Inspiration From Dianne and Paul

Send Me a Text Message

Looking for motivation, host Tom Butler jumps into a race on the virtual platform Zwift. The results were surprising and look to open a path for more improvement. 

The interview this episode is packed with inspiration as Tom talks with Dianne Iverson and Paul Dutky about their use of a tandem bike to support their cycling journeys. The discussion with them includes their personal experiences and their dedication to creating a more safe and inclusive cycling community. Don't miss this episode packed with motivation and heartfelt stories!

Links

Team Huffing and Puffing Great American Ride Signup - Password -GAR2025  runsignup.com/Race/Register/RaceGroup-1742637?raceId=92970

Nicole Ver Kuilen is an amputee athlete who challenges herself to swim, bike, and run from Seattle to San Diego. forreststump.org/1500-miles/

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Consider becoming a member of the Cycling Over Sixty Strava Club! www.strava.com/clubs/CyclingOverSixty

Cycling Over Sixty is also on Zwift. Look for our Zwift club!

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Show music is "Come On Out" by Dan Lebowitz. Find him here : lebomusic.com

Episode Transcript

Tom Butler (00:04):
This is the Cycling Over 60 podcast, season three,
episode 21,.
Inspiration from Diane and Paul, and I'm your host, tom Butler.
First off, thank you, ian fromEdmonton, for the encouraging

(00:26):
message.
Go Canada.
Ian reached out through thetext me link that you see on the
top of the podcast description.
I want to clarify somethingabout what happens if you send
me a text message.
I can't text back, but if I getsent a question now, I'm going
to respond in a post on Stravain the Cycling Over 60 Club.
Hopefully the podcastmanagement company I use will

(00:49):
provide a better way to respondto messages in the future.
In the meantime, considerjoining the Strava Cycling Over
60 Club.
Last week I mentioned the GreatAmerican Ride to benefit Rails
to Trails.
The ride is a virtual teamevent.
I put a link to Team Huffingand Puffing, which is the team
I'm going to be riding with, butI forgot to include a password.

(01:10):
So I'm including the link againthis week and the password in
the show notes.
Sorry about any confusion thatthat caused and thank you,
carolyn, for pointing out themistake.
I'm really excited about thepotential of the Thursday Zoom
call.
I want to make it a place tointeract with listeners who I
don't get an opportunity to meetin person.
Here are seven topics that Iwant to explore during the Zoom

(01:31):
calls.
One share your personal journey.
I love hearing what cyclingchallenges others are taking on.
Also, what are the overalllessons you've learned as you
attempt to get and stay fit?
Two what are your thoughts onlongevity?
What do you believe are the?
Are your thoughts on longevity?
What do you believe are theimportant lifestyle choices for
longevity?
Three talk about your cyclinggear and equipment.

(01:52):
If you found something that youreally like, I would love to
hear about it.
Four give some information onyour favorite cycling routes and
impactful experiences thatyou've had on the bike.
Five what are you learningabout cycling training and
techniques, especially as itrelates to cycling longer in
life?
Six give your thoughts oncyclists coming together as a

(02:13):
community.
Have you found a club or othergroup that enhances your cycling
experiences?
And number seven of course, Iwould love to talk about ideas
for making the podcast morerelevant and more entertaining.
This list isn't meant to belimiting.
I know there are things thatare not included here.
I'm a very curious person and Iwould love to hear about you

(02:34):
and your story, so join me onthursdays for the open zoom chat
.
It's 3 pm pacific time now.
I'll be riding the indoortrainer at the time, but I'm
sure you understand the Zoomconnection information is in the
Cycling Over 60 Strava Club oryou can find my email in the
show notes.
Send me a request by email forthe Zoom link Now.

(02:55):
There is a Cycling Over 60Zwift Thursday ride that goes on
at that time.
But whether or not you jointhat ride, I would love to see
you and talk to you on Zoom.
I decided to try a race on Zwift.
I find competition to be astrong motivator for me.
While competing against myselfis a primary way that I have
satisfied my competitive urges,I wanted to see what competing

(03:21):
against others would do.
There is no way that I'm goingto do a road race in real life.
I see it as way too dangerousfor me.
I mentioned in the episode onNovember 9th last year called
Cycle Crossover 60 that I willdo some training and maybe do a
cyclocross race next fall.
Honestly, I feel like I'm along way from actually doing a
race.
My training would have to giveme way more comfort than I

(03:41):
currently have with my bikehandling skills.
But the Zwift race is obviouslysafe, although I recently
almost crashed the trainerreaching for a towel but I think
it's likely that I can stayupright during the race.
Before I started the race, Ifelt like I wouldn't do very
well based on my previous Zwiftperformance.
There are five categories and Istarted in the lowest category.

(04:03):
The race route was 13.2 milesof a somewhat longer London
Uprising route.
I was happy with the effort Iput in during the race, even
though my result wasn'tspectacular.
I ended up 17 out of 46 ridersin that lowest group.
Now here's the thing I set apersonal best power for 8

(04:25):
minutes, which was 226 wattsaverage, 20 minutes, which was
214 watts average, and also 30minutes, with 197 watt average.
My average for 53 minutes was186.
That compares to my current 60minute average power best of 153
.
I'm quite confident that Iwould have set a new hour power

(04:47):
average had the event gone thatlong.
Now, as I talked about last week, my previous best power for 20
minutes was 194.
My FTP 20-minute test resultwas 191.
191 to 214 is a significantdifference.
I think the only way to look atthis is that racing is going to
be the best way for me to pushmyself to get stronger.

(05:08):
I'm going to get a better lookat my FTP by doing a race rather
than the FTP test.
The results suggest that I willbe able to move into a higher
category without muchimprovement.
Another way to look at theintensity was that my average
heart rate was 157 beats perminute with a high of 172.
That is about as high as Iwould want to be.

(05:29):
However, I could push it up to160 beats per minute average and
not be too worried about it.
But the real hope is that I'llbe able to bring my heart rate
down and still increase thepower output.
If I do end up moving up onecategory, I don't think I'll be
able to move up any further.
To be near the top of that nextcategory up would be a huge

(05:50):
step for me.
I didn't feel totally wiped outby the race, but it did push me
.
Given everything, I willdefinitely be racing again.
The main reason I'm focused onbuilding more community
connections with Cycling Over 60is that the cycling community

(06:14):
is just so fun.
An example of this is thelobbying event I attended a
while ago in Olympia that wasorganized by Washington Bikes.
It was a room full of greatpeople.
Two of those people Iimmediately knew that I wanted
to introduce to listeners of thepodcast.
They are Diane and Paul fromBremerton, washington, and I'm
so glad they agreed to come on.
Here is our conversation.
Since I started doing thepodcast, I've traveled to more

(06:38):
cycling events and done morecycling-related things, and that
gives me an opportunity to meeta lot of really great people,
and I have two of those peoplewith me here today.
Thank you, paul Dutke and DianeIverson, for joining me.

Paul Dutky (06:53):
Thanks for inviting us, Tom.

Dianne Iverson (06:55):
We're excited and we're not too far from you.
We live north of you up inBremerton.

