Dr. Robert Yoho: Chlorine Dioixde, DMSO & OSR: Three Suppressed, Easy-to-Use Therapies with Massive Healing Benefit

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everyone, welcome to episode number 45.
My guest today is the one andonly Dr Robert Yoho, because
we're friends.
This interview is one of themost casual conversations I've
had so far, and it is also anepisode that is truly too hot
for mainstream media and bigtech social media.
It's a sad reality that most ofthe promising therapies in

(00:21):
existence today get predictablycensored or vilified on those
platforms.
So for now, podcasts seem to bethe place where we are allowed
to speak freely, and Dr YohoandI did just that.
So if you've been following myshow, you know one of the
biggest topics I've beencovering is the problem of
toxicity and how we heal from it.

(00:41):
Even though he is retired, drYoho has been researching
alternative healing like it ishis job and, similar to me, he's
also been his own guinea pigfor all sorts of different
therapies, and it had been awhile since I interviewed him.
So I wanted to do a show thatencapsulated the best of what he
has found and experienced sincewe last talked and of all he

(01:02):
has researched and tried.
We narrowed the list down tothe three standout options of
chlorine dioxide, dmso and thelesser known OSR, which stands
for oxidative stress relief andwhich has a dramatic power to
deal with the problem of heavymetals in the body.
Now, in fairness to thelistener, we barely scratched
the surface of these threetherapies, so our intent here is

(01:24):
as much to pique your interestand invite the listener.
We barely scratched the surfaceof these three therapies, so
our intent here is as much topique your interest and invite
the listener, and especially ourscience-minded listeners.
Please don't just take our wordfor it, but take a deeper look
into all three of these topics.
I'll have links for you in theshow notes where you can go all
the way down the rabbit hole andresearch to your heart's
content, and I am confident whatyou will find will blow you

(01:45):
away.
Okay, before I go any further,this is a great place to remind
the listener that nothing inthis podcast is personal advice.
If you try any of the things wetalk about today, you do so at
your own risk.
But what you will hear in thisepisode is a jaw-dropping list
of ailments and stories ofhealing that, on the surface,
will probably seem wayoverstated, especially if you

(02:08):
come from a medical perspective.
Yet everything we mention isvery well documented by
countless studies and a torrentof personal testimonies, so much
so that I think you'd be sillyto just dismiss it.
So let me present you with thisidea.
If the three therapies we talkabout today became mainstream,
they would literally make almosteverything the pharmaceutical

(02:30):
industry sells instantlyobsolete.
And that's the point.
These therapies rarely breakinto the mainstream, and if you
do search for them on a typicalbrowser, what you're likely to
find is a boatload of links thatwill try to scare you away from
some of the safest, most potentproducts on the market.
That is by design.
And, in case you didn't know,google is owned by alphabet, who

(02:52):
is also in bed with thepharmaceutical industry.
And if you just can't believethat the medical industry
wouldn't embrace realbreakthroughs, then check out
some of my earlier episodes,like episode two, where I
deconstruct the history ofconventional medicine, or my
other interviews with Dr Yoho,dr Jen Vandewater or Dr Lee
Vliet, to name a few.

(03:13):
Once it clicks thatconventional medicine isn't
about healing, but it's aboutwildly profitable ongoing
treatments and, even worse, it'sabout control, everything
starts to make sense.
One other thing to note is thatDr Yoho went right at vaccines
as the number one contributingfactor as to why 6 out of 10

(03:33):
people in the US today have atleast one chronic health
condition.
He mentions a study thatcompared vaccinated people to
unvaccinated people.
The disease burden in theunvaccinated group is a paltry
2.64% compared to 60% of therest of the population.
I'll have a link in the shownotes for that study as well.
Friends, as I've been saying fora while now, our collective

(03:56):
poor health is not a lazinessproblem.
At its core we have a massivetoxicity problem.
We have been poisoned in amyriad of ways from birth to
grave, and unless we addressthat upstream cause of poor
health, we will be endlesslyplaying symptom whack-a-mole and
we will wastefully chasefruitless treatments.
It's time to change the game,or, as Dr Yoho put it at the end

(04:20):
of the interview, it's time todrive a stake into the heart of
Rockefeller medicine.
That is what we are about hereat Healing United.
We are turning healthcare onits head and building
person-centric programs to helppeople detox and heal so they
can get back to living the lifethey love.
If you want to find out moreabout our doctor-supervised,
coach-led andcommunity-supported detox

(04:42):
programs, visit us athealingunitedtoday, and I'll
have a link for that in the shownotes as well.
Okay, without further ado, getready for another
thought-provoking conversationwith my friend and truth-teller,
dr Robert Yoho.
Okay, hello everyone, welcometo today's show.
I am honored to have Dr RobertYoho back on the podcast for his
third episode.

(05:03):
He was actually the first guestof my entire show and so in case
you have not heard the firsttwo interviews with him, let me
give you a little backgroundabout my friend Robert.
He is a retired medical doctorwith 40 years of experience and
he is the face behind thepopular sub stack Surviving
Healthcare, where he writesabout healthcare corruption,
covid frauds, the globalpsychopaths and US

(05:24):
constitutional decay, which areall things I've covered on my
show.
So you can probably tell why Ilike him so much.
But he reached out to me duringthe height of the COVID
hysteria, after I published my18 Reasons I Won't Be Getting a
COVID Vaccine, and we becamefast friends.
He even came here to Floridaand I got to meet his wife and
we got to spend an afternoon tothe beach together.
So from time to time I'd sayRobert and I have kind of

(05:46):
switched roles from teacher tostudent and I'm not sure who was
taught who more, but I canconfidently say that anything I
may have taught Robert, he justquickly surpasses my depth of
knowledge on a topic.
It's just a delight to becomehis student.
So he's a gifted teacher andsynthesizer and, to his credit,
he is quick to change his mindif he's presented with

(06:06):
compelling evidence and he is100% unafraid to call things
like he sees it.
So, robert, welcome back to theshow.

Speaker 2 (06:13):
It is so good to be with you again, christian thank
you, you don't have to be thatflattering, but I appreciate it.
I'll lap up anything you sayand of course you can tell
Christian and I regard ourselvesas old friends now, so it's
always fun to do a podcast withsomebody you know.

Speaker 1 (06:33):
Yes, it is All right.
Well, let me toot your horns alittle bit more.
So I went back and looked andour last interview was about 16
months ago and it's been funkeeping up with your work
because you have just been onone of the most accelerated
learning curves of anybody Iknow and just by the nature of
your inquiry, you'resimultaneously aggressively
studying the natural healthspace and researching like your

(06:54):
life depends on it.
But it goes deeper than thatfor you, because you're also
someone who asks the why?
Question.
You're finding so many powerfultherapies and you're saying,
why are these not mainstream?
And, to your credit, you don'twant the superficial answer, you
want the real answer and forthose willing to look and try to
find the answer to why suchdramatic things are so
ruthlessly suppressed can be anugly story, but you have the

(07:17):
will to face it.
So I guess I wanted to give thelistener just a little window
into what that's been like foryou.
So you're not just someresearch cyborg, you're a real
person.
And so, before we get to kindof the three topics we want to
cover today, just give thelistener a little more
background on what it's beenlike for you personally or
emotionally, just as a retiredmedical doctor waking up to the

(07:39):
realities of what became thetheme of your sub stack of
healthcare corruption, covidfraud, global psychopaths and US
constitutional decay.

Speaker 2 (07:47):
It's been painful and I think the most difficult
thing in life is changing yourmind.
And some of my friends say I'mgood at it.
I don't know whether they meanI'm wishy-washy, but it's.
You know, you develop a knackfor it in an environment like
this and I've written four booksand I've written I've got 1.2

(08:08):
million words in print on my substack and I spend my time
editing and as I edit I thinkabout things and try to
synthesize them and try toimprove the writing.
And as I do that, I find Ichange my mind.
Sometimes I change my mind inthe middle of a story and flip
on whoever it is I'minterviewing and realize I'm

(08:29):
interviewing a limited hangoutor another freaking psychopath,
and then I write it updifferently.
So I started out, I retired at65 and you know I was a cosmetic
surgeon and we have a lot oflitigation and it, you know it's
not unique to me and towardsthe end all my friends sort of

(08:51):
got knocked out of the the gameby litigation and I was on the
point of being knocked out, butI was ready to retire anyway.
So I just, you know, resignedmy medical license and started
writing, and I'd been writingfor two years before that, I
just was attracted to themedical corruption thing and I
eventually wrote this.

(09:14):
Butchered by Healthcare book.
Yeah yeah, that was sort of mystrongest offering.
It took me three years tofigure out and write, and my I
don't have a copy of my mostrecent one.
My most recent one was aboutdentistry and it's called Judas
dentistry, which the dentistsare Judas's when you get right
down to it, because they doseveral things that are

(09:37):
absolutely wrong and bad foryour health not bad for your
health, but mortal.
And the worst is root canals.
They should never do anotherroot canal.
Those things are they basically.
They bleed bacteria from themas long as they're in your mouth
.
They cause coronary disease,they cause cancer, they cause

(09:59):
inflammatory syndromes.
My wife had three or four ofthem, I forget, and she got them
taken out and her fatal diseasewent away.
She had amyloidosis and thereare many, many stories about
that for breast cancer and a lotof other inflammatory diseases.
And then they use mercury intheir amalgams, which are linked

(10:22):
into the main problems we'refacing now, which is the vaccine
.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
So, I mean, I can go into that if you want, but yeah,
we'll get into some of thosestories as we go, and I guess
one of the things I wanted youto comment on you've used the
word the FDA's dark criminality,as you've described some of
what you're running into, andbecause the three things we're
going to talk about today arechlorine dioxide, dmso and OSR,
and you can't study thosewithout also coming across just

(10:50):
the ruthless suppression of them, and they're such great
catalysts for healing, but onceyou start looking for them, what
you're going to find is just abunch of misdirection on the
internet.
So give people a little senseof how, of what they're, how
that system works and why it'sso hard to find good information
these days.

