Memorial of Mary, Mother of the Church - John 19: 25-34 - Daily Gospel Exegesis

Episode Transcript
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(00:10):
Hi everyone, welcome back to theDaily gospel exegesis podcast
where we have a go at doing an exegesis of the literal sense of
the text. We look at the Gospel reading.
That's right at today's mass andwe give you the tools to
understand what it meant in its original context, by combining
the best Catholic. With the teaching of the church.

(00:32):
So today we have a really interesting feast in the
church's liturgical calendar. This is actually the newest
official Feast on the general, Roman lectionary.
So, this is called the memorial of Mary Mother of the church.
And the text we have today is anincredibly Rich Text.
Theologically. There's a whole lot, we could
say about it. And so today will be a longer

(00:56):
episode as we try to dive into all the different verses here.
But really will only just be scratching the surface.
So let's have a look at it. John chapter 19 verses 25 to 34
near the cross of, Jesus stood his mother and his mother's
Sister Mary, the wife of clopas and Mary of magdala seeing his

(01:19):
mother and the disciple, whom heloved standing near her.
Jesus said to his mother woman. This is your son.
Then, to the disciple. He said, Is your mother.
And from that moment, the disciple made a place for her in
his home. After this, Jesus knew that
everything had now been completed and to fulfill the

(01:42):
scripture perfectly. He said I am thirsty a Jar, full
of vinegar, stood there. So putting a sponge soaked in
the vinegar on hyssop Stick. They held it up to his mouth.
After Jesus had taken the vinegar.
He said it is accomplished and bowing his head, he gave up his

(02:04):
spirit. It was preparation day and to
prevent the bodies remaining on the cross during the Sabbath
since that Sabbath was a day of special solemnity.
The Jews asked pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies
taken away. Consequently.
The soldiers came and broke the legs of the first man who had

(02:25):
been crucified with him. And then of the other, when they
came to Jesus, they found he wasalready dead.
And so instead of breaking his legs, one of the soldiers
pierced his Side with a lance and immediately they came out
blood and water. So, what's the context to you?
Well, Jesus is being crucified. And if you want to hear the

(02:48):
versus leading up to the ones that we get to today, you can
hear those verses as bonus episodes of the podcast, because
those verses are never actually read in small chunks in the
lectionary. So if you want to hear an
in-depth exegesis of verses 23 and 24 and those surrounding
versus you can get access to that through the patreon page.
And there is a link to that in the episode description.

(03:11):
So verse 25 near The cross of Jesus.
Now, even this phrase is interesting because the other
gospel authors say that at the foot of the cross.
Well, in fact, people weren't really at the foot of the cross
at all. They were standing at a
distance, only John emphasizes that there are people standing
at the foot of the cross and Scholars have pointed out that

(03:31):
this is beginning to fulfill. What Jesus said earlier, in the
gospel about when I am lifted upfrom the earth.
I will draw everyone to myself. He said that in chapter 12 and
it's interesting, isn't it? Now?
He's being lifted up from the earth and people are being drawn
to the foot of the cross. And then we have a list of
people who are at the foot of the cross.

(03:52):
So it's his mother and his mother's Sister Mary, the wife
of clopas and Mary of magdala. So let's start with his mother.
So we know that she's called Mary.
Of course, although John doesn'tcall her by name.
He only ever calls her Jesus mother.
And in fact, the other Possible authors, don't tell us that

(04:13):
Mary. His mother is at the foot of the
cross, but John does. And that might indicate that
John has a particularly special relationship with Mary which
we're going to see in this particular passage as well.
So Mary, his mother is at the foot of the cross is Jesus dies.
And of course, this particular scene is one that many Catholics
would meditate on as part of theRosary, and there's a lot of

(04:35):
spiritual things that can be drawn from this.
So his mother is there at the foot of the cross watching him
die. And this is in a sense of
fulfillment of what was said, atthe start of Jesus life.
Remember when Mary brought Jesusinto the temple shortly after he
was born to be consecrated. There was a prophecy that was
given to Mary at that time and it says a sword will pierce your

(04:58):
own soul. And many people see this moment
when she's watching her son, die.
This is in a sense of fulfillment of that prophecy
that his sword will pierce her soul.
That's in Luke chapter 2 verse 35 So Mary is not named in
John's gospel and that could be a couple of different reasons
for that. Maybe John the author is trying
to avoid confusion with the other Mary's because there are

(05:20):
so many women called Mary in thegospels.
It's a very common name of that time.
So, maybe in order to avoid confusion.
He just calls her Jesus mother. It's possible that John is also
doing this for theological reasons.
Maybe he's deliberately calling her Jesus mother, and there
might be some theological motivations there.
Maybe he, To emphasize that Maryplays a symbolic role as the

