May 14, 2025 • 47 mins
Andrew Davies is on a mission to transform the corporate world with the magic of improv! In our chat, we dive deep into how he uses his skills as the Better Meetings Director at Artly Working to help teams ditch the snooze-fest meetings and embrace creativity and collaboration instead. Imagine a workplace where brainstorming feels like fun instead of a chore—yeah, that’s what we’re talking about! We also get into the nitty-gritty of how you don’t have to be the funniest person in the room to rock improv; it’s all about being present and supportive. So grab your favorite mug and get ready to learn how to spice up those meetings that should’ve been an email—because trust me, you’ll want to tune in for this one!
Bio
Andrew Davies is the Better Meetings Director of Artly Working, which uses Improv and Theatre to help build stronger teams made up of happier people, and higher performers. Since starting in 2019 Artly Working has led programs with over 100 innovative companies like Netflix, Roblox, Meta, and Google.
With training In Improvisation from The Magnet Theatre, and Facilitation from Georgetown University, Andrew Is passionate about bringing those skills to strengthen company culture, and people experience. His Better Meetings workshop helps teams to gather with purpose and play, designing and facilitating more effective meetings that people actually want to attend!
Andrew has won several awards for his groundbreaking work including the Young Pioneer Award from the Jewish Education Project and the Pomegranate Prize from the Covenant Foundation. Andrew is also the co-founder of Charactours, theatrical walking tours where the past visits you, and The Bible Players, a Jewish comedy team.
When Andrew’s not working, he can be found making up songs with his toddlers Miller and Oren, bike riding around Philadelphia, or leading a free tennis camp In the neighborhood
Links
Takeaways:
- Improv isn't just about being funny; it's all about being real and present in the moment, which can transform your day-to-day interactions.
- Andrew Davies shows us how improv can bridge the gap between artistic expression and corporate culture, making meetings more engaging and effective.
- Creating a supportive environment in the workplace is crucial—everyone should feel they can participate without fear of judgment.
- The 'Yes, and...' principle can be a game changer in brainstorming sessions, helping to nurture creativity and collaboration among team members.
Links referenced in this episode:
Companies mentioned in this episode:
- Artly Working
- Netflix
- Roblox
- Meta
- Caricatures Theatrical Walking Tours
- Bible Players
How do I get such great guests?
PodMatch I use Podmatch to get the best guests on the show. Check out PodMatch if you
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
Create Art Podcast InterviewAndrew Davies hello friend. This
is Timothy Keem O'Brien, yourhead instigator for Create Art Podcast,
where I bring my over 30 yearsof experience in the arts and educational
world to help you tame yourinner critic and create more than
(00:26):
you consume. So I'm continuingon with my slew of interviews. I
had a lot of interviews thisyear so far here in 2025. And the
person you're about to hear,his name is Andrew Davies. Now, I
met him in Podmatch, which isa service I use to connect guests
(00:48):
with podcast hosts and I doreceive a small commission for that.
But again, as I like to tellyou, I'm only going to bring on the
people that I think are goingto definitely assist you with your
creative endeavors. So let'stalk about Andrew right here, right
now. And we just, I think whenyou hear this interview, you're going
(01:12):
to hear a lot of fun with thisone for sure. Now, Andrew is the
Better meetings director ofArtly Working, which uses improv
and theater to help buildstronger teams made up of happier
people and higher performers.Now, since starting it in 2019, Artly
(01:32):
Working has led programs withover 100 innovative companies like
Netflix, Roblox, Meta andGoogle. I'm sure you've heard of
these. If you haven't, you'reliving underneath a rock. Now, with
training and improvisationfrom the Magnet Theater and Facilitation
(01:52):
from Georgetown University,Andrew is passionate about bringing
these skills to strengthencompany culture and people experience.
His Better Meetings workshophelps teams together with purpose
and play, designing andfacilitating more effective meetings
that people actually want toattend. And I'm just going to stop
(02:16):
right there for a second. Soat work and at home, I have a mug
that says I survived anothermeeting. That should have been an
email. And I got to tell you,we really need Andrew where I work,
where I do my day to day work.So I definitely want to talk to my
boss and see if we can hireAndrew in on this one. And that's
(02:37):
one of the reasons why Iwanted to interview him, because
he's showing how you can useyour art in a corporate setting.
And why not? I mean, we'retalented. You're talented in what
you do, I'm talented in what Ido, and why not bridge that gap?
Now, Andrew has won severalawards for his groundbreaking work,
(02:59):
including the Young PioneerAward from Jewish Education Project
and the Pomegranate Prize fromthe Covenant Foundation. Andrew is
also the co founderCaricatures Theatrical Walking Tours
where the past visits you andthe Bible Players, which is a Jewish
(03:20):
comedy team. When Andrew's notworking, he can be found making up
songs with his toddler'sMiller and Oren bike, riding around
Philadelphia or leading a freetennis camp in the neighborhood.
I have bestowed upon him thehonor of being a twin dad, even though
he is. Kids aren't the sameage. Anybody that has two kids like
(03:43):
that and does all his stuffthat he does automatically gets assigned
twin dad status in my book.All right, I'm going to step out
of the way here for thisinterview. And here it is. Andrew
Davies appearing on Create Artpodcast. I know you're going to love
it. I have the pleasure ofspeaking with Andrew Davies. Andrew,
(04:05):
how is it going for you this evening?
It's going pretty well. Yeah.Doing good. Kids are asleep. Feeling
good.
Awesome. Awesome. That isgood. I know how that feels when
they're asleep because I'vegot the twins, and when they're asleep,
the fun can begin.
That's right. That's right.
Well, I'm really glad that youcame on the show. Here we've been
(04:27):
talking back and forth usingPod Match, and something that really
caught my eye was improv withyou. And I've done improv. I'm originally
from Chicago, and, you know,you can't live in Chicago and not
do improv. It's just, youknow, it's that deep dish pizza and
(04:49):
whatnot. But one question Ihad about that that I hear a lot
is, do you really need to befunny to do improv?
Yeah, it's a great question.And I love that you. You did some
improv in your life inChicago. I think between that and
deep dish, definitely thehealthier thing to do for your life,
you know, so, you know, do youneed to be funny to do improv? You
(05:13):
really don't. I think improv,one of the kind of common misunderstandings
is that improv is really aboutbeing funny, telling jokes, being
quick, being witty, and that.That's the whole goal of it. I think
improv is really teaching youhow to be real, how to be genuine,
how to be in the moment, howto be honest and authentic. And I
(05:37):
think that improv reallystrips away a lot of the, you know,
preparations that we have inlife, the way we disguise ourself
with clothes or preparation ordifferent things. And it just says,
okay, you are making things upin the moment. Everything is in this
moment. Can you be real? Canyou be honest? Can you build something
(06:01):
together? And so what I loveabout improv is really that everyone
can do it. And I thinkEveryone learns a lot about themselves
when they do it.
Yeah, for sure. For sure.Because I can tell you I'm not the
most funniest guy on the faceof the planet, but when I trust my
scene partners, somethinghappens. And I don't know what that
is because I'm not, you know,my art is not improv. I'm just, you
(06:26):
know, the big dumb guy thatcomes on the, you know, on the stage
and, you know, does stupidthings. But maybe the Chris Farley
type guy. But sure, I knowthat when I'm working and collaborating
with the team, it comes outbeautiful. So I love improv. I really
(06:46):
do.
Yeah.
Now I work for the federalgovernment. How can I use improv
in my workplace? Because a lotof our listeners that are out there,
they're putting their toe intodoing art, doing whatever they want
to do, but how can I take thatimprov? Take an improv class and
(07:08):
use that at work.
Yeah. So I think an improvclass is really great for anyone
to practice the tools of beinga better listener, a better communicator,
and really a collaborator as ateammate. So improv is really rarely
a solo sport. It's almostalways two or more people, and that's
(07:29):
because you're making thingsup from scratch. And I think we do
a lot of improvising in ourworkplace all the time, but we don't
necessarily have the tools ofhow to be a good collaborator. So,
you know, one of the kind offamous maxims if people know anything
about improv is yes, and.Which is really not always having
(07:49):
to say yes or agree with whatpeople are saying, but what it means
is saying yes to their ideafirst, acknowledging hearing, seeing
their idea, and then wantingto add on to it. So I think very
often in the workplace, one ofthe things I think we can really
notice just in our own headsis how often our first reaction in
our brain, not even out loud,necessarily. Maybe. No. Right. When
(08:12):
someone says, hey, this month,I think we should. We should try
a new marketing campaign wherewe all, you know, eat lunch at the
same table and we film it, andyou're in your brain, you might be
saying, no, that wouldn'twork. That's dumb. We're not actors.
Or, that wouldn't work. Wetried something like that last year.
And so I think the challengeof improv to us is to invite us to
(08:35):
try to say yes in our mindsfirst and then add on to it. Because
oftentimes ideas get shut downbefore they even really get to grow.
And improv is all about takingA little idea, a little moment, and
making it grow. And I thinktoo often in our workplaces, we never
get to the big ideas. We neverget to the exciting ideas, because
(08:57):
our instinct is to see thenegative right away and to shut it
down. So I think it just canstart in our own minds with just
noticing how we react and thenchanging it. A really simple game
I love to play just to getpeople noticing how quickly we can
be judged judgmental. It'sjust a game called band names. Right?
We all have bands like that welove. And band names, you can play
(09:20):
with two or more people andanyone just says a band name so they
can just look around you forideas if you don't have anything.
I can look around myself rightnow, and it's like, you know, water
cup, phone case, right.Computer screen. And the other people
in the group just have to say,I love it. And then we have a new
band name. And all it is is tonotice how in our minds, when we're
(09:43):
not. We don't really have aband. There's no real stakes. We're
not really deciding anything.How quickly we still, in our minds,
are like, computer screen,that's a terrible band name. Right.
Like, we instantly startjudging it, even though there's no
consequence. So to practicenoticing that judgment in our mind
and try and just like, tampthat down and let the ideas come
through and see if you can do10 or 20 or 30 band names and then
(10:05):
pause and say what was greatthat came out of that. Right? And
if we never did those initialterrible band names or unexciting
band names, we wouldn't findthe one that we actually love. You
know, Revolver toothpaste orwhatever we love and finding that.
