February 5, 2025 • 56 mins
Ever wondered if a TV psychic was the real deal or just a marketing genius? Join us as we take a hilarious yet insightful journey through the life of Miss Cleo, the unforgettable TV psychic whose commercials became late-night legends. From her start as Uri Del Harris in Los Angeles to becoming the voice of the Psychic Readers Network, we unravel the enigma of Miss Cleo. Was she truly clairvoyant, or did she master the art of 'fake-it-till-you-make-it'? Get ready for a rollercoaster ride through her colorful past, complete with humorous anecdotes and the fascinating backstory many never knew.
Step into the realm where personal storytelling mingles with deception and reality blurs with performance. We draw curious connections between public personas like Miss Cleo and Anna Nicole Smith, exploring their motivations to create elaborate yet sometimes fictitious narratives. With lighthearted humor, we navigate the Seattle theater roots of Miss Cleo's journey, exposing how a character created for a play morphed into a cultural icon. Listen as we compare Miss Cleo's memorable role to the likes of Progressive's Flo and other iconic commercial figures, while pondering the comforting allure these personas provide amidst their ethical pitfalls.
Relive the nostalgia of the 90s as we uncover the psychic industry's quirky charm and its darker underbelly. From the parody sketches that kept us laughing to the legal scandals that left us questioning, Miss Cleo's legacy is one of both laughter and controversy. Discover the truth behind the infamous Psychic Readers Network and the shady practices that left countless callers with skyrocketing phone bills. Despite the scandal, Miss Cleo remained a fascinating figure in pop culture, reflecting broader themes of identity and deception. Tune in for a ride filled with humor, insight, and a nod to the infamous world of TV psychics.
From murderers to money launderers, thieves to thugs – police officers from the...
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Death in Entertainment is hosted by Kyle Ploof, Alejandro Dowling and Ben Kissel.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Gather round, dear listeners, as we peer into the
cosmic crystal ball wherefortunes are told, fates are
sealed and late-nightinfomercials rule the land.
She had the voice of aCaribbean auntie who always knew
your business.
Before you did A deck of tarotcards and a hotline that somehow
(00:24):
always put you on hold.
Please hold the line.
That's right.
We're talking about thelegendary Miss Cleo, from her
mysterious accent to her evenmore mysterious legal troubles.
We're diving deep into the wild, wacky and kind of shady world
of TV psychics.
Was she a true mystic, amarketing genius, or just the
greatestfake-it-till-you-make-it story
(00:45):
of the 90s?
Buckle up, because your futureholds one heck of a story.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
The charge for this call is $4.99 a minute.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
So light some incense , shuffle your tarot deck and,
for the love of Miss Cleo, don'tforget to ask your spirit
guides before giving out yourcredit card number.
That's today on Death inEntertainment.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
Call me now live from Los Angeles 911.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
What is your emergency?
Here in Hollywood now twocounts of murder injury and
death oh my god, shocking newdetails that has stunned the
entertainment world.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
This makes me a little nervous.
The hair stood up on my arms,just like in the movies.
What do you call this thinganyway?
Death.
Speaker 7 (01:36):
In entertainment.
Speaker 5 (01:38):
All right.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
What's up everybody?
Greetings Ditto Universe.
How are you?
Speaker 5 (01:43):
What up how?
Speaker 1 (01:43):
you doing everybody?
Greetings Ditto Universe.
How are you?
What up, how you?
Speaker 5 (01:47):
doing.
Hi Hope your Pro Ball Sundayweek was good Absolutely
fantastic.
Speaker 7 (01:49):
Nobody's thinking about the Pro Ball.
Speaker 5 (01:51):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Not even the players.
Speaker 5 (01:53):
Definitely not.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
What's up everybody.
My name's Kyle Plouffe.
I'm Alejandro Dowling.
Speaker 5 (01:58):
And I am Ben Kissel.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Yes, ben Kissel is here to stay.
Everybody we are.
Speaker 5 (02:03):
Absolutely.
Thanks all so much for enjoyingthe first few episodes of OK
Bud and I'm excited to be partof the Death and Entertainment
team.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yes, which, if you're watching this and not a part of
the Patreon, it's patreoncomslash diebud.
You get to see every showperformed live before it goes
out on audio only to all theother podcast platforms.
Speaker 5 (02:21):
It's very, very fun and we'll be adding more content
to the Patreon.
Again, it's patreoncom slashdiebud.
As the weeks go on, perhapssome political blabbing coming
from my big old lips, because,god knows, it's a crazy time to
be alive, yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
If anybody hasn't seen us before I know the people
watching us have but if you'relistening to us for the first
time, we have to warn you.
We are a true crime comedypodcast, so there will be laughs
, in spite of talking about verydark subjects.
Speaker 5 (02:46):
Okay, we have to laugh in the darkness.
Speaker 7 (02:49):
Yes, we do.
I see a lot of laughs in ourfuture with this episode.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Yeah, yes, today we're talking about Miss Cleo,
and so if you don't want to hearus laugh about her, then call
another hotline.
All right, and without furtherado, let's get into it.
Okay, so did you guys know thatMiss Cleo was not born Miss
(03:27):
Cleo?
Speaker 5 (03:33):
I would assume, not I would have.
Usually, when the baby is born,they're not like this is a
65-year-old.
Speaker 6 (03:37):
Jamaican woman named Miss Cleo we're going to name
her Samantha.
Speaker 5 (03:39):
No, I'm sorry, it's Miss Cleo.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Yeah, so Miss Cleo was actually born Uri Del Harris
.
Oh, and Cleo was a Leo.
She was born August 12th 1962.
Speaker 5 (03:52):
I could see that she has Leo energy.
She does Definitely.
Speaker 7 (03:56):
Were you really excited to find out that her
sign rhymed with her name, andthat too?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
for me that her sign rhymed with her name, and that
too she was born august 12 1962.
Speaker 5 (04:12):
Not in jamaica, not in the caribbean.
Why not even jamaica?
Speaker 1 (04:13):
queens, not even that .
But in good old los angeles,california, nice, you guys know
her as miss cleo.
She was famous for playing thattelevision personality.
Uh, she was a spokeswoman forthe psychic paper call minute
service called the PsychicReaders Network, in a series of
television commercials thataired from 1997 to 2003.
Speaker 5 (04:33):
Man, those commercials were on every single
night.
I remember it was.
I would watch USA Network withRhonda up all night and it would
constantly show that Jim Carreymovie Once Bitten.
I don't know why.
Oh yeah, jim Carrey movie OnceBitten.
I don't know why.
Oh yeah, jim Carrey vampirefilm that I think he got famous,
and they're like we got therights to this.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
I only saw it between clicks, Like I never watched
the whole thing.
Speaker 5 (04:52):
It was always on Rhonda Up All Night.
It was that.
And Miss Cleo, she wouldadvertise twice in the same
advertising block.
Speaker 7 (04:58):
Yeah, it was ubiquitous.
You couldn't miss it.
You couldn't.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
Yeah, so she was born in Los Angeles County Hospital,
and she was born to ElisaTeresa Hopus.
Speaker 5 (05:10):
She just loves names that rhyme yeah, elisa, teresa
and Cleo the Leo.
Speaker 7 (05:16):
That is a grand name, opus.
Yeah, yeah, it really is Hopus.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
Oh, hopus.
Yeah, Excuse me, oh, I actuallylike Hopus.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Oh.
Speaker 5 (05:22):
Hopus.
Yeah, excuse me, oh, I actuallylike Hopus better.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Hopus Popus.
Speaker 5 (05:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
And David Harris.
Speaker 7 (05:27):
Okay, that's not so grand, I like that, just a
normal name grounding her.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yeah, but Elisa was a Californian and David was from
Texas.
Okay, she attended a verywell-to-do boarding school,
Ramona Convent Secondary School,a Catholic girls' school in
Alhambra, California.
Speaker 5 (05:47):
Hey interesting.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Not too far from here , right down the street.
You know Miss Harris.
She was an interestingcharacter for many reasons, one
of which is the sheer amount offake names that she assumed over
the years.
Like I said, her real name wasUri Harris, but she also used
various aliases, including, butnot limited to, re Paris Uri,
(06:09):
cleomilly Uri, paris Ray DelHarris, cleomilly Paris Uri oh,
my goodness, and CleomillyHarris.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
Why did she choose those names?
Speaker 7 (06:20):
And they're all basically the same name.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
Exactly so if she ran into someone on the street and
they're like Cleo Millie.
Speaker 7 (06:26):
No, it's actually Milo Kelly yeah.
Speaker 5 (06:30):
She sounds like one of those American Girl dolls.
Yeah, remember those things.
They were made of paper, right?
My grandma always wanted me toplay with those, and I'm not the
gay one.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
It's never great when you have enough fake names to
start a baseball team.
That's very true.
Speaker 5 (06:42):
There's something going on.
I mean, I don't know if thebaseball team would be that good
given those names, but yeah,yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
She spoke with a thick Jamaican accent on TV.
Reports suggest she had nodirect Jamaican heritage
whatsoever in her entire familytree.
Speaker 5 (06:59):
Is acting a crime.
I ask you is acting a crime?
Speaker 7 (07:04):
Yes, it is actually well in certain, you'll find out
all right.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Instead she came.
She says she came from a familyof caribbean descent but was
raised in the us.
Speaker 7 (07:15):
But it's not true okay yeah, didn't she also say
she had 10 brothers and sisters?
Yes, and then it changed.
Sometimes she was from was fromJamaica, or her parents were
from Jamaica, or one time, Ithink, she said that she was
adopted by Jamaican parents.
Speaker 5 (07:33):
Yes, oh, okay, so she's got a lot going on.
Speaker 7 (07:35):
Yeah.
Key word, though, is Jamaica.
Yeah right, that's what shewanted.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
Well, that's how you know she's a psychic.
Yeah, that's absolutely true.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
Over the years she's shared varying accounts about
her parents and her upbringing.
In 2006, she had an interviewwith the Advocate and she
described being raised by strictCaribbean Catholic parents in
Los Angeles who were aware ofher sexual orientation.
She was a lesbian.
Okay, and she says that theywere aware of her sexual
orientation from an early age.
(08:06):
Uh, she recounted that herfamily didn't openly discuss her
being a lesbian, referring it.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
She referred to it as the pink elephant in the room
oh, interesting, all right, sothat's unfortunate she wasn't
able to express herself sexuallyopenly.
Yeah, in her family that'sprobably true, to be honest, and
I hope that they were nice toher.
Yeah, good one, Alejandro, Getit.
You do hope that they were niceto her.
(08:31):
It seems as if they wereaccepting, but not open
necessarily.
Speaker 7 (08:38):
Yeah, but what do they want?
She's supposed to bring hergirlfriend home and make out on
the couch.
Speaker 5 (08:43):
Well, no, but normal relationships.
I mean.
Come on, you got to be a littlebit.
Speaker 7 (08:46):
You know toning down a little for your parents.
Speaker 5 (08:48):
Well, I'm not saying have sex on the couch with a
woman in front of your mother,but I am saying maybe you could
have a girlfriend over fordinner, as normal couples would
have their spouse or theirsignificant other over for
dinner.
Speaker 7 (09:00):
Then put on some girl-on-girl porn.
Speaker 5 (09:02):
Well Then put on some girl-on-girl porn.
You're just making it all aperversion for your sexual
fantasies.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
It's not the act.
Okay, it's who they are.
I know, I know.
So, yeah, official records theyconfirm that she's from Los
Angeles, her dad is from Texasand her mother is from
California, and thesediscrepancies have led to
confusion about her true origins.
Friends and associates havenoted that Harris shared
different stories and itcontributed to the enigmatic
(09:30):
nature of her personal life.
Speaker 5 (09:32):
Okay.
Can she tell the truth?
Speaker 1 (09:34):
This is what we definitely know for sure Zero
connections to Jamaica or theCaribbean islands.
She was, in fact, a lesbian.
By some accounts, her parentswere actually super supportive
of it.
Okay, so it wasn't just a wildrumor that she was a lesbian no,
okay she.
She blamed them for not beingokay with it because they were
conservative caribbean folk.
But that's all bullshit, okay,she was actually kind of rich
(09:57):
growing up.
She went to a well-to-doprivate boarding school, um, and
I was gonna say that shemisrepresented these facts.
But let's call it what itreally is.
She just straight up lied aboutpretty much everything.
Speaker 5 (10:07):
Misrepresented Is acting a crime.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
That's, you know, not yet I'm almost you know.
But being weird and giving afake background story to your
friends.
That's what.
Speaker 7 (10:16):
Steve Renn is easy Dad.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
What's a friend other than a future enemy?
You?
Speaker 6 (10:21):
never want to know.
Speaker 5 (10:24):
You can't have everybody know the truth all the
time, because next thing youknow they're plotting against
you.
Everyone's got to havedifferent information.
When they come together at yourfuneral and then they're like
holy shit, that makes thefuneral a fun one.
Speaker 7 (10:37):
There's different versions of this, of course, but
usually it stays as a stagepersona, but it sounds like with
her she was putting it in herpersonal life too.
Right, what?
Speaker 5 (10:48):
have we learned from the Israeli military?
The whole world is a stage.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Right, it's true, the theater of operations is what
they call it, oh.
Speaker 5 (10:57):
I love that theater.
It's one of my favorite playsOperations.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
People's heads get blown up like a fucking grape,
good God, uh.
People's heads get blown uplike a fucking grape, good god,
uh.
So this is also to your point,ben.
This is something people do ona regular basis, like I know
rich people that have grown uprich and they pretend they're
poor because they feel like theyget more clout, hate it.
Uh, it's very annoying, likeanna nicole smith yeah, people
will not let us have that.
(11:20):
What do you mean?
They think that we're lyingabout anna nicole smith not
being like being middle class orbeing well off early in life.
Speaker 7 (11:26):
She would always be like I grew up dirt poor.
Yeah, but she didn't huh, Notat all.
It was a normal upbringing.
Speaker 5 (11:35):
One person's normal upbringing is another person's
poverty, though.
We're from Wisconsin, so we'llbe like we're doing pretty good,
pulling in about 70, 75k a year, but they say in Los Angeles
that would be below the povertyline.
Yeah, you make a good point,but I think Anna Nicole Smith
grew up in Texas or somethingshe did.
Yeah, Point muted.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Yeah, she also told friends in adulthood that she
had a very traumatic childhoodthat included potential abuse
from quote, a regular visitor tothe house, which is assumed to
be an uncle, though details areunclear due to the difficulty of
verifying her stories, as sheoften embellished details about
her life.
There's no concrete informationabout these allegations.
Speaker 5 (12:15):
Well, I will say, as someone who has worked with a
lot of people that have gonethrough that and in many ways
dealt with it myself you make upshit as a way to escape, so it
might that very well could betrue.
And then she's like, well, I'mnot, miss clee, I'm not whatever
her real name is yuri I'm notyuri, I'm millie, you know, and
(12:35):
so maybe that's a form ofdisassociation on her part good
point plus could be dealing withher sexuality.
Speaker 7 (12:42):
that is, another, yeah, perhaps another,
personality to her that sheseparated in some ways.
