October 8, 2025 • 24 mins
Cut The Tie Podcast with Evan Mestman
What if the very drive that made you successful is the same thing destroying your health? In this powerful episode of Cut The Tie, host Thomas Helfrich sits down with Evan Mestman, founder of ProAttitudes and a health transformation and leadership coach for high-performing executives.
After 20 years in corporate America—including a career that survived 9/11—Evan walked away from burnout to rebuild not just his body, but his purpose. Today, he helps business leaders who’ve “climbed the ladder but left their health on the bottom rung” reclaim their energy, reframe their mindset, and reawaken their leadership.
This conversation dives into the mental, emotional, and physical ties that hold many executives back—and how taming your inner critic might just save your life.
About Evan Mestman
Evan Mestman is the founder of ProAttitudes, a health transformation and leadership coaching company that helps executives lead with clarity, energy, and confidence. A certified nutritionist and diabetes educator, Evan’s career spans startups, leadership roles in medical device sales, and 20 years in corporate America. Today, he combines neuroscience, mindfulness, and behavioral science to help clients rewire their habits, strengthen their “attitude muscle,” and shift from burnout to balance.
In this episode, Thomas and Evan discuss:
- Climbing the ladder while losing your health
Why high-performing executives often leave their well-being behind—and how to climb back up before it’s too late. - Taming the inner critic
Evan explains how to quiet the self-defeating voice in your head and strengthen your “inner coach.” - Reframing success
Why true success lies in the intersection of what you do, how you do it, and why you do it. - Fueling leadership through health
The habits, mindset, and tools that help leaders rediscover joy, energy, and purpose in both work and life.
Key Takeaways
- You can’t lead others if you can’t lead yourself
Great leadership starts with physical and emotional health. - Health is a leadership skill
How you fuel yourself determines how you show up for your team and family. - Tame the inner critic, train the inner coach
Self-awareness is the foundation for lasting transformation. - Habits reveal your mindset
Change your thoughts and your behaviors will follow. - Private victories create public victories
The small, consistent wins in health and mindset make the biggest business impact.
Connect with Evan Mestman
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/evan-mestman/
🌐 Website: https://www.proattitudes.com
📧 Email: evan@proattitudes.com
Connect with Thomas Helfrich
🐦 Twitter: https://twitter.com/thelfrich
📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/cutthetie
💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thomashelfich
🌐 Website: https://www.cutthetie.com
📧 Email: t@instantlyrelevant.com
🚀 https://www.instantlyrelevant.com
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_01 (00:00):
Welcome to Cut the Tie Podcast.
Hi, I am your host, ThomasHelprick, and I'm on a mission
to help entrepreneurs cut thetie to whatever's holding them
back from success.
And they better define thatsuccess on their own terms,
otherwise, you're chasingsomeone else's dream.
So welcome to the show, EvanMestman.
unknown (00:15):
How are you doing?
SPEAKER_00 (00:16):
Hey, I'm grateful for you inviting me on.
Thanks so much.
SPEAKER_01 (00:20):
It it is uh it's gonna be my pleasure by the end
of this.
I'm telling you right now.
Right now, it's your pleasure.
It's like Chick-fil-A style.
My pleasure.
My daughter works there.
That's how I owners and knowthat.
All right, take a moment, Evan.
Introduce yourself, where you'refrom, what you do.
SPEAKER_00 (00:33):
Hey, everybody, I'm Evan Messman.
I am a health transformation andleadership coach.
What I do is I work withbusiness leaders who've climbed
that ladder to success, but theyleft their health on the bottom
rung because they thought theyhad to.
And what I do is I take themback up to the top rung before
they fall off the ladderaltogether.
(00:54):
And I do it three differentways.
I help them lose weight withtheir minds, not their mouth.
I help them be intentional withtheir health.
And most importantly, I helpthem tame their inner critic.
I keep mine up here on the shelfjust to show people.
I've got him down to six, eightand a half inches.
He used to be six feet tall.
And I keep up on my shelf also,Yoda.
(01:16):
He's up here.
You can't really see him.
I'm gonna point.
There he is, because I want tohelp develop everybody's inner
coach.
Do you start like me?
SPEAKER_01 (01:25):
Do you start your sessions like with like fat you
are?
SPEAKER_00 (01:30):
You know, it's so funny that people are either on
or off a diet, they're always sodifficult with themselves.
The one thing that they beatthemselves up all the time is I
cheated, I'm on, I'm off.
I'm like, we need a betterrelationship with food, we need
a better relationship withourselves, we need a better
relationship with everything inour lives.
(01:51):
And the one person you need abetter relationship with is the
voice in your head, and that'sreally what I focus on.
SPEAKER_01 (01:57):
Yeah, it's uh I just thought it cited that the best
thing for weight loss isamphetamines.
Yeah, no, it doesn't, or orzempic, right?
SPEAKER_00 (02:06):
You might as well go all the way to take the
injectables, take the GLP ones.
SPEAKER_01 (02:10):
And I my boobs, I don't care where it goes in,
just go in.
SPEAKER_00 (02:16):
And it's not just about weight loss.
You know, I'm a nutritionist,diabetes educator.
To me, I believe that we shouldbe fueling leadership.
Private victories lead to publicvictories.
If you want to take better careof your company, start fueling
your leadership with takingbetter care of yourself.
SPEAKER_01 (02:32):
Yeah.
I mean, yeah, you'll you'llthink better and everything
else.
Uh we'll get into some of yourjourney a little bit, but uh
there's a lot of nutritionistsand people, you know, why why
should or why do uh individualsor companies pick you?
SPEAKER_00 (02:44):
Hmm, it's a great question.
Well, you know, I've I'm verywell schooled, but I'm my first
client.
My first, I was heavy heavy as akid.
So I've experienced the bullyingand and making a muscle, nothing
happens, and having thatwonderful belly around the
middle.
And I went through an ordinarychange, uh, some just some
(03:04):
simple habits that I changedover a summer and went through
transformation.
I've been reverse engineering itever since.
But the main reason whycompanies are hiring me and also
business leaders is because ofthe thousand leaders that I've
already helped.
And I believed that I was incorporate America because one of
my startups that I work with,um, I was in a startup that was
(03:26):
a wellness company delivered viathe internet, and I had 20
consultants that I was managing,and it was going great until we
went public on 9-11, 2001, inCantor Fitzgerald.
