Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back to
Creativity GGG, the podcast
where Chris insists that makingan interstellar audio drama is a
perfectly rational use of histime.
Today's topic the glamorousworld of 3am self-doubt,
otherwise known as the DarkKnight of the Soul Spoiler.
It involves cereal.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
It's 3am, you wake up
up, the doubts come flowing in.
You suck, you're fake, you're afailure.
If you're an artist, a writer,a songwriter, a pianist, a poet,
a performer, you've faced thismess at midnight, at at 3 am.
(00:46):
In storytelling I call this thedark night of the soul.
It's a big beat in storytelling, but it's not a beat in your
life that you ever want to gointo.
I mean, it's the low point.
It's where the hero has losteverything, where you've lost
everything, and everything justkind of becomes too much.
(01:08):
And at 3 am, man, that's notsomething.
That's fun.
I mean, you got no sword, yougot no map, you got no allies,
you got nothing.
You're on your own, you'renaked.
You're naked in front of theworst person on the planet to be
naked in front of Yourself.
(01:28):
Just the fear that maybe thiswas all a mistake.
I mean, gosh, I should havesaid that right.
Or, oh man, I wish I had saidthis.
Or I should have said thatright, oh man, I wish I had said
this.
What was I thinking to do that?
I mean, oh my gosh, it's tough.
(01:50):
And the older you get, the moredeep the dark night of the soul
becomes.
I mean it can get deep.
I just went through one.
He wrecked me for a couple ofdays and I thought, well, maybe
(02:15):
I should just throw in the towel, just find a bench and sit on
it.
Just sit in the park and watchpeople walk by and just wait out
the rest of my time on earth,whatever that was.
I mean just sit.
I mean I could hardly move.
I mean that's how deep it got.
And it happens.
(02:36):
Come on, it happens.
It happens to you, it happensto me, it happens to all of us,
because we're human.
I look at these presidents andthese prime ministers and even
these kings and I'm like, oh no,at 3 am these guys go through
the same shit that we all gothrough.
It's just the way it is to be ahuman and I don't think you get
(02:57):
out of humanness without awhole series of dark nights of
the soul.
Okay, so I'm working on thisshow, song in Space, and a lot
of my Creativity to Gigi.
Podcasts are about the process.
(03:19):
It's the show we're buildinghere at Studio to Gigi, and song
song goes through it too in thestory.
Almost every episode, our youngviolinist the heart of our
story faces her own dark night.
I mean, why not?
That's kind of like the journeywe take.
She becomes stranded and shebecomes defeated.
(03:41):
We're talking about an11-year-old girl.
She gets stripped of herconfidence Because when you're
an artist, that's what it's allabout.
It's like you are puttingyourself out there.
I don't care if you're 11, andI don't care if you're 1100.
Her bow is broken, her music isgone and the dark night comes.
(04:02):
In stories it comes rightbefore the transformation, but
in the middle of the dark nightit doesn't feel like there's
transformation.
It feels like there's just end,hopelessness, drowning.
I mean, it's tough.
I'm talking about this becauseCreativity to Gigi is really a
(04:26):
production diary about pullingthis project together at least
right now it is and how theprocess mirrors the story I'm
getting together.
Last night I had a cast readthrough with a pilot and we kind
of worked through it.
So I'm right in the deep, inthe middle of this process right
now, and what I wrestle with at3 am is the same thing Song
(04:52):
wrestles with on her spaceshipthe belief that it's over, the
belief that she's not enough,that the song is gone.
That's what I feel like.
You know, the song is gone.
Why am I doing this?
Why don't I just go sit on abeach?
I mean, I've lived a long life.
How long do I have to keepliving?
(05:12):
What's the point?
I mean, these are the things youget to when you're an artist.
These are the things you get towhen you're an artist, and if
you don't think you're going toget to it, I got bad news for
you.
You are going to get to it, andthe thing that really separates
(05:37):
out successful artists fromartists that are a little less
successful is their willingnessto face it down, this dark night
of the soul, face down thedoubt and get to this place,
which is fuck it.
