March 23, 2022 • 35 mins
This episode is about intersectionality, racial identity, and trauma informed care. We talk with Eliane from the Service Board, Dr. Stacey Patton from the Institute of Urban Research at Morgan State University, and Mylinh and Robert from API Chaya.
Learning Objective: To reflect on identity and understand the concept of intersectionality as it applies to both trauma and resilience and how to support young people of color.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (00:08):
Please note that Showing Up features themes of trauma,
mental health, andresilience, which
may be triggering for some.
So please, listento your body's cues,
take breaks, and useself-regulation strategies.
Don't hesitate to ask for help.
No issue is toobig or too small.
REBECCA (00:26):
You can always reach out to the National Suicide
Prevention Lifeline at800-273-8255 for support.
They will be availableto talk with you
and connect you to localmental health resources.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (00:48):
Hi, everyone.
Welcome to Showing Up.
I'm Sophie, and Iuse she/her pronouns.
REBECCA (00:53):
I'm Rebecca, and I also use she/her pronouns.
SOPHIE (00:56):
We are both part of the trauma-informed care
team at Cultivate Learning atthe University of Washington.
Welcome to Showing Up.
This is a time where we talkabout trauma-informed care
practices for Expanded LearningOpportunities or ELO programs.
ELO programs include basicallyanywhere young people
spend time outside of theschool day classroom setting,
(01:16):
like after-schoolcare, summer camps,
and skill-based programs.
REBECCA (01:21):
Sophie, before we jump in today, I'm
wondering if you have anupdate for me about Monty.
SOPHIE (01:26):
I would love to give you an update about Monty.
So for those of youwho might not know,
my puppy is named Monty.
He is a little labradoodleSpaniel hybrid mix situation.
And I learned this week thatthe little bit of lab in him
might be why he hassome growing pains.
REBECCA (01:47):
Oh.
SOPHIE (01:49):
I know, it was very sad.
I mean, it was alittle convenient
to have him be a little bitmore mellow than normal.
But I felt quite bad for him.
And it took us a little while tofigure out why he was limping.
But we got him somepuppy ibuprofen,
and he is definitely feelingbetter and resting a lot.
He's extra snuggly,so it's kind of nice.
REBECCA (02:12):
I'm glad he's feeling better.
SOPHIE (02:13):
Yeah, I know.
He recovered prettyquick after a couple
of hours on ibuprofen--back to normal.
REBECCA (02:19):
Good, good.
SOPHIE (02:20):
How about you, Rebecca?
How's Gus?
REBECCA (02:23):
Gus-- for those of you who
don't know, he is myfive-year-old little poodle
mix also.
And lately, I thinkhe's been starting--
it's funny when he startsto notice what we do,
me and my partner.
And lately, he's noticedwhen we go to our bedroom
and put on real pantsthat's not sweat pants.
(02:46):
Then he'll know thatwe're about to leave.
[LAUGHTER]And so he'll recognize that.
So when we go put on jeans orsomething more presentable,
then he'll know thatwe're about to leave.
And he'll get all cute anddo all his little cute things
to try to make us stay.
So he'll just go bellyup and flop on our feet
so that we can't walk anymore.
(03:07):
And we have to pethim because how
do you not pet a dog that'sexposing their belly to you?
SOPHIE (03:13):
Yeah, I mean it's a rule.
You have to pet the tummy.
REBECCA (03:17):
So that's just a little fun quarantine
quirk that he's developed.
[LAUGHTER]
SOPHIE (03:23):
You've successfully trained your dog
to recognize the meaning behinddifferent types of pants.
REBECCA (03:27):
Right?
Like hard pants and soft pants.
And if it's the hard pants,then we're going to leave.
SOPHIE (03:35):
Thank you for that spectacular "pupdate."
So today we are talkingabout intersectionality,
racial identity, andtrauma-informed care.
This episode was developed basedon our current understandings
of the topicspresented within it.
Concepts, terms, anddefinitions do change
as we all learnmore and do better.
(03:57):
We want to namemost of the language
and examples used to discussracial bias or racism
are based on the culturaland historical context
of the United States.
We'll have severalresources in the show notes
that you can explore if you'dlike to dive deeper into being
an anti-racist care provider.
REBECCA (04:13):
Today we'll be chatting with Elaine from the Service
Board, Dr. Stacey Pattonfrom the Institute of Urban
Research at MorganState University,
and Mai Lin andRobert from APA Chaya.
SOPHIE (04:23):
Let's jump in with our Youth Voice
interview with Elainefrom the Service Board.
[MUSIC PLAYING] Hi, Elaine.
Welcome.
ELAINE (04:37):
Hi, my name is Elaine.
I use she/her pronouns,and I am currently
a senior at LindberghHigh School in Renton.
And I learned aboutthis opportunity
through a tSB mentor.
I am a tSB since freshmanyear, so they have really
watched me grow up.
REBECCA (04:56):
How so?
Can you tell us what tSB is?
ELAINE (04:58):
So tSB is a youth-led program
but it's actually anon-profit organization that
started roughly 26 years ago.
The program that weoffer throughout the year
from January to June iscalled our Core Program,
where we create theseaccessible moments for youth
all over Seattle and thegreater Seattle area.
(05:21):
We do provide community servicehours as well as opportunities.
We provide adultmentorship hours.
We also educate on socialand environmental justice,
which is super cool,because I had no idea what
that was before tSB.
(05:41):
And we do outdoor adventure,which is one of our Core things
through snowboardingin our Core Program.
And then in the summer, wehave skateboarding as well.
REBECCA (05:53):
So today's episode is about intersectionality
and basically how differentaspects of one's identity
interact and overlap.
And there are somany things that
make up one's identity likeage, disability, race, gender,
and so much more.
Elaine, how would youdescribe your own identity?
ELAINE (06:10):
My identity is pretty complex.
I think I always strugglewith categorizing all of them.
But some of the main ones are Ido identify as Asian-American.
I am more specificallyVietnamese-American.
I am female-identifying.
I'm also Catholic-identifyingin the sense
that I understand myown definition of it.
And I feel comfortabletussling with all
(06:34):
these different things.
Also, because of tSB,I have grown interest
in that spark for social andenvironmental justice activism.
Yeah, but right now, Ithink my strongest one
is being a student.
Yeah.
There's a lot ofvalues and beliefs
that tie into allof my identities
(06:55):
and just the conceptof all the three.
Values, belief, and identityare always mixed for me, so.
REBECCA (07:02):
Thank you for sharing that.
I'm curious tohear about how you
talk about your ownidentity with your friends
and then also how youtalk about your identity
with adults in your life.
ELAINE (07:12):
I don't necessarily talk about my identity
with my friends orany adults in my life
that are not part of tSB,where it's almost taboo for me.
And I don't know if it's becauseI just grew up in a space
where it's not the bestthing to talk about,
or because a lot ofpeople tend to have
(07:34):
surface-levelconversations, and I
tend to really more for the deepone, like just jump into it.
But it's always weird or anot-normal thing for people
to talk about.
Yeah, it's also really hardbecause sometimes whenever
I do mention an identitythat I do identify with,
and then I toldthem another one,
they'd be like, well,that doesn't make sense,
(07:55):
because those twoclash with each other.