And I went from hero to zero.
And I had to put my tail betweenmy legs because I had 500,000
founder shares worth zero, andhad to take care of my family.
(03:48):
And I pivoted into corporateAmerica by selling insulin pumps
because I'm a diabetes educator,and then that went south because
the FDA said you can't importinsulin pumps anymore from
Desatronic, but it was a companywas Roche had purchased them,
and then I had to pivot intoanother company, which was KCI,
which then was purchased by 3Meventually.
(04:09):
That I learned really what it'slike to go from being in sales
to being in leadership.
I started running my own team.
I went to, I was on thego-to-market strategy for new
products.
I really learned a lot.
And then I was recruited byanother company called ComboTech
for leadership.
(04:29):
And I actually developed theiruh national clinical sales team,
which they didn't have one.
I opened my mouth and said, Youneed one.
They said, Well, go ahead, buildone.
So I had a great opportunity anda run there.
So I had 20 years in corporateAmerica in sales management
leadership, and I learned how itsucks the joy out of everything
(04:51):
that you do.
And they don't do itintentionally, but that's
something that I want to do isto help people bring back in
their culprit culture somethingthat emanates from everybody is
joy instead of fear.
Why does everybody um worried incompanies right now with the
lack of engagement?
It's because everybody's afraid.
So part of what I do is inleadership, if you're taking
(05:12):
better care of yourself, you canlearn how to tame that inner
critic that's beating the fear.
SPEAKER_01 (05:18):
You're uh you're uh you're hitting the right points
for sure.
Did you find uh because that'swhat people need?
Do you find that typicallythough, the the problem?
And this is more of anentrepreneurial question because
it's like sometimes the problemthey want the symptom solved,
and you're like, I'm gonnadeliver that for you.
And he and I know how to dothat.
And then you get you're like,now let's go actually solve what
(05:38):
you get you easy.
And they sometimes go like, Whatare you which craft are you
talking about?
Did they do you have that dothey have that existential
moment like I'm not talkingabout me?
SPEAKER_00 (05:49):
I think what happens is people will come to me
because of the voice they hearin my marketing, which is their
voice.
And what'll end up happening isthey'll come to me and say, Hey,
I want to lose some weight, orum, I really want to get my
blood sugar better controlled.
But because I know that I cometo them at the level that
they're at, and we start todiscover truly what the
(06:12):
underlying issues is, I go deep.
This is not transactional.
Hey, go on a diet, go in anexercise program.
It's in there.
This is the deep work of reallywhat's your why?
And why is there so muchresistance if you've been really
wanting this?
And there's a reason.
It's because you've beenprotecting yourself from the
(06:34):
underlying pain and sufferingthat you're afraid you're gonna
have by dealing with the issuesthat are keeping you stuck.
That's the work that I love todo.
That's taming the inner criticand helping develop that inner
coach.
Um, it's it's an easy thing andit's a hard thing at the same
time.
Um, but diets don't work.
SPEAKER_01 (06:54):
They don't you know, I some of you quit.
It's not that I quit drinking, Ijust stopped taking, stop
drinking.
Like I'm I'm not a drinkeranymore.
I just choose not to have one.
Would I have one if it addedvalue?
Yes.
And the way I did that was, youknow, I listened to a book, but
I was but the idea behind thebook was I'm not gonna promote
someone else's stuff here, butthe point is I changed the
meaning associated with having adrink.
SPEAKER_00 (07:17):
And change your identity.
That's what you did.
You did a reframe.
So a lot of I'll work withpeople who want to quit smoking
too.
And what'll happen is theythey'll walk into a room and
they crave the cigarette.
I go, Well, you're still asmoker.
But when I know they come to meat that moment where they go,
Ugh, somebody's smoking?
Disgusting.
Now they become a non-smoker.
(07:39):
It's an identity shift.
It's the same with I haveanother client of mine who was
in France in Paris, and he sawthis businessman sitting there.
Well, he was at theall-you-can-eat buffet.
This guy's sitting there with acup of coffee, perfectly
coiffed, you know, his tie andhis suit, reading the newspaper,
and he's just drinking hiscoffee.
And he looked at him and hesaid, I want to understand what
(08:03):
motivates that guy.
And changing that paradigm forhim, having him be able to
create some shifts in his beliefsystems.
Now he emulates that.
Now, when he goes and travelsthe world as a business leader,
it's no longer I have tostruggle with avoiding eating
all the cakes and cookies andall that.
(08:23):
He's like, nope, my identity hasshifted.
And that's a uh that's the workthat I love to do because it's
the work that I needed to domyself that made all the
difference in the world.
SPEAKER_01 (08:34):
Yeah.
Well, tell me your definition ofsuccess then.
Is it is as it exists today?
How do you define success?
SPEAKER_00 (08:42):
Hmm.
You know, success to me is theuh the intersection of the what
to do, the how to do it, and thewhy to do it.
Where the three of thoseintersect is success.
Keep it simple.
SPEAKER_01 (09:00):
And did that is that something newer?
Been there for a while?
SPEAKER_00 (09:04):
Uh you know, I learned I learned that through a
process, but it's part ofStephen Cubby's work.
It's part of sales process thatI've learned.
And it's just, I don't I'veheard it so many times, but I've
incorporated it into my processthat it's your behavior.
So what the what is it what youdo, that's your behavior, right?
(09:26):
The how you do it is technique.
And then the why you do it isattitude, which is why my
business is called proattitudes.
And where the three of thoseintersect, you're gonna see a
habit, which is what StephenCovey talked about.
But for me, I look at thatintersection as success.
Because if you can promotehabits based on behavior,
(09:49):
technique, but also driven bythe right why, that's that's
gonna be success.
And that's the neural pathwaysin our brain.
I don't believe that the theissues that we have today, the
chronic illnesses, diabetes,heart disease, autoimmune
disease, um, obesity.
I don't believe they're justdiseases of metabolism.
I really truly believe they'rediseases of our neural pathways
(10:10):
in our brain.
And then if we can change theparadigm, if we can shift,
reframe the way we think andbelieve, which is what my
specialty is, that changeseverything and it makes it a lot
easier.
You know, you're you don't wantto be pushing against
resistance, saying, I'm gonna dothese things, but I really don't
believe it.
