June 19, 2024 • 46 mins
In this inspiring episode, Jane Clauss sits down with the multi-talented Mary Jo Hoffman, an acclaimed author, artist, and photographer. Together, they explore the profound connection between nature and creativity. Discover how practicing creativity daily can enhance your life, why simplicity is crucial in the creative process, and how personal experiences can fuel your artistic journey. Jane and Mary Jo delve into the art of nature photography, sharing tips on lighting, composition, and capturing captivating subjects. They also discuss the transformative power of stillness and selective attention in nurturing creativity, mindfulness, and overall well-being. Tune in for a heartfelt conversation brimming with insights and practical advice to help you unlock your inner creativity.
Be sure to listen to the entire interview to full understand the placefulness you can find on your own creative journey. Easily check out the highligths with these quick reference points:
0:00-5:00
Mary Jo shares her love of nature from a young age and discusses creativity of capturing beauty from nothing using her imagination.
Mary Jo reflects on leaving her career in aerospace engineering allowing her to rediscover her creative side through photography. She explains how she was motivated to create her blog Stillblog.net and how she committed to photographing nature daily for 12 years.
Jane Clauss and Mary Jo discuss how being in nature calms the mind and body, highlighting nature's importance for creativity.
5:55-10:55
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
VO (00:00):
It's time to tantalize your earbuds with creative makers and
shakers. It's creative living,the podcast with Jane Clauss,
Jane Clauss (00:10):
this is creative living, where we help you live
your most creative life. I'mJane Clauss, now on the podcast
and pretty much in life, I loveto dive into the world of
creativity by exploring thestories and telling the stories
and the journeys of artists andmakers and really true
visionaries. And today, I havegot a very special guest. So
(00:34):
before we get started, I wantyou to imagine capturing the
beauty of nature every singleday for over a decade. That's a
lot of work, but that's exactlywhat our guest, Mary Jo Hoffman
has been doing for the last 12years. Mary Jo is a former
aeronautical engineer who'sturned artist, photographer and
(00:57):
is now an author. Her book,still the art of noticing is
packed full of 275 of her moststunning photos and essays to go
along with them that'll make yousee the world in a whole new
light, and maybe even inspireyou to live more creatively. I'm
(01:19):
so happy to welcome Mary JoHoffman to creative living. Hi,
Mary Jo,
Mary Jo (01:24):
Hi Jane. That was a fantastic intro. Thank you.
Well,
Jane Clauss (01:28):
all true. All true. I want people to imagine what
you did and see if we couldactually even do something every
single day for 12 years. But youhave a very signature style of
creativity. But I'm going to hityou with the hard question.
First, Mary, Jo, what doescreativity mean to you? Oh, oh,
that
Mary Jo (01:49):
is so hard, truly. Well, creating something from
nothing, using your imagination.I mean, even if you just sit and
daydream, you've createdsomething from nothing, you've
created something a story inyour imagination. That's
creativity. I think we're allcreative. We all do. We all and
for some of us, it gets shutdown early. I'm not sure why,
(02:11):
but we're all creative, and so,yeah, I just say creating
something from nothing throughyour imagination.
Jane Clauss (02:17):
I totally agree. I always tell everyone, even my
lawyer friends and doctorfriends who would never do
anything creative, or they saythey're not doing anything
creative. I'm like, Yeah, you'recreative. Everyone is creative.
Let's just sit down and dowhatever it is we're doing that
is creative. You make it up.That's what creativity is,
right? I
Mary Jo (02:35):
agree. I you know, creating a life is creative.
We're all creative. We are allcreative, yes.
Jane Clauss (02:41):
So why do you think nature is such a great place to
start when you're looking forcreativity? Because I think it's
the place to start. It is,
Mary Jo (02:50):
you know, if you read, I love, I love reading
biographies of artists. If youread any, if you read many, in
the end, they all come back andsay, nature is their
inspiration. Right? At somepoint, almost all will say,
fundamentally, nature's theirinspiration. It, you know it, it
is, it is the ultimateinspiration. It's infinite.
(03:11):
It's, you never tire, you neverget to the bottom of it. It's
there. It's around us, how weevolved. It's, it's the ultimate
creative source. I think I
Jane Clauss (03:22):
love that you said it's the ultimate creative
source, because it is thesource, and it is, I think,
really like they, you know, it'sthis nurture in nature, like you
go out there, they want you totake a Nature Bath so you can
get more creativity. They wantto put your feet and get
grounded and be in nature,because that's really what
connects you to everything. Now
Mary Jo (03:41):
that we can look at how the brain lights up for
anything. You know, you putpeople in a in nature, and all
sorts of good things starthappening in the brain, and our
sympathetic nervous system callscalms down. I mean, we evolved
to be in nature and besurrounded by nature. And when
you go out nature, where you'rezooming in, and, you know,
(04:01):
looking close and then zoomingout, telescoping in and out,
that's really good for thebrain. So, yeah, a little bit of
time in nature every day is goodfor the health. Have you always
been a nature lover, like yourwhole life? Yeah, I always want
to. I was the tomboy who grew upplaying outside all day long.
You know, the edge of suburbandevelopment in the 70s. I was
(04:22):
born in 64 you know, outsidefrom sunrise to sunset until you
got called home for dinner. Andyes, I loved nature from a very
young age.
Jane Clauss (04:32):
Yeah, playing with worms, picking up different
animals, and looking at all theflowers you probably know ever
well. By now, you know whatevery single flower and weed,
and the name of it and whereit's come from. But Did you
always know those things? No.
Mary Jo (04:45):
So I was at the edge of urban development. So I played
in the woods, mostly in thewoods build. I was a a master
fort builder. I think I shouldhave become an architect, quite
frankly. But anyway, um. Soflowers and gardening, no, but
in terms of learning the namesof things I have because I've
(05:07):
been doing this for 12 years andpaying such close attention, but
it's not my strong suit. I findsubjects that interest me
visually, and then I come home,and then I make my photo and I
post it to my blog still, andit's at that point where I
google and find the name, andbecause when in the post, I
always the name of the subjectand the Latin name, in case
(05:31):
anyone's interested. And sothat's how I've that's my
education is 12 years of onesubject a day, learning the
name, learning whether it'snative, learning whether it's
invasive, learning whether it's,you know, a transplant from
somewhere else, and then. Soyes, I would consider myself a
naturalist today, but memorizingLatin names is not, is not one
(05:55):
of my strongest at all.
Not at all well.
Jane Clauss (05:58):
I mean, I think that's great because your
project was also a bit ofeducation for you and for
everybody that was following youon your blog. So let's talk
about your project.Stillblog.net, that's where your
blog lives. Your first image wassent out into the universe on
January 1, 2012 what was theoriginal vision you had for the
(06:20):
blog? Or was it just like, I'mgoing to put this one picture up
and see what happens?
Mary Jo (06:24):
Yeah, it's, it's an interesting story. So I was in
my 40s. Had been workingcorporate aerospace re I was an
aerospace research scientist,which is a rocket scientist, and
I so I worked in the aerospaceindustry, in research, I was an
aeronautical and astronauticalengineer. Those are all lots of
(06:45):
big words. Yeah, so, but I hadleft that job after 17 years
because of corporate takeoversand family planning. And my
husband and I had taken ouryoung kids to live in Southern
France for six months. We hadtaken a sabbatical, and it was
the first time in my adult lifeI hadn't been working. I worked
(07:09):
all through college, and thenwent straight into corporate
research, and suddenly I hadfree time. I had I was also a
creative kid, a kind of a maker,not, you know, my friends that
knew me then wouldn't have saidthat, but I sewed, I baked, I
did crafts. I just I wasn't Iwas a maker by inclination. And
(07:31):
so when I finally had some freetime in my mid 40s, in as on a
sabbatical in a rented house insouthern France, my husband had
similar ambitions. Wanted,always had wanted to write, and
so we said, let's practice forretirement. And you know,
because we're going to go backto our busy lives in six months,
right? But we're going topractice for retirement when we
(07:51):
would someday get to do right,creative work, right? And what
happened is, I, I had been anamateur photographer, so I
crafted one of these one a dayprojects that that were popular
then still popular, becausethey're extremely powerful. And
I chose one year I was for oneyear I was going to photograph
(08:12):
found nature, and in a it turnsout, this very stylized way, and
post it to a blog. And I decidedto name the blog still, as in,
like still life photography. WeI started that on January 1. In
my mind, it was a calendar year,one year commitment, one year
project. And by six months in,the project had gotten a lot of
attention, media attention, andI kept going. So here I am, 12
(08:36):
and a half years later, andfourth, over 4000 images later,
yeah, and I haven't missed aday, that's
Jane Clauss (08:42):
a lot, and we're gonna get into that. But I mean,
over the last 12 years, spendingso much time discovering nature
and taking photos for yourproject, for your blog. I mean,
I just have to, did you alsocreate a clone of yourself to
get everything else done? Imean, you have to live life like
every single day.
Mary Jo (09:03):
Life happens, that life happens. It does happen, you
know. And you know, in those 12and half years, they've been
fairly calm years for me.However, my dad did pass away,
and I'm and my mom's 88 now, andI'm the primary for her, and
which has meant a lot ofunexpected emergency room visits
in the last three years. And solife happens. And what happened
(09:27):
is I devised the project so thatthe minimum required to not
break the chain was simple. Soit's found nature on a white
background, and I can literallybe in a hospital and pick a leaf
off of a potted plant, hold itagainst a white wall, and take a
photo, and I haven't broken thechain, and you're good to go,
(09:49):
and I'm good to go. So I do thata lot sometimes. I mean, life
happens ironically. Some of thebusiest I've ever been is since
I launched this book in May, inthe last 12 years. I mean, I've.
Been crazy busy with speakingengagements and and various
things. And so the last, thelast four weeks since I launched
(10:09):
my book, I've been doing a lotof holding a potted plant leaf
in front of a white wall andcalling it good.
Jane Clauss (10:17):
And that's okay. I love that you did that the using
the white background. I mean, itreally does just single out this
one item, this one piece ofnature that you found for the
day, but in the long run, 12years later, here we are today.