Speaker 2 (11:11):
So my last post.
You know I'm derivative.
I can't claim I have anyoriginal thoughts except for the
synthesis of what's going on,but I summarized.
There's this fellow called aMidwestern doctor Most of you
probably heard of him and hewrites a sub stack and he turns

(11:31):
out an incredible volume ofcontent.
And he he wrote a seven oreight posts about DMSO and he
essentially convicted the FDA ofsuppressing that which, in
essence, murdered millions ofpeople.
And so the FDA has beenslaughtering us for decades.
Their leaders should be hung.

(11:52):
Their employees should bestripped of their degrees and
forbidden to work in science,government or related industries
on pain of death.
They should be turned out intothe street to watch their
buildings burned and the groundthey stood on sown with salt so
no evil crop could ever growthere again.
And that was the end of my lastpost, and so that's.

(12:13):
My feelings about the FDA areclear.
They're a part of an evil triadwith the National Institute of
Health, the NIH and the CDC, whoare equally corrupted and
equally doing their best toreduce the population by
destroying our health.
I mean, it's crazy, it's hardto believe.

Speaker 1 (12:33):
I told you he's not afraid to tell it like he sees
it.
That is it's you've and I.
What I appreciate you is aboutyou is you don't come to
statements like that lightly.
No, you do it based on what youfind and you, once you see it,
you can't unsee it and it's justpainful.
But at some point we have toface it so we can acknowledge it
and deal with it.

Speaker 2 (12:52):
Yeah, I'm most familiar with the FDA because as
a physician.
They supposedly help regulatethe drugs and they do exactly
the opposite of what they'resupposed to do.
They promote the pharma stuffand the profits at the expense
of our health.
They're supposed to protect thepublic and they don't.
And the FDA's involvement in anegative way is a marker for

(13:14):
truth, oddly enough, becausetheir lies make you look more
closely at something, and that'scertainly what happened to me
with chlorine dioxide and DMSO.

Speaker 1 (13:24):
Yeah, yeah, okay, well, give us an update.
So you've kind of givenhumanity the gift of being quite
transparent with your story.
So you were diagnosed withParkinson's and, as you
mentioned, your wife was sick aswell.
She was diagnosed with cancer.
That's why you have beenresearching like your life
depends on it.
But, given the reach of theaudience you have now with your
sub stack, you've been publiclytelling your story and you've

(13:44):
been presented with so manydifferent therapies and shiny
objects and opinions on what youmight do to heal yourself.
And you've really zeroed in onthe three things chlorine
dioxide, dmso and OSR.
So I wanna kind of take themone at a time and just really
feel free to weave your storyinto the conversation, with how
you've used them or what youfound.
But let's start with chlorinedioxide.

(14:06):
So there's so much we could say, both of us on this topic in
particular.
Both of us have said quite abit, but summarize it for
somebody who's hearing aboutthis for the first time.
What is it in a paragraph ortwo?
And how would you describe whatchlorine dioxide is and what it
does?

Speaker 2 (14:20):
Before I get into that, let me describe my
Parkinson's and why and what Ithink about it in brief.
Okay, great, what's happened?
So I was diagnosed 18 monthsafter having a tremor for 10
years, and so I got into thisthing and I started to look at

(14:40):
it carefully and I realized thatmercury seems to be the cause
of a lot of Parkinson's and anawful lot of medical problems.
And I had three features that Icould blame on the mercury.
I could, I could.
I've got minor scoliosis, whichis a mercury feature.
I've got the Parkinson's, whichis clearly related, and I have

(15:05):
a quirky personality which youcould testify to.
So the listeners are notfamiliar with what mercury does
neurologically.
Alice in Wonderland the storyhad a little part that said mad
as a hatter to describe mercurytoxic hatter, which is a
commonly known in the.

(15:26):
I think it's the 1700s when thehatters used mercury to treat
the hats they made and they wereall kind of crazy because they
were mercury toxic and it wasnever recognized at the time
what it was, but it wasrecognized that they had some
sort of problem.
So I've got all three and I've,you know, I've gone through an

(15:49):
awful lot of things to treat itand basically my status seems
relatively stable.
But you know, to treat aninjury like that, which you've
had for at least a decade, isnot easy, and Parkinson's is
particularly refractory ordifficult to treat.
So I don't think I've improveda heck of a lot, but I've
learned, I've learned, and I'velearned and I've learned.

(16:12):
So, anyway, so you want us togo into chlorine dioxide?

Speaker 1 (16:15):
Yeah, start there, cause that's, I guess you would
say, probably the number onething for any doctor, coach,
caretaker, anyone serious abouttheir health.
If you learn about chlorinedioxide, that has so much
potential to help.
So do I have that right, andhow would you describe it?

Speaker 2 (16:39):
Chlorine dioxide was characterized by NASA as the
universal antidote.
And I first saw it when I sawthis guy named Andreas Kalker,
who is an annoying German thatyou have actually interviewed
and I didn't want to interviewhim because he's so darn
annoying and he is one of thekey, you know, if not developers
, certainly promoters ofchlorine dioxide.
This thing is.

(17:00):
It's fascinating.
It was discovered, you know.
The compound has been known along time.
Sodium chloride, not chlorine.
Sodium chloride combined withhydrochloric acid in very low
concentrations produces asubstance called chlorine

(17:21):
dioxide, chlorine dioxide.
And this fellow was on a goldmining expedition in South
America and his crew fellmorbidly ill and I think it was
with dysentery or maybe malaria,and he, in desperation.
He put a few drops of sodiumchloride in a glass of water for

(17:41):
each one and swallowed it andthree hours later they were fine
.
They looked like they were ondeath's door.
So he developed an interest inthis and spent his entire rest
of his life trying to understandand experiment about it and
promote it, and that was JimHumble, and he died last year, I
think.
Was it last year?
I think it was last year, yeah.

(18:02):
So I got my interest in it.
When I want I will.
I heard about this guy, this uhcalcure, but I did.
I just ignored him until uhchristian interviewed him and I
thought, well, he scooped meagain, he scooped me again.
So so I I looked at itcarefully and realized that it

(18:24):
was the most important medicaladvance possibly ever.
I mean, that just sounds likeinsane hyperbole, is an insane
exaggeration, but it's not thestuff.
Ten million people are using itworldwide and it's been.
It's been heavily documentedwith clinical case reports.

(18:46):
It's not since big pharma isagainst it and they're against
it because it would replacevirtually every one of their
medicines.
They're against it.
So it hasn't had randomized,controlled trials as much or any
of this nonsense which opposesthis medical science in the
current day.
But it's absolutely clearwhat's going on, based on the

(19:11):
case reports and tens ofthousands of case reports, and
the case reports involveeverything from curing diabetes
and I've seen that with my ownfreaking eyes.
A friend of mine took it andher diabetes.
She had diabetes with bloodsugars in the four hundreds, the

(19:31):
insulin pump, the whole nineyards and that was cured in two
weeks.
And the only thing that wouldwork that fast is a pancreatic
infection of some time kind thatwas knocked out by the chlorine
dioxide and that's one of thetheories about how it works is
it knocks out infections.
But malaria is a horribledisease.

(19:52):
It's the worst infectiousdisease on the planet for the
last 100 years.
It kills 3 million people plusa year, and chlorine dioxide
kills it.
It absolutely knocks it out.
No recurrences after threedoses over 18 hours.
It kills Lyme disease, which is.

(20:12):
You can read about my analysisof it.
But that thing was developed bythe US military as a bioweapon
and it either got loose or wasreleased in the American
population and now it infestsprobably a double-digit percent
of all the population andthey're symptomatic in a

(20:33):
single-digit percent of ourpopulation.
And it's just horrible.
It's chronic fatigue and allkinds of other problems.
These people are non-functionaland it cures it in a month.
Many cancers, including thingslike disseminated pancreatic
cancer, are cured with chlorinedioxide and breast cancer is

(20:57):
commonly cured with chlorinedioxide.
It takes several hours to sortof start to understand it.
You can read Christian'ssubstacks or mine, uh, but as a
start.
But, um, to really understandit you have to work on it for a
while so you understand how touse it and how to avoid
misstepping.
But um, there there are manyautoimmune diseases that

(21:22):
chlorine dioxide knocks rightout.
And basically the stuff the theexplanation for it.
The best science that we havesuggests that when you swallow
some in water it goes to everypart of your system and is
attracted to acidic areas.
And these acidic areas arepathologic.
They're either areas ofinfection with yeast or fungi,

(21:45):
bacteria or viruses.
And, of course, and this stuffknocks out COVID in a couple of
doses I mean, covid is nothingburger and then it somehow
improves the physiology in theseacidic areas and then and then
it cures all these diseases.

Speaker 1 (22:05):
Yeah.
I mean, it's just, oh, it'sremarkable.
I remember interviewing Kalkerand he described it as
combustion, like it just kind ofwhooshes through and oxidizes
out the whatever.
It has an affinity forpathogens and toxins and it just
has an ability to dissolvethings.
It's actually, if you look tobuy it, you have to buy it for
water purification, and if youkind of get the, the human body

(22:26):
is mostly comprised of whatWater You're essentially it's a
way of purifying the water inyou and it's what gives it the
breadth of all these differentthings he's talking about.
And if you haven't seenRobert's most recent post,
there's just this gigantic listof documented stories of people
recovering from so manydifferent conditions and it

(22:47):
really is, as far as we can tell, it's just the purification
element about that.
But anything else you want tosay about that, because I know
there's, if you?

