What happens when we break free from our reading comfort zones? Nita Creekmore, author of "Read Outside Your Bubble," returns to the Cultural Curriculum Chat podcast to explore this transformative question with host Jebeh Edmunds.
Creekmore's journey began as a Black little girl rarely seeing herself represented in books. "Oftentimes Black little girls were like the little sidekick or the little friend and then they kind of were in and then out of the story," she recalls. This experience fueled her passion for diverse literature and eventually led to her creating the hashtag #ReadOutsideYourBubble, which evolved into both her educational philosophy and the title of her thought-provoking book.
At the heart of Creekmore's approach is the LEAP framework: Learning (incorporating mirrors and windows), Equity (ensuring representation of marginalized stories), Accessibility (finding ways to obtain diverse books), and Purpose/Professional learning (intentional implementation). This comprehensive roadmap provides educators with practical strategies for building inclusive reading environments where all students feel seen and valued.
For teachers hesitant to incorporate diverse literature, Creekmore suggests starting with interactive read-alouds. "I feel like a read aloud is like the bridge," she explains, recommending teachers prepare thoughtful discussion questions and create space for student connections. She emphasizes that diverse books benefit all students—not just those from marginalized backgrounds—by expanding worldviews and fostering empathy.
Creekmore's wisdom extends beyond book selection to address classroom climate, offering insights on community building, professional learning through peer observation, and advocacy strategies like grant writing for book acquisition. Her approach balances scholarly understanding with practical implementation, making inclusive literature accessible to any educator willing to begin the journey.
Follow Nita Creekmore @LoveTeachBless across social platforms and subscribe to her blog at www.love-teach-bless.com
for ongoing inspiration as you expand your own reading bubble and help others do the same.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome back to the Culture Kicklimb Chat podcast.
I'm your host, jeva Edmonds,and today's episode is all about
the power of reading beyond ourcomfort zone.
And I have in the guest chairMrs Nita Creekmore, the author
of Read Outside your Bubble.
And if you have been a ride ordie listener of the podcast,
(00:23):
nita is making her second roundin the guest chair.
So excited to have Nita.
And if you are new, nitaCreekmore is an educator, a
literacy advocate, aninstructional coach and author
of this new thought-provokingbook called Read Outside your
Bubble.
We're going to be diving intowhy diversifying your bookshelf
(00:46):
matters and how to embrace thediscomfort that can come with it
, and what it really looks liketo build a reading life rooted
in empathy and inclusion.
And before we jump in, I've gota little announcement myself.
I have created my first debutnovel, the Orange Blossom, and
(01:08):
that debuts this fall.
So be sure to check in the shownotes for signing up to be in
that email list group so youknow early release dates and
some really fun literary eventsthat are going to be happening
with the book.
So I am so excited.
Without further ado, let's getinto this rich conversation.
(01:29):
Welcome back to the guest chair, mrs Nita Creekmore.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Welcome my dear, I'm so, so excited to be here, so
excited.
Thank you and you were justtalking about.
I was on this podcast probably.
I feel like it was like twoyears ago.
Yep Two years ago, right aroundthis time Right around this
time, and so we're back.
I'm back in the seat again.
That makes me happy, okay, somaybe what I said before
(01:56):
resonated, that I can come backagain, then again, and again,
and again.
Yes, I'm happy.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Oh, thank you.
And you know, nita, your bookhas me.
I have it dog-eared.
I got it all, like you know,highlighted and all the things I
mean there's some points where,but I love how you format this
book before we get into it.
It is such a wonderful readbecause we get to learn more
about you as a human being, asan educator, and your love
(02:27):
emanates through all of thesepages.
So I am so proud of you forwriting this book.
And I also know if we were inthe same state, same classroom
building, teaching fifth grade,you'd be my like fifth grade
teacher bestie.
But you know that's anotherepisode for another day.
So let's get into it.
Ms Nina, what sparked the ideaof reading outside your bubble?
(02:48):
Was there an experience thatreally pushed you to write this
book?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
You know I talk about my why in my book a lot,
because as a Black little girlgrowing up, I just didn't see a
lot of books of little Blacklittle girls who look like me as
being like the main characterin the story.
Oftentimes, you know, blacklittle girls were like the
(03:13):
little sidekick or the littlefriend and then they kind of
were in and then out of thestory.
And I think, with there hasbeen an influx in diverse books
in the past few years.
I would say in the past 15, 10to 15 years it's been like an
influx of diverse books, not asmuch as it needs to be, I would
say are kind of on the lower endof the publishing market.
(03:36):
But I will say this it's beenso much richness in books that I
discover.
And so this reading outside yourbubble, I would say I started
posting about more diverse books.
My love for it was since college, but I started posting more and
more about it in about 2016, 17on my page, on my Love Teach
(03:57):
Bless page, and I started usingthe hashtag read outside your
bubble.
I made a shirt about it and thereason why I chose reading
outside your Bubble is because Ithink oftentimes people get
caught up in their own circleand we don't push the limits in
our reading and our growth.
And I would say, even for myself, you know, like I would want to
(04:20):
read because I hadn't learned alot about my African-American
history as much as I should havein school.
So I'm engulfing myself in thatwhich there's nothing wrong
with that because I did notlearn that in school and I want
to learn more about differentcultures, different identities,
the gender fluidity and justknowing more about that, about
the LGBTQIA plus community andlike just really grasping the
(04:44):
stories behind those identities.
And I, too, had to expand mybubble, right.
And so it's one of those thingsthat it started just me posting
and me just talking about it,me integrating that as me being
a coach, me being a teacherleader, me being a teacher in
classrooms.
That birthed Read Outside yourBubble.
(05:04):
And the funny thing is is thatI was asked to write the book
probably about two years beforeI actually did.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Really.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Yes.
And so I was like, oh, I hadjust.
