In this episode, we explore the journey of a Black male mathematics teacher whose teaching practice has been significantly shaped by his participation in the CREATE Project's teacher residency program. Dr. Nickolaus Ortiz and Cam Bentley dive into how the program's principles and strategies have influenced approaches to research and to teaching math, particularly in addressing the unique challenges and opportunities faced by Black male educators. Cam Bentley shares his experiences of being a resident to becoming teacher in the field of mathematics education. He discusses how the CREATE program helped him develop culturally responsive teaching methods that resonate with his students and helps to build a supportive learning environment.The episode highlights key themes such as identity, the importance of representation, the role of mentorship, and the impact of collaborative research on teaching practices. Join us as we unpack the personal and professional transformations of both Dr. Nickolaus Ortiz and Cam Bentley through their research and how their collaboration's influence extends beyond the classroom, shaping a vision for equitable and effective mathematics education.
Link to article discussed: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/09518398.2022.2061623
Executive producers: Dr. Nickolaus Ortiz, Cam Bentley and The CREATE Project
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed are the speaker's own and do not represent
(00:09):
the views, thoughts, and opinions of Georgia State University.
The material and information presented here is for general information purposes only.
The Georgia State University name and all forms and abbreviations are the property of its
owner and its use does not imply endorsement of or opposition to any specific organization,
(00:35):
product, or service.
Hi everyone.
Welcome to the Create Ed podcast.
We're really excited to have you with us today and every day.
This podcast is a part of an original multimedia content experience of the Create Project here
(00:56):
at Georgia State University.
Now what's the Create Project?
I'm glad you asked.
It's a three-year teacher residency here at Georgia State.
Now what's the teacher residency?
Basically we train and support future teachers.
We come alongside of them for several years so they're not just dropped into the classroom.
We come alongside teach you, support you, and then even afterwards we support you with
(01:20):
professional learning and development.
Now in each episode of this Create Ed podcast series, we explore conversations, ideas,
wonderings, challenges, really you name it at the intersection of birth through 12, through
college, through grad school, through traditional and non-traditional education here in Metswa,
(01:44):
Atlanta, and in Georgia and in the southern region of the United States.
We do all of this through the lens of the Create Project approach to education and in
a nutshell it's four things we focus on.
Taking the time to be rooted in our local context, understanding the context of this
work and learning and teaching.
(02:05):
The second thing is inviting all people to participate in this work.
We're all invited.
You're invited.
Third is we understand who we as individuals are in this work.
Who are you?
And the fourth is to remember that education and supporting education and teachers is also
about joy, freedom, liberation.
(02:31):
Now what does all of that mean?
That's what this podcast series will dig into.
In this episode, we're going to look at how the Create Project supports math teacher education
here in Atlanta.
And we're going to do that by talking with Cam Bentley.
Cam's an alumni of the Create Project and he's also a current math teacher.
(02:54):
Now as we get started, let's take a moment everybody and take a deep breath, relax.
And as you settle in to listen to our podcast, here's a few questions to think about as you
prepare to listen right now.
What's unique about being a black male math educator in general and here in Atlanta, Georgia
(03:18):
in particular?
How are math teachers trained to bring themselves in the classroom as they develop their high
level of skills to be educators?
Now here's a big one.
What gets lost in our current conversation nationally, locally, globally about education
and educators?
(03:40):
What's the role of the kind of research that Cam and Dr. Ortiz are going to talk about in
this work?
And how do we connect to the math research that Dr. Ortiz and Cam did?
How do we connect it to ourselves and to our everyday lives as teachers, caregivers, students
and community members?
(04:01):
A lot of questions to think about.
Let's drop in.
We're going to join Dr. Nicholas Ortiz as I mentioned a second ago.
He was a professor of math education at Georgia State University and a member of the Create
Project research team.
And Cam Bentley, Georgia State class of 2023, Create Project alumni and a current math teacher
(04:24):
at his alma mater, Thompson High School in Augusta, Georgia.
Enjoy.
Good evening, everybody.
Good afternoon.
Good morning, wherever you are in the world.
I am known as Dr. Nicholas Ortiz, but you all can call me Nicholas.
I'm an assistant professor of mathematics education here at Georgia State University and a member
(04:45):
of the research team with Create Project.
I also want to allow my co-star here to introduce myself as well.
Hey, my name is Cam Bentley, well, Camron Bentley, but everybody calls me Cam.
I am a former Create Project resident and I am currently about to enter my second year
as a teacher.
(05:06):
I am a mathematics teacher.
I teach algebra one and foundations of algebra here at my alma mater at Thompson High School,
which is just outside of Augusta.
And again, I just graduated class 2023 from Georgia State and through Create.
Awesome.
Awesome.
Awesome.
Appreciate that introduction.
So hopefully y'all know a little bit about us.
(05:27):
We're going to go ahead and jump straight into some of the questions.
And so we have this part of this conversation.
We wanted to kind of tell y'all just about the work that Mr. Bentley and myself have
been doing together over the course of a couple years, right, Cam?
It's been a couple years, isn't it?
Long time.
Yeah.
So one of the first things we wanted to kind of jump into and I'll kind of take the position
(05:50):
of just posing questions, right?
Like and then we'll both kind of just respond to them.
The first one we were kind of just thinking through is what has Create meant to either
of us, given our role in the residency, specifically what has its purpose been, what is it supposed
to do for us, particularly what we do just in our different roles.
I can jump in first too, Cam.
(06:11):
Then I let you jump in.
But so it has really helped me to think a lot about the ways that we can be intentional
about who we place into public schools, right?
Like that's the work that Create has really done for me.
Right?
Like it takes up this mentor and says that we have the opportunity to supply districts
and the profession with some of the most effective and justice-oriented educators.
(06:32):
Right?
Create reminds me that teaching is not as easy as somebody who wants to communicate,
but that it is a profession of skilled workers.
I think a lot of times we lose sight of that.
Right?
Like in some of the larger national discourse, right?
Like doesn't really represent the skills and the qualities of these people as professional
(06:53):
skilled workers.
I think in Create, we have the opportunity to help communicate and establish values of
joy and freedom even within the work of teachers and teacher educators.
And that's a privilege.
That's definitely a privilege.
As a researcher, I am committed to reflecting on the work that we do and documenting the
ways that we improve educational experiences for all youth.
(07:15):
That's kind of what I do as a member of the research team.
That's part of the work that Cam and I, like kind of telling that story have been doing
together.
With that said, I'll let Cam jump into answering a response to that question as well.
Alright.
Create has helped me a lot in developing me into the educator that I am today.
And while in Create, I learned valuable information as far as different classroom strategies like
(07:41):
classroom management, differentiated instruction.
And one of the main things is, again, me, one of the foundations of my teaching philosophy
is building relationships with students.
And they really stress that and create.
Well, yeah, building on that too, right?
Like I love how you kind of just mentioned the relationships, right?
(08:02):
And that's one of the things that we've talked about a lot just in our interactions with
each other.
So if nothing else, y'all, people out there listening to podcasts, land, right?
Create helps us think about the relationships that we make, not only with educated, with
among one another, among the research team, but then also with students as well.
(08:22):
So awesome.
So moving on to this next question.
So as a researcher, I work with Cam to foreground particularly two studies, right?
Like, and what's interesting, right?
Like is that sometimes, right?
Like that gets translated very well.
Sometimes it doesn't get translated as well, right?
Like particularly, right?
Like, it can feel like maybe we're only talking to other academics, other people that are
(08:43):
just within the scope of research and whatnot.
And then like, how that kind of just gets again, positioned to the broader world and
just kind of relate in different ways.
So I wanted to take a second, right?
Like so one of the questions I posed to Cam, right?
Like was like, so Cam, what is it that you think I was actually studying the whole time?
(09:05):
So with that, I wanted Cam just to kind of respond to it.
And then I'll kind of add my own take of what was I really focused on as we were working
together.
So I would love the conversation from your point of view first.
So I know for sure that the study that you were doing, it was on black language and using
the classroom.
And I know so when I was in, during my student teaching in the APS, the school, the classroom
(09:30):
that I had was, I would say majority Caucasian.
So I know it probably was a little bit tougher to kind of look into that black language there,
but like the school I teach at my dean, I'm at my alma mater, how school that I graduated
from.
And again, my class is diverse, but there's, the majority of my students are African American.
(09:53):
So I know it's probably was a little bit easier for you there to kind of, well, I know it's
easier, but it was, it was a little more less challenging to look at that black language.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I think that's a, that's a, that's a really important point for the study, right?
Like is that, so I was kind of thrown off by the context when I came into this APS classroom,
(10:14):
right?