So I think just noticing ourtendency to say no and inviting ourselves
to try to say yes.
(10:25):
I like that. And I have somany band names that some of them
I can't say on the air becauseof the language. So, you know, for
sure, well, let's. Let's divea little bit, a little bit into you.
Because this, you know, usingimprov in the workplace does fascinate
me. But let's. Let's find outkind of what makes you tick a little
(10:49):
bit. When you look back atyour early career, is there a moment
where you felt like, hey, Ifound my calling. I've made it. This
is what I want to do?
Yeah, I think there's a few ofthose moments early on in my life,
and I think that for allartists, as you know, your podcast
(11:13):
is really about creating art.Helping people jump into art. I think
the biggest thing is raisingyour hand and giving it a try. And
that is really the toughestthing. So the first moment where
I remember doing that, I wasin fifth grade. I was 10 years old.
And our teacher, Mrs. Aaron,did a musical every year with our
class. And the auditionprocess was very simple. She gave
(11:35):
us each a note card, and shetold us to write on the note card
if we wanted a big part or asmall part and singing or non singing.
And so we all got that samechoice. And I thought about it for
a minute, and I was, like, alittle nervous about it. I was like,
I don't know. I've neverreally done a show. And I was like,
big part singing, non singing.I don't really know if I have a good
voice. You know what singing.Like, why not? And so we did Fiddler
(11:57):
on the Roof that year, and Igot to play Tevye, the lead in this
show. And I'm convinced tothis day it's because I was the only
boy that probably put bigparts singing, right? And so just
by raising my hand and saying,yeah, I'm up for singing, I really
think that's why I got therole, because we didn't audition,
we didn't do anything. And sofor me, that was a light bulb moment
(12:17):
of how scary it is to raiseour hand, how scary it is to try,
but how satisfying it can be.And then I loved the experience so
much. That was kind of when Ifirst caught the bug. And then, really
in high school, I had anincredible musical theater director
who really convinced all of usthat we were putting on a Broadway
show. I went to a tinysuburban Jewish high school, and
(12:40):
he really convinced us thatthis was critical, that this show
was amazing, that we wereBroadway level, and we believed it.
And so I think the show cameout pretty well, considering, you
know. And so I think doing theMusic man with him was. Was a big
moment for me. And then for mein New York City, I studied improv
at the Magnet Theater. And itwas really there where I found that
(13:01):
improvisation was the form oftheater that allowed me to kind of
bring my creativity, bring myvoice, and really challenged me to
really be honest and myselfand not be able to just hide behind
a character or a costume or ascene, but be my genuine self. And
it also really unlocked for mehow powerful our imaginations are
(13:24):
to create a scene and create astory. That when people would watch
a show, you can just jump intoit and say, something is true, and
then it is. I Remember oneshow on my team, the Commotion? We
would make up a musical everyweek, a musical show every Tuesday.
And we got the suggestion of,like, fish. That was just the suggestion,
the word fish. And we starteda scene, and two of us were tuna
(13:47):
in a tank together at, like, asushi restaurant. And we were trying
to escape, and that was ourscene. So we just said, we're tuna
in a tank. And suddenly weare, right. The audience went with
us. We didn't needpyrotechnics, costumes. And so that
has really stuck with me inall of my work. And I really encourage
people is that forstorytelling, for play. We all have
such rich imaginations that wedon't need a lot to get our imagination
(14:09):
going. So I love that aboutimprov, that we can do it anywhere,
we can do it anytime. And it'sreally just building on all of our
brilliant imaginations in ourminds to paint the scene.
And we can do it cheaply, too,say, which I know a lot of businesses
are like, how do I do thischeaply? Well, you can pay Andrew
a lot of money and he can showyou how to do it cheaply.
(14:31):
Exactly, exactly. And itreally is like. I think one of the
beautiful things about improvand when we come into workplaces
and we work on things withfolks, is when you get these tools,
they are just a renewableresource. They are something you
can come back to wheneveryou're feeling stuck and come back
to these activities, come backto these approaches. Games as simple
(14:52):
as band names or ones that getmuch more complicated, and you can
always come back to them tokind of renew that sense of team,
team and the spirit and thefocus that you have as a group. So,
yeah, it really is like thegift that keeps on giving, and I
love it so much that way.
How do you, you know, workingfor corporations, you know, coming
(15:13):
into the work workplace likethat, how do you balance that corporate
culture with the art culture?You know, there's a misnomer that,
you know, all of us artistsare sitting here smoking cigarettes
in berets wearing, you know,black fingernail polish and black
eyeliner. Just for the record,I'm not wearing that tonight, but
(15:38):
in case I was, you know. Buthow do you balance that and how do
you feed yourself as an artistby working in that. In that sphere?
Yeah, that's a great question.You know, it definitely starts with
listening, as all great improvdoes. So listening to the leaders
(16:01):
of the organization, to thefolks in the organization, to get
a sense of what is theircompany culture, what are Things
like how. How much do theycollaborate in general? What is the.
What is the vibe like ingeneral? And we always start our
sessions by tell people. We'renot asking you to become, you know,
a traveling Shakespeareanactor today. All we're asking you
(16:22):
to do is to notice whereyou're at in your comfortability
and just try and turn it likeone little click. Just try and challenge
yourself and turn it onelittle click. So for some people,
that means speaking at all inany improv game is going to take
all their courage. And we'relike, great, amazing. You stepped
in and you gave a suggestionthat was great. For other people,
they're going to be morecomfortable presenting, and they
(16:43):
may want to jump into somemore complicated games. So everyone's
starting at their own place,and I think recognizing that and.
And letting people know thatthey are their own barometer of,
like, what. What the successlooks like, I think, you know, I
really feel that everyone isan artist. I really believe that
in every profession, in everyplace. So I think that while people
(17:03):
are a little scared initiallyto jump into things, they really
find their creativity and findtheir voice. I often feel that we
need to treat kids more likeadults and adults more like kids.
You know, I think. I think itwas Picasso maybe, that said that
we are all artists aschildren, and then we need to find
that again when we get older.When I teach improv in school settings,
(17:28):
in elementary schools, and Iask for a volunteer, almost every
hand shoots up every timebecause kids recognize this is going
to be fun. I'm going to enjoythis. I want to be part of it. With
adults, I rarely even ask forvolunteers. I just say, okay, next
game is Tim and Jennifer. Comeon up. Right? Because I know that
being put on the spot is soscary for us. We become so afraid
(17:50):
of making a mistake, afraid offailing, that we need that kind of
encouragement. And so I thinkgiving that encouragement to people,
once people see that it's kindof a safe space they can play together,
people really jump into it.And I think, you know, that's what
we've gotten better at atartly working. Myself and my co founder,
Dave Classko, is reallybridging the world of artists and
(18:11):
companies and corporations.And we've learned some of their language,
you know, thinking inquarters, which is something I never
really did before, and. Andthings like that, their timeline
and schedule. But, you know,we have so much more in common than
separates us. And I alwaystell them, like, I'm not an expert
in your industry. That's notwhy I'm here. I'm an expert in people,
(18:31):
in communication, incollaboration and teamwork. Right.
And that's why I'm here. SoI'm not trying to tell you that the
way you're doing yourparticular work is. Is wrong or different.
I'm trying to share with youtools that I think are useful to
your group. And, you know,like I was saying, starting with
listening, we always get asense of what they're hoping to improve
on. Is it really, like,morale? That's a trouble? Is it that
(18:54):
we have a hard time followingthrough on projects when we start
them? Is it that we have ahard time, you know, staying in touch
or communicating? So it variesthat way. But, yeah, I think we can
bridge those worlds. Like Isaid, there's an artist in all of
us, so everyone can speak thatlanguage, too. I think.
I. I love how you said that,because I have been preaching that
(19:15):
for. Oh, gosh. I don't want tosay how old I am. Everybody knows
I'm 52 at the time of thisrecording, you know, But I have been.
You know, that's somethingthat I discovered early in my. In
my journey, is that we, youknow, we're all artists, and we all
have that creative. Thatcreative spark in each and every
(19:36):
one of us. And I like thequote by Picasso where, you know,
we're all, you know, start offas art, you know, start off, you
know, painting as an artist,and then we're always continually
trying to get back to that.Amen to that.
Yeah.
How do you. And I think youhinted at it just a little while
(19:59):
ago, but how do you overcomethe reluctance when you're walking
into a corporate setting?Because, again, people think us artists
are, you know, in the beretsand the cigarettes and all the makeup
and all that kind of stuff.How do you overcome that and really
(20:20):
get your foot in the door?
I think that when people firststart, everyone's a little bit nervous,
unsure what to expect, butthat as we play together, really
starts to build trust. So Ithink we start really simply and
really small, and we work upto harder things. So I think when
(20:42):
people think of improvisation,they immediately jump to the greatest
performers in the worldperforming. Maybe they think of Whose
Line Is It Anyway? Or, youknow, Second City or some of the
stars they know from SaturdayNight Live and those shows doing
improv. And, you know, that'sreally like level 10 of improv. Right?
And so we want to encouragepeople that we're starting really
simple. So one of the things Ilove to do Is starting with non verbal
(21:06):
activities, right? Startingwith activities where we just get
to move our bodies. SometimesI invite people to just kind of like
pass a sound around thecircle, right? So we're not even
asking you to make any wordchoices to think of anything, Just
asking you to pass the soundor just ask you to silently do a
mirror activity, right? Justsilently mirroring another person
(21:27):
in our movements can get us tothink about our body, to start to
get comfortable with the ideaof play without asking us for really
any high level creativity orthinking out of the box. Because
I think it's really thepressure we put on ourselves that's
a worry. And so when peoplesee they can do it, they just feel
(21:48):
so much better. I, I think somuch of what I love about improv
is that it lets us play andlets us fail, make mistakes and realize
that we're okay and gonna beokay. And I think that when people
see they can play games, ifthey mess up a game, we just try
the game again. It's not theend of the world that they start
(22:10):
to get comfortable with it.And there's also an exhilaration
that they find when they trysomething scary they weren't sure
they can do. Like one game Iwill build to maybe about half an
hour, an hour into a sessionis a game I love called speech, where
everyone takes turns steppinginto the middle of a circle and improvising
a speech. And the way it worksis they say, I am sick and tired
(22:30):
of. And someone from theoutside of the circle who's not them
suggests an object, a noun,something simple. It can't be people
or because we don't want to bemean. And I don't want to be complicated
because I don't want people tobe put on the spot. I don't want
it to be like the economy andto have people have to get in their
heads, right? I alwaysencourage you just look around the
room. I'm always like lightbulbs we hate, you know, posters,
(22:51):
books, whatever it is. Andthen the person in the middle has
to say three reasons they'resick and tired of it. Books. They're
too hard to read. I alwaysdrop mine in the toilet when I'm
reading. And the pages arealways ripped, right? And it doesn't
matter what the three reasonsare. We all like clap like maniacs.
