that and I had twoother agents tell me they were
(27:03):
interested.
I took two Zoom calls with twoother agents.
In the end I felt like it wasnot quite the best fit for me.
One agent I spoke with themtwice because the first meeting
actually kind of made me feel alittle.
I just spoke with them twiceand in the end I ended up going
(27:29):
with the um, with the originalagent, who saw something in me
immediately love that, love that.
And when you, when I'm subbedand you.
So how did that go?
Did you do another zoom call?
Was there a phone call?
How does your agent give youthe news and how did you
celebrate?
Um, he sent me an email andthen we talked on Zoom and he
(27:54):
said, ok, we're going to have aZoom call with them to see what
they're thinking about for thebook.
And so we did that and I didn'treally know what to ask.
I was Googling, like, what doyou ask on these calls?
I want to make sure I wasn'tmissing anything.
And so I did that.
And the Zoom call went well.
(28:14):
And then we didn't hearanything for a while.
So I was like, oh, did it notgo well?
What's going on?
And so my agent reached out andhe was like, oh, they're still
interested, but I know also atthe time there was the
Harper-Collins strike, so thatalso might've been delaying
process.
Um, but eventually we had yetanother zoom call when we
(28:37):
decided to okay, let's, let's go, let's go forward with the
whole thing.
And we had a zoom call to likewelcome me to the team.
And it was really great.
It was really great to get toknow my editor and establish a
rapport.
That's awesome.
And what publishing house areyou with?
So I'm with Amistad.
Is the imprint of HarperCollins?
Okay, I'm familiar with Amistad, I've heard good things about
(28:59):
them, so hopefully you'll bewell taken care of and happy
over there.
Yes, yes, I mean so far.
So far, so good.
That's good to hear.
How has your perspective changedon writing after tackling
memoir, and was memoir somethingyou've always written or was
this a new endeavor for you?
This was a new endeavor for mebecause, as a journalist, I've
(29:22):
always tried to not put myselfin the story.
I always tried to keep you knowmy opinions to myself be
unbiased, just not be.
The story is not me, it's neverme.
Opinions to myself be unbiased,it's not be.
The story is not me, it's neverme.
And now the story is me and it.
You know, it's a littlefrightening in a way, because I
just know, as someone who is amember of the media, I know that
(29:43):
there are going to be peoplethat hate it.
They're going to be people thatlike it.
They're going to be people thatsay, well, this was her fault
because she did that, or peoplethat say she should have done it
this way, or I don't understandwhy she and those things are
going to be hard to hear, butit's going to happen.
I need to prepare myself forthat.
It makes me happy to go back tomy first love of fiction, where
(30:07):
I am not the story, but it'salso a bit scary because I think
they say that getting memoirpublished is extremely hard and
the stats are low and you know,because I feel like there are
more people writing fiction.
So that kind of scares me andI'm trying to not let that get
(30:37):
in my head and just let my storyflow and just write the best
novel that I know to write.
But sometimes it gets in myhead a bit Understandable,
understandable.
Do you have any advice forpeople who are tackling memoir
for the first time?
Do you have any advice forpeople who are tackling memoir
for the first time?
I would just say to find out asmuch as you can if there's an
(31:00):
audience for your story.
Find out what your angle shouldbe if your story is unique.
And I would say those are thetop three things, because I've
seen a lot of people that wantto do a memoir on it's kind of a
very commonplace situation andthey're asking why are they not
(31:22):
getting bites from agents oranything like that?
So trying to make sure thatyou've got the right angle for
your story, something thatpeople would really want to read
, and then just go deeper, whichis something that I'm
struggling with.
When you think you've gone deep, you probably have not gone
deep enough is what I'm learning.
So just continue to go deeper,because the deeper you are
(31:45):
emotionally in the memoir, themore people will relate to you
and connect with the book.
I love that and connect withthe book.
I love that.
What's the best piece of writingand craft advice you have for
memoir writers and writers ingeneral?
To take some time away fromyour piece when you finish one
(32:16):
of your drafts.
And unfortunately I did nothave a lot of time away, because
when you do on proposal, youhave a deadline.
The manuscript is due by suchand such date.
So I could not do the StephenKing thing of putting it away
for three months and then goingback to it Like sorry, stephen,
I have a deadline.
And then going back to it likesorry, stephen, I have a
(32:53):
deadline.
So I could not do that.
But if you are especially withfiction maybe where you can do
that, just spend some time awayfrom it, because I find that the
longer I spend away from it,when I come back I can really
see it with fresh eyes.
I can really get into therevisions.
I love revisions.
I hate the first draft, thewriting process, but the
revisions are where I thrive, sotaking that time away is so
useful.
Take enough time where you'reno longer stressed about the
work.
I love that.
What else would you like to saythat we didn't cover?
Yeah, I can't think of anything.
(33:13):
I think you covered quite a lot.
Yeah, that's why I was tryingto ask you a little bit about
how you did the proposal,because then I was like, well,
maybe the angle can be herprocess and then her proposal
writing or something like that.
You know any tips on that?
Yeah, the proposal is a bigpart of it.
It really is, and I mean Idon't know if this is good
advice or not, but so manypeople they say, for your
(33:38):
proposal and when you queryauthors to have your first
chapter of your book, like Isaid, I was moving all around
with my book so it was not eventhe first chapter.