(10:30):
That's that's you're alwaysgonna go back to old habits.
That's why I always start withthe why.
That's why, you know, I'm theSimon Cynic of Nutrition.
SPEAKER_01 (10:40):
What's uh in in that journey, I'm sure you had your
own metaphoric ties to cut.
I mean, you described someonejust like living a life of, oh,
I had to go through that as youknow, lose weight, do the thing,
change my mindset.
Uh, but what's been the biggestone to build build the business
you have today and be where youare?
SPEAKER_00 (10:59):
Huh.
Well, that's a loaded question,and there's a lot going in
there.
To be successful for me wasfirst understanding that I
actually had those voices in myhead and they were real and
they're normal, everybody's gotthem.
And I don't have to listen tothose voices.
Those are not me.
My inner coach is the one that'slistening to the inner voices.
(11:21):
And you'll know that if you askyourself when you hear something
in your head, is that me or isthat a based on a feeling or a
thought?
You'll know the difference.
When I understood that and I wasable to acknowledge those
thoughts and know that they werecoming from my inner critic, I
was able to then separate myselfout.
That self-awareness was thefirst step for me.
(11:43):
And then acceptance that, hey,I'm human just like everybody
else.
How do I develop?
I call it the attitude muscle.
How do you develop the attitudemuscle so that you don't, you're
not the inner critic's not theCEO of your life, the inner
coaches?
And you need the inner coach tobe the CEO, and you can't get
rid of your inner critics.
You need to make friends withthem.
(12:04):
That happened to me at a veryyoung age because of how I'm a
result of trauma.
I had trauma as a kid, um,bullied as a kid too, very
sickly as a kid.
So I had to make some decisions.
Do I want to end up like therest of my family with all these
diseases and then dying young?
Um, do I want to end up like mybrother, who is four four years
(12:26):
older than me and obese?
And do I, you know, my momcalled it baby fad, but it
wasn't.
Like, I need to do the work.
So I looked in the mirror andrealized no one's here to save
me.
I've got to do the Gogginsthing, right?
I didn't know Goggins back then,but it was looking in the mirror
and realizing there's work to bedone here.
Let's just do it and not worryabout tomorrow and don't regret
(12:48):
about yesterday, just focus ontoday.
And that is to me, when Istarted this business five years
ago, which was after thecorporate run that I loved and
enjoyed it, but COVID gave methe opportunity to come back to
doing what I really truly have apassion for.
Um, I sat down with a verydifferent perspective because I
(13:11):
had all that experience, plus Itamed my inner critic.
And that's yeah, that's what Ilove bringing to other people.
It's like it's not a hard thingto do.
SPEAKER_01 (13:20):
I'm Ella, you you know the moments that happened,
like you know, and you in yoursis definitely there's uh there's
like a building moment thathappened that got me to hear it,
it got me to hear.
Do you remember the momentthough you had the first
breakthrough with a client?
SPEAKER_00 (13:35):
Wow, okay.
Um not that I mean, I've beendoing this for a long time.
So I go I don't remember thefirst one, but there is one but
memorable one where I cannotbelieve that happened kind of
thing.
Yeah.
I had a client come to me from adoctor.
She was over 500 pounds.
We didn't know how much sheweighed because we could we
didn't have a scale to weighher.
(13:56):
And she was bleeding in thewrong in the wrong place, and
they couldn't put her, she wastoo big for the MRI machine.
And the doctor said, if youdon't go see Evan, you're gonna
die.
And I remember this poor womancoming into my into my office
and just just dreading workingwith me, and not was bad enough,
(14:17):
she sat down and the chairbroke.
I mean, I'm not even sure.
I'm surprised you didn't have togo to her.
I mean, 500 pounds, like mosthurt.
Well, I what ended up happeningwas um we started working
together and I helped her getdown to below 300.
But what's more important, shewas a travel agent, and she
said, You saved my life.
(14:38):
She and you got me back to whatI love to do.
She couldn't drive, she was tooheavy to drive, she had to have
somebody drive her.
So I remember the first time shecalled me and she said, I guess
where I am.
I'm sitting in my brand new car.
What a wonderful feeling! Likeshe, you know, and now she could
travel places.
Then the first time she was ableto get on an airplane again.
SPEAKER_01 (14:59):
It gives me chills just thinking about how I she'd
probably gotten to travelbecause she loves travel and now
can't travel.
That's like the most depressingthing in the world.
Like, yeah.
I live in a golf course that Ican't afford the membership
behind me, and it's like I justgo look at this beautiful,
top-rated, and I'm like, one dayI'm gonna be able to pull the
trigger on that.
SPEAKER_00 (15:18):
The truth is, well, you'll find joy in other things,
which is part of what I, youknow, that's my that's my my
tagline is I help people findmore mojo, more moments of
spontaneous joy through yourhabits, through mindfulness,
through your nutrition, throughyour total fitness.
It's gonna lead to more momentsof spontaneous joy because what
(15:39):
do people do in business?
They work, work, work.
Oh, I gotta work more becausethat's the one thing I have is I
can just turn up the volume, Ican do more.
That overdrives samurai.
That's one of the inner critics.
And what happens?
You you burn out.
And then that burnout leads toabuse.
You know, you might go in adrink binge, you might go just
(16:00):
say no to everything.
You go eating, go out to eat onthe weekends.
It could be work, work, work,and then you're off on the
weekends and you're in thisterrible cycle till all of a
sudden it catches up with you.
SPEAKER_01 (16:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (16:13):
Those are the kinds of clients I love working with
because they are so successfulin business, but they haven't
learned how to take the skillset that they have in business
and translate it over to takingbetter care of themselves.
And it's there, they've got it,they do it in business.
Why can't they do it forthemselves?
SPEAKER_01 (16:29):
It you know, it's uh I read uh Ronald, Dr.
Ronald Siegel's book, I thinkSiegler or Siegel.
Yeah.
Siegel, the science ofmindfulness.
And David.
David Eagleman is that theLightmire guy, the life guy he
wrote with Livewired.
I well, no, this guy's like aHarvard professor, so these were
his lectures.
And what I took from it, likethere's a lot you can take from,
(16:51):
but but I took from it was uhwas a realization, an epiphany
that people, you know, we'veonly had about a hundred years
of technology, let's say, atmost.
