Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the Deep
Dive.
Today we're tackling somethingpretty significant President
Trump's one big, beautiful bill.
That's right.
It's this huge piece oflegislation that well, it could
really change things for realestate and housing across the
country.
So our mission today is to giveyou the inside track, cut
through the complexity and showyou what it means for you,
(00:22):
whether you own a home, you'relooking to buy, renting, or
maybe you're an investor.
Speaker 2 (00:26):
And we've gone
through quite a bit of material
on this really broken down thebills details.
We're hitting the big taxchanges, the new incentives, but
also some potential challengespeople aren't talking about as
much.
The goal is to pull out thereally important stuff the why
behind the what, so youunderstand what's shifting.
Speaker 1 (00:45):
All right, let's dive
in First up, maybe the biggest
headline for homeowners taxdeductions, specifically the
state and local taxes deductionSalty.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Ah yeah, salty Always
a hot topic.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
Huge changes here.
That old $10,000 cap has beenpushed way up to $40,000.
$40,000.
Now it is temporary, we shouldsay it's supposed to end in 2030
.
Speaker 2 (01:07):
That's a key detail
the temporary nature.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
But for now it's a
big jump.
So here's where it gets reallyinteresting.
What does this actually meanfor homeowners, especially
depending on where they live?
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Well, the immediate
thing, you see, is relief,
significant relief, particularlyfor people in those high tax
states Think New York,california and New Jersey.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Right Places where
property taxes and state income
taxes are really high.
Speaker 2 (01:33):
Exactly.
This could literally save themthousands of dollars each year.
Makes owning property there,well, maybe a bit more
attractive or at least lesspainful financially.
So it eases that burden maybe abit more attractive or at least
less painful financially.
So it eases that burden it does.
Though you know, theinteresting underlying question
is whether this temporary fixactually solves the deeper
fiscal issues for those statesor if it just kind of delays
(01:54):
things and does it stop highearners from leaving.
That's the bigger strategicplay perhaps.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Good point.
It's not just SALT, though.
The bill also affects otherhomeowner deductions like
mortgage interest.
Speaker 2 (02:05):
Right, the mortgage
interest deduction, that one's
now permanent, or you know,permanent in legislative terms.
Speaker 1 (02:11):
Meaning it stays,
unless Congress actively changes
it again.
Speaker 2 (02:14):
Precisely.
It provides some stabilitythere.
It allows deductions onmortgages up to $750,000, or a
million if the loan was frombefore December 2017.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
OK, and something
else is making a comeback, isn't
it?
Mortgage insurance.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
Yes, the mortgage
insurance deduction.
This is actually prettyimportant, especially when we
talk about getting people intohomes.
I saw Well, historically,something like four million
homeowners use this deductioneach year.
Wow, something like 4 millionhomeowners use this deduction
each year, wow, yeah.
And the average saving wasaround $2,300 a year $2,364 to
(02:51):
be precise.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
That's not
insignificant?
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Not at all.
It's a real help for first-timebuyers, maybe lower-income
families too.
It directly lowers one of thoseupfront costs that can just
feel overwhelming, so it helpsmake buying a home a bit more
accessible.
Speaker 1 (03:09):
It could, yeah, it
might subtly boost demand, which
is, you know, something towatch, given the ongoing supply
issues in the market.
Okay so, benefits forindividual homeowners, but what
about the bigger picture, thehousing shortage?
Is the bill doing anythingthere?
Speaker 2 (03:18):
It is actually.
Let's zoom out a bit.
The bill puts a lot of emphasison affordable housing.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
How.
Speaker 2 (03:23):
Mainly through the
low-income.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
This is a really,
really important tool.
It's not money directly torenters, but rather a tax credit
for developers.
Speaker 2 (03:36):
Ah, ok, an incentive
for them to build.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
Exactly.
They get a dollar for dollarreduction on their taxes if they
build or renovate affordablerental units.
It basically uses private moneyfor public good.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
And the seal.
Speaker 1 (03:48):
The expectation is
this could finance maybe over a
million affordable units, eithernew builds or preserving
existing ones, over the next 10years.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
A million units.
That's substantial.
Speaker 1 (03:59):
It is David Dworkin
from the National Housing
Conference, called LIHTC quotethe nation's most effective tool
for this.
It's seen as a direct way totackle that housing shortage we
keep talking about OK, that's asignificant piece for affordable
housing.
We keep talking about Okay,that's a significant piece for
affordable housing.
Now let's pivot a bit.
What about investors?
How does this bill change thegame for them?
Speaker 2 (04:19):
Ah yes, investors,
there are some major changes
here too, opportunity zones, forinstance.
Speaker 1 (04:26):
Opportunity zones.
They've been around, but thisbill makes them permanent.
Speaker 2 (04:30):
That's the plan.
Yes, Making them permanentreally solidifies them as a
long-term strategy.
They offer some pretty powerfultax breaks.
Speaker 1 (04:38):
Okay, let's unpack
this.
What's the main goal behindthese zones?
Speaker 2 (04:42):
The idea is to drive
investment into lower-income
areas that haven't seen muchdevelopment.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
How do the tax breaks
work?
Speaker 2 (04:49):
Investors can defer
paying capital gains taxes.
If they reinvest those gainsinto businesses or real estate
within these zones, and if theyhold the investment long enough,
they can reduce or eveneliminate those deferred taxes.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
So it encourages long
term commitment to those areas.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
That's the theory.
The legislation wants to fosterthat long term investment.
The real question, though, theinsight for investors and
communities is how it plays out.
