After 'Superman': James Gunn's Been Talking... | News 06-23-25 - DC on SCREEN | DC Studios News/Review

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You were listening to DC on screen.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
All right, Percosett, Molly, Percoset. That is.

Speaker 1 (00:13):
Pulits are worthy tea man.

Speaker 2 (00:15):
I know, Man, it's get stuck in your head. I
hate when it gets in there. M does it every
once in a while. Yeah, I can't remember what my
wife had me singing the other day, and I was
just like, oh my god, why did you do this
to me? It wasn't that it was. It wasn't mask off.
I don't know what it was, though.

Speaker 1 (00:34):
I had to get a few bad ones out of
my head. I'm still I think it pulled off a miracle.
I watched The Little Girl and two other two or
three other just randoms. I don't know what the song was.
I think I had peanut butter in it. They must
have chanted it forty five times in a row. Oh
that's so terrible, because you know, you know that endless energy.

Speaker 2 (00:57):
No, and I never had that as a kid.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
I'd seen it then. I don't know if I had
it like that.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
No, I did, but yeah I did at a certain point.
It was it was.

Speaker 1 (01:08):
A long time. I mean it was genuinely fifteen straight minutes.
I feel like I'm just chanting. They should have summoned something.
It was weird, but I don't know what that song
was or what it sounded like. And I'm very proud
of that.

Speaker 2 (01:24):
Oh good, it's important to be proud of something. Yeah
the hell? Okay, Well, I just looked down on my
desk and there's like an action figure gun that I
don't recognize. Wait, where did you come from?

Speaker 1 (01:41):
It's like you found you found evidence of a coming
attack and toy story mode left one piece behind.

Speaker 2 (01:48):
Yeah, I mean I hate what was out.

Speaker 1 (01:49):
There reporting to his sergeant, I'm sorry, sergeant, but I
never find it. I'm sure.

Speaker 2 (01:53):
Oh shit, Like I don't. Not only do I not
recognize it, it's broken. It like, what what happened here?

Speaker 1 (02:01):
No? Maybe it's a peace offering? Is it?

Speaker 2 (02:05):
Well? We don't have any animals to bring me a
dead rat or a broken toy, so I don't know. Yeah, anyway,
Welcome into DC on screen. Yeah, I'm your host, David C. Robertson.
This is your co host, Jason goss Man. It is
a it's a lot, man. It's every time we get

(02:26):
close to a movie opening, it is like all the
news happens, and I think this is our final news
episode before Superman comes out. It kind of has to be.
It kind of has to be. Yeah, because we got
Superman three, We've still got Superman returns. If we're gonna

(02:47):
do that one mm hmm. There she is, yeah, and
then we go like two days later.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:55):
Yeah, So I mean this is gonna this is And
look they've been they've been dropping a lot of Now, look,
here's the thing. There were two big articles. We've already
talked about a couple of things on one of them
because we did like a quick news thing and a
couple of weeks ago, and so there was an Entertainment
Weekly with James Gunn long form interview, and then there

(03:17):
was a Rolling Stone. Both of them are worth reading,
but he says a lot of the same shit in
both of them. There was also a DC Showcase podcast
where he also said a lot of the same shit there.
I've grabbed pertinent stuff from all three of those, as
well as a couple of other sources. But you know,

(03:39):
especially like the Rolling Stone and Entertainment Weekly, there's there's
some good stuff in there that I dude, like, I
love reading about your running process. It ain't gone to
the show like I've got six I've got sixteen pages here, James.

Speaker 1 (03:56):
It just sounds sounds rude that way.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
It does sound rude, and I don't mean it rude.
Like I do love it. I love like for me
as a writer and as someone who cares deeply about
all this shit, and and uh, you know, like I
will watch a rom com if it says an aspiring writer. Yes, yeah,
I you know, it's fine. It's about my people. Uh

(04:21):
but uh yeah, I'm not like I'm deeply interested in
going like, oh that's really cool. Like I like that
he's doing this. I like to the but that's just
from my own we've already talked about it. If we've
already talked about it on the show, I kind of
skip it.

Speaker 1 (04:35):
I'll have to leave. Yeah. Yeah, so some some yeah,
I mean some establishing things. Then. Yet, so you're basically
doing one interview over how many sources now three or four?
You know, kind of it feels like a kind of
continued body of of things that were said.

Speaker 2 (04:50):
Kind of, uh, there were certain, you know, little differences
in what he had to say that made me go, oh,
well let me add that line. And then and sometimes
I was just like that's the same, it's the same
these are literally the same picture. We're good.

Speaker 1 (05:06):
Yeah, and some of the stuff we don't get now,
you know there will be time after. Right now we're
sixteen pages for us, means this could be up to it,
including a seven and a half hour recording.

Speaker 2 (05:15):
So no, it will not be that, Jason, I'm telling you,
I will cut you off.

Speaker 1 (05:20):
We may die here.

Speaker 2 (05:22):
I will not die here, sir.

Speaker 1 (05:26):
Well, yeah, for my own good then, whether whether I'm
left for dead or accidentally take you with me. Yeah,
we have to call it somewhere. Yeah, we have plenty
of time to cover the riting and all that after
after it's over and we're just talking. What I assume
at this point look like levely box office numbers.

Speaker 2 (05:44):
Maybe because you know Hollywood report, like, look, man, Hollywood
reporter said one hundred and thirty five million on the tracking. Now,
like various sources are coming out. I don't know what
to believe because some people are saying basically they're going
from ninety million to one hund undred and eighty five million.
They can't decide what it's going to be. Ninety is

(06:04):
a long way from one hundred and eighty five million.

Speaker 1 (06:08):
Some would say half, some would say slightly less.

Speaker 2 (06:11):
And they're all like biased, like they're like, oh, it's
gonna be ninety. Let's get all the people with the
laughing face is excited because that's lower than Man of Steel.
May oh opening, we can flop in coming, flop in coming. Yeah.
I mean, it's just I don't trust any of these sorts.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
I means, like eighty one or something opening again, Uh.

Speaker 2 (06:31):
Man of Steel maye like one hundred and twelve, I
think one hundred and thirteen and thirteen, Yeah, something like that.
I didn't write down that metric because it's a fucking
uh ten.

Speaker 1 (06:44):
Years, ten plus year movie. Yeah that would that would
legit be maybe one hundred and fifty. Now it's only
been that long and still.

Speaker 2 (06:53):
Yeah, so uh yeah, we don't know what's gonna make.
Everyone's saying like somethingtically different, but.

Speaker 1 (07:03):
It's a weird speculative market anyway.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
Apparently Warner Brothers, according to according to one Outlett, thinks
it's going to be between ninety and one hundred and
twenty five million. That's also kind of a big range.
So we've said this on every big movie movie opening.
You can't trust the tracking numbers. We don't know what's
going to happen. You know, I don't think any of

(07:28):
these numbers came out after we started bombing the fuck
out of Iran, So who knows. We don't know the
global Yeah, the global economy might change drastically.

Speaker 1 (07:38):
We just don't know what's happening, and in the moments
ahead we do not.

Speaker 2 (07:45):
So on the box office expectations, I do.

Speaker 1 (07:50):
Think ninety to one twenty is a more acceptable range
of guests for me than ninety to one eighty.

Speaker 2 (07:55):
Mm.

Speaker 1 (07:55):
Yeah, actually I don't mind that as a guest that
you got to be able to get it some kind
of some kind of decent range for actual asses that
will be in seats. That has to be some some
level predictable.

Speaker 2 (08:05):
But yeah, I just don't know, like everything, you.

Speaker 1 (08:08):
Want to just take a wild stab at it for fun,
Not really, but sure, would you have a guess if
you actually wanted to.

Speaker 2 (08:19):
I would say probably around one thirty five.

Speaker 1 (08:22):
You think so personally that's actually about where I have.
I think around one twenty five one thirty one self. Okay,
so we're we're I'll jot down one twenty five to
one thirty five as are our guessing range, just for fun,
and then I'll forget where I jotted that down, but
it's there.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
Yeah. So you you guessed one twenty five to one
thirty five and I guessed one thirty five, right, Okay, cool?

Speaker 1 (08:47):
Cool?

Speaker 2 (08:47):
Well. In this Rolling Stone interview that he did, he
talked about the expectations and how everyone's like, oh, everything's
riding on everything for DC Studios is riding on Superman.
Everything's riding on Superman, and uh, James said, really, I
just go that's their business, because that's not the truth.

Speaker 1 (09:04):
For me.

Speaker 2 (09:05):
My truth is this is the first movie out of
DC Studios. Other people may say it's got to be
a home run, nothing else. I'm like, no, I'd be
very happy with a double fucking fucking iron Man. Wasn't
the be all and end all. It wasn't Avatar. We
are doing something that's a piece of the puzzle. It's
not the puzzle itself. We have Peacemaker, we have Supergirl,

(09:27):
and what we want to do is make a movie
that people love they feel connected to the characters. Is
just this one movie, it's not everything. I hate it
when there's a fucking article and it's going on about
all the problems and blah blah, blah blah blah. And
that means even more pressure on James Going and Superman.
I'm like, guys, I'm not responsible for all of that.
I'm responsible for my piece of the pie. I've got

(09:49):
to make my budget back. I'll be very happy with that.

Speaker 1 (09:52):
Yeah, respectful. I mean, that's not far from what he
said not too long ago. It's not which whenever one
starts saying that that's when the hype cycle started. Oh
Superman's first, Well, it's just going to have to destroy
everything for it to matter. Now it doesn't. I've got
ten years on this contract. Yeah, granted some things cost
him up a year or two. He does at that time,

(10:14):
I feel.

Speaker 2 (10:15):
Like he doesn't have ten years of the contract. He
had four years of the contract, but a ten year plan.

Speaker 1 (10:19):
Right, Yeah, sorry, but he and yeah, I think that
did cost him some time. The writer's striking all that,
But he seemed to he seemed to have enough in
the bank that he's gonna be able to really get ground.

Speaker 2 (10:29):
Well. One of the great things about it was, like,
and has he pointed out in one of these articles,
is you know a lot of people have given him
shit because like, oh, he's doing everything, He's doing everything.
He was doing these things before he took on the
job being DC Studio's head. He was doing Creature Commandos
because we had already we had already talked about Creature
Commandos or an animated series that he was working on

(10:54):
that he was, you know, very excited about. And we
knew he was writing Superman before he became the head,
and he already had a contract for Peacemaker too.

Speaker 1 (11:05):
He keeps telling the story about how he broke Superman
years ago, or how he broke it to his satisfaction.
I mean, yes, well before this was his job.

Speaker 2 (11:14):
Right right, and Crypto was his end by the way. Yeah, sorry, uh,
I don't know what if I feel like I interrupted you,
I don't. I don't think so, Okay, well sorry if
I did. We've got a new poster for for for Superman,

(11:36):
and I love this thing. Man. It looks like I'll
put it up on the on the site DC, on screen.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
Put it up anywhere you can find it. Put it up.
You said it to me, and I just said, oh,
that's Majestic or some shit.

Speaker 2 (11:47):
Yeah, it's total throwback. It looks like an old Majestic
it did. Yeah, it looks like it looks like Drew
Strusen could have done this ship, and it looks like
a proper old school painting. It's not because there's a
little flaw on the belt that I saw and other
people pointed out, and I was like, damn it, I
was gonna let it slide. Why the hell did y'all
talk about it? They left one little section red and

(12:11):
it was just a weird little photoshop accident. It's like
a little thing on the belt and I'm like, y'all
are just like the most joy killing us motherfuckers. Yeah,
I hate that. I saw it. I was just like, nah, well,
maybe they'll fix that before they've actually put it out
to say it for sale, you know. And I mean

(12:32):
little shit like that goes. This is the getty Shark motherfuckers.
So you can calm down.

Speaker 1 (12:39):
So, oh yeah, I gotta find that now. I really
want to see this. But good Sorry, I'm gonna find
it in the background now, Okay.

Speaker 2 (12:47):
A Gun was talking to Rolling Stone about depowering Superman.
A lot of people have complained, not a lot. It's
not like a ton a ton there are people who
have complained, Oh just Superman week week affoh uh, Gun

(13:08):
says there are things that I know I don't explain
in reference to Superman that I don't even want to
say out loud. But I wanted Superman to be vulnerable.
I see the online things who would beat whom Homelander
or Superman or fucking whatever, Adam Warlock or Brightburn, and
I'm like, this is the fucking stupidest fucking conversation. Like Sovan,

(13:30):
whoever would win this fight means that they're the best,
because I'll just go out and write, god Man, who
can destroy you with a wink? And I win. I
win all the fights forever. Absolutely. It's something I've been
saying for years. People get mad at me. I hate
that shit. I hate that who would win, Goku or Superman?
Whoever the fuck the writers want to win?

Speaker 1 (13:51):
Writers aside.

Speaker 2 (13:51):
Yeah, and for whatever reason the writers, Batman can't beat Superman.
That's just ridiculous. He has motherfucker because that was written.

Speaker 1 (14:02):
Uh, real real time, real world example is wrestling. Now.
They walk in with a plan, sometimes they walk out
with a different one based on how the crowd went. Yeah,
the people have turned turned heel literally on spur of
the moment, because that's where the crowd was moving and
that's what they went with.

Speaker 2 (14:20):
Mm hmmm.

Speaker 1 (14:20):
It's crazy time.

Speaker 2 (14:21):
But the fun of it is reading it and going
that is an interesting way of getting there or saying
what does this mean? What does this say about his motivations?
Some of it is about the mental gymnastics of it,
is going like, oh, how did they get to Superman
did this and took down Batman? How did they get

(14:42):
to Batman taking down Superman this way or whatever like these.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
Like the Dark Knight Returns parts where how and why
he took him down? You know, the like the the
brassiness of that. That's cool, that's a that's a neat thing,
but doesn't have to be there for every last thing.

Speaker 2 (14:58):
But also like the thing that peopleeople who were like
fucking Batman took down Superman and Dark Knight returns he
did a bit, but also like Superman's out there and
listen to his heart stop beating, like yeah, yeah, and
he does have some measure of compassion and fondness for Bruce,
like they are these It's just it's just so reductive anyway.

Speaker 3 (15:22):
Gun says, Yeah, I mean the story like when you're
learning something about the characters, the place yourself if you
want to If that's the kind of story you're into,
right then mm hmm, way.

Speaker 1 (15:32):
More interesting than playing Pokemon with comics.

Speaker 2 (15:36):
Yeah. But as far as scaling back Superman's powers, Gun says,
I didn't want a Superman who could punch planets, and also,
we're creating a whole universe now, so what's a girl
with wings gonna do in the face of that. So
he's a little less powerful. Guy, Gardner's pretty fucking powerful.
They're all pretty wonderful and powerful, honestly, and talking to people,

(15:57):
a lot of people are like, I like Batman better
because he can actually be beat and I get that.
So we have a Superman that can be.

Speaker 1 (16:03):
Beat mm hmm, I dig it, Yeah, I do. I
mean he led with that. Yeah, it's kind of funny
we even have that conversation. It's it's such a weird
character because you don't have that conversation in any other
capacity than like Superman almost.

Speaker 2 (16:18):
I mean, you do have your Gokus and your Homelanders
and shit where people are just like that. You've got
the power fantasy people who are just like jerking.

Speaker 1 (16:27):
The Homelander, just knocking it out of the park for that.

Speaker 2 (16:30):
Yeah, you've got You've got people like just scrubbing the
skin off their dicks over how powerful these characters are
and that's their ultimate power fantasy, and I just I've
never understood it. I want to I want a character
who's beatable. I don't want to watch Superman juggle the
fucking planet and not being able to be.

Speaker 1 (16:51):
I enjoyed it moments, I do, but I have a
weird relationship with it almost like there I like there
being restraint, but for reasons that are more like I
really hate the uh Like Marvel does this a lot
to feel like, got it that Batman does? They get
this a lot, but I hate these like steroid driven
stories where you get like Batman with a fearing, for instance,

(17:13):
is it's fun for a second? I mean I do
like that one actually because it has the fearing. There's
like a reason he got that. Yeah, but that's organic
in a way when you get things for a second.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
The yellow ring is what you're talking about, right, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (17:24):
Sorry I made the yellow ring. But yeah, like when
you when you when you're getting it for a good right,
Like the reason the restraints there with Superman is because
it's built into his character, like the actual character of
his person is integrity when you're just getting these little
flashes of Jimmy Elson becoming the giant space turtle for
a second. All right, it's cute. It's a funny story.
It's like it's cute story for half a second. But

(17:46):
it's not a memorable fun thing. No one's incorporating that.
It didn't have to be there, and it can go.
It's not building much for me.

Speaker 2 (17:53):
Yeah, it's fun to pop it in every once in
a while.

Speaker 1 (17:56):
And I love going down a rabbit hole where you're like,
oh man, let's you know what if I did compare
their powers, I can I can enjoy it for a second,
Like I like think my one of my favorite experiments
is thinking about how in theory, Gambit could just put
his hand on the world and concentrate long enough and
just crack that thing open like a nut.

Speaker 2 (18:10):
I don't, yeah, I don't. In that case, I don't
think it would be a long enough situation so much
as it would be just like could he muster the
energy to actually get it done? Like exactly, there's so
much concentration and so much power.

Speaker 1 (18:25):
Whatever is it feasible that way? See? Like that's a
fun conversation for me to go down, but for a
little bit lived.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
I don't live there, right, And the most fun to
me is far because when people are like dude, like
out in the real world, when people find out I
do a DC podcast, their first reaction is, oh, who
wins in a fight so and so and so and so,

(18:52):
And my reaction has to be, well, which version of
the character you're talking about? And then they dropped their
head because they know exactly what I'm getting at. Yeah, Like,
are we talking about golden age Batman with a gun?
Are we talking about fucking silvery Superman who's juggling planets?
Like what are we discussing? Because silvery Superman is like

(19:13):
super super smart, super super smart. Yeah, super super smart,
super smart.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
Don't do this to yourself or but do not this
to yourself? But like, yeah, like Batman with a gun
and knee jerk reactions, uh.

Speaker 2 (19:29):
Yeah, most crisis Superman seems to be like of average intelligence.

Speaker 1 (19:34):
Yeah yeah, uh, but yeah, I compare that to the
bat God. Different thing.

Speaker 2 (19:44):
Yeah, Grant Morrison's bat God is I When I was
a kid, I loved that ship because I was like, yeah,
fucking Batman. Batman's just God. He's just so cool James
Bond and he's like, you know, all these different characters
and wrapped him into one and he's just like Sherlock
Holmes and now like as a forty year old, I'm like,

(20:06):
I mean, being able to do everything is kind of boring.

Speaker 1 (20:10):
Yeah, it is when he can just do it magically.
There's like when there's just too much stuff in his
utility belt or a weird Superman eerro where he had
too many powers that just gets that gets lame. I
don't know how to subscribe it, but yeah, Superman having
a moral code that keeps him in check, or just
Batman having like some limits that keep him just fuck,

(20:33):
he's got to sleep like two hours. Yeah, yeah, that's
that's time. He can't be planning for Killer Croc, even
though he's been in prison for twelve years now and
doesn't see any like a backup plan for a third,
backup plan for a fourth character that he had run
into for seven and seventeen years, like go to bed Man.

Speaker 2 (20:56):
Yep, which I that's one of the reasons I was like,
I really liked stuff, like, uh, I think it was
Wade who did that Queen of Fable storyline where they
had Alis did Bruce from the from the group from
the Justice League, and like the whole world was being

(21:17):
overrun by fairy tales and they were like trying to
figure out what the hell was going on, and then
like Batman just appears over the corner and like motions
for I don't know, Kyle Rainer or somebody to come over,
and he just like hands he just hands them a
book and he's like they're fairy tales and he's gone.
They're like, oh shit, man, Batman helped, didn't he Yeah

(21:42):
like that. He's like, I got other shit to do,
but this is what you'll looking.

Speaker 1 (21:47):
For, but this was just here's the key. Just yeah,
yeah he does yeah, god speak. I like that. That
is one of my favorite words of that, Like the
You Tell Me stories about a similar vibe with Spider Man,
like Peter Parker version just popping in and being super
smart out of nowhere. Just hey you, by the way,
that's actually the answer to this chemistry problem. You can't

(22:08):
I gotta go. Uh did get robbed?

Speaker 2 (22:11):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (22:13):
I like the version though that he's just too damn
busy to be as smart as he could be at
any given time. Yeah, that's a good that's a good
limitter for me, fat god when you need it to be,
but not when you but he can't do it all
the time. Yeah, you still want them to be you know, manable,
we'll call it.

Speaker 2 (22:31):
Yeah, And you know what I would probably do in
the comics now, I'd probably get hate for it if
they haven't already done it. I like the idea of
Bruce basically programming an AI version of himself who just
like pops into people's feeds, the j LA feeds, and

(22:52):
it's like, all right, so Bruce is asleep, but here's
the thing. I've been analyzing this and here's what you
want to here's what you want to take care of.
Oh thanks, Ai Batman.

Speaker 1 (23:03):
I like the idea that there's one like it's gonna
be like Elastic Man or somebody that we find out
for two years has had a relationship with an AI
Batman who at the end of it like goes to
the end of his instructions and just at the end
of it was just like, Okay, I gotta go. He's
don't tell him I was here, Like because AI Batman
would keep himself a secret too, mm hmm. He just
he just has a whole ongoing plan that the actual

(23:25):
Batman doesn't know about, and of course he'd pick on
somebody like plastic.