So I would say, if you're, ifyou're holding off because you
want to make sure it'sdefinitely the first chapter, I
think that the agents andpublishing houses give some
grace with that.
I don't think that's somethingthat you necessarily have to
(34:00):
worry so much about.
Like, I would say, submit thechapter that's going to get it
sold.
Love that, love that.
I appreciate your time.
I loved hearing your story.
Thanks, thanks, thanks forhaving me.
And when is your book out?
Same fall, 2025.
They haven't given me a dateyet.
I'm actually probably likeright neck and neck with where
(34:21):
you are, because my agentreached out to me just yesterday
to do the cover console.
She had a form, though.
She sent me some questions,which actually was good because
it helped prompt me to thinkabout how.
Yeah, and she had me, likelinked to some covers I like and
so okay, so I need to reallyfill up my little Pinterest page
then with some covers of like.
(34:42):
I told her I was like I know, Ijust don't want the whole like
Lennon Doyle untamed.
You know all these books havethat cover now, or it's just
like the, you know watercolorsand like the glittering letters.
I'm like that's no.
I was like there's too manybooks like that.
I love the Paris angle.
I love that you were boldenough to tell your truth about
(35:06):
a hard part of your life and Ilove that it's memoir.
Like I said, you're the firstmemoir author I've had the
opportunity to talk to, sohopefully, it takes off and
soars and you know, I hope so, Ireally hope so.
I mean it's just.
Yeah, I feel like I'm writing abook that I haven't seen.
So that was important to me,because no one talks about how
(35:28):
you net.
Everyone talks about how muchthey hate the american health
care system and how europe doesit best, but then there's no,
there's no like book you canread about how someone actually
did go through that and has thatcomparison of what, if this
would have happened to me in theus, should I go back to the us?
Um, like even seleka juad'sbook, she went back to the us
when she was diagnosed withcancer, uh, while living in.
(35:51):
So you know, it's some that'sanother thing people probably
criticize me for in the book.
She should have gone back tothe US.
Are they like us?
You know us brown people Moreopen to the metric, it is true,
it is a Black man cross thestreet.
When they see me to get away,they cross the other way.
And cross the street when theysee me to get away, they cross
(36:12):
the other way.
Yeah, no, I mean, it's not likethe whole, like black love and
all of that.
Black couples is not reallymuch of a thing here.
It's pretty much a unicorn whenyou do see a black couple
together.
My boyfriend is white.
I've dated a couple of blackguys here, but they were African
, as in, they were born inafrica, um, so they're still,
(36:36):
you know, down for it.
But yeah, it's very much mostlyinterracial dating here so I
heard that that men overseas andover there, specifically in
paris, like black women, but Ididn't hear that it was, you
know, almost exclusively theinterracial dating over there.
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, Ihave some friends that have
(37:00):
dated like mostly Black guys,but they were all um.
Also they're from the Caribbean.
If they're from, like um,martinique or Guadeloupe, like
they're often more dating blackwomen.
But yeah, I don't have any.
My black male French friendshere don't.
They've never dated black women, like not once, not ever in
(37:22):
their life.
That's crazy, yeah.
And my black French womenfriends either they've never
dated a black guy.
They're different than overhere.
Yeah, yeah, very different.
Now is the cost of living overthere um, good, is the?
What cost of living?
Yeah, so I was in new yorkbefore.
(37:44):
It's way more expensive in newyork, way more um here,
particularly for me, thegroceries have a good price,
like you can get food for fairlycheap.
You get apartments, aren't?
They're expensive for France,but they're not that expensive
when you compare it to New Yorkand all of that.
(38:04):
But the salaries are extremelylow.
So if you are here with aFrench salary, then it's hard,
it's difficult, but if you I waswith the international, then
it's hard, it's difficult.
But if you, I was with theinternational organization for a
while and they paid well, sothat was fine, and then now with
me freelancing, having us basedclients and things like that,
it makes it okay.
(38:25):
But if it was only French salary, I would probably be struggling
.
Would you come back or wouldyou take it out?
I might come back.
I mean, I would go to, maybelike california, because I've
always loved la.
So I've been thinking aboutthat.
I got my french passport, uh,about a year or two ago, so now
(38:49):
I could just go back and forthif I want.
Is the writing community infrance?
Is there a post-med or a largewriting community over there?
Are you not familiar?
There's a lot of writers, but Iwouldn't say there's a large
writing community.
I haven't noticed much of acommunity when it comes to
writers here.
Maybe I'm wrong and they've gota community I don't know about,
(39:12):
but, um, I just know a bunch of, like you know, writers that
are friends or like looselylinked writers.
So I would like for that tochange.
But I'm closer to, like, theAtlanta area and they have a
really um big writers community.
Like every year they do BlackWriters Weekend in Atlanta.
(39:32):
Oh wow, there's like a literaryawards on that Sunday and all
kind of events all weekend andstuff.
So I was curious if it was likethat over there.
Wow, that's nice, I wish.
Maybe I need to start it.
I don't know well if you evercome down here emailing.
I will, I will, I will you knowsomething like that.
(39:55):
Yeah yeah, there is a.
There's a retreat that I'mtrying to go to in September.
It's in France.
It's Black Women, writers ofEurope.
Oh, I love that.
Yeah, so there's like.