Right, I think she has themaking of a great psychic, oh
yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
She also told people like Alejandro mentioned earlier
that her biological mothercould not take care of her, so
she gave her away to a woman whopromised to take care of her
and put her through a reallygood all-girl boarding school.
Her friends don't even know ifthe story's true, but that's
what she ended up tellingeverybody.
Either way, regardless of pastbeing true or not true, she did
(13:13):
go on to have a future, you guys?
Yes, she did so from LosAngeles.
The next place we see her popup is Seattle Washington, and I
feel like this is a breedingground for con artists.
Speaker 5 (13:24):
Seattle's an interesting spot for it.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Yeah, yeah I, um, I.
This is where I met someone whowas a con artist in my life.
Yeah, and I remember getting atext when I was out working one
day and I get this video of agirl masturbating, being like I
miss you, oh, and I go.
Who is this?
I didn't recognize the hand orthe vagina that was in the yeah,
interesting video and I'm likeI get home and I show my
(13:47):
roommate.
I'm like dude, someone.
I don't even know what to sayto this girl.
I was like I'm gonna call her.
He's like oh, they probablywon't pick up.
I call the number and hedoesn't know.
But I see a phone light up inhis fucking dresser drawer.
What?
Yeah, he's like they probablywon't pick up and he's like but
he's acting weird, wait, yourroommate called you with a wait.
Speaker 5 (14:06):
Your roommate sexted you.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Yes Saying send me a picture of you jerking off.
Why would they do that?
Because he's a fucking weirdoand he still does comedy.
I'm not going to say his name,people might figure it out.
But these people think I'mweird for not hanging out with
him because he's so nice.
And people think like theydon't see that.
Speaker 5 (14:24):
I don't know, buddy, we'll talk about that.
Off air, that's an off airthat's an off air.
No, that's an on air People.
Speaker 7 (14:29):
The gist is, his roommate probably wanted to see
Kyle's nudes then.
Yes, so he was pretending to besome chick, but he's also.
But also he probably wants toexploit him later.
Speaker 5 (14:49):
Never assume they, like you People in the
entertainment business, have nomorality.
You don't say Biggest kind ofall-time Starbucks Seattle.
Not good coffee.
I'm sorry, dunkey, you're myboy.
Speaker 7 (15:03):
But they did have Kurt Cobain.
Speaker 5 (15:05):
That is true.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Oh boy.
So what she becomes known forin Seattle is directing and
producing and performing inproductions at the Langston
Hughes Theater.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
So she is an actor.
Yeah, this is my Okay.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
No, you're way ahead of the ball here.
Okay, as always, you're nailingit.
Speaker 7 (15:26):
There's a venn diagram and it's acting, and
psychics and scumbaggery isright there in the middle and at
this point, when she's puttingon plays at this theater, that's
exactly what she should bedoing with her talent.
Yeah, nobody's hurt, you know.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Yeah, yet her acting uh associates, cohorts,
co-actors and actresses.
Uh, they found her to be verytrustworthy and honest and a
good person.
But that's also the sign of acon artist is no one's ever been
ripped off by an asshole.
It's always a very nice person.
That gets you.
You know you don't feel as uh.
Speaker 5 (16:03):
You feel good about it.
Yeah, you feel great about it,exactly.
Speaker 7 (16:05):
Yeah, like the music man that's who shows up.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
So she was active in the Seattle theater community
under the name Ree Paris, and in1996, she wrote and starred in
a play titled For Women Only,portraying a Jamaican woman
named.
Speaker 5 (16:20):
Cleo, oh my, are you kidding me?
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Origin story Hello.
So she created Miss Cleo for aplay in Seattle.
Speaker 5 (16:29):
I love this.
Speaker 7 (16:31):
Yeah, how great would it have been to see that play
the beginning of an empire.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Yeah, In 1997, Harris produced and performed in two
additional plays at the LangstonHughes Performing Arts Center
Summer Rhapsody and Supper ClubCafe.
Speaker 5 (16:46):
Oh, exciting.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
However, these productions faced financial
difficulties, and this is wherethings start to fall off all off
the wagon here.
Speaker 7 (16:55):
And, if I'm not mistaken, she talked in her
normal American voice offstagewith her theater company,
correct she?
What, offstage, like all thepeople that worked with her at
this theater, knew her as thisAmerican girl, not jamaican
woman.
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (17:13):
Yeah, she wasn't going full.
Andy kaufman, uh, jim carrey,andy kaufman.
She wasn't miss cleo off stageyet yet, yeah, she wasn't like.
Speaker 7 (17:21):
Thank you very much oh big.
Speaker 5 (17:27):
What a show that was.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
So she ended up having her last hurrah.
She did the Supper Club Cafeand she was directing that, and
so she was in charge of payingeverybody.
Speaker 5 (17:38):
Oh no, that's not dope.
You don't want that.
Speaker 1 (17:40):
You get the rake, you pay it out, right, so she
didn't pay it out Right.
Speaker 5 (17:46):
Yeah, maybe not the best person to be in charge of
the finances.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Yeah, and what she did do was tell everybody that
she had bone cancer.
Oh, went that route, and thenshe skipped town and she would
have crushed early days of allthe GoFundMes.
Speaker 5 (18:03):
Oh absolutely Before GoFundMe kind of cracked down on
that, which still a lot slippedthrough, she would have been
loaded yes, she would have beenall over that.
Speaker 7 (18:11):
Call me now and fund me life.
Fund me now.
Fund me next vacation you knowshe deserves a vacation I'm not
saying I don't want to hang outwith her.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
That's my problem right, oh yeah you'll get to
this when you saw thedocumentary right kyle.
Speaker 7 (18:27):
yes, she had quite the friend group I'm sure she
did Multifaceted.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
Yeah, so she provided letters citing the exact
amounts owed to each individualand said that she would pay them
after her medical expenses.
Oh, my God, and everyone saidthat money never came.
Speaker 5 (18:43):
This is an IOU for it .
What was the car from Dumb andDumber?
Oh yeah, never came.
This is an iou for it.
What was the car from dumb anddumber?
Oh, you're gonna want to holdon to that.
Speaker 7 (18:50):
She literally dumb and dumbered it you know how
cruel is that, though, to put ona show and make all these
starving artists work for free,when I think they're getting
paid yeah, oh, it's brutal,that's.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
That's a con, that's a con yes, um yes that is a
crime.
That's no longer acting, that'sconning, yeah uh, these
experiences in seattle's theaterscene were instrumental in
shaping the miss cleo personathat we all saw on tv as part of
the campaign for the psychicreaders network, which I didn't
(19:24):
realize.
She was just a spokesperson.
I thought she started it.
I thought she was the personand it was her company.
She, it was not.
So again, how was acting acrime?
Speaker 5 (19:34):
so that's now.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
I'm back to the same theory it really does come up to
me now where I'm just like okay, she was flow.
We all know flow is not flow,right, actress?
Speaker 5 (19:44):
yeah, she's not in charge of your progressive.
By the way, the other day I sawthe little guy.
Yeah, one of our local haunts.
No, not Peter Dinklage.
She said little guy.
Yeah, I'm talking about the guyfrom Progressive, non sequitur,
peter Dinklage.
I saw Peter Dinklage.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
I didn't see Peter Dinklage Megan, for no reason.
He's not DeVito.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
No, the little guy from the progressive commercial.
Oh, okay, funny little guy Tiny.
Yeah, but he's also not.
He's just an actor too.
That's true.
They should all be in prisonthen.
Miss Cleo's in prison and dead.
Speaker 7 (20:14):
They should all be dead, no they should not be At
the Psychic Friends Network,though they started off with a
totally different woman Right Atthe start, and it was just some
like white woman talking in hernormal voice.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
Boring.
That's not going to get me tocall in.
What the hell does she know?
She looks like the person I'mgoing to call and complain about
.
Speaker 7 (20:33):
And then Ree Harris, or whatever the hell her name is
, walks in saying she's MissCleo, Like where do I stand for
the audition now?
And they're like you're hired.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Well, Psychic Friends Network is a different one.
There were so many of them.
Psychic Readers Network therewas a whole bunch.
Speaker 7 (20:48):
Yeah, was Psychic Friends, the one with Dionne
Warwick.
Let me see, remember when shewas.
Speaker 5 (20:53):
Of course I do.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
This was the heyday, it was Dionne Warwick.
Oh God, yeah, and.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
Linda Georgian and Dionne Warwick.
A hell of a singer.
Speaker 7 (21:01):
Yeah, see that, the worst one, dm warwick, because
she was trusted you.
Yeah, she was so wellestablished, a legend in the
music industry, and she used allthat goodwill to sell these
psychic.
I think there's outlines.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
I think there's one worse what billy d williams?
Speaker 7 (21:19):
yeah, oh my career like oh him and dion were
essentially the same, then theyhad the same goodwill.
Yeah, I don't necessarily agreewith the very premise you guys
are speaking fromwill.
Speaker 5 (21:25):
Yeah, I don't necessarily agree with the very
premise you guys are speakingfrom, really, because I don't
know if psychic networks areinherently bad, what if they
make you feel good?
They definitely make you feelgood.
But I mean, obviously it's the10 minutes 10 a minute.
Yeah, you know, it begins to belike am I calling someone in
prison?
What's going on?
They all make you feel good, isthat bad?
Speaker 1 (21:46):
they all said the people working.
They referred to them aspsychic sweatshops.
Ah, and they said that, uh, thepeople who would call would be
regular callers all the time.
Oh, they chase that high oflike.
Oh, I'm gonna get good newstoday, got you so?
Speaker 5 (21:59):
it becomes very predatory it's very desperate
and predatory.
Speaker 7 (22:02):
Yeah, and that's where it becomes bad, because
the 900 numbers charged by theminute and these were people
with serious psychologicalissues right, right right and
very, extremely lonely and sothen, they're paying all this
money to someone that ispretending to be a psychic yeah,
(22:22):
it's like when you get an emailfrom adam schiff.
Speaker 5 (22:25):
Remember that during the election I got so many
goddamn emails from politiciansthat I'm like who was the
poorest sap giving them sevendollars every time because
they're like this is the lastwe're gonna need, and they start
crying and I think that's moremanipulative than this perhaps.
Speaker 7 (22:38):
Yeah, politics is a worse way, worse animal praise
on the saddest of the sad yeah,by the way, speaking of dm
warwick and billy d williams,remember kenny kingston no no
you guys don't remember kennykingston.
Who's kenny kingston?
He was he was right up there.
What, yeah, wouldn't you wantto call that guy?
Speaker 1 (23:00):
let's for advice we need the people at home to see
this I don't know, was that a?
Speaker 5 (23:05):
I'm from wisco like you.
I don't remember Kenny Kingsman.
Speaker 7 (23:09):
Oh yeah, he was as ubiquitous as the Riddler guy.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Oh, that dude With the question mark suit.
Speaker 5 (23:17):
Yeah, this guy looks like he's got the same haircut
as the owner of the Los AngelesRaiders.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Pumpkin pie haircut.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
Yeah, that little Prince Pomperoy, yeah.
Speaker 7 (23:26):
It looks like Orville Redenbacher if he smoked crack.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
Yeah, instead of eating the popcorn, I watched a
documentary on Orville.
Apparently he really did lovepopcorn.
Speaker 7 (23:39):
What you don't say yeah, you loved it, chris loved
it.
The shocker is he hated popcorn.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
That's what I kind of thought it was Popcorn.
You ruined my life.
I'm more than popcorn.
It's like no, you're notOrville, yeah.
Speaker 7 (23:53):
In the documentary we're referring to, call Me Miss
Cleo.
That is on Max Okay, adocumentary about her, and in
that they interview some of thepeople that worked at the
Psychic Network, and all of themwere just guys and gals off the
street and so not.
So not, of course not okay andyou know how we were just
(24:15):
talking about.
Like people with seriousproblems would would call in and
really need help.
Yeah well, these workers feltbad, but yet they would still
have to pretend to give themadvice and, at the end of the
day, these people didn't care ifthey were psychics or not,
because they just needed someoneto talk to.
Speaker 6 (24:32):
Yeah, oh sad.
Speaker 7 (24:33):
And one guy had a persona.
What was it?
Like Cassandra.
He's like I'm Samantha from theSouth.
Oh, my goodness.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
But it was clearly a guy Like I closed my eyes to see
if it could be a woman.
It wasn't and he's smiling.
People really liked cassandra.
She really liked samantha.
It's probably really offensiveto people who born in the south
in america, but that's literallywhat he was saying here's the
other thing to think about withthe psychic readers network is
that you see miss cleo on tv.
Speaker 7 (24:58):
She's like call me now.
And you're like, oh cool, Iwant to talk to miss cleo.
So you dial in.
You're not going to get misscleo, you don't get miss cleo no
, you don't get miss cleo, soyou get this guy pretending to
be samantha cassandra from thesouth, and so some people,
though were, would be encouragedto kind of talk in a jamaican
accent to get cool, yeah, okaythat was part of the work that
(25:20):
people would be like well, whatif people are asking if they
want to talk to miss cleobecause that's she says, call me
now.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
They're not calling one of us now and uh, they said
they were supposed to be likejust put the phone away from and
be like is miss cleo here?
Speaker 7 (25:31):
like oh no, she just stepped out, sorry you got me
interesting but then they wouldkeep them on hold to make them
pay more money.
Oh my goodness oh, that'shorrible, so we have a clip here
from one of the people thatworked at the hotline.
Speaker 6 (25:45):
Yes, Yo, big up to you them way out of Kingston.
We wake up this morning and wesee the thing tunnel Internet
gone mad.
Speaker 5 (25:57):
Respect.
You don't know, I'm so far withthe yard Booyah, booyah, urgh.
Speaker 6 (26:04):
Big ups that is horrible.
Speaker 5 (26:07):
That is the worst accent I have ever heard.
Speaker 7 (26:09):
Oh my goodness, Full disclosure.
That was actually Chet Hayes.
Oh my God, Tom Hanks' son.
Yeah, His name's.
Speaker 5 (26:17):
Chet Hayes.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
Chet Hayes, Chet Hanks, who knows?
Speaker 7 (26:20):
Oh, you don't know about that.
I don't know anything aboutthat family.
Just Google Chet Hayes,Jamaican sometime.
Speaker 5 (26:26):
I do know that he fell in love with a Jamaican gal
and then he couldn't stop,couldn't stop the patois.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Okay, so here's the commercials that we all know.
Speaker 8 (26:36):
You have questions, I have the answers.
Who asked you to go out of town?
The stupid young one or themarried one?
The married one, that's what Ithought.
Don't go, you hear me.
If you want him to believe thatit's over, then you got to stop
accepting the booty calls at 2am in the morning.
People have been criticized andjabbed at and talked about
throughout the ages for havingdifferent beliefs, and
(26:59):
apparently I am no exception.
Although it is a constantchallenge, I will continue.
I will not allow them to stopme.
I will teach as a shaman andhelp those who seek the
knowledge.
Speaker 5 (27:12):
She went straight shaman at the end, huh.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Shango shaman is what she called herself.
Really yeah, she's from a lineof Shango shamans.
No kidding.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
All right.
Speaker 7 (27:22):
Yeah, and you couldn't ask her too many
questions about where she camefrom.