And I see the fear when peoplestep, take their turn to step into
(23:12):
the middle and how scary itcan be. And then how good they feel
knowing that the whole groupis going to support them. And games
like That I always say to theteam, it's not about the person in
the middle. It's all about thesupport and culture of safety and
support that the whole circleis making. So it's up to the circle
to make it easy for thatperson in the middle. And that's
(23:33):
really, for me, like a centralmetaphor for the workplace is what
are you doing as a circle tomake sure that whenever one of you
is in the middle, you knoweveryone has your back. Right. You
have the support of everyoneon your team. So I hope that that
feeling of the support youhave from your team really sticks
with people, and they knowthat when it's their turn to give
(23:54):
a big presentation, you know,to send out an important email, whatever
it is in your organization,that you have the support of those
people in the circle. It'sreally a circle of support.
That, that is awesome. I, I,oh, my gosh, we need you. Come on
over. We need you.
Yeah. Yeah.
(24:14):
I can't be the only onepreaching this kind of stuff in my
job, so.
Yeah. Yeah. And oftentimes,you know, it helps to have someone
from the outside come in andintroduce this. Right. Because if
each of us in our workplacetried to introduce it, it might be
read by our co workers aslike, oh, you think you know more
than me, or you think you're abetter teammate than me, when that's
(24:36):
not really what we're saying.Right. But when I come into the workplace,
in some ways it's easier,right. Because I'm an outsider. I'm,
I'm not telling you what areright or wrong about your dynamics.
I'm just helping to give youtools and help, help you to grow.
And so it can really, canreally be great to jumpstart things,
I think, in a nice way.
Something that, you know,because I, I'm kind of corporate.
(24:58):
I'm, you know, federalgovernment, so that's, that's corporate.
Ish, Something we all hate.And I have a coffee mug that says,
I survived another meeting.That should have been an email. So
let's talk about meetings.How, how can I use improv to make
a meeting better? I know, youknow, before you're talking about,
(25:20):
you know, having everyonethere and creating that, that, that
circle of support, which Ithink is awesome, but how can I use
improv when I'm leading a meeting?
So I think when we're leadinga meeting, the first thing is to
check in with ourselves beforethe meeting to make sure we know
(25:41):
why we're having thisparticular meeting. Right. Too often
in our workplace, meetings getput on the calendar or we meet every
Monday and that becomes thefocus of the meeting or there is
no focus. Right. And so Icreated, with Artly working, a better
meetings template, we call it.And I really created that because
I wanted to give something forpeople who maybe only had five minutes
(26:04):
before a meeting to check inwith themselves about why they were
having that meeting. So justtaking like five minutes to check
in can be so important. If youhave an hour, great. But we don't
always have that. But I thinkjust stopping ourselves five or ten
minutes before. So I thinkimprov can really help us to think
about the group. And one ofthe things that's defining for improv
(26:28):
is that everyone isparticipating is that the program
is interactive. And so I thinkthe number one metric to look at
of whether a meeting wassuccessful or not, worthwhile or
not, was it a meeting or not?Was, was it interactive or was it
frontal? Right. Was itparticipatory and everyone's participating,
(26:51):
or was it, you know, a speechand putting people to sleep? Right.
If it could have been apodcast like you said, if it could
have been an email, it wasn'treally a meeting, right? It was a
verbal email. It was a. It wasan in person podcast. And that's
fine if that's what peoplesign up for, right? If you sign up
to see a speech, great, yousee a speech. But a meeting really
(27:12):
should include everyone. Andthe reason is because the reason
you're meeting together isbecause there's magic that happens
in the space that you'remeeting together is that ideas can
grow in the group and can growtogether. So a couple ways you can
specifically use improv.Right. One, like I was saying, is
kind of to kick offbrainstorming and to brainstorm in
(27:34):
the mindset of yes. And so youcould start with something like band
names with a partner to getyour brain going. And you could come
to every meeting saying, Iwant to make sure there's a moment
of every meeting where we'reasking the team to brainstorm and
we're going to say yes and towhatever they say in the moment of
the meeting. Right. If you'rethe boss, right. And you're running
the meeting, you may know inyour mind 100 reasons why. Some suggestions
(27:56):
will be difficult, but it'sreally valuable during that time
you're together not to wastetime on the negative of like, well,
here's the 10 reasons why wecan't do a company picnic. Just say,
great, tell me about thecompany picnic you want to see and
they'll describe it, and youmay not end up doing that specific
idea, but you might later say,you know, they talked about that
company picnic a lot, but Iwonder if we could just do something
simple. We, like. We bring inblankets, and we just, like, sit
(28:18):
on the floor in ourauditorium, and we have a picnic
at the building or whatever itis. I think if you. If you encourage
that, that improv, thatbrainstorming. Yes. And mindset,
that can be. That can be sohuge. And I think another thing is
to notice the energy of themeeting. Right. Sometimes we go with
the best intentions for thingsto be interactive, for things to
(28:39):
be participatory, but theenergy just drops. That people are
fading. People are distractedon our computers, it's very hard
to stay focused. Right. Likewhen we're speaking now, I made sure
to close every tab on mycomputer. I'm turning off notifications.
I don't want to be bothered byanything else. And that's really
hard in our meetings to havethat focus. So to invite people to,
(29:00):
like, be in the room, reallytry and be present, like improv.
And if we see people fading,pause for a moment, and let's think
of what we can do. We couldjust, like, do some wiggles. Stand
up and wiggle around. We coulddo the mirror activity. The one person
could just stand up. As aleader, you could start copying.
Just ask everyone to mirroryou, just to make everyone move around
in a fun way. And I guaranteewhen you jump back into the conversation,
(29:24):
folks will have more energy.So I think oftentimes people worry
that if they do improv, ifthey do a piece of movement, that
this will take away from theproductivity of their meeting. And
what I want to challenge isthat if you're not having an interactive
meeting, if people aren'tengaged and energized, you're not
being productive already.Like, you've already lost people.
(29:46):
So I think that's soimportant. And, you know, after every
program that I lead, we alwaystalk about for ourselves internally.
Two things. Highlights. Whatwere the highlights? And Abby's.
This is something that reallyI learned from my wife and I love,
which is even better. Ifs. Soit'd be even better if we did that.
So if. If everyone did thatafter a meeting, whoever led the
meeting, you said, okay, whatwere the highlights that meeting?
(30:06):
What was the best part? Andhow could I make it even better if
we did something else? Right?So I think those are some. Some tools
you can use.
Awesome. I'm stealing that. Iam definitely stealing that.
Good, good. You can't stealit. I gave it to you.
Oh, well, there youabsolutely. You know, we're still
going to have people out therethat are like, I can't do this kind
(30:28):
of stuff, or they're realintroverts. My wife, I'm all out
there. I'm like, let's go. AndI met her in theater. She's the introvert.
She would not. I mean, shewould not stand in that circle and
be like, no, you know, I'm notgoing to do that. How do you handle
somebody that's an introvertlike that? And how are you sensitive
(30:50):
kind of to their. To their,you know, overall mental kind of
stuff when you're doingsomething, when you're doing a presentation
like that?
Yeah. We work with a lot oftech and health tech companies, and
that's often something that wehear early on is like, you should
know our team has a lot ofintroverts. We're a very introverted
team. And we always say,that's. That's great. You know, I
(31:13):
mean, on one level, I thinkthe binary of extroverted introvert
is one of those things in lifethat we decide at moments, I'm an
extrovert, I'm an introvert.The truth is, we are all both right
in different circumstances, indifferent spaces. Each of us is super
comfortable and super willingto put ourselves out there, and in
other spaces, we're not right.And it may. It may be the opposite,
(31:33):
but I think it's. It's helpingpeople to see that improv is not
about being the loudest, thefunniest, the wackiest, the craziest.
That's not what we're lookingfor. I'm looking for the best listeners,
the most supportive, the bestteammates. And I think the introverts
are sometimes amazing at that.Right. Sometimes it's the extroverts
(31:56):
that are challenged, becauseI'm asking them to pause running,
running away with their ideas,and to listen more and interact with
folks. And sometimes whenfolks are a little more introverted,
they start a little moreslowly and they can build together,
and that's great. So theyreally do a great job. And I think
one of the nice things aboutimprov that's great for folks who
(32:18):
feel like they're introvertsis that the focus is on the group,
not on yourself. You know,Stephen Colbert, in a commencement
speech that he gave, talkedabout how improv is all about serving
others, and it's about gettingout of our own mind and realizing
that our role on any improvteam in any Game in any meeting,
in any space is to serveothers, is to make the other people
(32:39):
look good and to support them.Right. So for introverts, like maybe
your wife or other folks, tosay to them, your role is not to
be the loudest and in frontand the funniest. If you can be the
best supporter of the group,that's amazing. And that's often
the most valuable person at anorganization or in a meeting is the
person that's just like reallynodding along and excited with every
(33:04):
idea. Right. They're justtheir person. That's just like, yeah,
that's great. That's great,Tim. That's great, Andrew. I love
that. Right. And so just thatenergy and that support can be really
nice. And so I think it reallyis for everyone. And introverts and
extroverts, all welcome.
Absolutely. Because I know inyou were saying how we're all introverts
(33:26):
and extroverts, you know, kindof, you know, all, you know, and
a nice combination of, ofthat. I know for me, if I'm going
to a conference, I am theintrovert. I'm just, you know, if
I'm not presenting, I'm like,you know, I'm in a new place but
you know, you get me in myoffice and I'm singing Frank Sinatra
(33:46):
every morning at six in themorning just to keep myself awake.