Like and for millennials, likemillennium, like years,
thousands of years, tens allhundreds of thousands of years.
SPEAKER_00 (17:08):
We're our we're right, we're hardwired a certain
way.
We're our our hardware hasn'tupdated.
SPEAKER_01 (17:13):
We we have and but for but for thousands of years,
like five, six thousand years,there there are been people
who've just studied becausethere was nothing else to do,
apparently, but they juststudied how the mind and body
worked, and how you you know,before there was modern
medicine, like how you can behealthy through your mind, and
it made me think like we dismissall that so fast, but they have
(17:33):
thousands of and millions ofpeople have have spent their
life studying and like the theworks that you read from, you're
like, Well, there's actuallyreal science behind that that we
just kind of dismiss that'salready been discovered.
And and and you just don't evenyou just dismiss it as all that
was years ago.
There we were people back thenwere no dumber than today.
We have not evolved anything.
SPEAKER_00 (17:52):
I mean you know why though?
In the this this was a majorfocus in science up until about
the 60s, 50s and 60s, when allof a sudden pharmaceuticals came
into and then everybody thought,oh, we'll give you we'll have a
pill to solve everything, andeverything went on the wayside.
Now, what I'm really excitedabout is what's happening now
(18:12):
with the NIH and make AmericaHealthy again.
The focus is not political, it'sabout getting back to the root
of science and innovation, whichI think in the next two to three
years, you're going to see anabsolute explosion of
opportunity and also solutionsto the problems that we've had
(18:33):
for the last 30, 40 yearsbecause big pharma and big agro
have been leading us down thispath that is not sustainable,
but somebody's putting money intheir pocket.
SPEAKER_01 (18:44):
You're you're uh we are we're in the age of pharma.
Um we'll go to that.
That could be a whole show, butlike a whole podcast.
So uh what do you most uh like,you know, you know, or let me
say it differently.
How do you measure impact ofwhat you do?
SPEAKER_00 (19:00):
Well, I'm uh a leader myself, and I was leading
a team.
So I know that if you can'tmeasure, you can't improve it.
So there are certain things thatI'll do with my clients um that
I will measure.
I they get a commitment log, andin that commitment log, there's
daily habits.
I call it the day dailymindfulness work, and then
(19:23):
there's weekly commitments, andthen at the end of the month, we
also do a review, a monthlyreview, then we do a quarterly
review, we do a six-monthreview, very much like you would
in business, but it's not thethe stuff that's going to make
you feel like, oh, I'm notaccomplishing anything.
I focus on positivereinforcement and also
reinforcing the positive neuralpathways that they've created.
(19:47):
So there's a method to mymadness in this process of
measuring it.
So I'm measuring things like,well, what actual habits have
they improved upon?
And there are definite specificways that I can do that in that
um that kind of uh coaching thatI do and the tools that I create
as far as the you know,quarterly review, six-month
(20:09):
review.
And they see it.
And honestly, it it makes adifference when you do that kind
of review and go, you know,don't just look at what you
should be doing, look at whatyou've already accomplished
because say, well, that's whereI used to be.
Wow.
Look how far I've come.
Well, this is where I want togo.
Okay, that's fine.
Don't be hard on yourself.
(20:30):
Now, here's the gap.
And we're always working on,well, what's the plan for the
next three steps?
And it's it's really that simpleto get people on my program.
Of course, I provide them atremendous amount of knowledge
and skill.
I give them tools in thetoolbox.
One of them is my better bitebuddy, which is an AI-driven
(20:50):
tool to help them learn how toincorporate all of my tools with
them when I'm not around.
Um, and they can practice andask it, like, you know, what you
know, how do I get how do Isolve the the cravings at eight
o'clock at night when I want togo and grab the ice cream?
Or um I'm going out to dinner.
(21:12):
What's the best choice?
How do I can I eat healthier?
How can I understand what theinner critic is doing versus
what the inner coach is doing?
It has some really great umlogic built into it, but it it
sounds like me, it acts like me,and I love that tool on top of
the other 60 tools that I'vecreated that are built into that
(21:32):
AI tool that my clients loveusing.
And you know, because everybodyneeds something different, but I
love having uh being able tocreate these things.
Um, and they're from 30, I'vebeen doing it for 30 years, so
there's a lot of tools.
SPEAKER_01 (21:46):
You got a wealth of knowledge.
If there was a question I shouldhave asked you today, though,
and I didn't, what would thatquestion have been?
SPEAKER_00 (21:53):
Um, what's my favorite thing to do?
SPEAKER_01 (21:55):
What is your favorite thing to do?
SPEAKER_00 (21:57):
I'm a gardener.
You know, when I was a kid, um,I I learned how to garden
working with uh Mrs.
Wolf.
I write about her all the time.
She had a five-acre estate onthe Hudson, and she was an uh a
widow, and she had um an acre ofgardens that needed five
gardeners.
(22:17):
But I was this teenager stuckout there in 98 degree weather,
pulling the weeds.
By the time I finished one end,the weeds were knee high on the
other.
But she taught me everythingthat I know.
And part of it is she'd alsotaught me how to dig a
five-dollar hole for a 50 centplant.
She taught me that um you youtake care.
(22:40):
You the what you call the law ofnature, the law of the gardener
is you nurture it, you water it,you make sure it's in the right
place, and it will grow.
And, you know, lessons that Ilearned as a kid, um, and I now
cultivate optimism for myclients because that's really
what I do.
And um I love uh I have a gardenin my front yard.
(23:01):
It has I have no lawn, it's allflower gardens.
And I have a public garden thatI create for my.
There's a uh in Huntington, wehave this beautiful park that's
a hundred years old that wasgetting dilapidated.
And my wife and I eight yearsago decided to take on this uh
area that was full of weeds.
We asked the town, can we makean a garden here?
(23:21):
And he let us.
And now it's the amity garden,and people come from all over to
take a look at it.
Amity Garden of Heckshire Park,it's uh at Heckshire Park is on
uh in my Facebook group.
Just you know, not a lot ofpeople in it, but you know what?
It's a labor of love to helpbring people together.
So you can see that's a passionof mine, too.
SPEAKER_01 (23:40):
That's great.
I love that.
Uh all right, so shameless plugdown.
How do they get a hold of you?
Who should get a hold of you?