Like I'm expecting to see a whole lot of like black students just inside of the classroom,
but it was, that was not the reality necessarily within your classroom, right?
Like so even within that first study, right?
Like my focus changed from the ways that students were using black language to how this educator,
right?
Like was using black language to teach students, particularly in the subject of mathematics.
(10:38):
And for those, right?
Like who are kind of like, man, what are y'all even saying about this thing?
Kind of like y'all are talking about a black language.
What do y'all even mean by that?
Ken, did you want to take a stab at that first before I kind of jump into like, well,
I say black language is just how, how, what I could take from that is just how we, how
(10:59):
we interact one another.
What languages will you use that you might not hear in a different setting than things
like that?
Like with my kids last year when I was teaching in Atlanta, again, there was a lot of different
things that I said that they were like, hold up, what you saying?
For me, I'm from the country.
So my black language and somebody from the city black language could be a little bit
(11:21):
different.
It's still the same.
But again, there's different things that I know that I might say and I will be in a space
and you say, what does that mean?
This game, I'm from the country.
But yeah, yeah.
And I think just to add on to that, right, like I think part of what Cam is bringing
up, right, like is this idea of like language kind of being very much regional, right, like
(11:43):
in context driven, right, like particularly, right, I'm interested in the ways that particularly
right, like linguistic practices of black Americans, I'm looking particularly within
my study, I was looking at what does it look like to be situated within this metropolitan
of Atlanta, right, like, but part of what Cam is saying to right, like is that what
my black language is also informed by me being a country boy from right outside of Augusta.
(12:06):
Right.
And so I think part of what we were kind of making the case for is like, what were some
of the similarities in terms of kind of thinking about that language within also, how did that
language particularly right, like some of the linguistic practices that we see common
among African Americans kind of used for educational purposes as well, right.
(12:28):
So part of the question that I was asking was to say, right, like, well, does does it
is this language also appropriate in a mathematics context, right, like in which Cam was helping
me to kind of think through and make sense of right, like, was how was he even using
it to be able to to teach mathematics concepts.
There was one phrase, this is the phrase and came on, I don't know, I don't even know if
(12:50):
I shared this with you, right, like, but the title of the article that I just submitted,
right, was one of your most common phrases that you use all the time talking about right,
like, y'all in here sounding like the what?
The children's choir, right.
Exactly, right.
Like in so part of what I was arguing in this in this this academic journal, right, like
(13:14):
was this was that Ken was also using this as a form of formative assessment, right.
So in the ways that we think about black language kind of being this very much call and response
kind of activity, part of what I was arguing was that Ken was also using it in his math
pedagogy to think about formative assessment and to be able to assess the students understanding
of different mathematical concepts.
(13:35):
So that's a that's a bulk, just an overview of what the what the article and what the research
was kind of getting at, and particularly how he was using that.
One of the other examples I give you all like because I want you to go read the article
as well.
One of the other examples, can you remember, can you just tell them a little bit about
(13:56):
what a mood meter was.
I talked a little bit about what a mood meter was.
And I so I learned to move me from Dr. Jacob packet, who is a professor at GSU.
He was our coordinator through the middle of program.
And it's basically just what I how I use it was there's different ways you could do it.
So one way that we learned was that you just that you have a mood.
(14:22):
You basically just checking to see where your students are before you start the lesson.
And there would be a I wish I had a race my board not too long ago.
I had them on board.
So basically, there's like, you're like, oh, I'm good.
I'm okay.
I'm all right.
I'm great.
I need to check in.
So what I did is again, I teach math.
(14:44):
So what I did was to kind of connect it to mathematics.
I use quadrants.
So I had a coordinate playing graph on my board and usually we would try to do it at
least once or twice a week.
And our conduct students would come in, especially on Mondays.
Mondays was the big days.
A lot of times we do it on Fridays.
And when they come in, I give them a sticky note.
(15:07):
So they would write their name on the back of the sticky note.
And on the front of the sticky note, they would draw an emoji of how they're feeling.
And then they would go and place it on the quadrant in which they are.
So again, it was, I'm good.
We'll be quadrant.
Well, I'm great.
We'll be quadrant one.
I'm all right.
I'm good.
I'm good.
We'll be quadrant two.
I'm I, O slash okay.
And in quadrant four would be checking with the coachman.
(15:32):
And so again, that kind of just gave me an opportunity to see where my students were.
Because again, I always let my students know before class starts.
If you got something going on, just let me know.
I'll work with you.
And I want to build on that too.
So one of the connection that I saw in there, even to the black language, was that in quadrant
three, it was so funny to you.
(15:53):
When you walked in, it was saying, I'm a hi.
So it was very much like a testament to black language.
Even seeing that within the mathematics space.
And as Ken was saying, a lot of the students was like, at first they just kind of looked
at it first, right?
But they were like, okay, they kind of bought into it.
So again, you saw it kind of operating in those spaces.
(16:16):
Yeah.
So the other study that I wanted to look at and that I've kind of been tracing and following
with Ken this year was part of what I wanted to see was that the stuff that maybe like,
I as a create researcher know is kind of going on in the residency.
Remember what I wanted to say and make the case for was like, could we say that some of
(16:39):
that was also showing up in his first year of teaching, right?
And so there were things that Cam continues to say and was like, you know, that I was
observing and he's like, yeah, you know, I could say that I learned this from create
or I could say that this thing was important, something that I learned within the residency.
And I want to bring you back to just one of those points.
(17:01):
We don't have to stay here too long.
But one of the things that you were kind of saying like, what I gathered you learning
from the residency that I definitely saw as I observed in your classroom or like was
the way that you were building relationships with students.
Can you talk a little bit just about that maybe like what you gathered from, from create
and what you try to make sure that you emphasize in your first year of teaching?
(17:23):
So again, I shared this.
It was either our first together time together times where we met during we always met at
least once a month.
And during our together times, it was either our first one or our second one, which we
talked about relationship.
And we first got in, they showed us a video.
It was Rita Pearson's Ted talk about every kid needs a champion.
(17:46):
And it means just basically explain that again, to show up for your students be there and
to build those relationships with your students.
And I've learned to know that as a teacher, if you build those relationships with your
students, they would do anything that you want them to do.
And you saw, I was talking to somebody about this the other day.
(18:11):
You saw how hard my kids were working.
They probably, I think probably the last time you came right before they took the EOC or
it was the second to last time.
And my kids, so as they're doing EOC testing, I have my algebra one class, my first period.
And the class is already an hour and 50 minutes long.
And a lot of times, well, when we were doing the EOC's, the classes could be longer.
(18:38):
And I remember one day, our class was, we ended up being in class for two hours and
35 minutes or something like that.
And we worked about two hours and 25 of those two hours, 35 minutes.
And the kids, I let them know up front, we had a week, we had two weeks, 14 days to
(18:58):
be exact before 14 class periods before we took the EOC after we came back from spring
break.
So I let them know before we left.
Hey, when we come back, it's go time.
It's go time.
And again, I did not expect to get the, I did not expect my students to work as hard
(19:18):
as they did.
And again, they're hardworking students.
But when I tell you that, again, we, I kind of gave them like, I'll let them know ahead
of time, hey, there's five algebra one classes.
And if we get the highest scores, we celebrate and I'm taking y'all top golf, I'm taking
y'all bowling, whatever you want to do.
So I kind of gave them an incentive and that made them want to work hard.
(19:40):
And again, so you have to build those relationships with your students.
You have to show up for them, go to games, ask them about the different things in life.
Ask them, hey, how's this going?
How's that going?
What you do this weekend?
Talk to your kids.
I stress that.
And again, a lot of teachers who may be dealing with different things, as far as classroom
(20:02):
management and things like that.
A lot of that stuff could be eliminated if you build a relationship with your students.
That's good.
No, that's good.
No, I appreciate that.
Hey, so y'all, yeah, y'all check it out.
Check it out the second article and you'll hear a lot more about just what we're capturing
in that part of the study.
Appreciate you reflecting there, right?
(20:23):
Yeah, so moving on to this next question, right?
Like, so, so something that you and I both know something about, maybe that some of our
listeners don't know as much about, right?
The question says, what is special or unique about being a black male mathematics educator?
So yeah, I'll let you jump in there first.
So it's special being a black male educator for one, because we're one of the biggest
(20:49):
minorities within the teaching profession.
I don't know if it's still 2%, right?
At one point, there was only 2% of African Americans, 2% of teachers were African American
males.
And especially in a school where like my school, the demographic is mostly black and for kids
being able to see, especially black kids, especially black boys, being able to see people in these
(21:15):
positions like teachers and principals and APs and different things like that.