Speaker 2 (22:55):
The easiest path to understanding it.
I've got links in the topparagraph of every post, I've
got it in bold and if yousubscribe to my Substack, there
is my pitch Surviving Healthcarerobertyohosubstackcom.
In the top of every post.
You can learn about, basicallyabout the stuff we're going to

(23:16):
talk about today, and there'scomprehensive links to where to
buy chlorine dioxide, how to useit, how to make it all that
stuff.
So thank you for giving me akick in that direction,
christian.
I didn't want to miss thatstory.

Speaker 1 (23:33):
No, I'm glad you looked into it because, like I
said, you have far surpassed thedepth of research and you've
traveled and interviewed so manypeople about it.
Now just to do your own duediligence, and it's fun to learn
from you now.
So give a few practical tips ortidbits on chlorine dioxide One
, how easy is it to make it andhow expensive is it, and I'll

(23:56):
ask you a couple others afterthat.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
Okay, so the value of treatments is inversely related
to the cost, right?
So things like cancerchemotherapy, which costs
millions a year sometimes, arealmost completely useless.
There's five cancer entitiesfor which a therapeutic effect

(24:19):
or an improvement in death whichis all you really care about
occurs.
The rest of them, they claimtwo months survival benefit or
there's no survival.
In the case of radiationoncology, which is blasting
cancers, it doesn't work at all.
It literally doesn't work atall.
One entity, that's prostatecancer, supposedly helps and you

(24:39):
have to do an invasiveprocedure where you plant these
radioactive seeds around yourprostate.
Or you could do chlorine dioxideor you could do chlorine
dioxide and get a cure.

Speaker 1 (24:51):
Yeah, so four pennies on the dollar.

Speaker 2 (24:55):
So so the price is is cheap.
What were your other parts ofyour question?

Speaker 1 (24:58):
well, just how to make it so, how you like, you're
basically just making other keykey things.

Speaker 2 (25:02):
Okay, so you can buy the two components from amazon
and I've got links for them.
Christian has links for them.
They may change, but you canlook up chloride, sodium
chloride, 22.5 percent orwhatever it is 25 percent and

(25:22):
four percent hydrochloric acid.
Now you can make enough totreat the city you're in for six
months for less than $200through the directions that are
in the best resource, which istheuniversalantidotecom.
That was put together by ananonymous source and it is

(25:42):
absolutely fabulous.
By an anonymous source and itis absolutely fabulous.
One of the key points aboutchlorine dioxide is you got to
start low and go slow.
It's critical because otherwiseyou get this Herxheimer
reaction which will give youfatigue or diarrhea.
No one's ever been killed by itas far as I know, and I've got
350, 400 hours in plus studyingit and it's just like everything

(26:09):
else we're going to talk abouttoday.
It's freaking, totally safe,but you can get a Herxheimer
reaction.
The Herxheimer thing wasoriginally described for
penicillin treatment of syphilisand penicillin knocks that
syphilis right off, but it turnsthe little spirochetes into
multiple pieces that make youkind of sick for a while, maybe

(26:32):
24, 48 hours at the most.
But you can be fatigued, get afever, get rashes.
Usually a Herxheimer reactionfrom chlorine dioxide or DFSO
which we're going to chat aboutlater is milder.
You just feel fatigued.
And the key to these treatmentsis start low and go slow.

(26:52):
And there are specificdirections about starter
protocols for chlorine dioxidein theuniversalantidotecom and
so I recommend and I've neverbeen a cautious fellow, I've
always taken too much and I paidthe price, and I still pay the
price yeah, so I get tired.

Speaker 1 (27:11):
It's like working out or something and uh, yeah, so
at a minimum I get tired one ofthe one of the upsides I suppose
if there is one to herxing isjust oh, it's something's
working.
It's a symptom that your body'sstarting to detox and there
really is something that needsto get out.
And it's an invitation to makesure you get your exits open.
You move and you sweat and youbathe and breathe and poop and

(27:32):
all the things you can be doingto let those toxins circulate
their way to the exit.
So, yeah, he's right, just takeit slow, like with all the
things we're going to talk about.
And, as both of us would say,none of this is personal advice.
It's just kind of lessons fromdoing this and do your own
research on it.

Speaker 2 (27:49):
But man is this stuff it's for entertainment value
only Right?
I can tell you it'sentertaining.

Speaker 1 (27:56):
Yeah, you can listen to us banter.
So a couple other things aboutit.
You can use it orally,topically, in IVs or enemas, and
there's a difference betweenchlorine dioxide and chlorine
dioxide solution, so tell thelistener the difference between
those two.

Speaker 2 (28:09):
Okay.
So if chlorine dioxide is usedtopically, you need to combine
it with DMSO, which makes itpenetrate.
It doesn't work very well as atopical solution without DMSO.
It might work on open wounds,it's been described Anyway.
So the difference between CDSchlorine dioxide solution and
chlorine dioxide Chlorinedioxide refers to all kinds of

(28:34):
chlorine dioxide products, andthe one that's traditionally
used is mixed on the spot withtwo different solutions One, 4%
hydrochloric acid, which isabout the same concentration as
your stomach acid.
This is not something that'sgoing to burn your hand.
And number two, sodium chloridesolution, and that's a super

(28:55):
saturated solution, so you can'tput any more into water than
that which I believe is 22.5%.
Is that correct, christian?

Speaker 1 (29:03):
I don't know the number on that.

Speaker 2 (29:06):
But anyway you can order that stuff and then you
combine it in drops, a few drops, and then you dilute it in an
entire liter.
So currently I'm taking 10drops of each, and when you
refer to drops you refer todrops of one component or the
other.
You don't say 20 drops.
I'm taking 10 drops, which is10 drops of each in a liter of

(29:29):
water drunk over a day, andthat's still probably too much
for me.
I probably use six drops, butpeople work up to a lot more.
And the chlorine dioxidesolution is a method popularized
not invented but popularized byKalker where you put the two

(29:51):
solutions, one in a littlecontainer that is exposed to the
water in the rest of thecontainer and you put the two
components in that littlecontainer and then that makes
the chlorine dioxide solutionsolubilize into the water and
the rest of the container andit's supposedly a little more

(30:13):
pure.
But that method is not as strongas the chlorine dioxide drops.
It doesn't manage to treatsuccessfully.
It doesn't treat successfullyeither malaria or autism.
Now, autism is almostimpossible to treat, but Carrie
Rivera, who I've interviewed, isthe authority on that and she

(30:38):
has remarkable success.
Not with them all, but she getsthem to talk and it's somehow
purifying or treating or gettingrid of the acidic areas in
these little kids with enemasand oral and baths.
It brings them out of thisthing.
I mean, it's just, it's astunning.

(30:59):
It's a stunning thing and she'savailable at Carrie, at Carrie
Rivera dot com.
That's her email and if youguys who are listening have
autistic kids and you need toconsult, it's not very expensive
.
I think it's $150 or $175 forthe first hour and you can get
an enormous out of it, enormouslot out of it.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
Yeah, no, she's.
I'm looking forward tointerviewing her myself.
I there's, I have envisioned aalmost an autism series because
it's such a growing problem andspecific to what God will come
to when we come to OSR.
But the vaccine problem andwhere, where these kids are
being poisoned.
And she has done so much ofjust God's work out there, not,

(31:43):
you know, just getting theaccolades, he's just doing the
hard labor figuring out how tohelp these people.
So that's yeah, I would secondthat and it's a testament.
Even Calker in his book he'sgot a very onerous, complicated
parasite protocol fordetoxification and supposedly
that he's they've helped about350 kids reverse autism with

(32:03):
chlorine dioxide as one of thetherapies mixed into how to help
autistic kids.
So anyway, these are big storiesor big claims, and we are not.
We're just saying go.
We are saying this because itneeds to be said.
When you go search for thisstuff on the internet, what
you're going to find iseverything to scare you away
from it.
And we just want to have acounter story out there that

(32:24):
says maybe the story you'refinding when you go searching is
there intentionally.
And we want you to do your duediligence and Robert and I
especially Robert have just donedeep dives, trying to say here
if you're taking an honest lookat it, here are the things to
look at.
Anything you want to add tothat.

Speaker 2 (32:39):
Yeah, calcar Kerry, mark Brennan and Jim Humble were
the original group who promotedthis stuff after Jim Humble
discovered and developed theideas.
So you know, they all know eachother and they really have done

(33:00):
a wonderful job.
It's kind of too late to stopthis juggernaut.
And they had seminars in 100countries plus, yeah.
And then they threw grennan andhis sons in jail.
Uh in, uh they.
They threw a bag over his headand took him out of colombia
illegally and then, you know, hedid a monkey trial in the

(33:22):
united states and his he got outof jail and his sons are still
in jail.
I mean, it's just a prison.
It's a remarkable story fordoing something that never
harmed a soul and cured so manypeople.

Speaker 1 (33:35):
Yeah, so go look into it.
We've got resources and linksand they'll have some in the
show notes for you where you cango look more closely at it.
So, okay, well, let's switch toDMSO.
So you've been experimentingwith that lately and if you were
to summarize it maybe in aparagraph or two, because
there's so much that could besaid about it, but get us in the
ballpark.
If you've never heard of DMSO,what is it?

(33:57):
What does it do?
How would Robert Yoho describeit?