Speaker 2 (23:28):
Man, Plastic Man, elastic Man.

Speaker 1 (23:32):
Yeah, honestly, I just grab any man, any one of
the men who's ever been at the watch Tower doing something. Yeah,
that's fair because they're all pretty much the same goofy
side character that I needed for that.

Speaker 2 (23:41):
Yeah. Oh, actually that's a pretty good idea too, is
like Bruce trains an AI, but the AI kind of
gleans enough of his personality that the AI becomes Batman. Yeah,
so Bruce didn't even intend to do it. That's fun.

Speaker 1 (23:56):
I mean they've toyed with that, with O Mac and
stuff like that, but I don't I mean that, of course,
a different, very different global kind of story. I don't think.
I don't know that anyone's done you know what I'm not.
I haven't been reading comics recently enough to see if
anyone's done proper as stories in current comics have. I
bet that showed up somewhere.

Speaker 2 (24:13):
I'm sure. All right. So, talking to BuzzFeed, James Gunn
says that three people from Guardians of the Galaxy are
in Superman. He said, and this is some tricky, tricky wording.
Here he says, I know Palm Clement Tief is one
of the robots. In the same scene, it's Bradley, and

(24:35):
it's Michael Rooker as another one of the robots. We've
got two Guardians right there. So it sounds like he's
saying Palm is one of the robots and Rooker is
one of the robots and Bradley is something else, because
he says it's Bradley and then he's very like he
very like h obviously does not say what Bradley is playing. Sure,

(25:00):
it's Bradley and it's Michael Rooker as another one of
the robots.

Speaker 1 (25:04):
Mm hmmm, Yeah, I don't fully follow what he's going for.

Speaker 2 (25:06):
Also, oh, I think Bradley has raised a different character.

Speaker 1 (25:12):
Yeah, I mean I get that part, but I was
waiting to hear Michael Rosenbaum.

Speaker 2 (25:15):
I'm oh, Rosenbaum is in there. Yeah, he's He's already
said he's in he's playing some voice act, some small
voice cameo.

Speaker 1 (25:23):
Yeah, I mean he'll call it half for bath List though.

Speaker 2 (25:25):
Yeah, he was in The Guardians and Galaxy.

Speaker 1 (25:27):
He sure was.

Speaker 2 (25:28):
He sure was.

Speaker 1 (25:29):
Uh do you diamond headed looking dude?

Speaker 2 (25:31):
I think do you have you like, I've heard rumors
of what Bradley is and I've heard it from months.
I've heard months and months and months ago. I won't
say it then if you haven't heard it, and now.

Speaker 1 (25:43):
I think I have avoided that. Okay, Yeah, spare me,
spare me.

Speaker 2 (25:46):
Yeah. I just think it's interesting that he brought it up, Like,
why would you even say that? James?

Speaker 4 (25:54):
Yeah, like that anyway, remember that that shot from the
from the thing, the little commercial or whatever that everyone
was mad at because it was like the first shot
of Superman flying and they were like, his eyes are weird.

Speaker 1 (26:07):
Yeah, he looks the Walleye shot.

Speaker 2 (26:09):
Yeah, the walle eye shot Yeah.

Speaker 1 (26:10):
Yeah, almost had a shorthand after a while, I.

Speaker 2 (26:14):
Believe Yeah, And everyone's been making fun.

Speaker 1 (26:17):
Of it, right, and then it was its subsequent removal yep.

Speaker 2 (26:21):
And they said there was a situation on social media
where people thought David was flying with the CG superimposed thing.
Was that telling when you talk about having to figure
out how to pull off these mechanics of getting David
to fly authentically, James says, No, I don't think it
was so much. It was a TV commercial and it
wasn't a finished visual effects shot, so the part of
him flying it was a photograph of his face and

(26:42):
him flying it was a photograph of a drone flying
in front of an actual background. So all the pieces
were real, but it was incorporated in kind of a
funky way. I didn't love the shot, so it's not
even the shot that's in the movie. Sometimes I'm pretty
strict about when I'm going through a trailer and looking
at each of these shots, but sometimes the commercials, I
forget to look at this closely, so that one kind

(27:05):
of got by me. You can't be doing that shit, James.

Speaker 1 (27:09):
That's kind of funny, though transparent response. I've ever seen
one of those.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
Oh, people are roasting the ship out of him because
he's walking it back. Now he's walking it back. He
took it out because everyone bullied him. He really, everyone said, hey,
this is shit, so he took it out. And now
he's trying to act like, oh, this one just got
by me, instead of him just approving it and thinking, oh,
it's great, and then everyone going no, it didn't, you
piece of shit. I think this guy is I think

(27:39):
the guy is busy.

Speaker 1 (27:41):
Yeah, I was about to say, he's so busy. I'm
kind of okay in a world where both of these
are a little bit true, I think you can call
him a column be it.

Speaker 2 (27:48):
Yeah, I don't care. I don't care. Guy's busy as shit,
like whatever.

Speaker 1 (27:54):
Man like, yeah, he probably glanced at it and maybe
he missed that shot. I don't know. I'm genuinely impressed
that people can do a lot of video editing anyway.
I'm I constantly think about those studies where you just
see you can just like do change blindness, where you
you just sneak a gorilla across the basketball game.

Speaker 2 (28:14):
Uh huh.

Speaker 1 (28:16):
Or a security guard watches, you know, twelve hours of
footage and the whole robbery takes place and you just
don't even notice.

Speaker 2 (28:21):
Yeah, I mean, if you're looking at it from James
Gun's perspective and he's like busy, he's this this was
our first flight. This was the first big flight shot
that we shaw with that we saw. But you know,
like that ain't the first thing he's seen it.

Speaker 1 (28:37):
Yeah, I know. That's that's the part where like hmm, yeah,
I agree at miss misshot there it is. If that's
just if that's just really what happened, then it's hilariously transparent,
but but understandable of course. But yeah, like that's that
is the strategy of it is. It was a highly

(28:58):
scrutinized shot. It's one of those where and I bet
you have that. I bet you'd love to have that
one again, if you if that's really how they went
down meet our new Oh yeah that was a bird.
It's a plane. It's crooked.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
Yeah, that was a weird shot. We screwed it up. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (29:17):
I think the goodwill currently has probably overtaken.

Speaker 2 (29:20):
I think so the memory of that, I mean, the
memory is still alive. But yeah, for some for people
who are desperate for it to be.

Speaker 1 (29:30):
I mean, I remember, I don't have any feelings.

Speaker 2 (29:32):
Yeah, I mean, well, look, you and I, even on
our small level, have dealt with video editing and trying
to produce a thing. Shit just happened. Sometimes sometimes you
miss stuff. Sometimes you just you didn't you shot a
thing and you're like, oh Jesus, that looks terrible. Yeah,
it happens.

Speaker 1 (29:49):
You ever heard you ever hear the final mix of
something come out of a speaker that you can't be
undone now and you hear it and go, oh oh oh,
that's that's a twek I should have that can't be undone.

Speaker 2 (30:01):
Dude, I do with this podcast. I'll just be listening
to something that we that I just put together and
everything or you sent me back the you know, the
combined audio or something. Yeah, and I'm sitting there like, huh, well,
we're not redoing that every once in a while. Yeah,
it's just something bad happens. You're like, oh, well, we'll

(30:23):
get over it, or they won't.

Speaker 1 (30:24):
Yeah, that is one of the issues. One of the
practical issues with the length of ours, just the sheer
length of ours, is that it's it's a it's a
one off, like we're going to average going going on
about anything for like an hour or two three sometimes. Uh,
he says with a whimper, a whimpering acknowledgment of the
truth of the matter at the thirty two and something mark.

Speaker 2 (30:46):
Uh huh, shut up no, as a directive, let me
get through this.

Speaker 1 (30:52):
Yeah, Like for us, like, yeah, if there's something in
the background that's like that, we can't go we can't
go back, and we do that, we just can't. It's
a practical problem. Yeah, that that, to our recording is
is the best we've got and it's gonna have to go.

Speaker 2 (31:11):
All right, So seeing is how we're on page three,
let's continue h three of sixteen sent up a bitch.

Speaker 1 (31:20):
Uh, yeah, I've seen worse. We have, We've seen double
it we have truthfully.

Speaker 2 (31:26):
Now, how does Lois not see passed the glasses? Well,
in this movie, she clearly like as we start, she's
already she already knows he's Superman. Yeah, and uh, they
said to James, you've already bypassed one of the stickiest issues.
How does Lois not see pass the glasses? And gun

(31:46):
says it comes up again later in the movie and
it's explained. She says it we mention it and it's
a one off, and people chuckle. But there's stuff later
in the movie about the glasses that are cannon. That's
cannon in the comics. And then the interviewer says, there's
a controversial seventies issue of the comic book where it
shows its basically Superman uses super hypnotism to change people's

(32:07):
perception of him in the glasses. It's what an idea.
It was an idea that was sent in by a
fan that has mostly been ignored since. And Gunn says
something like that. I only know it from DC Comics
writer Tom King. The first time we met was at
Peter's house, Peter Saffron's house. We had this sort of
writer's group come in. One of those people was Tom King,

(32:29):
and he was the most helpful. I'm like, I just
don't know how to fucking deal with the glasses thing,
because it bothers the fuck out of me. All that
little stuff that people are like, it's a fantasy, just
let it go. I'm like, no, I have to explain everything.
Everything for me has to come from a place where
I believe it. As outlandish as it is. With Rocket,
I could not just make it like a talking raccoon.

(32:51):
It had to have a very real foundation for where
he came from and how he came to be, and
I needed to believe that, right. I don't know, like
I think, you know personally, like I get where James
Gunn is coming from.

Speaker 1 (33:05):
And yeah, I would time the same way.

Speaker 2 (33:08):
But at the same time, like I just don't think,
like we've had Superman actors walking around not even with
glasses on in public and people don't recognize them because
you don't think that Superman's gonna be walking around like
Henry Cavill literally walked around in front of a billboard
of himself in Times Square and no one gave a shit. Yeah, yeah,

(33:31):
I think you know, generic white guy. You see a
generic white guy, you're not gonna be like, oh, look
at that guy who's all hunched over. He appears to
be you know, a foot or two smaller than Superman.
He's hunched over, he's bumbling, he's you know, tripping all
over the place. Uh, his hair is completely different. You're
not gonna think like, oh, that's Superman.

Speaker 1 (33:53):
I mean I think if you get to if you
can actually change the way you walk alone, that'd probably
do us the story for you. Just put on a
different jacket, a beanie, and go on your way.

Speaker 2 (34:02):
Yeah. There are lots of people who look like people. Yeah,
every time I go to Walmart, I look at see
I'm like, oh I know that person. No, No, I don't, right, No,
I don't know that personally, just look like somebody I know.

Speaker 1 (34:13):
The glasses are a funny thing too, because you wouldn't
for any moment in it if it was just something
just an affectation you had as at work, Like if
there was no history of it and it was just
a thing he did at work, and it was a
one off where he had him one time and throw
him to side. No one thinks anything about it.

Speaker 2 (34:28):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (34:29):
But again it's sueer Man. We gotta have we gotta
have an explanation for the glasses one way or the other.
But yeah, what's gonna be a problem for him is
that he's gonna put him on again later. It's that
he's gonna make it a designed costume choice for himself
inside the movie as Clark Kent and just you know,
you can make it as simple as I don't know,
the glasses, complete the look if you want to whatever. Okay,
he goes dumb as Ghostbusters twenty sixteen. You know, I

(34:51):
just took out the lenses because they kept getting fucky.
Mm hmm. You don't have to, and I advise not
doing it, but a lot of stupid explanations will get
the job done at my point.

Speaker 2 (35:01):
Oh yeah, oh yeah. Let's see, they said to James,
with this movie, you have people actively rooting against you
because they're fans of a previous incarnation of Superman. In DC.
Zack snyders Gun reacts with fake surprise and says, what yeah,
and they were like, yes, as you may have heard,
and he laughed. He says, I'm I'm trying to think

(35:23):
of how to say this best. I don't mind it.
I think it's good. I think you don't want to
have everybody root for you. And I have an actor
who reads everything online. I won't say who it is,
but he'll read this article and he'll know who it is.
It's one of the top five in Superman. And this
actor gets so upset over things that people say. I said,

(35:44):
first of all, you realize that the trailer came out
and the reaction was ninety seven ninety eight percent positive.
These people help us because you don't want everything to
see one hundred percent positive.

Speaker 1 (35:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:55):
Yeah, it's all right to have an opposing force. Every
once in a while, some of the things get ridiculous.
I just know that every time something comes out, it
doesn't matter how positively received, there's going to be something
that is of great controversy. It was great controversy that
the Sun calls Superman pain and the interviewer says, but
that's not what was happening. That was his bone snapping
back together right, and Gun says, it's like when a

(36:17):
doctor resets your bone. You scream, But it doesn't fucking
matter because is that really a controversy? Is that really
something that you're upset about? Or did you have a
hard time finding something to be upset about. There's always
going to be that, there's going to be something that
people are upset about, and it's okay. This actor reads
everything though. He reads every fucking Reddit thread. He watches
all of the videos, including by the people who make

(36:39):
their livings by hating us. That's how they make all
their money. But you don't have to watch their videos
where they're talking about how you're awful. You can be
reading it all the time, or you can't be reading
it all the time. It'll fucking murder you. It's a
terrible thing to do to your soul. And the interviewer says,
is this actor your lead? David Corn Sweat and Gun says,
it's one hundred percent not David. David is superman. He's

(37:01):
not a normal person.

Speaker 1 (37:07):
That's good.

Speaker 2 (37:09):
So I'm like, is it? Nick Holet? Is it? Skyler
is like, who is it? Is it? Philian? Is it? Oh?
I would have it.

Speaker 1 (37:17):
Would be funny for it. It would be the funniest if
it was Philian. That's that's a bestie of his and
the top five like it for him to and it
would be funny for him to call out I bet
and a bestie of his so publicly. He'll know when
he reads this ship listen this motherfucker.

Speaker 2 (37:33):
Oh man, did you see that?

Speaker 1 (37:34):
That's what he just did.

Speaker 2 (37:35):
It was great. I didn't include it in the show notes,
but there was a bit where someone online was saying, like,
they did my man Nathan dirty with that hair. Oh yeah,
Nathan was like insisted, I insisted on it. Oh god, uh.

Speaker 1 (37:54):
I appreciate the spirit, young man, but but come now, the.

Speaker 2 (37:58):
Hair really must our last big, our last big Superman news.
The way into Lex Luthor is what I called this.
They asked him, what was your way into Lex Luthor?
And Gun says, I really understand Lex. I feel like
I relate to Lex more than I wish I did.
But for me, Lex looks at Superman like artists look

(38:20):
at Ai. He is the world's greatest man in so
many ways. He's done these unparalleled things. And then you've
got a guy who comes in who's done nothing to
deserve the ability to fly and to smash down buildings.
And he's also extraordinarily handsome, and all of a sudden,
that's all the world is talking about. And that sort
of obsession with being replaced, with being with your gifts,

(38:41):
not being seen or passed over, I think is what
drives Lex. I relate to everything he does. He's just
meaner than I am. I really like that.

Speaker 1 (38:55):
I get it. I feel a little bit like this
version of Lex is going to be kind of a
The more you relate to him, the more we need
to check to see how you're doing with your therapy.
But I get it too, I understand. I mean, yeah,
but it's got to be a dick move if you
work that damn hard. Yeah, and it just consistent. Look
at him, just just fuck him, you know, like yeah.

Speaker 2 (39:18):
Oh no. I used to get really aggravated with you know,
because we I do a lot of work to put
together show notes and stuff and try to get their
correct context for news stories and whatnot. And then like
people will just come in and get like hundreds and
hundreds of thousands of views, and they're doing this shit

(39:38):
as their real job now, and all they're doing is
just like exactly what James is talking about. It's their
job to hate a thing, and all they do is
shit on everything that's there, Yeah, and take everything out
of context because they didn't bother to look at it.
They're just like coming in going yeah, I don't know,
I heard this blah, and that shit bothered the fuck.

Speaker 1 (39:59):
Out of me.

Speaker 2 (40:00):
I'm believing, Uh, they're ever getting millions of views, and
I'm just I'm sitting over here going really okay, Yeah, yeah, it.

Speaker 1 (40:12):
Always seems like a cheap angle. Maybe over sympathizing with
Lex too, though I do wonder to what extent they'll
they'll make it a product of hard work, and he
feels betrayed or just he was always the one who
it was just that easy for him. Mm hmmm. Because
I don't know, I'm kind of now that i'm thinking

(40:33):
about it, like Lex never really works.

Speaker 2 (40:35):
I don't.

Speaker 1 (40:35):
I don't know if any any story, any part of
the storyline or work. Lex like had to cram in
college because he was worried about something.

Speaker 2 (40:43):
Well, he's a genius, so that's not the issue. But
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (40:48):
I mean, they're other than the problem of having a superman.
I don't see him having overcome much in his life.

Speaker 2 (40:54):
I think you're wrong. I think you're wrong, Like I
think there is there, especially like in Small Villain and
so cert iterations of the comic, there was a lot
of Les having to prove himself to Lionel proved a lot.

Speaker 1 (41:10):
Of family baggage, a lot of family baggage. I'll definitely
give you that. I'm just talking about externally, I guess,
like in the in the resume kind of sense, the
CV sort of sense, I guess.

Speaker 2 (41:19):
Yeah. Well, I mean, you know, there are versions of
it where he's a self made man, so he had
to be he had to do something.

Speaker 1 (41:26):
He was true, that is true. There are versions where
he has come up.

Speaker 2 (41:29):
Yeah, it just really depends on you know what version
you're talking about. As I always say, I don't know
what version you're talking about. Motherfucker. You talking about Superman, Lowist,
you're talking about Titans, Titans. He came out from nothing,
like his daddy, like Lionel was like living in a hovel.

Speaker 1 (41:48):
And then they come back with I'm talking about the
version of this conversation where I left a second ago,
and then they walk away.

Speaker 2 (41:56):
And that's why you're you're my only friend, That's why
we are alone. Yeah, so you're the only one of
my friends like you and my wife are the only
ones who got of like, oh his autism kicked it.

Speaker 1 (42:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (42:14):
Well no, I just I get I get so tired
of the you know, this is the only version of
this character. No, no, it's not. Which one are you
talking about? Yeah, and people like to mix and match
and be like that's my lex. I'm like, yeah, it
is literally your lex because you just almost whole cloth them.
You took a bunch of shit from a different bunch
of different versions that you liked, and then you're mad

(42:35):
that somebody else isn't doing that.

Speaker 1 (42:37):
Yeah, from those lex quilt that you made.

Speaker 2 (42:46):
So this was exciting. This is on the the DC
Showcase podcast and gun was a he was a guest
on that show and they were asking him about Lobo
being in Supergirl, which by the way, is just called
Supergirl Now I'm good with that instead of Supergirl Woman

(43:07):
of Tomorrow, And because Lobo is not in the comic
and he was in early drafts of the comic series,
and they're asking if they restored that or if it's
going to be in a different way, and Gunn says
that's not the case. Lobo is not an amalgamation of
any parts from the original. It is unquestionably Lobo through

(43:31):
and through. He says, the truth is that Woman of
Tomorrow in the comics is very much is a bunch
of little stories, and we needed to create one through line,
one three act story, a more traditional story. So Lobo
helps us do that. It's not an amalgamation, amalgamation of
him and Krim is a totally separate character. He is himself.
I love Lobo. I always thought he was a great

(43:53):
character to adapt. I think he's maybe, in some ways
the biggest comic book character that's never been in a film.
I think it was a cool thing to do. I
am excited about that. It seems to indicate that we'll
get more of Lobo and snippets throughout the film.

Speaker 1 (44:10):
Maybe I'm almost imagining him now as like a kind
of a specter ish, kind of a tend Norman kind
of kind of thing. Hm hm as he like it
was like a through line to go through this. They
skip time, they skip all kinds of things. I mean,
the story does a wonderfully clever job of skipping time

(44:31):
several times. Yeah. God, he's so good at this. But yeah,
like I that would be fun to see him just
run through the story, Like, just imagine going through that
story with Lobo just basically everybody for once in a
while popping along as like a little Jimmy Cricket. Hey,
how's the uh, how's the being kind of a son
of it going for you?

Speaker 2 (44:50):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (44:50):
Have you hit this stage of son of a bitches yet?

Speaker 2 (44:52):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (44:53):
No, no, not yet?

Speaker 2 (44:55):
Yeah, drives off. That would be fun. I hadn't thought
about it being like a Jiminy cre this kind of situation,
like Lobo being Supergirl's conscience. Yeah, that's funny.

Speaker 1 (45:05):
Get enemy at your bastage?

Speaker 2 (45:07):
Nah? How many motherfuckers you killed? None? What?

Speaker 1 (45:12):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (45:14):
Yeah, I'm I'm I'm very interested to see what they do.
I'm I'm so excited. I'm so excited about this ship.

Speaker 1 (45:20):
Dude, she could help it, like she could also just
help him. He could help her just track down someone
like them, like someone who's understands what it's like to
just kill because he's curious about killing. Yeah, yeah, I
thought about how much fun that's going to be. In
a second, I got excited again. All right, Chuck place,
what are we on page two and a half?

Speaker 2 (45:43):
Oh? Man, you don't want to know it's five five.

Speaker 1 (45:49):
Yeah, oh good.