I believe they're BlackAmerican, or they might be Black
British, I'm not sure, butthey're trying to, you know,
cultivate that kind of communityLove, that Love that I won't
(40:16):
hope to have to sit any longer.
It was nice meeting you, nicemeeting you too, and have a
great day, everything when it'sgood to go.
But send me your headshot andyour cover when you have it,
because I'm going to yeah.
J.D. Myall (40:37):
That wraps up today's craft chat chronicles
with JD Mayer.
Thanks for joining us.
If you like the episode, pleasecomment, subscribe and share.
For show notes, writingworkshops and tips, head to
jdmayercom.
That's jdyocom.
While you're there, join JD'smailing list for updates,
(40:58):
giveaways and more.
Welcome to Craft Chat Chronicles, the go-to podcast
for tips on craftingbest-selling fiction.
Here at Craft Chat Chronicles,we bring you expert interviews,
insights and tips on writing,publishing and marketing.
Join the conversation andembark on a new chapter in your
(00:26):
writing journey.
For workshops, show notes andmore information, visit
jdmayalcom.
That's jdmayalcom.
Robin Allison Davis’ (00:37):
In season two, episode eight of Craft Chat
Chronicles, we have debutauthor Robin Allison Davis
talking about living in Paris,her memoir about surviving
cancer and Paris and just themany things that she's overcome
(01:00):
and her publishing journey, andshe talks a little bit about the
process of writing proposalsfor your memoir.
So if you're interested inlearning about the process of
writing a proposal for a memoirand hearing her exciting and
interesting journey betweenliving and dating in Paris and
(01:22):
overcoming cancer while she'sthere, then you definitely want
to tune in because season two,episode eight of Craft Chat
Chronicles will be veryentertaining.
So let's get started.
Where are you on the globe?
I'm in Paris.
Oh, that's exciting.
What brings you to Paris?
Is that where you live, or areyou there for work?
(01:43):
Yes, I've been living in Parisfor eight years.
I'm American.
I moved here from New York,from the DC area, and, yeah, I
live and work here.
Do you like it?
Do you love it?
What's Paris like?
It's way more different than Ithought it was going to be,
because I moved, like I said,from New York, and so I thought
(02:06):
there were a lot of similaritieswith the city and not so much,
not as much as I thought.
So that that's been interestingand it's been quite a wild ride
, which is essentially what mybook is about.
Tell me about your publishingjourney.
So I've always wanted to be anauthor.
(02:26):
I've been writing since a veryyoung age a lot of poems, a lot
of short stories, a lot ofstarted and not finished novels,
and I've always been workingtowards something.
But then, when I had mysituation, my health, when I had
my health complications in 2018, it was very what am I trying
(02:54):
to say For me in 2018, when Ihad my health complications,
when I was diagnosed with breastcancer as an expat, I thought,
okay, I haven't really readanything about this, like
everything I've read aboutmoving to Paris is you move to
Paris.
You meet Pierre your second day, because you guys are both
reaching for the same baguette.
And now you're in love and youhave children that call you mama
(03:17):
.
And I was just like, okay, Ireally don't know how to
navigate this cancer journeyliving abroad.
I don't know anything aboutabroad.
I don't know anything aboutthis.
I don't have any family here.
I'm not even fluent in thelanguage.
So when that happened, I waslike you know what?
I think it would be a goodmemoir that would be helpful for
people that are maybe scared tomove abroad.
(03:39):
They can see that you can do itand bad stuff can happen and
you can still make it through.
And then I kind of put it tothe side.
Around 2020, when the pandemichappened, I was just like is
this really the book that I wantto do?
Is this really the story I wantto tell?
And then, after the firstlockdown that France had, I was
(04:01):
diagnosed with breast canceragain.
So at this time it wasn't justa surgery like I had last time
where I had a mastectomy, it waschemo and radiation and it was
all of these things during theworldwide pandemic where my
family could not fly to be withme because the borders were
closed, and I said, okay, okay,I think I get it now.
(04:22):
I think this is definitely thestory that I need to tell and
it's never the story I thoughtwould be my first book or my
debut.
But here I am.
Love that.
How's your health now?
My health is good.
I've had an all clear for aboutthree years now.
That's a blessing.
(04:42):
That's good to hear.
And have you met Pierre?
Yet I have not met Pierre, butI have met someone who is very
special to me.
That's good to hear.
What was the hardest part of thebook to write?
For me, the hardest part of thebook to write was the, the
(05:03):
portions that I'm stillprocessing myself when I was
writing my novels.
Um, it was different because Iwas trying to put myself in the
head space of the character andyou know, do all this world
building.
But I mean there was no realworld building in the same sense
for a memoir.
For me it was trying to go backand get deep into those
(05:26):
feelings that I have.
Like how did I feel when I wasfirst diagnosed?
How did I feel after mymastectomy and I lost a breast.
How did I feel after all thesethings?
And it's still.
It's still difficult, it'sstill it still can be very
emotional.
For me, it's the it's honestlythe lowest points of my life,
and having to put myself back inthose spaces and describe it
(05:51):
and talk about it in a way thatothers will connect with has
been the hardest part.
Can you walk me through yourwriting process and for writing
this memoir, and how did youstructure your writing routines?
Well, I first started off withwriting a lot of different
(06:12):
vignettes because I wasn't surewhat order I wanted to put
everything in.
So I said, well, let me do afew vignettes.