And that's what I do. Butthat's why they're not going to listen
to me. They're going to listento you. Unless you're going to bring,
you know, singing some FrankSinatra in one of your presentations.
Right, right, right, sure.Yeah. That's a good new one. I like
that.
All right, cool. You can, youcan have that one. That's yours.
(34:07):
Okay, great. That's mine. I'mgoing to run with it.
Well, I do want to bring upsomething. You, you have an upcoming
book called Participate comingup. Can you talk to us a little bit
about that when it's comingout? Don't give too much away because
we want people to go buy it.But can you talk about participate
(34:29):
for us?
Yeah. So I'm working on thebook this year. I'm a few chapters
into the writing and lookingto release it in 2026. And the book
is called Participate and I'mreally thinking about it as, as opposed
to a self help book, acommunity help book. And so the idea
of Participate is really tohelp you notice your own fears about
(34:52):
participating. How and whenyou're able to participate and not
able to participate, howyou're Able to jump in more and do
more of what you want to do.That's kind of the first half of
the book is some of the toolsof improv, the tools that I've learned
and the research I've doneover the years about how to be more
participatory, how to engage.And then the second half of the book
is really focused on you asthe leader of a group, you as a leader
(35:16):
in your community. How do youhelp to lift other people up? How
do you help other two peopleto participate? And I really feel
like all of us, how I said allof us are artists. I really think
all of us are leaders as well.So we may be a leader in the workplace,
running meetings, as you said,or running a team. We may be the
person that hosts, you know, adinner, dinner parties often, or
(35:37):
host board game parties, orhelps lead a neighborhood garden
and leads the cleanup. And sohelping people think about how they
can get others to participate,how they can make it a safer space
for others and to join, isreally the goal of the book. So it's
really for anyone that eitherfeels stuck and wants to do more
of themselves, wants to betheir more authentic self, or feels
(35:59):
that they're doing that, butwants to help others, wants to know
how to be a better leader andhelp others to participate. Because
I realized that's what kind ofconnects my different projects and
my different work, is that Ireally want everyone to see that
they're an artist, a leader,and that they really can do amazing
things. There's this teaching,this Jewish teaching from the rabbis
(36:20):
that I love. That is EzehuChacham halomed Mikola Adam, which
translates as who is wise? Onewho learns from every person. And
if I had to say, like, onemantra for life, that's it for me.
It's like, I think we canlearn from everyone. And I want to
help everyone see that theyhave something to share, they have
something to teach.
That is awesome. That isawesome. What's something that you've
(36:45):
learned while writing? Youknow, it's not finished yet. You're
starting it up, and it soundslike you've got a good outline. And,
you know, listen to someprevious episodes, because I've got
some publishers that wouldlove to have that book, you know,
push it out there. I'm justsaying I'm great. Yeah, but is there
something that you've learnedwhile writing the book that you were
(37:08):
like, oh, you know, it justkind of clicked for you, you know,
doing improv and being veryphysical. You know, you have that
kind of a learning and thatkind of aha moment. But writing that
book, has there been somesomething that you're like, oh, I
never thought of it that way.
Yeah. I think it's beeninteresting to try to put into words
(37:32):
as succinctly as possible,kind of some of the takeaways of
improv and the lessons forourselves. You know, I'll just share
from the chapter I was writingtoday. I was writing a lot about.
One of the things that I loveabout improv is about focusing on
the good and appreciating thegood. I had a teacher, an improv
teacher named Lewis Kornfeldwho said that as improvisers, we
(37:57):
don't have time to focus onwhat's not working. We have to notice
what is working. We have to belike heat seeking missiles for the
good in our scene becausewe're building something together
and that's what we need tofind. And that in our lives, we need
to be better and better abouttrying to see what is good in something
rather than what's negative insomething. So the next time we go
(38:18):
to a movie, say, what was thebest part of that movie? What did
that movie do really well?Even if overall we'd give the movie
a D. Right? Same with like, ifwe go to a party or a meeting at
work, and overall it was a D.What part of it was an A? Like, what
part of it was the good thatwe can build on, and that's our role
as improvisers, is to be theones that notice the good and lift
(38:41):
up the good. So I think that'ssomething I'm really thinking about.
And how we can practice thatin our own lives has been something
I've been reflecting on.
That's awesome. That's. Andthere is something, you know, to
be said about getting it downon a piece of paper or a computer
screen or something like that.That really, for me, anyways, it
(39:03):
really strikes home that,okay, yeah, you know, I've. I've
done all this improv, I'vedone all this theater, you know,
I've done all these podcasts,but when I put it down on a piece
of paper, I'm just like, wow.And then I can pull things out of
that. Now this is more kind ofa personal question, a little bit
of fun here because, you know,you're improv and I want, I want
you to have a fun time herewith us. So if there's one author
(39:29):
or improv star that you couldhave a conversation with here, and
I Just wave my magic wand andthey magically appear. Who would
it be and what would you talkto them about?
Oh, there's so many greatpeople that I would love to talk
to.
And you can't say me becauseyou're already talking to me.
I'm already here. I'm alreadyliving the dream. You know, a personal
(39:53):
star I was just talking aboutyesterday that was really influential
is Amy Sedaris. A lot ofpeople might know David Sedaris,
her brother, who is an amazingcomedic author and writer. Amy Sedaris
is an incredible actor,improviser, writer, performer, really
just like living artist,living art project. She's amazing.
(40:14):
She co created a show withStephen Colbert and Paul Danello
called Strangers with Candy,which was really influential to me
in my high school yearsbecause it was so funny, so outside
the box. She's so creative,and she's so unafraid of being strange,
which is so amazing to me. AndI think I struggle with that of not
(40:37):
being afraid to be weird, tobe strange, to try things. So she's
really been an inspiration tome in trying things. Like she. She
did a whole show where inStrange with Candy, she plays an
older, uglier version ofherself and wears a fat suit the
whole show she wears at homefor some family's holidays in a hilarious
way. And she did not mind thatshe looked ridiculous because she
(41:01):
was like, this is for thecharacter. This is for the story.
And I think so for so many ofus, our ego gets in our way and prevents
us from trying thoseridiculous ideas that we have. So
for me, she's someone thatdoesn't have that fear and is willing
to be ridiculous. And I wouldlove to talk to her and talk to her
about that. Yeah.
Okay, so I'll have her callyour people up and we'll make it
(41:23):
happen for you.
That's perfect.
Done and done.
Done and done.
All right, well, that's whatI. That's all I have for you here
today. Andrew, thank you somuch for talking with me today about
improv, about how we can useimprov in. In our day jobs, and just
everything that you're doing,I think it's a wonderful service.
(41:46):
And I am myself, I am, youknow, taking my artistry and, you
know, putting it towardsbusiness as well. So it's great.
I'm sitting here learning atyour feet, going, okay, this can
be done, and I don't have tosell my soul for it. So that is fantastic.
(42:07):
Thank you so much, Andrew, forsharing your knowledge and your experience
with us.
Yeah, thank you so much forhaving me. It's just wonderful. And
I hope everyone listeningfeels a little more encouraged to
try things, to get out thereand to be the artists that they were
when they were a kid.
Exactly. And if you're, youknow, at a company that, you know,
(42:28):
you're like me with the mugsaying, hey, you know, I survived
another meeting, shouldn'thave been an email. Andrew's website
and all that are is going tobe in the show notes. So I'm just
saying, if you don't likewhere you're working, have Andrew
come in and, you know, jazz itup a bit.
We can change it a lot. We'llchange it for the better together,
definitely.
(42:49):
Excellent. Great. Well, thankyou very much.
Thanks so much.
All right. Thank you so muchfor tuning in and listening to this
interview with Andrew Davies.A lot of fun times were had in this
interview. He's a theater guy,he's an improv guy, and that immediately
puts him really high on mylist for somebody to listen to. And
(43:12):
he's taking his art into thecorporate world, which I find fantastic.
I've done it in my job, and Iknow you can do it in your job, and
hopefully you've gotten someinsights on how you can do it, how
you can fit that in to your,you know, to your 9 to 5, even if
(43:32):
it's overnights or, you know,whenever you're working now, you're
probably asking yourself, hey,Tim, how did you get Andrew? Well,
in the beginning, I told you,I use PodMatch. And my affiliate
link is in the show notesthere for you. So if you have something
you want to share and be on aton of great podcasts, check out
(43:55):
podmatch. Now, if you're apodcaster and you're looking for
guests again, podmatch is theway to go. You get a, you know, as
a host, you get a smallcommission for the interviews that
you do. You, you know, you.You get to decide if it airs or not.
What I do with my guests is Ilet them hear this before you do,
(44:20):
and if there's anything thatthey don't like in it, we take it
out. And if I don't think thatit's going to benefit you, I don't
put it out there. So check outPodMatch. If you're a guest or if
you're a host and you need toreach out and, you know, like Andrew
did here with me, reach out.And you never know what you're going
(44:40):
to get, and you may have yournext best friend, you Never know.
Another service that I use iscalled Podcast Beacon, and this is
for my podcast host out there.So what it is is they give you a
wearable, whether it be kindof like a wristband or a key fob
(45:01):
or even a business card. Andlet's say you're at a conference
or you're at the grocery storeand you're like, hey, you know, talking
about your podcast, which uspodcast hosts do. You can have that
person that you're talking toput their phone over your wearable
and it'll take them right tothe website. There is not a business
card to lose. There's none ofthat jazz. But they do have business
(45:25):
cards. If you have to havethat, you know, you can just have
the person wave their phoneover it and you buy one and done.
I do get a small commission ifyou use my affiliate link there.
But I know the guy that runsit, Matthew Passi, fantastic guy.
And definitely I wouldn'tpromote it on my show if I didn't
believe in it and if I didn'tuse it. So check that out for yourself.
(45:47):
Podcast Beacon. And the lastthing that I'm going to be promoting,
I know I've got a lot ofpromotions, but I save them for the
end for you hardcorelisteners. Listeners. So I started
up my own business this yearin 2025. It's called TKB Podcast
Studio. And that's where Ihelp my clients and I lead them through
all the noise with quietprofessionalism. When it comes to
(46:10):
their podcast. I take themthrough soup to nuts, you know, tip
to tail on how to get thatpodcast out there, and I produce
it for them, help them promoteit, give them ideas on what their
podcast should be. If you'veever thought about starting a podcast,
go to tkbpodcaststudio.com youcan check out my portfolio there.