Speaker 2 (45:50):
Uh. Talking about Millie's casting as Supergirl, gun says Milly
was I I was just talking to Peter Safford about
this again before we were ever hired, and we were
talking about it and going through ideas. I was like, Peter,
you got to read this, you know, woman up tomorrow.
I was like, Right when it came out, I'm like,
it's really good. Listen. I love all of Tom's you know,

(46:13):
Strange Adventures is probably my favorite. I love the Mister
Miracle stuff. I love the Human Target. He's just had
all these little great comic series. I like the Black
Canary stuff. Now I can't wait to see what happens
next week. Anyway, I'm like, this is great, and he's like, well,
who would you see a Supergirl? I said, you see
the House of the Dragon. Who is that little blonde

(46:34):
girl on that? Because I wanted her to be this
little pixie ish but very attitudinal character, and so she
was the first person I brought up. And then when
we got her tape, I was like, oh, that's pretty.
You know, she's pretty.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
Good gets taped. Okay, Well, I was right, higher.

Speaker 2 (46:53):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, well, apparently came really close. It
was down to her and like Meg Donnelly was that
her name when I took that, Yeah, I think that
was it. It was the girl's played played Supergirl on
the Crisis on Infinite Earth's animated movies and Tomorrow Verk.
She really looks like Supergirl, like like to like to me,

(47:15):
which I had, I said this. I think last News episode,
I said that I thought Meg looked a lot more
like the artwork in Woman of Tomorrow than Millie Alcock.
And one of our listeners, one of our listeners, uh,
Lorenzo Valdez, was like, no, that's not true, like they

(47:37):
called me out like messaged me. It was just like, no,
I don't agree with that at all. I think Millie
looks more like the the the artwork. I'm like, I
just don't agree.

Speaker 1 (47:48):
But if I don't conject with a with a with
a polite get fucked, you're wrong. Okay, sorry, my bad?

Speaker 2 (47:55):
You know which is funny because I also I could
see you shrugging with apathy, like you just don't give
a shit me.

Speaker 1 (48:03):
Yeah, yes, neither way. There can change drastically for a film. Yeah,
as we have discussed earlier in this podcast.

Speaker 2 (48:12):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (48:13):
Oh, absolutely neither. You know that for me for the
most part, And I don't think a lot of people
end up looking like something that's gonna look as godly
as it's supposed.

Speaker 2 (48:22):
To either way. Yeah, you know, I just haven't.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
There's there's a whole, a whole little threads on subreddits
somewhere you can find if you look up Supergirl and that, Like,
there are other people that are still annoying Melissa when
I had that, lum, I don't know what. There's like
a scar on her forehead mm hmm, I have. I
have like a very similar one right in the middle
of my eyes. I know exactly the kind of mark
that made that, but yeah, like it it bothered me

(48:49):
the entire series. She's there's no version of events where
she was able to get that. I don't understand. Yeah, yeah,
just little stuff like that could be annoying either of
which way. I'm not worried about hair too much.

Speaker 2 (48:59):
Yeah no, I it's you know, I don't know why
you're talking about hair, but.

Speaker 1 (49:07):
Sorry, all right, just the look at it too much.
I mean it's not that big of ada, you know.
I'm not talking about getting all attracted to hair.

Speaker 2 (49:14):
Yeah, no, I wasn't talking about hair at all. I'm
just like, I think the actress the other actress looked
more like the artwork. And that's all I'm saying. Which
that means that I am ninety nine point six percent
excited about this movie instead of ninety nine point seven
percent excited about this movie. I've seen clips from House

(49:36):
of Dragon, like, dude, Millie's gonna kill it. Dude, Relli's
gonna kill it, Like, I don't know what tell you like,
I'm excited as hell.

Speaker 1 (49:46):
I think he had it down to two great choices
is what it amounted to.

Speaker 2 (49:49):
Oh and by the way, I think I said this
on Instagram or something this week. But like, if they
do a situation where at some point, because we gon
already going so heavy into like multiverse shit, like, can
we please get Power Girl played by Melissa b Noist?
I will take that. Yeah. I'll also take Sasha Kaye

(50:12):
playing Power Girl.

Speaker 1 (50:14):
Yeah, any of the above. A power Girl would be fun.
Just either which away.

Speaker 2 (50:18):
Also I'll take Megdonnelly playing Power Girl, Like can we
just do that? Yeah?

Speaker 1 (50:26):
Please?

Speaker 2 (50:27):
Over to Clay Face. Uh gun has confirmed. I think
he already has before, but just to be sure, Uh,
clay Face is intended to be rated R. He says,
it's just a great horror movie. That is a great, smart,
fun horror movie, which is in a genre that I
happen to love, which is body horror. It's rated R.

(50:48):
It's not anything now because the NPA has to watch it,
but it's most likely rated R. It's pretty intense. That
is not my genre.

Speaker 1 (50:55):
No, not at all for me.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
I'll be completely honest. Like I did enjoy the first
six All movies. It wasn't because of body horror though,
It's because it was actually a damn cool little premise
with a lot of little twists.

Speaker 1 (51:08):
Hanging that far. I don't make it into a ton
of horror in general. I kind of have to have
a gimmick to get me into it. So that being said,
I'm likely to watch clay Face.

Speaker 2 (51:18):
Yeah. Well, the gimmick that got me into Saw because
I didn't want to watch.

Speaker 1 (51:21):
Those do it. I just kind of get bored a
few minutes then oh yeah.

Speaker 2 (51:24):
But like the gimmick that got me into Saw was
basically the promise of a mind fuck moment where I
was like, oh, I didn't see that coming, you know,
and then like they did a really good job, especially
the first three, I would say, of giving me that
moment where I was like, oh, okay, you know, it's

(51:47):
not just cringe body horror shit. So like, especially when
I watched those, that was kind of the thing that
I needed. I needed to have, like the what the
fuck my know mind twist or whatever, like I needed
what like two of those in night Shyamalan movies did
really well.

Speaker 1 (52:08):
Yeah, I mean I like it more in the sci
fi twilet zone area. That's my favorite area of leaving
those questions. I don't like that so much in the
emotional area, where it's just Sophie's choicy kind of thing,
where you're just giving me some ridiculous choice have to
make or about an on screen horror, and a lot

(52:29):
of horror just does that. It just makes it like
graphic car instead of emotional horror. But a lot of
it's just kind of like, yeah, that would suck, and
I sometimes I don't I don't have a lot of
space for that.

Speaker 2 (52:39):
Usually I know they're like about to make Saw eleven
or something, but I haven't watched one since I don't know.
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (52:47):
I have thought you were joking when you said six earlier. No, no, no, shit,
no they were up higher.

Speaker 2 (52:52):
No no. I watched the first six for sure, and
I didn't hate the even the ones that I wasn't
as big into. But I think if you have an
inn for those movies, you're basically watching a series of
movies about a batman villain who does not have a batman.

(53:12):
There's no batman.

Speaker 1 (53:13):
If only there were a batman to stop this guy.

Speaker 2 (53:15):
If only there was a batman to stop this piece
of shit.

Speaker 1 (53:18):
Yeah, which would be a fun premise for it. I
would probably uh, I'd probably give a lot more of
a lot more ripe to play with that one.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
Yeah, I mean it is kind of fun. It's it's
fun to just sit and just be like, oh God,
like even when the you know, even the bad moments
were like, well that was stupid. You know, like you
get to have some some fun like laughing at it
a little bit, but then they'll turn it on you
and you'll be like, ah, shit, that wasn't funny after all.

Speaker 1 (53:43):
Yeah, there was a reason for it.

Speaker 2 (53:46):
I need to like, at this point, I need to
go back and rewatch them all before I can catch up.
But I didn't enjoy what I saw them, even though
it's not at all what I but I'm definitely interested
in clayface like this is. They've they've cast the body
Tom Reese Harry's gun revealed. He says it was a
long and incredibly exhaustive search.

Speaker 1 (54:08):
I kept wanting to joke about how it must have
been no one's ever heard of this dude.

Speaker 2 (54:11):
Oh no, not really, no one has.

Speaker 1 (54:14):
But see, that's the fun part is I've definitely entered
the stage where I don't recognize any of the names
until I go look him up or do their own
and do the research. I don't know him beforehand. I
have to go do the research every time now, so
I can't just see someone and go, yeah, no one
knows him. I probably just don't know him, but not
this time now.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
He said they were blown away by this guy. And
he's really only known for Apple TV's Suspicion and he
was in like Guy Ritchie's twenty nineteen comedy The Gentleman.

Speaker 1 (54:43):
I think I did want to watch that and forgot.

Speaker 2 (54:45):
And he won some sort of a sweepstakes with a
bunch of other dudes and they came in to do
this that They basically said, it's got you know, we
think one of these guys and at the end of
it and he was the one that won it. They
won the part.

Speaker 1 (55:01):
I mean, how is one sweep steak?

Speaker 2 (55:03):
I don't know. I don't know. I read that report
and I was like, I don't know what this means.

Speaker 1 (55:08):
I don't know what to do with that interpretation of
the word sweep steake.

Speaker 2 (55:11):
I don't either, but that's the word they used. I
didn't like it. Then I don't like it.

Speaker 1 (55:16):
Now the problem further consideration, I still don't like it.

Speaker 2 (55:21):
I think basically they just like did an exhaustive search
and then I think what they mean by sweepstakes is
they were like, hey, it's gonna be one of these
six guys, and they brought the six guys in and
then it turned out to be this guy. Like I
don't think it was at actual sweepstakes. Maybe I'm maybe
I'm wrong?

Speaker 1 (55:42):
Does that? I mean, clay Face is one of those
where it could possibly not matter in the slightest who
you cast for it. I think it will doesn't. I mean,
as far as it doesn't have to look like anybody
if you don't want it to. I mean, so maybe
it could. I mean, you could just put out a
collar random Hey, every casting for every freaking agent you've got, like,

(56:03):
who's your best shot, Who's the guy you've always wanted
to get some attention? Go for it, give a shot.

Speaker 2 (56:07):
Yeah, I mean I don't know.

Speaker 1 (56:08):
But and a new guy no one's heard of. Who's
Who's the one that you've just been like, oh my god,
I want to get this guy's.

Speaker 2 (56:14):
Yeah, it could have been that. It could have just
been a call to all agents like DM me give
me your best slide it so I can ignore it.
But it's it's gonna be like a body horror R
rated movie. So you don't want somebody that people know,
because that's how body, that's how, that's how horror movies.
In generally low budget horror movies, they cast. Initially, they

(56:36):
cast people that you've never heard of. Yeah, to keep
cost down. Nobody wants to go watch Tom Cruise get
his dick cut off.

Speaker 1 (56:46):
Yeah yeah, because.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
People have emotional attachments to people that they that are big.
So you want somebody that you've never heard of before
you can keep costs down because the people who like
that shit are gonna go. They want to go watch
somebody get it fucked up.

Speaker 1 (57:01):
Well, yeah. I mean, like you remember how risky it
was in Kevin in the Woods when he had Himsworth
killed off.

Speaker 2 (57:06):
That was a lot of fun.

Speaker 1 (57:07):
It was a lot of fun, but it was also
seen as very you know.

Speaker 2 (57:10):
But it was also like a horror movie that wasn't
like a pure horror movie it was.

Speaker 1 (57:14):
It was a trope. It was what it was for tropes.

Speaker 2 (57:17):
It was for tropes, absolutely, but it was also like
slightly a comedy in that way right where it was like, oh,
this is the you know. And also Himsworth wasn't that
damn big?

Speaker 1 (57:29):
Yeah, yeah, it was. The crest was rising, but it
wasn't that.

Speaker 2 (57:32):
Yeah. Yeah, I think he had like one thor under.

Speaker 1 (57:34):
His belt, right, But very much the joke was look
at this guy, you're expecting to and and ring it often.
But the whole script was forth walled as fuck, so different,
different application entirely.

Speaker 2 (57:46):
I'm still said, the final girl in that film hasn't
been bigger.

Speaker 1 (57:50):
She was good, she was good. They threw me off.
I forgot what I was gonna tell you. Sorry, I
was remembering that last thing, and yes, she was really good. Dolphining, dolphining, Yeah,
oh I think that was it. It would be nice
and fine to have a horror movie where I didn't

(58:10):
actually meet the man. Kit Like, just give me the
trailer and it's never anyone. I just never know who's
clay faced until the actual end of the movie. Uh huh,
never actually do meet the actor or actress. I have
no idea who the.

Speaker 2 (58:21):
End uh yeah, maybe, but you know the thing that
I like about uh what Mike Flanagan has said about
the movie is that it's based on Feet of Clay
or was inspired heavily by Feet of Clay from the
animated series. Kind of think I need to see the guy.
I kind of I need to I need to see

(58:42):
uh Matt Hagan. By the way, the rap apparently Clay.
The rap claims to have done some digging and discovered
that it is Matt Hagen.

Speaker 1 (58:51):
Just their best guess, and they're gonna hope it's right
when everything falls.

Speaker 2 (58:54):
I mean, it would make sense if it was. I mean,
if it's based on feet of Clay at all.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
You know, yeah, it's it's a good best guess.

Speaker 2 (59:03):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:04):
I did just run across a retelling of that. Jae's
story about how he like the reason there's so little
in the film was just couldn't fucking afford it, and
the robots didn't work yet hmmm. And that became the
thing that was so damn genius about it was there's
so little of the big scary thing, and like the

(59:25):
version of the events I heard at least was like, Yeah,
it was that way because he capitalized on the problem
he had. He saw it for what it was, and
he built he built around it. Like he didn't do
it by accident. He saw it and he filled the gap.
And that was genius. But it was it was created
because everything fucking failed on set that was supposed to
have a lot of sharks in it.

Speaker 2 (59:45):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean sometimes it'd be like that.

Speaker 1 (59:51):
Yeah, you know, sharks non always work.

Speaker 2 (01:00:01):
I wish we were big enough. See, that's that's the
real reason. That's the real reason I want us to
be really huge, a huge popular podcast. So I could
just name our episodes sharks don't work, you know, like,
and not have to worry about the consequences of that.

Speaker 1 (01:00:20):
Right, just for you so you can remember that that
was the part you enjoyed.

Speaker 2 (01:00:24):
Yeah, sometimes sharks don't work. Fuck it, I might do
it anyway.

Speaker 1 (01:00:35):
What's gonna hurt at this point, I don't know, probably
all the SEO from needing to put Superman in there.

Speaker 2 (01:00:41):
Yeah, probably all right. So onto the Batman Part two.
Oh Gun had some choice things to say about people
bitching about Batman two not being out. He says, the
only reason for the delay is there isn't a full script.
Those of you who follow me here probably know that already.

(01:01:05):
He says that Reeves is committed to making the best
film he possibly can, and no one can accurately guess
exactly how long a script will take to write. Once
there's a finished script, there's around two years for pre production, shooting,
and post production on big things Now, he debunked to
remember that the first draft of Batman two is expected
to be turned in or was expected to be turned in,

(01:01:27):
and wasn't on Memorial Day. He says, such a weird deadline. Yeah,
he said, you know, we're supposed to be getting it
this month in June. I hope that happens. We feel
really good about it. Matt's excited. I talked to Matt
all the time. I'm totally excited about it. So we
can't wait to read the scripts. But we haven't read

(01:01:47):
it yet. And he says people should get off Matt's
nuts because it's like, let the guy write the screenplay
in the amount of time he needs to write it.
That's just the way it is. He doesn't owe you
something because you like his movie. I mean, you like
his movie because of Matt. So let Matt do things
the way he does.

Speaker 1 (01:02:05):
He's like very structured and well worded with a lot
of his press recently, but there's almost an edge of frustration.
He said nuts and fucking twice then just the bit
you've pulled so far. Oh yeah, yeah, it's slightly loose colored.

Speaker 2 (01:02:21):
Oh yeah, and I'm here for dude.

Speaker 1 (01:02:23):
Yeah, I'm digging it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:25):
And he says that, you know, Reeves is not on
social media very much. He pays little attention to the noise.

Speaker 1 (01:02:33):
He's got some shit going on.

Speaker 2 (01:02:34):
Gun says, he's got a lot of other things happening,
so I don't think he lets it affect him. He's fine,
but I am irritated by people, he says, I mean,
it's just that thing people don't need to be entitled about.
It's going to come out when he feels good about
the screenplay, and Matt's not going to give me the
screenplay until he feels good about the screenplay. And then
with Rolling Stone, he also said, Matt's slow, let him

(01:02:59):
take it time, let him do what he's doing. God,
people are so mean. Let him do his thing.

Speaker 1 (01:03:04):
Man off as nuts, gotcha?

Speaker 2 (01:03:11):
Yeah, Which, you know, people are frustrated by this sentiment,
and they're angry with James Gunn for saying that. And
I hate to tell you, actually I don't. I love
to be able to tell you that is exactly the
attitude you want from someone who is running DC Studios
or any studio. You don't want people's threatening jobs and

(01:03:34):
telling them crank it out, crank it out, crank it out.
We got a deadline. You know, some marginal section of
the audience might forget that there was a Robert Pattinson Batman.
They're not going to forget, not anyone who matters not
on You'll keep the boat. It'll be a negligible amount.

Speaker 1 (01:03:54):
I don't think negligible, it will be it will be negligible.

Speaker 2 (01:03:58):
It will be a negligible eye negligible amount of people
who just forget that that they there was a Batman
Part one. Yeah, like most people will remember, oh yeah,
that was a thing. But you know, as I've been saying,
we got the Penguin just a minute ago. That that
also totally derailed what Matt Reeves was doing.

Speaker 1 (01:04:21):
You know. The Tom King had a habit of doing
this though in like the second half of I don't know,
I didn't get Human Target on its scheduled times. I
got it kind of after in little packets. But the
ones that I got of Tom Kings that were I
was getting them as they were released. Uh, he had
all of them that I remember. The big series were

(01:04:43):
delayed at some point, I think, and he would just
straight up say like, yeah, it's not ready.

Speaker 2 (01:04:48):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:04:49):
There was no real explanation. Yeah, I mean it's just
it's not ready and and we need a little bit
more time and I'll see you soon. And that's all
it really amounted to is it'd be delayed for like
a month, maybe two. I think it worse than one
on one occasion, like on ros mm hmm. But yeah,
it just wasn't that big of a fucking deal. Yeah,
he's waited a month.

Speaker 2 (01:05:06):
I am, like, I get it when it's certain things
like Joe Madderera back in the day was one of
the biggest comic book artists. He got huge doing Uncanny
X Men. I loved Joe MADD's work. He left that
Uncanny x Men, that huge fucking book to do his

(01:05:27):
own book. He was going to write and draw it.
It's called Battle Chasers. He did like nine issues and
it took something like twenty years for the tenth issue
to come out, like legitimately, and he didn't even draw
the tenth book.

Speaker 1 (01:05:42):
That is all right, that's that's rough.

Speaker 2 (01:05:45):
That's that's bullshit.

Speaker 1 (01:05:46):
That's some beach boys bullshit is what that is. But
that's bullshit that there's gonna be extremes to any behavior.
But yeah, for the last part, skipping a month or
two or just delaying for a seconds, not that I mean.
I listened to a ton of journalistically leaning podcasts, Like
my favorite genre of podcasts is probably like slightly journalistic
but a little bit a little bit funny mm hmm.

(01:06:08):
But you know better than anything we're trying to do,
of course. But like, I can't say anything without actually
having a dig at us in the middle of it.
It just doesn't make sense.

Speaker 2 (01:06:16):
To yeah, no, you do what you gotta do. Man,
do you understand I'm not scared of you. I'm not
scared of it. I don't want to do dig it. Ay.

Speaker 1 (01:06:29):
Yeah, let's uh. I forget where I was even going
that too. Yeah, it's like it's my favorite little little subset,
there is that little version.

Speaker 2 (01:06:35):
Do you really want to hurt me? Do you really
want to make me cry? Man?

Speaker 1 (01:06:40):
It's on the day mostly No.

Speaker 2 (01:06:42):
Yeah, there are definitely definitely days I even want to
make myself cry.

Speaker 1 (01:06:47):
I mean it's only when you about sixteen pages of
notes or something.

Speaker 2 (01:06:51):
Yeah, well, I mean, what am I supposed to do?

Speaker 1 (01:06:52):
Man?

Speaker 2 (01:06:52):
What am I supposed to do? Look? Ignore more? I'm trying, man,
It's so hard. So yeah, everybody is still asking, yeah,
is there a chance that Pattinson's Batman will be DCU
Gun is still saying I would never say zero chance

(01:07:16):
because you just never know. But it's not likely. It's
not likely at all.

Speaker 1 (01:07:20):
So I don't really see it unless they just, like,
what if they just sort of a band like if
Reeve just sort of says nah, and if you want
to go for it, that might be a way that
it actually proceeds that way.

Speaker 2 (01:07:35):
I mean maybe, but I didn't say that he was
the only one hold now yep, pretty much. But at
the same time that was true at a certain point.

Speaker 1 (01:07:46):
That was like four or five months ago.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
Well, no, that was years ago, was it? And I
guess it does come up probably from time to time, but.

Speaker 1 (01:07:57):
It might just been when we rehashed it recently.

Speaker 2 (01:08:00):
Anyway, Mister Miracle, this is an exciting announcement. Mister Miracle
adult animated series has been announced. Tom King is the showrunner.

Speaker 1 (01:08:12):
This will be interesting for him.

Speaker 2 (01:08:13):
I am very, very excited.