You're super busy on this booktour and doing speaking events
take care, Mom, it's reallyhelped you out. Did you kind of
(10:38):
foresee that the White wasbecause I can then do this
anywhere, or was it because of astylistic photography thing that
you wanted to do? Oh,
Mary Jo (10:45):
good question, because it did. It does make the project
easier. And yeah, one of thereasons I haven't broken the
chain in 12 and a half years.But I picked a set for esthetic
reasons. So I'm I'm aminimalist. I like Scandinavian
esthetic, and I likeScandinavian design. And so my,
if you look at my images,they're very graphic on bright
(11:07):
white background. It's very it'ssort of like a modern botanical
print, if you will. You know amodern take on a botanical
print. So it, I chose it as anesthetic for esthetic reasons.
It's interesting, I learned Iwas an amateur photographer and
not professional. And I thinkthat, honestly, was to my
advantage, because after I hadstarted the project, I had more
(11:30):
than one professionalphotographer Tell me, oh, you
can't photograph on a whitebackground. That's commercial
photography. That's consideredcommercial photography. And I'm
like, Okay, I didn't know. And Ido it because I like it. I also
wanted, for me, the blog, theexperience of the blog was very
important. So when you arrivedat the blog, I wanted a seamless
(11:52):
scroll through the unfoldingseasons. So I'm taking an image
a day. So if you go, there yougo. And I'm trying to be as
seasonal as I can. February inMinnesota gets a little tricky.
I
Jane Clauss (12:04):
was going to ask about the winter months. I
Mary Jo (12:07):
do it. But even by by February, even on board with
winter stems poking out of snow.But anyway, I try to be
seasonal. So you is you scrollthrough the blog, you should get
a seasonal unfolding. And Iwanted the scroll to be
seamless. And if I had like agray background, it's very hard
(12:27):
to match grays. So the onlything that would allow me to be
seamless is true, right? Or trueblack, right? And so I wanted
this. This still blogs a veryquiet corner of the internet.
It's very calm, very quiet, lookat one thing at a time and with
this seamless scroll. And so itstill is to that day, the blog
hasn't changed at all since itwas built. A matter of fact, I
(12:51):
don't keep waiting for it tocrash, because I don't. It's in
WordPress, and I don't know howto fix it. If it crashes,
Unknown (12:59):
everyone's going there, because you're all over and
everyone wants to know aboutMary. Jo, so, yeah, you
Jane Clauss (13:04):
better watch out for that. No, the the scroll is
cool, because you do see theseasons and the amount of time
that you put into, you know,really this passion. And you did
this every single day for 12years. You made it easy. You did
it everywhere you had to do it.Was there ever a moment when
you're like, I just don't havetime today, or I can't find the
(13:25):
right subject for that, for mypicture today? Or can you do a
couple days in advance?
Mary Jo (13:32):
Yeah, you know, it's almost every week where I think
I don't know what to photograph.I mean, even like, this week,
I'm having that experience. Iit's high summer, it's June.
It's so lush. We've had so muchrain. It's just like a wall of
green out there right now. And Ikeep looking out the at the wall
(13:52):
of green, thinking, what, whatam I going to pick today? So so
even even in high summer, I havethose moments. A lot of days,
the day gets away from me. It'sthe sun. I shoot with natural
light. So the sun is setting,and I say, oh my goodness, I
haven't taken a still blogphoto. And my husband laughs,
and he says, every day, honey,and he turns around and walks
(14:13):
away. So I on those days, I, youknow, I dash out. I happen to
live on three wooded acres. Idon't think you would need to to
do this kind of project, but Ido. So I dash out into the yard,
look around, and I grabsomething to photograph. And the
the interesting thing I'velearned over the years is
(14:35):
sometimes those dashed off lastminute photos end up being some
of the best. Yeah, right, yeah,of course, crazy. All I'm doing
is not breaking the chain. Idon't care about the quality of
the photo so much or thesubject. I'm just, I just want
to make sure I don't break thechain. It's been too long now.
I'm not. I'm not. Jane, no, Ican't. No, you can't. No. So I
(14:56):
dash out, I grab something, Iphotograph it, and sure enough,
it's it's. Ends up being, it canend up being one of my better
photos. And I think there'ssomething about, you know, that
deadline that shuts off theinner critic. And, you know, so
I'm a big believer in theeveryday because, because I've
seen it happen, right? I've seenthat even when you don't want
(15:16):
to, even when the day got awayfrom you, even when the sun's
about to set. If you make thatif you make that creative
effort, you could be surprised.So
Jane Clauss (15:26):
I love it. I always tell people, just spend one hour
being creative, and then I don'tcare what you do the rest of the
day, spend 30 minutes, becauseyou have that sense of
satisfaction that you get whenyou are creative. When I would
say, when you make it yourself,when you just let your body and
your brain just be in flow withwherever it goes. And I love the
idea because you had a goal, youhad a mission, you had I'm doing
(15:49):
this. I'm not breaking thechain. A lot of people like I'll
do it today, but I don't have topick it up. So maybe this is a
great way for people to startbeing creative. By saying I'm
going to do this every day for aweek, for a week, give yourself.
Mary Jo (16:00):
I, you know, those 30 day and 100 day challenges are
still really popular, andthey're really popular because
they work, and they work for awhole bunch of reasons, but they
really do work. And you hadasked earlier about and whether
I work ahead, and I used to.And, you know, the first few
years of the of the of theproject, I had a little, a
(16:23):
little folder on the corner ofmy iMac that said, just in case,
right? And it had a coupleimages in it that, in case the
day got away from me, I couldpost those. What I found in, I
think this is key too, is thatthat was more disruptive than
helpful, because it was harderto stop and start than to just
(16:44):
commit to doing every day. Ihaven't had a just in case
folder on my desktop forprobably eight years. Wow. Yeah,
I work. I was right before I goton the podcast with you, I made
today's photo. So I find fiveminutes of every day to make a
photo,
Jane Clauss (17:00):
and that's and you just take the photo and you post
it and you move on,
Mary Jo (17:03):
yeah, I mean, I edit it to bring the background to
bright white, and then at somepoint before bed, I post and I
post it and I set the timer soit updates overnight. So yeah, I
mean, and that's the other keyfor my specific project. I could
break each of those littlesteps, find your subject, make
(17:23):
your photo, edit the photo, andpost the photo into tiny little
increments sprinkled throughoutthe day. And we all have five
minutes here, five minutesthere. We all do. And so i i
instead of scrolling or whateveryou do when you have a five
minute wait or downtime. I youknow, I do one of those little
(17:46):
steps, and
Jane Clauss (17:47):
you make it easy on yourself too. I love that. So
let's give our friends an ideaof some of the photos and some
of the images and some of theobjects that you have captured
over the years. I'm going totell you what I saw in my
research, okay, and then you canadd some that I missed, and
let's see a pile of rocks,mountains of leaves lined up,
shells, acorns, pine cones,bird's nests, vegetables,
(18:13):
flowers, animal claws, I think,Yes, yeah, insect wings, grass,
ducklings, weeds. Is thereanything that you think is not
beautiful enough to be on theblog? Or, how do you make all of
those things beautiful? What amI missing?
Mary Jo (18:32):
That's a good question. So I will any found nature. So
nothing's off limits. I do do,not a lot, but a fair I do do
roadkill. So some of my mostpopular images are from
roadkill, a coyote and a bluejay wing.
Jane Clauss (18:50):
You put it on a white background, then you pick
up.
Mary Jo (18:53):
I slid my white background underneath, yeah, and
it's, it's, it's one of my morepopular images. Anyway, I do do
real kill everything iseverything is a candidate. Every
subject's a candidate. And mycriteria are It either has to be
beautiful or it has to beinteresting. So there are some
images I just post becausethey're so interesting, they're
(19:16):
not particularly beautiful. Butwhen I can get an image that is
both interesting and beautiful,then I gotta then I got a
keeper, then I got a winner.
Jane Clauss (19:25):
Have you ever had doubles? I mean, if you get a
weed and you're like, Well, thisis interesting, and it's
beautiful, and then, oh, I don'tknow, 10 years down the road,
you're like, I'm gonna use thisweek because it's interesting.
If I don't remember what I didlast week, and even if I posted
something on my website or anysocial media I still don't
remember. Yeah,
Mary Jo (19:42):
I repeat subjects, and after 12 years, yeah, so I do
like every there's certainsubjects because of where I am
in Minneapolis in the UpperMidwest, that are some of my
favorites. You know, milkweed,milkweed pods, cattails, because
I happen to have. Have a bigcattail bed outside my house,
(20:03):
but fiddlehead ferns, forexample, I do those every
spring. I will never tirephotographing fiddlehead ferns,
and every two year, every yearis different. So usually if I
revisit a subject, I'll try torevisit it in a different
season. So if I did it inspring, I'll do it in summer or
fall, but I will revisitsubjects, especially if they're
perennial favorites. Yeah, as
Jane Clauss (20:25):
I that's totally permissible, because you're
never going to film orphotograph them in the same way.
They're always going to lookdifferent. Every day
Mary Jo (20:33):
is different. I could, I literally, I could photograph
a matter of fact, I have, I havetried to do this. I had a
collaboration with TargetCorporation, and we're putting
this lineup of beach rocks withstripes, you know, on a shower
curtain. And it the image I haddone early in the project with a
(20:53):
lesser quality camera. Andbecause we're going to make a
shower curtain which is 100inches wide, I wanted a higher
resolution image. So I still hadthose beach racks, that pile of
beach rocks, so I recreated theimage, re photograph it with a
better camera, and it never,never, ever. I did it 50 times,
different windows, differentlighting, different times a day,
(21:16):
and it was never as good as thatfirst photo. And I can't tell
you why. There was somethingabout the softness, the softness
of the light at the angle. Idon't know all of it, it, they
were very close, but not asinviting as that first image.
Oh,
Jane Clauss (21:32):
fascinating. You said you still have those beach
rocks. So do you keep a lot ofthese different objects that you
find in nature? And does thatconsider you, or does that make
you a nature hoarder?
Mary Jo (21:42):
That's a good question. I am not a nature hoarder. I'm
not a hoarder. I'm a tosser bydisposition. So 99% of the
subjects I photograph, and theygo right back outside.
Otherwise, I mean, it's everyday, so otherwise I would I
would be drowning, and I havethis three acres of wooded land,
so they just go right backoutside, turn into compost.