(05:43):
mother of the church, but that'sjust a theory.
It's often very hard to reconstruct, why gospel authors
said particular things and sometimes they're just best
guesses. So also at the foot of the cross
we have his mother's sister, which is interesting.
So here we learned that Mary hada sister at specifically said
it's his mother's sister. Now, many believe that the

(06:07):
remember, this earlier, passagesin the gospels, where it talks
about the brothers of the Lord. So James and Joseph are two of
Jesus. Brother's, they're called his
brothers in the gospels. And they apparently live in
Nazareth with Jesus mother now, we're not 100% sure who exactly
these people are. They're certainly not Jesus or
own literal biological brothers because Mary didn't have other

(06:29):
children, but many believe that those other so-called Brethren
of the law. Are in fact children of this
woman who is Mary sister. So basically, they would be
Jesus cousins and that would make sense actually, because
Mary would live in Nazareth. Probably her sisters living in
Nazareth. And so it will be make a lot of

(06:50):
sense. That Jesus would spend a lot of
time with his cousins in Nazareth and that would come to
be known as his Brethren. So I think that theory makes
sense because we know from this passage that Mary has a sister
and there's even more support for this as well, if If you look
at the parallel passage for whatwe're reading today, the other
gospel authors describe, one of the women at the foot of the

(07:12):
cross as Mary, the mother of James, the younger, and Joseph.
So Matthew 27 verse is 56. Specifically says that one of
the women at the foot of the cross is Mary the mother of
James and Joseph now that James and Joseph, the people who are
known as Jesus brother's. Now, although Matthews version

(07:32):
doesn't identify that this Mary is His mother's sister, it does
make sense. If we put the two gospels
together, I think we have a veryclear case that this other woman
who is also called, Mary is the sister of Jesus mother and she
this other Mary is the mother ofJames and Joseph the Brethren of

(07:52):
Jesus. So they're basically his
cousins. It might seem strange to us.
That Mary would have a sister called Mary but that's sort of
how they did it in that culture,particularly in large families.
They would tend to I often use the same names so Mary was a
very common name in that culture.
We also have another woman at the foot of the cross here,

(08:13):
According To Jesus, according toJohn which is Mary, the wife of
clopas. Now, some people have suggested
that perhaps this Mary, the wifeof clopas is the other Mary that
Matthew refers to. As in Mary, the wife of clopas
is the mother of James and Joseph, that could also be true
as well. So there is some confusion here

(08:33):
about which me Your maps onto which Mary?
We have at least three Mary's here at the foot of the cross.
We have Mary, the mother of Jesus, Mary, the wife of clopas
and Mary of magdala. They're all definitely here.
And it's possible that there's afourth Mary.
So, his mother's sister, may well be called Mary, as well.
So that you can see how it's a very confusing.

(08:55):
And you've got to look at the text, you know, closely and see
how they map onto other passagesin scripture.
So, let's talk about, Mary, the wife of clopas.
The fact that she's called the wife of clopas indicates, the
clopas would have been known to John's audience.
Otherwise, there's no point in saying she's the wife of clopas.
Now. He's not mentioned in the Gospel

(09:16):
of John, but it appears to be the same person who is mentioned
in Luke's gospel. He's one of the disciples on the
road to Emmaus. If you remember that story, one
of the disciples is called cleopas and it's probably the
same person, Mary, the wife of clopas.
So, Clovis or clearpass is one of the early leaders.
The Christian Community and his wife, he's here at the foot of

(09:37):
the cross. We also have Mary of magdala at
the foot of the cross. So, Mary comes from a town
called magdala, which is actually been discovered now,
and you can go and see magdala today.
She's mentioned earlier in the other gospels as a woman who has
had seven demons cast out of her.
We don't know, a whole lot aboutMary of Magdalene.
She is not necessarily a prostitute.

(09:58):
The gospels don't say that it's just that she did have demons,
and they were cast out of her. But she is going to have a
starring role in the coming chapters after Jesus.
Resurrection, she has a very prominent role in The Gospel of
John. Apparently, there's some other
women who are nearby as well. We know that Joanna is possibly
nearby and possibly some other women, too.

(10:19):
So we should not see, you know, the list of women that John
describes as the only women. There's just certain ones that
he has decided to focus on now, to understand the next part of
this reading. We need to keep in mind the
status of women in that society and in The status of women in
ancient Societies, in general, women without a male protector,

(10:39):
had little or no social standingand very few societal
protections. So it was important that women,
particularly older women had a man in their life who could look
after them. Women depended on males.
That's how it worked in that society and that would usually
be the husband or an older son to help them survive.