Speaker 1 (01:08:17):
Like I was just bragging about how he you know,
like I was happy skipped occasionally. That's where I was
going with the journalistic thing is they'll skip occasionally and
get hey, cool, we couldn't get the story straight. Cool,
I'll see you next week. But like, yeah, I like
those skipping occasionally. But the TV's different. He's not gonna
be able to do that with TV.

Speaker 2 (01:08:34):
Mmm. No, No, I don't think so. But at the
same time, you know, he'll have he's already written the
damn thing is a comic. He'll have writers, you know,
adapt theory.

Speaker 1 (01:08:47):
He did the hard part.

Speaker 2 (01:08:48):
If you don't know what mister Miracle is, which I
realize some people don't like. It's a very very old
character came from the seventies, but there was Mister Miracle.
Tom King and Mitch Gerriz did a book called Mister
Miracle that was based on that character back in twenty seventeen.

(01:09:10):
Is a super escape artist Scott Free, and we'll do
the little log line for DC Studios. Mister Miracle. No
prison can hold him, no trap can contain him. He
is Scott Free, the worldwide celebrity sensation known as Mister Miracle,
and he is the greatest escape artist who ever lived.

(01:09:30):
But can he pull off the ultimate trick and escape
death itself. Something has gone horribly wrong with the perfect
life that Scott and his warrior wife Big Barda have
built for themselves on Earth. With war raging between their
home worlds of Apocalypse and New Genesis, Scott's cruel adoptive father,
dark Side, seems to have finally captured the Anti Life Equation,
the ultimate weapon that will give Dark Side total dominance

(01:09:52):
over the universe. As the mountains of bodies on both
sides grow ever higher, Only mister Miracle can stop to
slaughter restore peace. But the terrible power of the Anti
Life Equation may already be at work in his own mind,
warping his reality, exposing his long buried pain and shattering
the fragile happiness he's found with the woman he loves,

(01:10:14):
and so begins the odyssey of Scott Free Mister Miracle,
a harrowing, hilarious, heart wrenching journey across the pitfalls of
the ordinary and extraordinary as the son of God, raised
by the devil, tries to save his family, his world,
and maybe even himself.

Speaker 1 (01:10:31):
And that doesn't do it justice.

Speaker 2 (01:10:33):
It doesn't do it justice at all. I've seen some
people being like I do, oh, what DC used dark
Side to show up in a fucking comedy cartoon.

Speaker 1 (01:10:44):
It's not a comedy, though, it's not. The thing is
that you there are parts that are hilarious of the book,
there really are. The parts that are funny are outright funny.
But the parts that are tragic are truly so when
did you say that was announced?

Speaker 2 (01:11:02):
Was that that wasn't announced? At the NSC Animation Festival
this past Thursday? This past Thursday, or maybe Thursday before,
I can't remember, but it was one of those I'm.

Speaker 1 (01:11:15):
Gonna do a quick, quick little shout out for us here.
June fifteenth, twenty nineteen, was when you and I posted
our Mister Miracle review on Patreon an hour and three
minutes of that little Bastard so good. That is hour
and three of us going over the book. You know,

(01:11:36):
I can wait till the end for Dave to give
you the whole pitch, but I think it's worth it.

Speaker 2 (01:11:40):
Patreon dot com slast day you say, I'll screen, I'll
put a link in the show notes.

Speaker 1 (01:11:49):
Yeah, there's the TLDR version.

Speaker 2 (01:11:51):
Yeah. You know what. The the funniest thing that I
remember from that book though, and it's been a minute
since i've read it, the veggie dip. Yeah, like they
are having basically like the Geneva Convention in Mister Miracle
and Barda's fucking apartment and Dark Side Lord of Apocalypse,

(01:12:14):
the Alpha and the Omega as he claims, you know,
shows up and it's just like, because awkwardly gigantically sitting
on this little couch with a veggie, like a plastic
veggie platter, like eating carrots.

Speaker 1 (01:12:29):
Yeah, as you would like.

Speaker 2 (01:12:31):
I love that. It's something that Joss Whedon did very well.
And I know that's like a dirty name and shit
at this point, and it should be fucking but it's
one of the things that I really liked about his
work back in the day was he would take these
larger than life characters that you never see outside of
a certain epic nature, like you're always presented with this

(01:12:52):
like you know, grandeur, and you take those characters and
you say, okay, well, but what's the reality of his character?
What's the reality of life? Motherfucker?

Speaker 1 (01:13:04):
Mundanify them.

Speaker 2 (01:13:06):
Yeah. So there's like a bit where you're just like
you're gonna have this epic speech from dark Side, and
then he like walks away from his thraws of adoring
slaves and he goes into like a little side kitchen
and you know, pops open some some soda or it's
just like, fuck, I need some candy, you know, like

(01:13:26):
something like that. Yeah, And I do enjoy that shit.
And it doesn't bother me. It doesn't make me feel
like it takes me out, It puts me in further
in a Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:13:37):
Yeah. My memory of that book too is it's very
much they they kind of have like a like they
almost don't even remember what they buy. You just you
just buy veggie trays to have for things for like
for people over, you know, most kind of thing, and
like dark says, eat you eat these things when you're
here it just seems so like everyone's just participating in
the existence of the veggie tray. Yeah, it's like a

(01:13:58):
character in this It stood out for a reason. I
felt like it was such a hilarious thing to brought
in but.

Speaker 2 (01:14:04):
Also feels weird, weird and real in a way. That's
like you remember a while back, like fifty years ago,
where like reports started coming out that like uh Kim Jong,
dictator of North Korea, was like they were all worried
because they were like, we just can't we can't get
him to stop eating cheese. Like the doctors say, it's

(01:14:25):
not good for him. He's he's sick. He's literally sick,
like he's got a condition.

Speaker 1 (01:14:32):
Doctor Tom, it was bad for him. What happened He
went to a doctor when I'm the old doctor. He
killed him. What happened to the old doctor?

Speaker 2 (01:14:39):
Like this prognosis, This.

Speaker 1 (01:14:40):
Happened fourteen times before we realized what had happened.

Speaker 2 (01:14:43):
I you know, I hope I'm not just remembering a
weird onion article or something, but I feel like that
was a real story.

Speaker 1 (01:14:48):
It just like it could borderline be a dream, but
I could also completely see that one.

Speaker 2 (01:14:52):
Like yeah, I mean like officially like there's not he's
in great health, like because they just lie kill whatever.

Speaker 1 (01:14:58):
Doctor doesn't say that. Yeah right.

Speaker 2 (01:15:00):
But then there's also like, no, he might go any day,
like yeah, his arteries are clogged full of cheese. God,
I'm gonna look at this later and be like I don't.
I must have dreamed that this is that real.

Speaker 1 (01:15:21):
Yeah, it's unhealthy, it's over decades, cumulatile behavior. No, this
is more like crack open your chest and shove a
wedge of parmesan in a vein. Oh say he's gonna
die then? Yeah, of this gotcha?

Speaker 2 (01:15:36):
Yeah, oh my god, it's real. Twenty seventeen, Jason, you
found it. Yes, Kim Jong un had to retreat from
public life after eating too much a mental cheese after
a large shipment. Blah blah blah. Yes, yes it's weird. Yes,
he devours all of the cheese and wine. New York
Post says, suffering discomfort after addiction to Swiss. Yes this

(01:15:57):
is real. Yes, these are If it's not real, it
was a thing that was widely reported.

Speaker 1 (01:16:05):
Yea menela cheese, mm hmm, eating and cheese I've never
even heard of.

Speaker 2 (01:16:12):
That's Oh my god, I don't know if I don't know,
if I don't know the legitimacy of this, but it's
a metro dot CEO dot uk, says uh. North Korean
dictator Kim Jong un has lost so much weight because
COVID border closures have stopped him getting hold of Swiss cheese.

Speaker 1 (01:16:32):
Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:16:33):
Los Angeles Times Stephen Colbert examines North Korea's cheese crisis.
Thank God, God, you know, sometimes you're just like, please
tell me I didn't just cook.

Speaker 1 (01:16:43):
That up and there all right, I've been there. I mean,
I constantly tell you the same story over whatever again
and have yes you do or not even the same story.
It's not so much the same story as the problem
that it is.

Speaker 2 (01:16:58):
Yeah, that is a problem. So it is a problem,
a problem.

Speaker 1 (01:17:02):
Separate problem. The one I'm referring to is more like
I'll have the same response, but it'll be like a
like I'll go on like a monologue twice. But the
only thing that has given me any comfort is that
you have yet to tell me that I have like
contradicted myself so far.

Speaker 2 (01:17:17):
Mm hmm. Well, part of that's probably because I stopped listening, yes,
which is good though, because like the day that I
contradict myself so much that it actually perks your attention.

Speaker 1 (01:17:25):
Then we have to worry.

Speaker 2 (01:17:27):
I think part of the charm of our friendship, and
part of the reason it worked so well, is because
we both do that. We both tell each other the
same stories over and over again, but our memories are
both so bad that we we listen to the state
the stories and we're like, I remember something about this?
What was it again? And we're being honest.

Speaker 1 (01:17:50):
Yeah, we just started being two seniors when we were
in our thirties.

Speaker 2 (01:17:53):
Oh sweetie, I started long before that.

Speaker 1 (01:17:56):
Said we. Oh, we weren't a wei in till then.

Speaker 2 (01:18:00):
Okay, fair enough, fair enough.

Speaker 1 (01:18:02):
Maybe late twenties, you right, you right, you right, right right.
It was mid twenties, bro, it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:06):
Was twenty Yeah, it's two thousand and nine or ten,
something like that, and we really started being friends.

Speaker 1 (01:18:11):
Time has passed, it has. I want cheese.

Speaker 2 (01:18:16):
I mean, hilariously, I ate two string cheese. You know
what I mean what I'm talking about, like the.

Speaker 1 (01:18:22):
Yeah, yeah, delightful little guess.

Speaker 2 (01:18:25):
Yeah, the cheeseheads, the frigo cheeseheads. Yeah yeah, I ate
two of those sons of bitches. Before you called me
for this.

Speaker 1 (01:18:33):
I look, Kim, I get it, man, I have to
be careful around that stuff too.

Speaker 2 (01:18:37):
But yeah, that's not well, I'm not gonna condemn him.
That that's you know, there's a lot of other shit
you can talk about with Camp Jungun.

Speaker 1 (01:18:45):
There's plenty we won't see eyed eye on. But that
part I can I can sympathize with slightly.

Speaker 2 (01:18:50):
If you put me in a room with him and
then you were like, hey, man, neither of you can
kill each other. Yeah, but you know you have to
find something to talk about.

Speaker 1 (01:19:00):
Well, I mean the cheese. These things happened.

Speaker 2 (01:19:03):
I like cheese.

Speaker 1 (01:19:04):
Yeah, the hunters. Thompson used to say that him and
Richard Richard Nixon, I think while Nixon was president, I
want to say, or some shit like that, Like had
like thirty minutes alone together at some point, and you know,
given the relationship, you'd think it would just be a
brawl of some kind. And was like, no, no, we
talked about college football for thirty minutes. He was actually

(01:19:25):
pretty knowledgeable. We both knew about some high school recruits
and stuff, Like they had an in depth like a
nerd out walked about college football and who was on
top and who should be on top for a while.
That was the only thing they really moved on. Yeah,
I mean what, Yeah, I mean that was everybody knew
each other's stances. We're you gonna yell each other thirty minutes.
I already know who you are, you know who I am? Whatever?

Speaker 2 (01:19:44):
Yeah? Yeah, see, this is what like people in power do.
Yet I can't go home for Father's Day without hearing
some bullshit about well, you know Biden? Did them? Fuck?
You can't we just talk about well, the cat that's
sitting on top of Mom's car. Yeah, yeah, we both

(01:20:06):
know what cats do. It's mildly entertaining. We both watched
X files together. Does it have to be about Trump
versus Biden? Does it have to be that we're not
going to agree?

Speaker 1 (01:20:18):
Yeah? Yeah, I would didn't just be better if we
I'd forget who it was I talk to you recently
that I just stopped him mid sentence and said, Hey,
I just don't know where you're going with that, but
I do know that you haven't said anything yet that
I feel like I'm going to have anything that I
can say anything about? What this isn't something mean you
need to discuss?

Speaker 2 (01:20:37):
Man?

Speaker 1 (01:20:38):
And he said, well, I was just thinking. I hear
what you're thinking, but I don't think anything. Here is
something we mean you should touch on.

Speaker 2 (01:20:44):
Mm hm, and we moved on. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:20:47):
I forget what we talked about next, but it wasn't
what the fuck he was about to bring up.

Speaker 2 (01:20:52):
Yeah, but good god. Anyway, Hey, here's something you have
no interest in.

Speaker 1 (01:20:59):
That fun.

Speaker 2 (01:21:03):
July third is when Batman Ninja Versus Yakuza League is
officially on HBO Max for free, quote unquote, So there
you go on that if you've been biting your time,
and you know, the first one was really popular. Batman
Ninja did really well. Yeah, it sold a lot. Cgi

(01:21:27):
looks cool. I don't know what I'm looking like. I
watched Batman Ninja and I was like, I don't know
what the fuck this is, but it's entertaining. It's like,
you know, fucking.

Speaker 1 (01:21:36):
The name alone is gonna get serious views.

Speaker 2 (01:21:39):
I mean it is. You know, Batman Ninja was Batman
whisked away to the past to feudal Japan, and that
that was interesting. That was fun. It was a weird
little story. And this is what I'm seeing, you know,
Batman versus like Yakuza versions of the Justice League. That
shit looks dope, like he's on a MEC and shit like,

(01:22:01):
I don't know. It's not something you're going to enjoy,
but you know, I think if you, you know, broke
down some of your walls, you would.

Speaker 1 (01:22:10):
I've tried. I've tried. It's borderline and open invitation for
anyone to come over here with a damn copy of
Cowboy Bebop or some ship and show me. But I
just haven't ever had adopts.

Speaker 2 (01:22:22):
Did you did you never sell a Cowboy Bebop?

Speaker 1 (01:22:24):
I did?

Speaker 2 (01:22:25):
Oh you did? Okay, still still couldn't get into it.

Speaker 1 (01:22:28):
I just didn't. I couldn't. Couldn't understand.

Speaker 2 (01:22:31):
Yeah, because you had that X And I was like,
I would be shocked if she didn't try to show you.

Speaker 1 (01:22:35):
That, and that was that was the one that was picked.
And I kind of got to the end and was like,
so we're gonna watch like BTA, Yes, that's what I've
been watching recently.

Speaker 2 (01:22:44):
Yeah, I'll be honest with you, man, I.

Speaker 1 (01:22:46):
Think we just probably throw on some community.

Speaker 2 (01:22:49):
I still haven't watched Cowboy Bebop. I want to because
I've heard if you like Firefly, you will like this.
I haven't gotten to it yet. What I do like,
and I would think I'd be shocked if she didn't
show you some Miyazaki.

Speaker 1 (01:23:04):
I might have, or at least I've wandered through it. Probably.

Speaker 2 (01:23:07):
Yeah. My intro to that was Kiki's Delivery Service. The
English dub Phil Hartman played the cat, the Little Black Cat.
It was basically like an anime version of Salem from Sabrina. Yeah,
it was just like Phil Hartman going like, what the
hell's wrong with you? Why would you do that? Nah?
You know I was gonna watch Phil Hartman, I mean yeah,

(01:23:29):
And it was a delightful little film. That was my
intro to anime, and I have gone back for you know, two, three,
four or five. I don't know a number of Miyazaki films.
Hal's Moving Castle was very good. Spirited Away was less good,
but still interesting. I'm sure that there's something I'm forgetting

(01:23:49):
that I've seen.

Speaker 1 (01:23:51):
I mean, spirited is the one that your average person
could name if they didn't, well, I could do the
fill in the blank probably for it. At least most
people know the title spirited Spirited Away.

Speaker 2 (01:24:01):
I thought spirited Away, yeah, uh yeah, so me. Yeah,
Spirited Away had some really neat visuals and it had
an interesting story, and it did sag a little in
the middle for me. But oh, Princess Monon okay, was
was good. I really liked that one. I think all
that to say, I think if you're going to get

(01:24:22):
into it, it's gonna be from like an original a
more original idea than just being like, let me adapt
your superhero into a way in a way that you're
not gonna understand.

Speaker 1 (01:24:33):
Yeah, that is a good point. There's also a certain
amount of I mean, even with a mech situation, like
I've there is no trope in anime that I'm familiar
with that I haven't seen done somewhere else in DC
at this point, not a lot of news stuff you
can do with the set of bat Ears.

Speaker 2 (01:24:53):
Right, Oh yeah, don't say that. People get upset about that.

Speaker 1 (01:24:58):
I mean it's pretty deliberate reference. There's a thing a
few years ago that was literally done new with the Battiers,
but that's you know, yeah, there's a few and far between.

Speaker 2 (01:25:07):
Well, like Gunn literally said something very close to that,
and we're gonna get to here in a second, and
people have been really angry about him saying that. But
do you uh, are you still good to keep going.

Speaker 1 (01:25:23):
I'll take you up on that break this time.

Speaker 2 (01:25:25):
All right, we're gonna go to break you win. I
mean we're getting to the WBT portion and it's just
gonna be a free for all of different things of
different like one off conversation pieces here and uh.

Speaker 1 (01:25:43):
You know, I mean the tally has been live so far.
So what page we are?

Speaker 2 (01:25:47):
Oh? What page are we on? Jason? Oh? Oh no,
we are on page ten?

Speaker 1 (01:25:55):
Okay, gotcha?

Speaker 2 (01:25:55):
Ten of sixteen man Lovely Park.

Speaker 1 (01:25:58):
Hell yeah, that's a that's a good break spot. That's
a great spot.

Speaker 2 (01:26:02):
It's a pretty good break spot. All right, we'll be
right back and uh, we'll do We've got so much news,
come back, come back.

Speaker 1 (01:26:09):
Don't I love how that started? That ended with a
question mark so quickly that started with all rights come back.

Speaker 2 (01:26:17):
I didn't mean to do a question mark. All right,
go pie, All right, all right, everybody, we are back
in the saddle, and it is time for my favorite
segment WBT.

Speaker 1 (01:26:38):
A decent clip.

Speaker 2 (01:26:45):
It's more fun than just saying miscellaneous.

Speaker 1 (01:26:48):
It is.

Speaker 2 (01:26:50):
You remember back when there was a whole like, oh,
Geramo del Toro is going to do Justice League Dark.
You remember that? And then how it got shuttered.

Speaker 1 (01:26:59):
And thousands of years ago.

Speaker 2 (01:27:02):
Yeah, yeah, back in the old days. So in that
Entertainment Weekly interview they asked, they were like, hey, that
Geramo do Toro Justice League Dark thing seems like it'd
be right up your alley, and Gunn says, yeah, By
the way, Geramo's never said that to me. I hear

(01:27:22):
all these things about Gueramo would love to do Justice
League Dark. Well, Gieramo's never said that to me. Just
let Steven Spielberg do is Blackhawks movie that he wants
to do. Steven Spielberg, who I love above anyone else,
has never said that to me. So these things get
blown out of proportion. Years and years ago, I said

(01:27:43):
I wanted to make a Thunderbolts movie. I was in
a convention somewhere and somebody asked me what did I
want to do. It wasn't Guardians of the Galaxy. I
said Thunderbolts. For years and years, it's like, James Gunn
should be allowed to make a Thunderbolts movie. I have
a million things that I thought I wanted to do
at certain moments. M uh so, yeah, that's uh, that's interesting.
I know we recently somewhat recently with the past year,

(01:28:05):
had Geramo talking about like, oh, yeah, you know, I
don't really want to do that because now because it's
always going to get screwed by the studio and you know,
it went through all these things. He may have our
he he may have just been burnt beyond desiring to
do it.

Speaker 1 (01:28:22):
Yeah, yeah, which is funny because I hadn't thought about it.
But he was probably right because that would be an
accurate assessment given the studio at the time. But he
also might have just been taking a chance to take
a piss on him and that was a decision that
was made three years ago. Like m hm. It's just
an easy shot to take if you wanted to, but

(01:28:44):
a completely fair.

Speaker 2 (01:28:45):
One, yeah for Gieramo. Like but I think, you know,
if this comes out and we see this in the
news and people are talking about it, like why don't
you talk to James Gunn about it? And I think
Guarimo like that he as good as gun pointed out,
like they do they own a restaurant together. He and Germo,

(01:29:05):
they know each other, they're friends. But uh yeah, I
think there, I mean, there's a possibility at some point
that this comes up again. I'm sure it will, and
Garimo might be like, oh, maybe I can talk to
him about it, or maybe he's just lost interest at
this point.

Speaker 1 (01:29:22):
Yeah, might just moved on. Yeah, might have maybe completely,
maybe not at all, Maybe just waiting for the right
time to bring it up over shrimp cocktail or whatever
the fuck restaurant they have together.

Speaker 2 (01:29:32):
Mm hmm. Now he also was speaking about Creature Commandos.
A fan on Threads wondered if it was possible for
the Princess to return from the dead, and uh, someone
else said, I mean it is DC, so no one
stays down forever, and Gunn says in the DCU, if

(01:29:52):
you die, you are dead.

Speaker 1 (01:29:54):
Yeah. He had similar similar note about that on one
of the DC Showcase.