Speaker 2 (34:00):
So DMSO we have 30 plus years experience with these
things, with fluorine dioxideand DMSO, and DMSO is it was
developed by Stanley Jacobs, whowas an academic in Oregon, and

(34:21):
DMSO is, contrasted to chlorinedioxide has an enormous academic
literature behind it and Ibelieve I don't want to misquote
this, but I'm pretty sure itwas the early 60s when it I
think it was 1965.
Yeah, in 1965, it was renderedillegal by the FDA.

(34:43):
But the academics behind it areunquestionable and in
veterinary medicine it's anaccepted thing.
It's used to improve theirathletic recovery after injuries
.
To improve their athleticrecovery after injuries.
But the general disease inhumans it's been proven to treat

(35:13):
strokes, improve survival,improve traumatic brain injury
survival, cure spinal cordinjuries in some cases and many
circulatory disorders.
I mean, it's a remarkableability to treat pain and I was
using it topically because it'sa small molecule that penetrates
right into the body.
You have to kind of watch itbecause you have ethyl alcohol

(35:36):
on there and it'll bring thatinto the the body and that's not
good for you.
In fact it's poisonous if youget too much.
But and if you, if you've gotsoap on your extremity where
you're putting the DMSO on, youknow the soap soap goes right
into your body too.

Speaker 1 (35:53):
OK, well, zoom out with me.
So where does this come from?

Speaker 2 (35:56):
in nature, Okay it comes from a tree.
I don't know exactly how, butit's a biological product and
not some horrible chemical.
And if you look at Wikipedia,it looks like it's synthesized
in a laboratory, but it's not.
There's one company that makesmost of it from trees.
It's just an herb basicallymakes most of it from trees.

(36:19):
It's just an herb basically.
It's essentially an herb and itshould be called natural tree
syrup therapy or something likethat.
But it's not.
And I mean, I started using ittopically and it helped a little
bit, but when I started takingit orally it stunned me.
The lethal dose is two quartstaken within an hour, so it's

(36:39):
very safe in the doses that areused.

Speaker 1 (36:41):
Which nobody would ever take yeah.

Speaker 2 (36:43):
Nobody would ever take that.
It doesn't taste very good.
They have a prisoner studywhere they had them drink about
a cup of it a day for threemonths and they all just sailed
through.
They never even noticed anyproblem.
And they all just sailedthrough.
They never even noticed anyproblem.
And I'm taking two tablespoonsa day.
One tablespoon twice a day andit just tuned up all my aches

(37:05):
and pains.
I go to the gym and I do backsquats and now I can get all the
way down.
My knees are much, much better.
It's not instantaneous, butChristian's just looking at
incredulity at me instantaneous.
But Christian's just looking atincredulity at me at 71 doing
back squats.
He's just shaking his head.
No, it's impossible.
The story is incredible.

Speaker 1 (37:31):
It is because I've I have trained no shortage of
people in every decade of lifeand there aren't many 70
somethings who can do a fullsquat and then to know that I
didn't say a full squat.

Speaker 2 (37:36):
I said I got lower than I could before.

Speaker 1 (37:38):
All the way down sounded like anyway, but it's
pretty close but you have asignificant injury history with
all your rock climbing, whichmakes it more compelling that
yeah, even things that manydecades old are healing I
evulsed my quadricep or pulledit off of my kneecap and had to
get repaired twice, twicebecause I worked out too soon on
it.
Oh geez, yeah, smart me right,but you've got and you're so you

(38:03):
had.
I think it was yesterday youpublished another dmso substack
and the like to your what youwere saying earlier.
The list of things that thiscan help with it's it's similar
to chlorine dioxide, like how inthe world could it possibly
help that many differentconditions I can?
I could read a long list to hearif we want some, but what?
What could you say like?
What do we perceive to be themechanism of action of, of why

(38:26):
this is so potent?
What is it doing in the body toyour understanding?

Speaker 2 (38:30):
I you know I almost generically don't do mechanisms
right it doesn't make anydifference.
Okay, what makes a differenceis clinical case reports and not
even double blind case reports,because those costs many
millions each, sometimeshundreds of millions, and are
only accessible to drugcompanies, which are all
pathological crooks.

(38:51):
So case reports are where it'sat, in my opinion.
So I mean it even treats microclotting.
It's a blood thinner, so Ithink it would replace all the
current blood thinners, whichcaused lots of problems, with
something that was completelynon-toxic and safe.
And it just brings downinflammation, which you know,

(39:16):
christian and I have gone downthis path and we view
inflammation as the kind of rootof all evil and health, you
know, poor health.

Speaker 1 (39:27):
Well then, just figuring out why, are we
inflamed in the first place iskind of the question.
And yeah, some of that justcomes back to oh, let's see, I
had 17 mercury fillings in mymouth and I had root canals and
I had exposure to this, that andthe other.
And yeah, once you can recognizethat part of how I conceive of
or describe DMSO, nudge me ifI'm missing it or wandering here

(39:47):
, robert, but to me it's theclosest thing I'd say is like a
carrier agent and it's like thisability to kind of whoosh
through and it's almost like itjust pushes out what shouldn't
be there and somehow in itstailwindwind it brings what is
supposed to be there.
And you can use dmso to helpyour body get aloe in it or you
could use it.
Even that guy you interviewed,um, talked about having silver
with it, or some people do herbslike it's just a way to help

(40:11):
bring in.
You just got to be careful withwhat's on your skin or how
you're using it.
But you can use use it withchlorine dioxide, like you
mentioned, to increase theefficacy of it.
So is that a reasonably goodexplanation for what we think's
going on here?

Speaker 2 (40:24):
I think you I don't know, but the list of things
that Are so well documented yeah, they're so well documented.
I mean it treats Bell's palsy,sometimes gets rid of it, down
syndrome I don't know how itdoes that All these inflammatory
diseases and musculoskeletalconditions, liver failure,
gallstones, type 1 and type 2diabetics have reported that

(40:49):
DMS-Co reduced their need forinsulin pancreatitis, kidney
disease, chronic pain.
It helps wound healing a greatdeal open and closed wounds.
I mean.
It gets rid of bruising.
And there's an entity wherewhat I really liked about it,
attracted to me about it atfirst, was its ability to help

(41:11):
remodeling of tissues.
And maybe I'm dreaming, but I'mhoping it'll remodel my ankles
because my ankles are arthriticand it certainly decreased the
pain.
I'm much, much, much betterafter a month of using it and I
seem to be progressively gettingbetter.
The remodeling has been prettywell documented in scleroderma,

(41:31):
microscopically.
I mean it helps hair loss, Imean that's-.

Speaker 1 (41:36):
Herpes and canker sores is another one.
Herpes and canker sores and so-.

Speaker 2 (41:40):
Gums disease, quadriplegics gradually regain
motor function.
I mean, this is like it's anamazing, amazing thing.
Traumatic brain injuries, yeah,and you mentioned painkillers
earlier.

Speaker 1 (41:54):
Like in those NSAIDs and opiates, you're killing how
many people a year and earlier,like in those NSAIDs and opiates
, are killing how many people ayear.
And this just has.
It's basically the same thingit's harmless.

Speaker 2 (42:02):
There are no clearly documented deaths associated
with it.
There is a one in 2000 allergyrate severe allergy rate with it
and somebody apparently diedwhen they didn't stop taking it
when they got very sick with theallergy.
But that's the only documentedfatality that's even associated
with it and I don't think youcan call that causal because

(42:29):
nobody but a dummy would keeptaking it if they got a huge
rash and couldn't breathe.
So that was sort of a.
What do they call that?
One of those elimination?
You know it's an.
What do they call the videoswhere somebody does something
very stupid and dies?
The Darwin Awards, DarwinAwards, that's right, it's a
Darwin Award, it's not a DMSOcriticism.

Speaker 1 (42:48):
Right, yeah, that was a it's.

Speaker 2 (42:51):
Blindness has been cured.
Cataracts Visual acuityimproves I mean this just sounds
insane.
Cataracts visual acuityimproves I mean this just sounds
insane.
It does.
But I I reviewed this.
This guy put all the dmso stufftogether in about a 90 000 word
document and that's themidwestern doctor, right?

Speaker 1 (43:09):
yeah, yeah, yeah okay okay, so you summarize.

Speaker 2 (43:11):
He's got five other posts.
Yeah, you know, I told himwrite a book, but try to clean
up his prose.
Okay, well, for my scienceminded listeners, just give them
a sense of the breadth anddepth of.

Speaker 1 (43:19):
You know I told him to write a book, but try to
clean up his prose For myscience minded listeners.
Just give them a sense of thebreadth and depth of the studies
that have been done on DMS.
So I think I have the numbersfrom your post, but tell them
what they are.

Speaker 2 (43:36):
I don't remember the exact numbers, but this thing is
as well documented as any drugthat's on the market now.
I mean, it has a huge number ofstudies and this academic,
Stanley Jacobs from Oregon, he'ssort of the grandfather of this
whole thing and he did a lot ofstudies himself.
But since then, I mean, whatare the numbers you have?

Speaker 1 (43:51):
I have 3,000 studies and over 500,000 patients that
have been used it and studied.
So I think I got that from yourpost, so I imagine people find
it right there.
But anything else you want tosay about the studies that
you've found or looked at, injust being able to create the
list that you have?

Speaker 2 (44:10):
10,000 articles on the biological implications and
30,000 articles on the chemistry.
I mean, there's a lot ofstudies on chlorine dioxide, but
the stunning thing aboutchlorine dioxide is the case
reports, this stuff.
We've got all the case reports,including the veterinary
reports.
Plus we have studies, so therereally is no excuse for the FDA
not to have approved this drug.
I mean, it's just an outrage,and they're basically have

(44:33):
killed a lot of people bykeeping it out of our hands and
destroying our ability to use it.
The doctors are all chickens,you know.
They're afraid to do it becausethey'll lose their license once
the FDA gets off the train.