(22:04):
There is a few things I collect,beach rocks, well, Stripe only,
striped beach rocks, sea glass.I do have a box of bird nests. I
do have a box of pine cones. Butthat's only because I just had a
commission for a restaurant todo a big pine cone. Sure,
(22:27):
photos, and I don't think thatwill be able to stay. It's too
big a box, and I don't want tostore it so, but I do keep
certain collections. Yes,
Jane Clauss (22:34):
I have about a trillion cicadas. If you'd like
me to send you them. I actually
Mary Jo (22:39):
would. We don't have them here in Minnesota. I mean,
we get a few in the summer, butnot a lot. I know you guys can,
like, sweep them off your carlike snow, right? Sweep
Jane Clauss (22:49):
them off the car like snow. So I'm in Chicago. It
is summertime. We have cicadas.They're dive bombing me. They're
all over the trees. They're allover every single thing in my
backyard, even going on a walk,I have to, like, go around. So
if you would like some cicadas,
Mary Jo (23:03):
send me a cigar box full of cicadas.
Jane Clauss (23:08):
Yeah, I'll do it.
Mary Jo (23:09):
I love it. I just not a subject.
Jane Clauss (23:11):
I don't think I've I you'd like their wings?
Mary Jo (23:14):
I know, I think I have photographed them because they
have them in southern France,not Minnesota. I mean, we do,
but you don't find them. It'sthey're very few mall
Jane Clauss (23:22):
They're driving me crazy. So let me ask you this,
because I want to talk about thebook. Still the art of noticing
every single day that's over4000 photos. You put 275 in the
book. How did you How could youpick your favorites?
Mary Jo (23:39):
Yeah, that was the hardest part. I did it two ways,
right? I have this out ofcontrol portfolio with 4000
images, like, I can't even findstuff in it, okay? It's in it's,
of course, I didn't know thisproject. Who was gonna go on
this. I didn't tag it. I didn'tstructure it, right? It's just
this folder full stuff. Andthen, so what I did, I did, I
(24:02):
did a pass through the portfolioand said, and I had a folder
called still book worthy, right?I was throwing images in there
that I thought were worthy ofbeing published in a book. And
then I looked at that folder andI saw, I thought, I don't see
like a rhyme or reason to thiscollection. They're my best
photos, but I don't see a rhymeor reason to them, so I
(24:24):
abandoned that approach of justtaking the best photos, and then
I went with writing my essaysfirst, and then picking the
images that illustrate theessays, and that's what ended up
working for me. So a dozen of mybest photos didn't make it in
the book. Because, yeah, it'sinteresting. It's interesting.
(24:45):
But I'm super pleased with howthe book
Jane Clauss (24:47):
came out. Maybe, maybe there's another book in
the works. There has to be, or ashorter book, like the 12 that
didn't make it. And you canwrite bigger essays. There
Unknown (24:56):
you go. There.
Jane Clauss (24:56):
I mean, this. Yeah, again, you already talked about
working with the target.Corporation, I saw some of your
lettering. You would write wordswith the different found
objects. I'm obsessed with theone that says creativity
because, because it'screativity, yeah, can people
license them from you? Canpeople buy them from you?
Mary Jo (25:17):
I so I sell a lot of my images, and I have about 100
designers, professionaldesigners, or what are called
Art consultancies, that use myimages in their projects. And so
I get a couple requests a weekfrom them for three or four
images that they're going to putin some clubhouse in North
(25:40):
Carolina or something. So I dosell to professionals. I don't
regularly sell to individuals. Iwill if somebody really has a
special request, like it's for awedding invitation or something
like that, if someone reallywants it. And the only reason I
don't is the portfolio isunwieldy, and it's, it takes a
(26:03):
lot of my time to do the emailback and forth. This, is this
the image you want? What size doyou want that? Sure, yeah. And
so that individual sales I do. Ido rarely, but I do do if
somebody really wants one, but Ido sell to professionals every
week, yeah.
Jane Clauss (26:19):
So your hobby kind of turned into a business. But
when I ask back to the book,because I'm getting off on a
whole business track, and Ireally want to know about your
creativity, because I want tohelp everybody, because
everyone's thinking, Well, Idon't understand, like, what
does that mean? And you know,you have this daily practice for
12 years, and you put thesebeautiful images in a book of
what you discovered and what yousaw, and you talk a lot about
(26:41):
the art of noticing. What doesthat mean?
Mary Jo (26:45):
Yeah, I think you know, at some point, anyone who does
visual arts, any artist, whetherit's painting, graphic design,
photography, sketching, at somepoint you realize that there's a
famous book on on learning todraw, called drawing on the
(27:06):
right side of the brain, and theit's a classic and Betty
Edwards, the author, has said,if you can sign your name, you
can draw, you have the technicalskill to draw, but what you have
to do is learn to see. And it'sthe same with any of the visual
arts, whether it's photographyor what the visual arts
(27:26):
eventually all come to the sameconclusion is learning to see,
learning to notice, is the thehardest part of the creative
process. So it's training theeye to see. Sure, yeah,
Jane Clauss (27:39):
it's like fashion designers, they're putting
together outfits, and you haveto see how that's hitting a body
form, right? So, and some peoplecan see it, and some people
can't, or, like an interiordesigner, anything that you're
you're visually puttingtogether,
Mary Jo (27:53):
right? It's media Exactly, right. So people can
walk into a room an empty house,and see, see it all. Other
people can't. Most people can'tdo that. And so, yeah, it's
learning to see. And you know,I'm looking at a wall of green
right now, and every day I haveto find something to photograph.
And so learning to train the eyeto see, you know, look at that
(28:15):
visual overwhelm of, you know,this wall of green, and then
training the eye to pick out oneor two subjects or a dozen
subjects to make a compositionthat's takes more concentration
and well, in this my case,presentness, right? Mindfulness?
Sure, then, you know, pullingthe shutter on the camera, the
(28:39):
mindfulness
Jane Clauss (28:40):
and presentation, and still is the blog, and still
is the title of the book. Andyou talked about still art or
still images, and that's whatthese are. But it's also a play
on words to being still. Mindedstill in your day, still just
being still. We're never still.Our minds never stop. So has
your daily practice of beingstill, in discovering still? Has
(29:05):
that improved your creativity?Has that lowered your stress
level? What do you think aboutbeing still? Why is it important
for all of us to learn fromthat? Yeah,
Mary Jo (29:15):
I think I truly believe that I stumbled into a practice,
a simple practice that is turnedout to be really profound. And
the requirement attention,attentiveness, to find a new
subject every day, required meto be so present at least for
(29:36):
five minutes of every day. Andthat became essentially a
mindfulness practice. And so theone of the first benefits I got
from the project, and thereason, quite frankly, I never
stopped, is it turned into amindfulness practice that I
didn't want to stop. But then,even then, it kept unfolding.
This project kept unfolding indepths and depths and depths,
(29:57):
because after I, you know, Ireally. Had turned into this
mindfulness practice where I hadto be present for at least part
of every day to find a subject.Then, then suddenly I started to
have this entirely newrelationship with my place, the
place I live, where I grew up.Yeah, so in the good Midwestern
(30:18):
fashion, moved back to the placeI grew up, and so I here I am,
in this environment I've knownfor for 50 years, and yet I was
discovering it anew with thisnew level of height and
detention, right? So suddenly Icall it placefulness. I have
this nuanced now relationshipwith my plates, I'm not I
(30:42):
actually borrowed the term fromJenny Odell in her best selling
book how to do nothing. Do youremember that during
Jane Clauss (30:48):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. She
Mary Jo (30:50):
coined the term placefulness, and I have run
with it because it spoke to meso deeply, because she was
saying for her the Rose Gardenin Berkeley, California was her
place, and that that was her. Itbecame an antidote to this
anxiety and kind of itchyfeeling we all get when we spend
(31:11):
too much time online. And so tospend time in this rose garden
became her, her antidote to thatand and she called it
playfulness. And the same thinghappened to me with this
project, which is just a littlebit of time in nature, being
present, being really present,not just relaxing in nature, but
being present with nature. Andthen getting this nuanced
(31:33):
relationship with it led to thiskind of playfulness that I, you
know, I don't want to, I don'twant to go all woowoo on you
here.
Jane Clauss (31:42):
Let's go. I'm all about the Woo. I love it. I
spent a week in the junglegetting woo, woo. Let's go. So
Mary Jo (31:49):
anyway, I felt it was like, sort of like my expression
is sort of an on ramp to thesacred, I think. Yeah. So I feel
like this project unleashed awhole, a profound series, sure
of insights. Yeah,
Jane Clauss (32:04):
it's like the transformation from when you
started to this point and thislike practice that you did every
day. And again, you could sayit's like meditation people do
their daily practice of yoga.You just happen to be in, you
know, your place fullness. Justhappen to be in nature. And then
you're sharing that with if youdidn't share with everybody, you
would still probably have thatsame transformation, mentally,
(32:27):
physically, for sure. Yeah, Ithink that it's really, really
important to think about that,you know, for all of us, because
we're so busy and we get ouritchy heads when we're online,
all too much, and we getanxious, so just putting your
feet in the ground and orfinding out what you do every
day to make you transform to thereal you, because we don't, we
(32:50):
don't like to go there.Sometimes it's uncomfortable.
Mary Jo (32:52):
Yeah, before we got on, Jane and I were talking about
the Mayo Clinic, because it'snear where I live, and my
husband just did one of thesewellness checkups there, and the
doctor there was saying that theresearch on mindfulness
meditation is now saying that,so when you meditate, most
people, it's on your breath andor you're you're calming your
(33:15):
thoughts, or you're doing amantra to quiet the thoughts.
It's all inward, focused. Andthey were saying that the news
research is an outwardly focusedmeditation might even transcend,
like the the inward focus mightbe like a sub state of then the
outward focus, which is totranscend yourself, to transcend
(33:37):
the ego. And so it'sinteresting, because I feel like
my being present with nature,what again, dumb luck or
intuitive wisdom. Call it whatyou will, but that it was an
outwardly focused form ofmeditation. So yeah, I think I
stumbled into something reallypowerful.