Speaker 2 (01:30:03):
Oh yeah, yeah he did. He did. They because they
were like, oh, that's a very long name. Collins is
in the background. So the DC Showcase. Yeah yeah, they
were like, oh yeah, the Collins is in the background
and they could resurrect, and he was just like, nah,
you're dead.

Speaker 1 (01:30:18):
Yeah, she's dead.

Speaker 2 (01:30:19):
Yeah. It's like, unless you're a robot, you're dead. Like
pretty much.

Speaker 1 (01:30:24):
It's funny the girl asking questions kind of like she
she kind of responds like, I know, I knew you
were going to say that, but it still hurts to
hear kind of thing. But yeah, I'm right there with you, man,
because he basically I think she posed it to him, like, yeah,
you know what I mean, Like, but is there a
chance we're gonna get her back? And because dude, it
wouldn't matter if I did things like that, and he

(01:30:46):
goes on for about it about.

Speaker 2 (01:30:47):
Oh yeah, oh definitely yeah he uh. He went on
about it on threads because someone asked him like, oh,
so you're not gonna use the Lazarus Pit. Don't you
think this rule will limit you, uh from using established
elements established elements of DC commics lord like the Lazarus Pit.
He says, well, I wouldn't mind using the Lazarus Pit

(01:31:08):
or a resurrection story, but it would have to be
a part of the story itself. I won't be killing
major characters just to pop them in the old Lazarus
Pit to be alive again.

Speaker 1 (01:31:18):
Yeah, organic matters here, he says.

Speaker 2 (01:31:21):
What what backfires more is people believing there are no
stakes and death doesn't mean anything dead is dead. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:31:30):
I mean he already kind of really looked like he
killed some people in Creature Commandos and kind of murderline
got away with like you know, the you know, I
do love the Reddit old the old Reddit joke about like,
yeah I didn't lose his shoe, he's fine. Mm hmm,
like I almost sell some shoes come off. They got
beats so bad on that show.

Speaker 2 (01:31:50):
Mm hm.

Speaker 1 (01:31:52):
And then yeah, I mean yeah, he's already toying with
the line a little bit, but yeah, the line still
has to matter.

Speaker 2 (01:31:57):
Yeah, and you know it is James Gun, so he's
sneaky and uh yeah, you can't roll that out, like
the fact that, like, you know, people are like, oh,
you can't use this character because he's dead and you
killed him in the Suicide Squad and he's like you
never saw a body. Yeah oh yeah, but in the

(01:32:17):
and there was a monitor in the background that showed
he had a heartbeat, so yeah, he might not be dead.

Speaker 1 (01:32:22):
Oh okay, never saw a body. He went between the
starfish's toes quote man's fine or pokedon man's fine.

Speaker 2 (01:32:29):
Yeah, so this is really cool. This is exciting to me.
He was talking to Entertainment Weekly and they asked about
what's next for the DCU after Clayface, and Gun says, well,
then there's another TV show that's my favorite thing in

(01:32:49):
all of this that is hopefully getting made soon. It's
just my favorite thing. And then there's the movie. Oh shit,
I don't know what I'm allowed to say or not say.
But there's a couple of the things, a couple other
movies that are being written, one of which is in
pretty good shape, another which is kind of closer to
the start but we feel positive about. And then there's

(01:33:09):
a thing I'm writing, which I think is okay, So
what will we be? So what will be the next
thing after clay Face? Is not one hundred percent certain,
but it's pretty certain. And they asked how much of
these undisclosed titles are things that have already been announced
versus things that haven't, and he says, my favorite thing
has not been announced at all. One of the scripts
people kind of know about. My script, people don't know about.

(01:33:32):
The other script people don't know about. So it's mostly
stuff people don't know about. A couple of those things
announced in January of twenty three are in pretty good
shape in terms of coming up. But there was one
thing that I knew about from the very beginning that
when I pitched to David's ads laugh. What the DCU
would be I pitched to him, but we did not

(01:33:52):
announce in that first meeting because I felt like it
was too easy to rip off by another company. And
so that's one of the main things.

Speaker 1 (01:34:00):
That that's gonna leave a lot of speculation.

Speaker 2 (01:34:04):
Mmm. And they said, is there anything more that you
can say about this mystery project that you're writing next?
Is this the project that you'll direct next? And he says, well,
I'll always leave saying I'm going to direct until I
direct something, until I'm actually done with the screenplay, and
then I say, yeah, I want to do this, but
it's probably what I will direct. Yeah, probably to be

(01:34:27):
totally realistic. Yes, probably. H So, yeah, we don't know
what that is. I am excited and I can't help.
I can't help, but like notice and like point out
Tom King is a major player in DCUM. He's in
Gun's ear.

Speaker 1 (01:34:45):
Yeah, he's in the inner cabinet telling me his.

Speaker 2 (01:34:50):
New Gods movie. He's just gonna like not bring that
in in any capacity, Like I get if they like
can't do what a Eva wanted to do because Ava
du Varney was like part of it, and you know
she was going to direct it at some point, but.

Speaker 1 (01:35:06):
They were worried at the time it was going to
feel too much like Eternals, and then Internals didn't.

Speaker 2 (01:35:09):
Do well, I think. No, like Warner Brothers blamed New
Gods dying on Zach using dark Side in Zack Snyder's
Justice League.

Speaker 1 (01:35:23):
Oh, that that is exactly what that was.

Speaker 2 (01:35:26):
Officially what Warner Brothers said. They were like, oh, yeah,
we were going to do New New World or New
Fourth World. We were gonna do all that New Gods
and then, uh, we told Zach not to use dark
Side in Zack Snyder's Justice League, and then he did
it anyway. So that's why you don't get New Gods.

Speaker 1 (01:35:41):
Yeah, that's just a lie. We told him not to
and then he spent like a hundred million dollars doing
it anyway right under her. No, just right under.

Speaker 2 (01:35:51):
I mean it was already there. It was already in
the movie. Like they're like, Okay, you can do Snyder cut,
but you can't do the fucking Snyder cut that you
already have. Fuck you that's not true.

Speaker 1 (01:35:59):
Yeah, that's but how did that? And he just he
spelled his name on CODs a different when we saw
the paper I'll tell you that right now unspelled like.

Speaker 2 (01:36:08):
That, yeah, something. But I think the real thing was
like they were trying to get away from they had
already said Zack Snyder's Justice League is a cul de
sac and we're not going further. And I don't know
if you remember this, but Tom King was it was
pretty vocal on when people are like, is New God's

(01:36:28):
going to be in Zack Snyder's universe or is it
going to be like part of the hot modiverse? And
Tom King is just like winking. They'd say like, oh yeah,
I mean we got some stuff going on. I think
that's what it was. Warner Brothers was like, Okay, no,
you're not You're not connecting this. But like that was
one of the funniest things to me, is like every
almost everybody that came after took pains, like went out

(01:36:52):
of their way to make sure that their universe was
like in Zach's. You know what I mean. Like that
was it was that like little nod like, yeah, we
see what y'all did to Zach, so fuck y'all. H
this is here. Yeah, Jeff Johnson is behind the scenes
making fun of it, but uh, we're just slidding little
things in.

Speaker 1 (01:37:11):
Yeah, they left like a piece of this and that
here and there.

Speaker 2 (01:37:14):
Yeah, it might be an abomination upon the screen. I'm
sorry the flash. But you did try. Yeah, y'all did
try to make it low where you were in Zach's universe.
I'll give them, I'll give him that.

Speaker 1 (01:37:25):
It was.

Speaker 2 (01:37:26):
It was some only so much you can do when
the entire uh, I don't know what you call it,
the entire hierarchy of Warner Brothers is breathing down your
neck and not allowing you to make a good movie.
It's hard to make a good movie, period. But at
that point you're just fucked.

Speaker 1 (01:37:46):
Yeah. I love that Conan phrase about the UH. Takes
a lot of incredibly wonderfully amazingly talented people to come
together and work really hard to make a terrible movie.
Mm hmmm, Because it takes that just to get that
bunch time. Yeah, that's less a good one.

Speaker 2 (01:38:02):
Yep. Already, So let's talk a little bit about Batman's
DCU timeline.

Speaker 1 (01:38:08):
All right, it's gonna get weird maybe, well a little bit.
All right.

Speaker 2 (01:38:14):
So there were some fan discussions that were sparked by
events in Creature Commandos involving the chronology of doctor Phosphorus's
villainous career and his encounter with Batman, and someone said, like, look,

(01:38:37):
Phosphorus may have been operating for a really long time
after his transformation and his murder of Rupert Thorn, which
would mean Batman arrived on the scene way later, and
that would mean that, you know, Batman could never meet
Rupert Thorn, et cetera, et cetera. Gun says, yes, you
are right, it would be silly to assume doctor Phosphorus

(01:38:59):
Matt Batman he became Phosphorus. And he's also says I
wouldn't because in the reum in the show, doctor Phosphors says,
I haven't been touched in fifteen years. So God says,
God says, I would not even trust Phosphorus's sense of
time or his proclivity for hyperbole. So it's a little

(01:39:20):
unreliable narrator. We don't know when he became doctor Phosphorus
for real? Was it fifteen years?

Speaker 1 (01:39:27):
I mean?

Speaker 2 (01:39:27):
Okay?

Speaker 1 (01:39:28):
Also, if we're if we're going full unreliable narrator, was
it Batman? Are we sure of that? I can't remember
how that went down? Was that outside confirmation?

Speaker 2 (01:39:34):
I mean it was a Batman did like it was
the one who captured him.

Speaker 1 (01:39:38):
I think, Okay, I just wonder if that we saw
him in somewhere, if it was just him saying, yeah,
thatman got me.

Speaker 2 (01:39:44):
Well yeah, well no, we saw it like Phosphorus was
like in charge of like Rupert Thorn's activity, all of
his bullshit. After he killed Thorn, he took over his operation,
and then we got like the skylight with Batman looking
down and coming in. Yeah it was it was Batman.

Speaker 1 (01:39:59):
I mean, I just want to find out later it
was you know, some rookie cop or Tim Drake's audition tape.

Speaker 2 (01:40:05):
So yeah, people were like, oh, has Batman been acted
for fifteen years already or has he did he come
in way after Phosphorus was already in charge, and God
is basically saying like manah, none of the ship might
be true.

Speaker 1 (01:40:21):
Yeah, some version of this.

Speaker 2 (01:40:23):
Happened, but you know, you can't trust Phosphorus. He's crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:40:30):
So he got a wonder though. He just talked about
how much he regreted Adam Warlock recently.

Speaker 2 (01:40:34):
Mm hmmm hm.

Speaker 1 (01:40:37):
And it makes you wonder, is we watch him go
through these stages where right now he's the most excited
about that thing that he's doing.

Speaker 2 (01:40:43):
Uh huh.

Speaker 1 (01:40:44):
You know, we've we've been covering this so long that
the most excited thing he he'd ever done was right,
this thing he just finished and then creates your commandos. Right,
he gets excited about things as he's doing.

Speaker 2 (01:40:54):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (01:40:55):
But he has been around so long and we've been
doing this song of course. But like we'ven regret things
and say it openly, which is kind of funny, funny
place to be in.

Speaker 2 (01:41:04):
I'm fine with that. You know what happens, dude, as hard.
It's hard to be a creative I mean, for Christ's sake, man,
they just put out like a six page preview that
Mark Wade has written from the perspective of Wally is
not Wally West Barry Allen, who has now become basically
a chronicle order of history. And that's where they're heading
with the comics right now, where he's got all these

(01:41:26):
artifacts from across the different timelines of the multiverse and
the different versions of the timeline that he's living in.
Because he's talking about like all these different agents who
like change time and things get fuzzy. So now that's
what he's doing. Like he's seen enough of the multiverse.
He's seen enough of like all the different versions of
time that he's like just trying to like keep a

(01:41:48):
like a history of the DC universe is a neat idea.

Speaker 1 (01:41:53):
M hmm.

Speaker 2 (01:41:55):
And uh, you know, and that all comes from it's
a neat idea from Mark Wade, but it all comes
from the idea that, like, as these creatives move on
and create new stories in the comics and across TV
and movies and all these things, shit gets changed. Little
things get changed, and you know, you could always write

(01:42:17):
in something like that at a certain point if you're
James Gunn or anybody that says like, yeah, well, at
one point Batman had been around for fifteen years and
he took Doctor Phosphorus in. But then there was a
little shift in reality, and now Batman has been around
for seven years.

Speaker 1 (01:42:35):
Yeah, something like that. He got hit with an aging
stick somewhere. I mean there's some magic sticks that do that.

Speaker 2 (01:42:43):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:42:45):
Also, I mean gun even he expressed some trepidation even
about that shot over the shoulder where he was worried
about like, ah, we make him look like this, I'll
be stuck with that. And yeah, he's been worried about
that the whole time. Not surprising. Yeah, he's I'm not
surprised to see him almost backpedaling be like, well, I
don't know about any of it, really, I guess.

Speaker 2 (01:43:06):
Well, also, Phosphorus, the phosphorus thing is a very specific
issue as Phosphorus is. I mean he is nuts. Oh yeah,
he's been broken mentally. That was clear on the show. Sure,
And that's also like something that like people try to
get mad about with Birds of Prey and the fantabulous
emancipation of one Harley Quinn and they're like, oh, there

(01:43:28):
are no heroic males. Why the fuck would there be.
Harley is an unreliable narrator who just got out of
a terrible fucking relationship with a horribly abusive clown man.

Speaker 1 (01:43:39):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:43:41):
Clearly she's broken in so many ways for so many
different reasons.

Speaker 1 (01:43:47):
Which, in your interpretation, if you want the all dude movie,
then we would have to set it after she has
the same heartbreaking though with the IVY, and she'll do
an all dud movie and then you'll get that and
everyone will be happy, I guess, and we'll have the sequel.

Speaker 2 (01:43:59):
YEA.

Speaker 1 (01:44:00):
The weird thing to be hung up on in general,
this movie about Harley Quinn and the Birds of Prey
plural feminine plural. Oh, and then complain about the lack
of dudes hating things.

Speaker 2 (01:44:12):
Also, every man in there was a bad guy. Yeah,
well that sounds like real life too, isn't it a
little wise? I mean here you are complaining. Oh God,
like no, it's like, oh, this is silly, Yes, fucking
Harley's crazy. Harley is very silly. She has a silly brain.

Speaker 1 (01:44:34):
She does a musical member, you know, out of the
pre cte halfway through or not even pretty probably, but yeah,
like she has a musical number halfway through? What do
you want from her? Man?

Speaker 2 (01:44:43):
She's she's deeply, deeply lost her sense of reality. And
that's that is a Harley Quinn thing.

Speaker 1 (01:44:50):
Yeah, whatever's there is just thereby accident.

Speaker 2 (01:44:53):
Yeah. Hell, that's part of the appeal to me. I'm like, hell, yeah,
we don't have to worry about tone or anything in
this movie. This is all from Harley's perspective.

Speaker 1 (01:45:02):
This is crazy, and she might occasionally drop into a
completely timid demeanor and say some seriously intellectual ship and
you just got to roll with.

Speaker 2 (01:45:11):
That, yeah man, Yeah, so yeah, I'm not terribly worried
about what doctor Phosphorus says, not necessarily except for the
fact that, by the way, it's allan Tutic and are
you were you are you caught up on Resident Alien?

Speaker 1 (01:45:24):
No? Please, I know, please, like, as soon as we're done,
I'm not. I'm not kidding. That's I have the I
have the the devices set up on the rowing machine.
That's what we're doing is watching Resident Alien and rowing
my way to wherever.

Speaker 2 (01:45:42):
It's so good. They haven't they haven't skipped a beat
on quality, dude, like I it's so good.

Speaker 1 (01:45:48):
Yeah, episode pretty great. But yeah, right back to Phosphorus.
But please please feel free to let Phosphorus explain himself
as much as possible.

Speaker 2 (01:45:57):
Two to be doing it, Yes, exactly, but also just
don't take anything he says too seriously.

Speaker 1 (01:46:04):
Yeah, because Tutic did it, Studic.

Speaker 2 (01:46:06):
Did it, and James Gunn wrote it and he's a
nuts scary he's completely been broken. Yeah, all right, So
gun explained that a very famous actor pitched on else
World's film. He says he was talking about how the
script has to be good and they're not going to

(01:46:27):
make it if it's not, and he says the script
still needs to be good. We're not going to make
it unless we like the script. But I think that
there are exceptions. I told it to one person who
came in and pitched something that was an Elseworld's tale.
It was a very, very very famous movie actor. I said,
it depends on how the screenplay comes out. If it's
a masterpiece, i'll make it, but it has to be

(01:46:50):
a masterpiece. And then he laughs and he's and then
he goes and he is like, well, I don't know
if it's a masterpiece. He got all funny. He's still
working on it, though he's still trying to do it,
so we'll see. Masterpiece might be pushing it, but it's
got to be really great. If it's an else World's tale,
then it's worth telling something that might tend to confuse

(01:47:12):
a few people. But also part of our thing is
really being clear about what is else World's and what
is DCU. I love this idea, and I don't know
who it would be, but I love this idea that
some big actors, big huge famous actor came in and
pitched the thing, and gun was like, it's got to
be a masterpiece, and I don't know about that. I
love it, Like he's bumming out these huge stars.

Speaker 1 (01:47:36):
I just imagine Matthew mcconda hate for no good reason.

Speaker 2 (01:47:39):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:47:41):
It could be anybody, grab somebody off the top of
the pile, doesn't matter.

Speaker 2 (01:47:45):
Yeah, I like to imagine it was Tom Cruise.

Speaker 1 (01:47:48):
I mean that, if you say big Star, that's one
of the only few that left it really has the title.

Speaker 2 (01:47:54):
So yeah, I think it was James Cagney.

Speaker 1 (01:47:58):
Right, it was the ghost of Burt Reynolds.

Speaker 2 (01:48:03):
Was Red Butler? Yeah, zombie corpse of Bing Crosby.

Speaker 1 (01:48:08):
Or whatever's left of Brett Butler.

Speaker 2 (01:48:10):
All right, So they asked him, does the inclusion of
certain villains in Reeves's Batman epic Crime Saga preclude them
from also appearing in the DCU. Gun says no, But
both the Crime Saga and the DCU are a part
of dc Studios, So we of course take everything into
account that he did say there's no die Hard rule,

(01:48:33):
of course, so we might see something somebody will be
pulled back on that and be like, see he said
that they're not going to do no. No, he didn't,
no Diehard role, no Diehard rule. Yeah, So this is
one of the things that got people mad that he
said in the Rolling Stone profile, he said that Batman
was his biggest issue of all in DC right now,

(01:48:56):
and Batman is being prioritized along with Wonder Woman. They
did reveal that we've we've talked about that last News
episode that he is writing or they're all they're working
on a Wonder Woman's script right now, and James says,
I am not writing Batman, but I am working with
the writer of Batman and trying to get it right.

(01:49:17):
And he did clarify I think in a in the
Rolling Stone interview that they are still they are still
calling it at the moment brave in the bold.

Speaker 1 (01:49:26):
They'll drop it eventually, Oh they will, They definitely will.
That's too long, Yeah, that'll just be called Batman.

Speaker 2 (01:49:31):
Yeah, we've seen that trend over and over and he
cuts shit so or brave. Yeah, he says, I'm working
with the writer of Batman trying to get it right
because he's incredibly important to DC, as is wonder Woman.
So outside of the stuff that I'm doing in the
projects that are actively going, our two priorities are finishing

(01:49:53):
our Wonder Woman in Batman scripts. And he went on
to say that there's an issue of differentiating the DCU
Batman from Reeves Batman, who is in year two of
being avengeful Vigilante by the time of the Batman. He
says the biggest difference is that Brave of the Bolt
is based on Batman and Son by Grant Morrison, and

(01:50:15):
that story focused on a more established Batman who has
already mentored multiple Robins, of course, and has a son,
Damian Wayne. And he says, Batman has to have a
reason for existing, right, so Batman can't just be oh,
we're making a Batman movie because Batman's the biggest character
in all of Warner Brothers, which he is, but because

(01:50:35):
there's a need for him in the DCU, and a
need that he's not exactly the same as Matt's Batman.
But yet he's not a campy Batman. I'm not interested
in that. I'm not interested in a funny, campy Batman, really,
so we're dealing with that. I think I have a
way in by the way, I think I really know
what it's about. I just am dealing with the writer

(01:50:56):
to make sure that we can make it a reality.
And then he goes on to say, let me see,
I separated those two things for some reason.

Speaker 1 (01:51:11):
Dealing with the writers sounds so ominous.

Speaker 2 (01:51:14):
It does sound ominous, doesn't it. I did feel that way.
Boo boo boom. Anyway, he just said he I don't
know where I put that, sorry, fell He yeah, I know.
He has a whole thing where he says that, you know,
every Batman story has been told essentially, yeah, and people
are like, no, what hasn't been You could do this,
you could do that. And I'm like, he's talking about

(01:51:36):
all across comics. Like he's not talking about.

Speaker 1 (01:51:39):
The two movies we've seen, right.

Speaker 2 (01:51:42):
He's not talking about like, you know, whatever it is
for you know, let's say ten ten Batman movies essentially.
H I'm probably forgetting something in there. But he's not
just talking about those. He's talking about like across all
the animation, all the comic books, all all the Batman
stories have been told, and Gun wants to tell a

(01:52:04):
Batman story that we've never seen before. He doesn't want
to do a Batman movie where you're just gonna be like, well, those,
you know, the the comic book version of Under the
Red Hood was better because blah blah, No, you don't
want that. You don't want that, just like you know,
he's hugely inspired by All Star Superman, but he's not
telling All Star Superman that is not the story.