(46:33):
If it works with you, withwhat you want to do, definitely shoot
me an email. Now, if you wantto be on this show or if you have
ideas for the show, email metimothyreateartpodcast.com you know,
some of my best ideas comefrom you, you know, the person that's
listening to this podcast. Sodefinitely let me know what you think,
(46:57):
what you like about the show,what you don't like about the show,
anything at all. Let me knowwhat's going on, where you're at,
and maybe I can give you ahand. Maybe I can refer you over
to Andrew and get yourbusiness meetings fan. You know,
get them to be fun, can befantastic, get them to be effective,
(47:17):
so definitely shoot me anemail. Timothyreateartpodcast.com
Alright, I need to let you getback on with your day. I need to
get back on with my day. So goout there and tame that inner critic.
Create more than you consume.Try out some improv games at work.
(47:37):
You never know, it might workout pretty well. But go out there
and make some art for somebodyyou love yourself. I'll talk with
you next time.
Create Art Podcast InterviewAndrew Davies hello friend. This
is Timothy Keem O'Brien, yourhead instigator for Create Art Podcast,
where I bring my over 30 yearsof experience in the arts and educational
world to help you tame yourinner critic and create more than
(00:26):
you consume. So I'm continuingon with my slew of interviews. I
had a lot of interviews thisyear so far here in 2025. And the
person you're about to hear,his name is Andrew Davies. Now, I
met him in Podmatch, which isa service I use to connect guests
(00:48):
with podcast hosts and I doreceive a small commission for that.
But again, as I like to tellyou, I'm only going to bring on the
people that I think are goingto definitely assist you with your
creative endeavors. So let'stalk about Andrew right here, right
now. And we just, I think whenyou hear this interview, you're going
(01:12):
to hear a lot of fun with thisone for sure. Now, Andrew is the
Better meetings director ofArtly Working, which uses improv
and theater to help buildstronger teams made up of happier
people and higher performers.Now, since starting it in 2019, Artly
(01:32):
Working has led programs withover 100 innovative companies like
Netflix, Roblox, Meta andGoogle. I'm sure you've heard of
these. If you haven't, you'reliving underneath a rock. Now, with
training and improvisationfrom the Magnet Theater and Facilitation
(01:52):
from Georgetown University,Andrew is passionate about bringing
these skills to strengthencompany culture and people experience.
His Better Meetings workshophelps teams together with purpose
and play, designing andfacilitating more effective meetings
that people actually want toattend. And I'm just going to stop
(02:16):
right there for a second. Soat work and at home, I have a mug
that says I survived anothermeeting. That should have been an
email. And I got to tell you,we really need Andrew where I work,
where I do my day to day work.So I definitely want to talk to my
boss and see if we can hireAndrew in on this one. And that's
(02:37):
one of the reasons why Iwanted to interview him, because
he's showing how you can useyour art in a corporate setting.
And why not? I mean, we'retalented. You're talented in what
you do, I'm talented in what Ido, and why not bridge that gap?
Now, Andrew has won severalawards for his groundbreaking work,
(02:59):
including the Young PioneerAward from Jewish Education Project
and the Pomegranate Prize fromthe Covenant Foundation. Andrew is
also the co founderCaricatures Theatrical Walking Tours
where the past visits you andthe Bible Players, which is a Jewish
(03:20):
comedy team. When Andrew's notworking, he can be found making up
songs with his toddler'sMiller and Oren bike, riding around
Philadelphia or leading a freetennis camp in the neighborhood.
I have bestowed upon him thehonor of being a twin dad, even though
he is. Kids aren't the sameage. Anybody that has two kids like
(03:43):
that and does all his stuffthat he does automatically gets assigned
twin dad status in my book.All right, I'm going to step out
of the way here for thisinterview. And here it is. Andrew
Davies appearing on Create Artpodcast. I know you're going to love
it. I have the pleasure ofspeaking with Andrew Davies. Andrew,
(04:05):
how is it going for you this evening?
It's going pretty well. Yeah.Doing good. Kids are asleep. Feeling
good.
Awesome. Awesome. That isgood. I know how that feels when
they're asleep because I'vegot the twins, and when they're asleep,
the fun can begin.
That's right. That's right.
Well, I'm really glad that youcame on the show. Here we've been
(04:27):
talking back and forth usingPod Match, and something that really
caught my eye was improv withyou. And I've done improv. I'm originally
from Chicago, and, you know,you can't live in Chicago and not
do improv. It's just, youknow, it's that deep dish pizza and
(04:49):
whatnot. But one question Ihad about that that I hear a lot
is, do you really need to befunny to do improv?
Yeah, it's a great question.And I love that you. You did some
improv in your life inChicago. I think between that and
deep dish, definitely thehealthier thing to do for your life,
you know, so, you know, do youneed to be funny to do improv? You
(05:13):
really don't. I think improv,one of the kind of common misunderstandings
is that improv is really aboutbeing funny, telling jokes, being
quick, being witty, and that.That's the whole goal of it. I think
improv is really teaching youhow to be real, how to be genuine,
how to be in the moment, howto be honest and authentic. And I
(05:37):
think that improv reallystrips away a lot of the, you know,
preparations that we have inlife, the way we disguise ourself
with clothes or preparation ordifferent things. And it just says,
okay, you are making things upin the moment. Everything is in this
moment. Can you be real? Canyou be honest? Can you build something
(06:01):
together? And so what I loveabout improv is really that everyone
can do it. And I thinkEveryone learns a lot about themselves
when they do it.
Yeah, for sure. For sure.Because I can tell you I'm not the
most funniest guy on the faceof the planet, but when I trust my
scene partners, somethinghappens. And I don't know what that
is because I'm not, you know,my art is not improv. I'm just, you
(06:26):
know, the big dumb guy thatcomes on the, you know, on the stage
and, you know, does stupidthings. But maybe the Chris Farley
type guy. But sure, I knowthat when I'm working and collaborating
with the team, it comes outbeautiful. So I love improv. I really
(06:46):
do.
Yeah.
Now I work for the federalgovernment. How can I use improv
in my workplace? Because a lotof our listeners that are out there,
they're putting their toe intodoing art, doing whatever they want
to do, but how can I take thatimprov? Take an improv class and
(07:08):
use that at work.
Yeah. So I think an improvclass is really great for anyone
to practice the tools of beinga better listener, a better communicator,
and really a collaborator as ateammate. So improv is really rarely
a solo sport. It's almostalways two or more people, and that's
(07:29):
because you're making thingsup from scratch. And I think we do
a lot of improvising in ourworkplace all the time, but we don't
necessarily have the tools ofhow to be a good collaborator. So,
you know, one of the kind offamous maxims if people know anything
about improv is yes, and.Which is really not always having
(07:49):
to say yes or agree with whatpeople are saying, but what it means
is saying yes to their ideafirst, acknowledging hearing, seeing
their idea, and then wantingto add on to it. So I think very
often in the workplace, one ofthe things I think we can really
notice just in our own headsis how often our first reaction in
our brain, not even out loud,necessarily. Maybe. No. Right. When
(08:12):
someone says, hey, this month,I think we should. We should try
a new marketing campaign wherewe all, you know, eat lunch at the
same table and we film it, andyou're in your brain, you might be
saying, no, that wouldn'twork. That's dumb. We're not actors.
Or, that wouldn't work. Wetried something like that last year.
And so I think the challengeof improv to us is to invite us to
(08:35):
try to say yes in our mindsfirst and then add on to it. Because
oftentimes ideas get shut downbefore they even really get to grow.
And improv is all about takingA little idea, a little moment, and
making it grow. And I thinktoo often in our workplaces, we never
get to the big ideas. We neverget to the exciting ideas, because
(08:57):
our instinct is to see thenegative right away and to shut it
down. So I think it just canstart in our own minds with just
noticing how we react and thenchanging it. A really simple game
I love to play just to getpeople noticing how quickly we can
be judged judgmental. It'sjust a game called band names. Right?
We all have bands like that welove. And band names, you can play
(09:20):
with two or more people andanyone just says a band name so they
can just look around you forideas if you don't have anything.
I can look around myself rightnow, and it's like, you know, water
cup, phone case, right.Computer screen. And the other people
in the group just have to say,I love it. And then we have a new
band name. And all it is is tonotice how in our minds, when we're
(09:43):
not. We don't really have aband. There's no real stakes. We're
not really deciding anything.How quickly we still, in our minds,
are like, computer screen,that's a terrible band name. Right.
Like, we instantly startjudging it, even though there's no
consequence. So to practicenoticing that judgment in our mind
and try and just like, tampthat down and let the ideas come
through and see if you can do10 or 20 or 30 band names and then
(10:05):
pause and say what was greatthat came out of that. Right? And
if we never did those initialterrible band names or unexciting
band names, we wouldn't findthe one that we actually love. You
know, Revolver toothpaste orwhatever we love and finding that.
So I think just noticing ourtendency to say no and inviting ourselves
to try to say yes.
(10:25):
I like that. And I have somany band names that some of them
I can't say on the air becauseof the language. So, you know, for
sure, well, let's. Let's divea little bit, a little bit into you.
Because this, you know, usingimprov in the workplace does fascinate
me. But let's. Let's find outkind of what makes you tick a little
(10:49):
bit. When you look back atyour early career, is there a moment
where you felt like, hey, Ifound my calling. I've made it. This
is what I want to do?
Yeah, I think there's a few ofthose moments early on in my life,
and I think that for allartists, as you know, your podcast
(11:13):
is really about creating art.Helping people jump into art. I think
the biggest thing is raisingyour hand and giving it a try. And
that is really the toughestthing. So the first moment where
I remember doing that, I wasin fifth grade. I was 10 years old.
And our teacher, Mrs. Aaron,did a musical every year with our
class. And the auditionprocess was very simple. She gave
(11:35):
us each a note card, and shetold us to write on the note card
if we wanted a big part or asmall part and singing or non singing.