SPEAKER_00 (23:45):
Oh, shameless plug.
You know what?
I'm available.
Um, are we going to be givingany links?
I'll tell you proattitudes.
Great.
SPEAKER_01 (23:53):
Yeah, they'll show them notes.
SPEAKER_00 (23:54):
So proAttitudes.com forward slash follow will take
you to my link train.
So you can make an appointmentwith me, you can take the inner
critic quiz, you can also takethe lifestyle check-in quiz.
I've got lots of tools.
The better bite buddy, though,is a little different because
it's brand new.
So if you want to use the betterbite buddy, um, reach out to me
(24:14):
on uh either LinkedIn.
It's on I'm on LinkedIn.
Evan Messman uh is my name, andyou can find me there and also
my business pro attitudes.
Wonderful.
Thanks for coming on today.
Appreciate it, Evan.
I had a great time.
Thanks for uh asking me on.
SPEAKER_01 (24:30):
And anybody listening at this point or
watching, you rock, you musthave a great attitude to be
here.
And if this is the first timeyou were here, I hope it's the
first of many.
And if you've been here before,you know what to do.
Get out there, go cut the tideto whatever's holding you back,
but first define that success onyour own terms so you know
what's holding you back from it.
Thanks for listening.
Welcome to Cut the Tie Podcast.
Hi, I am your host, ThomasHelprick, and I'm on a mission
to help entrepreneurs cut thetie to whatever's holding them
back from success.
And they better define thatsuccess on their own terms,
otherwise, you're chasingsomeone else's dream.
So welcome to the show, EvanMestman.
unknown (00:15):
How are you doing?
SPEAKER_00 (00:16):
Hey, I'm grateful for you inviting me on.
Thanks so much.
SPEAKER_01 (00:20):
It it is uh it's gonna be my pleasure by the end
of this.
I'm telling you right now.
Right now, it's your pleasure.
It's like Chick-fil-A style.
My pleasure.
My daughter works there.
That's how I owners and knowthat.
All right, take a moment, Evan.
Introduce yourself, where you'refrom, what you do.
SPEAKER_00 (00:33):
Hey, everybody, I'm Evan Messman.
I am a health transformation andleadership coach.
What I do is I work withbusiness leaders who've climbed
that ladder to success, but theyleft their health on the bottom
rung because they thought theyhad to.
And what I do is I take themback up to the top rung before
they fall off the ladderaltogether.
(00:54):
And I do it three differentways.
I help them lose weight withtheir minds, not their mouth.
I help them be intentional withtheir health.
And most importantly, I helpthem tame their inner critic.
I keep mine up here on the shelfjust to show people.
I've got him down to six, eightand a half inches.
He used to be six feet tall.
And I keep up on my shelf also,Yoda.
(01:16):
He's up here.
You can't really see him.
I'm gonna point.
There he is, because I want tohelp develop everybody's inner
coach.
Do you start like me?
SPEAKER_01 (01:25):
Do you start your sessions like with like fat you
are?
SPEAKER_00 (01:30):
You know, it's so funny that people are either on
or off a diet, they're always sodifficult with themselves.
The one thing that they beatthemselves up all the time is I
cheated, I'm on, I'm off.
I'm like, we need a betterrelationship with food, we need
a better relationship withourselves, we need a better
relationship with everything inour lives.
(01:51):
And the one person you need abetter relationship with is the
voice in your head, and that'sreally what I focus on.
SPEAKER_01 (01:57):
Yeah, it's uh I just thought it cited that the best
thing for weight loss isamphetamines.
Yeah, no, it doesn't, or orzempic, right?
SPEAKER_00 (02:06):
You might as well go all the way to take the
injectables, take the GLP ones.
SPEAKER_01 (02:10):
And I my boobs, I don't care where it goes in,
just go in.
SPEAKER_00 (02:16):
And it's not just about weight loss.
You know, I'm a nutritionist,diabetes educator.
To me, I believe that we shouldbe fueling leadership.
Private victories lead to publicvictories.
If you want to take better careof your company, start fueling
your leadership with takingbetter care of yourself.
SPEAKER_01 (02:32):
Yeah.
I mean, yeah, you'll you'llthink better and everything
else.
Uh we'll get into some of yourjourney a little bit, but uh
there's a lot of nutritionistsand people, you know, why why
should or why do uh individualsor companies pick you?
SPEAKER_00 (02:44):
Hmm, it's a great question.
Well, you know, I've I'm verywell schooled, but I'm my first
client.
My first, I was heavy heavy as akid.
So I've experienced the bullyingand and making a muscle, nothing
happens, and having thatwonderful belly around the
middle.
And I went through an ordinarychange, uh, some just some
(03:04):
simple habits that I changedover a summer and went through
transformation.
I've been reverse engineering itever since.
But the main reason whycompanies are hiring me and also
business leaders is because ofthe thousand leaders that I've
already helped.
And I believed that I was incorporate America because one of
my startups that I work with,um, I was in a startup that was
(03:26):
a wellness company delivered viathe internet, and I had 20
consultants that I was managing,and it was going great until we
went public on 9-11, 2001, inCantor Fitzgerald.
And I went from hero to zero.
And I had to put my tail betweenmy legs because I had 500,000
founder shares worth zero, andhad to take care of my family.
(03:48):
And I pivoted into corporateAmerica by selling insulin pumps
because I'm a diabetes educator,and then that went south because
the FDA said you can't importinsulin pumps anymore from
Desatronic, but it was a companywas Roche had purchased them,
and then I had to pivot intoanother company, which was KCI,
which then was purchased by 3Meventually.
(04:09):
That I learned really what it'slike to go from being in sales
to being in leadership.
I started running my own team.
I went to, I was on thego-to-market strategy for new
products.
I really learned a lot.
And then I was recruited byanother company called ComboTech
for leadership.
(04:29):
And I actually developed theiruh national clinical sales team,
which they didn't have one.
I opened my mouth and said, Youneed one.
They said, Well, go ahead, buildone.
So I had a great opportunity anda run there.
So I had 20 years in corporateAmerica in sales management
leadership, and I learned how itsucks the joy out of everything
(04:51):
that you do.
And they don't do itintentionally, but that's
something that I want to do isto help people bring back in
their culprit culture somethingthat emanates from everybody is
joy instead of fear.