I figured, okay, I definitelywill talk about my surgery, let
me talk about how it was dating,even how, how it was moving to
Paris before all this happened.
All these different things.
I didn't want to write in alinear fashion, because I find
(06:33):
that a lot of times I getanxious about writing and the
anxiety comes from what is thefirst line going to be?
How do I start this?
So I said, ok, let me just hoparound, hop around and it'll all
come together in the end.
And in the end I sold onproposal Um and I wrote my
proposal over several years Iguess from 2018 to um, 2020,
(06:57):
2021, ish, no 2020.
Cause I I I queried agents inJanuary of 2021.
So I worked on the proposal fortwo years and I had friends who
had worked in publishing orfriends who were authors who
kind of helped me with theproposal structure and in the
(07:18):
end I had my sample chapter,which I tweaked and I was really
happy with.
It was not the first chapter ofmy book and I sent that out
with my proposal, and so that'show, basically, the ball got
rolling for me.
But it was difficult trying tofigure out the exact path that I
wanted to take with the bookand even now, now that I'm still
(07:41):
in this process and onrevisions, it looks nothing like
the proposal.
The sample chapter doesn't evenexist anymore.
It's not even like it'sdifferent.
It's completely different.
What structure did you use forthe proposal?
For the proposal, I mostly wentin chronological order, but I
had a lot of thematic chapters,a lot of thematic chapters and
(08:09):
the thematic chapters in termsof you know, advocating for
yourself, dating, making youknow how to make the move abroad
and things like that, and inthe end, once I had the entire
manuscript, it just didn't work.
It was a bit even.
I had my sister read one of mybe one of my beta readers
readers and she was like I wasreally confused on the timeline
of this and that I was like,well, okay, if you were here for
(08:30):
all of this and you're confusedon the timeline.
Obviously this is not workingin this fashion.
So I had to kind of rework, um,the order of the book and just
make it a bit more chronological, because it is difficult to
follow if you don't realize thatI had cancer twice and all of
those different things I meant.
(08:50):
Like the physical structure foryour proposal, did you do like a
pitch?
And then like how many chaptersdid you use?
For my proposal, I had anauthor bio, I had a sample
chapter.
I had a chapter outline.
I had a sample chapter.
I had a chapter outline, I hada marketing section, I had comp
titles and I believe that thatmight be it.
(09:16):
I might be leaving somethingout, but I that's how I queried
agents and then my agent is avery editorial agent and he
helped me with the proposal aswell before we went on sub.
And who is your agent?
William Clark of William Clarkand Associates.
I was curious about that.
I haven't really heard of toomany people querying on proposal
(09:37):
.
Usually people go out onproposal when they have an agent
already, so I was just a littlecurious.
Yes, mean it's normal formemoir you query, you query
agents with a proposal and thenyou sell on submission on
proposal, which I was glad forbecause I didn't want to have to
do all the emotional labor offinishing the book and then
(09:59):
nobody wants it in the end.
So that is true.
You mentioned emotional labor.
You mentioned anxiety aboutwriting certain parts and you
also mentioned that you werebasically exploring some of your
deepest pains.
Can you walk me through how youovercame the challenges of
recalling and writing aboutpainful experiences?
(10:23):
I did several things in termsof overcoming it and just kind
of remembering it, because thething is when you go through
something traumatic, a lot oftimes your brain will block it
out.
So, thankfully, I have been afaithful journaler most of my
life.
So I went through my journalsand I was like, oh my gosh, I
(10:43):
forgot that this happened or oh,it's interesting.
I felt this way when thathappened and reading that kind
of opened up more of theemotions as well as I took
physical field trips, I putmyself back in the same spaces.
I'm still seeing all the samedoctors, I go off into the same
hospitals.
So doing that when I'm there Imake sure I just kind of open up
(11:04):
my brain like okay, rememberyou were here before.
J.D. Myall (11:07):
How does it?
Robin Allison Davis’ (11:08):
look, how does it smell, how does it, and
all those things start to bringme back more into the emotions
and I I mean I sometimes justjot it down in a notebook or jot
it down on my phone, but itreally helps put me back in that
place In terms of the anxietyand the sadness of it all.
I am an advocate for therapy,which I started therapy right
(11:31):
after I was diagnosed and I wasworking with my therapist to
make sure that while I am doingthe emotional labor it's not
overwhelming for me and itdoesn't cause any sort of
breakdown, because there is alot of PTSD when you're
diagnosed with cancer.
What do you most hope thatpeople get from your memoir?
(11:53):
I hope that in my memoir peopleunderstand that there's a whole
big world out there and I thinka lot of people want to explore
it and they want to get outthere and they want to try to
live abroad and different thingslike that.
But they're afraid.
They're afraid of what couldhappen and one of people's
(12:14):
biggest fears in life in general, whether they're living at home
or an expat is getting cancerand I'm hoping that my book
shows that you can still takethat leap.
You can still do somethingoutside of your comfort zone and
the bad stuff will still happen.
It still could happen, butyou're going to make it through.
It's not the end.
You can do it, you can stickwith it and everything.
(12:35):
Well, fingers crossed, buthopefully everything works out
well in the end.
It's not going to be easy, butit's worth it.
How many revisions do you thinkyou guys did on this?
We are still in the revisionprocess.
(12:55):
So, because I did sell onproposal, I'm a bit later in the
process than some of our fellowdebuts.