And so then itmakes me question,
do I actually identifywith that or the way
that people see my identities?
Or the way that peopletake in what I say
is really different, too.
I think the biggest thing isjust the uncomfortable feeling
of vulnerability becauseyou can get really deep when
you go into intersectionalityand just talking about what you
(08:18):
do identify with andhow that creates you
or the fear of talkingabout that for people.
And I personally reallylike challenging that.
But I know that a lotof people don't or feel
very uncomfortable around that.
REBECCA (08:34):
I think that was a very insightful reflection
that you've had because a lotof different aspects of identity
do clash on the exterior.
But I think you have avery good understanding
of what those corethings are to you
and how that makesup who you are.
I can definitely relate asan Asian-American women,
(08:55):
also not growing up in spacesthat really give you open space
to explore that identity.
So I'm glad you're gettingthat through tSB, though.
I'm curious how adults inyour life, maybe at tSB,
have made differentaspects of your identity.
Do you feel safe and supported?
ELAINE (09:12):
I think it was really weird for me to feel supported
and seen when I wastalking about my identity,
just because I'dnever felt it before,
or I never knew how to identifythat or define that feeling.
And so when I did go to tSB,all the mentors around me,
even if they weren'tin a specific group
that I constantlywas with, they always
gave me that spaceand the capacity
(09:34):
to explore differentidentities that I might
identify with or helpme define this feeling
or define this certain identityand then claim it as my own.
But also, I think they reallychallenged me to really think
if this was what Ireally identified with,
or if it was something thatI just felt like I should
(09:54):
be identifying with.
Yeah, the whole idea ofnot being judged and not
having adults look down onyou or doubt what you say
was really nice.
SOPHIE (10:07):
I think that's a really great insight about ways
that we can show up foryoung people in our lives,
but also just for anypeople in our lives--
the importance oftruly listening.
REBECCA (10:17):
Thank you for just being so vulnerable and open
and sharing your journey throughfinding your own identity.
And I know it'llcontinue into the future.
But, yeah, thank you.
SOPHIE (10:29):
Thank you so much, Elaine.
ELAINE (10:31):
Thank you for having me.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (10:40):
All right, it's time for our word of the week.
We're going to share avocabulary word every episode
to help build a sharedterminology for talking
about trauma-informedcare practices.
Today we'll share adefinition for the term
"intersectionality."Intersectionality is the
complex cumulative wayin which the affects of multiple
forms of discrimination,such as racism,
(11:00):
sexism, and classism,combine, overlap, or
intersect, especiallyin the experiences of
marginalized individualsor groups.
Individuals with multiplemarginalized identities
experience compoundedoppression.
REBECCA (11:16):
Intersectionality just means that, depending
on our identities,our experiences in the
world affect us differently.
So for example, I identifyas an Asian woman.
And my experiences and the waythat I interact with the world
would be different fromSophie, who's a white woman.
We both identify as womenand experience sexism
in a patriarchal society.
But because I belong ina racial minority group--
(11:38):
specifically, in an Asiangroup-- my experience of sexism
is inherently racialized,and my flavor of racism
has sexist undertones to it.
This would look differentfor the type of overt racism
or microaggressions that anAsian man might experience
or people who hold adifferent set of identities.
SOPHIE (11:55):
Yeah.
So these are reallygreat examples of how just two
aspects of identityoverlap and shape our
experiences in the world.
Many other factors, likereligion, disability,
sexual orientation, bodysize, and socioeconomic class,
just to name a few,also intersect and shape
our experiences of bothprivilege and oppression.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MAI LIN (12:18):
API Chaya is an organization
that empowers survivorsof gender-based violence
and human trafficking togain safety, connection,
and wellness.
Email that you canreach out to us on--
it's info@apichaya-- I-N-F-Oat A-P-I-C-H-A-Y-A dot org.
(12:43):
You can always callour office line.
The phone numberis 206-467-9976.
ROBERT (12:52):
You can also contact us on Instagram and Facebook.
SOPHIE (12:57):
So welcome back, Dr. Patton.
Tell us a bit about you.
STACEY PATTON (13:00):
Absolutely.
So my name is DoctorStacey Patton.
My pronouns are she and her.
I teach journalismat Howard University.
I am a award-winningjournalist and author
and nationallyrecognized child advocate
whose work focuses onthe intersections of race
and parenting, which means Italk a lot about how people
(13:24):
treat children,particularly their bodies
and their psychologicaldevelopment
through parenting strategiesand also teaching.
I am an anti-spanking activist.
I believe thatchildren should never
be hit because it shapesthe way their brains grow,
(13:45):
how they see themselves.
And so a lot of myactivism focuses on decolonizing
parenting and coming upwith healthier, non-violent
ways to raise childrenso that they can achieve
their optimal potential.
REBECCA (14:00):
I heard you mention intersectionality.
And this whole episode isabout intersectionality and
trauma-informed care.
So in your opinion, why isit important to consider
intersectionality when talkingabout trauma-informed care?
Intersectionality acknowledgesthat things like race, class,
gender, sexuality, ability,religion, even your body size
(14:21):
are all these overlappingidentities and experiences
which intersect to producemanifold kinds of oppression.
They can also beempowering, too.
But when we talk abouttrauma and oppression,
people are often disadvantagedby these multiple sources
(14:43):
of oppression.
And these identity markersdon't exist independently
of each other.
They inform the others, oftencreating a complex convergence
of oppression.
At the intersection is where thesocial, personal, and political
context of trauma getsexperienced by individuals--
(15:05):
so how people move through theworld, how they're treated,
the messages they receiveabout their humanity,
their possibilities,their potential.
And their personaland community history
all matters in this equation.
I often hear peoplesay, "What doesn't
kill you makes you stronger."That's absolutely not true.
(15:28):
What tries to kill you is aform of chronic stress, which
can have wear and tearon your nervous system,
on your immune system, onhow your brain operates.
And so both traumaand oppression
can impact the brainand body in similar ways
and change your view ofyourself and the world.
(15:49):
And so in my work, I'moften inviting people
to acknowledge thecentrality of the child
when we talk aboutintersectionality.
People often overlookchildhood and child experiences
when we talk aboutintersectionality-- so how
we treat children, howwe acknowledge childism
(16:09):
as a foundational part ofthis intersection of trauma
and oppression.
So when we do we talkabout intersectionality,
at the root of anyintersection of oppression
is the psychologicalmanipulation of children.
You can't perpetuate any ofthese macro forms of oppression
that we always talkabout without first
(16:30):
destroying children as soonas they enter the world.
The psychologicalmanipulation of children
is essentiallythe practical root
of all forms of oppression.
And so you can't accuratelydo intersectionality research,
activism, therapy, teachingwithout fully understanding
how children and childhoodfits into different forms
(16:54):
of oppression.
I loved how you framed the four F's
of trauma responses.
Can you give us arundown of those?
STACEY PATTON (17:01):
So fight, flight, freeze, and fawn.
So fight is all aboutself-preservation.
And it's about protectionwhen we're faced with threat.
So evolution haswired our bodies
with something called anamygdala, which is essentially
the body's built-inalarm system.
(17:24):
And you search for cuesin your environment
for any potential threat toyour body, safety, survival.
And so fighting is aboutdefending ourselves.