Tom Butler (07:00):
Yeah, yeah, a great area.
We met at a event in our statecapital, olympia, where we were
looking to have an influence toadvocate for cycling
infrastructure and safe streetsand things like that, and I just
really appreciated hearing fromyou guys and your experience

(07:24):
and I wanted to get that outthere to the podcast audience
too.
So we'll get into that and letyou guys kind of share your
cycling experience and we'llstart with if each of you could
share, like, your earliestmemory of the bicycle.

Dianne Iverson (07:41):
Yeah, I'm gonna let Paul start with that one.
Yeah, so I don't know if atricycle.

Paul Dutky (07:43):
Yeah, I'm going to let Paul start with that one.
Yeah, so I don't know if atricycle counts.
It was pretty early, so myearliest memory is being living
on a hillside and being on atrike.
I was probably around four andI started going down the hill
and the pedal started movingfaster than my feet, so I had to
take my feet off and I waspointed down the hill, which was

(08:04):
terrifying.
I was picking up speed and Idon't remember any more than
that.

Dianne Iverson (08:10):
But he obviously lived, because he's still with
us.
That was in San Diego,california, right.

Tom Butler (08:18):
Okay.
Well, it's interesting, Like Ithink there's a lot of lessons
about gravity that happen whenyou're first learning to bike.
That sounds like one of those.

Dianne Iverson (08:30):
Yeah, I'm not sure he's learned that lesson
yet, though.
Maybe he has I love goingdownhill so I can't remember
exactly.
I remember starting with thetricycle, then going to a
scooter and then all of a suddenI had a bike and that was part
of my life and I had a Schwinnand our whole neighborhood was

(08:53):
closed off from the rest of theworld because it was just kind
of a dead end road and that waspart of our activity 12 months a
year with all the neighborhoodkids play, tag on your bicycle
and throw a Zori at somebody.
So I love bikes.

Tom Butler (09:08):
I loved it then and I still love them and I was just
talking to someone yesterdaywho is is in his 70s and he's
talking about he still gets kindof that aspect of freedom that
comes back to him, like when hegoes out for a ride, just gets
on and takes off and kind ofexplores the world on his bike.
It's that, you know, thatexperience of freedom that we

(09:30):
feel when we're, when we've gotour bike in the neighborhood and
we're able to take off withwith friends, it just seems like
that's something that lingerson.

Dianne Iverson (09:39):
It lingers on and it also puts you in the
space of a happy zone on.
And it also puts you in thespace of a happy zone that,
because when you're a child andyou're on a bike you are so
happy you return there even asI'm 74 years old and the only
bike I rode on for 30 years wasa recumbent bike at the gym
because of health reasons, andat age 55 I got a cancerous

(10:02):
tumor on my foot and had to havean amputation.
Well, that began the journey ofgood health, and the first
thing I did after I learned towalk around the track of my
neighborhood high school was togo buy a bike.
I was living in Portland andthat track became the spot that
I taught myself how to ride abike again.
I was by myself at that time.

(10:23):
Paul and I just met nine yearsago, so this was 20 years ago.
So what you were?

Paul Dutky (10:29):
saying about the joy you know, remembering what it
was like as a kid, in the spiritof adventure, when Diane and I
started riding together.
She was able, she used to tourwith her friends and then she
spent 35 years in a wheelchair.
So that joy when we started,you know, on our tandem, and she

(10:50):
got her trike and she startedriding independently and and we
started going on tours again,that joy is evident in diane
when she gets on the bike she'sback to where she was 25 and,
you know, doing a tour in europe.

Dianne Iverson (11:04):
You know, yeah, back when I was biking by myself
, my distance was 20 miles atthe most and it would be in
neighborhood roads from polesbowout to kingston, you know.
And now we're doing trips overthe cascade and 500 mile trips
and um.
So because of paul and hisassistance in helping me figure

(11:26):
out how I can do it, Iunderstand the health reasons.
It's a mental healthimprovement and a physical
health improvement as biking Ijust love it.

Tom Butler (11:38):
So you're talking about an issue here which is a
big part of your cycling, andthat's that you spent time in a
wheelchair and I'm wondering ifyou could explain that.
You can explain, like theaccommodations that you have and
why you have accommodations.

Dianne Iverson (11:56):
Back when I was 18, I was out fishing up by so
call me falls, and I got a rockin my shoe and that began the
journey of an infection in mybone.
I was born spina bifidus, Ionly had partial feeling in my
feet and I did not know that myfoot was wounded, and for the

(12:19):
next, until I was 55, I had todeal with that issue, and the
reason that I went to awheelchair was I had to teach.
I had a job and the only way Icould work was to not be
exhausted at the end of the day,and pain was part of my
everyday life.
So once I got a health issue sodramatic that I had to make a

(12:42):
decision, I found that thatdecision was the right one to
put me on a path of good health.
So is that the?

Paul Dutky (12:49):
decision being having your legs Right.

Dianne Iverson (12:52):
So 20 years ago I had my left leg amputated
below the knee and 10 years agoI had my right leg amputated
below the knee and I have nopain.
I'm not as strong as I'd liketo be, but that's a journey that
just is part of my journeyright now.

Tom Butler (13:10):
It's really fascinating to me what you're
saying, if I'm hearing you right, and so maybe you can clarify
for this to me but there's likethis mindset change or there's
this making different choicesthat, when you're 55, put you on
a path to better health.
But it's like there was like apretty dramatic medical

(13:34):
procedure I don't know the rightway to say that and definitely
a decision for you to make aboutwhether or not to have this
procedure that a lot of peoplewould not want to face that
decision.
And yet, when you're talkingabout it, what I'm hearing you
say is it actually enabled youto make better health choices?

(13:57):
It was a reawakening.

Dianne Iverson (14:00):
Yeah, that's part of it, but let me tell you,
in my 20s my doctors wanted todo it.
Back then, the infection in mybones and both legs was awful
and there was no way I coulddeal with that issue, and so I
chose the path of trying toavoid the pain as much as
possible by being in awheelchair.

(14:21):
I worked out in my wheelchair,I went to the pool, I did
weightlifting, I got on abicycle at the gym, but it was
all inside of a gym or aswimming pool.

Paul Dutky (14:31):
Not all, I mean, she also taught herself to kayak,
we'd go out.

Dianne Iverson (14:36):
That is true.
I used to roll my wheelchair tothe bus and go downtown
Portland and I rented a spot formy kayak and so that I wouldn't
have to do.
You know I was single, so Iwouldn't, have to take the kayak
on and off the car, which keepsyou from doing that sort of
stuff.

Paul Dutky (14:53):
And so, yeah, I did she's an excellent kayaker and
she's strong and when she's inthe kayak she's just like you
know every other kayaker it maybe better.

Dianne Iverson (15:03):
So at 55, I'm older, I'm wiser I'm sick and
tired of the pain, and the painwas so excruciating that I said
yes, to get rid of the pain.
When they told me we're goingto teach you how to walk again,
I didn't believe them.
I said I will be a good patient, but I don't believe you.
I've got to get rid of thispain.

(15:23):
I be a good patient, but Idon't believe you.
I've got to get rid of thispain.
I was a good patient and withina year, I'm riding my bike
around the high school tracks,away from people and away from
cars, because bicycle riding wasthe first thing I wanted to do,
and I wanted to do it outside,not in the gym.