So I am still just, I'mbasically just starting
revisions, but I the draft thatI turned into my publisher was
my fifth draft.
Exciting, when are you, um, dueto launch fall of 2025?
And they didn't.
(13:17):
I just asked because I didn'tknow if we had an exact like
month or day or anything.
I don't okay.
So, yeah, at first it was goingto be uh like spring or summer,
but, um, it's fall, so I don'tknow that I'm assuming probably
september, but I don't know.
Have you had any talk aboutyour covering stuff yet?
(13:37):
Uh, they told me to think ofsome ideas and it's funny
because I said I know what Idon't like, but I don't know I
like, especially when it comesto memoirs.
I know you know the celebrityones, they always have the
person's picture on it.
The non-celebrity ones, theyreally seem to vary, so I don't
exactly know.
I'm trying to keep like aPinterest page of different ones
(14:00):
that I like so I can get somesort of inspiration of what I
want.
I love that.
And who are you?
How long were you on submission?
First, I was on submission forlike six months and how did you
cope with that anxiety of that?
Oh gosh, not well, not well atall.
(14:26):
It was just not a very.
You know, my agent is amazingand he is very transparent, but
the whole process in general isjust not very transparent.
You just don't know what peopleare thinking, if they've read
it or if they're just taking toolong to get to it or everything
that's going on.
So I don't know.
I really just kind of threwmyself into my other aspects of
life, other hobbies, traveling,like social life, different
(14:47):
things like that.
I said if it's meant to be outthere, it'll be out there.
I love that.
What were your biggest surprisesso far in your publishing
journey?
Hmm, what are the surprises?
(15:09):
I think I was very surprisedthat people seem to not.
It seems like health memoirsare not that popular, which
(17:03):
surprised me because I mean, forone Suleikha Juwad's book has
done amazing.
It's been like a New York Timesbestseller and there's so many
others like that and I'm justlike, oh really.
But that was something that Iheard a lot from agents, where
they were at times a bithesitant, which was also very
surprising to me, because Parisis always such a big pull for
(17:24):
people.
I've read books about Pariswhere it was just surprising to
me that it was published.
So I was very surprised by thefact that the fact that it had
that health angle, they justreally were like hands off about
that.
That's surprising to me too,because we all go through it.
(17:45):
You know everybody ExactlyHealth issues and whatnot.
If you live long enough, you'regoing to experience it.
Exactly, You're also ajournalist.
Tell me a little bit about yourjournalism and that side of
your writing.
So in journalism, I amprimarily a television
journalist.
I started well, most of mycareer, honestly, has been at
(18:05):
NBC.
Right now I'm a freelancer, butI've been working on long form
true crime shows such asDateline network specials.
I did a lot with them, mostrecently working on morning show
, today show type things, andI've always really loved
television.
(18:26):
Television actually is how Igot into.
I got my broadcast journalismdegree.
I was a child who loved actingand loved writing and I was just
like, oh well, what about thesepeople that are on TV with the
news?
I was like that seems likethat's a mix of the two.
So no, I was not on screen, butI decided not to do that once I
(18:49):
was in college.
But I've always really enjoyedtelevision, watching it,
learning about it, writing thescripts for it and, as a result,
I find that, because I'mworking news, my writing for my
manuscript was a bit tight, alittle too tight.
I'm so used to saying, okay,you've got a minute 45 to get
(19:10):
this script and then we'll putit on.
I'm like, okay, I can write aminute 45 script, but no, I can
let the piece breathe.
For my book I can let itbreathe.
Everything doesn't have to beso tightly written.
So I found that I had to keepexpanding to reach my word count
because I was so concernedabout having things written in a
(19:30):
tight way.
Mm-hmm, Love that.
How did you get started in TVand film?
What do you think you did right?
Because I just I was soconcerned about having things
written in a tight way Love that.
How did you get started in TVand film?
What do you think you did rightthat helped you break into that
industry?
Multiple internships I was ahuge advocate of doing
internships, even when myparents didn't want me to.
I did them in the local station, I did them at the network
stations.
I did whatever I could.
(19:51):
Even I did a summer camp.
Local station, I did them atthe network stations.
I I did whatever I could.
If it was even I did a summercamp when I was in high school
for journalism, for televisionjournalism, Two of them in fact
and any sort of weekendworkshops I could do, I would do
it because I just knew that itis important to be good,
important to be hardworking, tomake your way in, but it's also
important who you know which issad but true.
(20:14):
And the more of these type ofthings you do, the more people
you get to know.
The more professionalorganizations you join, like the
National Association of BlackJournalists, the more people you
know that can help you get thatfoot in or can talk to someone
for you or can even just mentoryou.
And so when I started, I did aninternship at NBC News at
(20:34):
Weekend Today actually in NewYork the summer after my junior
year of college, worked reallyhard on that show.
They said, okay, it's the endof your internship.
If you need anything, let usknow.
So of course, I reached back mysenior year.
I said, well, hey, I'mgraduating in a month or two.
Is there anything?
And they said, okay, well,we'll contact you.
And they did, and I graduatedwith a job.
(20:56):
So, yes, and it was not easy,it was definitely work your way
up the ranks in a not so fun way, but I enjoyed it.
It paid off and as long as youlove what you're doing, then
it's not so bad.
And how about in writing andpublishing?