They need to see that.
And in my hometown, gang violence is one of its all-times highs right now.
And when these kids can see that, hey, if he can do that, what makes you think that I
(21:36):
can?
And that was one of my eyes on why I wanted to become a teacher, because I looked at some
of the people in these positions and I say, they can do it.
I know that I can.
Kids need to be able to see people who look like them in different positions, because
again, especially young people as well, like being a young educator, again, we can relate
(21:59):
to these students.
I tell my kids all the time, I listen to a lot of the same music I listen to.
They play a song and I start saying, is it cold care to know about that?
I be like, hey, we're six years apart.
We're six years apart.
And again, math in general, math is one of those core core subjects.
That was one of those big testing subjects.
(22:20):
So being able to relate to the kids, they're getting their buy-in.
No, that's good.
I think some of the things that you just kind of pointed out, I think people still don't
recognize the privilege of what it means to always have had somebody in that position
that looks like you.
(22:40):
If you've never had to think about, man, you know what?
I've never had a black male teacher.
Or I've never had a black woman teacher.
When you, again, part of what I'm trying to capture and what I think you were alluding
to is that people don't recognize that as an invisible privilege to all through your
K-12 experience to see teachers that look like you.
(23:02):
It's a very different disposition to have than somebody who is like, man, I've never
seen this.
And as you were saying, to start seeing those images, does something to the psyche that's
like, you know what, maybe there is something, there are different opportunities that I can
be exposed to, different things that I could aspire to.
(23:24):
Like it being that now that I've actually seen somebody in that position before, I think
the other thing that kind of, as you were kind of talking and made me think about, was
that we both were very young when we first started teaching.
All right?
Like I was 21 when I went into the high school class.
I just turned 22.
Well, my same thing, because my birthday is July.
(23:45):
Shout out to the Leos, right?
My birthday is in July, so I was hired at 21, but by the time I started teaching.
I was the same way I was hired at 21, started teaching at 22.
Yeah, man.
And it does something where I like to have that closeness and age to your students, right?
Like at C, where I like, you know, y'all are growing together and whatnot.
So appreciate you sharing that.
(24:06):
I think the other part, like definitely, right?
Like the representation part, right, like is key there.
But I also uplift, right?
Like to maybe some of our listeners don't know too, right?
Like that, what a lot of the research says, right?
Like the ways that black men kind of get positioned, particularly within education spaces, is solely
(24:27):
as authoritarian, right?
Like a disciplinarian, right?
So in other words, right?
Like again, for us to be like even within the content of mathematics, right?
Like says something different, right?
Like is because a lot of times we're not recognized for our pedagogy, right?
Like we're recognized for just being able to say, hey, boy, get in there, sit down and
stop giving your teacher problems.
You know what I'm saying?
(24:49):
But it's like, there's something about also being able to see that black educators bring
something again about the pedagogy and about what it means to be a good math teacher in
particular, especially ones, right?
Like that promote values of joy and liberation, right?
Like it's like, what does it mean, right?
Like when you also are interrogating, right?
(25:09):
Like we're challenging different notions of what people think black men do or operate
like or are, right?
Like I can see, man, this black male, this black teacher, right?
Like this man loves me.
You know what I'm saying?
Like that feels a lot different from the ways that they tend to see, oh, well, black males
are only this, only this, only this, right?
(25:31):
So I think that's the uniqueness, that's the specialness of being a black male educator.
Leading into that next part of that question, right?
Like which is like, in what ways do you think CREATE kind of helps to support the uniqueness
or the, what's special about being a black male educator?
I would say create honors that by again, preparing us to deal with different types of students
(25:56):
helps us by preparing us to deal with different types of situations.
So again, CREATE helped me a lot in to develop me into the educated I am today.
And again, the biggest thing I could say that I took from that was the relationship part
of that.
I know we've been talking about it already.
I definitely say one of the biggest parts that I took from everything that I learned
to create was that relationship part because that's my foundation as a teacher.
(26:21):
And again, preparing, just making sure that they prepare us for everything that needs
to be done as a teacher.
Everything that we need to do as a teacher.
That's it.
Yeah, that's it.
That's it.
To add to that, right?
Like I think part of what it helps for me, right?
Like I think, but even I think CREATE has honored that uniqueness, right?
(26:43):
Like by even allowing us to have time and space for this focus, right?
Like, and not saying that it was too narrow of a focus, right?
Like to say black male math teacher is very specific, right?
And even within the, even within the residence, right?
Like there weren't multiple people with those kind of identities, right?
(27:03):
Like, which is why I got so close.
Exactly, right?
And so I think there's a beauty in being able to say, right?
Like that there are things we learn when we look into the nuances and the crevices and
the particulars of situations, right?
Like what does it mean to like have a hyper focus on somebody with these identities and
that has come through this residency?
(27:24):
So I think CREATE has helped to honor that.
And yeah, yeah, yeah.
Cool.
Moving on into this next one.
So we've got about two more questions for y'all.
I know this has been good so far, man.
The most memorable experiences in CREATE, why was it important to either of us and what
(27:47):
should the legacy of CREATE be?
You want to take a stab at it first or you want me to?
Yeah, go ahead.
So one of the most memorable experiences for me was during the Baker Cloak Park Institute
we did in the summer previous, summer prior to my senior year, we went to the Legacy Museum
in Montgomery, Alabama, which kind of just highlighted some of the darker moments within
(28:12):
African American history, specifically as it relates to the people, the amount of people
that were lynched over the course of reconstruction all the way up until now.
And there I was able to see, one thing that really stuck out to me there was, so they
basically had tombstones, like they had tombstones with the names of every person that had ever
(28:38):
been lynched in America.
And they had it by county.
And so I remember we're walking through this little, it's not like a graveyard, but it's
like there's things and they're hanging from the ceiling.
And they also had some that were kind of like tombstones that were like laid out.
And I could see I'm from Magnificent County, Georgia.
So they have Magnificent County, Georgia, and there were three names on there.
(29:01):
And I remember one of the last names was Jackson.
So my folks come from Brock Creek, which is a part of our city in the out of the country.
So most of my folks come from Brock Creek and the Jackson's come from Brock Creek.
Everybody knows Thompson.
All the Jackson's from Brock Creek and they like that that's part of my family.
So I'm looking like this person probably could have been related somewhere down the
(29:23):
line.
I see his name.
I think it was David Jackson or something like that.
I remember that.
And that was that was very that's that close.
Also, it kind of talked about one thing that was very open to me was there was it kind
of alluded to that the prison system is another form of slavery.
(29:43):
So it was this one thing where we had there was you basically talking to somebody who
is like a screen.
And it's like you're talking to somebody who's in prison.
And that was very there were people who were in there who had tears in their eyes because
it was very out.
And yeah, I'll leave it at that.
(30:04):
Awesome.
Awesome.
Awesome.
I wanted to just for the listeners.
So I'm curious on your take to right like so.
How do you think create implemented that as a part of a teacher residency or what was
what's the point of that for educators?
Like so something like that that you experienced.
So I feel like they implemented that because again, as we know, create in Georgia State,
(30:26):
they're very social justice oriented.
So they wanted to show the residents this because.
All right, you're going to be dealing with all different kinds of students.
And you need to know what historically what they have been through and what they again
are still going through today.
(30:48):
So it would better inform your teaching practices and say, All right, maybe here I don't need
to say this, maybe here I don't need to do this.
Again, those things help inform and kind of it helps to help you to eliminate internal
biases you may know.
I mean, you may not know that you have that's helpful.
(31:11):
Like in one thing that kind of stood out to me, which you just responding to that, right?
Like was that, you know, people know that Georgia State create, right?
Like are very much social justice oriented.
So as we we open up the question was like, what should the legacy of create be right?
Like into me, right?
Like that's what more what more beautiful of a legacy can you have, right?
(31:32):
Like to say really that we're committed to particularly thinking about like what with
justice oriented education looks like, right?
Like what we need to do to prepare teachers to go into these particular environments.
I think one thing that I was kind of just thinking through to right, like, and curious
(31:56):
on you to respond to this from your from your vantage as a resident as well.
But one thing I kind of think about right, like is how or like even have some of the
legislation has has tried to push us away from like some of these conversations around
like maybe like justice oriented or kind of having legacies of social justice, right?
(32:17):
But how I think part of it, it says are like a part of what the legacy of create continues
to have to be right like in and must be right.
Like to say like, how do we even do it in these moments where where it is difficult, where
it is kind of looked at as something that is not that's not necessary or or or divisive,
(32:40):
right?
Like, I guess that's part of where I wanted to just get your your your thinking, right?