Tom Butler (15:40):
Do you think you're able to capture that for other
people, just like the freedomthat you were experiencing, that
point going from you know beinglimited as far as mobility, and
in pain, and then experiencinglike, hey, I'm able to move on
this bike and experience cyclingon this bike and experience

(16:07):
cycling.
Do you think there's words thatcan capture kind of what that
freedom felt like, what that joyfelt like?

Dianne Iverson (16:12):
I experienced the joy in other people when
they see Paul and I out on ourtandem or me out on the trike.
It just, it, just the facetells it all.
I'm not sure.
I guess I've never askedanybody, so that's when people
usually react, is when they seeus out there riding a bike and
our bike club members.

(16:33):
So I don't really know theanswer to that question.

Tom Butler (16:36):
I guess I would say and maybe you could describe a
bit like how that works.
How do you interface withprosthetics to the bicycle after
the amputations?

Paul Dutky (16:48):
So maybe I can answer that a little better.

Dianne Iverson (16:51):
Also retired ER doctors.

Paul Dutky (16:53):
So when we got together, it was obvious that
Diane wanted to bike, but shecouldn't keep her right foot on
the pedal and okay.
So, if I can abbreviate this,the answer was to give her foot
clips.
So she snapped in, but then shecouldn't.
If she was on her own bike, shecouldn't get out of the clips.
Okay, in fact she still has touse her hands to twist her foot

(17:16):
out of the clips.
Okay, but on a single bike ontwo wheels, she's unstable and
unable to do that.
So we got her a trike so thatshe's totally stable, she can
put the emergency brake on andthen she can clip in and clip
out with the bike staying in oneplace.
So the ability to use clips tohold her foot on the pedal was

(17:41):
sort of the magical solution forthat.
And then we got our tandem bikeand then just another issue the
problem is is that if I pedaltoo fast, okay, I'm actually
pulling her legs off.

Dianne Iverson (17:58):
And he's been known to do that.

Paul Dutky (18:00):
It took him about three months to finally figure
out he was doing that and shewent to the gym and learned how
to spin faster so she could moveher legs faster.
And the other thing is that onour new tandem she doesn't have
to pedal.
She adds power when she matchesmy cadence.

(18:21):
So if I'm going too fast thenshe just stops.
I'm basically spinning fasterthan she is and I'm not
affecting her feet.
So her trike and our tandem, asthey're currently set up,
basically gives her completefreedom to be on the bike and
her feet are stable in thepedals.

Dianne Iverson (18:42):
Yes, it's a recumbent trike.
What do they call them?

Paul Dutky (18:44):
Tadpoles Is that it yeah.
Two wheels in front and oneback.
A tadpole trike.

Dianne Iverson (18:48):
And you bet I'm clipped in Absolutely I have to
be, and it keeps my legs in thecorrect position and it keeps my
feet in the correct position.

Tom Butler (18:58):
Do you feel that understanding and maybe this is
something that you don't have alot of experience with, but do
you think that understandingabout how to connect to a
bicycle is pretty advanced, oris that something that you
advice that you have to seek out?
Is that something that enoughpeople are dealing with that

(19:20):
they really know how toeffectively make that happen, or
is that knowledge not aswidespread as it maybe could be?

Paul Dutky (19:28):
I don't think it's widespread, and we had to try
numerous different things to seewhat worked.
I think we've got a winningcombination now, but I don't
think this is intuitive.
For somebody with similarproblems, it's not obvious how
to get to a happy place on yourbicycle.

Dianne Iverson (19:48):
It requires an attitude that I have, but Paul
has it even stronger, which isif it doesn't work for you,
let's figure out another way tosee if it can work for you.
He's very persistent about that, whether it's in my.
I had two kayaks when I met himand he's improved those kayaks
so that I could use them moreefficiently.

(20:09):
He does the same thing on abike, so we spent three months
on my bike that I had a Trek anda folding electric bike trying
to see what we needed to keep myright the weakest leg on the
pedal, and as long as I wentuphill it would always fall off
the pedal.
So it's the attitude ofpersistence that, okay, this

(20:33):
didn't work, but why and henever gives up on that, on his
own body and his aches and pains, and he's teaching me to even
be stronger at it.

Paul Dutky (20:42):
Think how difficult it would be, if you have no
feeling in your feet and youdon't when you have a prosthetic
foot to feel pedal pressure tokeep your foot on the pedal.
So the only real answer is toclip in.

Tom Butler (21:07):
And for people that haven't listened before, that's
Seattle to Portland, a 206-mileride.
That happens over a couple days.
There's one hill called thePuyallup Hill that people talk
about and I was pretty nervousabout that Puyallup Hill and
when I got there I rode up thehill quite slowly which I will
do again this year when I rideup that hill but I was passed by

(21:27):
a woman who had a prosthesis onher right leg and as she was
passing me I got to see itbriefly as she kind of flew by
me.
But it was really to meinteresting to think about.
I don't think I have thatability to fully understand,

(21:48):
like, what's going on there whenyou're connected to your bike
and rotating the pedal in thatway, but it is to me a really
interesting thing about, kind ofthe mechanical aspect of that
kind of interface between yourleg and the bike.

Dianne Iverson (22:09):
We've learned a lot about that also in this
process.
I had my amputations inPortland Oregon and I wanted to
find a prosthetic expert hereclose to us and I interviewed
somebody and I really liked himand thought he really was good.
But I said, paul, you got to gointerview him with me too.
And we found a guy that if youwant to raise the bar on what

(22:32):
you are able to do, he helps youget there.
So he and Paul designed what Ineed for my legs in a kayak we
take off the lower part.

Paul Dutky (22:42):
And then Paulul helped design the polka tat my
dry suit so we got we got a drysuit that'll zip over her leg,
and but instead of having theleg on there, we put a a half
inch thick rubber, uh disc.
So her legs were really short.
But what we?

(23:03):
And then we move the bulkheadforward so she can press her
feet straight into a bulkhead.
That's closer.
She kayaks without herprosthetic legs on.

Dianne Iverson (23:13):
Well, they're on , but the lower part's not on.

Paul Dutky (23:16):
Yeah, the lower part's not on but now she has
much better control of the boatbecause she can press with her
legs.
Before she was just sitting ina seat without any ability to
have that power transfer.

Dianne Iverson (23:30):
So when I first started biking with Paul, about
every 45 minutes we would haveto stop and I'd have to take my
legs off and elevate thembecause they'd swell up.
And if I did that every hourand for about 10 minutes then I
could continue going.
My new prosthetic guy said oh,we just need to get you a
different kind of prosthetics.

(23:50):
And so he did, and he workedwith Paul and there's, at the
end of the day, my legs are lessswollen not more.

Paul Dutky (23:59):
So the circulation is not impaired.
The swelling actually goes downwith exercise now.

Dianne Iverson (24:03):
So having the right medical professional help
you to get stronger when you askfor it is essential, and my
prosthetic guy in Silverdale hasvideos of five people five of
his clients young to I think I'mprobably the oldest and he
interviewed us and has us onthere so that when people go to

(24:25):
his office they see that thisisn't the end of their life,
this is a new chapter in theirlife and you can get healthier
even with prosthetics.
I love that attitude.