Jane Clauss (33:57):
I think you did too, and I love that you're
sharing it with all of us. Youtalk about the term infra
ordinary. Yeah. Is that aboutnoticing
Mary Jo (34:06):
that is coined by a French philosopher in the 1970s
and it's about seeing below. Soinfra means below infra
ordinary, below the ordinary. Soit's the idea is, you know, we
become so habituated to ourenvironment that we don't, we
stop seeing the things that areright in front of us. So it's,
(34:31):
it's really funny, because theCanadian Medical Association
actually has a medical term forthis, and they call it
refrigerator blindness. Andliterally, and it's like, the
fridge, we have nothing to eat,yeah? We don't have any mayo in
the mail, like, right there infront of your face, yeah? So
they call it, they actually,literally call it refrigerator
blindness. So this is when youdon't see something and you
(34:55):
really don't see it. Your yourbrain is wired to notice the
differences in your.Environment. So when things
become so habituated, so common,sure that you stop registering
their existence at all. So whenI teach courses, I'm giving
people tips and tricks to seebelow the ordinary, to re see
(35:18):
what's always been right infront of them. And so, because
12 years of doing this for menow at this point, the most
exciting for me is to take themost ordinary subject, the most
ordinary subject, and photographit in a striking way, elevate
it, and then show it to peopleyou know, in this elevated way,
(35:42):
so that they have them see it ina different way. Make them see
it anew. Make them see it atall, right? It's the thing that
they've been walking over on thesidewalk or the parking lot for,
for, you know, that they don'teven see it ever, yeah,
Jane Clauss (35:55):
because you're just, you're just busy doing
other things. You're notnoticing anything. This is a big
thing. I lived in Arizona forseveral years, and in the
beginning I'm like, wow, look atthe mountains. I mean, they're
mountains. And then after fiveyears, I didn't even see the
mountains anymore. Yeah, yep,that's so Right, yeah. I mean,
and you're talking about the thelittle things that we would
(36:16):
maybe not see in the firstplace, but it is a thing. What
is can you give us one tip onhow to see these things?
Mary Jo (36:23):
Yeah, it is. It's the trick is very simple, but it
works very profound. It's calledjust, it's a it's I can use. I
call it spotlighting. So it'sjust giving yourself a filter.
It's your fill. You're usingselective attention to spotlight
a certain thing. So next timeyou go on a walk, for example,
just notice the color blue. Justif you're if you go on a walk
(36:47):
around your block every evening,say, I'm going to tell you, pick
a color, pick any color, exceptright now, don't pick green,
orange or blue, yeah, and justsay, Okay, I'm gonna go for a
walk, and I'm just gonna noticeblue, and you will see, I
guarantee you, you will see yourneighborhood with completely new
(37:07):
eyes. And you can do it. Youdon't have to do it with sight.
You can do it with sound, youknow, I'm only gonna listen for
birds. Yeah, yeah. And, youknow, and so that means you're
gonna drown out all of thetraffic noise, all everything.
I'm just gonna listen to birds,so just give yourself a
spotlight filter, and then focusyour selective attention, and it
will open up to you yourordinary environment. And it was
(37:32):
going to try it, yeah, yeah,you'll be surprised. It's very
it's really, it really works.
Jane Clauss (37:36):
That's our homework, friends. We all have
to, we have to do that when wego on our walks. You talk about
being a former aeronauticalengineer, I worked in radio
forever and ever and ever. Andwhen I would be stuck in radio,
and everyone was going out forhappy hour, going to see the
rock show, I was like, I gottaget blah, blah, blah. I have to
still be on the air. And I'll belike, I don't want to do it. And
like, well, it's not rocketscience. But wait the person who
(38:01):
can say, oh, but it is rocketscience. I can't leave so as an
aeronautical engineer, a rocketscientist, because that career
is about design and innovationand and learning, you know, and
figuring things out. Do youthink that background influenced
your approach to photography andart, because there's room for
(38:25):
innovation.
Mary Jo (38:26):
Yeah, first of all, most mathematicians, it's well
known that they're also verylike very good musicians. They
go hand in hand. I think it'sbecause they're both just
abstract languages, music, math,are both abstractions. And so my
engineering colleagues and Iworked in research was mostly
PhDs. Were some of the mostcreative people. I knew for
(38:50):
sure. You know, it's aninteresting thing. People are
saying to me quite often whenthey see that aerospace
engineering published artist,oh, left brain, right brain. And
I do, I do think I have that.Here's the thing, it's sort of
like creativity. I think we allhave it. We all have it, I
should say. But at some pointearly on, whether it was in
(39:11):
childhood or in college, we shutdown part of it. Sure we had to
choose, right? I'm going to be acreative or I'm going to be a
engineer, or I'm and so we, Ithink we all naturally have
those right brain, left brainconnections, but they do
atrophy. And I do think they doatrophy. There's
Jane Clauss (39:29):
a there's an experiment you can do, or a
practice, or whatever, a projectthat you can do with a group,
and you can say or with aperson. You give one group, they
an art project or an idea or asentence, come up with blank let
your seven year old self drawthis, or let your seven year old
self create this. What would itlook like? What would it be? And
then you give the same projectto a group of people, just, you
(39:52):
know, take them out of their jobfor a minute and ask them to do
this. And the seven year oldsare that mindset, and you ask
them to be that way. They'reThey're typically. Way more.
Their answers are more creative.Their ideas are more out there.
So you're right. I do think ifyou're not practicing it, it
does atrophy, or we put itaside, we put it on the shelf,
and maybe we close the door, andthat's what we don't need to.
Mary Jo (40:13):
We do when we don't need to, and we're all capable
of it. So, but yes, if you lookat my images, you, you, you will
see it's very they're verygridded, very linear. You the
aerospace engineer comes throughin my esthetic. I I say that my
subjects have to be interesting.For me. They're interesting when
they're when I'm blown away by,like, engineering precision of
(40:38):
them, you know they mean, or theor the mathematical pattern,
yeah,
Jane Clauss (40:43):
you're like, Oh, look at that. Yeah, aspect of it
because it's engineering, orit's math, or it's linear, and
that's how you see also, becauseyou are a minimalist, you like
things that are very, you know,in line with perf, yeah, that's
and it all makes sense,
Mary Jo (40:56):
and you can look at that. It's a very specific
esthetic, and
Jane Clauss (40:59):
the white background is all part, yeah,
yeah. What do you hope that thisproject has and will do to
inspire the people who see it?How will you help people?
Mary Jo (41:11):
Great question, and I have to say, the book is doing
incredibly well. It went intosecond printing within a week or
two of pub day. I mean, the bookis doing beyond my expectations
by a ton, beyond my publishersexpectations. And I this is, I'm
not saying this to brag rightnow, but I'm what I think might
(41:31):
be happening. Is it like it's Ididn't write the book this way,
but I think it is becoming abook about the creative process
that people are finding reallyinspirational, and because my
process is so simple, because Ido it every day, and I, you
(41:52):
know, like I said, I I can holdup a potted plant leaf in front
of a white t shirt or a whitewall, and I'm, I haven't broken
the chain. And it's thesimplicity of that that is
people are finding really,really, really inspirational and
within reach for them, you know.So I get the sense that the book
(42:14):
might be turning into sort oflike one of those classic books
on the creative process, becauseit's, it's just taking on it's
the book is taking on a life ofits own that nobody, including
myself, expected. Again, I thinkI stumbled into a super simple
process that this dailiness thathas really profound. It's very
(42:34):
simple, and in order to make itwork, you have to keep it
simple. Like, Don't overcomplicate your what you're
going to try and do every day.Yeah, keep it very simple.
Commit to not breaking thechain. Forget about the results,
forget about the art, forgetabout the quality of the drawing
or the painting or the photo.Just commit to not breaking the
(42:54):
chain. And I guarantee youprofound things will happen. You
know, the art will get better,and your insights about you and
your eye and what you like, allof that just comes out of the
process when all you have to dois not break the chain, right?
Just commit to not breaking justcommittable. Just commit to not
(43:17):
breaking the chain, but makesure that the minimum to not
break the chain is reallysimple, because life does
happen, and days do get awayfrom you, but you're still gonna
not break the chain on thosedays you're still like, if you
commit to making a watercolor aday, if all you do is wet the
brush, dip it in a in thepigment, and put a splotch on a
piece of paper, you haven'tbroken the chain, and you can do
(43:39):
that. And if you can be okaywith every day. Be okay with
Jane Clauss (43:43):
if it's just a splotch on the paper or if it's
a full masterpiece, like, beokay that you did not break the
change the chain. It's justprofound in all aspects of life,
really and truly, like, you canlive better creatively in so
many ways. Which brings us fullcircle. Right back to the very
first question, and what doescreativity mean to you? And you
(44:04):
said, it's everything, it'severywhere, it's
Mary Jo (44:07):
everywhere. We're all creative. Yeah, we all have an
imagination. If, I mean, ifyou're alive and living, you're
creative, right? You're you'vecreated your life, you're we're
all creative. Everything
Jane Clauss (44:16):
about it, I mean, I am so inspired right now. One
last thing, what makes you smilethe most when you wake up in the
morning?
Mary Jo (44:25):
Ah, good question. Um, a clear calendar. I'll tell you.
I still, I still, I when I wakeup in the morning, I don't know
what I'm going to photograph,but if I find a subject, so
every day is kind of like atreasure hunt for me. If I find
a subject that I just know isgonna be like, really a great
(44:48):
photo, and then I bring it home,I do my little simple setup
under the skylights in thekitchen, and I look at that
thing through the viewfinderthat puts a smile on my face.
Still to this day, every day,
Jane Clauss (45:02):
I love that. I love it. I'm going to be thinking of
you now when I take my walk outin nature, and there you go.
Tried to find things that Ithink that Mary Jo would like.
Okay, the book is still the artof noticing everybody needs to
buy a copy. Order your copy now,get two, because you'll lose one
or you're going to want to givegift one. That's
Mary Jo (45:21):
what that's what a lot of people are doing. Of course,
it's
Jane Clauss (45:23):
a beautiful book. Tell everybody where we can get
it. Everywhere books are sold by
Mary Jo (45:27):
publishers. Biden, you can buy from the publisher. It's
on Amazon, literally worldwide.Everywhere books are sold, it's
in a lot of museum shops and alot of gift in Home Stores.