Like, or it did it ever feel like there could have been times that create was preparing you
that felt divisive or I know I'm just kind of putting that question out there.
Like, I'm putting that one on the spot, but but I guess I'm just kind of curious or like,
(33:01):
could some people maybe perceive the work of create as divisive?
So anytime you talk about race, people can see it as divisive.
And so I don't feel that it would necessarily be divisive.
It's just again, people need to know that.
(33:21):
All right, these people have been historically marginalized since their arrival in 1619.
And not just say black people.
Again, if you look at Hispanics to this day, again, I can walk out.
I have dealt with her out again.
I'm from the country.
So I'm from East Central Georgia, and I have dealt with racism myself.
(33:45):
So again, teaching is one of those professions where you are grooming America's next generation.
So you need to have people in those positions who know that.
All right, there's a certain way that I might need to go about this.
There's a certain way that I might need to deal with these type of students.
(34:08):
Because again, all students are not receptive to everybody.
And again, how you come off as students, how you interact with them, how you talk to students
is very important.
And again, I don't think that to me, I don't think that it would make it divisive.
But again, it's just letting people know that, hey, you need to know this information so
(34:33):
they can better inform your practice as a teacher.
I love that.
I think that's a quote.
I feel like that's going to be one of the quotes from the podcast, my brother.
People need to know.
And I think that that's a part of the legacy.
A lot of people just do not know.
Is that right?
Some people, even to be able to say, man, even for you to walk into the Lincoln Memorial
(34:58):
and say, that's my family, to say, man, I did not know my family's name was represented
there.
So there's a lot of things we do not know.
And as I think the legacy of CREGATE is to say, how do we make sure it is not our teacher
who do not know?
Because we don't ever want to be in a space where we're preparing people to go out into
(35:19):
classrooms and they're like, oh, I never knew about that.
So I think that is part of the legacy.
I think also for me, the way I would respond to that question too is that the legacy of
CREGATE has supported research and teaching that has centered Blackness in particular.
I think CREGATE does that in a very much unabashedly way.
(35:39):
It never assumes that as educators, we have the final answer.
We're all one of my favorite moments.
And this is from the team side, right?
Like is that just we had moments of what's called shared learning where we were watching
the masterclass, if any of y'all have seen some of the videos from the masterclass, we
would use that as kind of like curriculum and to kind of talk about different subjects,
(36:00):
different topics.
And we did a lot of learning.
We pushed one another, we reflected.
And to me, that was the legacy of CREGATE.
It was that we were always in a space where we were constantly learning, constantly pushing
each other and never felt like I think everybody had the answers.
I think we were always again just kind of growing in.
To me, that's what the legacy of that work should look like.
(36:22):
Yeah.
Cool, y'all.
So we are down to our last question.
I know this has been a great joy for both of us, I think.
Sure.
Yeah.
I think we're going to go back to the question, what is the impact of CREGATE on us as a protectioner
and as a researcher?
(36:43):
The bit of a difference in this question, just saying, this one is specifically towards
how has it impacted us in particular and what can the feel other residents take from what
Kim and I have learned in our time together?
Cool.
You want to take this one first?
Yeah.
I'll say that without CREATE, I would not be there, I'm not just saying this, without
(37:07):
CREATE, I would not be the educator who I am now.
I feel like this first year, and what I say my first, basically two years, but these first
couple of years, I feel like I've done my job and I felt like that I've showed up for
my kids in the way that I needed to show up.
Without the knowledge and different things that I've learned through CREATE, I wouldn't
(37:28):
be able to say that as many others might.
Again, my readiness through CREATE will show up in the lives of my students, will show up
in the lives of my colleagues, and again, they can help schools because again, if you
look at it, if you have everything now is about data, and that's just how it is now,
especially within public schools, and if you have effective teachers, you have good data.
(37:57):
So again, that's one thing I can impact.
And again, any teacher, any person who goes through the residency, if they are learning
and holding these values that they are teaching true, and again, those you're going to touch,
you're going to see many different students, as many different students who have been touched
(38:17):
by the lives of these teachers.
So again, that's what kind of impact I think it has kind of had on me.
Awesome, awesome, awesome.
I think similar, right?
Like I think part of what it has helped me to appreciate more is just the everyday commitment
of teachers, right?
Like that they can easily, teachers could easily say that, you know, I got other things to
(38:40):
worry about, or I don't have time to figure out how to be committed to these other kind
of cultural, racial issues, right?
And part of what I'm recognizing, right, and what CREATE has helped me to think through,
right, is like, how do we honor this sacrifice from teachers in particular, right?
Like, because it's a noteworthy thing to say, right, like, you know what, I'm going
(39:02):
to make this a priority in my teaching, right?
Like I'm going to make student relationships something that's central to the ways that
I operate in these classrooms.
So yeah, it has helped me to honor them very deeply.
It's helped me to also think deeply about why our partnerships with districts continue
to matter and that we are nothing without buying from the community, right?
(39:22):
Like we can't do it just from the university alone, right?
We have to have partners with local districts, right?
Because that's where teachers are going, right?
Like to the local districts.
And it has helped me to think more about like just continue commitment to this work and
funding, sustainability of the work.
In particular, like what I think they learn from just the work that Cam and I have done
(39:46):
with one another is that there is room for educational excellence of black men in mathematics.
Right?
Like I think that we come with pedagogy, like to understand and to know, right?
That we come with pedagogy, we come with brilliance, right?
Like we come with humanizing activities, expertise, commitments, and that our identities are not
(40:07):
offensive or dismissive, right?
Like I think that is part of what we want and hope to convey not only from this podcast,
but some of my research from some of the teaching.
And yeah, I think, and I think that's the beauty of it.
That's the joy of it.
With that said, Cam, are there any just like maybe final words that you want to leave anybody
(40:28):
that's listening to the podcast with or just kind of reflect on?
Again, I kind of already said this, but shut up for your kids.
Let them know that you care about them because when you do that, it makes a world of a difference.
And again, build those relationships.
(40:49):
Talk to your kids.
I make that my focal point.
See how they're doing.
See where their heads are at.
And again, every kid needs a champion.
Every kid needs a champion.
That's beautiful, man.
Out in, we're just saying, right, like that this has been our time together has just been
marvelous, right?
Like I have learned so much just from Cam.
(41:10):
I appreciate it.
Yes, sir.
And I think there's this importance of being able to always be able to tie back the research
to the actual practice, right?
So I think Cam has given me a way to be able to think about that.
Again, for those of y'all that are listening, you know, check out the research articles,
you know, shoot your boy email.
If you need me to email it to you, I think it's public.
(41:32):
You still waiting on some publicity from it.
But with that said, y'all, thank y'all so much for tuning in and listening and signing
out from Dr. Ortiz.
Let's get it out.
Isn't that a great conversation?
As we wrap up this podcast, here's a couple of snippets that stood out for me and what
(41:55):
stood out for you.
It's vitally important that we build relationships with students and Cam talked about how that's
emphasized here at the Create Project.
The other thing they brought up is language, is context driven, local, regional, regional,
(42:16):
national, in our homes.
How do we use the languages and the cultures we bring with us to the classroom and the
education context?
How do we do that?
I love when Cam said, y'all, y'all in here sounding like the cheering cry.
Now, I know I don't say that right, but I love how Cam brings who he is to the classroom.
(42:38):
If I was a student, I'd be paying attention when my teachers brought who they were.
If he can become a teacher, so can I.
When Cam talked about black males in education and just that great conversation that he and
Dr. Ortiz had about it, yes, there's an important role of discipline, but also it's so much
(43:00):
more than that in how black male educators can be and are in the classroom.
Seeing yourself as a teacher can be liberatory.
That's huge.
Dr. Ortiz mentioned his research article and we have it posted below.
(43:20):
Please make sure you take a moment and read that.
It's powerful work.
And finally, you heard Cam talk about the Baker Hope Clark Institute with the Create
Project.
Did you wonder what that was?
Well, wonder no more because that's going to be the focus of the next episode.
We're going to dive in and talk more and explore the Baker Hope Clark Project and Institute.
(43:45):
And that's a wrap for this episode of Create Ed.
What did you think?
We hope our discussion has provided valuable insights into the power of research, education,
community partnerships, collaboration, just talking through all the different parts and
pieces of education.
(44:08):
If you enjoyed today's episode, please subscribe, rate, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts
and Spotify.
Your feedback helps us to continue to bring you meaningful content and to connect with
more listeners passionate about education, both here in Atlanta, in Georgia, in the South
region, the United States and around the world.
(44:31):
If you want to get connected and find out more about the Create Project, take a look
below and click on our website so you can find out about all the parts of this work.