This is what I'm meant to do,because expressing your art is
expressing your truth, and ifyour truth is dark, then that's
(05:57):
the truth you express.
That's how you kind of judge it.
All right, I mean, you look atart and you're like is that true
?
Is that speaking to me?
Am I speaking the truth In Songand Space?
It's like, am I playing truemusic?
But that's just the same.
Even if you're work as abarista in a coffee shop, you
(06:20):
know, or even if you workpicking up the trash at dawn.
I mean we're all going throughthis human experience Look.
Speaker 1 (06:33):
I've learned some
stuff.
Speaker 2 (06:35):
Okay, let's go over
it.
I mean, dark night isn'tfailure.
The dark night isn't failure.
The dark night is not failure,it's initiation.
Every artistic project we'redoing demands a passage through
(06:58):
doubt.
The doubt is sort of like theanvil that makes our art, our
creativity, fully formed.
Small acts break the spell.
I love that one.
Small acts break the spell.
(07:19):
Okay, what am I talking about?
Sometimes I write and sometimesI pray with my rosary beads and
sometimes I pour a bowl ofCheerios because, honestly,
cereal can be therapy.
I'm talking about when you wakeup in the middle of the night.
I'm talking about when you wakeup in the middle of the night.
(07:40):
You know, I'm lucky, I havethese beads and I work my way
through them, prayer by prayer,and that helps.
But my brother, my dearbeautiful brother, who passed
away so many years ago now, heused to tell me that when he had
dark nights of the soul, hewould go to the kitchen and he
would eat a bowl of Cheerios andthat kind of helped him, that
(08:03):
kind of put him back to sleep.
Okay, there you go.
You have the two dichotomy ofme and my brother, my spiritual
brother, my brother, birthdaytwin Ned.
He would get a bowl of Cheerios.
I pray with my rosary beads.
So it's rosary beads orCheerios, your choice.
(08:26):
You know, whatever therapy worksand transformation follows the
breaking, transformation followsthe breaking.
You know what do I mean?
I mean you need that dark nightof?
Do I mean I mean you need thatdark night of the soul.
Like I said, you need it andyou just have to trust in that
(08:49):
moment at 3.10 am, when theworld is so quiet and you look
out your window and the streetsare quiet and you open your
window and you can't hearanything but the, the hum that
never seems to go away in a city.
It's not the end, it's thetransformation in story and in
(09:10):
life.
Something has to crack beforethe light can come in.
So right now, as I said, I'm inthe middle of this process and
the fundraising feels impossible.
I mean it's a thing they nevertalk about in music school or
(09:32):
art school or theater school,you know.
But it's the fundraising.
It's tough and sometimes it'sjust like, oh man, fuck the
rehearsals, the sound design,the scale of it all.
I mean there's a million movingparts, but it's impossible is
exactly what the dark knight iswhispering to you give up, it's
(09:53):
impossible, it's impossible.
So what you've got to do is getthe fuck out of bed and take the
next tiny action.
Grab your rosary beads or, youknow, pour your bowl of Cheerios
.
Look, it doesn't go away.
(10:15):
I mean, it's 3 am again and thechorus comes back.
You suck, you're a fake, you'rea failure.
But this time I've learned.
Instead of lying there andtossing and turning, I get up, I
(10:38):
grab those beads, I pour thatcereal, I get out my sketchbook,
(10:59):
sketch an idea, I do the nextsmall thing and the night starts
to bend away from the void,away from the black hole, away
from the dark night.
Because the dark night of thesoul is not the end of the story
, it's the hinge.
It's where you decide to moveforward.
And that's where, and that'swhere the real music begins.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
So there you have it.
At 3am, chris findsenlightenment in Cheerios and
rosary beads and somehow stillbelieves producing song in space
is a good idea.
That, my friends, is creativityor madness, possibly both.
Thank you for listening toCreativity, ggg.
Until next time, may your darknights come with a decent
(11:52):
breakfast.