Does it genuinely lift thecommunity equitably?
Speaker 1 (05:15):
Or does it just lead
to gentrification?
Speaker 2 (05:17):
Exactly Does it
displace the people it's
supposed to help?
That's the tightrope walk.
The effectiveness reallydepends on getting that balance
right on the ground.
Speaker 1 (05:28):
A critical point, and
it's not just opportunity zones
for investors.
Right, there's more.
Speaker 2 (05:33):
Oh yeah, bonus
depreciation is back.
100% bonus depreciation,meaning investors can
immediately write off the fullcost of certain qualified
property improvements ratherthan depreciating them over many
years, that's back through 2029.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
That accelerates the
tax savings quite a bit.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Dramatically, and
there's also an increase in the
qualified business income or QBIdeduction.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
QBI, that's for
pass-through businesses.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Right, like
partnerships S-Corp, where the
profit passes through to theowner's personal tax return,
that deduction is up to 23% now.
Speaker 1 (06:06):
Okay, so bonus
depreciation plus a bigger QBI
deduction.
Speaker 2 (06:09):
It really juices the
after-tax returns, makes real
estate, especially things likemultifamily apartment buildings,
look much more appealing froman investment standpoint.
Speaker 1 (06:18):
So lots of incentives
baked in, but, like any major
legislation, it can't all bepositive, can it?
Are there potential downsidesor challenges we need to talk
about?
Speaker 2 (06:28):
Definitely no bill is
perfect.
One thing that jumped out fromthe source material was about
funding for the Green andResilient Retrofit Program, GRRP
.
Speaker 1 (06:38):
GRRP.
What was that for?
Speaker 2 (06:40):
It was specifically
aimed at making affordable
housing more energy efficientand resilient to climate change
impacts.
Think better insulation,efficient appliances, maybe
storm proofing.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
And the funding for
that is gone.
Speaker 2 (06:52):
The report suggests
it's been removed, and that well
.
It raises questions aboutcommitment to sustainability in
that sector.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
How so.
Speaker 2 (06:58):
It could really slow
down or halt planned green
upgrades in a lot of affordablehousing projects.
That impacts long term runningcosts for residents too, not
just environmental goals.
It could hamper that climateresilience push.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
OK, so a potential
hit to green initiatives.
What else?
Any concerns about oversight?
Speaker 2 (07:14):
There have been
discussions, yes, about
potential funding cuts toregulatory bodies.
The Consumer FinancialProtection Bureau, the CFPB, was
mentioned.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
The CFPB.
They handle consumer protectionin finance, including mortgages
.
Speaker 2 (07:28):
Exactly so reducing
their funding or similar
oversight bodies.
It could create someuncertainty, maybe some risk for
tenants and communities.
Speaker 1 (07:36):
Now, risk of what.
Speaker 2 (07:38):
Well, the argument
for deregulation is often that
it reduces burdens on businesses, maybe speeds things up, right.
But the flip side is, if thatoversight weakens, there's a
risk standards could slip.
Protections for tenants, forborrowers, areas where fairness
and consumer safety are reallyvital.
It's a potential consequence.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
OK, so pulling all
these threads together, the SALT
changes, mortgage deductions,lihtc, opportunity zones, the
potential downsides what does itall mean for you, the listener,
depending on who you are?
Speaker 2 (08:06):
Yeah, that's the key
question, because the impact
really isn't uniform, is it?
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Seems like it varies
quite a bit.
Speaker 2 (08:11):
Absolutely.
If you're a higher incomehomeowner, especially in one of
those high salt states, you'relikely seeing immediate
potentially significant benefits.
Same for savvy real estateinvestors, leveraging
opportunity zones or the newdepreciation rules.
Speaker 1 (08:25):
So clear winners
there, at least in the short
term.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Right Now, if you're
a lower income household or
maybe a first time buyer, theimpact might be more gradual.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
Less immediate.
Speaker 2 (08:34):
Probably the benefits
would come more from things
like that revived mortgageinsurance deduction making it
slightly easier to get into themarket and, longer term, if the
LIHTC boost really delivers onincreasing the supply of
affordable housing, that couldhelp.
But it's not an overnightchange.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
So different
timelines, different impacts,
depending on your situation andwhere you live.
Speaker 2 (08:56):
Exactly Understanding
those differences, those
nuances, is really crucial ifyou're trying to navigate this
new landscape.
Speaker 1 (09:02):
So, wrapping up this
deep dive, it's clear this big,
beautiful bill marks a prettymajor shift for real estate and
housing.
Lots of strong incentives,especially for homeowners with
higher incomes and for investors.
Speaker 2 (09:14):
Definitely tilting
the field in some ways.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
But also, as we
discuss, some potential
challenges and risks and,importantly, a real push on
paper at least for moreaffordable housing through LAHTC
and maybe sustained developmentin those opportunity zones.
Speaker 2 (09:28):
It's a complex mix
which leads to, I think, a
really interesting final thoughtfor you to consider.
Okay, Given this blend strongincentives for private
investment on one hand, andthese stated goals for boosting
affordable housing on the otherwhat's the biggest long-term
ripple effect going to be?
How will these changes reallyshape our communities over the
(09:49):
next decade?
Not just where we build, buthow development happens, who
benefits and what kind of placeswe end up living in?
Speaker 1 (09:56):
That's a powerful
question.
How will investment incentivesand affordable housing goals
actually interact on the ground?
Something definitely worthwatching.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
Indeed, it's a story
that's still very much unfolding
.