Speaker 5 (27:27):
Well, obviously not Me, don't know.
Also, the accent definitelydropped when she said the words
booty call.
Yeah, they should have.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Booty call.
It's just a booty call.
She called herself Miss Cleo.
She should have been calledMiss Remembran.
Speaker 5 (27:38):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
I'm just laughing.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
Remembran Is this thing on.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
I don't get it.
Speaker 4 (27:43):
remembering her past, oh it's always the best when
you explain them that's for thefolks at home.
Speaker 7 (27:51):
You're welcome really funny I think that she wanted
everyone to believe that shematerialized out of thin air.
Yeah, through mystic power.
Speaker 5 (27:59):
It was the 90s.
No one knew where you came from, where you went.
You just you entered andextended people's lives
willy-nilly yeah, and I'm intime of american freedom oh for
sure, and it was prosperous,yeah, yeah.
Speaker 7 (28:12):
I think, though, really be like if you're calling
the number, you're paying themoney.
Do you really want to talk tokenny kingston?
You want to talk to someonelike miss cleo?
Of course, that's why it worksso well a psychic named kenny.
Speaker 5 (28:24):
Yeah, what the fuck I'll go listen to your like folk
band maybe, but I'm notlistening to you giving me
advice.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
I'm your masseuse, frankie.
No, thank you, fuck out of here.
Okay, so we need a clip of.
What do we need a clip of rightnow?
Speaker 7 (28:45):
What would you like a clip of?
Oh, the parodies.
Oh, yes, Because this you werejust saying before the show.
It must have been huge, becausewe in Wisconsin heard of her.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
Yeah, I realized if I heard about anybody from
Stevens Point, wisconsin, afterI left, they were mega stars,
but at the time you're just likewell, I guess they just know
Stevens Point, wisconsin.
Yeah, like no, they don't, theyjust know Peter Weller.
Oh my God, robocop from myhometown, robo Me, mimi Bobeck,
peter Weller, I still think I'min the top five of the most
famous people from Stevens Point.
(29:14):
Hey, I think no one told methat let's go, but you know,
whatever, and I'm still not evenin the top to make their
careers by ruining mine.
Hey that's great.
Speaker 7 (29:31):
What a level of celebrity Uh yes, so yeah, she
was huge, she was everywhere.
Early two thousands.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
She was being parodied and that's the
documentary said.
That's when you know you'vemade it.
Speaker 7 (29:41):
When people start parodying, yes, like people get
upset about it, but it's like no, get upset about it, but it's
like no, that's when you're nextlevel, famous right so.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
So here's deborah wilson on mad tv.
Oh, I love this.
This is actually a great sketchyeah operators are standing by.
Speaker 8 (29:56):
Oh, and we have our very first caller.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Hello caller hello, is this cleo?
Yes, baby, it is.
Oh, you're the one that can seeinto the future.
Speaker 8 (30:06):
yes, yes, darling, you got the right, cleo oh honey
, can I ask you a question?
Speaker 3 (30:11):
What Was you working on September the 10th?
Speaker 5 (30:16):
Oh my God, oh my God, that's hilarious.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Well, yes, yes yes, really, you didn't see anything
strange going to happen on thatnext day.
Speaker 8 (30:34):
Um no.
Speaker 5 (30:37):
That is hilarious, Matt TV.
It had its moments.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
There's something that actually kind of happened
like that with the psychic.
Do you remember Sylvia Brownthat used to go on Montel?
Yes, of course, Hi, Montel.
There was a woman who wentthere that wanted to speak to
her husband in the afterlife andshe's like, oh, I see him
drowning and she's like he diedin the Twin Towers on September
11th.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
Oh my.
Speaker 1 (30:57):
God.
And she goes do you think therecould have been some water in
there and they were like no.
Speaker 7 (31:04):
And Montel was trying so hard to make it work.
Yeah, you know, maybe he wasdrowning in the smoke or
something.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
Maybe he knocked over a cup of water the end of her
career.
Speaker 7 (31:15):
She was even worse though.
She was worse, she would talkto victims' families and try to
pretend like she knew.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Like help the police.
Yeah, Told parents that a girlwas murdered when she wasn't.
Speaker 5 (31:28):
Oh, my goodness, she's dead.
Yes, he died.
Give up.
South park did a great.
Uh, I don't even think it was aparody, it's just a straight up
skewering of crossing over.
Anthony edwards, not anthonyedwards jonathan edwards
jonathan edwards.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
John edwards, yeah, yeah, because, yeah, people were
really desperate yeah, and he'sthe worst too, like he'll be,
like, uh, be like someone with agrandfather, with a ERMFL.
Speaker 5 (31:50):
Yeah, someone whose grandfather is older than them?
Anyone, anyone.
Do you have a child?
Speaker 7 (31:56):
younger than you, and they prey on people who are
grieving.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
Yeah, it's brutal, and then in that case I think he
also had audience plants.
That whole thing was a ruse,yeah so it becomes so massive.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Uh, she's literally just the face of the company.
So I have more sympathy for forwhat comes next, because what
ended up happening is thepsychic readers network.
They were getting so many callsand they would have, you know,
maybe some fraudulent callswhere you know you see the
commercial and then you're a kidand you think it's funny to
(32:30):
call the Psychic Readers Network, sure, and then your parents
are on the hook to pay for that,of course, and then parents
would say, hey, fuck you, I'mnot paying that.
Speaker 5 (32:38):
This is the modern day equivalent of in-game
purchases.
Oh, okay, where all of a sudden, your credit card is is $50,000
and you're like, why, oh, youneed a new sleeve for your Call
of Duty firearm.
I need skins, bro.
I need skin.
I wanted to be family guy.
Speaker 7 (32:52):
Did you both call the psychic line?
At least once we would call.
Speaker 5 (32:56):
Christian lines and do that whole thing.
So, we would make fun of it,but those were free.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, maybe a couple of sex lines, but not really I
just racked up a 2500 bill on411, looking for the contact
information for billy joearmstrong, because that green
day I wanted to invite them toplay my birthday party.
I was like seven years old.
2500 back in the day.
(33:23):
If you called 411 in anotherstate it would charge you so
much more so and.
I kept calling over and overand they kept saying no and I
was like, well, you just don'tknow what you're talking about.
Speaker 7 (33:31):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
Was it paid?
Oh, my dad ended up having topay it.
I was there what?
He had part-time visitationrights, so every two weeks I
would go over and the mail cametwo weeks later and he's like
who the fuck?
Speaker 5 (33:44):
got 411?
.
Speaker 7 (33:46):
It's like Buzz at the end of Home Alone.
Yeah, literally, kevin.
Speaker 5 (33:50):
For some reason that part-time visitation went away.
I don't know why.
Speaker 7 (33:55):
Yeah, I only racked up a $25 bill because I hung up
right away.
Speaker 5 (33:59):
Oh man, you really, you cursed that poor man.
Speaker 7 (34:02):
Yeah, that's weird, though they were at such expense
Like it wouldn't cost that muchto get green day to play at the
party, probably yeah, well, youknow, I tried, lessons learned.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
I'll see him someday.
Yes, um, and so those ended upbecoming collections sent to
collection agencies.
The collection agencies wouldsend a demand letter to the
parents and they would be signedby cleo they.
Speaker 5 (34:29):
Oh okay, so who's ever in charge?
Speaker 1 (34:31):
kind of set her up to be the fall guy she that's like
progressive saying hey, you oweus for money and it's signed by
flow it's yeah, exactly.
Speaker 7 (34:37):
No, that's a spokesperson it's signed by tony
the tiger yeah, right.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
So there's some attorneys in florida that I've
just they've had enough and theyrealized that the psychicic
Readers Network is based inBroward County.
So in 2002, florida, attorneyGeneral, bob Butterworth that's
a good name, bob Butterworth BobButterworth's in town, and
you're not getting away withthis shit anymore, any relation
to the missus.
Speaker 5 (35:02):
Could be.
If I go to fucking prison forlife because of Bob Butterworth,
I'm going to be so pissed off.
I'll be like what did you do?
Well, I stole a bunch ofpancakes and bob butterworth
came after me.
Kai, doesn't let you get anypancakes for free in this
goddamn town, christ so becausethey were signed by cleo the
they, florida attorney general,bob butterworth.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
He sued fictional character miss cleo for
violating the state's deceptiveand unfair trades practices act
it's florida.
Speaker 5 (35:30):
Yeah, have you been to florida?
Speaker 1 (35:31):
they've sued a fictional character at this
point oh my god so that's howthey got her in.
They roped her in because shesigned the, the uh demand
letters, but they found outthrough depositions and all that
that she didn't sign it yeahthey were clearly just fucking
her over.
Speaker 7 (35:47):
They foraged it so but I want to know is what did
it say?
Actually?
Did it say, miss cleo?
Speaker 1 (35:52):
yes, so then the lawsuit was based on.
Since they named her name, theywent and did a background check
and they realized that her namewas yuri harris and so that
came out in the news and it likeput a huge hole in her career
right, because she was no longerseen as this jamaican shango
there was shaman, there was anera, an era of kayfabe, where
(36:14):
kayfabe still lived.
Yeah, kayfabe being thefictional world that we all
agree to in the wrestling worldexactly, okay, I was just
pretending to understand before,but he just lets it fly out.
Oh, come on believe.
Speaker 5 (36:28):
It's like when you believe in batman verse like, oh
okay yeah, you don't believe inthat?
Speaker 7 (36:32):
yeah, all right, that makes sense now thank you.
Speaker 5 (36:34):
I believe that if I saw robert pattinson I'd be like
what are you doing up in theday, don't you have to sleep.
Speaker 7 (36:39):
Fight crime tonight, yeah we have a clip, remember,
of the lawsuit.
Yeah, I was portrayed in themedia.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
Yes, so the state of florida.
They sued, they subpoenaed formiss cleo's birth certificate
and other records.
The state prosecutors uh haddepositions with miss cleo about
her background.
Uh, miss cleo's attorney arguedthat the lawsuit was
politically motivated and thecase was closed later that year
after miss cleo and thecompanies worked uh out a deal.
(37:06):
Okay, uh, the charges were.
They alleged that miss cleo'sclaims were deceptive.
So the lawyer was like youcan't just say you're a psychic
network and then write on thebottom of the commercial for
entertainment purposes.
Only you can.
You're still lying to thepeople, but you're not.
I agree with you.
Speaker 7 (37:23):
Yeah, yeah, I don't know about this one.
Like it's morally it's terrible, yeah, but is it really illegal
?
Is it a?
Speaker 1 (37:31):
crime.
Yeah, so here's the birthcertificate saga.
Speaker 6 (37:36):
It's about her birth certificate, which shows her to
have been born in Los Angeles toAmerican parents to keep it
purposely vague.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
You may have this birth certificate, but is it
accurate?
Well, yeah, I mean I can'tdispute that, but there are lots
of reasons why I speak with aJamaican accent and I'm really
from Jamaica, but doesn't thisdocument prove otherwise?
I mean, that's how thedeposition went.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
It's a fairly straightforward question Is she
or is she not from Jamaica?
Speaker 6 (38:07):
She is from Jamaica in as much as this is her lawyer
yeah, and he's drowning he isfrom jamaica in as much as
anyone who has jamaican ties tothat country or to any other
country that they claim theyspeak.
She speaks with the jamaicanaccent and um as as much of
(38:29):
jamaican as anyone that claimsthat country are their culture
it's a lot.
Speaker 5 (38:34):
You know, it's like very intense music considering
what we're doing here.
But okay, they're, they're onit.
Yeah, they are the perp waterand everything.
Yeah, what about the peoplethat were the financiers of this
whole thing?
That's the big.
Who are they?
Speaker 7 (38:46):
they?
They are Steven Fedder andPeter Stoltz.
They're the ones that startedPsychic Friends Network and
hired Miss Cleo.
Speaker 5 (38:54):
What happened to them ?
Speaker 7 (38:55):
Well, I'm sure Kyle will tell us.
Psychic Readers Network.
What did I say, friends?
Oh, I keep saying.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Psychic Friends.
But this is what they do.
This is deception.
They were trying to get you tothink you're on the same company
.
Speaker 7 (39:06):
Well, it worked.
Yeah, because it you know it'slike WCW and WWF.
Speaker 5 (39:12):
It's not at all like that.
Speaker 7 (39:14):
I guess I'm not.
I can't talk about wrestling noyou can't, because you hate it.
Speaker 5 (39:19):
I don't hate it.
You openly criticize wrestlingand it's very difficult.
Speaker 7 (39:21):
Do not hate it at all .
Speaker 5 (39:23):
I love it now.
They're young for us and theyentertain us.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
I've been flipped.
We watched Royal Rumble lastnight Great, really fun.
I went to bed early and nowwe're going to watch the news
about Miss Cleo and the lawsuithere.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
If you're up in the middle of the night channel
surfing, you may come across oneof those infomercials that
promises you to put you in touchwith a psychic.
Most viewers probably just keepon surfing, but those who stop
and call in, well, they're putin touch with something.
All right, A telephone bill.
Way beyond what they probablyexpected.
All right, bro, call in.
Speaker 8 (39:56):
Call now for free trail reading and discover the
truth today.
Call me now.
Speaker 3 (40:01):
Call now and try it for free.
Well, here's one she justdidn't see coming.
A legal fight with thegovernment is in the cards for
Ms Cleo.
Speaker 4 (40:10):
Ms Cleo calls herself a psychic, so you'd think she
would have seen this one coming.
Speaker 5 (40:14):
Oh, shut it I think she should have seen it coming.
Speaker 7 (40:15):
I hate you, anderson Cooper, so we knew.
But then you probably knew thatanyway, didn't you, hey
Hundreds?
Speaker 3 (40:21):
of people have complained about a so-called
free tarot card reading.
Speaker 7 (40:31):
One.
They were charged.
That's a bet.
Speaker 5 (40:37):
Oh, there's Bob, that's Butterworth, that's
Butterworth right there.
Oh my God, not very butterySlippery fingered Butterworth.
A good tarot card reading doesgo about $100.
Speaker 7 (40:51):
No, but it was advertised as being free.
Yeah, call for your freereading.
So that's the problem?
Speaker 5 (40:57):
Yeah, there's no free meals, not in America, Not even
if you go to school and there'sa lunch.
It's kind of a problem actually.
Speaker 7 (41:03):
Do you think when that guy yells at his rebellious
teenage son, he says you needto start acting like a
butterworth?
The name means something.
Speaker 5 (41:15):
Damn it yeah yeah, what is this in my house?
Is this margarine?
I never thought I'd have a sonwho brought margarine into this
home.
Oh, we're butterworths, damn itso stupid the psychic readers
network.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
Uh, they did say that call for your free reading,
right, I see?
so that was the problem yeah,the callers were that were
taking the calls.
They were given a script toread from a computer program uh,
to simulate a tarot card spread.
The first three minutes werefree, but the callers were
charged after that.
So the game was keep them onthe line.
I got you.
They were told 18 minutes.
(41:56):
Is the the like, the good zone?
Keep them right around 18.
You can go longer.
Once you get them at 18, thenyou keep them on.
And what was it?
A minute?