It's our desire to feelempowered at all costs.
And sometimes this happensthrough maladaptive strategies.
(17:47):
So if you've come froma stressful environment,
where you always hadto be in survival mode,
always had to fightand defend yourselves,
and then you change environmentsthat are more peaceful,
then it can bedifficult to transition
into a different kind of space.
So then there's flight.
(18:07):
This, too, is alsoabout protection
from pain or threats.
And people achievethis through escaping.
You see this with peoplewho are constantly worrying,
got a lot of anxiety.
They're panicking.
They can be leaders whomicromanage other people.
(18:27):
These are folks who arealways hyper vigilant, always
danger-mapping, lookingfor signs of threats.
And sometimes these people looklike folks who are workaholics.
They might be overachievers.
And so in socialsituations, these
are the kind of people that willphysically remove themselves.
And so they're reallyconflict-avoidant.
(18:48):
Then you've got freeze.
Freezing, like the othertwo, fight and flight,
is also about self-preservation.
But this happenswhen you dissociate.
So a lot of kids who experienceabuse will disassociate,
like take leave of your body.
So it's a way you space out.
(19:08):
You detach from the world.
You depersonalize.
You detach from yourself.
And this happens whenstress becomes so much
that you feel immobilized.
These kind of folkswill self-isolate,
have a hard timemaking decisions.
They might be passive.
They don't take risks.
(19:29):
And they have a hardtime setting goals.
And then the last is fawning.
So fawning is another waythat people, particularly
those in abusive situations,will try to self-preserve.
So these are the kind ofpeople who placate others.
These folks don'tknow how to say no.
They feel afraid to sharewhat they really think
(19:49):
and how they really feel.
They're always concerned withother people's perceptions
of them.
They're constantly anticipatingthe needs of other folks.
They want to fit in.
So fawning really islike, if I can please you,
if I can keep you happy,then that strategy
is going to make me feel safeand keep me safe from being
(20:12):
abandoned, rejected, hurt, feelany kind of conflict or pain.
So I'm cognizant ofthe four F's when
I'm teaching collegestudents because I know
that stressed-out brainsin fight or flight mode
have a difficult time learning.
And far too manystudents are growing up
in stressful family situations,neighborhoods, and also
(20:36):
schools, which are unfortunatelyanother zone of intimidation
and violence.
They are facingteachers who use fear
as a pedagogicalstrategy-- fear of failure,
fear of an unwanted callhome, fear of the teacher,
fear of ridicule.
And so I disagree with thatbecause fear compromises
(20:57):
the ability to learn.
When we feel threatened ineither one of these four F's
and experience fear, wedownshift to survival mode.
And students are lessable to learn effectively
because their primary focusis on self-protection.
REBECCA (21:14):
So what are some strategies
that you use to createsafe learning environments?
STACEY PATTON (21:18):
I strive to be an amygdala whisperer.
I try to picture thatpart of the brain.
I try to also picturetheir ventral vagal--
vagus nerve, thisthing that's running
through the center of thebody and really touches
all the organs.
I try to be careful withthose areas of the body
(21:38):
and realize that all mystudents come into my classroom
with all of these histories.
I'm careful about howI introduce myself
to my students on day one.
I'm cognizant aboutmy tone of voice,
making eye contact withstudents-- just very
basic things.
I create tribal-- a tribalclassroom, where we are family.
(22:01):
We're a community.
I'm sort of like auntie.
And so I always doverbal check-ins,
whether I'm teachingonline or in person,
to see how everybody is.
I call names.
So it lets my studentsknow, I see you.
You matter.
I'm glad you're here.
Physical check-ins aswell-- sometimes we'll
(22:21):
stretch, do little exercisesto get the blood flow moving.
I also do guided meditationat the beginning of class.
So it's like five minutesof guided meditation
and [? choral ?]music I'll play.
I keep juice boxes,snacks, things like that
in the classroom becausehave longer classrooms--
class sessions-- thatare like three hours--
(22:44):
little stress balls,things that are tactile,
sometimes adult coloring books.
And so beyond these sorts oflittle things that you do,
I try to take time tobuild relationships
with my individual students.
I give them directionsand feedback in ways
that they'll respond to well.
(23:05):
I always convey respectand transparency
by giving them reasons behindwhy we're doing what we're
doing, if there's any changes.
I avoid power struggleswith students and escalating
behavior.
And I provide predictability anduse positive attention as well.
(23:27):
So it's all aboutmaking my students feel
heard and validated andsafe in their own bodies.
And then once they feelsafe in their own bodies,
then they take a risk ofbeing vulnerable and being
open to learning something newand committing to the journey.
SOPHIE (23:48):
Wonderful.
Doctor Patton, thank you so muchfor being here with us today.
STACEY PATTON (23:53):
Well, thank you so much for having me.
I really appreciate beinginvited to the conversation.
SINGER (23:58):
(SINGING) Please don't let me drown.
Please don't let me drown.
STACEY PATTON (24:03):
The Ida B. Wells Textbook Fund
provides textbooks to HBCUstudents who are cash-strapped.
So if you'd like to make adonation to help the students,
you can just go GoFundMe andenter the Ida B Wells Textbook
Fund to support.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (24:26):
So our next guests are from an organization called
API Chaya.
So welcome.
ROBERT (24:32):
Thank you.
My name is Robert.
I use they/them pronouns.
I get to be one of the youthprogram coordinators and youth
organizers at API Chaya.
MAI LIN (24:40):
Hi, everyone.
My name is Mai Lin.
I use they/them pronouns, and Iget to be the Youth and Family
Advocate at API Chaya.
SOPHIE (24:49):
I know that at API Chaya,
you work really hard todismantle violent systems,
and understandingintersectionality
is really key to that.
I'm curious tohear, Mai Lin, how
do these topics of raceand intersectionality
show up in your work with youth?
MAI LIN (25:05):
Ooh.
My answer to thatquestion is always,
how do they not show up, right?
Race is such a hugetopic within America,
but it is a worldwide--white supremacy is so
pervasive within our world.
And so I see it all the time,because within API Chaya,
(25:26):
most of the folksthat we work with
are folks who identify asAsian, Pacific Islander, folks
who identify as immigrants,because we have folks who
have been in America fora while, for generations,
and we have otherfolks who are coming in as newer
generations, who havea different relationship to what
racism looks like in America.
(25:47):
In my work with youthwhat's important
for me is to alwaysname that race
is very present in mywork, modeling for them
what accountabilitylooks like when
I talk about racism, when Italk about intersectionality--
that I'm seeing alltheir identities.
Everything that they areis being witnessed and seen
(26:08):
and highlighted, and sowanting to provide that space
and container for youth toreally identify and name
what their identitiesare to themselves.
REBECCA (26:19):
So, Robert, how do you approach
these topics ofrace and identity
when talking with youth?
ROBERT (26:24):
A huge part is really naming and acknowledging it.
As a Filipino-Americanperson, I know
I move through the worldas a person of color,
and then people willsee me that way.
I get the sense thata lot of young people
are giving us a testof, can I trust you?
As we all do as atypical human thing-- can
I trust you with acertain part of me?
(26:46):
And because of thedifferent conditions
of the structures of whitesupremacy and racism,
a lot of youth of colorare going to be checking,
is this part of me, this hugepart of me, safe with you?