Tom Butler (24:34):
I'm wondering if you are aware of the film 1,500
Miles.
I'm not it is a film, a woman.
I think it's Nicole and I thinkit's Ver-Kulin.
I'm probably saying that wrong,but it's V-E-R-K-U-I-L-E-N.

(24:55):
16 years after the amputationof her left leg, she challenged
herself to complete a 1,500 miletriathlon from Seattle to San
Diego.

Paul Dutky (25:07):
A triathlon, tom or a triathlon where she's swimming
and yeah, yeah, 1500 miles 1500miles.

Tom Butler (25:17):
So if you go to forest stump F O R R E S T S T U
M P, forestumporg, then you canfind a link to the film.
The group of people that I sawcycling on STP was affiliated in

(25:37):
some way with Forest Stump.
So I think it's maybe amovement of people, maybe a
movement of people and I think abig focus that they have is
saying that activity is so vitalto human well-being that
prosthetics that aresufficiently made for athletic

(26:01):
endeavors should be consideredessential medical devices and
covered by insurance.
I think it's, you know, one ofthe things that they advocate
for, and so I'm wondering if youcould talk a bit about that.
You are like you said.

(26:22):
You're out there, you're beingactive, you're in your 70s.
I see it in myself and theevidence is there that you being
active is really vital to yourwell-being, and I'm wondering if
you could comment on that a bit, about removing barriers for

(26:43):
people to be able to be activeas kind of an essential thing.

Dianne Iverson (26:50):
Your timing is really good on that question.
I'm a retired public employeefrom the state of Oregon and I
worked at the school district,the county and the state and
it's all part of the sameretirement system and it has
good health care and I had theoption of keeping that health
care option in retirement.
Um, even if I moved to anotherstate, which is so, I have very

(27:15):
good health care coverage thatcovers my prosthetic legs a
hundred percent.
Otherwise, if I had to coverthe 20%, it could easily be
$2,000 a year per leg.
That's a lot of money for mostpeople and so good healthcare

(27:36):
coverage is extremely importantto me and I'm very thankful that
I got it.

Paul Dutky (27:43):
Wasn't there an initiative, though, about adding
sports prostheses to insurance?

Dianne Iverson (27:48):
Yes.
So you know, when we saw youlast week, we met with the 26th
representative, michelle Caldier, and we met with her about bike
stuff, but she brought up theissue of policy before the

(28:08):
legislature concerning kids hadjust come in and testified that
they would like to have a secondset of legs that's covered by
insurance that allows them to bemore mobile, and, from what I
could tell, she was in favor ofthat, and so there are rules as

(28:29):
to how often I can get new legs,and I have to prove that my
previous legs aren't workinganymore.
I now have legs that arewaterproof and kayak friendly,
because we went to Hawaii andkayaked, but I couldn't have
done it if it hadn't been thatfive-year period.
I had to wait for new legs, andso there are barriers in the

(28:50):
insurance industry that you know.
If a kid needs to have anotherset of legs to do physical
activity, that's one of the mosthealthiest things you can do
for that kid.
I mean, they're incrediblyresilient and happy to be more
mobile because that's what theywant to do mobile because that's

(29:14):
what they want to do.

Tom Butler (29:15):
I think that that's a key observation I think you're
in a position to really speakto.
That is that, you know, I thinkit can be transformational when
you enable someone to be activeand when you, you know, take
away the messages that I'm sorry, you can't participate, you
know, and enable them toparticipate.
I just think that's so powerful.

Dianne Iverson (29:34):
I agree.

Tom Butler (29:35):
And I also want to just say thank you for being a
public servant.
I have a lot of respect forpublic servants and this is a
time that I just want to takethat moment to say yay to people
that are serving the public.
Yay to people that are servingthe public.

Dianne Iverson (29:53):
Yeah, I'm very glad I'm retired right now, but
I would not want to be a federalemployee right now.

Tom Butler (30:03):
Yeah, and it's a shame.
Talk about your current setup.
You've alluded to it a fewtimes, but can you speak more to
how you discovered it, themanufacturer and those things,
and what makes it unique for you?

Paul Dutky (30:16):
Well, one of the things is we had a standard
tandem where Diane was sittingbehind me and really couldn't
see much, but what happened isthere's a lot of pressure on her
butt sitting and that reallycaused some problems, and so we
switched to a recumbent seatwhen we got the trike.
But that worked so well that wewanted a tandem that had a

(30:41):
recumbent seat.
So our current tandem has arecumbent seat in front and a
standard seat in back for me.
So the advantages of that arewe're both looking at the road,
our heads are right next to eachother, so we can speak without
using intercoms and Diane canhave hands-free to do
photography, navigate, navigate.

(31:01):
So we were looking for a bikethat did that.
So Haas, as a German bikecompany, has built a Pino, which
is which is this bike.
So we, we bought the bike, butit doesn't.
Because of the way thehandlebars are designed, I can't

(31:21):
stand up easily on the bike topedal, which is what I always
did before.

Dianne Iverson (31:26):
Right, when we went up a steep hill.

Paul Dutky (31:28):
It was the extra power, we'd go up in four miles
an hour.
I'd be standing and move up thehill Right.
So I can't even get this bikemoving easily because of where
the handlebars are.
So we added electricity to thetandem so that I can get the
bike started moving withelectricity and then clip in as

(31:50):
we're rolling.
So those are all modifications.
And then again the bike doesn't.
I can't overdrive Diane and andI because she has a slip gear
for the front.
So this particular arrangementis really sort of a miraculous
solution.
Now it's a.

(32:10):
It's a fairly big and heavybike, so it's not as nimble and
quick as a standard tandem.
And it's light.
It's heavier.
So there's compromises, right,but for the two of us this is
the ideal arrangement.

Dianne Iverson (32:24):
There's a Facebook page called Halfs Pino
Owners.
I belong to it and people helpeach other navigate how to make
adjustments on their bike.
What's amazing about thisparticular German bike is it's
an adaptive bike for all sortsof disabilities.
So parents with children withdifferent disabilities buy this

(32:50):
bike for that purpose and youcan buy the parts to help you
put your kid in the correctposition.
So if your kid can move theirlegs but needs some connection
to making sure the legs areright, they can make that brace.
If your kid can't use theirlegs at all, the kid can still
be on the bike.
If an adult is a hand cranker,they adapt it to hand cranking

(33:13):
and then for the average person,we take our granddaughter out
on it when she was shorter.
We haven't taken her lately,but it's adaptable.
Put kids on, you, just move theboom.
So it's.
I think it's one of the mostincredible bikes out there.

Tom Butler (33:26):
Well, I've seen and I'm really attracted to them.
You know, I think one of thethings is being closer together.
So my wife you know I wanted toget a tandem, thinking it would
be a way for us to cycletogether, and she's like, well,
if we do that, then what I getto experience is your back, is

(33:49):
your back.

Dianne Iverson (33:50):
That's a lot of those photographs.
Paul's back His shoulder, hisright shoulder, his left
shoulder.

Tom Butler (33:58):
Right, and so I just love.
The different seating allowsfor a different experience.