Uh, five bucks, 4.99 so99.
Speaker 5 (42:07):
Oh my God, yeah, that's coming in fast, that
money.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
The 90s the minimum wage the callers were only
getting, maybe minimum wage$5.50?
.
Yeah exactly, so they'regetting hourly what they're
getting in a minute.
Speaker 6 (42:19):
Holy hell.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
Yeah, they were asked for their name and address to
be used for mailers and ads.
They just got everything, allthe information to be used for
mailers and ads.
They were, they just goteverything, all the information.
Um, some callers were told theywere speaking, speaking to miss
cleo, but they were actuallyspeaking with an actor right who
?
Speaker 5 (42:35):
is also miss cleo.
Yeah, that's true.
Yeah, what's the difference,right?
Speaker 1 (42:39):
it's like santa claus you can have different
surrogates yeah, uh, so psychicreaders were not off the hook.
They ended up having to go tocourt, okay, and I believe,
because they're the ones whoactually are the perpetrators
here yeah, exactly, the ftcwasn't having this shit.
They let miss cleo go becausethey realized that she was just
a pawn in the game.
They did so she didn't servetime, nothing.
Speaker 5 (43:01):
No, she didn't have to pay any fines?
Speaker 1 (43:02):
nothing, because they realized that she was getting
completely fucked over.
The lawyer literally was likethe one that was trying to
prosecute her was upset at howbad of a deal that she got.
She wasn't making any money.
I thought she ran away with abillion dollars.
Yeah, she got almost nothing.
They did she didn't.
Yeah, exactly, the PsychicReaders Network took all the
money.
Speaker 5 (43:23):
Who are these assholes again?
Speaker 1 (43:25):
Stoltz and something else.
Fader, fader.
Speaker 5 (43:27):
Steven Fader and Peter Stoltz.
Yeah, what a bunch of schmucks.
Speaker 1 (43:32):
So the FTC came in.
They charged the companies withdeceptive advertising, billing
and collection practices and theFTC alleged that the companies
made over $1 billion using theseshady shyster tricks.
Oh, it makes sense.
Yeah, the companies in wholesettled with the FTC by paying a
five million dollar fine andrefunding some callers okay.
Speaker 5 (43:55):
Yeah, I mean this is different than one of those sex
lines, because the sex lines thegoal was to get it done real
fast.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Yeah, if the first three minutes are free on a sex
line, you can pull that offwhat's what's stopping you from,
like, becoming this major uhscam network if you're gonna
make a billion dollars and thenonly have to pay off five
million?
Speaker 5 (44:15):
Right, and they didn't serve time either.
No, it's just vanity.
Speaker 1 (44:19):
It's like a vanity stat Like, oh, they paid five
million.
Most people are like, oh my God, that's a lot of money.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
So no one went to jail in the scandal.
Speaker 7 (44:26):
Those two guys had to admit to deceptive practices or
something.
If I made a billion, I wouldadmit to anything and
essentially they were arrestedat one point but then they were
back on the golf course bysundown, so it was like a slap
on the wrist.
They did have to stop thePsychic readers network.
Speaker 5 (44:47):
Yes, but that's about it.
Yeah, definitely wasn't the endof psychic infomercials though.
Yeah, no For sure.
Speaker 7 (44:55):
Are they still around ?
Speaker 5 (44:57):
Psychic stuff is everywhere.
Yeah, probably more now thanever.
Speaker 7 (45:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (45:01):
Yeah, the internet is full of that stuff.
Speaker 7 (45:02):
But you don't see it hitting the culture like it did.
Speaker 1 (45:05):
There's a huge one in Massachusetts, Maureen Hancock,
and my mom goes to see her liketwice a year.
Speaker 7 (45:09):
My mom goes to see her like twice a year.
Speaker 1 (45:11):
Oh, okay, yeah, she does like stadium, like huge
theater for people.
Speaker 5 (45:14):
I mean it's kind of fun to see.
Speaker 7 (45:16):
Yeah, okay, I'll have to try it.
Speaker 1 (45:19):
Yeah, so all's well that ends well.
The hole was in the ship.
It went down and Miss Cleo wasdone and she was still.
It was weird she was doinginterviews like well, after the
Psychic Readers Network wentdown and she was still using the
persona.
Speaker 7 (45:36):
Yeah, we have a clip of.
There was a documentary shewanted to put out there to
legitimize her after this fiascohappened.
Speaker 5 (45:45):
Be careful who you pretend to be.
You might just become it.
Speaker 7 (45:48):
So here it is, Miss Cleo without the mask.
Speaker 8 (45:53):
You know, on television.
They wanted me to appear like Ihad just arrived on the scene,
straight out of Bush.
Well, that wasn't the case.
I actually had a higher up.
Tell me one time.
Well, don't tell him you wentto an all-girl boarding school,
why not?
Well, we really don't wantpeople, you, to think that you
(46:15):
know what, that I'm educatedright.
Speaker 5 (46:20):
That's unfortunate, so she's a victim in some ways
here too, I think so, and shekept up the voice after that,
which is interesting yeah, uh,in her final, she passed away
very young.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
She died from colon cancer on July 26, 2016, at the
age of 53.
Speaker 7 (46:38):
And unfortunately, that cancer was real.
Yeah, not like the other one.
She had Right, that means shewas only in her 30s when she was
doing peak mescluny, yeah, Iguess.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
so yeah, wow.
Speaker 7 (46:52):
She was sort of ageless if you think?
About it.
Yeah, yeah, they say that.
Speaker 1 (46:57):
Yeah, she was hospitalized after the cancer
had spread to her liver andlungs, started in the colon.
That chick can move fast.
She was discharged from thehospital and placed in hospice
care and still continued to doreadings privately from her
hospice bed.
Wow, why not For chargingclients up to $100.
Speaker 5 (47:16):
Oh good for her Hustle.
Till the end I've got to get mycolonoscopy in two years.
My doctor told me I'm 43, theysay 45.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
Oh wow, I thought they moved it up.
No, I feel like they just wantto get the younger guys get up
their asses.
Speaker 7 (47:33):
She wasn't too thrilled about the idea of
having to do it, and did youknow that she did it one more
time?
She put on the act oh really,for a 2015 commercial.
We have the clip.
Oh okay, let's see it.
Speaker 8 (47:44):
Miss Cleo is back.
No, do you have silverwaresweet pea?
Oh, my God, you have silverware.
I sent you something other thana knife and a fork.
I have a spoon.
How did you know?
Now I have a vision that youare going to take that spoon and
scoop up a bite of French ToastCrunch.
What All cinnamon and maplesyrup-y?
(48:07):
I can't believe.
You see, all that French ToastCrunch is back and I'm going to
eat it now.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Oh my God, eat it now .
Speaker 7 (48:14):
Eat it now.
You want to hear somethinginfuriating.
What Stoltz and Fader sued herafter that.
Oh my god she had to stop doingthe character again.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
But that was a joke commercial.
Yeah, that was an actual Frenchtoast crunch commercial.
Speaker 7 (48:29):
That was real.
General Mills paid her.
Speaker 5 (48:32):
Oh, my god, my okay, I was so confused.
Okay, I was confused too.
I didn't know that was ageneral mills commercial.
Speaker 7 (48:38):
Yeah, yeah, and so I was saying in 2015 she did it
one more time.
She got that in before she died, but then she was sued right
after it because those assholesown the persona.
Speaker 1 (48:50):
They own the character.
Yeah, that's what house theysaid.
How bad of a deal she got is.
They actually took thecharacter away from her.
They trademarked it, wow.
Speaker 5 (49:00):
So if they really wanted to, they could send out
another black lady doing thesame.
It shows you just howmainstream that character was.
If Kellogg's or whateverGeneral Mills used it in an ad,
used her in an ad.
Speaker 7 (49:10):
And then it never really left the zeitgeist.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
No, and that used it in an ad, used her in an ad,
right, and it never really leftthe zeitgeist.
No, and that was a year beforeshe died, which is crazy.
Wow, she seemed in decent shapethere, but, um, yeah, they said
that after her tv career ended.
She voiced characters in grandtheft auto vice city, nice.
Um, and, yeah, resurfaced inthe 2014 documentary Hotline
Hotline, indeed, that was beforethe Call Me Miss Cleo, the
(49:36):
documentary about her life thatpremiered on HBO Max December
2022.
And then the last thing that wehave here.
I spent all night trying tofind it.
You can't find anything, butthey did a Lifetime movie on
Miss Cleo.
Oh my God, her Rise and Fall,and all you can find is the
trailer.
Speaker 5 (49:53):
So we will watch that together.
Speaker 8 (49:55):
Don't go blindly through life.
Let me use the power of thetarot to show you the way.
Call me now for your freereading.
Speaker 5 (50:04):
Based on a true story .
Let's make some money this isCleo.
Speaker 8 (50:10):
You're our highest earner ever.
The sky is the limit.
Speaker 7 (50:13):
No one could foresee.
Keep him on the phone.
You're our highest earner ever.
The sky is the limit.
No one could foresee.
Speaker 8 (50:15):
Keep them on the phone.
You got this.
Tell me about your dreams 24million a month.
You're mocking our Jamaicanheritage.
You've been served.
Speaker 5 (50:25):
You do not need a crystal ball to know that the
FTC will stop deceptive tradepractices.
Speaker 8 (50:31):
She's ripping off millions of people.
Speaker 4 (50:34):
I'm paying my bills and taking care of my kids.
I'm not hurting anyone.
Let us talk to the lawyers.
These things blow over.
People put their trust in you,ms Harris, are you even a?
Speaker 5 (50:42):
psychic.
Our name's in the lawsuit, butit's my face.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
Ms Cleo her rise and fall.
Speaker 5 (50:49):
Oh my God man.
Lifetime movies are the best,yeah I, I can't.
Speaker 1 (50:56):
We have to find that somebody please.
Speaker 5 (50:58):
If you find a link, please send it to us at death
and entertainment at gmailcomyes, do use the dark web for
what it's supposed to be usedfor finding old, discontinued
lifetime movies yes, the thingis, it's not old at all, it was
2024.
Yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 7 (51:12):
It's 11 years old.
That shows you again how muchshe's still around in everyone's
minds For real.
They did mention in thattrailer that Jamaican woman's
like you're making fun of us.
Yeah, that was interesting.
In the Max documentary theyinterviewed Jamaicans and they
(51:34):
all said, oh, we knew it wasfake the moment we heard it Wow,
I'm sure they did.
Speaker 1 (51:38):
It's like when I see a movie and it's a bad Boston
accent.
I'm like that guy.
Nobody else notices.
Speaker 5 (51:42):
Right, oh, go ahead.
It was like the movie Fargo.
If you're from Minnesota, someof the accents are like no, that
ain't right.
Speaker 7 (51:58):
We don't sound like that and I would have no idea.
I thought it was great, theywere pretty good.
They were pretty good, yeah,and then the same went for black
people.
They also knew it was an act.
Speaker 5 (52:01):
But you know who didn't?
White people?
Of course not.
We don't know anything.
Speaker 7 (52:03):
We're like oh yeah, that makes sense and it was
revealed that she had this bigfriend group.
Did you notice something aboutthem?
Speaker 1 (52:09):
kyle well they were black.
No, they were all white laterin life, but the ones in seattle
were all black no, but theyweren't friends.
Speaker 7 (52:17):
They were.
They were the ones that weren'tpaid by.
That's true too.
No, she had this big friendgroup, all white, and they all
said I don't know whateveryone's been saying, because
she always talked in thatjamaican accent around me, so
they all defended her to thedeath that she was really
Jamaican, right, but they allhappen to be white people.
Speaker 5 (52:36):
I love that, so you know Well if you want a great
comedy routine on that.
Cat Williams' White Friends isone of the funniest stand-up
clips of all time.
Speaker 1 (52:45):
Yes, so RIP, miss Cleo.
Speaker 7 (52:48):
Yeah, yeah, you know, she brought some joy she.
So yeah, you know she broughtsome joy?
Speaker 5 (52:51):
Yes, she did, and it's unfortunate that she was a
pawn used by these people toscrew over a lot of innocent Big
time.
Speaker 1 (52:57):
That's why we're going to take it to Final.
Speaker 4 (53:01):
Thoughts.
Speaker 5 (53:02):
I think that Miss Cleo got a raw deal.
I agree, I went in and I waslike, oh, she's probably going
to be somebody horrible.
Speaker 1 (53:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (53:09):
And she was an actress trying to make it in
this crazy world Not easy beinga black gal, specifically in the
90s and before, obviously.
So, yeah, I feel bad for thepeople that called in need of
help and who got completelyscrewed out of tens of thousands
of dollars.
But Ms Cleo, I think she's justa pawn in a very, very bad
(53:31):
machine.
Speaker 7 (53:33):
Yeah, I mean she made a lot of people laugh, she gave
a lot of people advice, but thething is she still needed to
take some responsibility for herrole.
She also was the face of thecon and at some point, I know
she didn't get paid a whole lotunless she stashed money
somewhere, which very well couldbe the case, because think
(53:55):
about it, once it got really big, wouldn't you be like I'm gonna
walk unless you give me thisamount of money?
Speaker 5 (54:02):
I actually think the irony is she kind of got screwed
by the same, by the people thatdid the same thing that she did
to others.
Speaker 7 (54:08):
Yes, yeah, they like basically gave her ious yeah,
and let's not forget, shescrewed over her theater friends
yeah, so it's just a lifetimeof con and it's not like albert
finney and big fish yes, whereit's sweet and sentimental there
are really.
Speaker 1 (54:24):
There's real damage here yeah, there were people
that she victimized and then sheended up being the biggest
victim of all in the whole thingin some ways yeah, uh.
So I did go in thinking thatshe was going to be such a
corrupt scumbag.
But she had her faults, but shealso did get completely screwed
at the biggest point of hercareer.
Speaker 5 (54:41):
So also bob butterworth.
You don't get it.
Speaker 7 (54:44):
Come on, bob yeah, the butterworth family.
Yeah, I'll give you that, Ithink.
I think that it was too big forher.
She didn't realize, I don'tthink, how much she was conning
people.
Speaker 5 (54:58):
Well, you, just sit there in front of a camera.
You don't really realize howbig it can be.
All right, everyone.
Well, thank you so much forlistening to this episode of
Death and Entertainment.
Ben Kissel, Alejandro Dowling,Kyle Plouffe we will be back
with you next week.
Hail yourselves, everyone.
Talk to you soon and until nextweek.
Speaker 7 (55:15):
Don't go dying on us, bye-bye.
Speaker 4 (55:19):
Bye.
You have just heard.
Speaker 3 (55:21):
A true Hollywood murder mystery.
Speaker 1 (55:23):
I have never seen anything like this before.
Speaker 4 (55:26):
The movies, Broadway, music, television, all of it.
Speaker 6 (55:32):
A place that manufactures nightmares.
Speaker 4 (55:35):
Okay, everybody.
That's a wrap.
Good night.
Please drive home carefully andcome back again soon.
Gather round, dear listeners, as we peer into the
cosmic crystal ball wherefortunes are told, fates are
sealed and late-nightinfomercials rule the land.
She had the voice of aCaribbean auntie who always knew
your business.