And so for me, I model,I feel safe bringing this
into our conversation andinto our relationship.
Oftentimes I find myselfin my work sometimes
bringing in the strange,awkward, hard topic that people
(27:08):
aren't wanting to talk about.
And often the adultsin their lives
are afraid or are unsurehow to bring it up.
It's OK that things arecomplicated around race.
It's OK that that'sactually-- might
be a fun-- a funny thingto bring up in this space.
Hiding it is actually a tacticof prolonging the violence
in every case.
(27:29):
And then the other pieceis getting really curious.
And Mai Lin is sucha role model for me
of showing excitement andcuriosity for a young person's
lived experience.
And I really try tolean in in my growing
edge of showing curiosity ina young person's experience
and really asking them, canI bring this up with you?
I'm curious aboutthis in your life.
REBECCA (27:50):
Yeah, I think that that respect
for the individualperson's dignity
and giving all of thatchoice and curiosity
is a really beautiful partof the work that you all do.
I'm curious to hear differentways that you help make sure
that the young peoplethat you're working with
feel this sense of safety andfeeling seen and supported.
MAI LIN (28:11):
In my work, I do a lot of case management
with young folks.
And a lot of them areconnecting with me
because they'rewanting to look for,
let's say, a counselor, right?
They're highlightingtheir mental health needs
and are really wanting to seeksupport in finding someone.
And so often, thequestion that I ask them
(28:34):
is, what therapistwould you like?
What identities wouldyou like them to hold?
And I think that that'sone way that I really
make sure that a young person'sidentity is seen and supported.
The other thing I would nameis that, yes, curiosity.
Yes, all informationa young person
tells you is sacred information.
(28:58):
They are being vulnerablewith you, a stranger.
A person who they have not grownup with comes into their life
and starts telling themthis and this and this
and this is what weshould work on, right?
That shouldn't be the case.
It should be, what doyou want to work on?
What information do youfeel is important for me
(29:19):
in my work with you so thatyou are driving that steering
wheel?
And so, yes, get curious.
Get excited.
When a young personis like, this is what my culture
does, and I love it,hell, yeah, keep
doing it, you know?
Be in wonder.
Be in curiositywith young people.
(29:41):
I do know that, Robert, youhave a really beautiful way
of talking about thestructural shifts
that we discuss with youth.
Do you want to share alittle bit about that?
ROBERT (29:53):
The realities of structural racism
and white supremacy is thatit shapes material conditions.
I have worked with a lotof young Asian and young
Black youth.
There's a lot of waysin which their family
life, their schoolsthat they go to,
the resources that they knowthat they can access are just--
(30:13):
are so different froma white young person.
It's my charge tosupport young folks
in mobilizing to changethose material conditions
and also do my part as anolder person in their life to
really advocatewhere I go, wherever
is strategic and useful,to address those needs.
If there's a needin a young person's
(30:34):
life for their families tohave culturally relevant and
language-accessible health careand mental health care, then
I-- then that'sactually a charge for me
to actually push forthat and make sure
that there are structuresand institutions that
are supporting that.
If our work stays withindirect one-on-one service
and doesn't lead towardsshifts in material conditions
(30:56):
in our communities, then we'renot working ourselves out
of a job.
And it's an endless loop thatwe're never going to really
be able to address at the root.
REBECCA (31:05):
Absolutely.
So thank you bothfor being here today
and for being partof our podcast.
That was beautiful.
Thank you.
[MUSIC PLAYING]Strategy Spotlight
is a time for usto share something you could
implement in your programor classroom.
Our Strategy Spotlight todaycomes from Azure Savage.
Azure is the author ofthe book, You Failed Us--
(31:25):
Students of ColorTalk Seattle Schools.
He also leadsworkshops for educators
on creating safe classroomsfor students of color.
Let's listen as hedescribes the strategy
of radical welcome,radical support,
and radical empowerment.
AZURE SAVAGE (31:41):
Radical welcome-- and all these are
radical, because whenyou're fighting
against such a stronglyingrained racist system, you
have to be radical about it.
It can't be halfway done.
It has to be all inand do it radically.
So radical welcome is theidea that from the moment
a student walks in yourdoor on the first day,
you welcome them.
(32:01):
You ask them their name.
You ask them how they are.
You bring them intothe room immediately.
And you don't justdo it that first day.
You do it every day.
You continue makingsure that they
know that they are inthat room for a reason
and that theybelong in that room.
Radical support is reallyabout building a relationship
with your students, so youknow how to support them.
(32:22):
I get this questiona lot from teachers
who I talked to atmy school about,
how do I support a studentgoing through a hard time
when I barely know them?
I'm like, well,your first mistake
is that you barely know them.
You need to build some sortof foundational relationship
with your student so that,one, they can feel comfortable
coming to you,and, two, you feel
comfortable coming to them.
(32:42):
And of course you're goingto have a struggle with this
if you don't know them.
Another part ofradical support is
that it needs to be consensual.
You can't forcesupport on a student.
And if they areclearly like, this
is uncomfortable, you havegot to take a step back,
because if they don't wantyou in their business,
you trying to getinto their business
is just going to makethings a lot worse.
(33:03):
And the last piece ofthis-- radical empowerment.
We've really workedin this workshop to reframe the
idea of empowermentfrom giving someone power
to giving someone a reasonto see their own power and to
understand that they alreadyhave the power, because you
don't need to give them power,because they already have it.
They just don't-- they mightnot see it, but they have it.
(33:24):
And this idea that teacherscan do this in so many ways.
They can do thisthrough affirmations.
They can do this throughwriting a little note on a test,
like, "You did a great job."I love those notes.
And you feel empowered.
And it's not like they're theones needing to give you power,
because you're like,oh, I just did that.
I did it on my own, and Icould continue doing that.
Those, for me, I think arereally great foundational tools
(33:47):
to direct the way an educatoreducates to make sure
that students of colorespecially feel like they
have a power in the classroom.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (34:00):
As we wrap up this episode,
we'll leave you with afew reflection questions.
Part of building atrauma-informed care practice
is building ourown self-awareness,
so we can better show up forthe young people in our lives.
REBECCA (34:12):
Our first question is, there are so many things that
make up one's identity, likeage, disability, race, gender,
and more.
How would you describeyour own identity?
Next, thinking aboutsystemic racism
and structural oppressionand intersectionality,
what identities, privileges, andpositions of power do you hold?
And lastly, what issomething that you
(34:33):
can do to make sure differentaspects of young people's
identities are seen andsupported in your program?
SOPHIE (34:38):
For those of you listening
that are working directlywith young people,
either professionally orin your personal life,
we know that it takesvulnerability and bravery
to authentically show up todiscussions about privilege,
power, and identity.
We hope that hearingfrom our guests today
gives you the courageand additional vocabulary
you need to feelempowered to engage
in these discussionswith young people.
(35:00):
Remember, avoiding these topicsdoesn't make them go away.
The more we can acknowledgeand name these systems,
the more we can create changeand safety in our communities.
REBECCA (35:09):
This podcast was produced by Cultivate Learning
at the University of Washingtonwith funding from The Bonner
Group.