Speaker 1 (01:52:24):
You know, just just in pure mass, like just take
all of the all of the on screen movie Batman's
you've ever seen story wise, because Batman shows up in
so many titles across DC and just just a comic form,
like he'll he'll do more stories than that in one
year in print than you've seen in all of the
entirety of Batman in a movie. Yeah, I don't know,

(01:52:48):
by March or April, probably not even a contest. M Yeah,
just the stories are out there, and Gun's read them
like he's not He's yeah, I'm not saying I'm not
trying to over sell his She's read things like, yeah,
he's actually read a lot of these comics.

Speaker 2 (01:53:02):
Yep. And you know, by the way, because I guess
there's a certain amount of hubris now because of this
new Superman movie and what it seems to be going toward,
I'm seeing a lot of the you know, I'm seeing
a lot of the ugliness from the other side popping

(01:53:24):
back up of just like really hateful anti Snyder stuff
about how he didn't understand the character, and he was
a shitty very like y'all all need to chill a
fuck out.

Speaker 1 (01:53:33):
Ye never rid for that now, there's.

Speaker 2 (01:53:35):
No reason for it. Like it's the same shit that
we got and we liked BVS back of the day.
I'm like, can we can we like, like Snyder sat
there and read all the same shit, yeah, that everybody
else has read. There's plenty of room in the DC
cannon for a slightly darker Superman and he was only
slightly darker, like y'all overstate that shit way too much.

(01:53:58):
Oh yeah, And you know, I was on Instagram and
I asked, you know, I asked a question. I was like,
I have a question for the Snyder fans. You know, if,
because we knew that Zach was not coming back, if
they had done like that when they announced Cavil and
he said he was looking forward to doing this enormously
joyful version of Superman. If they had come in and

(01:54:19):
they had abandoned every storyline that Zack Snyder was doing
and went on their way, would you have said he
betrayed Zach And look, mostly there was a couple of
people who were like, yeah, that's what they would have said.
And I think some of them would have for sure,
but like mostly almost entirely, and I got a lot

(01:54:39):
of replies. Everybody was civil. Yeah, yeah, everyone had a
nuanced take, like, well, if they had done this and this,
I feel like that would have been up a trail.
But eh, well no, I wouldn't have been a trail.
I would have just been happy to see Cavil continue
or well, well they could have fit that in and
then Zach could have come back and said, well the
timeline shifted or what you know.

Speaker 1 (01:54:58):
Like people were where they were happy with both compromises,
what they got with it.

Speaker 2 (01:55:03):
Yeah, these were like Snyder bros. But they were not
like being a dick to me. I'm clearly, like you know,
I'm got like all the different versions in my background.
I've got like a big BBS Justice League display behind me,
of course, but I've also got like you know, Clooney
in the in the cubicle next to it on the shelter,

(01:55:24):
like but like no one was being like you, like
fucking diaperman, you piece of shit, you know, like nobody
was doing that. Like these were reasonable people, right, So
like I just I just I really want to get
away from like hating either side and just be like, hey, guys,
like just because you're you're happy you're getting your gun Superman,
which I'm happy about. But you know, you don't have

(01:55:46):
to be a dick to the people who like the
Snyder They're not all shit. They're not all people who
were evil. They just liked a different version than you.

Speaker 1 (01:55:54):
Yeah, all right, Yeah, I don't think I'm gonna be
any less exhausted by the people who just hated the
he didn't get it and are excited at people now
because I was the guy who did it, who's doing
it now gets it in a way that I get it.

Speaker 2 (01:56:09):
Yeah, But also like for a lot of the Snyder
fans that I'm seeing who are like, well, I keep
seeing the comment like, well they did it to us,
but a lot of the people, well yeah, there's that.
But then also like a lot of the people that
you're doing that, you're being a dick to on Live
for being excited about Superman. They weren't alive. I mean, yeah,
they weren't. They weren't around for Man of Steel. I

(01:56:31):
don't know what the fuck that is. They don't care.
They're just excited about this Superman movie. Like some of
these are like you know, teenagers and shit who were like,
I don't know whatever. I just thought Superman looked cool.

Speaker 1 (01:56:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:56:43):
Yeah, Like now I'm getting yelled at.

Speaker 1 (01:56:47):
I heard about the Cavil dude or whatever. He looks
like he's answer or whatever. But like this, this is
the one that I've seen because I'm fourteen.

Speaker 2 (01:56:55):
Right, I just think everybody's chill out just like the thing,
or don't I'll be I mean, you know, like I've got,
you know, my own ideas of what I want to see.
I've got my own favorite versions. I've read so many
comics and everything and seen somebody animated shows and movies.
None of them hit the mark completely for me. Yeah,

(01:57:16):
there's always something that I would do differently.

Speaker 1 (01:57:18):
Yeah, and the stuff we've loved the very most, we
could still probably go off in about an hour of
any any given one of them. Of just an hour's
worth of Man, I just wish if we had done
this maybe instead, they would have been this whole area
we could explore and on its best day. That doesn't
mean that we'd rather have that instead, It's just that
that's another area that we could also see exploring.

Speaker 2 (01:57:39):
Yeah, well, I mean, I dude, Batman animated series is
my holy grail. And I'll still slip. I'll put on
an episode and go, ohh, I change that line. Yeah,
Batman didn't need to respond to that. That was a
cheesy line. Yeah, I mean, god, hats off to Kevin
for trying to deliver that, but that was a bad line.

Speaker 1 (01:58:00):
Yeah. You think there's a couple of Beatles songs I
wouldn't let hit the hit the hit the floor. Yeah,
only a couple problem, only a couple, but they're out there.

Speaker 2 (01:58:14):
I meant to tell you about this, you know, I
probably shouldn't tell you on the show, but I'm gonna.
Uh there's a there's a store, like a record store
in California called a Meba and they do this fun
web series on YouTube called What's in My Bag? And
uh Mark Everett, you know e from Eels, was talking
about What's in his Bag and one of his was
like this really huge, like collector's edition vinyl edition of

(01:58:38):
I Think Let It Be, But it included a copy
of uh an old like a because they the album
had been produced by somebody else and they didn't like
it and they did it with somebody. Yeah, yeah, they
it has that copy in it. Version. Yeah, it has
the the original version, and he was like super excited

(01:59:00):
about it. He was like, he's like, it just goes
to show you, you know, if you uh, He's like,
it's really really expensive. So if you uh, if you
just you know, learn a craft like music and then
do it for twenty years and get some level of notoriety,
then Amiba will bring you out and you can get
that shit for free.

Speaker 1 (01:59:26):
That's the lesson we really need here.

Speaker 2 (01:59:28):
But I didn't know if you knew that was out
in the world.

Speaker 1 (01:59:31):
I don't think I've known that it was available to
actually get anywhere. I just would like to hear it.

Speaker 2 (01:59:37):
It's only in that box set.

Speaker 1 (01:59:39):
I've heard, I've heard pieces. I don't think i've I
actually sat and listened to his version of the album
front to back, but I really shouldn't want to. It
didn't sound good. It's not a good treatment. Now that
Bastard been better at his job, I would go in
Phil Spector.

Speaker 2 (01:59:51):
So it's still like an iconic piece of Beatles history.
And I meant to tell you about it. I wanted,
And the reason I told you now is because I
know that I'm not going to remember later.

Speaker 1 (02:00:02):
So yeah, you might as well. I appreciate it. Thanks
for shooting that out the door while you had the shot,
you know.

Speaker 2 (02:00:08):
I had to had to.

Speaker 3 (02:00:09):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (02:00:09):
God talked about rumors circulating on TikTok and Twitter that
Teen Titans is casting in the Fall. He says, that's
complete BS. They don't even have a script for it.
They have pieces of a script, but it's not a
complete script. There was also a rumor going around that
they were in the process of casting a new Batman actor.
He says, that is also a complete BS.

Speaker 1 (02:00:33):
I mean eventually, sure, but I like the slow cook
version of events here, I really do, and the separation
truly do. But you will eventually have to get us
a batman and a woman and a wonder woman.

Speaker 2 (02:00:46):
Mm hmmm.

Speaker 1 (02:00:48):
No, I don't wonder what happened, but there is a clock.

Speaker 2 (02:00:50):
Who do you think for a wonder woman?

Speaker 1 (02:00:52):
Who? God, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (02:00:54):
I mean, look aa Dharmis did just did baller Remo
certainly got the pretty down. I haven't seen Ballerina. Uh,
it's in the John Wick universe. I'm sure it's good
and Uh I've been I've seen a lot of people say,
Katie O'Brien, I had to look her up, and I
haven't seen her act, but I mean she's she's built,

(02:01:15):
she's stacked, she's got the you know, she's definitely got
the arms for it. Like Jesus God, I can look up.

Speaker 1 (02:01:22):
Well now I'm looking at both. But that's specifically Vallerina movie.
Mm hm Oh yeah, I've seen her face recently. Yeah,
she was.

Speaker 2 (02:01:30):
She was dating Ben Affleck for a while there.

Speaker 1 (02:01:31):
Yeah, she actually really does have a very wonder woman look. Yeah,
she's not bad guessing at all.

Speaker 2 (02:01:36):
She cute.

Speaker 1 (02:01:39):
Uh, she kind of finds me a little bit of
Marina Marina backroom.

Speaker 2 (02:01:45):
Oh you know she played uh she played uh what's
her face? Uh, Marilyn Marilyn Monroe, Marilyn Manson, Marilyn Monroe
in that movie that got a lot of flak. Uh.
I don't know. I think I think she she'd be
she did all right. I think she'd be fine. I
don't know. Yeah, but that Katie O'Brien, dude, she looks
like wonder woman with short hair.

Speaker 1 (02:02:06):
Let me grab her. Uh, let me check out them
guns came.

Speaker 2 (02:02:09):
Yeah, dude, she's she's like JK. Simmons with tits. We
are farmers.

Speaker 1 (02:02:21):
I am looking at pictures of what cannot possibly be
the right kid here. It was a smallish, possibly possibly
British lady. I'm not sure. Oh, I've seen her somewhere.
I know her face, dude.

Speaker 2 (02:02:41):
They gave her the long hair shields, stuck her in
a wonder Woman outfit. I think she can do it.

Speaker 1 (02:02:46):
Oh, that's why level eyes bleeding. That's where I've seen
her face everywhere recently.

Speaker 2 (02:02:50):
M m.

Speaker 1 (02:02:52):
Yeah, she could definitely do it.

Speaker 2 (02:02:53):
Mm hmmmm. So Gun says, because he was talking about
they have to have a great script before they go,
he says, we just killed a project. Everybody wanted to
make the movie. It was greenlit, it was ready to go.
The screenplay was not ready, and I just couldn't do
a movie where the screenplay is not good.

Speaker 1 (02:03:15):
Well, what the hell was it?

Speaker 2 (02:03:17):
I know? Right, God, damn it, man, I think it
was the authority. You think, So that's my guess. That's
my guess.

Speaker 1 (02:03:25):
I mean, can't be braving the bold.

Speaker 2 (02:03:28):
It can't. It's not braving the bold. He has said
that he is that is still an active Yeah, that's
still happening.

Speaker 1 (02:03:34):
Sump thing.

Speaker 2 (02:03:36):
It might be swamp thing. It might be swamp thing.
I'm guessing the authority. He said it was a movie,
so we know it's not Booster Gold. And then he
says Paradise Lost is still moving along. It is slow moving.
That was a TV series, by the way, he says,
it's slow moving, but it's moving and yeah, I really
love that project a lot. And then he was asked
if the show would directly connect to his plans for

(02:03:58):
Wonder Woman the DCU, and he was guarded, and then
he said yes, well yes, and no, Wonder Woman is
a separate thing. We're working on Wonder Woman. Wonder Woman's
being written right now, so it's different. I mean, it's
not different. They're connected. She's from fucking Thimbiscira, So I

(02:04:18):
don't envy him trying to figure out how to keep
all this shits.

Speaker 1 (02:04:21):
Yeah, it's a hard world to map out, probably on
the fly mm hmm, with a lot of questions being
asked in an even time.

Speaker 2 (02:04:31):
But Entertainment weekly, he did say that, like, we're in
a pretty good place with Sergeant Rock. We're still moving forward,
but it's not gonna be what would Peter want me
to say here? It's still moving forward, but yeah, right now,
it wasn't exactly where we wanted it to be creatively,
so it needs to change a little bit. So as

(02:04:51):
far back as Entertainment Weekly, they were still working on
Sergeant Rock and it hasn't been officially greenlit. So I
don't think that's what he's talking about when he said
they just killed her project. I'm assuming it has to
be the authority, dude. Maybe, I mean, but there's stuff.
There's stuff that he hasn't even brought up. He hasn't
told us about too, so he did, you know, I.

Speaker 1 (02:05:10):
Mean, well teen Titans and static chuck at some point.

Speaker 2 (02:05:16):
Yeah, I don't know. I mean, but it's weird that
he said it was green lit because he's previously said
that it won't get green lit unless there's a script.
So that makes me think that that was like an
early thing that he green lit early on and then went, oh,
maybe we shouldn't do that. Let's not green lighted unless
it has a good script. That's what makes me think

(02:05:38):
is the authority, especially like maybe that's from pre it
has to have a good a good script to be
green lit right away.

Speaker 1 (02:05:48):
Possibly and until end of your theory, like some of
the authority bleeding into other stuff might mean it's cannabalized
its way out of being required.

Speaker 2 (02:05:57):
Yeah, it might.

Speaker 1 (02:05:59):
Now the amount of people that's going to piss off
that already had their heart sets on our heart set
on a number of characters, if that's the case, or
it's gonna sick. But hopefully they do the weed thing.

Speaker 2 (02:06:10):
Mm hmm.

Speaker 1 (02:06:13):
Also, he just he said he pulled the green light.
But did he say acts entirely or just stopped it?

Speaker 2 (02:06:19):
He said, killed it.

Speaker 1 (02:06:21):
Okay, that does sound weird, so kill it. Everything's ready
to go. Didn't like the words on the page, so
I killed the entire thing.

Speaker 2 (02:06:28):
Often you do rewrite, or maybe he just ungreen lit it. Yeah,
maybe that's what he means.

Speaker 1 (02:06:34):
I feel like that one. The word makes more sense
to me.

Speaker 2 (02:06:37):
Yeah, of course it might. I mean, we don't know.
It might be a thing where they said we never
could get the script right. It was green lit, we
never could get it where we wanted it. And now
other projects that are way further along have completely null
and voided. It's been made redundant, as they say. So
there's no reason to have that because we've got this

(02:06:58):
character from this and this overhere, and we've got this
character from this over here, and maybe we'll try this
again sometime down the line. Who knows. I don't know.
That's just my guess.

Speaker 1 (02:07:09):
Yeah, I'm with you a lot authority, it's everything.

Speaker 2 (02:07:13):
Oh yeah, a lot of flak for this one. Uh.
Gun was basically giving his idea of what killed the
MCU or caused it a tremendous amount of trouble, and
Gun says, I don't even know if it's really their fault.

(02:07:33):
He says, uh, that alone would have.

Speaker 1 (02:07:37):
Would have gotten name in trouble.

Speaker 2 (02:07:39):
Well yeah, and then he says, uh, well, you know
a lot of people get mad or just reading headlines.

Speaker 1 (02:07:43):
Well sure, but that pull quote alone, they would have
been like, no, they need to admit what they did.

Speaker 2 (02:07:47):
Yeah, but he says, I don't even know if it
was really their fault. And he said, you know, Marvel's
parent company, Disney ordered the studio to ramp up production
to fill its streaming library. And he says that wasn't fair,
it wasn't right. It killed them. Uh. He says, we
have to treat Yeah. He says, we have to treat
every project as if we're lucky. We don't have the

(02:08:10):
mandate to have a certain amount of movies and TV
shows every year, So we're going to put out everything
that we think is of the highest quality. We're obviously
going to do some things, some good things and some
not so good things, but hopefully, on average, everything will
be as high quality as possible. Nothing goes before there's
a screenplay that I'm personally happy with. And uh, that's
actually he says.

Speaker 1 (02:08:30):
He's they've seen the failure of that at least, otherwise
HBO would one hundred percent try that themselves.

Speaker 2 (02:08:36):
Yeah, and he said that the number one reason the
film industry is struggling right now is because people are
making movies without a finished screenplay.

Speaker 1 (02:08:44):
He's got the money people sold on this as his strategy,
So yeah, dude, as long as it works, it's a
fine diagnosis if you don't have the keys, but he does.

Speaker 2 (02:08:54):
But also, Warner Brothers has been doing this shit since
they have been announcing slates and canceling movies and having
you know, fucking selling movies to theaters that don't exist,
I never did exist. They've been doing that forever.

Speaker 1 (02:09:12):
I mean, that's a fair amount of how the industry works,
just on the daily as a normal course of events,
Like you just hype a thing until enough people are
hyped and enough people are attached, and this guy's kind
of calming and blah blah blah, and then it becomes
a thing, and then that's what a green light means,
and somebody actually shows up on a day and film something.

Speaker 2 (02:09:28):
And then they were so desperate to do it in
the wake of Marvel that they just kept announcing shit
and canceling shit. Like I am digging hopefully that all
all of the investors, all everybody who's on the board,
whoever it needs to be at Warner Brothers has seen
that go down and be like, Okay, yeah, we need
to change.

Speaker 1 (02:09:46):
Well, I can't stress this enough. It is incredibly fortunate
for Gunn. How bad Max is doing mm hmm, like
the streaming app Like it's not like he there's no
I don't think there's a future there except as they
have to have that appendage like everybody else does. But like,
I don't think they have any better idea of where
they're gonna get any money out of it. It's no

(02:10:09):
fucking clue really, So like if they had all the
pressure of a budding new network and all that crap
that that you know, got all the Disney bullshit, going
on to again where they were Marvel. Yeah, that maybe
fucked too, m hm.

Speaker 2 (02:10:22):
And now I don't I don't know if you noticed this.

Speaker 1 (02:10:24):
Max sucking its finally a win.

Speaker 2 (02:10:25):
I don't know if you noticed this, and I don't
know if we'd ever talked about it, but there was
a major difference between what was going on with the
Marvel Disney Plus shows and what happened with Peacemakers specifically,
but also Harley Quinn uh and swamp Thing for real Uh,
swamp Thing and Teen Titans and all that shit. Like

(02:10:48):
Max and Warner Brothers were putting their stuff out on
physical media after a while, like they were they put
a first season of Peacemaker out on Blu ray m
and all these other shows that are we're on Max
Disney didn't put out Blu rays for their shows. All right, No,
we're not gonna do. You know, you're not gonna go
and get Falcon in the Winter Soldier on Blu ray.

Speaker 1 (02:11:10):
I do remember that now that you mentioned it.

Speaker 2 (02:11:12):
Like, no, you're not gonna get you know, Hawkeye or
whatever you're whatever, that Loki and all that shit. You're
not gonna get it. You have to have Disney Plus
to be able to watch it.

Speaker 1 (02:11:21):
It was something in that session later where there was
did they ever come around on that. I don't know,
there is not that you're just begging for it, but.

Speaker 2 (02:11:33):
No, I'm well, I would love it, but I'm not
completely keyed in on uh everything with Marvel per Se,
but I you know, I would like to catch up.
But I am somewhat involved in the in like the
the bootleg Blu ray community, just because there are things
that like, there are TV shows that were never released

(02:11:56):
TV shows and movies that were never released on physical media.
And uh, I'm and I'm talking about like borderline lost
media here, not like copyright infringing. I'm talking about like
this stuff just never happened, right, and we're gonna lose
it if we don't find it somewhere. But uh, a
lot of those guys, yeah, a lot of those A
lot of those bootleg guys were making really high quality

(02:12:20):
Blu rays out of out of the Disney Plus shows
because they just weren't going to release them. I don't
know if I steal the case, but I think that
is like that was specifically a bad call in my mind.
You know, if someone doesn't want to pay for Disney Plus.
But even like the collectors are gonna want it, you know, like,
why would you take that away just because you're scared

(02:12:43):
you're not gonna get your money out of a streaming service?
Like the streaming service thing is a fad unless you
figure out how to make it work.

Speaker 1 (02:12:50):
Yes, and no, I just think it's a functional appendage now,
like it's just the thing you're using to distribute, so
you don't have to monetize it some way or the other.
It seemed like the physical distribution. I'm surprised at the
very least. There's not like you put out a vinyl
of a record. I mean one because if you're kind
of one of the people that likes to listen to it,

(02:13:11):
you're gonna be cool. I want to listen to the
vinyl thing because it's all the all the vinyl reasons.

Speaker 2 (02:13:15):
But mm hmmm.

Speaker 1 (02:13:16):
I mean, for the most part, it's just a neat
thing to physically have regarding a thing that you like.
You don't always sit down and do the physical act
of listening to the vinyl of a thing. You kind
of have it and you listen to it sometimes, but
it's not the primary.

Speaker 2 (02:13:31):
Right, Like if I buy physical media. I put it
on my shelf, and I enjoy looking at it, but
then I'm if I'm gonna watch the stream I look
at it, yeah, like I'm not. I will check every
version of that, like I can I pay two dollars
to rent it? No, okay, well, put on the Blu ray,
damn it. I just really didn't want to have to
get up put that thing in a thing. But yeah,

(02:13:52):
but I still want it. I still like have that
desire to own it, because you don't ever know what's
gonna happen on streaming anyway.