Before you did A deck of tarotcards and a hotline that somehow
(00:24):
always put you on hold.
Please hold the line.
That's right.
We're talking about thelegendary Miss Cleo, from her
mysterious accent to her evenmore mysterious legal troubles.
We're diving deep into the wild, wacky and kind of shady world
of TV psychics.
Was she a true mystic, amarketing genius, or just the
greatestfake-it-till-you-make-it story
(00:45):
of the 90s?
Buckle up, because your futureholds one heck of a story.
Speaker 3 (00:52):
The charge for this call is $4.99 a minute.
Speaker 1 (00:56):
So light some incense , shuffle your tarot deck and,
for the love of Miss Cleo, don'tforget to ask your spirit
guides before giving out yourcredit card number.
That's today on Death inEntertainment.
Speaker 4 (01:08):
Call me now live from Los Angeles 911.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
What is your emergency?
Here in Hollywood now twocounts of murder injury and
death oh my god, shocking newdetails that has stunned the
entertainment world.
Speaker 4 (01:27):
This makes me a little nervous.
The hair stood up on my arms,just like in the movies.
What do you call this thinganyway?
Death.
Speaker 7 (01:36):
In entertainment.
Speaker 5 (01:38):
All right.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
What's up everybody?
Greetings Ditto Universe.
How are you?
Speaker 5 (01:43):
What up how?
Speaker 1 (01:43):
you doing everybody?
Greetings Ditto Universe.
How are you?
What up, how you?
Speaker 5 (01:47):
doing.
Hi Hope your Pro Ball Sundayweek was good Absolutely
fantastic.
Speaker 7 (01:49):
Nobody's thinking about the Pro Ball.
Speaker 5 (01:51):
Absolutely not.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
Not even the players.
Speaker 5 (01:53):
Definitely not.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
What's up everybody.
My name's Kyle Plouffe.
I'm Alejandro Dowling.
Speaker 5 (01:58):
And I am Ben Kissel.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Yes, ben Kissel is here to stay.
Everybody we are.
Speaker 5 (02:03):
Absolutely.
Thanks all so much for enjoyingthe first few episodes of OK
Bud and I'm excited to be partof the Death and Entertainment
team.
Speaker 1 (02:09):
Yes, which, if you're watching this and not a part of
the Patreon, it's patreoncomslash diebud.
You get to see every showperformed live before it goes
out on audio only to all theother podcast platforms.
Speaker 5 (02:21):
It's very, very fun and we'll be adding more content
to the Patreon.
Again, it's patreoncom slashdiebud.
As the weeks go on, perhapssome political blabbing coming
from my big old lips, because,god knows, it's a crazy time to
be alive, yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:35):
If anybody hasn't seen us before I know the people
watching us have but if you'relistening to us for the first
time, we have to warn you.
We are a true crime comedypodcast, so there will be laughs
, in spite of talking about verydark subjects.
Speaker 5 (02:46):
Okay, we have to laugh in the darkness.
Speaker 7 (02:49):
Yes, we do.
I see a lot of laughs in ourfuture with this episode.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Yeah, yes, today we're talking about Miss Cleo,
and so if you don't want to hearus laugh about her, then call
another hotline.
All right, and without furtherado, let's get into it.
Okay, so did you guys know thatMiss Cleo was not born Miss
(03:27):
Cleo?
Speaker 5 (03:33):
I would assume, not I would have.
Usually, when the baby is born,they're not like this is a
65-year-old.
Speaker 6 (03:37):
Jamaican woman named Miss Cleo we're going to name
her Samantha.
Speaker 5 (03:39):
No, I'm sorry, it's Miss Cleo.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Yeah, so Miss Cleo was actually born Uri Del Harris
.
Oh, and Cleo was a Leo.
She was born August 12th 1962.
Speaker 5 (03:52):
I could see that she has Leo energy.
She does Definitely.
Speaker 7 (03:56):
Were you really excited to find out that her
sign rhymed with her name, andthat too?
Speaker 1 (04:09):
for me that her sign rhymed with her name, and that
too she was born august 12 1962.
Speaker 5 (04:12):
Not in jamaica, not in the caribbean.
Why not even jamaica?
Speaker 1 (04:13):
queens, not even that .
But in good old los angeles,california, nice, you guys know
her as miss cleo.
She was famous for playing thattelevision personality.
Uh, she was a spokeswoman forthe psychic paper call minute
service called the PsychicReaders Network, in a series of
television commercials thataired from 1997 to 2003.
Speaker 5 (04:33):
Man, those commercials were on every single
night.
I remember it was.
I would watch USA Network withRhonda up all night and it would
constantly show that Jim Carreymovie Once Bitten.
I don't know why.
Oh yeah, jim Carrey movie OnceBitten.
I don't know why.
Oh yeah, jim Carrey vampirefilm that I think he got famous,
and they're like we got therights to this.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
I only saw it between clicks, Like I never watched
the whole thing.
Speaker 5 (04:52):
It was always on Rhonda Up All Night.
It was that.
And Miss Cleo, she wouldadvertise twice in the same
advertising block.
Speaker 7 (04:58):
Yeah, it was ubiquitous.
You couldn't miss it.
You couldn't.
Speaker 1 (05:02):
Yeah, so she was born in Los Angeles County Hospital,
and she was born to ElisaTeresa Hopus.
Speaker 5 (05:10):
She just loves names that rhyme yeah, elisa, teresa
and Cleo the Leo.
Speaker 7 (05:16):
That is a grand name, opus.
Yeah, yeah, it really is Hopus.
Speaker 5 (05:20):
Oh, hopus.
Yeah, Excuse me, oh, I actuallylike Hopus.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Oh.
Speaker 5 (05:22):
Hopus.
Yeah, excuse me, oh, I actuallylike Hopus better.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Hopus Popus.
Speaker 5 (05:25):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:25):
And David Harris.
Speaker 7 (05:27):
Okay, that's not so grand, I like that, just a
normal name grounding her.
Speaker 1 (05:31):
Yeah, but Elisa was a Californian and David was from
Texas.
Okay, she attended a verywell-to-do boarding school,
Ramona Convent Secondary School,a Catholic girls' school in
Alhambra, California.
Speaker 5 (05:47):
Hey interesting.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
Not too far from here , right down the street.
You know Miss Harris.
She was an interestingcharacter for many reasons, one
of which is the sheer amount offake names that she assumed over
the years.
Like I said, her real name wasUri Harris, but she also used
various aliases, including, butnot limited to, re Paris Uri,
(06:09):
cleomilly Uri, paris Ray DelHarris, cleomilly Paris Uri oh,
my goodness, and CleomillyHarris.
Speaker 5 (06:18):
Why did she choose those names?
Speaker 7 (06:20):
And they're all basically the same name.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
Exactly so if she ran into someone on the street and
they're like Cleo Millie.
Speaker 7 (06:26):
No, it's actually Milo Kelly yeah.
Speaker 5 (06:30):
She sounds like one of those American Girl dolls.
Yeah, remember those things.
They were made of paper, right?
My grandma always wanted me toplay with those, and I'm not the
gay one.
Speaker 1 (06:39):
It's never great when you have enough fake names to
start a baseball team.
That's very true.
Speaker 5 (06:42):
There's something going on.
I mean, I don't know if thebaseball team would be that good
given those names, but yeah,yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
She spoke with a thick Jamaican accent on TV.
Reports suggest she had nodirect Jamaican heritage
whatsoever in her entire familytree.
Speaker 5 (06:59):
Is acting a crime.
I ask you is acting a crime?
Speaker 7 (07:04):
Yes, it is actually well in certain, you'll find out
all right.
Speaker 1 (07:09):
Instead she came.
She says she came from a familyof caribbean descent but was
raised in the us.
Speaker 7 (07:15):
But it's not true okay yeah, didn't she also say
she had 10 brothers and sisters?
Yes, and then it changed.
Sometimes she was from was fromJamaica, or her parents were
from Jamaica, or one time, Ithink, she said that she was
adopted by Jamaican parents.
Speaker 5 (07:33):
Yes, oh, okay, so she's got a lot going on.
Speaker 7 (07:35):
Yeah.
Key word, though, is Jamaica.
Yeah right, that's what shewanted.
Speaker 5 (07:40):
Well, that's how you know she's a psychic.
Yeah, that's absolutely true.
Speaker 1 (07:45):
Over the years she's shared varying accounts about
her parents and her upbringing.
In 2006, she had an interviewwith the Advocate and she
described being raised by strictCaribbean Catholic parents in
Los Angeles who were aware ofher sexual orientation.
She was a lesbian.
Okay, and she says that theywere aware of her sexual
orientation from an early age.
(08:06):
Uh, she recounted that herfamily didn't openly discuss her
being a lesbian, referring it.
Speaker 5 (08:11):
She referred to it as the pink elephant in the room
oh, interesting, all right, sothat's unfortunate she wasn't
able to express herself sexuallyopenly.
Yeah, in her family that'sprobably true, to be honest, and
I hope that they were nice toher.
Yeah, good one, Alejandro, Getit.
You do hope that they were niceto her.
(08:31):
It seems as if they wereaccepting, but not open
necessarily.
Speaker 7 (08:38):
Yeah, but what do they want?
She's supposed to bring hergirlfriend home and make out on
the couch.
Speaker 5 (08:43):
Well, no, but normal relationships.
I mean.
Come on, you got to be a littlebit.
Speaker 7 (08:46):
You know toning down a little for your parents.
Speaker 5 (08:48):
Well, I'm not saying have sex on the couch with a
woman in front of your mother,but I am saying maybe you could
have a girlfriend over fordinner, as normal couples would
have their spouse or theirsignificant other over for
dinner.
Speaker 7 (09:00):
Then put on some girl-on-girl porn.
Speaker 5 (09:02):
Well Then put on some girl-on-girl porn.
You're just making it all aperversion for your sexual
fantasies.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
It's not the act.
Okay, it's who they are.
I know, I know.
So, yeah, official records theyconfirm that she's from Los
Angeles, her dad is from Texasand her mother is from
California, and thesediscrepancies have led to
confusion about her true origins.
Friends and associates havenoted that Harris shared
different stories and itcontributed to the enigmatic
(09:30):
nature of her personal life.
Speaker 5 (09:32):
Okay.
Can she tell the truth?
Speaker 1 (09:34):
This is what we definitely know for sure Zero
connections to Jamaica or theCaribbean islands.
She was, in fact, a lesbian.
By some accounts, her parentswere actually super supportive
of it.
Okay, so it wasn't just a wildrumor that she was a lesbian no,
okay she.
She blamed them for not beingokay with it because they were
conservative caribbean folk.
But that's all bullshit, okay,she was actually kind of rich
(09:57):
growing up.
She went to a well-to-doprivate boarding school, um, and
I was gonna say that shemisrepresented these facts.
But let's call it what itreally is.
She just straight up lied aboutpretty much everything.
Speaker 5 (10:07):
Misrepresented Is acting a crime.
Speaker 1 (10:10):
That's, you know, not yet I'm almost you know.
But being weird and giving afake background story to your
friends.
That's what.
Speaker 7 (10:16):
Steve Renn is easy Dad.
Speaker 5 (10:19):
What's a friend other than a future enemy?
You?
Speaker 6 (10:21):
never want to know.
Speaker 5 (10:24):
You can't have everybody know the truth all the
time, because next thing youknow they're plotting against
you.
Everyone's got to havedifferent information.
When they come together at yourfuneral and then they're like
holy shit, that makes thefuneral a fun one.
Speaker 7 (10:37):
There's different versions of this, of course, but
usually it stays as a stagepersona, but it sounds like with
her she was putting it in herpersonal life too.
Right, what?
Speaker 5 (10:48):
have we learned from the Israeli military?
The whole world is a stage.
Speaker 1 (10:52):
Right, it's true, the theater of operations is what
they call it, oh.
Speaker 5 (10:57):
I love that theater.
It's one of my favorite playsOperations.
Speaker 1 (11:00):
People's heads get blown up like a fucking grape,
good God, uh.
People's heads get blown uplike a fucking grape, good god,
uh.
So this is also to your point,ben.
This is something people do ona regular basis, like I know
rich people that have grown uprich and they pretend they're
poor because they feel like theyget more clout, hate it.
Uh, it's very annoying, likeanna nicole smith yeah, people
will not let us have that.
(11:20):
What do you mean?
They think that we're lyingabout anna nicole smith not
being like being middle class orbeing well off early in life.
Speaker 7 (11:26):
She would always be like I grew up dirt poor.
Yeah, but she didn't huh, Notat all.
It was a normal upbringing.
Speaker 5 (11:35):
One person's normal upbringing is another person's
poverty, though.
We're from Wisconsin, so we'llbe like we're doing pretty good,
pulling in about 70, 75k a year, but they say in Los Angeles
that would be below the povertyline.
Yeah, you make a good point,but I think Anna Nicole Smith
grew up in Texas or somethingshe did.
Yeah, Point muted.
Speaker 1 (11:53):
Yeah, she also told friends in adulthood that she
had a very traumatic childhoodthat included potential abuse
from quote, a regular visitor tothe house, which is assumed to
be an uncle, though details areunclear due to the difficulty of
verifying her stories, as sheoften embellished details about
her life.
There's no concrete informationabout these allegations.
Speaker 5 (12:15):
Well, I will say, as someone who has worked with a
lot of people that have gonethrough that and in many ways
dealt with it myself you make upshit as a way to escape, so it
might that very well could betrue.
And then she's like, well, I'mnot, miss clee, I'm not whatever
her real name is yuri I'm notyuri, I'm millie, you know, and
(12:35):
so maybe that's a form ofdisassociation on her part good
point plus could be dealing withher sexuality.
Speaker 7 (12:42):
that is, another, yeah, perhaps another,
personality to her that sheseparated in some ways.
Right, I think she has themaking of a great psychic, oh
yeah.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
She also told people like Alejandro mentioned earlier
that her biological mothercould not take care of her, so
she gave her away to a woman whopromised to take care of her
and put her through a reallygood all-girl boarding school.
Her friends don't even know ifthe story's true, but that's
what she ended up tellingeverybody.
Either way, regardless of pastbeing true or not true, she did
(13:13):
go on to have a future, you guys?
Yes, she did so from LosAngeles.
The next place we see her popup is Seattle Washington, and I
feel like this is a breedingground for con artists.
Speaker 5 (13:24):
Seattle's an interesting spot for it.
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Yeah, yeah I, um, I.
This is where I met someone whowas a con artist in my life.
Yeah, and I remember getting atext when I was out working one
day and I get this video of agirl masturbating, being like I
miss you, oh, and I go.
Who is this?
I didn't recognize the hand orthe vagina that was in the yeah,
interesting video and I'm likeI get home and I show my
(13:47):
roommate.
I'm like dude, someone.
I don't even know what to sayto this girl.
I was like I'm gonna call her.
He's like oh, they probablywon't pick up.
I call the number and hedoesn't know.
But I see a phone light up inhis fucking dresser drawer.
What?
Yeah, he's like they probablywon't pick up and he's like but
he's acting weird, wait, yourroommate called you with a wait.
Speaker 5 (14:06):
Your roommate sexted you.