We'd like to thank our mediaproducers, Tifa Tomb and Ryan
Henriksen, and our graphicdesigner, Tami Tolpa.
You can find more ofCultivate Learning's work
by going tocultivatelearning.uw.edu.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (00:08):
Please note that Showing Up features themes of trauma,
mental health, andresilience, which
may be triggering for some.
So please, listento your body's cues,
take breaks, and useself-regulation strategies.
Don't hesitate to ask for help.
No issue is toobig or too small.
REBECCA (00:26):
You can always reach out to the National Suicide
Prevention Lifeline at800-273-8255 for support.
They will be availableto talk with you
and connect you to localmental health resources.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (00:48):
Hi, everyone.
Welcome to Showing Up.
I'm Sophie, and Iuse she/her pronouns.
REBECCA (00:53):
I'm Rebecca, and I also use she/her pronouns.
SOPHIE (00:56):
We are both part of the trauma-informed care
team at Cultivate Learning atthe University of Washington.
Welcome to Showing Up.
This is a time where we talkabout trauma-informed care
practices for Expanded LearningOpportunities or ELO programs.
ELO programs include basicallyanywhere young people
spend time outside of theschool day classroom setting,
(01:16):
like after-schoolcare, summer camps,
and skill-based programs.
REBECCA (01:21):
Sophie, before we jump in today, I'm
wondering if you have anupdate for me about Monty.
SOPHIE (01:26):
I would love to give you an update about Monty.
So for those of youwho might not know,
my puppy is named Monty.
He is a little labradoodleSpaniel hybrid mix situation.
And I learned this week thatthe little bit of lab in him
might be why he hassome growing pains.
REBECCA (01:47):
Oh.
SOPHIE (01:49):
I know, it was very sad.
I mean, it was alittle convenient
to have him be a little bitmore mellow than normal.
But I felt quite bad for him.
And it took us a little while tofigure out why he was limping.
But we got him somepuppy ibuprofen,
and he is definitely feelingbetter and resting a lot.
He's extra snuggly,so it's kind of nice.
REBECCA (02:12):
I'm glad he's feeling better.
SOPHIE (02:13):
Yeah, I know.
He recovered prettyquick after a couple
of hours on ibuprofen--back to normal.
REBECCA (02:19):
Good, good.
SOPHIE (02:20):
How about you, Rebecca?
How's Gus?
REBECCA (02:23):
Gus-- for those of you who
don't know, he is myfive-year-old little poodle
mix also.
And lately, I thinkhe's been starting--
it's funny when he startsto notice what we do,
me and my partner.
And lately, he's noticedwhen we go to our bedroom
and put on real pantsthat's not sweat pants.
(02:46):
Then he'll know thatwe're about to leave.
[LAUGHTER]And so he'll recognize that.
So when we go put on jeans orsomething more presentable,
then he'll know thatwe're about to leave.
And he'll get all cute anddo all his little cute things
to try to make us stay.
So he'll just go bellyup and flop on our feet
so that we can't walk anymore.
(03:07):
And we have to pethim because how
do you not pet a dog that'sexposing their belly to you?
SOPHIE (03:13):
Yeah, I mean it's a rule.
You have to pet the tummy.
REBECCA (03:17):
So that's just a little fun quarantine
quirk that he's developed.
[LAUGHTER]
SOPHIE (03:23):
You've successfully trained your dog
to recognize the meaning behinddifferent types of pants.
REBECCA (03:27):
Right?
Like hard pants and soft pants.
And if it's the hard pants,then we're going to leave.
SOPHIE (03:35):
Thank you for that spectacular "pupdate."
So today we are talkingabout intersectionality,
racial identity, andtrauma-informed care.
This episode was developed basedon our current understandings
of the topicspresented within it.
Concepts, terms, anddefinitions do change
as we all learnmore and do better.
(03:57):
We want to namemost of the language
and examples used to discussracial bias or racism
are based on the culturaland historical context
of the United States.
We'll have severalresources in the show notes
that you can explore if you'dlike to dive deeper into being
an anti-racist care provider.
REBECCA (04:13):
Today we'll be chatting with Elaine from the Service
Board, Dr. Stacey Pattonfrom the Institute of Urban
Research at MorganState University,
and Mai Lin andRobert from APA Chaya.
SOPHIE (04:23):
Let's jump in with our Youth Voice
interview with Elainefrom the Service Board.
[MUSIC PLAYING] Hi, Elaine.
Welcome.
ELAINE (04:37):
Hi, my name is Elaine.
I use she/her pronouns,and I am currently
a senior at LindberghHigh School in Renton.
And I learned aboutthis opportunity
through a tSB mentor.
I am a tSB since freshmanyear, so they have really
watched me grow up.
REBECCA (04:56):
How so?
Can you tell us what tSB is?
ELAINE (04:58):
So tSB is a youth-led program
but it's actually anon-profit organization that
started roughly 26 years ago.
The program that weoffer throughout the year
from January to June iscalled our Core Program,
where we create theseaccessible moments for youth
all over Seattle and thegreater Seattle area.
(05:21):
We do provide community servicehours as well as opportunities.
We provide adultmentorship hours.
We also educate on socialand environmental justice,
which is super cool,because I had no idea what
that was before tSB.
(05:41):
And we do outdoor adventure,which is one of our Core things
through snowboardingin our Core Program.
And then in the summer, wehave skateboarding as well.
REBECCA (05:53):
So today's episode is about intersectionality
and basically how differentaspects of one's identity
interact and overlap.
And there are somany things that
make up one's identity likeage, disability, race, gender,
and so much more.
Elaine, how would youdescribe your own identity?
ELAINE (06:10):
My identity is pretty complex.
I think I always strugglewith categorizing all of them.
But some of the main ones are Ido identify as Asian-American.
I am more specificallyVietnamese-American.
I am female-identifying.
I'm also Catholic-identifyingin the sense
that I understand myown definition of it.
And I feel comfortabletussling with all
(06:34):
these different things.
Also, because of tSB,I have grown interest
in that spark for social andenvironmental justice activism.
Yeah, but right now, Ithink my strongest one
is being a student.
Yeah.
There's a lot ofvalues and beliefs
that tie into allof my identities
(06:55):
and just the conceptof all the three.
Values, belief, and identityare always mixed for me, so.
REBECCA (07:02):
Thank you for sharing that.
I'm curious tohear about how you
talk about your ownidentity with your friends
and then also how youtalk about your identity
with adults in your life.
ELAINE (07:12):
I don't necessarily talk about my identity
with my friends orany adults in my life
that are not part of tSB,where it's almost taboo for me.
And I don't know if it's becauseI just grew up in a space
where it's not the bestthing to talk about,
or because a lot ofpeople tend to have
(07:34):
surface-levelconversations, and I
tend to really more for the deepone, like just jump into it.
But it's always weird or anot-normal thing for people
to talk about.
Yeah, it's also really hardbecause sometimes whenever
I do mention an identitythat I do identify with,
and then I toldthem another one,
they'd be like, well,that doesn't make sense,
(07:55):
because those twoclash with each other.
And so then itmakes me question,
do I actually identifywith that or the way
that people see my identities?
Or the way that peopletake in what I say
is really different, too.