I was already writing me and myhusband's other book, Every
Connection Matters, and I wasjust like I just don't know if I
have the bandwidth to do thatand that, and so I kind of took
a pause on it and then circledback around.
And when I circled back aroundI said I'm just going to do it
and I'm excited that I did.
(05:33):
It was very cathartic and, asyou said, like a lot of my
stories are in the book of justme as a kid me, me just in my
adult growth, of just mylearning, and so that burned
free outside your bubble and allof my chapters in there.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
I just love it and that's how I was connected to
your work is your Love Teach,bless.
You know life on social mediaand you gave me lots of ideas of
books that I could have used inmy classroom as well.
And your love for culturalresponsiveness in learning and
reading, because, like you said,text is in everything.
And to have that and also toexpand that bubble, because some
(06:15):
of us have oh, that's aparticular genre that I like to
read with my students, or, youknow, we only have this bin for
certain holidays and then we putthe bin away.
I love how you've got wonderfulstrategies you know to help us
educators and human beings, likeyou say, to expand that bubble
and open that leader.
(06:35):
You know ladder for learning aswell.
So you talk a lot about yourbook.
I love this framework that youcame up with, the LEAP framework
.
Can you share with ourlisteners and our viewers the
significance of this acronym?
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Yes.
So the LEAP framework is aframework I would say that I
birthed, but it's something thatI've been using for years that
I put a name to.
So the L is learning, andenmeshed in the learning is the
work from Dr Rudine Sims, bishopand thinking about.
I don't think you can readinclusive and diverse text
(07:10):
without thinking about her workJust thinking about mirrors and
windows and sliding glass doors.
And I enmeshed her work in theL part because I felt like it's
important of doing your ownlearning for yourself and how
you identify and making surethat that continues.
Like that's not something thatI'm saying when you're expanding
(07:32):
your bubble, that you lose anyparts of yourself while doing so
right, you can still be yourwhole self and all of its
intersections.
And also, you know, readoutside your bubble and learn
about other cultures and otherpeople outside the margins.
And I started with the L, solearning can look so different
(07:52):
for different people, but Ithink I believe my belief is
that a lot of the learning is inthe books that we read.
In the books that we read inthe conversations that we have
with other people, in theauthentic relationships that we
build with other people, becauseI also built that into my book
about you can't do this workwithout relationship and
community, and part of that isthat learning piece.
(08:15):
Yes, read books, but expandingyour world is expanding those
relationships as well, and Ibecome a better person in
expanding my relationships.
And so that's the L.
The E is equity and making surethat this is for everybody, that
ensuring the diversity of allpeople, especially those that
(08:38):
fall along the margins, you know, the ones that are often pushed
out of curriculum, pushed outand their stories are often not
told.
And making sure that we includea lot of different backgrounds
and perspective taking andstories.
You know, and I'm going to getto the A, but think about that.
(08:58):
I think about being a kid, andI'll talk about this too being a
kid and learning aboutcolonialism and learning
pilgrims and learning about that, and I remember distinctly
thinking and wondering where arepeople during this time yes,
you know like they're good, andas a kid, you know we did the
(09:20):
plays and we did, you know, andthen wondering about their
peoples.
Those are just questions thatit happens in your mind while
we're learning these things Likewhere's the other stories?
You know, where's the otherstories?
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
In making sure that equity, you know, is there.
The A is accessibility, and Iput access in there because we
have a lot of books in ourschools and we have a lot of
schools that don't have enoughbooks that are diverse and
inclusive, and so, and how canteachers, how can educators get
(10:03):
these books in the hands ofchildren?
Um, I offered off a couple ofdifferent you know places that
books can, that you can getbooks from, and it's getting
easier and easier to get books.
Like there's lots of grants youcan write, there's lots of
things, and it's just being justreally intentional and
proactive in that, making surethat you have access to diverse
(10:24):
literature and being intentionalabout that.
And then the P is purpose andprofessional learning, and the P
stands it's like a dualdefinition there, because you
have to root in that purpose,ground back into that purpose of
why you're doing what you'redoing, but also professional
learning piece.
That's just.
That's the coach in me of makingsure that we're teaching
(10:49):
teachers how to do this workeffectively and how to do this
work without causing harm, andso I think that's very important
.
I think everyone should be atthe table.
I think we should becollaborating on how we
integrate text effectively.
I think sometimes we don't vetbooks enough.
I think sometimes teachers arereading books without reading
(11:10):
them before they even put themin.
And I just think making surewe're being really super
intentional about our teachingand the work of culturally
responsive teaching and I'veseen so many times when we give
it the name and sometimesteachers are doing harm and we
don't, some of us don't realizethat that's happening and it
ends up happening.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
And you've got wonderful graphics.
You've got wonderfulfacilitation questions,
wonderful graphics, you've gotwonderful facilitation questions
and even that.
And I like I tell you, honey, Ihighlighted a bunch of stuff
but I don't want to give awaytoo much because I want people
to buy your book, but 10 ways tovet inclusive books.
And, like you said, I love howyou talked about with grants,
(11:51):
especially with the access piece.
When we are learning in ourday-to-day as teachers, we feel
like grant writing is somethingabove us in some way, like it's
a daunting task, like you know.
One extra thing to do.
And I love how you evenincluded all of these
organizations that are lookingand begging for teachers.
(12:13):
The money is there.
We can fill out a new classlist.
You know, sometimes when youget that, you know God bless
them.
The retired teachers you getall their free books.
It's like free can come with acost.
Yes, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
That's what I always say, yes, but also, you know,
like, yes, and you're talkingabout those grants, they become
my email all the time and, justlike a few months ago, I have a
ton of books.
I mean I've got to let me witha ton of books.
So it's not like I have a needfor them, because I either buy
them, and my husband just knowsthis is what happens.
(12:47):
He just said the other day wegot to do something about all
these books.
