Loving What's Unloveable

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Episode Transcript

Jim (00:00):
Hello, and welcome to this episode of Decide on Joy, a
podcast coming to you fromHarmony Spiritual Center in Fort
Worth, Texas.
My name is Jim Kova.

Pjae (00:11):
And I'm Reverend Dr.
PJ Stanley.
And welcome aboard

Jim (00:15):
This episode is titled, loving.
What's unlovable?
a, A useful skill for sure.
It's quite useful.
And why do we find some thingsunlovable

Pjae (00:29):
that's it that's a you know what this this Exactly was
talking with some otherministers that I know and
there's just things that we thatgo against our Values that go
against what we believe is,right?
That go against how we thinksociety should be, how we should
treat each other.
And so rather than looking atthe behavior, we look at the

(00:50):
person, and it's hard for us tolove them.
We, you know, we, we separatedifferent kinds of love, like
agape love is supposed to bespiritual high love, and there's
romantic love.
But the bottom line to me isthat no matter what you call it,
if there's not unconditionallove, it's going to go away.
It's going to go away.
And so learning how to loveunconditionally helps with

(01:12):
everything you do, with yourpartnerships, whether it's
business or whether it's romanceor whatever, understanding what
unconditional love means, andthat you have the power to do
that.
It's not, it's not dependentupon what someone else does.
You love them because of who youare.

Jim (01:27):
Right.
So, how do you get to thatplace?
It's because We justautomatically respond to some
people negatively, I think.
We do.
We do.
And it's just, it may not haveanything to do with their values
or what they're actually doing.
It does not.
It's just their,

Pjae (01:45):
their

Jim (01:45):
vibration.
There's something going

Pjae (01:47):
on there.
Correct.
You know, you're immediatelylike,

Jim (01:49):
no, no.
Yeah.
Completely.
So, how do you get From that, towhat we're calling about
unconditional love, what is, howdo you get there?

Pjae (01:59):
Yeah, so, and that's a very good question and it's a
decision like anything else.
It's a decision you decide to doso, and why would you decide to
do so?
The reason why I decided to doso is because I think everyone
comes to the planet lovable.
I think we come as babies.
You think about a baby, they're,and so it ends up being their
circumstances.
Maybe it's something going onwith the way that they think,

(02:21):
the way that their brain works.
It's not that they come here notto be loved.
They come, we all come here tobe loved.
And so, I believe.
And so So I make a decision, achoice, to, to love people
regardless of how they'reshowing up.
But the question is, how do youdo that?
Once you make the decision, thenwhat happens?
And you have to notice, this isa word, this is a phrase that

(02:42):
I'm starting to use now.
I really like it a lot.
You have to notice what you arenoticing.
Like you see things, but youdon't pay attention to it.
So you have to start noticingwhat you are noticing.
And if you are noticingsomething negative about
somebody, you have to stopyourself and say, well, what's
that about?
So you, in each case, you decideon how to get past whatever it

(03:03):
is you're feeling that'snegative, that makes you feel
like you, they're unlovable.
And so you have to, you have toask yourself, what's this about?

Jim (03:10):
So you, you can make that conscious choice and still
perhaps not want to have anextended, Absolutely.
Connection with them.
Absolutely correct.

Pjae (03:21):
Yes.
Being, loving someoneunconditionally is not the same
as having a relationship withsomeone.
It just means, when you look atsomeone and you look at them
with unconditional love, thenthere's forgiveness, there's
compassion, there's a, a, adesire to understand and not
judge.
So that's what that's about.
I, there's a real quick story,when I used to be at living in

(03:42):
Los Angeles, I was a peaceofficer.
There was a gentleman thatwould, that I was working with.
And every time he would stepinto the office, I would just
look at him and be completelyupset.
It's like, oh, I don't, and itshowed in how he was behaving.
And he even said to me one time,he goes, what in the world have
I done to you?
And I thought, what, what in theworld has he done to me?

(04:03):
And I finally, I just looked atit, I just thought about him,
and I thought, what is it?
He reminded me of my father.