Speaker 1 (02:13:58):
I mean, with enough to disposable income and your particular
DVD library at my disposal, I could see myself sitting
in a living room and thinking, for a dollar ninety nine,
I'm gonna rent this. I don't feel like going up.
I don't feel like trying to fish it out of
where this is on the DVD rack right now.

Speaker 2 (02:14:15):
Yeah, but there's you know, an interesting party role.

Speaker 1 (02:14:18):
I'd have to go actually plug up a DVD player
to my computer to even play one. Right now, there's
another thing in my entire house to play one with.

Speaker 2 (02:14:27):
If I were Gunn and I were Warner Brothers at
this point, I would put and they are kind of
doing it. I'm noticing. I would put every show I could,
every movie on the cheapest DVD, not even a Blu
Ray DVD, and sell that shit at Walmart. And that's
what they're doing. If you go to Walmart right now,
they are DVD sets of the complete series of Titans.

(02:14:49):
I saw Doom Patrol in there one day, like complete
series set on DVD, Like make that shit b you know,
basement ben cheap to get as more as much people,
as many people as possible to be interested in watching
that shit and catching up on anything. Like they're still
making money off of it. But nobody's going to HBO

(02:15:09):
Mexico and like, oh I got to watch this old
show that doesn't exist anymore.

Speaker 1 (02:15:13):
I mean they're not, but they're not even you know,
I hadn't thought about how much how difficult it is
to even get like you've got all those DVDs, but yeah,
like you could bring over a stack up into my
house and like I haven't pulled that DVD thing out
out of my drawer in two years. Fuck if it
didn't work with he sitting, they're just stick in hand.

Speaker 2 (02:15:29):
Like but when I go to Walmart like there's always
like older people looking at the DVDs. They don't want
Blu Ray that that shit's too expensive. They want DVDs
like Walmart specifically does DVDs mostly because they know they're demographic.
Thew Walmart is CBS. Dude, it's a bunch of old
people who didn't get past the DVD player. I mean
they were just like, that's what I'm doing.

Speaker 1 (02:15:50):
Fuck it, legitimately, Is this not a thing that's out
there in some capacity? Can you not buy like flash
strives of movies? I don't know. That seems like a
natural level of just if you want a physical copy
of something, it's it's gonna look like it's gonna look
stupid as shit. There's no getting around the fact that
that looks stupid. But so does the CD ryle when
it comes down to it, like those those are just silly,

(02:16:11):
little shiny pieces of shit. Now in the back of
them all looks the same. I don't care who you are,
what what movies on the back of it looks the same.
USB drive whatever it actually goes into my computer. If
you wrote over a stack of USB's with different logos
on them, we could watch those mm hmm it would
just be a weird thing to brag about or make
a shelf of.

Speaker 2 (02:16:31):
Yeah, I still think, well, I think the USBs are
still more expensive than just a stack of CDs, Like
you can mass manufactured DVDs way way easier.

Speaker 1 (02:16:46):
Probably from mass, I assume, definitely from mass.

Speaker 2 (02:16:49):
But because just to get like a blank Yeah, but
that's a USB that's big enough to put a whole
movie on. It's too expensive.

Speaker 1 (02:16:56):
Yeah, it's like a teary byte. And there's all these
all those rewrite functions that are so useful if you
had your old like old school lockdown one right, you know,
no RW function whatsoever. I don't know. Maybe cheaper, I
don't know. And it doesn't have to have extra memory,
only the memory it needs, and only just the functions
it needs. Just do this one thing, play when it
says play play, no rerecapacity whatsoever.

Speaker 2 (02:17:16):
I don't know. I don't know. Plus, you know, I've tried,
you know, sticking a movie that I had on a
on a USB and shoving that my TV. It's kind
of a pain of the ass to figure out how
to make that work.

Speaker 1 (02:17:30):
I know, I don't understand why that drive is there?
What is it doing.

Speaker 2 (02:17:33):
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (02:17:33):
I feel like it's just like it's somehow it's just
for professionals that have come over with the powerpront presentation
and know how to work that. Maybe no one has
ever done that.

Speaker 2 (02:17:42):
Yeah, And I'm sitting there going like, okay, so what
I have to like download kind of download VLC on
on my TV? Like, is there like an app that
will just play a fodcast? Oh, I don't understand.

Speaker 1 (02:17:52):
I mean, mine in theory has a thing where I
could play stuff from my computer downstairs. But do you
know how hard that is to actually get to work?
It's it's yeah, it's as bad as it's like Microsoft
two thousand NTE kind of hold log me in before
that kind of bullshit compute. It's not need more zemas.

Speaker 2 (02:18:10):
Now, No, this is a pain in the ass. So
I think, for various reasons, DVDs are still going to
be the standard. For a minute. DVDs and Blu rays
four KUHD is where the people who care, who really care,
are going to go about about the best quality they
can get.

Speaker 1 (02:18:27):
To be funny, if it goes back to beta and
just everything ends up being everything physical goes back to
a size that's roughly just a pizza. Yeah, we're just
back to vinyls and beta. I don't know why it
leveled out to this size, but here's what we ended
up as a society.

Speaker 2 (02:18:41):
Yeah. And I don't know, like because everyone was like, ah,
the physical media is obsolete, until like, I don't know,
like a month later they realized, oh wait, streaming services
are hemorrhaging money and selling off all of their stuff
to other streaming services. Well where do I get this?
I don't know. It's well, now I can't find it
anywhere because no one because the parent company decided that

(02:19:03):
it wasn't getting enough views, so they took it off
their service because it was taking up too much bandwidth.
No one else cared enough about it to license it
from them. So now you have a big chunk of
lost media. Yeah, you have a completely a big chunk
of lost media. And unless something like a reboot or
something happens to you know, get people interested in that
nine seasons of Night Court, you're not gonna find it anywhere.

Speaker 1 (02:19:25):
Yeah. Like that is the scariest part is we have
traded convenience that they and I've gone fully that way.
My all of mine is convenience. But if all of
those libraries where I have things or have just things
stored or just refer to them where I know they
are when they go, not if they're gone, I don't
have references back to that.

Speaker 2 (02:19:45):
Yeah, I'll have to love physical media, dude, But I
love physical media. I want my fucking house to be
the house of Alexandria, dude, like Congress of Yeah, just like,
let's do it, let's get it fiction.

Speaker 1 (02:19:58):
I mean, I I affiliate, but I don't want to
take that on in my life practically.

Speaker 2 (02:20:03):
So no, that can fun for me. So yeah, like that,
unless I'm moving, it's fine.

Speaker 1 (02:20:08):
Oh god, yeah, moving with that kind of stuff is
such a pain.

Speaker 2 (02:20:12):
Mm hmm it is.

Speaker 1 (02:20:15):
And I have this. I had this thing like one
percent of whatever you own when you move vanishes into
the vortex of another multiverse somehow. It's just you cannot
move from one place to another without stuff vanishing. And
when you have big, complex collections like that, I worry
every time about like, well, which one of you went missing?

(02:20:35):
And I'll never know, or like I will find out
in twelve years and then wonder did I ever even
own it?

Speaker 2 (02:20:40):
Shit?

Speaker 1 (02:20:41):
I forgot now, you know, yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:20:43):
No, I mean I've got a flash shirt that I
had when I lived with Matt. Yeah, and I don't
know what happened to that flash shirt. I've never seen it.
I moved out of his house and I never saw it.

Speaker 1 (02:20:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:20:55):
I searched his entire house, never saw it, never figured
out where it went. I was like, I don't know,
but you know what, I left one of my favorite hats,
and it's probably a hat that it shouldn't be a
favorite of. Like it was a I had a leather
cowboy hat, but it was like an Australian cowboy hat,
which is different.

Speaker 1 (02:21:16):
It's one of those things where like it's different and
you want it to make it better, but it probably
makes it worse.

Speaker 2 (02:21:21):
Uh No, I think it makes it better, because nothing's
worse than a big fucking cowboy hat from like Texas.

Speaker 1 (02:21:26):
You know, I don't disagree with the central premise here.

Speaker 2 (02:21:29):
I had some stupid, hokey shit, but like, man, I
loved like I had this, Like it was like a leather,
big leather like hat. It was. It looks great, It
looked great in the rain. I bet like it was
fucking phenomenal. Like my friend Chris gave it to me.
He had a brown one, he had a black one.
He gave me the black one, and yeah, and uh man,

(02:21:53):
I took that ship on a cruise and I don't
know what happened, but it just disappeared. I never it
never came back with me on flat cruise. I have
pictures of me, like sitting on a porch smoking, looking
angry with this ding.

Speaker 1 (02:22:05):
I have seen pictures of a young then angry.

Speaker 2 (02:22:11):
Well not fin. I was pretty. I was quite fat
at the time, but.

Speaker 1 (02:22:14):
Uh was that?

Speaker 2 (02:22:15):
Yeah? I miss having but yeah I can't. I couldn't
even go on a cruise without losing something.

Speaker 1 (02:22:23):
Was that the cruise you were extremely drunk for?

Speaker 2 (02:22:25):
Yes, well it's the only cruise I've ever read.

Speaker 1 (02:22:30):
Okay, yeah, okay, So there we're one for one on
memory issues and cruise. So god knows what happened to
that hat.

Speaker 2 (02:22:39):
Yeah, that cruise had a That cruise had a barbed dick.
It was like a cat. It barbed me for life
on cruises. I never want to go back on another.

Speaker 1 (02:22:48):
I have no intention myself unless they make flat cruises.

Speaker 2 (02:22:51):
Yeah. I got one more story, if you'd like to
hear it.

Speaker 1 (02:22:56):
What page are we on?

Speaker 2 (02:22:58):
Well, you are on page sixteen. Okay, we are done.
We've got just this. So he's got guns in his office,
He's got like a The Superman Versus the Amazing spider
Man comic book in his office, and they had to
ask him about it Marvel DC crossover. Gun says, We've

(02:23:22):
talked about it a billion times. That could easily happen,
But simultaneous to that, I think it would be interesting.
I also think people are a little over it. I
think people want to see good stories with their superheroes,
and that's what matters, and they want to see different
types of stories with their superheroes. And people love superheroes,
that's obvious. But they need more variety and they need

(02:23:44):
just more quality storytelling. And just having spider Man and
Superman team up isn't gonna do it if it's shit.
So it's got to come from a real place, and
it's really hard to make that work. I did Superman
because I love the character. I was excited about writing
that movie. If I were to write a Superman versus
spider Man movie, it is a concept, I'm going to

(02:24:05):
be like, oh, yeah, this could be a this could
be a great film. Or am I doing it because
oh yeah, people want to see Superman and spider Man
team up. For me, it would have to be if
we ever did it, it would have to be under
someone who thought it was going to be awesome and
wasn't just a cash grab because I am just not
into that. And then he's clarified I don't. I don't

(02:24:29):
think it's likely, but I don't think it's an impossibility either,
and in a tweet, Gun noted that constantly seeing crossovers
and mashups is less enchanting to me than a strong story.
I agree wholeheartedly.

Speaker 1 (02:24:43):
I mean, no notes, but I want DC versus Men
at all.

Speaker 2 (02:24:48):
I want Amalgam in the slightest due that nineties kid
me was to see it.

Speaker 1 (02:24:54):
I want to see that circles back. So like where
we started this episode about the I don't want to conversation.

Speaker 2 (02:25:01):
And well, in a way it does, but the like
DC versus Marvel and that that series was not like
the most interesting part to me, and like, what was
more interesting to me is where it gets us, which
is Amalgam, and the Amalgam universe was really cool where
you have like a combination of Wolverine and Batman Dark Claw,

(02:25:22):
you know, you have saber Tooth with the Joker's fucking head.
You have you know, like god, these just strange. The
Amazing Spider Boy, you know, a mixture of Connell and
Peter Parker. Like that shit was cool. I loved the Amazonian.
It was fucking a combination of Wonder Woman in Storm.
That shit was dope. And that's what I would want
to see. That's why I would want to see the

(02:25:44):
crossover stuff happen at all.

Speaker 1 (02:25:46):
I can see it, just to get you to like
a new set of characters that you're excited about. Yeah,
just to smash them all the logos that we already
know on screen together. I done with ye done within
of them, Yeah, very much. Just a cash grow feeling
kind of thing. It wouldn't feel inherently, it wouldn't do
meny good and you couldn't come back from it.

Speaker 2 (02:26:07):
You could, they did in the comics.

Speaker 1 (02:26:09):
Yeah, in the comics you can, if you got the
whole universe process and all that. I mean, like in
a live universe. I don't think it's gonna I don't
think you can undo that.

Speaker 2 (02:26:19):
Yeah, I think you could. But if they did a crossover,
it would just have to be a really strong story.
Like I agree, I don't think the like the the
DC versus Marvel as far as the way they presented
it back in whatever it was ninety five or whatever
it was ninety four, that was you know, a portal

(02:26:39):
opened up and they all fought and we got to
vote on it. That's yeah, that's it's going to need
to be better than that.

Speaker 1 (02:26:46):
I look for readership engagement that is a stroke of
brilliance that is beautiful that I mean, no notes again,
but it won't work here. It's a different medium entirely.

Speaker 2 (02:26:58):
Right right right, And like the the thing that I
cared about because I was like reading DC Versus Marvel
with Matt in the back in the back pew of
our church, and I was just going like, this isn't.
This isn't a good fight, Like this isn't doesn't take
into account several things, and I don't you know, it's
not interesting from a characters standpoint because of this, and

(02:27:19):
you know, and you know Matt's like, well whatever.

Speaker 1 (02:27:24):
That's another part of it. It'd be hard to do,
Like the behind the scenes stuff, Wo'd be hard to do.
How do you who gets to do that? Everyone's gonna
want to throw stuff at it. It's gonna end up
being yeah, too much and too little at the same time,
but you're gonna have scenes like that. Really, like how
did these four seconds of lameness make it into And
everyone's gonna lose their shit over four seconds because it's
not that yeah Beethoven's.

Speaker 2 (02:27:45):
Night, right, But like the place that it brought us
to with amalgam was just so so cool. Is such
a an interesting idea to sort of just like merge
the universes and create these new characters out of whole
cloth almost where it was just like it's like, you
know what, We're gonna make a whole line. We're gonna

(02:28:06):
devote our entire both of our entire publication lines into
creating basically like you know, I don't know bootlegs, you
know how Like you go to like Mexico or something
and you're like, I don't know the Justice Avengers. You
see these toys, yeah, and it's like some weird like

(02:28:26):
it's like a Superman cape and a Batman head, but
damn it, those are Spider Man's arms, you know, Like
you get these like weird characters in bootleg for him.

Speaker 1 (02:28:36):
I said this before the first time I ever saw
the PJA Masks characters was on a T shirt for
my daughter. I'd never seen the show, so it took
me a minute to figure out those weren't just rip offs.
I kept trying to figure who they ripping off because
they look close to stuff but not close enough.

Speaker 2 (02:28:49):
Yeah, and you're just like, it's like a vers some
version of Batman and some version of Spider Man. But
he's there with Beetlejuice and Egon from the Ghostbusters and
I don't understand any of them.

Speaker 1 (02:28:59):
But he's colored green.

Speaker 2 (02:29:01):
Yeah he has a bat But that was I just
really love the Amalgam stuff and I would love to
see it someday on the big screen, because I mean,
everybody's got to get their own shit right first, because
we're just now getting back to building up DC again,
starting to do that, and God help them, the MCU
is just now pulling themselves out of a ditch and

(02:29:23):
maybe gonna get some X Men going, and that's exciting
and honestly, fucking like Doomsday and Secret War has got
me jazzed and making me want to like catch up
because I want to see who Jackman run around the MCU.

Speaker 1 (02:29:37):
I I agree, I'm carrious about some things too, and MCU.
On the one hand, I've I've never been this worried.
On the other hand, I think things are fine. It's
a weird time over there too. But to your point, yeah,
everyone get their own ship together first. I don't want
to see any of it until although how fun would
it be to do a universe where like you did

(02:29:57):
a crossover story where it's the old see you cross
over with the new DCU and just do a story
where there's like a big emotional handoff that's a fourth
wall break.

Speaker 2 (02:30:06):
Hmm. I want to see all you're.

Speaker 1 (02:30:08):
Going to do that, you know, if it's a big
story about stories, that would be a little bit different
for me.

Speaker 2 (02:30:13):
Yeah, I want to get what Gun.

Speaker 1 (02:30:16):
Said, it's just a good script he'd like to do.

Speaker 2 (02:30:18):
Yeah, yeah, I want to I want to see good
I want to see good stories. That's what I want
to see more than anything. I mean a little bit. Yeah,
everybody wants mister Toad's wild Rides. Sure, I you know,
I I want to see that fucker on the motor
on the seventies motorbike pretend to be Captain America from this,
you know, from the old movies. You know, sure, I

(02:30:38):
want to see that. I want to see the guy
you know from the Trolley of the Incredible Hulk playing Daredevil,
you know, running around with with the cyclops from the
X Men movies and yeah, whoever, I don't know, I
mean Ben afflecks Daredevil, Like, let's do that, let's.

Speaker 1 (02:30:55):
Get in back boiled down. What what was really said
to that famous guy and his office the tom Cruise
or whatever it was? Well, if the script's good, dough
will make it. Yeah, and you know yours isn't yet,
but it could be.

Speaker 2 (02:31:09):
Yeah. Yeah, so yeah, I mean, I know, I know. Look,
I'm easy to please though as well. Like a lot
of people give Marvel shit. No, it sucked, it sucks.
It sucked. I'm like better than Black Adam anything I see.
They're like, oh man, that one was bad. You can
skip that one. And I'm like, uh, people said that

(02:31:30):
shit about it. Turnalist fucking Eturtles is terrible. E Turtles
is terrible. You know that, right, you can't watch that.
Don't watch that one.

Speaker 1 (02:31:37):
And I was like it and I love it was
actually not bad at all, but.

Speaker 2 (02:31:41):
I fucking loved the Turtles. Dude. That ship was so good.

Speaker 1 (02:31:44):
I would have probably taken some out as all, but.

Speaker 2 (02:31:46):
It was long, I'll give you that.

Speaker 1 (02:31:48):
Even then it was yeah, okay, but at a time
it would have been fair to be like, I mean,
black Adam, what do you think I'm gonna get mad
at it? But like now I've seen Madam web and
that was you, Yes, and it was as bad as
you were told, saying it is everything you were told
about a poor a poorly made film like you. I

(02:32:08):
watch so there's like this whole little vein of movies
they're making right now, like Craven is the one that
just hit or I just noticed you the other day
was streaming available, and I'm like, yeah, I gotta watch
it now, like all those like uh Mobius morbous morbus right, it's.

Speaker 2 (02:32:23):
Got a right morbous.

Speaker 1 (02:32:25):
I watched that one. What that was? That was pleasantly
surprising kind of thought, Well, I mean it's still not great,
but it is no way even close to what you
were told. Yeah, but Madam Webb, I I kind of
thought i'd have a similar experience. I got in and
I was like, oh, this is actually hard to watch.

(02:32:47):
I see their point. I'm having trouble finish.

Speaker 2 (02:32:51):
That was the thing, is you know, like everybody was like, oh, man,
Like as soon as the first trailer came out from
Adam Webb, you know, everybody was like, oh, this is
dog shit, and I was like, I don't know, the
trailer looked intriguing to me. I though, thought it looked
all right, and then yeah, I don't think I never
saw it though.

Speaker 1 (02:33:05):
All right was the right word. And then and then
and then I saw the stuff and then and there.
Reviews were just so bad after a while, you just
have to try it. And then I did and it
and it is that bad. But I was surprised most
of them aren't really that. It's not really like you're
like you're hearing most of the.

Speaker 2 (02:33:24):
Time, yeah, I don't really trust anybody anymore because I'll
watch something and be like, no, there was something to this,
now hold on, you know, And then otherwise other times
I'm just like, hey, you know.

Speaker 1 (02:33:35):
Oh yeah, yeah, and like you can have a lot
of Adam, was that the worst thing? Yeah, it still
wasn't the worst, And like you do not even have
a lot of overlap. But there are plenty of times
I've I've brought you something and you, oh, yeah, it's
a fucking awful what the fuck is wrong with you?
I could be completely into it, absolutely sold, and you're

(02:33:57):
just like, are you actually ill right now? Whatever? Dude?
What I just I just never showed me that one again?

Speaker 2 (02:34:02):
Okay?

Speaker 1 (02:34:03):
Cool, Like it'll happen.

Speaker 2 (02:34:06):
Like I will see stuff and go like, oh, Jason's
gonna hate this, Like I'm pretty good at knowing what
you'll hate, you know, Or I'll show you like a
clip of something to be like, hey, look at this,
I think this is really funny. You probably won't that.

Speaker 1 (02:34:19):
You know what I see now. I worry that you've
You've you've gotten confirmation bias about things I hate, and
I wonder, like, well, maybe you're wrong a couple of times,
or I changed or something. Maybe it might be a
couple of wonderful things that I've I've deprived myself of
by being a curmudge maybe.

Speaker 2 (02:34:36):
But also like I'm pretty like honestly, like I will
probably just tell you to watch it anyway. Like if
I really like something.

Speaker 1 (02:34:44):
It usually just gets because we spend enough time talking
that we're like, yeah, I mean okay, but.