Jane Clauss (45:36):
Beautiful. I'm so happy and proud of you, and we
just met. So that's a lot.Thanks, Jane. If people want to
find you, follow you on socialmedia, go to your website. What
are all those places? Okay,
Mary Jo (45:48):
the blog is called still. Stillblog.net. And
because I've been doing thisevery day for 12 and a half
years, if you just type in Mary,Jo, and still it will be all me,
me and my images. And the onlyplace I'm active on social is
Instagram, and there I'm underMary Jo Hoffman,
Jane Clauss (46:04):
still the art of noticing artist, photographer,
author, Mary Jo Hoffman, thankyou so much for joining us on
creative living. Thanks,
Mary Jo (46:15):
Jane. This was really fun. I've really, really enjoyed
this.
VO (46:18):
Live better creatively for more inspiration, visit Jane
clauss.com thank you forlistening. You.
It's time to tantalize your earbuds with creative makers and
shakers. It's creative living,the podcast with Jane Clauss,
Jane Clauss (00:10):
this is creative living, where we help you live
your most creative life. I'mJane Clauss, now on the podcast
and pretty much in life, I loveto dive into the world of
creativity by exploring thestories and telling the stories
and the journeys of artists andmakers and really true
visionaries. And today, I havegot a very special guest. So
(00:34):
before we get started, I wantyou to imagine capturing the
beauty of nature every singleday for over a decade. That's a
lot of work, but that's exactlywhat our guest, Mary Jo Hoffman
has been doing for the last 12years. Mary Jo is a former
aeronautical engineer who'sturned artist, photographer and
(00:57):
is now an author. Her book,still the art of noticing is
packed full of 275 of her moststunning photos and essays to go
along with them that'll make yousee the world in a whole new
light, and maybe even inspireyou to live more creatively. I'm
(01:19):
so happy to welcome Mary JoHoffman to creative living. Hi,
Mary Jo,
Mary Jo (01:24):
Hi Jane. That was a fantastic intro. Thank you.
Well,
Jane Clauss (01:28):
all true. All true. I want people to imagine what
you did and see if we couldactually even do something every
single day for 12 years. But youhave a very signature style of
creativity. But I'm going to hityou with the hard question.
First, Mary, Jo, what doescreativity mean to you? Oh, oh,
that
Mary Jo (01:49):
is so hard, truly. Well, creating something from
nothing, using your imagination.I mean, even if you just sit and
daydream, you've createdsomething from nothing, you've
created something a story inyour imagination. That's
creativity. I think we're allcreative. We all do. We all and
for some of us, it gets shutdown early. I'm not sure why,
(02:11):
but we're all creative, and so,yeah, I just say creating
something from nothing throughyour imagination.
Jane Clauss (02:17):
I totally agree. I always tell everyone, even my
lawyer friends and doctorfriends who would never do
anything creative, or they saythey're not doing anything
creative. I'm like, Yeah, you'recreative. Everyone is creative.
Let's just sit down and dowhatever it is we're doing that
is creative. You make it up.That's what creativity is,
right? I
Mary Jo (02:35):
agree. I you know, creating a life is creative.
We're all creative. We are allcreative, yes.
Jane Clauss (02:41):
So why do you think nature is such a great place to
start when you're looking forcreativity? Because I think it's
the place to start. It is,
Mary Jo (02:50):
you know, if you read, I love, I love reading
biographies of artists. If youread any, if you read many, in
the end, they all come back andsay, nature is their
inspiration. Right? At somepoint, almost all will say,
fundamentally, nature's theirinspiration. It, you know it, it
is, it is the ultimateinspiration. It's infinite.
(03:11):
It's, you never tire, you neverget to the bottom of it. It's
there. It's around us, how weevolved. It's, it's the ultimate
creative source. I think I
Jane Clauss (03:22):
love that you said it's the ultimate creative
source, because it is thesource, and it is, I think,
really like they, you know, it'sthis nurture in nature, like you
go out there, they want you totake a Nature Bath so you can
get more creativity. They wantto put your feet and get
grounded and be in nature,because that's really what
connects you to everything. Now
Mary Jo (03:41):
that we can look at how the brain lights up for
anything. You know, you putpeople in a in nature, and all
sorts of good things starthappening in the brain, and our
sympathetic nervous system callscalms down. I mean, we evolved
to be in nature and besurrounded by nature. And when
you go out nature, where you'rezooming in, and, you know,
(04:01):
looking close and then zoomingout, telescoping in and out,
that's really good for thebrain. So, yeah, a little bit of
time in nature every day is goodfor the health. Have you always
been a nature lover, like yourwhole life? Yeah, I always want
to. I was the tomboy who grew upplaying outside all day long.
You know, the edge of suburbandevelopment in the 70s. I was
(04:22):
born in 64 you know, outsidefrom sunrise to sunset until you
got called home for dinner. Andyes, I loved nature from a very
young age.
Jane Clauss (04:32):
Yeah, playing with worms, picking up different
animals, and looking at all theflowers you probably know ever
well. By now, you know whatevery single flower and weed,
and the name of it and whereit's come from. But Did you
always know those things? No.
Mary Jo (04:45):
So I was at the edge of urban development. So I played
in the woods, mostly in thewoods build. I was a a master
fort builder. I think I shouldhave become an architect, quite
frankly. But anyway, um. Soflowers and gardening, no, but
in terms of learning the namesof things I have because I've
(05:07):
been doing this for 12 years andpaying such close attention, but
it's not my strong suit. I findsubjects that interest me
visually, and then I come home,and then I make my photo and I
post it to my blog still, andit's at that point where I
google and find the name, andbecause when in the post, I
always the name of the subjectand the Latin name, in case
(05:31):
anyone's interested. And sothat's how I've that's my
education is 12 years of onesubject a day, learning the
name, learning whether it'snative, learning whether it's
invasive, learning whether it's,you know, a transplant from
somewhere else, and then. Soyes, I would consider myself a
naturalist today, but memorizingLatin names is not, is not one
(05:55):
of my strongest at all.
Not at all well.
Jane Clauss (05:58):
I mean, I think that's great because your
project was also a bit ofeducation for you and for
everybody that was following youon your blog. So let's talk
about your project.Stillblog.net, that's where your
blog lives. Your first image wassent out into the universe on
January 1, 2012 what was theoriginal vision you had for the
(06:20):
blog? Or was it just like, I'mgoing to put this one picture up
and see what happens?
Mary Jo (06:24):
Yeah, it's, it's an interesting story. So I was in
my 40s. Had been workingcorporate aerospace re I was an
aerospace research scientist,which is a rocket scientist, and
I so I worked in the aerospaceindustry, in research, I was an
aeronautical and astronauticalengineer. Those are all lots of
(06:45):
big words. Yeah, so, but I hadleft that job after 17 years
because of corporate takeoversand family planning. And my
husband and I had taken ouryoung kids to live in Southern
France for six months. We hadtaken a sabbatical, and it was
the first time in my adult lifeI hadn't been working. I worked
(07:09):
all through college, and thenwent straight into corporate
research, and suddenly I hadfree time. I had I was also a
creative kid, a kind of a maker,not, you know, my friends that
knew me then wouldn't have saidthat, but I sewed, I baked, I
did crafts. I just I wasn't Iwas a maker by inclination. And
(07:31):
so when I finally had some freetime in my mid 40s, in as on a
sabbatical in a rented house insouthern France, my husband had
similar ambitions. Wanted,always had wanted to write, and
so we said, let's practice forretirement. And you know,
because we're going to go backto our busy lives in six months,
right? But we're going topractice for retirement when we
(07:51):
would someday get to do right,creative work, right? And what
happened is, I, I had been anamateur photographer, so I
crafted one of these one a dayprojects that that were popular
then still popular, becausethey're extremely powerful. And
I chose one year I was for oneyear I was going to photograph
(08:12):
found nature, and in a it turnsout, this very stylized way, and
post it to a blog. And I decidedto name the blog still, as in,
like still life photography. WeI started that on January 1. In
my mind, it was a calendar year,one year commitment, one year
project. And by six months in,the project had gotten a lot of
attention, media attention, andI kept going. So here I am, 12
(08:36):
and a half years later, andfourth, over 4000 images later,
yeah, and I haven't missed aday, that's
Jane Clauss (08:42):
a lot, and we're gonna get into that. But I mean,
over the last 12 years, spendingso much time discovering nature
and taking photos for yourproject, for your blog. I mean,
I just have to, did you alsocreate a clone of yourself to
get everything else done? Imean, you have to live life like
every single day.
Mary Jo (09:03):
Life happens, that life happens. It does happen, you
know. And you know, in those 12and half years, they've been
fairly calm years for me.However, my dad did pass away,
and I'm and my mom's 88 now, andI'm the primary for her, and
which has meant a lot ofunexpected emergency room visits
in the last three years. And solife happens. And what happened
(09:27):
is I devised the project so thatthe minimum required to not
break the chain was simple. Soit's found nature on a white
background, and I can literallybe in a hospital and pick a leaf
off of a potted plant, hold itagainst a white wall, and take a
photo, and I haven't broken thechain, and you're good to go,
(09:49):
and I'm good to go. So I do thata lot sometimes. I mean, life
happens ironically. Some of thebusiest I've ever been is since
I launched this book in May, inthe last 12 years. I mean, I've.
Been crazy busy with speakingengagements and and various
things. And so the last, thelast four weeks since I launched
(10:09):
my book, I've been doing a lotof holding a potted plant leaf
in front of a white wall andcalling it good.
Jane Clauss (10:17):
And that's okay. I love that you did that the using
the white background. I mean, itreally does just single out this
one item, this one piece ofnature that you found for the
day, but in the long run, 12years later, here we are today.
You're super busy on this booktour and doing speaking events
take care, Mom, it's reallyhelped you out. Did you kind of
(10:38):
foresee that the White wasbecause I can then do this
anywhere, or was it because of astylistic photography thing that
you wanted to do? Oh,
Mary Jo (10:45):
good question, because it did. It does make the project
easier. And yeah, one of thereasons I haven't broken the
chain in 12 and a half years.But I picked a set for esthetic
reasons. So I'm I'm aminimalist. I like Scandinavian
esthetic, and I likeScandinavian design. And so my,
if you look at my images,they're very graphic on bright
(11:07):
white background. It's very it'ssort of like a modern botanical
print, if you will. You know amodern take on a botanical
print. So it, I chose it as anesthetic for esthetic reasons.