I think the biggest thing isjust the uncomfortable feeling
of vulnerability becauseyou can get really deep when
you go into intersectionalityand just talking about what you
(08:18):
do identify with andhow that creates you
or the fear of talkingabout that for people.
And I personally reallylike challenging that.
But I know that a lotof people don't or feel
very uncomfortable around that.
REBECCA (08:34):
I think that was a very insightful reflection
that you've had because a lotof different aspects of identity
do clash on the exterior.
But I think you have avery good understanding
of what those corethings are to you
and how that makesup who you are.
I can definitely relate asan Asian-American women,
(08:55):
also not growing up in spacesthat really give you open space
to explore that identity.
So I'm glad you're gettingthat through tSB, though.
I'm curious how adults inyour life, maybe at tSB,
have made differentaspects of your identity.
Do you feel safe and supported?
ELAINE (09:12):
I think it was really weird for me to feel supported
and seen when I wastalking about my identity,
just because I'dnever felt it before,
or I never knew how to identifythat or define that feeling.
And so when I did go to tSB,all the mentors around me,
even if they weren'tin a specific group
that I constantlywas with, they always
gave me that spaceand the capacity
(09:34):
to explore differentidentities that I might
identify with or helpme define this feeling
or define this certain identityand then claim it as my own.
But also, I think they reallychallenged me to really think
if this was what Ireally identified with,
or if it was something thatI just felt like I should
(09:54):
be identifying with.
Yeah, the whole idea ofnot being judged and not
having adults look down onyou or doubt what you say
was really nice.
SOPHIE (10:07):
I think that's a really great insight about ways
that we can show up foryoung people in our lives,
but also just for anypeople in our lives--
the importance oftruly listening.
REBECCA (10:17):
Thank you for just being so vulnerable and open
and sharing your journey throughfinding your own identity.
And I know it'llcontinue into the future.
But, yeah, thank you.
SOPHIE (10:29):
Thank you so much, Elaine.
ELAINE (10:31):
Thank you for having me.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (10:40):
All right, it's time for our word of the week.
We're going to share avocabulary word every episode
to help build a sharedterminology for talking
about trauma-informedcare practices.
Today we'll share adefinition for the term
"intersectionality."Intersectionality is the
complex cumulative wayin which the affects of multiple
forms of discrimination,such as racism,
(11:00):
sexism, and classism,combine, overlap, or
intersect, especiallyin the experiences of
marginalized individualsor groups.
Individuals with multiplemarginalized identities
experience compoundedoppression.
REBECCA (11:16):
Intersectionality just means that, depending
on our identities,our experiences in the
world affect us differently.
So for example, I identifyas an Asian woman.
And my experiences and the waythat I interact with the world
would be different fromSophie, who's a white woman.
We both identify as womenand experience sexism
in a patriarchal society.
But because I belong ina racial minority group--
(11:38):
specifically, in an Asiangroup-- my experience of sexism
is inherently racialized,and my flavor of racism
has sexist undertones to it.
This would look differentfor the type of overt racism
or microaggressions that anAsian man might experience
or people who hold adifferent set of identities.
SOPHIE (11:55):
Yeah.
So these are reallygreat examples of how just two
aspects of identityoverlap and shape our
experiences in the world.
Many other factors, likereligion, disability,
sexual orientation, bodysize, and socioeconomic class,
just to name a few,also intersect and shape
our experiences of bothprivilege and oppression.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
MAI LIN (12:18):
API Chaya is an organization
that empowers survivorsof gender-based violence
and human trafficking togain safety, connection,
and wellness.
Email that you canreach out to us on--
it's info@apichaya-- I-N-F-Oat A-P-I-C-H-A-Y-A dot org.
(12:43):
You can always callour office line.
The phone numberis 206-467-9976.
ROBERT (12:52):
You can also contact us on Instagram and Facebook.
SOPHIE (12:57):
So welcome back, Dr. Patton.
Tell us a bit about you.
STACEY PATTON (13:00):
Absolutely.
So my name is DoctorStacey Patton.
My pronouns are she and her.
I teach journalismat Howard University.
I am a award-winningjournalist and author
and nationallyrecognized child advocate
whose work focuses onthe intersections of race
and parenting, which means Italk a lot about how people
(13:24):
treat children,particularly their bodies
and their psychologicaldevelopment
through parenting strategiesand also teaching.
I am an anti-spanking activist.
I believe thatchildren should never
be hit because it shapesthe way their brains grow,
(13:45):
how they see themselves.
And so a lot of myactivism focuses on decolonizing
parenting and coming upwith healthier, non-violent
ways to raise childrenso that they can achieve
their optimal potential.
REBECCA (14:00):
I heard you mention intersectionality.
And this whole episode isabout intersectionality and
trauma-informed care.
So in your opinion, why isit important to consider
intersectionality when talkingabout trauma-informed care?
Intersectionality acknowledgesthat things like race, class,
gender, sexuality, ability,religion, even your body size
(14:21):
are all these overlappingidentities and experiences
which intersect to producemanifold kinds of oppression.
They can also beempowering, too.
But when we talk abouttrauma and oppression,
people are often disadvantagedby these multiple sources
(14:43):
of oppression.
And these identity markersdon't exist independently
of each other.
They inform the others, oftencreating a complex convergence
of oppression.
At the intersection is where thesocial, personal, and political
context of trauma getsexperienced by individuals--
(15:05):
so how people move through theworld, how they're treated,
the messages they receiveabout their humanity,
their possibilities,their potential.
And their personaland community history
all matters in this equation.
I often hear peoplesay, "What doesn't
kill you makes you stronger."That's absolutely not true.
(15:28):
What tries to kill you is aform of chronic stress, which
can have wear and tearon your nervous system,
on your immune system, onhow your brain operates.
And so both traumaand oppression
can impact the brainand body in similar ways
and change your view ofyourself and the world.
(15:49):
And so in my work, I'moften inviting people
to acknowledge thecentrality of the child
when we talk aboutintersectionality.
People often overlookchildhood and child experiences
when we talk aboutintersectionality-- so how
we treat children, howwe acknowledge childism
(16:09):
as a foundational part ofthis intersection of trauma
and oppression.
So when we do we talkabout intersectionality,
at the root of anyintersection of oppression
is the psychologicalmanipulation of children.
You can't perpetuate any ofthese macro forms of oppression
that we always talkabout without first
(16:30):
destroying children as soonas they enter the world.
The psychologicalmanipulation of children
is essentiallythe practical root
of all forms of oppression.
And so you can't accuratelydo intersectionality research,
activism, therapy, teachingwithout fully understanding
how children and childhoodfits into different forms
(16:54):
of oppression.
I loved how you framed the four F's
of trauma responses.
Can you give us arundown of those?
STACEY PATTON (17:01):
So fight, flight, freeze, and fawn.
So fight is all aboutself-preservation.
And it's about protectionwhen we're faced with threat.
So evolution haswired our bodies
with something called anamygdala, which is essentially
the body's built-inalarm system.
(17:24):
And you search for cuesin your environment
for any potential threat toyour body, safety, survival.
And so fighting is aboutdefending ourselves.
It's our desire to feelempowered at all costs.
And sometimes this happensthrough maladaptive strategies.
(17:47):
So if you've come froma stressful environment,
where you always hadto be in survival mode,
always had to fightand defend yourselves,
and then you change environmentsthat are more peaceful,
then it can bedifficult to transition
into a different kind of space.