Join us next time as we dig into the Baker Hope Clark Institute.
Cam brought it up a couple times, I believe, and we're going to dive into more about what
(44:52):
this institute is, what it does, and how you can be connected to the work as well.
Thank you for listening and until next time, let's continue to build strong partnerships
that foster thriving educational communities and transform teachers, teacher education,
this work into places of deep joy.
(45:15):
Does that sound like a good thing?
Come on with us.
See you next time.
The views, thoughts, and opinions expressed are the speaker's own and do not represent
(00:09):
the views, thoughts, and opinions of Georgia State University.
The material and information presented here is for general information purposes only.
The Georgia State University name and all forms and abbreviations are the property of its
owner and its use does not imply endorsement of or opposition to any specific organization,
(00:35):
product, or service.
Hi everyone.
Welcome to the Create Ed podcast.
We're really excited to have you with us today and every day.
This podcast is a part of an original multimedia content experience of the Create Project here
(00:56):
at Georgia State University.
Now what's the Create Project?
I'm glad you asked.
It's a three-year teacher residency here at Georgia State.
Now what's the teacher residency?
Basically we train and support future teachers.
We come alongside of them for several years so they're not just dropped into the classroom.
We come alongside teach you, support you, and then even afterwards we support you with
(01:20):
professional learning and development.
Now in each episode of this Create Ed podcast series, we explore conversations, ideas,
wonderings, challenges, really you name it at the intersection of birth through 12, through
college, through grad school, through traditional and non-traditional education here in Metswa,
(01:44):
Atlanta, and in Georgia and in the southern region of the United States.
We do all of this through the lens of the Create Project approach to education and in
a nutshell it's four things we focus on.
Taking the time to be rooted in our local context, understanding the context of this
work and learning and teaching.
(02:05):
The second thing is inviting all people to participate in this work.
We're all invited.
You're invited.
Third is we understand who we as individuals are in this work.
Who are you?
And the fourth is to remember that education and supporting education and teachers is also
about joy, freedom, liberation.
(02:31):
Now what does all of that mean?
That's what this podcast series will dig into.
In this episode, we're going to look at how the Create Project supports math teacher education
here in Atlanta.
And we're going to do that by talking with Cam Bentley.
Cam's an alumni of the Create Project and he's also a current math teacher.
(02:54):
Now as we get started, let's take a moment everybody and take a deep breath, relax.
And as you settle in to listen to our podcast, here's a few questions to think about as you
prepare to listen right now.
What's unique about being a black male math educator in general and here in Atlanta, Georgia
(03:18):
in particular?
How are math teachers trained to bring themselves in the classroom as they develop their high
level of skills to be educators?
Now here's a big one.
What gets lost in our current conversation nationally, locally, globally about education
and educators?
(03:40):
What's the role of the kind of research that Cam and Dr. Ortiz are going to talk about in
this work?
And how do we connect to the math research that Dr. Ortiz and Cam did?
How do we connect it to ourselves and to our everyday lives as teachers, caregivers, students
and community members?
(04:01):
A lot of questions to think about.
Let's drop in.
We're going to join Dr. Nicholas Ortiz as I mentioned a second ago.
He was a professor of math education at Georgia State University and a member of the Create
Project research team.
And Cam Bentley, Georgia State class of 2023, Create Project alumni and a current math teacher
(04:24):
at his alma mater, Thompson High School in Augusta, Georgia.
Enjoy.
Good evening, everybody.
Good afternoon.
Good morning, wherever you are in the world.
I am known as Dr. Nicholas Ortiz, but you all can call me Nicholas.
I'm an assistant professor of mathematics education here at Georgia State University and a member
(04:45):
of the research team with Create Project.
I also want to allow my co-star here to introduce myself as well.
Hey, my name is Cam Bentley, well, Camron Bentley, but everybody calls me Cam.
I am a former Create Project resident and I am currently about to enter my second year
as a teacher.
(05:06):
I am a mathematics teacher.
I teach algebra one and foundations of algebra here at my alma mater at Thompson High School,
which is just outside of Augusta.
And again, I just graduated class 2023 from Georgia State and through Create.
Awesome.
Awesome.
Awesome.
Appreciate that introduction.
So hopefully y'all know a little bit about us.
(05:27):
We're going to go ahead and jump straight into some of the questions.
And so we have this part of this conversation.
We wanted to kind of tell y'all just about the work that Mr. Bentley and myself have
been doing together over the course of a couple years, right, Cam?
It's been a couple years, isn't it?
Long time.
Yeah.
So one of the first things we wanted to kind of jump into and I'll kind of take the position
(05:50):
of just posing questions, right?
Like and then we'll both kind of just respond to them.
The first one we were kind of just thinking through is what has Create meant to either
of us, given our role in the residency, specifically what has its purpose been, what is it supposed
to do for us, particularly what we do just in our different roles.
I can jump in first too, Cam.
(06:11):
Then I let you jump in.
But so it has really helped me to think a lot about the ways that we can be intentional
about who we place into public schools, right?
Like that's the work that Create has really done for me.
Right?
Like it takes up this mentor and says that we have the opportunity to supply districts
and the profession with some of the most effective and justice-oriented educators.
(06:32):
Right?
Create reminds me that teaching is not as easy as somebody who wants to communicate,
but that it is a profession of skilled workers.
I think a lot of times we lose sight of that.
Right?
Like in some of the larger national discourse, right?
Like doesn't really represent the skills and the qualities of these people as professional
(06:53):
skilled workers.
I think in Create, we have the opportunity to help communicate and establish values of
joy and freedom even within the work of teachers and teacher educators.
And that's a privilege.
That's definitely a privilege.
As a researcher, I am committed to reflecting on the work that we do and documenting the
ways that we improve educational experiences for all youth.
(07:15):
That's kind of what I do as a member of the research team.
That's part of the work that Cam and I, like kind of telling that story have been doing
together.
With that said, I'll let Cam jump into answering a response to that question as well.
Alright.
Create has helped me a lot in developing me into the educator that I am today.
And while in Create, I learned valuable information as far as different classroom strategies like
(07:41):
classroom management, differentiated instruction.
And one of the main things is, again, me, one of the foundations of my teaching philosophy
is building relationships with students.
And they really stress that and create.
Well, yeah, building on that too, right?
Like I love how you kind of just mentioned the relationships, right?
(08:02):
And that's one of the things that we've talked about a lot just in our interactions with
each other.
So if nothing else, y'all, people out there listening to podcasts, land, right?
Create helps us think about the relationships that we make, not only with educated, with
among one another, among the research team, but then also with students as well.
(08:22):
So awesome.
So moving on to this next question.
So as a researcher, I work with Cam to foreground particularly two studies, right?
Like, and what's interesting, right?
Like is that sometimes, right?
Like that gets translated very well.
Sometimes it doesn't get translated as well, right?
Like particularly, right?
Like, it can feel like maybe we're only talking to other academics, other people that are
(08:43):
just within the scope of research and whatnot.
And then like, how that kind of just gets again, positioned to the broader world and
just kind of relate in different ways.
So I wanted to take a second, right?
Like so one of the questions I posed to Cam, right?
Like was like, so Cam, what is it that you think I was actually studying the whole time?
(09:05):
So with that, I wanted Cam just to kind of respond to it.
And then I'll kind of add my own take of what was I really focused on as we were working
together.
So I would love the conversation from your point of view first.
So I know for sure that the study that you were doing, it was on black language and using
the classroom.
And I know so when I was in, during my student teaching in the APS, the school, the classroom
(09:30):
that I had was, I would say majority Caucasian.
So I know it probably was a little bit tougher to kind of look into that black language there,
but like the school I teach at my dean, I'm at my alma mater, how school that I graduated
from.
And again, my class is diverse, but there's, the majority of my students are African American.
(09:53):
So I know it's probably was a little bit easier for you there to kind of, well, I know it's
easier, but it was, it was a little more less challenging to look at that black language.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I think that's a, that's a, that's a really important point for the study, right?
Like is that, so I was kind of thrown off by the context when I came into this APS classroom,
(10:14):
right?
Like I'm expecting to see a whole lot of like black students just inside of the classroom,
but it was, that was not the reality necessarily within your classroom, right?
Like so even within that first study, right?
Like my focus changed from the ways that students were using black language to how this educator,
right?
Like was using black language to teach students, particularly in the subject of mathematics.
(10:38):
And for those, right?
Like who are kind of like, man, what are y'all even saying about this thing?
Kind of like y'all are talking about a black language.
What do y'all even mean by that?