Speaker 1 (44:46):
Yeah, I read a book this year called how is it the
Lethal Dose, and she just kindof finally solidified for me
this concept of standard of careand how.
That's just professionalhandcuffs.
You have to fall in line withwhatever the accepted standard
is and if you do that and youmurder somebody, too bad for
them.
But if you do anything outsidethat and there's a consequence,

(45:09):
boy, now you're off thereservation and the powers that
be won't protect you anymore.
But to your point, doctors arestuck in that I can only do
what's standard or I can't work.
And that's part of the wholesystem that they're
participating in and part ofwhat we're just trying to lay
out for people to be able to seeit.
That's part of why studies likethis we couldn't have more.

(45:31):
And yet, to Robert's point,they're still afraid to use this
because it's not standard ofcare.

Speaker 2 (45:38):
Now, the footnote to what you said is that doctors
are allowed to use drugsoff-label that are approved for
something else, and DMSO beforethey really got going on it.
It was approved for a bladderinflammation and so they use it
for that.
What's that called Cystitis,something?
Cystitis, Interstitial cystitis?

(46:00):
I think there you go.
I might be wrong about that,but you are allowed to use it.
It's available.
You can go to dmsocomdmsostorecom and buy gallons of
it, which is what I've done.

Speaker 1 (46:13):
Which is also significantly inexpensive, like
chlorine dioxide.
That's the other beautiful partof it.
It's also significantlyinexpensive, like chlorine
dioxide.
That's the other beautiful partof it.
It's just and it's compared toall these other expensive
treatments.

Speaker 2 (46:22):
A gallon of that stuff, which would be for one
person it would last years, isless than $100.
No, it's a little over $100.

Speaker 1 (46:31):
Yeah Well, and to close an open loop, some
listener may have that, likeRobert mentioned in your post,
you say the FDA murdered Dmso innovember of 1965 they put a ban
on researching it.
But then in 1994 the deshay actthat this dietary supplement,
health and education act waspassed, that kind of took away
the fda's power to keep it underwraps, and so that's why it

(46:53):
started to make a comeback.

Speaker 2 (46:54):
but it's still because it was a natural product
.
Right that took away the.
Fda's ability to regulatethings that weren't synthesized.
This thing is a natural.
It's made from it's justessentially trees.

Speaker 1 (47:09):
Yep, okay, and so you have been using it obviously,
so tell people a little bit ofsome of your experience.
Obviously, you mentionedimprovement in ankles.
Any other things?

Speaker 2 (47:23):
you want to tips you want to give people related to
its usage.
Well, I think you know there'sa trend to being conservative
and there's nothing wrong withbeing conservative, but this
stuff's harmless and I take itorally and I think if you take
it with food there's less chanceyou're going to upset your
stomach.
It's not very upsetting.
Anyway, I brush my teeth withit because it helps gums improve

(47:43):
and helps the adherence toteeth improve, and I've got some
recession.
So I take a teaspoon of it andbrush my teeth with it once a
day and then I take the rest ofit in orange juice or and
sometimes in the middle of ameal.
So I think you know it's alwaysgood to be careful with your
tummy, and taking a lot ofsupplements all at once is not

(48:06):
the best policy, as I've learnedin my chagrin.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
Oh my gosh, the amount that you've I've seen.
You sent me a video of, likeyour supplement warehouse that
you have, or graveyard perhaps,and it's remarkable, the stuff
you're willing to try and gothrough to find the best for the
rest of us.
So thank you for doing that.
Okay, so this may be the mostimportant part of the whole
podcast today, so if you're halflistening, pay attention.

(48:31):
So, one of the things I heardin your interview with Herb,
where you guys were talkingabout DMSO and he said that the
more toxic the body is, the moreyou're going to stink when you
use dmso, and apparently yourwife made some rude claim.
Well, I started stinking whenyou began.

Speaker 2 (48:46):
Actually, you know, I feel that I'm quite toxic,
right, I feel like I hurts withboth dmso and um chlorine
dioxide, for example but but Ididn't really have much trouble
with that.
I just said that because I justwrote that that was dramatic.
But a lot of people do get agarlic breath or a garlic smell

(49:10):
when they use chlorine dioxideand it's quite objectionable for
some people, and maybe my wifedoesn't have much of a nose, but
I don't get a lot of complaintsabout that.
Okay, good, yeah, so, and thestory is supposedly that once
you start to recover, the smellgoes away because you're not
earthy anymore and you don't get.

(49:31):
Yeah, so that's who knows.

Speaker 1 (49:35):
But you've been able to stay married through despite
yeah and frequent stinking.
Okay, good.
So just forewarning, if youstart to detox, there might be a
little like, oh, like we cansmell the funk coming out of you
.
So like smell, yeah, all right.
Well, um, obviously inexpensive.
There's talk about using itwith water, so do you?

(49:56):
Do?
You and herb talked about theimportance of diluting it just a
little bit to get it wet, causeit's once it has taste water,
it just it gets it craves more,and that's part of what makes it
work.
Tell me a little bit about that.

Speaker 2 (50:06):
Well, herb.
Herb says that he uses it inmultiple different dilutions
depending on the use.
Okay, it sounds like overkillto me, but mixing it with 30%

(50:27):
water, for example, or even 10%water, seems like a good first
step.
When you get the stuff in andif you try to swallow it without
mixing with water, it heats upin some sort of reaction and I'm
always afraid it's going toburn me.
But I use 100% DMSO to brush myteeth with and of course it's
mixed with water in the salivaand it makes my whole mouth sort
of warm and I use two minuteson my Sonicare and then I

(50:52):
swallow that along with somemore water.
So I don't know if I haveanything smart to say about that
, except for the generalrecommendation is to dilute it,
especially if you're using it onthe skin surface.
It doesn't work as well withoutbeing diluted.

Speaker 1 (51:05):
Yeah, yeah.
Well, that's one of the thingsI noted, and Colker talks about
it in his book.
He's got a topical protocol andone of the suggestions is you
can combine it with 70% DMSO.
So I guess the 70% is the DMSOand the 30% is the water.
Is that what you're saying?

Speaker 2 (51:21):
Yes, that makes sense Okay.

Speaker 1 (51:22):
Yes, okay, very good.
And the other couple practicesUse it in your eyes.
Yeah, you did that, didn't?

Speaker 2 (51:27):
you.
Oh, yeah, yeah, how did that go?
So I have you know, among allmy other problems, they have
macular degeneration.
It's mild, I'm hoping, but thetreatment with chlorine dioxide,
dmso and other things likecastor oil, believe it or not,

(51:48):
help macular degeneration.
And to make it easy for you,you can put the DMSO-chlorine
dioxide combination on youreyelids and that penetrates
right through to the retinabecause the DMSO carries it
through.
But I was using drops in my eyesand I made the mistake of not

(52:10):
diluting the stuff with saline.
I just used water.
So it really stung and I put upwith that for several weeks and
then I thought, well, this isenough of this.
But later on I talked to anexpert who says I was told me I
was an idiot, that I should haveused saline and I wouldn't have

(52:31):
had any trouble.
But you can check my iPostabout that.
But I believe the DMSO issomething like four to one,

(52:51):
saline to DMSO, something likethat.
It might be 10 to one, but it'snot going to hurt you or cause
any permanent damage and thechlorine dioxide is something
similar.
So I think that that's thestrongest thing for getting rid
of macular degeneration.
For cataracts, it's hard toimagine there are treatments for
cataracts, but apparently thecastor oil is a pretty good

(53:14):
treatment and even a month ofthat you get rid of early
cataracts, which is sick.
I mean, just think of all thesurgery and all the nonsense and
all the lenses and all theother crazy stuff that we've
done for cataracts when there'ssomething easy, that's safe,
never cause problems andavailable everywhere for

(53:35):
cataracts.

Speaker 1 (53:36):
Yep, yeah, the other big tip I want to make sure we
leave people is to make sure, ifyou're using it topically, that
you're not also using it withmakeup or sunscreen or hair dyes
or any sort of other things onyour skin, because you're going
to drive that into your body.
So that's just a practicalthing if you're considering
doing it.
But you made a point toward theend of that post that I just

(53:57):
thought was worth highlighting,so I wanna get your comments on
it.
You just said just the patienceelement.
To reverse a major healthcondition can take months and
there's an emotionalrecalibration it takes to say,
okay, now I get to figure outhow to be consistent at this
over some time.

Speaker 2 (54:13):
So anything you wanna say about either your
experience with it or storiesyou've read, or just the
patience and consistency factorwhen it comes to some of these
therapies we're talking about,Well, I didn't have to wait long
for my improvement and in fact,this stuff, the DMSO, was the
most dramatic treatment thatI've ever taken symptomatically,

(54:35):
and I've got athletic sprainsand strains.
I have hips that supposedly arebone on bone and the
orthopedists all want to cut offthe head of my femur and
operate on me.
But when you get right into it,you realize that the anatomy of
your bony structures havealmost nothing to do with your

(54:58):
symptoms and people have anatomythat looks like mine and they
are running marathons.
So I wish I would have knownthis before.
I did my shoulders.
I've got two prostheticshoulders with titanium alloy
and so I've got that inside mybody and my immune system has to
cope with that.
But I'm hopefully, hopefullyI'll be able to stay away from

(55:20):
hips.
But I got better instantly andI progressively improved over
two months and I'm stillimproving.
And you know, like I say, I didfairly deep squats yesterday
and deeper than I'd done inyears.
And I said I was doing deepsquats and Christian envisions

(55:42):
me with my butt on my heels, butthat's not quite.
It's not quite that good.