(11:01):
So we get to verse 26 and John says seeing his mother and the
disciple he loved. So now we learn, there's someone
else at the foot of the cross. It's the disciple whom Jesus
loved. He's never identified by name in
John's gospel, but he is presentin all the important scenes.
In Jesus ministry, this disciple, whom Jesus loved keeps
popping up in our introduction to the Gospel of John.

(11:24):
In that bonus episode. I recorded about the Gospel of
John, we talked about who this disciple probably is.
Seems overwhelmingly likely thatthis disciple whom Jesus.
Loved is the author of The Gospel of John so that will
probably be the Apostle. John John, son of Zebedee.
That would make good sense aboutwhy the author of The Gospel,

(11:45):
never names, this disciple whom Jesus loved because it's John
himself and I think that makes good sense.
So, let's assume here that this disciple is John.
So, he Jesus from the cross, sees his mother and John and he
says, To his mother woman. Now, we need to talk about this
term woman because to us in the 21st century that sounds quite

(12:07):
offensive. Doesn't it to call any girl,
with a particular, your mother to call her woman in that
culture. It was not offensive.
It was actually quite polite. It was equivalent to our Madam.
So if you can actually think this is a Bible fact, that is
really helpful. If you can, keep in mind, woman
in the New Testament, is equivalent to our modern day

(12:28):
Madam. It's actually a term of respect.
So, he says to his mother woman.This is your son or most
translations would say, behold your son, roughly, what that
means is from now on, he will belike a son to you.
That's basically what he said sofar and then he turns to the
disciple. And he says this is your mother

(12:51):
or behold your mother and roughly, that means treat her as
your own mother. Now, it's not that the disciple,
John doesn't have a mother of his own because we know from a
lot. During the gospels that John
does have a mother. In fact, she'd stars in a couple
of scenes where she comes to Jesus.
So John certainly has a mother. But rather the point Jesus is

(13:13):
making is he wants this discipleJohn to take care of Mary
because Jesus is no longer goingto be able to take care of Mary,
he's going to die. So he wants to leave his mother
in good hands. These are some of Jesus final
words from the cross. It's probably shortly after this
that he that he passes away. Why does Jesus give Mary to the

(13:34):
disciple? What's going on here?
There's one main reason and thatwould be.
He wants his mother to be lookedafter, after he's gone.
That's the main reason why he sets up this Arrangement, where
he gives married to John. There's another possible reason,
which might be involved here, which is that Jesus loves this
disciple. He's called The Beloved
disciple, and he wants, The disciple to experience the love

(13:58):
of Mary. So he feels that the Beloved
disciple would be a good match for Mary for them to spend a lot
of time together in the coming years because he loves both Mary
and the Beloved disciple. So here the church sees an
additional spiritual meaning, and many of you Catholics would
have probably heard that at thismoment.

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It's believed that not only did Jesus.
Give Mary to the Apostle, the Beloved disciple.
He also gives Mary to all Christians.
It is at this moment that Mary becomes the mother of all
Christians and here's how the logic works for that, since the
Beloved disciple represents all Christians to an extent.
And in fact, probably, that's a reason why John doesn't name the

(14:41):
Beloved disciple, he Him just the Beloved disciple.
Maybe the point he wants to make, is that this disciple
represents all Christians because all Christians are
beloved. Now that I think that makes
sense actually, so if we follow that logic, then if Mary is
becoming the mother of the Beloved disciple.
And if the Beloved disciple represents all Christians will
then, Mary, Jesus makes Mary themother of all Christians.

(15:05):
If that's right, then we can seethis moment as Jesus, completing
his Christian family elsewhere in the gospels, Jesus.
Jesus talks about how in the Christian family for Christians.
Christ is our brother. God is our father and now Mary
is going to become our mother. That's one way of looking at why
Jesus does this. And it's, in this sense that at

(15:28):
this moment. When Mary becomes the mother of
the church, she also becomes thenew EVE.
The church fathers often talk about how Jesus is in, you, Adam
and Mary is the new Eve, becauseMary is in quite a real sense.
The mother of a new Manatee the church.
She's the mother of a new group of people.
Now, that is an interesting application because the church

(15:50):
does actually see this moment. As when Jesus says, to the
Beloved disciple, behold your mother.
The church does see this as the moment in which Mary becomes the
mother of the church. Now, that's not actually there.
On the literal sense, is it but John apparently discerns and the
church discerns? That there is also a deeper
deeper spiritual thing going on in this moment and that's