Ken, did you want to take a stab at that first before I kind of jump into like, well,
I say black language is just how, how, what I could take from that is just how we, how
(10:59):
we interact one another.
What languages will you use that you might not hear in a different setting than things
like that?
Like with my kids last year when I was teaching in Atlanta, again, there was a lot of different
things that I said that they were like, hold up, what you saying?
For me, I'm from the country.
So my black language and somebody from the city black language could be a little bit
(11:21):
different.
It's still the same.
But again, there's different things that I know that I might say and I will be in a space
and you say, what does that mean?
This game, I'm from the country.
But yeah, yeah.
And I think just to add on to that, right, like I think part of what Cam is bringing
up, right, like is this idea of like language kind of being very much regional, right, like
(11:43):
in context driven, right, like particularly, right, I'm interested in the ways that particularly
right, like linguistic practices of black Americans, I'm looking particularly within
my study, I was looking at what does it look like to be situated within this metropolitan
of Atlanta, right, like, but part of what Cam is saying to right, like is that what
my black language is also informed by me being a country boy from right outside of Augusta.
(12:06):
Right.
And so I think part of what we were kind of making the case for is like, what were some
of the similarities in terms of kind of thinking about that language within also, how did that
language particularly right, like some of the linguistic practices that we see common
among African Americans kind of used for educational purposes as well, right.
(12:28):
So part of the question that I was asking was to say, right, like, well, does does it
is this language also appropriate in a mathematics context, right, like in which Cam was helping
me to kind of think through and make sense of right, like, was how was he even using
it to be able to to teach mathematics concepts.
There was one phrase, this is the phrase and came on, I don't know, I don't even know if
(12:50):
I shared this with you, right, like, but the title of the article that I just submitted,
right, was one of your most common phrases that you use all the time talking about right,
like, y'all in here sounding like the what?
The children's choir, right.
Exactly, right.
Like in so part of what I was arguing in this in this this academic journal, right, like
(13:14):
was this was that Ken was also using this as a form of formative assessment, right.
So in the ways that we think about black language kind of being this very much call and response
kind of activity, part of what I was arguing was that Ken was also using it in his math
pedagogy to think about formative assessment and to be able to assess the students understanding
of different mathematical concepts.
(13:35):
So that's a that's a bulk, just an overview of what the what the article and what the research
was kind of getting at, and particularly how he was using that.
One of the other examples I give you all like because I want you to go read the article
as well.
One of the other examples, can you remember, can you just tell them a little bit about
(13:56):
what a mood meter was.
I talked a little bit about what a mood meter was.
And I so I learned to move me from Dr. Jacob packet, who is a professor at GSU.
He was our coordinator through the middle of program.
And it's basically just what I how I use it was there's different ways you could do it.
So one way that we learned was that you just that you have a mood.
(14:22):
You basically just checking to see where your students are before you start the lesson.
And there would be a I wish I had a race my board not too long ago.
I had them on board.
So basically, there's like, you're like, oh, I'm good.
I'm okay.
I'm all right.
I'm great.
I need to check in.
So what I did is again, I teach math.
(14:44):
So what I did was to kind of connect it to mathematics.
I use quadrants.
So I had a coordinate playing graph on my board and usually we would try to do it at
least once or twice a week.
And our conduct students would come in, especially on Mondays.
Mondays was the big days.
A lot of times we do it on Fridays.
And when they come in, I give them a sticky note.
(15:07):
So they would write their name on the back of the sticky note.
And on the front of the sticky note, they would draw an emoji of how they're feeling.
And then they would go and place it on the quadrant in which they are.
So again, it was, I'm good.
We'll be quadrant.
Well, I'm great.
We'll be quadrant one.
I'm all right.
I'm good.
I'm good.
We'll be quadrant two.
I'm I, O slash okay.
And in quadrant four would be checking with the coachman.
(15:32):
And so again, that kind of just gave me an opportunity to see where my students were.
Because again, I always let my students know before class starts.
If you got something going on, just let me know.
I'll work with you.
And I want to build on that too.
So one of the connection that I saw in there, even to the black language, was that in quadrant
three, it was so funny to you.
(15:53):
When you walked in, it was saying, I'm a hi.
So it was very much like a testament to black language.
Even seeing that within the mathematics space.
And as Ken was saying, a lot of the students was like, at first they just kind of looked
at it first, right?
But they were like, okay, they kind of bought into it.
So again, you saw it kind of operating in those spaces.
(16:16):
Yeah.
So the other study that I wanted to look at and that I've kind of been tracing and following
with Ken this year was part of what I wanted to see was that the stuff that maybe like,
I as a create researcher know is kind of going on in the residency.
Remember what I wanted to say and make the case for was like, could we say that some of
(16:39):
that was also showing up in his first year of teaching, right?
And so there were things that Cam continues to say and was like, you know, that I was
observing and he's like, yeah, you know, I could say that I learned this from create
or I could say that this thing was important, something that I learned within the residency.
And I want to bring you back to just one of those points.
(17:01):
We don't have to stay here too long.
But one of the things that you were kind of saying like, what I gathered you learning
from the residency that I definitely saw as I observed in your classroom or like was
the way that you were building relationships with students.
Can you talk a little bit just about that maybe like what you gathered from, from create
and what you try to make sure that you emphasize in your first year of teaching?
(17:23):
So again, I shared this.
It was either our first together time together times where we met during we always met at
least once a month.
And during our together times, it was either our first one or our second one, which we
talked about relationship.
And we first got in, they showed us a video.
It was Rita Pearson's Ted talk about every kid needs a champion.
(17:46):
And it means just basically explain that again, to show up for your students be there and
to build those relationships with your students.
And I've learned to know that as a teacher, if you build those relationships with your
students, they would do anything that you want them to do.
And you saw, I was talking to somebody about this the other day.
(18:11):
You saw how hard my kids were working.
They probably, I think probably the last time you came right before they took the EOC or
it was the second to last time.
And my kids, so as they're doing EOC testing, I have my algebra one class, my first period.
And the class is already an hour and 50 minutes long.
And a lot of times, well, when we were doing the EOC's, the classes could be longer.
(18:38):
And I remember one day, our class was, we ended up being in class for two hours and
35 minutes or something like that.
And we worked about two hours and 25 of those two hours, 35 minutes.
And the kids, I let them know up front, we had a week, we had two weeks, 14 days to
(18:58):
be exact before 14 class periods before we took the EOC after we came back from spring
break.
So I let them know before we left.
Hey, when we come back, it's go time.
It's go time.
And again, I did not expect to get the, I did not expect my students to work as hard
(19:18):
as they did.
And again, they're hardworking students.
But when I tell you that, again, we, I kind of gave them like, I'll let them know ahead
of time, hey, there's five algebra one classes.
And if we get the highest scores, we celebrate and I'm taking y'all top golf, I'm taking
y'all bowling, whatever you want to do.
So I kind of gave them an incentive and that made them want to work hard.
(19:40):
And again, so you have to build those relationships with your students.
You have to show up for them, go to games, ask them about the different things in life.
Ask them, hey, how's this going?
How's that going?
What you do this weekend?
Talk to your kids.
I stress that.
And again, a lot of teachers who may be dealing with different things, as far as classroom
(20:02):
management and things like that.
A lot of that stuff could be eliminated if you build a relationship with your students.
That's good.
No, that's good.
No, I appreciate that.
Hey, so y'all, yeah, y'all check it out.
Check it out the second article and you'll hear a lot more about just what we're capturing
in that part of the study.
Appreciate you reflecting there, right?
(20:23):
Yeah, so moving on to this next question, right?
Like, so, so something that you and I both know something about, maybe that some of our
listeners don't know as much about, right?
The question says, what is special or unique about being a black male mathematics educator?
So yeah, I'll let you jump in there first.
So it's special being a black male educator for one, because we're one of the biggest
(20:49):
minorities within the teaching profession.
I don't know if it's still 2%, right?
At one point, there was only 2% of African Americans, 2% of teachers were African American
males.
And especially in a school where like my school, the demographic is mostly black and for kids
being able to see, especially black kids, especially black boys, being able to see people in these
(21:15):
positions like teachers and principals and APs and different things like that.
They need to see that.
And in my hometown, gang violence is one of its all-times highs right now.
And when these kids can see that, hey, if he can do that, what makes you think that I
(21:36):
can?
And that was one of my eyes on why I wanted to become a teacher, because I looked at some
of the people in these positions and I say, they can do it.
I know that I can.
Kids need to be able to see people who look like them in different positions, because
again, especially young people as well, like being a young educator, again, we can relate
(21:59):
to these students.
I tell my kids all the time, I listen to a lot of the same music I listen to.