Speaker 1 (55:46):
Not quite that good, maybe yeah.

Speaker 2 (55:48):
Christian's a professional trainer.

Speaker 1 (55:50):
Yeah Well, and similar to you, like, as you're
listening to this, I'm.
I'm thinking of all the stupidthings I did in the gym, or the
ways I have pushed the envelope,trying so many things over the
years, trying to find where thereal limits are, and if nothing
else, they the listeners can belaughing at us in the ways that
we've been been the guinea pigsto come, you know, hack away
through the options out thereand come back and be like, hey,

(56:12):
don't do that.
This one's better though, andmaybe don't put it in your eyes
if you don't dilute it withsaline.
First, we're just willing to goout and try things and learn
them, and then I love thethought that the body's not
incapable of healing.
It just takes longer as we getolder.
And there's an element of likewhat's the return on this
investment and how do I do it?
And so I'm constantly in thepractical weeds of how do I make

(56:35):
this believable, approachable,methodical and strategic and
this adaptable for people, andto me that's the fun place,
because it's where the most ofthe stories are gonna come from.
But so I'm not giving.
My point is I'm not giving upon your knees in a deeper squat
here.

Speaker 2 (56:50):
Okay, it is.
What's the bottom line?
And you know, I reviewed thenatural approaches to vision
improvement with a woman who didthat.
What was her name?
Yeah, out in Ventura, and I'veI concluded there were only two
things in her program thatseemed likely to be the uh, the
big causes of improvement, andnumber one is get rid of your

(57:11):
glasses or try to decrease theirmagnification, and number two
was sun gazing, and she had allkinds of other exercises and
this and that that never didn'tseem to make any sense to me.
But my vision has gotten betterwith just those two things.
Yeah, and these glasses areclose-up correction glasses for

(57:31):
working on the computer andthey're less strong than the
ones I was wearing a month ago.

Speaker 1 (57:35):
Yeah, I can see the difference that your face looks
different with those on fromlast time we talked.
No, it's great, I even have itfor those interested.
I have an interview with CarlosMoreno which is all about
restoring your eyesightnaturally, and the
counterintuitive effort to relaxinstead of strain, instead of
focus.
It's weird how, if you trainyourself to relax your eyes,

(57:56):
that takes the pressure off ofthem and things will come back
into focus, but you have to letit go out of focus first to get
that benefit.
And so it's there's so much todo.

Speaker 2 (58:05):
That inspired me to do my interview with someone
else and she told me the samestory.
I don't believe it.
I still don't believe it.
I think the only two things aredecreasing your correction if
you wear corrective lenses, andsun gazing.

Speaker 1 (58:22):
Yeah, well, there you go.
You've got three things to try.
Go forth and try See what worksfor you.
So anything else you want tosay about DMSO before we move on
.
I've got the book people cancan check out about it.
But what other thoughts oranything we did not cover about
this week?
Obviously they can go find morein your substack.

Speaker 2 (58:42):
Yeah, I.
I thought this guy's, theMidwestern doctor's, treatment
of it was more comprehensive,more convincing, and you know, I
thought it was better, exceptfor the grammatical errors and
the usage errors in his posts.
I thought it was better thananything that had been written
about it, and I, of course, readthe same book that you're

(59:03):
referring to, and that was itdoesn't have all this
information.
So if you, I've got a post,it's only 3,500 words long and
you can look through this andget all the information and it's
got all the links thatMidwestern Doctor uses for his
posts.

Speaker 1 (59:20):
Okay, cool, I'll have that in the show notes for
people.
The book I was thinking of isthe one I think it's on the same
site where you can get DMSO.
The title is DMSO for Humansand its Recipes and Treatments.
It's by Herb Richards, so ifyou want to look, into it.

Speaker 2 (59:34):
Herb is the guy I interviewed, yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:36):
And he's in his 90s.
He sounds like he's sharperthan most people in his 50s.

Speaker 2 (59:40):
You're like my goodness, I think he's in his
90s.
You know, this Midwesterndoctor guy reported that he had
a lot of case reports of peoplewho were very elderly, who had
been using dmso for many yearsand they seem to retard their
aging.
So that's something somebodywho's 71 like me is very
attractive to hear.
Yeah, yeah, I want to hear thatstuff.

Speaker 1 (01:00:01):
Yeah, come back in another 16 months yeah, we'll
get the next update from robertand his continued healing
journey.
Okay, well, let's switch to OSR.
So that's the last one, and youwere the one that introduced me
to this.
I had so many wow moments as Iwent through this extensive post
you did.
I was blown away by how muchwork you put into that one.
So, if I remember correctly,osr is something you came across

(01:00:24):
because you were looking for away to detox the mercury from
your 17 fillings in your mouth.
Is that right?
Yeah, okay, cool.
So give us some context andunderstand the significance of
metal first and then we'll getinto OSR.

Speaker 2 (01:00:38):
So can I talk about the control group study right
now?
Yes, absolutely, that's a greatone, all right.
So what's going on?
What's important, what isn'timportant?
I mean, it's just a hall ofmirrors to figure out what is
going on, and Christian and Ihave reviewed many, many topics,
but it turns out there's astudy that proved that the

(01:01:00):
independent variable, the thingthat's 10 times as important as
everything else, are thevaccines and I'm not talking
about the COVID vaccines, I'mtalking about every vaccine.
And someone figured out a simpleway to study this, and they did
this thing called the controlgroup study.
Now there's only 900,000 peoplein all the United States who've

(01:01:20):
never had a single vaccine youknow, these are the Amish and so
on and the authors of the studysomehow interviewed those
people in a random fashion andthey learned that their chronic
disease rate was only 2.5%.
So they didn't even have thevitamin K that they give to kids

(01:01:40):
you know, little babies at thetime of their birth.
So now it's well known what thechronic disease rate is in the
rest of society and is climbingdramatically.
It's over 60%.
Yeah, it's incredible.

Speaker 1 (01:01:55):
Six out of 10 people now have a chronic disease.
And so you're saying that justto give the listener context.
But those numbers against eachother 2% compared to 60%, or two
and a half compared to 60%, 2%compared to 60% or two and a
half compared to 60%.

Speaker 2 (01:02:14):
So they you know there's ways that these people
who write studies statisticallycompare two groups of people and
typically, if there's less thana 5% chance that the difference
could have been could occur bychance alone, that's considered
very highly significant.
In other words, that's a prettygood indication that what
they're writing about is true,and that's called the p-value,

(01:02:35):
without getting into detail.
So the p-value for this thingwas not 0.05 or 5%, it was
something like 0.00001%.
You know it was so small.
Nobody had ever seen a p-valuethis small.
So what that means is that itabsolutely proves that the

(01:02:56):
vaccines are the culprit for thechronic disease, Absolutely
proves they're the independentvariable.
They're 10 times or 100 timesas important as all the other
things that we've been lookingat, including diet, including
EMF, including iodine deficiency, including exercise.
Those things are insignificantcompared to the vaccine.

(01:03:17):
The vaccines are what's killingus, and it's been purposeful
and it's frankly a nightmare.
Yeah, what's that?

Speaker 1 (01:03:25):
It's hard to swallow because there's many things that
implies and there's so muchstill ongoing irrational defense
of it where, without evidence,without people won't even go
there, like most people can'teven name what.
Can you even tell me?
Three ingredients in one?
Most doctors can't even answerthat question.
And that level of ignorance andthat level of irrational

(01:03:47):
defense.
At some point we have to saywhat are we doing and what's the
real problem here.
And you've been willing to,both of us have been willing to
talk about that.
But I don't want to get too faroff topic because I think the
point you're making when itcomes to OSR or all the metals
that are in those shots, is acommon problem we have.
And that's just one place.
Mercury has found its way orother heavy metals have found

(01:04:10):
their way into our body.
So is that kind of the summaryof what you?

Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
Mercury is an exception to the idea that the
vaccines are the sole cause or99% of the cause or 95% of the
cause of our chronic disease.
Mercury is a problem and thereason.
You know my speculation, sincemercury the second biggest cause
of mercury is vaccines.
Right Until recently they allhad mercury adjuvants, which

(01:04:36):
means that mercury was everyvaccine as a carrier protein or
a carrier molecule and in theorythey cut that out around 2000.
But in practice they justchanged the rules for reporting
the mercury, so it's stilleverywhere and it's certainly in

(01:04:58):
the flu vaccines.
So mercury is a horrible toxicsubstance.
And how they could have gottenaway with you know, nobody was
minding the ship at the FDA,there's nobody regulating the
regulators and they somehow gotmercury into those things.
So I think that the mercury inthe amalgams, which is common
40% of United States people and60% of Europeans have amalgams

(01:05:21):
and the mercury in the amalgamsrelates to the vaccine injury,
you know, and it interplaysAnyway.
So that's my theory.
But the absolute fact of thematter that's been established
by the control group study isthat the vaccines are the
independent variable.