(16:12):
important for the purposes of our podcast because we typically
focus on the literal. Into the text.
And in fact, the Catholic Churchteaches that we have to start
with the literal sense in order to understand the text of the
Bible, but the church also doesn't rule out that there can
be legitimate spiritual senses of the text.
Sometimes. Jesus says things, and sometimes

(16:33):
the gospel authors savings, which also have a secondary
spiritual meaning, which is legitimate.
And this is one of these texts where the church says.
Yes. There is an additional spiritual
meaning here. Mary is also becoming the mother
of the The church at this momentwe get to verse 27 and John
here. The author says from that

(16:54):
moment, the disciple made a place for her in his home.
Now here we learn a couple of interesting things, if Jesus is
giving Mary to the Beloved disciple, it must be because her
husband is dead. So, Joseph must be dead by this
point. Otherwise, there'd be no need
for Jesus to arrange for Mary tobe looked after if you think
about it. This also provides strong

(17:15):
evidence that Jesus. Not have brothers or sisters of
his own, otherwise, his brothersand sisters could have looked
after me Mary after Jesus is gone.
In fact, in that culture was theresponsibility of the eldest
living son to look after the mother.
That was actually the expectation.
Since Jesus can no longer do this.

(17:36):
He know that he's about to die. If he had a brother, it would be
natural for the brother to them become the person that looks
after her, the fact that Jesus gives me re to someone else.
So strongly indicates that he has no brother.
That actually makes sense. Doesn't it here?
There will be no need for him togive Mary to John, if he knew

(17:56):
that Mary was going to be lookedafter by different brother.
In fact, it would actually be aninsult for Jesus to make this
Arrangement. If he did actually have
brothers, the arrangement, wouldnot make sense.
It will be quite insulting to his brothers.
So I think that this is actuallythe strongest argument for the
Perpetual virginity of Mary. There's other arguments, you can
make, but I think this is the strongest biblical argument.

(18:18):
This does seem to be evidence that Jesus does not have
brothers or sisters of his own verse, 27 continues.
And here, the Apostle John notice that he says from that
moment. He made a place for her in his,
in his home. So it indicates that the Beloved
disciple made preparations for this Arrangement immediately

(18:39):
possibly even that Night, he went and received marry into his
home. Now that phrase made a place for
her in his home. It can actually be translated
receive, which is interesting. And that word is often used to
describe receiving Heavenly realities.
So earlier when Jesus breathed on them and said, receive the

(18:59):
holy spirit, it's the same Greekword there.
So, something that, when the Beloved disciple here takes
marry into his home. It's also indicating that he's
receiving a great and deep. Spiritual reality.
Where is this home that he takesher into?
That's disputed. There's different Traditions
about where exactly John and Mary lived for the rest of their

(19:20):
life. It appears that they moved
around a bit between Ephesus andJerusalem, so they had multiple
homes and I moved around. So we get to verse 28 after
this. So after Jesus has spoken to
John and his mother. Now, there's probably a bit of a
break in time here at probably doesn't happen straight after
it, but certainly shortly after he's been speaking to Mary and
John. Now, we get to a time that the

(19:43):
other gospels tell us is 3:00 p.m.
The other gospels. Tell us that, at this time,
there's Darkness over the land. And then Jesus says, my God, my
God. Why have you forsaken me?
So John doesn't include that phrase.
So we'll analyze that phrase when we get to looking at the
other gospels, but John now tells us knowing that all was

(20:05):
now finished. So the Greek word here for
finished is actually closely linked to another The Greek word
that means purpose. So they both can be translated
as sort of end knowing that everything was now ended knowing
that the purpose was accomplished.
So basically Jesus knows that he's done what he needs to do.
His finished, the work that needed to happen on the cross.

(20:27):
The suffering has gone on for the length that it needs to
happen. Notice that Jesus knows this his
exercising Supernatural knowledge here, even on the
cross. He knows that what he's been
sent to do is now accomplished. He knows the time has come for
him, too. So what is this?
Everything knowing that all was now finished?
Well, it's basically the father's work of Salvation.
Jesus knows that it is now accomplished.