Speaker 2 (02:34:49):
I'm pretty good at being like, I don't know, I'm
pretty cocky, Like I think I have a pretty good
amount of uh confidence at times most of the time
that I can like convince you something was a good thing,
even though from all manner of outset it looks like

(02:35:09):
something even especially to you, that you would not like.

Speaker 1 (02:35:13):
Well, but you're gonna know the ins and outs enough
to be like, no, no, no, I know an end here
that's not going to be obvious. But but hear me
out right right. But then there's like, so last night
we were joking about I since you some screenshot about
some ship which I was I'd been joking about how like, hey,
look at this live TV matter, Like every time I
go to to Max, I guess it's still Max. It

(02:35:33):
advertised to me that it's going to be h HBO
Max soon. What the fuck just changed?

Speaker 2 (02:35:37):
The sight?

Speaker 1 (02:35:37):
O cares. But there's this scroll line that I have
to avoid every time about live TV. Well, I'm kind
of looking forward to the separation now, and maybe that'll
mean that the live TV bullshit we'll get off my
streaming app that I don't want to get to. And
I sent you this thing though, and ended up having
this thing about like Duster or whatever. We ended up
having this conversation about Duster and this other, this other, like.

Speaker 2 (02:36:00):
I'd never heard of it.

Speaker 1 (02:36:01):
I had not heard of Duster until we engaged in
the entire thing pretty much out loud and like as
we're going like next thing, you know, we're like, we're
actually going to watch this. It was a surprising turn
of events. I had low expectations of the thumbnail i'd
been shown.

Speaker 2 (02:36:16):
Yeah, like I had heard of Duster that I was
going to.

Speaker 1 (02:36:18):
Send it your way and be like, hey check this out.
But hey, here we are.

Speaker 2 (02:36:21):
Yeah, like, here's the thing about Duster, the show I
had never heard. To my knowledge of Duster, I had
watched the trailer though, and I had seen a clip
of it that made me go, oh, I want to
watch this. Did not know what Duster was. It was
like I never like acknowledged the name in any way,
shape or form, and did not. I just knew, hey,

(02:36:43):
that's that show with the foxy girl who looks like
she's in a seventies black exploitation film and sawyer from Lost.
That's what I knew it as. And the like I
had seen the trailer and thought that looks great, and
then like my real in that made me go like
I swear it was like a few days, like two

(02:37:05):
days before you brought this up to me. My end
was like I had seen a clip of it where
her FBI sidekick or whatever pulls out a Superman wallet
and she gives him shit, Well really, what are you five?
And he's just like, no, fuck you. You know we're
drawing the line at giving shit to the man of Steel.
He is the epitome of righteousness. He you know, when

(02:37:26):
I have an ethical quandary, I say what would Superman do?
And she's like, okay, respect. And that was my end.
And I was like when you brought that up, I
was like, oh, that's that show. Well, I got to
show you this part.

Speaker 1 (02:37:39):
That's fine. I was bringing up live like I've kind
of seen this and this looks weird. Yeah, but one
thousand percent would have would have expected that be like
a show that I would have seen. You would have
seen like the thumbnail of never gotten past it. I
would have never done anything.

Speaker 2 (02:37:55):
And you know, it happened, right, and it was funny
because you were That happened, and it's so weird that
we've been friends for so long and there are still
things that we find out about each other that kind
of go like wait what and like we had had
this conversation where like, I don't know, it came out
that I really like seventies black spilitation movies because I'm

(02:38:19):
just like all about like yeah, hell yeah, fuck the man,
Like I want to say, I want to see a
movie where like, you know, Pam Greer is running around
like killing Whitey like us, I grew up on that shit.
And like I was, I lived in Montgomery and WCV
would play like you know, Coffee or you know Cleopatrick

(02:38:43):
Jones or you know Foxy Brown or you know, all
these different shows and then like Saturday afternoon would be
like Kung Fu Theater and like me and my dad
would just like watch all this shit. They didn't have
like a proper like we had antenna TV. We didn't
have like cable in my house, so like we would
have like you know, we had like three channels and
two of them came in and one of them was PBS,

(02:39:06):
and then we had like WCV, which was sometimes Fox,
but back when we when I was a kid, Fox
didn't really have a lot of programming, so like a
lot of times they would just be playing old movies
that they could get the rights to, and uh, it
would just be like stuff like that. Sometimes it'd be
like a death wish or something like that, but a
lot of times it was just like fucking dolomite or

(02:39:27):
some shit, and I'm just sitting there like, hell, yeah,
you know, John Shaft, that just feels like home to
me in a lot of ways. I love that shit.
And I guess we'd never talked about it.

Speaker 1 (02:39:41):
Nothing ever came up. It was just not in mud.
I think I ran across some occasionally, like five ten
minutes are in there, but just never hit never have
a screen. Yeah, yeah, rare fine for me. I'd problem
like from what I've seen, I'd probably stopped and watch
a few minutes for sure when I was a kid,
But I don't think it ever came up much.

Speaker 2 (02:40:00):
I mean, you had stuff that was like real, real, real,
real tongue in cheek, like Blackula, But then you also
had stuff that was just like, oh, okay, shit, well
they're you know, they killed the master and now they're
you know, on their way and cutting a white swath
across the country. Okay, like that that was like. And

(02:40:21):
there was a trilogy and I won't say the name
of it here. They did change the name of the
first movie to to uh, oh god, what was it
the Legend of Black Charlie. That is not the original
name of that movie. Black is the N word, y'all.
And there was like three of them. But like, and
I like the I like the character arc of these
movies because they start off like killing the the the horrible,

(02:40:46):
you know, slave owner, and then they're being hunted by
bounty hunters. But by the third movie, they are the
fucking bounty hunters. They're the law, like and I think
the tagline for the Fat the last movie was like, uh,
bringing black Law to the white Man's Country or some shit.
I don't know, Like I just I love that kind
of shit, Like hell yeah, it's good. It's well like

(02:41:09):
Django so much like that was like, oh god, that
would have.

Speaker 1 (02:41:13):
Just been like a huge production version of your sweet
Spot in certain ways.

Speaker 2 (02:41:18):
Yeah, but I like seventies. I like that seventies look
to me, that looks like film like cool hand Luke. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:41:25):
I definitely there where you can just barely see the
fuzz and yet it's more clear somehow.

Speaker 2 (02:41:30):
I can see the grain. I can see like the oversaturation,
like the really like when they were really starting to
fuck around with like uh extreme close ups when they
would do those like fast zoom in's too, like of teeth,
you know, a whip, a whip going around a dude's
arm and he's dropping his gun and shit like I

(02:41:50):
love those old spaghetti Western type stuff. I love Sergio Leone.

Speaker 1 (02:41:53):
Wow, Wow, the shots of teeth for a second there.
I don't know that wasn't just a weird time in
the seventies where like the version maybe it was a
there was a moment in film I think where like
the version of going really in like that was like
you'd get a really deep I don't know, you just
zoom it on the mouth to show the emotion like

(02:42:13):
that was where the emotion was. I don't understand. That
looked weird, and all it ever did was point out
that early demo work on film was not a priority.

Speaker 2 (02:42:21):
Look, I think I think a lot of what you're
talking about because a lot of that came to the
Western cinema from Sergio Leoni. Okay, and Sergio Leoni literally
took that shit Fromkirosoca, like he he ripped off a
ton of like he ripped off a ton of like
eastern uh cinema techniques. So like when you watch like

(02:42:46):
The Cold, the Bat and the Ugly, you're basically watching
someone well kind of like.

Speaker 1 (02:42:51):
Reinterpret we'll call it reinterpret.

Speaker 2 (02:42:54):
Well, I mean he literally lost a lawsuit about fistful
of dollars.

Speaker 1 (02:42:57):
Uh oh yeah, case, I was pretty infamously not happy
with any of.

Speaker 2 (02:43:01):
This, right but uh, you know, the the extreme close
ups on the eyes, on the mouth, like different, that's
all like, that's all Japanese shiittch so like. And I
think it's funny because like all of that stuff that
I really like. Uh, it's funny because I feel like
that's part of what you hate about animating.

Speaker 1 (02:43:19):
As there's a trend there. But here we find ourselves again.

Speaker 2 (02:43:21):
Yeah we've gone we have Burbigley.

Speaker 1 (02:43:26):
Yeah and yeah. So anyway, I see how my might
dislike is sincere here, I did not realize this is
a trend, that it was in any.

Speaker 2 (02:43:38):
Way tying to it. Mm hmmm, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:43:40):
I really do kind of it is. It is not
an ignorant talk I'm making. It's almost an open call
rather that I would like to like this thing that
there's millions of. I just don't understand how if someone
can't explain it to me I'll hear you out.

Speaker 2 (02:43:54):
I think it, and I'll say this, and we can
wrap it up because we're we're past the three hour
marketing predicted market Yeah, Jesus Christ. But like I was
showing my wife, Yeah, last night in bed, I randomly,
uh just started you know, doing the the little like

(02:44:17):
song from Citizen Kane. There is a man, a certain man,
a certain man, you know.

Speaker 1 (02:44:24):
Uh, I forget that's where that's from. I just hear
it occasionally referenced and completely yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:44:29):
Oh yeah. They did a reference to it to mister
Burns on The Simpsons, like it's it's there's a white
stripe song. That's where goes an ode to Charles Foster
Kane and I love Citizen Kane, dude, Like it is
one of my favorite fucking movies. It might be the
but still be it might still be the best movie
ever made if you like, sit down and you really
look at the cinematography, like and it's not just Sergio Leoni.

(02:44:51):
A lot of this ship comes from what fucking Orson
Wells did because they, like Orson basically created uh modern cinema.
Like before it was just like people like shooting stuff.
It was just like hey, yeah, we're gonna shoot some stuff.
And then like Orson Wills came in and said, yeah,
but now I'm going to do it well and show
y'all how to do it in a lot of ways.

(02:45:13):
Not in every way, but in a lot of ways.

Speaker 1 (02:45:15):
I mean even and even general audience knows like some
of the like I'm like, we need the shot to
feel bigger, so we're going to cut out the floor
and stuff like that. Like he he treated, yes, yes,
he did to film. Then what you know, the Beatles
and on them got so much lauded for later where
they treated the studio as an instrument, like he was like, no, no,
the camera will do things the shore and make the story.

(02:45:38):
He kind of made it an art.

Speaker 2 (02:45:39):
I think, yeah, he absolutely did. And I think a
lot of what he did is what you know, Kirosawa,
what Sergio Leoni did, where you would take these shots
of teeth or eyes or whatever, or you'd take these
certain setups and you go, what is it trying to
convey here? Is it just trying to convey a certain feeling?
Is it trying to like the eyes of the windows
to the soul. You know, you can see what a
what a mouth is doing Uh. There's shots in Citizen

(02:46:02):
Kane where you'll see an action that's going on. You'll
have like the action going on, and then you'll cut
to something like just like a smiling black guy who's
like almost statuesque, while something else is going in the background,
Like what are we trying to say about this? Like
is this a is this a false face? Is this
you know?

Speaker 1 (02:46:20):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (02:46:21):
A commentary on servingtude? Uh? And you know part of
that scene that I was just talking about with that
face is the fact that you know, they're celebrating Charles
Foster Kane, but what he's done is he's just bought
out this rival company, this rival newspaper, I believe. And
while they're all celebrating and he's dancing, you know, you

(02:46:41):
have you have these the two other guys I can't
remember the names now because I'm forced to. And the
one guy is going like, well, do you really think
that this is gonna this is a good idea? I
mean all of these people had different politics than us. Oh,
well he's in charge now, it's fine. Uh, he'll just
change them. He'll just change their mind till convince them.
And he's like, well what if he what if they

(02:47:02):
convince him without him knowing it. Like you can run
around and colonize everybody and you can fucking you know,
buy out everybody because you have the money, but you
can't change their hearts. Yeah, you know you can. You
can force people to be your slave and maybe they'll smile,
But what's in their eyes, there's their mouth is doing

(02:47:22):
something different than their eyes are doing. There's so much
like really cool, fucking uh stuff to consider with with
when cinematography is really good. And that's also what I
what I think of when I see stuff like Sergio
Leone or you know, uh, anime. In some ways, I
don't know, there's a lot to consider, and maybe it's

(02:47:43):
not you know, everyone's taste, it's clearly not, but I
think there's something of value there.

Speaker 1 (02:47:48):
Definitely that would be a fun we never have of
aw thing. I'm surprised we never did sit down and
watch Citizen Kane. That sounds like something we should have done.

Speaker 2 (02:47:56):
Oh God, is so good, dude.

Speaker 1 (02:47:57):
I haven't watched it since I was probably twelve with it.

Speaker 2 (02:48:00):
Yeah, it's it's worth it. Like like I just I
haven't watched in a few years, but just like watching it,
just that scene with Beth and he i'd forgotten. Like
I literally just thought like, oh, yeah, it's that fun
song bit where they're all all the women are dancing
and he's they're like swinging him around and shit and singing,
and like I showed her that clip. But like they
cut so much depth into it, like in between him

(02:48:23):
dancing with with women and whatnot and the celebrating employees,
there's there actually is so much like really good shit
in there, Like like god, they just stuffed it with depth.
There's so much commentary.

Speaker 1 (02:48:39):
I know I've said and he did, like I know
I've said this before on the show that I basically
just watched it because I was like, I'm supposed to
watch that. But my only real memory of it a
vague memory of the plot and some shots, but like
I definitely remember more from the movie about articles I've
read about it since, but I just as a like

(02:49:00):
a thirteen fourteen year old over it was. I I
do kind of remember thinking like, yeah, I'm I know
I'm supposed to watch this, and uh and I'm bored,
so so let's just do this. So like you got
under the rental store or whatever, you grabbed it, you
popped it in and all I remember thinking when I
finished it was like like I went in thinking like,
you know, I'm just I'm just a dumb kid, don't
know nothing, but let me let me pop this in

(02:49:22):
and see. And then watched it and thought, well, I'm
still just a dumb kid, don't know nothing, and I
don't really understand what I just saw here. But I
think that's as good as I was told. And then
I put it back on the shelf. And that's as
much as I've understood about it over the years.

Speaker 2 (02:49:39):
Yeah. Yeah. My wife watched it and she said she
watched it in college and she was like, that's black
and white is boring.

Speaker 1 (02:49:44):
I didn't. I I think I understood that. I don't know.
I guess that's the best way. But I think I
think it was as good as I understood as it could.
I didn't. I couldn't get my head around why I
thought it was maybe even as good as I was
being told. I didn't have the yeah then or now clearly.

Speaker 2 (02:50:01):
But I you know, look, I think when I saw it,
I was maybe thirteen or fifteen something like that, maybe
I don't know, and it was on some you know,
Turner or something. I don't know, and I just recorded
it off of cable something like that, and I was
I had been told, you know. And it was also
a thing that like fuck's sake, you know, tiny Tunes

(02:50:23):
did a parody of it, like I knew of it,
and I was like, Okay, well I need to see this,
and I think my brain broke, Like I feel like
I knew I didn't understand it all.

Speaker 1 (02:50:35):
Oh, that's what this is all supposed to be.

Speaker 2 (02:50:38):
Yeah, Like I was like, this is what every movie
should aspire to be on some level, Like this is
the complexity of message. Like they're not necessarily hammering home
any specific political message because they're going back and forth.
They go back back and forth quite a bit. But
the only real like, the only real message is at

(02:51:01):
the end of the day, no matter what we accomplished
and how much people love us, we all just want
to go back to being that care free kid who
doesn't give a fuck about money, you know, Like I.

Speaker 1 (02:51:11):
Mean, I like I have the big Like A States
of Take was supposed to be just my career journalism
and all that was, you know, buying a newspaper dis
my opinions equals bad. Yeah, but then that was supposed
to be The takeaway was yeah, this this big old
Hearst character, even him, was supposed to be just yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:51:29):
Yeah, but he was you know, he starts out doing
it for the right reasons and then but did he
because it was was he really just all about like
was he was really good being altruistic? Yeah? Was he
trying to be altruistic because he really just wanted to
be loved? Was that the issue?

Speaker 1 (02:51:45):
Like at what point did he get caught up in
his own story and it was the whole thing?

Speaker 2 (02:51:49):
Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah, Yeah, it's great. And it doesn't
necessarily like hold hold your hand. It doesn't give you
the hope speech. It's just fucking like, I don't know,
you make up your mind. I don't know, but this
is a.

Speaker 1 (02:52:01):
Really was and I think there's to you. It seems
like it it hit this spot where yeah, I think
there there is a little bit to that. Like you
saw it and went, Okay, all these all these movies
I've seen all this time, I see now what they
were trying to amul, like this is ground zero.

Speaker 2 (02:52:16):
Yeah yeah, because I was noticing film filming techniques and
stuff too, Like I was like, oh god, oh god.
The makeup, Oh god, like because they did like spanning makeing, like,
oh my god, dude, like fucking the way they were
like they just like it's like link Lader's boyhood. And
I know I keep bringing that shit, but I did
for Superman the movie as well, but like this.

Speaker 1 (02:52:38):
Time, you know, high watermark example of a lot of things.

Speaker 2 (02:52:40):
Yeah, like they didn't take twelve years to make the thing,
but like I love seeing like the character's age like,
and they did it so well that like, I'm watching
this movie in fucking HD. The last time I watched
it it was in you know, I don't know, ten
eighty and it was crisp. You know. I'm still like

(02:53:02):
I had to remind myself in the portions where these
people are old men that they were in makeup. Like
there were times where I would be like, oh god,
I wonder how they got him looking so young in
the other scenes, wait, no, they were wearing makeup to
look old. Like. The makeup was so good in some
of these scenes that I had just completely forgotten that

(02:53:24):
they were young men. And it's jarring for me to see.
It's still jarring for me to see pictures and video
of Orson Wells as an old man in real life,
because that is not what he looked like as an
old man in Citizen Kane. If that makes any sense. Yeah,
Like I see the aged version. I'm like, and I

(02:53:46):
do in my mind there is an idea, right, well
what he did to himself is drunk ass.

Speaker 1 (02:53:53):
Well the further ways in Charms of the Crew.

Speaker 2 (02:53:57):
Yeah, yeah, but you know, look at the there is
like a deltation of my mind. There is like a
there's like a thing where I'm like, well, that's Charles
Foster King. That's anyway, Yeah, the French.

Speaker 1 (02:54:18):
You gotta keep them separated, you know, I understand.

Speaker 2 (02:54:22):
Yeah. Anyway, I think we should probably stop talking. And
I love you, and it's ten thirty at night now,
and we started a long long time ago, and anyway,
I'm gonna send this over. Please send it back. And
you guys out there remember that we are planning on
doing a commentary track for Superman three. Still. If you're

(02:54:47):
still down for that, Jason, then we'll throw up on Patreon,
uh and uh then we'll also just do a review
of the movie, uh for the news feed or for
the news feed for the main feed, but Patreon dot com,
slash DC on screen. Please come check us out, be

(02:55:08):
friends with us. You can't join for free. You won't
get the commentary, but you don't get that unless you
do either pay for it individually for three dollars or
five dollars a month, and you'll get all the exclusive
and have access to all that shit, including mister Miracle,
including mister Miracle, which I will link in the in

(02:55:29):
the show notes.

Speaker 1 (02:55:30):
Which we there's an hour and three minutes and fifty
seconds of I think us just fawning over how much
we fucking love that.

Speaker 2 (02:55:41):
Yeah, there's nothing.

Speaker 1 (02:55:42):
I don't I do not recall if we had a
single thing to say it was negative about it.

Speaker 2 (02:55:48):
I don't either.

Speaker 1 (02:55:48):
I don't think so we might have been like it
was a bit heavy on my thighs. It rested for
too long.

Speaker 2 (02:55:54):
I couldn't.

Speaker 1 (02:55:56):
It was sore. I couldn't put the book down. No, no, no, no.

Speaker 2 (02:56:02):
Barta has blue eyes in this part of the book,
so that means it was real.

Speaker 1 (02:56:08):
We had to complain about the shipping to find something
to complain about on that one. It's bad.

Speaker 2 (02:56:16):
I don't even know what you're talking about.

Speaker 1 (02:56:18):
Just a doubt we even had that.

Speaker 2 (02:56:20):
Yeah, I don't. I don't know. I don't remember a complaint.
I remember like us sitting around trying to figure out
like that. If there's a negative aspect of that review,
I'm pretty sure it's that we might not be smart
enough to completely decipher what they were going there.

Speaker 1 (02:56:33):
Yeah, there might be that. Even there's a couple of
things like yeah, I'm sure it's in there somewhere and
probably above our heads, but it looks great.

Speaker 2 (02:56:43):
All right. Thank you guys so much for listening, and uh,
you know, come join us on Instagram at DC on Screen.
We're on threads, We're on Facebook, we're on YouTube, We're
all over the place. But DC on screen dot com
is our official site, and uh, we're also on Tumblr.
We do that too. We're all over I swear to God.

(02:57:04):
But yeah, thanks thanks for listening and seeing a few
days with Superman three. Until then, keep some DC on
your screen.

Speaker 1 (02:57:11):
I forgot that part now bye,

All Episodes

After 'Superman': James Gunn's Been Talking... | News 06-23-25

Episode Transcript

Popular Podcasts

Stuff You Should Know

New Heights with Jason & Travis Kelce

24/7 News: The Latest

.css-15opob5{left:0;position:absolute;top:0.8rem;} All Episodes

.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}After 'Superman': James Gunn's Been Talking... | News 06-23-25