Why does everybody um worried incompanies right now with the
lack of engagement?
It's because everybody's afraid.
So part of what I do is inleadership, if you're taking
(05:12):
better care of yourself, you canlearn how to tame that inner
critic that's beating the fear.
SPEAKER_01 (05:18):
You're uh you're uh you're hitting the right points
for sure.
Did you find uh because that'swhat people need?
Do you find that typicallythough, the the problem?
And this is more of anentrepreneurial question because
it's like sometimes the problemthey want the symptom solved,
and you're like, I'm gonnadeliver that for you.
And he and I know how to dothat.
And then you get you're like,now let's go actually solve what
(05:38):
you get you easy.
And they sometimes go like, Whatare you which craft are you
talking about?
Did they do you have that dothey have that existential
moment like I'm not talkingabout me?
SPEAKER_00 (05:49):
I think what happens is people will come to me
because of the voice they hearin my marketing, which is their
voice.
And what'll end up happening isthey'll come to me and say, Hey,
I want to lose some weight, orum, I really want to get my
blood sugar better controlled.
But because I know that I cometo them at the level that
they're at, and we start todiscover truly what the
(06:12):
underlying issues is, I go deep.
This is not transactional.
Hey, go on a diet, go in anexercise program.
It's in there.
This is the deep work of reallywhat's your why?
And why is there so muchresistance if you've been really
wanting this?
And there's a reason.
It's because you've beenprotecting yourself from the
(06:34):
underlying pain and sufferingthat you're afraid you're gonna
have by dealing with the issuesthat are keeping you stuck.
That's the work that I love todo.
That's taming the inner criticand helping develop that inner
coach.
Um, it's it's an easy thing andit's a hard thing at the same
time.
Um, but diets don't work.
SPEAKER_01 (06:54):
They don't you know, I some of you quit.
It's not that I quit drinking, Ijust stopped taking, stop
drinking.
Like I'm I'm not a drinkeranymore.
I just choose not to have one.
Would I have one if it addedvalue?
Yes.
And the way I did that was, youknow, I listened to a book, but
I was but the idea behind thebook was I'm not gonna promote
someone else's stuff here, butthe point is I changed the
meaning associated with having adrink.
SPEAKER_00 (07:17):
And change your identity.
That's what you did.
You did a reframe.
So a lot of I'll work withpeople who want to quit smoking
too.
And what'll happen is theythey'll walk into a room and
they crave the cigarette.
I go, Well, you're still asmoker.
But when I know they come to meat that moment where they go,
Ugh, somebody's smoking?
Disgusting.
Now they become a non-smoker.
(07:39):
It's an identity shift.
It's the same with I haveanother client of mine who was
in France in Paris, and he sawthis businessman sitting there.
Well, he was at theall-you-can-eat buffet.
This guy's sitting there with acup of coffee, perfectly
coiffed, you know, his tie andhis suit, reading the newspaper,
and he's just drinking hiscoffee.
And he looked at him and hesaid, I want to understand what
(08:03):
motivates that guy.
And changing that paradigm forhim, having him be able to
create some shifts in his beliefsystems.
Now he emulates that.
Now, when he goes and travelsthe world as a business leader,
it's no longer I have tostruggle with avoiding eating
all the cakes and cookies andall that.
(08:23):
He's like, nope, my identity hasshifted.
And that's a uh that's the workthat I love to do because it's
the work that I needed to domyself that made all the
difference in the world.
SPEAKER_01 (08:34):
Yeah.
Well, tell me your definition ofsuccess then.
Is it is as it exists today?
How do you define success?
SPEAKER_00 (08:42):
Hmm.
You know, success to me is theuh the intersection of the what
to do, the how to do it, and thewhy to do it.
Where the three of thoseintersect is success.
Keep it simple.
SPEAKER_01 (09:00):
And did that is that something newer?
Been there for a while?
SPEAKER_00 (09:04):
Uh you know, I learned I learned that through a
process, but it's part ofStephen Cubby's work.
It's part of sales process thatI've learned.
And it's just, I don't I'veheard it so many times, but I've
incorporated it into my processthat it's your behavior.
So what the what is it what youdo, that's your behavior, right?
(09:26):
The how you do it is technique.
And then the why you do it isattitude, which is why my
business is called proattitudes.
And where the three of thoseintersect, you're gonna see a
habit, which is what StephenCovey talked about.
But for me, I look at thatintersection as success.
Because if you can promotehabits based on behavior,
(09:49):
technique, but also driven bythe right why, that's that's
gonna be success.
And that's the neural pathwaysin our brain.
I don't believe that the theissues that we have today, the
chronic illnesses, diabetes,heart disease, autoimmune
disease, um, obesity.
I don't believe they're justdiseases of metabolism.
I really truly believe they'rediseases of our neural pathways
(10:10):
in our brain.
And then if we can change theparadigm, if we can shift,
reframe the way we think andbelieve, which is what my
specialty is, that changeseverything and it makes it a lot
easier.
You know, you're you don't wantto be pushing against
resistance, saying, I'm gonna dothese things, but I really don't
believe it.
(10:30):
That's that's you're alwaysgonna go back to old habits.
That's why I always start withthe why.
That's why, you know, I'm theSimon Cynic of Nutrition.
SPEAKER_01 (10:40):
What's uh in in that journey, I'm sure you had your
own metaphoric ties to cut.
I mean, you described someonejust like living a life of, oh,
I had to go through that as youknow, lose weight, do the thing,
change my mindset.
Uh, but what's been the biggestone to build build the business
you have today and be where youare?
SPEAKER_00 (10:59):
Huh.
Well, that's a loaded question,and there's a lot going in
there.
To be successful for me wasfirst understanding that I
actually had those voices in myhead and they were real and
they're normal, everybody's gotthem.
And I don't have to listen tothose voices.
Those are not me.
My inner coach is the one that'slistening to the inner voices.
(11:21):
And you'll know that if you askyourself when you hear something
in your head, is that me or isthat a based on a feeling or a
thought?
You'll know the difference.
When I understood that and I wasable to acknowledge those
thoughts and know that they werecoming from my inner critic, I
was able to then separate myselfout.
That self-awareness was thefirst step for me.
(11:43):
And then acceptance that, hey,I'm human just like everybody
else.
How do I develop?