Like, what are we doing?
Like, are we going to getanother bookshelf?
Are we going to we gonna getanother bookshelf?
Are we gonna?
It has been asked the samequestion, same thing.
That's the thing.
But, um, just a couple monthsago I I saw that we need diverse
(13:07):
books, had a grant and it wasfor title one, schools, and I
ended up shooting the email tomy um media specialist and said,
hey, you know, this is a.
She looks like it's an easyright.
If you need help with anything,let me know.
Blah, blah, blah, we get thegrant and so she's like so
excited.
We get like $5,000 worth ofbooks added to her and they and
the, and the stipulation is theyhave to be diverse and
(13:31):
inclusive.
Yay, you know, she was excitedabout that I was excited about
that, and so when I say, youknow, grant writing used to be
because I'm aging myself, but 22years in education, grant
writing used to be moreextensive than it is today I
will say that.
But now it's like a form thatyou fill out, you say your why,
(13:52):
what's your reasoning, and thenyou can get free books sent to
you, and that's happened to mebefore when I was an
instructional coach.
We need diverse books.
Again Sent me boxes of books,right, and so it's just one of
those things that you have tojust find it, and I put lots of
resources in there foraccessibility to making sure.
Especially I will say in thistime yes, oh yeah, so, when God
(14:19):
placed it on my heart, this isthe time to write this book, and
my book came out March of thisyear.
This book is needed.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Big time.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
And I talk about banned books in one of my
chapters, because we need toread banned books and we need to
know policy.
We need to know what we need todo as educators and teachers to
be able to teach our childrenthe books that they need and the
history that they need to learn, and that's often through
(14:50):
picture books and books that areon the shelves right now.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
And you even have what I love about you you even
had a sample letter about thediscussions of the books that
you have and in sending it toparents, so there's no excuse.
You got the form letter.
It's right there with heart andempathy and equitable access to
these books and it's just likeI said, you've got a plethora of
(15:13):
resources in every singlechapter to say, yes, we need to
relearn.
And I love the discussion thatyou have with your own learning,
the L part of getting thatreframe of the banned books and
reframing that mindset to veryimportant books.
And why and I'm not going togive too much, but she quotes a
(15:34):
little Beyonce You'd be like, oh, yes, uh-huh, we want to be in
the VIB section.
Yes, so there's so many goodthings and I love how, because
you know, as I do, growing upwith that lack of representation
, like you said, and you touchon like Babysitter's Club, I'm
like, yes, that's when we hadJessie Like hey, jessie, she's
(15:55):
on the cover.
We have our own book and I tellyou I read that thing cover to
cover.
But I love how you've got and Isay we say this all day, but
you have visualization tools inthis book that make you in that
learning piece as an educator,to go back in your own life as a
learner, as a student, toreally see what was missing,
(16:19):
like you said, what was pushedaway.
What was missing, like you said, what was pushed away and what
did we not have our own accessto that as adults we're looking
for and, to my point too,there's so many teachers.
(16:40):
You know they think this as anew initiative and you know well
, I've done this unit plan and Ilove how you talked about World
War II, for example, andthere's so many perspectives and
attitudes on this, just theallied countries and other
voices that you yourself, as theeducator, researched about.
(17:01):
And that to me.
What do you say to thoseeducators that are seeing you
down the hall doing your thingand having that discussion with
your students but they're stillholding tight to that bubble.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Yeah, it's not easy.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
It's not easy, yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
You know, as a coach, there are teachers.
We call them resistant teachers.
Teachers, yes, resistant um tochange and and not just when you
see resistant teachers.
They're not just.
It's not just about inclusivebooks well, no, no, no oh yeah,
we've been doing it the waywe've been doing it.
You know, and you hear that alot.
(17:41):
And here's the thing when youask a teacher who is seemingly
resistant, do you think that allchildren, children should learn
?
and they always say yes theyalways say yes, do you think
that all children belong in yourclassroom now?
Yes, okay, and so to?
(18:03):
Once you get there, you're likeokay, so if that's the case,
then we need to be teaching allchildren and making sure that
they're represented in ourcurriculum.
Now I also talk about in mybook.
I have worked at apredominantly white school
before where I was the one ofthe only black teachers at fed
School.
Those also need those stories.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
Say it again yes, those students need to Same.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Yeah, and I would teach them about the stories and
I didn't have any put in Atthat time.
I had no pushback.
You know they love learning.
They wanted to learn about thedifferent perspectives and
backgrounds and stories thatthey hadn't learned about,
perspectives and backgrounds andstories that they hadn't
learned about, and so I sharethose real, that realness, with
love, right, and so I.
(18:50):
There was a time, I will behonest, where I used to get
really angry about the pushback,right, and now I can honestly
say that I do it with love.
And so one way, some of theways that you can do that is,
like you know, as a coach, I hadthe, I would say, privilege,
with quotes, to be in differentclassrooms, and so I would coach
(19:12):
the teachers and I wouldintentionally choose diverse
books to go along with whateverit is they're teaching, so they
can see me modeling withwhatever it is they're teaching,
so they can see me modelingwhat it can look like, by
integrating these books in yourcurriculum by way of interactive
read-aloud.
Let's say right, so you'relearning about colonialism.
(19:32):
Let's say third grade.
Third grade was like the sweetspot.
Oh yeah, oh yeah, I can stillsee the paper hats yes, Still
see the paper hats and still seethe little churning the butter,
all that whole thing.
Let's just let it go away.
Yes, got you.
But I would talk about, let'ssay, I bring in the book which
(19:55):
is a new book called Before theShips Talks about Africans
before they becameAfrican-American.
I think that's very essentialbecause as a child, if you only
hear about your culture as aBlack American, african-american
, as you began with slavery, itdoes sound silly.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
It does.
Oh yes, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Not that we're trying to push out that history.