Paul Dutky (34:07):
It is a different experience.
There is a significant downside.
When Diane was behind me rightand she couldn't see the road,
then she wasn't commenting onbeing too close or being out of
the lane or rocks or this.
And now that she's in front,there's this non, no, slow down,
do this, do that, I'm gettingthis.
Anyway, that didn't happenbefore, so it's a significant

(34:29):
change.
He's adapted, so it's asignificant change.
I love it.

Tom Butler (34:33):
He's adapted Well, it sounds like maybe some of
that is good observation too,though.

Dianne Iverson (34:43):
I think so, but it's all up to you to ask.
We actually if you'd like to doa test ride sometime, you're
welcome to come to our house,since we're not very far from
you, and do a test ride, and doit with your wife, if you like.
We actually have two of thesenow.

Tom Butler (34:56):
Fantastic.
Well, we might take you up onthat.
That would be wonderful.
I would like you to talk alittle bit about writing tandems
together, and you've alreadyalluded to that.

Paul Dutky (35:10):
there's a partnership there, and you've
already alluded to that there'sa partnership there, you know,
and that partnership changed alittle bit, with Diane being

(35:30):
able to see things out in front.
Is that something that you haveto get used to, Do you think
everybody kind of has to getused to?
That friend who's ridden atandem with his wife for years,
and he said and this is reallygood advice he said, Paul, he
said now you're riding withDiane, you need to remember that
you are the captain of the bike.
You're the captain, but she isthe admiral.
And I went oh, I think you'reright.

Dianne Iverson (35:51):
This is a retired police officer.

Paul Dutky (35:55):
So that is good to keep in mind because I mean she
has to be become either place,she has to be be comfortable and
we have to make joint decisions.
So, on the bright side of this,when you're navigating and
you're trying to find your waythrough the world or you're
you're trying to find where youare in a later, in a different
country, or you're trying tofind where you are on a lane or
you're in a different country, Imean having two eyes on the
road, with different opinions.

(36:15):
There are some disagreements,but by far there's an advantage
in having a better understandingand being able to navigate the
world better with two eyes onthe road than just one.
That's awesome.

Dianne Iverson (36:27):
So for example, our first overseas trip on our
old Cannondale, where I was inback.
We had the first five daysbefore we were going on a bike
and barge trip in Paris.
So we just entered the cityfrom the suburbs and got to know
the city.
Well, paris is made up of abunch of roundabouts and when
you're on Google Maps and you'relistening to the directions,

(36:50):
they't quite pronounce the uhnames too well on the streets
and you may have eight roadscoming out of an intersection
and I'm supposed to tell paulwhich road we're going to take.
I generally did it, uh,oftentimes too late.
He doesn't hear very well, soso anyway, well, it was
difficult.

Paul Dutky (37:09):
The internet connection was slow, that's true
.
So what would happen?
We would invariably go twoturns past where we needed to be
continuously.
So when she's in front, she canactually see.
If you're using like drivingwith GPS, you can see the
intersection and you might beslow.
Where you are might be slow,but you understand.

(37:30):
It's the third turn to theright, right, and so now that
we're in front, we're navigatingbetter, much better.
Where you are might be slow,but you understand.

Dianne Iverson (37:37):
It's the third turn to the right, and so now
they're in front.
We're navigating better, muchbetter, but when you're in a
brand new place like a city likethat, it really helps to have
two sets of eyes.

Paul Dutky (37:44):
A lot of people say we just absolutely can't be
together on a tandem.
There's too much arguments.
But if you join a tandem clubyou've got a pre-selection
process, you've got all thesepeople that do get along well
with each other and that makesit a delightful club to belong
to, because there's a lot of Idon't know what do you call it
Positive harmony in a group likethat.

Dianne Iverson (38:06):
We are members of the Evergreen Tandem Club
that most of the members are outof the Seattle area.
It took us a couple of years.
We went down to Tacoma andstarted a ride with about 11
bikes and as we were setting up,I realized we were the only

(38:26):
couple that didn't have headsets.
Everybody else had headsets andwere talking to each other.
Well, that's one of the biggestfrustrations is you can't hear
each other very well on astandard tandem and headsets are
like the answer, so just doingit with other people that are
more experienced than you.
We went and got a headset andnow we love the headset when I'm
on my recumbent trike and he'son a separate bike, Because if
he makes a right turn and Idon't see it, I can talk to him

(38:49):
and say I don't know where youare.

Paul Dutky (38:51):
Yeah, or if I go through the intersection and she
decides to stop, she can say oh, I didn't make the intersection
, but practice and forgivenessare extremely important.

Tom Butler (39:04):
I love it.
Can you talk a bit about howyou started writing together,
just that process?
When did you notice each otherand you know how did?

Dianne Iverson (39:19):
that come about?
Jealousy, jealousy.
So in 2015, I had my secondamputation in March and by
August 21st I had ants in mypants and I needed to get out of
town.
So I went and got my ferryticket out of Port Townsend to

(39:41):
Friday Harbor.
That includes four hours ofwhale watching, along with
having a trip to Friday Harborand lunch with friends and
coming back the same day.
Who's on this boat?
The bike club, and they'regoing out for four days of
camping on San Juan Island, andthey all got their outfits on
and they all got their bikes.
And I'm just saying to myself Ican't do that.

(40:04):
I wish I could do that.
And because you're on a boatfor seven hours, or at least the
first four hours we got to knoweach other on the boat and we
saw whales that day too.
That's when we found out thatwe both loved kayaking and that
we both loved bicycle riding,and so we had a date a month

(40:26):
later, and that's how it began.

Paul Dutky (40:29):
So if we're going to do stuff together, it becomes
rather clear what thelimitations are and the problems
.
And so then it's just and Ilike solving problems like that
he does so.
So it's just a.
Now you're embarking on aprocess where we just
incrementally just improvethings.
So so here's something.
So when we got the trike, soDiane, was independent.

(40:54):
You know I'd go out riding andyou know I mean she wouldn't be
able to keep up on her otherbike at all.
I mean it would be impossiblewhen we got the trike it's an
electric trike, right?
So she'd then go out with me.
The first time we used it, shewould just scream by me wait for
me at the top of the hill.
The first time we used it, shewould just scream by me wait for

(41:15):
me at the top of the hill, Imean.
so she could just keep up as apartner on a ride and I could go
as fast as I wanted and she hadno problem keeping up with me.

Tom Butler (41:25):
That was a nice solution.
Decide first to do tandemriding together, or did you
decide first to do the triketogether, for her to use the
trike and ride?

Dianne Iverson (41:38):
that's a good question.
First week I had two singlebikes that I had bought uh one.
When I moved.
I retired from portland andcame to polesville uh, 20 miles
away from here and I had twosingle bikes that I could ride
to the neighborhood.
I can ride to Kingstoncarefully, and that's kind of
what I did on my own.
So when he met me, our goal wasto try to get me to be able to

(42:02):
handle 40 mile days with thebike club.
So we took my single bike downto the foothills trail and
parked the car and did apractice run trying to figure
out how to keep me from losingmy right foot off the off the
pedal.
We tried different versions ofshoes, of pedals, and obviously

(42:25):
I wasn't going to be able to useclip-ons because I just knew
I'd go into fear mode.
So we first started off withtrying to get me to do a single
bike and try to solve thoseproblems and finally, Did we do
the tandem, the standard tandem,before?