(21:16):
What do you think you did writethat helped you secure your
book deal and get on the pathyou're on now?
I think it was also talking topeople that genuinely wanted to
help me.
Because one thing I havenoticed is that there can be
sometimes a bit of a gatekeeperattitude in terms of publishing
(21:37):
and some people that I felt Iwas friends with, that had gone
through the process, didn'treally want to give me any
advice or help me with that.
I'm like, okay, interesting.
But then I had other people oneof my very best friends who was
incredibly helpful, likesharing her proposal with me
that got her her book deal andthis and that and other people
that I know that worked inpublishing.
They told me that they wouldtake a look and it was just
(22:00):
having their advice and havingthe support and they were
helping to motivate me.
I think that really helped me,because sometimes I was just
like you know what it just seemstoo hard.
I'm reading on the internethere where nobody gets a book
deal, where nobody getspublished, where 1% of people
(22:21):
all those crazy stats that youread about you can read that and
you can get very disheartenedand demoralized and I think that
my circle, my group of friends,the people that I've met, they
were really, really helpful tome.
I love that.
Do you remember your elevatorpitch?
(22:43):
Can you tell me your pitch.
Oh, I don't think I had anelevator pitch.
Be honest, elevated pitchesmake me so.
They make me anxious, because Ihave actually witnessed someone
giving an elevator pitch in theelevator to my boss and it was
the most awkward thing I'd everseen in my life.
Like everyone was just.
(23:04):
Like you could just seeeveryone's faces turning red out
of embarrassment, like is thisreally happening?
I don't have an elevator pitch,but I will have one before the
book comes out.
I'll make sure that I willperfect that, but yeah, no, I
don't have one.
How are you liking our debutgroup so far?
I like it.
(23:24):
I like it.
I wish it was a bit morediversity in the types of books.
It seems like I'm the onlynonfiction, which is surprising
because I know a lot ofnonfiction authors the majority
of the ones I know but it'sreally.
I like how supportive it is andI feel like you can ask a
question about anything andpeople.
(23:45):
Someone will have an answer, orat least try to have an answer
about it.
Have you made any friends fromthe group so far, or is it just
more of a casual conversation?
It's casual conversation, butthere's some people I talk to
more than others.
There's one person in the groupthat lives in France and I've
talked to her.
Yeah, I think she's going to beleaving France soon, but yeah,
(24:07):
she's been living here for a PhDprogram and we've been chatting
.
And then there's someone elsein the accountability groups
that I chat with.
Now, have you started makingyour own plans for launch yet?
As far as, like, if you'regoing to do a party or what you
want to do on social media orany of that good stuff, I am
definitely having a party.
I like having parties very much.
(24:31):
I like to have my party on aboat.
That's my plan and it will bein Paris and I've told my
friends you know, if you want tofly in, you can, or it could be
just the Paris people.
But yeah, I would love to havesome sort of branded items as a
like party favor.
Of course, lots of books thathopefully people can buy and I
(24:52):
can sign, and I just want it tobe a good time.
Good music, like pop, somechampagne, do a little dancing
at the end, like just a goodtime, because it's been oh my
God, I went through what fiveyears of hell and then just
going through the process ofgetting the book out.
(25:13):
It's just it'll be time toparty.
You owe yourself a good time,definitely.
Yes, yes, what are you workingon currently?
Currently, I am working on acouple of things.
I'm kind of toying around witha novel, a horror novel.
I'm a big horror fan.
So working on something likethat, um, just basically kind of
(25:34):
starting out on it, using it todistract me from getting my
edits back.
But those will be back soon andthen I'll be cracking down on
um, my book, but right now justtinkering around with the horror
novel.
I'm sorry, sorry, I'm going outof order.
I'm just conversational today.
Yeah, it's fine.
So, because I'm about to jumpagain.
(25:57):
That's why I was warning you.
So we talked about you gettingyour agent.
We didn't talk about the call.
Did you get a call?
Did you get an email?
How did that process go?
My agent sent an email sayingthat he was very interested in,
you know, meeting with me,possibly representing me.
So then we did a zoom call.
(26:19):
I was in Florida with my familybecause it was my father's 75th
birthday.
We had gone.
We went to Fort Lauderdale.
Yeah, we went to randomly FortLauderdale to celebrate my dad's
birthday, um, so I took thezoom call in the lobby of the
hotel and I was like, oh, thisguy is like really.
I was like he's really nice,he's really on top of it.
(26:42):
Um, he only, uh, representsnon-fiction.
So I like that.
He has a specialty.
And I asked him if I couldspeak with one or two of his
clients and he agreed and helinked me with one of them.
And then of course you know youhave to go back to the other
agents that your work was out to.
So I did that and I had twoother agents tell me they were
(27:03):
interested.
I took two Zoom calls with twoother agents.
In the end I felt like it wasnot quite the best fit for me.
One agent I spoke with themtwice because the first meeting
actually kind of made me feel alittle.
I just spoke with them twiceand in the end I ended up going
(27:29):
with the um, with the originalagent, who saw something in me
immediately love that, love that.
And when you, when I'm subbedand you.
So how did that go?
Did you do another zoom call?
Was there a phone call?
How does your agent give youthe news and how did you
celebrate?
Um, he sent me an email andthen we talked on Zoom and he
(27:54):
said, ok, we're going to have aZoom call with them to see what
they're thinking about for thebook.