The history is there, we knowit, we feel it, even 300 years
later.
However, I need to hear beforethe ships, because I need to
know where my people came from.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Yes, and so if I hear that, I'm like, okay, so
they're not, okay, so they'renot.
We were kings and queens, wedid have our own language and we
had our own customs.
We had, you know, we're overhere thriving, and then we were
brought.
So, hearing that, and then wewere brought over, just like you
talk about before the 13colonies where they were before
(20:58):
they came over here in the third, you know, and so then I get
the whole story, because thenyou want me to talk about Native
peoples.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
So before.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Kali what they got going on over here.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Different perspectives in one lesson,
right.
But you can start by way ofinteractive read aloud, right.
I feel, like a read aloud islike the, like the bridge, and
so once you start withinteractive read aloud, then you
can begin to do even more withit.
Right, but if someone isapprehensive, beginning with
(21:33):
interactive read aloud is likeokay, I can read a lot of book,
okay, so how can you make aninteractive?
Let's read the book beforehand.
I can't stress that enoughbecause I've seen so many.
I'm someone that's bringing acold read as an adult.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
Oh, yeah, oh yes, I love interacting.
I'm in front of kids.
You can't do it, you got toread it.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
Yeah, I'm going to read the book and so, like you
know, you read the bookbeforehand.
You think about okay, thiswould probably be a good
discussion point.
Let me think about a reallythoughtful question that might
kind of birth some gooddiscussion that goes along, or
already learning about Right, Iwould say three to four stopping
(22:19):
points where you're going topause and ask a question.
Stopping point where you'regoing to pause and ask a
question, and if you've everworked for kids with two days,
they're gonna pause you anywaythey're gonna, oh, yes, your
hand in the midst of your readaloud, especially if they have
lots of connections, and sothat's a.
Really I feel like you know less, I guess stressful not
(22:39):
stressful to me, but for someteachers might be stressful less
stressful read aloud option.
That's kind of like the bridgeand the discussion and the kids
collaborating and discussing andhaving these rich conversations
.
You'll want to do more.
You're not going to do thismore, right?
If a class, a quiet classroom,is a scary classroom, we need to
(23:04):
be energized.
Discussion and collaboration,and so I feel like that's the
bridge.
That's how I would offer up toa teacher I might be like where
do I begin?
How do I start?
You know modeling and also, ifyou have a coach in your school,
(23:26):
the best professional learningis a teacher that's doing it
well.
Coverage Go to see anotherteacher in action doing this
work.
Take notes.
Think about her.
They're questioning His or herquestioning or they're
questioning.
Think about what books that'requestioning his or her question
or their questioning.
Think about what books thatthey have on their shelves.
Look around their room, yes, tosee the community that's built,
(23:50):
the space that's built Tosomeone who's doing this work
well.
It doesn't just start withbooks, it started way before
that part.
Yes, no-transcript.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
Oh, that's so powerful, nita.
And I love how in the book youtalk about your community
meetings.
You know I used to do classroommorning meetings and stuff.
I used to say, oh, my classroomcommunity.
But I love how you switch thatto community building, community
meetings.
It didn't have to be in themorning, but just real quick
checkpoints sitting on the floorcalling your fifth grade
(24:40):
seniors of the school.
I'm like, oh yes, and you dothat.
And I love how you talk aboutyour past teachers in your life
and how they took care of youand how you took that to heart.
You know, and again it's justlike, yeah, you are, we are
vibing.
I just love, love this book.
(25:01):
So for someone we talked aboutjust starting to build their
diverse bookshelf go-to tips,like you said, we can get grants
.
I always love too that you evensaid of what can I do to keep
moving forward with those VIBbooks.
You know, if you have a littlefree library in your
neighborhood, put some in there.
And I love how you go going toyour school board and you know
(25:22):
there's so many things that wecan do to have that action into
having more inclusive books.
But before we go, where can wefind your amazing work, and I'm
going to put your link of yourbook in the show notes as well,
because we need you to have thisbook.
So where can we find nita creek?
Speaker 2 (25:42):
more sphere of awesomeness I um, I probably
have too many socials, but I amvery active on instagram.
That's probably like the placewhere I kind of start my work is
instagram.
Love teach, bless.
I am tiptoeing into blue sky,so I say tiptoe because I forget
(26:04):
about it, and then I'm like, oh, I want to post it, and then I
also want threads.
Love Teach Bless.
Facebook, love Teach Bless.
So you can like, my studentsdid this year.
Oh, that's a whole nothercontent.
You can Google me and they did.
And I'm like, okay, we're notdoing that right now.
(26:25):
We're learning hello hilarious,oh my goodness but, um, love
teach blesscom is, um, where I Ido blog on there fairly often,
um, and so those are differentplaces you can find me.
And then I would also love forpeople to subscribe to my email.
Subscribe, subscribe to my blog.
So when you get my blog and yousubscribe, anytime I post it
(26:45):
comes to your email and then Ialso send emails out as well
where you can subscribe.
But I love people and soanytime you message me, it's me
behind there messaging you back.
Every time it's nobody else,it's Nita messaging you.
I love to help people.
People have messaged me andasked for help of how to become
a coach, how to integrate booksmore, and I am very open to that
(27:11):
as well.
People want to bring me totheir schools all these things.
So please, please, be a part ofmy Love Teach Bless community.
I don't look at it as followers.
You're people that just supportmy work and I'm so blessed and
grateful for everyone.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
And we're blessed to have you in our sphere and you
just have.
You exude positivity and loveof learning and reading and I
can't wait for folks to get yourbook.
This would be amazing in ourPLCs everybody and our
institutes that we have going on.
June is right around the cornerand this is an amazing read.
(27:48):
Nita, I am so proud of you andI am so happy and blessed that
you are in my life as a reallysweet friend and encourager and
a fellow author.