Speaker 1 (14:08):
Yes Saying send me a picture of you jerking off.
Why would they do that?
Because he's a fucking weirdoand he still does comedy.
I'm not going to say his name,people might figure it out.
But these people think I'mweird for not hanging out with
him because he's so nice.
And people think like theydon't see that.
Speaker 5 (14:24):
I don't know, buddy, we'll talk about that.
Off air, that's an off airthat's an off air.
No, that's an on air People.
Speaker 7 (14:29):
The gist is, his roommate probably wanted to see
Kyle's nudes then.
Yes, so he was pretending to besome chick, but he's also.
But also he probably wants toexploit him later.
Speaker 5 (14:49):
Never assume they, like you People in the
entertainment business, have nomorality.
You don't say Biggest kind ofall-time Starbucks Seattle.
Not good coffee.
I'm sorry, dunkey, you're myboy.
Speaker 7 (15:03):
But they did have Kurt Cobain.
Speaker 5 (15:05):
That is true.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Oh boy.
So what she becomes known forin Seattle is directing and
producing and performing inproductions at the Langston
Hughes Theater.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
So she is an actor.
Yeah, this is my Okay.
Speaker 1 (15:21):
No, you're way ahead of the ball here.
Okay, as always, you're nailingit.
Speaker 7 (15:26):
There's a venn diagram and it's acting, and
psychics and scumbaggery isright there in the middle and at
this point, when she's puttingon plays at this theater, that's
exactly what she should bedoing with her talent.
Yeah, nobody's hurt, you know.
Speaker 1 (15:43):
Yeah, yet her acting uh associates, cohorts,
co-actors and actresses.
Uh, they found her to be verytrustworthy and honest and a
good person.
But that's also the sign of acon artist is no one's ever been
ripped off by an asshole.
It's always a very nice person.
That gets you.
You know you don't feel as uh.
Speaker 5 (16:03):
You feel good about it.
Yeah, you feel great about it,exactly.
Speaker 7 (16:05):
Yeah, like the music man that's who shows up.
Speaker 1 (16:09):
So she was active in the Seattle theater community
under the name Ree Paris, and in1996, she wrote and starred in
a play titled For Women Only,portraying a Jamaican woman
named.
Speaker 5 (16:20):
Cleo, oh my, are you kidding me?
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Origin story Hello.
So she created Miss Cleo for aplay in Seattle.
Speaker 5 (16:29):
I love this.
Speaker 7 (16:31):
Yeah, how great would it have been to see that play
the beginning of an empire.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Yeah, In 1997, Harris produced and performed in two
additional plays at the LangstonHughes Performing Arts Center
Summer Rhapsody and Supper ClubCafe.
Speaker 5 (16:46):
Oh, exciting.
Speaker 1 (16:47):
However, these productions faced financial
difficulties, and this is wherethings start to fall off all off
the wagon here.
Speaker 7 (16:55):
And, if I'm not mistaken, she talked in her
normal American voice offstagewith her theater company,
correct she?
What, offstage, like all thepeople that worked with her at
this theater, knew her as thisAmerican girl, not jamaican
woman.
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 5 (17:13):
Yeah, she wasn't going full.
Andy kaufman, uh, jim carrey,andy kaufman.
She wasn't miss cleo off stageyet yet, yeah, she wasn't like.
Speaker 7 (17:21):
Thank you very much oh big.
Speaker 5 (17:27):
What a show that was.
Speaker 1 (17:28):
So she ended up having her last hurrah.
She did the Supper Club Cafeand she was directing that, and
so she was in charge of payingeverybody.
Speaker 5 (17:38):
Oh no, that's not dope.
You don't want that.
Speaker 1 (17:40):
You get the rake, you pay it out, right, so she
didn't pay it out Right.
Speaker 5 (17:46):
Yeah, maybe not the best person to be in charge of
the finances.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
Yeah, and what she did do was tell everybody that
she had bone cancer.
Oh, went that route, and thenshe skipped town and she would
have crushed early days of allthe GoFundMes.
Speaker 5 (18:03):
Oh absolutely Before GoFundMe kind of cracked down on
that, which still a lot slippedthrough, she would have been
loaded yes, she would have beenall over that.
Speaker 7 (18:11):
Call me now and fund me life.
Fund me now.
Fund me next vacation you knowshe deserves a vacation I'm not
saying I don't want to hang outwith her.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
That's my problem right, oh yeah you'll get to
this when you saw thedocumentary right kyle.
Speaker 7 (18:27):
yes, she had quite the friend group I'm sure she
did Multifaceted.
Speaker 1 (18:32):
Yeah, so she provided letters citing the exact
amounts owed to each individualand said that she would pay them
after her medical expenses.
Oh, my God, and everyone saidthat money never came.
Speaker 5 (18:43):
This is an IOU for it .
What was the car from Dumb andDumber?
Oh yeah, never came.
This is an iou for it.
What was the car from dumb anddumber?
Oh, you're gonna want to holdon to that.
Speaker 7 (18:50):
She literally dumb and dumbered it you know how
cruel is that, though, to put ona show and make all these
starving artists work for free,when I think they're getting
paid yeah, oh, it's brutal,that's.
Speaker 1 (19:02):
That's a con, that's a con yes, um yes that is a
crime.
That's no longer acting, that'sconning, yeah uh, these
experiences in seattle's theaterscene were instrumental in
shaping the miss cleo personathat we all saw on tv as part of
the campaign for the psychicreaders network, which I didn't
(19:24):
realize.
She was just a spokesperson.
I thought she started it.
I thought she was the personand it was her company.
She, it was not.
So again, how was acting acrime?
Speaker 5 (19:34):
so that's now.
Speaker 1 (19:35):
I'm back to the same theory it really does come up to
me now where I'm just like okay, she was flow.
We all know flow is not flow,right, actress?
Speaker 5 (19:44):
yeah, she's not in charge of your progressive.
By the way, the other day I sawthe little guy.
Yeah, one of our local haunts.
No, not Peter Dinklage.
She said little guy.
Yeah, I'm talking about the guyfrom Progressive, non sequitur,
peter Dinklage.
I saw Peter Dinklage.
Speaker 1 (19:59):
I didn't see Peter Dinklage Megan, for no reason.
He's not DeVito.
Speaker 5 (20:03):
No, the little guy from the progressive commercial.
Oh, okay, funny little guy Tiny.
Yeah, but he's also not.
He's just an actor too.
That's true.
They should all be in prisonthen.
Miss Cleo's in prison and dead.
Speaker 7 (20:14):
They should all be dead, no they should not be At
the Psychic Friends Network,though they started off with a
totally different woman Right Atthe start, and it was just some
like white woman talking in hernormal voice.
Speaker 5 (20:28):
Boring.
That's not going to get me tocall in.
What the hell does she know?
She looks like the person I'mgoing to call and complain about
.
Speaker 7 (20:33):
And then Ree Harris, or whatever the hell her name is
, walks in saying she's MissCleo, Like where do I stand for
the audition now?
And they're like you're hired.
Speaker 1 (20:45):
Well, Psychic Friends Network is a different one.
There were so many of them.
Psychic Readers Network therewas a whole bunch.
Speaker 7 (20:48):
Yeah, was Psychic Friends, the one with Dionne
Warwick.
Let me see, remember when shewas.
Speaker 5 (20:53):
Of course I do.
Speaker 1 (20:55):
This was the heyday, it was Dionne Warwick.
Oh God, yeah, and.
Speaker 5 (20:58):
Linda Georgian and Dionne Warwick.
A hell of a singer.
Speaker 7 (21:01):
Yeah, see that, the worst one, dm warwick, because
she was trusted you.
Yeah, she was so wellestablished, a legend in the
music industry, and she used allthat goodwill to sell these
psychic.
I think there's outlines.
Speaker 1 (21:16):
I think there's one worse what billy d williams?
Speaker 7 (21:19):
yeah, oh my career like oh him and dion were
essentially the same, then theyhad the same goodwill.
Yeah, I don't necessarily agreewith the very premise you guys
are speaking fromwill.
Speaker 5 (21:25):
Yeah, I don't necessarily agree with the very
premise you guys are speakingfrom, really, because I don't
know if psychic networks areinherently bad, what if they
make you feel good?
They definitely make you feelgood.
But I mean, obviously it's the10 minutes 10 a minute.
Yeah, you know, it begins to belike am I calling someone in
prison?
What's going on?
They all make you feel good, isthat bad?
Speaker 1 (21:46):
they all said the people working.
They referred to them aspsychic sweatshops.
Ah, and they said that, uh, thepeople who would call would be
regular callers all the time.
Oh, they chase that high oflike.
Oh, I'm gonna get good newstoday, got you so?
Speaker 5 (21:59):
it becomes very predatory it's very desperate
and predatory.
Speaker 7 (22:02):
Yeah, and that's where it becomes bad, because
the 900 numbers charged by theminute and these were people
with serious psychologicalissues right, right right and
very, extremely lonely and sothen, they're paying all this
money to someone that ispretending to be a psychic yeah,
(22:22):
it's like when you get an emailfrom adam schiff.
Speaker 5 (22:25):
Remember that during the election I got so many
goddamn emails from politiciansthat I'm like who was the
poorest sap giving them sevendollars every time because
they're like this is the lastwe're gonna need, and they start
crying and I think that's moremanipulative than this perhaps.
Speaker 7 (22:38):
Yeah, politics is a worse way, worse animal praise
on the saddest of the sad yeah,by the way, speaking of dm
warwick and billy d williams,remember kenny kingston no no
you guys don't remember kennykingston.
Who's kenny kingston?
He was he was right up there.
What, yeah, wouldn't you wantto call that guy?
Speaker 1 (23:00):
let's for advice we need the people at home to see
this I don't know, was that a?
Speaker 5 (23:05):
I'm from wisco like you.
I don't remember Kenny Kingsman.
Speaker 7 (23:09):
Oh yeah, he was as ubiquitous as the Riddler guy.
Speaker 1 (23:14):
Oh, that dude With the question mark suit.
Speaker 5 (23:17):
Yeah, this guy looks like he's got the same haircut
as the owner of the Los AngelesRaiders.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Pumpkin pie haircut.
Speaker 5 (23:24):
Yeah, that little Prince Pomperoy, yeah.
Speaker 7 (23:26):
It looks like Orville Redenbacher if he smoked crack.
Speaker 5 (23:33):
Yeah, instead of eating the popcorn, I watched a
documentary on Orville.
Apparently he really did lovepopcorn.
Speaker 7 (23:39):
What you don't say yeah, you loved it, chris loved
it.
The shocker is he hated popcorn.
Speaker 5 (23:45):
That's what I kind of thought it was Popcorn.
You ruined my life.
I'm more than popcorn.
It's like no, you're notOrville, yeah.
Speaker 7 (23:53):
In the documentary we're referring to, call Me Miss
Cleo.
That is on Max Okay, adocumentary about her, and in
that they interview some of thepeople that worked at the
Psychic Network, and all of themwere just guys and gals off the
street and so not.
So not, of course not okay andyou know how we were just
(24:15):
talking about.
Like people with seriousproblems would would call in and
really need help.
Yeah well, these workers feltbad, but yet they would still
have to pretend to give themadvice and, at the end of the
day, these people didn't care ifthey were psychics or not,
because they just needed someoneto talk to.
Speaker 6 (24:32):
Yeah, oh sad.
Speaker 7 (24:33):
And one guy had a persona.
What was it?
Like Cassandra.
He's like I'm Samantha from theSouth.
Oh, my goodness.
Speaker 1 (24:39):
But it was clearly a guy Like I closed my eyes to see
if it could be a woman.
It wasn't and he's smiling.
People really liked cassandra.
She really liked samantha.
It's probably really offensiveto people who born in the south
in america, but that's literallywhat he was saying here's the
other thing to think about withthe psychic readers network is
that you see miss cleo on tv.
Speaker 7 (24:58):
She's like call me now.
And you're like, oh cool, Iwant to talk to miss cleo.
So you dial in.
You're not going to get misscleo, you don't get miss cleo no
, you don't get miss cleo, soyou get this guy pretending to
be samantha cassandra from thesouth, and so some people,
though were, would be encouragedto kind of talk in a jamaican
accent to get cool, yeah, okaythat was part of the work that
(25:20):
people would be like well, whatif people are asking if they
want to talk to miss cleobecause that's she says, call me
now.
Speaker 1 (25:24):
They're not calling one of us now and uh, they said
they were supposed to be likejust put the phone away from and
be like is miss cleo here?
Speaker 7 (25:31):
like oh no, she just stepped out, sorry you got me
interesting but then they wouldkeep them on hold to make them
pay more money.
Oh my goodness oh, that'shorrible, so we have a clip here
from one of the people thatworked at the hotline.
Speaker 6 (25:45):
Yes, Yo, big up to you them way out of Kingston.
We wake up this morning and wesee the thing tunnel Internet
gone mad.
Speaker 5 (25:57):
Respect.
You don't know, I'm so far withthe yard Booyah, booyah, urgh.
Speaker 6 (26:04):
Big ups that is horrible.
Speaker 5 (26:07):
That is the worst accent I have ever heard.
Speaker 7 (26:09):
Oh my goodness, Full disclosure.
That was actually Chet Hayes.
Oh my God, Tom Hanks' son.
Yeah, His name's.
Speaker 5 (26:17):
Chet Hayes.
Speaker 1 (26:18):
Chet Hayes, Chet Hanks, who knows?
Speaker 7 (26:20):
Oh, you don't know about that.
I don't know anything aboutthat family.
Just Google Chet Hayes,Jamaican sometime.
Speaker 5 (26:26):
I do know that he fell in love with a Jamaican gal
and then he couldn't stop,couldn't stop the patois.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Okay, so here's the commercials that we all know.
Speaker 8 (26:36):
You have questions, I have the answers.
Who asked you to go out of town?
The stupid young one or themarried one?
The married one, that's what Ithought.
Don't go, you hear me.
If you want him to believe thatit's over, then you got to stop
accepting the booty calls at 2am in the morning.
People have been criticized andjabbed at and talked about
throughout the ages for havingdifferent beliefs, and
(26:59):
apparently I am no exception.
Although it is a constantchallenge, I will continue.
I will not allow them to stopme.
I will teach as a shaman andhelp those who seek the
knowledge.
Speaker 5 (27:12):
She went straight shaman at the end, huh.
Speaker 1 (27:14):
Shango shaman is what she called herself.
Really yeah, she's from a lineof Shango shamans.
No kidding.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
All right.
Speaker 7 (27:22):
Yeah, and you couldn't ask her too many
questions about where she camefrom.
Speaker 5 (27:27):
Well, obviously not Me, don't know.
Also, the accent definitelydropped when she said the words
booty call.
Yeah, they should have.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
Booty call.
It's just a booty call.
She called herself Miss Cleo.
She should have been calledMiss Remembran.
Speaker 5 (27:38):
Oh, okay.
Speaker 1 (27:39):
I'm just laughing.
Speaker 5 (27:40):
Remembran Is this thing on.
Speaker 1 (27:42):
I don't get it.
Speaker 4 (27:43):
remembering her past, oh it's always the best when
you explain them that's for thefolks at home.