(20:49):
He's done everything he needs toJesus said to fulfill the
scripture. So, John is going to tell us
something to the Jesus says here, which John realizes is
Jesus deliberately fulfilling scripture.
So John and the other gospel authors are constantly showing
us how Jesus is the Messiah. He fulfills the prophecies about
the Messiah. So, Jesus says here, I thirst

(21:13):
now. It's a simple enough statement,
I first, but he's actually quoting here.
Apparently from some 69 verse 21, which says this They also
gave me goal for my meat, in my thirst, they gave me vinegar to
drink. Notice the specificity of that.
This is a Messianic Psalm widelyrecognized as a Psalm about the
Messiah, even before the time ofJesus, and it says that the

(21:37):
Messiah is going to have vinegarto drink when he's thirsty.
Well, that's exactly what happens here.
There might also be Echoes from another Messianic Psalm Psalm
22, which mentions the Messiah will have a dry mouth.
And in fact, Jesus will shortly quote from Psalm 22.
So Jesus says, this deliberately, he says I thirst

(21:58):
because he wants to fulfill thisMessianic prophecy.
He intends to fulfill it, but probably also his literally
thirsty. He really does need a drink one
of the prominent effects of crucifixion was overpowering
first because you lost a lot of body fluids through, open wounds
and perspiration. So he would actually be quite
thirsty, verse 29, a bowl full of vinegar, stood there.

(22:21):
The Greek word he says this is common wine.
So vinegar or common wine. So the Romans apparently would
have this common wine prepared for any crucifixion victim, who
is thirsty. Now, Scholars differ about is
this the same wine that Jesus was offered earlier.
So earlier on, in the crucifixion.
Jesus was offered vinegar mixed with gall and that is a cheap,

(22:45):
Roman vinegar wine, and apparently that would have a
drug mixed into it to dull the senses.
So some Scholars think that thisis apparently a custom of the
Romans to offer a crucify crucifixion victim.
This kind of wine that has a special drug in it to dull the
senses, as a way of helping themendure the crucifixion.

(23:08):
But a lot of other Scholars, Scholars would say that doesn't
really fit what we know about the Romans, Maybe by offering
the crucifixion victim vinegar. It's just a way of mocking them
because giving them a sour drink, like this is just going
to make them feel more thirsty. So it's a way of further.
Kingdom and I think that's probably the correct idea.
So there is a question here about is this the same drink
Jesus was offered earlier because he did actually say no

(23:31):
to this drink earlier. But here, he accepts it.
So possibly, it's a different kind of wine that he accepts or
possibly, he accepts the wine now the vinegar because he needs
to speak. So he needs his tongue to have
enough moisture in needed to, inorder to speak.
So they put a sponge full of vinegar on hyssop.

(23:52):
So Jesus is high above them. So they can't pour it directly
into his mouth. So they probably put it on a
pole of some sort. So they put this vinegar on a
sponge and then they rest the sponge on.
Hyssop, so he said, he's kind oflike a dry shrub plant.
Now, the other gospels only tellus that it's a read, but John
tells us specifically that it's a hyssop plant.

(24:14):
John thinks. This is significant.
Why is it significant that they give him vinegar on a hyssop
plant? Well, he said was of extreme
significance. So that you is because it will
remind them of the first Passover night at the first
Passover. Each household slew a perfect
lamb and then they put the bloodon the The door posts so that

(24:35):
the death angel would pass over them.
And this is what Moses tells Israelites.
He says you shall take a bunch of hyssop, dip it in the blood
that is in the Basin and strike the lintel.
And the two side posts with the blood that is in the Basin and
none of you shall go out the door until morning.
So it was hyssop that they used to distribute the blood.

(24:57):
So it was the blood of the Passover Lamb mediated by the
hyssop that saved the Israelitesfrom death.
And he's of also played a key role in the cleansing ceremonies
that involve the Israelites being cleansed from impurities.
We said that in Leviticus 14 andnumbers 19.
So if you put those two images together, I think about what's
going on here. Jesus.

(25:18):
The perfect Lamb of God is shedding his blood.
In order to save people, to bring people to God and to
purify God's people, to allow them to dwell with him.
So, John knows that there's a significance to the fact that
hyssop is used. In this crucifixion so they held
the hyssop and the sponge to hismouth when Jesus had received

(25:41):
the vinegar. He said now it's likely think
about it. If he didn't receive the
vinegar, he might not have been able to say these.
Next words. He wanted to say his final words
and his parched lips and his throw to needed moisture.
So he accepts the vinegar now, even though he refused it
earlier. So he takes some of the vinegar.
And he says it is finished. So these are very famous words

(26:06):
in Greek. Its tetelestai.
Now. A lot of Christians have taken.
This certainly, this is a phrasethat's rich with meaning.
It is finished. A lot of Scholars.
Have taken this to mean, this isthe moment of which the sin
transaction has been completed. So they see this in kind of
transactional terms and certainly you can see it that
way. But it could also just mean

(26:27):
something like this, the suffering is finished.
Because remember Jesus knows nowthat he's that he can die.
He knows that whatever the work is that the father has given him
is now finished. So maybe it means something like
taking on the sins of Israel andsuffering in their place is now
finished. Or maybe it means something like
this. I have finished my mission and I