It's interesting, I learned Iwas an amateur photographer and
not professional. And I thinkthat, honestly, was to my
advantage, because after I hadstarted the project, I had more
(11:30):
than one professionalphotographer Tell me, oh, you
can't photograph on a whitebackground. That's commercial
photography. That's consideredcommercial photography. And I'm
like, Okay, I didn't know. And Ido it because I like it. I also
wanted, for me, the blog, theexperience of the blog was very
important. So when you arrivedat the blog, I wanted a seamless
(11:52):
scroll through the unfoldingseasons. So I'm taking an image
a day. So if you go, there yougo. And I'm trying to be as
seasonal as I can. February inMinnesota gets a little tricky.
I
Jane Clauss (12:04):
was going to ask about the winter months. I
Mary Jo (12:07):
do it. But even by by February, even on board with
winter stems poking out of snow.But anyway, I try to be
seasonal. So you is you scrollthrough the blog, you should get
a seasonal unfolding. And Iwanted the scroll to be
seamless. And if I had like agray background, it's very hard
(12:27):
to match grays. So the onlything that would allow me to be
seamless is true, right? Or trueblack, right? And so I wanted
this. This still blogs a veryquiet corner of the internet.
It's very calm, very quiet, lookat one thing at a time and with
this seamless scroll. And so itstill is to that day, the blog
hasn't changed at all since itwas built. A matter of fact, I
(12:51):
don't keep waiting for it tocrash, because I don't. It's in
WordPress, and I don't know howto fix it. If it crashes,
Unknown (12:59):
everyone's going there, because you're all over and
everyone wants to know aboutMary. Jo, so, yeah, you
Jane Clauss (13:04):
better watch out for that. No, the the scroll is
cool, because you do see theseasons and the amount of time
that you put into, you know,really this passion. And you did
this every single day for 12years. You made it easy. You did
it everywhere you had to do it.Was there ever a moment when
you're like, I just don't havetime today, or I can't find the
(13:25):
right subject for that, for mypicture today? Or can you do a
couple days in advance?
Mary Jo (13:32):
Yeah, you know, it's almost every week where I think
I don't know what to photograph.I mean, even like, this week,
I'm having that experience. Iit's high summer, it's June.
It's so lush. We've had so muchrain. It's just like a wall of
green out there right now. And Ikeep looking out the at the wall
(13:52):
of green, thinking, what, whatam I going to pick today? So so
even even in high summer, I havethose moments. A lot of days,
the day gets away from me. It'sthe sun. I shoot with natural
light. So the sun is setting,and I say, oh my goodness, I
haven't taken a still blogphoto. And my husband laughs,
and he says, every day, honey,and he turns around and walks
(14:13):
away. So I on those days, I, youknow, I dash out. I happen to
live on three wooded acres. Idon't think you would need to to
do this kind of project, but Ido. So I dash out into the yard,
look around, and I grabsomething to photograph. And the
the interesting thing I'velearned over the years is
(14:35):
sometimes those dashed off lastminute photos end up being some
of the best. Yeah, right, yeah,of course, crazy. All I'm doing
is not breaking the chain. Idon't care about the quality of
the photo so much or thesubject. I'm just, I just want
to make sure I don't break thechain. It's been too long now.
I'm not. I'm not. Jane, no, Ican't. No, you can't. No. So I
(14:56):
dash out, I grab something, Iphotograph it, and sure enough,
it's it's. Ends up being, it canend up being one of my better
photos. And I think there'ssomething about, you know, that
deadline that shuts off theinner critic. And, you know, so
I'm a big believer in theeveryday because, because I've
seen it happen, right? I've seenthat even when you don't want
(15:16):
to, even when the day got awayfrom you, even when the sun's
about to set. If you make thatif you make that creative
effort, you could be surprised.So
Jane Clauss (15:26):
I love it. I always tell people, just spend one hour
being creative, and then I don'tcare what you do the rest of the
day, spend 30 minutes, becauseyou have that sense of
satisfaction that you get whenyou are creative. When I would
say, when you make it yourself,when you just let your body and
your brain just be in flow withwherever it goes. And I love the
idea because you had a goal, youhad a mission, you had I'm doing
(15:49):
this. I'm not breaking thechain. A lot of people like I'll
do it today, but I don't have topick it up. So maybe this is a
great way for people to startbeing creative. By saying I'm
going to do this every day for aweek, for a week, give yourself.
Mary Jo (16:00):
I, you know, those 30 day and 100 day challenges are
still really popular, andthey're really popular because
they work, and they work for awhole bunch of reasons, but they
really do work. And you hadasked earlier about and whether
I work ahead, and I used to.And, you know, the first few
years of the of the of theproject, I had a little, a
(16:23):
little folder on the corner ofmy iMac that said, just in case,
right? And it had a coupleimages in it that, in case the
day got away from me, I couldpost those. What I found in, I
think this is key too, is thatthat was more disruptive than
helpful, because it was harderto stop and start than to just
(16:44):
commit to doing every day. Ihaven't had a just in case
folder on my desktop forprobably eight years. Wow. Yeah,
I work. I was right before I goton the podcast with you, I made
today's photo. So I find fiveminutes of every day to make a
photo,
Jane Clauss (17:00):
and that's and you just take the photo and you post
it and you move on,
Mary Jo (17:03):
yeah, I mean, I edit it to bring the background to
bright white, and then at somepoint before bed, I post and I
post it and I set the timer soit updates overnight. So yeah, I
mean, and that's the other keyfor my specific project. I could
break each of those littlesteps, find your subject, make
(17:23):
your photo, edit the photo, andpost the photo into tiny little
increments sprinkled throughoutthe day. And we all have five
minutes here, five minutesthere. We all do. And so i i
instead of scrolling or whateveryou do when you have a five
minute wait or downtime. I youknow, I do one of those little
(17:46):
steps, and
Jane Clauss (17:47):
you make it easy on yourself too. I love that. So
let's give our friends an ideaof some of the photos and some
of the images and some of theobjects that you have captured
over the years. I'm going totell you what I saw in my
research, okay, and then you canadd some that I missed, and
let's see a pile of rocks,mountains of leaves lined up,
shells, acorns, pine cones,bird's nests, vegetables,
(18:13):
flowers, animal claws, I think,Yes, yeah, insect wings, grass,
ducklings, weeds. Is thereanything that you think is not
beautiful enough to be on theblog? Or, how do you make all of
those things beautiful? What amI missing?
Mary Jo (18:32):
That's a good question. So I will any found nature. So
nothing's off limits. I do do,not a lot, but a fair I do do
roadkill. So some of my mostpopular images are from
roadkill, a coyote and a bluejay wing.
Jane Clauss (18:50):
You put it on a white background, then you pick
up.
Mary Jo (18:53):
I slid my white background underneath, yeah, and
it's, it's, it's one of my morepopular images. Anyway, I do do
real kill everything iseverything is a candidate. Every
subject's a candidate. And mycriteria are It either has to be
beautiful or it has to beinteresting. So there are some
images I just post becausethey're so interesting, they're
(19:16):
not particularly beautiful. Butwhen I can get an image that is
both interesting and beautiful,then I gotta then I got a
keeper, then I got a winner.
Jane Clauss (19:25):
Have you ever had doubles? I mean, if you get a
weed and you're like, Well, thisis interesting, and it's
beautiful, and then, oh, I don'tknow, 10 years down the road,
you're like, I'm gonna use thisweek because it's interesting.
If I don't remember what I didlast week, and even if I posted
something on my website or anysocial media I still don't
remember. Yeah,
Mary Jo (19:42):
I repeat subjects, and after 12 years, yeah, so I do
like every there's certainsubjects because of where I am
in Minneapolis in the UpperMidwest, that are some of my
favorites. You know, milkweed,milkweed pods, cattails, because
I happen to have. Have a bigcattail bed outside my house,
(20:03):
but fiddlehead ferns, forexample, I do those every
spring. I will never tirephotographing fiddlehead ferns,
and every two year, every yearis different. So usually if I
revisit a subject, I'll try torevisit it in a different
season. So if I did it inspring, I'll do it in summer or
fall, but I will revisitsubjects, especially if they're
perennial favorites. Yeah, as
Jane Clauss (20:25):
I that's totally permissible, because you're
never going to film orphotograph them in the same way.
They're always going to lookdifferent. Every day
Mary Jo (20:33):
is different. I could, I literally, I could photograph
a matter of fact, I have, I havetried to do this. I had a
collaboration with TargetCorporation, and we're putting
this lineup of beach rocks withstripes, you know, on a shower
curtain. And it the image I haddone early in the project with a
(20:53):
lesser quality camera. Andbecause we're going to make a
shower curtain which is 100inches wide, I wanted a higher
resolution image. So I still hadthose beach racks, that pile of
beach rocks, so I recreated theimage, re photograph it with a
better camera, and it never,never, ever. I did it 50 times,
different windows, differentlighting, different times a day,
(21:16):
and it was never as good as thatfirst photo. And I can't tell
you why. There was somethingabout the softness, the softness
of the light at the angle. Idon't know all of it, it, they
were very close, but not asinviting as that first image.
Oh,
Jane Clauss (21:32):
fascinating. You said you still have those beach
rocks. So do you keep a lot ofthese different objects that you
find in nature? And does thatconsider you, or does that make
you a nature hoarder?
Mary Jo (21:42):
That's a good question. I am not a nature hoarder. I'm
not a hoarder. I'm a tosser bydisposition. So 99% of the
subjects I photograph, and theygo right back outside.
Otherwise, I mean, it's everyday, so otherwise I would I
would be drowning, and I havethis three acres of wooded land,
so they just go right backoutside, turn into compost.
(22:04):
There is a few things I collect,beach rocks, well, Stripe only,
striped beach rocks, sea glass.I do have a box of bird nests. I
do have a box of pine cones. Butthat's only because I just had a
commission for a restaurant todo a big pine cone. Sure,
(22:27):
photos, and I don't think thatwill be able to stay. It's too
big a box, and I don't want tostore it so, but I do keep
certain collections. Yes,
Jane Clauss (22:34):
I have about a trillion cicadas. If you'd like
me to send you them. I actually
Mary Jo (22:39):
would. We don't have them here in Minnesota. I mean,
we get a few in the summer, butnot a lot. I know you guys can,
like, sweep them off your carlike snow, right? Sweep
Jane Clauss (22:49):
them off the car like snow. So I'm in Chicago. It
is summertime. We have cicadas.They're dive bombing me. They're
all over the trees. They're allover every single thing in my
backyard, even going on a walk,I have to, like, go around. So
if you would like some cicadas,
Mary Jo (23:03):
send me a cigar box full of cicadas.