I call it the attitude muscle.
How do you develop the attitudemuscle so that you don't, you're
not the inner critic's not theCEO of your life, the inner
coaches?
And you need the inner coach tobe the CEO, and you can't get
rid of your inner critics.
You need to make friends withthem.
(12:04):
That happened to me at a veryyoung age because of how I'm a
result of trauma.
I had trauma as a kid, um,bullied as a kid too, very
sickly as a kid.
So I had to make some decisions.
Do I want to end up like therest of my family with all these
diseases and then dying young?
Um, do I want to end up like mybrother, who is four four years
(12:26):
older than me and obese?
And do I, you know, my momcalled it baby fad, but it
wasn't.
Like, I need to do the work.
So I looked in the mirror andrealized no one's here to save
me.
I've got to do the Gogginsthing, right?
I didn't know Goggins back then,but it was looking in the mirror
and realizing there's work to bedone here.
Let's just do it and not worryabout tomorrow and don't regret
(12:48):
about yesterday, just focus ontoday.
And that is to me, when Istarted this business five years
ago, which was after thecorporate run that I loved and
enjoyed it, but COVID gave methe opportunity to come back to
doing what I really truly have apassion for.
Um, I sat down with a verydifferent perspective because I
(13:11):
had all that experience, plus Itamed my inner critic.
And that's yeah, that's what Ilove bringing to other people.
It's like it's not a hard thingto do.
SPEAKER_01 (13:20):
I'm Ella, you you know the moments that happened,
like you know, and you in yoursis definitely there's uh there's
like a building moment thathappened that got me to hear it,
it got me to hear.
Do you remember the momentthough you had the first
breakthrough with a client?
SPEAKER_00 (13:35):
Wow, okay.
Um not that I mean, I've beendoing this for a long time.
So I go I don't remember thefirst one, but there is one but
memorable one where I cannotbelieve that happened kind of
thing.
Yeah.
I had a client come to me from adoctor.
She was over 500 pounds.
We didn't know how much sheweighed because we could we
didn't have a scale to weighher.
(13:56):
And she was bleeding in thewrong in the wrong place, and
they couldn't put her, she wastoo big for the MRI machine.
And the doctor said, if youdon't go see Evan, you're gonna
die.
And I remember this poor womancoming into my into my office
and just just dreading workingwith me, and not was bad enough,
(14:17):
she sat down and the chairbroke.
I mean, I'm not even sure.
I'm surprised you didn't have togo to her.
I mean, 500 pounds, like mosthurt.
Well, I what ended up happeningwas um we started working
together and I helped her getdown to below 300.
But what's more important, shewas a travel agent, and she
said, You saved my life.
(14:38):
She and you got me back to whatI love to do.
She couldn't drive, she was tooheavy to drive, she had to have
somebody drive her.
So I remember the first time shecalled me and she said, I guess
where I am.
I'm sitting in my brand new car.
What a wonderful feeling! Likeshe, you know, and now she could
travel places.
Then the first time she was ableto get on an airplane again.
SPEAKER_01 (14:59):
It gives me chills just thinking about how I she'd
probably gotten to travelbecause she loves travel and now
can't travel.
That's like the most depressingthing in the world.
Like, yeah.
I live in a golf course that Ican't afford the membership
behind me, and it's like I justgo look at this beautiful,
top-rated, and I'm like, one dayI'm gonna be able to pull the
trigger on that.
SPEAKER_00 (15:18):
The truth is, well, you'll find joy in other things,
which is part of what I, youknow, that's my that's my my
tagline is I help people findmore mojo, more moments of
spontaneous joy through yourhabits, through mindfulness,
through your nutrition, throughyour total fitness.
It's gonna lead to more momentsof spontaneous joy because what
(15:39):
do people do in business?
They work, work, work.
Oh, I gotta work more becausethat's the one thing I have is I
can just turn up the volume, Ican do more.
That overdrives samurai.
That's one of the inner critics.
And what happens?
You you burn out.
And then that burnout leads toabuse.
You know, you might go in adrink binge, you might go just
(16:00):
say no to everything.
You go eating, go out to eat onthe weekends.
It could be work, work, work,and then you're off on the
weekends and you're in thisterrible cycle till all of a
sudden it catches up with you.
SPEAKER_01 (16:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (16:13):
Those are the kinds of clients I love working with
because they are so successfulin business, but they haven't
learned how to take the skillset that they have in business
and translate it over to takingbetter care of themselves.
And it's there, they've got it,they do it in business.
Why can't they do it forthemselves?
SPEAKER_01 (16:29):
It you know, it's uh I read uh Ronald, Dr.
Ronald Siegel's book, I thinkSiegler or Siegel.
Yeah.
Siegel, the science ofmindfulness.
And David.
David Eagleman is that theLightmire guy, the life guy he
wrote with Livewired.
I well, no, this guy's like aHarvard professor, so these were
his lectures.
And what I took from it, likethere's a lot you can take from,
(16:51):
but but I took from it was uhwas a realization, an epiphany
that people, you know, we'veonly had about a hundred years
of technology, let's say, atmost.
Like and for millennials, likemillennium, like years,
thousands of years, tens allhundreds of thousands of years.
SPEAKER_00 (17:08):
We're our we're right, we're hardwired a certain
way.
We're our our hardware hasn'tupdated.
SPEAKER_01 (17:13):
We we have and but for but for thousands of years,
like five, six thousand years,there there are been people
who've just studied becausethere was nothing else to do,
apparently, but they juststudied how the mind and body
worked, and how you you know,before there was modern
medicine, like how you can behealthy through your mind, and
it made me think like we dismissall that so fast, but they have
(17:33):
thousands of and millions ofpeople have have spent their
life studying and like the theworks that you read from, you're
like, Well, there's actuallyreal science behind that that we
just kind of dismiss that'salready been discovered.
And and and you just don't evenyou just dismiss it as all that
was years ago.
There we were people back thenwere no dumber than today.
We have not evolved anything.
SPEAKER_00 (17:52):
I mean you know why though?
In the this this was a majorfocus in science up until about
the 60s, 50s and 60s, when allof a sudden pharmaceuticals came
into and then everybody thought,oh, we'll give you we'll have a
pill to solve everything, andeverything went on the wayside.