Speaker 7 (27:51):
You're welcome really funny I think that she wanted
everyone to believe that shematerialized out of thin air.
Yeah, through mystic power.
Speaker 5 (27:59):
It was the 90s.
No one knew where you came from, where you went.
You just you entered andextended people's lives
willy-nilly yeah, and I'm intime of american freedom oh for
sure, and it was prosperous,yeah, yeah.
Speaker 7 (28:12):
I think, though, really be like if you're calling
the number, you're paying themoney.
Do you really want to talk tokenny kingston?
You want to talk to someonelike miss cleo?
Of course, that's why it worksso well a psychic named kenny.
Speaker 5 (28:24):
Yeah, what the fuck I'll go listen to your like folk
band maybe, but I'm notlistening to you giving me
advice.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
I'm your masseuse, frankie.
No, thank you, fuck out of here.
Okay, so we need a clip of.
What do we need a clip of rightnow?
Speaker 7 (28:45):
What would you like a clip of?
Oh, the parodies.
Oh, yes, Because this you werejust saying before the show.
It must have been huge, becausewe in Wisconsin heard of her.
Speaker 5 (28:54):
Yeah, I realized if I heard about anybody from
Stevens Point, wisconsin, afterI left, they were mega stars,
but at the time you're just likewell, I guess they just know
Stevens Point, wisconsin.
Yeah, like no, they don't, theyjust know Peter Weller.
Oh my God, robocop from myhometown, robo Me, mimi Bobeck,
peter Weller, I still think I'min the top five of the most
famous people from Stevens Point.
(29:14):
Hey, I think no one told methat let's go, but you know,
whatever, and I'm still not evenin the top to make their
careers by ruining mine.
Hey that's great.
Speaker 7 (29:31):
What a level of celebrity Uh yes, so yeah, she
was huge, she was everywhere.
Early two thousands.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
She was being parodied and that's the
documentary said.
That's when you know you'vemade it.
Speaker 7 (29:41):
When people start parodying, yes, like people get
upset about it, but it's like no, get upset about it, but it's
like no, that's when you're nextlevel, famous right so.
Speaker 5 (29:50):
So here's deborah wilson on mad tv.
Oh, I love this.
This is actually a great sketchyeah operators are standing by.
Speaker 8 (29:56):
Oh, and we have our very first caller.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Hello caller hello, is this cleo?
Yes, baby, it is.
Oh, you're the one that can seeinto the future.
Speaker 8 (30:06):
yes, yes, darling, you got the right, cleo oh honey
, can I ask you a question?
Speaker 3 (30:11):
What Was you working on September the 10th?
Speaker 5 (30:16):
Oh my God, oh my God, that's hilarious.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Well, yes, yes yes, really, you didn't see anything
strange going to happen on thatnext day.
Speaker 8 (30:34):
Um no.
Speaker 5 (30:37):
That is hilarious, Matt TV.
It had its moments.
Speaker 1 (30:40):
There's something that actually kind of happened
like that with the psychic.
Do you remember Sylvia Brownthat used to go on Montel?
Yes, of course, Hi, Montel.
There was a woman who wentthere that wanted to speak to
her husband in the afterlife andshe's like, oh, I see him
drowning and she's like he diedin the Twin Towers on September
11th.
Speaker 4 (30:57):
Oh my.
Speaker 1 (30:57):
God.
And she goes do you think therecould have been some water in
there and they were like no.
Speaker 7 (31:04):
And Montel was trying so hard to make it work.
Yeah, you know, maybe he wasdrowning in the smoke or
something.
Speaker 1 (31:11):
Maybe he knocked over a cup of water the end of her
career.
Speaker 7 (31:15):
She was even worse though.
She was worse, she would talkto victims' families and try to
pretend like she knew.
Speaker 1 (31:23):
Like help the police.
Yeah, Told parents that a girlwas murdered when she wasn't.
Speaker 5 (31:28):
Oh, my goodness, she's dead.
Yes, he died.
Give up.
South park did a great.
Uh, I don't even think it was aparody, it's just a straight up
skewering of crossing over.
Anthony edwards, not anthonyedwards jonathan edwards
jonathan edwards.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
John edwards, yeah, yeah, because, yeah, people were
really desperate yeah, and he'sthe worst too, like he'll be,
like, uh, be like someone with agrandfather, with a ERMFL.
Speaker 5 (31:50):
Yeah, someone whose grandfather is older than them?
Anyone, anyone.
Do you have a child?
Speaker 7 (31:56):
younger than you, and they prey on people who are
grieving.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
Yeah, it's brutal, and then in that case I think he
also had audience plants.
That whole thing was a ruse,yeah so it becomes so massive.
Speaker 1 (32:10):
Uh, she's literally just the face of the company.
So I have more sympathy for forwhat comes next, because what
ended up happening is thepsychic readers network.
They were getting so many callsand they would have, you know,
maybe some fraudulent callswhere you know you see the
commercial and then you're a kidand you think it's funny to
(32:30):
call the Psychic Readers Network, sure, and then your parents
are on the hook to pay for that,of course, and then parents
would say, hey, fuck you, I'mnot paying that.
Speaker 5 (32:38):
This is the modern day equivalent of in-game
purchases.
Oh, okay, where all of a sudden, your credit card is is $50,000
and you're like, why, oh, youneed a new sleeve for your Call
of Duty firearm.
I need skins, bro.
I need skin.
I wanted to be family guy.
Speaker 7 (32:52):
Did you both call the psychic line?
At least once we would call.
Speaker 5 (32:56):
Christian lines and do that whole thing.
So, we would make fun of it,but those were free.
Speaker 1 (33:01):
Yeah, maybe a couple of sex lines, but not really I
just racked up a 2500 bill on411, looking for the contact
information for billy joearmstrong, because that green
day I wanted to invite them toplay my birthday party.
I was like seven years old.
2500 back in the day.
(33:23):
If you called 411 in anotherstate it would charge you so
much more so and.
I kept calling over and overand they kept saying no and I
was like, well, you just don'tknow what you're talking about.
Speaker 7 (33:31):
Wow.
Speaker 1 (33:32):
Was it paid?
Oh, my dad ended up having topay it.
I was there what?
He had part-time visitationrights, so every two weeks I
would go over and the mail cametwo weeks later and he's like
who the fuck?
Speaker 5 (33:44):
got 411?
.
Speaker 7 (33:46):
It's like Buzz at the end of Home Alone.
Yeah, literally, kevin.
Speaker 5 (33:50):
For some reason that part-time visitation went away.
I don't know why.
Speaker 7 (33:55):
Yeah, I only racked up a $25 bill because I hung up
right away.
Speaker 5 (33:59):
Oh man, you really, you cursed that poor man.
Speaker 7 (34:02):
Yeah, that's weird, though they were at such expense
Like it wouldn't cost that muchto get green day to play at the
party, probably yeah, well, youknow, I tried, lessons learned.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
I'll see him someday.
Yes, um, and so those ended upbecoming collections sent to
collection agencies.
The collection agencies wouldsend a demand letter to the
parents and they would be signedby cleo they.
Speaker 5 (34:29):
Oh okay, so who's ever in charge?
Speaker 1 (34:31):
kind of set her up to be the fall guy she that's like
progressive saying hey, you oweus for money and it's signed by
flow it's yeah, exactly.
Speaker 7 (34:37):
No, that's a spokesperson it's signed by tony
the tiger yeah, right.
Speaker 1 (34:43):
So there's some attorneys in florida that I've
just they've had enough and theyrealized that the psychicic
Readers Network is based inBroward County.
So in 2002, florida, attorneyGeneral, bob Butterworth that's
a good name, bob Butterworth BobButterworth's in town, and
you're not getting away withthis shit anymore, any relation
to the missus.
Speaker 5 (35:02):
Could be.
If I go to fucking prison forlife because of Bob Butterworth,
I'm going to be so pissed off.
I'll be like what did you do?
Well, I stole a bunch ofpancakes and bob butterworth
came after me.
Kai, doesn't let you get anypancakes for free in this
goddamn town, christ so becausethey were signed by cleo the
they, florida attorney general,bob butterworth.
Speaker 1 (35:23):
He sued fictional character miss cleo for
violating the state's deceptiveand unfair trades practices act
it's florida.
Speaker 5 (35:30):
Yeah, have you been to florida?
Speaker 1 (35:31):
they've sued a fictional character at this
point oh my god so that's howthey got her in.
They roped her in because shesigned the, the uh demand
letters, but they found outthrough depositions and all that
that she didn't sign it yeahthey were clearly just fucking
her over.
Speaker 7 (35:47):
They foraged it so but I want to know is what did
it say?
Actually?
Did it say, miss cleo?
Speaker 1 (35:52):
yes, so then the lawsuit was based on.
Since they named her name, theywent and did a background check
and they realized that her namewas yuri harris and so that
came out in the news and it likeput a huge hole in her career
right, because she was no longerseen as this jamaican shango
there was shaman, there was anera, an era of kayfabe, where
(36:14):
kayfabe still lived.
Yeah, kayfabe being thefictional world that we all
agree to in the wrestling worldexactly, okay, I was just
pretending to understand before,but he just lets it fly out.
Oh, come on believe.
Speaker 5 (36:28):
It's like when you believe in batman verse like, oh
okay yeah, you don't believe inthat?
Speaker 7 (36:32):
yeah, all right, that makes sense now thank you.
Speaker 5 (36:34):
I believe that if I saw robert pattinson I'd be like
what are you doing up in theday, don't you have to sleep.
Speaker 7 (36:39):
Fight crime tonight, yeah we have a clip, remember,
of the lawsuit.
Yeah, I was portrayed in themedia.
Speaker 1 (36:45):
Yes, so the state of florida.
They sued, they subpoenaed formiss cleo's birth certificate
and other records.
The state prosecutors uh haddepositions with miss cleo about
her background.
Uh, miss cleo's attorney arguedthat the lawsuit was
politically motivated and thecase was closed later that year
after miss cleo and thecompanies worked uh out a deal.
(37:06):
Okay, uh, the charges were.
They alleged that miss cleo'sclaims were deceptive.
So the lawyer was like youcan't just say you're a psychic
network and then write on thebottom of the commercial for
entertainment purposes.
Only you can.
You're still lying to thepeople, but you're not.
I agree with you.
Speaker 7 (37:23):
Yeah, yeah, I don't know about this one.
Like it's morally it's terrible, yeah, but is it really illegal
?
Is it a?
Speaker 1 (37:31):
crime.
Yeah, so here's the birthcertificate saga.
Speaker 6 (37:36):
It's about her birth certificate, which shows her to
have been born in Los Angeles toAmerican parents to keep it
purposely vague.
Speaker 2 (37:44):
You may have this birth certificate, but is it
accurate?
Well, yeah, I mean I can'tdispute that, but there are lots
of reasons why I speak with aJamaican accent and I'm really
from Jamaica, but doesn't thisdocument prove otherwise?
I mean, that's how thedeposition went.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
It's a fairly straightforward question Is she
or is she not from Jamaica?
Speaker 6 (38:07):
She is from Jamaica in as much as this is her lawyer
yeah, and he's drowning he isfrom jamaica in as much as
anyone who has jamaican ties tothat country or to any other
country that they claim theyspeak.
She speaks with the jamaicanaccent and um as as much of
(38:29):
jamaican as anyone that claimsthat country are their culture
it's a lot.
Speaker 5 (38:34):
You know, it's like very intense music considering
what we're doing here.
But okay, they're, they're onit.
Yeah, they are the perp waterand everything.
Yeah, what about the peoplethat were the financiers of this
whole thing?
That's the big.
Who are they?
Speaker 7 (38:46):
they?
They are Steven Fedder andPeter Stoltz.
They're the ones that startedPsychic Friends Network and
hired Miss Cleo.
Speaker 5 (38:54):
What happened to them ?
Speaker 7 (38:55):
Well, I'm sure Kyle will tell us.
Psychic Readers Network.
What did I say, friends?
Oh, I keep saying.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Psychic Friends.
But this is what they do.
This is deception.
They were trying to get you tothink you're on the same company
.
Speaker 7 (39:06):
Well, it worked.
Yeah, because it you know it'slike WCW and WWF.
Speaker 5 (39:12):
It's not at all like that.
Speaker 7 (39:14):
I guess I'm not.
I can't talk about wrestling noyou can't, because you hate it.
Speaker 5 (39:19):
I don't hate it.
You openly criticize wrestlingand it's very difficult.
Speaker 7 (39:21):
Do not hate it at all .
Speaker 5 (39:23):
I love it now.
They're young for us and theyentertain us.
Speaker 1 (39:26):
I've been flipped.
We watched Royal Rumble lastnight Great, really fun.
I went to bed early and nowwe're going to watch the news
about Miss Cleo and the lawsuithere.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
If you're up in the middle of the night channel
surfing, you may come across oneof those infomercials that
promises you to put you in touchwith a psychic.
Most viewers probably just keepon surfing, but those who stop
and call in, well, they're putin touch with something.
All right, A telephone bill.
Way beyond what they probablyexpected.
All right, bro, call in.
Speaker 8 (39:56):
Call now for free trail reading and discover the
truth today.
Call me now.
Speaker 3 (40:01):
Call now and try it for free.
Well, here's one she justdidn't see coming.
A legal fight with thegovernment is in the cards for
Ms Cleo.
Speaker 4 (40:10):
Ms Cleo calls herself a psychic, so you'd think she
would have seen this one coming.
Speaker 5 (40:14):
Oh, shut it I think she should have seen it coming.
Speaker 7 (40:15):
I hate you, anderson Cooper, so we knew.
But then you probably knew thatanyway, didn't you, hey
Hundreds?
Speaker 3 (40:21):
of people have complained about a so-called
free tarot card reading.
Speaker 7 (40:31):
One.
They were charged.
That's a bet.
Speaker 5 (40:37):
Oh, there's Bob, that's Butterworth, that's
Butterworth right there.
Oh my God, not very butterySlippery fingered Butterworth.
A good tarot card reading doesgo about $100.
Speaker 7 (40:51):
No, but it was advertised as being free.
Yeah, call for your freereading.
So that's the problem?
Speaker 5 (40:57):
Yeah, there's no free meals, not in America, Not even
if you go to school and there'sa lunch.
It's kind of a problem actually.
Speaker 7 (41:03):
Do you think when that guy yells at his rebellious
teenage son, he says you needto start acting like a
butterworth?
The name means something.
Speaker 5 (41:15):
Damn it yeah yeah, what is this in my house?
Is this margarine?
I never thought I'd have a sonwho brought margarine into this
home.
Oh, we're butterworths, damn itso stupid the psychic readers
network.
Speaker 1 (41:35):
Uh, they did say that call for your free reading,
right, I see?
so that was the problem yeah,the callers were that were
taking the calls.
They were given a script toread from a computer program uh,
to simulate a tarot card spread.
The first three minutes werefree, but the callers were
charged after that.
So the game was keep them onthe line.
I got you.
They were told 18 minutes.
(41:56):
Is the the like, the good zone?
Keep them right around 18.
You can go longer.
Once you get them at 18, thenyou keep them on.
And what was it?
A minute?