So then there's flight.
(18:07):
This, too, is alsoabout protection
from pain or threats.
And people achievethis through escaping.
You see this with peoplewho are constantly worrying,
got a lot of anxiety.
They're panicking.
They can be leaders whomicromanage other people.
(18:27):
These are folks who arealways hyper vigilant, always
danger-mapping, lookingfor signs of threats.
And sometimes these people looklike folks who are workaholics.
They might be overachievers.
And so in socialsituations, these
are the kind of people that willphysically remove themselves.
And so they're reallyconflict-avoidant.
(18:48):
Then you've got freeze.
Freezing, like the othertwo, fight and flight,
is also about self-preservation.
But this happenswhen you dissociate.
So a lot of kids who experienceabuse will disassociate,
like take leave of your body.
So it's a way you space out.
(19:08):
You detach from the world.
You depersonalize.
You detach from yourself.
And this happens whenstress becomes so much
that you feel immobilized.
These kind of folkswill self-isolate,
have a hard timemaking decisions.
They might be passive.
They don't take risks.
(19:29):
And they have a hardtime setting goals.
And then the last is fawning.
So fawning is another waythat people, particularly
those in abusive situations,will try to self-preserve.
So these are the kind ofpeople who placate others.
These folks don'tknow how to say no.
They feel afraid to sharewhat they really think
(19:49):
and how they really feel.
They're always concerned withother people's perceptions
of them.
They're constantly anticipatingthe needs of other folks.
They want to fit in.
So fawning really islike, if I can please you,
if I can keep you happy,then that strategy
is going to make me feel safeand keep me safe from being
(20:12):
abandoned, rejected, hurt, feelany kind of conflict or pain.
So I'm cognizant ofthe four F's when
I'm teaching collegestudents because I know
that stressed-out brainsin fight or flight mode
have a difficult time learning.
And far too manystudents are growing up
in stressful family situations,neighborhoods, and also
(20:36):
schools, which are unfortunatelyanother zone of intimidation
and violence.
They are facingteachers who use fear
as a pedagogicalstrategy-- fear of failure,
fear of an unwanted callhome, fear of the teacher,
fear of ridicule.
And so I disagree with thatbecause fear compromises
(20:57):
the ability to learn.
When we feel threatened ineither one of these four F's
and experience fear, wedownshift to survival mode.
And students are lessable to learn effectively
because their primary focusis on self-protection.
REBECCA (21:14):
So what are some strategies
that you use to createsafe learning environments?
STACEY PATTON (21:18):
I strive to be an amygdala whisperer.
I try to picture thatpart of the brain.
I try to also picturetheir ventral vagal--
vagus nerve, thisthing that's running
through the center of thebody and really touches
all the organs.
I try to be careful withthose areas of the body
(21:38):
and realize that all mystudents come into my classroom
with all of these histories.
I'm careful about howI introduce myself
to my students on day one.
I'm cognizant aboutmy tone of voice,
making eye contact withstudents-- just very
basic things.
I create tribal-- a tribalclassroom, where we are family.
(22:01):
We're a community.
I'm sort of like auntie.
And so I always doverbal check-ins,
whether I'm teachingonline or in person,
to see how everybody is.
I call names.
So it lets my studentsknow, I see you.
You matter.
I'm glad you're here.
Physical check-ins aswell-- sometimes we'll
(22:21):
stretch, do little exercisesto get the blood flow moving.
I also do guided meditationat the beginning of class.
So it's like five minutesof guided meditation
and [? choral ?]music I'll play.
I keep juice boxes,snacks, things like that
in the classroom becausehave longer classrooms--
class sessions-- thatare like three hours--
(22:44):
little stress balls,things that are tactile,
sometimes adult coloring books.
And so beyond these sorts oflittle things that you do,
I try to take time tobuild relationships
with my individual students.
I give them directionsand feedback in ways
that they'll respond to well.
(23:05):
I always convey respectand transparency
by giving them reasons behindwhy we're doing what we're
doing, if there's any changes.
I avoid power struggleswith students and escalating
behavior.
And I provide predictability anduse positive attention as well.
(23:27):
So it's all aboutmaking my students feel
heard and validated andsafe in their own bodies.
And then once they feelsafe in their own bodies,
then they take a risk ofbeing vulnerable and being
open to learning something newand committing to the journey.
SOPHIE (23:48):
Wonderful.
Doctor Patton, thank you so muchfor being here with us today.
STACEY PATTON (23:53):
Well, thank you so much for having me.
I really appreciate beinginvited to the conversation.
SINGER (23:58):
(SINGING) Please don't let me drown.
Please don't let me drown.
STACEY PATTON (24:03):
The Ida B. Wells Textbook Fund
provides textbooks to HBCUstudents who are cash-strapped.
So if you'd like to make adonation to help the students,
you can just go GoFundMe andenter the Ida B Wells Textbook
Fund to support.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (24:26):
So our next guests are from an organization called
API Chaya.
So welcome.
ROBERT (24:32):
Thank you.
My name is Robert.
I use they/them pronouns.
I get to be one of the youthprogram coordinators and youth
organizers at API Chaya.
MAI LIN (24:40):
Hi, everyone.
My name is Mai Lin.
I use they/them pronouns, and Iget to be the Youth and Family
Advocate at API Chaya.
SOPHIE (24:49):
I know that at API Chaya,
you work really hard todismantle violent systems,
and understandingintersectionality
is really key to that.
I'm curious tohear, Mai Lin, how
do these topics of raceand intersectionality
show up in your work with youth?
MAI LIN (25:05):
Ooh.
My answer to thatquestion is always,
how do they not show up, right?
Race is such a hugetopic within America,
but it is a worldwide--white supremacy is so
pervasive within our world.
And so I see it all the time,because within API Chaya,
(25:26):
most of the folksthat we work with
are folks who identify asAsian, Pacific Islander, folks
who identify as immigrants,because we have folks who
have been in America fora while, for generations,
and we have otherfolks who are coming in as newer
generations, who havea different relationship to what
racism looks like in America.
(25:47):
In my work with youthwhat's important
for me is to alwaysname that race
is very present in mywork, modeling for them
what accountabilitylooks like when
I talk about racism, when Italk about intersectionality--
that I'm seeing alltheir identities.
Everything that they areis being witnessed and seen
(26:08):
and highlighted, and sowanting to provide that space
and container for youth toreally identify and name
what their identitiesare to themselves.
REBECCA (26:19):
So, Robert, how do you approach
these topics ofrace and identity
when talking with youth?
ROBERT (26:24):
A huge part is really naming and acknowledging it.
As a Filipino-Americanperson, I know
I move through the worldas a person of color,
and then people willsee me that way.
I get the sense thata lot of young people
are giving us a testof, can I trust you?
As we all do as atypical human thing-- can
I trust you with acertain part of me?
(26:46):
And because of thedifferent conditions
of the structures of whitesupremacy and racism,
a lot of youth of colorare going to be checking,
is this part of me, this hugepart of me, safe with you?
And so for me, I model,I feel safe bringing this
into our conversation andinto our relationship.