Now, what I'm really excitedabout is what's happening now
(18:12):
with the NIH and make AmericaHealthy again.
The focus is not political, it'sabout getting back to the root
of science and innovation, whichI think in the next two to three
years, you're going to see anabsolute explosion of
opportunity and also solutionsto the problems that we've had
(18:33):
for the last 30, 40 yearsbecause big pharma and big agro
have been leading us down thispath that is not sustainable,
but somebody's putting money intheir pocket.
SPEAKER_01 (18:44):
You're you're uh we are we're in the age of pharma.
Um we'll go to that.
That could be a whole show, butlike a whole podcast.
So uh what do you most uh like,you know, you know, or let me
say it differently.
How do you measure impact ofwhat you do?
SPEAKER_00 (19:00):
Well, I'm uh a leader myself, and I was leading
a team.
So I know that if you can'tmeasure, you can't improve it.
So there are certain things thatI'll do with my clients um that
I will measure.
I they get a commitment log, andin that commitment log, there's
daily habits.
I call it the day dailymindfulness work, and then
(19:23):
there's weekly commitments, andthen at the end of the month, we
also do a review, a monthlyreview, then we do a quarterly
review, we do a six-monthreview, very much like you would
in business, but it's not thethe stuff that's going to make
you feel like, oh, I'm notaccomplishing anything.
I focus on positivereinforcement and also
reinforcing the positive neuralpathways that they've created.
(19:47):
So there's a method to mymadness in this process of
measuring it.
So I'm measuring things like,well, what actual habits have
they improved upon?
And there are definite specificways that I can do that in that
um that kind of uh coaching thatI do and the tools that I create
as far as the you know,quarterly review, six-month
(20:09):
review.
And they see it.
And honestly, it it makes adifference when you do that kind
of review and go, you know,don't just look at what you
should be doing, look at whatyou've already accomplished
because say, well, that's whereI used to be.
Wow.
Look how far I've come.
Well, this is where I want togo.
Okay, that's fine.
Don't be hard on yourself.
(20:30):
Now, here's the gap.
And we're always working on,well, what's the plan for the
next three steps?
And it's it's really that simpleto get people on my program.
Of course, I provide them atremendous amount of knowledge
and skill.
I give them tools in thetoolbox.
One of them is my better bitebuddy, which is an AI-driven
(20:50):
tool to help them learn how toincorporate all of my tools with
them when I'm not around.
Um, and they can practice andask it, like, you know, what you
know, how do I get how do Isolve the the cravings at eight
o'clock at night when I want togo and grab the ice cream?
Or um I'm going out to dinner.
(21:12):
What's the best choice?
How do I can I eat healthier?
How can I understand what theinner critic is doing versus
what the inner coach is doing?
It has some really great umlogic built into it, but it it
sounds like me, it acts like me,and I love that tool on top of
the other 60 tools that I'vecreated that are built into that
(21:32):
AI tool that my clients loveusing.
And you know, because everybodyneeds something different, but I
love having uh being able tocreate these things.
Um, and they're from 30, I'vebeen doing it for 30 years, so
there's a lot of tools.
SPEAKER_01 (21:46):
You got a wealth of knowledge.
If there was a question I shouldhave asked you today, though,
and I didn't, what would thatquestion have been?
SPEAKER_00 (21:53):
Um, what's my favorite thing to do?
SPEAKER_01 (21:55):
What is your favorite thing to do?
SPEAKER_00 (21:57):
I'm a gardener.
You know, when I was a kid, um,I I learned how to garden
working with uh Mrs.
Wolf.
I write about her all the time.
She had a five-acre estate onthe Hudson, and she was an uh a
widow, and she had um an acre ofgardens that needed five
gardeners.
(22:17):
But I was this teenager stuckout there in 98 degree weather,
pulling the weeds.
By the time I finished one end,the weeds were knee high on the
other.
But she taught me everythingthat I know.
And part of it is she'd alsotaught me how to dig a
five-dollar hole for a 50 centplant.
She taught me that um you youtake care.
(22:40):
You the what you call the law ofnature, the law of the gardener
is you nurture it, you water it,you make sure it's in the right
place, and it will grow.
And, you know, lessons that Ilearned as a kid, um, and I now
cultivate optimism for myclients because that's really
what I do.
And um I love uh I have a gardenin my front yard.
(23:01):
It has I have no lawn, it's allflower gardens.
And I have a public garden thatI create for my.
There's a uh in Huntington, wehave this beautiful park that's
a hundred years old that wasgetting dilapidated.
And my wife and I eight yearsago decided to take on this uh
area that was full of weeds.
We asked the town, can we makean a garden here?
(23:21):
And he let us.
And now it's the amity garden,and people come from all over to
take a look at it.
Amity Garden of Heckshire Park,it's uh at Heckshire Park is on
uh in my Facebook group.
Just you know, not a lot ofpeople in it, but you know what?
It's a labor of love to helpbring people together.
So you can see that's a passionof mine, too.
SPEAKER_01 (23:40):
That's great.
I love that.
Uh all right, so shameless plugdown.
How do they get a hold of you?
Who should get a hold of you?
SPEAKER_00 (23:45):
Oh, shameless plug.
You know what?
I'm available.
Um, are we going to be givingany links?
I'll tell you proattitudes.
Great.
SPEAKER_01 (23:53):
Yeah, they'll show them notes.
SPEAKER_00 (23:54):
So proAttitudes.com forward slash follow will take
you to my link train.
So you can make an appointmentwith me, you can take the inner
critic quiz, you can also takethe lifestyle check-in quiz.
I've got lots of tools.
The better bite buddy, though,is a little different because
it's brand new.
So if you want to use the betterbite buddy, um, reach out to me
(24:14):
on uh either LinkedIn.
It's on I'm on LinkedIn.
Evan Messman uh is my name, andyou can find me there and also
my business pro attitudes.
Wonderful.
Thanks for coming on today.
Appreciate it, Evan.
I had a great time.
Thanks for uh asking me on.
SPEAKER_01 (24:30):
And anybody listening at this point or
watching, you rock, you musthave a great attitude to be
here.
And if this is the first timeyou were here, I hope it's the
first of many.
And if you've been here before,you know what to do.
Get out there, go cut the tideto whatever's holding you back,
but first define that success onyour own terms so you know
what's holding you back from it.
Thanks for listening.
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