Speaker 1 (01:05:42):
They're the cause of the chronic diseases chronic
diseases, which just says thatthe majority of the population
has some level of at leastinitial metal toxicity and
likely ongoing metal toxicity.
I did an interview with ZenHoneycutt where we talked about
the studies they did with publicschool lunches and fast food.
I think it's like 18 differentfast food companies, and the

(01:06:03):
most shocking thing of the wholeinterview was the amount of
heavy metals in both of thosetypes of foods the school
lunches and fast food.
It was like 6,000% more thanthe safe upper limit, and so
it's not just our vaccines andour mercury fillings in our
mouth, it's also in our food.
And then the reality that it ispart of jet exhaust that we're

(01:06:24):
getting more heavy metals.
This is a significant issue thatoften I love my work because I
I get I'm I'm tasked withfinding causal factors like
where do these problems comefrom?
If I can work at the root causelevel, I don't have to treat
anything.
It's the body sorted out, andwhat we're saying here is
there's a significantlyoverlooked challenge of metal

(01:06:47):
toxicity that we can nowcorrelate to being injected
repeatedly with liability-freearm juice dozens of times as a
kid and then into adulthood.
It's still with us and that'swhy I was so delighted to find
your post on OSR, becausethere's something that I've
never seen that had this muchpotential and this ease of use

(01:07:11):
for something as significant asheavy metals.
Because you try to get them outof your body and you don't do
it well, you can end up makingyourself worse.
So talk to us a little bit aboutthat or any comments on what I
just said?

Speaker 2 (01:07:24):
Yeah, EDTA chelation is an unreliable way to get rid
of mercury.
So I may have misspoken earlier.
I may the statistics I quotedabout amalgams may be applied.
It may be the statistics thatare actually for root canals,

(01:07:44):
which is a whole other storythat I developed in my book
Judas Dentistry.
But you know the number.
There's at least a third of ushave amalgams and they're still
dissolving in the United States.
I'm not sure.
I know the so on to OSR.
So I'd been hearing ever sinceI started investigating mercury

(01:08:06):
due to my Parkinson's and got my17 root canals out.
That was me, I'm sorry, 17amalgams out at a Tijuana IAOMT
dentist who was great.
I've been trying to figure out away to get rid of the mercury

(01:08:28):
or improve my status somehow,and it took me down a lot of
avenues.
But when I got an invitation tovisit Boyd Haley, who is the
world's most famous expert onmercury toxicity and I'm quoting
Bobby Kennedy here that's whathe said on a podcast and I
believe it he's done that's whathe said on a podcast and I

(01:08:49):
believe it.
He's done a massive amount ofwork on it, and I interviewed
him on the ground in Tennesseeand his partner, david Kennedy,
in San Diego.
I took trips to see him eachand spent a half a day with each

(01:09:10):
one in interviews.
And Boyd is just a genius.
He's almost hard to understandbecause he's so high level and
he has a hard time bringing itdown to the level of somebody
like me.
But he invented you know, davidKennedy informed him about the

(01:09:33):
problem some 20 years ago and heis a bench chemist and he
invented a chelator that wouldbind mercury and essentially
render it inactive.
And this thing locks it up insuch a way that it just can't,
it doesn't do anything.
And he got investors.

(01:09:54):
He got all his friends a lot ofthem were dentists and David's
friends to donate around $50million for clinical trials and
lab trials or lab animal trials,and those guys, they have
plenty enough to get this stuffapproved.
It's totally harmless.
There's never been anassociated death or even anybody
who got very sick.

(01:10:15):
I mean, it's got a couple ofvery small problems that are
very rare, which you can readabout in that post.
But it binds up.
It's got these little chemicalarms that wrap around the
mercury.
And what's even better is thestructure of mercury is very
close to the structure ofgadolinium, which is that
horrible contrast dye theradiologists use all the time

(01:10:36):
and it binds up gadolinium, itbinds lead and it binds cadmium,
and these other things have notbeen studied.
This extrapolation is from thestructures and it binds other
heavy metals.
So this thing is a major advance.
It's made from natural products, so it should be in an exempt

(01:11:00):
category and not need FDAclearance.
But these guys have gottenintimidated by the FDA and
they're afraid of them and theybasically stopped marketing it
for a while and now it's back onthe market in a buyer's club as
a water purifier.

(01:11:21):
There are a couple of Chineseimitators that basically are not
pure enough to be used and havemade people sick.
So I don't recommend you get onthe internet and search for OSR
or NBMI, which is the otherabbreviation for it.
I don't remember the chemicalstructure, but this stuff's made

(01:11:41):
from natural products and itshould be sold as a supplement
and we're hoping that, withKennedy as the head of the
health and human services, thatthat'll be allowed and that'll
let this thing out of the bag.
Right now it's expensive andwe're trying to make enough
money to keep the whole thing inbusiness and be able to supply

(01:12:06):
this thing cheaply.
So it costs.
It currently costs around $500for a month.
Now, a month of this stuff, I'mconvinced, is enough to bend
your health for the better.
So I recommend, if you canafford that, to go for that and
if you can afford longer coursesfor mercury.
If you're a dentist, forexample, you have mercury

(01:12:27):
toxicity worse than I do andyou'd better take that as long
as you're a dentist, for example, you have mercury toxicity
worse than I do and you'd bettertake that as long as you're
alive, you know and you canafford it.
But the problem with it is it'snot a therapeutic agent.
It just locks up the mercury,so damage that's already done,
like Parkinson's disease, is notgoing to respond to it.
Parkinson's is notorious forwhen it becomes symptomatic

(01:12:51):
you've already got brain damage,and so that's the scoop.
It's not.
Usually it's not very dramatic.
If you're acutely mercury toxic, like the gold miners in
Columbia that they tested, thenyou feel way better when you get
on the OSR.
But for people who have subacuteor chronic intoxications and

(01:13:13):
that's what they call itintoxication I hate that word If
you have subacute or chronicintoxications, you often don't
notice too much.
The newsflash is that I havetwo friends who got on it and
they documented from their scansthat their mercury levels

(01:13:35):
dropped to zero.
And it's in the post that willgo out in a week exactly what
the scans are and how they work.
But they're electronic scansthat can measure heavy metals in
your body.
So these two people had clearlydocumented decline in their

(01:13:57):
heavy metals.
They didn't have urine levelsor anything like that.
The studies, the $50 millionworth of studies documented a
lot of stuff like that a lot ofurine levels that went up
because it's getting excreted.
The thought is that it's notmainly excreted but it is bound
up in such a way that it'sinactive.
You know these metals.

(01:14:23):
You should take this before yougo in, for if you have to have
a gadolinium, you should take ascooper of it, which is a couple
hundred milligrams or 300milligrams, an hour or two or
three before you go in for thegadolinium scan.
That way it'll bind that stuffup and it won't poison you.

Speaker 1 (01:14:38):
Yeah, gadolinium, in case you didn't connect it.
If you have an MRI and they usea contrast dye so they can see
something, that's what he'stalking about.
So if you're going to get acontrast MRI, you would want to
have some OSR on hand, becausegadolinium is highly toxic, just
makes it convenient for thedoctors to peek into, look at
stuff Similar to barium.
You know you swallowradioactive, radioactive stuff,

(01:14:59):
so you can it's insane, yeah.
So, okay, well, tell peopleabout.
So you mentioned a little bitabout the, I guess, regulatory
roadblocks that these inventorskept coming into, so I'd love do
you know anything about thenatural sources of what they use
to make OSR?

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
I can't tell you.
I don't know, but they are.
It's a couple of naturalproducts.

Speaker 1 (01:15:22):
Okay, and then what?
Tell people about the?
Anything else you want to sayabout the regulatory roadblocks
they were running into, how fdakept changing the rules.
But I also wanted you to tellpeople about the rat studies
they did with osr and how therats that they just couldn't
poison them.
So tell people about that wellthey could poison them.

Speaker 2 (01:15:41):
But it took a hell of a lot of mercury so they'd
inject.
They injected a bunch of ratswith 17 times a lethal dose of
mercury acutely lethal thisisn't something that's
chronically lethal orchronically damaging, like those
of us with amalgams get.
And then within a short timemaybe a half an hour they gave
them an injection of the OSR inDMSO and DMSO is used as a

(01:16:05):
solvent, but I'm convinced thatit helps.
And DMSO is used as a solvent,but I'm convinced that it helps.
And I take my OSR in DMSObecause I want it to penetrate
into these areas where themercury is held, like inside the
bones and inside your brain,and I want it to come out and
get greeted by the OSR and boundup.

(01:16:26):
So I think taking it with DMSOis the best idea.
But the rats half of themsurvived at 17 times a lethal
dose and at lower doses.
They all survived and I can'tquote exactly what it was I
think what you had was liketwice the lethal dose.

Speaker 1 (01:16:47):
So we know if we give a rat this much mercury it'll
kill them, like every 100% ofthe time.
They gave him 2X that, in thepresence of OSR, none of them
died.
They all lived.
Yeah, they all lived.
It's that remarkable of achelator.
So a chelator if you don't knowthat word, it means it binds,
it just grabs a hold ofsomething, and so when we're
talking chelates, it grabs it asa permanent bond.
And if it can't get it out, theupside is it at least renders

(01:17:10):
that heavy metal inert and itcan no longer harm the body.
If I understand that right.
Is that what your researchfound.

Speaker 2 (01:17:16):
Edta is the best known chelator and that's used
for various things and claimedto work for heavy metals.
But in point of fact what itgenerally is thought to do is do
a weak bond on these things,pull them out of the brain or
wherever they are andunfortunately sometimes they get
deposited in the kidneys orcreate other toxic issues when

(01:17:39):
the chelator lets go of it.
And the EDTA is not a strongchelator.
This thing takes thousands ofdegrees of temperature to get
the bond released.
In other words, that's what'sbeen done in the test tube and
it just doesn't release for anyreason.
It just kills it.
It kills the metal and wraps itall up with the chelator
molecule and renders it inactive.

(01:17:59):
Even if it doesn't leave thebody, it's been rendered
inactive.

Speaker 1 (01:18:04):
Yep, and you're never going to have your internal
temperature hit thousands ofdegrees, so we can safely say
you're going to be fine.
So, um, okay, let's see whatother any other things you want
to mention about?
Either your experience you know, you kind of went on this
research odyssey following boydand hayley and researching their
work.
Anything else you want to sayabout your experience or your

(01:18:25):
work with them, um, or the, whattheir story taught you.
Or your experience or your workwith them, or what their story
taught you.
Or your experience using OSR.