I am just so, so proud of youand keep doing what you're doing
.
I will continue to support yourwork.
And yes, what an amazingconversation we had this
afternoon.
I hope you are feeling inspired, everyone, as you just get to
(28:12):
read a little deeper and widerand expand your bubble Outside.
Your Bubble is a must-have foranyone who wants to grow as a
reader, an educator and anoverall great human being.
And I hope, if you love thisepisode, don't forget to follow
and leave a review, and it helpsour podcast reach way more
(28:33):
people about culture, equity,education and connection.
And again, thank you, Nita, forjoining us and thank you all
for listening.
We'll see you here same timenext week.
Welcome back to the Culture Kicklimb Chat podcast.
I'm your host, jeva Edmonds,and today's episode is all about
the power of reading beyond ourcomfort zone.
And I have in the guest chairMrs Nita Creekmore, the author
of Read Outside your Bubble.
And if you have been a ride ordie listener of the podcast,
(00:23):
nita is making her second roundin the guest chair.
So excited to have Nita.
And if you are new, nitaCreekmore is an educator, a
literacy advocate, aninstructional coach and author
of this new thought-provokingbook called Read Outside your
Bubble.
We're going to be diving intowhy diversifying your bookshelf
(00:46):
matters and how to embrace thediscomfort that can come with it
, and what it really looks liketo build a reading life rooted
in empathy and inclusion.
And before we jump in, I've gota little announcement myself.
I have created my first debutnovel, the Orange Blossom, and
(01:08):
that debuts this fall.
So be sure to check in the shownotes for signing up to be in
that email list group so youknow early release dates and
some really fun literary eventsthat are going to be happening
with the book.
So I am so excited.
Without further ado, let's getinto this rich conversation.
(01:29):
Welcome back to the guest chair, mrs Nita Creekmore.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Welcome my dear, I'm so, so excited to be here, so
excited.
Thank you and you were justtalking about.
I was on this podcast probably.
I feel like it was like twoyears ago.
Yep Two years ago, right aroundthis time Right around this
time, and so we're back.
I'm back in the seat again.
That makes me happy, okay, somaybe what I said before
(01:56):
resonated, that I can come backagain, then again, and again,
and again.
Yes, I'm happy.
Speaker 1 (02:03):
Oh, thank you.
And you know, nita, your bookhas me.
I have it dog-eared.
I got it all, like you know,highlighted and all the things I
mean there's some points where,but I love how you format this
book before we get into it.
It is such a wonderful readbecause we get to learn more
about you as a human being, asan educator, and your love
(02:27):
emanates through all of thesepages.
So I am so proud of you forwriting this book.
And I also know if we were inthe same state, same classroom
building, teaching fifth grade,you'd be my like fifth grade
teacher bestie.
But you know that's anotherepisode for another day.
So let's get into it.
Ms Nina, what sparked the ideaof reading outside your bubble?
(02:48):
Was there an experience thatreally pushed you to write this
book?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
You know I talk about my why in my book a lot,
because as a Black little girlgrowing up, I just didn't see a
lot of books of little Blacklittle girls who look like me as
being like the main characterin the story.
Oftentimes, you know, blacklittle girls were like the
(03:13):
little sidekick or the littlefriend and then they kind of
were in and then out of thestory.
And I think, with there hasbeen an influx in diverse books
in the past few years.
I would say in the past 15, 10to 15 years it's been like an
influx of diverse books, not asmuch as it needs to be, I would
say are kind of on the lower endof the publishing market.
(03:36):
But I will say this it's beenso much richness in books that I
discover.
And so this reading outside yourbubble, I would say I started
posting about more diverse books.
My love for it was since college, but I started posting more and
more about it in about 2016, 17on my page, on my Love Teach
(03:57):
Bless page, and I started usingthe hashtag read outside your
bubble.
I made a shirt about it and thereason why I chose reading
outside your Bubble is because Ithink oftentimes people get
caught up in their own circleand we don't push the limits in
our reading and our growth.
And I would say, even for myself, you know, like I would want to
(04:20):
read because I hadn't learned alot about my African-American
history as much as I should havein school.
So I'm engulfing myself in thatwhich there's nothing wrong
with that because I did notlearn that in school and I want
to learn more about differentcultures, different identities,
the gender fluidity and justknowing more about that, about
the LGBTQIA plus community andlike just really grasping the
(04:44):
stories behind those identities.
And I, too, had to expand mybubble, right.
And so it's one of those thingsthat it started just me posting
and me just talking about it,me integrating that as me being
a coach, me being a teacherleader, me being a teacher in
classrooms.
That birthed Read Outside yourBubble.
(05:04):
And the funny thing is is thatI was asked to write the book
probably about two years beforeI actually did.
Speaker 1 (05:11):
Really.
Speaker 2 (05:12):
Yes.
And so I was like, oh, I hadjust.
I was already writing me and myhusband's other book, Every
Connection Matters, and I wasjust like I just don't know if I
have the bandwidth to do thatand that, and so I kind of took
a pause on it and then circledback around.
And when I circled back aroundI said I'm just going to do it
and I'm excited that I did.
(05:33):
It was very cathartic and, asyou said, like a lot of my
stories are in the book of justme as a kid me, me just in my
adult growth, of just mylearning, and so that burned
free outside your bubble and allof my chapters in there.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
I just love it and that's how I was connected to
your work is your Love Teach,bless.
You know life on social mediaand you gave me lots of ideas of
books that I could have used inmy classroom as well.
And your love for culturalresponsiveness in learning and
reading, because, like you said,text is in everything.
And to have that and also toexpand that bubble, because some
(06:15):
of us have oh, that's aparticular genre that I like to
read with my students, or, youknow, we only have this bin for
certain holidays and then we putthe bin away.