Jim (04:09):
Ah.

Pjae (04:11):
And I finally, I told him, I said, listen, it is not your
fault.
It is, this is all me.
It's all me.
You have done nothing wrong.
But as long as you look like mydad, I'm not gonna be able to be
in relationship with you.
And unless you get a plasticsurgery, I think it's over for
us, And so he understood thatand so he understood what I was
telling him.
I apologize for that.
I, is that your fault?
Mm-Hmm.

(04:31):
But it's just the way it is,right?
So you haven't done anythingwrong.
Don't worry about it.
It just is what It's, don'tworry.
And I took, I took ownership of,of what was happening, right?
Yeah.
Right.
Without me,

Jim (04:41):
and.
You could perhapsunconditionally love him, but
not when you were in hispresence.
From afar.
From afar.
It's

Pjae (04:49):
okay.
I say that to people, they thinkI'm joking, but it's, it's
sometimes it just, you just lovepeople from afar.
You know that I have a brother.
He's still my brother eventhough he passed away.
And he was more, more timeshomeless than he was in the
home.
And he was someone that gave mea bridge to understanding

Transcribed by https (05:06):
otter.
ai And maybe not all homesick,but he was gave me a bridge to
be able to see homelessness andnot think it towards, why are
they out there?
There's so many choices.
You know, all the judgments thatwe give, but my brother had a
lot of choices.
He had people who loved him.
He had a wife who loved him,children who loved him, sisters
who loved him.
He didn't want to be in thehome.
It was a choice he made to beout on the street.

(05:28):
He was more comfortable there,no matter how much we loved him.
And so so, so loving someone whowas doing something unlovable.
Or seemingly unlovable gave me abridge to start to understand
some things.
And so I think that's what youhave to kind of look for.
What's the bridge between youand that person?
How are you going to, and again,I'm not advocating relationship.

(05:49):
I'm just saying understandingand lack of judgment and care
and concern so that we do a ahomeless we feed the homeless
once a year in honor of mybrother that never would have
happened had my brother not beena homeless person.
So someone that I loved.
Made me, made me care more aboutwhat was going on.

Jim (06:08):
Right and, Is that something that we think the
person on the other end of itcan feel that?

Pjae (06:19):
I believe, now you think about this, that's a very good
question, and I keep sayingtheir questions are good, but
they really are, because this isthe interesting thing.
We ask that question, but thenwe know when someone is looking
at us and doesn't like us, Wefeel it from someone when they
say that they like you, but youknow that they don't.
You know, the words coming outof their mouth does not match
what's happening with theirheart.
We know this.

(06:39):
So, yes, so they know it too.
They're human beings.
They know it too.
They don't, they don't addressit.
They don't come back at youbecause it's not what they do.
But they absolutely feel thejudgment.
They absolutely feel the lack oflove and compassion.
We all feel it.

Jim (06:54):
Do they feel the opposite?
Do they feel the positive?
Do they feel the unconditionallove?

Pjae (06:59):
I believe that they do.
When we go and do the feeding ofthe homeless, it's not the food.
They hang around and talk withus and chitchat and seem to feel
very comfortable around us.
Even when we finish passing,there's no more food left.
They're still hanging out totalk with us.
So I think they do feel thelove.
Feel that love from us.
And sometimes there are, youknow, people are homeless for
different reasons and sometimesthere's a mental capacity or

(07:22):
incapacity that I can't, I don'tknow.
But I think, I believe thatunconditional love bridges a lot
of things.
And coming at them with that, Ithink, passes, passes through a
lot of portals.