Jane Clauss (23:08):
Yeah, I'll do it.
Mary Jo (23:09):
I love it. I just not a subject.
Jane Clauss (23:11):
I don't think I've I you'd like their wings?
Mary Jo (23:14):
I know, I think I have photographed them because they
have them in southern France,not Minnesota. I mean, we do,
but you don't find them. It'sthey're very few mall
Jane Clauss (23:22):
They're driving me crazy. So let me ask you this,
because I want to talk about thebook. Still the art of noticing
every single day that's over4000 photos. You put 275 in the
book. How did you How could youpick your favorites?
Mary Jo (23:39):
Yeah, that was the hardest part. I did it two ways,
right? I have this out ofcontrol portfolio with 4000
images, like, I can't even findstuff in it, okay? It's in it's,
of course, I didn't know thisproject. Who was gonna go on
this. I didn't tag it. I didn'tstructure it, right? It's just
this folder full stuff. Andthen, so what I did, I did, I
(24:02):
did a pass through the portfolioand said, and I had a folder
called still book worthy, right?I was throwing images in there
that I thought were worthy ofbeing published in a book. And
then I looked at that folder andI saw, I thought, I don't see
like a rhyme or reason to thiscollection. They're my best
photos, but I don't see a rhymeor reason to them, so I
(24:24):
abandoned that approach of justtaking the best photos, and then
I went with writing my essaysfirst, and then picking the
images that illustrate theessays, and that's what ended up
working for me. So a dozen of mybest photos didn't make it in
the book. Because, yeah, it'sinteresting. It's interesting.
(24:45):
But I'm super pleased with howthe book
Jane Clauss (24:47):
came out. Maybe, maybe there's another book in
the works. There has to be, or ashorter book, like the 12 that
didn't make it. And you canwrite bigger essays. There
Unknown (24:56):
you go. There.
Jane Clauss (24:56):
I mean, this. Yeah, again, you already talked about
working with the target.Corporation, I saw some of your
lettering. You would write wordswith the different found
objects. I'm obsessed with theone that says creativity
because, because it'screativity, yeah, can people
license them from you? Canpeople buy them from you?
Mary Jo (25:17):
I so I sell a lot of my images, and I have about 100
designers, professionaldesigners, or what are called
Art consultancies, that use myimages in their projects. And so
I get a couple requests a weekfrom them for three or four
images that they're going to putin some clubhouse in North
(25:40):
Carolina or something. So I dosell to professionals. I don't
regularly sell to individuals. Iwill if somebody really has a
special request, like it's for awedding invitation or something
like that, if someone reallywants it. And the only reason I
don't is the portfolio isunwieldy, and it's, it takes a
(26:03):
lot of my time to do the emailback and forth. This, is this
the image you want? What size doyou want that? Sure, yeah. And
so that individual sales I do. Ido rarely, but I do do if
somebody really wants one, but Ido sell to professionals every
week, yeah.
Jane Clauss (26:19):
So your hobby kind of turned into a business. But
when I ask back to the book,because I'm getting off on a
whole business track, and Ireally want to know about your
creativity, because I want tohelp everybody, because
everyone's thinking, Well, Idon't understand, like, what
does that mean? And you know,you have this daily practice for
12 years, and you put thesebeautiful images in a book of
what you discovered and what yousaw, and you talk a lot about
(26:41):
the art of noticing. What doesthat mean?
Mary Jo (26:45):
Yeah, I think you know, at some point, anyone who does
visual arts, any artist, whetherit's painting, graphic design,
photography, sketching, at somepoint you realize that there's a
famous book on on learning todraw, called drawing on the
(27:06):
right side of the brain, and theit's a classic and Betty
Edwards, the author, has said,if you can sign your name, you
can draw, you have the technicalskill to draw, but what you have
to do is learn to see. And it'sthe same with any of the visual
arts, whether it's photographyor what the visual arts
(27:26):
eventually all come to the sameconclusion is learning to see,
learning to notice, is the thehardest part of the creative
process. So it's training theeye to see. Sure, yeah,
Jane Clauss (27:39):
it's like fashion designers, they're putting
together outfits, and you haveto see how that's hitting a body
form, right? So, and some peoplecan see it, and some people
can't, or, like an interiordesigner, anything that you're
you're visually puttingtogether,
Mary Jo (27:53):
right? It's media Exactly, right. So people can
walk into a room an empty house,and see, see it all. Other
people can't. Most people can'tdo that. And so, yeah, it's
learning to see. And you know,I'm looking at a wall of green
right now, and every day I haveto find something to photograph.
And so learning to train the eyeto see, you know, look at that
(28:15):
visual overwhelm of, you know,this wall of green, and then
training the eye to pick out oneor two subjects or a dozen
subjects to make a compositionthat's takes more concentration
and well, in this my case,presentness, right? Mindfulness?
Sure, then, you know, pullingthe shutter on the camera, the
(28:39):
mindfulness
Jane Clauss (28:40):
and presentation, and still is the blog, and still
is the title of the book. Andyou talked about still art or
still images, and that's whatthese are. But it's also a play
on words to being still. Mindedstill in your day, still just
being still. We're never still.Our minds never stop. So has
your daily practice of beingstill, in discovering still? Has
(29:05):
that improved your creativity?Has that lowered your stress
level? What do you think aboutbeing still? Why is it important
for all of us to learn fromthat? Yeah,
Mary Jo (29:15):
I think I truly believe that I stumbled into a practice,
a simple practice that is turnedout to be really profound. And
the requirement attention,attentiveness, to find a new
subject every day, required meto be so present at least for
(29:36):
five minutes of every day. Andthat became essentially a
mindfulness practice. And so theone of the first benefits I got
from the project, and thereason, quite frankly, I never
stopped, is it turned into amindfulness practice that I
didn't want to stop. But then,even then, it kept unfolding.
This project kept unfolding indepths and depths and depths,
(29:57):
because after I, you know, Ireally. Had turned into this
mindfulness practice where I hadto be present for at least part
of every day to find a subject.Then, then suddenly I started to
have this entirely newrelationship with my place, the
place I live, where I grew up.Yeah, so in the good Midwestern
(30:18):
fashion, moved back to the placeI grew up, and so I here I am,
in this environment I've knownfor for 50 years, and yet I was
discovering it anew with thisnew level of height and
detention, right? So suddenly Icall it placefulness. I have
this nuanced now relationshipwith my plates, I'm not I
(30:42):
actually borrowed the term fromJenny Odell in her best selling
book how to do nothing. Do youremember that during
Jane Clauss (30:48):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. She
Mary Jo (30:50):
coined the term placefulness, and I have run
with it because it spoke to meso deeply, because she was
saying for her the Rose Gardenin Berkeley, California was her
place, and that that was her. Itbecame an antidote to this
anxiety and kind of itchyfeeling we all get when we spend
(31:11):
too much time online. And so tospend time in this rose garden
became her, her antidote to thatand and she called it
playfulness. And the same thinghappened to me with this
project, which is just a littlebit of time in nature, being
present, being really present,not just relaxing in nature, but
being present with nature. Andthen getting this nuanced
(31:33):
relationship with it led to thiskind of playfulness that I, you
know, I don't want to, I don'twant to go all woowoo on you
here.
Jane Clauss (31:42):
Let's go. I'm all about the Woo. I love it. I
spent a week in the junglegetting woo, woo. Let's go. So
Mary Jo (31:49):
anyway, I felt it was like, sort of like my expression
is sort of an on ramp to thesacred, I think. Yeah. So I feel
like this project unleashed awhole, a profound series, sure
of insights. Yeah,
Jane Clauss (32:04):
it's like the transformation from when you
started to this point and thislike practice that you did every
day. And again, you could sayit's like meditation people do
their daily practice of yoga.You just happen to be in, you
know, your place fullness. Justhappen to be in nature. And then
you're sharing that with if youdidn't share with everybody, you
would still probably have thatsame transformation, mentally,
(32:27):
physically, for sure. Yeah, Ithink that it's really, really
important to think about that,you know, for all of us, because
we're so busy and we get ouritchy heads when we're online,
all too much, and we getanxious, so just putting your
feet in the ground and orfinding out what you do every
day to make you transform to thereal you, because we don't, we
(32:50):
don't like to go there.Sometimes it's uncomfortable.
Mary Jo (32:52):
Yeah, before we got on, Jane and I were talking about
the Mayo Clinic, because it'snear where I live, and my
husband just did one of thesewellness checkups there, and the
doctor there was saying that theresearch on mindfulness
meditation is now saying that,so when you meditate, most
people, it's on your breath andor you're you're calming your
(33:15):
thoughts, or you're doing amantra to quiet the thoughts.
It's all inward, focused. Andthey were saying that the news
research is an outwardly focusedmeditation might even transcend,
like the the inward focus mightbe like a sub state of then the
outward focus, which is totranscend yourself, to transcend
(33:37):
the ego. And so it'sinteresting, because I feel like
my being present with nature,what again, dumb luck or
intuitive wisdom. Call it whatyou will, but that it was an
outwardly focused form ofmeditation. So yeah, I think I
stumbled into something reallypowerful.