I love how you've got wonderfulstrategies you know to help us
educators and human beings, likeyou say, to expand that bubble
and open that leader.
(06:35):
You know ladder for learning aswell.
So you talk a lot about yourbook.
I love this framework that youcame up with, the LEAP framework
.
Can you share with ourlisteners and our viewers the
significance of this acronym?
Speaker 2 (06:50):
Yes.
So the LEAP framework is aframework I would say that I
birthed, but it's something thatI've been using for years that
I put a name to.
So the L is learning, andenmeshed in the learning is the
work from Dr Rudine Sims, bishopand thinking about.
I don't think you can readinclusive and diverse text
(07:10):
without thinking about her workJust thinking about mirrors and
windows and sliding glass doors.
And I enmeshed her work in theL part because I felt like it's
important of doing your ownlearning for yourself and how
you identify and making surethat that continues.
Like that's not something thatI'm saying when you're expanding
(07:32):
your bubble, that you lose anyparts of yourself while doing so
right, you can still be yourwhole self and all of its
intersections.
And also, you know, readoutside your bubble and learn
about other cultures and otherpeople outside the margins.
And I started with the L, solearning can look so different
(07:52):
for different people, but Ithink I believe my belief is
that a lot of the learning is inthe books that we read.
In the books that we read inthe conversations that we have
with other people, in theauthentic relationships that we
build with other people, becauseI also built that into my book
about you can't do this workwithout relationship and
community, and part of that isthat learning piece.
(08:15):
Yes, read books, but expandingyour world is expanding those
relationships as well, and Ibecome a better person in
expanding my relationships.
And so that's the L.
The E is equity and making surethat this is for everybody, that
ensuring the diversity of allpeople, especially those that
(08:38):
fall along the margins, you know, the ones that are often pushed
out of curriculum, pushed outand their stories are often not
told.
And making sure that we includea lot of different backgrounds
and perspective taking andstories.
You know, and I'm going to getto the A, but think about that.
(08:58):
I think about being a kid, andI'll talk about this too being a
kid and learning aboutcolonialism and learning
pilgrims and learning about that, and I remember distinctly
thinking and wondering where arepeople during this time yes,
you know like they're good, andas a kid, you know we did the
(09:20):
plays and we did, you know, andthen wondering about their
peoples.
Those are just questions thatit happens in your mind while
we're learning these things Likewhere's the other stories?
You know, where's the otherstories?
Speaker 1 (09:40):
Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2 (09:42):
In making sure that equity, you know, is there.
The A is accessibility, and Iput access in there because we
have a lot of books in ourschools and we have a lot of
schools that don't have enoughbooks that are diverse and
inclusive, and so, and how canteachers, how can educators get
(10:03):
these books in the hands ofchildren?
Um, I offered off a couple ofdifferent you know places that
books can, that you can getbooks from, and it's getting
easier and easier to get books.
Like there's lots of grants youcan write, there's lots of
things, and it's just being justreally intentional and
proactive in that, making surethat you have access to diverse
(10:24):
literature and being intentionalabout that.
And then the P is purpose andprofessional learning, and the P
stands it's like a dualdefinition there, because you
have to root in that purpose,ground back into that purpose of
why you're doing what you'redoing, but also professional
learning piece.
That's just.
That's the coach in me of makingsure that we're teaching
(10:49):
teachers how to do this workeffectively and how to do this
work without causing harm, andso I think that's very important
.
I think everyone should be atthe table.
I think we should becollaborating on how we
integrate text effectively.
I think sometimes we don't vetbooks enough.
I think sometimes teachers arereading books without reading
(11:10):
them before they even put themin.
And I just think making surewe're being really super
intentional about our teachingand the work of culturally
responsive teaching and I'veseen so many times when we give
it the name and sometimesteachers are doing harm and we
don't, some of us don't realizethat that's happening and it
ends up happening.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
And you've got wonderful graphics.
You've got wonderfulfacilitation questions,
wonderful graphics, you've gotwonderful facilitation questions
and even that.
And I like I tell you, honey, Ihighlighted a bunch of stuff
but I don't want to give awaytoo much because I want people
to buy your book, but 10 ways tovet inclusive books.
And, like you said, I love howyou talked about with grants,
(11:51):
especially with the access piece.
When we are learning in ourday-to-day as teachers, we feel
like grant writing is somethingabove us in some way, like it's
a daunting task, like you know.
One extra thing to do.
And I love how you evenincluded all of these
organizations that are lookingand begging for teachers.
(12:13):
The money is there.
We can fill out a new classlist.
You know, sometimes when youget that, you know God bless
them.
The retired teachers you getall their free books.
It's like free can come with acost.
Yes, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (12:27):
That's what I always say, yes, but also, you know,
like, yes, and you're talkingabout those grants, they become
my email all the time and, justlike a few months ago, I have a
ton of books.
I mean I've got to let me witha ton of books.
So it's not like I have a needfor them, because I either buy
them, and my husband just knowsthis is what happens.
(12:47):
He just said the other day wegot to do something about all
these books.
Like, what are we doing?
Like, are we going to getanother bookshelf?
Are we going to we gonna getanother bookshelf?
Are we gonna?
It has been asked the samequestion, same thing.
That's the thing.
But, um, just a couple monthsago I I saw that we need diverse
(13:07):
books, had a grant and it wasfor title one, schools, and I
ended up shooting the email tomy um media specialist and said,
hey, you know, this is a.
She looks like it's an easyright.
If you need help with anything,let me know.
Blah, blah, blah, we get thegrant and so she's like so
excited.
We get like $5,000 worth ofbooks added to her and they and
the, and the stipulation is theyhave to be diverse and
(13:31):
inclusive.
Yay, you know, she was excitedabout that I was excited about
that, and so when I say, youknow, grant writing used to be
because I'm aging myself, but 22years in education, grant
writing used to be moreextensive than it is today I
will say that.