And so we all got that samechoice. And I thought about it for
a minute, and I was, like, alittle nervous about it. I was like,
I don't know. I've neverreally done a show. And I was like,
big part singing, non singing.I don't really know if I have a good
voice. You know what singing.Like, why not? And so we did Fiddler
(11:57):
on the Roof that year, and Igot to play Tevye, the lead in this
show. And I'm convinced tothis day it's because I was the only
boy that probably put bigparts singing, right? And so just
by raising my hand and saying,yeah, I'm up for singing, I really
think that's why I got therole, because we didn't audition,
we didn't do anything. And sofor me, that was a light bulb moment
(12:17):
of how scary it is to raiseour hand, how scary it is to try,
but how satisfying it can be.And then I loved the experience so
much. That was kind of when Ifirst caught the bug. And then, really
in high school, I had anincredible musical theater director
who really convinced all of usthat we were putting on a Broadway
show. I went to a tinysuburban Jewish high school, and
(12:40):
he really convinced us thatthis was critical, that this show
was amazing, that we wereBroadway level, and we believed it.
And so I think the show cameout pretty well, considering, you
know. And so I think doing theMusic man with him was. Was a big
moment for me. And then for mein New York City, I studied improv
at the Magnet Theater. And itwas really there where I found that
(13:01):
improvisation was the form oftheater that allowed me to kind of
bring my creativity, bring myvoice, and really challenged me to
really be honest and myselfand not be able to just hide behind
a character or a costume or ascene, but be my genuine self. And
it also really unlocked for mehow powerful our imaginations are
(13:24):
to create a scene and create astory. That when people would watch
a show, you can just jump intoit and say, something is true, and
then it is. I Remember oneshow on my team, the Commotion? We
would make up a musical everyweek, a musical show every Tuesday.
And we got the suggestion of,like, fish. That was just the suggestion,
the word fish. And we starteda scene, and two of us were tuna
(13:47):
in a tank together at, like, asushi restaurant. And we were trying
to escape, and that was ourscene. So we just said, we're tuna
in a tank. And suddenly weare, right. The audience went with
us. We didn't needpyrotechnics, costumes. And so that
has really stuck with me inall of my work. And I really encourage
people is that forstorytelling, for play. We all have
such rich imaginations that wedon't need a lot to get our imagination
(14:09):
going. So I love that aboutimprov, that we can do it anywhere,
we can do it anytime. And it'sreally just building on all of our
brilliant imaginations in ourminds to paint the scene.
And we can do it cheaply, too,say, which I know a lot of businesses
are like, how do I do thischeaply? Well, you can pay Andrew
a lot of money and he can showyou how to do it cheaply.
(14:31):
Exactly, exactly. And itreally is like. I think one of the
beautiful things about improvand when we come into workplaces
and we work on things withfolks, is when you get these tools,
they are just a renewableresource. They are something you
can come back to wheneveryou're feeling stuck and come back
to these activities, come backto these approaches. Games as simple
(14:52):
as band names or ones that getmuch more complicated, and you can
always come back to them tokind of renew that sense of team,
team and the spirit and thefocus that you have as a group. So,
yeah, it really is like thegift that keeps on giving, and I
love it so much that way.
How do you, you know, workingfor corporations, you know, coming
(15:13):
into the work workplace likethat, how do you balance that corporate
culture with the art culture?You know, there's a misnomer that,
you know, all of us artistsare sitting here smoking cigarettes
in berets wearing, you know,black fingernail polish and black
eyeliner. Just for the record,I'm not wearing that tonight, but
(15:38):
in case I was, you know. Buthow do you balance that and how do
you feed yourself as an artistby working in that. In that sphere?
Yeah, that's a great question.You know, it definitely starts with
listening, as all great improvdoes. So listening to the leaders
(16:01):
of the organization, to thefolks in the organization, to get
a sense of what is theircompany culture, what are Things
like how. How much do theycollaborate in general? What is the.
What is the vibe like ingeneral? And we always start our
sessions by tell people. We'renot asking you to become, you know,
a traveling Shakespeareanactor today. All we're asking you
(16:22):
to do is to notice whereyou're at in your comfortability
and just try and turn it likeone little click. Just try and challenge
yourself and turn it onelittle click. So for some people,
that means speaking at all inany improv game is going to take
all their courage. And we'relike, great, amazing. You stepped
in and you gave a suggestionthat was great. For other people,
they're going to be morecomfortable presenting, and they
(16:43):
may want to jump into somemore complicated games. So everyone's
starting at their own place,and I think recognizing that and.
And letting people know thatthey are their own barometer of,
like, what. What the successlooks like, I think, you know, I
really feel that everyone isan artist. I really believe that
in every profession, in everyplace. So I think that while people
(17:03):
are a little scared initiallyto jump into things, they really
find their creativity and findtheir voice. I often feel that we
need to treat kids more likeadults and adults more like kids.
You know, I think. I think itwas Picasso maybe, that said that
we are all artists aschildren, and then we need to find
that again when we get older.When I teach improv in school settings,
(17:28):
in elementary schools, and Iask for a volunteer, almost every
hand shoots up every timebecause kids recognize this is going
to be fun. I'm going to enjoythis. I want to be part of it. With
adults, I rarely even ask forvolunteers. I just say, okay, next
game is Tim and Jennifer. Comeon up. Right? Because I know that
being put on the spot is soscary for us. We become so afraid
(17:50):
of making a mistake, afraid offailing, that we need that kind of
encouragement. And so I thinkgiving that encouragement to people,
once people see that it's kindof a safe space they can play together,
people really jump into it.And I think, you know, that's what
we've gotten better at atartly working. Myself and my co founder,
Dave Classko, is reallybridging the world of artists and
(18:11):
companies and corporations.And we've learned some of their language,
you know, thinking inquarters, which is something I never
really did before, and. Andthings like that, their timeline
and schedule. But, you know,we have so much more in common than
separates us. And I alwaystell them, like, I'm not an expert
in your industry. That's notwhy I'm here. I'm an expert in people,
(18:31):
in communication, incollaboration and teamwork. Right.
And that's why I'm here. SoI'm not trying to tell you that the
way you're doing yourparticular work is. Is wrong or different.
I'm trying to share with youtools that I think are useful to
your group. And, you know,like I was saying, starting with
listening, we always get asense of what they're hoping to improve
on. Is it really, like,morale? That's a trouble? Is it that
(18:54):
we have a hard time followingthrough on projects when we start
them? Is it that we have ahard time, you know, staying in touch
or communicating? So it variesthat way. But, yeah, I think we can
bridge those worlds. Like Isaid, there's an artist in all of
us, so everyone can speak thatlanguage, too. I think.
I. I love how you said that,because I have been preaching that
(19:15):
for. Oh, gosh. I don't want tosay how old I am. Everybody knows
I'm 52 at the time of thisrecording, you know, But I have been.
You know, that's somethingthat I discovered early in my. In
my journey, is that we, youknow, we're all artists, and we all
have that creative. Thatcreative spark in each and every
(19:36):
one of us. And I like thequote by Picasso where, you know,
we're all, you know, start offas art, you know, start off, you
know, painting as an artist,and then we're always continually
trying to get back to that.Amen to that.
Yeah.
How do you. And I think youhinted at it just a little while
(19:59):
ago, but how do you overcomethe reluctance when you're walking
into a corporate setting?Because, again, people think us artists
are, you know, in the beretsand the cigarettes and all the makeup
and all that kind of stuff.How do you overcome that and really
(20:20):
get your foot in the door?
I think that when people firststart, everyone's a little bit nervous,
unsure what to expect, butthat as we play together, really
starts to build trust. So Ithink we start really simply and
really small, and we work upto harder things. So I think when
(20:42):
people think of improvisation,they immediately jump to the greatest
performers in the worldperforming. Maybe they think of Whose
Line Is It Anyway? Or, youknow, Second City or some of the
stars they know from SaturdayNight Live and those shows doing
improv. And, you know, that'sreally like level 10 of improv. Right?
And so we want to encouragepeople that we're starting really
simple. So one of the things Ilove to do Is starting with non verbal
(21:06):
activities, right? Startingwith activities where we just get
to move our bodies. SometimesI invite people to just kind of like
pass a sound around thecircle, right? So we're not even
asking you to make any wordchoices to think of anything, Just
asking you to pass the soundor just ask you to silently do a
mirror activity, right? Justsilently mirroring another person
(21:27):
in our movements can get us tothink about our body, to start to
get comfortable with the ideaof play without asking us for really
any high level creativity orthinking out of the box. Because
I think it's really thepressure we put on ourselves that's
a worry. And so when peoplesee they can do it, they just feel
(21:48):
so much better. I, I think somuch of what I love about improv
is that it lets us play andlets us fail, make mistakes and realize
that we're okay and gonna beokay. And I think that when people
see they can play games, ifthey mess up a game, we just try
the game again. It's not theend of the world that they start
(22:10):
to get comfortable with it.And there's also an exhilaration
that they find when they trysomething scary they weren't sure
they can do. Like one game Iwill build to maybe about half an
hour, an hour into a sessionis a game I love called speech, where
everyone takes turns steppinginto the middle of a circle and improvising
a speech. And the way it worksis they say, I am sick and tired
(22:30):
of. And someone from theoutside of the circle who's not them
suggests an object, a noun,something simple. It can't be people
or because we don't want to bemean. And I don't want to be complicated
because I don't want people tobe put on the spot. I don't want
it to be like the economy andto have people have to get in their
heads, right? I alwaysencourage you just look around the
room. I'm always like lightbulbs we hate, you know, posters,
(22:51):
books, whatever it is. Andthen the person in the middle has
to say three reasons they'resick and tired of it. Books. They're
too hard to read. I alwaysdrop mine in the toilet when I'm
reading. And the pages arealways ripped, right? And it doesn't
matter what the three reasonsare. We all like clap like maniacs.
And I see the fear when peoplestep, take their turn to step into
(23:12):
the middle and how scary itcan be. And then how good they feel
knowing that the whole groupis going to support them. And games
like That I always say to theteam, it's not about the person in
the middle. It's all about thesupport and culture of safety and
support that the whole circleis making. So it's up to the circle
to make it easy for thatperson in the middle. And that's
(23:33):
really, for me, like a centralmetaphor for the workplace is what
are you doing as a circle tomake sure that whenever one of you
is in the middle, you knoweveryone has your back. Right. You
have the support of everyoneon your team. So I hope that that
feeling of the support youhave from your team really sticks
with people, and they knowthat when it's their turn to give
(23:54):
a big presentation, you know,to send out an important email, whatever
it is in your organization,that you have the support of those
people in the circle. It'sreally a circle of support.