And so we did that and I didn'treally know what to ask.
I was Googling, like, what doyou ask on these calls?
I want to make sure I wasn'tmissing anything.
And so I did that.
And the Zoom call went well.
(28:14):
And then we didn't hearanything for a while.
So I was like, oh, did it notgo well?
What's going on?
And so my agent reached out andhe was like, oh, they're still
interested, but I know also atthe time there was the
Harper-Collins strike, so thatalso might've been delaying
process.
Um, but eventually we had yetanother zoom call when we
(28:37):
decided to okay, let's, let's go, let's go forward with the
whole thing.
And we had a zoom call to likewelcome me to the team.
And it was really great.
It was really great to get toknow my editor and establish a
rapport.
That's awesome.
And what publishing house areyou with?
So I'm with Amistad.
Is the imprint of HarperCollins?
Okay, I'm familiar with Amistad, I've heard good things about
(28:59):
them, so hopefully you'll bewell taken care of and happy
over there.
Yes, yes, I mean so far.
So far, so good.
That's good to hear.
How has your perspective changedon writing after tackling
memoir, and was memoir somethingyou've always written or was
this a new endeavor for you?
This was a new endeavor for mebecause, as a journalist, I've
(29:22):
always tried to not put myselfin the story.
I always tried to keep you knowmy opinions to myself be
unbiased, just not be.
The story is not me, it's neverme.
Opinions to myself be unbiased,it's not be.
The story is not me, it's neverme.
And now the story is me and it.
You know, it's a littlefrightening in a way, because I
just know, as someone who is amember of the media, I know that
(29:43):
there are going to be peoplethat hate it.
They're going to be people thatlike it.
They're going to be people thatsay, well, this was her fault
because she did that, or peoplethat say she should have done it
this way, or I don't understandwhy she and those things are
going to be hard to hear, butit's going to happen.
I need to prepare myself forthat.
It makes me happy to go back tomy first love of fiction, where
(30:07):
I am not the story, but it'salso a bit scary because I think
they say that getting memoirpublished is extremely hard and
the stats are low and you know,because I feel like there are
more people writing fiction.
So that kind of scares me andI'm trying to not let that get
(30:37):
in my head and just let my storyflow and just write the best
novel that I know to write.
But sometimes it gets in myhead a bit Understandable,
understandable.
Do you have any advice forpeople who are tackling memoir
for the first time?
Do you have any advice forpeople who are tackling memoir
for the first time?
I would just say to find out asmuch as you can if there's an
(31:00):
audience for your story.
Find out what your angle shouldbe if your story is unique.
And I would say those are thetop three things, because I've
seen a lot of people that wantto do a memoir on it's kind of a
very commonplace situation andthey're asking why are they not
(31:22):
getting bites from agents oranything like that?
So trying to make sure thatyou've got the right angle for
your story, something thatpeople would really want to read
, and then just go deeper, whichis something that I'm
struggling with.
When you think you've gone deep, you probably have not gone
deep enough is what I'm learning.
So just continue to go deeper,because the deeper you are
(31:45):
emotionally in the memoir, themore people will relate to you
and connect with the book.
I love that and connect withthe book.
I love that.
What's the best piece of writingand craft advice you have for
memoir writers and writers ingeneral?
To take some time away fromyour piece when you finish one
(32:16):
of your drafts.
And unfortunately I did nothave a lot of time away, because
when you do on proposal, youhave a deadline.
The manuscript is due by suchand such date.
So I could not do the StephenKing thing of putting it away
for three months and then goingback to it Like sorry, stephen,
I have a deadline.
And then going back to it likesorry, stephen, I have a
(32:53):
deadline.
So I could not do that.
But if you are especially withfiction maybe where you can do
that, just spend some time awayfrom it, because I find that the
longer I spend away from it,when I come back I can really
see it with fresh eyes.
I can really get into therevisions.
I love revisions.
I hate the first draft, thewriting process, but the
revisions are where I thrive, sotaking that time away is so
useful.
Take enough time where you'reno longer stressed about the
work.
I love that.
What else would you like to saythat we didn't cover?
Yeah, I can't think of anything.
(33:13):
I think you covered quite a lot.
Yeah, that's why I was tryingto ask you a little bit about
how you did the proposal,because then I was like, well,
maybe the angle can be herprocess and then her proposal
writing or something like that.
You know any tips on that?
Yeah, the proposal is a bigpart of it.
It really is, and I mean Idon't know if this is good
advice or not, but so manypeople they say, for your
(33:38):
proposal and when you queryauthors to have your first
chapter of your book, like Isaid, I was moving all around
with my book so it was not eventhe first chapter.
So I would say, if you're, ifyou're holding off because you
want to make sure it'sdefinitely the first chapter, I
think that the agents andpublishing houses give some
grace with that.
I don't think that's somethingthat you necessarily have to
(34:00):
worry so much about.
Like, I would say, submit thechapter that's going to get it
sold.
Love that, love that.
I appreciate your time.
I loved hearing your story.
Thanks, thanks, thanks forhaving me.
And when is your book out?
Same fall, 2025.
They haven't given me a dateyet.
I'm actually probably likeright neck and neck with where
(34:21):
you are, because my agentreached out to me just yesterday
to do the cover console.
She had a form, though.