But now it's like a form thatyou fill out, you say your why,
(13:52):
what's your reasoning, and thenyou can get free books sent to
you, and that's happened to mebefore when I was an
instructional coach.
We need diverse books.
Again Sent me boxes of books,right, and so it's just one of
those things that you have tojust find it, and I put lots of
resources in there foraccessibility to making sure.
Especially I will say in thistime yes, oh yeah, so, when God
(14:19):
placed it on my heart, this isthe time to write this book, and
my book came out March of thisyear.
This book is needed.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Big time.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
And I talk about banned books in one of my
chapters, because we need toread banned books and we need to
know policy.
We need to know what we need todo as educators and teachers to
be able to teach our childrenthe books that they need and the
history that they need to learn, and that's often through
(14:50):
picture books and books that areon the shelves right now.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
And you even have what I love about you you even
had a sample letter about thediscussions of the books that
you have and in sending it toparents, so there's no excuse.
You got the form letter.
It's right there with heart andempathy and equitable access to
these books and it's just likeI said, you've got a plethora of
(15:13):
resources in every singlechapter to say, yes, we need to
relearn.
And I love the discussion thatyou have with your own learning,
the L part of getting thatreframe of the banned books and
reframing that mindset to veryimportant books.
And why and I'm not going togive too much, but she quotes a
(15:34):
little Beyonce You'd be like, oh, yes, uh-huh, we want to be in
the VIB section.
Yes, so there's so many goodthings and I love how, because
you know, as I do, growing upwith that lack of representation
, like you said, and you touchon like Babysitter's Club, I'm
like, yes, that's when we hadJessie Like hey, jessie, she's
(15:55):
on the cover.
We have our own book and I tellyou I read that thing cover to
cover.
But I love how you've got and Isay we say this all day, but
you have visualization tools inthis book that make you in that
learning piece as an educator,to go back in your own life as a
learner, as a student, toreally see what was missing,
(16:19):
like you said, what was pushedaway.
What was missing, like you said, what was pushed away and what
did we not have our own accessto that as adults we're looking
for and, to my point too,there's so many teachers.
(16:40):
You know they think this as anew initiative and you know well
, I've done this unit plan and Ilove how you talked about World
War II, for example, andthere's so many perspectives and
attitudes on this, just theallied countries and other
voices that you yourself, as theeducator, researched about.
(17:01):
And that to me.
What do you say to thoseeducators that are seeing you
down the hall doing your thingand having that discussion with
your students but they're stillholding tight to that bubble.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
Yeah, it's not easy.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
It's not easy, yeah.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
You know, as a coach, there are teachers.
We call them resistant teachers.
Teachers, yes, resistant um tochange and and not just when you
see resistant teachers.
They're not just.
It's not just about inclusivebooks well, no, no, no oh yeah,
we've been doing it the waywe've been doing it.
You know, and you hear that alot.
(17:41):
And here's the thing when youask a teacher who is seemingly
resistant, do you think that allchildren, children should learn
?
and they always say yes theyalways say yes, do you think
that all children belong in yourclassroom now?
Yes, okay, and so to?
(18:03):
Once you get there, you're likeokay, so if that's the case,
then we need to be teaching allchildren and making sure that
they're represented in ourcurriculum.
Now I also talk about in mybook.
I have worked at apredominantly white school
before where I was the one ofthe only black teachers at fed
School.
Those also need those stories.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Yes, yes.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (18:25):
Say it again yes, those students need to Same.
Speaker 2 (18:29):
Yeah, and I would teach them about the stories and
I didn't have any put in Atthat time.
I had no pushback.
You know they love learning.
They wanted to learn about thedifferent perspectives and
backgrounds and stories thatthey hadn't learned about,
perspectives and backgrounds andstories that they hadn't
learned about, and so I sharethose real, that realness, with
love, right, and so I.
(18:50):
There was a time, I will behonest, where I used to get
really angry about the pushback,right, and now I can honestly
say that I do it with love.
And so one way, some of theways that you can do that is,
like you know, as a coach, I hadthe, I would say, privilege,
with quotes, to be in differentclassrooms, and so I would coach
(19:12):
the teachers and I wouldintentionally choose diverse
books to go along with whateverit is they're teaching, so they
can see me modeling withwhatever it is they're teaching,
so they can see me modelingwhat it can look like, by
integrating these books in yourcurriculum by way of interactive
read-aloud.
Let's say right, so you'relearning about colonialism.
(19:32):
Let's say third grade.
Third grade was like the sweetspot.
Oh yeah, oh yeah, I can stillsee the paper hats yes, Still
see the paper hats and still seethe little churning the butter,
all that whole thing.
Let's just let it go away.
Yes, got you.
But I would talk about, let'ssay, I bring in the book which
(19:55):
is a new book called Before theShips Talks about Africans
before they becameAfrican-American.
I think that's very essentialbecause as a child, if you only
hear about your culture as aBlack American, african-american
, as you began with slavery, itdoes sound silly.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
It does.
Oh yes, oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Not that we're trying to push out that history.
The history is there, we knowit, we feel it, even 300 years
later.
However, I need to hear beforethe ships, because I need to
know where my people came from.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (20:36):
Yes, and so if I hear that, I'm like, okay, so
they're not, okay, so they'renot.
We were kings and queens, wedid have our own language and we
had our own customs.
We had, you know, we're overhere thriving, and then we were
brought.
So, hearing that, and then wewere brought over, just like you
talk about before the 13colonies where they were before
(20:58):
they came over here in the third, you know, and so then I get
the whole story, because thenyou want me to talk about Native
peoples.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
So before.
Speaker 2 (21:08):
Kali what they got going on over here.
Speaker 1 (21:11):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (21:12):
Different perspectives in one lesson,
right.
But you can start by way ofinteractive read aloud, right.