Speaker 2 (01:18:32):
Yeah, I didn't have any dramatic relief and I've
used it every day for threemonths and then I've used it
several times a week since and Ididn't notice very much.
But that was expected a lot,and so the other thing I want to
say about these guys is I did agood brain biopsy on them, so

(01:18:54):
that what that means is that Iknow them and they're very
sincere.
They're not in it for the moneyand it's been a I mean, it's
been a very expensive odysseyfor them and they and they are
interested in trying to save usfrom mercury toxicity, which is
a huge problem, and I think it'sclosely related to the vaccines

(01:19:18):
and closely related to thatcontrol group study.
You know exactly what percentof the problem is mercury, who
knows but it's the only storyout of all the dozens and dozens
that I've covered which itseems to be a causal factor in

(01:19:38):
the 60%.

Speaker 1 (01:19:42):
The 60% chronic disease burden that the US
population suffers with and Iguess from a coach perspective,
I've been looking intodetoxification really
significantly since COVID kickedoff or since the vaccine in
particular rolled out, butreally even before then, 2006
was kind of my first to wake upto like what in the?
This is a much bigger problemand if there's hope for people

(01:20:05):
who are hearing this andthinking I'm good, this is the
win, there's to me.
There's hope for people who arehearing this and thinking I'm
good at this is the win.
There's to me.
There's a difference betweendetoxification, between
purifying and taking things outof the body and actually healing
the body.
They're like.
Thinking of them in twodifferent tracks has been fun.
One is about removing burden,the other is about nourishing
deeply, and I've expanded mydefinition of nourishment beyond
food.

(01:20:25):
It's sunlight, it's water, it'shope, it is it my definition of
nourishment beyond food.
It's sunlight, it's water, it'shope, it's movement, it's many
things that mechanically orpsychologically, nutritionally,
nourish the body in a way thatif we can get this stuff out and
we can render it like he'stalking about and we can also
work at healing.
And there's so many promisingtherapies out there that also

(01:20:45):
get suppressed.
But that to me even for yourstory, robert, is where I think
there's still a lot of hope andthere's a lot of ground to be
gained of.
Yeah, we got to purify, we haveto know how to get this crap
out, but if we also have thediligence of study on really
it's a short list is sometimesit comes back to the basics of
you got to move and sweat andbathe and breathe and poop and
get the body to have thestimulus it needs to turn the

(01:21:08):
engine and have the patience totake that runway of healing.
And, just to your point,healing is going to take a while
.
Okay, let me calibrate to thatand work with it.
But anything, any comments youwant to add to that.

Speaker 2 (01:21:19):
Yeah, I interviewed Pierre Corey and Scott Marsland
about their approach to vaccineinjury which appeared.
I mean, it is a very insightfulinterview and I learned a lot.
I mean, now they convinced methat shedding is a real thing
because they have ways tomeasure the spike protein load.
But they have not approachedDMSO or chlorine dioxide

(01:21:44):
seriously and they're using avariety of treatments that are
more like standard drugs.
That it seems to be verysuccessful, but I think a
do-it-yourselfer could almost doas well if you get on chlorine
dioxide and the MSO.
Now the other thing I don'tthink I mentioned this, but the

(01:22:05):
minimal effective dose forchlorine dioxide is unknown.
It's probably very low.
There were people that weretaking water out of a river that
had some chlorine dioxidepoured into it.
They were downstream in Africaand they had some healing
effects from the dilute riverwater.
I mean, it's just crazy.

Speaker 1 (01:22:25):
Sounds like homeopathy.

Speaker 2 (01:22:27):
I know it's hard to believe, but we have all kinds
of reports.
Now, if you guys get ontheuniversalantidotecom, there's
a reference to a Telegramchannel there and I summarized
the case reports, or I took, youknow, 5,000 words of case

(01:22:47):
reports and put them in a postabout a month ago.
And they're not all using thestuff all day long, like Kerry
Rivera suggests.
They're not all using enemasand every other thing.
Some of them are using smallamounts once a week or twice a
week, and it still has effects.
So I would suggest that everylistener learn about chlorine

(01:23:12):
dioxide and get on at least asmall dose of this once or twice
a week and you may prevent alot of problems.
I mean, it pretty much killsglyphosate.
If you've covered that, I meanthat's a disaster.
But so, anyway, that's all Ihave to say.

Speaker 1 (01:23:30):
Okay, well, a couple of other, just practical nuggets
, I'll mention.
There are some knockoffproducts, like you mentioned,
and we'll have links for youwhere if you want to get what
Robert's research has turned upas the real deal, then we'll
have that for you.
And then I guess I will startto wrap up here a little bit, so
as we've obviously barelyscratched the surface of all

(01:23:50):
three of these topics.
Then we'll have places wherethey can go learn more.
But give us any update on yourhealth you want to give us that
or your, your wife I know youmentioned recently how much
better she's doing.
So anything else you want tomention, I'll just kind of tie a
bow around your particularhealth journey to this point.

Speaker 2 (01:24:07):
Yeah, she Bo around your particular health journey
to this point.
Yeah, she's fine.
She got her root canals out andshe is the old girl, she's very
energetic and she feels greatand I'm stable.
I can't realize.
I mean, I've tried.
I mean I've been usingphosphatidylcholine, which is

(01:24:29):
lethacin, intravenously once aweek for months and that was
supposed to be a miracle and Ididn't notice anything.
Now the doctor who put me onthat told me not to use DMSO or
chlorine dioxide and I had ahard time not doing that because
those are the two mostpromising therapies, period.

(01:24:49):
So she thought that I might nothave as good a response, but I
just couldn't leave them off thetable.
So it might be my fault, itmight be her fault, but I
haven't noticed anything fromthe phosphatidylcholine.
And for me, getting offcaffeine and alcohol seemed to
help too.

(01:25:09):
The caffeine the caffeine wasgiving me symptoms that were
probably that I was attributingto parkinson's, you know.
So I think it made me worseyeah, that could.

Speaker 1 (01:25:21):
That would make sense if you get the jitters from too
much caffeine, for sure yeah, I, I tried.

Speaker 2 (01:25:26):
I also had suggested to me that I use the carnivore
diet and I did that for threemonths, but I couldn't tolerate
the constipation.
I mean, I tried all kinds ofthings and you know Parkinson's
patients are constipated, so Iwon't tell you what happened
exactly, but That'll be for theoff the record conversation.

Speaker 1 (01:25:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:25:46):
Okay cool.

Speaker 1 (01:25:48):
Well, any final words of encouragement for the
listener and then tell peoplewhere they can find and follow
your work.

Speaker 2 (01:25:54):
Well, I think the encouraging thing is is that
these are the greatest medicaltreatments in history and
they're at our fingertips.
And if you know, what I want tosee is, I want to see a stake
nailed through the heart ofRockefeller medicine, because it
is a vampire.
And it's sucking our blood.
It's sucking, you know.

(01:26:15):
We spend twice as much percapita as any developed country
and we have horrible outcomes.
We have early mortality, we'vegot the worst record on the
COVID nonsense than any countryin the world, and I mean it just
.
The story goes on and on and on.
So I think these two are thebiggest, most important things,

(01:26:36):
but I don't want to completelyminimize diet or taking some
iodine or, you know, avoidingEMF exposures or any of the
other stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:26:44):
Yeah, well, it's fun when you major in major things.
When you do, you find, in thesecases, very inexpensive,
legitimate purifying agents andyou have a lifestyle that can
support it.
You're not poisoning yourselfwith toxic thinking and and
other you know self-image issuesthat are weighing your
physiology down.
The body is remarkable at whatit can heal and you have so many

(01:27:05):
posts with so many pictures ofjust look at what can happen.
If it's inspiring, just to see,my goodness, those kinds of
things really can get better,with just simple, legitimate
answers and people patientlywilling to do what doctors are
supposed to do and practicemedicine and try not to harm
anybody.
So, yeah, I'm right there withyou on let's let's reinvent a
better model for healthcare andand what it could have been all

(01:27:28):
along.

Speaker 2 (01:27:28):
Got to burn the whole thing to the ground, yeah, so
my platform isrobertyohosubstackcom and it's
surviving healthcare, so you cansearch for either one.
Surviving healthcare Substack.
You can search for that.

Speaker 1 (01:27:43):
Right on and, yeah, he is very prolific the amount
of writing he does.
I'm jealous of how much timeyou get to research and find
things, but it's, it's awesomewhat you do.
So, robert, you are a gift tohumanity.
You could have just ridden offyour end.
You could have you sit here anddo this, all this research, and
you don't have to do this.
You could have ridden off intothe sunset.
Yeah, you just had to.
Rest of us.

(01:28:04):
Yeah, it's a compulsion, andyour work is bridging the gap
between researchers and laypeople or people like me, who I
can pick up with it and make myown version of trying to help
and amplify it.
So, on behalf of all of us whohave benefited from your work
and your readers.
They don't get a chance to saythank you, but I want to, so I'm
honored to call you a friend.

Speaker 2 (01:28:24):
Don't cut yourself short.
You're as sophisticated as I am.

Speaker 1 (01:28:29):
Well, maybe your depth of research is amazing.
So, thank you, and yeah, I lovehaving you on the show, I love
calling you friend and it's beenan honor having you back on the
show today.

Speaker 2 (01:28:39):
Thanks for buttering me up.
Christian, You're welcome.
I'll talk to you soon.
Talk to you soon, bye.

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