They play a song and I start saying, is it cold care to know about that?
I be like, hey, we're six years apart.
We're six years apart.
And again, math in general, math is one of those core core subjects.
That was one of those big testing subjects.
(22:20):
So being able to relate to the kids, they're getting their buy-in.
No, that's good.
I think some of the things that you just kind of pointed out, I think people still don't
recognize the privilege of what it means to always have had somebody in that position
that looks like you.
(22:40):
If you've never had to think about, man, you know what?
I've never had a black male teacher.
Or I've never had a black woman teacher.
When you, again, part of what I'm trying to capture and what I think you were alluding
to is that people don't recognize that as an invisible privilege to all through your
K-12 experience to see teachers that look like you.
(23:02):
It's a very different disposition to have than somebody who is like, man, I've never
seen this.
And as you were saying, to start seeing those images, does something to the psyche that's
like, you know what, maybe there is something, there are different opportunities that I can
be exposed to, different things that I could aspire to.
(23:24):
Like it being that now that I've actually seen somebody in that position before, I think
the other thing that kind of, as you were kind of talking and made me think about, was
that we both were very young when we first started teaching.
All right?
Like I was 21 when I went into the high school class.
I just turned 22.
Well, my same thing, because my birthday is July.
(23:45):
Shout out to the Leos, right?
My birthday is in July, so I was hired at 21, but by the time I started teaching.
I was the same way I was hired at 21, started teaching at 22.
Yeah, man.
And it does something where I like to have that closeness and age to your students, right?
Like at C, where I like, you know, y'all are growing together and whatnot.
So appreciate you sharing that.
(24:06):
I think the other part, like definitely, right?
Like the representation part, right, like is key there.
But I also uplift, right?
Like to maybe some of our listeners don't know too, right?
Like that, what a lot of the research says, right?
Like the ways that black men kind of get positioned, particularly within education spaces, is solely
(24:27):
as authoritarian, right?
Like a disciplinarian, right?
So in other words, right?
Like again, for us to be like even within the content of mathematics, right?
Like says something different, right?
Like is because a lot of times we're not recognized for our pedagogy, right?
Like we're recognized for just being able to say, hey, boy, get in there, sit down and
stop giving your teacher problems.
You know what I'm saying?
(24:49):
But it's like, there's something about also being able to see that black educators bring
something again about the pedagogy and about what it means to be a good math teacher in
particular, especially ones, right?
Like that promote values of joy and liberation, right?
Like it's like, what does it mean, right?
Like when you also are interrogating, right?
(25:09):
Like we're challenging different notions of what people think black men do or operate
like or are, right?
Like I can see, man, this black male, this black teacher, right?
Like this man loves me.
You know what I'm saying?
Like that feels a lot different from the ways that they tend to see, oh, well, black males
are only this, only this, only this, right?
(25:31):
So I think that's the uniqueness, that's the specialness of being a black male educator.
Leading into that next part of that question, right?
Like which is like, in what ways do you think CREATE kind of helps to support the uniqueness
or the, what's special about being a black male educator?
I would say create honors that by again, preparing us to deal with different types of students
(25:56):
helps us by preparing us to deal with different types of situations.
So again, CREATE helped me a lot in to develop me into the educated I am today.
And again, the biggest thing I could say that I took from that was the relationship part
of that.
I know we've been talking about it already.
I definitely say one of the biggest parts that I took from everything that I learned
to create was that relationship part because that's my foundation as a teacher.
(26:21):
And again, preparing, just making sure that they prepare us for everything that needs
to be done as a teacher.
Everything that we need to do as a teacher.
That's it.
Yeah, that's it.
That's it.
To add to that, right?
Like I think part of what it helps for me, right?
Like I think, but even I think CREATE has honored that uniqueness, right?
(26:43):
Like by even allowing us to have time and space for this focus, right?
Like, and not saying that it was too narrow of a focus, right?
Like to say black male math teacher is very specific, right?
And even within the, even within the residence, right?
Like there weren't multiple people with those kind of identities, right?
(27:03):
Like, which is why I got so close.
Exactly, right?
And so I think there's a beauty in being able to say, right?
Like that there are things we learn when we look into the nuances and the crevices and
the particulars of situations, right?
Like what does it mean to like have a hyper focus on somebody with these identities and
that has come through this residency?
(27:24):
So I think CREATE has helped to honor that.
And yeah, yeah, yeah.
Cool.
Moving on into this next one.
So we've got about two more questions for y'all.
I know this has been good so far, man.
The most memorable experiences in CREATE, why was it important to either of us and what
(27:47):
should the legacy of CREATE be?
You want to take a stab at it first or you want me to?
Yeah, go ahead.
So one of the most memorable experiences for me was during the Baker Cloak Park Institute
we did in the summer previous, summer prior to my senior year, we went to the Legacy Museum
in Montgomery, Alabama, which kind of just highlighted some of the darker moments within
(28:12):
African American history, specifically as it relates to the people, the amount of people
that were lynched over the course of reconstruction all the way up until now.
And there I was able to see, one thing that really stuck out to me there was, so they
basically had tombstones, like they had tombstones with the names of every person that had ever
(28:38):
been lynched in America.
And they had it by county.
And so I remember we're walking through this little, it's not like a graveyard, but it's
like there's things and they're hanging from the ceiling.
And they also had some that were kind of like tombstones that were like laid out.
And I could see I'm from Magnificent County, Georgia.
So they have Magnificent County, Georgia, and there were three names on there.
(29:01):
And I remember one of the last names was Jackson.
So my folks come from Brock Creek, which is a part of our city in the out of the country.
So most of my folks come from Brock Creek and the Jackson's come from Brock Creek.
Everybody knows Thompson.
All the Jackson's from Brock Creek and they like that that's part of my family.
So I'm looking like this person probably could have been related somewhere down the
(29:23):
line.
I see his name.
I think it was David Jackson or something like that.
I remember that.
And that was that was very that's that close.
Also, it kind of talked about one thing that was very open to me was there was it kind
of alluded to that the prison system is another form of slavery.
(29:43):
So it was this one thing where we had there was you basically talking to somebody who
is like a screen.
And it's like you're talking to somebody who's in prison.
And that was very there were people who were in there who had tears in their eyes because
it was very out.
And yeah, I'll leave it at that.
(30:04):
Awesome.
Awesome.
Awesome.
I wanted to just for the listeners.
So I'm curious on your take to right like so.
How do you think create implemented that as a part of a teacher residency or what was
what's the point of that for educators?
Like so something like that that you experienced.
So I feel like they implemented that because again, as we know, create in Georgia State,
(30:26):
they're very social justice oriented.
So they wanted to show the residents this because.
All right, you're going to be dealing with all different kinds of students.
And you need to know what historically what they have been through and what they again
are still going through today.
(30:48):
So it would better inform your teaching practices and say, All right, maybe here I don't need
to say this, maybe here I don't need to do this.
Again, those things help inform and kind of it helps to help you to eliminate internal
biases you may know.
I mean, you may not know that you have that's helpful.
(31:11):
Like in one thing that kind of stood out to me, which you just responding to that, right?
Like was that, you know, people know that Georgia State create, right?
Like are very much social justice oriented.
So as we we open up the question was like, what should the legacy of create be right?
Like into me, right?
Like that's what more what more beautiful of a legacy can you have, right?
(31:32):
Like to say really that we're committed to particularly thinking about like what with
justice oriented education looks like, right?
Like what we need to do to prepare teachers to go into these particular environments.
I think one thing that I was kind of just thinking through to right, like, and curious
(31:56):
on you to respond to this from your from your vantage as a resident as well.
But one thing I kind of think about right, like is how or like even have some of the
legislation has has tried to push us away from like some of these conversations around
like maybe like justice oriented or kind of having legacies of social justice, right?
(32:17):
But how I think part of it, it says are like a part of what the legacy of create continues
to have to be right like in and must be right.
Like to say like, how do we even do it in these moments where where it is difficult, where
it is kind of looked at as something that is not that's not necessary or or or divisive,
(32:40):
right?
Like, I guess that's part of where I wanted to just get your your your thinking, right?
Like, or it did it ever feel like there could have been times that create was preparing you
that felt divisive or I know I'm just kind of putting that question out there.
Like, I'm putting that one on the spot, but but I guess I'm just kind of curious or like,
(33:01):
could some people maybe perceive the work of create as divisive?
So anytime you talk about race, people can see it as divisive.
And so I don't feel that it would necessarily be divisive.
It's just again, people need to know that.
(33:21):
All right, these people have been historically marginalized since their arrival in 1619.
And not just say black people.
Again, if you look at Hispanics to this day, again, I can walk out.