Oftentimes I find myselfin my work sometimes
bringing in the strange,awkward, hard topic that people
(27:08):
aren't wanting to talk about.
And often the adultsin their lives
are afraid or are unsurehow to bring it up.
It's OK that things arecomplicated around race.
It's OK that that'sactually-- might
be a fun-- a funny thingto bring up in this space.
Hiding it is actually a tacticof prolonging the violence
in every case.
(27:29):
And then the other pieceis getting really curious.
And Mai Lin is sucha role model for me
of showing excitement andcuriosity for a young person's
lived experience.
And I really try tolean in in my growing
edge of showing curiosity ina young person's experience
and really asking them, canI bring this up with you?
I'm curious aboutthis in your life.
REBECCA (27:50):
Yeah, I think that that respect
for the individualperson's dignity
and giving all of thatchoice and curiosity
is a really beautiful partof the work that you all do.
I'm curious to hear differentways that you help make sure
that the young peoplethat you're working with
feel this sense of safety andfeeling seen and supported.
MAI LIN (28:11):
In my work, I do a lot of case management
with young folks.
And a lot of them areconnecting with me
because they'rewanting to look for,
let's say, a counselor, right?
They're highlightingtheir mental health needs
and are really wanting to seeksupport in finding someone.
And so often, thequestion that I ask them
(28:34):
is, what therapistwould you like?
What identities wouldyou like them to hold?
And I think that that'sone way that I really
make sure that a young person'sidentity is seen and supported.
The other thing I would nameis that, yes, curiosity.
Yes, all informationa young person
tells you is sacred information.
(28:58):
They are being vulnerablewith you, a stranger.
A person who they have not grownup with comes into their life
and starts telling themthis and this and this
and this is what weshould work on, right?
That shouldn't be the case.
It should be, what doyou want to work on?
What information do youfeel is important for me
(29:19):
in my work with you so thatyou are driving that steering
wheel?
And so, yes, get curious.
Get excited.
When a young personis like, this is what my culture
does, and I love it,hell, yeah, keep
doing it, you know?
Be in wonder.
Be in curiositywith young people.
(29:41):
I do know that, Robert, youhave a really beautiful way
of talking about thestructural shifts
that we discuss with youth.
Do you want to share alittle bit about that?
ROBERT (29:53):
The realities of structural racism
and white supremacy is thatit shapes material conditions.
I have worked with a lotof young Asian and young
Black youth.
There's a lot of waysin which their family
life, their schoolsthat they go to,
the resources that they knowthat they can access are just--
(30:13):
are so different froma white young person.
It's my charge tosupport young folks
in mobilizing to changethose material conditions
and also do my part as anolder person in their life to
really advocatewhere I go, wherever
is strategic and useful,to address those needs.
If there's a needin a young person's
(30:34):
life for their families tohave culturally relevant and
language-accessible health careand mental health care, then
I-- then that'sactually a charge for me
to actually push forthat and make sure
that there are structuresand institutions that
are supporting that.
If our work stays withindirect one-on-one service
and doesn't lead towardsshifts in material conditions
(30:56):
in our communities, then we'renot working ourselves out
of a job.
And it's an endless loop thatwe're never going to really
be able to address at the root.
REBECCA (31:05):
Absolutely.
So thank you bothfor being here today
and for being partof our podcast.
That was beautiful.
Thank you.
[MUSIC PLAYING]Strategy Spotlight
is a time for usto share something you could
implement in your programor classroom.
Our Strategy Spotlight todaycomes from Azure Savage.
Azure is the author ofthe book, You Failed Us--
(31:25):
Students of ColorTalk Seattle Schools.
He also leadsworkshops for educators
on creating safe classroomsfor students of color.
Let's listen as hedescribes the strategy
of radical welcome,radical support,
and radical empowerment.
AZURE SAVAGE (31:41):
Radical welcome-- and all these are
radical, because whenyou're fighting
against such a stronglyingrained racist system, you
have to be radical about it.
It can't be halfway done.
It has to be all inand do it radically.
So radical welcome is theidea that from the moment
a student walks in yourdoor on the first day,
you welcome them.
(32:01):
You ask them their name.
You ask them how they are.
You bring them intothe room immediately.
And you don't justdo it that first day.
You do it every day.
You continue makingsure that they
know that they are inthat room for a reason
and that theybelong in that room.
Radical support is reallyabout building a relationship
with your students, so youknow how to support them.
(32:22):
I get this questiona lot from teachers
who I talked to atmy school about,
how do I support a studentgoing through a hard time
when I barely know them?
I'm like, well,your first mistake
is that you barely know them.
You need to build some sortof foundational relationship
with your student so that,one, they can feel comfortable
coming to you,and, two, you feel
comfortable coming to them.
(32:42):
And of course you're goingto have a struggle with this
if you don't know them.
Another part ofradical support is
that it needs to be consensual.
You can't forcesupport on a student.
And if they areclearly like, this
is uncomfortable, you havegot to take a step back,
because if they don't wantyou in their business,
you trying to getinto their business
is just going to makethings a lot worse.
(33:03):
And the last piece ofthis-- radical empowerment.
We've really workedin this workshop to reframe the
idea of empowermentfrom giving someone power
to giving someone a reasonto see their own power and to
understand that they alreadyhave the power, because you
don't need to give them power,because they already have it.
They just don't-- they mightnot see it, but they have it.
(33:24):
And this idea that teacherscan do this in so many ways.
They can do thisthrough affirmations.
They can do this throughwriting a little note on a test,
like, "You did a great job."I love those notes.
And you feel empowered.
And it's not like they're theones needing to give you power,
because you're like,oh, I just did that.
I did it on my own, and Icould continue doing that.
Those, for me, I think arereally great foundational tools
(33:47):
to direct the way an educatoreducates to make sure
that students of colorespecially feel like they
have a power in the classroom.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
SOPHIE (34:00):
As we wrap up this episode,
we'll leave you with afew reflection questions.
Part of building atrauma-informed care practice
is building ourown self-awareness,
so we can better show up forthe young people in our lives.
REBECCA (34:12):
Our first question is, there are so many things that
make up one's identity, likeage, disability, race, gender,
and more.
How would you describeyour own identity?
Next, thinking aboutsystemic racism
and structural oppressionand intersectionality,
what identities, privileges, andpositions of power do you hold?
And lastly, what issomething that you
(34:33):
can do to make sure differentaspects of young people's
identities are seen andsupported in your program?
SOPHIE (34:38):
For those of you listening
that are working directlywith young people,
either professionally orin your personal life,
we know that it takesvulnerability and bravery
to authentically show up todiscussions about privilege,
power, and identity.
We hope that hearingfrom our guests today
gives you the courageand additional vocabulary
you need to feelempowered to engage
in these discussionswith young people.
(35:00):
Remember, avoiding these topicsdoesn't make them go away.
The more we can acknowledgeand name these systems,
the more we can create changeand safety in our communities.
REBECCA (35:09):
This podcast was produced by Cultivate Learning
at the University of Washingtonwith funding from The Bonner
Group.
We'd like to thank our mediaproducers, Tifa Tomb and Ryan
Henriksen, and our graphicdesigner, Tami Tolpa.
You can find more ofCultivate Learning's work
by going tocultivatelearning.uw.edu.
[MUSIC PLAYING]
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