Paul Dutky (42:43):
we got the trike A long time before, so we were
riding before and we decidedtandem riding was the solution.

Dianne Iverson (42:51):
One of our friends they're both retired.
She got diagnosed withparkinson's disease and so they
bought a canondale tandem andthey asked us to come to their
house and get on their tandem intheir living room on training
wheels to see if that wassomething that would work for us
, and I, I think about a weeklater we bought the tandem, just

(43:12):
like theirs, clips With clipson it.
She could clip in her feet andthen we went down to California
and did our first bike ride onit.

Paul Dutky (43:20):
So what happens is I straddle the bike, I hold the
bike steady and she climbs onand clips in, and then, when we
stop, I stop the bike, stabilizethe bike and then she can clip
out Gotcha.

Dianne Iverson (43:34):
So in 2017, we went to France and did our
Paris-Debrouze bike and bargetrip.
2018, we went to Italy, andthat's when it was a seven-week
trip that my butt just couldn'thandle it anymore.
So we came home and we boughtthe tandem, the Class.
Piano, Tandem and the trike allin the same summer actually.

Tom Butler (43:57):
You mentioned a cycling club and I think you
guys are active with the WestSound Cycling Club.
Is that correct?
I wonder if you could talkabout for you what do you think
a good club provides cyclists?

Paul Dutky (44:15):
Well, it's a social connection and I think, what you
know, it's tricky.
I mean you could.
When we had a larger club about10 years ago, there was all
kinds of different.
You could call them clicks,right, people are going
different speeds, people aremore relaxed, people are pushing
faster, and we try toaccommodate those different

(44:36):
elements and it's sort of whathappens is you end up sort of
over time.
What's happened is we we have acore group of people that enjoy
touring together and we try toalso do weekday rides for local
people in the club, but there'sa core group that will go out on

(44:56):
10, 12 day rides.

Dianne Iverson (44:58):
They did a month ride in.

Paul Dutky (44:59):
Canada.
We're compatible with oneanother, so everybody has a good
attitude about how to move dayto day or over a week or more.

Dianne Iverson (45:09):
So this club has been around a lot longer than
I've been involved with it, andmost people were working and so
now most of the members are intheir 60s and 70s and some 80s,
um.
So they used to have ridesweekly on saturdays because
people worked monday throughfriday.
So during the summertime it'svery frequent that there are

(45:29):
rides tuesday, thursdays andSaturdays that different people
take the lead on taking peopleon, and they'll have anywhere
between 5 to 18 people on a ride.
But if you know that there'sgoing to be a ride each week and
it gets posted the previousweek, then people join you.
So that's been a very importantpart, especially now we're
actually growing again.

(45:50):
The 60-year-olds are retiringand wanting to get back on a
bike and they don't have theexperience and they like to go
with people that know where togo.
So they just need to learn howto ride a bike again and be
comfortable.

Paul Dutky (46:03):
For 35 years this was a racing club.
It's really evolved over time.

Tom Butler (46:07):
Okay, it Okay.
That's very interesting.
It doesn't sound like you'reseeing younger people coming to
the club as much as older people.

Paul Dutky (46:20):
That would be true.

Dianne Iverson (46:37):
That's true.
We have a different arm on theclub, an advocacy arm that Paul
chairs, and right now I'm vicepresident of the West Sound
Cycling Club.
But Paul chairs the advocacygroup and because we've been
advocating for safer streets inBremerton now for nine years and
it was happening before Ishowed up the younger people
reached out to us and wanted tohelp us on advocacy.
So did they join our club?
No, but we joined a partnershipand they started a Facebook
page of communication.
They live a lifestyle that isnot two cars, they live a

(46:58):
lifestyle that is sometimes onlya bike, but sometimes a car and
a bike.
They want their kids to be ableto ride around the community
and so that younger group theydon't have time to be gone
Tuesday, thursday, saturday on abike ride with us.
They are living their life andwant safer streets and that's
where our connection is.
So a year and a half ago westarted they started and we're

(47:21):
partnerships on a Facebook pagecalled Street Spark Bremerton
and we have 450 people on it nowand those are local residents
who want to make the streetssafer for biking, walking and
rolling in a wheelchair.
So that's where our connectionhas been with the younger
generation.

Paul Dutky (47:40):
That's blurred the distinction of what's the club
right and what's just acommunity of people that want to
make bicycling safer and easierand more connected.
That's a much bigger group nowthan just our club.

Tom Butler (47:54):
Well, I love that and I love that focus on active
transportation and activerecreation, and to me that
sounds like something everybicycle club should really think
about is that there is thisbroader community that thinks of
bicycles in maybe differentways than like a racing club
would think about the bicycleand one of those young men who

(48:17):
reached out to us a few yearsago.

Dianne Iverson (48:21):
He was down in olympia.
He was at our table I had he'sthe one with the ponytail and
he's he's been a wonderful assetin the discussion.
And so it's not just paul anddiane and the bike club, it's
these young people with kidsgoing to the elementary school
and, uh, it's amazing.
So we can get 30 people at ameeting to testify on a
particular issue and we had kidsat the last time we did this,

(48:43):
we had kids as part of thetestimony.

Paul Dutky (48:45):
So we're making an impact with, with the city,
because now we're.
Some refer to us as the bikemafia.
Okay, fair enough, because wehave a lot of people on board
now and they feel like they'rebeing pushed and they are.

Dianne Iverson (49:04):
And we're educating ourselves.
So you will see on our StreetSmart Remington Facebook page
that part of the purpose iseducating more people, ourselves
included, as to what are thepossibilities.
I'll post photos of going toVictoria.
We ride to medical appointmentsat the University of Washington

(49:25):
, so from downtown Seattle tothere.
So it's an educational tool forus and we've learned a lot.
I I feel like I have adoctorate in how to design roads
.
Now, yeah, for bikes.

Paul Dutky (49:41):
We were asked by the city of palestine to give a
presentation to theirengineering department with
respect to our trip to thenetherlands, and so we really
emphasize traffic calming andhow the whole attitude and
approach is different in theNetherlands and when we were
done we got the feeling that wehad given them some options that
they were really excited abouton how to improve the streets

(50:04):
and connectivity in Palsbo.
So I mean we had good feelingsabout it.

Dianne Iverson (50:09):
And that was just last Friday.

Paul Dutky (50:11):
Having an impact.

Tom Butler (50:12):
Yeah, nice, that's amazing, now you know.
So obviously you're involvedlocally with advocacy and we met
at an event that was more aboutstatewide advocacy.
Are there other ways?
Are you active on a nationallevel at all as far as advocacy
is concerned?

Dianne Iverson (50:31):
Not at all, no Other than we helped our state
senator become a congresswomanand we took her on a bike ride.
We took her on two bike ridesactually.

Paul Dutky (50:44):
We've taken our county commissioners on bike
rides and what we now have is abunch of elected officials that
appear to be pro-bicycle andunderstand that basically our
county is well behindsurrounding counties in bike
infrastructure.
So we feel like we've got alittle bit of a political
momentum going here, I hope.