(26:48):
have perfectly fulfilled. The will of the father that
would last one would certainly fit with the context of John.
He's come to do the will of God to bring Salvation to people and
it's now accomplished. It's finished.
Now there is another possible, interesting interpretation here
of these words. It is finished.
So, all through the Gospel of John, there's this imagery that

(27:09):
Jesus is making a new creation and some Scholars.
Think the word here for finishedis fairly similar to the word
that's used for rested on in terms of the creation week.
So God created in six days, and then he rested on the seventh.
So maybe this is tapping into this kind of similar New
Creation language, so Is has been making the new creation

(27:32):
through his ministry. And now, perhaps, when he says
it is finished. Maybe this is when he rests, as
he dies on the cross on the cross.
He can finally rest from the newcreation has been making.
So that's a kind of a cool interpretation as well as is the
case with most of the Gospel of John.
There's all sorts of possible things that are could mean and
different Scholars able to draw out different themes.

(27:57):
So at this point, according to the other Gospels, he then says,
father into your hands. I commend my spirit.
And then now John tells us, he bowed his head and gave up his
Spirit notice. It's kind of voluntary.
He gives up his Spirit voluntarily.
Jesus could have prolonged his life using Supernatural power

(28:17):
for as long as he wanted but he is now finished the work that
needs to happen. He knows that this is his moment
to die. So he voluntarily gives up his
life. There's a famous poem which says
something along the lines of Jesus died on a cross of wood
and yet he made the hill on which it stood.
So really, if you think about the significance of the fact

(28:37):
that Jesus, the Creator voluntarily gives up his life on
the cross. It's quite profound.
So at this point, Jesus dies, His soul separates from his
body. So it's a very solemn moment,
Jesus. The Messiah dies.
The other gospels, tell us that at this point, the curtain of
the temple was torn. There's an earthquake, the tombs

(28:58):
open. And then the center Ian says,
truly. This was the son of God.
So, all of these things happen, straight after Jesus dies.
Jesus has just died on the crossat about 3, p.m.
On Good Friday, and now we get to verse 31, it was raishin day.
So this is the day before the Sabbath and it's important to

(29:20):
remind ourselves how the dating system of the time system works
in that culture. So Jesus dies on a Friday on
Good Friday, and the following days is Saturday.
So that's when the Sabbath wouldbe.
But for them, the Sabbath beginsat sunset on Friday.
So as Jesus dies at 3 p.m. It's getting very close to

(29:40):
Sunset. So they're starting to get close
to the Sabbath. This of course, is one of the
key pieces of evidence, which tells us that Jesus was
crucified on a Friday. John's gospel is very clear that
the next day is the Sabbath. So that means Jesus must have
died on a Friday and to prevent the bodies remaining on the
cross during the Sabbath since that Sabbath was a day of

(30:03):
special solemnity, or you can translate this passage for that.
Sabbath was a high day. So here we learn that the
Sabbath in this case. Is going to be a special feast.
And in particular, we know it's part of the Passover week.
So the next day, the Saturday will not only be the normal
Sabbath. It's also a special Jewish feast

(30:24):
associated with the Passover. So it's kind of like an extra
special Sabbath Feast the next day.
So there's three people being crucified there including Jesus
and the Jewish authorities know it's not going to be appropriate
to have the bloody Jewish body'sstaying on the cross.
Particularly dead bodies on the cross after.
Sunset because Deuteronomy chapter 21 talks about how you

(30:46):
need to take the bodies away andbury them before Sunset of the
Sabbath. So the trying to follow the
Jewish law here, so they're getting worried that it's
getting close to the beginning of the Sabbath.
The Jews asked pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies
taken away. So the Jewish leaders want the
whole process to be finished quickly and we say quickly, but
in reality, it looks like a crucifixion started at about

(31:09):
9:00 a.m. So they have actually already
been there for quite quite a while and now they're wanting to
finish up at this point. Two of the three men are alive.
Jesus is dead. But the other two men are still
alive a quick way to speed up the death of a crucifixion
victim. It's kind of cruel but it does
work is they would get a mallet and break the legs of the person

(31:31):
hanging on the cross. If you break the legs of the
person on the cross, they can nolonger hold themselves up and
they can't breathe anymore. So, they die very quickly after
that. So it's one of the Roman ways of
Killing people on the cross. So the Romans were basically
masters of execution and torturebasically.
Now pilot, if you think about, it doesn't have to comply with

(31:52):
their request. They asked pilot.
Can we please kill these people quickly?
Now, pilot in the position. He's in, doesn't have to say
yes. He doesn't care about Jewish
laws. But in this case, he chooses to
allow it because he has to maintain a fine balance of a
relationship with the Jewish leaders.
If he continually frustrates them, they might rebel against
him. So he has to walk a fine line