She sent me some questions,which actually was good because
it helped prompt me to thinkabout how.
Yeah, and she had me, likelinked to some covers I like and
so okay, so I need to reallyfill up my little Pinterest page
then with some covers of like.
(34:42):
I told her I was like I know, Ijust don't want the whole like
Lennon Doyle untamed.
You know all these books havethat cover now, or it's just
like the, you know watercolorsand like the glittering letters.
I'm like that's no.
I was like there's too manybooks like that.
I love the Paris angle.
I love that you were boldenough to tell your truth about
(35:06):
a hard part of your life and Ilove that it's memoir.
Like I said, you're the firstmemoir author I've had the
opportunity to talk to, sohopefully, it takes off and
soars and you know, I hope so, Ireally hope so.
I mean it's just.
Yeah, I feel like I'm writing abook that I haven't seen.
So that was important to me,because no one talks about how
(35:28):
you net.
Everyone talks about how muchthey hate the american health
care system and how europe doesit best, but then there's no,
there's no like book you canread about how someone actually
did go through that and has thatcomparison of what, if this
would have happened to me in theus, should I go back to the us?
Um, like even seleka juad'sbook, she went back to the us
when she was diagnosed withcancer, uh, while living in.
(35:51):
So you know, it's some that'sanother thing people probably
criticize me for in the book.
She should have gone back tothe US.
Are they like us?
You know us brown people Moreopen to the metric, it is true,
it is a Black man cross thestreet.
When they see me to get away,they cross the other way.
And cross the street when theysee me to get away, they cross
(36:12):
the other way.
Yeah, no, I mean, it's not likethe whole, like black love and
all of that.
Black couples is not reallymuch of a thing here.
It's pretty much a unicorn whenyou do see a black couple
together.
My boyfriend is white.
I've dated a couple of blackguys here, but they were African
, as in, they were born inafrica, um, so they're still,
(36:36):
you know, down for it.
But yeah, it's very much mostlyinterracial dating here so I
heard that that men overseas andover there, specifically in
paris, like black women, but Ididn't hear that it was, you
know, almost exclusively theinterracial dating over there.
Oh yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah, Ihave some friends that have
(37:00):
dated like mostly Black guys,but they were all um.
Also they're from the Caribbean.
If they're from, like um,martinique or Guadeloupe, like
they're often more dating blackwomen.
But yeah, I don't have any.
My black male French friendshere don't.
They've never dated black women, like not once, not ever in
(37:22):
their life.
That's crazy, yeah.
And my black French womenfriends either they've never
dated a black guy.
They're different than overhere.
Yeah, yeah, very different.
Now is the cost of living overthere um, good, is the?
What cost of living?
Yeah, so I was in new yorkbefore.
(37:44):
It's way more expensive in newyork, way more um here,
particularly for me, thegroceries have a good price,
like you can get food for fairlycheap.
You get apartments, aren't?
They're expensive for France,but they're not that expensive
when you compare it to New Yorkand all of that.
(38:04):
But the salaries are extremelylow.
So if you are here with aFrench salary, then it's hard,
it's difficult, but if you I waswith the international, then
it's hard, it's difficult.
But if you, I was with theinternational organization for a
while and they paid well, sothat was fine, and then now with
me freelancing, having us basedclients and things like that,
it makes it okay.
(38:25):
But if it was only French salary, I would probably be struggling
.
Would you come back or wouldyou take it out?
I might come back.
I mean, I would go to, maybelike california, because I've
always loved la.
So I've been thinking aboutthat.
I got my french passport, uh,about a year or two ago, so now
(38:49):
I could just go back and forthif I want.
Is the writing community infrance?
Is there a post-med or a largewriting community over there?
Are you not familiar?
There's a lot of writers, but Iwouldn't say there's a large
writing community.
I haven't noticed much of acommunity when it comes to
writers here.
Maybe I'm wrong and they've gota community I don't know about,
(39:12):
but, um, I just know a bunch of, like you know, writers that
are friends or like looselylinked writers.
So I would like for that tochange.
But I'm closer to, like, theAtlanta area and they have a
really um big writers community.
Like every year they do BlackWriters Weekend in Atlanta.
(39:32):
Oh wow, there's like a literaryawards on that Sunday and all
kind of events all weekend andstuff.
So I was curious if it was likethat over there.
Wow, that's nice, I wish.
Maybe I need to start it.
I don't know well if you evercome down here emailing.
I will, I will, I will you knowsomething like that.
(39:55):
Yeah yeah, there is a.
There's a retreat that I'mtrying to go to in September.
It's in France.
It's Black Women, writers ofEurope.
Oh, I love that.
Yeah, so there's like.
I believe they're BlackAmerican, or they might be Black
British, I'm not sure, butthey're trying to, you know,
cultivate that kind of communityLove, that Love that I won't
(40:16):
hope to have to sit any longer.
It was nice meeting you, nicemeeting you too, and have a
great day, everything when it'sgood to go.
But send me your headshot andyour cover when you have it,
because I'm going to yeah.
J.D. Myall (40:37):
That wraps up today's craft chat chronicles
with JD Mayer.
Thanks for joining us.
If you like the episode, pleasecomment, subscribe and share.
For show notes, writingworkshops and tips, head to
jdmayercom.
That's jdyocom.
While you're there, join JD'smailing list for updates,
(40:58):
giveaways and more.
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