Dianne Iverson (51:05):
But it's a good question.
I'm vice chair of LeaflineTrails Coalition, which is a
four-county collaborationbetween the four county
governments parks mostly andthen they have a few of us who
are not county employees and wehave been going through a
transition and we're now locatedwithin Cascade Bicycle Club as
our fiscal agent and a staffperson that staffs the.

(51:26):
We just have a part-time staffperson that staffs the board.
We're just starting, I thinknext week, with a policy
committee and we have the WSDOTwill be presenting next week at
our board meeting on the latestpolicy issues that are going on
in the state legislature.
But much of what goes on in thestate legislature is federal

(51:49):
funding, so part of this policydiscussion through Leafline
Trails Coalition will bebringing people that are
involved in different effortsaround the region and different
organizations to come togetherand keep each other informed as
to what are the federal policiesand state policies.
Right now it's about are yougoing to get your money?

Paul Dutky (52:08):
We're interested in changing Bremerton state and
county policy and state policy,you know, I mean because some of
the policy decisions aredifferent.
What do you call it?
Barriers?
They're barriers to provingsafety and connectivity.
So this is sort of a differentissue.

(52:31):
But basically, the trafficcalming in the Netherlands is
what's provided an 80% reductionin fatalities and injuries in
their bicycle infrastructure, intheir bicycle infrastructure
and in the United States and thecounty specifically, what

(52:55):
they've done is they've tried tomake sure that cars can move as
quickly and efficiently aspossible, whereas in the
Netherlands they understand thatyou slow cars in areas where
there's high populations so thatif there is an accident it's
not lethal.
But the two policies these arepolicies.
The two policies arecontradictory and we're trying
to move the local policy towhere you slow the vehicles, you

(53:17):
slow the turns, you make itsafer for people that exist here
, and so that's wheresignificant policy changes at
the state and regional level areimportant and we're working on
that.

Dianne Iverson (53:29):
It's a good question concerning the feds.
Right now Our county, alongwith several other jurisdictions
, want to raise grant, which isfederal funds, to the tune of
$16 million to design the gapsfor the paved trail from the
Bainbridge Island Ferry toPolesville, up to Port Gamble
and all the way to the coast,and that was a collaborative

(53:52):
effort with Port Angeles beingthe lead.
They have to spend that moneyin 10 years to design where the
gaps are.
The biggest gap is our countyand then in other parts in
Jefferson County and ClallamCounty you'll have a stretch and
then you have a little gap.
So they have 90 miles completed.
It will be a total of 140 milesfrom point A to B and then

(54:13):
there'll be another 100 miles ofconnectors to that.
That's all federally fundedthrough the Graves grant and we
think as of this week they'regoing to get the money.

Paul Dutky (54:22):
So with this, in perspective, they're 90 miles to
our one right.
There's one mile of safe bikefacility on that route right now
, and it's that county, wow.

Dianne Iverson (54:33):
Is that the Bainbridge Ferry terminal?

Tom Butler (54:36):
Well, you know to me that Olympic discovery trail
you know and you're you'retalking about a connector.
I think it's would beconsidered part of that trail.

Dianne Iverson (54:49):
It is the trail.
They are the leaders in thisstate.

Tom Butler (54:53):
Yeah.

Dianne Iverson (54:55):
And it's part of the national trail.

Tom Butler (54:57):
And I'm anxious to spend more time.
I haven't spent much time onthe Olympic Discovery Trail in
this season.
I you know I want to do more ofthat because to me it is a
national treasure the northwesttandem rally two years ago was
located in swim, and that's uh.

Dianne Iverson (55:15):
I think we had 600 people at the tandem rally
this year.
Uh, last year was a year.
A year ago, a year and a halfago, we told people you got to
come because the rides that youwill go on for the two to four
days, depending on how many daysyou're going to stay there, are
exquisite.
You have the mountains, youhave the sea, you have the

(55:36):
forest, you've got it all.
It's one of the most beautifulplaces in the state to ride a
bike and it's safe and it hasthe most paved trails of mileage
.

Tom Butler (55:47):
That is even close to us, so we love it can you
talk about how your backgroundshave fueled your interest in
advocacy?

Paul Dutky (56:01):
so that's, that's a good question.

Dianne Iverson (56:05):
That's how we got a second date, Paul.

Paul Dutky (56:10):
At the time we met I was extremely frustrated
because I was chair of theKitsap County Non-Motorized
Committee and I'd offered somereally good proposals, really
good ideas, and they were goingnowhere.
And when I met Diane so this isa problem with bureaucrats,
with government right and when Imet Diane she was an expert in

(56:33):
government and bureaucrats.
So let me help you understandthis she said for one thing, she
said do you have any personalrelationship with the county
commissioners?
And I went no, that's a problem.
So we've worked.
So Diane is the personalrelationship person and I'm sort
of the idea person that youknow the facts on the ground and

(56:55):
designing things and makingsure they all fit if you're
going to propose something.
So the two of us together aresort of a unique combination and
it seems to be a winningcombination.

Dianne Iverson (57:07):
The last 10 years of my life I worked for an
elected official Actually, Iworked for three and I used to
be an elected official in my 30sin a small rural town in Oregon
.
So I've been the bridge betweenthe employee and the elected
official.
And how do you take policy andmake it happen?
And got to facilitate some ofthat in Multnomah County.
It had nothing to do withtransportation For me it's

(57:29):
education and helping kids thataren't succeeding but the fact
that I know elected officials, Irespect elected officials, I
honor the fact that they're apart they need to lead the way.
And so my first question to himwas this is a great plan and
who's championing thisnon-motorized plan at the county

(57:50):
level?
And Paul goes what?

Tom Butler (57:51):
do you mean?
I said well, you have threecounty commissioners.

Dianne Iverson (57:53):
It's got to be somebody's passion, even though
this plan is pretty old.
And he didn't know and I wentoh yeah, that's a problem.
You need to know what thecounty commissioners want,
Because what we found out isthey really weren't leading the
way and we needed to educatethem.
And that's what we're doing nowand figuring out.
What does that look like?

Tom Butler (58:14):
I'm wondering, Paul, if you have had a specific
perspective about public safetyas a emergency room physician.

Paul Dutky (58:26):
I can't say that my background in emergency medicine
it's more my background as acyclist.
I empathize, if you will, withpeople that just want to have a
more direct and safe way to getsomeplace, a pleasant way of
getting around.
They ought to be able to get,for instance, from Port Orchard

(58:51):
to Bremerton on a bicycle, andthere is no way.
You ought to be able to getacross town in Bremerton safely,
and there is no way.
And so, from a cyclistperspective, I try to provide
the city, through public worksand its elected officials, a
vision of north, south and eastwest corridors.
That's feasible and possible,and we've been working on that

(59:11):
for eight years, and much of itis now in place, but I don't
know that emergency medicine perse is part of that.

Dianne Iverson (59:20):
So, within the bike clubs, some people have
been killed on the roads ofKitsap County and I myself.
In 2019, paul was been killedon the roads of Kitsap County
and I myself in 2019, paul wasout hiking on the Olympic
Peninsula and I was out on mytrike by myself on what I
thought was probably the safestroad around which probably is
and I got hit.
I got hit at the intersectionof Clear Creek and Mountain View

(59:41):
and it was just two vehicles megoing through this intersection
and a car hitting me.