(32:13):
there verse 32 consequently. The soldiers came and broke the
legs of the first man who had been Crucified with him and then
of the other. So those two men are killed by
their legs being broken. And if we understanding Luke's
account correctly, one of these men, quite possibly ended up in
Paradise at that moment or at least possibly pass through

(32:37):
Purgatory, but he was a righteous man.
One of these men verse 33. When they came to Jesus, they
found he was already dead. So, Jesus, we know died earlier
because John's gospel and the other gospels tell us that he
gave up his Spirit. Why does Jesus died earlier than
the other men? While one version could be that?
Jesus voluntarily gave up his life at a certain point and you

(32:59):
can read the text that way, Jesus chooses the moment of his
own death, but it could also just be that he's experienced
extensive beatings earlier in the day that the others haven't.
So it makes sense that he would die first verse 34 instead of
breaking his legs. One of the soldiers pierced his
side with a lance or you can translate that spear.

(33:21):
So this is a Roman way of confirming.
If the person is dead on the cross, the idea.
Seems to be that if you pierce someone with a spear in their
side and then they react to it or their body convulses will
then they're still alive, but iftheir body doesn't convulse,
that's a good sign that they're dead.
So, this is kind of a Roman way of checking or confirming that
the person is definitely dead. And immediately there came out

(33:45):
blood and water. So this is a very famous passage
when the Roman soldier stabs Jesus in the side blood and
water comes out. So firstly, on a biological
level, why does this happen? Well, there is actually a
medical explanation for this normally if you stab, someone
water is not going to come out. It will just be blood.
But if someone dies by crucifixion due to the trauma

(34:07):
that the victim has experienced on their heart and their lungs
in terms of the way. The person has had to struggle
to breathe and struggle to pump the blood around from the heart.
Then it's a known medical phenomena that in crucifixions
and other similar things. Fluid can gather around the
heart and the lungs. So, it looks like and most
Scholars and medical researcherswho have looked at.

(34:29):
This. Have said that when the soldier
pierced Jesus, it ruptured, his pericardial sac.
And as a result, the fluid buildup came out.
So blood and water came out of there.
So what is John include this? There's a couple of different
reasons. Firstly, John wants to stress,
that Jesus really is dead, at the time.
Jesus is writing there. Some interesting controversies

(34:50):
happening about was Jesus reallyhuman.
So it seems that one of the things John is doing here is
confirming for his readers. Jesus really is dead.
There's no other way to explain it.
The blood and the water came out, that would only happen if
you're dead basically, so this insistence that Jesus is dead,
highlights that Jesus really is human and he really did die.

(35:11):
If you look at 1, John Chapter 4verses 2 and 3 which is written
by the same author. You can see that pretty early on
in the church. They're already having
discussions about was Jesus really human.
So John here is Meaning to this discussion.
And in fact clarifying, that Jesus really is Human by talking
about what happened here at the moment, the spear went through
him and of course, this controversy later shows up in

(35:34):
the form of gnosticism. So, it was around early on and
John in his writings in particular has to combat it.
So there's a medical explanationbut there's also heaps of
theological implications here about the fact that blood and
water come out of Jesus side. There's been about six or seven
strong. Theological interpretations that

(35:55):
have been taken from what happens here.
There's different ways. The church has understood the
theological significance. In fact, they could all be
right. There's lots of different things
that the blood in the water symbolizes.
So I just want to take you through some different ways.
The blood and water has been interpreted.
Theologically. So firstly the fact that Jesus
side is spirit is pierced kind of mirrors how Eve is formed

(36:19):
from Adam side. So Adams varieties formed from
Adams. Rib, well, here, Jesus, bride is
formed from his or inside. So it's like the same part of
the body that the bride is formed from when Jesus offers
his life blood and water, pours out, and that innocence gives
birth to the church, which is his bride.
This is how Jesus wins a bride for himself by pouring himself

(36:42):
out and of course, so the blood you could say, represents the
price that Jesus Paid to purchase his bride and the water
is the method by which people enter.
The church, they become part of his bride through baptism.
So there's a lot of profound significance between paralleling
atom and the way his bride is formed and the way Jesus bride

(37:04):
is formed on the cross. That's quite amazing.
Actually when you see that secondly blood and water and
there's a strong tradition of this blood and water can
represent the sacraments particularly.
So the blood is taken to represent the Eucharist and
water represents baptism. John has already said quite a
bit about these two sacraments in his gospel.
So in John chapter 3, Talks in Nicodemus about water baptism,