Uh, five bucks, 4.99 so99.
Speaker 5 (42:07):
Oh my God, yeah, that's coming in fast, that
money.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
The 90s the minimum wage the callers were only
getting, maybe minimum wage$5.50?
.
Yeah exactly, so they'regetting hourly what they're
getting in a minute.
Speaker 6 (42:19):
Holy hell.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
Yeah, they were asked for their name and address to
be used for mailers and ads.
They just got everything, allthe information to be used for
mailers and ads.
They were, they just goteverything, all the information.
Um, some callers were told theywere speaking, speaking to miss
cleo, but they were actuallyspeaking with an actor right who
?
Speaker 5 (42:35):
is also miss cleo.
Yeah, that's true.
Yeah, what's the difference,right?
Speaker 1 (42:39):
it's like santa claus you can have different
surrogates yeah, uh, so psychicreaders were not off the hook.
They ended up having to go tocourt, okay, and I believe,
because they're the ones whoactually are the perpetrators
here yeah, exactly, the ftcwasn't having this shit.
They let miss cleo go becausethey realized that she was just
a pawn in the game.
They did so she didn't servetime, nothing.
Speaker 5 (43:01):
No, she didn't have to pay any fines?
Speaker 1 (43:02):
nothing, because they realized that she was getting
completely fucked over.
The lawyer literally was likethe one that was trying to
prosecute her was upset at howbad of a deal that she got.
She wasn't making any money.
I thought she ran away with abillion dollars.
Yeah, she got almost nothing.
They did she didn't.
Yeah, exactly, the PsychicReaders Network took all the
money.
Speaker 5 (43:23):
Who are these assholes again?
Speaker 1 (43:25):
Stoltz and something else.
Fader, fader.
Speaker 5 (43:27):
Steven Fader and Peter Stoltz.
Yeah, what a bunch of schmucks.
Speaker 1 (43:32):
So the FTC came in.
They charged the companies withdeceptive advertising, billing
and collection practices and theFTC alleged that the companies
made over $1 billion using theseshady shyster tricks.
Oh, it makes sense.
Yeah, the companies in wholesettled with the FTC by paying a
five million dollar fine andrefunding some callers okay.
Speaker 5 (43:55):
Yeah, I mean this is different than one of those sex
lines, because the sex lines thegoal was to get it done real
fast.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Yeah, if the first three minutes are free on a sex
line, you can pull that offwhat's what's stopping you from,
like, becoming this major uhscam network if you're gonna
make a billion dollars and thenonly have to pay off five
million?
Speaker 5 (44:15):
Right, and they didn't serve time either.
No, it's just vanity.
Speaker 1 (44:19):
It's like a vanity stat Like, oh, they paid five
million.
Most people are like, oh my God, that's a lot of money.
Speaker 5 (44:23):
So no one went to jail in the scandal.
Speaker 7 (44:26):
Those two guys had to admit to deceptive practices or
something.
If I made a billion, I wouldadmit to anything and
essentially they were arrestedat one point but then they were
back on the golf course bysundown, so it was like a slap
on the wrist.
They did have to stop thePsychic readers network.
Speaker 5 (44:47):
Yes, but that's about it.
Yeah, definitely wasn't the endof psychic infomercials though.
Yeah, no For sure.
Speaker 7 (44:55):
Are they still around ?
Speaker 5 (44:57):
Psychic stuff is everywhere.
Yeah, probably more now thanever.
Speaker 7 (45:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (45:01):
Yeah, the internet is full of that stuff.
Speaker 7 (45:02):
But you don't see it hitting the culture like it did.
Speaker 1 (45:05):
There's a huge one in Massachusetts, Maureen Hancock,
and my mom goes to see her liketwice a year.
Speaker 7 (45:09):
My mom goes to see her like twice a year.
Speaker 1 (45:11):
Oh, okay, yeah, she does like stadium, like huge
theater for people.
Speaker 5 (45:14):
I mean it's kind of fun to see.
Speaker 7 (45:16):
Yeah, okay, I'll have to try it.
Speaker 1 (45:19):
Yeah, so all's well that ends well.
The hole was in the ship.
It went down and Miss Cleo wasdone and she was still.
It was weird she was doinginterviews like well, after the
Psychic Readers Network wentdown and she was still using the
persona.
Speaker 7 (45:36):
Yeah, we have a clip of.
There was a documentary shewanted to put out there to
legitimize her after this fiascohappened.
Speaker 5 (45:45):
Be careful who you pretend to be.
You might just become it.
Speaker 7 (45:48):
So here it is, Miss Cleo without the mask.
Speaker 8 (45:53):
You know, on television.
They wanted me to appear like Ihad just arrived on the scene,
straight out of Bush.
Well, that wasn't the case.
I actually had a higher up.
Tell me one time.
Well, don't tell him you wentto an all-girl boarding school,
why not?
Well, we really don't wantpeople, you, to think that you
(46:15):
know what, that I'm educatedright.
Speaker 5 (46:20):
That's unfortunate, so she's a victim in some ways
here too, I think so, and shekept up the voice after that,
which is interesting yeah, uh,in her final, she passed away
very young.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
She died from colon cancer on July 26, 2016, at the
age of 53.
Speaker 7 (46:38):
And unfortunately, that cancer was real.
Yeah, not like the other one.
She had Right, that means shewas only in her 30s when she was
doing peak mescluny, yeah, Iguess.
Speaker 1 (46:48):
so yeah, wow.
Speaker 7 (46:52):
She was sort of ageless if you think?
About it.
Yeah, yeah, they say that.
Speaker 1 (46:57):
Yeah, she was hospitalized after the cancer
had spread to her liver andlungs, started in the colon.
That chick can move fast.
She was discharged from thehospital and placed in hospice
care and still continued to doreadings privately from her
hospice bed.
Wow, why not For chargingclients up to $100.
Speaker 5 (47:16):
Oh good for her Hustle.
Till the end I've got to get mycolonoscopy in two years.
My doctor told me I'm 43, theysay 45.
Speaker 1 (47:25):
Oh wow, I thought they moved it up.
No, I feel like they just wantto get the younger guys get up
their asses.
Speaker 7 (47:33):
She wasn't too thrilled about the idea of
having to do it, and did youknow that she did it one more
time?
She put on the act oh really,for a 2015 commercial.
We have the clip.
Oh okay, let's see it.
Speaker 8 (47:44):
Miss Cleo is back.
No, do you have silverwaresweet pea?
Oh, my God, you have silverware.
I sent you something other thana knife and a fork.
I have a spoon.
How did you know?
Now I have a vision that youare going to take that spoon and
scoop up a bite of French ToastCrunch.
What All cinnamon and maplesyrup-y?
(48:07):
I can't believe.
You see, all that French ToastCrunch is back and I'm going to
eat it now.
Speaker 1 (48:11):
Oh my God, eat it now .
Speaker 7 (48:14):
Eat it now.
You want to hear somethinginfuriating.
What Stoltz and Fader sued herafter that.
Oh my god she had to stop doingthe character again.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
But that was a joke commercial.
Yeah, that was an actual Frenchtoast crunch commercial.
Speaker 7 (48:29):
That was real.
General Mills paid her.
Speaker 5 (48:32):
Oh, my god, my okay, I was so confused.
Okay, I was confused too.
I didn't know that was ageneral mills commercial.
Speaker 7 (48:38):
Yeah, yeah, and so I was saying in 2015 she did it
one more time.
She got that in before she died, but then she was sued right
after it because those assholesown the persona.
Speaker 1 (48:50):
They own the character.
Yeah, that's what house theysaid.
How bad of a deal she got is.
They actually took thecharacter away from her.
They trademarked it, wow.
Speaker 5 (49:00):
So if they really wanted to, they could send out
another black lady doing thesame.
It shows you just howmainstream that character was.
If Kellogg's or whateverGeneral Mills used it in an ad,
used her in an ad.
Speaker 7 (49:10):
And then it never really left the zeitgeist.
Speaker 1 (49:14):
No, and that used it in an ad, used her in an ad,
right, and it never really leftthe zeitgeist.
No, and that was a year beforeshe died, which is crazy.
Wow, she seemed in decent shapethere, but, um, yeah, they said
that after her tv career ended.
She voiced characters in grandtheft auto vice city, nice.
Um, and, yeah, resurfaced inthe 2014 documentary Hotline
Hotline, indeed, that was beforethe Call Me Miss Cleo, the
(49:36):
documentary about her life thatpremiered on HBO Max December
2022.
And then the last thing that wehave here.
I spent all night trying tofind it.
You can't find anything, butthey did a Lifetime movie on
Miss Cleo.
Oh my God, her Rise and Fall,and all you can find is the
trailer.
Speaker 5 (49:53):
So we will watch that together.
Speaker 8 (49:55):
Don't go blindly through life.
Let me use the power of thetarot to show you the way.
Call me now for your freereading.
Speaker 5 (50:04):
Based on a true story .
Let's make some money this isCleo.
Speaker 8 (50:10):
You're our highest earner ever.
The sky is the limit.
Speaker 7 (50:13):
No one could foresee.
Keep him on the phone.
You're our highest earner ever.
The sky is the limit.
No one could foresee.
Speaker 8 (50:15):
Keep them on the phone.
You got this.
Tell me about your dreams 24million a month.
You're mocking our Jamaicanheritage.
You've been served.
Speaker 5 (50:25):
You do not need a crystal ball to know that the
FTC will stop deceptive tradepractices.
Speaker 8 (50:31):
She's ripping off millions of people.
Speaker 4 (50:34):
I'm paying my bills and taking care of my kids.
I'm not hurting anyone.
Let us talk to the lawyers.
These things blow over.
People put their trust in you,ms Harris, are you even a?
Speaker 5 (50:42):
psychic.
Our name's in the lawsuit, butit's my face.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
Ms Cleo her rise and fall.
Speaker 5 (50:49):
Oh my God man.
Lifetime movies are the best,yeah I, I can't.
Speaker 1 (50:56):
We have to find that somebody please.
Speaker 5 (50:58):
If you find a link, please send it to us at death
and entertainment at gmailcomyes, do use the dark web for
what it's supposed to be usedfor finding old, discontinued
lifetime movies yes, the thingis, it's not old at all, it was
2024.
Yeah, that's crazy.
Speaker 7 (51:12):
It's 11 years old.
That shows you again how muchshe's still around in everyone's
minds For real.
They did mention in thattrailer that Jamaican woman's
like you're making fun of us.
Yeah, that was interesting.
In the Max documentary theyinterviewed Jamaicans and they
(51:34):
all said, oh, we knew it wasfake the moment we heard it Wow,
I'm sure they did.
Speaker 1 (51:38):
It's like when I see a movie and it's a bad Boston
accent.
I'm like that guy.
Nobody else notices.
Speaker 5 (51:42):
Right, oh, go ahead.
It was like the movie Fargo.
If you're from Minnesota, someof the accents are like no, that
ain't right.
Speaker 7 (51:58):
We don't sound like that and I would have no idea.
I thought it was great, theywere pretty good.
They were pretty good, yeah,and then the same went for black
people.
They also knew it was an act.
Speaker 5 (52:01):
But you know who didn't?
White people?
Of course not.
We don't know anything.
Speaker 7 (52:03):
We're like oh yeah, that makes sense and it was
revealed that she had this bigfriend group.
Did you notice something aboutthem?
Speaker 1 (52:09):
kyle well they were black.
No, they were all white laterin life, but the ones in seattle
were all black no, but theyweren't friends.
Speaker 7 (52:17):
They were.
They were the ones that weren'tpaid by.
That's true too.
No, she had this big friendgroup, all white, and they all
said I don't know whateveryone's been saying, because
she always talked in thatjamaican accent around me, so
they all defended her to thedeath that she was really
Jamaican, right, but they allhappen to be white people.
Speaker 5 (52:36):
I love that, so you know Well if you want a great
comedy routine on that.
Cat Williams' White Friends isone of the funniest stand-up
clips of all time.
Speaker 1 (52:45):
Yes, so RIP, miss Cleo.
Speaker 7 (52:48):
Yeah, yeah, you know, she brought some joy she.
So yeah, you know she broughtsome joy?
Speaker 5 (52:51):
Yes, she did, and it's unfortunate that she was a
pawn used by these people toscrew over a lot of innocent Big
time.
Speaker 1 (52:57):
That's why we're going to take it to Final.
Speaker 4 (53:01):
Thoughts.
Speaker 5 (53:02):
I think that Miss Cleo got a raw deal.
I agree, I went in and I waslike, oh, she's probably going
to be somebody horrible.
Speaker 1 (53:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (53:09):
And she was an actress trying to make it in
this crazy world Not easy beinga black gal, specifically in the
90s and before, obviously.
So, yeah, I feel bad for thepeople that called in need of
help and who got completelyscrewed out of tens of thousands
of dollars.
But Ms Cleo, I think she's justa pawn in a very, very bad
(53:31):
machine.
Speaker 7 (53:33):
Yeah, I mean she made a lot of people laugh, she gave
a lot of people advice, but thething is she still needed to
take some responsibility for herrole.
She also was the face of thecon and at some point, I know
she didn't get paid a whole lotunless she stashed money
somewhere, which very well couldbe the case, because think
(53:55):
about it, once it got really big, wouldn't you be like I'm gonna
walk unless you give me thisamount of money?
Speaker 5 (54:02):
I actually think the irony is she kind of got screwed
by the same, by the people thatdid the same thing that she did
to others.
Speaker 7 (54:08):
Yes, yeah, they like basically gave her ious yeah,
and let's not forget, shescrewed over her theater friends
yeah, so it's just a lifetimeof con and it's not like albert
finney and big fish yes, whereit's sweet and sentimental there
are really.
Speaker 1 (54:24):
There's real damage here yeah, there were people
that she victimized and then sheended up being the biggest
victim of all in the whole thingin some ways yeah, uh.
So I did go in thinking thatshe was going to be such a
corrupt scumbag.
But she had her faults, but shealso did get completely screwed
at the biggest point of hercareer.
Speaker 5 (54:41):
So also bob butterworth.
You don't get it.
Speaker 7 (54:44):
Come on, bob yeah, the butterworth family.
Yeah, I'll give you that, Ithink.
I think that it was too big forher.
She didn't realize, I don'tthink, how much she was conning
people.
Speaker 5 (54:58):
Well, you, just sit there in front of a camera.
You don't really realize howbig it can be.
All right, everyone.
Well, thank you so much forlistening to this episode of
Death and Entertainment.
Ben Kissel, Alejandro Dowling,Kyle Plouffe we will be back
with you next week.
Hail yourselves, everyone.
Talk to you soon and until nextweek.
Speaker 7 (55:15):
Don't go dying on us, bye-bye.
Speaker 4 (55:19):
Bye.
You have just heard.
Speaker 3 (55:21):
A true Hollywood murder mystery.
Speaker 1 (55:23):
I have never seen anything like this before.
Speaker 4 (55:26):
The movies, Broadway, music, television, all of it.
Speaker 6 (55:32):
A place that manufactures nightmares.
Speaker 4 (55:35):
Okay, everybody.
That's a wrap.
Good night.
Please drive home carefully andcome back again soon.
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