That, that is awesome. I, I,oh, my gosh, we need you. Come on
over. We need you.
Yeah. Yeah.
(24:14):
I can't be the only onepreaching this kind of stuff in my
job, so.
Yeah. Yeah. And oftentimes,you know, it helps to have someone
from the outside come in andintroduce this. Right. Because if
each of us in our workplacetried to introduce it, it might be
read by our co workers aslike, oh, you think you know more
than me, or you think you're abetter teammate than me, when that's
(24:36):
not really what we're saying.Right. But when I come into the workplace,
in some ways it's easier,right. Because I'm an outsider. I'm,
I'm not telling you what areright or wrong about your dynamics.
I'm just helping to give youtools and help, help you to grow.
And so it can really, canreally be great to jumpstart things,
I think, in a nice way.
Something that, you know,because I, I'm kind of corporate.
(24:58):
I'm, you know, federalgovernment, so that's, that's corporate.
Ish, Something we all hate.And I have a coffee mug that says,
I survived another meeting.That should have been an email. So
let's talk about meetings.How, how can I use improv to make
a meeting better? I know, youknow, before you're talking about,
(25:20):
you know, having everyonethere and creating that, that, that
circle of support, which Ithink is awesome, but how can I use
improv when I'm leading a meeting?
So I think when we're leadinga meeting, the first thing is to
check in with ourselves beforethe meeting to make sure we know
(25:41):
why we're having thisparticular meeting. Right. Too often
in our workplace, meetings getput on the calendar or we meet every
Monday and that becomes thefocus of the meeting or there is
no focus. Right. And so Icreated, with Artly working, a better
meetings template, we call it.And I really created that because
I wanted to give something forpeople who maybe only had five minutes
(26:04):
before a meeting to check inwith themselves about why they were
having that meeting. So justtaking like five minutes to check
in can be so important. If youhave an hour, great. But we don't
always have that. But I thinkjust stopping ourselves five or ten
minutes before. So I thinkimprov can really help us to think
about the group. And one ofthe things that's defining for improv
(26:28):
is that everyone isparticipating is that the program
is interactive. And so I thinkthe number one metric to look at
of whether a meeting wassuccessful or not, worthwhile or
not, was it a meeting or not?Was, was it interactive or was it
frontal? Right. Was itparticipatory and everyone's participating,
(26:51):
or was it, you know, a speechand putting people to sleep? Right.
If it could have been apodcast like you said, if it could
have been an email, it wasn'treally a meeting, right? It was a
verbal email. It was a. It wasan in person podcast. And that's
fine if that's what peoplesign up for, right? If you sign up
to see a speech, great, yousee a speech. But a meeting really
(27:12):
should include everyone. Andthe reason is because the reason
you're meeting together isbecause there's magic that happens
in the space that you'remeeting together is that ideas can
grow in the group and can growtogether. So a couple ways you can
specifically use improv.Right. One, like I was saying, is
kind of to kick offbrainstorming and to brainstorm in
(27:34):
the mindset of yes. And so youcould start with something like band
names with a partner to getyour brain going. And you could come
to every meeting saying, Iwant to make sure there's a moment
of every meeting where we'reasking the team to brainstorm and
we're going to say yes and towhatever they say in the moment of
the meeting. Right. If you'rethe boss, right. And you're running
the meeting, you may know inyour mind 100 reasons why. Some suggestions
(27:56):
will be difficult, but it'sreally valuable during that time
you're together not to wastetime on the negative of like, well,
here's the 10 reasons why wecan't do a company picnic. Just say,
great, tell me about thecompany picnic you want to see and
they'll describe it, and youmay not end up doing that specific
idea, but you might later say,you know, they talked about that
company picnic a lot, but Iwonder if we could just do something
simple. We, like. We bring inblankets, and we just, like, sit
(28:18):
on the floor in ourauditorium, and we have a picnic
at the building or whatever itis. I think if you. If you encourage
that, that improv, thatbrainstorming. Yes. And mindset,
that can be. That can be sohuge. And I think another thing is
to notice the energy of themeeting. Right. Sometimes we go with
the best intentions for thingsto be interactive, for things to
(28:39):
be participatory, but theenergy just drops. That people are
fading. People are distractedon our computers, it's very hard
to stay focused. Right. Likewhen we're speaking now, I made sure
to close every tab on mycomputer. I'm turning off notifications.
I don't want to be bothered byanything else. And that's really
hard in our meetings to havethat focus. So to invite people to,
(29:00):
like, be in the room, reallytry and be present, like improv.
And if we see people fading,pause for a moment, and let's think
of what we can do. We couldjust, like, do some wiggles. Stand
up and wiggle around. We coulddo the mirror activity. The one person
could just stand up. As aleader, you could start copying.
Just ask everyone to mirroryou, just to make everyone move around
in a fun way. And I guaranteewhen you jump back into the conversation,
(29:24):
folks will have more energy.So I think oftentimes people worry
that if they do improv, ifthey do a piece of movement, that
this will take away from theproductivity of their meeting. And
what I want to challenge isthat if you're not having an interactive
meeting, if people aren'tengaged and energized, you're not
being productive already.Like, you've already lost people.
(29:46):
So I think that's soimportant. And, you know, after every
program that I lead, we alwaystalk about for ourselves internally.
Two things. Highlights. Whatwere the highlights? And Abby's.
This is something that reallyI learned from my wife and I love,
which is even better. Ifs. Soit'd be even better if we did that.
So if. If everyone did thatafter a meeting, whoever led the
meeting, you said, okay, whatwere the highlights that meeting?
(30:06):
What was the best part? Andhow could I make it even better if
we did something else? Right?So I think those are some. Some tools
you can use.
Awesome. I'm stealing that. Iam definitely stealing that.
Good, good. You can't stealit. I gave it to you.
Oh, well, there youabsolutely. You know, we're still
going to have people out therethat are like, I can't do this kind
(30:28):
of stuff, or they're realintroverts. My wife, I'm all out
there. I'm like, let's go. AndI met her in theater. She's the introvert.
She would not. I mean, shewould not stand in that circle and
be like, no, you know, I'm notgoing to do that. How do you handle
somebody that's an introvertlike that? And how are you sensitive
(30:50):
kind of to their. To their,you know, overall mental kind of
stuff when you're doingsomething, when you're doing a presentation
like that?
Yeah. We work with a lot oftech and health tech companies, and
that's often something that wehear early on is like, you should
know our team has a lot ofintroverts. We're a very introverted
team. And we always say,that's. That's great. You know, I
(31:13):
mean, on one level, I thinkthe binary of extroverted introvert
is one of those things in lifethat we decide at moments, I'm an
extrovert, I'm an introvert.The truth is, we are all both right
in different circumstances, indifferent spaces. Each of us is super
comfortable and super willingto put ourselves out there, and in
other spaces, we're not right.And it may. It may be the opposite,
(31:33):
but I think it's. It's helpingpeople to see that improv is not
about being the loudest, thefunniest, the wackiest, the craziest.
That's not what we're lookingfor. I'm looking for the best listeners,
the most supportive, the bestteammates. And I think the introverts
are sometimes amazing at that.Right. Sometimes it's the extroverts
(31:56):
that are challenged, becauseI'm asking them to pause running,
running away with their ideas,and to listen more and interact with
folks. And sometimes whenfolks are a little more introverted,
they start a little moreslowly and they can build together,
and that's great. So theyreally do a great job. And I think
one of the nice things aboutimprov that's great for folks who
(32:18):
feel like they're introvertsis that the focus is on the group,
not on yourself. You know,Stephen Colbert, in a commencement
speech that he gave, talkedabout how improv is all about serving
others, and it's about gettingout of our own mind and realizing
that our role on any improvteam in any Game in any meeting,
in any space is to serveothers, is to make the other people
(32:39):
look good and to support them.Right. So for introverts, like maybe
your wife or other folks, tosay to them, your role is not to
be the loudest and in frontand the funniest. If you can be the
best supporter of the group,that's amazing. And that's often
the most valuable person at anorganization or in a meeting is the
person that's just like reallynodding along and excited with every
(33:04):
idea. Right. They're justtheir person. That's just like, yeah,
that's great. That's great,Tim. That's great, Andrew. I love
that. Right. And so just thatenergy and that support can be really
nice. And so I think it reallyis for everyone. And introverts and
extroverts, all welcome.
Absolutely. Because I know inyou were saying how we're all introverts
(33:26):
and extroverts, you know, kindof, you know, all, you know, and
a nice combination of, ofthat. I know for me, if I'm going
to a conference, I am theintrovert. I'm just, you know, if
I'm not presenting, I'm like,you know, I'm in a new place but
you know, you get me in myoffice and I'm singing Frank Sinatra
(33:46):
every morning at six in themorning just to keep myself awake.
And that's what I do. Butthat's why they're not going to listen
to me. They're going to listento you. Unless you're going to bring,
you know, singing some FrankSinatra in one of your presentations.
Right, right, right, sure.Yeah. That's a good new one. I like
that.
All right, cool. You can, youcan have that one. That's yours.
(34:07):
Okay, great. That's mine. I'mgoing to run with it.
Well, I do want to bring upsomething. You, you have an upcoming
book called Participate comingup. Can you talk to us a little bit
about that when it's comingout? Don't give too much away because
we want people to go buy it.But can you talk about participate
(34:29):
for us?