(37:26):
John chapter 6, he talks about blood being associated with
Jesus body and the sacrament of the Eucharist.
So now we see the culmination ofthis blood and water imagery
coming together. John has deliberately set up
these themes early in the gospeland then focused on this passage
here. So very strong tradition in the
church officer shouting blood and water with Eucharist and

(37:48):
baptism st. John chrysostom says it was not
accidentally or by changing Chance that these streams came
forth. But because the church has been
established from both of these her members know this since they
have come to Birth by water. And a nourished by
flesh-and-blood the Mysteries, the sacraments have the source
from there. So that when you approach the

(38:09):
awesome chalice, you may come asif you were about to drink from
his very side. So, it's quite profound words
there. Another interesting theological
interpretation here is the waterin particular, is seen to be an
image of the holy spirit being Without Jesus earlier in the
Gospel of John, particularly in chapter 7, described Living

(38:30):
Water, welling up from within himself.
He actually used this language of a special Supernatural water
that exists within his own beingwell.
Now, that water is being poured out and we know that that water
is the holy spirit. Also, this image of blood and
water is one of the most famous images of Jesus Sacred Heart.
So you've probably seen the icons of the Sacred Heart of

(38:52):
Jesus. The most And picture to
represent, Jesus, Sacred Heart Is the blood and the water
coming out of Jesus, own heart here.
So there's a strong tradition ofa sir shouting, the Sacred Heart
here, with what happens some church fathers such as
tertullian. They see the water and the blood
as signifying. Two types of Christian baptism.

(39:14):
So Christian initiation through water and then blood represents
the baptism of death or martyrdom.
So that's an interesting interpretation as well.
Some also see here, a parallel with the rock that we struck by
Moses in the wilderness. You might actually see some
artwork like this. So that famous scene, where
Moses strikes, The Rock in the wilderness and water comes out.

(39:37):
There's an elaboration of this in that Aramaic rendition of
the, the Torah in the Aramaic, version of the Torah.
The the text read slightly differently for that story.
It says that when Moses struck the rock, both blood and water
gushed forth. That's in Numbers chapter 20
verse 11. And we see that in the
Palestinian targum. Apparently, that was a common

(39:59):
Aramaic way of reading that passage.
So, Paul in his own writings, inthe New Testament interprets,
the rock that Moses struck as a symbol of Christ, from which
flows, the spiritual drink of the Eucharist, and the spirit.
So, maybe Jesus being pierced here and producing blood and
water is supposed to mirror. The rock that was struck by

(40:20):
Moses in the wilderness. And also John himself later.
Elaborates on this theme in 1, John chapter 5.
He says, this is the one who came through water and blood.
Jesus Christ, not by water alone, but by water and blood.
So John clearly sees this as very important.
So we've reached the end of the text up to verse 34 and as you

(40:43):
can see, it's an incredibly RichText theologically.
Historically, there's so much more we can say about what the
church fathers have said about these passages.
What contemporary Scholars have said, some of the different
theories? And so really, we've just
scratched the surface. So if you want to hear the next
part of John chapter 19, you canhear that on the solemnity of

(41:04):
the most Sacred Heart of Jesus in year.
Be. So today is our last episode in
the Gospel of John. We've had quite a long streak of
the Gospel of John and that has now come to an end.
Hopefully you've enjoyed doing adeep dive into this gospel.
It's quite a difficult gospel, but hopefully I've appreciated
this approach from here. We're going to start doing a

(41:26):
continuous look through the synoptic gospel.
So moving chronologically through the synoptic gospels on
weekdays. So that will start tomorrow.
And that's when the mass of the the lectionary, a mass start
starts to read through the synoptic gospels in that way.
So hopefully you'll join us for that tomorrow.
And please tell other people about it.

(41:47):
As we're beginning, a new section of study.
It's a good time for new people to join.
And to learn more about the Gospels.
So as you would expect as a whole stack of catechism
paragraphs that refer to what you've heard today, particularly
that section of the end about blood and water flowing out,
that is seen as having great sacramental, significance, so we

(42:07):
don't have time to read them allout today.
It is already been quite a long episode, but in the episode
description, you'll find a list of all of these catechism
references that refer to what you've heard today, so you can
have a look at those. If you're interested.
I hope you've learned something new today.
Thanks so much for your support of The ministry, please tell
other people about this podcast so that word can continue to

(42:30):
spread, we can continue to learnthe teachings of the church and
the gospels and so we can learn more about God and his kingdom
and to continue to build his kingdom on Earth.
Please tune in for the next episode.

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Memorial of Mary, Mother of the Church - John 19: 25-34

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Memorial of Mary, Mother of the Church - John 19: 25-34