I have dealt with her out again.
I'm from the country.
So I'm from East Central Georgia, and I have dealt with racism myself.
(33:45):
So again, teaching is one of those professions where you are grooming America's next generation.
So you need to have people in those positions who know that.
All right, there's a certain way that I might need to go about this.
There's a certain way that I might need to deal with these type of students.
(34:08):
Because again, all students are not receptive to everybody.
And again, how you come off as students, how you interact with them, how you talk to students
is very important.
And again, I don't think that to me, I don't think that it would make it divisive.
But again, it's just letting people know that, hey, you need to know this information so
(34:33):
they can better inform your practice as a teacher.
I love that.
I think that's a quote.
I feel like that's going to be one of the quotes from the podcast, my brother.
People need to know.
And I think that that's a part of the legacy.
A lot of people just do not know.
Is that right?
Some people, even to be able to say, man, even for you to walk into the Lincoln Memorial
(34:58):
and say, that's my family, to say, man, I did not know my family's name was represented
there.
So there's a lot of things we do not know.
And as I think the legacy of CREGATE is to say, how do we make sure it is not our teacher
who do not know?
Because we don't ever want to be in a space where we're preparing people to go out into
(35:19):
classrooms and they're like, oh, I never knew about that.
So I think that is part of the legacy.
I think also for me, the way I would respond to that question too is that the legacy of
CREGATE has supported research and teaching that has centered Blackness in particular.
I think CREGATE does that in a very much unabashedly way.
(35:39):
It never assumes that as educators, we have the final answer.
We're all one of my favorite moments.
And this is from the team side, right?
Like is that just we had moments of what's called shared learning where we were watching
the masterclass, if any of y'all have seen some of the videos from the masterclass, we
would use that as kind of like curriculum and to kind of talk about different subjects,
(36:00):
different topics.
And we did a lot of learning.
We pushed one another, we reflected.
And to me, that was the legacy of CREGATE.
It was that we were always in a space where we were constantly learning, constantly pushing
each other and never felt like I think everybody had the answers.
I think we were always again just kind of growing in.
To me, that's what the legacy of that work should look like.
(36:22):
Yeah.
Cool, y'all.
So we are down to our last question.
I know this has been a great joy for both of us, I think.
Sure.
Yeah.
I think we're going to go back to the question, what is the impact of CREGATE on us as a protectioner
and as a researcher?
(36:43):
The bit of a difference in this question, just saying, this one is specifically towards
how has it impacted us in particular and what can the feel other residents take from what
Kim and I have learned in our time together?
Cool.
You want to take this one first?
Yeah.
I'll say that without CREATE, I would not be there, I'm not just saying this, without
(37:07):
CREATE, I would not be the educator who I am now.
I feel like this first year, and what I say my first, basically two years, but these first
couple of years, I feel like I've done my job and I felt like that I've showed up for
my kids in the way that I needed to show up.
Without the knowledge and different things that I've learned through CREATE, I wouldn't
(37:28):
be able to say that as many others might.
Again, my readiness through CREATE will show up in the lives of my students, will show up
in the lives of my colleagues, and again, they can help schools because again, if you
look at it, if you have everything now is about data, and that's just how it is now,
especially within public schools, and if you have effective teachers, you have good data.
(37:57):
So again, that's one thing I can impact.
And again, any teacher, any person who goes through the residency, if they are learning
and holding these values that they are teaching true, and again, those you're going to touch,
you're going to see many different students, as many different students who have been touched
(38:17):
by the lives of these teachers.
So again, that's what kind of impact I think it has kind of had on me.
Awesome, awesome, awesome.
I think similar, right?
Like I think part of what it has helped me to appreciate more is just the everyday commitment
of teachers, right?
Like that they can easily, teachers could easily say that, you know, I got other things to
(38:40):
worry about, or I don't have time to figure out how to be committed to these other kind
of cultural, racial issues, right?
And part of what I'm recognizing, right, and what CREATE has helped me to think through,
right, is like, how do we honor this sacrifice from teachers in particular, right?
Like, because it's a noteworthy thing to say, right, like, you know what, I'm going
(39:02):
to make this a priority in my teaching, right?
Like I'm going to make student relationships something that's central to the ways that
I operate in these classrooms.
So yeah, it has helped me to honor them very deeply.
It's helped me to also think deeply about why our partnerships with districts continue
to matter and that we are nothing without buying from the community, right?
(39:22):
Like we can't do it just from the university alone, right?
We have to have partners with local districts, right?
Because that's where teachers are going, right?
Like to the local districts.
And it has helped me to think more about like just continue commitment to this work and
funding, sustainability of the work.
In particular, like what I think they learn from just the work that Cam and I have done
(39:46):
with one another is that there is room for educational excellence of black men in mathematics.
Right?
Like I think that we come with pedagogy, like to understand and to know, right?
That we come with pedagogy, we come with brilliance, right?
Like we come with humanizing activities, expertise, commitments, and that our identities are not
(40:07):
offensive or dismissive, right?
Like I think that is part of what we want and hope to convey not only from this podcast,
but some of my research from some of the teaching.
And yeah, I think, and I think that's the beauty of it.
That's the joy of it.
With that said, Cam, are there any just like maybe final words that you want to leave anybody
(40:28):
that's listening to the podcast with or just kind of reflect on?
Again, I kind of already said this, but shut up for your kids.
Let them know that you care about them because when you do that, it makes a world of a difference.
And again, build those relationships.
(40:49):
Talk to your kids.
I make that my focal point.
See how they're doing.
See where their heads are at.
And again, every kid needs a champion.
Every kid needs a champion.
That's beautiful, man.
Out in, we're just saying, right, like that this has been our time together has just been
marvelous, right?
Like I have learned so much just from Cam.
(41:10):
I appreciate it.
Yes, sir.
And I think there's this importance of being able to always be able to tie back the research
to the actual practice, right?
So I think Cam has given me a way to be able to think about that.
Again, for those of y'all that are listening, you know, check out the research articles,
you know, shoot your boy email.
If you need me to email it to you, I think it's public.
(41:32):
You still waiting on some publicity from it.
But with that said, y'all, thank y'all so much for tuning in and listening and signing
out from Dr. Ortiz.
Let's get it out.
Isn't that a great conversation?
As we wrap up this podcast, here's a couple of snippets that stood out for me and what
(41:55):
stood out for you.
It's vitally important that we build relationships with students and Cam talked about how that's
emphasized here at the Create Project.
The other thing they brought up is language, is context driven, local, regional, regional,
(42:16):
national, in our homes.
How do we use the languages and the cultures we bring with us to the classroom and the
education context?
How do we do that?
I love when Cam said, y'all, y'all in here sounding like the cheering cry.
Now, I know I don't say that right, but I love how Cam brings who he is to the classroom.
(42:38):
If I was a student, I'd be paying attention when my teachers brought who they were.
If he can become a teacher, so can I.
When Cam talked about black males in education and just that great conversation that he and
Dr. Ortiz had about it, yes, there's an important role of discipline, but also it's so much
(43:00):
more than that in how black male educators can be and are in the classroom.
Seeing yourself as a teacher can be liberatory.
That's huge.
Dr. Ortiz mentioned his research article and we have it posted below.
(43:20):
Please make sure you take a moment and read that.
It's powerful work.
And finally, you heard Cam talk about the Baker Hope Clark Institute with the Create
Project.
Did you wonder what that was?
Well, wonder no more because that's going to be the focus of the next episode.
We're going to dive in and talk more and explore the Baker Hope Clark Project and Institute.
(43:45):
And that's a wrap for this episode of Create Ed.
What did you think?
We hope our discussion has provided valuable insights into the power of research, education,
community partnerships, collaboration, just talking through all the different parts and
pieces of education.
(44:08):
If you enjoyed today's episode, please subscribe, rate, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts
and Spotify.
Your feedback helps us to continue to bring you meaningful content and to connect with
more listeners passionate about education, both here in Atlanta, in Georgia, in the South
region, the United States and around the world.
(44:31):
If you want to get connected and find out more about the Create Project, take a look
below and click on our website so you can find out about all the parts of this work.
Join us next time as we dig into the Baker Hope Clark Institute.
Cam brought it up a couple times, I believe, and we're going to dive into more about what
(44:52):
this institute is, what it does, and how you can be connected to the work as well.
Thank you for listening and until next time, let's continue to build strong partnerships
that foster thriving educational communities and transform teachers, teacher education,
this work into places of deep joy.
(45:15):
Does that sound like a good thing?
Come on with us.
See you next time.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
The Joe Rogan Experience
The official podcast of comedian Joe Rogan.