Jim (07:33):
I'm probably, I mean, I don't exactly know the context
there, but it may be also thatthey're glad to have somebody
talking to them withoutjudgment, and who isn't
preaching to them, because thatfrequently goes with that sort
of food delivery.
It

Pjae (07:48):
absolutely does.
There is no condition, again,unconditional, there's no
condition on us passing out thefood.
We're doing it because we loveour brother, and because we have
a better understanding now ofhomelessness, and simply want to
help.
And there's no, you come up withthe way you want to come up.
The way you want to come up, youdo have to be respectful.
We're not going to allow any,you know, talking and, you know,

(08:09):
all this sort of thing.
We're not going to allow badbehavior.
That's a different story.
But, But yeah, I, you know Ibelieve that they feel it from
us I feel it from them as well.
It's, it's actually, and that'swhy I encourage a lot of people
to just come and just be with usand you'll see that it's a, it's
a beautiful and joyous day andtime.
They're funny, they can, theycan joke, I mean they joke, they
just don't, they're human beingsand they act like human beings.

(08:32):
When you when you look at themas if they're human beings.
Yeah, I mean,

Jim (08:34):
I actually, PJ knows this, but I actually live in the midst
of the You do.
What you might describe as thehomeless district in Fort Worth.
Not in a shelter or anythingother than an apartment, but I
am right smack in the middle ofthat.
And so I do see them, and yeah,they're no, yeah.
They're

Pjae (08:50):
just human beings, and you just give them the respect that
they deserve for being a humanbeing.

Jim (08:56):
And, and very few of them are actively dangerous,
sometimes, sometimes, becausethere is a lot of mental illness
and stuff there, but, and, and,that's a place where you do have
to, it's not exactly judging,but it's perceiving things like,
okay, this person, I may beloving them unconditionally, but
I really need to be at somedistance from them, because, No,

(09:17):
this

Pjae (09:18):
is, this is, this is, you know protecting yourself and
being aware of danger, andthat's a, that's a real thing.
I'm concerned, as a woman, youknow, I'm, I'm always looking
when I, I don't go to placeswhere it's dark.
I don't get into my, you knowwhat I mean?
I park under the, you know, allthe things that women do.
And men too, I'm assuming.
To just not to accidentallystumble upon a, a dangerous

(09:38):
place.
So that's, that's a, that's agood judgment.
That's not about judging thesituation.
Right.
It's about making sure you'resafe wherever you go.
Right.
I do that all over the world.
I do that all over the world.
Yeah.
I don't know.
So, you know, when you, whenyou, when you begin to, to take
that on, I think asunconditional love, it helps

(10:00):
everything.
And I think particularly in a,in a, in a relationship and
marriage, we, we get intomarriage because of romantic
love.
We're just romantically loved,sexually attached to people.
But if you're going to be inthat relationship, if you've
committed to being there yourwhole life, then unconditional
love is going to really come inhandy.

(10:21):
It's gonna be very helpful forthe two of you when you love
them, when they're not the sameperson that you married.
Because, because how can theybe?

Jim (10:29):
Well, no, no, no one.
How can

Pjae (10:30):
any, no one is, no one is.
And to be constantly reachingback and saying, well, you're
not that person.
Well, I should hope not.
I should hope not.
Yeah.
You know, and so, so you're notconstantly judging and saying,
and thinking about, well, whatyou've lost.
When you're looking at someonewith unconditional love, you're
looking at what is beautifulnow.
What is great now?

(10:51):
And that's what it does for you.
It opens those doors.
So I, I just recommend thinkingabout what it looks like and how
your heart can open to that.
And how you can just lovesomebody beyond the behavior and
into who they are, which is adivine being.
They're just, we're divinebeings.
And I know people think thatsounds very, I, I don't know.
I don't know what the wordpeople want to, it doesn't make

(11:12):
any difference.
But that is what it is for me.
Is understanding that we're allspiritual beings, that we're all
actually divine beings.
And that's what I'm looking at.
When I'm looking at people, I'mlooking at the divine.
I'm not looking at the behavior.

Jim (11:25):
Right, right, right.
Maybe that's a good place tostop for this one.
I think it is.
It was a shortish episode, but Ithink we may have covered it.
I think we did.
Okay.
Alright.
Thanks for being here, and we'llsee you next time.

Pjae (11:38):
Absolutely.
Bye.