Yeah. So I'm working on thebook this year. I'm a few chapters
into the writing and lookingto release it in 2026. And the book
is called Participate and I'mreally thinking about it as, as opposed
to a self help book, acommunity help book. And so the idea
of Participate is really tohelp you notice your own fears about
(34:52):
participating. How and whenyou're able to participate and not
able to participate, howyou're Able to jump in more and do
more of what you want to do.That's kind of the first half of
the book is some of the toolsof improv, the tools that I've learned
and the research I've doneover the years about how to be more
participatory, how to engage.And then the second half of the book
is really focused on you asthe leader of a group, you as a leader
(35:16):
in your community. How do youhelp to lift other people up? How
do you help other two peopleto participate? And I really feel
like all of us, how I said allof us are artists. I really think
all of us are leaders as well.So we may be a leader in the workplace,
running meetings, as you said,or running a team. We may be the
person that hosts, you know, adinner, dinner parties often, or
(35:37):
host board game parties, orhelps lead a neighborhood garden
and leads the cleanup. And sohelping people think about how they
can get others to participate,how they can make it a safer space
for others and to join, isreally the goal of the book. So it's
really for anyone that eitherfeels stuck and wants to do more
of themselves, wants to betheir more authentic self, or feels
(35:59):
that they're doing that, butwants to help others, wants to know
how to be a better leader andhelp others to participate. Because
I realized that's what kind ofconnects my different projects and
my different work, is that Ireally want everyone to see that
they're an artist, a leader,and that they really can do amazing
things. There's this teaching,this Jewish teaching from the rabbis
(36:20):
that I love. That is EzehuChacham halomed Mikola Adam, which
translates as who is wise? Onewho learns from every person. And
if I had to say, like, onemantra for life, that's it for me.
It's like, I think we canlearn from everyone. And I want to
help everyone see that theyhave something to share, they have
something to teach.
That is awesome. That isawesome. What's something that you've
(36:45):
learned while writing? Youknow, it's not finished yet. You're
starting it up, and it soundslike you've got a good outline. And,
you know, listen to someprevious episodes, because I've got
some publishers that wouldlove to have that book, you know,
push it out there. I'm justsaying I'm great. Yeah, but is there
something that you've learnedwhile writing the book that you were
(37:08):
like, oh, you know, it justkind of clicked for you, you know,
doing improv and being veryphysical. You know, you have that
kind of a learning and thatkind of aha moment. But writing that
book, has there been somesomething that you're like, oh, I
never thought of it that way.
Yeah. I think it's beeninteresting to try to put into words
(37:32):
as succinctly as possible,kind of some of the takeaways of
improv and the lessons forourselves. You know, I'll just share
from the chapter I was writingtoday. I was writing a lot about.
One of the things that I loveabout improv is about focusing on
the good and appreciating thegood. I had a teacher, an improv
teacher named Lewis Kornfeldwho said that as improvisers, we
(37:57):
don't have time to focus onwhat's not working. We have to notice
what is working. We have to belike heat seeking missiles for the
good in our scene becausewe're building something together
and that's what we need tofind. And that in our lives, we need
to be better and better abouttrying to see what is good in something
rather than what's negative insomething. So the next time we go
(38:18):
to a movie, say, what was thebest part of that movie? What did
that movie do really well?Even if overall we'd give the movie
a D. Right? Same with like, ifwe go to a party or a meeting at
work, and overall it was a D.What part of it was an A? Like, what
part of it was the good thatwe can build on, and that's our role
as improvisers, is to be theones that notice the good and lift
(38:41):
up the good. So I think that'ssomething I'm really thinking about.
And how we can practice thatin our own lives has been something
I've been reflecting on.
That's awesome. That's. Andthere is something, you know, to
be said about getting it downon a piece of paper or a computer
screen or something like that.That really, for me, anyways, it
(39:03):
really strikes home that,okay, yeah, you know, I've. I've
done all this improv, I'vedone all this theater, you know,
I've done all these podcasts,but when I put it down on a piece
of paper, I'm just like, wow.And then I can pull things out of
that. Now this is more kind ofa personal question, a little bit
of fun here because, you know,you're improv and I want, I want
you to have a fun time herewith us. So if there's one author
(39:29):
or improv star that you couldhave a conversation with here, and
I Just wave my magic wand andthey magically appear. Who would
it be and what would you talkto them about?
Oh, there's so many greatpeople that I would love to talk
to.
And you can't say me becauseyou're already talking to me.
I'm already here. I'm alreadyliving the dream. You know, a personal
(39:53):
star I was just talking aboutyesterday that was really influential
is Amy Sedaris. A lot ofpeople might know David Sedaris,
her brother, who is an amazingcomedic author and writer. Amy Sedaris
is an incredible actor,improviser, writer, performer, really
just like living artist,living art project. She's amazing.
(40:14):
She co created a show withStephen Colbert and Paul Danello
called Strangers with Candy,which was really influential to me
in my high school yearsbecause it was so funny, so outside
the box. She's so creative,and she's so unafraid of being strange,
which is so amazing to me. AndI think I struggle with that of not
(40:37):
being afraid to be weird, tobe strange, to try things. So she's
really been an inspiration tome in trying things. Like she. She
did a whole show where inStrange with Candy, she plays an
older, uglier version ofherself and wears a fat suit the
whole show she wears at homefor some family's holidays in a hilarious
way. And she did not mind thatshe looked ridiculous because she
(41:01):
was like, this is for thecharacter. This is for the story.
And I think so for so many ofus, our ego gets in our way and prevents
us from trying thoseridiculous ideas that we have. So
for me, she's someone thatdoesn't have that fear and is willing
to be ridiculous. And I wouldlove to talk to her and talk to her
about that. Yeah.
Okay, so I'll have her callyour people up and we'll make it
(41:23):
happen for you.
That's perfect.
Done and done.
Done and done.
All right, well, that's whatI. That's all I have for you here
today. Andrew, thank you somuch for talking with me today about
improv, about how we can useimprov in. In our day jobs, and just
everything that you're doing,I think it's a wonderful service.
(41:46):
And I am myself, I am, youknow, taking my artistry and, you
know, putting it towardsbusiness as well. So it's great.
I'm sitting here learning atyour feet, going, okay, this can
be done, and I don't have tosell my soul for it. So that is fantastic.
(42:07):
Thank you so much, Andrew, forsharing your knowledge and your experience
with us.
Yeah, thank you so much forhaving me. It's just wonderful. And
I hope everyone listeningfeels a little more encouraged to
try things, to get out thereand to be the artists that they were
when they were a kid.
Exactly. And if you're, youknow, at a company that, you know,
(42:28):
you're like me with the mugsaying, hey, you know, I survived
another meeting, shouldn'thave been an email. Andrew's website
and all that are is going tobe in the show notes. So I'm just
saying, if you don't likewhere you're working, have Andrew
come in and, you know, jazz itup a bit.
We can change it a lot. We'llchange it for the better together,
definitely.
(42:49):
Excellent. Great. Well, thankyou very much.
Thanks so much.
All right. Thank you so muchfor tuning in and listening to this
interview with Andrew Davies.A lot of fun times were had in this
interview. He's a theater guy,he's an improv guy, and that immediately
puts him really high on mylist for somebody to listen to. And
(43:12):
he's taking his art into thecorporate world, which I find fantastic.
I've done it in my job, and Iknow you can do it in your job, and
hopefully you've gotten someinsights on how you can do it, how
you can fit that in to your,you know, to your 9 to 5, even if
(43:32):
it's overnights or, you know,whenever you're working now, you're
probably asking yourself, hey,Tim, how did you get Andrew? Well,
in the beginning, I told you,I use PodMatch. And my affiliate
link is in the show notesthere for you. So if you have something
you want to share and be on aton of great podcasts, check out
(43:55):
podmatch. Now, if you're apodcaster and you're looking for
guests again, podmatch is theway to go. You get a, you know, as
a host, you get a smallcommission for the interviews that
you do. You, you know, you.You get to decide if it airs or not.
What I do with my guests is Ilet them hear this before you do,
(44:20):
and if there's anything thatthey don't like in it, we take it
out. And if I don't think thatit's going to benefit you, I don't
put it out there. So check outPodMatch. If you're a guest or if
you're a host and you need toreach out and, you know, like Andrew
did here with me, reach out.And you never know what you're going
(44:40):
to get, and you may have yournext best friend, you Never know.
Another service that I use iscalled Podcast Beacon, and this is
for my podcast host out there.So what it is is they give you a
wearable, whether it be kindof like a wristband or a key fob
(45:01):
or even a business card. Andlet's say you're at a conference
or you're at the grocery storeand you're like, hey, you know, talking
about your podcast, which uspodcast hosts do. You can have that
person that you're talking toput their phone over your wearable
and it'll take them right tothe website. There is not a business
card to lose. There's none ofthat jazz. But they do have business
(45:25):
cards. If you have to havethat, you know, you can just have
the person wave their phoneover it and you buy one and done.
I do get a small commission ifyou use my affiliate link there.
But I know the guy that runsit, Matthew Passi, fantastic guy.
And definitely I wouldn'tpromote it on my show if I didn't
believe in it and if I didn'tuse it. So check that out for yourself.
(45:47):
Podcast Beacon. And the lastthing that I'm going to be promoting,
I know I've got a lot ofpromotions, but I save them for the
end for you hardcorelisteners. Listeners. So I started
up my own business this yearin 2025. It's called TKB Podcast
Studio. And that's where Ihelp my clients and I lead them through
all the noise with quietprofessionalism. When it comes to
(46:10):
their podcast. I take themthrough soup to nuts, you know, tip
to tail on how to get thatpodcast out there, and I produce
it for them, help them promoteit, give them ideas on what their
podcast should be. If you'veever thought about starting a podcast,
go to tkbpodcaststudio.com youcan check out my portfolio there.
(46:33):
If it works with you, withwhat you want to do, definitely shoot
me an email. Now, if you wantto be on this show or if you have
ideas for the show, email metimothyreateartpodcast.com you know,
some of my best ideas comefrom you, you know, the person that's
listening to this podcast. Sodefinitely let me know what you think,
(46:57):
what you like about the show,what you don't like about the show,
anything at all. Let me knowwhat's going on, where you're at,
and maybe I can give you ahand. Maybe I can refer you over
to Andrew and get yourbusiness meetings fan. You know,
get them to be fun, can befantastic, get them to be effective,
(47:17):
so definitely shoot me anemail. Timothyreateartpodcast.com
Alright, I need to let you getback on with your day. I need to
get back on with my day. So goout there and tame that inner critic.
Create more than you consume.Try out some improv games at work.
(47:37):
You never know, it might workout pretty well. But go out there
and make some art for somebodyyou love yourself. I'll talk with
you next time.
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