Paul Dutky (59:45):
She ended up in the ER.
She had a significantconcussion For six months.
When I showed up in theemergency department I looked at
her foot, her shoe on her foot.
There was a hole right throughher foot which was a prosthetic
foot, luckily.

Dianne Iverson (01:00:04):
It was part of the car.
Wow, luckily it was part of thecar.
I was blacked out and the firstresponders had to deal with it.
It took her six months torecover from it.

Tom Butler (01:00:16):
Wow, you mentioned the tandem rally in Sequim and I
think the next one is inSpokane at Washington.
That's the Northwest TandemRally.
It's July 4th to 6th.
I'm actually going to be inSpokane already at that time, so
I'm definitely going to go dropby.

(01:00:38):
I'm probably going to take arecording device and do an
episode about the rally.
What can I expect to experienceat a Northwest Tandem Rally?

Dianne Iverson (01:00:53):
Probably heat in Spokane.
My prosthetic legs don't likeheat so we probably aren't going
to go to that rally because ofthe heat.
But I find tandem rallies to beawesome.
The first one I think I everwent to was Klamath Falls, and I
used to live in Redmond, oregon, and so Klamath Falls was three

(01:01:14):
hours south of there by car,and on that one it was 700
people and it was over a holiday, so most of the people in
Klamath Falls were somewhereelse.
And then we had a police escort, so you start the morning at
the same time and you have apolice escort for the next few
miles, just taking you into thecity, and then you have the

(01:01:36):
option of going 30 miles, 45miles, 75 miles, and they feed
you along the way.
So every 15 miles you get somegreat food, and they actually
won me a food award as far asI'm concerned.

Paul Dutky (01:01:48):
But I think, I think what you'll, I think what, from
my perspective, whatdistinguishes tandem rallies is
that you have couples which havesurvived.
I mean, you know so, maybe asmall, minuscule group of people
that actually started tandemriding, and these people have
survived and they actually getalong with each other.
So it's a large group of peoplethat sort of have good

(01:02:09):
relationships with each other,and that is, I think, a
remarkable gathering.
I think that's fine.

Tom Butler (01:02:15):
That is fantastic.

Dianne Iverson (01:02:16):
I love that perspective old tandem during
the Klamath Falls Tandem Rallyand we were the last couple
coming in.
We had done the 65 mile rideand we had told ourselves the
only way we're going to be ableto do this is pace ourselves,
otherwise we're going to be deadat the end of the day.

(01:02:37):
So we were last and they hadevery boat and all the water and
all the food and a van thatwould check up on us.

Paul Dutky (01:02:44):
Yeah, you're the reason we're here.
They said.
It was like we really feltsupported.
It was great.

Dianne Iverson (01:02:50):
But I have a personal story.
At the tandem rally there, oneof the volunteers was in a pair
of shorts, and in a pair ofshorts you notice that they have
an artificial leg, and so if Isee somebody with an artificial
leg I go up and join thesisterhood brotherhood and say
hi to them.
And so I went up and said hi tothem and at that point in time

(01:03:12):
I think I had long pants on, soI pulled up my legs and I said
look at me, he goes.
Wow, I didn't know I could ridea bike.
And so he rides a bike and hequit doing it when he got his
prosthetic leg, like two yearsbefore, and I became his
inspiration.
I've never met the guy.

Tom Butler (01:03:32):
I don't know what he's doing now, but I have a
suspicion he's back on a bikethat is such a fantastic story,
so do you have some tripsplanned in the near future here?

Dianne Iverson (01:03:43):
yes, we are well our most, our trip.

Paul Dutky (01:03:48):
We were supposed to be on a trip to california, it's
just that the forecast callsfor inundation and rain for over
a week.
So most of our club memberssaid and let's just we're
supposed to leave today for thebike ride.

Dianne Iverson (01:04:01):
Driving 13 hours to ride in the rain every day
didn't seem smart, but thisspring we have a trip planned.
Go ahead.

Paul Dutky (01:04:07):
Yeah, so the next ride is we're going to go to
Vienna, Austria andCzechoslovakia and ride down to
Budapest, Hungary, and spend sixweeks.

Dianne Iverson (01:04:19):
One of our good friends is 10 years older than I
am.
She's 84.
She's going with us, 10 yearsolder than I am, she's 84, and
she's going with us.
And then we hope Paul's sisterwill be joining us.
But she's got a diet healthdiagnosis that we need to figure
out what what that is.
But we're all signed up.
We're leaving May 1st and Pauland I will be gone six weeks.

Tom Butler (01:04:37):
Well, budapest is one of those places I'd like to
go cycling.
I don't know much about it, soI'll have to ask you guys after
you're back what it was like,but for some reason to me
Budapest sounds like a placethat would be really neat to
experience on a bike.
We'll see.

Dianne Iverson (01:04:56):
One of the things we really want to do is
you can take a bike and horsetrip from Prague to Vienna, to
Budapest, but nobody would takeour bike and I can't ride a
regular tandem or a regular bike.
So we really want to takePaul's sister on a bike and
barge because it's so cool.
There's only like well,depending on the size, the ones

(01:05:18):
we've been on have been 12passengers and 18.
So it's an intimate group.
You only unpack once.
We did a two week one from.
Paris to Bruges, that's why wewanted to do this spring but we
couldn't do it.
So we're doing hotel to hotel.
But it's all a path.
It's a shared use path, like99% of the distance.

Paul Dutky (01:05:36):
So you're moving from place Every day.
You're packing up and moving.

Dianne Iverson (01:05:40):
And they take your luggage if you want them to
.

Tom Butler (01:05:49):
Well, thank you so much for joining me.
You are so delightful.
I'm so thrilled that I got tomeet you at the olympia lobbying
event and thanks so much fortaking the time to to to share
with me today.
I am so impressed by you guys.
It just in numerous ways, theadvocacy that you do, the fact
that you are one of thosecouples that have survived a tan

(01:06:12):
, a tan, a bike together, andjust, uh, the way that you are
inspiring others to to be active.
I think that's all amazing andjust really thankful that got to
share this conversation witheverybody on the podcast.
Thank you, john.

Dianne Iverson (01:06:30):
This is our first, so thank you for inviting
us.

Tom Butler (01:06:33):
Well, I will say if you have a podcast out there,
get Paul and Diane on yourpodcast, because they're
wonderful guests.
So hopefully it won't be yourlast.

Dianne Iverson (01:06:44):
All right, thank you, tom.
Yeah, take care now you, tom.

Tom Butler (01:06:46):
Yeah, take care now, bye-bye.
Whenever I meet people likeDiane and Paul, it is an
inspiration to me.
It inspires me to get out andride and to reevaluate excuses
that I let hold me back, but I'malso inspired by how active

(01:07:09):
they are in their community.
I'm looking forward to findingsome time to do some cycling
with them and getting to knowthem even more.
I think it's particularlyimportant the work that they are
doing to raise awareness aboutobstacles that can interfere
with young people having accessto prosthetics that can support
interest in athletics.
If you have an opportunity tospeak on this issue, please do

(01:07:32):
so and watch 1500 Miles.
I will put a link in the shownotes.
I hope that you find ways toinspire those around you and I
hope you have plenty of peopleto inspire you.
And remember age is just a gearchange.