Jane Clauss (33:57):
I think you did too, and I love that you're
sharing it with all of us. Youtalk about the term infra
ordinary. Yeah. Is that aboutnoticing
Mary Jo (34:06):
that is coined by a French philosopher in the 1970s
and it's about seeing below. Soinfra means below infra
ordinary, below the ordinary. Soit's the idea is, you know, we
become so habituated to ourenvironment that we don't, we
stop seeing the things that areright in front of us. So it's,
(34:31):
it's really funny, because theCanadian Medical Association
actually has a medical term forthis, and they call it
refrigerator blindness. Andliterally, and it's like, the
fridge, we have nothing to eat,yeah? We don't have any mayo in
the mail, like, right there infront of your face, yeah? So
they call it, they actually,literally call it refrigerator
blindness. So this is when youdon't see something and you
(34:55):
really don't see it. Your yourbrain is wired to notice the
differences in your.Environment. So when things
become so habituated, so common,sure that you stop registering
their existence at all. So whenI teach courses, I'm giving
people tips and tricks to seebelow the ordinary, to re see
(35:18):
what's always been right infront of them. And so, because
12 years of doing this for menow at this point, the most
exciting for me is to take themost ordinary subject, the most
ordinary subject, and photographit in a striking way, elevate
it, and then show it to peopleyou know, in this elevated way,
(35:42):
so that they have them see it ina different way. Make them see
it anew. Make them see it atall, right? It's the thing that
they've been walking over on thesidewalk or the parking lot for,
for, you know, that they don'teven see it ever, yeah,
Jane Clauss (35:55):
because you're just, you're just busy doing
other things. You're notnoticing anything. This is a big
thing. I lived in Arizona forseveral years, and in the
beginning I'm like, wow, look atthe mountains. I mean, they're
mountains. And then after fiveyears, I didn't even see the
mountains anymore. Yeah, yep,that's so Right, yeah. I mean,
and you're talking about the thelittle things that we would
(36:16):
maybe not see in the firstplace, but it is a thing. What
is can you give us one tip onhow to see these things?
Mary Jo (36:23):
Yeah, it is. It's the trick is very simple, but it
works very profound. It's calledjust, it's a it's I can use. I
call it spotlighting. So it'sjust giving yourself a filter.
It's your fill. You're usingselective attention to spotlight
a certain thing. So next timeyou go on a walk, for example,
just notice the color blue. Justif you're if you go on a walk
(36:47):
around your block every evening,say, I'm going to tell you, pick
a color, pick any color, exceptright now, don't pick green,
orange or blue, yeah, and justsay, Okay, I'm gonna go for a
walk, and I'm just gonna noticeblue, and you will see, I
guarantee you, you will see yourneighborhood with completely new
(37:07):
eyes. And you can do it. Youdon't have to do it with sight.
You can do it with sound, youknow, I'm only gonna listen for
birds. Yeah, yeah. And, youknow, and so that means you're
gonna drown out all of thetraffic noise, all everything.
I'm just gonna listen to birds,so just give yourself a
spotlight filter, and then focusyour selective attention, and it
will open up to you yourordinary environment. And it was
(37:32):
going to try it, yeah, yeah,you'll be surprised. It's very
it's really, it really works.
Jane Clauss (37:36):
That's our homework, friends. We all have
to, we have to do that when wego on our walks. You talk about
being a former aeronauticalengineer, I worked in radio
forever and ever and ever. Andwhen I would be stuck in radio,
and everyone was going out forhappy hour, going to see the
rock show, I was like, I gottaget blah, blah, blah. I have to
still be on the air. And I'll belike, I don't want to do it. And
like, well, it's not rocketscience. But wait the person who
(38:01):
can say, oh, but it is rocketscience. I can't leave so as an
aeronautical engineer, a rocketscientist, because that career
is about design and innovationand and learning, you know, and
figuring things out. Do youthink that background influenced
your approach to photography andart, because there's room for
(38:25):
innovation.
Mary Jo (38:26):
Yeah, first of all, most mathematicians, it's well
known that they're also verylike very good musicians. They
go hand in hand. I think it'sbecause they're both just
abstract languages, music, math,are both abstractions. And so my
engineering colleagues and Iworked in research was mostly
PhDs. Were some of the mostcreative people. I knew for
(38:50):
sure. You know, it's aninteresting thing. People are
saying to me quite often whenthey see that aerospace
engineering published artist,oh, left brain, right brain. And
I do, I do think I have that.Here's the thing, it's sort of
like creativity. I think we allhave it. We all have it, I
should say. But at some pointearly on, whether it was in
(39:11):
childhood or in college, we shutdown part of it. Sure we had to
choose, right? I'm going to be acreative or I'm going to be a
engineer, or I'm and so we, Ithink we all naturally have
those right brain, left brainconnections, but they do
atrophy. And I do think they doatrophy. There's
Jane Clauss (39:29):
a there's an experiment you can do, or a
practice, or whatever, a projectthat you can do with a group,
and you can say or with aperson. You give one group, they
an art project or an idea or asentence, come up with blank let
your seven year old self drawthis, or let your seven year old
self create this. What would itlook like? What would it be? And
then you give the same projectto a group of people, just, you
(39:52):
know, take them out of their jobfor a minute and ask them to do
this. And the seven year oldsare that mindset, and you ask
them to be that way. They'reThey're typically. Way more.
Their answers are more creative.Their ideas are more out there.
So you're right. I do think ifyou're not practicing it, it
does atrophy, or we put itaside, we put it on the shelf,
and maybe we close the door, andthat's what we don't need to.
Mary Jo (40:13):
We do when we don't need to, and we're all capable
of it. So, but yes, if you lookat my images, you, you, you will
see it's very they're verygridded, very linear. You the
aerospace engineer comes throughin my esthetic. I I say that my
subjects have to be interesting.For me. They're interesting when
they're when I'm blown away by,like, engineering precision of
(40:38):
them, you know they mean, or theor the mathematical pattern,
yeah,
Jane Clauss (40:43):
you're like, Oh, look at that. Yeah, aspect of it
because it's engineering, orit's math, or it's linear, and
that's how you see also, becauseyou are a minimalist, you like
things that are very, you know,in line with perf, yeah, that's
and it all makes sense,
Mary Jo (40:56):
and you can look at that. It's a very specific
esthetic, and
Jane Clauss (40:59):
the white background is all part, yeah,
yeah. What do you hope that thisproject has and will do to
inspire the people who see it?How will you help people?
Mary Jo (41:11):
Great question, and I have to say, the book is doing
incredibly well. It went intosecond printing within a week or
two of pub day. I mean, the bookis doing beyond my expectations
by a ton, beyond my publishersexpectations. And I this is, I'm
not saying this to brag rightnow, but I'm what I think might
(41:31):
be happening. Is it like it's Ididn't write the book this way,
but I think it is becoming abook about the creative process
that people are finding reallyinspirational, and because my
process is so simple, because Ido it every day, and I, you
(41:52):
know, like I said, I I can holdup a potted plant leaf in front
of a white t shirt or a whitewall, and I'm, I haven't broken
the chain. And it's thesimplicity of that that is
people are finding really,really, really inspirational and
within reach for them, you know.So I get the sense that the book
(42:14):
might be turning into sort oflike one of those classic books
on the creative process, becauseit's, it's just taking on it's
the book is taking on a life ofits own that nobody, including
myself, expected. Again, I thinkI stumbled into a super simple
process that this dailiness thathas really profound. It's very
(42:34):
simple, and in order to make itwork, you have to keep it
simple. Like, Don't overcomplicate your what you're
going to try and do every day.Yeah, keep it very simple.
Commit to not breaking thechain. Forget about the results,
forget about the art, forgetabout the quality of the drawing
or the painting or the photo.Just commit to not breaking the
(42:54):
chain. And I guarantee youprofound things will happen. You
know, the art will get better,and your insights about you and
your eye and what you like, allof that just comes out of the
process when all you have to dois not break the chain, right?
Just commit to not breaking justcommittable. Just commit to not
(43:17):
breaking the chain, but makesure that the minimum to not
break the chain is reallysimple, because life does
happen, and days do get awayfrom you, but you're still gonna
not break the chain on thosedays you're still like, if you
commit to making a watercolor aday, if all you do is wet the
brush, dip it in a in thepigment, and put a splotch on a
piece of paper, you haven'tbroken the chain, and you can do
(43:39):
that. And if you can be okaywith every day. Be okay with
Jane Clauss (43:43):
if it's just a splotch on the paper or if it's
a full masterpiece, like, beokay that you did not break the
change the chain. It's justprofound in all aspects of life,
really and truly, like, you canlive better creatively in so
many ways. Which brings us fullcircle. Right back to the very
first question, and what doescreativity mean to you? And you
(44:04):
said, it's everything, it'severywhere, it's
Mary Jo (44:07):
everywhere. We're all creative. Yeah, we all have an
imagination. If, I mean, ifyou're alive and living, you're
creative, right? You're you'vecreated your life, you're we're
all creative. Everything
Jane Clauss (44:16):
about it, I mean, I am so inspired right now. One
last thing, what makes you smilethe most when you wake up in the
morning?
Mary Jo (44:25):
Ah, good question. Um, a clear calendar. I'll tell you.
I still, I still, I when I wakeup in the morning, I don't know
what I'm going to photograph,but if I find a subject, so
every day is kind of like atreasure hunt for me. If I find
a subject that I just know isgonna be like, really a great
(44:48):
photo, and then I bring it home,I do my little simple setup
under the skylights in thekitchen, and I look at that
thing through the viewfinderthat puts a smile on my face.
Still to this day, every day,
Jane Clauss (45:02):
I love that. I love it. I'm going to be thinking of
you now when I take my walk outin nature, and there you go.
Tried to find things that Ithink that Mary Jo would like.
Okay, the book is still the artof noticing everybody needs to
buy a copy. Order your copy now,get two, because you'll lose one
or you're going to want to givegift one. That's
Mary Jo (45:21):
what that's what a lot of people are doing. Of course,
it's
Jane Clauss (45:23):
a beautiful book. Tell everybody where we can get
it. Everywhere books are sold by
Mary Jo (45:27):
publishers. Biden, you can buy from the publisher. It's
on Amazon, literally worldwide.Everywhere books are sold, it's
in a lot of museum shops and alot of gift in Home Stores.
Jane Clauss (45:36):
Beautiful. I'm so happy and proud of you, and we
just met. So that's a lot.Thanks, Jane. If people want to
find you, follow you on socialmedia, go to your website. What
are all those places? Okay,
Mary Jo (45:48):
the blog is called still. Stillblog.net. And
because I've been doing thisevery day for 12 and a half
years, if you just type in Mary,Jo, and still it will be all me,
me and my images. And the onlyplace I'm active on social is
Instagram, and there I'm underMary Jo Hoffman,
Jane Clauss (46:04):
still the art of noticing artist, photographer,
author, Mary Jo Hoffman, thankyou so much for joining us on
creative living. Thanks,
Mary Jo (46:15):
Jane. This was really fun. I've really, really enjoyed
this.
VO (46:18):
Live better creatively for more inspiration, visit Jane
clauss.com thank you forlistening. You.
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