I feel, like a read aloud islike the, like the bridge, and
so once you start withinteractive read aloud, then you
can begin to do even more withit.
Right, but if someone isapprehensive, beginning with
(21:33):
interactive read aloud is likeokay, I can read a lot of book,
okay, so how can you make aninteractive?
Let's read the book beforehand.
I can't stress that enoughbecause I've seen so many.
I'm someone that's bringing acold read as an adult.
Speaker 1 (21:48):
Oh, yeah, oh yes, I love interacting.
I'm in front of kids.
You can't do it, you got toread it.
Speaker 2 (21:57):
Yeah, I'm going to read the book and so, like you
know, you read the bookbeforehand.
You think about okay, thiswould probably be a good
discussion point.
Let me think about a reallythoughtful question that might
kind of birth some gooddiscussion that goes along, or
already learning about Right, Iwould say three to four stopping
(22:19):
points where you're going topause and ask a question.
Stopping point where you'regoing to pause and ask a
question, and if you've everworked for kids with two days,
they're gonna pause you anywaythey're gonna, oh, yes, your
hand in the midst of your readaloud, especially if they have
lots of connections, and sothat's a.
Really I feel like you know less, I guess stressful not
(22:39):
stressful to me, but for someteachers might be stressful less
stressful read aloud option.
That's kind of like the bridgeand the discussion and the kids
collaborating and discussing andhaving these rich conversations
.
You'll want to do more.
You're not going to do thismore, right?
If a class, a quiet classroom,is a scary classroom, we need to
(23:04):
be energized.
Discussion and collaboration,and so I feel like that's the
bridge.
That's how I would offer up toa teacher I might be like where
do I begin?
How do I start?
You know modeling and also, ifyou have a coach in your school,
(23:26):
the best professional learningis a teacher that's doing it
well.
Coverage Go to see anotherteacher in action doing this
work.
Take notes.
Think about her.
They're questioning His or herquestioning or they're
questioning.
Think about what books that'requestioning his or her question
or their questioning.
Think about what books thatthey have on their shelves.
Look around their room, yes, tosee the community that's built,
(23:50):
the space that's built Tosomeone who's doing this work
well.
It doesn't just start withbooks, it started way before
that part.
Yes, no-transcript.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
Oh, that's so powerful, nita.
And I love how in the book youtalk about your community
meetings.
You know I used to do classroommorning meetings and stuff.
I used to say, oh, my classroomcommunity.
But I love how you switch thatto community building, community
meetings.
It didn't have to be in themorning, but just real quick
checkpoints sitting on the floorcalling your fifth grade
(24:40):
seniors of the school.
I'm like, oh yes, and you dothat.
And I love how you talk aboutyour past teachers in your life
and how they took care of youand how you took that to heart.
You know, and again it's justlike, yeah, you are, we are
vibing.
I just love, love this book.
(25:01):
So for someone we talked aboutjust starting to build their
diverse bookshelf go-to tips,like you said, we can get grants
.
I always love too that you evensaid of what can I do to keep
moving forward with those VIBbooks.
You know, if you have a littlefree library in your
neighborhood, put some in there.
And I love how you go going toyour school board and you know
(25:22):
there's so many things that wecan do to have that action into
having more inclusive books.
But before we go, where can wefind your amazing work, and I'm
going to put your link of yourbook in the show notes as well,
because we need you to have thisbook.
So where can we find nita creek?
Speaker 2 (25:42):
more sphere of awesomeness I um, I probably
have too many socials, but I amvery active on instagram.
That's probably like the placewhere I kind of start my work is
instagram.
Love teach, bless.
I am tiptoeing into blue sky,so I say tiptoe because I forget
(26:04):
about it, and then I'm like, oh, I want to post it, and then I
also want threads.
Love Teach Bless.
Facebook, love Teach Bless.
So you can like, my studentsdid this year.
Oh, that's a whole nothercontent.
You can Google me and they did.
And I'm like, okay, we're notdoing that right now.
(26:25):
We're learning hello hilarious,oh my goodness but, um, love
teach blesscom is, um, where I Ido blog on there fairly often,
um, and so those are differentplaces you can find me.
And then I would also love forpeople to subscribe to my email.
Subscribe, subscribe to my blog.
So when you get my blog and yousubscribe, anytime I post it
(26:45):
comes to your email and then Ialso send emails out as well
where you can subscribe.
But I love people and soanytime you message me, it's me
behind there messaging you back.
Every time it's nobody else,it's Nita messaging you.
I love to help people.
People have messaged me andasked for help of how to become
a coach, how to integrate booksmore, and I am very open to that
(27:11):
as well.
People want to bring me totheir schools all these things.
So please, please, be a part ofmy Love Teach Bless community.
I don't look at it as followers.
You're people that just supportmy work and I'm so blessed and
grateful for everyone.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
And we're blessed to have you in our sphere and you
just have.
You exude positivity and loveof learning and reading and I
can't wait for folks to get yourbook.
This would be amazing in ourPLCs everybody and our
institutes that we have going on.
June is right around the cornerand this is an amazing read.
(27:48):
Nita, I am so proud of you andI am so happy and blessed that
you are in my life as a reallysweet friend and encourager and
a fellow author.
I am just so, so proud of youand keep doing what you're doing
.
I will continue to support yourwork.
And yes, what an amazingconversation we had this
afternoon.
I hope you are feeling inspired, everyone, as you just get to
(28:12):
read a little deeper and widerand expand your bubble Outside.
Your Bubble is a must-have foranyone who wants to grow as a
reader, an educator and anoverall great human being.
And I hope, if you love thisepisode, don't forget to follow
and leave a review, and it helpsour podcast reach way more
(28:33):
people about culture, equity,education and connection.
And again, thank you, Nita, forjoining us and thank you all
for listening.
We'll see you here same timenext week.
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